Atlanta Hawks: Summer reading: Al, Jamal, Etan and Pape

eighth

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ok so i Tied for First…but anyways.

MC
Its pretty obvious the Hawks cant keep Jamal and sign Horford. What are some viable options for the Hawks with Jamal….Sekou Smith mentioned packaging Jamal, Smith for Carmelo. What are you Thoughts

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Yeah top 10!

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I’m happy with signing Etan. He’s a decent big man. At least we’re doing something. Granted I think we could’ve done so much more. Hopefully we can at least work a sign and trade after this upcoming season for J Craw. That or perhaps resign him. Of course I would’ve preferred signing J Craw and Horford rather than giving JJ the biggest contract in the NBA. That’s just me. Looks like our team is pretty much in place. Hopefully it’ll be an exciting year. I still predict approximately 46 wins. 5th seed in the East.

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T Prince is more of a wing forward than guard. That’s what I like about Jamaal. Granted Prince is a leader and would fit in well. I’d like to keep Jamaal especially considering he wants to play in Atlanta and deserves mid market value comparable to a Ben Gordon type.

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What about re-signing Al to a near max deal and packaging him and JC to Denver for Melo and JR Smith? This would allow the Hawks to retain Josh and his defensive/athletic prowess while moving Marvin to the bench to make way for Melo. JR Smith would be the backup to JJ and the Hawks could use the rotation of bigs (Zaza, Powell, Etan?) to fill in for Horford. Starting lineup of Bibby, JJ, Melo, Josh, and ___ seems pretty competitive to me. Would this work?

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@LKT

JR SMITH has redflag written all over him. No Way he comes to ATlanta esp with our already fragile locker room situation.

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The hawks need to trade Jamal Crawford for J.R Smith & sign Josh Boone instead of Etan Thomas!!!

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If they trade Jammal i hope they don’t oopsy like they did with Josh Childress with a 2nd round pick.

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I understand JR is a headache. Denver knows this too well…and that’s why they may not be willing to move Melo to ANY team w/o JR included in the deal. True, lockerroom chemistry is a legitimate concern, but I would take that chance for the Melo prize.

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let’s get off the hypothetical trades…”package bibby, marvin, and mo evans for melo, and whoever…” this is like packaging ISH for a bag of gold. be serious.

LET’S DEAL WITH REALITY. PLEASE.

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Dos Hawkquis

Welcome back.

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@MC “they talk all the time about how they like that their guys don’t make bad headlines. JR already has a couple of those under his belt.”

So does Melo – dude punched (well, slapped) Jared Jeffries, got a DUI and possibly a possession charge for weed as well (might be mixing him up). I don’t think any owner would worry about Melo’s bad headlines, so I don’t see why packaging JR would be a deal-breaker.

The Hawks should take any headlines they can get.

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I don’t understand Jamal Crawford. I get wanting to be paid. Who doesn’t? I get he had an outstanding year last year. But, what I’m starting to question is how much he likes it here. He seems like a great guy. Does he just simply not really like the guys on the team?

I know the Hawks brag about the fact that no one gets in trouble. But, I’m convinced Joe Johnson is an a$$hole after his stupid coments and his refusal to apologize. Josh Smith is great, but he does not play hard all the time. Bibby seems like a goof. Does Jamal just hate these guys?

Can’t think of any other reason. He claims he likes it here. So, why not play out the last year of the deal? Why get traded to an unkown team? Only thing I can think of is that Jamal just does not like his teammates.

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I seen on NBA.com that the only way we trade jamal would be to improve our team which i hope is true….
But MC did u read the tweet by Sam Amonica(or something like that) where he said we are confident we would resign Jamal? Is he totally off base…..?

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Section 303,

Jamal wants to get paid because his value is at the highest it has EVER been. 18 ppg last season and SMOY.

What if he gets hurt this season? His contract value goes down for next year. What if we get a new CBA next year? Then his contract value goes down.

Given Drew’s motion offense, the fact that Teague could see more PT, and Marvin might actually play better, Jamal’s ppg average is likely to go down. As a result, his contract value ges down.

It is in Jamal’s best interest to request a new deal.

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As for how you feel about JJ, you are entitled to your opinion. But I think you are off base.

Except for the one bad comment JJ made about the fans and not really apologizing, what else has he done in his 5 years here to make you think he is an A-hole?

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Maybe

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For you Chicago Lovers

Hoopsworld top 50 players 3 Hawks in top 25 and No Bulls

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=17213

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MC – Flip Murray at vet min would be an adequate replacement if JC1 is traded. Anyone still remembers him?

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MC: This statement

“It still doesn’t look like the Hawks are going to offer Jamal Crawford the kind of long-term contract extension he’s looking for”

According to who or are you being coy with us at the expense of Jamal’s imagine? Per your reference link, Jamal’s “alleged” statement came from another person with “supposedly” knowledge of the situation. Since it did not come out of Jamal’s mouth, could his desires have been taken out of context? Was this other person his agent or some close friend putting his spin on the situation? To some fans, the presentation of this story which as been duplicated many times through out the media is casting a negative imagine on Jamal so telling the story correctly is very important.

