Atlanta Hawks: Coach countdown
In the latest tangential, incremental update on the Hawks’ coaching search, Byron Scott tells Mitch Lawrence of the New York Daily News that Avery Johnson is the favorite for the Nets’ job. (Love how they managed to get Phil Jackson in that headline, too.)
ASG honcho Michael Gearon Jr is back in town. Mark Jackson is in town to meet with the owners today. Larry Drew interviewed yesterday. Dwane Casey is waiting. That might be about it for the final candidates.
So who do you want? AJC wise guy Jeff Schultz likes Johnson but was nice enough to ask for your input, too.
I went on 790 The Zone yesterday and was asked which guy I considered to be the frontrunner for the position. I answered the way no one seems to want to hear nowadays: “I don’t know.” I could have speculated that it’s Casey because of his ties to Sund, which seems to be the thing to do. Of course, a couple weeks ago Johnson was all the rage, with some media declaring him the favorite before the Hawks had even talked to the other three. Now you add Jackson to the equation. Drew has his supporters in the organization, too.
The point I’m trying to make is, the Hawks are having internal deliberations about the candidates. This is what happens in organizations, especially when there are multiple owners with perhaps differing opinions. Rick Sund is in charge of the search but obviously ASG will have its say. So who is the favorite? I suppose it depends on whom you ask in the organization and when you ask them. Some time soon the Hawks will decide on a coach, make him an offer, sign him and announce to everyone that he’s been their guy all along. I look forward to that day.
– On a more important note, I’m pulling for summer commenter Ken Strickland to make a full recovery. Stay strong, Ken.
MC
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199 comments Add your comment
Big Ray
June 8th, 2010
1:54 pm
Northcyde ,
LOL. We agree more than you think we do, or than I let on. We’re just both pretty opinionated on some subjects, and the differences are usually not fundamental, just a matter in difference in terminology.
I think some of the less-than-reasonable or idiosyncratic (is that a word, or did I just make it up?) comments that bubble up on blogs bother you more than they do me. I’m used to it, been blogging here since Sekou Smith started it back in 2005. Or put another way, you are more passionate about it than I am.
Don’t take me personal, I have always challenged those who display a knowledge for the game. Beats the hell out of trying to talk to anybody who only makes idiotic, sophomoric comments every time they post. Unfortunately, there is never a shortage of that….
Big Ray
June 8th, 2010
1:59 pm
Ramon ,
All that you said about Mark Jackson could also be said about you, could it not? Are you then a good candidate for a coaching job? I’m not trying to be sarcastic, but you have to wonder….can Jackson put that into play, and convince a pile of millionaires with differing personalities and temperaments to do it… consistently ?
Like you, I’m inclined to think that there must be a reason Sund wants to put him in front of the owners. But then the question becomes this: was it really Sund’s idea, or is somebody else in the organization (perhaps one of the owners themselves) pushing it? Do we know for sure that Sund made the recommendation, or is that specualation? We don’t know. I still think this is not the time to be trying such a thing out, but what do I know?
Like I said, the fan’s role remains…sit, watch, wait…
Najeh Davenpoop
June 8th, 2010
2:02 pm
I hate to throw cold water on all of your arguments, but the honest truth is that none of us have any idea how good any of these coaches will be except Avery, who is the only one with an extensive body of work as an NBA head coach with a talented roster. Northcyde’s arguments against Mark Jackson and Ramon’s arguments for him both have merit, but the truth is neither of you have anything more than a wild guess as to how successful he will be. I’m not picking on y’all — this applies to all of us. This is not like signing or drafting a player where we can all look at his game film and form an educated opinion of his abilities.
We have nothing at all to go on for these assistant coaches other than the success of their former teams on which they were assistants and their individual success as players, and the connection between those two things and theit eventual head coaching success is tenuous at best. Mike Woodson won a title as an assistant and was an All-Star player, but he ended up being an extremely average coach.
