Atlanta Hawks: Shaq open to joining Hawks (UPDATE: Shaq hasn’t heard from Hawks)
Shaq provides muscle but also potential headaches.
Tim Povtak of FanHouse reports that the Hawks have offered Shaquille O’Neal a two-year contact starting at the full mid-level exception. That figure is pegged to the league average salary and won’t be known until the league completes its audit this week but should come in at about $5.5 million for the first season.
I can confirm at least the Shaq half of this story: He’d be interesting in playing for the Hawks, according to a person with knowledge of his free-agent desires. But a person familiar with Atlanta’s plans said it’s doubtful the team has made such an offer this early in the free-agent process. (UPDATE: Shaq’s agent, Perry Rogers, says he hasn’t heard from the Hawks.) The Hawks are seeking a bulky center, and ASG is said to be willing to use the mid-level exception and pay some luxury tax if necessary to do so, but so far it doesn’t appear the Hawks have decided whom else to target after re-signing J.J.
Shaq, 38, just finished the least productive of his 18 seasons. He’s certainly a more physical deterrent in the post than anyone the Hawks have now, and his blocks and rebounds numbers are still pretty good. But Zaza’s production actually compares decently when adjusted for minutes and when accounting for Shaq’s much higher usage rate. And if Shaq were to play a major role for the Hawks it would mean less minutes in the lineup for Al and/or Smoove, who are more effective players.
If the Hawks are looking to make a buzz as Potvak suggests (”They also could use O’Neal’s star appeal to help create some much needed interest in the franchise,” he writes) then Shaq can still do that. But they should be careful what they wish for in that regard. The Hawks are looking to create a more serious and dedicated culture for the team with a first-year coach, and I can tell you from firsthand experience that Shaq probably isn’t going to help that effort. His approach is that of an 18-year vet with four rings and a nonchalant view of the regular season.
If Shaq came to Atlanta, it wouldn’t be long before he’s telling teammates and media that the Hawks simply need to be dominant at home and .500 on the road and everything will be OK. When L.D. says the Hawks need to play with more energy and effort every night to make it a habit, Shaq at some point would suggest the Hawks don’t really need to worry until March. When the Hawks lose games they shouldn’t and slide down the standings, Shaq would shrug and say they just need to hold onto homecourt advantage for the first round and everything will be cool. And if Shaq becomes unhappy with his playing time, then I don’t need to tell you Shaq is not going to be quiet about it.
If the Hawks signed Shaq, he would instantly become the biggest presence in the locker room, the guy with the most cred and the biggest voice. In addition to deciding if Shaq could still help them on the floor, the Hawks would have to be sure this team is ready to handle his off-court influence.
MC
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656 comments Add your comment
ClassicHawks
July 5th, 2010
11:44 pm
@ASG, BILLY KNIGHT, MIKE WOODSON, RICK SUND… THANK YOU GUYS FOR RESURRECTING A FRANCHISE THAT WAS WORST OFF THAN THIS RECESSION WE ARE IN!! THANK YOU FOR GIVING THESE BANDWAGON, UNINTELLIGENT ATLANTA HAWKS FANS SOMETHING TO TALK ABOUT, BECAUSE QUITE FRANKLY THIS CITY DOESN’T DESERVE A CONTENDER & BY YOU STILL DOING YOUR BEST TO GIVE US ONE SHOWS THE LOVE YOU HAVE FOR THIS BEAUTIFUL CITY AND THESE UNGRATEFUL FANS!! HAWKS ARE GOING TO MAKE HISTORY AND I HOPE YA’LL BANDWAGONER’S ARE READY FOR THE RIIIIIIIIIIDDDDDDEEE!! WHICH I KNOW U GUYS ARE!!!! HOLLA!!
Michael Cunningham
July 5th, 2010
11:45 pm
@ Najeh: “If they do that, though, his trade value for this season would still be his rookie-scale salary right? In other words, even if they sign-and-trade him with an extension before Oct. 31, they could only get back this year’s $5.4 million worth of salary for him?”
actually, now that i think of it, if they signed-and-traded him with an extension he would almost certainly become a BYC player because he obviously is going to get a raise of better than 20 percent over $5.4 million. so scratch even that unlikely scenario.
