Atlanta Hawks: Parsing some previews
Almost time to tip off. (Curtis Compton/ ccompton@ajc.com)
No practice for the Hawks today. The AJC Hawks preview is at . . . newsstands . . . today! Run out and buy it! Please?
Meanwhile, here are some previews from around the InterWebs, each with a brief highlight and my comment:
Peachtree Hoops
They previewed the Hawks back on Oct. 12.
THHB says 50-32: “I am sensing change won’t be the magic elixir for playoff excellence, given Joe getting a year older and an inevitable dip in team fortune in regards to injury, but it will be enough for a back-to-back 50 win campaigns and grab the home court once again.”
KW says 52-30: While the mounting injuries are of a major concern to me, I do think that the way this team is being written off is premature. Are they a championship contender? Probably not, but there may be only two or three of those in the Eastern Conference and the Hawks are still right at the top of the rest of the pack. I am going back to back 50 win seasons and a top 4 seed in the conference.”
MC says: Both guys mention injury, and that’s the elephant in the room for the Hawks. Odds are they won’t get through this season in peak health (and isn’t that another reason last season felt like a letdown to some?) and there’s also the matter of L.D.’s approach to practicing them long and hard.
ESPN
Their gang of experts all made a prediction and Atlanta’s average ranking was 5.9 in the East.
Michael Wallace and Tim Legler were most optimistic, picking the Hawks fifth. But Wallace says: “Replacing Mike Woodson with Larry Drew won’t be enough to shake things up and get the Hawks beyond the first round of the playoffs.”
Chris Sheridan was most pessimistic about the Hawks’ chances, picking them No. 8 in the East: “They are still playoff material, no doubt, but they’ll be road kill again if they face Boston, Miami or Orlando in the first round.”
MC says: The Hawks have given no indication they can compete with the Magic so there’s no case to be made there. And I don’t see Atlanta overcoming Boston’s tenacity and toughness in a seven-game series. But, call me crazy, I think they actually match up better with Miami and could give them a series.
Ball Don’t Lie
Forced to make a prediction three months ago, Kelly Dwyer decided the Hawks would finish 48-34. But he sounds pretty optimistic in his blog write-up:
“Nice additions, a cheap but possibly effective hire in Larry Drew, and a step away from former coach Mike Woodson’s stifling “offensive” attack? It would seem that, even after a slow start as everyone gets used to the new boss, the Hawks would eventually fall in line and into that safe middle road. Fewer wins than last season? I just think it’s a product of their surroundings, and that potential slow start. . . .
“This isn’t a bad thing. Under Woodson, these guys always started hot, but topped off. With Drew, the hope is that they’ll be penny-foolish and pound-wise, shuffling their best work toward spring as opposed to peaking in fall.”
MC says: Not sure about the “nice additions” part, though someone with the Hawks reminded me the other day that Josh Powell, Etan Thomas, and Jason Collins are better than what they Hawks have had in those 10-11-12 spots in recent years. So I guess that’s something.
Dwyer makes a good point about the slow start. It’s possible the Hawks will be a less-efficient offensive team this season and the new defensive approach might be best for the long-term but could be ugly in the interim as L.D. tries to get these guys to buy in and their personnel deficiencies aren’t hidden by switches. But being less predictable offensively and defensively might pay off in the playoffs.
SI.com
Ian Thomsen talked to a scout from an opposing team for his take on the Hawks.
Says the scout: “The Hawks are looking through the wrong side of the window of opportunity right now. They’ve hit their ceiling and they can’t go any higher. I want to believe new coach Larry Drew can make a difference because he’s been around, he’s seen so many different things and paid his dues. But Atlanta has some hardheaded guys in that locker room, and it’s at the point where I don’t see much improvement in them anymore.”
MC says: This was a big part of Woody’s problem at the end. No one would say he’s not a strong-willed guy but eventually even he couldn’t get through to this group. L.D. is saying the right things but if guys don’t get the message then at some point it becomes about accountability.
Will L.D. be able to win a battle of wills with these guys? Would he, say, bench Smoove if he keeps taking jumpers or pouting instead of getting back on D? Would he sit J.J. if the isos become a problem again? If he’s really about defense, and defense is about effort, will he decide minutes based on those principles?
SLAM Online
ATL-ien Lang Whitaker posits a best-case/worst-case scenario of 57-60 Ws/something less than 53. Says Lang: “The last few years the Hawks have played with the slimmest of margins of error, and they’ve actually done pretty well, all things considered. This year they’ll again be living on the edge. At least it gives us Hawks fans something to think about.”
MC says: I like the optimism. Really. I’m a skeptical/cynical/hopeless hack so just by the nature of this gig I’m eventually going to pick at the things that can and do go wrong. Fans should look at all the things that can go right. It’s that time of year, blog people. Enjoy it.
MC
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95 comments Add your comment
Sope Creek
October 24th, 2010
1:11 pm
Nice set of comments . . . but I think they’re all being optimistic. I think the Hawks go 40-42 this year. My guess is that LD shows to be too much of a players’ coach and the “hard headed” guys on this team tune him out as a continuation of the way they tuned out Woody. It sure seemed that way in the preseason . . . .
So I predict this year to be a big step back . . . and next year is the make or break year for this core. They either decide they want it badly enough to put aside their own egos and peccadillos, or they tank even worse.
BTW, Sund hasn’t proved that he can do much more than tinker so far. He didn’t decide he needed a coaching change based on the merit of Woodson’s accomplishments so as much as he just acceded to the collective willfulness of the core roster. Other than that he’s added some experienced end of bench guys and worked in a redundancy – Jordan Crawford – at shooting guard, perhaps as a hedge against Jamal leaving. But then after watching Jordan at Indiana and Xavier, he’s also exacerbated the willfulness of the players . . . .