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If Jamal is traded, trade him for A CENTER!!!!!!!!

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All of the worthwhile just signed big deals and are untradable at this point. Unless the Hawks wait and get Dalembert from the Kings who I think could be traded at the beginning of the season because he would be part of that team for 3 months

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You have to love Ron Artest, I’m so ready for this up can coming NBA season. Ron Artest takes on Doc Rivers via Twitter

http://www.foxsportswest.com/08/30/10/Ron-Artest-takes-on-Doc-Rivers-via-Twitt/landing_lakers.html?blockID=300600&feedID=3687

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Etan gets signed. i want to see the hawks go after jerry stackhouse and allen iverson

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David Lee got 6 years $80 million. Offer Al 6 years $85 million and go on about your business that’s basically what he would get on an open market if he were a free agent in this class with Boozer and Lee anyway. As for Jamal, call those 3 teams back if they have a C, SF, or PG worth talking about that does not send you into luxury territory anytime soon. Keep it simple “dumb Sund of a GM”.

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Still smh@ them about to sign Thomas. Dude has health and injury concerns. He is not the same player he once was. Why not sign Boone who is younger, grabs more boards, and blocks more shots. He also doesn’t have the health and injury concerns that Thomas has………As for Jamal. take the best offer you get for him and call it a day.. Jordan Crawford and a guy like Flip Murray would provide the scoring off the bench.

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I say trade Jamal, Mo, and Za Za for Lebron(Just Playing), I think we got a good team, we better have a good enough team to compete for a Title because Im tired of getting laughed at EVERY year, well not EVERY year, just every year of my life thus far!

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“Smoove had to go out and get an offer; once he did, we matched….now tell me why shouldn’t that have been the right approach with Marvin, who was going to be a RFA, not un.
Same for Al; let someone else make that offer.”

If anything, Smoove should have been offered a contract by the Hawks and Marvin should have gone out and found a deal on his own. Smoove had accomplished far more for this team when he was up for restricted free agency than Marvin. I can understand the sentiment to let Al go out and find his own deal like Smoove, but to be fair, Al means a lot more to this team than Marvin, and not extending him the formality that Marvin got wouldn’t look good. I’d rather they just give him the David Lee deal and move on. This team really seems to do exactly the opposite of what makes sense sometimes though.

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Oh yeah and David Lee. That makes four top-4 fantasy players for Golden State.

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How about Jamal and Bibby for Mo’ Williams and Daniel Gibson from the Cavs? Trade Machine says it works, and –

Gives the Hawks a young legit PG who can score

Gives them a 47% 3pt shooter in Gibson, and a 42% 3pt. shooter in Mo’

Saves ASG about 3m in salaries for this year – and Mo’ is a Free Agent after this year. Hey, Jamal wants to leave…Bibby can back up Session’s in Cleveland.

We would probably have to throw in a 1st pick also, but it could be worth it.

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“How about Jamal and Bibby for Mo’ Williams and Daniel Gibson from the Cavs? ”

Any trade that involves the Hawks getting something of value for Bibby is worth considering, but Boobie Gibson is owed a lot of money for what he does (three more years at $4 million per year for a guy who isn’t even a real point guard), and Mo Williams expires after next year, not this one. That’s a little too much additional long-term salary for not enough of an upgrade in talent.

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Who is etan is he good ? if not what a waste.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!

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STEVE W i like that trade william and bibby for mo but the problem is the hawks traded chill your best small forward on the team, so if you trade marvin who play small forward ?
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!

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jason

“MC if we sign pape do we send him to the d league.
Ive heard *rumors that we would”

Just curious as to your sources? *[rumors]

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GEE MACK,

Thanks bro!! i read the blogspot daily and religiously, just been taking it all in and haven’t post since April. lol.

I really like what we have in the Hawks. JJ, JSmoove, Horfy and JCrawford were all arguably all stars last year and we have them under contract. Add a young point guard in Teague, known scorer in Jordan Crawford…a motion offense for Bibby and Marvin to get them moving off screens for their shots…a decent back up center in ZaZa, plus 2 extra bodies in Powell and Etan, I think that we will do just as well as we did last year as far as wins.

I think if the Hawks wait until February to trade JCrawford, we could get a viable center to go into the playoffs. IMO.

I THINK THAT WE WILL BE BETTER THAN MIAMI!!!

“I don’t usually watch basket ball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends.”

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Najeh – the wing defense being supplied by Mo’ Evans and Carney…

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And KenS – I’m for us signing Etan BTW. If we’re just going to sing a Vet Min., LD must think we need Big Interior Defense – Boone is only 6-10 (officially, I’ve heard closer to 6-8, but I’m not sure) 240 – Etan is a beast. Skinner would have also fit the bill.

I would assume we will rotate, JC3, Etan, and JC2 as the 13th guy deactivated, barring injuries on the roster of course.

