Atlanta Hawks: Next Day J.J.

COME ON HAWKS GIVE US SOMETHING

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Good riddance to him and Woodson. Definite losers in life.

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*quotes

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Hawks need to get rid of JJ,Woodey,Smittey,Bibbey,and start all over again and get players that willl play as hard as HARFORD.

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@MC, could you please give fans (after Monday… like maybe Tuesday) a quick and dirty view of how much money the team has to spend on another team’s free agent? Hopefully, that will help the passionate fans understand the salary cap limitations as it relates to shopping for FAs this summer. As I understand it, we’re looking at something in ths single digit range (less than $10M) if Joe walks. I doubt that any elite FA takes a huge discount to play here.

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“Hopefully, that will help the passionate fans understand the salary cap limitations as it relates to shopping for FAs this summer. As I understand it, we’re looking at something in ths single digit range (less than $10M) if Joe walks.”

I don’t think the Hawks are going to let Joe walk without working out a sign-and-trade, particularly if a team like the Knicks still wants to throw max money at him. In the event of a sign-and-trade, the Hawks would be able to receive a max salary’s worth of players in return, irrespective of the cap number.

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[re-posted from last blog]

It got on there late.

*terrell – supposedly GS is going to move either;
S.Curry or Monta Ellis. Lack of chemistry in backcourt
being the reason. You may be right about Josh v Nellie.

Grandad
May 9th, 2010
2:46 pm

Co-sign Ken Strickland.

For all – Josh Childress is a restricted FA. We hold his rights.
We can re-sign or S & T. Greek economy would suggest he may look
to return to the NBA. New coach would enhance our ability to re-sign.
He is on record as being frustrated @ being locked in, thus becoming typecast as a bench player (6th man) on the Hawks [under Wdsn].
He naturally wanted to compete for a starting pos. As has been proven
over the course of time, there is no competition for positions or playing time under Wdsn. He locks in players for whatever reason and throws away the key, come hell or high water.

Now for my 1st sggestion of what I’m sure will be many:
*Mega *Blockbuster *Trade:
We Send:
*Josh Smith
*Marvin Williams
*Jeff Teague

We Get:
*Stephen Curry
*Andris Biedrins
*Corey Maggette

**Works on NBA trade machine
***We absorb Maggette’s contract
[offset by Curry's rookie contract & not having to deal with *Joe]
(*max contract)(same with CM’s age for GS)
gamble with Biedrins inj.,
we get future transcendent star [SC]to replace Joe.
Ship Bibby’s salary anywhere for a bag o’ doughnuts.

****GS is motivated by Josh Smith (age, talent, potential)
Marv (age, talent, potential) & Jeff (age, talent, potential)
All three fit GS model/system and Nelson surely realizes the
untapped potential. [once again/Wdsn]

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Grandad, I think there are about 10 players in the league for whom the Warriors would trade Stephen Curry, and the Hawks don’t have any of them.

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@AJ, if Joe walks you get less than $10 mil to replace him. Have to wait for official cap # to be precise, but think in Marin’s pay range.

BWAF

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“Redick, Lowry, Amir Johnson.
Three inexpensive pieces [FA's] utilized under ‘the’ right coach
could be valuable.”

Don’t know about those players specifically, but I agree with the general idea that there are plenty of good young players in the NBA that could be valuable pieces on good teams if utilized correctly. But that alone is not going to solve this team’s issues.

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Najeh – correct. Hence the term, *pieces.

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Golden State would be much more receptive to trading Monta Ellis… problem is, I’m not sure he’s not just a better version of Jamal Crawford. In other words, he seems like a great fantasy player who can score points in bunches, but I’m skeptical as to whether that translates into wins.

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If the Hawks were to trade Joe, here’s an example of a realistic (in my opinion) trade possibility they might encounter that would have benefits for both sides:

Hawks trade: Joe Johnson (signed to a new max or near-max deal), Jeff Teague
Hornets trade: Darren Collison, Peja Stojakovic (contract expires next year), their lottery pick this year, and their first round pick in 2011

Hawks get a young, rising star point guard who can start immediately and push the tempo with the athletic front court, cap flexibility going forward so that they can re-sign Horford and be a player in next summer’s free agent market, and a sudden bounty of first-round picks that they can either use to trade up to aim for a guy like Evan Turner or Wesley Johnson, increase the depth on the roster as a whole, or trade for veteran role players who can fill needs immediately.

Hornets get a guy who, unlike Collison, can start with CP3 in their backcourt, take a lot of pressure off of CP3 to carry the team single-handedly, and get a much-needed infusion of talent on a team seriously lacking it outside the point guard position.

I’ll leave it to y’all to decide how realistic this is or how beneficial it may be to the Hawks (or the Hornets for that matter). I’m not pretending like this won’t be a step back next year — I think any scenario in which Joe leaves will end up being a step back, unless they send the world’s biggest blunt to Pat Riley and get him high enough to trade Dwyane Wade. I’m not even saying getting rid of Joe is the right idea, but if the Hawks look to part ways with Joe, I think they could do a lot worse than this.

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josh smith just stadin’ around…that’s not like him…

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Some of us were in those 100 filled seats a few years ago. We saw a young, hungry team that competed as hard as it could every night, although they were often overmatched.

There is absolutely no excuse for a professional team to quit in the biggest game of the season. Yet, we have seen this cast of Hawks quit so many times the last 2 years that it has gotten sickening.

What used to be that tough, overmatched bunch seems to have turned into a spoiled, satisfied group of guys who are content with being losers. Josh or Joe have to go, as well as Woody. If we re-sign Joe, we need to trade Josh for a true center and make Al the center-piece of the franchise.

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Najeh:

I really like Collison alot.
But, is it within the rules (I don’t know) to send two players
in a S & T? I know you can recieve two.

Do you think Chi. would part with Noah under the same
circumstances if we took back *Hinrich?

I also think we should start planning (hopefully) for the return of
Childress to fortify roster. [@ least a S & T with him/Greek econ]
J.Chil. as with a player *(Lowry) would never quit.
Plus I’m certain he’s gained maturity living overseas.

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Surprisingly lost in all of the issues surrounding the Hawks this post-season has been their inability to guard a playmaking PG and/or force that playmaking PG to play defense. IMO, a new head coach, someone who can address the above scenarios and allowing Josh Smith to go somewhere that will allow him to play SF (which is what he really wants to do) are the three most important things for the Hawks to address.

