Atlanta Hawks: Waiting on J.J. (UPDATE: J.J. expected to accept offer in second meeting)
Assuming he can use an extra $25 million or so, J.J. willl be back. (Bob Rosato/SI)
(UPDATE: A person with knowledge of the process said the Hawks are to meet with J.J. again in L.A. with the expectation that the two sides will work out the details of a contract agreement.)
What’s up, blog people? Shaking off the cobwebs after staying up way too late and obsessively checking the Blackberry for some confirmation that J.J. accepted Atlanta’s maximium contract offer. No official word on that yet but my prediction that there’s no way he (or any other older free agent) leaves that much cash on the table is looking pretty good. I’ll update as the day goes along.
After Rick Sund met with Joe and his agent to extend the offer, the Knicks made their pitch to him. The Heat also are trying to get in the running. The Mavs also want to get an audience with Joe even though they have no cap room.
None of those teams has Atlanta’s $27 million advantage. Sure, J.J. could try to force a sign-and-trade to one of those teams and still get his Bird rights money, but that would require an agreement between the Hawks and the new team. Why go through all of that when a max offer is sitting in front of him?
Also, while the Hawks aren’t a championship-level team, they are better right now than any of the teams with the cap space to offer J.J. the max. Sure, those teams all can get better by making moves, but this is another area where J.J. has what he wants in front of him so why take a chance somewhere else? The Hawks are going to have to get creative to improve the team once J.J. re-signs but they already have a good team.
It seems much of the league was surprised that the Hawks offered the maximum. I couldn’t find anyone who predicted J.J. would re-sign in Atlanta, probably because no one believed ASG would spend the money. NBA.com’s David Aldridge says Sund and his people (who’ve always been big J.J. fans) had to convince the owners to make the investment. Aldridge also amplified what I said in yesterday’s blog about future trading possibilities for J.J.:
“And if the Hawks don’t break through in the East in the next couple of seasons, Johnson will only be 31 in the summer of 2012, and still have a lot of teams interested in his services. You can always trade him, the argument went; someone will rise up in the next few years into contender status, and teams on the rise tend to be more willing to go all-in for a year or two and make a trade for a high-priced player.”
That happens all the time in the NBA. It’s why when Michael Gearon Jr was lamenting that Jermaine O’Neal was overpaid last season, I was thinking that O’Neal still got traded along to Toronto and then later to Miami after the Pacers gave him a big-money deal. This was after he proved to be injury-prone and unable to get them over the top.
Aldridge ended his post with a sentiment I saw expressed by other reporters on Twitter last night: “It no doubt also came up that it’s highly unlikely that the current Atlanta Spirit ownership group will still be in charge of the Hawks in six years. Johnson’s due bill will be someone else’s problem by then.”
If that indeed is part of their rationale, it’s obviously a cynical point of view. From a practical standpoint it’s also risky since no one is lining up to buy sports teams nowadays. More likely, the Hawks figure they can always move J.J. later and start over if things don’t work out. It’s not an unrealistic expectation.
MC
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444 comments Add your comment
Scoots
July 1st, 2010
5:00 pm
Well said, Chipper. God I admire you
cdog
July 1st, 2010
5:01 pm
no mr rondo, i don’t think like that.i’m happily married.i don’t do adulturey
Chip Shot
July 1st, 2010
5:01 pm
Thanks
-Chip Shot
cdog
July 1st, 2010
5:03 pm
drmaryb, i use to work down there.there was a girls basketball coach there named mary ellen.i was wondering was that you.thanks for clearing that up for me.peace and joy to you.keep up the good work.
i_am_soulstar
July 1st, 2010
5:04 pm
I guess I should state that I’m an infectious disease epidemiologist, just to establish some sort of credibility.
Chip Shot
July 1st, 2010
5:05 pm
I guess I should state that I’m LeBron James
Rondo
July 1st, 2010
5:06 pm
You are a good man cdog I was only kidding.
Dr. Drew
July 1st, 2010
5:06 pm
I’m lost. Is this a health blog, or a sports blog?
Fonz
July 1st, 2010
5:08 pm
This blog officially jumped the shark about the middle of Page 3.
i_am_soulstar
July 1st, 2010
5:11 pm
Still basketball related. If they skipped over Alabi because he has hepatitis B, then I’m obviously curious which type of hepatis B it was, as acute Hep B usually goes away on its own, but chronic Hep B can cause long term problems. Try and keep up.
