Atlanta Hawks: Inside ‘Camp Drew’
L.D. (seated on right) as Spike Lee
Dropped in to Philips yesterday for the last day of Larry Drew’s “clinic” for his assistants. He took five days to school them on the finer points of his offense so they’ll have it down by the start of training camp. The Hawks also will run some “traditional stuff,” L.D. said, but the goal during this camp was to work on Atlanta’s motion stuff.
The lineup: Bob Bender as Bibby, Lester Conner as J.J., Duane Ferrell as Marvin, Kenny Gattison as Smoove and Tyrone Hill as Al. L.D. filled in for Conner late in the session.
(Not exactly the Hawks but, shoot, I wouldn’t mind taking that squad down to the rec league.)
L.D. recorded the session on video so he could show it to his players when camp opens Sept. 28– he said he felt like he was directing a movie, and Conner called him “Spike Lee. There were lots of cracks from the coaches about getting clowned by players once they see their old bodies working this hard. L.D. had to tell his assistants to take it easy a few times.
L.D. (understandably) didn’t want any video in the public domain. So I’ll try to explain what I saw even though pictures would do the job much better than words (also keep in mind the coaches were working against air). . . .
There was lots of motion and ball movement, yes, but what stood out was how much of the action had players cutting to the basket. It seemed there always was an option for the next man in the sequence to either accept the ball while moving to his position or reverse field and look for a cut to the basket. Not everything happens on the strong side, either, so ball-watching and inattentiveness by defenders can mean backdoor baskets.
“It’s very difficult to guard,” Conner said. “You have to be precise in your defensive schemes. You can be beat at any spot on the floor at any time. NBA teams don’t like to guard a lot of movement and screens. I’ve heard the guys [Hawks players] are all for it and are excited about it.”
For weeks L.D. has said his system would “force the ball to move” and I get that now. Things happen so fast there’s not much opportunity for holding the ball. The screens and cuts happen quickly and if the first option is not there then the ball quickly swings the other way, leading to move movement.
Not much possession time is spent on the one- or even two-man game. Each guy gets a chance to touch the ball at different spots on the floor. Decisions must be made quickly for things to flow correctly.
Some of my notes: “pindown screens with curl to free-throw line. . . dribble hand-offs, sometimes with roll man. . . backdoor cuts. . . high-post pick-and-pop. . . flare screens with roll man. . . ball reversal to quick weakside seal post-ups. . . high-low post-ups. . .”
L.D. has some philosophical principles to go along with the Xs and Os. He said he believes his system will work because the Hawks have so many “interchangeable pieces” to work with. Al will play some power forward with Zaza or Twin at center but Drew said the combinations won’t end there.
“We have the luxury a lot of interchangeable positions. We’ve got twos that can be play 3, threes that can play four, fours that can play five. We can even move Josh to the five against certain matchups. You might see the five at the three. You might even see the five at the one. [Regardless of lineup] nothing changes as far as the action on the floor. I want to utilize our abilities as interchangeable pieces.”
Such an approach could make the Hawks less predictable. It’s theoretically tougher to hone in on a player who is deployed at multiple positions and can be used multiple ways within the offense.
L.D. said his emphasis is on exploiting Atlanta’s strengths rather than covering for its weaknesses. For example, here are his views on Smoove playing minutes at small forward:
“He has the ability to erase a lot of defensive mistakes because of his athleticism. I won’t match him up against a lightning-quick guy where he would have to defend multiple screens. But he certainly will be able to play some 3. At the same time, he can be a tough matchup at the 3 as well. You play him at some 3, there is a high probability he is bigger than that three man, stronger than that three man. Certainly the way to take advantage of that matchup is to post him up. We will certainly try to utilize his ability against a smaller guy. It won’t necessarily be about us adjusting to what the other team does. We want to put the opponent in a position where they have to match up with us.”
It’s an aggressive approach. There certainly will be more turnovers. Theoretically there should be fewer isolations and long jump shots. I figure L.D. will have to use his bench liberally, too, if he wants the Hawks to run a lot of motion offense and while also becoming a bona fide defensive team. He’ll have to make lineup adjustments on the fly.
The Hawks are going to have to be in good shape to run this stuff; L.D. said conditioning would a “top priority” early in training camp. The Hawks also are going to have to be precise, unselfish and persistent. L.D. has some work to do with that Woody had a lot of stuff he wanted to run too but he never could coax guys to do it consistently. Things got tough and the Hawks freelanced.