*sigh*
Section 303
October 24th, 2010
2:46 pm
I’ll give my prediction: I got the Hawks going 48-34. That will be enough to sneek into the 4th spot. I think the win total will be down because Miami and Washington will be better this year. Also, not sure they will sweep Boston like they did last year.
Where ever they finish the regular season, is where ever they finish the regular season. This team will be judged on their playoff performance. If last year taught me anything, it was that playoffs are where seasons are good, bad, or total busts. The Hawks last year were total busts in the playoffs. I think that is why so many are down on them right now.
The weak effort against the Magic, Joe’s stupid comments, and the crowd booing them off the floor in games 3 and 4 have left a major bad tase in a lot of people’s mouth.
Hawks Fan In New Orleans
October 24th, 2010
2:50 pm
50-32 and a second round ouster – no sweep though. This is of course barring an unforeseen acquisition of a defensive beast and rebounding center.
lewis
October 24th, 2010
2:57 pm
49-33 + 4-2 loss in 2nd round
JeJe
October 24th, 2010
3:13 pm
Ken Strickland from previous blog:
“THE ATLANTA HAWKS SHOULD BE JUDGED BY HOW THEY PERFORM OVERALL AT THE START AND FINISH OF THE “REGULAR SEASON”
No, they should be judged by how they perform in the 2nd round. Boston sucked in the regular season last year…Who cares?
1) Miami is overrated
2) Orlando is still soft and a “sleeper team” (LOL!) and will choke in the playoffs.
Celtics/Lakers in the Finals
Samuel
October 24th, 2010
3:27 pm
46-36 #6 seed and 1st round loss to either Mia,Orl or Bos
STEEL(Formerly VenomSpitter)
October 24th, 2010
3:30 pm
I think I’ll know if LD has what it takes to be a coach if Josh keeps taking jumpers and LD sits his ass down and tells him “your not gonna see the floor until u understand that taking jumpers is hurtiing the team not helping.”
drmaryb (*_*)
October 24th, 2010
3:42 pm
Section 303
You lasted 72 hours, before digging up the dead horse again.
I guess, you just can’t hold your breath that long.
LOL!
Section 303
October 24th, 2010
4:03 pm
drmaryb, wasn’t digging up a dead horse. If you think that those comments aren’t part of the reason some are down/not interested in the Hawks right now, you’re wrong, again. Point was/is that the way the season ended (and Joe’s comments were a big part of the story when the season ended) killed a lot of the good the Hawks did last year.
So, not digging up a dead horse. Making a point. And, all I said were the comments were stupid. That is not something that can be argued, since they were stupid.
bigdave
October 24th, 2010
4:57 pm
nice read MC..
drmaryb (*_*)
October 24th, 2010
5:05 pm
“Celtics/Lakers in the Finals”
This is true.
Section 303
October 24th, 2010
5:07 pm
Let me add this to my prediction…Hawks finish 48-34. They will beat Miami everytime they play in Philips Arena. I made this call when the 3 d-bags decided to join forces and I’m standing by it now. Heat will lose everytime they enter Philips Arena.
drmaryb (*_*)
October 24th, 2010
5:10 pm
doc
Do you think Perkins can come back close to 100% for a guy his size?
If so, by when? Was injured in June 2010 … torn PCl and MCL.
hawks_4_life
October 24th, 2010
5:16 pm
When its all said and done, this is why we play the games. Predictions dont win games……………………GO HAWKS
northcyde
October 24th, 2010
6:33 pm
I will say this again. This team CANNOT start out slow, and expect to make it up at the end, to avoid getting a 5 seed or lower.
We have very winnable road games in November. And while we have a few tough home games in November, we’ll have a good shot to win each of those games.
If this team is a playoff level team, we should have no lower than an 12 – 6 record going into December. If we’re 9 – 9 or below, this team is going to hover around .500 for the rest of the year, because the rest of the schedule isn’t in our favor.
In December, the home schedule is great, but the road schedule is absolutely brutal.
The reason why the Hawks started out fast in past years, is because they took care of business against teams they were supposed to beat. The Hawks don’t need to be foolint around with teams they should be able to beat.
northcyde
October 24th, 2010
7:05 pm
I don’t trust the bench, but I do trust the starters.
People talk about developing the bench, but you can’t leave them out there if they can’t hold leads or if they let decifits get larger. If Drew keeps a short leash on the bench, I’ll say we go 50 – 32.
If he doesn’t, we could lose a few games we would’ve won otherwise.
jtshoopsblog
October 24th, 2010
7:12 pm
No way. the hawks have not reached their ceiling, not by a longshot.
Truth-Se rum
October 24th, 2010
7:14 pm
46-36 Hawks did not improve, made and unnecessary coaching change for an experiment. The same problems that prevented the hawks are still there. Sund did nothing to address hawks weaknesses but created question marks with the Woody lite move.There is still not enough talent here to get past the 2nd round. Add to that the other teams in the league addressed their weakness and in some cases made blockbuster moves.
Unless the hawks make an early/mid season meaningful trade This team finishes in the mid 40’s
See you at the end of the year.
Truth-Se rum
October 24th, 2010
7:15 pm
*an unnecessary
truly1
October 24th, 2010
7:26 pm
I will say the same as last year 53-29 last year we lost a couple that we should not have. we will struggle but get it together at the right time
SWAT Native
October 24th, 2010
8:41 pm
The funny thing is that if you were to roll back the clock each of the past few years you would see the same predictions that the Hawks would slip back, but they always get a little bit better (which you should expect with a team built around guys in their early 20’s). When will they learn?
Chris Sheriden should find another sport to write about. Hockey, maybe?
Clark Kent
October 24th, 2010
8:50 pm
Who cares, basketball is a giant snoozer.
KevinM
October 24th, 2010
8:56 pm
The Hawks better make the 4th seed minimum or its lights out in Round 1 no matter who they play.
