Atlanta Hawks: Season’s Over
– The Magic swept the Hawks. The total losing margin of 101 points is the largest in NBA history for a four-game sweep. The Hawks were booed in their own arena.
– They hope all of that doesn’t define their season.
– “We are disappointed at the series,” Smoove said, “but we can’t let a bad series overturn all the good we did the whole entire season. Coming into the postseason we thought we could do something special but we couldn’t get it done.”
– “I told [teammates] to keep their heads up regardless what they say about us,” J.J. said. “We had a hell of a year. It wasn’t a good series, but the whole season was good.”
– “I’m proud of our basketball team and what we’ve accomplished this season,” Woody said. “We did a lot of good things this season. I’m happy in the direction the team is going. Sure we have to get better. But it’s a big jump from the first round to the second, third and Finals. We’re still learning.”
– Clearly there wouldn’t be so many sour feelings about the Hawks if they had competed in this series. There is no way taking two franchise-worst beatings in a four-game series is going to leave them on good terms with their fans. At this point, the Bobcats can claim to be closer to the Magic’s level than the Hawks.
– Of course it also didn’t help that the Hawks gave lackluster effort in two games. Josh’s antics (he was looking at the Kiss Cam during one timeout) and J.J.’s comments about fans just added to the ill feelings.
– Still, 53 wins isn’t easy and not something the Atlanta Hawks have done very often. When I see some of my blog people talking about how they should have won 60 (shoot, I’ve even seen 65) I start to wonder. The Hawks are a talented team but, as I’ve said, it’s more physical talent than basketball talent, if you know what I mean. Of course you do, because you’ve watched this team play longer than me.
– No matter what you think of him as a coach, it’s indisputable that Woody is speaking the truth when he says: ““Whatever happens, whether I am here or somewhere else, this team is in a better place than before I got here. That means a lot to me and my staff.”
– Also true is if Woody doesn’t come back because of high expectations, they are expectations he helped create . “I would like to think that,” he said. “Sometimes I don’t think we get the credit because the media is so brutal on coaches. It’s awful. But I’m not going to let that send me in a tizzy or send me the other way because I can hold my head high for what I’ve done in six years.”
– He says he still wants the job: “I would love to stay. I started this six years ago and I would like to finish it.”
– Joe was non-committal about his future, saying he hasn’t thought about the factors that will go into his decision or which teams he might consider. But he said he hasn’t ruled out a return to the Hawks. “I will take some time off, clear my head and spend some time with my family. I am sure I will sit down with my agent in the next couple weeks and see what’s out there.”
– Fans booed J.J. during the game and when he left the floor for the final time. “It don’t bother me,” Joe said. “I’ve got thick skin.”
– Why does he think he had such a bad series? “[It's] a number of things I’d rather not talk about,” J.J. said. “Like I said, no excuses.”
– Asked if he was injured, Joe said: “No.”
– Don’t forget that the Hawks played what has looked like the best team in the league for two months. The Magic are deep, talented and committed. “One thing I’m real confident in with our team is our mental preparation,” Stan Van Gundy said. “I know our energy and intensity will be there. When we get beat, it’s not been because we’ve not been ready to play. As a coach, that’s about the best thing you can say.”
– “Just watch and see their level of intensity they play with,” Al said. “That defines their team. They’re a championship-caliber team. Just take that in and play like that for next season. It takes a whole lot of effort. It’s almost to the point where you have to make yourself feel uncomfortable out there. We didn’t have that this year. With some of our guys when fatigue set in, everybody kind of shied away from it.”
– That’s the kind of thing Woody means when he says the Hawks are still learning how to win. Woody never could get the Hawks to that level this season. It’s too simple to say that’s due to his failures as a coach. The Hawks need better depth–more “bonafide pieces” as Woody says. They need more leadership in the locker room and maybe a different mix of personalities. Otherwise, if Woody doesn’t return the next coach could run into some of the same problems.
– Also remember that it’s tough for any NBA coach to succeed when players know his job security is shaky. That’s just the truth in this league. It’s easier for a player to tune out a coach if he knows he can just wait him out and eventually he could be gone.
