Atlanta Hawks: Hawks 99, Knicks 90

New York–So the Hawks had a meeting Wednesday and basically called each other out for not being mentally tough enough. They said that when there are defensive breakdowns guys spend less energy covering for each other than they do griping. Instead of staying with the effort, they give up.

Al was as skeptical as anyone that anything would come of it. “A lot of things were talked about,” he said. “You go out and do it, you feel good about it. I feel like we did it at times, sometimes not. The Washington game and this game, I’ve really seen it.”

– In regards of focus and intensity, the Hawks have improved in the last two games no matter the strength of their opponents. Clearly the Hawks opened the game with more bounce against the Wizards and Knicks. It’s hard to explain but you can just see it in the way they deflect passes, run the floor, crash the boards, and both move the ball and take care of it.

– “We are helping each other now,” Smoove said. “We are having fun again, sharing the basketball, communicating. I think if we can put a string of games like that together, we can have a successful season.”

– Give the Hawks credit, but I’ve got two caveats. One is that the Knicks and Wizards just aren’t good enough to cause Atlanta the kind of frustration that comes from playing its best but still having to be precise and persistent for long periods. The other is that there’s energy and effort but then there are the limitations of the roster and how L.D. uses what he’s got.

– The latter came into focus during New York’s comeback. With Josh on the bench, the Knicks relentlessly attacked on pick-and-rolls and found little resistance at the basket. This was because Smoove is the team’s best deterrent at the rim, Bibby and Jamal offer little in the way of on-ball defense, and the guards were not in tune with Al and Zaza on the coverages.

– “We blew some defensive assignments, which we didn’t do the first half,” L.D. said. “We had some breakdowns. Some baskets they got in the second half, we did a good job with in the first half. With Josh, we know we can have a breakdown and he will erase our mistakes.”

– With Felton wreaking havoc by easily getting in the lane, L.D. never did call on Teague. It’s too hard for the Hawks when the opposing guards are penetrating and Al or Smoove are constantly being pulled out of position to help.

– I’ve snooped around and so far all I can gather is Teague’s reduced role is nothing more than coach’s decision.

– The fourth foul called against Josh was questionable. The fifth one was terrible. “You seen them,” he said. “It’s tough. They were tough calls but you really can’t speak on things like that or they will fine you. Hopefully they will look back and see those fouls. It’s always tough, especially when you know where youv’e got to be on the floor with defensive assignments and the way you help. Those two fouls were definitely frustrating for me.”

Marvin got the bench excited when he threw thunder down on Turiaf. He was noticeably more aggressive, willing to go to the hole and the boards, so maybe the knee is feeling better.

– Same thing goes for Mo, who made three key baskets in the third quarter and mixed it up on defense. “When [Josh] went to the bench, I knew we would have to get the energy and intensity from somewhere else,” L.D. said. “Mo Evans played big during that stretch.”

– Jamal and Al had their pick-and-roll game working. Jamal clearly loves New York, where his flashy style and scoring eruptions are still beloved. Knicks fans groaned when Jamal was left open for a 3 with the Hawks lead down to 75-71. They knew he wasn’t going to miss that.

– “It’s always fun to come back here,” Jamal said.

J.J.’s scoring struggles are becoming a big problem because now he’s wrecking Atlanta’s flow. There are times he’s just not in sync with what his teammates are doing and the ball stops when it gets to him, just like last season. It’s as if the more he struggles, the more he slows down his game as he thinks about what he can do to get a good shot instead of realizing he’d get plenty if he swung the ball around.

– But Joe did have 10 rebounds and seven assists with no turnovers. “I had to be effective some way,” Joe said. “I couldn’t make a damn shot. I just try to make up for it with defense, rebounding, getting guys shots. A lot of times they double me whether I am making shots or not. So I am just looking for open teammates.”

– It seems opponents have finally figured out Al is money on mid range jumpers. Lately they’ve prevented him from facing up as easily. “They are being more aggressive on me and almost forcing me to make other players and pass it out,” he said. “It’s just something I am going to have to adjust to. I’m unselfish enough that I am going to get the ball and kick it out quickly.”

– Bibby is still crafty when working the little two-man games on the wings. He got himself a couple open 3s doing that with J.J.

