Atlanta Hawks: Hawks 110, Jazz 87
Smoove and the Hawks eventually forced Jazz fans to throw in the towel. (Steve Griffin / The Salt Lake Tribune)
Salt Lake City–Wow.
- The Hawks finished their West trip in style by waylaying the Jazz. It was surreal to see the fans in one of the league’s toughest building start leaving midway through the fourth quarter.
- “As I told the guys before the game started, ‘Let’s turn a good road trip into a great road trip,’” L.D. said. “That was kind of our theme going into this game, and they did it. Just a great, great win.”
- The Hawks have won five of six games. Joe and Jamal are getting healthier. Their defense looks better. They play four of their next five at home. They’ve survived a grueling schedule despite injuries to sit a half game behind Orlando for fourth fifth place in the East.
- Could the Hawks finally be ready to get on an extended roll? “Why not?” Jamal said. “Other teams have had their chances to get on a run. I think it’s our time now. It’s a game tonight that a lot of people wouldn’t have bet on us. It was a gut check. It was a pretty convincing win against a great team.”
- There’s no question about that. The Hawks were sharper, faster, tougher and better than the Jazz from start to finish.
- “From start to finish I thought it was one of the most complete games where we controlled it from start to finish on both ends of the floor,” Drew said. “Defensively, I thought we did a great job. And then we actually got our and ran, made the extra pass.”
- The Jazz could do nothing to stop the Hawks on the perimeter. If they appeared slow to react, it might have been because Atlanta passed the ball so crisply. And when they did manage to close out, the Hawks frequently made plays off the bounce.
- “They pass the ball well,” Jerry Sloan said. “They got it to who was supposed to have the ball almost every possession. We didn’t seem to be able to do anything with it.”
- It was shocking to see the Jazz unable to run their normally-silky offensive sets because the Hawks beat them to the punch. Deron Williams, among the league’s best point guards, was made to look ordinary by J.J. and Atlanta’s swarming help defense.
- “I think we did a number on Deron,” Smoove said. “We did a good job with team defense.”
- “We tried to take away a lot of the easy touches,” L.D. said. “The system that they run, they are so good at it. They put you in a position of switching and if you are not careful you can get back cut. I thought we did a good job of defending that. I think we forced them into more one-on-one situations than what they are accustomed to and then we defended it.”
- J.J. was great at both ends. This was the first game in a while I can remember him so smoothly meshing his deliberate, one-on-one game into the rhythm of the offense. He picked his spots, let his teammates set him up and is starting to make more open jump shots.
- “You can see he’s starting to find rhythm in his game and what we do,” Drew said. “He is incorporating his game in the movement that we’ve put in.”
- The same can be said of Jamal, who scored at least 20 points for four straight games for the first time since he joined the Hawks. All of those efforts were efficient.
- When Joe and Jamal are going like this while getting other involved, the Hawks are very difficult to defend.
- “I think we are definitely getting healthier as a team,” Joe said. “We are starting to figure things out about how L.D. wants things to be run offensively and defensively. Most importantly, we are going out there and having fun.”
- “I think it just took time,” Jamal said. “We just had to figure out how we were going about things. I think now we are doing a good job picking our spots. But we still have such an interior presence with Josh, Al and Zaza and all those guys in there.”
- Al was making the shots that Jamal, Joe and Bibby (eight assists) created.
- That’s where the Jazz could have used Paul Milsap, who was out with a hip injury. Al Jefferson was flummoxed all night by Atlanta’s bigs.
- “We wanted to match their physicality,” Smoove said. “I think we did a good job at really pressuring them and stopping them from swinging the basketball easily. We got in the passing lanes and did a nice job of limiting them to one shot and rebounding and getting the ball out.”
- The Hawks made 14 of 25 3-point attempts. That’s a lot of long balls to put up but they were quality looks: all but two of them were assisted, and one of those was Jamal’s 47-foot bank shot at the buzzer.
- “We had great ball movement and we had some great looks,” L.D. said. “In most cases we won’t be taking that many threes. Joe got into a rhythm. Jamal got into a bit of a rhythm. They were within the flow of what we were doing.”
- The Jazz tried to make a game of it in the third quarter but couldn’t get stops. The Hawks had 10 assists on 11 field goals and made 6 of 8 3-point attempts in the period.
- The Jazz were a step behind trying to defend the three, probably because the Hawks gave them so many other things to worry about, too.
- “A lot of that had to do with the way we tried to guard them in the post,” Sloan said. “They threw the ball out of the post a number of times for guys to be able to take shots. That’s one thing; the other is whenever they were looking for three-point shots we had trouble getting to them.”
- Smoove was the early catalyst for the Hawks. He was all over the court as they raced out to a 20-6 lead. During that stretch he assisted on two of J.J.’s 3-pointers, plays that suggested they are rediscovering their chemistry. Josh also got an and-1 on the break, a steal and two rebounds during that opening burst.
- The starters handed the reserves a big lead in the second quarter. It wasn’t always pretty, but they pretty much maintained. Mo made open shots, helped with the team defense and even looked pretty good on the break.
- The Hawks returned to Atlanta to face the Pacers on Saturday. “Three big wins and coming off a great win like [against] the Jazz, it can definitely fuel you to a domino effect for us to string some wins here together,” J.J. said. “The East is tough, man, so we have got to get on a roll.”
MC
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
199 comments Add your comment
Hawks Fan In New Orleans
January 6th, 2011
1:15 am
I’d be remissed if I did not say “first”
Tom
January 6th, 2011
1:16 am
Great solid win!!!!
GaSouthernSmooth
January 6th, 2011
1:24 am
First? Good win Hawks, Jazz looked lost on offense at times without Millsaps. But FINALLY nice to see them beat a legit team. Now lets get on that roll J.J. was talking bout. O and it was hillarious seeing Heyward get schooled by J.J. after he got a big block and jumper in the second qtr. took the crowd right of it!
MsDee
January 6th, 2011
1:28 am
So many folks on here has been crying about ‘why the Hawks cant blow a team out’..well, CONGRADS’, WE JUST DID IT, AND AGAINST A TOUGH, PLAYOFF TEAM, ON THEIR DIFFICULT HOME COURT, WITH THE #1 PG IN THE LEAGUE..THE UTAH JAZZ!!!! And if the Hawks would not have blowned the huge lead last night against the Kings, we would have had back-to-back blow-outs against west coast teams!!!
Jae Evolution
January 6th, 2011
1:28 am
Jose Calderon had 20 Points and 17 Dimes tonight…I’m just sayin’.
rusty
January 6th, 2011
1:31 am
Enter your comments here
Hawks Fan In New Orleans
January 6th, 2011
1:35 am
I see the confidence building up in the veteran guards by their post game comment. L Drew’s test is to bring the younger guards up to speed and have confidence in them. Not nitpicking- GREAT WIN but I just see the big picture. I feel we will pass up the Magic in the next few games for 3rd in the East!
MsDee
January 6th, 2011
1:37 am
I just saw on the NBATV video clip of Jamal and Jerry Stackhouse how Jerry wants to play for the Hawks. Now sure why Sund didnt pick him up during the off season or even when Marvin & Mo Evans were both out early in the season??
Hawks Fan In New Orleans
January 6th, 2011
1:47 am
Ms Dee – Sund is dumb – simple as that.
And you are obviously right about finally getting another blowout win. A win is a win, but this was impressive – a statement game if you will.
Ramon
January 6th, 2011
1:51 am
Ramon
January 6th, 2011
1:44 am
Drmary, sorry for the late response, been having family time tonight. But from the previous blog. Jamal is a great player when he’s playing as he is now. And its hard to trade him when he’s playing like that.
However, When I say trade him for 2-3 good players, and you ask how can you make that happen, I think its quite simple. The Hawks aren’t truly in need of ’stars’, but more defensive minded players on the bench. For instance, I’d suggest Crawford and Mo Evans for Blaylock and Kaman. Or Crawford and Zaza for Camby and Miller. JC1 has been on a good streak lately. But do you realize this season against the Eastern teams who are ahead of us, JC1 is only averaging 12 points a game? Against the better defensive teams in the East JC1 is limited because the lanes close quicker. I believe in a package deal, you will receive more collective talent than you deal away. It will take quality depth to advance in the playoffs, not just 6-7 players who play at a high level sometimes. But 8-9 players who consistently contribute where ever their role is required. If you’re a defensive pg (Miller) don’t worry about scoring 20 ppg, just keep the opposing pg out of the lane. If you’re a back up big who’s job is to rebound and play smart defense, than get a rebound for every 2 minutes you’re in the game.
I would love to be able to improve the bench without trading any of the top 4 players. The problem with that is the rest of the 10 players are virtually impossible to trade and get something better in return.
* Link
* Report this comment
Ramon
January 6th, 2011
1:49 am
Sautee, when you consider how often Josh actually creates his own shot or creates shot for others (which would probably be only behind Joe and/or JC1) compared to Al method of normally being set up for his points by someone drawing the double off of his man. You must say, that 2-4 turnovers is a lot compared to 4 turnovers because of how the turnovers came. Its the same way Lebron or Wade can have 4-5 turnovers in a game (and they do that regularly), but it wouldn’t be as big of a problem as Al Jefferson having 2-3 turnovers. Josh still remains the Hawks player who can affect the game the most (on offense) without taking a single shot.
Ramon
January 6th, 2011
1:54 am
When Joe and Jamal make their shots, the Hawks look like a totally different team.
sam'l
January 6th, 2011
2:50 am
If the Hawks can play a game like this, they have a chance to win any game they play. The question is, is this really a progression that is likely to continue. Congratulations Hawks.
I have to wonder why anyone wants to trade Jamal Crawford. Isn’t it obvious that when he plays well, the Hawks win?
Bite the bullet. Give this guy some money….or (and I don’t know all the rules about signinig contracts) is it too late?
.
Jae Evolution
January 6th, 2011
2:53 am
How come the Hawks are always the last team on NBA.com to have the full game highlights shown…I swear.
northcyde
January 6th, 2011
3:07 am
@ Ramon.
Trading Jamal for “2 – 3 solid players” is not the way to go. The elite teams in this leagur have star players and very good players on their roster.
If you trade Jamal for merely a collection of “solid players”, what could happen to us is what just happened to Utah tonight.
As well coached as that team is, they have virtually no chance to get to that next level, because the only “star” player they have, is Deron. Utah’s roster is filled with solid players. But you need good players that can supplement star players.
Trading Jamal for a guy like an Andre Miller or a Marcus Camby would be decent moves to make. Miller is an above average PG and Camby is still an elite level rebounder and a decent shotblocker.
Anything less than that wouldn’t make us better.
Preferbly, we trade Jamal for an upgrade, like an Andre Iguodala. Of course, with our money situation, that’ll never happen.
More than likely, he doesn’t get traded.