Jeff
July 5th, 2010
11:46 pm
Michael — thank you… good explanation. I thought the same thing with the contract to JJ… that’s a big outlay of cash and the only way it balances out is if there is a LOT of winning during that contract.
You are spot-on about the core needing help… this team has done a lot over the last 3 or 4 years, but play deep into the playoffs isn’t one of them. As a lifetime Hawks fan, I just fear that the early 90s are happening all over again… that team, which showed such promise in 86, 87, 88 had pretty much hit a wall by 1991 and 92 and so changes came in a big way. I hated that the late-1980s team never got to an Eastern Final or an NBA Final, and I’ll feel the same about this group if it doesn’t happen…. great players, great excitement, lot of great moments, but eh….. something is missing.
Oh, well, great blog… good conversation… thanks for the info. Good luck Hawks — sign Shaq, commit yourselves like never before, and make a title run in 2011!!!
BubbaMumf
July 5th, 2010
11:47 pm
what do you guys think of that big line up?
Michael Cunningham
July 5th, 2010
11:47 pm
@PD: “Dwight Howard was not beaten by another big center in the playoffs. The Celtics used undersized physical big men to beat the Magic. Team defense and strategy are key in the playoffs.”
good point. Sheed might have been the most effective guy against Dwight, not because he’s particularly bulky but because he’s long, smart and nasty.
JIMMYMACK
July 5th, 2010
11:48 pm
ASSISTANT COACHES?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
Michael Cunningham
July 5th, 2010
11:49 pm
@Yoda: of course i respect Shaq. he’s Top 50, most dominant, all of that. but, no, he is not a franchise player at 38. even he knows that.
what Cavs comparison did i make? i’m speaking from my experience covering him in Miami.
northcyde
July 5th, 2010
11:50 pm
JSS . . . true.
But the bigger problem is that we have a defensive rebounding problem that trumps even the perimeter defense problem that leaves our bigs exposed. Too many times teams have missed shots, especially jumpshots, only for the opposing team to get a 2nd chance rebound and score again.
I mean . . from a PER 36 minute standpoint, Shaq was a better center than Horford in just about everything last year except free throw shooting. Even slightly better than him in rebounding and blocked shots.
My question is this. If you toss out a frontline of Shaq and Horford for about 12 minutes a game together, how much of a better PF does Horford become on both offense and defense? And would the presence of Shaq actually make Horford a better rebounder, seeing that Shaq takes up so much space? Does he make Smoove a better rebounder too, for that matter.
Anybody who watched the NBA Finals know that defense and rebounding won that title for L.A. It wasn’t their running game, or Kobe’s 50% FG shooting in every game. That team had to grind and claw to beat Boston.
Pretty teams don’t win titles, unless they have a Hall of Fame 6-9 PG, and a Hall of Fame C with an unstoppable hook shot.
Jeff
July 5th, 2010
11:51 pm
Speaking of Rasheed… anybody remember his long and illustrious career as an Atlanta Hawk? LOL If I remember right, his one game wasn’t even a home game was it? Who knows, maybe he’ll unretire and come play for the Hawks again. LOL
Marcus
July 5th, 2010
11:51 pm
What was the downfall during the Shaq/Lebron pairing last year? (pundits have at it. enlighten me)
Why would we expect a different result than CLE if we imported Shaq ?
PD
July 5th, 2010
11:52 pm
Thanks MC
macaroni tony
July 5th, 2010
11:52 pm
I with JimmyMack, what about assistant coaches. I would like to know who will be seating on the bench with LD. Also who out there will give you 100 block shots & seals, and only 24 years old that would be dumb, when we can toss MW out and match JC and S-N-T him as a package.
Jeff
July 5th, 2010
11:53 pm
Marcus — because the Hawks won’t be carrying the ENORMOUS weight of having the supposedly-best-player-in-the-NBA on the team and the franchise won’t think it’s a birthright to win an NBA title just because the mighty LeBron is on the team.
Plus, I wouldn’t say a 60-win season is a downfall… just a bad playoff series against Boston. That was one of the top 3 or 4 teams in the NBA… heck, I’ll take that for the Hawks ANY day.