Big Ray
June 8th, 2010
2:07 pm
Why does every picture of Sund make it look like his eyes are half-closed?
JoJo the Godfather
June 8th, 2010
2:09 pm
The guy I would want to replace Joe (IF HE LEAVES) is Rip Hamilton. In fact, I’d love to see parts like Bibby, Marvin & Crawford moved to Detroit for Rip Hamilton & Tayshaun Prince. Use the majority of the MLE on Ronnie Brewer. Bring Chill back. Maneuver the draft to select Sherron Collins & Trevor Booker.
Teague / Collins / (Vet Min or Bi-Ann)
Hamilton / Brewer
Prince / Childress
Smith / Booker
Horford / Pachulia / (Vet Min or Bi-Ann)
Big Ray
June 8th, 2010
2:09 pm
Najeh
If you hate to throw the cold water, then why’d ya do it?!
Damn you… I’m coming back with a super-soaker water gun next time…
ray allen 3 pt
June 8th, 2010
2:10 pm
I think the hawks should think about going after Rudy Gay in Free Agency. I have heard rumblings that we are looking for another wingman to replace Marvin Williams. Gay is 23 and emerging, snag him now!
Go Hawks!!!!
Big Ray
June 8th, 2010
2:10 pm
Why do all these Joe Johnson replacement recommendations always come with a guy who is OLDER??
Ramon
June 8th, 2010
2:12 pm
Big Ray, anytime you hire a new coach its always a 50-50 chance no matter the coach. Remember Phil Jackson took over the Bulls and won 6 titles. But Larry Brown had a title, and coaches of the year awards and took over the Knicks and it ended up being a bad hire. Right now at this moment, there’s no guarantee that D’antoni will end up being a good hire in NY because to date, he’s underperformed. Rick Carlisle underperformed in Detroit, although everyone thought it would be a perfect hire when he took over. Jim O’Brien was a big mistake in Indiana, as was Eddie Jordan in Philly, and so far (even before the Bonanza showdown) Flip Saunders wasn’t having a positive impact in Washington. All of the prospective good head coaches who had succeeded previously, took over positions and truly made the situation worse. Isaiah Thomas won more as the Knicks coach than D’antoni has, and then Larry Brown did. Its really a crap shoot no matter who you hire. And at the end of the day, its just something about Jackson’s attitude and his hunger for THIS job that gives me the feeling he’s the right man for this job right now. Remember when Isaiah coached the Pacers, he hadn’t coached before. And he actually did a great job, before Donnie decide to bring in Larry Bird to be hometown hero.
JoJo the Godfather
June 8th, 2010
2:17 pm
Why do all these Joe Johnson replacement recommendations always come with a guy who is OLDER??….because this team’s starting 5 doesn’t need to get younger. we’re already talking about a 20 yr old starting PG. Surround Teague, Josh & Al with a couple of veterans (with rings).
Big Ray
June 8th, 2010
2:18 pm
Ramon ,
True. I’m just worried about it not being the right time HERE for THIS team. Just because I’m worried about it doesn’t mean it won’t work, or the person I want hired WILL work. Fact is, I’m not entirely sure who I want hired out of the guys mentioned in connection with the job. I think all I can really settle for is a comfort level. My comfort level is lowest with Jackson as of right now. But that’s just me, and it could change. I don’t know enough about the guy from a coaching standpoint, but I’m also not qualified to judge candidates, which I’m well aware of.
It will be whatever it will be, but I hope it will be sometime this week or something. Tired of waiting around for interviews.
Big Ray
June 8th, 2010
2:20 pm
JoJo the Godfather,
I can roll with that theory, I just don’t want anybody who is what Bibby became – no longer able to contribute at a high level. That won’t help us at all. Not saying Rip Hamilton is that guy, but I’m tired of getting vets when they’re all but done. Look at the situation with Joe Smith..