I Believe In This Team
January 6th, 2011
4:05 am
The best part of the game was watching Utah try and charge back in the third, and the Hawks keeping them down by double digits. They never took their foot off the gas in this one.
Great win. Great game. Great road trip. Very happy fan. Thank you Hawks!!
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
6:06 am
The one day I choose to do something other than watch the Hawks game, they go out and do this. Maybe I should watch them less.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
6:07 am
“For instance, I’d suggest Crawford and Mo Evans for Blaylock and Kaman.”
Hell yeah. I’m down with this. Get Mookie back in a Hawks uniform, and if Bibby won’t give up his #10 to him, he can go f-ck himself.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
6:08 am
I wish nba.com would follow the lead of nfl.com and put every key play up on their website, not just a 2 minute highlight package ESPN style.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
6:15 am
Slightly less Woody-esque minutes distribution in this game, although Teague and Jordan still got next to no burn. Not really complaining since the game went so well, just pointing it out. Only Al cracked the 35 minute mark, which is good.
Nice to know that the Hawks shared the ball and played inside-out for four quarters. It’s pretty simple — when they do that, they win.
For some reason the blog monster ate all the comments I posted from my phone on the previous blog. Don’t know why…
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
6:17 am
And about those 25 attempted 3’s, nothing wrong with 3s if they are going to be in rhythm and in the flow of the offense. The Suns built a very 3-reliant offense over the last several years, and the reason it worked is because they had a guy who could make sure all those 3s were in rhythm and in the flow. As long as the ball is still going inside to open up those opportunities, it’s fine with me.
O'Brien
January 6th, 2011
7:28 am
When JJ AND Jamal are making shots, we are tough to beat. But we’ve always known that. The problem is what’s the backup plan for when we face a good defensive team and the shots are not falling.
That being said, great team win for the Hawks. We rarely win in Utah, and we havent done well against playoff teams on the road. So this win was extra special.
And with 4 of our next 5 at home, hopefully this can be our springboard to a long winning streak.
Duello
January 6th, 2011
7:40 am
The problem with trading or resigning Jamal is the salary cap ramifications. Even with Jamal expiring, the Hawks are on the books for $63 million next year for 8 players. So that would leave only about $7 million for 5 players. So we could resign Jamal if he agreed to a contract for like $4 million/year, but I don’t think he’d be willing to take that steep of a paycut.
The same problem presents itself when trying to trade Jamal. If we take back any salary in the trade that will be on the books for next year, we’re guaranteeing that we will either be in the luxury tax (which AS has been unwilling to pay), or the Hawks will have to trade someone. Hence all the rumors around the league that Smoove would be available after the Hawks gave Al and extension.
Basically, if the Hawks resign or trade Jamal for non-expiring contracts, the Hawks will be forced to trade someone else.
dukester
January 6th, 2011
8:19 am
Good game Hawks lets keep it going. Ramon said it best when Joe and Jamal are on this is a tough team. The problem is can they play consistently for the rest of the season. I mean that was a Lebron and Wade type performance. It will never make ESPN except maybe the half court shot Jamal made. But let’s see what happens here on out.
Mike is back
January 6th, 2011
8:21 am
MC, very good stuff…I hate to sound repetitive…but frankly…you have been on fire of late…very good reading.
THE HAWKS played a complete game…and they looked like a different team…TREMENDOUS EFFORT!!!
HATS OFF TO JJ AND JAMAL…for first off being open and honest about their struggles with the system…and the will power to adjust their games to work within the framework of the system…MAN IT WAS BREATH TAKING AT TIMES WATCHING THE PRECISION AT WHICH THESE GUYS WAS PERFORMING ON OFFENSE AND DEFENSE…can we get some more of that…THAT WAS GREAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BTW, I loved when BIbby kiss the crowd good bye…WHAT a nice gesture…THAT WAS PRICELESS. heh heh
GET YO ROOOOOOOLL ON HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
terrell
January 6th, 2011
8:25 am
Just heard Stackhouse on NBA TV lobbying for a roster spot on the Hawks. They were interviewing Jamal after the game last night. lol!
Joey
January 6th, 2011
8:26 am
The best D that I’ve seen from every Hawk all season.
If they would just play that kind of D every game . . .
Double Zero Eight
January 6th, 2011
8:29 am
It looks like Drew does have a plan given the roster that he has.
I hope he gives Teague and Collins as much playing time as
possible prior to the playoffs. We will need their depth.
Geemack
January 6th, 2011
8:33 am
Great win by the Hawks.
This big line up is for real. I wonder why it’s taking Drew so long to make it permanent.
Also they really should consider making Jamal a starter. If Lebron & D-Wade and function together, why can’t Jamal and JJ?
A bench that includes Marvin, Bibby Mo, ZaZa, & Powell would match any bench in the league. Including the Celtics.
terrell
January 6th, 2011
8:44 am
Have we ever played 4 qtrs of good basketball like that with Marvin in the starting lineup? Gotta stay big imo. If it aint broke, dont fix it. Bring Marvin off the bench with Jamal.
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
8:45 am
That defense was reminiscent of the Lenny Wilkens Hawks, when Mookie and 4teve Smith (a very underrated defender, BTW) and of course Dikembe.
I’ll never forget beating MJ and The Bulls in The Omni, and in a post game interview, Scottie Pippen lamented, “The Hawks were swarming, we could not put the ball on the floor to move it because they were attacking the ball from everywhere on the floor.” It was like a bees nest to watch the Hawks blanket their opponents.
Last night I saw a glimpse of that intensity. It always started with Mookie and ended with the finger wagging Mutumbo! Those were the glory days.
We are young and log enough to play that way, but it takes desire to do it nightly! Oh how I wish.
Kerry
January 6th, 2011
8:47 am
Great game last night, I love when they have control of the entire game, I’m vey proud of them, Keep Up The Good Work!!!
terrell
January 6th, 2011
8:48 am
Geemack, why start Jamal? He’s our spark plug. Plus Bibby gets us in the flow of the game. A bench that includes Jamal, Marvin, Mo, Zaza, Powell, and Teague is even better than yours. lol!
terrell
January 6th, 2011
8:51 am
Dr Mary, I dare you talk about defense when talking about LD’s Hawks. “The Hawks are soft this year, and LD doesnt care about defense. All he cares about is his so called motion offense”. Aint that right Samuel? lol!
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
8:59 am
Terrell (don’t call me Te-relle)!
You stupid boy! I know you saw that glimpse of old school defense last night.
What’s up Baby-Boy? Where have you been hiding? We being trolled to death, but MC has no defensive solution for that. LOL! The AJC is slow.
Ha Ha! Go Defense!
ant banks
January 6th, 2011
9:02 am
right now we are 5th behind orlando. can we get outta the 2nd round? yes, we are havin’ a good regular season, but how will the playoffs pan out for us?
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
9:04 am
Excellent display of what happens when everyone buys in and plays their role. Complete inialation of one of the league’s best and most polished teams. We made them look stupid. Tremendous effort Hawks! Good job.
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
9:07 am
LOL. Not ONE mention of Marvin in the entire write-up.
“I think we are definitely getting healthier as a team,” Joe said. “We are starting to figure things out about how L.D. wants things to be run offensively and defensively. Most importantly, we are going out there and having fun.”
Joe said “we are definitely getting healthier as a team.” LOL!!!!!!!! Marvin is OUT. That shows how this team feels about this guy.
it was not a bad pick, where you at? Joe and Jamal are beasting right now
Time to get some rest and take care of some weaker teams
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
9:08 am
Terrel – in drmaryb’s defense, last night was the first real strong showing of great team defense this year.
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
9:10 am
Hopefully we’ll roll upon returning home. Typically this team comes out flat and loses or barely wins when they return home w/ a 2-3 day break.
Marvin should be back for the Indy game JeJe – guess it was not a bad pick will start watching games and the blog again. Hopefully Marvin will continue his improvement after 5-6 nice games.
terrell
January 6th, 2011
9:11 am
Isnt it funny, how some people ONLY come around here when the Hawks have a bad game? Or get “outcoached”? lol! If the Hawks woulda lost, LD woulda been clearly “over his head” trying to outwit Jerry Sloan. Give the Hawks and LD some credit when its due, and quit hiding. Yall know who I’m talking bout.
terrell
January 6th, 2011
9:12 am
I’ve bashed this team myself a few times this year, but I dont run and hide when they play well.
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
9:14 am
Played well? Almost Perfect last night terrell. Makes you wonder? I always said when they truly buy in and play 100% we’d destroy anyone. I still believe that. It’s just – do they as a team?
terrell
January 6th, 2011
9:19 am
Fundamentals, well maybe thats why Sund is hesitant to make any moves.
terrell
January 6th, 2011
9:22 am
I believe if Marvin woulda been in with the 2nd unit, that Sac game woulda been a blowout too. Just sayin.
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2011
9:43 am
Best win of the season (IMO). Mo Evans is playing really, really well lately. When Mo is hitting his shots he becomes extremely valuable to this team because we simply don’t have that many guys who can be effective on both ends of the court. So while I’m glad to see Joe and Jamal get back in rhythm, I’m most encouraged by Mo’s play of late.
Oh yeah, nice drive & slam Jordan Crawford!
Rev in Tampa
January 6th, 2011
9:44 am
Its good to see some swagger…
JJ – “I think we are definitely getting healthier as a team,” Joe said. “We are starting to figure things out about how L.D. wants things to be run offensively and defensively. Most importantly, we are going out there and having fun.”
JAMAL – “I think it just took time,” Jamal said. “We just had to figure out how we were going about things. I think now we are doing a good job picking our spots. But we still have such an interior presence with Josh, Al and Zaza and all those guys in there.”
JJ – “Three big wins and coming off a great win like [against] the Jazz, it can definitely fuel you to a domino effect for us to string some wins here together,” J.J. said. “The East is tough, man, so we have got to get on a roll.”
The Hawks haven’t been talking with this confidence before last night’s game. It is good to hear them talking like this. It means that they are starting to believe it.
I also found JJ’s quote about finally figuring out how LD wants things run on offense and defense especailly intriquing. Something was definitely different about how the Hawks looked as a team on both ends of the floor. Last night’s win was much more than hitting 3pt shots.
Rev in Tampa
January 6th, 2011
9:48 am
LOL – Marvin is disappearing even when he is out with injury, but Damien (who got waived) and Pape (who got sent down to D-league) both showed up and were mentioned in MC’s article.
I posted this last on last night’s blog, but I thought it was worth repeating. Sorry for reposting the same stuff. You can just call me JeJe.
O'Brien
January 6th, 2011
9:58 am
As a starter, Marvin might have felt over-confident, and he was not usually challenged for minutes. I think going to the bench could be the motivation needed to keep him playing well.
And a bench of Jamal, Marvin, ZaZa and Mo is a solid bench (imo). The only thing missing is a solid backup PG.
