Atlanta Hawks: Hawks 96, Raptors 78

Raps couldn't control Smoove. (Rueters Photo)

Raps couldn't control Smoove. (Rueters Photo)

Toronto–Maybe you are thinking the Hawks beat another lackluster opponent. But funk that: They beat the mess out of a lackluster opponent, and don’t think there isn’t a difference in this league.

– The Hawks dominated the Raptors because Smoove did it all, Marvin did more (again) and they didn’t let down in a circumstance where it had to be tempting. Yes, they are a much better team than the Raptors, but give them credit for leaving no doubt about it.

– Raptors coach Jay Triano summed it up: “You go one through five: DeMar got outplayed by Joe Johnson, Jose got outplayed by Mike Bibby, Andrea got outplayed by Josh Smith, Sonny got outplayed by Marvin Williams, Joey got outplayed by Al Horford. Nobody could score and we couldn’t stop those guys and that is why you have a 20-point game.”

– The Hawks have won three in a row after the famous Wednesday meeting so they deserve to feel good about themselves. “What we have been doing these last three games is something special,” Josh said.

– OK, maybe that’s a bit much, but still. “We are going to have ups and downs all season,” Marvin said. “I think sometimes other people panic more than we do. We just can’t get too highs on the highs and too low on the lows. We started off 6-0, obviously we are going to hit some rough spots. The one thing about this team is we stay together.”

– Smoove made all the right plays at the right times, effort and otherwise. He controlled the defensive boards, passed when he should have and (of course) helped make the Raptors jump shooters when the Hawks took control in the third quarter.

– “It just seemed like he was all over the floor,” L.D. said. “When he plays like that and plays under control, he is such a force. His defensive game, he was all over the place, rebounding the basketball, helping defensively and talking. Just a super overall game.”

– “He impacts the game in a great way,” Al said. “For this team to take it to the next level, everybody has to be the same way.”

– Back-to-back day games. An opponent that thrives in Sunday matinees (7-2 in its last nine). No problem: 11 of 20 field goals, seven assists and 27 points in the first quarter. “I was a little concerned with our energy, whether we would have our legs,” Drew said. “We started the game with good intensity.”

– You had the feeling the Hawks would dominate if they could limit Toronto’s offensive rebounds, points in the paint and take care of the ball. They did all of that in the third quarter and were off to a comfortable W.

– Watching Marvin go for 17 points and 12 rebounds a day after he was good against the Knicks, i remembered he had a couple games like that in the first two weeks. Then he hurt his knee. Now he says he’s moving better even if the pain is still there.

– “I am starting to get my confidence back in it,” he said. “There are still some things that still bother me. Coach is doing a good job with slowing me down and letting me sit out in practice.

– After three straight games with no free-throw attempts and nine rebounds combined, Marvin took seven free throws and collected 20 rebounds in the last two. “I feel more explosive out there. When I first got it banged, I didn’t feel explosive at all. These last couple games I’ve been getting to the line because I feel more comfortable pushing off. I still feel pain but I am starting to feel better each day.”

– Joe made 6 of 12 field-goal attempts overall despite missing 4 of 5 threes. It’s just the third time in his last 10 games he’s shot at least 50 percent from the field. So of course his teammates ribbed him for getting just one rebound.

– “Well, I had 10 yesterday, so that makes up for it,” Joe shot back.

– J.J. seemed more upbeat after this one. “Honestly, I don’t worry about the misses,” he said. “I am sure here soon I will get it back on track. As long as we keep winning, that’s the main thing, but I will get it back.”

– The Raptors are one of the best rebounding teams in the league with Reggie Evans. Not so much without him. “I think that was big,” Josh said. “He’s been a monster this year. He is one of my good friends. I hated that this had to happen to him, but I’m kind of happy I didn’t have to play against him. He’s a tough player.”

– Toronto’s defense, not so good to begin with, also suffered without Evans. But when the Hawks take care of the ball and share it they are tough for even good defensive teams to guard (see the Pacers). “When we play the right way, it’s beautiful basketball,” Smoove said.

– Keep beating up on the likes of the Raptors and they can buy time to figure out how to do it ugly against better teams.

– I’m out, Hawks fans.

MC

238 comments Add your comment

greg

November 28th, 2010
6:17 pm

Mista Gamer

November 28th, 2010
6:20 pm

leon

November 28th, 2010
6:21 pm

leon

November 28th, 2010
6:21 pm

Well I tried

Hawks vs. Raptors

November 28th, 2010
6:23 pm

“What we have been doing these last three games is something special”

I hope they can keep that positive attitude going into December because December is going to be tough!

Notables:
Dec 4: @ Miami , Dec 6: @ Orlando , Dec 10: @ Spurs , Dec 16: @ Celtics , Dec 20: Home Orlando , Dec 26: @ New Orleans, Dec 27: @ Bucks , Dec 31: @ Thunder

ejh

November 28th, 2010
6:29 pm

This was a good win for the Hawks. They are continuing to progress, and go in the right direction. If this team could get their hands on someone like Ramon Sessions a young PG who defends and can truly give Bibby rest and be able to defend the quicker pg’s and another wing defender like jamario Moon the would make the hawks better defensivley. But as of now they are learning how to win and not to have as many lapses in energy and effort. If they continue to do this by the time they playoffs roll around this team will be a tough out in either round of the playoffs. So hawks keep maturing and learning how it takes total team effort and energy to compete night in and night out.

Also I noticed as long as Marvin is getting involved early in the game i.e. getting plays call for him from the very start he is more engaged and agressive and more focused, keep running plays for him early L.D.

jd

November 28th, 2010
6:31 pm

It’s been wonderful seeing the hawks go to the playoffs but lets’ be real now we need a center inorder to make it pass the orlando majic other than that the hawks are just spinning there wheels!

Jae Evolution

November 28th, 2010
6:41 pm

Mo Evans and Jeff Teague for Wilson Chandler and Toney Douglas!

i_am_soulstar

November 28th, 2010
7:26 pm

December’s gonna be a huge test. Glad they blew the Raptors out. I expected nothing less with Evans out.

Hawks Fan In New Orleans

November 28th, 2010
7:37 pm

I was at the Hornets/Spurs game today and when the announcer called out the final score of the Falcons/Packers game they erupted with. I was the only soul in the NO Arena with the gall to cheer…Mr. Everything has my all-star vote this year, nice triple-double and 3 game win streak, now the tough part of part of the schedule begins. We have passed the early season road-test though. I must admit its impressive to have the best road record in the east seeing how awful we were on the road against good and mediocre teams.

Ken Strickland

November 28th, 2010
7:56 pm

Despite the 4 and 3gm losing streaks, we’re 3rd in the East, behind Boston and Orlando @ 11-7. Last yr, we had only 19 road wins in 82gms. This yr we have 7 road wins in only 18gms.

Brandon Hayward Fan

November 28th, 2010
8:01 pm

How about Brandon Hayward for the center position.He can’t get along with Rick Carile.I think he plays with Dallas.

Sautee

November 28th, 2010
8:02 pm

Also Ken, we are back on a 50 win pace.

Dept. of Unintended Irony

November 28th, 2010
8:07 pm

Brandon Hayward Fan

November 28th, 2010
8:01 pm

“How about Brandon Hayward for the center position.He can’t get along with Rick Carile.I think he plays with Dallas.”

You THINK he does, while you call yourself a fan of his? ROFL!

Do you even know what his salary is, and how we would acquire him?

Jason Haywood fan

November 28th, 2010
8:32 pm

D.of U.I.

How about Jason Haywood, he plays for the Braves, I think.
He’s tall. Could he play the center position.
I don’t think he gets along with Pete Carril either.

Jason Haywood fan

November 28th, 2010
8:34 pm

Enter your comments here

JeJe

November 28th, 2010
8:35 pm

MARVIN NEEDS TO KEEP PLAYING LIKE THIS. WHEN HE DOES, THIS TEAM IS VERY TOUGH TO BEAT

DON’T BE TIMID. PLAY LIKE THIS EVERY DAMN GAME

Samuel

November 28th, 2010
8:40 pm

How about having a “players only meeting” before a legit title contender. While a win is a win, these victories still don’t prove anything towards the Hawks real issues, we all know that, stop kidding yourselves. Ken, that was the shortest post in your career. You can do better than that. December is coming up so you better get em in while you can. It’s time to see what these Hawks are made of.

L-QUE

November 28th, 2010
8:43 pm

I Think Hayward would be a great pick up we need at least one seven that command playing time . When we look down the road, SIZE matters. I dont know the data but I am sure big men are being dicussed for a true play off run, its wide open.

JeJe

November 28th, 2010
8:52 pm

If Marvin is aggressive and Teague can improve at all, this team will win a lot of games this year.

Our ENTIRE success is based upon whether Marvin attacks the basket. If he doesn’t we will be done in the 1st or 2nd round. If he attacks, we can make it a series vs. Orlando (same as the last 2 years. Too bad the guy has been asleep his whole career, save for 6 or 7 games a year)
I think when he attacks, it makes the ASG look better for believing in this core

FIRE SUND

northcyde

November 28th, 2010
8:53 pm

Hmmmm . . . last year after 18 games:

- Hawks were 13 – 5

* had only 5 road wins ( but wins @ Portland at full strength, and @ Boston )

* were #3 in the East . . one game behind Boston and Orlando, who were both 14 – 4

* 7 – 1 at home

* had fans flipping out because we had lost a bad game @ Detroit, leading to our 3rd loss in 4 games ( but was still 12 – 5 at the time )

* after the 18th game, we win 6 of our next 7 to push our record to 19 – 6.

It’s nice to see some of the people who were freaking out over a 13 – 5 Hawks team that had beaten top level teams, be so calm about an 11 – 7 Hawks team that can’t even beat one.

Hopefully the Hawks will keep winning to put everyone else at ease this year.

TheAntiMe

November 28th, 2010
9:14 pm

Obviously, when Josh is on it noticeably makes things better. Another not so noticeable but still quite important factor is that if Marvin can ever be more than just a tease, it will be instrumental in allowing the Hawks to gain some sort of consistency and not be a team that lives and dies by the streak so much.

Gulfwaves Gary

November 28th, 2010
9:56 pm

The Hawks have enough talent to dominate almost every game IF they decide to play with intensity. When they don’t you go from 6 and 0 to something way less. The last three games had intensity. GO HAWKS. Al Horford changed the Hawks with a winners attitude from the start and Josh Smith has unreal talent!. GO HAWKS!

Ken Strickland

November 28th, 2010
10:05 pm

NORTHCYDE-there’s a big difference between a team that CAN’T defeat a team with a winning record, as you put it, and one that has yet to defeat a team with a winning record. At 19-6 after 25gms last yr, we were winning at a 76% rate, which would have given us 62 wins. However, we finished with 54 wins, which means we finished last season much like we’ve started this one.

We started last season with the same HC we’d had for the last 6yrs, the same OFF/DEF systems, as it were, approach, and the same starting lineup from the previous yr. This yr, although we have the same starting lineup and 10 or 12 players from last yrs active roster, the HC, OFF/DEF system, and almost everything else about the teams approach is different. Our ability to win on the road,. and win convincingly, is definitely an improvement.

Why not expect the Hawks to go through some inconsistency and adjustment problems, much like the Heat, Bulls and Bucks, especially the Heat?. Even with all of their talent and hype, they just followed the lead of Hawk players and called a players only meeting to deal with their inconsistency, losing and adjustment problems. Bottom line, regardless of where we are record wise compared to last yr, we’re still in 3rd place in the East, just like we were last yr at this time, and at the end of last season.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 28th, 2010
10:09 pm

11-1 against bad teams, 0-6 against good teams.

Nice win for the Hawks. I watched the game streaming on my computer while Falcons-Packers was on the TV. Too bad maybe five people in Atlanta watched this game today. Whoever makes the NBA schedule should be fired.

In fact, an even better idea occurred to me. Why doesn’t the NBA start the season in January with the playoffs happening in August? Why have the first two months of the NBA season coincide with football, when they could start a couple of months later and have the NBA playoffs happen in August when there’s nothing happening in the sports world other than the “dog days of August” baseball games?

Great game for Smoove, who continues to cement himself as the Hawks’ MVP. Surely this won’t stop people for continuing to try to blame him for the Hawks’ problems and propose preposterous trades involving him.

Nice game for Marvin, but I’m over him. We’ve seen this movie before. He’ll go off against a couple of soft teams like the Knicks and the Raptors, and then he will go the next 10 games without hitting double digits in any category. As far as I’m concerned, a game like this is just good for boosting his trade value. I’m still down for the Jamal+Marvin for Prince+Wallace+Wilcox trade. For all the talk of the Hawks capitalizing on Reggie Evans’ absence, the Hawks barely out-rebounded this team after barely out-rebounding the Knicks yesterday. I still see nothing to convince me that they will go toe to toe with the teams they are going to face in the playoffs.

In any case, as little as this game means as far as the Hawks proving their worth as a playoff contender, it is still a win. If they can go close to undefeated against bad teams, at least they will make it back to the playoffs.

lewis

November 28th, 2010
10:14 pm

enjoyed watching the falcons and the hawks at the same time.

sick of seeing jamal/bibby on the foor at the same time.
sick of seeing joe suck.
Zaza is a sub par reserve pf
Mo Evans is solid
Larry Drew forcing Marvin’s involvement in the offense has helped him
Al is looking phenomenal on the offensive end

tom

November 28th, 2010
10:16 pm

i don’t really care about the slow start. As long as we beat the teams we should beat and the team starts really clicking after the all star break we can hopefully ride that into the playoffs.