– Despite their flaws, the Hawks won 53 games and made it to the second round. “We was playing confident all season long, and we thought we could give them a good fight,” Josh said. “But they are playing great basketball. We never did bring our ‘A’ game.”
– “It’s disappointing, but I feel like I left it all out there and gave all I had,” Al said. “I wish it could have turned out better.”
– I’m out, Hawks fans.
MC
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
255 comments Add your comment
O'Brien
May 11th, 2010
12:57 pm
Section 303,
I do have my concerns about Josh too. But it could just be that he tuned Woody out. It could just be that he was tired of the ISO JJ, so he figured he would get him shots up too. Although it could just be that Josh is spoiled, and stubborn.
Would you trade him for Al Jefferson?
Ramon
May 11th, 2010
12:59 pm
Here is the question, if Orlando goes and beats Cleveland 4-1 (like they did last year). And they beat the Lakers/Pheonix in less than 5-6 games to win the championship. Will that affect how we look back on this series? Sorry to say, but it just seemed as if Orlando is on a MISSION, and they won’t be denied this season. The Hawks defense may have wholes at moments, but many of the shots the Magic made was against good defense by the Hawks. When Howard puts the ball on the floor to make a move, you’re supposed to send the double team. And the Hawks did that. But the Magic’s passes are so crisp and direct, that its no way you can rotate fast enough to cover 2-3 guys who already know where they are passing before you even get there. Or when Carter, Nelson, Barnes or anyone else is penetrating, its no way Horford or Josh can leave Howard or Lewis to play help defense like they are able to against most team. The Magic have a line up where there’s NO ONE you can leave open. What other team in the NBA can even say that? Cleveland have Moon (and sometimes Parker) whom you can shy away from to help at times. LA has Artest who can you let shoot jump shots all game, and Odum as well. But the Magic have shooter after shooter coming off the bench to go along with the best post player in the league. The way this team is structured, the Magic could go down as one of the best teams in league history if they can string together 2-3 season runs (and they have no reason not to be able to).
So fairly to the Hawks, you can’t really judge this series, until you see the way other teams adjust (or fail to ) to this same Orlando team. If Cleveland only wins one game against Orlando (and its even possible for them to get swept because they can’t score enough points), their season will be a larger disappointment than what some consider the Hawks to be.
Fundamentals
May 11th, 2010
1:00 pm
SWAT,
That’s why as much as it’s bad for Woodson it’s time for a philosophy change. Avery, Sam, Byron Scott, Thunder Dan, Steve Smith, Mark Jackson all seem to be options? Someone to try a new look & voice.
As far as players go we need to evaluate what are our best options. We know Joe Smith, Jason Collins, Mario West, Randolph Morris and possibly Mo Evans won’t be back. We know Joe Johnson may or not be back. Now with that said we need 5-6 players to fill roles. What do we need?
#1 Lockdown defensive guard who can keep up with quicker guards. One that could play the point could help Teague relax in his development.
#2 Bogut type center who can be physical down low, rebound and play solid D.
#3 3 point shooters who can also defend.
We’ve got
Teague, Joe/replacement, Josh, Al, so we need a servicable center.
Bibby, Jamal and Evans, Marvin, ZaZa under contract.
Sounds like we need what we’ve always needed = 1-2 serviceable centers, a point guard and a 3 pt sniper. They don’t have to be outstanding. They just have to be servicable players who could be utilized and maximized.
Woodson had the pieces, he had the talent. He just chose not to maximize their development in the regular season. He coached for the regular season record, this deficiency glared in the postseason. Preached it all year. Now it’s time for Sund to decide what happens.
Yup!
May 11th, 2010
1:03 pm
I mean, it’s not like Woody was saying anything important in those huddles anyway. Josh has been hearing the same thing for six seasons “Defense, Rebound, Play harder, Switch, Iso-Joe!, Come on guys!, we gotta get a stop right now, Play!, we need some offense!”
No real strategy…..just weak general motivational statements. Josh KNEW woody didn’t have any answers, so did the rest of the squad. Face it people, Woodson reached his limit.
Really
May 11th, 2010
1:08 pm
For all you fans who think the Sund is about to shine, make sure to bring your umbrellas!!!
