Atlanta Hawks: Hawks 95, Bucks 80
Twin put his big body on Bogut. (Benny Sieu / Milwaukee Journal Sentinel)
Milwaukee–After scoring easily in the first half for the second straight night, the Hawks found themselves in a asasa game against an opponent that tends to thrive on it. On top of that the Bucks were rested while the Hawks were coming off that draining L at New Orleans last night.
- So it’s significant that the Hawks were able to win ugly at Milwaukee with a methodical, professional effort. “Coming in here off the back-to-back, we knew this game would be a physical game,” L.D. said. “I thought our guys responded really well tonight.”
- The Hawks scored 33 points after halftime against the Hornets and lost. They scored 38 in the second half against the Bucks and won.
- No doubt there’s a difference in offensive talent between the Hornets and Bucks, who are the league’s least efficient offensive team. And that’s mostly with Brandon Jennings.
- But Milwaukee just carved up and shut down the Lakers last week at the Staples Center. They could do neither to the Hawks, who made amends for that beatdown last month.
- “The last time we played this team they pretty much embarrassed us,” Joe said. “To come out and play the way we did tonight means a lot. We’ve got to try to build on this. We’ve got to try to string five or six wins together.”
- The Hawks were humming on offense in the first half: 22 of 40 field goals, 15 assists, six turnovers. All 10 guys who played scored and eight of them recorded at least one assist. “It’s nice to watch, I will tell you that,” Al said. “We are sharing the ball, different guys are getting involved. It seems like that is when we are at our best.”
- Then Iso-Joe returned in the third quarter. Fortunately for the Hawks he made a couple tough shots and Al got enough pick-and-pops that Milwaukee never could make a sustained run.
- Al continues to get it done despite his sore right hand. It was really swollen after the game and Horford said he plans to get an MRI tomorrow after X-rays were negative. “I know I look fine out there but it’s tough,” he said. “When I stop playing it feels OK but as soon as I get back out there it’s hurting.”
- I’m thinking the hand might explain Al’s seeming reluctance to go to the hole. Then again, if opponents inexplicably continue to give him room for jumpers then maybe there’s no need. “We set a pick-and-roll, everyone sunk in and almost gave me those wide open jump shots,” he said. “I had to take them.”
- Marvin was back on the bench with Twin starting at center. To Marvin’s credit, he remained aggressive and productive. He’s been consistent lately.
- Collins had 12 rebounds in 32 minutes. He frustrated Bogut. He freed Al to work over Ilyasova. He got in the way when the Bucks went to the hole and even drew a couple charges to kill their momentum. Only one of his four shots was a bad one.
- “I told him after the game, I want to see what our record is when he starts,” Josh said. “It has to be well over .500.” Actually it’s 5-5 but you know what he’s saying.
- “Jason has been doing a great job all year guarding bigger players,” Al said. “He’s been huge for us. It takes away from us having to help so much.”
- Smoove started the game attacking the rim. Eventually he began to wander back out to the perimeter but he was 6 of 12 so take the good with the bad.
- Efficient offensive game for Jamal in his second game back. He scored 14 points on eight shots and had two assists without a turnover. “I felt a lot more comfortable,” he said. “Yesterday I was just trying to feel my way.”
- His value is most apparent in games like this. Jamal, Horford and Marvin were the only Hawks to score in the fourth quarter.
- Bibby struggled for the second straight game. Teague replaced him late in the third quarter and Bibby didn’t return. L.D. mentioned Bibby was one of the guys who needed the holiday break so maybe he’s worn down.
- Teague played 18 minutes and made them count. It seemed like he followed every mistake with a positive play, such as when he chased down Brockman after a turnover and basically leaped over the 6-7 forward to block his layup attempt on the break.
- It remains to be seen if efforts like this will ever mean a regular role for Teague. “We knew with the matchup he was going to be able to match speed for speed,” Drew said. “I thought Jeff did a great job.”
- “Lester [Conner] tells me every day, just come in and try to make an impact on the game,” Teague said. “Do what I do and try to push the ball and try to be active on defense. That’s all they ask from me.”
- Even with Collins holding down the middle, it’s not like the Hawks shut down Milwaukee on the perimeter. Boykins, Dooling, and Salmons still were effective. But the Bucks got nothing from their forwards while Al, Josh and Marvin all were efficient.
- Zaza had a very good five-minute stint in the first half but then stayed on the bench after halftime. Mo had a very good seven-minute stint in the first half and got the same treatment.
- DNP-CD for Josh Powell and Damien Wilkins. L.D.’s rotation has yet to settle.
- The Bucks tried to rally in the third quarter but the Hawks always made a play when they needed it. For us, it was just a matter of maintaining our composure,” Twin said. “Once we answered them I think we took the wind out of their sails.”
- It was a weird fourth quarter for the Hawks. They shot 50 percent and held a 15-6 rebounding advantage but only outscored Milwaukee by five points. Atlanta had seven turnovers but Milwaukee only turned those into four points. The Bucks took 11 of their 20 shots in the paint but made only four.
- The Hawks scored just 38 points after halftime. This did not appease Bucks coach Scott Skiles: “They threw the ball wherever they wanted to throw it, did whatever they wanted to do all night really. Just methodically went through their stuff and their options and handled us pretty easily. It was worse than the score even appeared.”
Michael Cunningham
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109 comments Add your comment
Hawk n the Ham
December 28th, 2010
12:47 am
I missed the game due to the Falcons nail biter. Thanks MC!
Rev in Tampa
December 28th, 2010
12:54 am
MC,
Inqiring minds want to know: Why did Teague not play at all against CP3 in New Orleans? It seemed like the situation perfectly suited to Teague’s quickness. He got a DNP even though Bibby could not stay in front of Chris Paul and Jamal was stinking it up on the court.
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
12:55 am
Ken Strickland: “This is just speculation on my part, but maybe MEvans is playing more than DWilkins because Sund want’s to show teams he’s healthy, and is being showcased as trade bait.
lt’s also amusing to read some of the biased comments about Marvin being more productive coming off the bench of late, when he’s actually been more productive as a starter over the last 6gms.”
If you start Collins, our starting 5 is better rounded, and you have MORE SCORING OFF THE BENCH. That’s the main point
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
12:57 am
Package Bibby for MONTA ELLIS
sam'l
December 28th, 2010
1:24 am
Time for the Hawks to put it all together now…….I think I noticed some pretty stiff competition coming up soon…….
..
Najeh Davenpoop
December 28th, 2010
1:29 am
Props to Collins. I would have never guessed 7 or 8 months ago that he could actually be useful. He’s been great whenever he’s been in the game over the last month or so.