AJ,
I think the Orlando wins rank up there too, only because it helps get over the mental block of getting blown out in the playoffs last year.
kwooden1
January 6th, 2011
9:58 am
Great Win! With Joe and Jamal hitting shots along with the other guys contributing. They can score with anyone in the league. From whatever one has said they played great defense also.
GO HAWKS!!
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
10:06 am
Terrell – ASG can bank on efforts like last night as their team, but it won’t happen every day…or better yet it hasn’t to date. They still need to find ways to improve this team to truly be a contender. We need a post defender and a reliable PG, not a backup. Teague needs to show improvement just to be the backup for LD it seems. Bibby could serve that role, but we need solid PG play. Last night it was Bibby/Jamal/Joe serving in that role.
O'Brien
January 6th, 2011
10:08 am
Duello,
It gets worse. If there is a new CBA, then the salary cap would probably be lower, and the luxury tax threshold would also be lower. So the Hawks may actually have less than $7 mil to spend before the luxury tax.
I dont think the Hawks can afford to resign Jamal, and I think that’s one of the reasons why they drafted Jordan Crawford.
With Mo and Jamal off the books, I think we sign a backup SF (vet min), a backup PF (vet min), and a backup C (vet min, and it might be Collins again).
Edgewood Adam
January 6th, 2011
10:19 am
O’ Brien,
Surely they would have to grandfather in the contracts signed before the new CBA. Maybe have contracts signed before 2010 count on a pro-rated scale.
Great win last night. I had almost forgotten what a great player JJ is. I have been telling anyone that will listen that if JJ can go back to taking over games then this team is a 3 seed like last year but with a better chance in the playoffs. We can run Boston out of the gym.
Astro Joe
January 6th, 2011
10:30 am
I think LD is also “freeing” the team to run a little more, which comes naturally to them. He seems to be calling for a little more fast breaks and less half-court sets even when they’re on the road. I never understood that original strategy, get easy baskets ESPECIALLY on the road… don’t try to make everything a half-court grind. After pushing the tempo against the Clippers, it was like the players responded well on both sides of the court.
dap01
January 6th, 2011
10:31 am
My concern is that if we again fall in love with our lineup. The starters will again be out of juice and our bench will again not be prepared to help out in the playoffs.
Remember how BAD the Hawks were the last two years at playoff time. What is different this year?
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
10:37 am
Enough of this “if we play at our best we can beat anyone” crap. Any team besides Sacramento and Minnesota can make that same claim.
Rev, was Damien by the bench last night? Didn’t see him
Rev in Tampa
January 6th, 2011
10:50 am
JeJe,
I don’t know if Damien sat with the team. I only know what MC told us – that he stayed with the team in Utah and was apparently in the locker room with them.
Rufus1
January 6th, 2011
10:55 am
Why collins should start….
Collins was guarding Jefferson in the post on the right block….crossed to the left block using a screen…jamal was guarding the screener, but didn’t proved help to Collins….jefferson got a layup….Collins was give jamal the business about his defensive assignment….next time Jamal did his job…
Collins does the little things to win games…He is the new “Difference” or D2
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
10:57 am
I still don’t understand how cutting Damien was a business decision. There was no reason in the world to cut him unless we are signing a PG (which we won’t). Why would we sign a 3rd PG if our 2nd PG doesn’t even play? Damien was making the VETERAN MINIMUM
FIRE SUND
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
10:58 am
“With Mo and Jamal off the books, I think we sign a backup SF (vet min), a backup PF (vet min), and a backup C (vet min, and it might be Collins again).
DAMIEN, POWELL, COLLINS
FIRE SUND
KevinM
January 6th, 2011
11:02 am
Can we keep the bulk of our bench roster intact next year? Yes, we keep Zaza & JC2, but questions about Powell will come up and I really like this kid. Collins, he is showing how much of a waste he was last year by not being in shape. He is adequate in the post and does help on the defensive end.
kwooden1
January 6th, 2011
11:02 am
The one concern I have out of a win like this is the jumpshooting. All those shots were falling last night, but that isn’t going to happen every night. (they have proved that Already) The defense from Bibby and Crawford are what needs to be consistant every game for this team to be more successful. I don’t think they are going to become an inside first team anytime soon. The HAWKS have two excellent perimeter scores in Jamal and Joe, so they are a good team if at least one of those guys is clicking. (along with playing good defense and rebounding) My issue though with that model is Miami and Boston. We can’t beat them consistantly doing things that way. Boston can stop our scores and so can Miami. We need more in the paint scoring out of Horford and Smoove to consistantly be successful against the elite. Our bigs take more than half their shots from outside the paint. That is one thing that really needs to change.
GO HAWKS!!
bigdave
January 6th, 2011
11:02 am
“We tried to stop them but they were good at keeping their composure and executing their offense,” Kirilenko said.
well damn.
Ken Strickland
January 6th, 2011
11:03 am
It appears to me that LDrew has decided to go with a 3 guard rotation, until Marvin comes back. If he decides to stick with the big lineup, it means MEvans will become the 4th guard in the rotation and take over the roll DWilkins had, with Marvin backing up Smoove. If Moe’s knee has full healed, he can successfully fill that roll.
kwooden1
January 6th, 2011
11:03 am
Rufus, nice observation.
Rufus1
January 6th, 2011
11:05 am
The New PG
I don’t know how many of you have been watching, but Jamal has been playing better at the PG. He has been getting the team in its sets better and getting his shots more in the offensive flow. His offensive eFG% has been going up(if I am not mistaking) and his defense is much better.
I think LD is grooming JC1 to be the finishing PG in late close games in the playoffs.
KevinM
January 6th, 2011
11:14 am
I gotta think that Jamal cannot have his contract extended at this point until the end of season. I don’t honestly see how the Hawks hold onto him unless they move a couple of contracts.
He will very much be in demand next season, CBA new rules aside. He should be considered a huge core piece.
Ken Strickland
January 6th, 2011
11:17 am
RUFUS1-What’s most impressive about Jamal isn’t how he’s running the point, but how well and consistently he’s been playing good DEF. He’s done a particularily good job of playing the passing lanes, getting steals and deflections. He’s showing a new level of aggressiveness, both offensively and defensively, and last night it seems to have affected MBibby.
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
11:23 am
BIBBY PLAYED WAYYYY TOO MANY MINUTES THESE LAST 2 GAMES
WTF?
LAP
January 6th, 2011
11:23 am
No Marvin Williams=Hawks better off.
Angers me even more that Sund gave him that god awful 5 year 38 million dollar deal.
Look how much better this team is when you start an actual center even if it is someone pathetic like Jason Collins(who deserves props for at least bringing it every night despite his physical limitations.) Can you imagine this team with a legitimate center so that Horford could always play the 4.
Billy Knight had the most warped conception of what a team should be when he believed Joe Johnson could be a full time pg and Horford a full time Center. It’s plain to see that this team is better with a big man clogging up the middle. If we could have used that Marvin money on a guy like Felton, imagine where this team could be.
Ken Strickland
January 6th, 2011
11:26 am
RUFUS1-You comment about JCollins and Jamal reminded me of the way the MJordan led Bulls took off after acquiring an aging, but very intelligent center named Bill Cartwright. His ability to play excellent man post DEF allowed them to avoid using double teams.
I also think he’ll get better at rebounding, scoring and rotating once he’s better conditioned.
Melvin
January 6th, 2011
11:30 am
No post from Slimjr lately. I wonder why????
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
11:30 am
I think Collins needs to lose a few more pounds
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
11:33 am
LAP
Big men ain’t just laying around. They are like azz-holes, everybody needs one.
Sautee
January 6th, 2011
11:34 am
Ramon,
about this: “Sautee, when you consider how often Josh actually creates his own shot or creates shot for others (which would probably be only behind Joe and/or JC1) compared to Al method of normally being set up for his points by someone drawing the double off of his man. You must say, that 2-4 turnovers is a lot compared to 4 turnovers because of how the turnovers came. Its the same way Lebron or Wade can have 4-5 turnovers in a game (and they do that regularly), but it wouldn’t be as big of a problem as Al Jefferson having 2-3 turnovers.”
OK Ramon, this is in response to my pointing out that your statement of “Al has as many bad turnover games as Josh” was untrue. So now you are saying (I think) that Horford’s turnovers, even if they are less than Josh, are somehow more egregious?
Let me point out something, Ramon. It’s NOT just Josh who sets up his teammates. Horford’s assists are just a tick behind Josh (3.2 to 3.6). Your reference to Al Jefferson hardly applies here precisely because Horford IS so good a passer for a 4/5. Jefferson, btw has a career average of 1.2 assists / gm. In your attempts to defend Josh (unneeded in my eyes) you are ignoring the fact that Horford ALSO sets up his teammates.
Rufus1
January 6th, 2011
11:36 am
@Ken
I completely agree about Jamal’s defense…it has been very good. I was a very big critic of his defense in the past, but the way he has been playing latley…I have to give him his credit.
I think Collins is our Kendrick Perkins…
So with Collins playing that role and Jamal playing good defense and scoring efficiently, people need to take a new look at our team….In the 4th qt we can match-up with anyone.
WE ARE CLOSER THAN MOST PEOPLE THINK!
Rufus1
January 6th, 2011
11:41 am
@Kwooden
Collins was the only person on the team that takes charges…but I thought I remeber josh taking a charge in a game…Those kind of things can be infectious
Geemack
January 6th, 2011
11:44 am
Terrell
Why start Jamal? Because he’s a better option at PG than Bibby and Teague. Marvin, & Bibby can give you that same spark coming off the bench.
The team will be better suited with Jamal in the starting line up especially against elite teams.
Romoe1
January 6th, 2011
11:47 am
Hawks funs, we the Hawks can get a decent center they will be one of the elite teams in the league. They are fine at the point between Bibby, Teague and Jamal, if they could trade Zaza, Mervin or Evans with a baggage with one of those players they have a chance to beat any body.
doc
January 6th, 2011
11:52 am
those who thopught it wouldnot take time to learn each other in ld’s system were kidding themselves. it also seems it hasnt taken the bulls longer to do the same so it isnt suggested as a crutch or excuse. i do hope the lights are finally on and we make a run. jj saying so moight mean something.
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
11:54 am
No one will know the CBA rules till they come down, so we can’t assume anything. Most likely the players won’t allow a deal that won’t allow some flexibility. Question will be the luxury tax and how ASG will respond next season?
Jamal is definitely setting himself up for a bit time deal if he can follow his 6th man season with a complete season on both ends. If he can show mastery of the PG in a up tempo motion offense he’ll be that much more valuable to a potential team. I’m interested to see what will happen when it comes down to pay him or lose him? Everyone has their ideas about ASG, but that to me will become their defining moment. Put up or shut up time is coming. ASG can make a real statement with how they handle Jamal. I only hope he continues to put pressure on them with his outstanding play on both ends.
