Atlanta Hawks: All-in with max offer for Joe Johnson
When the Hawks meet with Joe Johnson in Los Angeles soon after the start of the free-agency negotiating period at 12:01 Thursday they are prepared to offer him a six-year contract for the maximum amount allowed, according to people with knowledge of their plans.
The exact amount of maximum contracts won’t be determined until a league audit is completed over the next week, but it’s expected to total about $119 million for a player with Johnson’s experience. The other teams making pitches to Joe can only offer him five years at about $92 million. I still believe that a gap of up to $27 million or so will be too much for Joe to turn down regardless of what other teams have to say about teaming up with LeBron or Bosh (or both), earning more in endorsements, or anything else not having to do with $27 million.
As a Bird-rights free agent, Johnson is eligible to receive from the Hawks a six-year contract starting at about $15.8 million with maximum raises of 10.5 percent in each year (the raises are based on the first-year salary and don’t compound). Keeping in mind that the numbers are not finalized, the year-by-year breakdown of the contract would look something like this: $15.8 million in 2010-11, $17.5 million in 2011-12, $19.4 million in 2012-13, $20.8 million in 2013-14, $22.4 million in 2014-15 and $24.1 million 2015-16. Joe would be 34-years old during the final season of the deal.
Before you ask, I’m wearing my beat writer’s beanie and keeping my opinion on this move to myself. Bret LaGree at Hoopinion . THHB at Peachtree Hoops and atl_hawk_luv at Hawks Str8Talk all offer reasonable takes on why they don’t like a max deal for J.J.
In analyzing this for yourself, keep in mind that the Hawks wouldn’t have the cap flexibility to find a comparable replacement for Joe in free agency. So if you want him gone, it means accepting that the Hawks probably wouldn’t be as good without him in the short term (LaGree and atl_hawk_luv explained why they think that’s OK). Also remember that if Joe accepts the deal and continues to produce at his current level for a couple years he could be a very tradeable asset in the future; his contract wouldn’t necessarily become an albatross.
MC
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672 comments Add your comment
Gatorman
June 30th, 2010
4:51 pm
Does anyone realize that the Hawks can’t afford that kind of offer, they don’t have the income for that. Maybe they are going to move to a huge market like New York (whups they have a team).
One | A DC Based Company - Report: Hawks Will Offer Max Contract to Joe Johnson
June 30th, 2010
4:51 pm
[...] get your way after all. No, this isn’t a post about LeBron James signing with New York. But, according to the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the Hawks are prepared to offer Joe Johnson a max contract, which Adrian Wojnarowski tweets should [...]
The Ayatollah
June 30th, 2010
4:51 pm
Sign a back up center who can play defense and rebound. Forget about signing a bigger and better one than the one we have. Hawks don’t have the money for that and never have. They would have to trade away too much. The best centers in the game are the ones who can score as well as defend. The defenders only are just role players. Kendrick Perkins and others come to mind. The others are superstars. If you didn’t draft one, they you can’t have one because nobody is giving away theirs. Saying anything otherwise is plain stupidity. Only two really good centers in the east with a third potentially really good one. Dwight Howard and Andrew Bogut, the third is Brook Lopez. Each guy was drafted by the team he plays on, and will not be leaving that team unless they begin to suck or can’t stay healthy. The rest are incumbent starters or backups. Al Horford is the only starter who is really a power forward that is so good he can play center effectively for more than thirty minutes a game. But he is not a true center, which shows just how special a player he is.
Jaz
June 30th, 2010
4:52 pm
Joe doesn’t want to be here in Atl. why such a push?!?! I think we should continue without him. He a good player but his heart is not in Atlanta.
TROTTINGHOME
June 30th, 2010
4:52 pm
Let me get this straight….If we don’t sign Joe we won’t be able to sign any other top free agent for the same price? Tell me please!!!!
Of course I really don’t worry cause this new offense might kill us no matter who plays.
MaxxHawk
June 30th, 2010
4:53 pm
I don’t think JJ is worth that money at all, but cap-wise, wouldn’t that be our best option? We won’t really be able to sign any real impact FA if we let him go, right? If we can let JJ walk and offer Rudy Gay big $, then I’d rather do that. If not, it might just make sense to give him all that money, even though we all know he isn’t a Max player
Michael Cunningham
June 30th, 2010
4:54 pm
@ Kraig: “MC- if the Hawks do indeed resign Joe, what other free agents do you see them attempting to sign in order to bolster the roster?”
they will be limited to using the mid-level and bi-annual exceptions to sign FAs. as Aaron notes, using those exceptions could potentially put them over the luxury-tax threshold which they presumably would want to avoid. otherwise, they would have to sign guys to min salaries and/or make trades if they want to add players.