Section 303
May 11th, 2010
1:10 pm
Yup, I don’t think many are questioning that. I don’t see anybody saying Woodson should be back. Just don’t fool yourself into thinking he was/is the only problem. When pro athletes aren’t trying, that’s on them not the coaching staff. In the NBA guys should be able to motivate themselves.
Really, I think that is why the Hawks are getting killed on here, in the media, on TV…not hard to tell when a group is dogging it. The Hawks gave no effort. Point the finger at those players.
Dap01
May 11th, 2010
1:19 pm
Everyone acts like Childress is a savior. He is not even starring in Greece. He was a 6th pick that is not starter material. He can be a valuable player and member of a team. Trouble is he expects starter money and he is closer to Mo Evans money ($2.5 million).
He is a small forward who can not stretch any defense.
Fundamentals
May 11th, 2010
1:20 pm
I’m not saying Sund is the answer either. He is presented with an opportunity. Our only opportunity for the summer. We go as he goes, track record isn’t so great, but he’s the GM. Pressure is definelty on he and the owners to secure a solid marketable product after this blunder.
Fundamentals
May 11th, 2010
1:35 pm
Chills couldn’t embrace his role before. Has he learned enough in Greece to realize he’s not a big time starter who commands big money? He’s an excellent role player. When he realizes that we’ll all be better off.
The Truth
May 11th, 2010
1:43 pm
Hawks Fans let not your heart be troubled; this too shall pass. Don’t kid ourselves, we all knew the loss was going to happen; we are just disappointed in the effort and the margin. Some of Orlando’s victory can be attributed to their perception of the Hawks and past match-up history. They had no fear in playing the Hawks; neither did they have a match-up problem to worry about in planning for the Hawks. If you look at our roster from top to down compared to theirs, we just got exposed. Kevin McHale said it best, “Orlando made the Hawks look a lot worst then they really are. They just met a buzz-saw when they played Orlando.” This very hot shooting Orlando team could look completely different in the next round if their perimeter shoots are suddenly not falling from being confronted with a different defense as with the Bobcats.
I think in retrospect this talk of the Hawks being so deep and athletic have been an over-exaggeration. Maybe the hype was great for the NBA to sell tickets and viewer-ship, but most of the expert had their very-low championship chances peg about right. When they use the word athletic with respect to the Hawks, they were really talking about Josh Smith and maybe Al Horford. Since they are both “tweeners” at their respective position, their athleticism could be and was neutralized with size and strength. And let’s not kid ourselves, the deepness of our team really rest with one player; a streaky Crawford who also was a neophyte in playoff competition. Not to mention the other issue this Hawks Team had with leadership, chemistry, coaching etc, we got about as much as possible out of this bunch.
This team as it is currently constructed has peaked. So on a “poor-man” budget; we got what we paid from a “big picture” standpoint. So we as fans should adjust our expectation accordingly now that the verdict has been rendered.
A Message to the ASG: Once we recalibrate our expectation, don’t expect a standing ovation from the fans if this product is reproduced next season.
Grandad
May 11th, 2010
1:44 pm
Josh’s body of work [season] should overshadow play-ffs
when he reverted to “old Josh”. Habits are hard to break
and he actually came further this year than we had a right
to expect[for one season]. One should not devalue the fact
that Josh is a very durable player. This came to mind when
O’B posed the Josh for A.J. trade scenario. Jefferson coming
off serious knee inj.
One of two things I heard on the radio this AM:
Question?
If Wdsn coached Orl. & Van G. coached the Hawks would
Orl. have swept? Radio guys agreed, yes/or maybe lose one.
Personally – if the two coaches were switched
[@ beginning of season] the series goes seven games.
Second was a rumor that Joe may end up in Dallas.
Makes sense, second bananna, close prox. to LR Ark.
Pos. S & T – Rodrigue Beaubois + Eduardo Najera & filler.
Hoops
May 11th, 2010
1:45 pm
This is what I would do if I were Rick Sund:
1. Don’t rehire Woodson. Go after the best available coach. Possibly Doc Rivers if he is serious about leaving Boston. Talk to Avery Johnson as well.
