Atlanta Hawks: Getaway day

ROD FROM CP-You claim everyone agrees that the playoffs are when players are made, and you use that as an excuse for bashing Marvin. However, you’ve conveniently omitted any bashing or judgement of JJ or Bibby, and we all know they haven’t distinguished themselves in recent playoffs.

You also made mention of Woodson doing exactly what he said he would do, and according to you, that’s increase team wins each yr. Now don’t you think that same playoff scenario should apply to HC’s as well? You see, when GM RSund gave him that last contract extension, he made it clear to Woodson and everyone else, in no uncertain terms, that he would be judged based on how well he prepared his team, and how well they performed in the playoffs.

The BS you’re espousing about him improving the regular season record was a mute point 2yrs ago. WHAT YOU FAIL TO REALIZE IS WOODSON’S FATE WASN’T BASED ON WHAT HE WANTED TO DO, OR WHAT HE DID DURING THE REGULAR SEASON. IT WAS BASED ON WHAT RSUND AND THE ASG WANTED, AND HOW HIS TEAM PERFORMED OVERALL DURING THE PLAYOFFS, PERIOD.

People like you are so focused on one player you can’t see anything else that’s taking place. You are so quick to point out the teams annual improvement in wins, and their 3 consecutive playoff appearances when it comes to Woodson. But when it comes to your favorite whipping boy, MWilliams, you act like he had absolutely nothing to do with any of that success, even though he’s been a 4yr starter.

Hell, the ASG won’t trade him, and Woodson wouldn’t bench him or limit his mins. So, shouldn’t that tell you that MWoodson’s view of MWilliams, as well as the entire Atlanta Hawks organization, is totally different from yours? And trust me, theirs is the only one that matters.

TRUTH SERUM-you obviously lack the ability to think beyond your desires and emotions, if at all in some cases. A good example is your crazy opinion that Shaq is the answer for the Hawks at center rather than AHorford. Well, after Shaq and the Heat won the NBA championship in 05-06, the next yr they were 44-37 and were swept in the 1st rd. The next yr(06-07) they were 15-67, and that’s when they decided to ship his sorry butt to Phoenix.

Before Shaq arrived in Phoenix, in 05-06 they were 54-28 and lost in the Western Conference Finals. In 06-07 they were 61-21 and made the semifinals. In 07-08 they were 55-27 and lost in the 1st rd. In 08-09, when Shaq arrived, they we 46-36 and missed the playoffs. And like Miami, they immediately sent his sorry butt packing to Cleveland.

In 07-08, with Ilgouskas as their center, Cleveland was 45-37 and made it to conference semi finals. In 08-09 they were 66-16 and made it to the NBA finals, and in 09-10, with Shaq as their starting center, they were 61-21 and got hammered by Boston in the semi finals.

Since the 05-06 season, when he won the NBA title with Miami, Shaq has been a cancer, and hurt all 3 teams he’s played for. If he can’t help improve a team as a starter, how in hell can you expect him to help a team coming off the bench, especially if he’s opposed to doing it? STUPID IS AS STUPID DOES!!

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Sund again: “I think we’re pointed in the right direction. I’m hopeful we’ll improve with some changes to our offense and our young players getting older, and we can stay among the top four teams in the Eastern Conference.””

LOL! The guy doesn’t care about winning rings. He just wants to win regular season games. He even said it himself: The blowouts vs. ORL didn’t matter because other teams got blown out.

Worst GM in the NBA.

The guy said our only goal 2 years ago was to make the Playoffs with a winning record (LOL!).

KWAME BROWN IS OUT THERE. WE HAVE A TRADE EXCEPTION, THE MLE, AND 3M CASH FROM SELLING THE PICK. IF U CAN SIGN JOE’S UNDERACHIEVING @$$ FOR $125M, HOW CAN U NOT AFFORD FREAKING KWAME BROWN?

THIS IS BULLSH!T

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All Truth-serum does is Whine, whine, whine.

Over and over.