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
11:55 am
Collins is solid (taking charges, etc), but he’s a bit too unathletic. I wish he’d lose some weight so he can better contest shots
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
11:57 am
Right now Jamal & JJ are showing they can play together. If Collins stays in the big lineup Marvin should respond well, if not better than when he was a starter. He can play multiple positions on the 2nd unit and dominate lesser competition. He seems to be a tweener in terms of his level of play. Hopefully it won’t take long to get him 100% after the back injury.
I.MUS WRITE
January 6th, 2011
11:57 am
Any trade that we make should include Mo Evans…Talk about a waste of a roster spot-he has been hobbled all year and his production is almost nonexistent. HTF is this guy labled a defensive stopper-I saw D Williams abuse him a few times last night-hell hes been getting abused all season. Pull the plug already!!!!
Pissed me off when we waived Wilkins -He plays great D and hustles every time hes in the game.
Stackhouse would be a great pick up IMO at 36 yo he is just as good as Marvin-The man played well against us in the playoffs last year in fact his and JJ the 120 million dollar man had similar statistics,,,Jus say’n
Al has become David West form 2 years ago-17 ft assasin…..Im suprised when he misses a shot,hes almost automatic from the elbow /top of the key.
Mo Evans/ZaZA for Ronny Turiaff Jamal/2nd for Turiaff
We should be enquiring about the 7′1 guy rotting away on the Knicks bench . Shot blocking-Ball skills -Post moves……. everything that ZAZA Gabore Lacks
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
11:58 am
Collins losing weight won’t help him JeJe – we need a youthful player of the same type as Collins. A defensive stopper. Someone with footwork and a knack for the boards. I still think that’s McGhee, but we most likley would never get him.
Scoop
January 6th, 2011
11:58 am
The secret to the Hawks success-put together the most grueling schedule imaginable, with more back to back games so far then any other team in the league. The Hawks are 9-3 on the 2nd game of back to backs, despite significant injuries to Joe, Marvin, and JC.
Winning 3 of 4 on the road without Marvin, who should be back in the lineup next game, is very impressive. The game to game improvement from the Hawks is finally becoming apparent, highlighted by last night’s game: we were recognizing the mismatches offensively, correctly dictating the tempo based on the situation, and our offensive spacing was the best I have seen from this Hawks team ever. There was one play in particular where a pick and roll was called for Joe on the strong side of the floor and he drove to the middle, passed the ball to Bibby on the wing when the defense double teamed him, and Bibby passed to Horford in the corner facing the defensive rotation for a easy basket.
Given, we were hot tonight with our shooting.A portion could be attributed to luck and the rest to our spacing and execution. However, what really impressed me was our execution defensively. Offense comes and goes, but defense should always be constant and we brought it tonight. I think now we are getting a glimpse of what this team can do when their healthy, especially their captain Joe Johnson.
It was not a bad pick
January 6th, 2011
12:00 pm
LAP
the Hawks would be even better with Marvin at the 3..Last night Josh tried his best to let Utah back in the game with his usual bad shot selection, and turnovers…Start Marvin , Al and Twin, and you may have a team that might advance past the 2nd round..good game Joe Max..It feels good to have your MAX player put up MAX numbers…Now if only he could do that every night…
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
12:01 pm
I doubt the Knicks are going to part with their Russian project. He’s too young to drop now. They’ll most likley try to develop him.
It was not a bad pick
January 6th, 2011
12:03 pm
Fundamentals
“He seems to be a tweener in terms of his level of play. Hopefully it won’t take long to get him 100% after the back injury.”
You got to be talking about Josh..
Marvin is a natural sf who can get you 20 ppg if the hawks would call plays for him…Josh is a classic Tweener..he is a small pf…not a sf..his bad shot selection and turnovers will hurt the hawks in the end
Ramon
January 6th, 2011
12:22 pm
Sautee, its truly hard to explain what I’m saying without video. But assists doesn’t mean you’re a play maker. If you watch, you’ll see Josh pick up a lot of hockey assists. You’ll see his initial move on this man, many times is just the first of two passes (swinging from the corner with defense reacting) of the shot that is finally attempted. But the initial play was made off of the first pass, even though that player will not be credited with an assist. Also for a good while Smoove was the initiator of majority of the fast breaks. It first started when T. Lue was Woody’s man crush, lol. Because there was no one else who would push the fast break. More and more lately, Al has started initiating the break as well.
Also to go along with it, how often do we see a big (the Zaza rule) drop a pass from Josh right under the basket still to this day? I just view Josh as more of a creator than Al is. So with that, higher turnover rates are expected.
Ramon
January 6th, 2011
12:30 pm
Sautee, Horford gets his assists from the offense, not from creating and making plays as much. That is evident in the fact that he’s averaging a full assist higher this season than he was last season. His assists are coming from back door screens when he’s in the high post, and hitting Joe or Bibby at the elbow coming off a pick. That’s not creating. That’s a play called by the coach, lol.
Not So Casual Observer
January 6th, 2011
12:33 pm
You are correct – Marvin was not a bad pick, he was an absolutely awful pick.
Marvin gives effort about 1 game in four and his body is not that of a SF. He has the lower body of a post player, without the strength, and the upper body of 2 guard. Marvin is an average shooter (or worse) from mid to long range and could not average 20 points in an empty gym.
Ramon
January 6th, 2011
12:38 pm
Marvin wasn’t a bad pick. The draft is a crapshoot, and a straight gamble. Many though Marvin would be the best player in the draft. But Marvin was a TERRIBLE re-signed player. It wasn’t stupid to draft him. But it was stupid to re-sign him for that amount. There are a long list of SF who produce the same or more than Marvin, for a lot less money.
Sautee
January 6th, 2011
12:49 pm
it was not a bad pick,
you said this: “Last night Josh tried his best to let Utah back in the game with his usual bad shot selection, and turnovers…”
I’ll call BS on this statement.
First, shot selection: Josh only took 8 shots for the game and 4 of them were within 9 feet of the basket. That is NOT poor shot selection. Many nights you can join me in criticizing his shot selection, but NOT last night. He took only two threes and hit one of two. That’s 50%. Isn’t that a higher % than Marvin shoots on 3s?
And yes he had two turnovers, but he also had 4 assists and two steals. That’s a net PLUS and not at ALL “letting Utah back in the game” as you try to put it.
By the way, about turnovers…..
Marvin Williams career assist to turnover ratio: 1.07
meaning that for his career he has (only) 1.07 assists for every turnover he makes
Josh Smith career assist to turnover ratio: 1.2
meaning that for his career Josh has (only) 1.2 assists for every turnover he makes.
For all of Josh’s sloppy plays and careless passes, he takes care of the ball better than Marvin, and that’s even though he handles the ball MUCH more than Marvin does.
Look man, it’s fine if you want to ride Marvin’s jock. Go for it. But you do not have to tear down other hawks to defend Marvin. And when you make erroneous statements like today, you can be sure that someone will come along and challenge you.
Clyde
January 6th, 2011
12:57 pm
Woodson didn’t want a rookie point guard thats why he drafted Mavin Williams and signed Speedy Claxton.
MJC
January 6th, 2011
1:06 pm
People need to give Jason Collins some love. We play better when he is in the starting lineup.
CavilierJones
January 6th, 2011
1:07 pm
Last nights Hawks game was absolutely, unequivocally the BEST HAWKS WIN IN ATLANTA TEAM HISTORY, PERIOD. The Hawks played solid through and through and never, ever appeared as though they were fazed by anything the Jazz did. A great win against a quality opponent. I feel that right now:::if the Hawks were to begin a playoff series right at this moment, they would easily win the Larry O’Brien trophy (gold trophy) signifying them as “WORLD CHAMPIONS”. They are playing that well right now and I now they will remain unchalleged if they keep it up. Think of this, how many times have the Hawks gone on a 4-game west coast trip in their history and came back home 3-1. I dont ever remember it. Go Hawks! Keep rolling on!
terrell
January 6th, 2011
1:13 pm
Why not use Jordan Crawford as the backup pg? Just looks like he has IT. Cant say the same for Teague.
terrell
January 6th, 2011
1:25 pm
Yawn @ it was not a bad pick.
O'Brien
January 6th, 2011
1:27 pm
Fundamentals,
Even if the Hawks are interested in bringing Jamal back, I think another team will offer him just as much money (if not more), and somebody will offer him a starting spot.
I think Jamal would love to play for the Knicks, and even if they get Melo, they can offer the Hawks a sign and trade for him. And the Hawks would have the option of getting a TPE in return (if they didnt want equal salaried players).
His decision making has improved, and his defense has looked a little better. In a perfect world, the Hawks would resign Jamal, and spend the money to upgrade the other positions.
Ken Strickland
January 6th, 2011
1:42 pm
I’ve been rather critical of LDrew and his decisions lately, especially his recent decisions not to play Teague, DWilkins and JPowell. However, I understand him pulling the plug on DWilkins, since I’m certain he knew he’d be waived.
Earlier in the season it was obvious to me he was experimenting with his rotations, and running what I call an extended preseason. That’s why he gave Teague, Powell and JoCrawford mins. I think that approach has come to an end, and he’s now developing a fixed rotation for the playoffs.
I think he’s decided that Teague and Jordan’s development will have to wait until after the season. It also seems he’s decided to go with starting the big lineup, and will go back to the small lineup as dictated, rather than the other way around. It appears Jamal has become our backup PG, MEvans our backup SG, and Marvin our backup SF.
It looks like his rotation will likely be Marvin-SF, MEvans-SG, Jamal-PG, Zaza-C, with Horford rotating from PF to C, and Smoove rotating from SF to PF. That’s a pretty good 9 man rotation. With everyone, except Marvin, fully recovered from their injuries, and producing at max efficiency, I see LDrew preparing the team for a serious 2nd half playoff run.
For me, this is the only logical explaination for his abrupt change in philosophy, approach, rotation, and starting lineup.
Ken Strickland
January 6th, 2011
2:10 pm
If Jamal continues to play decent DEF and shine as our backup PG, don’t be surprised if the Hawks resign him and he becomes our starting PG. Jordan Crawford can certainly do a good job of being our instant OFF off the bench. He can certainly score, add energy, penetrate, finish, dish, run the OFF, maintain an uptempo OFF, and run or finsh a fastbreak.
Jamal can certainly give us more on both ends of the court than Bibby is capable of giving, and if given adequate mins, Jordan Crawford can duplicate Bibby’s production while coming off the bench.
K.W.
January 6th, 2011
2:11 pm
Great win for the Hawks.
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
2:32 pm
It was not a bad pick. You’re blind crusade for Marvin missed my point. I meant Marvin isn’t good enough to really dominate 1st tier players, yet he’s so much better than 2nd tier. Coming off the bench will give him tremendous opportunities to fill up the stat sheet as opposed to being a 5th option.