Josh
July 5th, 2010
11:53 pm
@michael cunnigham
you said, “i already see Stephen A. Smith tweeted that Shaq wants more than the mid-level, which tells you how Shaq views his value. and the Hawks can’t do more than the mid-level, anyway.”
To be honest, Stephen A. Smith has gotten it all wrong so far this free agency. He said it was a done deal that JJ was going to the Knicks and we know that not to be true. He, IMO, is awful and I do not believe anything that comes out of his mouth.
Michael Cunningham
July 5th, 2010
11:54 pm
@N-Trigue: Tyrus Thomas is not a center, and especially not the kind of center the Hawks want/need. it looks like Brown is waiting to see if he can return to the Lakers.
♥Mz. Hawkdafied♥
July 5th, 2010
11:56 pm
At this point in Shaq’s career I’m sure he’d be open to signing with a lot of teams that perhaps he wouldn’t have in the past. I’m not convinced that Shaquille O’neal is the answer. And I don’t believe trading Josh Smith or Al Horford is the answer either.
Look at how far Phoenix got after Shaq left and remember when Lebron and company got eliminated with Shaq. The more I think about it, I’m thinking the team may want to pass on Shaq.
Michael Cunningham
July 5th, 2010
11:57 pm
@northcyde: “But the bigger problem is that we have a defensive rebounding problem that trumps even the perimeter defense problem that leaves our bigs exposed. Too many times teams have missed shots, especially jumpshots, only for the opposing team to get a 2nd chance rebound and score again.”
ditching the switches should help with that.
JIMMYMACK
July 5th, 2010
11:57 pm
I am not a regular contributor to the blog, but unless you keep us updated in the paper(which I do get home delivery) or the blog we can’t keep up with our team. I don’t care to write about the teams decisions because I have no control. But I have been asking about the assistant coaches for 4 days with no reply. But you seem to reply to the regulars and to hell on the occasional contributor. My only question is “WHAT IS THE STATUS OF SEARCH FOR ASSISTANT COACHES?”
~~MAC-ToWN~~ (Area Code 478)
July 5th, 2010
11:58 pm
is there any word or signs that Teague is gonna be “our guy” at PG going into the season….or are we still looking for an already proven PG that we KNOW can contribute immediately???
Jeff
July 5th, 2010
11:58 pm
Somebody please answer JimmyMack before he pops a vein…
Michael Cunningham
July 5th, 2010
11:59 pm
@Josh: yes, SAS has gotten some stuff wrong. but he does have a direct line to a lot of players, Shaq included, so on something like this i’m inclined to believe him. plus, from a biz standpoint Shaq isn’t going to want it out there that he will take the mid-level.
Wink
July 6th, 2010
12:00 am
Shaq coming to the ATL…I can get behind that. The only real negative is the “Hack A Shaq” come with him. Maybe a new coach will know when to take him out of a game.
First, the negative theory…he can’t learn a new offense are you kidding me; he had to learn Phil’s Triangle Offense; their are guys on that championship Lakers team that still can’t learn the the offense.
Shaq expressing his views regarding being dominate at home & playing 500 on the road; I believe Woody preached that same concept in his stay here, it would not be anything new in this locker room.
Shaq suggesting that the regular season does not matter as much as the playoffs; well I believe this is what all the off season fuss is about. We won 53 games and got dusted in the playoffs, whereas the Celtics had a terrible season by their standard and they went to the FINALS. Better to peak going into the playoffs than to coast in with an impressive regular season record.
Shaq being a distraction in the locker room & off the court is pure speculation. I believe Shaq presense will allow JJ to be the Clark Kent he is destine to be; Shaq will assume the Superman role. Shaq will take on the verbal challenge of Kobe, Lebron & Wade…he has played with all of them.
Finally, Shaq would give us that voice in the locker room & on the court that screams LEADERSHIP, why because he is not afraid of it, has a big voice & body to back it up, and the NBA hardware that should command respect.
The positive we gain, will be better interior defense in the paint area, low post option, a center that can pass the ball, rebound the basketball, and most importantly a force that has to be accounted for. Keep in mind we don’t need Shaq to score major points….give us 25 -30 minutes per game as a starter or play off the bench.