For this roster to to get to the 4th seed, they have to finish 3rd in their division. All these goals should be doable even if LD doesn’t man up and make any member of the core accountable this year.
I still wait for a starter to be yanked and replaced because of their poor performance for any length of time. These lopsided losses in the preseason don’t say or mean much, but effort has to be there night in night out going forward. 2-1 after the first week of the regular season.
chimming in
October 24th, 2010
9:17 pm
hawks go 41 and 41
bjrufino
October 24th, 2010
9:52 pm
As an avid hawks fan, I believe the hawks will advance to the Eastern Conference Finals or even in the NBA Finals, GO HAWKS
They will win 55-57 win.
tidog
October 24th, 2010
10:15 pm
No doubt about it, things will be rough out the gate. New coach, new offense, new defense, new player rotation (first ever player rotation).
When the players get comfortable with their roles the new offense and defense, this team should peak come playoffs and won’t be labeled a selfish boring team by the media.
O'Brien
October 24th, 2010
10:30 pm
My prediction is 49-33. We will have the 4th best record in the East, but we will be the 5th seed, because we will have the 3rd best record in our division.
And the NBA says division winners can finish no lower than fourth. However, even if we are the fifth seed, we would still have homecourt in the first round, so I think we will advance to the second round again.
Last season, when the players had an issue, they would go to LD. When they have an issue this season, who will they go to?
I hope they buy in to LD’s system. otherwise, we are looking at a first round exit.
darrell starks
October 24th, 2010
10:53 pm
My prediction 37-45 may be 8 seed in the east.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
darrell starks
October 24th, 2010
10:57 pm
Marvin william and teague will determain the hawks faith this year, AND WITH MARVIN NOT IMPROVING HIS GAME WILL HURT THE HAWKS BAD THIS YEAR.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!
darrell starks
October 24th, 2010
11:00 pm
1.HEAT
2.MAGIC
3.CELTICS
4.BULLS
5.BUCKS
6.BOBCATS
7.SIXERS
8.HAWKS OR WIZARDS
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
Najeh Davenpoop
October 24th, 2010
11:30 pm
“but it will be enough for a back-to-back 50 win campaigns and grab the home court once again.””
50 wins will not get the Hawks home court. In the highly likely event that Miami and Orlando finish higher than the Hawks in the standings, the Hawks can be no higher than the 5th seed. If the Hawks are the 5th seed with 50 wins, the division winner with the worst record has to win fewer than 50 games. I don’t see Boston winning fewer than 50, so unless the Central Division winner wins fewer than 50, the Hawks will not have home court in the first round.
Najeh Davenpoop
October 24th, 2010
11:31 pm
I’m with O’Brien on 49-33. I actually think the Hawks will be better in the playoffs this year than they have been in years past, but the regular season record will not reflect their improvement, since other teams in the conference have drastically improved their personnel.
Swatguy
October 24th, 2010
11:32 pm
The expert pundits have been wrong every year the last 5. We are more veteran than young now. We will be more mature than most teams out there. Josh, Joe, Al, Bibs and Jamal will need to bond tightly. If they do Hawks will play in the ECC unless they draw Orlando in the second round. I say 56-26.
Najeh Davenpoop
October 24th, 2010
11:44 pm
Just so y’all know, unless you think Miami or Orlando will finish with a worse record than the Hawks, the Hawks can’t finish any higher than 5th.
Doesn’t mean they can’t have home court (although I don’t think it will happen) but the 5th seed is the Hawks’ ceiling unless Miami or Orlando majorly underachieves.
Clyde
October 24th, 2010
11:51 pm
42-40 8th seed in the East.
Rufus1
October 25th, 2010
12:16 am
Its Amazing +
The east is tougher, the Celtics are older, but the Hawks young athletic Hawks takes a step back….Really????
Boston added to Grumpy old O’neals, to the oldest roster in the league, but people believe they will atleast as good….Wow!!!
What did Orlando do to improve….Nothing. When you teams wins 50+ games, you don’t want to change much.
The east has gotten tougher but only for the Hawks….. Really? So the Bulls and the Bucks will only have to play the Hawks…..NOT!!!
I am going to tell all of you what the problems is…..No one knows why the Hawks are so good.
They don’t a have a great player.
They don’t play great defense.
They don’t have a great offense.
They don’t have a great PG
They don’t have great size.
THEY JUST WIN!!!! Analysts don’t know how to judge the Hawks, because no one in the league wins like we do…. SO THEY SIMPLY PICK THE HAWKS TO GET WORSE.
If we can win 53 games with all those DEFICIENCIES, what happens when our offense and defense gets better……WE BECOME ELITE!!!!!
Hmmm
October 25th, 2010
12:24 am
Rufus1, EXACTLY!
MsDee
October 25th, 2010
12:37 am
Dito that Rufus1!!
I will probably have the highest prediction here but I truly believe the Hawks will finish 60-22!! Yes, I’m smoking, drinking, swimming in that Kool-aid cause just because we have trouble playing Orlando, doesnt mean other teams has trouble beating them. Our only 2 teams we seem to have problems with are Orlando and OKCity..that’s it. Every other team we have beaten wither in Phillips or on the road. And as the team gets more and more comfortable with this new offense, those WIDE OPEN SHOTS will soon look like layup to us cause we HAVE good shooters on our team, they just weren’t exposed much during previous seasons due to standing around watching Joe and his ISO’s. Joe, Bibby, Jamal, Jordan, & Al Horford(on a good shooting night) can all shoot very well with this offense. That’s why Orlando shooters are very well with their offense cause they are COMFORTABLE AND KNOWS WHERE EVERYONE SHOULD BE FOR AN OPEN SHOT IN THEIR OFFENSE!! But the biggest and main word is COMFORTABLE. Once we get to the point where we are COMFORTABLE with our new offense, all I can say is WATCH OUT ORLANDO, MIAMI, & BOSTON, OH AND OKCITY!!