Hire Houston assistant Coach Elston Turner as the new Head Coach and let him implement the offensive and defensive systems Rick Adelman has used in Sacramento and Houston, a team that overachieved without its best player and with a 6′6″ Center.

To solve problems 2 & 3, trade Josh Smith to Golden State for Monta Ellis and make both players happy.

Quick hits:
Chalk JJ’s comments up to his frustration over the team’s lack of discipline–oh, and of course you re-sign him.
Bringing Chidress back, to replace Maurice Evans, will improve the team’s unselfishness–a desperately needed commodity in team sports.
Jeff Teague and Randolph Morris should have played a lot more this year.
The Hawks have 3 7-footers on the roster, two of whom never play. They don’t necessarily need a center–they need to play the centers they have.

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For those of you watching the Cavs-Celtics game, now may be a good time to remind ourselves that Shelden Williams was picked 16 spots ahead of Rajon Rondo.

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Najeh–I don’t think your proposed trade makes that much sense for NO. I don’t think they are looking to add salary at this point. I think a more realistic trade is:

Al Horford
Jamal Crawford (his deal also expires in 2011)
2010 first round pick
2012 first round pick

for Chris Paul. Collison played well enough for NO that they might consider shipping Paul out. Horford is awesome obviously but the Hawks can’t have their two best players both be power forwards, it’s just not a good allocation of resources. Use the money you have under the cap (about 10 mil or so) to go after Salmons, who is probably could be had for 7-8 mil per. Do something with Childress’s rights to bring back another 2-guard to play on the bench. Then you have a starting five of Paul/Salmons/Williams/Smith/Pachulia. I know trading Horford is painful but if you could get a bona-fide franchise star back I think it’s worth it. I know I like that lineup more than the one we currently have, and unlike most trade proposals on this board, this one could actually happen.

Minor thing, you can’t trade back-to-back first round picks. So your proposed NO trade would have to involve 2010 and 2012 picks, at the minimum.

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Yet another Truth-serum lie:

Here’s his post from last night:

basketball 101

May 8th, 2010
11:17 pm

“Ignorance has it membership.”

“Al was not “Voted” to the allstar team, He was a coach selection in a space that was available as a consolation after Shaq announced he would not play- howard 1.2 million votes shaq 800,000 vote and al was with the rest of the pack some where in the mid to low 200,000 votes.”

“Sorry bout that ..LOL”

OK, here’s the TRUTH:

OK, Here’s the TRUTH: http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2010/01/cleveland_cavaliers_mo_william_5.html

It’s an article from the Cleveland paper stating that Shaq was left off the team. He never “announced” that he wouldn’t play. He wasn’t voted to play.

Here’s what Shaq said: “It’s always been a bureaucratic process,” O’Neal said. “I’ve been fortunate to go 15 times, so from this point on in my career, I won’t complain if I don’t make it. It’s all about the vote and who the fans want to see get in. Sometimes it disappoints me to see guys campaigning for it. I don’t like that. I don’t like to see guys campaign. Whoever gets in I wish them well.”

Yet Truth-serum would have us believe that Shaq “announced” that he wouldn’t play, and that was a factor in the coaches decision. Wrong again.

More lies in a vain effort to diss Horford.

I guess there’s nothing he won’t stoop to.

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MC-

It may be a little late to recommend, but could you do us fans a favor and relay to the Hawks not to throw towels over their heads while on the bench when things are not going good- It sends a terrible non-verbal message……..

Thanks.

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Times like this make me wish I was in Big Ray’s lap!

Look at me, look at me Ray- I need, I NEED!

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Is it me or does Bibby look creepy in the photo with him looking at Joe while Joe has a towel in his face LMAO

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O’B:

Chi. still cannot give him the Xtra yr.
Isn’t that the advantage of the ‘home team’.
S & T, he gets the Xtra yr.
Otherwise, why would he ever even consider a S & T.
Chi. wants to shed Hinrich’s contract in order to sign 2 max plyrs.

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Here’s my 2 cents…get rid of JJ, bring in Gilbert Arenas. I think he may have learned his lesson and wants to play since being in trouble and we may not have to pay a lot for his contract. He can bring leadership on the floor and can shoot. Chris Bosh is available. Let’s get him in the middle position and have Al Horford play his true position at forward. Bibby is old. Let him go too. Starting 5: Horford, J. Smooth, Bosh, Crawford and Arenas.

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“He turned down $16 million and he played like that? You can’t play like that for $16 million.”

–Charles Barkley

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We do not need Joe. Why the hell would anybody wanna pay him all that money just to see him hog the ball and shoot bricks and shrink under pressure. The only person who would give him a ton of money would be THE BIGGEST JOE NUTHUGGER ON THE PLANET. NORTHCYDE.

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Patrick,

You can’t be serious with ZaZa as our starting 5.

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That performance yesterday was piss-poor, they should understand why the crowd was booing them. I would be ashamed of myself if I worked that hard for a year to get to this point and then play that bad of a game on both ends of the floor. Embarrassing. Joe Johnson has been non-existent in the playoffs this year, and he wants LeBron money. He can go get that somewhere else, he’s not worth it

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i’ll chalk Woodson’s delusional “spoiled” comment to supporting his team, but i find Joe Johnson’s comment about not caring about whether the fans are there to be humorous considering that he cited fan attendance as a reason that he’D consider moving to another team, as a free agent. additionally, Johnson and Josh Smith have recently voiced the opinion that they don’t care about anyone other than their teammates. i’m not sure from where that sentiment originates, but the source and those who parrot it should be removed from the Hawks roster/organization before it pollutes the players who have pride in their performance as PROFESSIONALS!!!

on another note, when was the last time that an owner (ownership group) lost the “franchise players” AND their head coaches of BOTH of their teams in the same year??? David McDavid’s ownership sure is looking good about now! :-/

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Shake it up, don’t blow it up!

Bibby sits, Teague starts.

You guys need a history lesson. Do you really want to go there (Hawks circa 90s & 00s)? Accept the fact that the Magic have more talent, better coaching and a better front office. That’s ok. Let’s try to get where they are. We have to get value or keep JJ. Bibby has to go cause he is too much of a defensive liability. And of course, Woody has to go. Sorry Woody. But you’ve got bank.

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I knew that Joe’s Nut leach northcyde would show up LOL. I didn’t say anything about Wade clown. But u are right about 1 thing geting rid off Joe wont do anything. But getting rid of Joe AND Woody would do alot.