GT Alum
June 30th, 2010
4:55 pm
Paddy, it’s safe because it’s, as someone put it, “the devil you know.” The Hawks know what they have with this roster. Even after the FA shuffle is over, they should still be a solid playoff team.
Not resigning Joe would mean trades or trying to find cheaper alternatives – a lot of unknowns. Keeping the current roster together is a lot safer than getting rid of your best player and hoping that when the dust settles, you have a better team.
Brandon
June 30th, 2010
4:57 pm
Going to be 6 years I don’t have to spend money on the Hawks if they re-sign him.
D Hawks
June 30th, 2010
4:57 pm
This is a risk vs. reward move. If the Hawks didn’t do this, they would be handcuffed to replace him as MC said. The risk is that he doesn’t become Joe Contract ala Jon Contract (Koncak), but Joe is 100 times the player Koncak was with the exception of the playoff dropoff. Plus, we have Al and Jamal coming into new contract territory next with Al being a restricted free agent and Jamal having an expiring deal. I think other moves have to come with this move to smooth the PR bump the Hawks will take for shelling out this kind of money. Is there any truth to the rumor that ASG passed a collection plate amonst the 5000 owners to get up the extra millions to afford the max deal?
Einstein
June 30th, 2010
4:58 pm
Big mistake…JJ may actually accept this offer. The Hawks can do better.
ATLByrdsFan
June 30th, 2010
4:58 pm
Besides, if Joe signs max$$, what do we do with horford next year?!
If they give him that much money, I will NEVER spend my money on the Hawks again (glad I maxed out on the ‘nalia this year)
mykhalc
June 30th, 2010
5:00 pm
i hate Paul Pierce and BOS except when they play LA!!LOL but fact is i’d PP before i pay JJ. this team lacks a leader and Joe stripes as a leader will NOT change just ’cause of a new max contract. he is who is…a complimentary player…PERIOD!!! he struggles in the playoffs and it’s not for some UNKNOWN reason!!??!!! he was the best that ATL could do in gettin’ him from PHO…maybe even the best they can do now. but he ain’t a max player…PERIOD!! and he’s proven it…on the court with his non-playoff game and body language!!! just say no Joe!!!
Steve
June 30th, 2010
5:02 pm
If they’re going to “make him an offer he can’t refuse” I sure hope they intend on trading him. Do they realize that most fans don’t want him here anymore? He has had his chance to prove that he’s truly an NBA elite but I think all along he wasn’t the player we wanted him or needed him to be. It’s senseless to use up so much valuable cash over the next 6 years on a guy who can’t get it done.
There are still plenty of good 2nd tier free agents out there…surely we could afford a guy like John Salmons, who sure was a hell of a lot better in the playoffs than Joe.
Bye Bye Joe
June 30th, 2010
5:03 pm
1. If we sign JJ, we are sure to be encroaching on the luxury tax, and gives no hope of making an offer to Josh Childress who we could use to deepen our roster
2. a contract like that will tie up so much money that even with Jamal Crawfords expiring contract his year, we wont be able to make Al Horford a good enough offer to stay (especially since it locks a lot of money up in the same players we have already under-achieved with)
3. since we still have bibby, smith, williams, and zaza all under contract for another 3 years (minimum) – that eats almost $30M in salary room that we don’t have to go after another player
4. atlanta, as far as basketball is not a big market team…nobody is knocking on our doors to come play… handcuffing the money that we already don’t have just makes it worse
if we can get a sign and trade (rumor i saw on ESPN was possibly for Luol Deng and draft pick from Chicago or Anderson Varajeo from Cleveland…i think the hawks have to do it
Also, anybody who thinks we could legitimately trade for Carmelo Anthony is incredibly delusional…
And no free agents can come here cause even without JJ, we are eerily close to the salary cap… best we could get would be a MLE contract which means JJ Redick!
Jay
June 30th, 2010
5:03 pm
If we sign him to max, it better be done with the intention to trade him. JJ is NOT worth the max, period. And how do we expect to keep Horford in the following year?
I am completely let down by all of this.
atownhawk23
June 30th, 2010
5:04 pm
I don’t like hawks fans. Y’all folks are so negative. Y’all folks should just shut up sometimes, and I think y’all should calm down and give JJ another chance. GOSH!