Whine, whine, whine.

And whining about having an All-Star center!

It’s like complaining about the farmers with your mouth full.

(Hint: You lose credibility)

Guess what T-s? Horford is and will be the starting center here, at the very least until he’s re-signed.

Read, ‘em and weep.

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I think Zaza gets more minutes at center, with Al getting more minutes at backup PF.

and I think that will work for the regular season. When given extended minutes, zaza looked better than he does in spurts.

And playing al at PF more lets us see what he has. And it lets him get a better idea of his talents.

Hopefully our frontcourt will stay healthy.

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“I don’t know what people expect out of Drew’s offense. I guess some think that we’re going to get a lot of lay-ups and easier shots closer to the basket. I think what will happen, is that guys will get easier looks at jumpshots.”

I think more than that there will be more off the ball kovement which will result in more fouls drawn. To me that is where the offense has the most room for improvement. With the athletic ability and talent that exists on this team they should be top 5 in the league in free throw attempts.

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Giving teague more minutes will help with penetration?

More likely giving teague more minutes will help confusion and turnovers.

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2010-2011 predictions are starting to come in.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100709194314AAnk4SW

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Sund again: “I think we’re pointed in the right direction. I’m hopeful we’ll improve with some changes to our offense and our young players getting older, and we can stay among the top four teams in the Eastern Conference.””

LOL! The guy doesn’t care about winning rings. He just wants to win regular season games. He even said it himself: The blowouts vs. ORL didn’t matter because other teams got blown out.

Worst GM in the NBA.

The guy said our only goal 2 years ago was to make the Playoffs with a winning record (LOL!).

KWAME BROWN IS OUT THERE. WE HAVE A TRADE EXCEPTION, THE MLE, AND 3M CASH FROM SELLING THE PICK. IF U CAN SIGN JOE’S UNDERACHIEVING @$$ FOR $125M, HOW CAN U NOT AFFORD FREAKING KWAME BROWN?

THIS IS BULLSH!T

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I don’t think LDrew or RSund agreed to resign JCollins just to see him sit at the end of the bench and do nothing, like last yr. We were pretty successful last yr with Zaza being the only backup to get mins at center. Unlike a lot of you, I don’t think LDrew, Sund, or the ASG feel we need to sign a center for the express purpose of stopping DHoward, and I agree wholeheartedly.

With Teague guaranteed to get significant mins, it adds one more player to the list of JJ, Marvin, JaCrawford and JoCrawford that can penetrate and draw fouls. It also means we’ll have at least 2 penetrators on the floor at all times. With LDrew’s commitment to playing an up tempo fast breaking style OFF, along with Teague’s speed and quickness, there’s no reason not to expect him to be able to hit 4-5 FG’s and 4-5 FT’s per gm.

You can probably expect him to go coast to coast at least once a gm. Marvin, JJ and Bibby are 3 of the NBA’s better open shooters, and LDrew’s philosophy of using screens and attacking the basket, instead of relying on shooting jumpers, will give these 3 players a lot of open shots. I believe we’ll have at least 6 players, JJ, Teague, Horford, JaCrawford, Marvin and Smoove, averaging double figures, with Bibby coming close.

Could we use another center, YES. Do we need another center, NO. We proved that with last yrs success. We’re not going to win an NBA title next yr, so why go over board with signing players. Our title run will start next yr, after we resign Horford and make a decision on Bibby, along with the expiring contracts of JaCrawford, JCollins and MEvans.

If we trade Bibby($5.56M), and let JaCrawford($10.8M), MEvans($2.5M) and JCollins($1M) contracts expire, we can save close to $20M. I think that, along with our $3.5M trade exemption, is enough for us to resign Horford, as well as sign a quality backup center and PG. Remember, some centers that were traded, and those that decided not to opt out of the final yr of their contracts, will be FA after the season.

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“Marvin, JJ and Bibby are 3 of the NBA’s better open shooters”

?????? Wow!!!! No need to even argue with you anymore.