Big A
June 8th, 2010
2:23 pm
RUDY GAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
23 yrs old
JoJo the Godfather
June 8th, 2010
2:26 pm
I agree with that Big Ray. Rip looks to be in good shape though. He had a rough year this year with injuries and such. Still gave 18-3-4 a game on 33 minutes. Prince is in a contract year and will probably play his arse off this year. 13-5-3, good defense, 37% from 3 in 2009. Having similar players in Brewer & Childress woudl be huge too. Brewer, Prince & Chill all have a good enough handle to bring the ball up the floor. Very versatile roster.
Ramon
June 8th, 2010
2:27 pm
Big Ray, I understand. Lol, As I said before to me the three best candidates can’t be hired for the job (Adelman, Hubie Brown, and Doc Rivers). I like Avery, because of his winning percentage, but something about him just seems annoying lol. And Casey, I wonder how Casey would interact with this roster. To me, out of the names mentioned, its 1st Avery, 2nd Jackson, 3rd Casey, and 4th Drew. And its sad to me that those are the names that we’re choosing from lol. Whoever the coach is though, I hope they look into bring Steve Smith onto the coaching staff.
JoJo the Godfather
June 8th, 2010
2:28 pm
RUDY GAY!!!!!!!!!!
23 yrs old
Restricted free agent and we have no cap space!!!!!!!
Big A
June 8th, 2010
2:30 pm
we will have cap space if joe leaves, gay isnt anywhere close to a max contract
JoJo the Godfather
June 8th, 2010
2:32 pm
we will have cap space if joe leaves, gay isnt anywhere close to a max contract……if joe leaves and we renounce all of our free agents and sell our draft picks, we might have $8M to offer. that won’t be enough. memphis would match in a minute.
Big A
June 8th, 2010
2:34 pm
ok you are prob right, its just an interesting thought. he seems like an explosive player that we could use on the perimeter. we could try a sign and trade but i highly doubt joe would want to go to memphis. too bad, Rudy wouldve looked nice in a hawks uniform
Ramon
June 8th, 2010
2:35 pm
I’d take Brewer and Wilkins combined over Gay. Gay is lazy and will be overpaid. In the league now, if you have a wing who is lazy on defense, he’s no good to your team really. It does no good to score 19 points if you’re going to give up 18-23 points a game. I’d rather have Brewer who is going to make the opposition work for every shot they get off, let alone points they get.
Big A
June 8th, 2010
2:36 pm
if we sign a tough coach like avery johnson, rudy gay could be coaxed to play better defense
Najeh Davenpoop
June 8th, 2010
2:37 pm
Gay and Hamilton would both help the Hawks. Hamilton would be cheaper and easier to acquire because of his recent struggles, although much of that is attributable to the change in the offensive scheme, injuries, and having to coexist with shoot-first guards like Allen Iverson and Rodney Stuckey after spending years paired with Chauncey Billups. Gay would probably require a contract too big for the Hawks’ budget (not to mention the Hawks wouldn’t recoup any of that money through jersey sales…)
Sautee
June 8th, 2010
2:38 pm
northcyde,
about this: “Other fans in other cities do just that, when their team is a top 10 squad. The fans and families make supporting that team their #1 entertainment priority. Why can’t the fans and families in Atlanta do the same?”
You do not know, nor do you have any way to know, whether fans who support a team are making that support their ” #1 entertainment priority”.
Not only do you not know this, but I challenge you, Mr. King of Blog Research. to quantifiably show that whatever “entertainment choice” made was the #1 choice in that family’s priorities.
Either show us or back down the hype.
Big A
June 8th, 2010
2:41 pm
does anybody think that we could acquire chris bosh in a sign and trade?? joe johnson and josh smith perhaps, we receive chris bosh and a 2nd round draft pick…
Big A
June 8th, 2010
2:43 pm
or perhaps a sign and trade with phoenix for amare
O'Brien
June 8th, 2010
2:46 pm
Given that all the Hawks may have to work with is the mid-level and the bi-annual exception (along with the veteran’s minimum), doesn’t this lead back to Rick Sund’s off-season last year? Although he did a good job of trading for Jamal, he also signed Marvin, Bibby and ZaZa for ~$18 mil per year.