I think Etan can play Dwight very well for 5 minute spurts. And not just Dwight. Good 3rd Center in my opinion. His stats are better than Collins in almost every positive statistical category

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If we sign Horford to the max – 13.3-13.6 mil. next year – we will have about 65m tied up in 8 players, barring any trades etc. Now I see the fascination with 2nd round picks and D-League guys – they’re even cheaper than vet minimum guys. Most in the $450,000.00 – $500,000.00 range. We will have to sign 5 guys for minimums with the new CBA probably, for sure basically with the current CBA, next year. Unless we keep our 1st pick, then only 4 guys.

Hello Pape Sy, Gladyr, Aminu, Siler, Hendrix, Jackson etc.

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KenS – The report I read is to get Sy accustomed to NBA type play. A little different than overseas as you know, and NBA type players are different as well. Really a smart move to bring him over in my opinion, if the cost is not to much to pay Le Havre.

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SteveW, Miami will be under the same cap as well… Especially if its a hard cap.

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If we trade Jamal Crawford we will be a 7 seed in the East next year.

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draft*

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Just trade Jamal for a lottery team’s 1st round draft pick.

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Heh, heh, heh. Best post all day….

truthspitter

August 31st, 2010
6:43 pm
David Lee got 6 years $80 million. Offer Al 6 years $85 million and go on about your business that’s basically what he would get on an open market if he were a free agent in this class with Boozer and Lee anyway. As for Jamal, call those 3 teams back if they have a C, SF, or PG worth talking about that does not send you into luxury territory anytime soon. Keep it simple “dumb Sund of a GM”.

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Reggie

Dude, just because they say that white man can’t jump, you need to get off of some of the good stuff. Fernandez is the truth when it comes to creating his own shot, taking it inside and having a ton of potential. Who would you suggest?

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I like the idea of trading for Rudy Fernandez.. I can dig it.

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I think the Hawks will be in a “no-win” situation with Jamal regardless of their decision. If they trade him, it could be bad PR considering the positive impact he has had on the team and how well he has gel with the fans. In fact, to some fans, he may be more popular then JJ considering how JJ snubbed us in the playoff while Jamal played his heart out in a losing effort. Jamal has expressed a fondness for the Hawks and the city which contradicts the negative perception of Hawks and this town around the league. On the other hand, if you extend him a contract, as some have already mention, it could potentially create an unbalance team if Jordan Crawford becomes legit and gets unhappy due to a lack of PT. But, if Jordon development becomes slower then expected, then rewarding Jamal an extended contract would be the best move but likely an expensive luxury tax move.

Also, trading Jamal for some other player(s) for equal value could be costly and a setback as well since the Hawks have nearly maxed out their cap space with the expected additions of Thomas and possibly Pape Sy. So any new contracts from the Jamal trade would add more salaries beyond the current year if it’s not expiring. Again, they end up in the forbidden luxury tax land. However, if the new player’s contract is similar to Jamal’s expiring contract, then this would beg the question, what did they gain? They are now in the same situation as they were with Jamal. Surely the Hawks wouldn’t resign the new player because it would clearly contradict their rational for moving Jamal (as a business budgetary matter only) and not about any team improvements. Thus they would have traded a vital impact player for nothing in return.

The only glimmer of a reasonable scenario in trading Jamal would involve obtaining a similar expiring contract, a 1st round pick and more TPE. This would net us something for his services and set the stage for moving Marvin if he doesn’t pan out.

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Ahh you’re correct northcyde. My bad Ken Strick i see now. Still, Zaza was terrible last year. He has to get it together this year because the other back up bigs are very ehhhhh

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@MC how about this..melo and balkman for jamal and marvin…im thinkin mo evans in there also if not he can back up melo..sign ethan and even take achance at signiin iverson he is in atlanta workin out has there been any talk on him???…this lineup looks good

AL HORFORD—J.COLLINS/ZAZA/ETHAN THOMAS
JOSH SMITH—J. POWELL/BALKMAN
CARMELO—- (maybe mo)
JJ— IVERSON/JC2
MIKE—-JEFF T.

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Pendegraph said there was not one player in the mid to late 1st rd who could help the Hawks this year, but yet they’re talking about bringing Pape Sy over? Doesn’t make any sense. I’ll believe it when I see it. Guess he meant to say there’s no one in the 1st rd that could help us, but there’s someone in the 2nd. lol!

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No real news of yet. Sy and Thomas are still just rumors. I’m intrigued by Jamal’s decision. It gives us a chance to see someone put real vocal pressure on ASG to see what they’ll do. It puts Sund on the spot to make something happen. Is luxury tax worth the risk? Would Jamal play out his deal hoping for a better one after the season? Would we get a decent value for him in the form of a SF, PG or C? Are some of the chemistry issues related to Joe/Jamal as suspected earlier? If so will ASG dump Jamal to make Joe happy? Too many questions and no one to really give us answers? We just sit and wait.

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It appears that the only way a member of the Sacred Core gets to leave Sund Island is if they make enough of a fuss. Otherwise, the sick love-affair with a roster that taps out in 4 2nd round playoffs games, stays in tact. I wonder if Sund has a Status Quo target built into his employment contract with the ASG?