Does your boy want his role or not? Is selfish ambition and pride going to get in the way of winning? Do you care about the big picture…or just Marvin? It’s so easy to see, except for you.
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
2:36 pm
O’Brien
We can wait and see. I agree with your points, but my point is that ASG can set a precedent here. Do they want to pay, make it interesting or at least try to get something out of Jamal to improve this team. Letting him walk and using JC2 would be an embarassment. They can really send a message to fans, the league and free agents by how they handle Jamal.
We haven’t made the moves that some folks like, but you must agree that ASG has laid out the money for what it wants. Now will they lay it out for what they “need” to take the next step. We’ve grown slowly over the years. They’ve promised great things would come. It’s pretty much time for them to put up or shut up.
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
2:54 pm
Unless we are shopping for a new PG, we REALLY need to decrease Bibby’s minutes. He played like 35+ the last 2 nights ( he was in vs. RONNIE PRICE).
His major minutes will destroy him come March and onward
JeJe
January 6th, 2011
3:03 pm
Against the better teams, why not just start a lineup of Jamal Joe Josh Horford Collins, and bring Bibby, Duck, Mo, and ZaZa off the bench? It’s worth a shot against a team like Boston that is likely to get off to a good start
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
3:51 pm
I agree JeJe – it’s not that we don’t like Bibby. We value his contributions. He’s balling so far all year, but in the end he doesn’t have the legs for these extended minutes. We’ve gotta protect him for when it really counts. Winning now won’t matter if we don’t have him later.
You could also go Joe/Jamal/Josh/Horford/Collins with Bibby or Teague/ Mo/Marvin/Powell/ZaZa off the bench with JC2 and Etan available as well.
Fundamentals
January 6th, 2011
3:52 pm
Bringing ZaZa in as starter against faster teams would also allow us to stay big, but not be as slow as Collins. Swapping Bibby/Collins for Jamal/ZaZa would change our pace in response to matchups.
Double Zero Eight
January 6th, 2011
4:09 pm
Let’s give Teague some playing time against
the bad teams when we are winning handily.
Bibby is playing a lot of minutes and we may
need Teague to contribute during the playoffs
(if he has proven worthy). It is too early to
give up on him.
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
4:25 pm
Msdee – I’m one who wondered why the Hawks never blow teams out, and only win ugly against bad teams. Glad we pulled a surprise!
Only complaint about last night? Jeff Teague should have been in the game the last 5 minutes of the 1st half instead of Bibby. It was clear Bibby was gassed, but LD kept him in.
And he should have brought Teague in earlier at the end of the game, and played Etan instead of ZaZa when we’re up by 20 with 3 minutes left. Other than that, no complaints.
PS – Teague is not Acie Law. Hope LD doesn’t destroy him.
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
4:27 pm
You Called It!
I just want to give some love, props and a huge shout-out to Mr. Strickland!
Ken has been standing his ground and staring down the barrel of negativity, pessimism and despair all Summer long.
Ken has envisioned the Hawks that we all witnessed last night and the previous night in Sac-Town, (before the bench stumbled). OBrien, warned us about being healthy and we know how we played through a knee surgery, back problems and elbow surgery as well.
However, through all the impatient cries for JT0 and JC2 to play, Coach Drew stayed the course, remained calm and the team responded in kind. No one panicked, Josh pouted and threw his head band around, but Drew just ignored him and he just went away. There was no Dog-House nor berating for Josh to endure, Drew just drive along like “Mr. MaGoo” – rolling past every dangerous cliff and falling boulders.
I know it’s just 4 games, but, it was: The Way We Won.
We looked like a Big Red Machine rolling through the West.
We were shiny and sitting on dubs with spinners –
“California Country – Style”. When Marvin, returnsN I hope he can get in where he fit in. There has been a changing of the guards.
____________________________
Again, a ton o props to Mr. Strickland for calling it like he saw it, through all the adversity!
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
4:28 pm
I still say start Zaza, Al, Josh or Marvin, JJ, and Teague and see what happens.
Of course Josh is a much better player than Marvin, but I’m still not convinced he wouldn’t be a beast off the bench. But it would only work if we got the Marvin of the past 18 games or so, not the invisible man.
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
4:31 pm
Drmaryb – Actually, we blew the OKC game, looked terrible for 3 quarters vs. the Clips, looked great for 3 1/2 qtrs. vs the Kings and blew the doors of the Jass in Utah.
A 3-1 road trip. I’ll take it. Could easily have been 4-0, we really had the the Thunder.
Rufus1
January 6th, 2011
4:34 pm
@drmaryb….Great post
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
4:39 pm
ESPN Headline of Hawks win:
“Johnson, Hawks handle Jazz with Millsap out ”
In their headline, the only reason we won is because Millsap didn’t play. It’s not like this was a close game or anything.
KenS – I wouldn’t mind Jamal playing PG, but we’d have to ditch a salary, either Marvin or Bibby to make that happen I would assume.
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
4:47 pm
SteveW
No one destroyed Acie Law, Law has no game to destroy.
JT0 will not be destroyed, if he can’t ball? That’s on him!
__________________________
This ain’t College where you can shine amongst boys, like the NFL?
This is a Grown Man’s Business. Peel your ears back and hold on for dear life – it’s the speed of the game baby. These NBA dudes are huge and phenomenally strong and skilled. This is not a developmental league man.
These kids better show up with their “A” Game or A Game at all. Because, these Coaches don’t give a damn about nothing, but, winning A Basketball Game – Period! They don’t give a damn about a grown man crying.
___________________________
No Woman – No Cry! (Yall figure that one out). LOL!
hint: a stuck b!atch will holler. He He
It was not a bad pick
January 6th, 2011
4:53 pm
Sautee
In the third, Utah got it down to 10..Josh made two bad turnovrs, and jacked up a 3 that was a air ball..I am not lying..Wow people on this blog love Josh…but a blind man can see that his turnovers and bad shot selection is and have always been a big problem…It only takes one game with Josh showing no energy and jacking up jumpers for every one on here to start screaming TRADE JOSH..It happened after the Bos game…
Fundamentals
I misread your post the 1st time, but i still dont agree with Marvin not being good enough to dominate 1st tier players…Just go back and look at the games when Joe was out…Now if you put him in a corner and tell him to wait on the ball, yeah you are taking away a lot of his game….And i do care about wining, i have always said if Drew started a true center, so al can go to pf we would be ok..I just dont like Marvin to the bench for josh, who really is better suited for the bench…
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
4:58 pm
Drmaryb – Agreed about Acie, but Teague is a different animal. He’s better than Acie, and we can mess up his head.
But I also agree this ain’t Dleague. Teague needs to come ready play. JC2 also. Wonder what statement LD was making when he put JC2 in before Teague last night? Looks like Teague may be just before Etan on the bench, unless Mr. Sund has a talk with LD.
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
4:58 pm
Pick Your Draws Outa’ Your Azz!
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
5:14 pm
Shrink – It!
“and we can mess up his head.”
____________________
Then he better do like Artest and hire a Psychiatrist!
A Coach is not a Doctor. I guess Nick Van Exel helped his son find his inner-dog, because he was out in Dallas killing people – (allegedly). But, so far, Teague isn’t killing nothing but his game. IDK what Teague is doing in practice or the locker room, but for some reason Coach isn’t allowing him to kill his W-L record.
I have no opinions about the guys that don’t play, just the ones that do.
______________________
Having said that, I would release Nick Van Exel to go take care of his personal matters. If you can’t manage your house, you clearly can’t manage anything outside of your house. IMHO
Chad
January 6th, 2011
5:24 pm
Why is it the usual suspects are not here posting comments when things are going good?
GO HAWKS!!!
It was not a bad pick
January 6th, 2011
5:27 pm
To a certain person, Acie Law had game..The Hawks ruined his game…the hawks refuse to play young point guards…
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
5:31 pm
““Johnson, Hawks handle Jazz with Millsap out ”
In their headline, the only reason we won is because Millsap didn’t play. It’s not like this was a close game or anything.”
Hawks need more than one impressive road win to live down last year’s playoff debacle in the eyes of the national media. Nobody considers the Hawks to be a legit team, and I can’t blame them. Until the Hawks prove they have improved in the playoffs, they will continue to be disrespected. If the Hawks are smart, they will use that as motivation.
Sautee
January 6th, 2011
5:31 pm
it was not a bad pick,
about this: “In the third, Utah got it down to 10..Josh made two bad turnovrs, and jacked up a 3 that was a air ball.”
Yes, he did, but did those turnovers hurt us? No, they did NOT because the Jazz failed to score afterward. And we got an offensive rebound on his missed three.
And yet, despite the fact that these turnovers DID NOT affect the outcome of the game, or even the score at the time, you are smugly accusing Josh of “trying his best to let Utah back in the game” which is, as it turns out, a FLAT OUT LIE. If the turnovers actually HURT us, then you would have a case.
And that’s not to mention my earlier point that in addition to the two turnovers he produced 4 assists and two steals. My point is that he did MUCH MORE to affect the game in a positive way than he did negative, but guess which one YOU noticed?
It says a lot more about you that you would choose to focus on any negative thing Josh does (and Joe) then to give him credit for helping us win. What a fan you are!
I guess since Marvin looks unlikely to grow stones anytime soon, the best you can do is tear down his teammates. Thanks, by the way, for pointing out that Marvin lacks stones (I think you called them “kahunas”)
ATL FAN
January 6th, 2011
5:32 pm
FIRE SUND. Trade Marvin, we look great without him. Resign Jamal to a new deal, play him as starting SF. Dont resign Mo, sign Stackhouse, draft a big man next draft to play off the bench. 2012 NBA CHAMPS!!
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
5:33 pm
Timing!
In defense of Teague though, I don’t really think he has done anything that has kept him from getting more PT. It’s just TIMING. There have been more pressing needs and Coach has been evaluating his team with the new offense and new defense.
The main core has been severely injured and learning how to play in the new motion offensive sets. It has not been easy and it does take time to do that. Our record is very competitive, so, Coach must be doing something right.
Coach has been our version of “Matty Ice” no panic, no deer in the headlight looks and a very professional court-side demeanor. No Antics nor emotionial outbursts. Larry Drew has done an excellent job with what he has to work with or without.
sam'l
January 6th, 2011
5:45 pm
Up to now, I’ve been more concerned about the Hawks players being on drugs……..now I’m worried about the bloggers.
Do you really think after 50 or so years of teasing us,, this team is finally over the hump?
Miami and Orlando and Boston and San Antonio all look pretty good right now….It would be nice to join that group.
….
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
5:46 pm
A Thousand Words!
That photo of Josh waving the towel and telling the Jazz fans to “Throw it In!”
Is hilariously funny and appropriate!