Fundamentals
July 1st, 2010
5:11 pm
drmaryb & Cdog – I used to work in Pike Co, 98-00?
Any news on who we might trade Chills for if he’s talking to the Wiz for a S&T?
JC
July 1st, 2010
5:13 pm
Haha, try and do work for a few hours and get your opinions dragged through the coals – serves me right, I guess.
@drMaryB/Victor – so CP3 has knee problems, and he might not be able to slash as effectively in a few years. He’s still been an All-Star for the past three years. Claxton, on the other hand, was waived by the Warriors last year for Anthony Tolliver. Knees are knees, but as long as he can stand upright, CP3 will be a better player than Craig “don’t call him Speedy” Claxton ever was.
@Everyone else – I think I know the problem. You expect the Hawks and ASG to function like a well-run organization and get angry when they don’t. As a long-time Hawks fan, I’ve realized it’s pointless to get angry when they make obvious mistakes and call for blood. ASG owns the Hawks for the time being, and will continue to own it until someone comes along with a good enough offer to buy the team. They’re not going to sell it because you told them to on a forum.
With that in mind, I choose to laud any improvements that they do make. Of course I’d rather have Phil Jackson coaching the Hawks, but ASG won’t spend the money. For the money they’re willing to spend, Drew was a solid choice.
And while Joe’s proposed contract is incredibly high, at least they’re spending $ in an effort to maintain a key player on a very solid, albeit not a superstar team. Everyone has been yelling at ASG to open up the purse strings and spend money on the roster. Don’t get angry when they actually do it. Simply put, the Hawks with Joe Johnson > the Hawks without Joe Johnson.
Being a Hawks fan is like having a special need child. They’re not going to be top of their class, but you praise them heartily when they do do well.
Rondo
July 1st, 2010
5:14 pm
The guy still got drafted so he must be ok.
Rondo
July 1st, 2010
5:16 pm
Fundamentals
Chills for Gilberts Glocs and AK”S
Daniel
July 1st, 2010
5:17 pm
If the Hawks are going to trade with Golden State, I’d rather take back Biedrins than Ellis. Then you get back a legit center. With Ellis we would have 4 perimeter players constantly looking for their own shot with Joe, Ellis and the Crawfords. I think Josh or Al would have the right to punch someone at that point.
allan in texas
July 1st, 2010
5:17 pm
There is a rumor about a possible trade between the Hawks and the Warriors with the Hawks looking to move Marvin Williams and Bibby. Any word on who might be possibly coming back to the Hawks or is this just a cap clearing move?
i_am_soulstar
July 1st, 2010
5:17 pm
Rondo,
Maybe, but usually teams picking in the 2nd round don’t mind gambling on a projected 1st round pick that slips to the 2nd round because of health problems.
But that worked out great for the Spurs last year.
O'Brien
July 1st, 2010
5:18 pm
There is an article on yahoo.com/nba by Kelly Dwyer that is an interesting read. Needless to say, it doesnt say anything positive about the Hawks or JJ. here is an excerpt.
Bear in mind that Johnson achieved those stats by absolutely dominating the ball for the Hawks. Just owning it, for large stretches, forcing either a potential score or a potential assist to be added to his ledger just about every other time down court.
On top of that, didn’t we watch him age quite considerably in the playoffs last season? Johnson averaged 11.8 points per game in the second round, shooting a terrifying 29.5 percent along the way. He seemed nonplussed as ever as his Hawks fell out of the second round again, and for the second time in five years, he’s chosen big offseason money over a chance at a championship.”
Ouch.
jon the die hard hawks fan, is dead
July 1st, 2010
5:18 pm
i have a very hard time understanding why the hawks would give a max contract to a player who obviously does not want to be here. he’s showed that in his play. I STRONGLY feel he was outplayed this year by jamal crawford, who came off the bench I might add. max pay should be reserved for a leader, not someone who is just a stat filler and has the motivation of a sloth in heat. i like joe but i’d rather pay for a more talented leader…
Najeh Davenpoop
July 1st, 2010
5:20 pm
If any team is dumb enough to give the Hawks something of value for Bibby and Marvin, the Hawks should take it and throw a party.
i_am_soulstar
July 1st, 2010
5:21 pm
Najeh,
Amen.
