Atlanta Hawks: Al Horford: ‘I am going to war with who I’ve got’ (Update: Hawks sign Etan Thomas)

Tee

September 2nd, 2010
3:02 pm

Great work MC. ASG, please lock up Al now, he’s the heart and soul of this team! I hate to say it, but we may need to move Jamal to get a perimeter defender. Jordan Crawford will have to suffice for bench scoring.

The Real JC

September 2nd, 2010
3:05 pm

Love it – I mean, who says that? One of the few true team players left in the NBA.

Fear th Deer

September 2nd, 2010
3:09 pm

3rd!!

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
3:15 pm

4th!!!! – I’m such a loser

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
3:16 pm

Good to hear Al’s good attitude – what we’ve come to expect from him. A healthy Thomas is a beast by the way.

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
3:18 pm

Let’s see, would you rather go to war with RandMo and Joe Smith (who played well in his role last year BTW) or Etan Thomas and Josh Powell – War – Etan and Powell hands down.

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
3:20 pm

I think you could make the case we have improved slightly inside over last year.

shawn

September 2nd, 2010
3:22 pm

The reality is that Hawks are not better than Orlando or Heat. ASG did not do anything to make me believe that we are going to take it to next level. just look at who they hired as coach..nothing against LD, but what makes you believe that he is going to make this team better being the assistant under Woody?

Westurd

September 2nd, 2010
3:23 pm

This will be Al’s team soon…….as of right now, its not ones team and that bothersome. Finally someone step up and said, “I got some effing B*lls and will run this ship.”

Gil

September 2nd, 2010
3:28 pm

MC, Is this as nice and proffesional a guy as you’ve seen in the league?

GT Alum

September 2nd, 2010
3:33 pm

I bumped into Al at Philips today and asked him if that’s going to be enough to get the Hawks over the ceiling that for this franchise has been set short of the East finals for so long.

“I am going to war with who I’ve got,” Al said

Honestly, it sounds like he’s answering that question, I don’t think so, but I’m going to do everything I can to get us over that hump anyway.

Al Horford sounds like a smart, competitive young man. Seems like, if it’s what he wants, he could have a future in the front office after what will hopefully be a long and productive playing career.

Astro Joe

September 2nd, 2010
3:35 pm

MC, is the team captain chosen by the players or by the coaching staff? Obviously, having the title is meaningless unless your peers respect you, but some way, some how, Al needs to be established as the team’s first, second and third leader amongst the players. And I’m not trying to hear any comments about salaries… because for all of this love for Carmelo, Billups and Kenyon are the leaders of the Nuggets… Melo just takes the shots.

Air Zaza

September 2nd, 2010
3:37 pm

LOL, a younger Thomas was serviceable. This one is just there. We should be better for the regular season, it’s the off-season where I expect the worst.

Air Zaza

September 2nd, 2010
3:37 pm

post season. edit.

Hoops

September 2nd, 2010
3:40 pm

Al should be the captain of the Hawks in 2010-11. JJ works hard and leads by example, but Al leads by example and he also leads verbally.

Hawks Hack

September 2nd, 2010
3:41 pm

I’m sick of reading about the Hawks and there apathetic ownership!!

85Souf

September 2nd, 2010
3:43 pm

I see why they didn’t want to break up the core, granted they definitely needed some more Punch off the bench scoring wise, defensively inside & out, and just heart on the bench, The Hawks can truly sore Higher if the core plays better than they did… Joe’s fine except for when he’s in The Playoffs I don’t know if he can work on that but he needs to, Jamal was fine, Josh could score a tad bit more & maybe not give up in a Playoff game, Al could maybe score a bucket more, Jeff(new core player) if he plays solid cool but if he shines wow, Bibby could try to be more in shape & yawn less on the bench in Playoff games, AND MARVIN could double up ALL his numbers, if this were to happen which its no where near the realm of Impossible, it actually should’ve been happened The Hawks will be a Really Dangerous team in the regular season & in The Playoffs

The Grinch

September 2nd, 2010
4:08 pm

Shawn, it doesn’t matter who Drew is or who he’s coached under. The very fact alone that he ISN’T Mike Woodson will automatically mean this will be a better coached team than last year.

If Crawford’s demands get in the way of re-signing Horford, he has to go.

niremetal

September 2nd, 2010
4:09 pm

Milwaukee is not better.

JerryT

September 2nd, 2010
4:16 pm

Adding players isn’t the only way to get better. Several of these guys are young and still have room to improve. Dwight Howard didn’t just wake up one day with arms like that. There’s a whole ‘nother level of commitment that we probably haven’t seen here yet.

I Heart Atlanta

September 2nd, 2010
4:24 pm

I agree with niremetal, Milwaukee is not better (other than bogut being healthy)
They lost: Luke ridnhour (i know i can’t spell), Thomas, Stackhouse, gonzureach (lol again)
Gained: Douglas roberts, Magettie, Gooden, Dooling

bigdave

September 2nd, 2010
4:24 pm

great read MC..

IMO the only way this team takes that next step is if Joe plays at a “superstar” level (im still not sure what that is) and if Josh consistently plays all-star basketball which we all now he can.

Rufus1

September 2nd, 2010
4:50 pm

Niremetal Co-sign 4:09 post

Rufus1

September 2nd, 2010
4:54 pm

When Al Horford said earlier this summer that the Hawks needed to add an “impact center” to be a serious contender in the Eastern Conference,

Al you need to become that impact center, the Hawks aren’t going to pay 28mil a year for 2 impact PF.

jason

September 2nd, 2010
4:58 pm

three year deal for jamal and a five year deal for AL i think we have somethin goin on in this team that nobody see’s except me

northcyde

September 2nd, 2010
5:00 pm

What did people expect Al to say? “No . . . I don’t have enough help” . .?

He’s not going to throw his new teammates under the bus like that. Al is a profrssional, and has always carried himself as such. JJ and Smoove are the same way when interviewed about the team and its needs.

Still, all the talk is about what Drew is doing with the offense, but no chatter about what he’s going to do about the defense. Gotta play defense to deep into the playoffs.

I Heart Atlanta

September 2nd, 2010
5:01 pm

I c it Jason

ILL-Logical

September 2nd, 2010
5:05 pm

I am still trying to understand the value that some attach to All Star Al rregarding the team’s future prospects. He has had a good professional career to date with a somewhat contoversial All Star selection last year but to conflate extending his contract with thesurvival of the franchise strikes me as just a little over the top.

My unease is centered around the fact that NBA history is replete with “undersized” (6′9 and under)centers leading their teams to championships. From Bill Russell to Ben Wallace, there have been guys whose savy,skill and heart have enabled them to overcome their relative lack of size to overcome or at least compete with the Wilt Chamberlins and Shaqs of their era. I would even add Alonzo Mourning to that list because he certainly got the most out of his ability as a feared defender of the rim.

And having seen all of the aforementioned players play,I can say without hesitation ,that Al is not in their class. And further, from what I have seen-and I attended several of the big games like the Cavs and Lakers games as well as game 7 of the Bucks series- if he plays the 4 as he has “requested”, his ceiling there is at best Buck Williams,an offensively challenged but relentless rebounder.

In short, ASA is at best a 10 year plus starter.No more,no less and the desire to throw large sums of money at him while ascribing some shaman like leadership skills is confusing to me. Let’s face it,people are not lining up at Phillips’ or any other box office to ASA play. We enjoy his work when and if we get there but he is not a box office draw.

So maybe he will add 20 lbs of muscle; develop a killer low post move and become a premier shot blocker but in the meantime, he is just another very good player. Again,let,s not confuse effort with ability.

Dos Hawkquis

September 2nd, 2010
5:06 pm

I truly hope that the Hawk don’t “low ball” Horford with an offer like 5 yr $65mil and tick the man off. Their negotiating strategies aren’t the best. They low balled Chills and Josh…

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends.”

northcyde

September 2nd, 2010
5:11 pm

Rufus . . . that’s right on point. It’s going to have to be Horford that elevates his level of play. He can start by becoming a DOMINANT rebounder, instead of just a very good rebounder. He needs to average 12+ rebounds a game, instead of 10.

I would much rather see Horford average 15 pts – 13 rebs . . . than 18 pts – 10 rebs.

The Truth

September 2nd, 2010
5:11 pm

If Jamal comes to camp, he will either be disgruntle or satisfied. We shall see. Since he was the heart and soul of our bench, his attitude (if he plays for the Hawk) will determine the outcome of the Hawk’s season since he was labeled as “The Difference” or the “X-factor” on this team. Many have already forgotten how important his contribution was on the team. As much as I like AL Horford, he is not what strikes fear into our opponents mind. He is however the best center we got. He is the “Mr. Yeoman” on the team with his consistent work ethics on most nights. But our fear factors are Josh Smith ability to change a game defensively and JJ and Jamal ability to score. Since we only suited-up just 12 players on most nights, we were a very efficient team when are clicking on all cylinders. However, if one of our big guns go down, we went from being a good team to just average as we struggled to close out games sometimes even at full strength. This revelation was not so apparent last year because the team stayed relatively healthy. However, we did witness a few moments when a key player went down to injury while another player stepped-up to fill the void. But those moments were rare. If a key player is absent either physically or mentally for an entire season for what ever reason, contract or otherwise, then this team is not built to roll with any degree of consistency as the Celtics were. Yes we do have some additional players that will bring something new to table, but their contribution will likely be negated with the upgrades of players on teams throughout the eastern conference. Al Horford summed it up best:

“We have to work harder if we want to be any better because, man, the East. Milwaukee is better. Chicago is better. Miami is better, it goes without saying. It’s going to be an interesting year for us.”

i_am_soulstar

September 2nd, 2010
5:18 pm

I hope the positivity is infectious.

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
5:19 pm

Michael Cunningham:
Any recent news on Pape Sy concerning his contract with Le Havre?

I Heart Atlanta:
Bogut’s injury remains a concern for the Bucks.
It was a very serious injury.
More so, I think than is/was generally perceived.

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
5:28 pm

Miami has the (3) super fiends.

Boston had their Big (3)

That’s all the rage.
Get three super-stars.
-Personally-
I’m still a Team guy!
-However-
In the spirit of the times;
We have our Big-Bad-Super-duper (3) + (1).
Joe > Al > Josh + Jamal = playin’ team ball!

That rhymed in case you missed it.

northcyde

September 2nd, 2010
5:31 pm

And some of you gusy be killing me with the acronyms. “ASA”? I was initially like . . “he meant ASG, right?” But I guess “ASA” stands for “All-Star Al”

LOL . . smh . . . you need an acronym thesarus on here.

ASA = All-Star Al ( Horford )

E#2 = Employee #2 ( JJ )

JC2 = Jordan Crawford

JC3 = Jason Collins

Any other player acronyms I need to know about?

Rufus1

September 2nd, 2010
5:44 pm

@Northcyde

I agree either Al or Josh need to average 13rbs a game, but both need to average 10rbs. I think their rbs numbers will increase if they spend less time on the perimeter playing defense….because it doesn’t make any sense that the Hawks are one of the best offensive rbs teams, but bad on the defensive glass.

shawn

September 2nd, 2010
5:53 pm

The Grinch,
What LD has done to make him a better coach than Woody? My friend, you live in fantasy and I am talking to you about facts. Just look at LD resume and then talk to me about facts.

jason

September 2nd, 2010
5:55 pm

so its official on Hawks.com i heard that the hawks have finally signed free agent center Etan Thomas. what does he bring to this team? well for one defense. I mean have u taken a look at those biceps? And he is agressive to the rim which is what al horford lacked last season(but he brought some shooting which was pretty phenomanal). What do i expect from this team next year? not a championship but we are going to be give orlando somthin to rethink about for next season. But this post season isnt’t over yet. it has only just begun. in training camp i want to see atlanta go for that small foward say a guy like jerry stackhouse. Marvin mo and zaza i want to see traded. They were how i call our “dead weight” appearently there are some teams interested in them. Trade all of them for cash and we get some 2nd rounders. now I want a point guard that can run this team with his veteran presence and his playoff expirience. If you saw the orlando series u saw that mike bibby and jeff teague were spun like a top when jameer nelson was “scoring” all over the court. I use scoring as somthing to describe him. im talkin about Allen Iverson. Now i have heard from blogs that people say that he has a big ego. Now i do agree but we are trying to win a championship here! We can also get him cheap. So i post this to tell the fans that i think we can do pretty well next season if we make these transactions.

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
6:03 pm

Per “Hoops World”
The Atlanta Hawks have signed free agent center Etan Thomas, according to Executive Vice President/General Manager Rick Sund. Per team policy, terms were not disclosed.

“We’re excited to add a player of Etan’s caliber to our roster,” said Hawks head coach Larry Drew. “He provides additional veteran leadership, physicality and toughness to our club, especially on the glass and the defensive side of the ball. We also add another versatile and multi-positional player to our frontcourt.”

terrell

September 2nd, 2010
6:09 pm

Dos, how is that low-balling? That’s 13 mill a year? A couple of million more than Josh makes. I like Al, but 5 yr 65 mill sounds about right to me. 4 yr 60 at the most.

Ken Strickland

September 2nd, 2010
6:13 pm

I don’t see the Hawks resigning Jamal Crawford. We didn’t make Jordan Crawford and Pape Sy our 2 top draft picks with the idea of resigning JaCrawford, and he knows it. Since both players can play SG, PG, score and play DEF, they would make Jamal expendable.

With his expiring contract and scoring ability, we could trade him for draft picks, use our $3M trade exemption, and take back a small fraction of his $10+M contract. Getting rid of his contract, and losing MEvans $2.5M contract, could free up enough money for us to easily resign Horford. Bibby’s contract will be expiring after this season.

Starting next yr, we should be able to get enough OFF production out of both players to equal Jamal’s production, and their DEF ability and versatility would make them even more valuable. Let’s not forget we’ll have them for the duration of their rookie contracts, plus they’d be restricted FA’s when their rookie contracts expire. There’s just no long term benefit in resigning Jamal.

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
6:15 pm

northcyde

I’m glad you brought up the acronyms.
‘J-Cheese’ was here 1st, so how did ‘Jordo’
get to be JC2?
Should it not be the other way around?

jason

September 2nd, 2010
6:19 pm

im hearing from hawks.com that we are signing both jamal and horford in the same day.

jason

September 2nd, 2010
6:22 pm

MC im hearing that we agreed to a buyout with Le Harve so whats the truth? did we or didnt we sign him?

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
6:26 pm

Ken S

“Bibby’s contract will be expiring after this season.”

Just to clarify, you mean, becomes an exp. after this season.
He actually has 2 yrs left, counting this season.

Plus, we would have to take back a bit more than a small fraction.
Would we not?

Understand that when you get into the CBA I’m over my head.

*I personally would not want to rid ourselves of Jamal
just for the purpose of shedding his contract. [salary relief]

The Truth

September 2nd, 2010
6:29 pm

MC: Is that it as far as the Hawks acquiring more players? I mean Pape Sy signing doesn’t sound that critical since he was likely headed to the D-league anyway perhaps explaining the slow pace in acquiring him. It would seem that the biggest gorilla in the room now is Jamal Crawford. His move came from left-field and I’m sure unexpected by Sund. I mean the idea that Jamal disrupted his vacation no doubt rocked his world

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
6:34 pm

Thanks Michael!

Fresh

September 2nd, 2010
6:42 pm

LOL. Somebody on this blog got real issues man.

jason

September 2nd, 2010
6:44 pm

MC anyday know why am i heraring that we signed pape sy and i am hearing from your mouth that we didnt?

cp

September 2nd, 2010
7:36 pm

When I think of impact players, guys such as Jason Collins, Etan Thomas, and Josh Powell don’t come to mind. It is what it is.

James

September 2nd, 2010
7:37 pm

Hawks need to trade Jamal Crawford and Josh Smith to Denver for Carmelo Anthony & NeNe.

dstdeelite

September 2nd, 2010
8:11 pm

It’s really sad that the highest paid guy on the roster does not equate to the team captain/leader.

shaqtus thorns

September 2nd, 2010
8:15 pm

WOW, that guy is a jackazz.

O'Brien

September 2nd, 2010
8:45 pm

“I am just kind of leaving to that to the owners and my representation” Al .

I’m glad he realizes that it is not just up to Rick Sund. Rick needs owners approval, and given our 11 man ownership team, you just never know what to expect, and when to expect it.

Najeh Davenpoop

September 2nd, 2010
9:03 pm

“And having seen all of the aforementioned players play,I can say without hesitation ,that Al is not in their class. And further, from what I have seen-and I attended several of the big games like the Cavs and Lakers games as well as game 7 of the Bucks series- if he plays the 4 as he has “requested”, his ceiling there is at best Buck Williams,an offensively challenged but relentless rebounder.”

This is true now. Most of the projection of Al as an elite front court player is dependent on him developing one go-to post move, which would put him in that category. The reason for the amount of optimism about him stems from the fact that he is good at every other aspect of the game — rebounding, ball-handling, passing, defense, and as a team leader. I only saw Buck Williams towards the tail end of his career, so I can’t really say with certainty how good he was, but to imply that Al Horford’s ceiling as an offensive player is pretty much to rely on dunks and putbacks for most of his efficient offensive scoring is, I think, a mistake.

Jae Evolution

September 2nd, 2010
9:12 pm

I just read this article on A.I., and I know some of you see red flags with this guy, but this article made very solid points on why he would work here. Anyways heres the article for you guys: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/447466-allen-iverson-could-replace-jamal-crawford-in-atlanta

JerryWest

September 2nd, 2010
9:18 pm

Post from a good blogger at realgm:
“Etan’s always got something wrong. He’s also had rib injuries. But the biggest problem he has are his hands. He’s got good low post moves, but when you can’t hold onto the ball, there’s a problem. His ball skills are awful, and he’s a black hole – will not and maybe cannot pass. Also, for a strong physical player, he’s surprisingly clueless on setting picks – displaying a low BBIQ. He has good shot-blocking instincts, but he’s got below average height and length for a C. A better poet than NBA player.”

Najeh Davenpoop

September 2nd, 2010
9:29 pm

If Iverson has anything left in the tank and if he is willing to take a bench role (which may not even be as expansive as Jamal’s, considering that the Hawks have a lot of depth at the SG position) he would be a good fit as a 2nd unit scorer. Those are two big “if”s though.

Dub C

September 2nd, 2010
9:32 pm

Jae,

I just read the same article and I can see some validity in it. However, it just seems like Iverson brings drama everywhere he goes. He said he’d take whatever role he can get, but didn’t he say that when he went to Memphis?

Regarding signing Etan Thomas, I’m up in the air with that. I just don’t know what kind of impact he will have. But he can’t be any worse than Collins.

KevinM

September 2nd, 2010
9:37 pm

JC1 – very useful in his current role
JC2 – will have to learn a lot in a hurry to be any factor…he gets minutes if JC1 is gone. He’s here because the ASG had zero clue what E#2 was going to do….
JC3- he has to earn our respect……time to finally show something

E#2 – questionable in my eyes as a leader…….all I have is the past to go off of.
LD – all eyes are on his moves

The same roster through the first 9; a bad taste left over from last season and it will be hard for any other players to get any minutes. The minutes will be inconsistent and you can bet LD will have some guys in his doghouse as well.