O'Brien

November 28th, 2010
10:33 pm

Ken S,

I think our December schedule will tell us a lot about these Hawks. Road games @Miami, @Orlando, @ San Antonio, @Milwaukee, @OKC, @Boston, and a home game against Orlando.

And I would not compare our adjustment to the Heat’s adjustment. They have a bunch of new players (inlcuding one who needs the ball in LbJ), and we dont.

I know that our offense is different, but as Rick said, the motion offense is just one of our sets, so its not like we run the motion offense every single time down the court. We still run ISOs, pick and rolls etc.

There are some positives though. Road wins, high FG%, high assists among them. Hopefully we can keep building on our winning streak.

Rufus1

November 28th, 2010
11:01 pm

What I see…

I see a team that is working on the thing they were BAD at last year and forgot how to do the things they were GOOD at.

The Hawks know how to get-up for the BAD teams, how to win at HOME and run the ISO offense…….. Learning how to win on the ROAD, getting-up for EVERY TEAM, changing your OFFENSIVE IDENTITY is a lot to ask of any team.

WE WILL WIN 50+ GAMES
WE ARE STILL TO 3 IN THE EAST

The Bright side….

We have the best ROAD RECORD in the east and 11 WINS while JJ is strugglings……PLEASE SEE THE BRIGHT SIDE!

OK

November 28th, 2010
11:07 pm

Is Pape Sy Marvin Jr. With his back ailment? Jeez…

Grandad

November 28th, 2010
11:10 pm

O’Brien

Motion offense is run from a # of sets as well.
It also can be initiated from a pick & roll.
One can run a starter play then finish with motion principles.
Ball reversal is the key.
Making the defense guard both sides of the floor.

L-QUE

November 28th, 2010
11:52 pm

Basketball and the match up problems it brings is what makes basketball champions teams looking to compete for a title adressed as many problems they had in the off season boston got bigger and faster in some positions lakers added more to their weakness. regardless of the sideshow going on in miami. orlando didnt add help for howard .they to are finding it hard to blow out teams like last year .the bucks cant beat no team but atl. why, big inside quick at the point. ATL. cant live by the jumper alone .ATL big men lead and finish the fast break where are the guards. al& josh are going to need help from big men to advance in the play offs they will get there.most teams have changed personnel from last year.What happen last year is OLD NEWS, the future will be determined by injuries, and matchups that where we are behind the teams LA-BOSTON ORLANDO SAN ANTO.we still need a point and a sevenfooter to help against the monsters inside. then we can fully complain help didnt come this off season. I CANT BELIEVE TORONTO LET JACK GET AWAY FOR BAYLESS

Melvin

November 28th, 2010
11:53 pm

The Pacers beat the Lakers in LA. Does that make the Hawks win (in Indy) a better win now????? LOL take that Kobe…

tjhook

November 29th, 2010
12:14 am

“the one thing about this team is we stay together.”
Is Marvin delusional?! Does he think the Wednesday meeting was a formality? His ATTITUDE is why I want him out of a Hawks uniform; he has no sense of urgency. The Hawks need to assign someone to permanently agitate him because he doesn’t see the importance of being assertive/dominant on the court. TRADE HIM!!!

Najeh Davenpoop

November 29th, 2010
12:19 am

Yeah, I’ll promote Indiana to being a “good team” after that win.

10-1 against bad teams, 1-6 against good teams.

MsDee

November 29th, 2010
12:20 am

@northcyde,

I noticed that you were comparing the Hawks of last year to the Hawks of this year which is kinda unfair considering the fact that the JJ of last year is NOT the same JJ of this year nor is Jamal the same Jamal of last year..ALSO those MINOR loses we had on our mini losing streak were WITHOUT Marvin nor MO, and b4 you say ‘Marvin who’, WE HAD NO SF TO HELP OUT IN DEFENSE CONSIDERING HE PLAYS PRETTY GOOD DEFENSE..him and Mo!! AND FOR US TO STILL BE 3RD IN THE EAST WITH ONLY A FEW GAMES UNDER BOSTON AND ORLANDO IS REMARKABLE..WEITHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT!!!

JeJe

November 29th, 2010
1:37 am

Lol Indy won in LAL and Collison didn’t have a great game (he’s been a bit worse this year than I thought he’d be) and Granger didn’t go off either.

Hibbert is playing very well this year. Imagine having Hibbert and one of their PGs instead of Duck and Bibby …Oh yeah, we drafted Marvin over Granger too

FIRE BILLY

northcyde

November 29th, 2010
2:05 am

Remarkable?

MsDee . . come on now.

I said before the season that I thought the Hawks had a good shot to be 14 – 4 after 18 games, due to the extremely “easy” road schedule and the winnable home games. We took care of business on the road, which is great, but faultered mightily at home for some reason.

We can’t use the injury excuse to minor players, because half the teams we played in November had injured players that were more valuable to them, than Marvin and Mo are to us. We took advantage of them when they had players out, so some of those teams returned the favor when we had people out.

Next month it will be reverse. Our “easy” games are at home, while we play a pretty brutal road schedule.

If we can win these next 2 games to go 13 – 7, that should give us enough of a cushion to deal with the December road games, if we lose a good number of them.

But you and Ken should not be mistaken. November was by far the easiest part of our schedule. We had a golden chance to put up a very good record, and just couldn’t do it for a variety of reasons.

vava74

November 29th, 2010
3:27 am

Najeh,

The issue about Josh is that he does not keep the same focus.

In some of our losses he was not playing focused and looked tired and disinterested (BOS when he was schooled by Garnett).

It’s not rocket science to conclude that when Josh plays like this we either win or come close.

The problem is when he takes a game off on the boards, closing out on shooters, on man to man D and piles up bad turnovers and shots.

That’s when we definitively lose and usually by a lot.

CoastDog

November 29th, 2010
3:47 am

MsDee

November 29th, 2010
5:02 am

@northcyde

Ok again you say, “We can’t use the injury excuse to minor players, because half the teams we played in November had injured players that were more valuable to them, than Marvin and Mo are to us. We took advantage of them when they had players out, so some of those teams returned the favor when we had people out.”

U right but u act as if those loses were all blow-outs!! We only had 2 blowouts as of now, Bucks and Boston with 1 being with the Bucks with both Marvin and Mo out so dont act as if we were trash those games we lost. We lost between 4-7 pts. If I’m not mistaken, this is what the early part of the season is for, to make mistakes and correct them as we move along which we have as of late no matter WHO we play cause just like we are playing ‘non-playoffs teams’ so are Boston, Orlando, and New Orleans.

MsDee

November 29th, 2010
5:08 am

@northcyde, and u keep talking about the hawks COULD HAVE had a record of 14-4 after 18 games?? Who cares after 18 games??? I ONLY care what our record looks like with 18 games remaining!! Again, like you said, we started out last year after 18 games with the record of 13-5, and look where that got us…TO A VERY TOUGH 7 GAME SERIES WITH THE BUCKS AND AN EMBARRASSING SERIES ENDING WITH ORLANDO IN THE 2ND ROUND. I’m not saying we will be 60+ wins this season, but be happy where we are now!! BE HAPPY IN THE PRESENT AND SEE WHERE IT TAKES US IN THE FUTURE!!

O'Brien

November 29th, 2010
8:09 am

vava,

I think focus is one area where Josh can do better, especially since he sets the tone for the team. If other players are struggling, Josh tends to hang his head, and pout. We need “KG like” intensity from him.

O'Brien

November 29th, 2010
8:11 am

“no matter WHO we play cause just like we are playing ‘non-playoffs teams’ so are Boston, Orlando, and New Orleans.” MsDee .

Actually, the Hawks do not have any wins against teams that made the playoffs last year. Not one. Our only good win so far is against the Pacers.

Boston has wins against Miami (twice), Milwaukee, Chicago, ATL and OKC.

New Orleans has wins against Milwaukee, Spurs, Denver, Houston, Miami, Portland, Dallas.

Orlando has wins against ATL, Phoenix and Miami (and the Pacers).

So far, everytime we play a playoff team, we lose.

terrell

November 29th, 2010
8:26 am

Nothcyde,”extremely easy schedule” IN THE NBA? What planet do you live on? There’s no easy out in the NBA. Hell, N.O. was on like a 12 game winning streak, and got beat by the freakin Clippers, for crying out loud. The Pacers beat the Lakers in LA last night. These are PROFESSIONAL players. Remember that. And btw, I’d rather start off slow, while using a different offense, different rotations, etc.. than fading late with worn out starters, like we did for 3 straight years under your boy Woodrow. And 3rd place is 3rd place. The Hawks dont make the schedule, they just play who’s on it.

terrell

November 29th, 2010
8:47 am

“Hawks wont win without a center”, but Milwaukee’s 6-10 with A 7FTR and a GOOD PG. lol! Whatever. lol!

Fundamentals

November 29th, 2010
8:48 am

Proof positive that it’s all in chemistry and buying into the system. When they try their best, play with energy and work hard they win. When they don’t, they lose. It’s all in giving 100% professional effort and not pointing fingers.

A solid effort against quality teams in December will prove to the “easy schedule” crowd it ain’t who we play, but HOW we play the game.

terrell

November 29th, 2010
8:49 am

Obrien, key word being, “so far”.

Fundamentals

November 29th, 2010
8:51 am

MIA and ORL will give the Hawks another chance to shine this week. Let’s hope they play hard, they play together and they play their game so we can really see what we have.

JeJe

November 29th, 2010
9:23 am

Great posts, McDee. Any team can beat any team on any given night.

Hell, we beat the Lakers IN L.A. in the season we won 13 games. We beat the Spurs at home in 07 when we sucked.

Would just be nice to start beating good teams.
Gotta keep winning – don’t let up

Welcome back, Fundamentals. How was your Thksgiving?

Fundamentals

November 29th, 2010
9:34 am

I remember the Laker game well, a real whippin we put on’em that night.

I enjoyed a big time family meal with each of our wins…now I’m struggling to get back in the swing of things.

It’s all about chemistry JeJe. When they get along and play together we win, when they sulk and point fingers we definitely lose. We can beat anyone when we want to. It’s all about chemistry.

JeJe

November 29th, 2010
9:44 am

Exactly, Fundamentals

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/truehoop/miamiheat/news/story?id=5862172

Excellent article on the Heat. Read last paragraph:

“”They don’t want to step on each other’s toes,” the person said. “There’s no leader on the team. Somebody has to speak up and be the leader on the team. They can’t be afraid to step on people’s toes. They need a vocal leader who’s going to make everybody accountable. I don’t think it’s on the coach. It’s on the players.”

JeJe

November 29th, 2010
9:46 am

THE WHOLE KEYS TO THIS TEAM ARE:

1) REBOUNDING
2) MARVIN BEING AGGRESSIVE. WHEN MARVIN ATTACKS THE BASKET AND HITS OPEN JUMPSHOTS, NO ONE CAN GUARD THIS TEAM. WE HAVE 5 LEGITIMATE THREATS ON THE COURT LIKE LD SAID. THIS CORE ASG TALKS ABOUT IS LEGIT WHEN MARVIN ATTACKS

MARVIN IS THE X FACTOR AND THE KEY TO THIS TEAM

AND HE WILL PROBABLY FOLLOW UP 2 SOLID GAMES WITH HIBERNATION TIL JANUARY

PROVE US WRONG

Rufus1

November 29th, 2010
9:52 am

The Real Record

7-2 on the road…. Winning on the road is only the true test to how good a team really is…ASK BOSTON AND LA.

I think Boston won 25 games at home and 25 on the road…. I won rather have that record, than what we had last year…WE ARE WELL ON OUR WAY.

O'Brien

November 29th, 2010
9:59 am

“A solid effort against quality teams in December will prove to the “easy schedule” crowd it ain’t who we play, but HOW we play the game.” Fundamentals .

Co-sign. But that’s what makes it so frustrating. When the Hawks play the right way, they have a chance to beat anybody. But for various reasons, they have not done it consistently this season.

Hopefully, they will get it going in December. And one positive for the Hawks is we have gotten some of the back to backs out of the way.

And I can see the Hawks are not the only team to call players only meetings. Add Portland to the list (and I think Miami had one last week too).

From hoopshype.com;

(Brandon) Roy said the players-only meeting was “good,” and Marcus Camby called it “positive.” Wesley Matthews said conversation was open, frank and honest, and every player was given a forum. “We talked … about what we need to do,” Matthews said. “We don’t feel we’re an 8-8 team and that’s the gist of it. .

Mike is back

November 29th, 2010
10:02 am

MC, Great Stuff.

Another nice win…but these guys…always get excited and say the same thing win they are winning. When LD can get these guys give the kind of gritty determined effort like them BIRDS for four quarters…FOR EVERY GAME…those seats will fill up at Phillips…THAT’S WHAT UPS!!!

For once I agree with Samuel…these guys ain’t prove nothing yet…let see what happens in December. I’m off the Kool-Aide…until we can give a consistent effort…despite our circumstances…and despite our opponent…WORD UP!!!

Tremendous effort Smoove…I would be remised…if I didn’t mention that.

