Atlanta Hawks: Is Joe Johnson simply slumping?
J.J. is forcing some shots but he's missing lots of open looks. (Hyosub Shin/hshin@ajc.com)
As J.J.’s offensive struggles have continued he’s started to force things. He’s still a willing passer but he’s also tended to fall back into his habit of holding the ball, setting up his man and going one-on-one. And it just doesn’t seem like he’s been as good as that as usual, a development that’s in stark contrast to how his teammates have taken to the L.D.’s more balanced offensive approach.
But beyond those issues, my perception is that J.J. simply has missed a lot of good, open shots, particularly spot-up 3-pointers. Those are the kind of shots that tend to have little to do with forcing things. By definition, they don’t require J.J. to create his own shot. A teammate already has already made the play to create space; all J.J. has to do is catch the ball in rhythm, square up and make an open shot.
I think J.J. just hasn’t been able to do it consistently this season, but that’s just my perception. So I turned to the Synergy machine, which smashes false perceptions with the cold facts of shot-type statistics and video evidence*. And the numbers confirmed what I’ve perceived: Joe has attempted 54 spot-up jump shots and made just 11 (20.4 percent), including 9 of 46 on 3-pointers (19.6 percent).
J.J.’s shooting percentage on spot-ups is worse than his shooting percentage on every other type of halfcourt play: isolation (24 of 62, 38.7 percent), pick-and-rolls (14 of 44, 31.8 percent), post-ups (11 of 23, 47.8 percent), off screens (9 of 20, 45 percent), handoffs (7 of 15, 46.7 percent), and cuts (18 of 23, 78.3 percent).
It seems there is some merit to the idea that J.J. is slumping. (He’s questionable to play against the Grizzlies due to a sore elbow that apparently has nothing to do with his shooting slump but developed overnight Monday.)
“He is getting some good looks,” L.D. said. “It’s not a concern. I know his hand is bothering him a little bit. But I am confident he will get on target. The fact [is] that he hasn’t shot it with consistency and we’ve been able to still win some games without him shooting the ball very well. When he does get back on track it will make us that more effective. I am not concerned with that. It’s just a matter of him getting out of that little slump.”
As a team, the Hawks have more shot attempts on spot-ups than any other play and have made 133 of 351 (38 percent). J.J. has been the worst spot-up shooter among the perimeter rotation players; Bibby has been the best (25 of 52, 48 percent, which Synergy says ranks No. 7 in the league ). Jamal has made 17 of 45 (37.8 percent) and Marvin 11 of 30 (36.7 percent). Anyone who has watched Al shouldn’t be surprised that he’s made 16 of 30 (53.3 percent) and even Smoove is 26 of 69 (37.7 percent).
So J.J. has been the worst spot-up shooter on what is the league’s No. 15 ranked team for that type of shot, according to Synergy. There’s not much L.D. or anyone else can do to help J.J. if he can’t make simple, open, shots. Putting the ball in J.J.’s hand risks bogging down what has shown signs of becoming a very potent offensive attack as the team’s turnovers decrease (H/T Hoopinion).
But L.D. keeps doing what he can to get his All-Star guard going.
“I try to put him in situations, some of the usual stuff, the pick-and-pops,” Drew said. “Against the teams that do double team, I try to keep him in the middle of the floor where it’s harder to double team him. He’s missing shots that he normally knocks down. It’s just a matter of time until he finds that groove, that stroke again.”
(*My plan had been to review all of J.J.’s spot-up jumpers to see if nearly all of them have been quality shots, as I suspect. Alas, though I tried all day I couldn’t get Synergy’s video function to work so I’ll have to do that some other time.)
MC
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120 comments Add your comment
Scoop
December 1st, 2010
10:08 am
Lol. The Hawks can’t win. Either their too cheap/cash strapped, or they get criticized for keeping their best players.
People keep saying the Hawks roster is imbalanced but this couldn’t be farther from the case. Sure they give up size in the front court but that is more then made up for with the speed and athleticism of Josh and Al. The reverse is found with Joe and Marvin. Night in and out their have the size advantage over their defenders and especially with Marvin. Most nighhts teams place their SF on Joe leaving Marvin with an even smaller defender. That’s why I want Marvin to get more looks offensively. Josh needs to give up some of his looks for Marvin. There’s a reason the team has started to click these past three games and it’s no coincidence Marvin has started to play well.