Hawks (beat) Bucks
December 28th, 2010
2:07 am
Hawks played better on back-to-back than the Hornets did. Hawks won on the road and Hornets lost in Minnesota by 15.
Next up: Home against Golden State and then back on the road to Oklahoma City and then @ Clippers / @ Kings to open up January. Thunder will be tough but that’s still 3 outta 4 very winnable games that might put them on a good winning streak
Reggie
December 28th, 2010
2:17 am
@Najeh im glad u finally see twins importance to the team…before the season i said something about him being an importanat piece and you wanted to punch me through your computer screen.
L-QUE
December 28th, 2010
2:25 am
Marvin been reading about the trade talk,but he can play the 2, 3,4,5,he has already done this ,he played Okafur last game , he has great value, i got to stick with Josh ,they will be great players when they mature to the NBA game.poor Bibby GREAT WIN HAWKS
Najeh Davenpoop
December 28th, 2010
2:38 am
“@Najeh im glad u finally see twins importance to the team…before the season i said something about him being an importanat piece and you wanted to punch me through your computer screen.”
LMAO… don’t think I went that far, but I’m glad to be wrong on this one.
Grandad
December 28th, 2010
3:06 am
We only run when Al or Josh lead the break,
Teaguer notwithstanding, his coast to coast
ending the [1st qtr?] shows how his speed can
affect the game.
Joe stops the flow and the sharing [offense].
Watch him – when he catches it takes him forever
to make a decision, then he starts pounding the ball.
It’s impossible that on occasion someone is not open
immediately upon him catching. @ least now and again.
He never catches and makes a touch pass or a direct feed.
Trade Marv -now- while he is looking pretty good before
Sund and ASG fall in love with him all over again.
The team has won *20, count ‘em *20 games now!
Our problem on this board is:
were ready for the Hawks to make the jump,
as the Falcons did and become legit contenders.
Which is why so many of us wish for a trade to show
the fans (and the players alike) that the ASG
is committed to not only a winning culture, but an
organization whose purpose is winning a championship.
Grandad
December 28th, 2010
3:11 am
Didn’t mean to sound so critical.
We need another win streak.
Plus we need to beat a couple of good teams.
Lastly, we need to continue improving. (every game)
Mido
December 28th, 2010
6:47 am
i wonder if philly will trade Young for evans plus a draft pick? so we can finally get rid of marvin’s contract while his stocks is still good and use him as a trade bait to get us a serviceable C or PG.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=23×3g6p
E43
December 28th, 2010
6:54 am
The hawks need to find a way to put players on the court consistently, and they need to do so sooner rather than later. They may not have the bench power to do so but running a motion offense limits your choices. Right now it may be cool to have guys playing 40+minutes but it will hurt you in the long run. Kind of like the same way it has the past two years with the hawks getting bounced in the second round.
Mike is back
December 28th, 2010
8:34 am
MC, thanks for the detailed insight on the game…I missed the game watching them BIRDS.
Josh is on to something when he was speaking of Twin…give him credit…Twin has work himself back into NBA shape…no reason why we can’t keep him in the starting lineup…than Marvin gives you a extra punch coming off the bench…regardless of what his salary is…Marvin coming off the bench…give the Hawks a new dimension… it’s something I wish you could ask LD about.
Great observation on Bibby…clearly he is starting labor some…Dude has been huge for the Hawks…Ultimately, I think we are going to have to live with some of Teague turnovers…to get him ready for the playoff…he has made great strides…I hope LD is serious about giving Bibby a break…that would be a wise decision.
KEEP GOING…GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
8:39 am
Grandad, you have a good point. I’ve been saying that for 2-3 seasons now, that Josh and Al don’t give the ball up on fast breaks, because if they did, that would end the fast break opportunity. True enough it may occasionally cause turnovers, but more good things happen than bad things when they’re leading the break. Bibby can’t run like he used to, and Joe just refuses to. So isn’t that the VETERAN backcourt ONCE AGAIN (did it to Woody) undermining what the coach is telling them to do. LD keeps saying he wants them to play faster. But who has the ball more than Bibby and Joe? Nobody. So why don’t LD make an example out of his veteran back court. He tries to make an example out of Josh and Al for shot selection and foul trouble/defense. Why are they and Teague the only ones being held accountable?
J from the A
December 28th, 2010
8:42 am
The Hawks fans could really learn something from the Buck fans.
After all, the Bucks do not have any superstars and they are not a championship caliber team, yet their fans come and fill the arena … and even more telling of the quality of their fans, they continue to cheer — and cheer loud — even when their team is down 15/17 point.
J from the A
December 28th, 2010
8:46 am
Again with the Joe refuses to share the ball BS … he is the team’s ASSIST LEADER.
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
8:59 am
J from the A, for years, Allen Iverson was the assist leader in Philly, Kobe has always been the assist leader in LA, even before Shaq left. Michael lead the Bulls in assists in his younger days. When many of us say Joe refuses to share the ball, it means majority of the time Joe gets the ball he uses up a minimum of 5-7 seconds BEFORE he makes a move or passes it. By now the players are just standing and watching, so he’s not putting anyone in a best position to score or attack. Joe has so many assists because we have so many great jump shooters on the team, not because Joe made the play for them.
Daniel
December 28th, 2010
9:01 am
It’s easy to be the assist leader when you have the ball 75% of the time you’re on the floor.
So if Bibby needed a holiday break, why in the world was he playing over 40 minutes against the Hornets? Does MC not ask these questions for fear of Drew getting pissed at him? I saw that comment and didn’t know whether to get angry or laugh.
It was not a bad pick
December 28th, 2010
9:12 am
good game by the Hawks..The only problem I have is, Drew is scared of josh smith..No way I start josh over Marvin at the sf..I dont think Josh would accept that role….If Marvin gets 15 to 20 shot attempts a game, He will average well over 22 points a game..I like Marvin offensive game more than i like Joe’s..Marvin is more efficent…Its time to start Collins,Al,Marv on the front line…Josh is a perfect 6th man because he really does not play a position..More of an hybrid forward….
It was not a bad pick
December 28th, 2010
9:18 am
J from the A
With the amount of time the ball is in Jamal and Joe Max hands, they both should be around 7 or 8 apg…Al and Marvin should get way more touches..That would stop the offensive droughts…
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
9:18 am
It was not a bad pick, Josh really doesn’t play a position? But he was the best defensive PF in the league last season.
drmaryb (*_*)
December 28th, 2010
9:22 am
J from the A
Like Josh said, “Everybody knows there is NOTHING to do in Milwaukee!”
Except to load up the kids and go to Chicago.