GREAT EFFORT OFF OF A BACK TO BACK…NOW LET’S KEEP IT GOING HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

terrell

November 29th, 2010
10:39 am

1st it was Paul Silas’ fault, next it was Mike Brown’s fault, then it was Delonte West’s fault, and now it’s Eric Spoelstra’s fault. Lebon James is a freakin joke. Should’ve NEVER left Cleveland. Ruining his rep. BIG TIME!

JeJe

November 29th, 2010
12:12 pm

“”I can’t change my game dramatically, and I don’t think he can, either,” James said. “It doesn’t make any sense to do that. I’d be a role player at that point, if I changed my game dramatically.

“We have to figure out a balance, where we continue to be who we are for the better of the team, for the better of each other.”

LOL so how then will LBJ and Wade adjust? Neither is changing their game

Fail

i_am_soulstar

November 29th, 2010
12:17 pm

Kudos to LD.

It seemed like he had the majority of players getting back on defense rather than going for an offensive rebound as a part of his scheme against fast break-happy teams (Knicks and Raptors). On several offensive possessions during the Raptors and Knicks games, the players would shoot, and if no one was near the basket, they’d get back on defense. I thought it was crazy at first, but it actually seemed to limit the offensive efficiency of both opposing teams.

Kinda makes sense though if the opposing team uses fast breaks, speed, and open court play for many of their points, and your team shoots a high percentage.

And then the offensive rebound is a very infrequent occurrence in most cases. And so maybe LD is trading it for increased defensive competency.

I’ll take it.

I wonder if this scheme is effective against a good team????

JustAThought

November 29th, 2010
12:35 pm

There seems to be some people on this blog that is somewhat “concerned” with the heat……..all I know is when LBJ and DW get their act together, I have no doubts that team can have a 10-15 game run (a couple to be sure). So all you hawks fans, don’t worry they will figure it out (even if old man Pat Riley have to get invloved). Just continue to “hold your breathe” about this hawks team, cause you know like I know………..

O'Brien

November 29th, 2010
12:40 pm

i_am_soulstar,

I dont think the problem is the scheme. I think the problem is the execution.

terrell, JeJe,

One of the issues discussed before the season, was how will Wade and LbJ co-exist, when they both need the ball, and they are not great shooters.

That being said, most people are not surprised by the Chemistry issues. However, I am surprised they look this bad. One thing they are not doing is defending, but nobody on that team is a great defender, so it will be interesting to see how it plays out.

I just hope the Hawks beat them next week.

Ken Strickland

November 29th, 2010
1:09 pm

OBRIEN-you’re correct. The DEC schedule will tell us a lot about how far the Hawks have progressed, but only to that point. Some of you are far too focused on the teams regular season record, which is the same flawed thinking that got Woodson dismissed. LDrew realizes that his task is to prepare the Hawks to be more successful in the playoffs than in the past, and that’s why he’ll use the regular season to develop, teach and mold the team into a more productive and successful playoff team, which could mean sacrificing a few regular season wins.

When LDrew took over he was expected to:

1- improve team DEF,
2-provide more consistent OFF,
3-develop our younger players,
4-improve our ability to win on the road,
5-get more consistent production from our players, especially Marvin, Bibby and Smoove,
6-change the attitudes and focus of the players that quit on MWoodson.

While he’s still working on 1-3, he’s definitely had success with 4-6. It doesn’t take an extremely high IQ to realize it’s extremely more difficult for a HC to develop a team that’s able to win on the road than win at home.

I went walking this morning and started thinking about the teams future beyond this season, and here’s what I came up with. With Smoove having another off season to work on the much improved ball handling and shooting skills he’s demonstrated so far this yr, it could create some definite changes next season. If he continues to show consistent OFF and DEF production throughout the season, there could be some serious consideration for making him next yrs starting SF.

Of course, that would mean we’d have to acquire a starting quality center and move Horford to PF. I don’t see EThomas, MEvans or JaCrawford returning next yr. A bench with SF-MWilliams, C’s-ZPachulia & JCollins, :P F-JPowell, SG/PG’s-JoCrawford, JTeague, (or MBibby), Pape’ Sy, would be very versatile and deep. The adjustments would add another shot blocker to the starting lineup and give us an automatic matchup advantage at SF against most teams.

JUST FOOD FOR THOUGHT.

Fundamentals

November 29th, 2010
1:27 pm

JeJe at 9:45 AM is dead on it.

Heat are having the same issues as us. Just do what it takes to win. Your “game” should meet the need every night. Matchup’s change. We need leaders who hold our team accountable to giving 100% and playing their role.

I agree – Marvin is the X-factor. Has been for how many years? It doesn’t take much from him to completely change a game. Sad thing is he hasn’t touched his potential in terms of what he could be. I personally think he’ll continue to emerge…but that’s just me. He can be exactly what we need to put us over the top. Question is – does he want to be that guy? I think so. If we could see what we got the last two games from Marvin we’d be unstoppable.

northcyde

November 29th, 2010
1:44 pm

MsDee . . I’m happy . . see?

:)

I’m happy that this season didn’t spiral completely out of control and that teams that were supposed to be good, are also struggling.

If we can get to 13 – 7 before we start these road games, I’ll be even more happy.

:( )

The regular season matters folks. If we can’t win the division, we must finish in 2nd. But the playoffs are more about matchups, than anything else.

If the Hawks are 44 – 38, we really can’t expect them to do anything come playoff time. Using the Boston example is dangerous, because Boston started the season out on fire, before injuries decimates them and they went into a freefall. Once they got everyone healthy, they went back to being a great team.

We took care of business against the lesser teams. Now lets get back on track and see if we can beat some good teams. But until we do that, there will be skepticism about this team.

MsDee

November 29th, 2010
2:35 pm

@O’Brien 8:11am post..

I understand the Hawks haven’t beaten a ‘playoff team’ as of yet but if you were carefully reading what I posted at 12:20am and 5:02am, I clearly stated that those loses to the ‘playoff teams’ were WITHOUT MARVIN AND MO WHO ARE BOTH OUR ONLY SF’S ON THE TEAM!! And b4 you say it doesn’t or shouldn’t matter, WELL IT DOES CAUSE IT CAUSED JJ TO PLAY EXTENDED MINS AT SG AND SF AND ALSO KELP JAMAL IN THE GAME LONGER THAN HE NEEDED TO BE TO GUARD THE WRONG PLAYERS!! You guys will have a valid argument once we play Miami and Orlando WITH ALL OUR PLAYERS COMING UP THIS WEEK!! Until than, WE ARE IN 3RD PLACE!!!!!

Melvin

November 29th, 2010
3:00 pm

Can Hawks send the Nets their TPE along with a draft pick in return for Terrence Williams would could play SF…

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/An-NBA-and-D-League-first-Terrence-Williams-dem?urn=nba-289670

jeje

November 29th, 2010
3:11 pm

O’Brien,

I predicted right after The Decision how overhyped Miami is.

I said that all you gotta do is play a physical zone and cram the lane and this team will bend over and take it badly. They have no shooting outside of Mike Miller and Eddie House (who is about as bad as Bibby at everything outside of shooting – namely defense). Ilgauskas may be their 2nd best midrange shooter.

LeBron said that he and Wade are so good that they can’t defer, but there’s a need for balance on the team. WTF is he saying?

Why does Wade not want Riley as coach?

The best insight into these issues is always the comments section on the ESPN articles.

I think LeBron would easily get a ring if he had a healthy Joe Johnson or a younger Ray Allen next to him. The team has no jumpshooters, no PG, and no Center.

JUST PLAY A ZONE AND THEY WILL LOSE

Astro Joe

November 29th, 2010
3:13 pm

Kind of funny, LD used the word “accountability” in virtually every interview. Meanwhile, Avery simply demoted a knucklehead player to the NBDL. I wonder which lockerroom feels like there is truly “accountability” for actions on and off the court?

jeje

November 29th, 2010
3:19 pm

“Trust us: Frequently passive play from the big names, shaky shot selection and James and Wade meeting the media separate while Bosh roamed the American Airlines Center halls with his own security escort after the team meeting all stood out in Dallas more than that bump getting all the air time. ”

From ESPN.com

LOL do LBJ and Wade already not like Bosh?

O'Brien

November 29th, 2010
4:01 pm

AJ, I agree about a lack of accountability with the Hawks.

For example, after 2 or 3 games where we started slow, and he questioned their whereabouts on the night before games, what did LD say to MC?

He didn’t say he would change the lineup, he didn’t say he has thought about changing the lineup, he said he “might” have to think about changing the lineup. To me, the players don’t pay that any attention.

There was also talked about defense (guard your man, or else), but clearly, that doesn’t apply to Jamal or Bibby.

As for the D-League treatment, to be fair to LD, the Hawks players have not done anything to deserve that kind of punishment.

Terrence Williams, on the other hand…

“And in the month of November, repeated tardy violations earned Williams a two-game suspension. Further violations, following the suspension, upset Nets coach Avery Johnson so much that he sent the second-year forward to the D-League as punishment.”.

O'Brien

November 29th, 2010
4:12 pm

Melvin,

Hawks have had plenty of opportunity to upgrade the backup SF spot.

They could have traded for Chris Douglas Roberts at the trade deadline last season or during the off-season from the Nets (he eventually went to Milwaukee for a second rounder), but they were not interested.

They could have gone after a SF backup thyis off-season (Rodney Carney, Matt Barnes etc), but they were not interested.

But I would be ok with Terrence Williams. And since the Nets already have Travis Outlaw signed for the next 4 or 5 years, and they drafted Damion James in the first round (another SF), maybe they are willing to part with Terrence Williams.

Another trade option is Mo Evans for Terrence Williams, so we wouldnt pick up any extra salary.

But given Terrence Williams issues in NJ, I think Rick will pass on him.

I.MUS WRITE

November 29th, 2010
4:23 pm

Marvin Williams sighting…..Good game for him but we all know whats coming next. Drum roll please- Its David Blain time….Marvin will have minimal effect on the next 5 games-time for him to disappear .Trade this guy if anyone will take him.

Still not impressed by the win yesterday-lets see these guys beat playoff type clubs. By the way is there any doubt that Smoove is or best player now…..What a bargain for 11.5 per year. JJ should go to the bank with a mask on the way he’s robbing the franchise, he didnt pay himself though………SIGH!!

Ken Strickland

November 29th, 2010
4:26 pm

ASTRO JOE-AJohnson sent his player down as punishment for his rebellious attitude and off court behavior. In fact, many people, especially D-league officials, are questioning the move and wondering how it’s supposed to correct his actions of defiance and disrespect. It looks like AJohnson was just passing a problem he couldn’t or wouldn’t handle on to someone else. I wouldn’t call that type of over the top action ACCOUNTABILITY.

Recently we’ve seen the mins of JoCrawford, JTeague and JPowell reduced, so how can you assume it wasn’t an act of accountability? There are numerous ways to address accountability, and maybe our lack of awareness is due to a the lack of perception, limited knowledge, and/or understanding of what’s taking place.

I love the way the players, especially our captains, took matters into their hands and saught answers to the teams problems, because their recent play proves it obviously worked. In some respects LDrew is faced with trying to to do a complete 180 degree turn around of attitudes, habits and behavior that have been in existence for up to 6yrs.

We all know Woodson has stated his goal of making JJ an All Star, which might have become the focus of certain players. LDrew’s focus is to create a solid and competitive playoff caliber team, whether we have any All Stars or not. Running the motion OFF tends to spread the wealth and reduces the overall scoring opportunities of previous and hopefull All Stars, which could be the cause for the team experiencing periods of limited ball and player movement .

Spreading the wealth and creating more scoring opportunities for others is why we’ve been able to win convincingly on the rd with JJ playing poorly offensively, which wouldn’t have happened in the past.

northcyde

November 29th, 2010
5:04 pm

I just don’t understand what some of you want Drew to do, when it comes to accountability. You know that ( for the most part ) we have a subpar bench. So why do people expect everyone to be held to the same accountability standard?

So when Bibby and Jamal play bad defense, they should be held accountable for that?

OK

So what happens when Teague or Jordan come into the game, and give you bad offense and turnovers? Should they stay on the floor, to continue to “punish” Bibby and Jamal for bad defense?

That’s why we can’t afford to make an example out of Josh Smith or Joe Johnson on most nights. Their replacement may solve one problem, but may create 3 new problems.

The only thing Drew can do, is play the people that will win him games.

Jeff

November 29th, 2010
5:19 pm

trade for Steve Nash Hawks,

WE FLIPPIN NEED THIS MAN!

He will turn Josh Smith into a 20 and 10 player with ease

Fundamentals

November 29th, 2010
5:49 pm

Jeff, how is Nash going to help us over the next 5 years? We need a PG for the future. Sure it’d be great now, but what then? Dude’s 36?

JeJe

November 29th, 2010
6:14 pm

Ray

November 29th, 2010
6:40 pm

I’m telling you now trading for Steve Nash would be a big mistake. Actually that would be terrible I like the guy great point guard he’ll be in the hall of fame no doubt, but he’s 36.

He probably won’t have but 2 years left vs. Mike Bibby who would have maybe 6 at the most.
We do need a future PG, and maybe Teague needs some competition for minutes at that spot and no Jodran Crawford isn’t the answer

I think Teague has what it takes to be a great PG just needs a kick in the rear if you know what I mean to get him going. Some people need that cause he needs to learn to be aggressive and bold at the same time. He’s got one part, but lacking the other if he gets the other we have a great PG on our hands.