Drew is going to have to break the Hawks out of their iso offense, sometime-y defense mold. It will be interesting to see how he manages it and how the players take to it once it’s time to do the work.
MC
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329 comments Add your comment
Grandad
August 11th, 2010
10:35 pm
Fundamentals;
Ajinca eligible for multi-player
trade on or around Sept. 13th.
Grandad
August 11th, 2010
10:47 pm
LD mentioned conditioning would be imperitive.
I agree.
Also, depth and a deeper rotation will be a
necessity as well.
Players will not be able to rest on the offensive
end as all will be involved.
Constant movement.
Honestly, I think LD will have no problem getting
players to buy in because everyone’s involved.
Rev in Tampa
August 11th, 2010
10:48 pm
@Fundamentals – “Bibby won’t be able to survive the motion.”
He’s only 32. He’s not in a wheelchair. Any NBA point guard can survive the motion. I am only concerned about his defense.
The Truth
August 11th, 2010
11:28 pm
Rev in Tampa (9:11 pm post)
“I hope” and “you expect”
What the difference?
Agreed on changing away from the switching defense; however, I think Woody abuse of the switching defense is what the core of the issue. It’s not as bad as some frame it to be. The Piston won their championships with the proper use of this defense. What makes it so effective is the element of surprise. When use correctly, you don’t know when it’s coming. Woody was so predictable until opposing teams setup their offense by baiting the Hawks defense into a certain formation; like forcing Bibby to matchup against their center. In fact, that was the Bucks bread and butter offense during the playoffs that took us to 7 games.
truthspitter
August 11th, 2010
11:30 pm
Rev in Tampa: If almost any PF will be available when a trade is talked about give me Dirk then. Furthermore, give me Granger for Marvin and 2 future #1 picks right now. I’m sorry but almost any player? There are certain players that are simply not available. There will not be a stretch PF worth having available unless you think a guy like David West is worth giving something up for when he will come off of bench.
Grandad: If Sund had any vision and wanted Murphy he could have gotten him, Nets only want him because he has an expiring, they gave up Courtney Lee who makes less than $2 million in the trade. The Hawks are not going to make a trade before season for sure, and I don’t think they are going to do anything before trade deadline. All this franchise does is underachieve then take shots at the fans when they notice a sinking ship and don’t want to go along for the ride
drmaryb (*_*)
August 11th, 2010
11:45 pm
Grand-Daddy
I see a spread of 15 points from the 1 & 3.
Joe should still get whatever he wants, since he will be option#1 to score on this team, if he has 2 defenders he should pass to the cutter going into the post.
Jamal will still get his 18 on the perimeter and inside. The two scorers should get to the FT line on every other cut to the basket. IF everybody is moving w/o the ball, there should be some curl backs to the three point line, or a roll to the basket if the lane is open.
I think there will a lot of improvising plays to make, when the play breaks down under the opponent’s defensive adjustments. So, there has to be some free-lancing too. It will take several months for everyone to get on that same page.
There will be a lot of turn-overs at first, but that shall self-correct over time.
You – Think?
i_am_soulstar
August 11th, 2010
11:47 pm
Will these guys buy into the system for at least 75% of the season? I’ll believe it when I see it.
But if LD can make this team do things that Woody couldn’t, I’m ecstatic about our chances to improve.
Rev in Tampa
August 11th, 2010
11:52 pm
The Truth,
I emphasized the switching-D as the major problem. As you correctly point out, it was the predictablity that made it such a liability. But, as I also said, the toughness is also a major issue. There is no way the Hawks team I watched last year will make it past the 2nd round of the playoffs if they do not toughen up mentally. This is certainly more evident to Drew & Conner than it is to me. I have heard them make several comments to this effect. Because they know it is an issue, ‘I fully expect’ them to address it as a priority. The Hawks are an elite team athletically. But they have to get their mind right. Even MC called their defense, “sometime-y defense”. Can you imagine this Hawks team playing every night, every quarter, with tenacity. Wow!
I still think that the Hawks are a significant trade away from moving into the NBA Finals, but even without a trade the Hawks defense should improve more drastically than the offense if they learn to increase their intensity on defense. It stands to reason since there is more room for improvement on defense than offense. By the way, it is defense that wins championships.