Please understand, they are CHEESE-HEADS! They go to see the Packers and Bucks like Southerners go to Church! It is a family tradition, a way of life and a religion to cheer these two teams. What else are they gonna do?
Like Josh asked, “You mean, there is no Ruth Christ’s Steak House here?”
Come on, “J” Didn’t you know that?
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:27 am
About Bibby, I thought the same things. Why play him 41 minutes, when he can’t guard Paul or Jack? And a Teague DNP Coache’s decision? It’s not that we lost to the Hornet’s, It was just a seemingly winnable game that looked lost because of LD’s rotations.
And no Wilkens when we are playing the likes of Ariza?
But last night all is forgiven. Good win, on pace for a 49-50 win season in the improved East. Hope we don’t fold like a tent in the playoffs again.
And I hope Horford is healthy.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:28 am
And I don’t know who the blogger “It was not a bad pick” is, but ever since he started blogging, Marvin has been playing really good basketball. Keep blogging!
J from the A
December 28th, 2010
9:30 am
drmaryb,
I guess you have a point there! Even still, it would be nice to see half of their enthusiasm in our fan base.
it was not a bad pick,
I have come to appreciate your point of view on Marvin. I think you overstate the facts a bit, but underneath these overstatements, there is definitely is some truth. Marvin is talented (way more talented than most of us give him credit). I’d be willing to bet if he was on a team where he was the first or second option, he would probably 18/8 kinda guy.
However, I completely disagree with starting Marvin over Josh. Given Marvin’s abilities and his role (and his role is given to him in part because of team make-up), perhaps he is a more potent weapon coming off the bench.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:31 am
31 and 38 points in the 2nd half of the past 2 games. That’s not going to win many ball games. Maybe LD is great a pre-game coaching and strategy, but doesn’t adjust well at halftime.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:35 am
Starting lineup tweaks I would like to at least try:
Teague over Bibby
ZaZa over Twin (good game last night Twin!)
And Marvin over Josh.
I think Josh would be dynamite off the bench if his ego would accept it. Could you imagine Jamal and Josh off the bench?
And I know everybody keeps telling me Josh’s #’s are down because he has been playing more 3. I can accept that for blocks, shooting % (way down in Dec.), and steals. But why would moving to 3 make his Assists go down a full assist per game? I still say Josh’s head is not completely in the game this December, and I don’t know why.
J from the A
December 28th, 2010
9:36 am
Re: Bibby:
Bibby has been solid this year. As we have all seen, his spot up jumpers have been on point, including outstanding from beyond the arc. He is a good facilitator, etc. etc. He has even given improved effort on defense this year. (BTW, his defensive fundamentals are very strong; he just isn’t as fast as he needs to be to keep up with some of the faster PGs in the league.)
However, I have to agree: Bibby does not need to be seeing 30+ minutes per game. The Hawks need him to be fresh for late in the year. Plus, the Hawks need to continue to develop Teague. Teague has come along tremendously since the beginning of the year (or at least it seems). Having a “ready” Teague and a rested Bibby going into the playoffs would be great.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:37 am
Ramon – You make a good point about Josh. He was 2nd in Defensive Player of the Year voting, right behind Dwight.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:40 am
I think just about everybody on this blog has said, the keys to the Hawks besides health are Teague, ZaZa, and Marvin. Unlock those 3, and you have a ECF contender on your hands.
And it seems Marvin and too a lesser extent Teague are getting unlocked. I still wish LD would make Teague a regular part of the rotation. The guys got freakish athletic skills that you can’t teach.
oldtimer
December 28th, 2010
9:41 am
Good win for Hawks last night, which makes it even harder to understand why Drew refuses to go with the same lineup, and give at least as many minutes to Teague on a regular basis.
I agree with Grandad, Joe holds the ball too long. Last night he was just holding it, not even bouncing for many seconds and then finally launches a long jumper (i think he made one and missed one). Very strange, I mean ball was just sitting in his hand, nothing at all. Ball must move around, motion offense or not.
Good win, let’s stay with the same lineup and get Teague at least 20 minutes a game
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:42 am
Mido – It would have to be a 1st pick and a couple of 2nd’s for them to even look at it. Young is a Taj Gibson type of talent. Maybe better.
It was not a bad pick
December 28th, 2010
9:43 am
Ramon
Josh is a pf in a sf body…
J from the A
I really am beginning to think Drew was bad hire…Some body has to get Josh to play closer to the rim, I dont think Drew is that guy..Marvin is a better sf than Josh..i like Josh, but he still cannot shoot, and a lot of his jumpers seem to get the Hawks out of sync, if the Hawks had a center who shot jumpers, maybe you could post Josh up against sfs, but josh starting at sf will be a disaster in the future…other than Al, Marvin is the Hawks best jump shot shooter…
SteveW
Its more to come with Marvin.if the hawks ride him, he will score big..We need Joe Max to pass the d&*# ball sometimes…
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:44 am
JJ ain’t changin’, just sayin’. This is JJ’s team and he knows it. And he currently makes 14 times what his head coach does. Just sayin’s all….
STRETCH
December 28th, 2010
9:46 am
I know this is off subject, but does anyone else think that some NBA players look like other people?
Marvin Williams – Tracy Morgan
Michail Finley – Billy Ocean
Andre Miller – Richard Pryor
Just a few that i came up with!
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
9:46 am
And JJ is guranteed 49+ times as much by the Hawks organization over the next 6 years. This is JJ’s team, and the ball will stop when it gets to him usually. End of story.
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
9:49 am
SteveW, if teams come out of the jump trying to set the tone. Why take away your best interior defender and try to convert him to a six man? Josh needs to be in the game against the best front court players and point guard. How many times have we heard when Josh isn’t in the game, there’s no one there to protect the rim? Also, Josh is still a better SF than Marvin, and a better PF than Al (sorry but Al defense is better against centers than power forwards). Marvin has 5 decent games, and Josh has an excellent (not stellar) career. I’ll take Josh. Besides Marvin on the bench allows you to be able to trade Jamal for another bench center or point guard. Marvin can come in and back up Joe. What’s the point of going ‘big’ if you’re going to put in the players who PLAY small (Marvin)? lol
I believe, LD needs to sit Al for a week or two though and let his hand heel. Its better to go ahead and let him get some time BEFORE the all star break. You need everyone as healthy as possible for the home stretch (ala Boston last season) more than anything. Chicago are without Noah right now, so this is the perfect time.
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
9:52 am
It was not, in that case D12 is a center in a pf body. He’s only an inch taller than Horford, and has the upper body of Karl Malone and Charles Oakley, more so than Hakeem, David Robinson, Duncan, Shaq, and other centers. Charles Barkley and Rodman was shorter than Josh. And Horford is only a half an inch taller than Josh, and weigh the same.