That’s why I was so looking forward to getting a new coach who would be able utilize our strengths unlike Woodson did. We need to be in transition and moving the ball like LD’s system dictates. The Hawks will be fine and I believe will win the East. What more could you ask for with three all stars on the roster.
Alsandair
December 1st, 2010
10:16 am
I know it was a mistake when they signed him to all that money & now he don’t care.He said it last year.They need to trade him ASAP!!! Get what they can for him.Joe Johnson is one of the highest paid players in the league & he is not a top 25 player in this league.Trade Joe & fire Sund.That the hawks problems.
drmaryb (*_*)
December 1st, 2010
10:21 am
Obrien said:
“Did the Hawks overpay? Yes. But it’s all about supply and demand, and JJ was in high demand.”
I agree! I am not concerned about Joe’s contract at all, the sports world and this team is riddled with overpaid players not producing. JJ is not the reason the Hawks are losing games, there is PLENTY of blame to go around, start with the ASKG, Sund and work your way down the payroll list from there.
This team hasn’t had an effective PG nor C since Mookie and Dikembe, 13 years + 3 years now. Catastrophic misses on PG’s in the past 7 drafts and re-signing bad contracts and failure to build a decent bench.
Joe has made this team legitimate and we still are! We clearly needed help this off season and this franchise did NOTHING but fight against the owners and liked their – “CORE”. Liking this core is fine, but the added NO help!
Joe is NOT the problem, and he will be fine. Jamal does not defend, draw triple teams, nor issue assists. Also, Joe is NOT a cancer to the group and does NOT sulk!
drmaryb (*_*)
December 1st, 2010
10:37 am
Black Knight!
Bring Billy Knight back and let him finish what he started. He will got get that PG, dump salaries and found that serviceable center.
He would have signed Shaq, no doubt! Or at least, Dampieer. Billy was gone too soon, because he stood up to the Owners, starting with “Belkin for Joe” and tried to replace Coach Woodson. He would have signed Avery or Byron Scott, and he would have still accused the ASKG for trying to operate on the “CHEAP”!
Billy was deemed a malcontent for all aforementioned reasons and he was NOT fired! He resigned! Winning starts at the TOP! Winning is a CULTURE!
See: Arthur, Dimitroff and Smith!
See: Laker’s Owner, Jerry Buss and Phil Jackson!
See: Boston’s Owners, Danny Ainge and Doc Rivers!
See: New England’s Owners, GM and Belichik!
See: steinbrenner, GM and joe Torre!
See: “The Men in the Mirror”
They players must be supported and directed. The DeAngelo Halls’, T.O’s and Ocho Cincos MUST be shown the doors!
Rid these Hawks of the useless parts!
Owners win Championships and Players win Games!
drmaryb (*_*)
December 1st, 2010
10:40 am
* massive typos.
Ryan
December 1st, 2010
10:41 am
He simply sucks. What a waste of $119 million.
I.MUS WRITE
December 1st, 2010
10:43 am
To say the man is slumpping is an understatement. Those Numbers are horribble 20% from the field/ 20% from 3……Jeezuz
Well Hawks fans it’s just something to get used to -he is here for 5 more years at 20 per.Thats just wonderful -A 30 year old declining star eating up mucho dollars, which handicaps the team by not being able to sign needed players to improve the team. DAM
All summer we heard “we had to resign him”because we could only take back hafl his salary. Well im sure we could have gotten more production from a 10 mill per year type.
Wish we could have got Sonny Weems for the 10 mil S&T Joe for Kaman
Bibby
Weems
Smoove
Horford
Kaman
Teague
JC!
JC2
ZaZA
Mo
Powell
Marvin
I.MUS WRITE
December 1st, 2010
11:04 am
The only players that we’ve resigned that didnt fall off the next season is Josh and AL….the true corner stones of this franchise. These guys are hungry and continue to get better. Josh is our leader he does everything for us a real stat stuffer and does anyone notice how other teams get to the basket when he’s not in “Layup Line”
Obrien -I would have been cool with Brewer od Dhantay Jones for 8 mill, or even Caron Butler. If he is hurt he should be sat down. I would rather see JC2 get those minutes -Im sure he could shoot over 20% if given the minutes and shots…. Tired of people making excuses for this guy when he has chocked the past 2 years in the post season. If yall think he’s struggling now just wait until May if we actually make the playoffs.