Obviously nobody predicted that all 3 would have regressed the way they did, but if he had given Bibby a 2 year deal instead of a 3 year deal, Bibby would have been an expiring contract, and tradeable this off-season.
Also, Sund could have let the market set Marvin’s price, and quite possibly, maybe get Marvin for cheaper than $7.5 mil per year.
@ Ray,
Along with Ronnie Brewer, I think Matt Barnes and Damien Wilkins could be another option at the backup SF spot (depending on what we do with Chills).
The Truth
June 8th, 2010
2:49 pm
northcyde
Let me reiterate one of my central points:
“the formula for winning a NBA championship does not rest with just the Head Coach but the Entire Organization.”
Whether it is Avery Johnson, Casey or Mark Jackson (or any other dark-horses); the entire organization must also be accountable for the successes or failures of this team. What would it mean if the favored new coach request for additional roster acquisitions comes up short? He would likely take heat from a sub par season when the GM or ASG budget could have also played an important role. Also, if you are suggesting Doc Rivers coaching had nothing to do with their recent championship run and somehow it was just all about their hall of fame players, then I disagree. If he can get criticized for being rumored to be fired (as you suggested) then he should also get praised for winning a title. Not to mentioned also him being in the hunt for another.
Ramon
June 8th, 2010
2:50 pm
If Atlanta home games started at 7:30 or 8:00, instead of 7:00, the Hawks would have higher attendance. You take the average person who works downtown, but lives on the outskirts (Smyrna, Roswell, Alpharetta, Sandy Springs, Stockbridge, Ellenwood, Marietta). If they get off of work at 5:00. With the way traffic is, by the time they get home to go pick up their kids/spouse or whoever (because no one likes to go to a game alone) its a good chance its already 6:00-6:30. So before they could even make it to Phillips Arena, it may be 7:30 or even later (if they take the time to change clothes and take a shower). That can discourage people/fans from wanting to buy a ticket if they know they’re going to miss an entire quarter before they even get to the game.
Melvin
June 8th, 2010
2:51 pm
If Joe leaves (heck even if he stays), I wouldn’t seeing the Hawks sign T-Mac to a low risk contract that has a team opt for year 2 or 3.
Sautee
June 8th, 2010
2:52 pm
I’m not saying that Mark Jackson would be the best choice. I’d have to be in Sund’s shoes and have heard all the interviews.
But for those who keep harping on a lack of experience…..
Did Larry Bird’s lack of experience have any negative effect on his .687% winning %? How about on his .615% playoff record? His EC championship?
This is a yes or no question. Any takers?
Jerry West
June 8th, 2010
3:10 pm
Sautee,
Point taken on Bird’s experience, but check the Pacers roster when Bird took over. Veteran-laden, with no shortage of leadership, from Reggie to Chris Mullin to Mark Jackson himself.
lewis
June 8th, 2010
3:15 pm
8:30 games would allow me to leave after traffic unfuuus itself.
O'Brien
June 8th, 2010
3:17 pm
Melvin,
Welcome to the club. I suggested signing TMac (a couple weeks ago) for 2 reasons.
1) Low risk, high reward
2) marketing – dude was almost voted as a starter into the ASG last year. Some fans will buy the TMac Hawk jersey, some will come out to see what he has left etc.
lewis
June 8th, 2010
3:21 pm
I tried doing some research on T.Mac.
All I found was 2 years worth of articles devoted to his knees.
I’d be 100% for this idea if you could guarantee his health, but I don’t think it’s going to happen.