Jay
August 11th, 2010
11:57 pm
Who is Twin?
Rev in Tampa
August 12th, 2010
12:05 am
drmaryb (*_*), I learned how to cut an paste on blackberry yesterday. I was so glad to hear you say you couldn’t do it because I couldn’t figure out either. But once I figured it out it is quite easy.
1. Press the menu key and scroll toward the top. You will see “Select Mode”. Press it.
2. Go to the text you want to select.
3. Press and Hold down the “Lowercase/Uppercase” button on the extreme left or right hand bottom corner.
4. Use the scrolling ball to select your text.
5. Press the menu key. The menu will automatically be at “Copy”. Press it.
6. Go to the place that you would like to paste the text and press the menu key. The menu will automatically be at “Paste”. Press it.
Rev in Tampa
August 12th, 2010
12:11 am
Jay, I had the same question. Twin is Jason Collins. He has a twin brother that plays in the NBA.
I am still trying to figure out all the texting initials. I know was LOL is but beyond that I am still at a loss. I have gleaned that lots of it has a course meaning so I haven’t tried hard to find out. I will ask my teenagers when if my curiousity continues to rise. No doubt they know the meanings.
doc
August 12th, 2010
12:19 am
rod been hearing you on the josh thing at the three. i have been saying almost the same thing drew said today that he could be used to over power some threes on both d and o. i dont want to see him following a ray allen type though through screen after screen but that is usually what a two does on most teams ala what they did in detroit with rip. a lot of three’s dont do that so i can see josh doing quite well for short stints just like one would expect with al going to the four. no on had said or i havent heard you say al and josh should start at the three and four nor play 3/4 of a game in that position. now if they prove me wrong and look awesome at the new positions then keep them there. i just like that big line up possibility and would have liked to see it at least a few times during the season when we were getting our heads beaten in by playing as nire said, if plan a doesnt work then use plan b, try plan a harder.
Samuel
August 12th, 2010
12:20 am
I predict this offense will be a hit the first couple of weeks of the season. The Hawks always come out smoking. The problem will come in after these guys wear down from all that movement. There has only been one or two coaches who have been successful with the motion offense in the NBA. Ninety percent of the offenses are basically isolation and inside out. They put fancy names like :The Triangle and all kind of BS but in crunch time, they all look the same. I just don’t see Drew as being able to “sell it” for an entire season. Not with our weak as_ bench.
doc
August 12th, 2010
12:21 am
dr mb just get a mac…. command c then command v to copy. god i hate windows.
The Truth
August 12th, 2010
12:31 am
“the toughness is also a major issue.”
Agreed
When I did some stats analysis on the Hawks last season, offensively they were ranked similar to the Lakers in scoring (believe it or not) and that was in Woody’s ISO offense. But there was a major gap defensively between the Lakers vs. the Hawks especially rebounding and points allowed. As we applaud the coaching changes including a shift in strategies and mindset, I still believe the problem runs even deeper. As you pointed out, a “significant trade” may make the difference. We shall see
i_am_soulstar
August 12th, 2010
12:35 am
Samuel,
That’s agreed, but Drew himself will have to commit to negative reinforcement like Phil Jackson does. Run the designed offense or you’re coming out of the game. Run the offense from game to game or your minutes will be drastically reduced. But we don’t really have the bench to enforce that type of negative reinforcement, and although we do have the better guard depth than any team in the league (which I think we do), and we should be able to make it the guard’s responsibility to keep everybody moving, JJ and Teague are two of the most laid-back on-the-court players on the league.
What a difference it could make if those guys would just speak up.
Grandad
August 12th, 2010
12:36 am
Samuel
1st of all college & HS teams run it
Why not the Hawks?
2nd in the NBA Jackson & Sloan
get players to do what they want;
i e *[Triangle / Jackson],
*[Pick & Roll / Sloan].
If LD wishes to be successsful then
he must impose his will or…………..
Grandad
August 12th, 2010
12:46 am
truthspitter;
Thanks for the correction.
I missed the news, I caught the Collison part on the blog,
but did not follow up on the details. [Troy Murphy]
We, as you said, “if Sund had any vision”?
Another one bites the dust.
Once again, thanks for keepin’ an ol’ man current.