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vava,

I disagree with northcyde (Turk is not a choke artist, because he was a big reason why they beat Cleveland last year), but I disagree with you as well.

If we are willing to give Mike Woodson the majority of the blame in ATL, then isnt it possible that Mike Brown (not Shaq) was a big reason for Cleveland’s troubles?

You said “Cleveland should have run more”, but they didnt. Some will say Hawks should run more, but they didnt. The problem with Shaq, is he does not fit “any system” any more. A HC has to take advantage of his positives, and minimize his negatives.

Mike Brown does not know how to do that (if you read Cleveland blogs, they have similar complaints about Mike Brown that we have about Woody). And in Phoneix, all Mike D’Antoni knows is 8 seconds or less offense. How effective can Shaq be in that system?

I’m not arguing chemistry issues, because I think Shaq can be a disruption there. But I dont think we should ignore the coaching for part of the blame.

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OB,

Charley Rosen’s article does not focus on the quality of player A or B but ON THE MERIT of the signings/trades given the teams’ own situation.

Hence, signing Shaq was a mistake for both PHO and CLE, as was a huge mistake for Philla to sign Brand and for CLE to sign Jamison (although Rosen endorsed this particular move going against his own past reviews of Jamison’s game).

With all this, I am not saying that if we signed Shaq I am sure that it would not work out. I very much doubt it would since I consider Shaq as a completely useless asset at this stage since mentally he is not willing to accept the (limited) role in which he could still help a team.

As for the 5 players combo with Bibby and Marvin being the most effective, I have not doubt of the following:

Marvin is not a liability. He does not bring enough offensively but was a very effective defender and versatile in the switch D.

Bibby can still play and I do not consider him completely washed up. The fact is that when Crawford played the point we were not effective at all since defensively we were still as bad and Crawford’s free wheeling offense is not good for huge stretches and alienated the rest of the bench, in particular when he played the PG slot.

In my opinion, Crawford played too many minutes last year and that had a very negative effect on both Marvin and Bibby’s contribution (and on the bench).

In the end, we were far more dysfunctional with Crawford’s addition than we were the year before with (gulp) Flip who had a more limited role but was more effective defensively at the PG slot and more suited for the job.

The 6 win jump can be explained by the fact that we did not have any major injuries and by Horford and Josh’s improved game, not by Crawford’s role.

Note: I like Crawford as a person since he seems a really nice guy but I doubt that he was (or even can be) well utilized.

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“Could we use another center, YES. Do we need another center, NO. We proved that with last yrs success. We’re not going to win an NBA title next yr, so why go over board with signing players. Our title run will start next yr, after we resign Horford and make a decision on Bibby, along with the expiring contracts of JaCrawford, JCollins and MEvans.”

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KEN STICKLAND In Tampa

July 21st, 2010
1:34 am

I love the way you agree with yourself

Based on your lunacy it was a mistake to not resign Woodson. It is paradoxical to say “the hawks are headed in the right direction” when with woodson we were headed up now by your on concession we are headed down.

I rather like the up direction as opposed to the down direction. Now we have Woodson II spending his time working (to improve?) an offense that was already in the upper half of the NBA rather than address a defense that was in the bottom half. This is idiot watch at the genesis.

Teague is a scrub. Crawford II is already better than him. Hes a better ball handler, shooter and defender. Teague is a scrub.

This team sucks because Sund is clueless. I agree with many of the voices on the site that are calling for sunds firing. Even Schultz admits Sund is lost, as are you. This team is taking backwards steps and the hope is gone out of next season.

We were right on the edge of becoming an elite team. We were just a center away. Now, mediocrity, next, lottery.

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OB,

As I said, I feel a tiny bit indecisive about Shaq, however, that indecision is not ration but merely based on a tiny bit of faith that he would fit in well and could really help us.

Decisions based in faith are usually bad, so my inclination is to always go the rational way and rationality says NO to Shaq.