Who would you rather have Shaq, RandMo, Collins, Siler, or some project center…Shaq is an upgrade…I’ll take 2 years, because we have not gotten the center position right since Tree Rollins left town.
In regards to Al & Josh: if what I am hearing is true, then we make Al the Power Forward… with Pachulia to back him & Shaq.
Package Josh & Marvin or Josh, Bibby, & Evans to obtain Carmelo Anthony who is supposely on the block in trade. We will then have our small forward and turn this team over to Teague (our Rondo) and let Drew guide & mold him.
We then bring back Childress to play off the bench.
Our starting five would be:
Teague – PG
JJ – SG
Carmelo – SF
Horford – PF
Shaq – Center
Bench Player:
Jamal Crawford – PG or Bibby (if not in Proposed Trade with Josh)
Jordan Crawford – SG (Rook)
Childress – SF or Evans (if not in Proposed Trade with Josh)
Marvin – SF/PF (if not in Proposed trade with Josh)
Pachulia – C/PF
RandMo – C
Free Agent?
Pape Sy – SF(Rook)
We would then have our own version of the big 3, Shaq, Carmelo, JJ….(willing to part with Josh & Marvin for Carmelo Anthony)
Make it Happen Sund!!!!!
JIMMYMACK
July 6th, 2010
12:01 am
Thank you Jeff, but not just anybody — MC a person who inside information.
Captain Obvious
July 6th, 2010
12:02 am
Anyone remember Shaq’s tenure in Phoenix?
Shaq slowed down an athletic team with good chemistry (sound familiar?). Phoenix missed the playoffs in ‘09, because Shaq was too fat to run the floor and did not fit with the way the Suns played basketball.
We’re blessed with the fact Al can run the floor and be a matchup nightmare in transition. I really wish we’d start playing the break a lot more. This Hawks team is more athletic than most and I think we could easily out-run Dwight Howard and a broken down Vince Carter come playoff time.
Michael Cunningham
July 6th, 2010
12:02 am
@Jimmymack: “My only question is “WHAT IS THE STATUS OF SEARCH FOR ASSISTANT COACHES?”
sorry, dude, i didn’t see your question. if you put “MC” somewhere in there it increases the chances i will respond because i will know you are talking directly to me.
anyway, there is no update on the assistant coaches. LD hopes to have his top assistant in place by summer league, which starts on Monday, so look for something to happen this week. hope that helps you feel better.
Michael Cunningham
July 6th, 2010
12:03 am
@MAC Town: “is there any word or signs that Teague is gonna be “our guy” at PG going into the season….or are we still looking for an already proven PG that we KNOW can contribute immediately???”
can we at least wait until summer league starts before getting into that? man, i’m glad my blog people are hungry for info but it’s only July 6.
JIMMYMACK
July 6th, 2010
12:04 am
Thank MC now I can back to just looking for the gray boxes.
Michael Cunningham
July 6th, 2010
12:05 am
@ WINK: “Shaq being a distraction in the locker room & off the court is pure speculation.”
no, it’s his recent history.
Hmmm
July 6th, 2010
12:07 am
I heard we were shooping Bibby and Marvin. Nice, Just throw Mo Evans in there as well.
PD
July 6th, 2010
12:08 am
Comparing Shaq then to Horford now is pointless……..Hawks need to be careful with their spending? They should have drafted Alabi. I am a little tired of how these GM observe young players. Watch Rick Sund’s post draft interview on hawks.com annoys me a little. He states that drafting young bigs are project players. Like he knows Jordan Crawford is a sure shot.
Is it just this current draft or all the time? Alabi would have been worth the look.
The Spurs Rockets and the Thunder’s GMs are by far the most impressive GMs. They take the time to develop players.
Since bigs are such a commodity in this league why would they not create their own wealth at that position like how Cleveland developed Varejao.
Harry Hawk
July 6th, 2010
12:08 am
MC,
The main thing we all need to know is this:
Is it all going to be okay? That’s the vibe I get. If you can just let us know that it is, we’ll be cool, man.
UGA
July 6th, 2010
12:09 am
The article from FanHouse said that our interest in Shaq is the same as it is in Brad Miller and the Big Z. Big Z, who we were after last, would be cheaper and would accept his role of less minutes. ESPN’s Chris Broussard says Boston may have interest in Shaq.