I don’t want Joe to leave or nothing. I want us to sign and trade him. Got that u testicle leach.

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@ Wafflehouse

I think they get pizzed ( like I do ), especially when the marquee stars come to town. They have to endure 40% of the crowd cheering for the other team, or for some superstar that everybody loves. Instead of home court advantage, Philips Arena turns into what you’d see during a high school rivalry game, in which the crowd is split. The only other arena I’ve ever seen that take place, is in the FedEx Forum in Memphis. Their fans don’t show up, but they pack the place when Kobe, Lebron, and Wade come to town ( and cheer loudly for them )

So when you hear JJ and Smoove talk about “only playing for their teammates”, I think that’s where some of that stems from. Anybody who has ever been to Philips when the Lakers come to town, knows what I’m talking about. It’s sad to see 8,000 people rooting AGAINST the Hawks in their own building.

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Every season ticket holder needs to blast there salesperson and demand an apology. It is unacceptable to spend money where you are not appreciated!

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While in the past, Hawks ‘fans’ have mostly rooted for Miami, Lakers, Orlando, and Boston, that has not happened since Hawks took the Celts to a 7 game series in the playoffs. In the last 3 years, Hawks fans have come out in droves, especially for games that mattered or for the playoffs, shutting down those transplant fans.

But when Hawks suck it up the way they’ve done, then there is no excuse. They deserved to be booed.

They played with no hunger, no passion, no zeal. They played liked there was internal rift or hidden agenda amongst the team, which is never good.

Hawks have enough tools not to rebuild, but to retool. They have to make good decisions about who stays and who leaves. Woody gat to go. And as much as I love Joe, Joe has to go. His style of play is not conducive to the make up of this team.

Keepers: Horford, Josh, Jamal, Teague. Everybody else should be food for the fodder.

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unfortunately, the decision of whether Johnson stays or leaves is HIS choice. the Hawks can offer him a max contract, but he may opt to take less $$$ and go elsewhere (can you say “Cleveland”?), unless Sund can work out a sign & trade deal with a team whose willing to pay Joe max $$$, considering his post season performance this year. i doubt that a sign & trade will garner much “value”.

@northcyde
i’ve been going to Hawks games since the Wilkins/Rivers days, so i’m WELL aware how the transient folks wear the opposing teams gear and cheers on the Laker, Heat, Cavs or other team du jour. this is nothing new in ATL and i’m sure that Dominique has shared with them that the best way to sway them is to play well and WIN. it happened last year when the Hawks beat the Lakers in Philips. many Lakers fans in their colors were very vocal in cheering on Kobe, but even the ones in the enemy gear cheered on the Hawks when they took the lead and won. Joe and Josh need to get over themselves and grow up! Atlanta is a city full of fans who long to root for a winner so some attach to the winning opponent and some choose to root for the Hawks despite their record. the latter are the ones that they Hawks should consider. playing well and winning will bring the “bandwagon jumpers” over to the Hawks’ side.

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It is true that sometimes Phillips arena hasn’t felt like home court. I have walked into that arena and seen way too many jerseys that weren’t are colors. This year though I have seen something different the fans show up and they cheer for the hawks. When the hawks play like they did last night which happens what do the fans have to cheer about? Nothing so what do you hear the other teams fans. And it would be like that in any other arena except the hawks are hardly ever whooping somebody and the other team is hardly ever rolling over.

Simple as that JJ has no excuse and anybody who pays a 30 year old shooting guard who can’t show up in the playoffs is a fool. Unfortunately there are a lot of those in the NBA.

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The hawks must make moves quick this summer, first let get bosh we need a building block 2 starte with BOSH, AND HORFORD, on the blocks is a starte this team have no inside game every thing are jumpshots and thats nothing but and early exit in the playoffs.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!

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I no joe made that comment but deep in his heart he want 2 stay why would any one move from this great city 2 play some where else.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!

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Chicago feels the same way about Noah that the Hawks do about Horford. I don’t see any way they give him up in a trade for Joe.

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Chris Bosh does not need to be here from what I see in him he seems to be very softspoken too and I would die having to look at that Avatar damn thang or whatever he is !! and there’s a chance Joe will stay and if we make room for somebody like D Wade then we will have terrible players once again he will see himself facing the same Miami situation so we will c what Sund does this offseason the off season is actually more imp right now than this playoff turmoil

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Realistically, I don’t see the Hawks being able to sign any of the marquee FA’s (Wade, LBJ, Bosh). Bosh will probably leave TOR, but I think both LBJ and Wade will stay in their respected cities. That alone will impact every other FA’s mindset.

You’ll see other guys like Amare and JJ gravitate towards the likes of Wade or LBJ. Teams like the Knicks or Bulls will offer these guys bigger deals and a bigger stage to shine on, and I don’t see any of these guys turning down those deals to come and play here.

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lou Hudson

GO HAWKS!

************************

Joakim Noah’s playoff stats:

15 ppg – 13 rebs – 3 asst . . . . 53% FG – 95% FT ( 17 – 18 ) – 1 blk

Brad Miller’s playoff stats:

5 pts – 4 rebs – 1 ast . . . 37% FG – 100% FT ( 7 – 7 ) 0 blks

Do you really think that they’re tradiing Noah, their 2nd best player in the playoffs this year? Noah looked dominant in a few of those playoff games. He’s not going anywhere, no matter how much they want to get rid of Hinrich’s contract.

They may re-sign Brad Miller . . . at 3 million per year . . because that’s about all he’s worth right now.

Chicago doesn’t have to execute a sign and trade to get JJ. They could simply throw a lot of money at him, and rip him right away from us. I think everyone is trying to get some value back from a JJ trade at a need position. The fact is, that’s going to be much easier said than done.

JJ might be a scrub in these playoffs, but he’s not a scrub overall. But we may have to trade him for a scrub, especially when you talk about these teams who are well under the cap. Plus remember . . JJ still has to approve any sign and trade. He gets to pick where he wants to go in that situation. And he’s not going to wait around for the Hawks to come up with multiple sign and trades, just to help us out.

Some of you are going to have to take some of the emotion out of JJ’s comments, and look at the realistic situation that we’re facing come next year. If the Hawks don’t re-sign this dude ( even at far less than MAX prices ), we may get back significantly less talent in a sign and trade. Or we’ll simply get a trade exception. These teams below the cap though, don’t have to do anything to appease us.