Oh yeah he needs a jumpshot, but how long did it take J-smoove to acquire one and then have it be consistent?

Fundamentals

November 29th, 2010
6:50 pm

Took J-smoove one summer of quiet work to get a jumper..and he didn’t have one before that. Teague had one in college. He just needs time to believe in himself, to relax and to run the team. He needs to realize he isn’t being asked to be an All-Star, just to contribute. That’s what all our players need to understand. Just play your role,the rest will come with winning, not through individual stats.

L-QUE

November 29th, 2010
7:22 pm

Gulfway Atlanta dont have enough talent. we set on the side line holding the checkbook while our true competition went shopping. I am talking Boston, who added size and weight plus resigned speed. orlando added guards. miami, not atrue factor right now , they must reduce the big three to the big two to trully get players to compete for the east.IF ATANTA CAN NEUTRALIZE S.ONEAL, we have a good shot at winning. A playable big man & DEFENSIVE MINED GUARD atlanta should be ok.we have Josh at PF,SF-Marvin at SF,PF- Al at PF we dont need to go there.We can use another seven footer to keep bigger and heavier centers from wearing Al down, he’s not heavy enough.

ant banks

November 29th, 2010
7:34 pm

it is amazin’ that after 3 years and a new head coach, this STILL IS billy knights team, the core minus chills is his. sund ain’t left his mark yet, well maybe wit’ jamal crawford

Ray

November 29th, 2010
7:39 pm

@ Fundamentals

Well I understand where you are coming from in Smoove not having a jumper before this past summer.

I guess I have no choice to agree either seeing as the past few years he didn’t hit many shots with said jumper.

terrell

November 29th, 2010
8:02 pm

Ray, Bibby might have 6 what??? I know your’e not talking about years? I’d pay money to see Bibby play defense in 6 years. lol!

northcyde

November 29th, 2010
8:02 pm

82games.com stats for 2010 – 11 have finally been updated.

+/- LEADERS

Bibby ( +97 )
Smith ( +84 )
Horford ( +62 )
Collins ( +50 ) . . . which is incredible for the amt of time he’s played

In all . . 9 players have a positive +/- rating ( Thomas, Teague, Zaza, and Powell don’t )

*******

5 MAN UNITS

( Best +/- ): Bibby – JJ – Smith – Horford – Collins . . . ( +30 )

( Most Successful ): The starting 5 ( + 22 . . . 10 – 4 record ) and the Core + Jamal w/o Marvin in lineup ( +23 . . 10 – 4 record )

( Worst ): Jamal – JJ – Marvin – Smith – Horford ( -24 . . . 1 – 6 record )

*******

BY POSITION

( Strongest ): PF . . 20.1 PER . . +4.4 PER advantage over opposing PFs . . This also takes into the account the production of Horford at PF, along with Smith and Powell.

( Weakest ): PG . . 12.8 PER . . -5.8 PER disavantage under opposing PGs . . This is Bibby, Teague, and Jamal when he plays the point.

*******

SHOOTING

- 51.6% eFG . . ( 50.6% eFG last year )
- 71% of shots have been jumpers . . ( 66% last year )
- 63% of shots have been assisted . . ( 56% last year )

Ken Strickland

November 29th, 2010
9:10 pm

NORTHCYDE-excellent points in your 5:04PM post. The Hawks don’t have a dominant player like DHoward, or a player that can carry a team like LJames, DWade or KBryant, or a prolific scorer like CAnthony or KDurant. Therefore, we have to rely on speed, quickness and athleticism, along with OFF/DEF team work, to be successful. With a new HC, with a new OFF/DEF approach and philosophy, it’s going to take longer than a training camp, preseason, and 18 regular season gms to overcome yrs of bad habits and limited OFF/DEF decipline.

Jae Evolution

November 29th, 2010
9:12 pm

Has anyone seen Ish Smith from the Rockets? Jeff Teague should be taking notes on his play…

SteveW

November 29th, 2010
10:06 pm

I know the Hawks have won 3 straight over “weak sisters”. Still, it seems that we are coming together. My observation:

1) The Hawks were not used to a strenous training camp under Woody. With the increased intensity, we came out of camp a little banged up. And Mo’ was not over his knee surgery either.

2) Jamal was a little pouty over his contract status, and the different expectations under LD.

3) JJ is hurt, and trying to play through it.

But it seems like we’re starting to gel. We do have a fragile psyche, so I hope Miami or Orl don’t blow us out, or we’re apt to go into a funk for 5 or 6 games.

My biggest 2 questions of late: Were have ZaZa and Teague been? Talk about falling off the face of the planet. Those 2 have nosedived as of late.

One last observation, I do think LD has settled in as Head Coach. I think he was on the verge of losing this team during the 5 game losing streak, but he seems to be settling in as well. I think the Hawks are buying in to what he’s selling. And what I wouldn’t give if we could package ZaZa, Etan, Josh, and Jason for 1 decent big. That big, with Al and Josh would be a dangerous rotation for the rest of the League.

Hope JJ finds his shot soon, or he will be known as Mr. Contract.

SteveW

November 29th, 2010
10:11 pm

I do think during JJ’s funk, he is showing why he’s a top 25 player in the NBA and an All Star. Playing very good D, his Assists are good, and he’s rebounding fairly well. He’s been hurt, but he’s not whining about it (check out Andrew Bynum in LA for how not to be injured). I’ve been impressed. But as I said before, we need his shot.

And I hope Marvin does what he did last game the rest of his career.

Melvin

November 29th, 2010
10:24 pm

Watching OKC/Hornets game. Nice PG battle between Westbrook/Paul. I will have to give Westbrook the edge in this game b/c his 4th qtr performace. He scored like 11 of 24pts in the 4th.

SteveW

November 29th, 2010
10:29 pm

Grades after 18 games: Horford – A
Smoove -A- (Would be a solid A except for his funk during our beat downs).
Marvin – D- (F except it looks like he may be improving, and he is playing hurt)
JJ – B- Where did his shot go? Like the rest of his game
Bibby – B- Playing a little better than expected. Wish he were 2 or 3 steps quicker.

Jamal – B- Just doesn’t seem like he has “it” this year.

Mo’ – B Playing hard and tough. Good role player

Rest of bench – D- Bad, really bad, with rare exceptions. All of them show glimpses (ok, all but Etan), but nothing consistent.

Coaching – C I thought Teague was supposed to develop under this guy?

Team grade – C Until we get deeper, can play good teams well, and defend the Home court, it seems that ESPN’s ranking of 13 fits us about right. Just a little better than average at this point.

And with the Heat signing Dampier, when they get Udonis and Miller back, they are going to be trouble. Count on it. Wouldn’t want to play them after the All-Star break, unless Wad gets hurt or something. Wish Houston would have signed Dampier.

And has anybody signed De’Sean Butler yet? If not, can we?

Melvin

November 29th, 2010
10:36 pm

Here’s a backup SF the Hawks could sign for cheap. Wasn’t this the reason why the Hawks left the final roster spot open. To be flexible to sign a guy if needed.

Marc J. Spears: Kings waive guard Antoine Wright. Twitter

MsDee

November 29th, 2010
10:50 pm

Umm Melvin, now why would we want THIS GUY??? Its stated in an article that he has been a regular bench guy for the past 5 years with about 4 different teams with a stat line of 0.3,,,,0.4,,,,,0.0..again I ask, WHY WOULD WE WANT THIS GUY??

Melvin

November 29th, 2010
11:26 pm

MsDee,

He’s a former 1st round pick, so maybe he can resurrect his career and he could be signed on the cheap for a position of need. Heck, we all know the Hawks will not spend the money needed for a quality guy for the 15th spot. So we may as well sign someone with some NBA experience and possible potential…

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
1:00 am

Melvin,

I understand the “He’s a former 1st round pick” and the “So we may as well sign someone with some NBA experience and possible potential…” Isn’t that what we did for Acie Law?? He too was a 1st round pick with NBA experience with possible potential but aren’t Memphis about to release him as well??

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
1:02 am

All I’m saying, Melvin is that we don’t need another bum on the team..we still trying to get rid of the cob webs by Marvin.

SteveW

November 30th, 2010
1:11 am

At this point, I wouldn’t mind if we re-signed Acie if Memphis releases him. Did I just say that? It must be late.

Looked at Dampier’s line during the game tonite – 5 Boards in 7 minutes. We could have used this guy, especially if ZaZa continues in the tank.

SteveW

November 30th, 2010
1:13 am

Steve Nash is such a fitness freak, he probably has a couple of good years left at least. Nobody has ever averaged their career high in points after 15 seasons in the League. Nash is on pace to. With 9.7 apg as well. Incredible.

L-QUE

November 30th, 2010
1:16 am

THE FIGHT IN THE EAST IS GONNA BE HELL! ORLANDO IS TRYING TO SIGN MELLO OR CP3 MANAGEMENT SAY ONLY HOWARD WONT BE TRADED.THIS BY YARDBARKER FOXSPORTS I THINK THATS THE RIGHT LOCATION

SteveW

November 30th, 2010
1:16 am

If the Hawks stay healthy, JJ finds his shot, Teague develops, Marvin becomes a semi-beast, we may win 50 games. Sure wish we had 1 more legitimate inside presence. Maybe we’re planning on drafting Howard Thompkins. He would be a good fit for the Hawks system and needs. Doing pretty well playing on a gimpy ankle right now.

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
2:02 am

( drumroll )………………… ( hitting symbols )

I agree with MsDee.

“We don’t need another bum on the team.”

Couldn’t have said that better myself.

And that includes Acie. He’s a bust folks. If Grevais Vasquez, a rookie, looks twice as better as Acie, a 3rd year player, then Acie’s time in the NBA is almost over.

We are not a developing team anymore. We don’t have time to wait on projects.

The NBA stands for “No Bums Alowed”.

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
2:16 am

@northcyde…LOL..WOW, I’m so honored to have YOU agree with ME!!!!

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
2:16 am

symbols = cymbals

damn homonyms

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
2:18 am

Yeah I had to. Cause I’m tired of bums too. The last thing we need on this team is some cast-off from another team that has never done anything in his NBA life.

Just say NO to bums.

vava74

November 30th, 2010
2:25 am

A few people have been bashing JJ and re-posting garbage written by idiots of the press (Dwyer, Hollinger, …).

Oh, by the way, Durant is shooting .419 from the field and .267 from 3 point land…

AND NO FREAKING ONE IS SAYING THAT HE IS IN DECLINE AND THAT OKC MADE THE WRONG DECISION TO GIVE HIM A BIG CONTRACT!!!!!!!!!

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
2:42 am

Vava74, sorry but cant compare a 3year player to a 10th year player..but I do like that JJ does other things better even though the shot is wayyy off. My ONLY complaint in JJ is that he doesn’t make his move quick enough for me..he waits til trouble arrives and I just DON’T UNDERSTAND THAT WHAT-SO-EVER!!

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
3:20 am

“AND NO FREAKING ONE IS SAYING THAT HE IS IN DECLINE AND THAT OKC MADE THE WRONG DECISION TO GIVE HIM A BIG CONTRACT!!!!!!!!!”

When you are a 3rd year player coming off winning a scoring title, leading your undersized team in a spirited series against the eventual champion, making first team All-NBA, and anchoring the national team as it wins a world championship, you tend to get a little more slack than if you just came off “leading” your team to the worst second-round playoff defeat of all time while averaging half your regular season total in points in the aforementioned playoff series.

vava74

November 30th, 2010
4:27 am

Najeh,

The only point is precisely that: slack or lack of it.

Give JJ some slack. He is playing INJURED for crying out loud and at 29 there is no way that he is in decline.

On Durant, what people are failing to detect is that he is not only shooting worse, but also SHOOTING MORE, which it is the opposite of what you want from a guy who is struggling.

vava74

November 30th, 2010
4:30 am

JJ is shooting LESS and passing MORE which is something someone as stupid and in bad faith like Hollinger omitted.

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
5:12 am

vava74..u have valid points but still cant compare a 3rd yr player to a 10yr player cause just like you said, Durant(3 year mentality) is shooting more which is opposite of what you want from a guy like JJ (10 year mentality) who is shooting less while passing more.

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
5:13 am

Vava74, that’s just like expecting a 3 year old to out smart a 7 year old??

vava74

November 30th, 2010
6:06 am

MsDee,

No, what I want is FAIR reporting and not ESPN bull all the time.

JJ is not Kobe nor Lebron but he is a heck of a player who usually brings it to both sides of the court and it is extremely unfair that he gets all these reports on “decline” when has been playing injured and when there are other comparable players (in ability and situation – top man on team and having signed a max / big contract) who are also struggling with their shooting like Durant and Lebron (who is shooting 6% worse from the field and from 3 point land whilst piling up more than 4 turnovers per game).

{MAC-Town Georgia 478}

November 30th, 2010
6:23 am

Great posts by tom, msdee and terrell on page 1. That type of mentality is one I’m trying to have to ease the pain of not having beaten a good team yet this year and a somewhat mediocre start.

“tom

November 28th, 2010
10:16 pm

i don’t really care about the slow start. As long as we beat the teams we should beat and the team starts really clicking after the all star break we can hopefully ride that into the playoffs.”

especially like that….

the only thing I have to wonder is if we really have shown any signs that we WILL start clicking. Then again, we still are trying to get used to the new system and you have to imagine that Jamal and Joe will get better. Powell still is better than Joe smith last year. Josh and Horford are improved, and with Drew’s comfort in using the bench, hopefully Teague and Crawford will steadily improve and contribute more to make this team even deeper and more solid. Hopefully Marvin will perform more consistently as well, but what;s the possibilities of these things? We’ll see.