History shows Sund doesn’t make in-season moves…..be prepared to see this roster for the bulk of the season.

Ken Strickland

September 2nd, 2010
9:53 pm

EThomas is now a Hawk, so the time for complaining about his hands, size, injuries etc, is long past. We now have 13 players under contract, JJ, Smoove, Marvin, Teague, Horford, Zaza, JaCrawford, JoCrawford, MEvans, JPowell, JCollins, EThomas and Bibby. So, if we sign Pape Sy and bring him over, it’s a very good sign that JaCrawford will be traded before the season is over.

There’s no way the Hawks are going to buy out Pape Sy contract just to dump him in the D-League, or let him waste away on the bench in street cloths.

GRANDAD-Miami managed clear significant cap space, to sign Bosh, by trading MBeasley for draft picks. We could certainly do the same with JaCrawford, plus we have the $3.3M trade exemption. The money we’d save from trading JaCrawford, and the $2.5M from MEvans’ expiring contract, would get us close to what we need to resign Horford.

Bibby just completed the 1st yr of his 3yr contract. After this season, he will have completed the 2nd yr of that contract, so his contract will be in the final yr of his contract after this season. That would make it a very tradable expiring contract after the upcoming season.

All of you delusional fantasy league fans need to get a grip on reality and realize the Hawks aren’t going to trade JJ, Smoove, Horford, or any combination of their core players, and take on CAnthony’s contract, just to appease your fantasies.

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
9:54 pm

KevinM – Sund did get Bibby in an in -season move.

And about Etan – we need to remember it was just 4 years ago I think that this guy beat out Brendan Haywood for a starting job in Washington. All I’m hoping for is two good 5 minute spurts in some games we need him. I think he can provide that. Guy plays with energy, passion, and emotion. He is what he is – a hard nosed bench player. I think he can fill a role.

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
9:56 pm

And again, unless Jason Collins has vastly improved (he might have), Etan is his better in almost every way. And I like Jason – not a bad 4th string Center.

Dub C

September 2nd, 2010
10:02 pm

SteveW, – I agree totally. I can’t wait to see if all these rumors about Collins being in much better shape is true.

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
10:03 pm

Najeh

In addition to your 9:29 pm;
a John Shuerholz quote about the Braves
with regard to Manny Ramirez:
“We don’t do ifs”.

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
10:06 pm

Sorry, I should have qualified my last post.

Talkin about Iverson:
“Those are two big “if”s though.”

Fundamentals

September 2nd, 2010
10:16 pm

We’ve gotta make something good out of the Crawford situation. Either sign him and trade Bibby & Mo or use him for what we need – rebounding SF who can shoot the 3 and a C who can allow Horford to play PF for stints. Just please no Iverson! We need hungry, young talent, not washed up has beens with no desire.

Fundamentals

September 2nd, 2010
10:18 pm

“use” meant trade for.

Jae Evolution

September 2nd, 2010
10:40 pm

Fundamentals the guy is only 34-35 years old, I’m all for keeping Crawford he is an important part of our offense, but IF we lose him why not pick up someone who can instantly fill his shoes, A.I. has always been known as a scorer if he can accept the sixth man role and contribute he is the perfect pick up

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
10:50 pm

We shall see about Sy and D-League. I think if Jamal and Mo’ are with us at the beginning of the season, Sy is in D League. I think the plan all along has been:

‘011-’012 – Jordan Crawford takes Jamal’s place
- Sy takes Mo Evans place.

We use part of the 11m+ savings to give Al Horford a big contract. And we have 2 young 23 year olds to develop to energize the fan base. Teague will also be 23 in ‘011-’012 also.

Difference between Teague and Rondo:

Rondo has better leadership skills; is more assertive on and off the court. Great defense.

Teague has better basketball skills offensively, but is less assertive. Very passive. Yet to see how his defense goes.

Teague has better natural offensive skills than Rondo – look at Teague’s college stats and his limited time here. But Rondo is a high type A personality, who is aggressive on the defensive end, and is a very good floor general, with assists as well.

Somebody said the most they ever see Teague contributing is 15ppg, 7 apg. That’s probably true. And that’s ATL’s best PG since at least Mookie Blaylock, maybe even Doc and Spud. He may be the best since Eddie Johnson with those numbers (and yes I know Eddie played mostly SG, but he was really a hybrid). Am I missing somebody?

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
10:54 pm

I see Teague developing into a 9 ppg and 4 ast. per game type player this year, and with his quickness, learning defense very well.

Maybe 11 and 5 next year.

And 14 and 6 his 4th year. I still go back to Steve Lavin on Espn before the Hawks drafted Teague. He said in 5 years, Teague might be the best PG in the ‘09 class – which was an awesome class for PG’s. He has talent oozing out of him. Just give him time…

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
10:57 pm

And Hollinger (I believe) on ESPN said statistically that Teague would be a Rondo – had intangibles that didn’t show up on draft boards. And like Rondo, would be a work in progress. Northcyde or somebody had a great post on Rondo’s progression a couple of weeks ago.

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
10:59 pm

KenS – I certainly agree. I would hope the Hawks would not trade Al or Smoove for Carmelo. Jamal and Marvin on the other hand, I would do, esp. if Jamal doesn’t want to be here.

Grandad

September 2nd, 2010
11:05 pm

ILL-Logical

With all due respect;
I must disagree on a couple of points as they pertain to Al.
1st, I don’t think he’s an undersized center.
As for Bill Russell (I saw him play also), Ben Wallace & Zo,
Al is none of those. As a matter of fact, he’s not a center.
He does not have the requisite skill set to be #6, Ben or Zo.
He has done a magnificent job holding down the fort.
But he will never be a defensive stopper @ the rim.
My point:
He’s much better than Buck Williams. [reasons forthcoming]
But he’s a natural [4].

Secondly, Al is much better offensively than everyone
seems to think. He has been restricted by the star system.
Al shot 55% from the field. He has developed a dead-on
mid-range jumper. With a real offensive system he has a
chance to score 16 -18 every night, easily growing into
a 20-10 guy. Maybe not HOF, but certainly a perennial
all-star.

G-dad editorial note:
Al will become the face of the franchise.
*(if not already)
-Not Joe-

northcyde

September 2nd, 2010
11:17 pm

It wasn’t me SteveW . . . because I don’t think there is any way that Teague can become Rajon Rondo. Rondo was a defense first player, whose offensive game benefitted greatly from playing with 3 Hall of Famers. Rondo is a pure PG. Teague isn’t. So Teague is going to have to find his niche as a Earl Boykins type scorer.

We’ll see if he can run an NBA team come the preseason ( if he beats out Bibby as the starter ).

doc

September 2nd, 2010
11:30 pm

steve w … KevinM – Sund did get Bibby in an in -season move.

sorry it wasnt my boy rick that got us bibby but one gm billy knight, much maligned but the creator of the CORE.

ILL-Logical

September 2nd, 2010
11:36 pm

dad editorial note:
Al will become the face of the franchise.
*(if not already)
-Not Joe-

And that is precisely the point of my screed:why is he being touted as the face of the franchise when:
a) he is not the best player on the team and that may not change even if there are major trades;
b) he is not the leading box office draw on the team-when was the last time you heard someone say Man I got to go and see Al play tonight?; and
c) dude has not shown the ability to match up *outside* the paint with the KGs,Dirks and CB4s of the world on defense or having the ability to take them off of the dribble.
;
He is a good player with -potentially-a very good upside. Face of the franchise: hmmmmm. But with an organization that wants tunas with good taste rather than tunas that taste good …..IMJS .

doc

September 2nd, 2010
11:40 pm

yes ill, i hope his star is still rising.

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
11:41 pm

Northcyde – Co-sign, made the same points on other posts. Not trying to say Teague will become Rondo – 2 different skill sets. But Teague may be very good.

Doc – thanks for the correction – as I was writing the post, trying to remember….

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
11:47 pm

Man, been studying the Heat’s roster. They may have the worst 4-15 spots in the history of the NBA – terrible. After the big 3, your best players are:
4) Udonis Haslem – nice player, wish he was backing up Smoove
5) Mike Miller – washed up, distracted basically – good outside shot, and good passer
6) Juwan Howard – 37 – decent back up big
7) “Z” – 35 – Gone
House – Gone
9) Magliore – I actually like what he brings – wish he was in Jason Collins spot

Your starting PG’s – Chalmers/Arroyo – baaaad. I almost think those rumors of moving DWade to PG might be true.

C- Joel Anthony – terrible – would be competing with Etan for our 3rd C spot on the Hawks.

The Heat better hope the big 3 stay healthy…..

SteveW

September 2nd, 2010
11:49 pm

Chalmers, House and Arroyo are so bad at PG for the Heat, I actually think Teague and Bibby may eat them up when we play.

Publix

September 2nd, 2010
11:55 pm

Ok, so now we have a “birdman” in ET. He is equal to what Denver has in Andersson. Now if Crawford wants to leave, please trade him and get another pure scorer who can play some D.

It would be great if we could send Marvin and JC to the 76ers for Igoudala and nex year’s second round draft pick. Then all we’d need is to sign another free agent, maybe Stackhouse.

PG- JT; Bibby
SG- Johnson; Stackhouse; JC2
SF- Igoudala; Evans
PF- Smith; Powell; Thomas
C – Horford; Zaza; Collins

Very athletic lineup. Lots of points and we’d have to see what the D would look like. So what do you guys think???

Dan's Dickau

September 2nd, 2010
11:56 pm

Ok, so either

a. that’s the only photo of Etan Thomas in existence,

b. the ajc somehow doesn’t have access to other photos of Etan Thomas,

c. the ajc is actually too lazy, and decided to re-use the Etan Thomas photo they’ve already had up for a week.

I really feel like you all could do better.

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
12:25 am

I would guess it would take Jamal, Marvin, and a 1st pick at least to get Iggy. And that would put us way into luxury tax after this year – probably worse with the new CBA.

I proposed the same trade earlier today basically….

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
12:28 am

I wouldn’t mind getting Lou Williams from the Sixers if there were a way however…

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
12:38 am

Igoudala is untouchable just as Al is for us.

Publix

September 3rd, 2010
12:44 am

I don’t think that they would go for Williams because he is more of a PG, and we have two of them.

If we can’t get Iggy, how about Marvin, Crawford, and next year’s draft pick for Prince and Gordon.

Joshua

September 3rd, 2010
12:44 am

Pape Sy reached his buy out the 6-7 forward should now sign with Atlanta, Heard’s Boris Diaw with sick hops bet he doesnt play much this year.

The Truth

September 3rd, 2010
12:50 am

Below is the latest report (A French Translation) that covered the Pape Sy situation. Though it is dated Aug 6 2010, it does provide insight into the issues that relates to acquiring him. From this report it apparent that the goal for Le Havre would be to acquire an American Player to replace Pape Sy. Clearly the Hawks does not want to pay the quoted $500,000 buyout since it is based on the player’s performance output. The Hawks seem only interested in paying his replacement cost as they transition to another player. Could this be the bone of contention?

Update on the possible departure of Pape Sy to Atlanta, his agent Pascal Levy
On August 6, 2010 at 17:01 by Julien Dalcanale

While Atlanta has officially declared his intention to sign Pape Sy (drafted in the 53rd position) this summer, we wanted to know more and have to be met Pascal Levy’s agent. Exclusive interview.
Hello Pascal Levy. Jean Manuel Sousa, the coach of Le Havre has confirmed a few days ago that Pape Sy evolve Havre next year, what is it really, when the leaders of Atlanta has finally announce that they Pope had come to this summer?

In fact the situation right now and that Atlanta has expressed a desire to engage Pope next season. They changed their minds, because at the end of the summer league they were 95% on the idea to let him do his year at Le Havre and recover after one year, after a big season. But now, after internal discussions it seems that they decided it was more interesting for them to bring this year, they felt it was more useful for them to have it in their roster this year and already started to format it from their game against the NBA. Today they have expressed a firm desire to make them sign it is in talks with Le Havre for a few days

And what about the release clause ($ 500,000) and the deadline, which obviously is exceeded?
From a legal standpoint, a release clause is an element that clearly indicate the potential output of the player. In fact the date has passed, we had sent to Atlanta dates, terms, conditions, etc. so they knew everything. But beyond this outside of any clause, are of course opportunities for negotiation and termination.

To be clear, Le Havre has no contractual obligation to release Pape from his contract, it is true, it is out clauses. We should really find a financial agreement, Atlanta is not at all committed to paying $ 500,000, a sum that is not appropriate for a second round pick So Atlanta said they want him to come, but they do not want any more than it costs them $ 500,000, reflecting budget reductions put in a lot of franchises. Today the entire NBA is against the costs, staff costs, costs of scouting, etc. and therefore policy today in the NBA is trying not to spend too much money. They want to bring the Pape to give him a chance, because it is a chance for him to pay a fair price, so here it is at this stage for discussion. Anyway I hope I have is quite normal that Le Havre defend its interests and their finances because they need money, but it will at some point they will understand that it is better have a good transfer

Especially as the club will not affect any Normand dollars in June …
Yes yes absolutely, Le Havre will not touch anything in June 2011 when Pape was a year older. Anyway now the goal for Le Havre was able to fetch a player who can replace the Pape leads, and therefore a priority an American because I do not see French people today who can do that in these rates there, and then be able to recruit an extra player with the remaining money transfer. Le Havre was in any way a group at 7 under a pro, so there it would allow them to take a more pro, with the amount of transfer that may remain after deduction of payroll taxes, plus of course the envelope provided the basis for Pope. Anyway me what I said at Havre is in any way for the player it would be totally counter-productive as they prevent them from joining the NBA, they are in a position where they try to obtain as possible, and this is normal, but beyond that they must accept that with this operation they are able to enhance their team improve their finances and maintains a hook can be more easily and allow Pape to live his dream and his career. So we are in that discussion that is calm, sedate, productive. I think it will succeed anyway.
How Atlanta would be willing to pay as you sign for Pope this year?
I know how Atlanta is ready to, but because it is in talks I did not want to get into a bidding interposed by journalists, so I prefer not to talk too much about numbers, but what is on is that the $ 500,000 it is not possible at all. Atlanta has made an offer that was far enough. What is certain is that Atlanta wants, negotiations are under way, I’m also protect the interests of the club Le Havre anyway, so they are not damaging.
Interviewed exclusively by Julian Dalcanale

Hawks fans: Welcome Etan, wonder about Al | Atlanta Hawks: Fan Nest

September 3rd, 2010
1:08 am

[...] “cheap” are not the words one would ideally want to use in describing the Hawks most recent free agent acquisition, but if “tough” still fits, we’ll be happy that Etan Thomas is now aboard. The [...]

Geemack

September 3rd, 2010
1:12 am

SteveW

If Big-Z starts he will avg 12ppg & 7 reb I wouldn’t call that done. Look at his stats before Shaq came in Clev.

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
1:18 am

ILL-Logical

I do not have a problem with the
“face of the franchise”
blending in as a smaller part
of something bigger than himself.
The “Team” being the central focus.
A player who plays manifests all the
qualities we clamor for in our players.
A workman who shows up every night,
rolls up his sleeves & quietly goes
about his job.
Kinda like; Henry Aaron, Roberto Clemente,
Dale Murphy, Cal Ripken Jr., Jerry Rice,
Hondo, Elgin Baylor, Tim Duncan, et al.

Clyde

September 3rd, 2010
1:33 am

Pape Sy > Marvin

drmaryb (*_*)

September 3rd, 2010
1:36 am

Chill-Lax!

rusty

Calm down man, JC1 is not Joe Johnson! Joe plays lock down defense, assists, rebounds, carries this team! Joe does it all – all the time!

He needs help! Just like LeBron needed help! LeBron did NOTHING by himself!
What has he won? Not a damned thing! And ran like a girl to So. Beach!

Get off Joe’s back! You know NOTHING about basketball!
Joe IS the Hawks! 13 wins upon his arrival!
Go back to sleep – man!

________________________________________________

She got a Donk!

SteveW asked: “Drmaryb – How about Jamal, Marvin, and a 1st pick next year for Kirelenko and Feresenko (Utah should sign him any day now – RFA). There’s your beef! All 7-1 300+ lbs. of him.”

Take the 1st pick out of there and I might pull the trigga’ on a Gat!
That works for me! I like Beef-Cakes!

This trade would make the Hawks a really, really big team!
I like Big – Things! Wink-Wink!

drmaryb (*_*)

September 3rd, 2010
1:45 am

SteveW

Maybe add a 2nd round pick to the Kirelenko deal, or Maurice, but not a 1st round pick. That’s too much. IDK if Utah would give up the size of a
7′1″ C + Kirelenko size-wize for a couple of shrimps though?

Marvin plays much smaller than his size and Jamal is a specialist (sniper).
A one tool player. IDK if they would go for it!

KevinM

September 3rd, 2010
2:03 am

SteveW – Sund himself tells you he doesn’t make in-season moves. Easy to confuse he and BK I guess, after all, he is in charge of BK’s core team.

Sy nor Thomas make much of an impact on this team…..Sy and JC2 aren’t making an impact this year without those in front of them being taken out of the picture completely.

So, last year’s core is this year’s core, is next year’s core, blah blah blah. Here’s hoping the new offense makes them at least competitive next playoff season.

Our crack scouting staff is doing a great job coming up with those hidden gems in the draft and FA.

KevinM

September 3rd, 2010
2:06 am

Clyde – really? You have seen something from Sy that tells you to sit Marvin and replace him with the 2nd coming of Boris Diaw? Come on, i am not thrilled to have the 21st best SF either, but Sy isn’t getting that slot and 7M Marvin sitting and stewing….he is a ‘core’ piece.

Brian

September 3rd, 2010
2:12 am

Anoither bum to add the half assed roster the Hawks have. This team collected draft picks for nearly 10 years and Joe Johnson, Josh Smith and Al are all the Hawks have to show for it. A 2nd rate SG and two role players and a bench load of terrible big men that wouldn’t be playing if it wasn’t for the Hawks. Does anyone believe anyone else would sign Jason Collins and Ethan Thomas at this point?

I mean, really? This team isn’t even that talented to be honest with you. They have No PG and no center and honestly…. They don’t even have a true 2nd option.

Clyde

September 3rd, 2010
2:20 am

Lets go Dream

Clyde

September 3rd, 2010
2:22 am

Angel McCoughtry > Marvin

drmaryb (*_*)

September 3rd, 2010
2:24 am

MC

Can you sift around in the black hole and post my last blog,
Re: Toby Keith and Wayman Tisdale?

It’s titled: Bring Down the House!
In advance, Thank You for your time and consideration.

G-Nite everyone!

Dan's Dickau

September 3rd, 2010
2:35 am

Guess that answers my question.

darrell starks

September 3rd, 2010
2:44 am

Who, ASG SELL THE TEAM ETAN WHAT A JOKE, as a die hard hawks fan this has been a disappointing off season for me, and far as ticket sell i will not renew my tickets this of season, watch how the hawks fall back in the pack this season may be 6th seed at best.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!

Saint Richt

September 3rd, 2010
2:50 am

Making moves ASG!!!! Way to impress those who you want to spend money on your crap.