From myTV, I could hear the crowd being hostile and screaming at the Hawks and the Refs. Even, Bibby was out of character, when he blew the fans kisses as he retired to the bench! That was a very hostile environment to play in.
The Hawks showed very stout mental toughness last night.
Utah is not even a rivalry to the Hawks! I thought we were in New Orleans plaing The Saints for a minute. LOL
But look at all the faces looking up at the scoreboard, and away from Josh and at each other in utter disbelief. Great Photo by the camera man.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
5:46 pm
Joe Johnson is on Jim Rome Is Burning tomorrow at 4:30 on ESPN.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
5:48 pm
It’s supposed to be cojones, by the way, not kahunas.
Sautee
January 6th, 2011
5:51 pm
Najeh,
Yes, I know that, but was using the term he used. I guess I should have put a (sic) after kahunas, LOL!
Worldwide Clyde
January 6th, 2011
6:15 pm
The highlight of the night was Jordan Crawford’s dunk over that 7 footer from the Jazz.
FREE JORDAN CRAWFORD
Sautee
January 6th, 2011
6:20 pm
Yeah Clyde but the real question is, would Sean Williams have stuffed his ass?
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
7:00 pm
Pause
Najeh Davenpoop
January 6th, 2011
7:00 pm
“Yes, I know that, but was using the term he used. I guess I should have put a (sic) after kahunas, LOL!”
Yeah I was addressing Granny, not you, haha.
Ken Strickland
January 6th, 2011
7:09 pm
DRMARYB-WHAT’S UP LOVELY LADY? Last nights gm really was the type of performance I had envisioned for this team. It seems LDrew pushed several buttons, which he’s done in the past, but this time the team responded. He pushed the ISO button to exploit matchup advantages. He pushed the post up button, which forced them to provide help, and we passed out and they swung the ball beautifully. And he pushed the motion OFF button.
Like Karilinko said, we tried to make a comeback, BUT THEY REMAINED CALM AND KEPT RUNNING THEIR OFF. Remember when they switch to playing zone, and we moved the ball well, and scored so easily they quickly abandonded it? But the biggest difference in last nights win was the committment to playing 4 qtrs of consistent team DEF.
DOC-have to agree with you on that assessment. I don’t know why it’s taken us longer than the Bulls, but it certainly seems as though that’s what happened.
STEVEW-MEvans’ $2.5M comes off the books after the season, and we’re still several million under the cap. Crawford has been perfectly open and honest about his desire to remain a Hawk. The possibility of starting again, but this time on a winning team with potential, might get him to consider going for an acceptable Hawks offer, even if it’s not the highest offer.
SAUTEE-DON’T BE SO MEAN.
O'KSEE
January 6th, 2011
7:54 pm
all imma say is…nique better hit the Dougie! GO HAWKS!!!
honest_abe
January 6th, 2011
8:23 pm
great win.
8 shots by josh is encouraging. let the scorers score. thanks.
darrell starks
January 6th, 2011
8:32 pm
Great win last night.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
8:36 pm
KenS – We have 64+ million $$’s committed for next year with 9 players – Al, Marvin, JJ, Josh, Teague, Bibby, ZaZa, Sy, and JC2.
The cap will be different under a new CBA next season, much less. We are actually 13 million over the cap for this season, but $700,000.00 under Luxury Tax.
darrell starks
January 6th, 2011
8:36 pm
Collins is the anchor on defense, every since he have been in the starting line up the defense have look smooth, plus his defense take a lot of pressure of JOSH, HORFORD, in the paint.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
Blast
January 6th, 2011
8:40 pm
Surreal win last night. Wished I taped it so I could watch it again now. Hope it means Hawks have turned the corner. We have a chance to go on a winning streak this home stand.
Suprised Damien was given the choice of hanging with the team. Never seen that happen before. Something must be in the works, cos if the Hawks wanted him away for good, they would not have invited him to stay with the team. What is cooking? Something is brewing underfoot.
NBA TV crew cracked me up this AM. First, it was Greg Anthony inviting himself to lunch at Jamal’s expense. Then it was Jerry Stackhouse trying to wrangle an invite to Hawks roster. Hawks lot must be looking up if Stack is applying for a job with them on national tv!
darrell starks
January 6th, 2011
8:46 pm
Yes josh only took 8 shot but still scored 12points, the reason for that is josh agressiveness going toward the basket, have marvin ever took 8 shot and scored 12points ? nope.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
8:49 pm
Joe Johnson’s 1st year line with Boston (before the trade to the Suns)
20.7mpg, 6.3pts, 2.9 rbs,, 1.5assts. – I’m sure glad someone let him develop. The next season with the Suns for JJ (his 2nd year).
27.5 mpg, 9.8 pts, 3.2 rbs., 2.6 assts.
Close to what Teague would average actually. But somebody let him develop, and now he’s 3rd team All NBA.
Same with Kobe:
1st season
15.5 mpg, 7.6 pts, 1.9 rbs, 1.3 assts.
And 5 rings later, Kobe is Kobe.
I’m glad the Hawks were not in charge of developing them! We only developed Josh because we were a worthless 13 win team who couldn’t do any better. And he’s turned out pretty good.
And P.S. Joe Johnson is only a 2nd tier Max player, not a 1st tier Max money player like Kobe. JJ got the Max he could get in years of service, but not the Max the NBA allows to 10+ year vets, like Kobe. So when we say JJ and Kobe are max players, they are different kind of max players. Rudy Gay is a max player, but only a 1st tier Max, not 2nd like JJ, or 3rd and highest tier like Kobe. Just wanted to clarify.
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
8:53 pm
Darrell Starks – On Nov. 28th at the Knicks Marvin took 7 shots and had 13 pts.
On 12/20 at Orlando Marvin took 8 shots and scored 12 pts.
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
8:57 pm
Dirty Work!
honest_abe
Josh does so many little/big things that don’t go unnoticed, see the stats sheets.
Nimbers don’t lie. I agree with you, that the scorers should do the heavy lifting.
Like Doc told Tony Allen in a Celtics huddle, “Ray is the shooting – Allen, Tony is the defending, rebounding Allen.”
Coach has to communicate these roles apparently before, during and after the game I guess. But, Josh plays all over the place and he is stubborn and emotional.
From that photo up there, wouldn’t you say Josh is our Emotional Leader as well?
SteveW
January 6th, 2011
8:58 pm
Marvin had games of 26pts, 22, 18, 17, 16, 15 (twice), and 14 in December. Some of you guys act like he only played well the last 5 games before he was hurt. Not true. Actually scored 13 and 17 in the last 2 games of November as well. LD has had Marvin come alive, let’s get behind him and hope it continues (by some miracle maybe?)!!!
Sautee
January 6th, 2011
9:28 pm
Najeh,
ROFLMAO @ “pause”
When I typed it, the double entendre never occurred to me, LOL!
drmaryb (*_*)
January 6th, 2011
10:25 pm
SteveW
OK Steve, I will get behind Marvin and support him. But, I’m only doing this because you asked so nicely and it is the right thing to do. I really, want to see all the players do well. They deserve that respect and support.
I don’t get into the personal attacks and name calling. I will say that has a very large booty though. _smile_
Let’s Go Marvin! Get Well Soon, we need you back and we want you back.
Ramon
January 7th, 2011
12:09 am
Drmaryb, the Hawks are 9-5 this season when Josh scores over 20 pts. And three of the losses are to playoff teams (Jazz, Dal, OKC). The other two losses were to Det and NJN, and we know both of those losses were more due to the back court inability to guard Harris or Stuckey.
Melvin
January 7th, 2011
12:21 am
Nice article on the upcoming CBA…
http://blogs.hoopshype.com/blogs/tolnick/2011/01/06/a-harder-soft-cap-exploring-the-possibilities/
O'Brien
January 7th, 2011
8:10 am
The new CBA negotiations will be interesting.
I’m looking forward to the new CBA, and I hope it allows for more parity in the league.
Lakers Payroll – $91 mil, Orlando payroll – $90 mil, Dallas – $88 mil. I know they pay dollar for dollar luxury tax, but still.
Plus player salaries need to be cut back.
There is no reason why guys like Rashard Lewis, Michael Redd, even JJ should be making the money they make (imo).
It was not a bad pick
January 7th, 2011
8:50 am
SteveW
“And P.S. Joe Johnson is only a 2nd tier Max player, not a 1st tier Max money player like Kobe. JJ got the Max he could get in years of service, but not the Max the NBA allows to 10+ year vets, like Kobe. So when we say JJ and Kobe are max players, they are different kind of max players. Rudy Gay is a max player, but only a 1st tier Max, not 2nd like JJ, or 3rd and highest tier like Kobe. Just wanted to clarify.”
Joe Max has a max contract..No way around it…The game he had in Utah should be a normal thing..not 1 great game every 4 games due to his contract..He cannot be just solid, if the Hawks plan to move past the second round..Marvin has been soild, and he is the 5th option..We need big scoring games out of Joe Max..I hope he steps up and realize that this is his team..
JeJe
January 7th, 2011
9:04 am
LOL @ northcyde a few weeks ago acting like the lineup with J.Collins as start would be a problem for us.
3-1 on a West Road Trip
Fundamentals
January 7th, 2011
9:08 am
SteveW,
I’ve always said give Marvin till Feb to see if he can mesh with LD’s system. He obviously has shown he can. If he falls back off the wagon we most likely can attribute it to too many “shotmakers” and not enough balls.
JJ and Jamal are balling, with Smoove and Al seeming content to win and play their role. Can Marvin come back and get 15-20 per night along with them? Can he get boards, steals and play awesome D when he’s not? That’s the question. Can they all play their role?
I hope so, I really do.
drmaryb (*_*)
January 7th, 2011
9:23 am
Free Markets and Capitalism!
“There is no reason why guys like Rashard Lewis, Michael Redd, even JJ should be making the money they make (imo)”
_____________________________
I strongly and vehemently disagree with this convenient statement!
We live in The Free World where the underlying premise is
Survival of The Fittest!
In a player owner relationship, the player is the product sold and the franchise collects all revenues, from ticket sales, TV, food and beverage vendors, to merchandise sales, and everything in between. The sharing of revenues is a financial obligation due primarily the players and building employees and coaches and staff members.
I posted a comment from The Lakers owner last week verbatum, where he said this, while chuckling, “Kobe is directly responsible for 80M per year in revenue collected by The Lakers.” From that statement, I surmise that Kobe’s 25M/Year salary may make him under-paid relative to what is collected from his contributions to the ownership pie. This makes me wonder how many years especially back in the 80’s and 90’s were these players robbed blind and raped at the pay window!
I won’t even address the collegiate fiasco, were college players can’t receive a $100 hand shake or a slice of pizza from the billions they generate.
The Sports Business is Racketeering at the highest level and form!