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Najeh -”I can understand the sentiment to let Al go out and find his own deal like Smoove, but to be fair, Al means a lot more to this team than Marvin, and not extending him the formality that Marvin got wouldn’t look good”. Wait, Najeh, shouldn’t you have compared the value of Smoove to Al over Marvin, because we see Marvin getting the royal treatment for whatever reason I have yet to see.
There are guys out there more serviceable than Marvin and making 2/3 less.

Are you saying that the Hawks admittedly made a mistake by forcing Smoove to go get his own deal before matching it?
The point I was making is that the only contract that has made sense has been the Smoove contract. For a team cap-stricken, you have to balance out all your pawns. Sund and the ASG are not doing that. They aren’t getting the most bang for the buck and could do better…that is all I am saying. It would have been interesting to see what Marvin would have been worth on the open market and Bibby’s prior contract made him look like an easy decision. I still have hopes that Zaza will do something, anything, more consistently.

And yes, with the CBA talks coming, I can see giving Al an offer, and I wouldn’t be surprised if it was David Lee level. What is working against the ASG and Sund is that they say they are going to bring in help, yet pull their handful of ‘vet minimum cards’ out EVERY stinkin’ year and we are supposed to buy into that as the way to fill a roster with worthy bodies.
Collins just doesn’t do anything / Randolph Morris was a huge disappointment to me/Mario West is :45 of chaos….Joe Smith….a good locker room guy who had no chance of getting minutes and probably didn’t deserve any…..now we have Etan Thomas and what’s left of his health…I can’t wait to hear about he and Collins giving Horford all he can handle in practice, then come in and draw 2 fouls in 2 min.
The key to this team and will always be for as long as they are here are Mo/Bibby/Zaza….what you got out of them last year wasn’t worth anywhere near what they made as a unit.
It still blows my mind to see the numbers they gave to Marvin without any threat of him leaving…and then had the nerve to make Smoove sweat out the Philly offer that never happened (I bet Philly regrets that one every day), and then Memphis finally saves Sund’s hide.

Now we are expecting great things from our draft picks with the gritty defense they bring. I have never heard of JC2 playing defense of any magnitude and the Frenchman is just an athlete at this point….did you see his numbers last year?

A new season, a new reason to be optimistic…….

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[...] AJC reports that Atlanta isn’t ready to pull the trigger on a Crawford trade anytime soon: “As for Jamal’s value on the trade market, I’m [...]

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or jamal for HINRICH then marvin for TRAVIS OUTLAW

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Typical hawks dump the 6th man of the year and try and replace him with Flip Murray ROFLMAO the guy doesnt even have a team now .

Its gonna be hard to move Crawford for someone that can help us more than he can

I think Jamal is upset because he was under the impression that the Hawks wanted him around longterm thats why Sund asked him to remove his opt out before trading for him . If Sund doesnt ask him to remove his opt out Crawford gets a fat new deal from someone else on July 1st and we couldve matched or let him walk .

Now that he sees he isnt in our longterm plans he decides to to try and at least have a say in where and when he is dealt as opposed to waiting around for us to send him to places unknown .

I think Jamal truly wants to be a Hawk longterm but if we dont want him longterm he wants to go to a team that does.

I dont think it has anything to do with the players or coach its about Sund showing up at jamals house and making him think he was interested in Crawford being a hawk longterm and now MAYBE he is backing out after seeing the Marvin ,Bibby,and Zaza signing turn into disasters he knows jamal is the only chip we have worth anything and he wants to put him into play in February.

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And if Jamal doesn’t want to be here, I say oblige him – get him out. Same with any of the players, I only want guys who want to be here.

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Big & Tall!

Marvin is Big and Tall … Shouldn’t he be a PF?

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Hawks should trade Jamal Crawford and Josh Smith for Carmelo Anthony.

Hawks Roster:

PG – Mike Bibby
SG – Joe Johnson
SF – Carmelo Anthony
PF – Al Horford
C – Etan Thomas

It looks like we will have Etan Thomas while we will be weak at that position we will still have other good players to make up for that weakness.

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Section 303 . . . it’s not an issue that these guys “quit”. They simply couldn’t get it done. And in 08 – 09, Flip played horrible during the playoffs. I think he shot something like 32% FG, lower than the 36% that Jamal shot in last year’s playoffs.

Flip is a decent player. But he’s another guy that, once he got away from Woody and the ISO offense, struggled to play at the level that he did in ATL in other places.

Personally, I’m all for giving Jordan Crawford a shot to fill the backup SG role, instead of bringing Flip back, if a Crawford trade for ( hopefully ) a QUALITY big man goes down.

For college players, I personally look at guys who took NBA type shots in college. That is, if you were good at creating and making your own shot in college, that skill usually translates to the NBA. Guys who are “catch and shoot” guys in a college system, are more likely to fail on the NBA level, especially if they’re not the focal point of the offense.

That’s why a college superstar like Adam Morrison fails on the NBA level. He’s not going to have an NBA offense designed around his offensive strengths. So if he can’t create his own shot, his destiny is to be no more than a sporadically used “catch and shoot” guy.