MsDee
October 25th, 2010
12:44 am
I also wanted to point out that LD knows this team and how defense becomes important to them. The difference between us and Boston is that Boston defense drives their offense which is why Boston has won many titles despite their age. This is the correct way to win games, defense 1st then offense. But unfortunately, the Hawks offense drives their defense and since LD knows this by being with the team for the past 6 years, he wanted to get the Hawks COMFORTABLE with this new offense that can get them open/easy shots for Joe and company. And again, once the Hawks get COMFORTABLE with the offense, their defense will truly rise to the occasion!!
Rufus1
October 25th, 2010
12:50 am
Exactly MS DEE
I think we win atleast 55 games and have no worse than 3rd best record in the east.
Rufus1
October 25th, 2010
12:53 am
How are the Hawks going to be worse, if the offense has already proven we are going get easier shot……..HUH?
Freshfromatl
October 25th, 2010
12:53 am
MsDee pass me the kool-aid please!!!
I too predict the Hawks will be better record-wise and playoff-wise this year!!
Leggo!!!!!
Old School
October 25th, 2010
1:22 am
I am so frustrated! Why can’t we get more coverage of the Hawks? It is obvious we have some passionate fans. We would probably fill the arena with more news coverage. Where is the hype? Come on AJC give us better coverage and more information on our team! This team has been winning the last few years and it gets the least coverage of all.
Hawks Fan In New Orleans
October 25th, 2010
1:47 am
Wish I was in Atlanta to get the season preview edition AJC paper. Ready for Memphis baby!!!!
Big Ray
October 25th, 2010
2:24 am
Injury is indeed the elephant in the room. However, is this not so for any team? What if Boston’s two O’Neals can’t stay healthy? Then how do their brilliant offseason acquisitions look? Ask the Milwaukee Bucks what those injuries can do to you. All the same, we’re not as deep quality-wise as we would like to see. Check that….we’re not even as quality in our STARTING LINEUP as you might like to see. Two positions are still questions: SF and PG.
There are some who say center is a position of question, but if you have viable backups and options, it’s not. Are our backups/options viable?
Like some, I have limited trust in the bench. Here’s my assessment:
Teague – They want him to be good enough to start, and soon. He has the tools. Does he have the mentality? We don’t know.
Jamal – Most of the time, he’ll score. Most of the time, he’ll be a ghost on defense.
Collins – Looked fairly good when on the court in preseason. But will he be a guy that Drew turns to when more size is needed?
Etan – Got anything left? Dude is brutish and strong, but hardly taller than Al. Can he stay healthy and provide productive minutes, or will he be a muscle bound bench fixture?
Jordan Crawford – Only a matter of time before he sees the floor for significant minutes. Sooner is better, but don’t hold your breath. Without defensive improvement, it will be tough to break in. On the flip side, back court injuries could be the key (or a trade of Jamal).
Mo Evans – Depends. Can score, but will gripe about minutes. Has trouble on defense sometimes, and can be foul prone.
Zaza Pachulia – Can score, has good games here and there, and can rebound. Defends by being in the way. Can lay hard fouls. Otherwise, not an enforcer on the glass or in the paint.
Josh Powell – showed some serious moxie in the preseason. Can’t impact the game like J-Smoove does, but then again, few in the league can. A good stand-in down low, and may see more minutes than any other Hawks big man.
Big Ray
October 25th, 2010
2:27 am
If we can win 53 games with all those DEFICIENCIES, what happens when our offense and defense gets better……WE BECOME ELITE!!!!!
Yes…if all else is equal. But all else is NOT equal. Other teams took measures to improve dramatically. And becoming better on offense and defense is a relative term. Right now, Orlando seems able to prove that they are 25 points better than us any time we play. So let’s say we improve to where they only beat us by 10 points every time we play them. Are we then better? I want to win, not “lose better.”
MsDee
October 25th, 2010
3:02 am
@BIg Ray,
Yes, injuries are an elephant in the room but we can only speak for right now…I choose to speak on right now. Yes, the Hawks are a little banged up but if they get better, than they are better!
JoJo the Godfather
October 25th, 2010
6:01 am
The Hawks have a wealth of guards that play questionable defense (Bibby, Teague, Ja Craw, Jo Craw, & Evans)…Until 2 of these guys get replaced with a PG & SF that can play some D, the Hawks will remain good, but not great.
O'Brien
October 25th, 2010
7:27 am
I want to win, not “lose better.” Ray .
So do I. However, I think our ceiling this year is to “lose better” in the second round.
In terms of players, I dont think we have what it takes to get to the ECF, and I dont think we have what it takes mentally either. LD will have his work cut out for him.
dukester
October 25th, 2010
7:39 am
I say 50 wins. I mean it all hinges on Marvin he is really only the unknown talent on this team. Or maybe he is what he is. But we all seem to think he can be more than what he showed u so far. I would be happy if he could give us 10pts and rebounds at this point. If we could get that out of him we could win 53+.
joe
October 25th, 2010
7:58 am
i can’t see the hawks being anything but mediocre this year. they already are the laughing stock of the NBA for giving JJ 120+ M. they are relatively small, play occasional defense and as a whole don’t shoot the ball that well. I really thought Teague was going to step up, but I’m not seeing it. Bibby was done 2 years ago, he can’t guard ME…….
ILL-Logical
October 25th, 2010
8:13 am
Three questions loom in my mind concerning the upcoming season:
1. How can a player who paid his own way from FRANCE to compete; win over the head coach with his workout and offers the one thing that none of the other guards on the roster consistently display,defense have a “back injury” that keeps him out of the entire pre season?
2.Speaking of consistentcy, how can a player who has never been a consistent scorer, rebounder or defender continue to start? What are the internal politics that require Marvin wiliams to continue to start after 5 years of scoring 30 points one game and disappear the next? And to add insult to injury never draft/ aquire a player in those 5 years to at least push him to improve. And sign him to a long term contract to boot. Many argue about Marvin’s ability/skills but there is no factual predicate to argue about his inconsistent play.