PLEASE SELL THIS TEAM…………………..why do you guys HATE Atlanta so much as to hold our Hawks hostage? DBs………..

truthspitter

September 3rd, 2010
3:22 am

Pathetic, there is no growth going on with this team, by the time T.I. gets out of prison this time the Atlanta Hawks will be the St.Louis Hawks

oranjucejonz

September 3rd, 2010
4:33 am

THIS IS WHAT WE SIGN,THE HAWKS ARE THE JOKE OF THE LEAGUE…SIT BACK AND WAIT UNTIL YOU CAN SEE THE BOTTOM OF THE BARREL AND THEN GO FISHING.IM STARTING TO THINK THESE GUYS ARE PURPOSELY TRYING TO RUIN THIS FRANCHISE AND ITS FANBASE….DO THEY REALLY WANT A TEAM IN ATL????ETAN THOMAS ADDS NOTHING WHERE IT COUNTS.WE MAY BEAT THE RAPTORS OF THE WORLD BUT WHAT ABOUT THE REAL TEAMS…….SICK OF THIS $&#@

oranjucejonz

September 3rd, 2010
4:38 am

MC,WHY DO WE NEVER HEAR FROM THESE GUYS(ASG) LIKE WE HEAR FROM OTHER OWNERS AROUND THE LEAGUE.IM NOT EVEN SURE THEY EXIST,ITS LIKE A CAR WITH NO DRIVER,I SEE IT MOVING BUT NOBODYS BEHIND THE WHEEL…..IS IT POSSIBLE THAT SOMEBODY CAN INTERVIEW THEM AND LET THEM KNOW HOW DISGUSTED THE FANS ARE WITH THEM

JustAThought

September 3rd, 2010
6:49 am

ILL……..Well said about Al, and I agree with you.

truthspitter…….We can only “hope” that by the time T.I. gets out of prison this joke of a franchise is long gone.

I ask this question again……..Why would any of you hawk fans want to play for this team/organization?

JustAThought

September 3rd, 2010
6:52 am

juice! You don’t hear from them because they don’t have anything to say, unless you want to hear more BS.

O'Brien

September 3rd, 2010
7:22 am

Ken S,

Miami was able to trade Beasley for draft picks because the team that traded for him (Minny) was under the cap, plus his salary was only $5 mil or so.

I dont think there will be a team far enough under the salary cap to absorb Jamal’s contract. And why would they want to? Minny took Beasley because he is still young with potential. Jamal is 31 and has maybe 2 good years left, while Bibby is already on the down side.

If the Hawks trade Jamal and Bibby, we will be forced to take back contracts of similar value. I dont think anybody will give up draft picks for them either.

Steve W,

Joel Anthony is a lot better than Cheeseburger Collins.

drmaryb (*_*)

September 3rd, 2010
7:46 am

T-Spitter

T.I. Is out, but Lil’ Wayne is in.

no justice

September 3rd, 2010
7:57 am

10 people on a blog do not represent the Atlanta Hawk fanbase!

Eric

September 3rd, 2010
8:23 am

I can’t think of any player off hand that’s more physical than Etan Thomas. He’s like a new school Charles Oakley, definitely a good move by Atlanta. This team will win more games and be more organized under L.D. than “Woody” book it.

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
9:04 am

Guys – doubt seriously Z averages 12 and 7 starting for the Heat. His game was crashing and burning the last couple of years. 35, not aging well.

Never said Joel Anthony was not better than Jason Collins. Joel Anthony is penciled in as the Heat’s starting Center. Collins is our 4th string Center.

Grandad – I know that Iggy is basically untouchable, but there has been talk in Philly of trading him if the price was right because they have Evan Turner now, and he has basically the same skill set, younger, and cheaper. If they wanted to move Iggy, hey, be glad to help.

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
9:07 am

KevinM – Point taken. We did bring up Mario West from the DLeague last year – just jokin’…

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
9:29 am

For Z to average 12ppg, he would have to average almost 35 mpg, and I don’t think he’s ever averaged 35 mpg, esp. not at 35. I think he’ll give the Heat a solid 15-20 mpg off the bench, and be beat to death by younger, faster Centers throughout the league. Shot less than 45% from the field last year. .8 blocks in 21mpg. His game is on the major decline.

I stick by my comments about the Heat after the Big 3 – they are horrible in total. And I didn’t even go into LeBron’s back-up, James Jones – absolutely horrific as an NBA player.

Spoelestra may have to go with some weird line-up to make this work better. Something like this:

PG – DWade
SG – LeBron
SF – Juwan Howard
PF – Bosh
C – Z

But that’s a big, slow lineup. At least you could have Anthony, Haslem (who I like) and Magliore (who I also like) as back-up bigs with that lineup. Jones and Miller as back-up wings. And bring Chalmers, House and Arroyo off the bench as back-up PG’s, instead of having Arroyo as your starter.

Maybe they can win it all with the conventional starting lineup of Arroyo at PG and Anthony at C, but it looks pretty bad to me.

Astro Joe

September 3rd, 2010
9:49 am

TI don;t know who will start for the Heat, but in most games, the 5 who will get the bulk of the minutes (and finish close games) will likely be Wade, Mike Miller, LeBron, Haslem and Bosh. Chalmers, House, Anthony and Ilgauskas will likely be the key supplemental role players.

Astro Joe

September 3rd, 2010
9:49 am

I don’t know…

Dos Hawkquis

September 3rd, 2010
9:56 am

Miami has 18, yes 18 players under contract for the 2010-2011 season. Can someone please help me understand why Pat Riley would sign off on that many players under contract? The league minimum is 13 and teams, on average carry 15, but why 18. JUST CURIOUS.

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends.”

melkycabrera

September 3rd, 2010
9:59 am

75 points and 64 rebounds last year. Yeah, I feel better already.

JoJo the Godfather

September 3rd, 2010
10:57 am

Dos…Max is 15…Heat will have to cut some of those players…Some of them are on non-guaranteed or partially guaranteed contracts…You could see Shavlik Randolph, Kenny Hasbrouk, Patrick Beverly, or even Da’Sean Butler get cut…Hopefully Dexter Pittman too.

I.MUS WRITE

September 3rd, 2010
10:59 am

Im still no thrilled about our off season but at this point Etan is the best we could do. This is what happens when u try to improve the roster in SEPTEMBER…… I think Etan will surplant Zaza as our 1st big off the bench behind Al.

Etan Thomas>>>>> RMorris,Joe Smith

dap01

September 3rd, 2010
11:03 am

I am intrigued by Sy also, but if we look at it objectively, Sy was not even good on his 2nd rate French team.

Larry Drew will be a vast improvement over Woody but he really has his work cut out with this ownership and management group.

rusty

September 3rd, 2010
11:06 am

drmaryb
i guess you were dozing or something during the playoffs & the reg season,you didnt see jj go down the tank with horrible performances. you dont see j j dribbling the cloak out,you dont see jj ball hogging,uou didnt see him trying to take over games in the 4th quarter & us going down the tubes,you dont see the tremendous volume of shots but you see the lockdown defense that i & a lot of the fans dont see

rusty

September 3rd, 2010
11:08 am

and to even mention him in the same sentence with lebron is insane

drmaryb (*_*)

September 3rd, 2010
11:14 am

rusty

Joe is a Man not a Machine!
Have you ever had a bad day/week?
LeBron tanked to, so, did Dwight Big-Time against Charlotte.

Do you think they are Garbage too?
If not for Joe’s season play? The Hawks wouldn’t have even been in the
Play-Offs, much less round 2.

Move on!

JoJo the Godfather

September 3rd, 2010
11:23 am

I’m a little confused by the current roster (plus the possible addition of Sy)…That gives the Hawks 14 under contract and it pushes us up to under a $1M from the luxury tax…So 2 players will be in suits every game, and we’ve lost a lot of flexibility for mid-season trades having only 1 extra roster spot and not being able to take on much extra salary (say by using the TPE from the Chills trade)…There must be a trade already in the works, a 2 for 1 maybe, and there’s not much room in the frontcourt (Josh & Al too valuable; Powell, Collins & Thomas can not be traded; Za Za can; or would we add another big in addition to these 6?).

rusty

September 3rd, 2010
11:26 am

yea joe had a little bit of a bad patch of play in the playoffs,his pinky must have hurt,more likely his ego
we know he is only human. i want to see how he plays this year with his big contract.he will have to handle the ball more & take more shots. his great assists come from holding the ball & giving it up with 2 secs left & someone hitting a jump shot. i never see him driving quick to the basket & making a great pass off the dribble.

StoneyG

September 3rd, 2010
11:27 am

The Hawks will continue to be a mediocre team as long as ASG is the owner. They are not interested in winning a championship. All they want to do is put a competitive team on the court.

rusty

September 3rd, 2010
11:27 am

yea i seen jc doing this many times

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
11:39 am

14 guys on roster – 1 probably in DLeague barring injury or trade (Sy) – I would guess They will rotate Jordan Crawford, Jason Collins, and Etan T. as the odd man out on a nightly basis, again, barring injury.

I definitely think Etan has the fire and intensity, if he’s healthy, to push ZaZa, I just doubt he has that much left in the tank to do it night in and night out.

Etan can play the 4 also if Powell can’t for whatever reason. Good pick up for the vet. min.

If Horford goes down – do I trust ZaZa, Etan, Powell and Jason Collins at the 5? Yep, about as much as I trust any other 2nd – 4th back up big men in the league.

If Smoove goes out, do I trust Powell, Etan, Marvin, and Al to pick up the slack – yep, but I do wish we had a Brandon Bass type – he’s just a step up from Powell in my opinion. But I am looking forward to seeing what Powell can do in a Hawks uniform.

I think the Hawks go 1-13 just about as good as any team in the league by the way.

KevinM

September 3rd, 2010
11:40 am

StoneyG has an understanding of this organization. If they did want to win, they still don’t know how….they keep everyone on the team comfortable and not threaten any starting position….and I bet right now Bibby doesn’t come off the bench…he will have to get hurt or absolutely be horrid.

And for anyone suggesting JC2 and Sy and Bibby and Marvin can be used as trade bait…please, please. don’t waste the effort typing it…..they have zero value…..we are stuck in mediocrity until some of the core has been pushed out. That’s why you have to consider Al for a trade…..no one is untradeable after that spectacle last year….problem is, no one on the Hawks coaching staff has presented it to the core like that.

The BK regime continues….

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
11:44 am

Astro – No doubt Miami’s best 5 is DWade, Miller, LeBron, Bosh and Haslem. Not much behind that however. But that is a STOUT 5 right there, don’t let anybody kid you.

But that 5 will be eaten alive inside by – Shaq, Jermaine, KG, Big Baby, and Kendrick

And also by Bynum, Gasol, Odom, and Artest. And don’t think Artest and Barnes won’t do a number on LeBron….

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
11:45 am

Miami – Great regular season if everybody stays healthy. Can’t see them winning a title over LA or Boston however. Don’t match up well with them.

Fundamentals

September 3rd, 2010
11:56 am

What is the cost of waiving a player or trading for picks? Are we responsible for the remainder of their contract under the salary cap? We gave away Chills for TPE and picks? Why can’t we find a home for others?

Fundamentals

September 3rd, 2010
11:57 am

Heat may find out how important having quality role players can be. Kinda like we do in the 2nd round every year cause we all want to be the man, not the team players!

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
12:15 pm

C’est désormais officiel : Pape Sy (22 ans) deviendra la saison prochaine le seizième joueur français de l’histoire à évoluer en NBA. Drafté en 53eme position par les Hawks en juin dernier, un accord a été trouvé entre Le Havre, son club formateur, et Atlanta pour le libérer comme l’a annoncé le site officiel du STB. Le meneur vient compléter un bel effectif à l’arrière puisqu’il retrouvera Mike Bibby, Joe Johnson ou encore Jamaal Crawford.

“It’s now official: Pope Sy (22 years) will become the next season the sixteenth French player in history to evolve in the NBA. Drafted in 53rd position with the Hawks last June, an agreement was reached between Le Havre, his former club, and Atlanta to release as announced on official site of the STB. The leader completes a nice size to find the back since Mike Bibby, Joe Johnson or Jamaal Crawford.”

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
12:16 pm

L’arrière Pape Sy du Havre, qui s’est engagé en faveur de l’équipe américaine des Atlanta Hawks, sera remplacé par l’ailier Maxime Zianveni de Chalon-sur-Saône (Saône-et-Loire). Pape Sy, 22 ans, a trouvé un accord avec le club du Havre, qu’il quitte alors qu’il lui restait un an de contrat, pour honorer la proposition de la franchise américaine. Les discussions concernant l’éventuel départ de l’arrière havrais, qui avait été drafté par Atlanta en 53e position, ont finalement abouti. Pour pallier son départ, le club havrais a engagé pour une saison Maxime Zianveni, 31 ans (1,98 m). Ce joueur a été formé à Nancy où il est resté 10 ans. La saison dernière Zianveni jouait à Chalon-sur-Saône où il a tourné à 15 points et 8 rebonds en 29 minutes de jeu.

“The rear Pope Sy Le Havre, which was committed to the U.S. team for the Atlanta Hawks, will be replaced by winger Maxim Zianveni Chalon-sur-Saône (Saône-et-Loire). Pape Sy, 22, has reached an agreement with the club from Le Havre, which he left when he was left one-year contract, to honor the American proposal for the franchise. Discussions on the possible departure of the back Le Havre, which was drafted by Atlanta in the 53rd position, led ultimately. To compensate for his departure, the club has committed to Le Havre season Zianveni Maxime, 31 (1.98 m). This player was brought in Nancy where he stayed 10 years. Last season Zianveni played in Chalon-sur-Saone, where he shot 15 points and 8 rebounds in 29 minutes of play”

Ken Strickland

September 3rd, 2010
12:21 pm

Too many of our fans are still stuck in the same mindset that plagued former HC MWoodson, which focused on trying to construct and deploy our roster to match up with other teams strengths. We are now constructed to become the Phoenix Suns of the Eastern Conference. Instead of us trying to construct our roster to match the size and height of other teams, we’ve constructed our current to force other teams to match our speed, quickness and athleticism.

We will be a fast breaking, high motion OFF, and if a team can’t match our abundance of wing and back court speed, quickness, versatility and athleticism, especially in our motion OFF, their superior size and height will become a liability rather than an asset.

You develop your philosophy, approach, OFF/DEF systems, and get the players necessary to make it all work, and then let the other teams worry about stopping you, rather than the other way around. All of that seems to be in the making with the approach Sund and the ASG have taken so far. The biggest problem we seem to have as fans is the lack of vision, understanding of the VARIOUS WAYS OF APPROACHING SITUATIONS, and the mental lock that forces some to see only one approach to resolving everything.

Some of you are so focused on finding any and every potential flaw in the Hawks, whether real of imagined, that you forget that this SO CALLED:
1-FLAWED AND/OR IMBALANCED ROSTER,
2-NATUAL PF PLAYING OUT OF POSITION,
3-SF THAT UNDERACHIEVED,
4-IMMATURE PF,
5-IMMATURE PF,
6-TOO QUIET SG,
7-AND FLAWED HC,

ALONG WITH THE NBA’S LEAST PRODUCTIVE PG, still managed to out perform every other Eastern Conference team except Cleveland and Orlando. THIS YRS HAWK TEAM WILL BE A SERIOUS CONTENDER FOR THE EASTERN CONFERENCE TITLE.

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
12:22 pm

Dans l’air depuis quelques jours, le départ de Pape Sy du Havre est désormais officiel. Le président du STB a confirmé qu’un accord avait été trouvé entre le club, le joueur, et les dirigeants des Atlanta Hawks pour libérer Sy de sa dernière année de contrat. Pape Sy était au Havre depuis les cadets.

“In the air for several days, the departure of Pope Sy Le Havre is now official. The Chairman of the STB confirmed that agreement had been reached between the club, players and officials of the Atlanta Hawks for Sy release its final contract year. Pape Sy was at Le Havre for the cadets.”

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
12:24 pm

Trade Mike Bibby and Mo Evans. Give them away if you have to. Just get it done Ricky Rick. They’re holding back the talented youth on this squad.

cp

September 3rd, 2010
12:25 pm

I would take Joel Anthony over Ham Hock Collins, Thomas, and Powell….Thomas is about done. This cat hasn’t been healthy in almost 5 years. There was a reason the Thunder stopped playing him and went with the youngsters, because Thomas was terrible. They said they were going to improve this roster, I guess that didnt mean this year.

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
12:42 pm

LOL the French PPL on Blogs know enough about us to prognosticate

Les Hawks ne vont plus progresser (à l’inverse de ces 5 dernières années). JJ les plombe pendant 5 ans, s’ils ne resignent pas Crawford meilleur 6ème homme, clutch et qui leur a fait gagner une quinzaine de matchs cette saison, ils vont se faire bouffer même par Milwaukee qui sans d’immenses moyens à fait une intersaison bien meilleure (pas dur en même temps) . Ils vont se retrouver 6ème à l’est (et encore faut voir ce que va faire Washington) et se bouffer les Bulls ou les Magics voire les C’s au premier tour de PO. Bref perso je n’en attends rien (encore moins de Sy mais bravo à lui d’être drafté c’est déjà çà super s’il joue déjà 15 matchs c’est cool). Pourtant le Trio JJ, Josh et Horford avait de quoi tout exploser mais ils sont alone (Williams est inconstant, Bibby a 102 ans et ils n’ont pas de taille sous les panneaux)

“The Hawks do not go forward (unlike the last 5 years). JJ the leaden for 5 years if they do not resign Crawford best 6th man, clutch and made them win a dozen games this season, they’ll even fluff Milwaukee without tremendous resources to make a offseason much better (not hard at the same time). It puts them sixth in the East (and to see what Washington will do) and eat the Bulls or Magic or even C’s in the first round of PO. In short I personally do not expect anything (let alone Sy but kudos to him to be drafted is already here if Super 15 games already played it cool). Yet the trio JJ, Josh and Horford had something exploded but they are all alone (Williams is inconsistent, Bibby 102 years and they have no size in the panels)”

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
12:45 pm

Atlanta est une des top teams les moins respectées de la ligue…
Reveillez vous les gars ! Tout le monde ne peut pas avoir l’effectif de Miami ou de Boston..D’une part, l’impact de joueurs de banc besogneux et appliqués n’est pas à negliger surtout s’ils arrivent à transmettre une bonne mentalité à l’ensemble de l’équipe ! D’autre part, ne sous estimez pas les bienfaits de la continuité. En cinq ans, Atlanta a su constamment progresser pour passer d’une équipe a 13 victoires à une equipe à 53 victoires. Ils ont un noyau encore jeune ( Willimas, Horford, Smith, teague..) et perfectibles.
Arretez de les sous evaluer en permanence !

“Atlanta is one of the top teams the least respected of the league …
Wake up you guys! Everyone can not have the personnel to Miami or Boston .. On the one hand, the impact of bench players and needy is not applied to neglect especially if they manage to convey a good mentality to whole team! On the other hand, do not underestimate the benefits of continuity. In five years, Atlanta has consistently progress to move from one team to 13 victories a team to 53 victories. They have a nucleus still young (Willim, Horford, Smith, teague ..) and perfectible.
Stop by to assess the time!”