Jordan took AND MADE NBA caliber shots while at Xavier. This gives him an advantage over the high scoring “catch and shoot” college superstar. And if Jordan proves that he can play both the 1 and the 2, I think he could possibly handle a Flip-like role on this team.

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So, is a new blog coming, or did the AJC just put up a different link to this blog to drive more traffic here?

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If we keep Jamal we need to deal Mo and Bibby to give us slots to sign what we need – SF & C.

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northcyde & Sleepy, we are going to have to agree to disagree on Flip. I would love to have him back. The Hawks are in a desperate need for tough guys. Filp is a bada$$. Love that guy. I was sad to see him go.

I like Jamal Crawford a lot, too, by the way. I just do not think he really wants to be here anymore.

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[...] an Extension?Bleacher ReportAtlanta has options with Al HorfordYahoo! Sports (blog)HoopsWorld -Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog) -ProBasketballTalk (blog)all 51 news [...]

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Here is the question: Can JC truly expect to get more than John Salmons? If any GM gives him more than 7-8 million a year, they will regret down the road. I’d offer JC a 3 year deal for around 25 million. If he doesn’t accept that, then he should go ahead and pack his bags. However, I would not trade him to any team that is in the Eastern Conference, UNLESS its Toronto, and I’m getting back Hedo possibly, or its Orlando and I’m getting Vince back.

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West – Cyde!

Ramon

West Side is the Best Side …that fool is straight up certifiable.
Did you see that KFC you tube clip of dude free-styling while waiting on his
$55 Double-Down order. I think that order was for him and Gloria James.

Notice the Boston deal is non-guaranteed.
Dude is Bobby Brown Bipolar! He need some Weed & Hennesay.

What is Boston thinking? The got Rondo and Donkey.

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Is JAMAL a better player than JR Smith?

JR SMith make 6mil a year….Kykle Korver 5mil a year. The player are GREAT shooter, but play no DEFENSE, Jamal’s market is about 5-6 mil(don’t forget Bibby 6mil a year).

Travis Outlaw 7mil(But younger)

He has already been over paid for his skill set, offer him a 2 year 10mil deal….If he doesn’t like it, get his money of the books.

He should have asked in the begining of the summer, we could have approached Anthony Morrow(4mil)

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Sec 303,

While I totally agree that Flip is tough as nails, he’s also a turnover machine. He’s rated 184th among all players in assist to turnover ratio.

Let me say that again: One Hundred Eighty Fourth in the league. That’s not good enough, despite the toughness.

That’s not even worthy of the league minimum in my opinion. And I DO like Flip’s game, but just say no to TO’s.

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“Mo’s expires just like Jamal’s, so it’s really a wash. ”

Not true. Mo Williams has a player option for the next two seasons for $8.5 million a piece, and unless he thinks he can make more on the open market he will not be opting out. Boobie Gibson has one year left after this year and a team option for the year after that.

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This reasoning of not offering Jamal an extension makes some sense. However, to win a championship (if that is the goal), quality depth is required. Any team that would potentially pay out nearly 80% of their cap to their starters and expect to win a championship is really playing in the fantasy league. Go Figure!

Horford’s extension would spell doom for Jamal Crawford’s extension demand but I have never thought that the Hawks would be offering Crawford another contract in the first place. That isn’t a slight at him or any of his accomplishments while in Atlanta. It is just that the team is committed to another shooting guard and really can’t afford to go any deeper at that position.

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Najeh – you are so correct on Mo’s contract – I got his numbers off of hoopshype, an guess the light blue for player option didn’t register with my eyes. Espn Trade Machine says it’s only 2 years, not 3 – but researching the net, it does look like 3 more years – blows that trade to smitherins unless we plan on luxury tax next year – I doubt it!

P.S. I gotta man up when I’m wrong! I’m wrong

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SteveW

Here’s your trade that I promised.
Not the one I had in mind.
I’m still studying as to whom I think
may wish to trade for Jamal’s services.

For those who want Melo.

G-dad’s one time offer to Denver for Melo:

Denver gets:
Jamal, Marv, Bibby, Mo, JC2, next yrs #1 pick,
& next years PHX #2 pick.

Hawks get:
Melo & Chauncey

Works on trade machine. *[except for draft picks]

We would have to pick up ‘two’ players to fill 13 man roster.
*a [2] guard
*and another versatle player. [defender]-(small forward)
**also assuming Pape Sy & Etan will be signed as well.

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All of you guys, please stop thinking that Mello would even think about coming to ATL. He is either going to NY, or maybe even LA where he can play with Kobe and compete against MIA.
I can see LA sending Odom and Gasol plus a draft pick to Denver to get Mello, it would also make sense.

We, as I said before, can maybe get Fernandez for Crawford, or possibly even Oden. Portland has too may C’s and Rudy wants to leave.

Sign Thomas, trade Crawford, since Sund messed up by signing JJ. (too late to change, so no sense in talking about it)

Let’s hope that JT will be fine, and that JC2 can really score at the highest level.