{MAC-Town Georgia 478}

November 30th, 2010
6:28 am

Another thing, I appreciate and love Josh Smith’s hustle and ability to stuff the stat sheet, but does anybody else still get the feeling that his game is still a little too wild or sloppy?

His jump shooting is improved but his low post moves are still questionable and he throws up some horrible attempts in the paint too much for my liking. He’s got to improve those low post moves and/or atleast get better at drawing fouls when operating down there.

It’s that type of fine tuning on offense we need on offense from Josh come playoff time

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
6:51 am

@{MAC-Town Georgia 478}

What really get me is when fans talk about how we havent beaten a ‘playoff team’ but all the ‘non-playoff teams’ when just last year, we would beat the Good teams while losing to the not-so-good teams..to me ALL THE GAMES HAS THE SAME IDENTICAL GOALS…TOO WIN!!

{MAC-Town Georgia 478}

November 30th, 2010
7:26 am

That’s true@MsDee

Actually I find myself upset with the team plenty of times then I try to look at things with a more optimistic view (like this morning). What we all have to remember is everybody on here wants whats best for the team but we just express it differently, some more optimistic and some more pessimistic. I can understand where both sides/arguments draw their conclusions from.

O'Brien

November 30th, 2010
8:04 am

Vava,

I understand your point about the media being not being fair to JJ, and I agree with you. But I understand where the media is coming from.

1) KD – 5 years, $85 mil. JJ – 6 years, $124 mil (a lot more than KD)

2) KD – 22 years old, JJ – 29 years old (closer to decline)

3) Look at the schedule. Hawks are 0-6 vs last year’s playoff teams, OKC is 8-5 vs last year’s playoff teams.

And like Najeh said. KD and OKC are coming off a great season and a hard fought playoff series (plus the USA gold medal), while JJ struggled big time in the Hawks playoff blowout.

I do think JJ is injured more than he lets on, so he needs to get his rest before the tough part of the schedule really starts in a week or so.

Big Ray

November 30th, 2010
9:10 am

“He came out with that sense of urgency, flying around, blocking shots, rebounding and finding guys,” Johnson said. “When he is playing like that, we all play at a totally different level.”

That would be our $125 million dollar team captain talking about our $58 million dollar team captain. Heh….

Ken Strickland

November 30th, 2010
9:18 am

For those who insist on berating the Hawks for winning against none playoff teams,.consider this:

MIAMI-this is the team most people picked to win the East and the NBA title, yet they’ve mananged to win only one gm against a playoff team, Orlando, who they clobbered earlier in the season. It looks like they need to do a better jog of defeating none playoff teams., huh.

ORLANDO-While they’re leading their division, they’ve managed to win only 2 gms against winning teams, Atlanta and Miami(who embarrassed them earlier in the season).

BOSTON-They’re leading their division, and have won 4gms against teams with winning records, Atlanta, Miami, Chicago and Oklahoma.

So what does this tell us? It tells us that you can maintain a good REGULAR SEASON record and make the playoffs by consistently defeating none playoff teams, but it’s much harder to accomplish if you have trouble defeating those teams. To be honest, the only time defeating top playoff caliber team really matters is IN THE PLAYOFFS. Remember, we managed to defeat both the Magic and Cavaliers during the last 2 regular seasons, but got swept and embrassed by both teams when it counted the most, IN THE PLAYOFFS.

Last yr we accpomplished a 4gm REGULAR SEASON sweep of the Celtics. Do any of you really think we could have swept them during the playoffs? In 07 the Celtics swept us during the regular season, but had to rely on home court advantage to win a 7gm 1st round serious.

I DON’T GIVE A DAMN ABOUT THE REGULAR SEASON RECORD, OR PLAYOFF STATUS OF THE TEAMS WE DEFEAT AS LONG AS WE DEFEAT THEM. THAT ONLY MATTERS WHEN PLAYOFF TIME COMES AROUND, AS I’VE JUST DEMONSTRATED.

JeJe

November 30th, 2010
9:34 am

“I think there’s frustration from everyone,” James said. “As far as me and Spo being frustrated with each other, I don’t think there is. I have Coach Spo’s back or whatever the case may be. This is who we have.

What does “whatever the case may be. This is who we have” mean? Is he saying that he doesn’t care who the coach is or it wouldn’t matter who the coach is? Sounds like a swipe at Spoelstra or the assumption they’ll get a new coach

dap01

November 30th, 2010
9:39 am

Lebron is the poster child for “spoiled brat”.

JeJe

November 30th, 2010
9:44 am

WE NEED MORE PLAYERS TO COMMIT HARD FOULS AND PICK UP TECHNICAL FOULS.

WATCH THE HEAT/WIZARDS GAME LAST NIGHT. THAT’S WHAT WE NEED.

WE HAVE NO VUJACIC’S, RON ARTESTS, LAMAR ODOMS, KIRK HINRICHS OR KEVIN GARNETTS ON THIS TEAM

MARVIN DON’T GO BACK TO SLEEP

wesleywhatwhat

November 30th, 2010
9:53 am

well written, insightful article.

the ajc could use more MCs, and fewer “sports columnists”.

O'Brien

November 30th, 2010
10:04 am

Ken S,

Hawks will qualify for the playoffs just by beating up on none playoff teams. However, IMO, the Hawks are a mentally fragile team.

So if they can win games against playoff teams in the regular season, that will allow them to buy into LD’s system even more, which would make them more dangerous in the playoffs.

JeJe

November 30th, 2010
10:04 am

” “He came out with that sense of urgency, flying around, blocking shots, rebounding and finding guys,” Johnson said. “When he is playing like that, we all play at a totally different level.”

That would be our $125 million dollar team captain talking about our $58 million dollar team captain. Heh….”

LOL

drmaryb

November 30th, 2010
10:19 am

All Things Hawks!

The Hawks are doing quite well considering ALL the changes they made over the off – season. (smirk)
All jokes aside, the Hawks are who we thought they were, there have been no surprises thus far.

The team is moving the ball like they did to start last season, better then – I might add, however, the difference now is that the player and ball movement in a stated new motion offense is cemented in writing and has been verbalized as a “Change – We Can Believe In!”

So, here’s my point: We always knew how to move the ball, the difference now is Coach Drew is making it an IDENTITY for the team and for the rest of the NBA to know, that this is now a philosophical change in attitude and demands. The other notable change is the chunking of the switches on defense 100% of the time. We are still employing some switches, and we should!

but, not to the detriment and point of being predictable and also, the showing on defense to disrupt the post player and then quickly getting back to the perimeter snipers. Is a show and fake double team, sort of like a pump-fake and drive to the basket, which we don’t do nearly ENOUGH! I wish Marvin and Josh would employ more pump fakes and drives like Grant Long mastered under Lenny Wilkens.

Overall, I like what I am seeing, just need to iron out a few wrinkles and learn to remain focused when challenged by success! Young teams win 13 in a row and actually believe they are good –
Veteran teams (like the Falcons), win 9 in a row and know they suck!

A Champion NEVER believes he is as good or as bad as his record!
- drmaryb -

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
10:25 am

JeJe – Imagine if just 1 player could show the resolve, leadership and fire that KG does.

I still feel like LD will continue to incorperate Marvin. If we can keep Marvin involved and get Joe & Marvin healty we’ll be pleasantly surprised by the jump this team will make. If Marvin can produce we can focus our efforts on getting help at PG and maybe C.

I know I’ll get bashed, but Collins has played well when given the chance. Why can’t LD use him instead of ZaZa? Collins has proven he’s worked hard this summer, he’s good on the +/- and he’s giving his best. He’ll only improve as he gets more time and into full game shape. ZaZa just seems out of sorts and slow to his assingments?

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
10:42 am

O’Brien,

We’ve got to gel & really believe in our system and each other. That’s where they fell apart against ORL and CLE. They were intimidated and afraid to try their best and lose. They lost their heads and thus embarrassed themselves. They’ve just gotta realize we’re behind them 100% when they give 100%. Personally I don’t care if they win or lose as long as they give all they have and it shows. I can respect a good effort.

PHO and ORL were pretty solid efforts this year. Utah as well. I could handle that. We had some adjustments and some need for work, maybe a few folks who weren’t 100%, but the effort was there. I could respect that. Bucks and Boston just made me want to never watch them again.

Definitely all mental. They control their own destiny. The other teams can’t be the one to dictate that.

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
10:56 am

hawks will be judged by the playoff showing…i am not sure how collins, powell or etan will help us get outta the 2nd round though.

woody was right about teague and ac law though.

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
10:58 am

DRMARYB,

excellent points, changin’ the mentality from a stagnant iso-joe to a motion offense is similar to changin’ from a 3-4 defense in football to a 4-3 or vice versa. it is a MENTALITY that will take time and coachin…

Rev in Tampa

November 30th, 2010
11:05 am

Fundamentals, I agree completely with your 10:42am comments. I am eager to support this team. I desire to live in blissful optimism in regard to this team’s future. But it was evident that the Hawks were not ready to believe in themselves or even give a fair effort in their losses to Boston & New Jersey. I was forced to take a more balanced view of this team.

I have been encouraged these past few games, but the December schedule of games will help me know how much emotion to invest in the Hawks. If the Hawks players, themselves, are unwilling to go “ALL-IN” then I won’t be able to either.

I can invest emotionally in this team even if the management and owners do not, but if the players won’t give 100%, then I won’t either.

Go Hawks! Give us a reason to cheer…

SteveW

November 30th, 2010
11:20 am

7 back to back games in a month seems much to me. That’s what we have from Nov. 28th to Dec. 28th. Hope our legs are ready. We did pretty well on the 1st back to back in that stretch didn’t we?

I believe our cohesion is starting to rise to the top. If Marvin and Teague develop, watch out!

BTW, I’m still hopeful on Teague. He was the 7th PG drafted in ‘09. All scouts said he was a 5 year project at PG, but worth it because of his extremely high upside. And why all the bashing about no jumpshot by Teague? The dude has a great jumpshot, way better than Rondo or Rose for that matter. He just has to learn how to lead on court, that’s all. All of the other tools are there. He’s already a much better defender than Acie in my opinion.

SteveW

November 30th, 2010
11:24 am

And I would trade Josh Powell, Jason Collins, and Etan Thomas for Eric Dampeir right now. We could have signed him. He would help us, and would have kept him away from the Heat. Man we need him. ZaZa seems more lost than last year, after a really good start.

And bash the Heat now while you have a chance. I root for the Heat to lose every game. But, being a realist, I know when they get Miller and Udonis back, with the addition of Dampier, they will be the team to beat in the East still.

SteveW

November 30th, 2010
11:28 am

And how does ESPN rate the Bucks at 6-10 better than our Hawks? Is it because of the beatdown they gave us earlier in the season? Just wondering. BTW, the Bulls look like the real deal even without Boozer. It will be interesting to see how he fits in.

O'Brien

November 30th, 2010
12:11 pm

LD has been giving his bench ample PT to try and establish themselves, and with so many back to backs, we can see why.

Usually, the starters have a lead, and then the bench comes in, and falls behind. And then the starters climb an uphill battle for the rest of the game. We will need our bench to play well if we want to win some of those back to back games.

Hawks have won 3 in a row, and all the players are happy. But we know how quickly that can change. After all, they went 6-0 to start the season, only to go on a losing streak.

Hopefully they will be focused for the December run.

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
12:25 pm

Amen O’Brien.

Rev’s right. We need them to committ so we as fans can bring more fans to the table. After the 6-0 I had a few folks ready to believe, now they might never come back. I kept preaching to give this team till Feb. Guess I’ll have to be patient. Hopefully it’ll come.

JeJe

November 30th, 2010
12:54 pm

I am more scared of a healthy Bucks lineup than a healthy Bulls lineup.

Let’s be real: D.Rose and Noah are the truth – but Deng and Boozer don’t scare me.

With Milwaukee, a healthy lineup can have Jennings, Salmons, Bogut, and Maggette. Don’t forget Michael Reed if he ever returned

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
1:03 pm

Ants in your Pants!

Yeah Ant Banks, my point was that even though the Falcons are
9-2? They can play soo much better and have room for a ton of improvements!

The 1 minute field goal wins have been great and lucky! But, they are not blowing teams away at home and are losing to elite teams on the road. When, that defense moves to the top five? We will become unbeatable – period!

The Falcons are holding down the league and gaining momentum, but I haven’t seen all three phases click at the same time game in and game out like a machine! The schedule is favorable down the stretch for two play off rounds at home, but in the NFL it’s: One and Done! So, to win the Super Bowl, we have to get better in ALL phases consistently. So, while 9 – 2 is great, we need to play better.

The Hawks, likewise need to play their game and not their record! When they were 7 – 0? They really believed all they had to do was show up and breath against the real teams! Very IMMATURE thinking.

JeJe

November 30th, 2010
1:26 pm

Boozer is extremely fragile and a bit short for a PF. Deng is good – not great.

This whole team is predicated on Marvin’s aggressiveness. We need Van Exel to fire up Marvin if Teague is going to continue to suck.