The Truth
June 8th, 2010
3:23 pm
Sautee
Why do you asked a question to which you already know the answer? In Bird case, NO. Furthermore, just to further boaster your point about Larry Bird inexperience:
Despite having no previous coaching experience, Bird led the Pacers to a 58–24 record—the franchise’s best as an NBA team at the time—in the 1997–98 season, and pushed the Bulls to seven games in the Eastern Conference finals. He was named the NBA Coach of the Year for his efforts, becoming the only person in NBA history to have won both the MVP and Coach of the Year awards. He then led the Pacers to two consecutive Central Division titles in 1999 and 2000, and a berth in the NBA finals in 2000.
Jerry West
June 8th, 2010
3:28 pm
TMac thinks a bit too highly of himself last I checked. He didn’t want to come off the bench, despite seeming like he can’t really play a lot of minutes or consecutive games. I’d only sign him if he brought the PHX training staff with him.
Sautee
June 8th, 2010
3:34 pm
Jerry West,
Good point about the experience and leadership that those Pacers had. We only wish, eh?
But Bird STILL had to push the right buttons for them to make a 19 game improvement from the previous year. His lack of experience was NO factor in the results. He was COY that year.
The Truth
June 8th, 2010
3:34 pm
Follow-up
It is also ironic but there is an inexperience coach Larry Bird and PG Mark Jackson connection:
Jackson would eventually appear in his only NBA Finals as the Pacers’ starting point guard in 2000, The same year Larry Bird was the Pacer coach.
Is this an Omen?
Sautee
June 8th, 2010
3:37 pm
Truth,
Thanks for illuminating the point.
Hawks Fan
June 8th, 2010
3:40 pm
I understand that the hawks have a short list of candidates for their head coaching job but before they make a mistake how about considering some coaches such as Michael Cooper and Bill Laimbeer both coaches in wnba but won championships there and also won championships as players in the nba. I don’t understand why these two guys haven’t been recruited into the nba headcoaching fraternity. Did they do something to David Stern the commissioner?
Rufus1
June 8th, 2010
3:56 pm
Why I like Mark(because we know the most about him)
Mark is my #2 Choice, behind Avery
Mark Jackson is a 6ft PG, with a 7″in vertical and as slow as an over weight newborn, but he played 17 years in the NBA and is in the top 3 in ast….THAT IS ALL I NEED TO KNOW!!!
In order to play that long with his physical make-up, his Basket ball IQ must be EXTREMELY HIGH.
1) He would have to understand his own strengths and weaknesses
2) He would have to understand changing defenses
3)He would have to know the strengths and weaknesses of his own teammates (Josh from 18ft and Marvin trying to dribble)
4)We already know he was a tremendous leader
5)We know he thinks Teague has the seeds of greatness as PG (Because he said it)
6)We Know he commands great respect from the players around the league
7)We know that Phil Jackson and Doc Rivers success is greatly attributed to there assistant coaches…They are great leaders.
HIRE THE BEST LEADER OF MEN!!!
i_am_soulstar
June 8th, 2010
4:40 pm
Rufus,
Performance simply isn’t promised, and hiring so hiring anyone for any given position is considered taking a chance, but I think the worst thing the Hawks could do is hire the coach with gratest unknown. Sure Mark could turn out to be a better fit for the Hawks than all of the other coaches, but the fact is that in terms of probability, he’s the least likely to be successful and he’s also the greatest risk for disaster due to absolutely no experience whatsoever.
The candidate with the better resume and proven tools should get the position if you ask me. And that’s likely between Avery Johnson, Larry Drew, and Dwane Casey.
Mark should so some assistant coaching first. Sorry if I sound like a hater Mark.
i_am_soulstar
June 8th, 2010
4:41 pm
I obviously should’ve proofread that last post
i_am_soulstar
June 8th, 2010
4:45 pm
When we talk about Larry Bird and Doc Rivers coaching teams after having little previous experience, we’re talking about chance situations. Also, both of these coaches took over rebuilding teams. To hand the reins of a top 10 team to a guy with no experience??