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Sleepy. . . the one thing about me, is that I’ve NEVER said that JJ deserved MAX money. All I state is the realism of the situation. Somebody is going to throw big money at this dude, so we better have a damn good Plan B or C . . other than letting Crawford take JJ’s spot.

As for what I said about Crawford, all I’m stating is the truth. Some people want to build this team around Horford, Smoove, and Crawford. That’s fine. Just know what that means though.

JJ deserves all the hate that he’s getting. He’s playing horribly. He can’t play like that and expect the fans to be happy.

But if you look at the playoffs, it’s basically a situation in which JJ played good for the first 4 games, and sucked for the next 6 . . . while Crawford sucked for the first 4 or 5 games, but played good for the last 4 out of 5. I don’t know why these two guys can’t have a good or great game at the same time. That’s what we needed throughout these playoffs to have a shot. But it seems as if when one has it going, the other is ice cold.

JJ has had 6 consecutive sub 40% FG shooting games in the playoffs

Jamal has had 6 total sub 40% FG games in the playoffs

Crawford was a big reason why we were down 3 – 2 in the Milwaukee series.

JJ is a big reason why we’re almost dead, down 3 – 0 in this series.

So JJ is the focus of the hate. He deserves to be hated on.

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Northcyde & Wabe, you are probably correct that Chicago will not part with Noah. However, it does not change the fact that the Hawks must make a decision on Smith of Horford. Horford is more polished and player. Smith has trade value and the Hawks only hope to acquire a decent center. Teague with a new coach maybe the answer at the point. Hopefully, a sign & trade with JJ brings you back something if not the 10 mil will. You still have a chance to resign Childress or trade and a 1st round pick.
Again, resign Flip to replace scoring at the 2 when JJ is gone. The are not that far away, but they need to make the right moves.

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only scottie was a much more cerebral player

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darrell starks

ASG HAVE 2 MAKE SOME DECISION.
1.First sign joe 5 year 70mill that 13mill a year.
2.Sign bosh 5 year 100mill thats 20mill a year.
3.Trade marvin and teague for devin harris.
4.Trade josh and chills for rudy gay and ronnie brewer
5.Sign avery as coach 194wins 70lost as a coach.
6.24# pick solomon alabi
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!

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I’ll make this my last post of the night.

Not possible Darrell . . . but you could tweak it a little:

1) if we could re-sign JJ for that deal, that would be amazing. But let’s say that we can . . . OK

2) Only way we could get Bosh, is if we trade contracts that come close to that amount. And we can’t do that, without executing a sign and trade for him. So if you want that deal to get done, at the very least we’d have to give up Josh Smith ( 11.6 mill next year ) + Marvin Williams ( 6.7 million ) = totaling 18.3 million

So Bosh = Smoove + Marvin ( I don’t see them doing it, due to the glut of forwards they have on that team . . . but we’ll roll with it ) … . . It would be nice to get Calderon away from Toronto though.

3) With Marvin gone, you can’t use him in a Devin Harris trade. With Crawford being on the last year of his deal, that would be the obvious guy to trade for Harris.

So Crawford = Harris . . . ( they wouldn’t do it unless they got John Wall in the draft to run the point . . . but we’ll roll with it )

4) Smoove would already be gone, giving us only Bibby, Zaza, Teague, possibly Evans, and Horford to make additional moves for other players. None of those teams will trade a good player for our scrubs, unless they were shedding payroll. And Chill’s status is still up in the air.

So #4 is out

5) Avery as coach . . . OK

6) Solomon Alabi . . . OK

Your team:

G – Harris
G – Johnson
F – Mo Evans ( he’d have to start )
F – Bosh
C – Horford

** a pretty good starting 5, with Mo Evans being the weak link **

Bench

G – Teague
G – Bibby
C – Zaza
C – Solomon Alabi
2nd round pick
F – Childress ( only if ownership is willing to go over the Luxury Tax )

So we would need to at least sign 5 players to round out the roster ( giving us 13 players ). With probably only the MLE left, we’d probably have to use at least part of the MLE to sign a halfway decent role player ( a SF or a G ). The rest of the squad would be made up of bench players.

If Chill were to come back and be added to that team, you’re probably talking about the Hawks being over the Luxury Tax. Our ownership group will probably never allow to let that happen though, due to the lack of revenue that the team generates at the gate.

But if you could add Chill + Harris + Bosh . . although we’d have to shed Smoove + Marvin + Crawford . . . I don’t know if we’d be a better team, but we’d definitely be more balanced. And if say, you add my guy in the 2nd round – Jarvaris Varnardo ( Miss St -PF ) or Wayne Chism ( Tennessee – PF ), that would be an interesting squad to throw at people.

Teague and Alabi would have to become key cogs of this team off the bench, in order for that team to be successful.

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And when Horford signed his deal, we’d DEFINITELY be over the Luxury Tax, in that scenario.

But then again, every team remaining in the playoffs ( except us ) is over the Luxury Tax. 9 of the top 10 teams in payroll, made the playoffs. Only the Knicks didn’t.

And the teams that look to be in the EC Finals and WC Finals ( Portland, LA, Orlando, and Boston/Cleveland ), rank like this:

1) LA Lakers – 91.4 million
3) Boston – 86.5 million
5) Cleveland – 84.4 million
6) Orlando – 82.1 million
9) Phoenix – 74.9 million

22) Atlanta – 65.9 million

Gotta spend to win in this league.

OK . . that’s my last one. Take it easy.

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After the dust has settled, I don’t think we want to go back to the hawks of old. So first get rid of Woody and find a head coach that can inspire and develop players. Resign JJ for 13 to 15 million cause he should have saved us some money with his performance. Start Jeff Teague and find out what he has in him. Trade Bibby for a waffle house gift certificate cause he’s too old and slow. Finallly do a sign and trade of Josh Smith for Chris Bosh. They are both great defenders, but Bosh gives us a scoring presence on the inside and he can hit a jumper. Not saying he is the leader of the team that will take us over the hump. Think that should be Al Horford who has proven he is a winner and just has to accept that leadership role. Also find a talent scout who knows how to put a team together and doesn’t pass over future hall of famers!

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Ilove my boys I have not been able to see them play live till sat,8th I took a trip to atl my brother got tickets but before then I watch every game the hawks played! JoeJohnson is a strong minded person he don’t let stuff get to him josh smith is a Beast! He don’t play he’ll snap in a heartbeat and don’t care bibby is cool al horford,I always call them my boys even if they lose or win they are strong! Men I just wish I could have met then when I was here because they got nothing but heart! And I agree with my boy *Joe Johnson they didn’t need the extra drama from the suppose to be fans!you can’t win them all but I’m gonna leave on this the hawks make a greeat!team and I hope joe don’t leave atl because I plan on selling my home were I live now to move to atl and I want to be there 2 support them and hopfully I day meet them there my boys!