With Marvin, the guy is useless 90 % of the time, but when he is aggressive, he looks damn effective out there – maybe a poor man’s Antwawn Jamison. Teague hasn’t shown us much besides defense and an atrocious jumpshot

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
1:36 pm

last year, rick sund said that elite teams when 20+ games on the road. we are 7-2 on the road, so far. We have 32 more road games, i am sure that we will win atleast 13 more road games. i am surprised that we are 4-5 at home, but i am equally as surprise about our home record.

road wins mean more to me. it says that we are mature and can’t be rattled in hostile environments.

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
1:36 pm

Doin’ Work!

Teague should be in the gym with a hired ball boy until midnight on the daily!

Doin’ what? Doin’ Work!
Putting down 1,000 jump shots and making good on 500, before he takes his tired azz home! Ray Allen shows up on the court 4 hours before EVERY game to put up jump shots and he is 36 years old, while Grant Hill is 38.

So, should Marvin, who on Hawks 360 was riding his Rick Mahorn sized azz around in his Mercedes and a starched Polo Oxford Shirt, talking about he is not the one to show up at 12 noon for a 7PM game? He Should! Because his shot is TURRIBLE (Barkley’s Voice and Vernacular).

Oh yeah! Marvin says he likes to þake a nice shower and relax his mind before all games? Aye Marvin! How’s that workin’?

Go Figure! I can’t stand these candy-azzes!

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
1:42 pm

Drmaryb, it’s all about the “nimbers”!

We need Smitty back broadcasting!

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
1:44 pm

Show Time!

And, tell Sund that Elite Teams also, always play to their potentials too!

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
1:45 pm

” I DON’T GIVE A DAMN ABOUT THE REGULAR SEASON RECORD, OR PLAYOFF STATUS OF THE TEAMS WE DEFEAT AS LONG AS WE DEFEAT THEM. THAT ONLY MATTERS WHEN PLAYOFF TIME COMES AROUND, AS I’VE JUST DEMONSTRATED. ” Ken Strickland

yes, ken, but what do you see us doin’ in tbe playoffs this yr? if we finish 5th, that means a match up of possibly miami or chicago. i don’t see us gettin’ pass them in a 1st round.

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
1:46 pm

How can he use the term “Elite” when we’ve essentially proved nothing other than getting into the playoffs. “Elite” means you have a realistic shot to win the title. He haven’t up to this point. If we gel and potentially add a piece or two we might be in that echelon?

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
1:48 pm

Ant Banks, we’ll see how they do this year. If the team gels and gives 100% we can compete with almost anyone. I don’t see getting into the 2nd round as unrealistic. I do, however, think we’ll still have issues getting over the hump. My hope is that we at least make it intersting this time, like we did against the Celtics. Give yourself a chance, inspire some fans. Maybe then ownership will allow the extra $$ it’ll take to truly have a real shot at the title.

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
1:49 pm

fundamentals and maryb,

y’all do remember his sayin’ that last year, right?

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
1:49 pm

Fundamentals!

I know right? If not for Bob Rathburn, we would have no COLOR commentary!
lol!

Smitty would be informative and just as excitable (smirk) as Nique.
Thank Goodness we don’t have to tolerate Mark Jackson’s, “Mamma! There goes that man!” – Crap. Hey, Greg Anthony “The Analaphor” is pretty impressive too!

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
1:51 pm

FUNDAMENTALS,

etan, josh powell, and collins AND larry drew is ALL that sund thought that we needed to make it outta the 2nd round. i don’t know what these 3, collectively, will be able to do to get us past orlando

The Truth

November 30th, 2010
1:59 pm

“I’m not trying to break down the semantics of an actual trade. Maybe Jordan Crawford, Jamal Crawford’s expiring contract and a few future draft picks are enough.

Or maybe Atlanta would have to give up Josh Smith and absorb one of Phoenix’s long-term contracts, like Hedo Turkoglu or Josh Childress (eligible to be traded after Dec. 15).”

If this writer isn’t trying to “break down the semantics” of a trade, then what the hell did he just do? This trick of making a suggestion after declaring one was not intended is not fooling anyone. The bottom-line is that Phoenix wants Josh Smith after losing Stoudemire and they are indirectly campaigning hard for him. The Jamal and Jordan Crawford idea is really a smoke screen since neither player fills a void for Phoenix. Their problem is defensive presence so Josh Smith would be a huge upgrade for them. The problem is if they expect the Hawks to bite on this idea, then the weed they’re smoking must be the best because no-way this happen. Some of their fans routinely have come on this blog suggesting this same idea as well. Now it appears in the Bleacher Report. I know Sund hasn’t been a fan-favorite in Hawksville as of late with his constant inactions, but even he can’t be that stupid. Trading a nearly 37 yr old defensive liability PG for a nearly 25 yr old beast, where is the logic?

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/529672-nba-trade-rumors-5-reasons-steve-nash-and-atlanta-hawks-would-be-a-perfect-fit

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
2:02 pm

Ant,

Yeah, I remember that too. Etan? He wears nice dress suits! Maybe, those rebel flag comments glued his azz to the bench?

How can Etan and Pape Sy help us get past round 2, when we have never seen them suit up (my bad), uniform – up?

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
2:09 pm

Pipe-Dreams!

The Truth … Yeah man, them Phoenix dudes smoking Meth on a glass pipe, IF!
They think we let josh load his house on a United Van Lines truck headed West!

I will personally go down to Atlanta Underground and start that FIRE! Then, I would send Bin Laden and Alqueda some money to blow up Phillips Arena!

You FEEL Me?

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
2:13 pm

I don’t put any faith in the Nash speculation, unless we’re just plain stupid. Our group is signed for the next 4-5. Any moves need to improve that group for the duration of those contracts, not cripple them. I love Nash, but NO DEAL!

Ant – I do wonder every game why we have Etan? Folks gripe about Sy, but why is Etan always in a suit? Dude never even plays. Why did we sign him?

Powell, to me, has been a decent prospect, especially at the price. He’s finding his niche, showing some value. I tend to like him. I think if he was on the court with better perimeter D and a C to rely on for boards he’d be a valuable PF role player. I tend to like him, especially for vet min money.

Collins has shown a decent defensive presence. If he got minutes he’d give us a good defensive option. Was he Dampier, Chandler, Okafur – no, but he’s easily showing vet min value which is what you paid.

One of my issues is what’s up with ZaZa? Dude’s clueless of late. No rebounding, no defense, no help? He’s lost? For what we paid he’s not giving back his value.

Ant, the real issue overall is you’re complaining for players who get MLE money vs vet min money. It isn’t that the three you’re throwing under the bus are bad players, they’re just not the caliber players that you’re demanding. What you’re asking for is $15 million of the $20-25 million I think keeps us apart from the Elite teams.

All teams aren’t created equal. Sund & ASG handicap ours by $25 million every year. Don’t blame it on the players. Blame it on the budget…which in turn gets turned on the fans, who don’t show up b/c the product that’s presented doesn’t meet expectations night in and night out.

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
2:16 pm

MC – what is the deal with Sy and his “injuries”. Are we ever going to see dude in a uni or what? Why not D-League the kid to get him NBA reps?

Can we send Sy to the D-League and sign another vet since we’re already at 15? Is there a chance to release Etan if we’re not going to use him? What players can be released prior to the frenzy in Feb? What are our options?

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
2:16 pm

Fine Me!

Andre Johnson dislocates Finnigan’s eye sockets Sunday and both get fined 25K?
Dunta Robinson makes ONE PLAY at corner all season and gets fined 50K for a legal clock cleaning on DeShaun Jackson with both players out two games?

Where is Clyde?
Goddell needs to be FIRED!

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
2:22 pm

How bout we just send you to the Falcons blog drmaryb! This is Hawk Talk, you got the wrong bird.

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
2:23 pm

The Hawks were 90 – 33 at home the past 3 years, with that team playing absolutely great and exciting basketball @ Philips Arens.

And fan support of the team was average to lukewarm at best.

So don’t believe for one minute that the average fan in ATL will be compelled to come out to watch a team that gives 100% effort, but still manages to lose games.

No . . . they need to win those games. And even that hasn’t proven to be enough at times to bring out fans.

In December, with a lot of non big name teams coming to Philips, the fans will have to decide if they simply want to see the Hawks play and beat weaker opponents . . or would they rather watch them on TV?

Management failed to add new players that would upgrade the team. And they froze up when they had the chance to bring in a real box office star in Shaq. So the team we have now, is the team we have to support.

In the end, it’s the ASG’s fault for not doing their job. But the fans do need to ask themselves a question:

“Why do people try to find reasons to NOT support the team and go to games . . . instead of trying to find reasons TO support the team and go to games?”

Astro Joe

November 30th, 2010
2:24 pm

Fundamentals, the Hawks can only have 12 players dressed in uniform. So either Twin or Etan (along with SY) will be dressed in a suit.

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
2:25 pm

Fundamentals?

What else is ther to say about the Hawks, that hasn’t been said a trillion times? Are you Autistic? This blog site can use all the hits it can get!

It keeps the nimbers up? You got anything NEW to say about the Hawks?

I didn’t think so! LOL! Calm down!

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
2:35 pm

Scrolling!

Fundamentals, another thing, YOU/YALL can’t send me nowhere!
What you can do is this:

‘Get Your Scroll On!’

When you see my name? Step on the Gas!
When I see your ISH, I’ll return the favor!

LOL!

Geemack

November 30th, 2010
2:42 pm

To the people that are always criticizing the Hawks fans for their support of the team.

Well Miami have 3 of the top 15 players in the NBA, and the crowds look worse than the Hawks
.
Give Atlanta Wade or Lebron and Phillips Arena would be rocking for 41 games.

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
2:44 pm

Upcoming home schedule in December

Memphis
Philly
New Jersey
Indiana
Charlotte
Orlando
Cleveland
Golden St

And the only weekend games are Philly and Charlotte on a Friday, and Indiana on a Saturday. The Orlando game is on a Monday night.

And the Home schedule should at least give us a chance to balance out any bumps we may encounter out on thr road. If we can finish December with a 9 – 8 record, I’ll take that.
A 10 – 7 record would be great. 11+ wins would be a dream, and may give some indication that the Hawks are legit . . . if a few of those 11+ wins come against some of our rivals.

We’re 4 games above .500 right now. If we go 10 – 7 in November, we’ll be 21 – 14 going into January. That’s probably a realistic target right now.

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
2:50 pm

i actually like the idea of teague/jsmoove for nash. can you imagine how much damage we could do with nash? omg and trade j crawford to get kaman/camby for center? wow.

Rev in Tampa

November 30th, 2010
2:52 pm

northcyde, Fundamentals post had very little to do with the Atl fan base. The Atl Hawks fan base is what it is. And in this economy it is less that what it would otherwise be.

Fundamentals’ point, and my point as well, is that the Hawks owe the fans 100% when they step out on the floor. And since I’m easy to please, I’ll take 90% effort as long as the team competes. But when you give up halfway through the first quarter against Boston, then the fans have a right to gripe about this team and speculate whether they are going to give their emotional or financial support.

The Truth

November 30th, 2010
2:57 pm

drmaryb (*_*)

“You FEEL Me?”

Oh yeah, definitely felt that!! In fact, I would co-sign such a move; BY ANY MEANS NECESSARY. I’m rather pissed at the notion really. Of all the deals Sund have signed, the Josh Smith deal has been the best and now Phoenix wants to steal our joy. If what you send Laden and company isn’t enough, let me know. I believe I can sell my antique 1977 280Z and add to the kitty. This epitomizes the Hawks bad management of giving valuable players away for peanuts like Dominique Wilkins and others. Still pissed at that

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
2:57 pm

Astro – I realize the 12 player rule, but Etan has what 8 minutes on the floor as a Hawk? Why did we sign him? What is the point of having Sy in a suit? Send him somewhere to gain experience. Collins needs minutes to keep his timing and footwork. If we don’t he’s useless.

I said all this last year, only to watch Collins fail miserably against Dwight. Maybe he would’ve w/ plenty of playing time, but I tend to think he’d be useable if we had him primed before a matchup. Give him real run well before the game, get him primed to see what he can do. If he fails miserably release him as he’s useless to the cause we signed him for.

Keeping dead weight on the bench is useless. We need role players, not bench warmers. Use them or lose them!

Grandad

November 30th, 2010
2:57 pm

Enter your comments here

Grandad

November 30th, 2010
2:59 pm

Is the bloginator gettin’ anyone else or just me?

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
3:00 pm

Can’t give drmaryb crap? Sorry to offend, don’t get your feathers ruffled. I even had the decency to read your Falcons crap just to see if it had relevance. Face it, we need a game or an update from MC! No need to start lashing out at folks.

Grandad

November 30th, 2010
3:01 pm

I get it.
If you don’t kiss Joe’s ass…..

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
3:02 pm

Amen Rev

northcyde is spot on with the expectations/predictions. Very realistic, very good analysis.

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
3:05 pm

What’s up Grandad? Are they really not working?

I still wish we could’ve nabbed Ajinca for a prospect instead of letting Etan rot on the bench. Send the Sy and Ajinca to the D League for reps to get them ready for our future.

Props to Etan for his willingness to reach out to fans in Milton, but dude needs some sort of minutes to justify even signing him. He too will need reps if he is to prove of any value against Dwight. A rusty Etan or Collins is useless against Howard.

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
3:07 pm

No Rev . . . blame the ASG for basically giving Boston Shaq on a silver platter, who along with KG, completely neutralized and outphysicaled ( lol @ that word ) our frontcourt.