It was not a bad pick
December 28th, 2010
9:56 am
Ramon
You and i both know Al is only 6ft8..Howard has at least 2 inches on Al..thats why Al cant do anything with him..you said Josh is not taller than Al, so how tall does that make Josh?..6ft 7..So you are going to war with a front line of 6ft8,6ft7
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
10:00 am
Do NOT start Marvin.
Bring him off the bench and keep him ANGRY so he ATTACKS the basket
lewis
December 28th, 2010
10:01 am
Paul Pierce – Dr. Dre
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
10:18 am
Ramon – Because Josh, according to this blog, is no longer playing interior defense, because he is a 3 now for the most part. So the argument does not merit as currently constructed.
And Marvin has actually had 12 good games out of the past 17.
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
10:20 am
Steve, it does because of rotations. Marvin is a good one on one defender, but he sucks in defensive rotations.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
10:21 am
Ramon – Because Josh is at 3 now, I’m being told that’s why his blocks are down to 1.5 per game in December from 2.4 in November per game, and his steals are down to 1.2 per game, from 1.7 in December. I still don’t know why his assists are down a full assist per game because he’s at a 3. But his shooting % being down 7.6% and only making 3 of 17 of his last 3’s I m being told it is because of his move to the 3 spot. I say it is more mental and being disengaged from the game than anything else.
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
10:22 am
Why did it take so damn long to send Pape Sy off to the D-League. We’re 30+ games into the season and LD acts like they needed to go. No !@##ing !@#$. Maybe if you had sent them a month ago theyd have more playing experience.
IS DAMIEN WILKINS EVER GOING TO PLAY AGAIN?
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
10:24 am
I guess my point is, I think Josh’s head is not in the game on a consistent basis, and I’m not sure why. 7 years in the League, he should be maturing emotionally by now. Look at his meltdown in Beantown. Josh is one of my favorite players, but something just ain’t right. He’s not quite the Old Josh right now. Can’t figure it out.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
10:25 am
JeJe – Sy had a back injury, so treatment in ATL was better than at D-League.
And I agree with you about Wilkens. I still think Mo’ is getting showcased for a trade. And who knows, maybe Marvin is as well.
ltdbrave
December 28th, 2010
10:28 am
Remind me again why we paid Joe Johnson a max contract and reupped Bibby? What a waste.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
10:29 am
Ramon – I do appreciate what you said about rotations. Josh is a beast defensively. And that’s one reason I would like to see how he did as a super-sub type. I’m not saying leave him there. But you never know how he would do until you try in my opinion. I would like to see it for 3 games or so, and if it didn’t work, make him a starter again.
Same with starting ZaZa and Teague. Try it for 3 games. If it fails, go back to Twin and Bibby. Not much lost, and maybe a lot gained.
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
10:30 am
Steve, Josh had poor shooting games the last 4 out of 6 games. Yet his perimeter defense has still been there, and his steals actually went up while playing SF instead of PF. His shooting slump just so happened, started when Joe came back. If you noticed while Joe was gone, Josh was shooting jumpers also, but he was catching the passes in rhythm of the offense. He was coming off of screens (and so was Al). The jumpers he’s been shooting since Joe’s come back have come off of the offense being stagnant. Also Marvin has been doing a lot better as a 2 guard or as a back up perimeter player, not as a starting SF.
lewis
December 28th, 2010
10:30 am
tyreke evans could be out for 3-4 months
jamal
dalemebert
get it done
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
10:31 am
Man, we play a brutal game schedule thru Jan. 5th. I’m not talking about the teams, just the travel, back to backs, West Coast swing etc. We then get a couple of breather weeks with fewer games which we’ll need.
SteveW
December 28th, 2010
10:34 am
Ramon – Maybe it’s just me, but Josh just looks disengaged for the most part recently.
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
10:42 am
Steve, I understand what you’re saying. I’m just looking at it from the stand point beyond the box scores. People criticize Josh a lot. But Josh is actually one of the best playmakers on the team even on the offense. Who creates shots for OTHER players as much as Josh does? Notice how Al is never double teamed on the block, but Josh is (regardless if its at the 3 or 4). How many open jumpers have Al, Joe, Marvin, and Bibby received off of Josh making an initial move, or being in the post? I don’t buy into taking your best defensive player and not having him start. If you can notice the difference in how the opposition play when Josh is in the game compared to when he’s not. There’s no way you allow an opposing starting PG (all of them quicker than Bibby) to go against the Hawks without Josh in the line up. I will say this though, I think on offense, Josh and Al should switch. Al should take the role as the SF and Josh the role as the PF and goto the block more.
Josh settles for too many jumpers too often (many times I look and wonder why didn’t he pump fake and dribble penetrate). But there’s no one on the team of the regulars who I don’t think that same thing about. Josh, Joe, Al, Marvin, Bibby, and JC each settles for the jump shot too much! So its hard to just single out Josh for me, when he’s still second on the team in field goal %.
Also, under NO circumstances would I start Zaza. To me, Zaza looks awkward on offense, and dumb on defense. The charges that Collins took last night, would’ve never been drawn by Zaza. Zaza makes more turnovers than anyone on the team when given more than 20-25 minutes a game. I actually don’t see how the Hawks can ever expect to win anything with Zaza being the first big off of the bench. So there’s no way would I start him.
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
10:47 am
I’m with Jeje, Marvin plays better off of the bench. He’s more aggressive, and decisive.
Rufus1
December 28th, 2010
11:05 am
About Marvin….
This is what happens when you COACH to your players strengths… he is getting BETTER every Game.
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
11:07 am
The bottom line is that the NBA is very weak this year. Besides 4 or so teams, everybody else is pretty average/solid/mediocre.
There is no reason that this team [which is now healthy supposedly] can’t win 8 or 9 in a row
STOP PLAYING WITHOUT ENERGY
Ken Strickland
December 28th, 2010
11:08 am
Bibby still has a quick 1st step, but it only serves him when getting off a jump shot. He just doesn’t have the lift in his legs to finish in the lane or at the rim. He also seems to have lost another step, because he can’t seem to run a fast break.
If Horford or Smoove gives the ball to JJ or Bibby after a rebound, they know there’s little chance of a fast break being run. JJ and Bibby function best in half court, and seldom will either fill the lane or finish fast breaks. As the season has worn on, Bibby seems to be wearing down, and his DEF has gotten noticably worse.
Whenever JJ and Jamal start their ball hogging ISO, all previous ball and player movement ceases and we end up having trouble scoring. I’ve noticed JJ coming off screens and receiving the pass in perfect position for a stop and pop. But instead of him taking the open shot, he’ll hold the ball and go into ISO mode, which causes our players to immediately break off the OFF and clear out.