Zaza, either needs to step it up, or he needs to go as well.

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Zaza has potential, but he can’t block a shot to save his life. Sometimes looks like Hellen Keller trying to catch flies. I really hope things will change this year for him.

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Publix

Are you kidding me?
Gasol is NOT going anywhere – anytime soon! He is untouchable and Kobe would cringe if he saw your trade proposal! Lakers don’t need Melo, who
BTW is a high volume scorer! And, there’s only ONE ball in basketball!

Nice Try.

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BTW – For all the people that want Rudy Fernandez for Jamal, why do you want to trade 1 player who doesn’t want to be here for another? Fernandez said he is willing to sit out the next 2 years in order to go to Europe. I want somebody who at least half way wants to be here!

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Publix

I know shopping is a pleasure, but Zsa plays hard on defense.
He decapitates guards and never backs down.
There is more to defense than blocking shots,
Blocks are nice, but so is playing your position and offensive rebounding -
where excels on this team!

Zsa was always sparring from Woodson’s dog house and wasn’t used right last season.

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Yall trip me out wit these trade proposals knowing good and well the Hawks ain’t gonna make them happen.

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Clyde – You are probably so correct – but Jamal is the one who is possibly wanting to bolt – so we speculate.

How about this one – Kirelenko for Jamal and Marvin. Move Mo’ down to backup 2, sign Carney to back up 3 and I think you have yourself a very good basketball team, maybe better than now.

And I think the Jazz would possibly do it – Kirelenko will be a FA after this season, and the combination of Deron and Jamal in the backcourt would be deadly. Throw in a young Forward, well, they just might.

And we could probably re-sign Kirelenko for Marvin’s salary next season, because he would be 30 and sort of injury prone. Worth considering.

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Kirelenko is being talked about on the trading block – Jamal and Marvin for him just fits both squads – the Jazz need a SG, and Marvin would probably be the best SF on the team also.

It’s an East/West trade, so you don’t have to see the guys alot, and don’t hurt your playoff seeding etc.

And Kirelenko would be super in LD’s offense and Conner’s defense. He would make the guys around him better.

A foursome of JJ, Kirelenko, Smoove, and Al would be stout!

And I do think Mo’ Evans and JC2 could take Jamal’s spot fairly well – Mo’ and Carney would def. improve the perimeter defense. And Mo’ would be at his natural position of 2.

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And I think if you offered Kirelenko a 4 year, 24m deal next year, he might sign it – cheaper than Marvin. If not, you still have your MLE or draft picks to get another SF.

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* rummaging in the bottom of the Bargain Bin? ..

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MY TOP FIVE PLAYER
PG CP3
SG D WADE
SF LEBRON
PF AMARE STOUDEMIRE
C SUPERMAN
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!

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Roll Tide

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I’m hoping that the Thomas signing gets put on hold while a Crawford trade is explored…No need to sit two veteran bigs every game if Sund can find another in return for Ja Craw…Signing Thomas, possibly Sy, and getting two players in return for Crawford puts us at the roster max of 15 too.

Also, for those saying that Portland is loaded at center…We’ve got to remember that Pryz is injured and isn’t projected to be ready until Nov or Dec, and Oden hasn’t even set a timeline for his return…That team could play several months with Camby and LA as their only experienced bigs.

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O’Brien, you made my point about the insistence of this organization staying under the cap, but bringing bad signings into the equation.

The only ones that make sense from a value standpoint are Smoove and Zaza…Zaza being on the fringe. He still costs less than Gadzuric and the one who took his job in Milwaukee…gadzooks! He’s making 7.2M with the Warriors now….yes, put Zaza on that list.

That’s the only two that Sund has signed that makes sense…rookies don’t count. So you have a lot of mistakes within a 67M budget. Lots of wasted $$ for a 1st round playoff contender.

Again, I say let Al and JC1 play out this year, let the CBA work out the new rules and salary levels and then let Al and JC1 come back and then ask for their money. Chances are the numbers will be much lower….so no issue this year.

Then let the speculation begin, and put the pawns out there and let them worry where their next mega deal is coming from. We can match any Al offer, and if JC1 truly wants to be elsewhere, someone can come and offer something of value.

As much as I hated to watch Smoove go thru it, it was the right decision and the ASG/Sund were correct on at least one signing on this roster.

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To me it all comes down to whether Al wants to be here or not. We’ll have the $$ to sign him, whether it puts us in LT land or not. Signing Jamal is just whether you decide that now or then. I love Jamal, but he plays no D. Mo is suffering b/c he plays out of position. If we move Crawford for a very sericeable SF or C we instantly improve this team. Moving JC1 also allows room for Sy and JC2 to be experimented with. If we keep JC1 we need to move Mo and Bibby to open up room.

As for ZaZa it’s a niche thing. He was in Woodson’s doghouse all year. He thinks he’s a starter. He’s grumpy with decent backup minutes. He will play hard if he has a clearly defined role where he feels like a real contributor. Maybe LD will do as he said and start ZaZa some nights to go big. Can’t hurt. I think his effort is definintely linked to a lack of a defined role.