So, damn anyone who claims a player should not make fair market value in a sports equation. Just take a peek and look at the Revenue Books before making such an asinine statement. Sorry for the strong language, but that statement really irks me to no end.
Should a Real Estate Agent walk off with 20K from a closing, because she showed someone your house? No! But they did, and that greed was the beginning of the end in The Real Estate Market crash of 2008, that ended up on Wall Street.
_________________________________
Greed at the highest level. I say to the players, “Hire an Agent and Shake the owners like a salt shaker or a polaroid picture!”. Whichever, you prefer!
___________________________
Why? Because: Four Score and Seven Years Ago – some sh!t happened and we
were promised an indelible right to The Pursuit of Happyness!
drmaryb (*_*)
January 7th, 2011
9:47 am
LeBron James Undermines Labor Union Talks
by Adrian Wajornowski
Dec. 24, 3:17 PM
__________________________
An excerpt:
“ere’s the case James could make, and he’d be right: The biggest stars in the sport – LeBron, Kobe, Dwyane Wade – are far underpaid with maximum contracts. And the rest of the league’s players? They’re mostly overpaid. Privately, Lakers owner Jerry Buss tells people that Bryant has been worth as much as $80 million a year to his franchise. Most of the players in the sport are interchangeable and never affect television ratings, ticket sales or merchandising. Yet, Kobe and LeBron – and before them Michael, Magic and Larry – are responsible for the sport’s immense popularity and profitability”
_________________________________
In this article is a caption under Kobe’s photo …
“I am 100% committed to the players and I am not about to give back what the players before us has fought for and given us.”
_________________________________
From the Jerry Buss statement, my point is this:
“If this is OK and fair, why is he only saying it “PRIVATELY” that Kobe is worth 80M? In defense of OBRIEN, I know that Joe is not Kobe and does not generate anywhere near that amount in Ticket Sales, Merchandise, etc. But he and Rudy Gay have certainly benefited from The Spirit of This Rule. It’s not so much that Joe and Rudy are overpaid, as it is that Kobe is UNDER-PAID!
And that, OBRIEN is on the OWNERS!
Ken Strickland
January 7th, 2011
10:22 am
STEVEW-your response made me do a little digging and check out the Hawks cap situation, and you were right, which is usually the case with you. Thanks.
We have 5 more gms before meeting the Heat. Is there anyone besides me who thinks the Hawks can enter that gm on an 8gm winning streak? So far, this yrs version of last yrs Hawks have done pretty darn good, for a team that lost it’s 4 time AllStar(JJohnson)and 6the MOY(JaCrawford), who were out at the same time for extended time, as well as MWilliams, as starter. Here’s what I see as improvements over last yrs team.
1-Far more ball and player movement, and far less dependence on ISO’s.
2-Better team and individual DEF.
3-LDrew’s Ability/willingness to make adjustments and/or changes.
4-His ability/willingness to create favorable matchups, and eliminate unfavorable matchups.
5-His ability to get better performances, and win more on the road.
6-His ability/willingness to utilize his bench more by consistently utilizing a 9-10 man rotation.
7-His ability to make in gm adjustments.
8-His ability to deal with his players in a manner that’s avoided any friction with or among the players.
9-The team has shown a much better ability to close our gms in the 4th quarter.
JUST MY HONEST OPINION, AND FOOD FOR THOUGHT.
Big Ump
January 7th, 2011
10:54 am
drmaryb
What’s up my lady? I still see you kicking it hard and truthful. I hope you had a good holiday. I will have the group touring schedule together sometime next week. You will be one of our VIP.
Ken S.
I may not totally agree with your last post, but I think it’s a great post. By the way how everything with you? Ken when were you across the water? Myself 69 to 70. I ETS out of Fort Lewis. I understand you were a Marine. I wasn he Army myself. I guess we have a lot to talk about.
ILL-Logical
January 7th, 2011
11:19 am
The primary challenge for the Hawks going forward ,as I see it,is establishing/maintaining consistancy. Not only will consistant play result in more wins but it will begin to challenge the national media’s perception of the team. and that is important in terms of revenue genration from TV appearances and ,frankly, repect from the refs.
drmaryb (*_*)
January 7th, 2011
11:37 am
* consistent
drmaryb (*_*)
January 7th, 2011
11:41 am
Big Ump
Hello my man. I would love to catch one of your shows. Just send me a link and let me know when and where. The Holidays were fine and Happy New Year!
KenS
HNY to you too! My prayer is that you continue to win your battle with the health issues. Great to see you are still keeping the blog positive and hopeful in regards to our favorite team: The Hawks!
O'Brien
January 7th, 2011
12:44 pm
it was not a bad pick,
Most fans are disappointed in the play of JJ this year, and we would like to see more consistency (and bigger games) out of him. Most fans are disappointed in his play in the playoffs last year too.
But whether he is worth a max contract or not, Hawks had no choice but to pay him to keep him. It’s the way the NBA works, so hopefully he will step his game up.
Marvin has been solid, especially of late. But its easy to be solid when you are the fifth option.
Make Marvin the first option, and teams will double team him, teams will put their best defender on him, and teams will game plan for him.
If that happened, I think you would see just how (not) solid Marvin would be. Unless you know something that Roy Williams at UNC (who brought Marvin off the bench), Woody, and LD dont know…
drmaryb (*_*)
January 7th, 2011
1:37 pm
Joe needed elbow surgey, perhaps the injury affected his game and learning a new offense? Do we have amnesia or just plain ignoring the real facts.
What are the fans disappointed about? A player injury? Then say that! Don’t just ignore the truth. If I were a player, I wouldn’t listen to these fans either, they’re crazy.
ant banks
January 7th, 2011
2:37 pm
hawks are on the cusp of reachin’ “elite” status, as defined by sund. he said that he considers teams who win 20 games on the road as “elite.” hawks are 12-9 on the road, surely they will win 8 more road games.
i think that “elite” status should be reserved for teams who MAKE IT OUTTA THE 2ND ROUND.
ILL-Logical
January 7th, 2011
3:01 pm
Sorry about the spelling.
Ken Strickland
January 7th, 2011
3:20 pm
BIG UMP-What’s up, and thanks. I spent 19mos on Okinawa in 68-70. I was all excited about being there, for about 6mos. Then I realized I had seen just about everything there. I started getting depressed after realizing I had another 12mos on that rock. I wanted to avoid Viet Nam, and I definitely wasn’t going to jail or Canada. So, I joined the Air Force and took an immediate 18mo overseas tour.
I had a chance to spend my entire 4yrs stationed at Lackland AFB playing basketball and assigned to the gym. I missed out on a 3yr tour of duty in Sicily, but a broken finger caused those orders to be cancelled, so I ended up in Okinawa. The experiences I had over there, and in the military in general, caused me to finally grow up and take charge of my life.
As far as the cancer is concerned, I signed up with VA to get treatment. I don’t know when it will start, or where they’ll send me to get it done, but it will get done my friend. Considering I was only a few months from turning 64 when it was detected, I have to keep in mind how lucky I was that it was only in its early stages.
Back to basketball. I’m certain eveyone noticed the drastic improvement in JJ’s shooting against Utah. But did anyone notice the protective bandage on his elbow had been removed? If we continue to play OFF and DEF, especially DEF, the way we played against Utah, Teague and Powell should get some mins.
If the collective bargaining agreement causes the luxury tax limit to be reduced, the Hawks will have to trade at least on of our 9 guaranteed contracts. Since Bibby’s would have the only remaining expiring contract, he’d be the likely one traded. I have a question for everyone. If we make a trade and use the $3.3M trade exemption to acquire more salary than we take back, does it in any way affect our salary or luxury tax cap?
Boooo!
January 7th, 2011
3:53 pm
Steve Nash to ATL?
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=18398
Tehy’re not getting a crawford. I’d do it for Marvin, Mo, and Bibby in a heartbeat though + Picks
Boooo!
January 7th, 2011
4:09 pm
Honestly though if we could just get Kirk Heinrich and Andre Igoudala while only giving up Marvin, Mo, Mike, & Etan, I would be extremely pleased.
Maybe in a three team trade?
Boooo!
January 7th, 2011
4:11 pm
I know sombody will take them….
O'Brien
January 7th, 2011
4:15 pm
Phoenix already have grant hill and Josh childress, so I doubt if they would want Marvin.
Trading Crawford for Nash is an interesting idea. We would lose bench scoring, but our starting team would be better with Nash starting. And then bibby would become our PGoff the bench, with Mo Evans more PT at backup SG.
I doubt if the ASG and Rick would consider the move though. 1) Nash is not expiring, so his contract and horford’s extension would increase our payroll next year and 2)Crawford has been playing really well of late, and the Hawks are winning.
drmaryb
January 7th, 2011
4:17 pm
Bad Pick?
Here’s some truth for you and your drum banging re: Marvin should demand a trade?
an excerpt from: http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=18398
“On the surface, the Hawks can’t offer much in talent in return for Nash. The Hawks have shopped Williams but have found no takers, plus the Suns already possess a plethora of wing players.”
____________________________________
Good luck with that Marvin Williams trade demand. Nobody out there wants him, yeah I know ..I know…6 years as a starter wasn’t enough time to grow some stones….blah….blah…blah!
Josh and Joe wouldn’t pass the poor guy the ball, nor put it in the basket for him … eek …eek (rubbing my eyes with tears).
Well, folks looks like it”s gonna be another White X-mas … This time around, I hope Marvin gets well soon and return to his team and play whatever role Coach asks of him. If Marvin picks up where he left off, this team really does need his contribution. I’m all in, I promised SteveW last night that I would get behind Marvin and show him some love and respect. That he does deserve, he is a fine young man, very classy and intelligent and does have a nice game when he comes ready to play.
Melvin
January 7th, 2011
4:45 pm
Joe Johnson is on ESPN Jim Rome is burning show right now..
SteveW
January 7th, 2011
4:46 pm
Ramon, so the Hawks have basically the same winning % whether Josh scores 20+ or not. I assume that is the point?
9-5 Win Josh scores 20+ for a .643 winning percentage
15-9 When he doesn’t score 20+ for a .625 winning percentage
Very close to the same %.. About about 1/2 game difference. Negligible. And if the Hawks win let’s say the next 2, with Josh scoring 19 in each game, you could make a better case statistically that the Hawks a better with Josh not scoring +20. In other words, at this point, it makes no difference whether Josh scores 20+ a game or not. No indicator whether the Hawks will win or lose.
SteveW
January 7th, 2011
4:48 pm
“a” should be preceded by “are” in the last paragraph before the word “better”. Sorry, in a hurry typing, and didn’t check the spelling.