Even in half court, we’re starting to have problems posting up near the basket. Teams have started pressuring Bibby because they know he’s unable to challenge defenders off the dribble. So once he get’s the ball accross half court, he pulls up, which forces the posting player to give up position and come farther out to create a better angle for him to make the entry pass.
Instead of giving in so easily to pressure, Bibby should work harder to get himself into better position to make the entry pass. It’s the posting player’s responsibility to get and hold his position, and the PG responsibility get into position to make the entry pass. We’ve passed the one third mark of the season, and Bibby has started to wear down and become both an OFF and DEF liability.
It’s now time we stop focusing on what Teague doesn’t do well, because if given time and mins, he can and will improve, and has actually begun to do so lately. But Bibby has actually started to regress. He’s become more suited to being a situational player, not a starter. He’s become a total DEF liability, and his OFF limitations and inconsistency prevents him from compensating.
With Bibby, we don’t know what to expect on OFF from gm to gm, but we know not to expect any DEF. With Teague, we know we’ll get consistent DEF, speed, quickness and penetrating ability, but we don’t know what to expect offensively from gm to gm. A team can often get by winning at home with OFF, but you need DEF to win consistently on the road.
Ken Strickland
December 28th, 2010
11:16 am
JEJE-How can you say the NBA is weak this yr? How many of this yrs teams have worse records than they had last yr? Would you say teams like the Knicks, Spurs, Bulls, Celtics, Nets, Mavericks, Heat etc, haven’t improved?
Rufus1
December 28th, 2010
11:18 am
NO Trade Needed
I nolonger believe the Hawks need to trade anyone. I think that Twin and Teague need to Play more and Bibby needs to play less.
I don’t think Bibby and Jamal should finish a game unless they are both on fire….Their defensive liability as a combo is to great. Play one, but not both.
Twin had 12rbs last knight and Teague 7pts, 4ast and ONE AMAZING BLOCK.
LD has to get off Bibby’s “BAND WAGON” coach for the future of this team….PLAY TEAGUE
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
11:44 am
Every time I look at Etan Thomas, I think “this guy is the sage on the team who everyone goes to for advice or life lessons.” He looks like a guru or grandmaster
Michael Cunningham
December 28th, 2010
11:46 am
@ Rev in Tampa: “MC, Inqiring minds want to know: Why did Teague not play at all against CP3 in New Orleans? It seemed like the situation perfectly suited to Teague’s quickness. He got a DNP even though Bibby could not stay in front of Chris Paul and Jamal was stinking it up on the court.”
i agree. L.D. apparently does not. for some reason he’s willing to be flexible when it comes to matching up Twin against big lineups but not when it comes to Teague matching up against quick PGs. sometimes he says he’s going to do it with Teague and then he doesn’t (i specifically remember that happened in New York). it’s been a confusing situation. all i can do is ask the questions.
i’ll have more on this later.
Michael Cunningham
December 28th, 2010
11:50 am
@ Daniel: “So if Bibby needed a holiday break, why in the world was he playing over 40 minutes against the Hornets? Does MC not ask these questions for fear of Drew getting pissed at him?”
why would L.D. be mad at me for asking that? and even if he did get mad, why would i care? it’s a legit question.
listen, i ask L.D. questions like this all the time but, as i said above, sometimes the answers are confusing. it seems he has a little Woody in him when it comes to leaning heavily on his vets even after he says he’s not going to. what answer could he possibly give to satisfy you? it is what it is.
Michael Cunningham
December 28th, 2010
11:56 am
@JeJe: “Every time I look at Etan Thomas, I think “this guy is the sage on the team who everyone goes to for advice or life lessons.” He looks like a guru or grandmaster”
ha . . . one of his teammates said: “he’s one of those guys you look at it and wonder exactly what he’s thinking.”
terrell
December 28th, 2010
11:59 am
LD, please stick with the big lineup. Stop flip floppin. Marvin looks better coming off the bench. Horford doesnt have to bang with the 5’s. Smoove causes mismatch problems on offense(especially in the post) at the 3. It moves Evans further down the depth chart. Those 4 things alone should tell you, its the best option.
northcyde
December 28th, 2010
12:01 pm
LOL . . what Hawks team do some of you watch?
Didn’t JJ toss an alley-oop slam to Smith while on a 2 on 1 fast break? As a matter of fact, if JJ has the ball on a fast break, he almost always passes to a finisher like Josh, Al or Marvin.
Even with Josh, he likes to go coast to coast at times, but he’s made great passes to open shooters while on the break. His main problem is his awareness of other defenders coming up behind him to steal the ball.
The reason why the Hawks don’t run as much anymore, because the advanage isn’t there most of the time. Some of ya’ll want the Hawks to run or play fast, just to be doing it.
Playing fast has only worked for us historically, when we defended well. And a lot of times, Smith would use his speed at the 4 to beat his man down the court, which led to him finishing a lot of fast break dunks.
The switching defense, as much as people hated it, also led to a lot of fast break opportunities, because one of the bigs may have already been out on the perimeter when a rebound is grabbed or a ball is stolen.
LOL . . Oh God . . . Nique is doing TitleMax commercials? Haha.
Daniel
December 28th, 2010
12:14 pm
MC, thanks for the follow up. I think I was taking some of my frustration out on you. I was looking over Teague’s game logs and trying to make any sense of the decisions. He gets a DNP-CD against NO (with Paul), SA (with Parker), and NY (with Felton). I get the feeling that he would have only played like 5 minutes at most last night if Jennings was healthy.
Keep asking the questions. Maybe one day you’ll either get a good answer.
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
12:18 pm
“JEJE-How can you say the NBA is weak this yr? How many of this yrs teams have worse records than they had last yr? Would you say teams like the Knicks, Spurs, Bulls, Celtics, Nets, Mavericks, Heat etc, haven’t improved?”
I knew there was about a 0.001 percent chance I could come here this morning and have some nice comment ready from you.
Yes – I will stick by what I said.
Besides Boston, Miami, Dallas, the Spurs, and Lakers, every other team is pretty average this year.
It amazes me when people call teams like Chicago and OKC contenders. LOL.
tjhook
December 28th, 2010
12:40 pm
MC, can you ask Drew if there would be any advantages to bringing in a more accomplished lead guard (my suggestion: Mo Williams). With the team’s core signed long-term, it would seem it is more advantageous to have players that developed games instead of those that have a learning curve to complete.
Grandad
December 28th, 2010
12:42 pm
Ken Strickland;
excellent post and analysis.