I.MUS WRITE
December 1st, 2010
11:08 am
Is Etan The new Randolph Morris? Why did we spend a cupl mil on Pape Sy when he hasnt logged a minute this season? Will marvin be anything more than a 4th option? Did these guys play harder for Woody than Drew? Things that make you say Hmmmmm……………………………………..
i_am_soulstar
December 1st, 2010
11:26 am
Joe Johnson: Don’t Panic Quite yet
http://www.peachtreehoops.com/2010/12/1/1848501/joe-johnson-dont-panic-quite-yet?ref=yahoo
i_am_soulstar
December 1st, 2010
11:46 am
Al and Josh haven’t even peaked yet and they’re both playing all-star ball.
I’m not worried about Joe. He’ll come around as far as shooting, but the man clearly finds ways to contribute when the shot isn’t falling.
Bibby’s shooting the 3-ball like the Bibby of old.
Marvin’s still Marvin. I just wish he’d be 08-09 Marvin.
dukester
December 1st, 2010
11:49 am
@MC Thanks for the thumbs up about my comment about Joe’s inner strength and fortitude. Do you guys remember when Kobe’s finger was broke. That dude did not care man he went and competed like he didnt have a hand. You remember when Jordan had the flu in Utah that year!! 2 words Willis Reed!! Joe is not that guy.
He is what he is. Bottom line is we are stuck with him and we must find a way to win with him. Now if Larry Drew is smart he will find out what’s wrong with his hand and get it fixed. If he needs a couple days rest you better let him get it now because come march we will need him.
And as always find away to trade Marvin, Bibby and Zaza.
Lets see how bad the 76ers want to get rid of Andre Iguodala
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yl9afvk
Fundamentals
December 1st, 2010
12:17 pm
It seems Joe needs rest. Somehow he got banged up, then he got sick, now he’s dragging. Give the guy whatever he needs to rest, to work on his shot in the gym on his own and to get 100%. Right now he’s just hurting himself and the team’s future.
Our team is structured so that one guy in a slump doesn’t kill us. Give JC1 a few starts w/ JC2 backing him up. Mo seems ready to log minutes at SG/SF. Give Joe his time. He’ll be back.
If Josh & Al are such great Captains & vocal leaders, why can’t Joe be a quiet assassin, following their lead and helping this team win. Each player was given market value. Get off the contract already. It is what it is. Joe will help this team, he just needs time to get healthy. Right now he’s playing hurt to meet folks expectations who will NEVER be satisfied.
SteveW
December 1st, 2010
12:29 pm
As bad as we feel JJ has been, and I do think he’s hurting more than he’s letting on, he would probably still make the All Star team if selection was held today. Wade has been the only Eastern SG having a better season than JJ, and he’s missed alot with injuries already. Jackson with the Bobcats probably about equal to this point. Iggy is down, but I’d still love to have him on this team.
And I hope Horford and Smith continue the All Star play. Of course Dwight will be the starter at C. Hope Hibbert or a couple of other guys having good years don’t bump them off the roster. Noah is having a monster season to this point also. It would be nice having 3 All Stars from ATL..
Fundamentals
December 1st, 2010
12:34 pm
I know the All Star thing is big for the players and maybe the franchise, but I’d rather our players focus on the real goal – ECF or the NBA finals. All Star is just tied to voting and popularity contests. It’s not a true indication of all the players that deserve to be there each year. Iggy and Captain Jack, please. Hibbert is showing great progress, but I’d be surprised to see him an All Star.
SteveW
December 1st, 2010
12:37 pm
BTW, as much as we like to complain about bad contracts, the Hawks don’t have bad contracts. Check out the Sixers roster, the Bucks, even the Lakers. That PF with the Magic averaging 10 and 4 and making 20+ mill a year. Bibby, Marvin, ZaZa and JJ may be somewhat overpaid, but we don’t have bad contracts. Go look at the Blazers roster.