2. Sign and trade Joe Johnson. He has value. Get what you can for him. Devin Harris and Courtney Lee is a start.
3. Use any player we have except Al Horford in a trade for the best center available.
4. Josh Smith is not a small forward. If we can get a center then use Josh Smith as trade bait to improve the team. I have said many times – Josh for Bosh!
This is lineup possible-
PG – D. Harris, J. Teague
SG – J. Crawford, C. Lee
SF – J. Childress, M. Evans
PF – A. Horford, M. Williams
C – Bosh, Zaza
Head Coach – Doc Rivers
Hawk n the Ham
May 11th, 2010
1:49 pm
“Some of ya’ll done lost your mind” -Kilo Ali
Ramon
May 11th, 2010
1:51 pm
Josh Childress is not a full time starter for a contender in this league. Name what team in the semi finals would he have started for. Honestly, I don’t think Childress is worth more than 4-5 mil a season. I would take Ronnie Brewer, Outlaw, Posey, and others over Childress in a second. Yea I know Childress could play point guard some games, but he was here for 4 seasons. And when did anyone ever see Childress about to check in the game and think “YES! Childress is coming in.” And with the addition of another big man, Josh C would be the 3rd person to come off the bench behind Crawford, and the new big man. You don’t pay the 8th man 6 and 7 million. And please remember Childress wasn’t exactly a role model for staying healthy during his time here. And who wouldn’t take Gortat, Pietrus, Varajeo, Odum, Milsap, and others over him who aren’t starting in the league?
terrell
May 11th, 2010
1:52 pm
Still looking for “Hawks relieve Woodson of his coaching duties” on ESPN News.
CJ
May 11th, 2010
2:01 pm
I honestly think the WNBA Atlanta Dream would have played with more intensity.
However, several personnel changes are definitely needed.
The following imposters should be kicked to the curb:
Joe Johnson AKA Mr. No Show & Zero Personality
Josh Smith AKA Mr. NBA Cry Baby
Mike Bibby AKA Bout Time for Retirement
Marvin Williams AKA Mr. Invisible
If only the Hawks could get Dwayne Wade, had enough sense to draft Chris Paul, and find a center who didn’t trip over his own feet.
Mel
May 11th, 2010
2:30 pm
No excuses BUT i wonder how fresh Kobe would be if he had to chase Brandon Jennings and Jameer damn near the entire game?
Ted M
May 11th, 2010
2:38 pm
holy cow its 2:30pm and the Hawks still have not announced they will not be renewing (firing) Woodson’s contract.
O'Brien
May 11th, 2010
2:39 pm
Ramon, Dap01,
Marvin Williams makes $7.5 mil per year, and his career average is identical to Chills (10 and 5). Two questions for you.
1) who would u rather have (chills or Marvin) and why?
2) how much do you think Marvin is really worth?
Dwayne
May 11th, 2010
2:40 pm
hahaha…chills is Childress, what a joke, dude needs to get his mouth and teeth fixed, and whats up with that hairdo??? Didn’t that go out in the 70’s???? Stupid shot he has too, what is he doing, pushing the ball towards the basket???? He is your answer??? Atl. in worse shape than we thought.
GeeMack
May 11th, 2010
2:42 pm
Hoops
The free agent has to agree to the sign and trade. Why would JJ agree to got to the worst team in the league, just to help out the Hawks?
Remember Joe has the oppurtunity to make the money he want and go to title contender.
drmaryb
May 11th, 2010
2:50 pm
Derrick Coleman!
MVP LiFETIME TROPHY – for – UNDERACHiEVER.
Sheed gets a pass on that label. WHY? Sheed has a RING!
The Truth
May 11th, 2010
2:53 pm
This is yet another reason why the Hawks looked so terrible against Orlando. Since they are really a jump shooting team, they never really got good looks at the basket. One reason was Mike Bibby. Why was Orlando shooters always so open? Yes, they passed the ball well but also because of their PG Nelson. This guy is similar to a penetrating Chris Paul type. Look at what happens when you have this type of PG on your team.
Mel
May 11th, 2010
2:54 pm
It will be an interesting Summer for the Hawks and NBA alike. This will be one of the greatest Summers in a while.