KS on the nose with his dissolution.
I think Bibby should be used as a specialist.
A spot up shooter or a catch and shoot/come off screens,
even a screener for pick and pop, to utilized his outstanding
perimeter shooting. However, a shooter tends to lose his shot
when his legs tire. For shorter periods we could cover for him
defensively with scheme. Therefore, effectively turning over the
team to Teaguer. Another pg would need to be found. [JJ Barea]?
We need to begin turning over the roster with a defensive mentality
and a group of non-selfish players who fit the system offensively.
Kind of like ORL. [offense] Defensive stoppers are easier to find
than offensive SuperStars: *[possibly available]
*G.Wallace
*k.Lowry
*H.Thabeet
*S.Battier
*T.Allen
*J.Jeffries
*M.Camby
*DeSagana Diop
*Anderson Varejao {{{bad contract]}}=5 yrs
The team is achieving, improving and more fun to watch
than previous years. I still wish for ASG to go all in
and commit to a champions culture.
Perhaps the fans would pick up on that.
MC – maybe let Joe know that a portion of the fan base,
some knowledgeable, suspect that he is having trouble adjusting
to an offense where the ball moves & changes sides of the floor!
Maybe ask him? @ least one curious fan wants to know?
While you’re @ it; does Joe dislike Jamal? It appears so.?.?.?.
Grandad
December 28th, 2010
12:46 pm
*to utilize
*what moron would say to utilized
*Grandid
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
12:51 pm
BIBBY SHOULD NOT BE A STARTER. HE SHOULD HAVE AN EDDIE HOUSE TYPE ROLE
HE IS THE ONLY ROTATIONAL PG IN THE NBA INCAPABLE OF SCORING 25 IN A GAME
Daniel
December 28th, 2010
1:01 pm
JeJe,
Rondo, Kidd, Collison, Lowry, Fisher, Arroyo, Holiday, Calderon, and Hinrich.
And that’s just out of the starters in the league.
darrell starks
December 28th, 2010
1:03 pm
Collins have 2 started every game it free horford up at the 4 plus marvin plays better of the bench it only make sense, and plus collins play the dirty role along with josh.
with bibby, joe, marvin, josh, horford starting you have no role players in the line up.
with bibby, joe, josh, horford, collins starting you have size plus you have a center who plays good defense in the paint that make this team better.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
1:05 pm
“JeJe,
Rondo, Kidd, Collison, Lowry, Fisher, Arroyo, Holiday, Calderon, and Hinrich.
And that’s just out of the starters in the league.”
LOL that’s a lie. Bibby hasn’t scored 25 in maybe 3 years if my memory is right
darrell starks
December 28th, 2010
1:07 pm
Marvin is more comfortable coming off the bench, the team is much better with marvin, jamal with the second unit.
TEAGUE, JAMAL, MARVIN, POWELL, ZAZA IS A GOOD SECOND UNIT.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
1:12 pm
And Bibby is far worse than all of those point guards
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
1:13 pm
The difference between Bibby and Marvin is that Bibby tries his hardest but is washed up and sucks, and Marvin doesn’t try much most of the time (except for when he comes off bench) and sucks
terrell
December 28th, 2010
1:14 pm
Starks, I think you mean WE’RE more comfortable with Marvin coming off the bench? Or Marvin LOOKS more comfortable coming off the bench? Cause he definitely didnt sound like he was comfortable with it.
terrell
December 28th, 2010
1:17 pm
JeJe, I’d take Bibby over Arroyo. I’m sure Miami would too. They need more shooters.
lewis
December 28th, 2010
1:29 pm
Been saying it every day for a week now, what are we supposed to do when Bibby walks the ball up the court and makes the first pass to Joe with 15 seconds left on the clock?
We’re often down 4-8 points with 6 minutes to go. This is when the offense needs to work to get as many possessions in as possible. we’re not guaranteed to make shots, when Bibby hobbles up the court in crunch time when the offense really needs to execute quickly, its game over. We’re 20-13 but we should be 23-10. And this is because of a failure to execute offensively in the 4th quarter.
Teams know to stay close and not panic against the hawks, because, in the end, throw a zone or whatever to diffuse the ISO and we are toast.
Bibby is a spot up shooter who doesn’t play defense and can’t create his own shot.
Jamal is a high-volume jump shooter who plays minimal defense, can create his own shot, but the offense seems to stagnate when he’s in the game.
JJ is a high-volume iso player who can hit from the outside, inside, can create his own shot, draws double teams on a regular basis and makes decent decisions with the ball. He can also play defense.
Bibby < Jamal Jamal > Bibby
There is absolutely no proven reason to keep these guys on the court. Hypothetically they are all shot-makers, but have they ever all made shots playing together? And does anyone else on the court get shots with that lineup?
Daniel
December 28th, 2010
1:31 pm
JeJe,
On 2/20/09 Bibby scored 27 @ Portland. So less than 2 years ago. Plus, and this is where you might be missing the boat, you only score points when you get shots. The most shot attempts Bibby has had this year is 15. He’s only averaging 8 field goal attempts. There’s not many instances where anyone can score 25 on 8 shots.
I’m not saying Bibby is an elite PG, but he’s better than Eddie House.
lewis
December 28th, 2010
1:31 pm
Joe is better than Jamal who’s better than Bibby.
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
2:08 pm
JeJe,
On 2/20/09 Bibby scored 27 @ Portland. So less than 2 years ago. Plus, and this is where you might be missing the boat, you only score points when you get shots. The most shot attempts Bibby has had this year is 15. He’s only averaging 8 field goal attempts. There’s not many instances where anyone can score 25 on 8 shots.”
Daniel, even if he did get shots, I doubt he would score much, BECAUSE ALL HIS SHOTS ARE JUMPSHOTS. He is so damn unathletic that he cannot get in the lane and get EASY points. EVERY shot he takes is a contested 20+ footer.
Get MONTA Ellis already
Grandad
December 28th, 2010
2:15 pm
John Wooden always said it’s;
“the five who play the best together”.
Lewis is dead on;
“Bibby walks the ball up the court,
makes the first pass to Joe with 15 seconds on the clock”.
Don’t play Bibby and Joe together unless “we” want to slow it down.
[milk the clock].
Also guys, Jamal’s defensive effort is much improved.
His stereotype gives him a worse rap than is currently deserved.
He’s no Scottie Pippen but neither is he
[Sasha Vujacic or Adam Morrison].
*Joe -MUST- adapt!
oldtimer
December 28th, 2010
2:53 pm
While I am no fan of Joe slow ball, to me there is no comparison between Jamal and Joe.
Joe passes amazingly well.