Oden was not re-upped by Portland – I hope the Hawks will give him a chance on the cheap. He’s still only 22 or something, and could play well and develop behind Josh and Al.
Haywood wants out of Dallas evidently, but talk about a bad contract. He’d fit nicely with the Hawks, except we would have to release Etan to get him. The Brawlers part 4 it would be! Didn’t they have like 3 fight when they both were with the Wiz’s? Hard to believe Etan beat him out for the starters job only 5 years ago.
SteveW
December 1st, 2010
12:41 pm
Fundamentals – I agree totally. Give me championships over All Stars anyday. Being raised in ATL, it seemed we almost always had a good player on bad teams, so we just rooted for All Stars because their was no hope for Championships. John Drew, Dale Murphy, Steve Bartkowski, Willie Andrews etc.
But yes, give me a Championship over All Star teams.
Fundamentals
December 1st, 2010
12:46 pm
Nothing personal, but what are we losing by cutting Etan? Dude will never play a minute for us? What would Haywood command?
You feel bad for Oden. Dude will get a shot somewhere. He just needs to focus on nutrition, rehab and getting healthy again. He is under too much pressure to produce now in Portland.
What about Nique on your list of All-Stars w/ no chance of a Championship.
SteveW
December 1st, 2010
1:08 pm
Fundamentals – I was joking about Etan – just trying to make light of his fights with Haywood over in Washington. As far as I can tell, we would lose nothing by cutting him.
Almost listed ‘Nique, but we at least competed when we got to the 2nd round when he was here. Almost put Smith, Mookie, Mutombo and Rick Mahler in there also.
If the All Star game were today:
SG: Starter Wade Backup(s) between JJ, Jackson, and Ray Allen
PF: Starter Stoudamire Back up Josh Smith with Bosh maybe 3rd, then Blatchey, Brand, and Garnett also a little in the mix.
C: Starter Dwight Back up Noah 3rd C between Al, Bargnani, Brook Lopez, and Hibbert
Right now I would say we have 3 All Stars, but the process can be finicky. Bargnani averaging 20.8 on a bad team might get the nod over Al. Hibbert might also because he seems to have buzz in the League right now.
J from the A
December 1st, 2010
1:10 pm
Why does everyone confuse a laid-back, reserved personality as having no inner dog?
The analogy misses a little, but these confused comments remind me of my wayward youth.
Take for example, two of your neighborhood “thugs” (I am hesitant to use this analogy, especially in the context in which a bunch of racists confuse our good-hearted basketball players with thugs simply because they are black, but for lack of a better analogy, it will have to do): One is a boisterous, rowdy guy who is always vocal. He wears his “inner dog” on his sleeve for everyone to see. The other is very quiet and reserved. For people that don’t know him, he may come across as somewhat timid, lacking that true “inner dog.” But truth be told, to people that know both of them well, perfectly understand that the one is partial flash — perhaps someone you still don’t want to F*-with — while the other is 100% OG, silent but a real MFer that you would never ever want to cross.
Joe is like the latter. To people that don’t know him well, his laid back, reserved personality may give the impression that he is lacking an inner dog, but to those that know him well, know that he is 100% OG. The dog is there; he just doesn’t wear the dog on his sleeve.
darrell starks
December 1st, 2010
1:10 pm
dukester 11:49 a.m cosign i have always like igg but the hawks biggest problem is big man, us fan have been screaming for years about a big man and 2 move horford over 2 his natural position, there is no way the hawks can even come close 2 a championship with out atleast getting a center who can defend the paint and rebound.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
G.Rhone
December 1st, 2010
1:19 pm
drmaryb (*_*)
I’ve seen Joe be “Killer Joe” once maybe twice i.e., Playoffs vs. Boston…that’s basically it. JJ doesn’t even make free throws anymore. I’m not sure what game or habitual style he is sacrificing because JJ is still doing the same thing; Waiting for the double team and dribbling out the shot clock…it’s sad to see. ASG should’ve seen it coming….. : (
darrell starks
December 1st, 2010
1:20 pm
One of the trade scenario that could bring the hawks a big and a star player is biedrins and ellis, if the hawks could bring in ellis along with biedrins and keep horford and josh it would automatically make the hawks contenders in the east.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
darrell starks
December 1st, 2010
1:24 pm
Monta would be the 3rd best point guard in east.