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
1:02 pm

http://www.hoopinionblog.com/2010/09/stb-le-havre-confirm-pape-sy-buyout.html

truthspitter

September 3rd, 2010
1:22 pm

Meanwhile, in news of teams trying to make real moves instead of hyping some imaginary offense. The Trailblazers are still willing to trade Rudy Fernandez and the Knicks want him. The Blazers want a 1st rd pick but the Knicks can’t give them there 1st rd pick this year because you can’t go 2 years in a row without a 1st rd pick. So, why don’t we offer our 1st rd pick in a 3 way trade in which the Blazers get the 1st rd pick, Knicks get Fernandez and we get Wilson Chandler? Why I will answer why, because that “Dumb Sund of a GM” is still on vacation.

Link:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AqEQTt9GQjPFUYrFo4MHVGq8vLYF?slug=tsn-166829

truthspitter

September 3rd, 2010
1:26 pm

drmaryb (*_*) : T.I. is going right back he got caught with drugs Thursday violated probation

Rev in Tampa

September 3rd, 2010
1:28 pm

Pape Sy’s signing tells us something about Larry Drew. He wanted Pape. Listen to his excitement as he talks about Sy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUzS6e8EgUM

KevinM

September 3rd, 2010
1:30 pm

A fast breaking team in the playoffs? Now that right there is credibility down the tubes!

Fast break all you want at home, and against some teams, but when it comes down to executing, we live and die by the jump shot.
The mismatches inside……..they aren’t in our favor.

Right now we can’t guard a guard dog. Lester is going to have to get the core to buy in to his scheme….probably other teams haven’t seen the defense we’re going to throw at them. Hit ‘em with a backline of Al/Thomas/Zaza and Collins in a 4 man mulitiple position zone that kills them because of our ultimate talent advantage. If Orlando can play 4-1 offense, why can’t we install a 1-4 defense?

Love the optimism of a couple here……

dukester

September 3rd, 2010
1:33 pm

I have never in my life saw a fan base so hype about a player 8,000 miles away that is not even the best player of on his team. Ok guys you get hyped over International players like Yao Ming,The point guard kid from spain, Not players like Pape Sy. Why are the hawks paying 500,000 for the rights to a bench player I dont understand this. None of you have ever saw this kid play, whats the fascination with this guy please tell me????? We are talking about him like he is a savior!!

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
1:37 pm

He Played in the summer league. He was good. I’ve seen LeHarve footage. Again, he’s good. Better than ‘Rio and he certainly isn’t clumbsy like Marvin. Let’s also not forget that Mo Evans just flat out sucks and needs to be traded along with Mike Bibby. The kid will take someones spot eventually. Especially if Drew doesn’t play favorites.

Hmmm

September 3rd, 2010
1:39 pm

6′7 225 ’nuff said.

Ramon

September 3rd, 2010
2:06 pm

Dukester, I think Tony Parker was a bench player when San Antonio drafted him.

Rev in Tampa

September 3rd, 2010
2:06 pm

dukester, Drew obviously likes him. He sees something. He fits well with the TEAM: young, athletic, versatile & quick. Drew has been very clear that he wants to develop a TEAM – not throw some scrubs around 3 superstars.

I understand that fans want to pay their money to watch a superstar (the desire to bring in Carmelo), but there is no superstar that is coming to Atlanta who will give us an automatic bid to the Eastern Conference Championship. Had Carmelo been able to do it, he would have already done it with Denver. Even LeBron couldn’t do it in Cleveland.

Astro Joe

September 3rd, 2010
2:13 pm

Ham Hock Collins? Please, put that in the Hakws Blog HOF right now.

The Phoenix Suns of the East? When was the last time they made a finals appearance? Barkley & Thunder Dan?

KevinM

September 3rd, 2010
2:27 pm

Add to that Astro that Steve Nash is not working through that door.

We are still about finding an identity on this team…..and trying to get away from being a soft team.
The way we defend is a great example.

I know, Woody’s gone, all the demons are now exercised. I wonder why I heard that the players including our elite player say more than once that they wanted Woody back. When that didn’t work out, they went to get behind Lt. D. Now, is there still a country club atmosphere downtown?
Will any of the core be held accountable going forward? I’m willing to wait and watch, but no longer will I blindly support what I think is an average attempt to move this talent forward. And if nothing else, we are supposed to have talented forwards. Lord knows we’ve drafted enough of them.

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
2:30 pm

CP – That’s my point – If Joel Anthony was on the Hawks, he would at best be our 3rd string Center – or battling Josh Powell to be the 2nd string PF. As it is, he’s penciled in to be the Heat’s starter at Center, or at the very least battle the 35 year old Z for that job.

Truthspitter – I would love to have Rudy or Wilson but we’ll see…Probably worth a 1st pick for Wilson. Haven’t check the salary – is it doable under the CBA? We aren’t able to take anything off for shipping a 1st pick towards luxury tax.

Ken Strickland – I’m probably not quite the “homer” that you are, but I do think people discount this team. Remember everybody saying fire Frank Wren? Now that we’re in 1st place, he’s a genius. Sund has made some very good moves in my opinion.

JustAThought

September 3rd, 2010
2:32 pm

Hey Ken S.! Sorry if I only have history to by. Pheonix Suns of the east……..yeah right!

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
2:35 pm

Orlando’s 1 in 4 out offense is taught by none other than….Paul Hewitt of Ga. Tech. After Tech’s final four run, he was all the rage selling his DVD on how to run that offense.

Rule from old basketball coaches – you can never have too many shooters (and makers of course). That is exactly what Orlando is doing that kills ATL. – we double on Dwight, he kicks it to the open man for a 3. And we don’t have the horses down low not to double Dwight. So as Coach Van Gundy said – ATL, pick your poison.

And that’s 1 reason why we re-signed Collins, and signed Etan, so we could man up Dwight, and guard the perimeter.

JustAThought

September 3rd, 2010
2:36 pm

Oh Yeah…you forgot #8 – Ownership/GM who could not got out of it’s own way to save their own lives.

JustAThought

September 3rd, 2010
2:38 pm

And I guess what Boston did was just down right PATHETIC to you!

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
2:39 pm

Rev – It was obvious if you saw summer league, Sy had talent dripping all over him, even though he only played in 1 or 2 games (can’t remember). I still say he is Mo’ Evans replacement next year if he adapts to the NBA game. And barring an injury, I think ATL is crazy not to send him to DLeague to allow him to adjust to the American game, and not just in practice. He needs game time prep.

Alade Aminu had talent dripping all over him also, he just seems so passive.

dukester

September 3rd, 2010
2:43 pm

@Rev @Ramon I respect your opinions on Pape Sy well why did he make it to the 2nd round. I mean i really believe we could have just have invited him over to play. Nobody else wants this kid. If he is so better that MARVIN!!!! Why sign Marvin to a 35 million dollar deal. We could have spent 500,000 to buy this kid out. Come on guys slow down with all of the hype. And Rev you talk about superstars not being able to win us a championship first i will say look at the last 10 teams that did win the title yes superstars were present. So will Pape Sy take us to glory??? And better yet who is Larry Drew??? He is the lamest duck coach in the NBA. Hey look I have no issue with Larry or Pape i cant have a issue. I have never saw either one of them produce at what this blog is so happy to have them for ie coaching and playing. I mean we complain about JJ but say what you want he has produced against the best for years. If you look at the international games Pape has not been playing against the best. Look at how the US has dominated. All I am saying is pipe down with this guy please. ASG has sold us a pipe dream.

truthspitter

September 3rd, 2010
2:44 pm

@ Steve:Truthspitter – I would love to have Rudy or Wilson but we’ll see…Probably worth a 1st pick for Wilson. Haven’t check the salary – is it doable under the CBA? We aren’t able to take anything off for shipping a 1st pick towards luxury tax.

Steve a good GM would have no problem making it work. We could send New York Mo Evans and our 1st. They could then send us Wilson Chandler and send the 1st to Portland for Rudy Fernandez. Mo Evans and Wilson Chandler work in a straight up swap. We could ask for a 2nd rd pick or future consideration from New York for adding Mo in, even though I think Mo is garbage and would be glad to do Mo and a 1st for Wilson, but Wilson is a free agent at end of the year, that’s why I would ask for a 2nd rd pick.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ykaquwz

JustAThought

September 3rd, 2010
2:46 pm

Steve W

Sund is a sham, been a sham and will always be a sham! That why the ASG hired him……a guy that had been out of the league for some years (see Seattle), and HE was the best guy for the job……..I believe you and Ken S. are either the same or both “HOMERS”.

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
2:47 pm

How ATL wins a championship:
1) Teague develops very well, and Bibby remains a good back-up
2) Marvin takes the “Great Leap Forward” in his progress as basketball player
3) Horford and Josh take 1 more step up
4) LD is a very good coach, as are his assistants
5) The injury bug doesn’t hit
6) JJ and Jamal remain at their peak
7) We keep a good attitude on the team
We learn how to play playoff basketball. We’re definitely getting experience the past 3 seasons.

That’s about it – it’s possible. Or else:

- Hire Tonya Harding to attack Dwight’s knee

- Get Pat Riley drunk, and have him sign a deal trading LeBron to the Hawks for Jamal, Marvin and 2 1st picks.

Hey, it works…

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
2:50 pm

JustAthought – I do try to be a realist – a couple of blogs ago, I was accused of being negative because we wouldn’t get Dampier or Shaq in the frontcourt. But once it’s over, it’s over,and you go with what you have…

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
2:51 pm

Sund did steal Jamal – and somehow made 3m dollars on draft day, while keeping a 1st pick. Been pretty good to me.

JustAThought

September 3rd, 2010
2:55 pm

He didn’t steal Jamal………Golden State drafted the young guy that play at Davidson (sorry I can’t remember his name), which meant someone had to go. Hell! you could of walk in off the street and made that deal.

cp

September 3rd, 2010
3:18 pm

Astro I think I will go with Ham Hock Collins from now on lol. I liked what I saw from Sy in his limited minutes. Had a nice handle, played aggressive yet smart defense ( mario was way too aggressive) and he took it to the rim….You cant discount a player just because he went in the second round. Arenas, Monta Ellis, Michael Redd, Boozer, Louis Williams, Milsap and etc were all second rounders. I’m not saying Sy will be as good as these guys but don’t discount second rounders. The Spurs have shown that you can find great talent in the second round.

terrell

September 3rd, 2010
3:47 pm

CP, the Hawks cant even find talent in the 1st rd, yet alone the 2nd. lol!

Daddy Long Long

September 3rd, 2010
4:16 pm

Buying Hawks season tix now that Etan is the “center” piece we’ve been needing. Let’s GO HAWKS! Welcome to Hawksville Etan!

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
4:25 pm

SteveW

1st of all Ken Strickland is no homer.
(at least not in my opinion)

Rather, he is an “optimist”.

“No pessimist ever discovered the secret of the stars,
or sailed to an uncharted land, or opened a new doorway
for the human spirit.” ‘Helen Keller’

KS, certainly told it like it was in years past.
-Now-
That that he, Rev, myself & others see the positives
outweighing the negatives…..all of a sudden Ken’s a homer?
That’s funny.

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
4:29 pm

Grandad – not trying to down KenS in any way – I’m a positive realist also – Just my opinion he may be a little too positive sometimes – just my opinion however – Agree with much of what he says, as you can tell by the post.

SteveW

September 3rd, 2010
4:30 pm

Notice I just got called a homer as well….

doc

September 3rd, 2010
4:50 pm

stevew no prob as it is easy to misremember. much easier than first thought at my age.

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
4:51 pm

JustAThought

Since your not a homer;
[Why are you on the Hawks blog?]
Which team are you currently affilliated?

Miami?

Some fans are like that, they follow players
around from team to team. Nothing wrong with that.
They are just fans of certain players.
Women are like that, they tend to have crushes on
paticular players. [super-stars]
Not that there is anything wrong with that.
It’s like Jerry Seinfeld said;
about how players switch teams so much nowadays:
“We cheer for laundry”!
Of course he was talking about if you are a homer,
and you cheer for the team as opposed to the players.

Rufus1

September 3rd, 2010
4:53 pm

I want to see

I want to see what the Magic will do when 6′7 SY is guarding Nelson in the 4th qt…

I want to what happens when Jameer has to guard a 6′7 “Hyper Athletic” SY.

I want to see what this BLOG says if Sy becomes the starting PG.
6′7 Sy
6′8 JJ
6′9 MW
6′9 JSmoov
6′10 AL

I believe Sy is coming to compete for the starting PG postion….What BK want all along….A BIG PG!

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
4:58 pm

doc

Then there’s creative memory.
Just make it up as you go along.
When you’re our age just blame it on dementia.

Rufus1

September 3rd, 2010
4:58 pm

Perimeter D

Watch how much our perimeter “D” increases this year…That alone is worth 3 wins.

I don’t ever remeber Woody using Evans to Guard Duhon, Robinson, Jameer or Rose, but I bet that will change this year.

doc

September 3rd, 2010
5:07 pm

can optimism be grounded in reality or at least past performance instead of make believe and hope.

doc

September 3rd, 2010
5:09 pm

gd just read your note … optimism equals delusional dementia?

cp

September 3rd, 2010
5:20 pm

lol good point terrell. I’m talking about the second round and they can barely get the first round right. I still shake my head at the Sheldon pick. Its like everyone knew Sheldon would be a terrible player but BK. I remember him saying he called Coach K and asked him about Sheldon as if coach K was going to come out and admit that even he knew Sheldon was going to be atrocious.

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
5:27 pm

Rufus1 -&- (I think KS has alluded to this previously)

The funny thing is LD is/was the coach who should have
been coaching all along. Even though BK hired MW,
his [MW's] ways of doing things,
(I could not bring myself to say philosophy)
did not gee-haw with BK’s vision.

As for “Pepsi” do not try to put a wrapper
on him as versatility will be his strength.
Try this out, Joe, Jamal, Paps [1,2,3],
-now-
All three can play the [1], Joe & paps
can defend the [1], Joe & paps can defend
the [3]. Talk about versatile.
-Then-
[3,4,5]; Josh Al, Zaza,
-or-
Joe, Josh, Al
-or-
marv, Josh, Al.

My point:
We have alot more to look forward to, than some
of you more “pessimistic” fans think.

All in all;
I still smell a trade,
Not necessarily a biggie,
but a trade nonetheleass.
[before training camp]
-otherwise-
I couldn’t do:
G-dad’s T.O’t.D.

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
5:39 pm

doc

“An optimist will tell you the glass is half-full;
the pessimist, half-empty;
and the engineer will tell you
the glass is twice the size it needs to be”

Rod from College Park

September 3rd, 2010
5:49 pm

If this Papa Chow guy is as good as some of you say he is, there is no way Marvin should keep his starting job. So then, we will be paying 8 mill per to a bench player who can’t score over 13 points a game,even when he gets over 30 minutes a game. Sounds like the Hawks to me. Hawks will easily drop 2 or 3 slots in the standings this year if no other trades are made. This mgic offense stuff is very comical.

Rod from College Park

September 3rd, 2010
5:51 pm

Magic (motion) Drew offense

Jae Evolution

September 3rd, 2010
5:52 pm

I was never able to see Pape Sy in summer league, why is everybody so hyped up on him? From what I can tell he is a do-it-all type of player am I close here with that guess?

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
6:00 pm

Rod from College Park

It’s not Magic, it’s just “an” offense period.
Paps is not proven.
It’s what LD sees in him.
You, above all, should hope that PS could
potentially unseat Marv.
However, it still remains to be seen.
Still, nothing can be achieved w/o ‘hope’ & ‘confidence’.

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
6:06 pm

Jae Evolution

Point forward, can guard four positions. [1-4]
Long, solid build, quick on def, willing defender.
Think in the mold of Scottie Pippen.
*note – I did not say he’s gonna be as good as Pippen!
Lefty (I think)?

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:51 pm

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:52 pm

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

* Link
* Report this comment

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:51 pm

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now w

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:55 pm

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

* Link
* Report this comment

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:51 pm

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !

Mr con&ham

September 3rd, 2010
6:50 pm

Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now we have 2 scrubs!

Go to war? WTF? Hes been going to war the last 3 years and thats why we need a center now. The Hawks are no better this year than last. In fact theyve lost ground. Go to war with D E Z Z N U TT ZZ !Gee a back up to play the defense the starter cant. Now w

KevinM

September 3rd, 2010
6:55 pm

I think i get ur point!

Dr. Callemout

September 3rd, 2010
6:57 pm

The sophomoric child strikes again! Please leave this blogg alone T.S. You are not welcome hear anymore!

Freshfromatl

September 3rd, 2010
7:08 pm

LMFAO!!!!!! This dude has really lost his F’n mind!

Najeh Davenpoop

September 3rd, 2010
7:09 pm

When people start suggesting that a 6′7″ 2nd round pick from France who could barely play the point in summer league should be the starting point guard for an NBA team with playoff aspirations, it’s officially time for the offseason to end. Pape Sy is a nice, athletic SG/SF but he has nowhere near the ball handling skills necessary to play point in this league.

Dub C

September 3rd, 2010
7:20 pm

Dude…seriously??? I can’t even comment on that!

O'Brien

September 3rd, 2010
7:20 pm

Najeh,

Agreed. But hopefully 1 year from now JC2 and Sy Will be ready for major bench minutes.

I hope they send sy to the D league early in the season to get some game experience. And then we can bring him up when they feel like he is ready.

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
7:21 pm

Najeh

Absolutely correct.
-But-
He can defend the [1].

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
7:28 pm

O’Brien

If he’s a 1st rate defender, & he’ll be learning
the offense @ the same rate as everyone else, then
maybe he’s that diamond in the rough as LD said.
“Fingers crossed”.
D-League he will not be running LD’s system.
May be advantagious to get exp. with the big boys.

Ken Strickland

September 3rd, 2010
7:36 pm

GRANDAD-Like I’ve said before, it looks like LDrew is constructing this team to play the style of ball former GM BKnight envisioned, which MWoodson pretended to share in order to get the HC job. He wanted a quick, fast, athletic and versatile team that consistently played uptempo OFF and pressure DEF.

This idea that you can’t run or play uptempo during the playoff is just another narrow minded approach. You might not be able to run as much, but you can certainly run. If your team gets the DEF rebound or steal, it becomes your decision whether you run or not.

And as far as Jamal Crawford is concerned, it’s a matter of when, not if, he’ll be traded this yr. Even without him, OFF will not be a problem for the Hawks. The combination of Jordan Crawford and Pape Sy gives us more versatility, DEF, and about as much scoring potential, as Jamal Crawford will give us in LDrews expanded OFF and bench use.

The Hawks are going to be a good, exciting, and developing team for a long time with all of the young still developing talent they already have. It’s still puzzling to me how some of our fans continue making an issue of all of the things that must take place, or work out perfectly, for the Hawks to be a serious Eastern Conference title contender. Yet, not one of them can see where Boston, Orlando, Miami, Chicago and Milwaukee have to deal with any issues whatsoever in order for them to automatically consider them Eastern Conference title contenders, and/or better than the Hawks.