– Funny that Mike D’Antoni sounded like L.D. did the other day: “”Looking back, guys took off for Thanksgiving, we were feeling good about ourselves and we weren’t quite ready for a 1 o’clock game. It was against a good team. It is not a team you can do that, hang around and win anyway.”

– I’m out, Hawks fans.

MC

59 comments Add your comment

Najeh Davenpoop

November 27th, 2010
6:32 pm

10-1 against bad teams, 0-6 against good teams.

Another bad team on deck tomorrow. Of course, nobody in the Atlanta area will be watching, since the NBA scheduling geniuses scheduled it head to head with Packers-Falcons. But hopefully they can win the back to back road games and come home and rest up. Their next date against a quality team is next Saturday at Miami — which, for all of its struggles, is above .500.

Ernest

November 27th, 2010
6:56 pm

As a team, the Hawks have got to do a better job with perimeter defense. The book says you wait until until 20-25 games to make a full assessment of your team before making any personnel changes. I hope Sund is looking to see how the team can be improved in this area. I”m beginning to lack confidence that Teague is our next starting point guard.

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
6:57 pm

We all knew this would happen – one more bad game and LD would change the starting lineup. Now we beat up on weak teams and inflate our record so when we get destroyed vs. MIA/ORL soon, one loss won’t hurt and LD won’t do anything.

TEAGUE FIX YOUR JUMPSHOT Already

Interesting that neither Teague nor Jo-Craw played today

Leonljustice

November 27th, 2010
6:58 pm

I hope they can win against Miami. I think the guys just need confidence. I wonder what the deal with not playing Teague is. I would rather see him, than see Jamal Crawford.

mykhalc

November 27th, 2010
7:02 pm

fun..not fun…fun..not fun…??!!!! hey Pros (?) maybe just do your damn job that you are gettin’ paid millions to do??!!! i know….foreign concept!!!

here’s the truth…”– Give the Hawks credit, but I’ve got two caveats. One is that the Knicks and Wizards just aren’t good enough to cause Atlanta the kind of frustration that comes from playing its best but still having to be precise and persistent for long periods.”

when this happens ‘again’ can you say ‘not fun’ again!!?!!! geeeeessshhhh

nunna!!

November 27th, 2010
7:12 pm

Teague is slowly playing his way out of my wanting to see him get more time..
I don’t understand it..
Is dude too gun shy and does he even have to confidence of his team,let alone the coaching staff..
They are always (the team)getting on him about missed assignments.
Is he like how Vick was when he was here?
Just relying on his talent and not really studying or paying attention to what the coaches want.
Is he nervous and has anxiety issues when he plays in a game(at times)?
Whatever it is JT0,u need to get over it,get some help,or get out of the way son..

Sautee

November 27th, 2010
7:14 pm

Bibby is playing better this year, BUT…….

Trade Jamal and Marvin for Hinrich and Thornton.

We need a PG that can play D.

Hinrich’s contract is not so good, but the penetration he would stop should be worth it. Thornton is much more productive than Marvin if he can stay healthy.

Wiz might do this, since they would like to get out from under Hinrich’s contract and Marvin is still only 24. Jamal’s expiring would SURELY be attractive to them.

Or, they could keep Jamal and deal Gilbert.

jlewis

November 27th, 2010
7:31 pm

MC, no mention of JJ and horford playing 48 minutes today, why?

jlewis

November 27th, 2010
7:35 pm

Sorry MC, 39.18

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
7:39 pm

THE BEST WAY WE CAN GET THIS TEAM TO PLAY BETTER IS IF WE OPENLY CRITICIZE MARVIN AND TEAGUE EVERY DAY. THESE GUYS ONLY PLAY WELL WHEN CALLED OUT. I MEAN, MARVIN WENT BACK TO HIS CUCKOON IN THE 2ND HALF ALREADY TODAY. TEAGUE HAS NO JUMPSHOT AND IS TIMID. THE PLAN IS THAT THEY WILL READ THIS BLOG AND TAKE THE CRITICISM AND GET ANGRY AND PUT IT ALL ON THE COURT. I DON’T ASSUME MARVIN READS THESE BLOGS THOUGH. THE GUY HATES WATCHING BASKETBALL! LOL!!!!!!!!

ALL IN, SAY “DUCK”

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
7:42 pm

I think Darren Collison isn’t working out in Indy.