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
12:57 am
Rev in Tampa
Thanks a million for those easy instructions.
You explained it so a 3rd grader could understand it & that is definitely on my level when it comes to technology!
He He! Yipee!
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
1:06 am
Rev in Tampa
“Hey Look!”. I did it! Kewl – I am sooo smart! (smh)
drmaryb (*_*), I learned how to cut an paste on blackberry yesterday. I was so glad to hear you say you couldn’t do it because I couldn’t figure out either. But once I figured it out it is quite easy.
1. Press the menu key and scroll toward the top. You will see “Select Mode”. Press it.
2. Go to the text you want to select.
3. Press and Hold down the “Lowercase/Uppercase” button on the extreme left or right hand bottom corner.
4. Use the scrolling ball to select your text.
5. Press the menu key. The menu will automatically be at “Copy”. Press it.
6. Go to the place that you would like to paste the text and press the menu key. The menu will automatically be at “Paste”. Press it.
August 12th, 2010
(*_*). He He ……… I did it – real good! LOL
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
1:13 am
doc
Are you recommending I UPGRADE my ish?
rof & lol ….. & rof some more.
Grandad
August 12th, 2010
1:18 am
Mary Ellen;
several points:
*turnovers – more likely to come from being up-tempo.
Motion off does -not- lend itself to turnovers.
Fundamentals & concentration are a premium.
It is not a risky offense.
However, players -cannot- be careless!
It would be hard to predict who scores:
*In motion oft times the off. players are reading the def.
Therefore, the opposing coach may attempt to take
something away.
That’s the beauty – take one thing away – someone else
is open. *[imperitive, players must be un-selfish]
This is why LD keeps saying (5) players attacking.
This is not a star system!
This system is set up for balance.
Look for Joe and Jamal’s numbers to decrease.
[perhaps only slightly] *(offense)
Look for Josh & Al’s numbers to rise.
Marv as well.
I look for Teague to have a big yr. but assists are
more important to him than points.
*[asst. to t/o ratio may be the key to his success]
Bibby’s 3 pt shooting will determine his value.
I predict double figure scoring for Zaza.
*[Zaza returns to 12 & 8, as in his 1st 2 yrs wi Hawks]
Team Assists will be up:
* Look for more assist opportunities from more players.
* Wings hitting cutters.
* Post feeds [Zaza feeding Joe in the post]
not your typical assist.
The high / low feed is the best in b-ball
(it take away help)
* Look for Josh to get some triple doubles.
*Josh, pts, rebs, assts, [blks] quad double?
* the team shoud hit 20 assts every nite.
**[actually more]**
I hope I answered all your questions thoroughly.
MsDee
August 12th, 2010
1:33 am
I have a question for yall..
How well/bad do you guys think the Hawks will look with the NEW offense against the HEAT during the early Pre-season game??? Yall predict A LOT of turnovers or little to none??
My early prediction is I think we will look very uncomfortable being very early in the season, with very little time to clean-up the turnovers. Also, the nerves will get the best of them being that it will be a televisized preseason game on ESPN.
I really hope I am wrong and the Hawks come out FIRING FROM ALL ANGLES (literally) with all 5 players attacking every angle. NORTHCYDE and OTHERS who had a problem with the HAWKS never being mensioned as an elite team from the popular reporters/announcers, will finally get that opportunity if the Hawks can indeed suprise the whole NBA world with how well they look against the “SuperFriends” with their NEW OFFense and all!!
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
1:34 am
Rev in Tampa:
Your turn for some schooling:
OMG – Oh My God! (careful there – use this one carefully).
ROF – Rolling on Floor! (laughing position).
LOL – Laughing out Loud! (self evident).
SMH – Shaking my Head! (unbelievable).
SMDH – Shaking my Damn Head! (that’s a damned shame).
WTF – What the Eff! (don’t use that one – Rev!).
Effin’/Fkn – Woe! (A Lady can’t repeat that one!).
IDK – I don’t know! (self evident!).
WTH – What the Hell! (careful – Rev!).
Twin – Jason Collins’ Twin Brother is on His Back! (Over-Weight!).
Cheeseburger – Jason Collin’s 5 Food Groups! (he’s fat!).
Duck – Marvin’s Feet! (If it walks like a duck – it’s a duck!).
That’s about all I can think of right now.