Ken Strickland

September 3rd, 2010
7:36 pm

GRANDAD-Like I’ve said before, it looks like LDrew is constructing this team to play the style of ball former GM BKnight envisioned, which MWoodson pretended to share in order to get the HC job. He wanted a quick, fast, athletic and versatile team that consistently played uptempo OFF and pressure DEF.

This idea that you can’t run or play uptempo during the playoff is just another narrow minded approach. You might not be able to run as much, but you can certainly run. If your team gets the DEF rebound or steal, it becomes your decision whether you run or not.

And as far as Jamal Crawford is concerned, it’s a matter of when, not if, he’ll be traded this yr. Even without him, OFF will not be a problem for the Hawks. The combination of Jordan Crawford and Pape Sy gives us more versatility, DEF, and about as much scoring potential, as Jamal Crawford will give us in LDrews expanded OFF and bench use.

The Hawks are going to be a good, exciting, and developing team for a long time with all of the young still developing talent they already have. It’s still puzzling to me how some of our fans continue making an issue of all of the things that must take place, or work out perfectly, for the Hawks to be a serious Eastern Conference title contender. Yet, not one of them can see where Boston, Orlando, Miami, Chicago and Milwaukee have to deal with any issues whatsoever in order for them to automatically consider them Eastern Conference title contenders, and/or better than the Hawks.

Ramon

September 3rd, 2010
7:42 pm

Grandad, I don’t know why, but I think he has the skill set to prove a lot of people wrong on the court. Sy does so many things well, that you can’t find a glaring weakness of his. How many rookies drafted in the FIRST ROUND, can you say that about? People say why was he drafted so late then, but they fail to realize once you walk through the door on training camp draft position no longer means anything.

Overseas, there are so many reasons why a player can end up not being played a certain number of minutes. I mean people forget that Crawford didn’t play major minutes in Golden State just because the coach didn’t like him (neither did Teague). If majority of the championship teams feel their rosters with players selected in the 2nd round (pick number 31 is no different than pick number 32-35), then there must be a lot of talent out there. The MEDIA selects the top ten picks who are marketable. But basketball coaches select PLAYERS. And I’m confident that in Sy, we have a player!

Ramon

September 3rd, 2010
7:45 pm

Ken, to further strengthen your point, if you recall it was BK who didn’t allow Drew to interview for other assistant jobs while he was here. And it was also BK who lobbied 3 seasons ago for Woody to be fired. Maybe BK has known for years that Drew was the right man to bring about the change that he envisioned when he drafted and signed so many players who were similar in size/build.

Ken Strickland

September 3rd, 2010
7:45 pm

NAKEH-What’s really sick is people having no questions about Pape Sy’s ability to run the team, or problem anointing him as our starting PG, while claiming to have questions about JTeagues ability to run the team and be our starting PG. WHERE’S THE LOGIC?

Ramon

September 3rd, 2010
7:45 pm

Also, did the Showtime Lakers not run their way through the playoffs during the 80s, as well as the Supersonics in the 90s?

Ramon

September 3rd, 2010
7:47 pm

The loss of Jamal Crawford will mean more touches for Smoove and Horford on the lower block. Which Hawks fan can say that’s a bad thing?

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
7:50 pm

Ramon

He was drafted low because we were fortunate
that no one else knew about him.
LD even said, he was worried other teams would
find out about him.

Mike is back

September 3rd, 2010
7:51 pm

MC, what’s up…times doesn’t allow for much posting these days…course you know that I’m always one read or laugh away.

My take on Thomas…is of the bottom feeders that was left…Thomas wasn’t that bad of a choice…to my fellow bloggers…my opinion doesn’t at all address that the debacle…that is the ASG Some how they always end up in some kind of dilemma involving spending cash…now its SyS…hmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Previously I had posted some time back…that the Hawks needed a Reggie Evan type of guy to play in the post…well when healthy…Eton was that kind of guy…of course a lot will depend on his health. Having gone through some battles myself…I’m rooting for him to do well.

Now if we can get Jenny Craig to move in with Big Burger Collins…till the season it over with…WE SET. lol

Again, Sund may have salvage some bargains for another season…ASG…please sell the team already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

GO HAWK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mike is back

September 3rd, 2010
8:05 pm

That should be Etan…peace oooooooooooooout

Grandad

September 3rd, 2010
8:09 pm

G-dad’s Trade O’ the Day
[Sept 13 or thereabouts]

Dallas gets:
Jamal Crawford

Hawks get:
Jason Terry
-&-
Alex Ajinca

Who cannot like this trade?

Yes I would like Ajinca as a project Big.
Even more now – Etan can beat him up every day.
Plus I wish for a “true” Big.
Dallas -must- trade him. [AA]
-Now-
Jet comes home!
Can play [1] or [2].
Mentor for Jeff. [similar skill set]
(Would Jet be JT1 since he was here 1st)
-or-
(Would Jet be JT2 since he would be here last)

SteveW – you gotta like this one!

Trade off on the whole 6th man thing.

One for two, uh oh, another trade??? [forthcoming]???

JSS

September 3rd, 2010
8:57 pm

Well you don’t see that everyday…
Sy is a work in progress. Let’s let cap play out and not “Diaw” this kid before he gets a chance to acclimate to the NBA and the Hawks needs.

JSS

September 3rd, 2010
8:59 pm

“Cap” = “camp”

JSS

September 3rd, 2010
9:01 pm

@ Granddad… Did you forget what Buck Williams was like with the Nets before his knees went to pot?

doc

September 3rd, 2010
9:31 pm

well, when is the cup really about 5% full and the delusional folks think it is half full?

folks before we hope ourselves silly, reality should at least ask …. hmm what are the chances of one of our 2010 picks putting in meaningful minutes next year, much less two? first of all, didnt the guy picking em say there wasnt anything available at our slot in this draft? second, who have these guys played against of relevance to suggest they are of the caliber to play in the nba? i think it may be harder than it looks as we do our critiques every night. to carry the argument further, what are the actual odds of two guys who are not big names nor played against big time talent getting in to play significant minutes in their second year? i vote for delusion first and hysteria second as the driving force behind such sentiments. where is anything in the past of these two gentleman to suggest they are one year away from being contirbutors in the big time? finally, have you looked at the track record of the guy actually making the picks? is it that solid to suggest he cant miss or is it again the blind squirrel finding the acorn like we got with al first in being in the lottery and bk not getting enthralled with another 6′8 swing man. well, not just one acorn but two by the blind squirrel? this thinking lies beyond optimism or half fullitis but leans more to psychosis or delusion at the least.

i hope our real core of seven …… nothing more and nothing less … is ready to go to war. funny how al looked the part last year early on but as the season moved on he began to take on the look of a very weary warrior. does anyone else remember his body language at times coming back down the court to put up another fight. it is what did the whole team in and hasnt been fixed guys. sorry, it just hasnt. core of seven better be ready. mo, teague, twin, powell and etan are not prime time ready. dont even get me started on jc2 and papy as being relevant until the lights come on and they perform. now spend another eight to ten mil more and get me chills and shaq/kurt thomas and we talk and walk differently. meanwhile, the c’s load up with another forgotten man but a player with real experience. they are beginning to look like they are coached by george allen and play in a burgundy football uniform, we havent changed.

Rufus1

September 3rd, 2010
9:56 pm

Manu Ginobili Drafted 57th

bootsy collins

September 3rd, 2010
10:01 pm

He’s the Donald Rumsfeld of the NBA….

Same Scrubs

September 3rd, 2010
10:40 pm

Same Scrubs same results….Duh??

Clyde

September 3rd, 2010
11:13 pm

Marvin is unproven and is still a work in progress after all these years.

Rev in Tampa

September 3rd, 2010
11:54 pm

I’m sorry I missed the Grandad & Ken show tonight. Looks like everybody was all stirred up. More exciting than the Bible study I taught tonight.

Let me see if I can re-stir it: PAPE SY!

Samuel

September 3rd, 2010
11:59 pm

You guys still “yappin” about Papy Sy and Etan Thomas. WOW!!

Rev in Tampa

September 4th, 2010
12:03 am

I hope Drew gives Pape a spot on the team rather than assigning him to D-league. This idea of sending him to the D-league to learn the NBA style of play sounds wrong-headed. A person plays best when they are playing within their style. An athlete who has “it” learns to adapt and works at keep learning.

Actually, I wish NBA players were mandatorily assigned to European leagues so they could learn some fundamentals.

Clyde

September 4th, 2010
12:03 am

My starting lineup

pg – Pape Sy
sg- Jamal Crawford
sf – JJ
pf- Smoove
c- Horford

Rev in Tampa

September 4th, 2010
12:05 am

Now Clyde, that’s what I call stir’n the pot

The Truth

September 4th, 2010
12:06 am

Dam Doc

Who stirred you up? You are in rare form tonight. If that was a Perry Mason Episode I just read, I would want to order the full DVD set. Does it come in Blue-Ray?

Rev in Tampa

September 4th, 2010
12:10 am

@doc – “second, who have these guys played against of relevance to suggest they are of the caliber to play in the nba?”

Wasn’t it Jordan Crawford who dunked on LeBron at his basketball camp?

doc

September 4th, 2010
12:11 am

truth, truth is truth.

doc

September 4th, 2010
12:23 am

rev, i got a few hits playing college baseball as a pitcher. i wasnt a hitter though i could get other guys out. please let them do it under the lights with people paying admission and camera’s rolling before you anoint them nba players is all i ask. my boy rick says the first hurdle a rook has to overcome is just the notion he deserves to belong there. it is huge step and one we have seen others fail at as they come here from the draft, most recently mr acie law. teague is yet to justify his selection beyond having one mop up game in the last game of the year and four games in rookie league around a mea culpa he might want to just serve up the ball to others rather than bring it up himself the appointed task of a point guard i thought. the other guys looked good in rook league, jc2, or had injuries, papy, that kept them out of further review. we have some who have really never seen this guy play and only recently maybe begun to learn how to pronounce his name all of a sudden suggest he will be ready to play no later than next year. puhlease.

just reminding folks of where these guys are on the learning curve, a big one. after jc2 made his stuff, did he do it regularly in college against all comers and was an unqualified all star? can he do it consistently, even against the likes of mo evans is a start?

The Truth

September 4th, 2010
12:54 am

I think the disconnect with some bloggers is believing that they can somehow control, alter, or change the outcome of the Hawk’s upcoming season with just positive thinking to a degree of being blinded by what is live verses what is Memorex. By chanting their sentiment repeatedly, it will yield them a favorable outcome. To those bloggers, in case you didn’t get the memo, the outcome of the Hawks season will actually be determined by them and them alone. The most us fans can do is speculate and make predication to the extent of our knowledge, background and experience. At best, this falls in the realm of various forms of analysis, logic and/or deductive reasoning activity that can only yield intangible results unless you call stroking your ego something tangible if you guess right on a predication. At worst, it’s just making bogus claims and wild ass-guesses. Regardless of your aforementioned preference, it is certainly fine playing Saturday Morning Quarterback if the games is played on Sunday, as long as we keep things in prospective and stay grounded. The upcoming games and analysis are not real (at this point) only imaginary especially such things as claiming our rookies’ future hall-of-famers or the Hawks post-season a standing ovation (in advance) or a championship playoff finalist (just to name a few). Chris Berman coined it best, “That is why they play the game”. So while these debate teams of optimism verse pessimism rages on, let’s just all enjoy the ride have some fun, because as fans we are nothing more then spectators.

doc

September 4th, 2010
12:59 am

balance truth balance.

The Truth

September 4th, 2010
12:59 am

predication = prediction

The Truth

September 4th, 2010
1:03 am

Doc

I’ll try (not too deep)

Grandad

September 4th, 2010
1:10 am

For doc:
[@ doc sounds a little antagonistic]

I agree in part with with most of what you’re saying,
and am in total agreement with your logic.

As for two rooks contributing this year…I agree in that
hoping for one to produce is the extent of my optimism.
LD’s exuberance is the cause for my sanguine disposition
when it comes to Pape SY. On the other hand, I have much
less confidence in JC2. having watched both closely during
SL neither was overly impressive. However, PS was injured.
As a retired coach, I tend to look @ basketball from a coaches
viewpoint. (Defense 1st) Regardless of the learning curve PS can
defend -Right- now!

I also do not have any confidence in R.Sund or Pendergraph.
But, LD has given me reason to believe that he knows what
he’s doing. So, Paps is -his- draft choice. After they worked
him out LD said I want him & they got him. And from all accounts
will be here.

If Jeff Teague cannot cut the mustard, it will be a set-back.
Of course. But nothing sggests he can’t defend @ this level.

Jeff, Joe, Jamal, Mo, Marv, Paps, Josh, Al, Zaza. (that’s 9)
[Bibby, Etan, J.Howard) surely you get one from that group.
I’ve been saying all along, we need a trade, specifically
for a Big.

Am I hopeful? Yes! why? LD! more than any other reason.

I hope my points have been well taken.
Hopefully they exhibited logic & reasoning.
The last two statements included: hope & hopefully.
Darned optimism.

Rev in Tampa

September 4th, 2010
1:13 am

doc, I’m just stir’n the pot at this point. I do think Pape needs to develop. He is untested. In summer league he played with a lot of energy, did not back down from anybody, and showed a lot of athleticism. I see him rotating in for a few minutes to bring some enegy off the bench defensively. His length and speed that I observed in summer league can give guys fits. His minutes will be limited as well as his contributions offensively.

Here are the reasons why I have drunk the optimism kool-aid. The Hawks were one of the top scoring offenses in the league last year with an asinine offense. It really only amounted to four guys standing around while JJ or Jamal tried to create. And the more important the possession the more certain that they would run an isolation. But there were times in the flow of the game played as a team in a fast tempo. They were fun to watch. At home the crowd gave them extra energy. And they were unstoppable – until they stopped themselves with an isolation. They will trade Jamal. The moves made by Sund this offseason have telegraphed his anticipated trade of Jamal.

The Hawks are just too athletic to play the poor defense that they played last year. They will show much more improvement defensively than offensively. This is due to one phrase uttered by Drew – personal responsibility. Defense begins with heart. Again, Drew has been very clear – even to my initial consternation. He has brought in these ’scrubs’ with a lot of heart (Powell & Thomas). The Hawks will ‘get after it’ on the defensive end of the floor. I don’t know how well Teague will handle the team offensively, but I do know that he will play very effective defense.

There are other reasons that I would like to give but I am tired. Good night.

Rev in Tampa

September 4th, 2010
1:18 am

Hey Grandad, I’m available tomorrow. Watching the Bulldogs. Check your e-mail.

Grandad

September 4th, 2010
1:20 am

JSS

No I did not forget Buck Williams.
I did not mean to diminish his accomplishments in any way.

My comparison was in Al’s position & when compared to BW
my memory did not serve me well. I confess that I do not
have a “vivid” memory of BW. However, any comparison was
only in skill set & style of play. If I’m wrong then I
stand corrected. But my major point was in comparing Al
to centers. My memory of Buck Williams was – he was a
tough son of a gun.

Grandad

September 4th, 2010
1:23 am

JSS

P.S. – If memory serves, B.Williams may have been a little
more athletic than Al, early on in his career.

doc

September 4th, 2010
1:40 am

gd i am a fun loving guy. when does truth spit out sound antagonistic?

rev stir on, it is all fun when kept on target to basketball, nothing personal here by any means.

i still think we have seven men to go to war with not 14. let them prove themselves worthy before declaring them so. has been and never beens dont add up to nba ready players.

gd i have only seen teague recover from his mistakes to make defensive plays. i have yet to see him really take on or stop put clamps on anybody for extended minutes. i guess i disagree with everyone and agree with woody who would have played him more if he was a defender and understood the program instead of bringing back mario. i see him more offensive minded rather than defensive. guess that is where we disagree the most. mo is another year older and didnt show much last year. the bigs? well maybe, again let them earn it before declaring them nba worthy. collins wasnt, etan has played only 50 games in the last two seasons and powell is a scrub.

LD has a lot of teaching to do and is going to have to rely on 7 guys at first and hope to coach up two to three more.

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
1:48 am

“I hope they send sy to the D league early in the season to get some game experience. And then we can bring him up when they feel like he is ready.”

Actually With Sy coming in this is the PERRFECT oppourtunity for Mo Evans to be demoted down to our D-League counterpart the Utah Flash and work on his game. Real talk.

Also after watching some LeHarve footage, Pape Played off the ball most of the time. Occasionally playing PG (Like Childress) but as we saw in summerleague, he’s no PG. He did his best work in transition getting to the rim and drawing fouls. Kid is a slasher with a decent jumper (he’s not a leftie BTW). Hopefully he can handle the SF position for us & have a smooth transition into the league. I mean, he WAS playing PROFESSIONALLY in France. For all of the doubters, LARRY DREW picked this guy after he CRUSHED his SF counterparts in his pre-draft workout. This pick has nothing to do with Rick Sund. If Drew didn’t like him, Rick wouldn’t have just gone through that two week buyout process.

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
1:57 am

Also, why is Etan Thomas on our roster instead of Hassan Whiteside right now? I mean seriously. You’re paying 6′10 Etan Thomas 700K more to do what 7′1 Whiteside can do for much cheaper (Ride the pine). Great Job Rick smh.

wordsmithtom

September 4th, 2010
6:13 am

Why Etan vs. Whiteside? Sund said the Hawks needed veteran bigs over projects. Whiteside was not good enough to get drafted in first round. Fact. Etan has started for an NBA team. Fact. Perhaps in 2-3 years, Whiteside will be better than Etan. But, for a team needing veteran bench help, Etan wins this point. We tried the “project” thing with RandMo…..we need help NOW. If Etan stays healthy…no guarantees in this lifetime, mind you….but if he stays healthy, he gives us VETERAN experience and toughness NOW.

doc

September 4th, 2010
8:31 am

a little song from memory lane for all those thinking the cup is seriously half full to get the o’brien:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14Dgw_LSJ5w

truly1

September 4th, 2010
8:34 am

wst etan thomas is the 13th guy he will never get time except in blowouts we need a 7footer on the team and whitside got drafted right after we were stupid and passed.

truly1

September 4th, 2010
8:37 am

i agree with hmmm I think it was about the money they were getting not about veteran leadership that was just a cover up.

Rufus1

September 4th, 2010
9:17 am

Papa Sy

I don’t know how good he is, but LD got ASG to buy out his contract….ASG DOESN’T DO THAT. LD must believe in this kid and that is enough for me.

I have a 6′2 unproven PG
I have a 6′7 unproven PG
The slowest 6′3 veteran PG in the league

If LD can turn Teague into a legit PG in a year, why not Sy….Remeber Ginobili was drafted 57th and Papovich wasn’t a coach when he took over the Spurs(I think he was an exec with the team)

Forgive me for having faith in a 53 win team…Lol

JoJo the Godfather

September 4th, 2010
9:46 am

Lock up Al with an extension, and then trade away some of the veterans on this team…I’d send Bibby, Ja Crawford, Evans & our 2011 1st to New York for Eddie Curry, Toney Douglas, Wilson Chandler & Kelenna Azubuike…Cut Curry before he can get in his car and even think about heading south…Knicks can flip our first to Portland for Rudy F.