It was not a bad pick
January 7th, 2011
4:51 pm
O’Brien
Marvin only came off the bench for NC because they had a veteran team..In the championship game he made the key basket to help them win the NC..I think he would be a more willing passer than Joe..Joe should easily average 8 apg..
drmaryb
i dont believe the Hawks are shopping Marvin…we are not dumb enough to draft a guy #2, never really run plays for him, then watch him become a star some where else…If we traded Marvin to the Suns for Nash, I would be highly pissed…Nash is old and Nash cannot stay with any pgs in the NBA..I thought every one hated Bibby for that?….I would trade Jamal for Nash, because i doubt we sign him back after this year..
SteveW
January 7th, 2011
5:02 pm
It was not.. – Lie if you want, but JJ is not a player making the maximum the NBA allows, he is only making the maximum a 2nd tiered of the 4 tiers available.
1st tier – 10 year + vet
2nd tier – > than 10, but I can’t remember the other number and don’t want to look it up now.
3rd tier – A Rudy Gay max player, available right after your Rookie scale contract
4th tier – Rookie scale contracts
And of course you vet minimums, and all kind of salaries in between.
And remember, Joe took a risk. He turned down a 4 year 60 mill. contract offer by Sund, to play his final season on his last contract. What if he would have blown out a knee severely? He took a gamble, and it paid off in the free market. More power to him.
And with the current CBA, we only had the mid-level exception to re-sign a player if JJ left (5.7 mil per year), because we were over the cap. JJ Reddick signed for 7.25 mill per. Salmone got 8mil per. Miller with the Heat got 6 mill. per. And all those players are nowhere near the player JJ is.
We were looking at Flip Murray and Jarvis Hayes taking JJ’s place, and a trip to major mediocrity. I’m glad we re-signed him. And we’ll renegotiate in 3 years, keep him longer, but pay him less per year.
SteveW
January 7th, 2011
5:05 pm
And it was not… – I shouldn’t have used the term “lie”. My bad. But the truth is the last post, and you can’t twist it to fit your narrative of Joe Max. He is a max player, but not like people think. He never comes close to the 30+ mill Kobe will be making in a couple of years.
SteveW
January 7th, 2011
5:07 pm
We don’t call Rudy Gay, Rudy Gay Max, even though he’s making the max he can as a 3rd tier FA. But he still makes about 40 mill. less than JJ, who is making less than Kobe.
Boooo!
January 7th, 2011
5:15 pm
IDK what’s so hard for PPL to understand. KB24 makes like 24mill a year and JJ has been making between 17-14 mill for the last five years. stop looking at the total contract value. Joe is NOT making MAX money.
MJ was making like 30 mill a season. So baisically JJ is like half the player MJ was from a contract/value standpoint.
AND STOP CALLING HIM JOE MAX! It sounds like some perverted Tampon campaign.
Boooo!
January 7th, 2011
5:18 pm
Jermaine O’neal Made 21mill last season. Talk about theivery.
Rod from College Park
January 7th, 2011
6:08 pm
“The Hawks have shopped Williams but have found no takers”
Wow. I wonder why? No other NBA want’s Marvin Williams but the Hawks. Maybe they could trade him to the NBDL? No team will give away a good player for Marvin at this point of Marvin’s contract.
O'Brien
January 7th, 2011
6:11 pm
When Orlando signed Rashard Lewis (from Seattle), didn’t they offer him the max too?
drmaryb (*_*)
January 7th, 2011
6:18 pm
It was not a bad pick, said this:
“i dont believe the Hawks are shopping Marvin…we are not dumb enough to draft a guy #2, never really run plays for him, then watch him become a star some where else…”
_____________________________
You were the one on the last blog that has been cryingn “Marvin should demand a trade!”. I never said Marvin is currently being shopped (maybe he is?), however, Marvin Williams was placed on the trading block after last season and was the ONLY Hawks player on the trading block all Summer long during the biggest FA period in NBA history, with LeBron and Bosh leading the way.
The Hawks had no offers and no team(s) were interested in his services, or the offers made for him were laughable to the Hawks! Either way, he is still here and he is appreciated by the Coaches, team mates and owners. Marvin, will not be traded if it doesn’t improve the teams chances of winning.
But, he owes it to the org to bring his “A” Game and all out effort every game.
So far, he has done that. Coach Drew deserves equal credit for this as well.
Nobody on this blog wants to see Marvin fail, we need him top play well and fill his role. Defend, rebound and hit his open shots better than 50% would be very nice. Get to that FT line would be gravy.
Let’s Go Marvin! Get Well Soon!
superiorblogman
January 7th, 2011
6:23 pm
Danny Granger may be available or come available. I got that info from hoops hype com
First of, I do not care that we are trying a new lineup or don’t want to hear of messing up chemistry. Josh can either go to the bench or Granger can come off of the bench. Can you imagine Jamal and Josh or Jamal and Granger coming off the bench? Seriously no lead that another team could get on us would ever be safe and we would be a upgrade of Collins as starting C away from no style another team could play against us being unmatchable with our talent.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2d4bwwf
Marvin and Zaza a 1st rounder and a 2nd rounder for Granger. This is a case in which they would need a SF back and they would get another big which they have been desperately looking for plus 2 picks. I would even make that 2 1st round picks if push came to shove.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 7th, 2011
6:24 pm
Most of the Jim Rome interview with Joe was just cliches and nonsense (Rome ended the interview by asking Joe about Boo-Ray and Joe seemed genuinely confused that he was being asked that question) but Joe did say in that interview that his elbow is still not 100%.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 7th, 2011
6:30 pm
“Steve Nash to ATL?
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=18398
Tehy’re not getting a crawford. I’d do it for Marvin, Mo, and Bibby in a heartbeat though + Picks”
I’d do it without thinking twice. I like Jamal, but we are talking about the possibility of acquiring a future Hall of Famer here. Are you f-cking kidding me? This is a no-brainer. Can you imagine what wonders Nash would work for Smoove and Al’s games? Each one of them would be throwing down 3 or 4 alley oop dunks per game. Joe would get wide open 3 point looks all game long. Combine Nash’s point guard savvy with the Hawks’ athletic ability and you would get one of the most unguardable teams in the league.
Jamal’s scoring off the bench wouldn’t be missed nearly as much with Nash’s dead eye shooting in the starting lineup, Bibby’s dead eye 3 point shooting off the bench, and Nash’s presence improving the overall offensive efficiency of the team.
Sh-t, I’d throw Teague or Jordan in the deal to make that work if Phoenix insisted. First-round pick? Done. Two first-round picks? I might struggle with that, but I’d even do that if it had to be done. I wouldn’t give up Joe, Smoove, or Al (and that’s only because of age) but I’d gladly give up anyone else on this roster to get Nash in a Hawks jersey.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 7th, 2011
6:31 pm
And if the Hawks can get Nash without giving up Teague, I would think playing behind Nash would do wonders for Teague’s development.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 7th, 2011
6:33 pm
Or, even better, how about Jamal and Marvin for Nash and Josh Childress, who is wasting away on the Phoenix bench but who would fit in perfectly in LD’s offense. Maybe as a token of appreciation for taking Childress’ contract off their hands, Phoenix won’t ask for as much in young players and picks.
hbcuclassics
January 7th, 2011
6:36 pm
HBCU Classics All-Americans 2010
Defense
LB Keith Pough, Howard
LB Dejuan Fulghum, Tx Southern
LB Cliff Exama, Grambling
DL Kenrick Ellis, Hampton
DL Brandon Peguese, Hampton
DL Derrin Nettles, Morehouse
DL Christian Anthony, Grambling*
DL Malcolm Jenkins, Elizabeth C.
DB Moses Ellis, Prairie View
DB Prathon Wilkerson, Albany St
DB Kejuan Riley, Alabama State
DB D’Vonte Graham, NC A&T
*injured player
http://www.hbcuclassics.com
Najeh Davenpoop
January 7th, 2011
6:39 pm
“Phoenix already have grant hill and Josh childress, so I doubt if they would want Marvin.”
Grant Hill is old and expiring, and I think the Suns would take Marvin and the one less year owed on his contract if the Hawks took back Childress. I think it would be worth it to the Hawks, since Childress’ contract is worth less annually and he does a lot of the dirty work Marvin doesn’t do.
Najeh Davenpoop
January 7th, 2011
6:41 pm
Another advantage of trading for Nash, of course, would be the corresponding increase in attendance. Even acquiring Bibby in ‘08 resulted in a modest revival of fan interest; getting a two-time MVP and future Hall of Famer would likely have a much bigger impact on the team’s attendance.
I really don’t see a downside to making this deal. If for some weird reason it doesn’t work out, Nash’s contract expires next year.
Rev in Tampa
January 7th, 2011
6:55 pm
I happened to be in Radio Shack when I saw in Jim Rome so I turned up the volume to listen. Sales clerk didn’t like that I did it but I told her it was Joe Johnson so she let me hear the rest of the interview. I’m certain she did not know who Joe is.
I thought Jim Rome was being condescending in asking about the Mayo/Allen incident. Even when it was clear, as Najeh noted, that JJ was unsure what Rome was referring to, Rome continued to suggest that it would be easy for that sort of thing to happen on the Hawks team. JJ said he couldn’t imagine it since the team chemistry is so good. But Rome wouldn’t let it go. Rome came off as being unusually jerky.
Major de`Coverly
January 7th, 2011
7:00 pm
Marvin should be trade bait because we play better with a big team-
marvin and jordan crawford and jeff teague and evans is a good trade for nash and somebody they don’t wont.
superiorblogman
January 7th, 2011
8:11 pm
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2b6a5dg
Zaza and Bibby for Jameer Nelson and Ryan Anderson since they Magic really want another big if they are in bad need here they go.
Ken Strickland
January 7th, 2011
8:18 pm
When Marvin returns, the Hawks will become a bigger, taller, deeper, more versatile, and better offensively and defensively. You can whine, cry, and complain about him all you want, but we need him. As much as I feel we need to replace MBibby as our starting PG, I’m not stupid enough to believe we don’t need what he does best.
Some of you need to get past your personal issues with certain players and put team needs 1st. While you might not like Marvin, for whatever reason, the fact still remains that we are a better team with him.
Rev in Tampa
January 7th, 2011
8:20 pm
New blog is up…
Ken Strickland
January 7th, 2011
8:44 pm
With what JJ and Jamal are saying about the team finally getting what LDrew expects, and with their, and the teams, performance against Utah, I’m really excited about the remainder of our schedule.
If Drew decides to settle on starting the big lineup, look for JCollins’ rebounding, scoring and help DEF to improve as he becomes better conditioned, and more comfortable with, and confident in, his fellow starting teammates.
Blast
January 7th, 2011
9:10 pm
Najeh,
Great series of posts. Couldn’t agree more. Folks say Hawks need a point and center. With Collins holding it down at the five now, we need a point more. Nash is as best as you are gonna get. And he puts Hawks over the top. Like the trade with Chills too.
Where the new blog at? MC out and Ken subbing. This is the latest blog.