I would like Joe to stay, Woodson to go. What do you do when your coach has you run the ONE play all year. It’s the playoffs, the Magic know your play. He sucked, but Woodson is a let down as a coach. No plays. Kevin Durant rarely has to dribble to get his shot off because his coach has him running through 3 screens and there is BALL MOVEMENT.
Teague better avg 20 and 10 this Summer
Bench Bibby.
Keep Joe
SIgn veterans like PJ Brown was to the Celtics, Kurt Thomas was to the Bucks.
Mo can go
Mel
May 11th, 2010
2:57 pm
It still bothers me to this day.
People mention Elite PGs
We could have drafted TWO of them. OK we missed them BUT
Next year we draft SHELDON??
That was the pick that set this franchise back not 05. We could have easily fixed 05’s mistake by drafting Rondo, or even Gay who I’ve read some suggest.
Hoops
May 11th, 2010
3:03 pm
GeeMack,
The Nets may get John Wall in the draft. Wall, JJ, & B. Lopez would make a good cast to surround with role players. You have a great young PG, an outside shooter, and a good post. That’s more than the Hawks have to surround role players with!
Oldtimer
May 11th, 2010
3:10 pm
Face it Atlanta Hawks fans, you all ran into a hot team and your team fades when their back is against the wall. The Hawks match up very good against any other team in the league besides the Magic and the Lakers. This team has played the Celtics, Cavs and Suns tough. Furthermore, they won 53 games. I understand your frustration, but you have a solid base. A new coach and a key few free agents is all you need.
Everyone piles up on Joe Johnson, but Dirk, Wade, Bosh, C. Anthony and the other so-called superstars are sitting at home right now after first round exits. Face it, there is only one team going to win every year and there are just a few superstar elite level teams and players. Calm down, take a nap and come back with some logical next steps. Not these spur of the moment reactions. If it was so easy your franchise would not have slipped into non-existence prior to J.J. arriving. Now, because you a booed your best player and a guy who made a commitment to improve your franchise, I don’t think you are not likely going to get another big time player (any better than Johnson). Face it, Wade is not going to Atlanta, James is not going, Kobe is not going, and Bosh and Carmelo play the same spots as your key guys. Therefore, look for a respected high energy, X & O coach, a good solid point guard (remember Joe J. flourished in playoffs with Nash), a consistent three man (back-up or starter) and a true starting center. And finally, remember it was not D. Howard that beat you last night night, but R. Lewis, Air France, V. Carter, J. Nelson, etc. It was a team of guys.
Rod from College Park
May 11th, 2010
3:14 pm
Ramon,
Try naming 5 teams in the league that Marvin would start for. That’s the question. Chills or any other starting small forward in the league would have been a better option than Marvin.
Section 303
May 11th, 2010
3:20 pm
Oldtimer, next time you post, try writing in paragraphs. I got a headache trying to read through what you wrote. I know you’re an “Oldtimer”, but I’m thinking paragraphs were around in your day, too.
This just sucks….f’ing Hawks…when will I ever learn. I guess it doen’t matter…we’re Hawks fans, whether we like it or not. When we wake up tomorrow, we will still be Hawks fans.
Though, when I wake up tomorrow, I will not be a Joe Johnson fan. Just like when I woke up yesterday. That arshole can go jump in front of a bus. Like many of you, I’ve been a long time season ticket holder…Joe’s comments still p#ss me off. He owes an apology.
Section 303
May 11th, 2010
3:23 pm
By the way, I would dance in the streets if we got Lopez and Harris from NJ. I would be willing to give up a lot to get those guys in here. Not likely, though. Isn’t the big problem with sign-and-trade that the player has a lot of the power. Doubt Joe, considering what a piece of trash he is, would be willing to help the Hawks. He’s in it for him, which is fine, I guess. But, F him for it anyways…
Fundamentals
May 11th, 2010
3:34 pm
Feeling your pain 303, but you need to relax. You’ll have a coronary before July when the fun starts.
Joe owes us an apology just to save his face and increase his value to another team. His comments were not welcome, not needed and a sign of how he truly feels. Anger and emotion do cause things to slip, but usually it’s what’s on your heart.