Hawks would have Teague & Douglas at PG, Johnson & Crawford at SG, and Williams & Chandler at SF, with Sy & Azubuike (once healthy) backing up where needed…My thinking is that this is a way to rebuild around Joe, Al & Josh with a young group of athletic guards/wings.

Knicks wind up with a pretty good bunch of shooters/scorers and still have cap flexibility for next year: Felton, Bibby, Rudy, Jamal, Gallo & Walker all have had success shooting the 3.

JeJe

September 4th, 2010
9:51 am

FIRE WOODY

Ken Strickland

September 4th, 2010
9:56 am

There were quite a few rookies who had outstanding seasons last yr. They were able to show what the could do, in spite of their lack of experience against NBA caliber talent, because they had HC’s that were willing to give them opportunities, mins and unconditional support, unlike JTeague. There’s no reason Jordan Crawford can’t be productive as a rookie if given consistent mins, opportunities and support.

We can make all of the logical excuses we want, but a lack of NBA experience, and/or being a rookie, certainly hasn’t prevented numerous rookies from producing each yr. I wouldn’t expect Jordan Crawford to have the same OFF impact of Jamal Crawford, but his DEF superiority would certainly narrow the gap.

O'Brien

September 4th, 2010
10:27 am

Ken S,

For those rookies who excelled last year, very few played for 50 win teams. That being said, I would trade Jamal now and give Mo Evans and JC2 the backup SG slot.

Rev,

Although the Hawks had one of the best offenses last year, it was mostly due to the big numbers we put up against non-playoff teams. It would be interesting to compare our points scored average against the 15 other playoff teams, compared to our average against non-playoff teams.

And most of our scoring droughts came against playoff teams.

Ramon,

The Showtime lakers had a 6′9″ PG running the show. If Phoenix couldnt do it with Steve Nash, it will be tough for the Hawks to do it with Bibby and Teague.

Overall, I think our offense will be better (even if we start out slowly), and in the playoffs, our games will be more competitive, giving us a chance to make it to the ECF.

doc

September 4th, 2010
10:42 am

ken ….
I wouldn’t expect Jordan Crawford to have the same OFF impact of Jamal Crawford, but his DEF superiority would certainly narrow the gap.

not to want to pop the balloon ken only there is no where to be suggested in any report on jordan crawford that he s a defensive stalwart, just not. that is made up in your desire to wish and hope.how can you make a statement and what is it based? where is it said he is a defensive threat? sorry, there is no reality to it nor logic. in fact, he is said to be undersized by some for his position as well as a guy who needs the ball in his hands to be effective. that will have to change. he has a lot to learn it seems, along with a whole team to learn LD’s system. i think the efforts will be to teach the starters first and the others will come along more slowly because the attention will have to be put there and appropriately so. i think that is going to be more challenging than some realize or expect and will cost us early.

“wishing and hoping”

o’b, ur kidding right jc2 and mo? and expect to compete for the top four spot as well as approach 53 wins or are you playing for the year after the lock out?

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
11:11 am

Hasan Whiteside would have been cheaper than Etan, so I don’t think money was a factor there – Hasan only makes $730,000.00 – Etan, after the league rebate, will make $854,000.00.

I think Sy is the grand experiment of this season. Of course, if he comes in here and outplays Mo’, I think Mo’ would be easy to trade with his expiring contract. But I think the plan is, give him a year in Dleague, and then come in and compete for Mo’s vacated spot next season. But again, if he blows them away in the pre-season, I’m sure that could change.

Sy must have been on a good team at Le Havre, I don’t know, haven’t checked. But he played less than half the game, and besides shooting %, had terrible stats. Did find his past 2 year stats on the Euro League web site, as well as his game by game stats.

And I don’t know why everybody is so down on Mo’ Evans. He is what he his – a backup 2/3 with excellent defense and ok offense. I like him. Smart vet, who can average double figures if Marvin gets hurt. Hustles when I see him play.

doc

September 4th, 2010
11:15 am

askg says; “we like rebates”, if we HAVE to fill out a roster.

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
11:15 am

Don’t stone me when i say this – When I see JC2, I see Flip Murray – 10-12 PPG game eventually, with hustle, some assists and court vision. He may exceed that at some point, because he is agressive. I will be very surprised if he averages more than 5mpg this season, unless Jamal leaves, injuries, trade or something. It’s not that he’s bad, it’s just that he’s playing behind the SMOY.

Grandad

September 4th, 2010
11:19 am

Well now, we come to an interesting point.
Thanks to doc.
We may start slower true – due to learning new systems;
offense & defense.
But the trade-off, finishing stronger, would be well worth it.
Everyone keeps harping on the play-offs:
2nd round, 2nd round, 2nd round…failure, failure, failure.
I’m glad you brought that up doc.
Taking time to “teach” & peaking @ the right time.

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
11:21 am

i will remind people again – Before his open heart surgery and blown left MCL, Etan beat out Haywood as the starter in Washington.

Guy is obviously a conditioning freak, is over 11/2 years past his blown knee, I think he may surprise us as the 3rd C/PF. Al and Smoove will get at least 66mpg if healthy between them. ZaZa 15 – Powell (maybe 10mpg) and Etan (5) will spit the other 15, with JC3 in there on occasion to keep himself fresh.

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
11:24 am

Smoove may play a few minutes at 3 some games also, and that would be a few more minutes to split up in the bigs rotation.

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
11:27 am

These guys that are mad at the end of our bench – Let’s get a reality check – if they were real good, they wouldn’t be at the end of a bench! Etan, Collins, JC2. Sy – they are what they are, on the Hawks for specific purposes, either developing or to be Man Up defenders in the low post, that’s all.

doc

September 4th, 2010
11:29 am

yup, gd, ultimately that is what is is all about. surprised it isnt brought up more to be talked about. you do see how hard it is going to be to teach up the young guys while they teach up the vets dont you? priorities are necessary and the young guys will have to fall back unless they are very quick learners. maybe the guys with the shortest learning curves play while those slower dont?

unfortunately we cant fall too far behind the pack if we expect to do something in the post season and with this fan base. sorry, we had to do it this year without spending more to what it takes to be a true challenger for the ring. surprised that the heat have held the line so well salary wise in their coup of the decade. still think if we had gone to say the 6th spot and spent about 8 to 10 mil more we could have loaded this team up to be one that could compete for the o’brien. instead, we admittedly, from my boy rick’s mouth, play for the fourth spot in the east. also think revenues would have compensated for it but i guess their accountants have discouraged such a foray into tax land.

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
11:32 am

I get the feeling some want the end of the bench to be 2nd stringers, or even 1st – there not. And I think we have as good as end of the bench guys as anybody really. If you get too good of a guy down there, you have a disgruntled NBA player AKA Brandon Bass with the Magic – Man I would love for him to be a Hawk BTW.

Lakers end of the bench last year: Mbenga, Vujacic, Morrison, Walton – not exactly a murderers row.

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
11:34 am

If want the Spurs model as Sund said we did, remember, they paid luxury tax 3 out of the last 5 years, including 8.8m last yr. Just sayin’….

doc

September 4th, 2010
11:41 am

stevew, mo evans would be end of bench for the lakers since you brought the ;aers into the discussion. instead he is number 8/9 on ours is the difference. powell was end of bench for the lakers last year and now he is our number 8/ 9? does that sum up the difference. our end of the bench might have papy, twin and jc2, what do the lakers have this year and last? try the bench of the celts now, the guys we swept last year? see the differences there now? do you still think they are in our back pocket? i did last year, before the season and said so that we would have avery good chance to end up third. i dont this year. that is going backwards.

The Truth

September 4th, 2010
12:25 pm

Now we know The Truth; as
I read between the lines, apparently Shaq willingness to play for the Hawks demanding 8M was his compensation for playing on a bad though he sited Cleveland as an example. He calls out Mo Williams reflecting what he really thought about him (Dam, I didn’t know it was like that)

O’Neal said what sold him on the Celtics is the unselfish play of the veteran group.

“I like that they play together and nobody really worries about shots, ” O’Neal said. “When I was with Cleveland, guys who couldn’t even play were worried about shots. Why was Mo (Williams) taking 15 shots, and I’m only taking four? If LeBron takes 20 shots, that’s cool.

“So I said, let me get with a good team for the last two years. I don’t mind people calling me a journeyman. I’ve been programmed to move around every three years.”

The Truth

September 4th, 2010
12:26 pm

Correction: “playing on a bad team”

jason

September 4th, 2010
12:31 pm

hmm ive been thinkin about that Iggy trade and it would work out.

jason

September 4th, 2010
12:38 pm

updating u all that we are close to a deal with jamal.

Ken Strickland

September 4th, 2010
1:00 pm

DOC-I never said Jordan Crawford was a DEF stalwart, but in comparison to the DEF of Bibby and Jamal Crawford, he’d certainly look like one if he stayed anywhere close to his man. It appears obvious to me that LDrew targeted both Jordan Crawford and Pape Sy as their picks in this yrs draft. They were drafted based on their talent and ability to have an impact within his motion half court OFF and fast breaking style.

Since they’ve obviously watched hours of film on each player, as well as worked them out in person against various competition, I trust the confidence they have in their abilities to perform at the level over the apprehension of fans with glass half empty mentalities.

Either way, it’s nothing more than opinions and conjecture at this point, but some opinions are more informed than others. LDrew, RSund, and the ASG are obviously sold on Pape Sy’s ability to be productive in this OFF system now rather than later. WHAT HAVE YOU READ OR SEEN THAT WOULD CHALLENGE THEIR ASSESSMENT ON HIS ABILITIES, OR JORDAN CRAWFORD’S FOR THAT MATTER?

OBRIEN-whether a team wins 50+ or 40+gms, it depends on the HC’s attitude towards rookie players, and whether he has the guts to give him consistent mins and opportunities, that determines if he’ll have a chance to contribute. Why are we debating the potential contributions of a pair of rookies and a 2nd yr player? Didn’t this team win 53gms with a starting veteran SF and PG that drastically under produced and barely gave us bench production?

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
1:36 pm

Doc – Mo’ Evans would not have been at the end of their bench last year, he would have been in what this year is Matt Barnes spot, coming off the bench as a 3/2 guy.

And Powell was not at the end of the Lakers bench last year, he got about the same minutes that Joe Smith got for us. Played in 60+ games. I understand what your trying to say, but that’s not quite the way it is.

And would I have signed Matt Barnes for the 2 year vet exception like the Lakers in a heartbeat….

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
2:19 pm

I’m tired of Mo pouting on the bench when he doesen’t get any PT. You have to EARN PT and he hasn’t done that. He bricks layups and has one of the funkyest Jumpers in the league. He can’t even dribble. Not only that, but dude publically stated that the ONLY reason he didn’t opt out with the Hawks this season is because he COULDN”T FIND A BETTER DEAL. Well DUH sherlock U SUCK! He has publically stated that he belives his 2.5 mill/yr contract was not a representation of his true value and that he was UNDERVALUED and should be paid more…ROFLMBO!!! WOW It’s on the AJC u can read it for yourselves.

He can’t even Play defense right. He’s SUPPOSED to be a top notch defender but he ONLY shows up when Kobe comes to town. Unfortunately, we don’t play the lakers every day. Other than that, dude can barely stay in front of anybody.

Pape Sy > Mo Evans

Jordan Crawford > Mo Evans

Sirgay Gladyr = Mo Evans

Jeff Teague > Mo Evans

Flip Murray > Mo Evans

Matt Barnes > Mo Evans

Raja Bell > Mo Evans

Courtney Lee > Mo Evans

Kyle Korver > Mo Evans

Wesly Matthews > Mo evans

Shannon Brown > Mo Evans

Aaron Afflalo > Mo Evans

Ronnie Brewer > Mo Evans

C.J Miles > Mo Evans

Luke Walton > Mo Evans

Rodney Carney > Mo Evans

CDR > Mo Evans

DO I need to go on? TRADE the Ungrateful Millionaire. If I have to see his no dribblin’ missin’ layups behiend catch a hissy fit on the bench one more time! ugh!

And Mike Bibby is just washed up

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
2:22 pm

Mario West Plays better D than Mo Evans.

doc

September 4th, 2010
2:24 pm

sorry stevew, the numbers for powell in the playoffs dont suggest powell was a top ten guy for the lakers last year:

here is the info served up for you. it is deceiving to use his 9mpg as an indication he was more than and end of the bench guy. he will be our 8/9 guy.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3774/gamelog;_ylt=AjP7lkn.A.B7_gzKBlHjeT3tPKB4

maybe an upgrade on joe smith but does that really say much?

also doubt the role you suggest for mo if with the lakers last year. i feel he would be feeling wool suit and steel under his butt rather than a uni and a wood floor under his feet

Ramon

September 4th, 2010
2:24 pm

O’Brien, the Suns didn’t lose because of their offense, they lost because they couldn’t defend. So if a team is able to lock in defensively and still maintain THEIR pace, they will be successful in the playoffs. Steve Nash is the worse defensive PG in the league, that’s why they lost.

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
2:31 pm

This is all Mo Evans is good for. CRYING

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1VjoNI9TPM

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
2:32 pm

and getting OWNED again

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzhL6oNMrMA

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
2:33 pm

and again

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWC7RfUbMBg

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
2:35 pm

Marvin Williams > Mo Evans

Mike Bibby YES even Mike Bibby > Mo Evans

Josh Childress(aka Diva) > Mo Evans

Hmmm

September 4th, 2010
2:39 pm

Mo Evans is servicable but he needs to check his ego. Also, he’s redundant on our roster as of now. So is Mike Bibby. They need to be swapped for a big. Hopefully rick Sund won’t screw it up this time like when he Let Flip Murray go instead of Bibby.

Rick can Redeem himself by Getting Rid of Mo and Bibby INSTEAD of Jamal Crawford, who we actually need.

Reid Adair

September 4th, 2010
2:52 pm

Al Horford is a class act. It’s too bad ASG collectively doesn’t have half his class.

They sold their souls to Joe Johnson … and then lied to everyone by claiming they weren’t finished in free agency. But, as some of us suspected, they were broke – and they were finished.

Ken Strickland

September 4th, 2010
2:58 pm

A lot of our fans complained about new HC LDrew, and made an issue of him SAYING ALL OF THE RIGHT THINGS. Well, it appears he’s putting his money where his mouth is. He certainly hasn’t attempted to construct his roster to match up with the other Eastern Conference teams. It seems quite certain he intends to backup his claim of changing the past approach. He intends on forcing teams to match up to our speed, quickness, versatility and athleticism.

It’s also apparent he intends to consistently play uptempo, based on the type of players he’s added to the roster. It’s just as obvious Sund, Drew and the ASG feel our perimeter DEF, not our interior DEF, was our biggest DEF problem.

jason

September 4th, 2010
3:28 pm

i agree with hmmm. I think we should trade him and marvin to gs for reggie williams. Then we sign free agent jerry stackhouse

jason

September 4th, 2010
3:33 pm

here is reggie williams mix. He could help on defense and offense.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhWPBpfV9rs

cp

September 4th, 2010
3:52 pm

Yea Jason I like Reggie’s game. I brought him up before on here. I was hoping he wouldn’t go back to the Warriors so we could snatch him up.

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
5:11 pm

Doc – had already seen the playoff numbers several times. People use different rotations for the playoffs – more bigs, the game slows down (usually). Wasn’t referring to the playoffs – of course La is going to go with Gasol, Odom, Bynum up front, sometimes even moving Artest to 4, and bringing a Luke Walton or Powell off the bench.

Powell was LA’s 9th guy last year – and he will be the Hawks 9th or 10th guy this year.

And Mo’ would have been playing for LA instead of Vujicic. .

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
5:12 pm

No way Mo’ Evans would have been on the end of LA’s bench…

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
6:22 pm

BTW – I’m not really trying to defend Mo’ here. I just don’t think he’s as bad as some make him out to be. And he did kill us by exercising his contract option for 2.5m If we had not have signed JJ, we would have had only our MLE to sign a player – and we couldn’t have even gotten JJ Reddick for the MLE! And def. not a Salmone.

We would have still had Jamal, and that’s another story – Jamal is an above average NBA player, but he is a notch below JJ.

doc

September 4th, 2010
6:24 pm

stevew do you think walton’s back injury had something to do with it as he ended up playing double the amount of time powell did during the playoffs. if walton’s healthy does he get a rotation spot in leiu of powell even though they play the same position but with the versatility of many of the lakers does he sit and walton play? who got walton’s play time?

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
6:25 pm

Try Bibby, 2 1st picks and a 2nd for Lou Williams. Now we would have 2 exciting young PG’s.

And if Jamal wants to walk, try to get Dunleavy and a 1st pick from the Pacers – they’re really trying to dump Dunleavy in Indy. Good back up for Marvin – or maybe even a starter.

doc

September 4th, 2010
6:28 pm

they “dont” play the same position… is what i meant to say.

doc

September 4th, 2010
6:30 pm

stevew, mo has always fit the budget. for the money, not bad.

terrell

September 4th, 2010
7:00 pm

Hire Woody! Somebody. Anybody. lol!

O'Brien

September 4th, 2010
7:09 pm

doc,

If JJ plays 36 mpg at SG, then Mo and JC2 will only be needed for 12 mpg backing him up. You dont think they could handle 12 minutes combined?

I would sign a minimum salary guy like Rodney Carney to backup Marvin, so JJ can focus on SG (with only spot minutes at SF).

Najeh Davenpoop

September 4th, 2010
7:14 pm

In fairness to Mo Evans, he would probably be a lot more effective if he didn’t play the majority of his minutes out of position at small forward. He is consistently asked to guard players who are bigger and stronger than him while having to go up against these same players on the offensive end of the floor. Mo Evans is 6′5″. He should be a 2-guard, but the Hawks in their infinite wisdom have a billion SGs and no SF so they are forced to play him out of position.

SteveW

September 4th, 2010
7:50 pm

Doc – that’s what I was about to say – Walton and Vujicic for that matter made quite a bit more than Powell – Walton 6+m and Vujicic 5m. And Powell did get better minutes ‘08-’09 also.

Najeh – Co-sign def.

robdawg08

September 4th, 2010
8:21 pm

Why are the Hawks ALWAYS financially strapped ? I can’t wait to see this so called WAR against the Miami Heat. It will be a quick battle like 125-90 Heat over Hawks…

Rev in Tampa

September 4th, 2010
8:33 pm

“the Hawks in their infinite wisdom have a billion SGs”

It is very clear that Jamal will be traded. I wish the Hawks had not filled all the post spots, so we are left with looking at which SF we can get to back up Marvin. I think the Hawks could find a very good back-up at SF with Jamal as bait.