Astro Joe
June 30th, 2010
5:05 pm
@MC, the options as I understand them are sign Joe for around $15M+, S&T Joe for a player who earns 50% of his first year salary (like trading Joe Johnson for a $7.5M player) or let him walk altogether and only have around $5M to replace him. Is that in the ballpark of being an accurate summary?
Mike is back
June 30th, 2010
5:06 pm
MC, those other guys can talk all the crap they want…they don’t have to face the fans.
If offering JJ max dollars is such a bad deal…why are so many teams clamoring for his services ready to do the exact same thing?????????????????
Even NY…if they do not land LBJ…they will have to offer max dollars for JJ services too.
GO FIGURE….AND GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
STEEL (Formerly VenomSpitter)
June 30th, 2010
5:07 pm
ARE THEY F**KING CRAZYYYYYYYYYYY.
Forget this team
Matt
June 30th, 2010
5:09 pm
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
mykhalc
June 30th, 2010
5:09 pm
s/b…but fact is i’d pay PP before i pay JJ.
cp
June 30th, 2010
5:12 pm
Ehh it is what it is. We will probably see a lot of cheap no name guys on the bench. I cant take another year of Mario West. No more MARIO….. Whats up with the summer league roster? I like the kid from Maryland they just added. He goes to the rim with authority and is a solid defender. From the scouting reports he just disappears to often on offense. Not real happy with that but if he is a good defender who can get out and score in transition he might be worth a look at.
STEEL (Formerly VenomSpitter)
June 30th, 2010
5:12 pm
If they do this I officially hate the hawks.
Anyody who thinks Joe is worth over 70 milli is a F**KING FOOL.
D Hawks
June 30th, 2010
5:12 pm
The scary thing is I think the Hawks could have waited this out and maybe gotten JJ back for less money because I don’t think anyone else sees him as a 1, but they can’t take the chance on ending up with nothing or with a far less player with the lower salary cap space. They either had to go all in or all out and risk tanking and getting into the lottery. If you end up making the playoffs without JJ, you gain nothing in the long run. Plus the down side would be that maybe Al doesn’t want to resign later because he doesn’t think you’re committed to your core players. Tough call for management.
Section 303
June 30th, 2010
5:14 pm
God! This organization will never learn! Not having Joe may hurt in the short run, but not in the long.
Christ….millions for a guy who can never hit big shots in the playoffs and rips the fans. Makes me sick.
Alsandair
June 30th, 2010
5:17 pm
I’ll rather they offer Rudy Guy a max deal then Joe johnson.Rudy’s 23 years old & his 6′9.The hawks will be sat for the future,instead of Joe playing so-so for three years,then tanking the next three years.
Harry Hawk
June 30th, 2010
5:18 pm
Here’s hoping Joe tells us and our max offer to get bent. We don’t need to be paying that man max money.
Peter
June 30th, 2010
5:21 pm
WHAT A JOKE…..and a huge waste of money if that happens……we will never ever be a contender with Joe as our main guy sucking us dry, and stopping any ball moment, and any movement in the Hawks future !
G-MAN013
June 30th, 2010
5:21 pm
if it makes yall feel better Childress will have a contract in place for the Wizards. Sekou confirmed it. Maybe we can get McGee
Laker Lover
June 30th, 2010
5:23 pm
The Hawks are stupid to keep Joe and Mr. Sund better find a suitable replacement because “No Show Joe Needs To Go”! Hey that’s catchy….get rid of him Mr. Sund!!!!!!
James
June 30th, 2010
5:24 pm
If Joe Johnson accepts the Hawks max contract offer then that pretty much let’s you know he cares more about money than winning cause If he wants to win he will leave Atlanta.
bubba
June 30th, 2010
5:26 pm
OK,let me get this straight. Hawks are going offer $120 milliion to a player who said he didn’t care about Hawks fans? Done deal, no one will pay this second hand player that much. Hope new coach can muster all the B.S. he’s got himself into next season. Even Dennis Rodman cared more than this bum.
JKJ
June 30th, 2010
5:26 pm
Sign JJ and band truth-serum from this blogg. The things you posted on the last page was sick and disturbing please stop with the disrespectful comments.MC you should BAN truth-serum until he gets has act together.One month Ban for truth-serum.
ryan
June 30th, 2010
5:27 pm
If the rumors are true that if sign Joe Johnson and then trade him to Denver for Mello lets do it.