Joe takes the ball inside and scores on majesty of shooting guards in league.
Joe plays D, and usually the most difficult assignments per game.
Joe never complains.
Joe never misses games because of mysterious shoulder/neck injury, foot injury, or back injury.
Joe is a model of consistency year after year.
Those are some very positive attributes, for a player that takes abuse for style of ball he was asked to play for past 5 years.
It takes time to change, he is evolving, give the young man time.
O'Brien
December 28th, 2010
2:53 pm
Good win last night. Although once again, we go to ISO Joe, and our offensive flow stops. LD and Joe need to do a better job of keeping the ball moving. Fortunately, 38 in the second half was enough.
I dont know what’s up with Josh, but for December, His points, rebounds, blocks and steals are all down from his November numbers.
I know LD wants to play Al at PF more, but I wonder if he has studied the effect it has on Josh playing SF on the perimeter more. Is he robbing Peter to pay Paul?
7 years in the league though, and Josh is still up and down, which is frustrating. If he would bring a KG-like intensity every game, this team would be so much better.
drmaryb (*_*)
December 28th, 2010
2:56 pm
J from the A
“J” unlike you, most Atlantans are transplants and most here are sophisticated with culture for the Fine Arts, Fine Dining, High End Shopping and like SHAQ, they need to be SEEN. The Attitude of The City is:
“How much money do you have?”
These corporate attitudes do not constitute a true fan base. Look at the name of the local paper: The AJC, what does the “C” stand for?
You got it – Constitution!
Even, The Braves going to The World Series caused David Justice to call them out for NOT selling out “The Ted”. And, after David was lambasted, he went on to hit the winning Home-Run to deliver The Braves their only Championship in history after a 9 – 10 Year run.
Let’s face it – Atlanta is NOT a sports city.
Having said that, there is just so much to choose from here, when it comes to spending entertainment dollars. Meanwhile, if The Hawks build a real contender, they will draw their fair share of Stars NOT Fans to come to the games.
One thing is for sure, this city will NOT support a mediocre team that does not win convincingly and has no Super-Star! That’s why SHAQ went to Boston, th Hawks are not seen on any National TV Stage and no one outside of us bloggers really care about this team.
It is what t is – so, Let’s Go Hawks!
drmaryb (*_*)
December 28th, 2010
3:09 pm
Iso-Joe!
There is a time and place for every thing under the sun! I have no problem with the Iso-Game. We are fortunate to have two really great Iso-Players on this roster. Some teams can only wish they had that, look around and see.
LeBron, DWade, Kobe, Melo, Amare, Paul Pierce, KG, Horry, et al … Every great PG? They ALL do it in the Clutch! MJ did it, and that’s why they are called:
Clutch-Players! Who else would you want to take that Shot?
That’s why they make the Big-Bucks! Baseball and Football players make a generation of pay checks for their families – If they are special players.
Tiger Woods is Clutch. What’s the problem? Jordan said he failed over a thousand times before he became an ICON! Jerry West did it too!
Classi Sports Games are Archived and played into eternity to feature – ISO PLAYS! Why knock that now? When a career is ended, that’s when players reflect and realize how special they really were.
ISO-JOE? Bring it On!
drmaryb (*_*)
December 28th, 2010
3:26 pm
MC replied:
“ha . . . one of his teammates said: “he’s one of those guys you look at it and wonder exactly what he’s thinking.”
Etan Thomas is an “Aloof ” character. He lives in his own mind and is NOT an engaging person nor team mate apparently. This young man has how own agenda and perhaps having a serious heart defect? He has learned to live his LIFE independently and to look out for his own well – being.
I actually, understand that as a person who lost their Mother to a serious and rare ( 3 million to 1 chance of having an incurable: Heart Disease), diagnosed.
My point is, Etan Thomas is not the right player to help this young ball club.
Etan, IMHO, is an intellectual and philosophical young man who needs to find another niche in LIFE. It, definitely is NOT being on a young Basketball Team.
Perhaps, Etan should be an Activist or a Motivational Speaker for his cause!
Aye Sund! Buy him out and Build Your Team! Perhaps, we will come.
drmaryb (*_*)
December 28th, 2010
3:38 pm
Rufus1 said:
“I nolonger believe the Hawks need to trade anyone. I think that Twin and Teague need to Play more and Bibby needs to play less.”
I agree with the later part of this comment. But, The Hawks do need to make a talent adjustment to this roster. Maybe, three new players: PG & C. Put Marvin in his correct role, coming off the bench for sure. We need a starting SF, a Super-Star at SF is easier to find: Gerald Wallace?
This team is very duplicitous at several positions. Keep Jamal and Marvin, unless you can seriously upgrade those two for a PG or C.
They came, They measured and we ARE lacking!
JeJe
December 28th, 2010
3:48 pm
““ha . . . one of his teammates said: “he’s one of those guys you look at it and wonder exactly what he’s thinking.”
Is this a good or bad thing? I interpreted from MC’s statement that Etan is a different type of cat and is very intellectual. drmaryb thinks Etan is “aloof” and probably doesn’t know his teammates well. Which is right?
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
3:51 pm
Why LD didn’t call Oakley to bring him in to help coach?
Ramon
December 28th, 2010
3:52 pm
Charles Oakley would tell Kenny Smith, you can’t stand watching bad basketball. Did you wear a blindfold your entire career in SACRAMENTO? Because everything from the uniforms, to the game play, to the messed up high top fade was BAD!
It was not a bad pick
December 28th, 2010
3:56 pm
JeJe
Ellis is not a pg, so where would he play?
darrell starks
I agree with Collins now starting, the hawks have a good mix of role players and go to men, but no way Josh should be starting over Marvin..i never seen a former #2 pick having to play second fiddle to just a solid player…
drmaryb (*_*)
December 28th, 2010
4:16 pm
Evan Turner was the #2 Pick!
Marvin Williams was the #2 Pick!
Kevin Durant was the #2 Pick! (An Aberration)
_______________________
Here’s my point, Jordan Crawford was what? A #27 Pick?
Evan Turner was a huge reach in this Draft, and was subsequently thrown into the fire on an obviously Bad Team! Does that make him a Bust? Or, like The Clippers two Drafts ago, The PF, aaah his name eludes me … Has the misfortune of being drafted by the Clippers! You know who I’m speaking of … Aaah!
Anyway, Evan Turner went to a bad team and now he’s a goat? For crying out LOUD! The Philly’s suck! Maybe he would be a nice player on a contender. But, throwing him out there as a savior is NOT fair to his rookie status.