Help me out fellas! We gotta’ skool the Rev in Tampa.
-smiles-
MsDee
August 12th, 2010
1:36 am
Now let me add, I dont really care if the Hawks win or lose that game cause it IS just a pre-season game that doesnt mean anything, but my opimitism will be HOW WELL THEY LOOK running it against the HEAT/Orlando.
Grandad
August 12th, 2010
1:40 am
MsDee – Look for the Hawks to be kind of vanilla
in the pre-season. (baby steps)
Grandad
August 12th, 2010
1:43 am
Mary Ellen:
Marv – I thought “Duck”
was a shortened form of
“Duck-Butt”.
Self explanatory, I suppose???
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
1:46 am
Grand-Daddy!
That is Change – I can Believe in!
I actually understood all of that.
I am sooo smart. (rof). I doesn’t sound as complicated now, but I am winded from thinking about it.
That means Joe better find his track shoes!
It reminds me of:
Reggie Miller
Ray Allen
Rip Hamilton
Jeff Hornacek
Josh Childress
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
1:47 am
Grand-Daddy!
And:
John Starks
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
1:49 am
Grand-Daddy!
And:
Ron Harper
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
1:58 am
Ms. Dee
IDK if Drew will run too much of it in pre-season.
Don’t want to show the league your secret weapons to do a film study – before the games count.
He may show a few wrinkles to test it out here and there, but very little of it.
IMHO (in my humble opinion). That was for Rev in Tampa!
LOL.
Hey Rev: I’m your Rosetta Stone?
Grandad
August 12th, 2010
2:06 am
For all:
The picture above MC’s article;
*(Bender dribbling)
shows an alignment of two guards, two wings, one high post.
On a secondary break, the two up top
(aligned as guards)
May very well be a [1] & a [5]
or a [1] and a [4].
Typically on a break, a Big [4 or 5] will
be the last man down.
So many times the offense starts with a Big up top.
The high post could even be Joe if LD wanted to set it up
that way. For match up purposes it could change from
game to game.
Same for [in] game adjustments.
I just used the picture as a reference.
that is only one set of many.
Grandad
August 12th, 2010
2:16 am
Mary Ellen
He most likely will run his base scheme.
[pre-season]
They will build on that base continuously.
However, pre-season is for learning & his
charges must learn quickly.
I agree – he will keep it vanilla.
Our Hawks will be ironing out kinks.
I think all season will be a learning process
and players will be growing into the offense.
He will not put everything in all @ once.
Plus, as players evolve, so will his offensive sets,
plays, and emphasis. Therefore the offensive scheme
will evolve as well.
drmaryb (*_*)
August 12th, 2010
2:26 am
Pentangle for Dummies!
Grand-Daddy!
Thanks for sharing your expertise on the new offense!
You are now in your element with the simple explanations!
You are a Teacher! KISS (keep it simple – stupid).
Sleepy
August 12th, 2010
2:43 am
Guys like Joe and Jamal who can pass ,dribble ,and shoot extremely well are gonna get there points in any offense .
I dont what LD is gonna do with Josh .I think its crazy to to think he can change him when hes shown that hes basically the new Rasheed wallace . A top teir talent who mentally cannot handle being one of the top two guys on a basketball squad . Put him on a team where he knows hes not the alpha and he will flourish .
vava74
August 12th, 2010
5:54 am
A bit off topic. However, I think it’s a balanced and fair view on our current situation:
http://www.peachtreehoops.com/2010/8/8/1611665/like-it-or-not-asg-got-it-right?ref=yahoo
People get too hung up on moves, trades, this and that and start over valuing marginal guys when the truth is that we have a pretty decent group and we are well positioned to make some moves IF AND WHEN necessary later in the year.
O'Brien
August 12th, 2010
7:12 am
northcyde,
Although I was not a fan of resigning Bibby, I was ok with the move. My issue was Bibby’s 3rd year is GUARANTEED. Andre Miller’s 3rd year is a team OPTION.
If Bibby’s 3rd year was not guaranteed, then he would basically be an expiring contract right now that we could package with another expiring (Mo Evans) for an upgrade. Instead, we have to wait until next offseason.
truth spitter,
One stretch PF that was available on the FA market was Anthony Tolliver (50 3ptrs in 46 games with GS). But he ended up signing with Minny for 2 years, $4.5 mil. I think he would have been good for the motion offense.