Same thing applies to Mo and Marvin. Give them a defined niche and use them. They can be serviceable starters who have the potential to really surprise you. Notice their impact on nights when Joe is out and they’re counted on. They usually put up big numbers.

Also, Rudy F fits the same mold. To get him we’d have to clear out JC1, Bibby and maybe even Mo to allow enough minutes for this guy to be happy. He wants minutes, not Europe. He thinks he can be a starter or at leaast 6th man candidate. Portland thinks he’s Mo Evans.

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[...] report to camp (and he would), but would it be a good look for the Hawks to have an unhappy camper? Atlanta Journal-Constitution The Hornets officially named Monty Williams—a longtime assistant and a nine-year NBA [...]

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Pending results of physicals, Thomas will be signing Friday morning at the latest.

http://hoopshype.com/twitter_media.html#ixzz0yNVdity2

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King Teezo, I agree, it is hard to keep spending your more than ever before hard earned cash and plucking it down to watch this same core do what we know their limits show. The 2 playoff runs convinced me of their limit. There is no excuse as all of them have been to that level before…to not win one game? To not defend your home court? To take plays off during the playoffs? Inexcusable and no one on that roster should have gotten a raise…I don’t care what the repurcussions are.
Had Joe walked, I know there are those who would have complained about it, but it would have opened up a world of choices within a stricken cap. IMO, watching LBJ leave Cleveland…this team would not have been struck as bad.
I think Sund is showing all his cards now; this is going to be his core 3…….Al/Smoove/Joe…..IMO, not good enough..there is an imbalance of strengths here.

One of our 2 PFs should go; fill the void at PG or C. Then go about your business and depend on your reserves. There should not be one guy who is at an untradeable level.

LD will not be the disciplinarian nor the offensive guru he is being touted as….there isn’t nothing that has pointed to his ‘genius’ as a leader….he will have his ups and downs and I have to accept it…but you don’t get a 2 year trial run if you are the only choice that makes sense.
Me, I would have rather had Patrick Ewing come in here and given us some of the Orlando Magic knowledge than Woody’s lieutenant.

I will take my medicine should LD exceed my expectations. But you are dealing with the same group…..JC1, Powell, Sy, and Thomas don’t count in this equation.

Keep trying to entice us ASG with your hawks ’secure your seats’ plan on the radio….what could possibly be the enticement here? Maybe LD and the guys doing a ‘core’ hug banner would do the trick.

Like my boss at work says, if you’re not with us, I don’t want you here.
I’ll sit this year out thank you.

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Food for thought on resigning JC1:

The current active 6MOY award winners in recent memory:
2008-09 Jason Terry Dallas Mavericks
2007-08 Manu Ginobili San Antonio Spurs
2006-07 Leandro Barbosa Phoenix Suns (now Toronto)
2005-06 Mike Miller Memphis Grizzlies (now Miami)
2004-05 Ben Gordon Chicago Bulls (now Detroit)
2003-04 Antawn Jamison Dallas Mavericks (now Cleveland)

The last 3 winners are the only ones still with their current team.

I see a change of address coming up for JC1 based on impact alone to this team and since he has 1 year left, I play it out with him. JC2 wiil have to step up.

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6 years

if we had 2 different coaches, with 2 different styles I would be feed-up with “CORE” also. We had the same coach with no offensive identity working to put square pegs in round holes.

Would you consistently trust Marvin to take someone of the dribble?
Would you consistently put your worst jump shooter on the perimeter?
Would you consistently ask your center to guard PG?
Would you consistently avoid exploiting mismatches?

These are the things are coach did for 6 years, the Hawks need a different coach to evaluate their talent. ASG thinks are talent was wasted and they made the wrong decision to fire BK instead of Woody.

I believe BK want to hire Drew 3 years ago, when he tried to fire Woody. This team looks like the DREAM BK wanted when he started. He probably built this team thinking DREW would run the Offense and Woody would be the “Defensive expert”…Woody had other plans…ISO, ISO, ISO.

ARE PLAYERS DON’T KNOW HOW TO SET A SIMPLE PICK, AFTER 6 YEARS UNDER THE SAME COACH….AMAZING!!!!

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Even though Larry Drew is a rookie coach, I dont see him as a ‘rookie coach’ simply because he has been with the Hawks for 6 long years! The only way he is truly valued as a ‘rookie coach’ is if he was hired to another team, other than the Hawks!

Also, I LOVE Jamal and everything about him, his actions on and off the court, his intellectual way of talking in interviews, etc..I will miss him but I do believe he is our best bet to getting Chauncey Billups here along with a SF other than Mo Evans. Dont know much about trade rules/machines/engines or whatever, but all I know is I want Chauncey and a SF!

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Crawford’s closest comparison from this offseason was John Salmons, who got a 4yr $32M deal, with a 5th yr $7M team option…With Jamal making $10M this year, that means that roughly a 3 yr $21M extension would give him equal value…I think that’s fair, but the Hawks do not need to be the team to give it to him…He should be traded while his value is at its highest (expiring contract) in order to balance out this roster.