STEEL (Formerly VenomSpitter)
June 30th, 2010
5:31 pm
I don’t even think the knicks are dumb enuff to give Joe max money
honest_abe
June 30th, 2010
5:33 pm
can we just sign bosh, amare, lebron and dwade? i’ll play point and coach for free…
Astro Joe
June 30th, 2010
5:36 pm
Abe, with the cameo appearance.
Zero rings Joe
June 30th, 2010
5:37 pm
When Joe has zero rings at the end of the day, which he will undoubtedly have if he reups with the Hawks, I wonder how he’ll feel ten years down the road.
bigdave
June 30th, 2010
5:37 pm
“A source close to Joe Johnson told Frank Isola of the New York Daily News that Johnson has narrowed his list of teams down to the Hawks, Knicks and Bulls.
If the Hawks do not offer Johnson a maximum-salary contract, Johnson is almost certain to leave Atlanta and will likely sign with the Knicks. “
Dr. Strong
June 30th, 2010
5:37 pm
Bad move! He folds in the play-offs like a cheap suit. Why sign a player who disses the city and fans, we deserve better, so long Hawks enjoy purgatory….
Hawks To Offer Johnson Max Deal | Soaring Down South | An Atlanta Hawks blog
June 30th, 2010
5:39 pm
[...] Michael Cunningham is reporting that the Hawks will indeed offer Johnson a max deal when the clock strikes midnight tonight. There is a lot of misinformation out there from a lot of publications, but I have a feeling that Michael is not one that will spread misinformation. He is a very good writer who isn’t going to write about assumptions or supposition. If he’s reporting this, then my guess is, he has heard something from inside that this will indeed happen. [...]
I'm a clown
June 30th, 2010
5:42 pm
The Ayatollah ….best post on the board….clown
hot err
June 30th, 2010
5:43 pm
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
James
June 30th, 2010
5:46 pm
The Hawks are the dumbest franchise in the NBA.
JC
June 30th, 2010
5:46 pm
Just an FYI, here are the highest paid NBA players (for 2010-11):
1. Kobe Bryant LA Lakers
$24,806,250
2. Rashard Lewis Orlando
$20,514,000
3. Kevin Garnett Boston
$18,800,000
4. Tim Duncan San Antonio
$18,700,000
5. Michael Redd Milwaukee
$18,300,000
6. Pau Gasol LA Lakers
$17,822,187
7. Andrei Kirilenko Utah
$17,822,187
8. Gilbert Arenas Washington
$17,730,694
9. Vince Carter Orlando
$17,300,000
10. Zach Randolph Memphis
$17,333,333
11. Carmelo Anthony Denver
$17,149,243
12. Dwight Howard Orlando
$16,509,600
13. Elton Brand Philadelphia
$15,959,099
MsDee
June 30th, 2010
5:46 pm
Again, I have mixed feelings of keeping Joe or letting him go. But after reading most of you guys posts, I have to stick-up for Joe a little bit. Yall have to understand that Joe was being burnt-out by Woodsons mins and all but 2 offensive plays. Come playoff time, Joe wasnt worth 2 dead flies, cause he was tired and from playing all 40+ mins in regular season, other teams knew exactly how to defend him. Now if Woodson knew how to uterlize his bench, and provided more offensive plays, Joe PROBABLY would have been our LeBron/Wade/Kobe come playoff time..and we wouldnt be here now complaining how much money Joe is worth. Look at how Doc handle Boston, he rested his guys and maybe too long at times cause they only won 50 games but who cares since they made it all the way to the finals.. to a game 7, no less!!
I say lets see how Joe performs under Drews’ system. Again, Drew knows what works and what doesnt work for this team. I have the confidence that Drew will uterlize his bench properly and would know how to get the most out of Josh Smith.
Now, if Joe just doesnt want to play for us anymore, then s&t or let him walk..I still believe we can and will be a playoff bound team!!
JC
June 30th, 2010
5:48 pm
Sorry, I meant to mention the players that would be making more money than Joe if he gets the max in 2010-11, not including current free agents.
STEEL (Formerly VenomSpitter)
June 30th, 2010
5:48 pm
JOE IS NOT WORTH MORE THAN 2 USED SHOELACES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NCBravesFan
June 30th, 2010
5:49 pm
If this is true, you gotta think a significant trade is in the offing. No reason for the ASG to move aggressively on making a max offer to JJ unless they feel they have bigger fish to fry in the offseason.