We should NOT throw Jordan Crawford out there with the wolves! They will eat him alive and destroy his psyche! Send him to the D-League! This team is too good and we never needed him at the SG position with our roster stacked with proven talent at that spot! Either groom him now or trade him for a PG later. But, Jordan can NOT fix the Hawks problems: he is neither a PG nor C nor a team NEED!
drmaryb (*_*)
December 28th, 2010
4:19 pm
After suspending Andray Blatche and JaVale McGee one game for an altercation outside of a club, league sources say that the Washington Wizards will consider trading either Blatche or McGee in the coming weeks. The team will gauge interest around the league and after shopping the players, make a decision about whether or not a trade is the right decision for the franchise. HoopsWorld
Fundamentals
December 28th, 2010
4:19 pm
O’Brien – if we had one player that could maintain KG intensity we’d definitely be a better team. KG’s one of a kind. He’s amazingly intense and focussed. No one on our roster possesses his drive.
Good win last night. Great to see Marvin really finding a niche of late. His timely shooting and effort is the key to our wins. If Marvin can keep this up I see only good things for him. I do feel Jamal competes for shots and minutes without giving us the intangibles Marvin can, but Marvin has to keep working to win his teammates over. His niche is being carved. Just keep up the good work.
Twin definitely proves there’s merit to having a big C in the paint. I wish Tree Rollins had a 22 year old 7′ son we could borrow. I firmly believe ZaZa and Etan aren’t enough. Twin has shown heart, professionalism and character. He’s proven his worth and value to the team. He’s endorsed by the team. Congrats to a real success story Twin. We need you buddy. Called for it all last season, glad to see it now.
Bibby is definitely worn down. He’s been burning his candle at both ends all year hoping LD will allow Teague to take some pressure off. Now is the time to bring Teague into his role or get a PG prospect in here using Mo/Jamal. Bibby would be an awesome role player, but he doesn’t have the gas for 30 min per game. He’s better suited to a solid 15-20 minutes.
Fundamentals
December 28th, 2010
4:23 pm
McGhee would be an awesome prospect for our team. Tall, fast, athletic, young. He could definitely give this team a wrinkle we haven’t had in some time. Imagine a front court of Al,Josh, JaVale being pushed by Teague with Joe spotting up? Somebody explore some options with a Wiz deal!
i_am_soulstar
December 28th, 2010
4:25 pm
Yup, send Jordan to the D-League. I’m sick of seeing him in a shirt and tie. I’d rather he be getting PT, and maybe he feels the same.
Teague is really starting to come around. I think this team is still in the midst of developing a new identity. Maybe not even LD knows what the starting lineup will be by Game 82.
Fundamentals
December 28th, 2010
4:28 pm
Trade machine matches up for McGhee & Hinrich for Jamal. Gives them an expiring 10 mil instead of 2 contracts for another year?
Rod from College Park
December 28th, 2010
4:28 pm
It was not a bad pick,
“I agree with Collins now starting, the hawks have a good mix of role players and go to men, but no way Josh should be starting over Marvin..i never seen a former #2 pick having to play second fiddle to just a solid player…”
So what your saying is that a guy, (Josh Smith) who has better career numbers in every category, PPG, RPG, APG, FG%, MPG, BPG, SPG, except for 3 point percentage and free throw percentage, was voted as the second best defensive player in the league last year, never gets hurt, and has arguably been the second best player on this team for the last couple of years, should come off the bench behind a guy who has a history of injury, disappears in the vast majority of his games played, does not play with any intensity, and is worse in almost all statistical categories? What if you did your job for 5 straight years, and were better than they guy next to you for 5 years, and then he had a two to three week period, where he produced better than you. Should he get a promotion over you? Think before you type. If you like Marvin’s game, cool, but stop trying to discredit Josh with Marvin. The two players are not even in the same hemisphere offensively or defensively.
Fundamentals
December 28th, 2010
4:30 pm
Thornton, Blatche & Hinrich for Jamal, Mo & ZaZa matches up as well. They’d get 2 expiring plus ZaZa while losing one expiring, one “problem” and one hefty vet contract?
drmaryb (*_*)
December 28th, 2010
4:43 pm
Fundy!
That’s a lot to get for Jamal, Month, Zsa – Don’t you think?
The Wiz just traded Arenas, don’t you think they will want Marvin or Josh on return? After all, they are trying to WIN!
Ken Strickland
December 28th, 2010
4:47 pm
Bibby is such a DEF liability, that when he produces offensively, at best it only allows him to maybe neutralize the opposing PG’s. There were earlier comments about Teague needing to make an impact when he’s in the gm. Well, wouldn’t you say we’re starting to see that happening of late?
We all know Jamal is a DEF liability as well, but he more than makes up for it with his OFF. At least he’s starting to fight over picks and stay in front of his man, while Bibby can’t seem to do either. Check the number of times Horford and Smoove have had foul problems when Bibby plays heavy mins like he did in New Orleans.
Some have made an issue of Teagues turnovers and Bibby’s low turnover rate, but now we’re starting to see Bibby make the same type of turnovers. At least Teague’s turnovers occur as he is penetrating and trying to score, or create easy opportunities for others.
Bibby is starting to have more frequent turnovers, while continuing to play it safe. He seldom penetrates, does little to create easy scoring opportunities for others, and seldom goes below the 3pt line with the ball in his hands.
Recently, I’ve watched LDrew display some of the same vagueness and questionable decision making that were constantly on display with Woodson.
EXAMPLES:
1-He used JJ on CPaul, who did an excellent job in the 1st half, but eventually wore down.
2-Against the Hornets, he refused to play Teague or DWilkins, his 2 best perimeter defenders off the bench, when perimeter DEF was definitely needed.
3-Even though he’s acknowledged Bibby has started to wear down, and his OFF and DEF have started to suffer, he’s continued to rely heavily on him and play him heavy mins.
4-There seems to be little to no accountability for JJ and Jamal, who are increasingly doing more ISO, which disrupts both the OFF and both player and ball movement.
Mike is back
December 29th, 2010
12:09 am
MC, excellent analogy…and Really Great Stuff…I wonder if LD feels the pressure to win like his predecessor.
You just scratch your head every time LD leaves Bibby at the mercy of these young PGs…I’m tired of hearing these same excuses…there is two moves LD can make to augment our deficiency at the PG and Center…that is play Teague and Twin more…they have earned it!!!
Those moves may NOT pay immediate dividend…but come the playoff…THEY WILL BE PRICELESS.
drmaryb (*_*)
December 29th, 2010
9:15 am
Josh is untouchable – really!
He is a 5 Tool Player – Super Glue! And, if he glues his azz in the paint? A Defender of the Rim!
Aye Josh! Glue your azz in the paint! It will help your team!