Not so casual observer
June 8th, 2010
7:18 pm
Any unproven coach would be a step back for the Hawks, and I include Avery Johnson in the unproven category. A proven coach, as I see it, is one who has been successful with more than one team and various types of rosters.
This organization needs a NAME, a proven coach, otherwise Woodson should have been retained. A quality coach brings a proven system and the respect required in a “players league”. If the ASG is not consulting the players they should.
If the ASG truly desires a championship then step to the plate and spend big money on a big-time coach (no luxury tax). Otherwise, releasing Mike Woodson, attempting to re-sign JJ and taking any other steps to improve the roster becomes simply wasted effort if the coach hire is wrong.
On the roster, I will go back to the same thing from prior years – Marvin has a post player’s lower body and a wing’s upper body. A big butt, not exactly the physical requirement to play the better 3’s in the league and thin through the chest and arms so that he is unable to match the strength of the bigger 3’s and 4’s.
Teague, who has been compared to Rajon Rondo earlier in this blog, also has a big butt for his frame. Built more like Mark Jackson without the height and weight to back another player down the lane. How is Teague ever going to develop into anything like Rondo with such physical differences? How also does a player reach this point in life with such poor shooting mechanics? The only similarity between the two is the position they play.
In Teague’s defense, not many “experts” thought much of Rondo earlier in his career.
Simply put, the draft picks spent on the Williams, Marvin and Shelden, have set the franchise back several years from where we would be if those picks were better used.
Ken Strickland
June 8th, 2010
7:57 pm
I’m more interested in the roster we present to our new HC, than who we hire as our new HC. As far as JJ is concerned, no other team can offer more money than the Hawks. Even if we overpay him at $20M per yr, it would only be a $5M increase in our payroll, since we were already paying him $15M.
Since Woodson was not resigned because of his inability to produce in the playoffs, I find it hard to believe the ASG wouldn’t make every effort to give the new HC what he needs to excel in the playoffs. And that starts with going all out to resign JJ, which is why I believe the ASG will make it very hard for JJ not to resign.
With JJ and a new HC on board, all we have to do is solidify our bench. To ease the Hawks financial issues, we can sign C DJ MBenga, SF DWilkins, a vet PG, and resign PF/C RMorris to go with ZPachulia, JCrawford, Bibby and our draft pick.
The Hawks will automatically become a much better DEF team with our new HC not starting and playing Bibby major mins. Not being forced to switch everything, and having our front line players staying with their assignments near the basket, rather than being on the perimeter trying to play PG’s and SG’s, will certainly be an improvement. Having our front line players stay with their assignments will also help us become a better OFF/DEF rebounding team, as well as allow our shot blockers to remain in position to block more shots.
Better DEF rebounding means more fast breaks and easy scoring opportunities, and OFF rebounding means more scoring opportunities. We could very easily end up being a younger, more athletic version of the playoff Celtics.
yeaaaboyeee
June 9th, 2010
2:49 pm
is marvin williams like still growing or something….. or maybe someone keeps tying his shoestrings together. that guy is the nbas’ most clumsy player.and what is wrong with his back. just keep stealing your money marv. i would it’s gauranteed….
truthspitter
June 10th, 2010
11:41 am
Casey is the worse case little stupid looking fool. He could not even win with a 1st ballot HOF’er (Kevin Garnett) on his team. What a dumb move
Geo13Dude
June 10th, 2010
1:47 pm
Since the Hawks have waited this long, they may as well bring Byron Scott in for an interview–at the least!!! Chris Paul THRIVED under this guy, and that would bode well for the development of Jeff Teague.
Josh and Al might also progress, given B. Scott’s work in molding David West into a perennial 20 point scorer.
Otherwise, they should just go with Mark Jackson!
No coaching experience–true–but, just like B. Scott, he’s proven to be a WINNER in this league, nonetheless.
And that is a HUGE Something the other two CANNOT claim!