3. Which of the so called core will be sacrificed to the gods of commerce because of the coming fiscal changes? Management has given the farm to Joe and trying to beat the clock with an unprecedented( in the Sund era) offer to Al. The BASG will not pay big money to everyone, so who is going to be be the odd man out?
vava74
October 25th, 2010
8:33 am
JoJo,
Mo is a good defender at the SG slot. Not great, but above average since he moves his feet and always tries to keep up with the opposing player.
The fact that he cannot stop Kobe or Wade is irrelevant since only top notch defenders can slow them down and we are talking about 4 or 5 guys in the league tops.
It’s at the SF slot that he gets constantly burned due to his lack of size (not only he is only 6′5” but also his wingspan is not great.
GeeMack
October 25th, 2010
9:14 am
dukester
10pts and 10rebs out of Marvin?
He needs to give us more than that. 14ppg & 7rebs would be a start.
That dude needs to step up this year.
ICECOLD
October 25th, 2010
9:17 am
UNdefeated 62-20… beat everybody in the playoffs… and win championship.. mvp- of the league joe johnson 28 points 6 assist a 4 rebounds a game.. finals mvp josh smith triple double .. 22 points 12 rebounds 11 assist and 4 blocks a game … and defensive player of the year!!!! lol.. *( my little dream world )*
ICECOLD
October 25th, 2010
9:18 am
62-20… beat everybody in the playoffs… and win championship.. mvp- of the league joe johnson 28 points 6 assist a 4 rebounds a game.. finals mvp josh smith triple double .. 22 points 12 rebounds 11 assist and 4 blocks a game … and defensive player of the year!!!! lol.. *( my little dream world )*
drmaryb (*_*)
October 25th, 2010
9:30 am
For Better or Worse!
The ASKG has married themselves to this core of mediocrity, for better or worse. The puzzling thing is they knew this when they said: ‘I Do!”
If your fiancé is thirty years old, 5′2″, fat and has bad breath?
She is not going to become younger, grow a foot, lose weight and have fresh minty-breath on the honeymoon!
So, you either lower your expectations or accept her for who she is.
After living with Marvin for 5 years, we already know who he is. Why hasn’t the SF
position been upgraded? And, if Josh keeps taking those long jumpers? Don’t say a single other word, glue his azz to the bench, until he stops taking them.
If Josh can’t interpret his shooting percentages in the paint versus the perimeter by now? Then, trade his azz for Gerald Wallace or someone who doesn’t have rocks for brains!
This is a GM and Coaching issue. People treat you the way you let them treat you!
doc
October 25th, 2010
9:38 am
marvin has to decide or be given his role on who he is to become. is he the fifth option and the defensive effort guy who gets you 8 to 10 rebounds a night or what? i dont have a clue as to his role and he doesnt either is my guess. if he were to give what i suggested i would be happy with him. he can still be the glue that binds and be the guy who hits the critical three when everyone else is covered ala bowen, battier, horry, artest, etc. just tell me what he is to do and have him do it. i dont think there is room for another 20 ppg guy on this team. there is a role for the guy who makes all the critical defensive plays, gets after rebounds and plays the guy who is always there in case you need him rather than the guy who goes into hiding until he falls down and rod points it out.
JeJe
October 25th, 2010
9:40 am
LOL @ darrell starks.
Charlotte and Philly finishing above us?
LOL. You must be that confident in pathetic/overpaid/overrated Elton Brand or the Charlotte lineup that is saddening to look at. You are a moron
Chris E
October 25th, 2010
9:50 am
The Hawks will win 50+ this year and although I would have preferred a Big I like what LD is trying to do. The offensive scheme looks good and if the guys give more effort on Defense the Hawks have proved they can play with anyone except Orlando. All they need to focus on is effort on the road and consistency throughout the year. Teague & Powell will make a difference in the rotation and with a deeper bench the starters would be burnt out by the playoffs!!! The guys have to mature mentally as a unit and if they buy into LD’s scheme by playoffs they will have come together as a team and mentally and physically they will be ready to compete at a HIgh Level!!!
Chris E
October 25th, 2010
9:57 am
I meant the starters won’t be burnt out by the playoffs. we all know that the Hawks have been overachievers the last 3 years. The iso offense does not get it done in the playoffs!!!! LD is teaching concepts on on Off & D and if he commits to playing players off the bench the team will eventually buy into his team concept. Not that Woody did a bad job but he did not have a lot of imagination on Offense and in the playoffs if there is no real continuity on offense you will not be successful in the second round. What I saw of ATL against Miami gave me lots of hope that ATL will close out games that they have let slip away in past seasons which will grow their confidence and make them an elite team.
Rufus1
October 25th, 2010
9:59 am
So let’s say we improve to where they only beat us by 10 points every time we play them. Are we then better? I want to win, not “lose better.”
@Big Ray
You are only talking about one team. Their is only one team in the east that has proven they are better than us. I will say it again…Please stop giving the Magics credit to every team in the League.
Miami has no post defense and Boston is old and we swept them. Depending on how the seeding falls, we may not have to see the Magic until the ECF….We may get Boston in the 2nd round.
WE HAVE NOT REACHED OUR CEILING, YOU REACH YOU CEILING WHEN YOU HAVE EXHAUSTED ALL OF YOU OPTION. WE CAN IMPROVE AT THE PG, OFFENSE AND DEFENSE, SO WE STILL HAVE ROOM TO GROW.
PS. All things being equal…injuries are concern for every team.(if the Magic lose D12)
BigTimeTECHFan
October 25th, 2010
10:00 am
Hawk win 50, then NBA championship.