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Just checked stubhub, you can get 2 upper level tickets for $3.00 and 55 tickets in varying sections for under $10 a piece. That is still a rip off to watch this heartless bunch.

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I’m kinda debating whether to go to this game on a cheap ticket just to keep my streak alive (been to every playoff game this century) or to stay at home, knowing that there’s no way in hell I can convince anyone else I know to go to this one.

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NORTH CYDE okay since we traded marvin and josh for bosh.
how can we get devin harris ? he will be on the trade block if john wall is drafted by the nets.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!

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I’m waiting for $1 seats for the game

FIRE WOODY

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Woody said we demand too much…LOL…is expecting a damn win in this series too much?

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CP CHRIS BOSH WILL MAKE THIS TEAM BETTER POINT BLANK PERIOD WE HAVE NO INSIDE SCORE AT ALL.
GO HAWKS!!!!!

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We need to go get Salmons and David Lee

pg – Jamal
sg – Salmons
sf – Jchill
pf – Jsmoove
c – David Lee

Bench – Teague, Bibby, Marvin, Horford, Zaza, Joe Smith, Draft Pick

FIRE WOODY

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2010 ATLANTA HAWKS ROSTER
STARTE DEVIN, JOE, OUTLAW, HORFORD, BOSH.
BENCH TEAGUE, JAMAL, MOE, ZAZA, SOLOMON ALABI
RESERVE JOE SMITH, COLLINS
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!

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Watching the Hawks pitiful, lackluster display of “basketball” followed by Steve Nash’s inspired performance tonight after getting stitches over his eye is like watching two different sports.

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Trade Marvin and Teague for Devin Harris. Today’s most noteworthy comment. Check Harris out physically long and hard before you make that move….otherwise…..this might be very good.

The Hawks are maddening beyond their ability to lose big games. They could win Monday just to cause a few more headaches.

I hope they do win. Go Hawks!

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Here’s a question. Would you guys be for bringing Woody back, if it included Eddie Jordan being his lead assistant?

I’m sorry but I still believe if you bring Joe, Josh, Horford, Marvin and Teague back and sign Brewer, Haywood, and Felton that the team would be a lot better. Brewer, Haywood, and Felton together would be the price of a Chris Bosh alone. The Magic made runs no matter who were on the floor because they had better depth. But when have you turned the channel to the game during this series and not seen either Joe, Josh, or Al in the game?

At 30 years old, Haywood coming off the bench and getting 25-30 minutes a game could be a big boost. And also I wouldn’t rule out signing Jermaine O’Neal for a backup Center role either. He is still a great inside defender.

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By the way, thanks to ESPN many of you are now saying Josh gives up on plays too much and how he should hustle on every single play (even when he’s hit in the mouth by his own teammate). But what player who starts have you seen in the playoffs who hustles on every single play up and down the court? You name one player, and I will show you where they didn’t. Even Lebron, Kobe, Wade, all of the Celtics, Spurs, and others have been criticized in games for having a lethargic (lazy) mood about them at some point during this post season. And Smoove misses two defensive plays on fast breaks, and half of you go crazy. Then you guys say to replace him with BOSH, who quit on his team the week after the all star game. CNNSI have been saying for months how Bosh gave up on the Raptors. Smoove is the type of player I would want on my team, and for the price he’s a bargain!

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Clyde, I agreed on your Kimbo Slice comments. I don’t know WTF JJ was talking about…because what brought the raft down on the team was the fact that they was playing like they had the lead…instead of getting their scrubs asssssss blowed out at home…IN THE BIGGEST GAME OF THE SEASON.
There was no sense of urgency by the coaching staff or the team. If you are a fan making a sacrifice to shell out cash to support your home team…YOU WERE DAM DISAPPOINTED IN WHAT YOU WITNESS SATURDAY.
It was very disheartening to hear the teams captain make those types of comments about the fan…WTF did he expect us to do cheer for their listless performance.
Nire, I get tired people like you thinking you know anything about ATL fans…YOU CAN’T TRANSPLANT IT…YOU HAVE TO LIVE IT. Don’t criticize the fans…when the team had clearly pack it in for the season. Even ATL fans deserve better than that.

I think the players are just feed up Woody’s system…and it is being manifested in the game. However, I still think the Hawks have to resign JJ…but it is time to split him and Woodson up.

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out of all of this, i will have to say al horford has played well but then again he won 2 ncaa championships in ufl so at least he knows what it takes to reach the top and it won’t get there by sole talent but effort and drive and hustle and teamwork and a driven-head coach, which are all the stuff the hawks are lacking now, and what happened to joe smith, what happened to the NOW YOU KNOW ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE playoff atmosphere at home in the playoffs it seemed we reached our peak and are now declining significantly, feel bad for jamal crawford this being his first playoff experience in his career of a decade and this is what he gets after being sixth man of the year, just sad, we need a winner mentality coach that is not safe with a 20 or 30 point blowout ala van gundy or not happy when another team comes back or one that would rely on homecourt in the playoffs to determine their team’s success, no reason a 3rd seed could play this bad and could have swept the celtics this season who are now tied with the cavs 2-2, whatever happened to the real hawks team needs to be investigated no more joking around, now it has gotten personal with the fans (also i think jj got frustrated that he realized he is not as reliable or clutch at the end that he and woody thought he was)

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Here’s my definition of worth max money, if you CAN’T win a game in playoff basketball just because you showed up on the court, than you’re not worth max money. Really I think only 5 players in the league are worth max money (Dwight Howard, Lebron, Durant, Kobe, and Wade)

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Grandad, he didn’t have those chances before. This is the first season where the Hawks are heading into the off season where the finances aren’t tied up in court. I’m not saying that I’m for it, I’m just saying its no guarantee that whomever you get will be better. Jeff Van Gundy couldn’t get past the 2nd round with Yao, McGrady (Healthy), Battier, and Alston. And Yao was the best center in the league then. Avery couldn’t do nothing more than win 60 games like Dallas always do, and find a way to lose a 2-0 NBA Finals series. Byron Scott doesn’t really run that many offensive plays with his teams. If you watched any of the Hornets game, you will see they did a lot of standing around and ISO plays with West, Stojakovich, and CP3. Or CP3 and Chandler would run a pick and roll, where Paul just threw it up to the rim. Collins had Jordan! That’s enough said on him. Truly there are only 4-5 coaches who have won the championship in the last 12 years. So there are only 4-5 championship coaches out there at the moment. And all of them had larger payrolls. I will say though I would love to see this Hawks team running the triangle set in their half court offense.