I would try get him and Dahntay Jones (cheap rugged SF) in a trade. Marvin, Jamal, Bibby. And 2 of those guys +/or Teague would be nice

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
7:43 pm

*Any…Marvin + Bibby/Teague. Jamal + Bibby/Teague.

I’d much rather have a Darren Collison than Will Bynum. Dude is like 5″10 and I don’t think he’s that good

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
7:43 pm

CLYDE FOR POSTER OF YEAR. U DON’T POST HERE MUCH ANYMORE, FAM

FIRE WOODY

hbcuclassics

November 27th, 2010
8:06 pm

Nov. 27, 2010

FCS Round 1:
Ga. Southern 41
SC State 16

DII Rd. 2:
Albany St. 30
Wingate 28

Grambling 38
Southern 17

Samuel

November 27th, 2010
8:31 pm

Why does a “scrubb” like Teague get all this press. Let’s talk about some real ball players, how bout it? Lump him in the Salim, Acie, Royal crew and call it a wrap. I’m tired of hearing about him.

northcyde

November 27th, 2010
8:32 pm

@ MC . . . JJ told you what he is doing. He’s trying to get teammates open shots when the opponent comes to double team him.

People still try to defend JJ like he is Kobe, so he still gets a lot of attention even when he’s ice cold. So to get people open shots, he sometimes does have to hold the ball to draw the double.

While people cried to the heavens about the ISO offense last year, that’s one of the things it provides. And it’s one of the big reasons why our offensive rating was so high, despite the stagnation at times.

6 of JJ’s 7 assists were 3 point makes. ( 3 to Bibby, 2 to Mo, 1 to Jamal ).

JJ’s problem is that for some reason, he can’t make wide open 3s anymore. I have no idea what is up with that. So if he can’t make those shots, he either needs to drive into the paint, or create for others.

jtshoopsblog

November 27th, 2010
8:46 pm

The team only realize NOW that they were not mentally tough enough? I know southerners are known to be a little laid back and mellow, but this is ridicoulus!!!!

Rocket Scientist

November 27th, 2010
8:51 pm

Thats great Nunna comparing A man whos represented in the hall of fame, leading candidate for MVP this year and one of the great draft choices of all time to… poot teague.

You stink Nunna. MV7 Rocked the ATL much better than that hand off artist you got now

Rod from College Park

November 27th, 2010
8:51 pm

Rocket Scientist

November 27th, 2010
8:58 pm

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
9:00 pm

northcyde IS ON THE RIGHT PATH ON THE OTHER BLOG.

JAMAL + EVANS FOR IGGY OR ADD IN MARVIN + X AND GET LOUIS WILLIAMS/NOCIONI TOO.

THEY GOT SOME NICE TRADEABLE PIECES AND THAT TEAM BLOWS, SO LET’S TRY MAKE A DAMN TRADE.

WE NEED SOME MORE PRICKS LIKE NOCIONI TOO

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
9:16 pm

Anyone questioning how frail Marvin is, watch this video. Any time a player touches him, he just falls over. I’ve never seen him dunk a basketball and land properly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0z8F2k0-9s

Wabe

November 27th, 2010
9:39 pm

I’ve DVR’d the past couple of games…

Two wins – against bad teams – but wins.

Noticed the starters are logging heavier minutes.

Also noticed that Drew seems to be freezing JT0 and JC2’s minutes. I didn’t see either of them get on the floor vs. the Knicks (maybe I’m wrong?). Not sure what the deal with that is. I know Mo Evans had himself a good game, but…

JC2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mo Evans

Also, I know JT0’s not playing good ball right now. But, 17-18 games in, and it seems Drew’s already given up on the kid. I haven’t seen any Teague the past 2 games. I’m not gonna sit here and defend Teague, because he hasn’t been making the most of his minutes. But, him sitting on the bench isn’t gonna do anything to help him improve. Send him over to the D-League if anything – no use in just keeping him on that bench frozen.

truly1

November 27th, 2010
9:58 pm

Well I think we should trade teague. if we are not going to play him anything less than consistant minutes it is not going to help us in the futute it will be a missed pick because his confidence is going to get worse if not being played consistantly. He has the talent to be good in this league with the right team and Coach.

JerryWest

November 27th, 2010
10:03 pm

Hawks used to lose to the bad teams a lot because they used to sleep walk.