Unfortunately, we can only afford guys for the vet minimum.
Rev in Tampa
August 12th, 2010
7:29 am
vava74, thanks for the article. It sounds like they’ve been reading Ken Strickland and Grandad.
vava74
August 12th, 2010
8:07 am
Rev,
It’s just common sense!
Three seasons ago we made the move for Bibby mid way the year and that paid off handsomely.
Why shouldn’t we be patient and first see “who is worth what” in the conference and where we need help instead of over-spending or overreacting in the off-season?
Fundamentals
August 12th, 2010
8:15 am
Rev,
I guess I did sound too down on Bibby’s chances. I realize he’s only 32. I just got a bit sour when he basically checked out last season. The guy has the ability to command the floor and run our team anytime, but seemed to not be involved last season, especially when it counted. Was that Woodson or was it bad chemistry on our team? Time will tell.
LD & ASG basically bringing back the same team tells me it was the players shutting down on Woodson. Hopefully LD will garner their respect. Hopefully with real competition firmly in place Teague and Bibby will both excel trying to keep the starters minutes.
Both in my mind are very valuable. I tend to hope Teague can play 1/2 the game this season while supported by Bibby. That way he’s not under the pressure of playing the entire game…which he’ll need to do next season and thereafter to command our team.
Fundamentals
August 12th, 2010
8:16 am
I am a bit apalled that Murphy and Collison went so cheap? Was there no way for us to get involved?
Rev in Tampa
August 12th, 2010
8:20 am
Fundamentals, I agree with your comments regarding Teague. Bring him along in such a way that he can succeed.
Fundamentals
August 12th, 2010
8:32 am
I’d like to see the fire and determination that Bibby brought over from Sac town to lead our team to the playoffs and giving Boston a run the first time. Just seemed like the next year he lost that leader role and slowly took a back seat to everyone. Where’s our floor general?
Samuel
August 12th, 2010
8:40 am
Grandad,
Big difference in HS and College and the NBA. Also Sloan and Phil vs LD. You have an 82 game season plus playoffs. These guys pace themselves and I don’t see LD being able to change that as a 1st year coach making 650 grand a year. Plus, who’s he gonna put in when he “holds players accountable”, “pigfoot Collins”?
Like I said, you have one or two coaches who have been successful with it. We’ll see if LD has what it takes.
Is LD=LS/PJ?
Samuel
August 12th, 2010
8:41 am
JS
Fundamentals
August 12th, 2010
8:48 am
Samuel
I’m guessing LD isn’t going to run fast paced Princeton sets all the time to run us ragged. I’m guessing he’s going to have several looks or sets that we can run to keep the opposing defense off balance. We might actually see Teague or Bibby dribble up, command a play and see something besides handing to to the SG and running to the corner.
Anything new will be a blessing to all players compared to that.
Fundamentals
August 12th, 2010
8:51 am
With that comment above it still makes me tend to think Bibby’s gonna have to really buy in and want it to outcompete Teague for the slot. Kid’s got youthful energy and the will to prove himself in the league on his side. Bibby’s on the close to retirement side of things.
Rufus1
August 12th, 2010
8:59 am
A little perspective
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=17062
Rev in Tampa
August 12th, 2010
9:09 am
There was news early in the summer that Bibby was ready to step into a mentor’s role – play where and when he was asked to play and take Teague under his tutelage.
Bibby has lots of value to this team this year (he is not indispensable) because of the transition that Bibby will have to make, but after that I think his value falls off significantly. The ASG should have seen that coming.
Fundamentals
August 12th, 2010
9:26 am
Rev, that was the talk when they signed him and then Woodson did his usual, bench the kid. I do think Bibby has value to us or to other teams. His salary isn’t that extreme, though you can’t think that here.
Rufus1’s article post does keep it in perspective.
Our success is based on if we gel and if we can support LD from a player and van standpoint. I don’t think other teams are as critical on positions 11-13/15, but for us it seems we have to pick on something.
ASG and the Hawks can’t say they don’t have loyal, passionate and dedicated fans…though Mike may want to stop by my house and talk to me a while after gettin on him today a little. I just remember the Sac town days and his arrival. That’s what I want to see. I’m sure he does too, only this time we’ll get over the hump.