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Darrell, Bosh can’t guard Rashard Lewis nor Dwight Howard. So how does he solve the problem? The problem in this series wasn’t the interior. The Hawks outrebounded the Magic last game by a lot, and still got blown out. The major problem with this team is lack of defensive pressure on the ball from the back court. And when you have Bibby and Crawford in at the same time, that makes it even that much worse. When those two are on the court you will always be playing 4 man defense against a 5 man offense. That’s why I say if you add just a back up center in the mold of Haywood, then the interior will be just fine. Horford and Smoove give majority of the league problems. The problem comes when they can’t challenge penetrating guards’ shots because they don’t have a suitable big on the bench to come in if they’re in foul trouble. Most of their fouls were against Nelson and Carter as much as against Howard.

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Grandad, that’s easy to say for Nash. Do you see the look on Smoove and Horford’s face when they’re on defense after a guard has just penetrated the lane, or they have to rotate out to the arc, because the back court messed up THEIR rotations? Smoove and Horford actually be looking like they want to ask their teammates “What the hell are you doing out here?”. If you’re the PF or C standing behind the matador flag all game long, you’ll start to get frustrated and give up a play or two also, lol.

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Ramon:

Well said on the 5 max guys. I can’t think of any others.

Mr. Wdsn has had resources to coach. Heck, he should have
the acuity to coach himself w/o brilliant assts.

I’m not going to debate that any further, we have
discussed his coaching weaknesses ad nauseam.

You did bring up one interestin point;
our team is structured to run the triangle.
[I thought E.Jordan was a Princeton off. guy]
But I have felt all along that or players skill set
(to better include Marv) was best suited for the triangle.

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Grandad, I get what you’re saying. But remember Jackson didn’t come up with the Triangle, Winters did. Many coaches don’t manage their offensive sets. I guess I’m just scared of a Lon Kruger happening all over again. And truthfully Sund doesn’t have a great track record of hiring coaches. Though I will say with the hiring of McMillan it does show he’d be interested in hiring Mark Jackson.

And yes E. Jordan is a Princeton guy. But I was mainly just using him as an example of if Woody got help. Truly the main problem of Woody’s is his offense sets or lack of. If you have that corrected, with the subtraction of Bibby from the starting line up. And you place that with the addition of Haywood and Brewer (or Mike Miller/Outlaw) on the bench. Then what problem will you have then?

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Dam i cn’t sleep tonight this is fun.
IM TEACH YOU GUYS ON HOW 2 BUILD A TEAM.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!

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Ramon Joe ain’t even worth 17 million. I say give David Lee 9 and Salmons 8 if your gonna spend 17 million. We get a our center that we never had and a 2 guard that’s just as good as Joe for the same price.

FIRE WOODY

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Clyde, I can’t disagree with that point you just made. But I don’t see David Lee being an upgrade over Horford at the center position. There’s nothing that Lee does better than Horford. Its just he’s in an inflated system. And when you have Harrington playing PF, it’ll be easy for you to get many Rebounds because no one else on your team is trying. I would rather have Haywood than David Lee. But the point is either way, the owners are going to have to go into luxury to complete. I really think with an offensive system, Joe ppg could easily go upto 23-25 per game, even with his minutes going down. And if you bring in someone like Brewer, than he no longer has to guard the best perimeter player on the team. Actually I could see a Joe/Brewer/Marvin/Smoove/Horford being able to be the Hawks version of the Bulls, with Teague(still developing)/Crawford/Outlaw/Haywood/Bibby and whatever draft pick being on the bench.

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Its all about depth. This would be one of the deepest teams in the NBA next year.

pg – Crawford
sg – Salmons
sf – Smoove
pf – Horford
c – David Lee

Bench – Teague, Bibby, Marvin, Jchill, Zaza, Joe Smith, draft picks

FIRE WOODY

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Clyde – David Lee is probably gonna re-sign with the Knicks.
It’s been orchestrated. I read how they were gonna do it but
I forgot the details. He would cost us too much $ anyway.
People wanting Salmons need to beware;
whomever gets him does not need to overpay based on this season.
Redick will be a better bargain. His #’s per mins. played are
better than Joe’s. Basketball IQ/high due to playing for
Coach’K’ and for Van Gundy. Not a SS just a piece.

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“I dont understand where you guys get this emotion that bosh can’t play defense if you have a bunch of scrubbs in front of you of course you will look bad on defense”

Yeah, that is a problem we Hawks fans are all too familiar with, having to see Josh and Al cover up for the defensive deficiencies of the back court.

“this the same thing every one said last year when i said lets get stoudemire and every one said no no he can’t play defense but look at him now taking his team 2 the finalls.”

First of all, Phoenix is not in the finals. Secondly, I was under the impression scenarios to acquire big men were being discussed because of the Hawks’ inability to guard so-called “true centers” like Dwight Howard, Andrew Bogut, Shaq, etc. If you bring Bosh or Stoudemire here, Horford will still be guarding those “true centers”. Yes, both those players can score better than Smoove. Yes, Stoudemire has improved on defense. No, neither one of them will ever make an All-Defense team.

Trade Josh for either one of them, and you sacrifice defense for offense without addressing the big man problem. Straight up.

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And for the record, I’m all for moving Smoove if you get a guy with Smoove’s level of talent who can guard true centers in return. I still haven’t seen one realistic trade proposal that involves this happening though.

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Najeh, I liked your idea with Josh to N.O.
for Collison & other pieces & parts.
Josh as a piece for “needed VALUE”.
Would not have to be a [5].

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From Bill Simmons’ column on ESPN’s Page 2 (about the luck which Kerr has had with his past year’s decisions as a GM):

“But he also knew Steve Nash isn’t wired that way. He’s loyal. He’s Canadian. He’s old-school. He believes in things like, “I am the leader of this team, so as soon as I say that I might want to leave, I can’t lead anymore.”

Speculation:

What is relevant here is that JJ did not commit to the Hawks and probably that created a greater distance between him – a quiet fellow which almost certainly did not even tried to quash inside his own locker room any rumors or speculation – and the younger players.