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Rumplestilskin, my point in agreeing with Ken S. is that we are assuming a lot of unknowns will fall into place this year to be in a position to win a championship. If we are convinced that Teague is an effective point guard then go out and get Shaq now; go “all in”. But if there is significant reservation about Teague’s readiness to step into that role then it would be foolish to get Shaq. What good is having a 20 minute per game center without a point guard that can run the offense. All the Hawks will have accomplished for sure is saddled themselves with another bloated contract (assuming the Hawks sign Shaq for the 2 year MLE). You, yourself, have serious doubts about Teague. You called him a “scrub”.

Futhermore, Rumplestilskin, if you think Teague is a scrub and you consider that Crawford II is our point of the future (surely you are not suggesting that Bibby is the pg who will take us to the next level), then it seems to me, that YOU must conclude that the Hawks are not ready to win a championship this year either. For it would take some time to develop Crawford II into a true pg.

You comment, “We were right on the edge of becoming an elite team. We were just a center away”, seems to be contradictory to your statement that Teague is a scrub. Which is more important, a starting pg or a 20 minute per game center who is only necessary to take care of D. Howard?

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YAWN

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Hawks fans listen,

Unless the Heat suffer major injuries in the next few season the Heat will compete for a championship at least 4 of those 6 years. The only teams that can eliminate them in the east are the Celtics and Magic. Everyone else is chopped liver.

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Ken Strick,

No other GM was offering Joe Smith and Jason Collins at the time the Hawks signed them either.

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Ken…your salary #’s for next year are a little confusing…We’ll more than likely have to take something back for Bibby, so that will go against any available $’s…Also, I’m not sure why you’re saying to add the trade exception???…This is not money that we receive, and it does not allow us to go over the luxury tax threshold and not pay…It is simply a trade chip that expires in a year…Horford will be due a raise of roughly $6M next year…Crawford’s expiring deal will more than take care of that and still allow us to add our draft pick (unless traded) and save $3M…However, I’m expecting a trade soon.

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vava74

I’m not sure if he would have, but I saw more accomplished players accept those type offers (PP & Dirk).

Don’t forget what Memphis got out of that deal, cap relief, and Marc Gasol who has a better upside than Horford. They traded for Zach Randoph (20 ppg 11 rebs) when K. Brown salary came off the books. They weren’t winning with Pau so why keep him.

What excuse do you have for the reason Miami nabbed 3 of the top 15 players in the NBA in free agency?

We can keep making all the excuses we won’t for the Hawks not being major players in making franchise changing deals, but the bottom line is we can’t sell players on the oppurtunity to win.

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Geemack,

If I’m not mistaken, because of Pierce and dirk’s age, the salary cap rules says they can only get a 4 year Max deal.

JJ would have been offered a 5 year max deal ($95 mil) deal from some teams with salary cap space. So for us to keep him, we had to overpay and give him a 6 year Max deal.

Do u think stoudemire is worth 5 years $100 mil (given his previous eye injury and knee injury, and no more Steve nash)?

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O’Brien

Stoudemire only makes since if you get JJ, LBJ, D-Wade, Melo, or CP3 to go with him.

Also if Josh and Al can make a jump to 18 – 20ppg apiece and 10 to 12 rebs apiece then we will forget about JJ’s deal would make more since.

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VaVa

PP & Dirk are a lot longer in the tooth than Joe. And, they are on their 3rd Max Deals,
they both opted out. I’m sure at the behest oft their Agents to make MORE not LESS money!

I’m done hearing how Dirk took less money to help his team? Help his team do what?
WIN? I think not – What has Dirk ever won besides MVP’s for his mantle and twilight years?

Let’s Keep it Real! If nothing else – at least do that!

I respect you VaVa – Big Time man, but let’s compare apples to apples.
Joe is 28 years old and PP + Dirk is = 70 years old + or – .

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VaVa

Sorry, I was responding to Gee Mack – who was responding to you.
So, Gee Mack – my last post was in response to your comments
Re: PP & Dirk.

Peace! (*_*)

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