The Boston beatdown, while bad, didn’y bother me nearly as much as the Milwaukee beatdown. The Boston one you could kind of see coming. The Milwaukee one was completely uncalled for.

When the Hawks face a bad matchup, bad things are going to happen to this team, because we don’t have a superstar nor quality depth to bail us out. But there’s no way in the world that Milwaukee should ever beat us by 15+ points . . ever.

It is what it is though. The Hawks are a good, but not an elite team. So fans simply shouldn’t expect elite level play out of these guys. Now that Memphis is fully healthy, don’t be surprised if that game isn’t far more tougher Wednesday night, than the game we played in November.

Geemack

November 30th, 2010
3:07 pm

northcyde

“Why do people try to find reasons to NOT support the team and go to games . . . instead of trying to find reasons TO support the team and go to games?”

The same reason you won’t go see a movie franchise that has an OK plot, and the same tired ending. I love basketball so I attend the games regardless, just because.

The casual fans are the ones that fill the seats, and the ASG have not given those fans a reason to come to the games.

Geemack

November 30th, 2010
3:16 pm

northcyde,

I agree with you the Hawks are a good team, but not an elite team.

So could someone please tell Rick Sund to stop trying to pass them off as an elite team.

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
3:35 pm

Geemack . . the only way to bring them here, is to bring a superstar to ATL. Good basketball by non-star personalities isn’t good enough.

That’s why the Shaq thing is so damaging from a marketing standpoint. They had a golden chance to bring a NBA icon to ATL. But they “like the core” so much, that they wouldn’t pay extra to bring the dude in.

Heck, the Hawks JUST got on FM radio this year, after being on that weak azz AM 680 signal. When Ted had the team, they were on AM 750, a signal that you can hear all across the Southeast on a clear night. But on 680, you’d be lucky to hear the signal outside the 285 perimeter.

There’s no doubt that the ASG doesn’t have a clue as to how to market this team to the ATL demographic.

On the flip side . . so-called die hard Hawk fans can’t be giving up on the team at the first sign of adversity either. The exact thing they accuse the team of doing, the fans will do at the drop of a hat.

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
3:36 pm

Sund lives in Billy Knight’s dream. He has yet to really make his mark on this team.

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
3:39 pm

I think the Hawks were dropped from the FM band after the big losing streak. The economy has alot to do with fans showing up. Arena’s everywhere are empty. Just don’t keep talking “elite” until you put up the $$ “elite” teams get. We’re on economy budget, thus economy results and economical fans who won’t passionately buy into the product.

Shaq woundn’t fill the seats. We need someone young, someone with flair, someone with a future in this organization. Not a tired ring chaser.

Ken Strickland

November 30th, 2010
3:42 pm

ANT BANKS-I see us defeating our 1st rd opponent in fewer than 7gms, regardless of who we play, and I see us having a very competitive 2nd rd series, win or lose. Beyond that, I can’t realistically say what we’ll do, or how far we’ll go. Regardless of our regular season record, I see LDrew will make the Hawks a much better prepared and more competitive playoff team.

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
3:44 pm

FUNDAMENTALS,

i think that nash would do jus’ that, for the short term…PACK THE ARENA!! a packed arena means more merchandise, more alochol, more parking, more concessions…MORE MONEY. and with more money we can get marquee players.

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
3:55 pm

OK ant, what then next year or for the 3-4 that follow when Nash is 40? What’s our future after this year? How do you replace Smoove down low? I just don’t see it.

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
4:08 pm

Fundamentals . . . lol . . so the Hawks are already off the FM station? Are you serious? That’s sad.

And you’re wrong about the impact of Shaq.

Shaq is one of the top NBA personalities in the league. While his presence may not have the Hawks at 100% capacity, he’d easily have us at above 90% capacity . . instead of the current 77% we’re at now.

The curiousity of him in a Hawks uniform, would’ve brought the casual fans out in droves. It would’ve increased the number of national TV games we got too, because the national media has always loved Shaq. And that means local advertisers would be compelled to advertise more not only at Philips, but also on FSN South and SportSouth and on radio.

All the ATL music and hip-hop stars would come out. Which means that all of the groupies and Shaq groupies will come out.

Honestly, if the ASG couldn’t make money with Shaq on the Hawks, they need to completely get out of the NBA.

The Truth

November 30th, 2010
4:10 pm

Josh Smith at Dick’s Sporting Good Today 6:00 – 7:00 PM

http://www.nba.com/hawks/fans/Smoove_at_DSG_113010.html

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
4:12 pm

FUNDAMENTALS,

i am glad that you ask. trade smooth for nash. dangle crawford’s expiring contract to get MORE pieces. etan, collins, jpowell, mo evans all come off the books next year. bibby will have an expiring contract next year. sund has to use his brain and be creative.

what are we goin’ to do next year anyway? j crawford 1, likely won’t be here, teague ain’t gettin’ enough minutes now to be ready and j crawford 2 is not a point

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
4:19 pm

Who do you think the casual ATL fan would rather see?

A developing Jeff Teague . . . or an over the hill Allen Iverson?

If the ASG isn’t going to seriously make the type of moves to build a championship contender in ATL, they may as well make the type of moves that may make them money.

drmaryb (*_*)

November 30th, 2010
4:20 pm

Open Door!

Aye! Fundamentals, you opened that door – I just walked in and ate your lunch.
You know me! I like spittin’ & spattin’ with the fellas. You also know that I LOVE reading your posts, I look foward to all your stuff.

But, I’m still gonna Talk Falcons whenever and wherever I feel like it.
I like the comparing the Hawks to the Falcons, two home teams playing well – it ’s ALL good!

LOL!

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
4:25 pm

northcyde – I can see your point, I’m just not a Shaq fan myself. He’s playing well in Boston, he destroyed the Hawks the other night. I actually think he had to check the ego at the door to participate in Boston, but it’s a long season. He still has time to screw things up. We don’t have the mental edge on our team to handle Shaq. He would’ve hurt us IMHO.

True ant. I just think we’d destroy any chance of D w/o Smoove this year getting Nash. So w/o all those “pieces” Sund will have ~ $30 million in cap space for all of them with 6 slots to fill? Sounds like an older Nash, one decent player and 5 vet mins to me.

With or without Nash we’ll be in the same boat next year hoping for another trade/free agent miracle. Been here too long, it never happens…unless you trade Nique for Manning on crutches. We’ll rely on “organic growth” and poor draft scouting to save us.

Oh yeah, it’s JOHN CONTRACT, not Joe Contract. There can only be one my friends who destroyed our chances. Joe’s contract isn’t the one.

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
4:26 pm

norhtcyde @ 4:19, that is my point exactly!!! nash would sellout the arena for atleast the rest of this year. dude is an avid soccer player, so he is in hella shape. i think he is good for 2 more years this year and another year if he plays >25/ game.

Fundamentals

November 30th, 2010
4:27 pm

Iverson is another head case that needs real veteran leadership to make him check his ego at the door. Hawks have none of that to offer.

Rev in Tampa

November 30th, 2010
4:27 pm

northcyde, I agree with your point about Shaq. He would have been more effective in drawing in Hawks fans than the organization’s entire marketing department.

And maybe Shaq and Garnett were too much for the Hawks frontcourt, but it is no excuse quitting in the middle of the game. The Hawks stopped challenging the Celtics. They settled for jumpshots (more than usual), they stood around on defense, they argued with each other, and, basically, gave up. I felt sorry for the folks who had given their evening and their money to go to that game. Aganist the Nets the Hawks came out with no energy, became discouraged, and went through the motions until the last five minutes of the game. I felt like a fool for giving two nights in a row to watch the games and caring about a team that did not care about playing.

I don’t mind watching the Hawks lose. I will cheer for them through 13 win seasons, but I cannot stomach watching a team that does not compete.

You say, “…so-called die hard Hawk fans can’t be giving up on the team at the first sign of adversity” and I agree, but what I will not cheer for is a team that gives up at the first sign of adversity.

I have liked what I have seen from the Hawks since the New Jersey game, but I am waiting to see that effort against the Miami and Orlando this coming weekend.

What frustrates me so much is that I have a much higher ceiling for this team than you. I believe this TEAM can compete at an elite level – IF they will… I think this TEAM’s athleticism can neutralize almost every SUPERSTAR with his supporting cast.

The Hawks have to overcome some bad habits and that will take time. I have no problem with them losing some games they should win while they unlearn these habits, but there is never an excuse for quitting

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
4:45 pm

I dont think Phoenix is crazy to believe we will give up Josh for Nash!! They should understand that the most they will get for Nash is some draft picks and some decent back-ups..and that’s with any basketball team!! NO ONE WILL TRADE GREAT YOUNG TALENT FOR GREAT OLD TALENT..JUST AINT GONNA HAPPEN!! Jamal,Zaza,Mo, and draft picks, plus TPE and 3mil from JChills for Nash is what they would get!

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
4:46 pm

Marvin or Mo…not both for Nash.

lewis

November 30th, 2010
4:54 pm

Yalls is hilaa-rious.

the hawks play more under control and in front of bigger crowds on the road.
7-2

Rod from College Park

November 30th, 2010
4:55 pm

If we traded for Nash, which we probably will not do, the last player that should be traded would be Josh. Nash would make Josh another Amare S. or Shawn Marion (in his younger days) type of player. Josh and sometimes Horford would be the players who would benefit the most with a true point guard. Defensively, they would suffer more, because Nash is worse than Bibby, and Jamal defensively. The crowds are dead because of the lack of a star player, and the lackluster play at home. Young Atlantans prefer flash over substance. Not saying that’s good, but it is what it is.

northcyde,

“Who do you think the casual ATL fan would rather see?

A developing Jeff Teague . . . or an over the hill Allen Iverson?”

Exactly. If you are not going to win a championship, which that Hawks will not do as constructed, then why not bring in players that will help fill the Arena up. Shaq and or Iverson would have done that. ASG needs serious marketing help. I was a season ticket holder for the last 5 years, and gave up my tickets this year because 1. Marvin Williams continues to start, and 2. We have no chance of winning a championship as constructed. When I look at the home games on TV, I could not be happier that I kept that couple of thousand dollars.

northcyde

November 30th, 2010
5:06 pm

It’s just when I look at the TRUE elite teams ( even historically ), this is what I see:

- they have a superstar/MVP of the league top 5 candidate

- they have at least 2 other players who play at a legit All-Star level

- they have a top 10 defense

- they are a top 5 road team in the league

Sund’s definition of “elite” is garbage, and means nothing. As bad as Knight was, he would’ve never made an idiotic statement like that.

Rev, the problem with the Hawks is that we have 4 or 5 really good players, with the rest being highly inconsitent and/or “bums”, as MsDee said last night.

That means that if one of our top 5 players struggle, especially if it’s Smith or Horford, we have no one we can bring in to pick up the slack. And God forbid that one of those 2 get hurt for a few weeks. We’re dead in the water then, unless JJ and Jamal play out of their minds.

That’s why I don’t get too high or too low when watching the Hawks. As of right now, we’re not a championship level team. So I have no choice but to watch how things develop, and see where it takes us.

The December road games will tell a lot about this team. And they simply can’t be competitive on the road, they must win some of those tough games.

Rod from College Park

November 30th, 2010
5:09 pm

I have not commented on Teague at all, but from what I have seen, he is just not that good. His shot is almost unfixable, he plays very timid, like Marvin, and he seems to have that deer in the headlights look. Look at his demeanor on the court and compare it to JC2’s demeanor and that should tell you something. I personally played pickup games this summer with Travis Best, who plays overseas, and he is better than Bibby and Teague right now. There is no reason that the Hawks should not have a capable backup to Bibby at the point on the roster. I still contend that there are players in the D-League, and overseas, who would be tremendous upgrades over Marvin. I guess it’s just the politics of the NBA.

JeJe

November 30th, 2010
5:50 pm

Damn the regulars on here have been killing it lately. From Big Ray’s post about JJ’s quote how Smoove needs to always be on his game, to Northcyde….Damn!

Rod from CP,

EXCELLENT points. Teague is way too timid and his jumpshot sucks. Backup to Bibby? We need a better overall starting PG and Bibby should be a situational player. TJ Ford makes like 8M a year and comes off the bench, so Bib can make 6M a year and come off our bench.

Jarrett Jack is who we should have gone after 2 summers ago. Damnit!

Travis Best!!

Astro Joe

November 30th, 2010
5:59 pm

MsDee, like trading Al Jefferson (great young talent at the time) for KG (great old talent at the time)?

I don’t know that trading Josh for Nash is the right move, but I do know that trading a player when they are performing at a high level is much smarter than trading them when they are struggling.

ant banks

November 30th, 2010
6:44 pm

astro joe,

we shoulda traded marvin last year cause his stock was higher than it is now.

Astro Joe

November 30th, 2010
6:52 pm

Didn’t Miami trade for an old Shaq by giving up a relatively young Lamar Odom and Caron Butler?

ant, Marvin’s best season was actually in ‘08-09.

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
7:07 pm

@AstroJoe,

I said, “TRADE GREAT YOUNG TALENT FOR GREAT OLD TALENT..” Al Jefferson is GOOD young talent while KG is GREAT old talent. There is a difference. Al Jefferson could NEVER change the way of a game the way Josh can WHEN HE IS PLAYING WITH SOME KIND OF B-BALL IQ!!