1.ROSE
2.RONDO
3.ELLIS
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!
darrell starks
December 1st, 2010
1:30 pm
Warriors have 2 make a move, no way they continue 2 keep MONTA, STEPHEN IF THE ORGANZATION WANT’S 2 IMPROVE.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!
Slumping?
December 1st, 2010
1:32 pm
If U ask me Johnson is not Slumping because he wasn’t too good to begin with!
sam'l
December 1st, 2010
1:33 pm
Just for about 10 minutes I saw it clearly…..trade Joe Johnson for a quality center. Then, I thought, on another team, Joe would have to prove himself and he’d immediately start putting up 30 points a game at 45% and the other team would become a contender.
Joe will be okay. He is a tremendous telent. He’s got to get out of some bad habits after several years of iso.
.
darrell starks
December 1st, 2010
1:33 pm
MARVIN, JAMAL, ZAZA AND 1ST
FOR
ELLIS, BIEDRINS
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!
darrell starks
December 1st, 2010
1:36 pm
AND RODNEY CARNEY IN THE TRADE, good trade for both team.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!
dukester
December 1st, 2010
1:51 pm
@ J from the A I agree with the whole inner dog thing except from the childhood aspect. I think your speaking of a bully more so a person who has strong mind fortitude and or will power.
@Darrell I agree we need a big man but the problem is the Hawks think they have a center in Al Horford so we are wasting time asking for a center. My main goal is to rid this team of:
Marvin
Bibby
Zaza
Pape Sy
Jason Collins
I think replacing these guys with the right veterans and younger guys will have a nice team in play for us. I will just about about take anybody for Marvin Williams
JeJe
December 1st, 2010
2:31 pm
I agree with dukester’s list, except for ZaZa and Collins. ZaZa sucks, but his contract is not bad – we will not get a better backup Center for the same salary.
Collins makes nothing and is in okay shape. If anything, he should be getting 8-10 mpg. He can shoot FTs and has a bit of a jumper. That is not bad for a 2nd or 3rd Big off bench
JeJe
December 1st, 2010
2:31 pm
People need to look at the Lakers’ backup Bigs. Ratliff and Bynum are out- they have 6″9 scrubs no one has heard of getting minutes at Center
Big Ump
December 1st, 2010
2:34 pm
Ms Dee your 2:51 am post was right on the money. By the way how you been doing?
northcyde
December 1st, 2010
2:44 pm
testing . . 1 . . 2 . . 3
northcyde
December 1st, 2010
2:51 pm
LOL . . good Lord. The AJC needs to do something about the blog. I guess I have a cussword embedded in a word, or a group of words, that won’t allow my post to be seen. Now I have to go through the entire thing.
northcyde
December 1st, 2010
2:57 pm
All the dude needs to do is stop launching threes. Just because he’s open from deep, doesn’t mean that he should keep shooting.
When you look at JJ’s shot location percentages on Hoopdata, it’s pretty obvious. I’ll compare last year’s shooting to this year’s, and the number of attempts he’s taking from that range:
AT RIM: 52.1 ( 3.7 att ) . . . . 58.3 ( 3.3 att )
< 10 FT: 51.1 ( 3.4 att ) . . . . 52.5 ( 2.2 att )
10 – 15FT: 47.7 ( 1.7 att ) . . . . 46.4 ( 1.6 att )
16 – 23FT: 40.0 ( 4.8 att ) . . . . 35.0 ( 3.8 att )
3 POINT: 55.4 ( 4.6 att ) . . . . . 38.4 ( 4.6 att )
guesswhosthis
December 1st, 2010
3:02 pm
I think the problem is that jj has gotten too comfortable with woodsons offense. when jj was with the suns, he was not the star on the team and was set up by nash for a lot of spot up threes, and he would drain them.but when he came to the hawks, they made him the starand he had to create his own shot.so I think he kind of forgot how to play without the ball.kind of like the same problem lebron and wade has.so I think being that he was a very good spot up shooter in phoenix,I think if you give him some time to adjust, he’ll figure it out.
dukester
December 1st, 2010
3:04 pm
@JeJe you know what I really dont have a problem with ZaZa either except he cant block shots!! I was so disappointed when we resigned Marvin Bibby and Zaza I almost puked. I mean Bibby is cool for what we have as far as a veteran. If he can continue to hit the open 3 we cool. But man we have 70 million in the life of those contracts and between the 3 we could have got better for that money.