Don’t think we get him. I’d be fine with the other O’Neal, Jermaine. He could play the 4 also.
JSS
July 6th, 2010
12:09 am
@ Northcydye…
Quite true, but besides the switches, this team refuses to scrap for rebounds even when they had better position. I will exclude Zaza and Bibby from that point… You’ve got to want it!
Not N-Trigue
July 6th, 2010
12:10 am
N-Trigue – please GIVE UP about Tyrus Thomas – that horse is DEAD ! I do like what another post said….what do we have to lose, go for it, use the window while its open…we say we want a BIG- well he’s big and not that bad an option IMO…I hope a CP3 deal can work out somehow…
UGA
July 6th, 2010
12:10 am
Cheaper options:
Josh Boone or Joel Anthony.
N-Trigue
July 6th, 2010
12:13 am
MC any updates on the summer league roster? Papa Sy can play my boy AJ Moye plays ovaseas and said he’s a beast! Can’t wait to see him and teague playing together!
Michael Cunningham
July 6th, 2010
12:13 am
@ Harry Hawk: man, that’s some funny stuff. i have no influence on the Hawks’ decisions, so can’t help you there. but it’s just basketball so no matter what happens it’s going to be OK as long as life is good.
with that, i’m going to get some sleep, blog people. holla at you tomorrow.
PD
July 6th, 2010
12:14 am
Develop Randolph Morris!!!!!!! Whenever got in during garbage time he looked worthy of more playing time. I blame Woody for that junk. Also, Joe Smith should be brought back to the team and used in the 2nd unit with Zaza. They were a great tandem that was not exploited enough.
macaroni tony
July 6th, 2010
12:14 am
I would prefer JO because he has a lot less miles on his body. But I do like that the fact that the Hawks are trying to make moves. But trading JS would be dumb, I would like to see MW gone.
Josh
July 6th, 2010
12:15 am
@michael cunningham
the only other team out that is even interested in Shaq is Boston and the only reason he will go there is for a possible ring not playing time. Its too crowded there and there really would be a drama there worse than Shaq and Kobe or Shaq and Wade.
Josh
July 6th, 2010
12:16 am
@michael cunningham
and besides Shaq is no longer in his prime and he is no longer worth what he thinks. If the Hawks are offerign 5.5 mil to 6 mil a yr, if I was Shaq I would take it cause he will not get that in Boston.
northcyde
July 6th, 2010
12:17 am
PD
July 5th, 2010
11:44 pm
I think the Hawks should try to get a younger and more athletic center like Chandler or Haywood. Shaq is one of my favorite players but I don’t think he would be as effective at this point in his career.
To matchup with Dwight Howard?
Dwight Howard was not beaten by another big center in the playoffs. The Celtics used undersized physical big men to beat the Magic. Team defense and strategy are key in the playoffs. Loading up on over the hill and over paid players is not the key to winning. Look at how true championship teams are built. All the players are complimentary Shaq does not compliment the Hawks.
***********************************
PD . . keep in mind what Shaq’s defensive numbers per 48 minutes were last year:
SHAQ
Opponent eFG% . . . 46.8%
Opponent iFG% . . . 47% ( iFG . . . inside FG% )
Opponent ppg . . . 15.5
Opponent PER . . . 14.2
These are the numbers for the 2 guys you named.
CHANDLER
opponent eFG%: 54%
opponent iFG%: 58% ( remember .. Al Horford gave up 60% )
opponent ppg: 17.4
opponent PER: 18.2
HAYWOOD . . in Dallas ( his numbers were actually better in Washington . . and this will explain why Dallas didn’t do too well in the 1st round )
opponent eFG%: 53% . . ( 51% in WAS )
opponent iFG%: 54% . . ( 46% . .which was great )
opponent ppg: 17.6 . . ( 18.9 )
opponent PER: 16.8 . . ( 18.0 )
And also remember this . . . Shaq puts up better offensive numbers than both of those guys
Just out of curiosity, I looked up Shaq’s defensive numbers while in Phoenix
opponent eFG%: 53%
opponent iFG%: 45%
opponent ppg: 18.6
opponent PER: 16.5
Every number was higher in Phoenix . . except the iFG% number . . the weak defensive number of Horford. Horford’s defensive numbers are pretty good, except for iFG%. But even Shaq’s defensive numbers in Phoenix was better than Tyson Chandler’s last year, and a little below Brendan Haywood. Shaq probably benefited a little last year from playing with Big Z and Varejao. Cleveland’s defense was strong, even before Shaq came there.