Beat Oklahoma City in finals
KevinM
October 25th, 2010
10:07 am
Najeh, I figured if the Hawks finish behind ORL and MIA, and Boston takes the Atlantic, and we have one of the top 3 records in the league, shouldn’t we still be eligible for the 4th seed? We just can’t be a Top 3 because the Atlantic Division winner would take that slot.
I could be wrong though; I don’t think its just based on wins/losses.
I just think if the Hawks end up below 4, the playoffs will not bring good news to the core.
I can see 50 wins; 35 home/15 road. If this offense truly does improve the team, and they could possibly play .500 road ball, then this team could end up with 55-57 wins.
I don’t think you move JC1 during the season though. You get as much out of him as you can, letting JC2 learn from the sidelines, then insert him as Joe’s backup next year. JC1 will be a good piece for us in Year 2. I don’t see Sund moving him unless JC1 gets chippy with the sceanrio.
Let next year’s contracts work themselves out over the offseason; its time to focus on getting ready for Memphis, Philly and Washington in Week 1.
Rufus1
October 25th, 2010
10:36 am
David Aldridge….
http://www.nba.com/2010/news/features/david_aldridge/10/25/morning-tip-heat-offense/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt1
I’m Feelin’ …
1) Finally. Opening Night! There are more quality teams with a realistic chance to win a championship as the season begins than I can remember in a very long time.
2) If the Hawks, and especially Joe Johnson, will buy into the Princeton philosophy that Larry Drew is trying to sell, Atlanta could be a very dangerous team on offense. In the fourth quarter, moving the ball from strong to weak against the Heat got Maurice Evans a wide-open three, and Jamal Crawford, and Johnson. It works.
Freshfromatl
October 25th, 2010
10:42 am
Rufus1,
You make a great point. Too often on this blog, dudes seem to unconsciously make every team out to be the Orlando Magic (maybe they’re living in their little fantasy world) *shrugs*
All I know is come Wednesday at approximately 7:00pm, the bandwagon pulls out…is you on or is off?
O'Brien
October 25th, 2010
10:47 am
“Najeh, I figured if the Hawks finish behind ORL and MIA, and Boston takes the Atlantic, and we have one of the top 3 records in the league, shouldn’t we still be eligible for the 4th seed?” KevinM .
Nope. NBA rules say a division winner cannot finish lower than 4th, regardless of record. So if Orlando, Miami and Boston finish ahead of us, then the Central division winner would automatically be the fourth seed.
However, if we finish as the 5th seed, we could still have homecourt in the first round if we have more wins than the Central division winner.
Freshfromatl
October 25th, 2010
10:53 am
http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2010/10/22/good-bad-of-the-east-in-preseason-play/
ATLANTA HAWKS
The good: Atlanta is committed to its new flex-style motion offense, with more cutting and screening that should produce better shots, take pressure of Joe Johnson and diversify the crunch-time offense.
The bad: It’s slow going so far. The Hawks are shooting a middling 43.5 percent from the floor, Johnson still can’t get to the foul line as much as a high-volume scorer should, and Josh Smith remains prone to the occasional lazy, long two-pointer. Stick with it, Hawks.
Another GM
October 25th, 2010
11:06 am
The Hawks are a good team, just not a very good team. The main problem in Atlanta is the management group, they refuse to spend the money to move to the next level. Most teams try to find a way to upgrade their team in the offseason………the Hawks try to find a way not to spend money. The Hawks will go 45-37 in the regular season and be toast in the first round with their 5 seating in the conference.
The east will be watching to see how Shaq does in Boston……………if he does well and helps the team with his big body then the Hawks will take a lot of critiscm.
O'Brien
October 25th, 2010
11:16 am
Doc,
LD has been on record saying one of the problems with Marvin last year was he did not know his role, did not know when shots would be coming etc.
Based on his comments, I assume LD has spoken to Marvin and told him exactly what his role is. I think his role will be similar to how he played in the Miami pre-season game. 10 pts, 8 rebounds, and a big 3 pointer down the stretch.
IF we can get that consistently from Marvin (10 pts, 8 rebs, big shots at key moments, and very good defense), that will be a huge boost for the lineup.
cp
October 25th, 2010
11:16 am
I think they win 48 games . Hopefully LD truly holds guys accountable this year. I really don’t like the laziness of this team at times. If a guy is not out there getting it done then sit them on the bench and insert somebody who cares.
yodaddy
October 25th, 2010
11:20 am
yall are funny talking about 41 wins….straight drinking the ESPN kool-aid.
The team will win at least 50 games this season. I saw Joe Johnson put up 29 in the new offense without a whole lot of energy expenditure. I saw Horford taking some wide open shots 9even though they didn’t fall that night. I saw Josh Smith playing maturely after having 2 fouls in the first quarter. I saw Bibby knocking down clutch shot after clutch shot and controlling the tempo.
As much as people talk about how horrible Bibby is…he’s not really that bad. I never heard Bibby couldn’t play defense until he got here and was constantly switching on to Dwight Howard. Bottom line…he’ll be just fine and the dark horse…Bibby can shoot the lights out and is a clutch player in terms of taking shots and taking care of the ball.
JoJo the Godfather
October 25th, 2010
12:09 pm
I say cut Etan Thomas, and grab Patrick Beverly & Da’Sean Butler right now…Both were cut by Miami today…Losing Etan doesn’t change who we are as a team…Developing one of these youngsters in to a rotational player on 2nd round/free agent money, could.
Astro Joe
October 25th, 2010
12:22 pm
48-34. 1st round loss in the playoffs. The key learningof the season is that the sacred core ain’t all that sacred. LD will be fine as the head coach… the issue is the roster.
Grandad
October 25th, 2010
12:39 pm
Mr. Michael Cunningham:
If you’re reading this, I really would like to know,
what the heck is the deal with Pape Sy?
What is the real story?
Are the Hawks hiding something?
Inquiring minds want to know?