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it just makes me sick that we gave all of that money to jj & now cant pay jj. i would have been much happier bringing salmons here for half the money we gave jj. we would have gotten a hell of a more competitive player. i really think that jc is a much better offensive player than joe ( shooter & passer) & jj is way overrated as a defensive player

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Now if we can’t sign Jamal, and it’s very possible we cannot, maybe ASG would go into luxury tax next season with:

Jamal, JC2, and 2 1st picks for Iggy from the Sixers. Then move Mo’ to the 2 spot, and Marvin backs up Iggy.

And yes I know Mo’ is not the player Jamal is. But I do think we underrate Mo’s defense. I think he would bring much more defensive intensity to the wing than Jamal. But of course, he’s not the player Jamal is – that’s why Jamal makes 10.8m per, and Mo’ makes 2.5m per.

If the Sixers want to rebuild, they clear cap space with Jamal, and get 3 more young players. But I would guess ASG wouldn’t go into luxury tax for that deal – maybe not any deal.

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Grandad – Great list of great players. I think mine would be more conventional:

Dwight – If I was going to start a team from scratch, and could get 1 player, I think it would be Dwight. He causes so many match-up problems, and is healthy.
LeBron
KDurant
DWade
Kobe

With Gasol a close 6th. I’m glad to see somebody else think’s Gasol is a top tier player besides me. The guy is so unstoppable in so many ways – and reports say he closer to 7-3 instead of 7-1. Just like they say KDurant 6-11 1/2 and not the listed 6-9.

And DeRon Williams 7th…I like Chris Paul, but let’s see how he comes back from his injury.

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Rusty, how do you know JJ doesn’t want to be here? Besides his ill-advised statements in the playoffs last year, can you offer any proof?

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SteveW
I went by [listed] pos.

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Grandad – Aaaah – didn’t notice – looking forward to your next trade – let’s just get these Hawks to the next level

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Rufus1 Rufus who said jamal was elite ? No one said he was all nba

You dont know what you are talking about if you think Korver or Outlaw has the same skillset as Jamal . They are NO WHERE CLOSE. JR Smith no where close and he would have a problem playing for any other team besides the Nuggets who have allowed him to get away with more stuff than most teams. He was dumped by Hornets and never touched by the Bulls before landing in Denver and was on good behavior one year to get that 16 mil and has attitude and behavior has gotten worse every year since then .

Please provide us with a link to where Crawford has had a ATTITUDE PROBLEM ? You are just making this stuff up as you go along .

Jamal was 18 and 3 and forced you to defend him with your #1 or #2 perimeter defender there is not another bench person in the league that does that .. We didnt ask Crawford to play setup man and he was more than willing and able to as he came here getting almost 5 assists per game.

Jamals value is that he can play both guard positions and basically is a starting caliber shooting guard coming off the bench

Why are we only watching the 4th quarter of these games ? You make no sense with this stuff especially that you think JJ is worth 22 million . Did you see the playoffs ? Bosh is not worth 22 million either but if JJ is the #3 sg and Crawford is the #10 sg in the nba then how come JJ is worth 22 million and Crawford is not worth 8-9 million ?

Kobe
Wade
JJ
Roy
Manu
Iggy
VC
Ray Allen
Rip
JC1

The hilarious thing is someone has now said that suddenly paying jamal 8-9 million at age 30 for 3 years somehow some big risk
.
Ray ray is 35 yrs old
Manu,VC,Terry 33 yrs old
Rip,Sjax 32 yrs old

I would say that if we were to extend Jamal to a 3 year 26 million dollar extension it would be a great deal and its still quite less than the majority of the rest of the over 30 sg’s have gotten the past couple of seasons .

I know we are not going to pay the luxury tax but instead of people just owning up to knowing the team would never pay they try and rip Jamal who has been nothing short of fantastic since hes been a hawk .

I look at a ton of these trades and they are a step back and I feel that we shouldnt accept going backwards at all.

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rev in tampa
do you really think jj was happy here last year. he didnt like shareing the glory with jc,he didnt like the fact that many fans liked jc style of play better than his. he didnt like being called iso joe,he didnt like jc. last year he opened his big mouth saying that he thought he was an elite player & then he had to try to prove it by taking the ball over in the forth quarter.he put tremendous pressure on him self & then showed the world that he couldnt deliver. i dont know why anyone would think he would be happy in taking a smaller role getting less shots & monopolizing the ball less. i think he will have even more pressure on himself to prove he is worth all of that money. i dont know what to make of these fans who think jj is worth 2 to 3 times more money than jc

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She got a Donk!

SteveW asked: “Drmaryb – How about Jamal, Marvin, and a 1st pick next year for Kirelenko and Feresenko (Utah should sign him any day now – RFA). There’s your beef! All 7-1 300+ lbs. of him.”

Take the 1st pick out of there and I might pull the trigga’ on a Gat!
That works for me! I like Beef-Cakes!

This trade would make the Hawks a reallyn really big team!
I like Big – Things! Wink-Wink!

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