Najeh Davenpoop
July 1st, 2010
5:22 pm
Monta Ellis is not a point guard — he is more like a better version of Jamal Crawford — but I’d gladly take him and the $44 million left on his contract if all the Hawks have to give up is Bibby and Marvin. At least Ellis is a good player with trade value.
BigTimeTECHFan
July 1st, 2010
5:24 pm
Michael Cunningham
Where you and I disagree is “changing coaches won’t be enough”
I think Woodson was a major problem, Hawks have talent to win it all with a good coach. I’m guessing the Spirit Group feels the same and has confident in their choice of L Drew which is to be respected. As for JJ performance, coaches make adjustments to defend him, Woodson never countered, just look at Kobe by game 7 of finals, Boston had him contained like the Magic did JJ, but Jackson was a step ahead. Woodson was not even close to Rivers and P Jackson, why as JJ was contained so were Hawks. He still Iso’d and made JJ look worse, I would have been tee’s off to.
I think Drew has pointed out his offensive and defensive approach, and he’s spot on. JJ will be better player by making the D focus on other players. Yea he may not be goto guy but in the end he gets more stats.
Would have been nice to lock him up cheaper earlier, but it sounds like JJ and agent made right call by waiting, both sides have to agree for it to happen, plus sometime on major deals it’s hard to commit from an owners view because you have time.
Timbo
July 1st, 2010
5:25 pm
I said it last night in the ESPN chat that since I know media-types, I knew the Hawks would be criticized by them in either case; whether they signed him to a max deal or refused to do so, and let him leave . . .
For the record, I think it is too much.
Najeh Davenpoop
July 1st, 2010
5:26 pm
Can anyone post a link confirming this alleged rumor though? This blog is the only place I’ve seen anything about the Warriors being interested in such a deal.
i_am_soulstar
July 1st, 2010
5:30 pm
Najeh,
I’d hate to take on Ellis’ contract w/o trading Jamal. If they move Marvin and Bibby to clear cap space, I’m hoping they bolster the front line.
Chip Shot
July 1st, 2010
5:30 pm
twitter.com/warriorsworld
twitter.com/AlexKennedyNBA
Chip Shot
July 1st, 2010
5:31 pm
theres your links
tidog
July 1st, 2010
5:31 pm
Max contract money = elite player that has the balls to play his original contract out. the end
drmaryb
July 1st, 2010
5:31 pm
Drew
It’s the peoples bolg! “If you don’t like it? Then turn your station. (-mike tyson-)”
CDOG
Naw! Not me man, I am the team doc for a Women’s Pro Football Team though:
Shout out to the: Atlanta Xplosion 2006 National Champions! We play LA, Texas, Orlando, Dallas, Miami &
NC to name a few! Check out the Website!
Soul_Star!
Yeah, I just read about Alabi on rotoworld.com and they reported he slipped to #50 in the
NBA Draft due to a + Hepatitis B test….iam surprised that got out due to HIPPA laws.
But, you may know a little more about the treatment success rates. I found that very
Interesting to say the least! I guess his major symptom would be fatigue among others.
I don’t deal much with this topic, but I plan to read some abstracts later tonight, to see what the
current treatment protocols are. Would love to hear your expertise on it as well.
Thanks for your response! You are an asset to this blog & you are appreciated!
i_am_soulstar
July 1st, 2010
5:32 pm
Najeh,
http://twitter.com/AlexKennedyNBA
Chip Shot
July 1st, 2010
5:32 pm
also ho to the hawks forums they seem to have the updates
http://www.hawksquawk.net/community/index.php/forum/1-homecourt/
Chip Shot
July 1st, 2010
5:33 pm
go*
Jesse
July 1st, 2010
5:37 pm
Sign and trade JJ for Gilbert. Gilbert is a crunch time scorer, is a year younger, and only has 4 years left on a max deal that pays the same as Joe’s.
Don’t give me the gun-charge thing, before that and the injury, Gilbert was considered a top 5 shooting guard in the league, definitely above Joe Johnson
Rondo
July 1st, 2010
5:37 pm
i am soulstar and drmary 2 real life Ms. Hawthornes
STEEL (Formerly VenomSpitter)
July 1st, 2010
5:38 pm
Please Gilbert is a chucker.