He’s tired of being here under the current status quo. He wants change as well!
And yes, we’re all Hawks fans in the end, hoping, waiting, dreaming, but never quite getting there.
Stinger
May 11th, 2010
3:43 pm
Lots of dreamers here when it comes to signing Bosh / Wade etc.
I’m a little more grounded.
My plan would include -
A new coach absolutely – Tom Thibodeau (all defense all the time)
Sign and Trade JJ but only if we can get a needed asset in return (no K Heinrich). Do not sign him to a 6 yr max deal – too long given his age.
Trade for a PG (2 options) 1 – See who drafts Wall and look at their “new” backup (Devin Harris, etc) 2 – Go after Chris Paul’s back up – Darren Collison
Match the offer for Childress (Does anyone remember his PER when he was with the Hawks – hint #2 on the team slightly behind JJ).
New Center ? (Horford to the 4) – not this year – try the draft – consider all sign and trades Amare etc but not likely.
Section 303
May 11th, 2010
3:43 pm
Fundamentals, I hear ya’. I am going to take the advice of Oldtimer and go catch a nap. Just a rotten end to the season. And, despite what I read from some, the 53-wins are tarnished by the awful playoff performance. To me, almost like the regular season was a complete waste. Just can’t get past the lack of effort…then Joe’s comments….Joe’s comments really, I mean really, p#ssed me off.
Oh, well…I’m out. Talk at you guys later. Have a good night.
Fundamentals
May 11th, 2010
3:49 pm
You’re on the right track on realism for singings. I see a need to really look for rising talent that hasn’t gotten that big break. Draft hasn’t been our strong suit, but we can dream.
I don’t see Wade doing anything here. Why is Miami such an underachieving team with Wade if he’s better than the second coming?
Bosh = old, not the answer in Toronto or here.
Amare – not the answer at the All-Star break or now.
I really liked the Harris idea before, but this year really hurt his value. Collison would be a good idea to investigate.
The Truth
May 11th, 2010
3:54 pm
Section 303
Here is the rules on:Sign and trade agreements
When a team is willing to sign an upcoming free agent, but the player’s current team wants something in return, it might be in the best interest of both clubs to execute a sign-and-trade deal. This occurs when one team signs one of its free agents and immediately trades that player to another team. A sign-and-trade is beneficial to both the player and the teams; the player receives a bigger contract than he might ordinarily get from a team that he would like to play for, while the trading club gets something in return for a free agent, and the recipient of the trade gets the player they desire. Sign-and-trades are a reality in the NBA because of the CBA’s rules: unlike baseball, where teams losing free agents are compensated with draft picks or cash, NBA teams that lose free agents receive no compensation.
So if the greedy money-hogging JJ wants the most money available, it is better for him to work with the Hawks than against them. But as you suggested, if he just wants to be jerk he can just walk and take less money somewhere else. But my guess though based on his history (of being only about the money), he will cooperate.
Dap01
May 11th, 2010
4:04 pm
O’Brien, did I mention Williams. I only noted that Childress is a very good player but not a starter and not what we need.
He is average in a 2nd rate league.
SirReal
May 11th, 2010
4:12 pm
1) Woody did an impeccible job turning the team around and he’ll always have my respect for that, but the players just wont play for him anymore. He’s hit a ceiling w/ the hawks and I think he should go elsewhere so he can provide the D-minded coaching a team may need. We’re clearly built to light it up. 2) Let Joe “I’m just a regular season All-star” Johnson get out of here. He’s made good $. Time to move on. He apparently doesnt like the fans here anyway so leave. 3) Bibby is fat and slow. Not even flashes of the Bibby from the Kings. As much as I like him, he’s done. 3) Jettison Marvin Williams in the process. He’s not good enough. Period. 4) Get a coach in here that the team will play for.
Ken Strickland
May 11th, 2010
4:12 pm
SECTION303-everyone deserves blame for what happened to us in the playoffs. Nobody deserves more blame than Woodson though, and no one has made more excuses for Smoove than Woodson. How many times over the last 2-3yrs have we heard Woodson dismiss his attitude and behavior and offer youth and immaturity as an excuse?