Mike is back
December 1st, 2010
3:09 pm
MC, I’m not worried about JJ’s shooting slump…it will come around once he fully recovers from his injuries. Dude has a propensity for playing hurt…that concerns me. I know JJ feels obligated to play through his injuries…However, when the injury is clearly impacting his performance…SOME TIME YOU GOTTA SHUT IT DOWN…I know playing through injuries is a part of the game…so that’s a hard call.
I would also add that part of his slump is attributed to his adjustment to the motion offense…IT’s still a work in progress…I didn’t think he would struggle as much as has…I thought JJ would thrive in LD’s new offense…clearly that hasn’t been the case.
I don’t think JJ can change his persona…that’s just who he is…however he can work on re-inventing himself…and re-inventing his game…all the super stars do it…they are constantly working ways to improve their game…in order to remain amongst the elite in the league…you keep saying to yourself…if JJ would add some explosion to his game…dude would be a totally different player…thus far in his tenure with the Hawks…it hasn’t happen.
Show us some new facet to your game JJ…the ASG has invested a heck of a lot of cash in you…that the lease you can do…step out box and dunk on some of these cats…when you are going to the rack…let folk know what time is daaaaaaaaaaaaawg. lol
GO HAWK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ant banks
December 1st, 2010
3:10 pm
what is the one difference this year, than has been in previous years as it relates to jj? dude signed this crazy azz contract then he has a waitress pregnant!! i do know that pregnant women, especially if they are not your wife and they may be comin after your money, can put pressure on a brother
Grandad
December 1st, 2010
3:32 pm
Once again………………………….
MC wants our comments on Joe………………….
Joe Johnson is the greatest ever!
Grandad
December 1st, 2010
3:34 pm
Well that one got through.
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Joe Johnson made a mistake “once”.
Grandad
December 1st, 2010
3:41 pm
Bloginator @ it again!
Can’t be critical of Joe I guess?
ASHCAN.
December 1st, 2010
3:52 pm
Man bump all the crap about jj shot and game will come back,with all the $$$ he’s making(highest paid player)he suppose to be dominating on most nights.I think he should give some of the dollars back so we can get another player in a trade or trade him(jj).
DAChef
December 1st, 2010
4:20 pm
Time to cut Etan Thomas and go get Earl Clark from Phoenix before the Lakers beat you to him..The kid will immdly bring rebounding and perimeter defense that’s lacking from the second unit…
Hawkfan Ant
December 1st, 2010
4:24 pm
Joe will be fine. He`s just pressing too hard.
On the other hand we need better Point Guard play!
Teague needs to play with Confidence and Speed or Bust!
But here`s a thought for next season(Greg Oden)and a darn good
trainer to go with him!
Ramon
December 1st, 2010
4:39 pm
Wow, where’s my comments?
Rev in Tampa
December 1st, 2010
4:43 pm
drmaryb (*_*),
I seem to remember that you discussed the nature and prognosis of Oden’s injury at some point. Am I remembering correctly? If so, could you remind us of the chances of his return to the NBA and the possibilities of him regaining his status as an top prospect?
Rev in Tampa
December 1st, 2010
4:46 pm
Grandad,
Keep trying to post. I am eager to hear your thoughts on JJ’s shooting woes. I was impressed how you ‘prophesied’ Josh’s shooting improvement by simply watching a video of him in a preseason practice.
Sautee
December 1st, 2010
5:34 pm
I guess I’ve posted this a dozen times, but somehow people KEEP getting it confused.
Listen folks! Joe Johnson signed the highest contract of any Free Agent during the off season. He is NOT, I repeat IS NOT the highest paid player in the league.
He is 16th. Here is the link: http://hoopshype.com/salaries.htm
Geez, it’s like Dick Cheney and the lie about Iraq and WMDs. The lie just won’t go away.