Chip Shot
July 1st, 2010
5:38 pm
gilbert is a PG
Woodys No Goody
July 1st, 2010
5:39 pm
After years of hard work we are once again the laughing stock of NBA. Every website out there is saying how stupid this deal is. Thumbs up! Hope you guys plan on selling a lot of those Chick-fil-A family ticket plans. Why don’t we go ahead and put the Globetrotters on this years schedule as well?
I give up trying to take this team serious.
Rondo
July 1st, 2010
5:40 pm
Gilbert is a RM a rifleman
Najeh Davenpoop
July 1st, 2010
5:40 pm
From what it says on those twitter accounts, it looks like the Hawks would be moving Marvin and possibly Bibby for cap space, which Ellis wouldn’t provide. I’d be surprised if any team was dumb enough to give the Hawks something of value for Marvin and/or Bibby. Marvin for Dan Gadzuric (whose contract is expiring) seems a lot more likely than anything bringing Ellis here.
i_am_soulstar
July 1st, 2010
5:40 pm
Thanks drmaryb,
Much appreciated. I need to get like you and stop blogging with kiddie bloggers.
Najeh Davenpoop
July 1st, 2010
5:43 pm
Swapping Marvin for Gadzuric — saving future cap space and adding an energy big man off the bench in the process — would probably increase the likelihood of the Hawks matching any offers Childress gets.
It could also open the door for them pursuing someone like Ronnie Brewer or Josh Howard, who are unrestricted free agents and could step in to replace Marvin at small forward.
drmaryb
July 1st, 2010
5:44 pm
Bad Newz Kennels!
Looks like Mike Vick NOT off the hook yet! Parole Officer is in on the investigation now!
Video shows him leaving @ 207 AM and shooting occured @ 210 AM.
Marcus Vick may be the trigger man? Vick lied @ when he left? Quanis Phillips is not oinly their
cousin but also a convicted Felon in the dog-fighting case. Vick can’t be assoc. With a convicted felon
I guess the same should go for Quanis. Heck, they’re all convicted felons!
Vick may be on his way back to the Penitentiary to serve out those 5 years!
Poor Judgement and character all the way around! So so sad!
Needed a basketball break on here! Whew! With all the ignorant and impossible trades.
Cap & Trade people! First – Joe has to sign. Then we can look at the #5 spot. In that order!
If you’re NOT talking about a Center? What are you talking about? IF teague doesn’t work,
look at a backup plan there – thirdly. After that, the bench. In that order IMHO.
i_am_soulstar
July 1st, 2010
5:44 pm
I wouldn’t be surprised if they traded Marvin for draft picks. We need his salary off the books ASAP.
terrell
July 1st, 2010
5:46 pm
Marvin and Bibby? Yeah right. Who in their right mind would trade for those 2? Hell, give me A.Randolph and Turiaf and I’d be ecstatic.. Seriously.
ReddJonn68
July 1st, 2010
5:46 pm
If there is a S&T in the wings then signing on the dotted line is the first step. Let’s just wait & see how things unfold. It’s funny though to watch all these media outlets clamoring over the free-agent bonanza, these guys are gonna take their time after all they did wait quite a while to get to this point. As we sports fans know the dominoes won’t fall into place until Lebron inks his deal. Though Bosh may jump in head first to be on a playoff team, wish we had some extra cash to throw at him or anyone. Oh my bag, Sund is in charge no wonder we don’t have anything to offer anybody.
terrell
July 1st, 2010
5:47 pm
Hell, give me Anthony Morrow and Turiaf and I’d be ecstatic.
terrell
July 1st, 2010
5:49 pm
If shooting happened 3 min AFTER Vick left, how is he a suspect??? Just curious. Dumb azz shouldnt’ve been there, but just sayin.
Jesse
July 1st, 2010
5:51 pm
Gilbert is a combo guard, he needs the ball but he doesn’t need to bring it up. If we play a motion offense it doesn’t matter who brings it up.
Even if the fit isn’t perfect, I still think 4 years of Gilbert is honestly a better option than JJ for 6 years.
As for him being a chucker, this is true, but his career shooting % is still 42%. Joe Johnson’s is 44%. Not much difference there.
terrell
July 1st, 2010
5:51 pm
Marvin leaves for draft picks or expirings and Chills comes back home. Simple.