It could be argued that the Hawks should go after another pg, but the Hawks should go with who they’ve got. To go after another pg would be to hedge their bets. Teams that hedge bets are indecisive. And winners do not equivocate. Rather, they charge forward.

robdawg08

September 4th, 2010
8:36 pm

So what’s the status of Jamaal Crawford, Mr. Cunningham ? Limbo ?

doc

September 4th, 2010
8:50 pm

najeh they backed themselves into that corner when they ignored j chills, didnt they? if i remember, they had no back up plan, is how for behind they were on what his choices were. some here think it was part of the infinite salary restriction plan of the askg. i think they were caught flat footed and had to scramble to make good and sign a guy for maybe one more year than they wanted to, kind of lost leverage there.

if jamal goes, who is there to play minutes at point? you guys ready to give the keys to teague with no back up. you guys think like the askg does then, if you do. before you say jj, he is an infinitely better sf than he is as a point guard. we tried that experiment once when jj’s body was more like a point guard. i think he has fleshed out a bit more since then. it failed then why is it going to be successful or is that the definition of crazy?

rev a back up sf for the sixth man of the year? this is a guy who could step into a starter spot if either the point guard or two guard are injured without us missing a beat or maybe getting another valve for its engine. boy you dont give him any respect. he also can say the right things after we lose.

gee o’b that sounds great. let us sit down a guy who only scores 18 ppg and avg 35 mpg in his career so we can put two guys that cant possibly do what he did and bring in a scrub that is possibly worse than mo. ummm who is going to handle 48 mpg at point that is proven?

Fresh

September 4th, 2010
9:56 pm

A Quote From Shaq In A Recent Interview:

O’Neal said what sold him on the Celtics is the unselfish play of the veteran group. “I like that they play together and nobody really worries about shots, ” O’Neal said. “When I was with Cleveland, guys who couldn’t even play were worried about shots. Why was Mo (Williams) taking 15 shots, and I’m only taking four?

http://www.nola.com/hornets/index.ssf/2010/09/shaquille_oneal_expects_to_hav.html

LOL AND SMH AT ALL OF THE IDIOTS WANTING SHAQ IN THE HAWKS LOCKER ROOM!!!!!! Thank you Boston from saving the Hawks from themselves! Also if this is the way Shaq felt about the Cavs, what do you think he was gonna say about Al, Josh, Joe, or Jamal taking shots????????

Rev in Tampa

September 4th, 2010
10:01 pm

doc, I love Jamal. But he is not a pg. He is a pure sg, of which we have ‘billions’. I would like the Hawks to aquire a quality sf that would split time with Marvin – a two-headed sf tandem. The idea is that there be little fall-off in quality when Marvin goes out of the game. This would cause match-up problems for most teams that have a scrub backup. Drew wants other teams to try to match up with the Hawks rather than the Hawks try to bend to other teams.

Drew, who played pg in the NBA for 10 seasons, has evaluated Teague closely for over a year. He seems ready to give the keys to Teague.

Rev in Tampa

September 4th, 2010
10:14 pm

Bibby, Teague – pg
Johnson, Evans, Jordan Crawford – sg
Marvin, trade aquisition, Sy – sf
Smith, Powell – pf
Horford, Pachulia, Thomas, Collins – c

Of course this allows that guys could rotate into other positions – ie. Horford into pf

doc

September 4th, 2010
10:34 pm

rev, just hope jj stands close to the defensive basket so he can bring the ball up for teague. i see nothing coming off the bench to bring any life to this team rev, no one. who is it you think from this group that could do the flip jamal act? “trade acquisition” at this time of year to give us serious points? where is he and whom? man you are really piling the responsibility on the starting five. do you think there is a guy that can compare to jamal and jj at 2 and 3 if jj stays at 2 and someone comes in at three?

truthspitter

September 4th, 2010
11:03 pm

I hate Marvin Williams as a basketball player. I wish he would just go away, even if it had to be by an injury that did not make his life horrible but just made it where he could never play basketball again

Rev in Tampa

September 5th, 2010
12:04 am

doc, I feel this move would give the Hawks more BALANCE than what they currently have with the overload at sg. If Mo is out of position at sf, then he needs to move to sg.

And if the Hawks have JJ, Jamal, Jordon, & Mo at sg then somebody has to be moved. Jamal has an expiring contract, loads of trade value, & is a defensive liability.

And if Mo is out of position at sf, then the Hawks have a bigger weakness at small forward than at point guard or center because they would only have Marvin & Pape. As you said many times over the past 24 hours (very artfully I might add) Pape is not ready to step in and carry a significant load right now. And truthspitter is praying for Marvin to lose a foot in a car accident – which points out how thin the Hawks are at sf. M. Cunningham has been pointing this out for weeks. So why not use Jamal in a trade to bring in some real talent at sf to turn a real weakness into a potential strength.

And if Jamal’s defense is as invisible as EVERYONE on this blog suggests, then his high scoring average is offset to some extent by the points he allows.

Also Jamal’s playing style is very “isolation”-oriented. Drew is implementing a very team-oriented offense. It will take great discipline for the Hawks to stay with the team concept when it is easier to back off and let JJ & Jamal create.

The Hawks will be fine on offense without Jamal. Yes, I remember your earlier point about the Hawks padding their scoring average against poor teams. Are the Hawks the only team in the league that pads their offense against poor teams? I assume that all teams put up more points against poorer teams and less against playoff-bound teams. Where the Hawks really need to improve is on defense – where EVERYONE says Jamal is a liability.

doc

September 5th, 2010
12:17 am

rev made many points but that was not one of them i dont believe.

guys i dont think it is wise to make a move now. there is going to be enough going on with the KD offense changes. also, it behooves jamal to play his heart out just like he did last year and that is to our advantage. if you give me a truen number 6 guy to play at sf with an expiring contract then so be it. we had one of those guys and snubbed him in chills. with drew making comments he wants to look at smith at sf i dont think between jj and j smith filling in there you want to put as much money there as we would have to. i like jamal’s versatility and what it gives us. if you say “doc, i can get you a legit big an a tighten up the screws swing guy” then i might consider it. otherwise ride it out until february and decide then.

Rev in Tampa

September 5th, 2010
12:21 am

Sorry doc for maligning you on the last point. Somebody said it to me over the last 24 hours and you have said the most. By the way, I have enjoyed your posts.

Rev in Tampa

September 5th, 2010
12:35 am

doc, I’m not a fan of putting Josh at the SF. Too many temptations to shoot. I almost made that point in the previous post, but felt it would weaken the overall thrust of the logic.

I’m also a fan of waiting to the trade-deadline. A lot of “if’s” have to fall in the Hawk’s favor for their season to be considered successful (Success for me = strong showing in the Eastern Conference Finals). I would rather the Hawks pull the trigger on a trade when they know better where the real needs are.

doc

September 5th, 2010
12:39 am

yeah rev, fun to jibe back and forth. not too many things to get truly riled about. we all want the same thing, the hawks to win. i imagine even though i have been counterpunching with ken s through the summer, he knows me well enough after 6 years here that i am not at all malicious but my points are as relevant as his though from a different view point. anyway, i just what to hear him say a few more things because i miss him so when he is away.

i do think it is going to be pretty hard for LD to get everyone on the same page and i would like to have some instant offense on the bench in case it is needed. if it is as much ball movement as they say then it might look really good for jamal as well. every player seems to go through the cross hairs on this blog, for years it was how unworthy josh smith was. well now it seems to be the hawk in the dog house is jamal. sometimes it is deserved like with marvin or bibby last year, just dont understand how a guy who brought us back so many times last year an wins a very prestigious award gets so little love around here. all he wants is a chance to do a contract, didnt woody want the same thing last year about this time?

doc

September 5th, 2010
12:51 am

defense is a team thing and the team didnt play it, not just jamal. it wasnt as though 13 guys were on the page with what woody wanted and jamal wasnt. teague looked lost most of the time on defense and unnecessary on offense, bibby flat footed on defense and uninvolved on offense though he made every effort to scratch and hold whenever he could. look, i saw some serious matador sh!t from jj as well and no attempt to block out under the basket nor make an attempt at bounds from time to time and he is as big as lebron at 6′8″ and 240 lbs. the team hall mark of the crucial stop was there at the beginning of the season, it wasnt at the end. that was not due to jamal.

The Truth

September 5th, 2010
2:01 am

As I listened to Etan Thomas interview, it became apparent why he was chosen oven the other competing players. If you don’t know it already, he was coached by then assistant coach Larry Drew during his tour with the Wizards so they have a prior working relationship. Also he is familiar with this offense since it was deployed in Washington by their former Head Coach Eddie Jordon. Apparently as Jordan’s former assistant, LD will be emulating his own variation of this offense. Because as Thomas explained, it will not be based solely on the Princeton. Since this offense requires a great deal of basketball IQ and a lot of moving, cutting, slashing and dashing, I’m wondering if Zaza isn’t at risk for losing some backup minutes to Thomas since he is seems so familiar with its complexity and Zaza is probably not.

And how will JJ and Josh Smith handle this new offense? With Mr. ISO JJ, I question the cutting, slashing and dashing parts since that has not been his forte. The dribble-dribble-shoot JJ has been part of his DNA even before he became a Hawk. With Josh Smith, I only wonder about his basketball IQ capacity required to gasp all of the finer details of such a complicated system. However, the much maligned Marvin may actually flourish in this new offense since it will finally give him a real structure to work within. Since Woody’s ISO system was based on athletic improvisation, it often time had Marvin looking clumsy since he is not a creative offensive player when trying to take his man one-on-one. In this new system, Marvin would just follow the instructions of moving, cutting, slashing and dashing and he will automatically get his scoring opportunities. If he should bomb in this offense, then we can officially declare him an undisputed bust. As for Bibby, after further review, I have mix emotion as to how he will gel in this offense. We should all know that it was Rick Adelman in Sacramento who first installed the Princeton Offense in the NBA. He coached his team with Bibby and Chris Webber to the Western Conference finals in 2002 using primarly the Princeton Offense. So Bibby is the unique Hawk player that knows it perhaps better then any other player on the team. So he gets a A+ for his basketball IQ. However, since father time is catching up with Bibby, I question whether he can excecute the quick movements, the cutting, slashing and dashing duties of this offense on a regular bases.

So if a team is incompatible to this offense then their chances of success is very low. It is by no means a silver bullet a successful season. As evidence of that, here is some links to the Good, the Bad and the Ugly days of the Princeton Offense with one of its disciple as a casualty.

Big Ray

September 5th, 2010
2:29 am

Zzzzzzzzz….

Rev in Tampa

September 5th, 2010
6:30 am

Truth, I enjoyed the post. I also found the Good, Bad, & Ugly links especially helpful. I think the Princeton offense will be a great asset to the Hawks.

wordsmithtom

September 5th, 2010
7:40 am

Truth, thanks for that interview link. I hadn’t seen the Conner interview, so that too was instructive. He wants to see more physicality…more charges taken. Emphasis toughness. Zaza’s boxing fits that well. Sometimes he seemed to have lapses of concentration. Boxing forces you to have your wits about you at all times as well as improving cardio and footwork. Witness Zaza’s play in Euro this summer. Adding Etan to push him only makes it better.

Tactically, this lets them play Smith and Horf more aggressively. Last year Woody felt he could not afford to get either in foul trouble because he didn’t trust the bench. Well this year’s bigs are ready not only to give fouls, but to fill in if starters get in foul trouble. Without a doubt, the overuse of Hawks starters led to physical and mental tiredness at end of season. Boston played their bench last week and took a couple losses. Rested starters played better when playoffs started.

Marvin should do much better in a structured offence. He is a poor ISO player, but he’s the same size as Smith and Horf. He creates mismatches for smaller 3’s if he’s in position to take advantage of them. A 240 lb 3 cutting to the hole is no fun when you’re 6-5 or so trying to stop him.

The Hawks upgraded by staying the same at the core and bringing in more physical players (Etan and Powell). Hopefully Collins will stay on that diet….betting he does. Top to bottom, the Hawks don’t have the “big 3″ of Miami, but I like what our 2nd team brings much better. Plus if Zaza brings that boxing mentality against Bosh, I like the Z man in 3.

drmaryb (*_*)

September 5th, 2010
8:03 am

Hallelujah!

Doc is a Man on Fire and he said: “every player seems to go through the cross hairs on this blog, for years it was how unworthy josh smith was. well now it seems to be the hawk in the dog house is jamal. sometimes it is deserved like with marvin or bibby last year, just dont understand how a guy who brought us back so many times last year an wins a very prestigious award gets so little love around here. all he wants is a chance to do a contract, didnt woody want the same thing last year about this time?”

Amen!

doc is in the Pulpit on Sunday morning!

truthspitter

September 5th, 2010
8:04 am

I apologize for my 11:03 post because it sounds evil and horrible but I really do wish Marvin would just go away he is a cancer to this team. We got rid of Sheldon and Acie, Marvin has to go, he represents the failures of this franchise every time I see him in a Hawks uniform

Samuel

September 5th, 2010
8:51 am

Fresh,
While Mo was shooting 43% Shaq was shooting 57. Shaq has a career 58% shooting percentage from the floor. Mo Williams hasn’t done shuat. He’s a wanna be star who will get put back in his place this year without LBJ. He’s from Mississippi so he’s my boy automatically but he’s no Shaq.
Funny how real “Championship” franchises aren’t afraid to sign these “so-called” locker room cancers while wannabes continue to sing that same ole song about getting “quality” guys and finishing where they do. (see Lakers and Ron Artest).

This team has basically swapped Mario for JC2, Joe Smith for Ethan Thomas and Woody for LD. That’s supposed get us to the next level, Please. This squad as it is currently assembled will struggle to make the playoffs. We get rid of Jamahl and we’ll be playing ping pong.

M. (idiot) cunning...ham

September 5th, 2010
9:33 am

“Horford and Hawks hoping they have enough guys who can do this.” – mike con man

?

Do what? play defense?

OK quick question Idiot cunning ham ( Mr official A. Ho. nutz warmer) Exactly how many centers did A. Ho. actually shut down last year? Howard just put an exclamation on the fact that A. Ho is a very weak interior defender but the reality is he did not shut down anybody including Howard. Opposing coaches love running in side to A. Ho. and the rate of completions/attempts against A. Ho in the paint was excessive, and thats with out taking inthe fact that many of the few who did not score went to the free throw line because horford lived in foul trouble. In fact his block shot to foul rate interprets it will take about 3 fouls for him to block 1 shot!

Its not just Howard. A HO. is very weak in the interior defense game. So what? now you hire some one to play defense for him? aint that a B!!tch.

Last year Woodson increased A. Ho’s field goal attempts by 50% and All it equate to was .23 pct increase/ 1 more basket a game.

Allstar? F-LOL

This freeloader could not make the all nba team nor the NBA all defensive team on any level and those are coaches decision. He may be your god but a 12 NBA career average and a 13 point best college year tells me once you Floridians get back to reality, Al is just your average Ho.

M. (idiot) cunning...ham

September 5th, 2010
9:38 am

HOW TO FINISH WORST THAN LAST SEASONS TEAM?

Bibby, Teague – pg
Johnson, Evans, Jordan Crawford – sg
Marvin, trade aquisition, Sy – sf
Smith, Powell – pf
Horford, Pachulia, Thomas, Collins – c

Of course this allows that guys could rotate into other positions – ie. Horford into pf

M. (idiot) cunning...ham

September 5th, 2010
9:39 am

THE GREAT AMERICAN HYPOCRITE?

drmaryb (*_*)

September 5th, 2010
8:03 am

Hallelujah!

doc

September 5th, 2010
9:57 am

truth, it kind of confirms some of my realistic apprehensions about how all this is going to work. only two years ago i felt philly and we were very similar in looks. they got rid of a few pieces, specifically their aging point guard who is younger in miles than ours, brought in a cog that turned out to be a square to fit in the round hole and hired a coach that needed time or commitment to get his system installed before being jettisoned and they are in the lottery. i dont think many folks realize how close things are between teams and how quickly a team can fade if the effort is not there. most games are decided by two to three baskets. it is gonna be interesting for sure.

ping pong eh? well at least running around trying to chase the bouncing ball with the emphasis on chase, well maybe mad scramble.

shaq might have brought an attitude we needed or called people out who didnt get it. he didnt undermine them as they were ripe for a fall, too immature with all their shucking and jiving on the sidelines. they certainly werent professionals as they had never really won anything. shaq wont have that responsibility. basically our organization is that of control freaks at the top so that type of leader doesnt work for them because indirectly it would be criticism of them.

well the dusty springfield chorus can continue ….. wishing and hoping.

Ken Strickland

September 5th, 2010
10:41 am

Damn DOC, you’re on a role my man. Good to see you back at it full time.
With some of the changes to the top teams in the East, some being rather drastic, I can see some of the adjustment and chemistry problems Philly went through taking place.

While the Hawks won’t improve significantly based on new acquisitions, save a new HC, we will be the most stable team roster wise, as well as the team that’s most likely to avoid suffering any adjustment and/or chemistry issues.

Last yr Boston took basically the same approach we’re taking this yr. Even with KG’s injury issues, they maintained their core, especially their starting lineup, and added to their bench. And we all saw how well that worked out. And before any of you GLASS HALF EMPTY ADVOCATES start whining about me comparing the Hawks to the Celtics, I’m not comparing the 2 teams, but rather their similar approach.

doc

September 5th, 2010
11:09 am

got it ken s. uh no comparison though i compared them a bit earlier in the thread for what they did in the off sesason compared to us. sorry i thing d west is a better third guard than ours. oh we dont have one? that is behind rondo and nate. whoo just there there is a huge difference and why i think our askg dropped the ball and folded up the bank when they saw how tought the competition was going to be the magic, heat and c’s. that is what i saw as we sudently went from we will spend to we will want to hold onto 4th seed. ken s bro that is a huge step back, sorry. isee you desire to have faith in our guys and LD. my issue has always been on what sits on top and why i dont think we will make the necessary adjustments to maintain pace. again we stopped at tax, cool we are 11th best in salary right now, cool up from 22nd as some big spenders backed up and the three amigos took their “bargain” deals south. ultimately it is about the money that is spent. looking back there have been few if any real good teams that spent that didnt rise to their spending. i said good teams not facsimile’s of the thomas led knicks.

we are real good. i just want them to be better and i dont think a trick offense is going to take us anywhere close to what sac had ten years ago as our pieces arent as balanced as theirs was starting with a youthful penetrating aggressive point guard who could play d with a good basketball iq head on his shoulders and a legit center and legit pf that could pass the rock to the wiz who blew up internally and the sixers last year that didnt buy into it.not to forget the coach may not be as good or as experienced as in sac. got to take my man samuel’s attitude of “show me first” to that like the state before i believe it. we are real good but like any real good team could go backwards in a hurry. the nba is a tough league from what i hear, pretty competitive.

JeJe

September 5th, 2010
12:05 pm

LOL @ J-Craw telling the Boston Globe he won’t request a trade.

I guess our writers couldn’t get that answer out of him.

*Waiting for the next Al Horford update*

LOL @ no update on Bibby or Marvin or Smoove

Good job, guys

doc

September 5th, 2010
1:43 pm

yeah truthspitter that spit had a bit more venom than usual in that one, kind of raised an eyebrow for me. glad your loose rocker is back in place.

O'Brien

September 5th, 2010
1:59 pm

Doc,

I’m with you on the PG issue. I Would have liked to bring in a 3rd PG because teague is unproven, and bibby is old and declining.

However, I don’t want Jamal playing PG. I want him playing SG. If the ASG were willing to spend the Money, I would prefer to keep Jamal.

However, given their financial limitations, Jamal is our best chance at upgrading the bench. Maybe he could have brought in a backup SF and a backup PF. Maybe he could bring us a backup center and a draft pick.