Both Woodson and Smoove have been together for 6yrs, and in some ways, nothing seems to have changed much. Basically the same behavior and attitude from Smoove, and the same lame excuses and lack of any corrective action or accountability from Woodson. This falls within the realm of the old saying, IF YOU’RE NOT PART OF THE SOLUTION, YOU’RE PART OF THE PROBLEM.
Bottom line, Woodson makes excuses for the attitudes and behavior of his veteran players because he knows he’s done nothing over the yrs to correct their negative behavior, attitude and habits. He’s also guilty of promoting team decisiveness, by establishing a cast system between veterans, rookies and younger players.
We’ve seen it over and over again. Whenever things fall apart, our OFF suddenly becomes the JJ and Bibby show, with ISO’s, jump shooting and the freezing out of younger players like Horford, Smoove and Marvin, even when they’re consistently producing.
What kind of team unity and chemistry can their be when our younger players know they’re expected to produce, but have to do so while playing error free ball? Imagine the attitudes of those players after getting pulled from the gm and openly blasted and embarrassed on the sidelines by Woodson for making a mistake, and seeing certain veteran players repeatedly making the same mistakes without any accountability or acknowledgement whatsoever from Woodson?
Which player do you blame for getting fatigued after being forced to player too many mins? Which player do you blame for not getting in the gm to give that fatigued player any rest. Which player is responsible for deciding what DEF we play, or when to make a needed change or adjustment to that DEF if it’s not working? Which player do you credit for designing our limited half court OFF, or switching DEF. Which player is responsible for the decision to continue starting and playing nonproductive players like MWilliams and MBibby?
Even Woodson has stated that everything ultimately falls on the HC, so why is so hard for others to accept that fact?
Westurd
May 11th, 2010
4:15 pm
Section 303:
Glad you’re posting on here…..you’ve said everything that needed to be said……………..and if Joe didn’t walk in front of a bus, well maybe its time to give him a little nudge. Spent all my money on a bum who “could care less” if I was even in the stands. Tarnished his legacy here without out a doubt.
Mike is Back
May 11th, 2010
4:18 pm
Fundamentals and Section 303 I still have to disagree…because you are making your assumption base on his relationship with Woody. Now if there was a situation where he had did the exact same thing under more then one coach…then there would at lease be a better barometer to make your assumption. Don’t forget what Chill said about Woody. He wasn’t at all please with the role Woody had for him…but obviously he was mature enough to handle the situation better.
Look at what Alan Gentry was able to do with Amare Stoudemire…sometimes a change in coaching philosophy can make a difference. I’m just saying I would explore that avenue first before making wholesale changes to the team.
After the way Woodson treated Joe Smith…what quality Vet in his right mind would want to come to the Hawks???
Ramon
May 11th, 2010
4:33 pm
O’Brien, I would rather have Marvin. And Marvin is way overpaid at 7.5. He should be more int he 5.5- 6 Million a year range. Marvin is a better man to man defender, shooter (in all aspects), and younger than Childress. An opposing defender coul easily leave Chills a lot quicker than they can leave Marvin. Marvin very well may be the best shooter on the team. In my opinion, Marvin’s biggest fault is that he doesn’t shoot enough. Marvin is overpaid for the role that Woody had him playing true enough. But just because you overpay for one person, isn’t reason to go and overpay for another person. And I’m still believing that in an offense that emphasizes ball movement more, Marvin can average 5-6 points more per game than he does now.
Rod, I know your view on Marvin. But aside from ball handling and offensive rebounding, there’s not much you can say that Chills does better than Marvin. JoshC went overseas because Sund (and no one else in the league) would pay him $7 Mill a year. At this moment, off the top of my head Marvin would start for Miami, New York, New Orleans, Detroit, Milwaukee, Golden State, LA Clippers, New Jersey, I’d take Marvin over Barnes in Orlando, and a few other teams.