He stopped being considered a leader.

This coupled with the fact that clearly Josh and Al have been complaining internally (and sometimes publicly) about lack of ball movement (which is a direct consequence of Woody’s “system”) killed this team.

If we look back, now that the season is over, we forgave JJ many many times – out of gratitude – for many many bonehead-I-wanna-be-the-hero plays (stupid three point attempts, ISOs which ended in highly contested and impossible to go in shots) and even a few dead periods on defense.

His play – for which I only blame him about 33,3% – was detrimental of the team success and one of the direct causes for many of our 4th quarter choking jobs.

Now, here is the thing: EVEN SO, SOMETHING very serious happened during the Milwaukee series.

JJ was playing really well during the first 4 games. His best playoff basketball since his days in Phoenix and then… you know what you have been seeing since then.

He probably went vocal either before game 3 or after game 3 or 4 and the rest of the guys turned their backs. Then, we saw the disaster which happened in game 5 in ATL.

I think that from game 4 onwards JJ had completely lost both his trust in the rest of the team and their respect.

This is clear to me and the main reason why JJ feels that he is not worried about his play affecting his stock – he will tell everyone that his play is the one during the 4 games of the Milwaukee series and that after that he had been boycotted by the younger players.

He stopped really caring or lost his fire for the Hawks after game 4 of the Milwaukee series.

He did show up on the defensive end during games 6 and 7, however, he probably did it hoping that the rest of the guys crashed and burned and no one could point their fingers at him whilst he could still protect his status as a good defensive player (a commodity which is essential to his max contract aspirations).

The problem is that the plan backfired, we won both games in which he played only a supporting role.

More problems certainly happened during or immediately after those games, inside the locker room.

Probably some back and forth talk amongst the two factions where the young guys probably said that they could get it done without his ISO play and JJ probably sulked.

During this whole procedure Woody was probably also either under fire – and protecting JJ – or -completely AWOL thinking about how to use Collins’ big bench-shaped butt against Howard.

By the time the ORL series started, no one was on the same page.

One thing which may have happened in the Milwaukee series:

Maybe, just maybe, JJ was accused of not playing enough D after the losses in games 3 and 4 and to be looking only for his numbers and for his up and coming free agency.

Salmons shot 15-20 during those 2 games and went to the line for 13 FTs and Jennings 15 for 27 (in spite of the switching D, both were usual defensive assignments for JJ).

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when your team gets spanked by more than 30 points at home in the playoffs. you deserve to get boos. and when there is a 50-50 chance that you are going to lose by 20 points or more in the playoffs alone. your team deserves to get boos.

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not to mention crawford is the only player on the hawks whos numbers are the same on the road and at home

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JOHNSON IS TICKED OFF?? What about the fans man? You know, the ones who pay to watch you play. The ones who fund that paycheck you don’t earn. You don’t think they’re ticked off??

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Some of these trade proposals on here are unbelievable.

1) What has Bosh done for Toronto?
2) Hornets are trying to shed salary, so why trade Josh Smith for Collison?
3) Who would be their backup for CP3 who always gets hurt?
4) Keep in mind that when trades are made, salaries have to come close to matching.

And most importantly, for a trade to work, it takes 2 willing partners.

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The Hawks are a lot of “HYPE” and “TALK” without any backbone or desire to back that talk up. In reality the Hawks can be the FIRST TEAM to come back from a 3-0 deficit. The Hawks can beat the Magic like a drum four games straight if they put their hearts and minds into it. But most of the times the Hawks take the path of least resistence and take the LAZY WAY OUT OF THINGS. For all of Joe Johnson’s tough guy talk I saw him drive in on a breakaway and miss a layup at point blank range. If he had any sense at all he would have stuffed it home making sure he made the basket in such an important playoff game. The fact is that he didnt care and he knew the fans wasted their money coming to watch him so he nonchalantly just scooped it up off the backboard carelessly and he missed badly which I think is why the fans started booing the Hawks. It wasnt until that play until I heard the boos. THE HAWKS HAVE EMBARRASSED THE NBA BY THE WAY THEY HAVE PLAYED AGAINST THE MAGIC. LIKE CHARLES BARKLEY SAID, NO NBA TEAM SHOULD LOSE BY 20 POINTS UNLESS THEY ARE NOT GIVING ANY EFFORT AT ALL.

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WOW!!! Joe, you aren’t a vocal leader, you want your skills to speak. You have been a good player here,joe. the problem is, now, you suddenly become vocal. yeah, vocal in abusing the fans who pay your overblown salary. You said it yourself;you have failed with no explanation. You are a good second guy, but your game is not to the level of the other number ones in the league. your stand and dribble for twenty seconds and launch a prayer has been done, and the league knows how to defend it. Nice watching you joe, but your time has come. Enjoy New York, and the fans there. They will blister you. WE have supported you for the last few years. Belkin was right, and that hurts to say. You are not the man, and unfortunately, he was right on. This team needs a leader. Sorry joe, you have proven in the last two playoff series that it is not you. Who to bring in, That’s what they pay the executives to do, find a retool to bring the hawks to the next level. It’s obvious they are not in the elite group of teams. Go Hawks Fans.

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The hawks have a good team but a very bad offensive system..lets get ball movement and cut out all the iso’s and one on one.when the ball is moving they’re hard to beat! do they have film sessions to see this like everyone else does?

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Lmao at Ramon for blaming Espn for Josh’s lethargicness, but using CNNSI as a source for Bosh supposedly quitting on the Raptors.

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2 things jump out right now.

1) Last year our off-season objective should have been to get Za Za some help down below. Remember seein’ him get abused by Z. Well, of course Dwight is gonna do that to us. Signing Joe Smith was like peein’ on a forest fire. We need a banger. He doesn’t even really need to score, just be big, bang, and rebound.

2) Joe Johnson took it upon himself to state that he was one of the better players in the league. He went on to state that he would prove it in the playoffs, where the best players play their best. Homeboy is not one of the better players in the league. He took on the boo birds and lost, so he needs to take his medicine. Sellin’ woof tickets and such…..

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Hawks players for inspiration please look at Steve Nash’s game on Mother’s Day night 2010. The guy played with so much heart and determination that is amazed me! After receiving stitches and with his eye closed he still came back in the game and played hard!! He gives the fans what they paid to see..a good game!! That is all we ask of you. We know you can’t win every game but please stop looking defeated like you have gave up. As long as you play with intensity and as if you want to win we support you.