Ramon
October 25th, 2010
12:46 pm
Lol, in this picture, Van Exel still has that look on his face like ‘I can still drop 13 a game if needed’. lol
Grandad
October 25th, 2010
12:51 pm
Again to Michael Cunningham:
I think you confuse “dispassionate” with disinterested.
Your approach to the Hawks is not dispassionate but laborious.
Your 5 questions about the Hawks in the AJC = formulaic.
When I challenged your passion [for this job] previously,
I was wrong, I simply should have challenged your interest level.
RaJaH
October 25th, 2010
1:06 pm
I agree with JoJo. Butler is lottery talent and would be a great investment. The question is would Sund act before any other GM.
northcyde
October 25th, 2010
1:56 pm
Definitely co-sign on adding Butler to this roster. We’re going to have to replace Mo Evans at the end of the year anyway, so we might as well make a 2 yr investment in Butler to see what he can do next season ( or by the end of this season ).
*******
Just to reinterate what Najeh and O’Brien are talking about with visual numbers, say you have this scenario in the Eastern Conference.
ATLANTIC
Boston: 50 – 32
CENTRAL
Milwaukee: 47 – 35
SOUTHEAST
Orlando: 63 – 19
Miami: 59 – 23
Atlanta: 52 – 30
Your division winners are Orlando ( 63 – 19 ) . . Boston ( 50 – 32 ) . . Milwaukee ( 47 – 35 ). These teams MUST be in the top 4 in seeding.
Because Miami has the 2nd best record in the East ( but not a division winner ), they’ll still secure the #2 seed.
And while Atlanta would have the 3rd best record in the East, because of the rule that gives the division winners 3 of the top 4 seeds, we can be no higher than a 5 seed.
So your seedings would look like this
1) Orlando ( 63 – 19 )
2) Miami ( 59 – 23 )
3) Boston ( 50 – 32 )
4) Milwaukee ( 47 – 35 )
5) Atlanta ( 52 – 30 )
So our matchup would be 4) Milwaukee vs 5) Atlanta.
Fortunately, 1st round home court advantage is actually determined by record, not seeding. So although we are the 5 seed, we’d get home court advantage in that series.
But our seeding would be locked in at that point. So if we make it to the 2nd round, you know who would be waiting for us.
******
@ KevinM . . . if the Hawks only win 15 road games during the regular season, that team is dead in the water come playoff time. That would mean that nothing has changed with the mentality of playing on the road.
i_am_soulstar
October 25th, 2010
2:03 pm
Yeah, Butler’s a great talent, but that torn ACL diminishes his value greatly. He probably won’t be able to play until next year, if that.
drmaryb (*_*)
October 25th, 2010
2:06 pm
DeSean Butler Cut?
Wow! I say go get him and nurse him along to play with Marvin.
Marvin is not garbage, but he is what he is. Can he improve? Sure, why not?
But, Mr. GM needs to do something – anything!
As good as we are, we can be better.
‘There is no calamity in not reaching your goals – The calamity is having no goals to reach.”
-aurthur unknown-
What is The ASKG goal? To win 50 games? To scratch round two and win A game? To stay below the Luxury Tax? To keep the core together? Or, is it to win a championship?
It appears to me all of the above is true, except the last goal aforementioned.
Say what you will about Mark Cuban, his team does what The Hawks appear to being doing for the past ten years! But, to a man, we all know his goal is to:
Win a Championship? How doe we know this? Because, Mark makes changes year in and year out. As ineffective as those changes may be, we can see the effort from the owner being applied feverishly.
Sure, The Hawks will win 50 games and earn a round 2 spot – So what? Thaþ window of opportunity will not remain open forever, certainly not for ten years without constant tweaks, great trades and entering the Luxury Tax realm.
And, like a “2 Live Stews Caller”: I’m Gone!
northcyde
October 25th, 2010
2:10 pm
In my opinion, your assessment is still wrong Grandad. Saying that he’s “disinterested” insinuates that he doesn’t care. MC has given a level of detail about events and players that even Sekou didn’t do here.
The fact that he would write 2 to 3 blogs a week during a very uneventful summer after the JJ signing, proves that he was anything but “disinterested”
I just think that you don’t like his straight forward, no extra fluff writing styke.
If not reporting more about Pape Sy, a guy that probably shouldn’t have been signed by the Hawks in the first place, makes him “disinterested”, then 75% of the fan base is disinterested as well.
If we have to count on Pape Sy for defensive perimeter help, something is already SERIOUSLY wrong with the makeup of our bench.
nique
October 25th, 2010
2:14 pm
They’ve got the talent. It’s all about defense, ball movement and shot selection. In other words – being disciplined and showing max effort through 48.
northcyde
October 25th, 2010
2:17 pm
@ soulstar . . that’s a very low risk investment, seeing that guys have come back successfully off from tearing an ACL. Plus, he’s still young, so the healing and recovery time will be somewhat reduced, than if he were 30 and suffered that injury.
LOL . . if we can stash former heart patients on the bench, surely we can commit to Butler for the minimum for 2 years.
drmaryb (*_*)
October 25th, 2010
2:23 pm
Tear it Up!
i_am_soulstar I see your concern, but trust me, with state of the art orthopedic surgens, medical technology and rehabilitation programs available today?
DeSean can and probably will recover 100% or close to it. Age is also on his side. I say, do it now! And, put him on IR.
i_am_soulstar
October 25th, 2010
2:26 pm
northcyde,
I hear you man, I just know that ACL is tough to come back from. A few have done it, but I think more have been forced to bow out because of it.
But you’re right, it would be a very low risk investment.
i_am_soulstar
October 25th, 2010
2:32 pm
drmaryb,
Yeah, if he could come in next year and be a cheap and effective replacement for Mo Evans, then I’m all for it.
But I think I’ve lived through much disappointment (as I’m sure you all have), waiting on a player to heal, return to the court, and save my team, only to have another complication arise before he even makes it thru warm-ups. So I’m definitely skeptical.