The league have a lot of great SFs in the game right now. They have James, Durant, Anthony, Gay, Granger, Pierce, Wallace, and more. But in the last 10 years only one team has won a championship with an all star SF, and that was Boston (Prince wasn’t an all star when Detroit won Championship). In my mind, the PG position and depth at the C, SF on the bench is more vital needs now than replacing Marvin is. When you have a team dedicated to playing inside out, with a PG who can penetrate and facilitate, the SF is going to get their stats from swing passes (with a good coach). Marvin has proven he can consistently knock down open jump shots. Its easier to get an all star wing than it is to get an all star post or point. So I say use your resources on those positions, and on the coaching staff.
Joe
May 11th, 2010
4:34 pm
I thought this morning headlines would read “Woody Gone” “Woody Fired” you mean he still has a job? The Hawks organization is truly a joke. I never liked Billy Knight but this is his team and he wanted to fire Woodson, maybe he wasnt was bad as I thought. B.K. creation made us 3rd in the East and with a real coach, we may not have beat ORL but we would have at least been competitive.
GeeMack
May 11th, 2010
4:50 pm
Ken,
You know I have been one of the biggest supporters of the Hawks coach on the blog, however I must admit the current fall from points directly to coaching.
I agree that we do not need a complete over haul, but we do need minor tweeking. As much as I hated JJ comments I am not sure we should let him walk without setting us back a few years.
Hoops
Wall may turn out to be a fine player, but JJ would be silly to start over at this point in his career. I like DHarris, but I have seen enough of Teague to make him the starter next year.
cp
May 11th, 2010
4:51 pm
Ken great post . I agree on everything but Marvin. This cat has been starting for 4 years and been in the league 5 Seriously how much more time and excuses are people to make for him….. The night he started with the second unit and didn’t stand out was the nail in the coffin for me. How in the world can you play with the second unit and get outplayed by everybody…. Mario West who has no offensive game looked better. The dude just does not stand out no matter what he does. He makes no impact on the game. Thats why he is the invisible game. All I heard during the playoffs was “Marvin has to get going”. And he never did.
NDiiBaBii
May 11th, 2010
4:51 pm
I’m proud of the Hawks no matter what, I think we could’ve went all the way with the team we have, but hey we didn’t. I actually think Woody did a great job w/ this team, I remember when it was just a few of us in the arena cheering, and its nice to see the growth of the team. He deserves a contract!
cp
May 11th, 2010
4:55 pm
Im sorry Ramon but Marvin would not start on most of those teams.
Ramon
May 11th, 2010
5:11 pm
CP, when was the last time you seen Marvin in an offensive that RUN PLAYS? Which one of those teams have SF who truly do shoot better and have a better touch than Marvin? Marvin goes 4-5 minutes on the court without someone putting him in position to score, that’s not HIS fault. Richard Hamilton can’t shoot better than Marvin (neither defend), but look how he was utilized. Marvin hasn’t had a coach since Roy Williams. The scary thing about this roster is Marvin, Josh, Horford, Teague, and Mario all haven’t had any coach but Woody since they’ve come to the league. So neither has had a coach who would try to find a way to BEST utilize them on the offensive end. So you pretty much have four/five players who have skills and athletic ability who haven’t been coach in half of the game.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 11th, 2010
5:11 pm
BOSH IS NOT A CENTER
Please, for the love of God, quit posting things like “the Hawks need a center so they should get Bosh”. Bosh is skinnier than Smoove and weaker than Horford. What in the world makes any of you think he would match up well with Shaq and Howard?
Marcus aka decatur g
May 11th, 2010
5:12 pm
One of the ironies is that last summer a lot of folks (me included) were pining over PG Ramon Sessions from MIL and on the fence w/resigning Bibby (eventually resigned for 3 yrs/18 mil). Sessions signed a late offer sheet (4 yrs./16 mil) with MIN that the Bucks didn’t match. For most of the season he languished in a reserve PG role for the T-wolves, deferring to rookie Johnny Flynn and probably checking the Reuters/AP wire to see if Euroleague phenom Ricky Rubio (MIN other 1st round PG selection from the ‘09 draft) was house-huntin’ in the land of 10,000 lakes.
hindsight is 20/20.
GeeMack
May 11th, 2010
5:12 pm
The next time someone says the ATL is a bad sports city. I gone tell them go to the blog.