It’ll be interesting to see what the ASG does with this. You have to wonder if they would go ahead and take a chance at Shaq. You’re not going to find a better interior anchor on both offense and defense than him, out of the available free agents that are out there. He’ll cost more though.
Acquiring . . even overpaying for Shaq . . would be the ultimate proof that they’re trying to go for it THIS YEAR, and not just simply getting the best economical center to fill a need. They tried that last year when they tried to sell us on Jason Collins and Joe Smith.
If they don’t go after Shaq, Big Z is probably the better choice. Avoid Brad Miller at all costs.
Shaq may make us better overall, while also moving the needle at the box office.
HawkKingBibby
July 6th, 2010
12:17 am
Surely M.C. the Hawks already had a plan who they wanted to target in free agency . Are you trying to say since we said addious back in May vs Orlando all they did were twiddle they’re thumbs and wonder if JJ would accept they’re offer in July?
Emir S.
July 6th, 2010
12:18 am
I’m not sure how’d this thing work out. If I’m not mistaken Shaq got the starting job over Big Z in Cleveland.
Why? Becuase….It’s Shaq. I woulda kept Z as the starting 5. If Shaq comes to Atlanta, do you really think he’d want a bench role? You’d have to put him at the 5 and Horford at the 4 and Smoove at the 3. But we all know Smoove dosent flourish at the 3. So what do you wanna do? You put Josh on the bench and let your frontcourt consist of Shaq and Al? And your backcourt of Teague, JJ, and Marvin? While Josh Smith sits on the bench? I doubt this will work out.
Unless you actually trade Smith away….but are we really willing to do so? I mean Smith has improved in each and everyone one of his seasons. He is a growing talent. Maybe that whole package of Josh, Bibby, and Evans to Denver for Carmelo? But do you really think they’d take that package. Theyre not getting anything close to Carmelos “status”.
I’ve had my doubts on JJ coming back since 2 months ago. I was split on him. After reading these blogs i got convinced otherwise. Im glad he came back. We got that done. To make us better we are thinking of signing Shaq….I just dont see how much more good we can get with Shaq in Atlanta. I mean dont get me wrong. I’d LOVE to wear a Shaq Hawks Jersey. I’d love to see him play in Atlanta. But its about how productive “might” he be. I guess I’m split on this as well if it happens or not.
~~MAC-ToWN~~ (Area Code 478)
July 6th, 2010
12:20 am
lol we gotta stay hungry @ MC…but I understand ya
PD
July 6th, 2010
12:21 am
Word Tony move Marvin and Bibby for CP3 or Haywood and someone else……….The only problem with keeping Smoove and then getting a true center. You would have to slide everyone down to their supposed true positions. Smoove cannot shoot the 3 so he cannot play the 3. Marvin is a better shooter. I wish we could make them one player because of the different skills they have.
N-Trigue
July 6th, 2010
12:23 am
If we don’t go after Tyrus we need to go after Luis Scola! We don’t need a big that only has 2yrs left in the tank if were gonna go that route we definitely shouldve drafted a project center like Whiteside!
PD
July 6th, 2010
12:25 am
northcyde – good stuff
Wayne stuck in AL
July 6th, 2010
12:25 am
Great…just what the Hawks need: a slow, overweight over-the-hill guy with bad feet. No wonder I’ve never taken this team seriously…
Josh
July 6th, 2010
12:26 am
@Emir S.
I would not oppose a trade of sending Josh Smith, Mike Bibby and Marvin Williams to the Hornets for CP3. This is the only player I will take in return for trading Smith. Sick line up. We would make at least the Eastern Conference Finals with this lineup.
PG: Chris Paul (Teague)
SG: JJ (Jamal Crawford)
SF: Childress? (Jordan Crawford)
PF: Horford
C: Shaq (Za Za)