It’s always with guys that have back or knee problems. Do they ever completely heal?
Grandad
October 25th, 2010
2:51 pm
northcyde
My post, although a follow up to the Pape Sy post,
was not about him.
I noted the 5 question “article” if you can call it an article.
Don’t put words in my mouth;
I said disinterested, I mean’t disinterested.
Now my point;
I said what was on my mind, clear and simple.
As Howard Cosell would have said:
“I call it like I see it”.
Hardly anyone pays attn to the Hawks.
Hardly anyone reads the AJC anymore.
Not all of the problem but a symptom.
*[concerning what ails the Hawks attendence]
By the way – I never mentioned Sekou.
I’ve never compared the two men.
Where are you getting that?
Were I to compare;
it would be basketball coverage in:
* Washington DC
* Dallas / Ft. Worth
* Indy
* Orlando
All of which I am familiar.
Even in Nashville, you have a better paper than the AJC.[sp.page]
Once again I know of which I speak.
Have a good day, -nc-.
The weather was beautiful in Nashville this past weekend.
dukester
October 25th, 2010
3:25 pm
dukester
10pts and 10rebs out of Marvin?
He needs to give us more than that. 14ppg & 7rebs would be a start.
That dude needs to step up this year.
@Geemack I feel you man but sometimes you have bid low and hope for the stars. LOL You are right but I dont think Marvin has that kind of heart. I agree with some of the other bloggers if he can just get 10 boards a night (3-4offensive) he will get his points and carry his weight. Play good solid defense and hit the open shot when it is there (3-4 open shots a game) I will be happy with that. You know being we are undersized it would help if he would go down in the paint after every shot and fight for a board. I mean how many fast breaks is leading Josh leads more than he does which one reason we have problems rebounding. So do you want Josh in the open court flying high or Marvin. LOL anwser Marvin get your butt down in the post and rebound. LOL Good luck hawks!! Looking forward to long winter nights with this team again. The family loves it.
Ken Strickland
October 25th, 2010
4:12 pm
JE JE-Once again you’ve eliminated part of my statement in order to make your usually weak point. And how in the hell can you say any team that played well enough during the regular season to finish as the 4th seed “SUCKED DURING THE REGULAR SEASON? Man, you don’t have a clue, otherwise why would you work so hard at twisting everything.
The Hawks will do well during the regular season and the playoffs. We won’t struggle to win a 1st rd series, or get swept and embarrassed in 2nd rd, like the last 2yrs. Under HC LDrew, the 2010/2011 Atlanta Hawks will be far better prepared to compete in the playoffs than they ever were under former HC MWoodson. With the varying improvements of Eastern Conference teams like the Bulls, Bucks, Knicks, Bobcats, Wizzards, Nets etc, wouldn’t teams expected to finish at the top of the Eastern Conference, like the Celtics, Magic and Heat, lose additional gms to these teams, and not just the Hawks?
pinoy hawk
October 25th, 2010
8:59 pm
at least 50 wins for atl. why? because we have the same team (core) as last year and the conference rivals’ rosters (except for miami obviously) are likewise the same.
i don’t consider boston, chicago nor ny upgraded because they added damaged goods (boozer, shaq, jermaine and amare) to their rosters.
so expect a 50-win season and a 2nd round exit (again)!
Truth-se rum
October 25th, 2010
10:59 pm
“Injury is indeed the elephant in the room. However, is this not so for any team? What if Boston’s two O’Neals can’t stay healthy? Then how do their brilliant off season acquisitions look? Ask the Milwaukee Bucks what those injuries can do to you”
Its really poor thinking and desperate when you have to hope some of the other players get hurt in order for your team to have a chance. Id rather get the talent to play on their level than to ask never never land to hurt key players on the other team.
But hey, I guess you got to do something because we aint gonna get a impact center to put us in the “serious contender category.
I agree with the majority of the bloggers. Hawks between 42-48 wins. – no center still.
Truth-se rum
October 25th, 2010
11:48 pm
sport illustrated
Final East Standings
1. Miami Heat (1.0)
2. Orlando Magic (2.2)
3. Boston Celtics (3.0)
4. Chicago Bulls (4.7)
T5. Atlanta Hawks (5.2)
T5. Milwaukee Bucks (5.2)
7. Charlotte Bobcats (8.3)
T8. Philadelphia 76ers (8.7)
T8. Washington Wizards (8.7)
10. New York Knicks (9.5)
11. Indiana Pacers (12.0)
12. Detroit Pistons (12.2)
13. New Jersey Nets (12.3)
14. Cleveland Cavaliers (13.5)
15. Toronto Raptors (13.7)
Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/ian_thomsen/10/21/scouts.picks.nba.season/index.html#ixzz13QvCt6uc
Truth-se rum
October 25th, 2010
11:52 pm
CBS predictions
Eastern Conference
01) Orlando Magic (67-15, 1st in Southeast)
02) Boston Celtics (55-27, 1st in Atlantic)
03) Chicago Bulls (53-29, 1st in Central)
04) Miami Heat (50-32, 2nd in Southeast)
05) Atlanta Hawks (48-34, 3rd in Southeast)
06) New York Knicks (47-35, 2nd in Atlantic)
07) Detroit Pistons (42-40, 2nd in Central)
08) Milwaukee Bucks (39-43, 3rd in Central)
09) Washington Wizards (36-46, 4th in Southeast)
10) Philadelphia 76ers (35-47, 3rd in Atlantic)
11) Indiana Pacers (27-55, 4th in Central)
12) New Jersey Nets (26-56, 4th in Atlantic)
13) Charlotte Bobcats (24-58, 5th in Southeast)
14) Cleveland Cavaliers (23-59, 5th in Central)
15) Toronto Raptors (19-63, 5th in Atlantic)
flyboyyschris
October 26th, 2010
9:38 am
1st place hawks