JSS

September 5th, 2010
1:59 pm

Well, I’m not going to moan about what we have (or don’t have)…
@ Michael Cunningham…
Has the Hawks front office given you any time frame on when they are going solidify their camp invitees? Thanks

doc

September 5th, 2010
2:31 pm

o’b, i thought we did that, upgrade the bench that is. dont we have the lakers 8th guy off the bench now, a former starter for the wiz (not, he even lost a slug fest for it i think, didnt he) and two steals from the draft because LD liked them. that to go with a guy who was a candidate for a reality show about losing weight. it is said he lost a person of fat and now is completely different than before? did i leave any of the upgrades out? where is stackhouse? oh yeah, that was last year when we went to camp with a few spots open. got rid of hunter and brought in mario instead of stack, makes sense dosnt it?

wishing and hoping…. show me = WAHSM …. ASKG

Najeh Davenpoop

September 5th, 2010
4:10 pm

Co-sign Big Ray at 2:29 AM.

JeJe

September 5th, 2010
4:10 pm

LOLOLOL JOE DIDNT EVEN TAKE A PARTIAL PAYCUT.

LOL LBJ, BOSH AND WADE TAKING MILLIONS LESS.

AND 29 YR OLD UNDERACHIEVING JOE KILLS OUR PAYROLL
LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Ken Strickland

September 5th, 2010
5:10 pm

DOC-I had an issue with us relying on Bibby as our only backup PG before I realized in LDrews system, the traditional PG role won’t be required. In his OFF, the PG’s responsibility is to initiate the OFF, not run it. JJ, both Crawfords and Pape Sy can initiate our OFF, in addition to Bibby and Teague.

Drew seems to be designed to take advantage of the passing skills of our front line players, not just our PG and other back court players. This roster indicates we’re going to be a team that features speed, quickness, versatility, ball and player movement.

Before last yr, the Suns had one of the shortest and smallest NBA teams in the last 20+yrs, and they used speed, quickness, versatility, ball and player movement to successfully compete against bigger and taller teams. The hawks will be bigger, taller, just as quick, fast and versatile.

doc

September 5th, 2010
5:25 pm

ummm without nash and amare, too.

Emir S.

September 5th, 2010
5:50 pm

Give Marvin one more year…seriously. I dont have to bring up the fact of Woodson having no plays for him, to get my point across. Give the guy another year, another chance, another offense.

Stop worrying about the Heat as well. Proven talent…but unproven team. Worry about the Celtics, the Magic, the Bulls and the Bucks.

I’m really intrested to see how the Superfriends manage to keep their ego’s in check. Would love to see Wade sink a 3 pointer at the buzzer in Miami and stand up on the announcers table and yell “This Is My House”. I’d love to see Lebrons and Boshs reactions.

Anyways more importantly, I’m also not convinced by any moves we’ve made so far that tell me we’ve improved anything. I, like many others, beleive something big might be brewing tho!

(Big as in like how we got Jamal last year)

jason

September 5th, 2010
6:00 pm

this is my trade o’ the day.

mo and marv traded to Gs for reggie williams

jason

September 5th, 2010
6:02 pm

updating u all we have signed jamal and will announce to the press before holloween

doc

September 5th, 2010
6:45 pm

thanks jason for the update, before halloween, eh?

Grandad

September 5th, 2010
7:26 pm

jason

What’s your source?
national Examiner
-or-
http://www.grit.com

Grandad

September 5th, 2010
7:33 pm

wordsmithtom – Co-sign @ 7:40 am

An addendum;
heavy minutes [top 6] *contributed to play-off collapse.

Rod from College Park

September 5th, 2010
8:03 pm

“Marvin should do much better in a structured offence. He is a poor ISO player, but he’s the same size as Smith and Horf. He creates mismatches for smaller 3’s if he’s in position to take advantage of them. A 240 lb 3 cutting to the hole is no fun when you’re 6-5 or so trying to stop him.”

When I continue to see dumb comments and excuses made for Marvin Williams it really amazes me. Marvin has never been a mismatch for anyone. Teams actually defended him with the likes of OJ Mayo and Kirk Hinrich. You don’t have to stop him going to the hole because most of the time, he will stop himself by stumbling over his own feet. Good basketball players can adapt to any system, and make their presence felt. Marv is like the goofy stepchild on this team. None of the players on the team have any confidence in his game, and he is so timid and cowardly, that he will never demand any respect. I wish we would have signed Shaq, because I know he would have called Marvin out this year. Nobody else on this team has the balls to call him out.

Doc,

I agree. Don’t know what all this Jamal hate is about. He is easily the second or third player best player on the team, and one of the only guys who can actually create his own shot.

KevinM

September 5th, 2010
9:09 pm

Prediction: we get a 2nd rounder for Jamal.
Can’t wait to see Pape Sy initiate this offense that comes from one year with Eddie Jordan, who by the way was a huge mistake his last 2 hires.
Be careful who you associate LD with; not a lot of success there.

JSS

September 5th, 2010
9:20 pm

How those Ladies!!!! Come home and finish them off!!! Go Dream!

JSS

September 5th, 2010
9:21 pm

How “about”

Clyde

September 5th, 2010
10:01 pm

LETS GO DREAM

Its a shame they might win a championship before the Hawks

Clyde

September 5th, 2010
10:03 pm

We need the owner of the Dream to buy the Hawks

Clyde

September 5th, 2010
10:04 pm

When was the last time the Hawks made it to the Eastern Conference Finals?

JSS

September 5th, 2010
10:33 pm

Answer:
Never!!!
Western conference final in 1970

~~MAC-ToWN~~ (Area Code 478)

September 5th, 2010
11:13 pm

Honestly, I’m tired of hearing about most of these guys. The Hawks are my team and organization, so I want whoever they put out on the court to WIN GAMES, including who we have now, but I’m so tired of hearing about JJ, Smoove, Crawford, Marvin and Bibby.

H3ll, we’re only planning on being a middle of the pack or latter playoff team anyway, right? And when you trade people, you usually expect to get equal or more value back, right (unless its a salary dump)?

With that said, I know it’s not possible (for all) but I wish we could deal away JJ, Smoove, Marvin, Crawford and Bibby, or atleast 2 or 3 of them. Get some fresh faces, something new to talk about around here.

Horford’s the only one I’d truly hate to see go. I dont care to see this same core group for a mediocre season and early playoff exit.

Hopefully the roles the guys play in Drew’s “system” on O and D will change things and that’s all I cant hope for.

JSS

September 5th, 2010
11:40 pm

MAC-Town, you running the Labor Day Road Race in the AM?

Grandad

September 6th, 2010
12:10 am

doc: below is from 1:?? am Sept 4

For doc:
[@ doc sounds a little antagonistic]

I think you may have misunderstood.
I said for doc rather tham @ doc.
Sometimes saying *(@ ______),
sounds as if you’re coming at them.
Hence, antagonistic.
I was not referring to anything you said.

Just so you know, I like Jamal as well.
I would not trade him.
However, [push/shove] then we must get equal compensation.

Two last thoughts.
I don’t think LD’s offense is a trick offense.
-&-
Would you concede that a *[major upgrade in coaching]
would equate to a major improvement with the team, given
virtually the same personel. *[hypothetically speaking]

Grandad

September 6th, 2010
12:13 am

doc

last paragraph = ?
I ended a ? with a .

doc

September 6th, 2010
1:14 am

i dont think it is a trick offense but really everyone here talks about it like they know what to expect. i dont think anyone knows what it is going to look like or how it is run. i will wait to render an opinion about it or LD. realist not pessimist.

WAHSM …. ASKG

Grandad

September 6th, 2010
1:42 am

doc

It’s like I told SteveW;
I realize I was only a lowly HS coach but,
after 30+ years of running motion offense
and studying variations thereof:
(Coach Knight, Don Meyer, P.Carill & Princeton)
among others I have a working knowledge of the
concepts he will be teaching.

I would not expect you to take my word.

However, I’m sure, of that which I speak.

vava74

September 6th, 2010
2:19 am

“JeJe

September 5th, 2010
4:10 pm

LOLOLOL JOE DIDNT EVEN TAKE A PARTIAL PAYCUT.

LOL LBJ, BOSH AND WADE TAKING MILLIONS LESS.”

Due to Florida’s taxes, Lebron and Bosh are actually taking MORE net than if they had signed for the MAX in New York or ATL.

Mike (free booty) con/ham

September 6th, 2010
7:57 am

OK some of you guys have been complaining about all the attention I give to Al Horford. Some of you feel that a career 12pts 9 rebound man who was # 25th among centers for block shots is not the kind of guy you want to build team around or a fan club.
]
Thats a fair position.

My question to you is….Would you like some of my free booty?

Mike (free booty) con/ham

September 6th, 2010
8:02 am

PS

I have a fat nasty stanky aziz if you are interested? If you smell my breath and my aziz you cant tell the difference.

Mike (free booty) con/ham

September 6th, 2010
8:05 am

“I dont care to see this same core group for a mediocre season and early playoff exit.”

fire woody now!

Ramon

September 6th, 2010
8:21 am

@ Grandad, I can’t wait to see how many things will open up off of the back door screens. I can almost see JJ coming out screens like Reggie Miller. And Smoove coming off of screens for easy lob passes underneath.

doc

September 6th, 2010
9:16 am

GD being an oglethorpe grad i loved and coached the wheel to young high schoolers. worked like a charm.

however i want to see how our personnel fit into it and how he deploys it is all i am saying. we have looked a little free lance, undisciplined and school yard in the past. not sure whether the guys will buy into the discipline or the thinking that has to go into it.

look if they get ball and personnel movement which ultimately determines the likes of boston and the lakers vs. us then fine. i just want to see how they do it and how quickly they get it before i go “this is mecca”.

JeJe

September 6th, 2010
10:33 am

FIRE WOODY.

doc

September 6th, 2010
10:43 am

add on to above GD; they are not going to restructure this roster for LD. either these guys get it and he stays or they dont and he goes. if they flail miserably they wont wait to make a decision either, he will go quickly. the leash is short is my estimation, this roster either fits or it doesnt. LD says they have the people and the players say they like it. that should be enough and if it doesnt work then they have to get rid of it and go back to playing it straight up as they have in the past and depend on their athleticism instead of a disciplined attack. the only discipline they have had is to have one guy pound the ball in place for a few seconds to run some clock then go to the first piece that looks open. with lue it didnt work as well as it did with jj.

Ken Strickland

September 6th, 2010
12:25 pm

Now this is strictly speculation on my part, but based on our roster, and the obvious input LDrew had in putting it together, I believe the standard idea of the PF, SF, SG, PG and C positions will be blurred in his motion OFF. When everyone is moving and screening, with the idea of creating switches and mismatches, it doesn’t matter all that much which position you started out playing.

One thing is certain, and that is LDrew’s motion OFF, along with our overall speed, quickness, athleticism and passing ability, will put an awful lot of pressure on opposing teams’ half court DEF. Drew obviously doesn’t feel a more traditional backup PG or SF is necessary, at least not at this point.

If he intends to play AHorford more at PF and Smoove at SF, wouldn’t it be logical to expect JJ, JaCrawford and Marvin to play more than one position as well? JJ certainly had difficulty playing PG in Woodson’s limited ISO, one on one style, but he might be perfectly able to play PG in LDrews motion OFF, which won’t rely on having a traditional PG with traditional PG skills.

Instead of ISO’s and post ups, our players will beat their defenders with speed and quickness, using back cuts if they overplay, and jump shots or drives to the basket if they lag behind or get picked off. As fans, we’re still thinking in terms of traditional positions and approaches, while LDrew is thinking nontraditionally. He’s looking to create a guard and wing oriented team that will create match up problems for the more traditionally constructed teams, much like the Suns have successfully done over the last few yrs.

The main difference is the none requirement of a dynamic PG like SNash to make his OFF function. It sounds to me as if he intends to introduce actual TEAM BASKETBALL to Atlanta and the NBA, instead of the STAR POWER ONE ON ONE BASKETBALL that’s dominated it over the last couple of decades.

Grandad

September 6th, 2010
1:13 pm

doc

“Management must speak with one voice.
When it doesn’t management itself becomes
a peripheral opponent to the team’s mission.”
‘Pat Riley’

“There are only two options regarding commitment.
You’re either in or you’re out.
There’s no such thing as in-between.”
‘Pat Riley’

“There can only be one state of mind
as you approach any profound test;
total concentration, a spirit of togetherness, and strength.”
‘Pat Riley’

“The Ten Commandments were not a suggestion.”
‘Pat Riley’

“Being ready isn’t enough;
you have to be prepared for a promotion
or any other significant change.”
‘Pat Riley’

I don’t usually refer to Pat Riley;
but on this occasion he seemed to help me express
how I think as a coach.

LD is not me, however I would hope he has the kind of
*moxie:
[piss & vinegar, backbone, nerve, boldness, defiance]
-continued-
[resolution, will, balls, ardor, fortitude, staying power]
-&-
[courage] to approach this job in such a way that he would
not abandon his conviction because a player or players
will not submit to the team.

He must be willing to put it on the line,
even with Josh or Joe to dictate his will.

If he must change his beliefs to suit the players
then he is no better than Wdsn.

I think it was important for him to bring in;
Collins, Powell, E.Thomas. *[they will be all in]
Also to win the battle for Pape Sy [management].

Any Coach worth his salt wins those *battles.
*[players & management]
I’m telling you from experience.
He must. He cannot give in.
I’m pullin’ for the guy.

Rick Sund

September 6th, 2010
2:10 pm

I am not back from vacation yet, so expect a decision on Jamal in about 7 weeks.

We are evaluating players and coaches on a daily basis. We have the same young core, and our goal this year is to finish in the top 4 in the East and win at least ONE game in the second round

Best,
Rick

The Truth

September 6th, 2010
2:32 pm

With all the chatter lately about Teague as being the next PG starter of the Hawks and Jamal Crawford being a heartbeat away from the trading-block; Not much chatter about the prospects of Jordon Crawford emerging as a contender for the starting PG position in a combo guard role. As Ken alluded to, in LD motion offense, so much is possible including this idea. If Jordon Crawford emerges as a multi-talented player which he did show in the summer league, then it could boaster credence to this idea (if LD hadn’t thought of it already). In this scenario, Jamal Crawford keeps his job and Teague or Bibby becomes the odd-man out while Pape Sy becomes the third option. If Jordon Crawford turns out to be “The Truth”, (and that’s a big if) then playing him as a combo guard along side Jamal and JJ could put a tremendous amount of offensive pressure of the opponent in a Princeton Offense design. When you think of this set, think of Gilbert Arenas and his role with the Wizards. When you really think about further, a combo guard role for Jordon is the only scenario in which he and Jamal could coexist. He can do no worst on defense compared to Bibby (not sure about Teague)

jason

September 6th, 2010
2:34 pm

Grandad i do not want to give out my sources. just know that we are signing him before halloween

ant banks

September 6th, 2010
2:44 pm

JASON,

you sound like an effin’ idiot. YOUR sources tell you that we have signed, not WILL SIGN, but have signed jamal and the team will announce before effin’ halloween? mf that is 8 weeks away. lol.

why would we sign crawford BEFORE we know what we have in teague or jc2? they could be jus’ as good as jc and a lot cheaper. plus, the hawks are signin’ horford before we sign anyone else.

you are an effin’ idiot. lol.

ant banks

September 6th, 2010
2:56 pm

check out eddie jordan and ernie break down the finer point of the princeton motion offense. i am wit’ ken. the hawks will be jus’ as good or better this season. i like ecf, too.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=4&ved=0CCcQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DX9WZoTYdsQE&ei=5TiFTLSJDsXflgevs9wy&usg=AFQjCNE1ewYeaGp2Wbo_A_0DOelZr0YvcQ

Grandad

September 6th, 2010
2:59 pm

jason

So, you have inside sources.
I see.
Good to know.
Keep us posted.
When are they going to announce the trade?
Sept. 14th or wait until Columbus Day?

northcyde

September 6th, 2010
5:41 pm

Offense . . offense . . offense.

Hawks had the #2 offensive rated team last year . . . but the #13 rated defensive team last year.

The team characteristics, for the most part, of championship caliber teams are:

1) they usually have a top 10 rated defense ( even top 5 )

2) they usually win 24+ games on the road

3) they are usually a top 10 rebounding team

4) they are usually an efficient half court offense.

******

As the great womens coach from the U. of Tennessee ( Pat Summitt ) always says:

“Offense sells TICKETS . . Defense wins GAMES . . Rebounding wins CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!

Rev in Tampa

September 6th, 2010
7:23 pm

Northcyde, I agree. That is why Jamal is more valuable to the Hawks as a trading chip.

Jamal is my favorite Hawks player. His smile is infectious and he genuinely loves playing for a winner. And any time he has the basketball he is able to make special things happen. But because Jamal is so good he can bring serious trade value.
Its just business…

northcyde

September 7th, 2010
12:26 am

It’s the entire team though Rev. Even in year’s past, when the Hawks weren’t switching everything, these guys would have big time defensive lapses in games.

Guys like Crawford and Bibby may be the biggest liabilities, but our other guys just aren’t consistently good defensive players at critical times.

Josh Smith bails this team out A LOT, with his hustle plays . . then will turn around and kill us with lackidasical closeouts on shooters and not boxing out on defense for rebounds.

JJ may be our best perimeter defender, but he only seems to really lock in on defense when he’s playing against another star player. And his closeouts are weak at times as well.

And those are just the team leaders. I won’t even go into the other guys and their lapses. The bench guys were horrid on defense last year.

For this team to get to the level where people want them to be, we MUST become a much better defensive team, not a much better offensive team. It is highly unlikely that our new offense is going to turn us into Phoenix East, like a lot of people want to believe. So we must find a way to improve defensively and get to that next level as a team.

This team has to be able to win games, when they don’t break 90 points, like Boston and San Antonio do.

One of the best games this team played last year, was that ugly 80 – 75 win @ Dallas. The Hawks couldn’t buy a basket in the 2nd quarter in that game, but played defense well enough to not let Dallas run away with the game. Then when the offense started to somewhat click again, the defense was able to hold off Dallas when they made that final run.

That’s when you’ll know that this team will be ready come playoff time. When we can win ugly, especially on the road.

Michael (free booty) con & H a m

September 7th, 2010
4:14 pm

“Horford and Hawks hoping they have enough guys who can do this…” – get dominated by Howard? Go a whole year with out shutting down an opposing center? Have a career 12pt average? Finish 25th among centers for block shots?

Michael (free booty) con & H a m

September 7th, 2010
4:18 pm

Yeah management is stupid and thats why the hawks cant be champions. The offense was on par with the lakers while the defense was… well you never going to win a championship with your center rated as # 25 among centers for shot block and 60% of the people who attempted shots over horford in the low post scored… those who did not often got to the free throw stripe seeing he commits 3 fouls for every 1 block shot. Defensively he reminds me of a live fish on the beach just flopping around….

Atlanta Hawks: Al Horford: ‘I am going to war with who I’ve got’ (Update: Hawks sign Etan Thomas)

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Atlanta Hawks: Al Horford: ‘I am going to war with who I’ve got’ (Update: Hawks sign Etan Thomas)

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