JerryWest

November 27th, 2010
10:05 pm

Hawks had the easiest schedule in the East so far. Only Lakers and Kings had it easier as of today.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/nba1011.htm

jdewayneatl

November 27th, 2010
10:07 pm

I will be glad when the Hawks start playing at a really high level again, so that the attention will swing to the Hawks WORST WEAKNESS… whack a** Fans

truly1

November 27th, 2010
10:09 pm

I have seen Teague play well like when he made those 2 three pointers against Indiana only to go on to play 12 minutes. I think he was aggressive that game but LD didnt keep him in the 2 quarter to find out.

JerryWest

November 27th, 2010
10:09 pm

Notice the only top 16 teams we have beaten are Memphis without Gasol and Indiana without Collison.

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
10:33 pm

“Notice the only top 16 teams we have beaten are Memphis without Gasol and Indiana without Collison.”

FIRE SUND
TRADE MARVIN
TRADE BIBBY

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
10:34 pm

U LET RAYMOND FELTON SCORE 18 TODAY. LOL. BATTLE OF THE WORST POINT GUARDS

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
10:40 pm

“– I’ve snooped around and so far all I can gather is Teague’s reduced role is nothing more than coach’s decision.”

MC, what exactly does this mean? Seems like JT0 is just a situational player now, since he does nothing on offense besides hitting that floater (which he rarely does because he is so damn timid).

Great blogs recently – have enjoyed them

O'Brien

November 27th, 2010
10:43 pm

Knicks were on fire, and we beat them at their house.

Did not see the game. But it looked like Marvin had a great first half. If only he can do that more often, the team will be better offensively (Marvin scoring) and defensively (less Jamal).

northcyde,

I’m glad JJ was able to contribute with 10 rebs and 7 assists. But we are not paying him $124 mil for rebounds and assists.

Out of 17 games, there have been 8 games where he scored 15 points or less. We need more from him, especially against the good teams.

And 20-71 from behind the arc is horrible. Hopefully he gets it going.

JeJe

November 27th, 2010
10:48 pm

Exactly, O’Brien. He acts like he can just get boards and assists if his shot is off. WTF? @ his price, he should be scoring 28 and dominating any player who guards him besides Kobe or LeBron.

It’ll be less than 2 years before Joe starts raising attitude and faking injuries. The guy is not a winner

rusty

November 27th, 2010
11:01 pm

why write if the damn thing dont enter the post . hey woody oh i mean ld give teague a real fk chance & use jc2. it sure seems like your pulling a woody. play jj 40 min even tho he cant make crap & shoots way to much. we might get get away with this against crappy teams but not good teams. yea nortcyde your boy jj is just playing great i think he sure is worth that 124 k. i notice that you never give jc1 credit for a great game oh thats right he worth only one quarter of the value that your buddy is worth

Najeh Davenpoop

November 27th, 2010
11:46 pm

Rocket Scientist beat me to it. We can only hope Teague can one day do for the Hawks what Vick did for the Falcons.

truly1

November 27th, 2010
11:53 pm

yeah i am saying rusty

K.W.

November 28th, 2010
12:43 am

Nice win for the Hawks. Hopefully they can keep this streak going. Their not the only ones holding “player only meetings” this early. The Heat held one after they lost to the Mavs (hmmmm).

lewis

November 28th, 2010
1:12 am

zaza has regressed

he’s gotten blocked the past 9 out of 10 times i’ve seen him shoot

Hawks Fan In New Orleans

November 28th, 2010
2:50 am

SMH comparing JT0 to MV7.

Michael Cunningham

November 28th, 2010
6:04 am

@jlewis: “MC, no mention of JJ and horford playing 48 minutes today, why?”

no reason. guess i can’t get to everything. Horford’s minutes were a function of Josh’s foul trouble–one or the other pretty much always has to be on the court for the hawks or it’s free passage to the rim. Joe’s minutes were just slightly above what he normally plays.

Michael Cunningham

November 28th, 2010
6:10 am

northcyde: “@ MC . . . JJ told you what he is doing. He’s trying to get teammates open shots when the opponent comes to double team him. People still try to defend JJ like he is Kobe, so he still gets a lot of attention even when he’s ice cold. So to get people open shots, he sometimes does have to hold the ball to draw the double.”

so he’s holding the ball until he draws a double? shouldn’t he try to score when he’s singled? and no matter what he decides, shouldn’t he do it quicker? it’s just not his style. he needs to dribble and set guys up. he doesn’t turn the corner hard on screen-rolls, he just kind of floats on the perimeter.