Astro Joe

November 30th, 2010
7:38 pm

MsDee, if Josh can do this agains the playoff caliber teams consistently, then he becomes close to untouchable. But I think that we haven’t yet seen that happen. Oh, and Steve Nash is GREAT, don’t sleep.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
7:41 pm

Josh for Nash is an idiotic trade, mainly because Nash is 36. If this was 2004, sure. But in 2010, when Josh has at least 10 years of All Star basketball ahead of him while Nash has maybe three years left in the league? Hell no.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
7:42 pm

And by the way, I keep telling y’all — Bleacher Report is worthless. The people who write there are no more knowledgeable — and in most cases much less knowledgeable — than us. They don’t have any more credibility than we do.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
7:44 pm

“So what does this tell us? It tells us that you can maintain a good REGULAR SEASON record and make the playoffs by consistently defeating none playoff teams, but it’s much harder to accomplish if you have trouble defeating those teams. To be honest, the only time defeating top playoff caliber team really matters is IN THE PLAYOFFS.”

If you’re talking about the Celtics or Lakers — teams that have shown they can win in the playoffs — this is fine. If you’re talking about the Hawks — a team that has only shown that it has no clue how to beat good teams in the playoffs — this is irrelevant. The Hawks have growing up to do when it comes to beating good teams, and they need to show that in the regular season.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
7:49 pm

And by the way, KG was 31 years old when Boston traded for him, and he was an impact player on both ends of the floor both before and after the trade. Nash, as great as he is offensively, is 36 and is an even bigger defensive liability than he was in his prime. Not to mention, Josh has accomplished a lot more at this point than Al Jefferson had by 2006.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
7:53 pm

“Didn’t Miami trade for an old Shaq by giving up a relatively young Lamar Odom and Caron Butler? ”

Shaq was 32 at the time of that trade, and like KG was an impact player on both ends of the floor at the time of the trade. Nash is 36 and is an impact player on one end of the floor.

darrell starks

November 30th, 2010
7:54 pm

Will it ever come down 2 trading josh or horford 1 day ?
My opinion is yes unless josh move 2 small forward.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!

darrell starks

November 30th, 2010
7:56 pm

If the hawks ever want 2 win a championship first ASG must spend the money or sell the team.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!

darrell starks

November 30th, 2010
8:04 pm

LD must make changes in the line up in order 2 produce a tough minded team that will compete, you can’t judge this team off the last 3 win and say every thing is ok which is not.
WIZARD 5 – 11
KNICKS 9 – 9
RAPTORS 6 – 11
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!

L-QUE

November 30th, 2010
8:33 pm

WHO in the hell wants STEVE NASH- ANT BANKS- you seen a game all year . NASH will nevvvver get another max contract. Why would the Hawks give away a 25 year old terror for awashed up slow footed guard. The Suns bring in a faster guard on defense. we got bibby, The Hawks needs Childress back, leave the junk there , stop by Dallas and bring J. Terry home, leave Zaza and Teague in the mid west. Play the seven foot twin, stop letting heavier centers wear Al down Josh is always there to help on defense,play Powell at the small foward, in some match ups, Josh & Josh both have the quickness to play pf-sf.

RealSquawk

November 30th, 2010
8:34 pm

Why even suggest trading Josh Smith right now? Does Josh have the worst contract on the team? Is Josh in what seems to be a slump that has extended from the playoffs until now? Is Josh closing in on thirty? Is Josh not from GA? Whose marketing reach is increasing? Whose is decreasing?
Who does the team rest on to get them all playing? Who does the team seem content to watch dribble the ball into predictable? Who actually seems to care more about winning and what the fans think?

I have had my share of trade Josh moments, but now is not the time. I would say this might be the worst time possible.

And seriously Josh for Nash? Hmmm. Right, let’s trade the best compliment for Nash, for him, so Nash can give the ball to Joe and oh look Joe can dribble. Funny right?

Why not do something constructive? Trade Joe to one of the teams willing to pay him over the summer and cut some salary add a solid veteran, a draft pick, a big man?

I am so confused. People clamoring for front court depth want to trade one of the best front court players in the league.

I swear you guys must be plants from other teams. Shoot. Maybe you are Steve Belkin.

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
8:48 pm

@AstroJoe

You must didnt read my 4:45pm post carefully..I DID say Nash was GREAT, Josh is YOUNG & GREAT..while Nash is OLD & GREAT. No NBA team will trade YOUNG & GREAT for an OLD & GREAT player. I was saying that AL Jefferson was YOUNG & GOOD while KG is OLD & GREAT. GOOD and GREAT has 2 different meanings, which meant I would have traded AL Jefferson for KG TOO!!

Ramon

November 30th, 2010
8:50 pm

I would never think about a Josh for Nash trade. However, one trade that I would do (if possible), that many of you may not like is:

Atlanta gets:
Monta Ellis
Andris Biedrins
Rodney Carney

GS gets:
Jamal Crawford
Al Horford

L-QUE

November 30th, 2010
9:00 pm

THE HAWKS IS AN ELITE TEAM period. They are being judged by fans who want to see them advance further than last year.But our weakness is still there no facilitating guard who can shoot the jumper no inside help ” off the bench” misuse of our hybrid players.There are few big small forwards in the league Marvin is one ,Artest,James & Dirk should be Dallas will never win with him playing PF he ain’t one.

Astro Joe

November 30th, 2010
9:03 pm

Would I rather have a 10 year All-Star or a legit chance to contend in the next 2-3 years? For me, that’s a no brainer. I personally don’t believe a nucleus of Horford, Josh & Joe can be the core of a legit contender. So watching this team win 50-ish games for the next 6 years is always an option… with a likely ceiling of the 2nd round of the playoffs. But at least we stay somewhat relevant.

Astro Joe

November 30th, 2010
9:05 pm

MsDee, seriously, great? With at best 1 All Star appearance in 6 NBA seasons? Great? Wow.

O'Brien

November 30th, 2010
9:20 pm

Ramon,

That is an interesting trade proposal, but I would pass.

But I would consider Monta Ellis and Vladimir Radmonovic for Jamal and Bibby.

An interesting comment from Mike Smith, Falcons head coach. From ajc.com;

Smith knew the potential perils of year three.

“Sometimes familiarity is not a good thing,” he said. “It’s natural for a staff and players to get into a routine and become comfortable with one another. It was important that we looked at all levels, starting with me, and we held ourselves to higher expectations.”.

What stood out to me, is I feel like thats a problem with the Hawks and LD. There is a level of comfort and familiarity, so the players are taking longer to get out of their Woody ways, and buy into LD’s ways.

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
9:21 pm

Because he IS a difference maker on the court..To be honest with cha, ALL-STAR recognitions are basically other people’s opinions, facts. So just because Josh didnt make it, doesnt mean he doesnt deserve it. He is a GREAT YOUNG BALL PLAYER AND I WOULDNT TRADE HIM FOR NOTHING..AND THAT MEANS WADE OR LEBRON, cause lately it isnt working for them either!

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
9:25 pm

@O’Brien

That’s true but LD is in no fashion like Woody..he has HIS OWN VISION, WAY HE COMMUNICATES TO THE GUYS, AND DIRECTION..The Hawks just needs to stop being immature and get it together sooner than later!!

Astro Joe

November 30th, 2010
9:26 pm

MsDee, it sounds like you;re a bigger Josh fan than Hawks fan. There is NOTHING wrong with watching your favorite player for 10+ years… I just personally have a different agenda. I could give a crap who wears the Hawks uniform, I just want to see that uniform drenched with championship champagne.

Ramon

November 30th, 2010
9:43 pm

O’brien, tomorrow, I may would pass on that deal also. lol But for this team, I would rather have Monta Ellis over Carmelo, because he’s half the price. And he can play the point and really put pressure on the opposing team. I would consider Jamal, Bibby, and a first for him and someone else.

L-QUE

November 30th, 2010
9:54 pm

And with your ten year allstar you will see he couldn’t do in Atlanta no more than he did in mizz. So whats the point, he can’t help them .he want help us Atlanta dont need NASH. but if you talking ROSE,CP3,CURRY, RONDO,NELSON,WILLIAMS,HARRIS,or some of the good young talent coming in the league thats a horse of a different color.JORDON&PIPPENS STAYED TOGETHER , The Bulls just added players asNEEDED. They didnt burst the core.Same can be said for Boston, Lakers , Chicago. Build to your needs and the future Nash is not even a quick fix .10 Steve Nashes wont deliver a championship to us this year or next.Trade for now and the future, the NBA is moving into the future.why do you think so many older players are playing for pennies on the dollars, the Suns trying to dump him and his check. FOR YOUTH. That would set HAWKS basketball back years.keep JOSH.S. AL ,MARVIN TOGETHER.as for as FAN SUPPORT ,just win they Will come .I know I WILL. The best show in town.Win or loose.

O'Brien

November 30th, 2010
10:44 pm

MsDee,

I agree that LD is is very different from woody. But he was still woody’s right hand man for 6 years, and the players are very comfortable with him. As a result, I think they tune him out sometimes.

Hawks better not sleep on Memphis. Memphis will be tired because tomorrow is the second game of a back to back. However, Memphis just beat the Lakers in Memphis.

Hawks have been off since Sunday, so There is no reason for them to start sluggish tomorrow.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
10:46 pm

“Would I rather have a 10 year All-Star or a legit chance to contend in the next 2-3 years? For me, that’s a no brainer.”

If Nash couldn’t win a title in his prime with Joe Johnson as his 3rd best teammate behind Shawn Marion and Amare Stoudemire, what makes you think the Hawks will “contend” with Joe Johnson as Nash’s best teammate when Nash is past his prime?

The Suns are 8-9 right now. Just saying…

Ken Strickland

November 30th, 2010
10:49 pm

The Lakers just lost their 3rd consecutive gm to the Grizzles, which gives them a 13-5 record, which is only 2gms better than the 11-7 Hawks. I guess it’s time for them to start trading away players, based on the way some of you seem to think.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
10:49 pm

And even if you want to argue that Horford is at least as good as Joe, I don’t see how Horford/Joe/Marvin is a better supporting cast than Marion/Joe/Amare. Nash couldn’t even make the Finals with that team, and that was when he was 30.

Najeh Davenpoop

November 30th, 2010
10:49 pm

“The Lakers just lost their 3rd consecutive gm to the Grizzles, which gives them a 13-5 record, which is only 2gms better than the 11-7 Hawks. I guess it’s time for them to start trading away players, based on the way some of you seem to think.”

If they hadn’t won a second-round playoff game in 20 years, then yeah, it would be.

Section 303

November 30th, 2010
10:56 pm

So, we’ve waited years for Josh Smith to finally start becoming a star and people want to trade him? Makes no sense. Let’s stop talking about it. Would be a disaster of a move.

darrell starks

November 30th, 2010
10:56 pm

L-QUE

November 30th, 2010
10:57 pm

ASTRO-JOE allstars or voted by how popular you are not how good you are.Just like dancing with the stars.In most cases the larger fan base the more you might be an allstar. Truth has shown us a player may be hurt most of year and still be a allstar.A lot of player should be allstars for how well they played that year .if every thing was fair or justifiable then JESUS wont have to take over rulership. A player cant be judged on allstar appearances, factully a player may be an allstar this year and get voted in each year after. its more to be popular to sell endosment products now .Very few years are the players playing the best that year are chosen. the media just now know him playing on a major network a few times a year

Section 303

November 30th, 2010
10:57 pm

I was wondering who would be the first basketball genious to try and equate the Lakers 3-game skid to the Hawks. Ken, you are the winner. Congrats!

darrell starks

November 30th, 2010
11:27 pm

MsDee

November 30th, 2010
11:32 pm

The Lakers last 3 loses has been to Utah, Indiana, & Memphis…The Hawks only lost to Utah and that was because Horford chocked at the line to tie the game..The Lakers lost to 2 ‘non-playoff teams’ BACK-2-BACK!?!? Plus, add what Ken said. AGAIN, WE WILL BE JUST FINE!!!!

darrell starks

November 30th, 2010
11:33 pm

Today i would trade
HORFORD
JAMAL
BIBBY
FOR
MONTA
BIEDRINS
RODNEY CARNEY
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!

darrell starks

November 30th, 2010
11:36 pm

STARTER MONTA, JOE, MARVIN, JOSH, BIEDRINS
BENCH JC2, MOE, RODNEY, POWEL, ZAZA
RESERVE TEAGUE, COLLINS
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!

Melvin

November 30th, 2010
11:52 pm

Since the Lakers lost to Grizzlies in Memphis, does that boost the Hawks victory over Memphis now….

drmaryb (*_*)

December 1st, 2010
8:39 am

Melvin

No.

Lakers are the 2 Time Back 2 Back NBA Champions & HOF laden Kobe, MVP, Perenial All-Star, surrounded with superior talent and a deep bench, with a 10 Ring HOF Coach and Jerry Buss.

Move on people …

ant banks

December 1st, 2010
1:35 pm

L-Que,

I simply stated that i liked the idea of it for the short term. but if we want to get to the NEXT level, we will have to trade some pieces to get better or keep our same core until 2016. rick sund does not have a hustler mentality. we have some assets to move, but you can’t be scared to move them.

WOULD YOU TRADE JSMOOVE FOR A CHAMPIONSHIP? i am not sure that most of y’all would answer appropriately to this question. shaq, garnet, ray allen are all hall of famers. their respective previous teams were NOT AFRAID to deal them.