Michael Cunningham

November 28th, 2010
6:13 am

@JeJe: ““– I’ve snooped around and so far all I can gather is Teague’s reduced role is nothing more than coach’s decision.” MC, what exactly does this mean? Seems like JT0 is just a situational player now, since he does nothing on offense besides hitting that floater (which he rarely does because he is so damn timid).”

yes, it would seem that his role as a defensive guy is reduced because of his offensive weaknesses. all i meant is that, as far as i can figure, that’s all it is and nothing else is happening behind the scenes to explain his DNP-CD.

RED

November 28th, 2010
6:28 am

i think that the jamal, marvin for hinrich and thornton trade is fair enough and realistic. Then we can also reconsider sac’s offer of thompson for teague. We’ll have a mix of vets and young and talented players that can contribute right away.

Our line up will look like this:
PG- Bibby/Hinrich
SG-JJ/Jordan
SF-Thornton/Evans/ Pape
PF- Smoove/Thompson
C- Al/ Collins

oldtimer

November 28th, 2010
8:29 am

MC, an insightful blog about JJ holding on to ball and his struggles and how Hawks need him, and JT0. We all know what happens when Josh and AL are taken out. Those fouls on Josh were a joke yesterday.

I saw Collins in the game more than normal yesterday. Do you think Collins is beginning to take some minutes from Zaza? I know Collins is better against bigger centers, but yesterday, NY really didn’t have a big center, unless we are including the big Russian. Why is Zaza struggling? Should he not take the ball inside, and try to just shoot from outside? It seems like when he goes inside, he fumbles the ball, or gets blocked.

MsDee

November 28th, 2010
8:48 am

Look, we dont know what goes on or what is said from LD to Teague behind the scenes. Maybe during practices, LD is asking something from Teague that is STILL refuses to do it even during practices so this is LD’s way of teaching/punishing him until he DO WHAT HE IS TOLD!! Remember, LD is a PG teacher during his assistant job the past 6 years in his PG camp during off seasons..he KNOWS what he is doing but I guess he realize he shouldn’t have told Teague in the beginning that THE PG POSITION IS UP FOR YOUR TAKING cause he kinda made Teague lazier cause he just KNEW he would have the position no matter what! LD is now back tracking and doing some damage control to get out of Teague what he needs from him…THIS IS MY TAKE ON THINGS!!

JeJe

November 28th, 2010
8:58 am

“t THE PG POSITION IS UP FOR YOUR TAKING cause he kinda made Teague lazier cause he just KNEW he would have the position no matter what!”

How did he know he’d have the position?

If Teague can’t win a starting job from Bibby, who is DEFINITELY a bottom 5 starting PG at this point (if not the worst), then he really is pretty bad in practice

JeJe

November 28th, 2010
9:49 am

I think this team needs to have player-only meetings after EVERY GAME, regardless of the result. That is the ONLY way this team will be focused the next game.

May sound dumb, but it’s true. I NEVER see this team lose after a players-only meeting, no matter the opponent.

IF MARVIN AND TEAGUE CAN JUST WAKE UP AND CONTRIBUTE, THIS TEAM HAS POTENTIAL. IF NOT, WE WILL SUFFER IN THE PLAYOFFS AGAIN. THE MIAMI SITUATION MAKES ME FEEL A BIT BETTER. PLAY LIKE WE DID YESTERDAY AND THURSDAY AGAINST WINNING TEAMS AND WE WILL WIN A LOT OF GAME. STAY FOCUSED. DO NOT LOOK PAST TORONTO

JeJe

November 28th, 2010
9:52 am

Our December schedule look a bit hellish, but if this team is focused, it can win most of the games.

PLAYERS-ONLY MEETINGS LEAD TO WINS. JAMAL, IF U ARE READING THIS, PLEASE RELAY IT TO YOUR TEAMMATES

bonquesha

November 28th, 2010
10:01 am

What’s really going on with Joe? Historically, the early part of the season are great shooting months for him. Is it plausible that his wrist/hand is a bigger issue than LD is willing to admit? There were times when he clearly passed up wide-open shots to his teammates and every time he sits, he’s covering it to keep it warm. He looks uncomfortable. Is there not a place in the schedule where he can sit to get it better? If this continues, he’s going to shoot the Hawks out of games.