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I’m going to the game tonight. GULP!

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Gilbert Arenas and Bosh ??? WTH Why would we want an oft injured 30 year old PG. Bosh is 6′10 225 -HE IS NOT A CENTER – if we did get Bosh Horford would be stuck playing Center for ever.

The Joe johnson Experience is getting old- The dribble king plays like crap and then gets heated when the fans boo….. Well people pay alot of money to see these guys and they show up looking like a D League team. All we ask is that they leave everything on the floor and go all out, besides the first 2 bucks games I havent seen that so the boo’s are deserved IMO.
I give the Thunder and Jazz credit for going toe to toe with the defending champs. Utah is missing 2/5 of their starting lineup and they play really hard every night. If the hawks played this way there would be no Boo’s .Maybe the fans displeasure for the type basketball we play will get sumones attention…… Woody sux -not gonna waste time on him -Trade him for Scot brooks and be done with it.

A 53 win team doesnt lose multiple games by 20+ points -JJ should be mad at himself for not playing up to his abilities.

Naje thanx for that lol…..Rondo was picked 21 and we got Sheldon at 5-thats still a mystery to me -what did they see that we didnt-I wanted ROY so bad.

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My Great-Grandma plays with more intensity. I’ll ask her to suit up for the Hawks.

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Do we dare watch the train wreck that is coming on TV tonight?

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Dap has a good question.

For me… I will be at the Braves game in Milwaukee.
That might not be much better but at least I can watch the people and all the other stuff not committing errors and choking with men in scoring position.

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Any of you basketball-IQ-challenged nuts on here ever consider the possibility that Orlando Magic is a much better,a much deeper, and a much, much better coached team than the Atlanta Hawks? Why dnot see how far the Magic go before berating our team about losing to them. The Magic made the FINALS last year and are better this season. The Hawks (as well as most of the NBA) has had trouble matching up with the Magic for a couple of seasons.

If losing to a superior team makes the Hawks losers, then the NBA is full of losers, right?

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Another important fact:

We need to get the new coach signed ASAP so we can tell to whichever FA we pursue (if any) what will our team look like.

My guess is that if we do not sign a big name (like Byron Scott) we will not be able to pry away any quality free agents given our poor showing this year.

After yet another 4-0 sweep in the second round, ATL is NOT THE PLACE to go to if you are a FA which still has some prestige and game (like for instance Haslem which I would love to have as our third big).

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who cares

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Josh Smith is a BEAST who negates his good play by continually #1) hoisting up ill-advised jump shots, many of which are from the 3pt range, which are out of his range; #2) continuing to drive the ball up the court (pretending he is a guard) constantly turning the ball over; #3) making poor passes when he is indecisive which result in turnovers. JOSH SMITH IS A WALKING TURNOVER MACHINE that is hurting the Hawks and preventing them from getting to the next level. Someone needs to sit Josh down and talk to him about this. He is unaware just how stupid he looks out there on the court.

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Gilbert Arenas??? Why not Artest and Tinsley too. These are just the stabilizing figures we need! If Josh goes off the deep end because of JJ just imagine how Arenas may effect him.

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WHY isn’t Rick Sund on the hook?

Fire Woody? Screw JJ! To Hell w/ Smoove! Blah, blah, blah…but why is Rick Sund teflon?

Wasn’t he duped into re-signing a washed up Mike Bibby, to an absurd contract?

Didn’t he trade for regular season 6th man, but playoff no-show, Jamal Crawford?

Didn’t he sign Mo “WTF” Evans?

And stop the BS, why did he draft Jeff Teague? Is that the best he could do?

I won’t mention Mario West, but dude, please…

We are moon walking under his leadership – where’s the improvement? Tonight we get heckled nationally by Kenny and Chuck and everyone will get panned except Sund. WHY?

What has he done right? Oh, he doesn’t talk to the press. Hip, hip, hurray….Other than that he’s a collossal turd. He played hardball and lost with Childress, he gave 7′0 Euroleague MVP David Anderson away for absolutely nothing.

WHAT HAS THE GUY DONE????

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2009 Draft Review

Hawks take Jeff Teague who has done absolutely nothing but looked lost.

Coulda shoulda

Darren Collison making Chris Paul expendable.
Rodrique Beaubouis future star in Dallas.
BJ Mullens true center.
Sam Young solid 1st yr. contributor in Memphis.
Marcus Thornton another very productive 1st yr. in NO.
Dejuan Blair all he does is rebound and defend.

Again, why is Sund not on the HOOK?

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Based on Josh’s salary, age, and his (potential) impact on offense and defense, you will be hard pressed to find another player that comes close to that. Also, I would like to see if another coach can help Josh change some of his bad habits.

So I would not trade Josh as yet. Plus his value probably took a hit from his performance in the last few games.

Give us a PG and a HC, and then we can see what kind of impact they have on the team.

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ESPN trade machine is lousy. I managed to get the entire Hawks non- FA in a trade for Gasol and Kobe.

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Fight to the end? The Hawks? They have not put up a fight yet in this series. It’s over.

Bye Bye Woody and Joe!

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Najeh ,

In situations like this, losing your best player always hurts. But I’d take that New Orleans scenario. Collison is a good young pg who can hold his own on both ends of the court. I don’t want Peja, but a bad contract has to happen somewhere along the line, so be it….

I could go for a S&T with Chicago as well, if it netted us Noah and Hinrich. Hinrich’s contract is not a good one by rote, but he’s a good enough player where I’d accept it.

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Alright guys, lets breakup this pity-party up for awhile. It time for a little comic relief.

Here is a thought: What if Van Gundy really got creative and intentionally save Woody’s job by losing the next 2 playoff games. That way, Woody can make a case to his boss which would setup him to resign for a multi-year contract. With CJ (“Choke” Johnson) happy of Woody resigning, he then re-ups for another 5 years. That would setup 5 more years of “Beat-Downs” by Orlando Magic against the Hawks.

Van Gundy would be a genius!!!

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LOL@ The Truth…..

The only problem is that Pat Riley still runs things in Miami. He’ll get something done, and sooner than we imagine.

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JOSH CANNOT PLAY SF.

He can’t dribble and he can’t shoot. And Lebron and Melo and others would abuse him.

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I get it…deflect and say you arent elite so you can sleep at night knowing you are getting destroyed and that you didnt hold your team accountable. wow…ive never heard a coach bash on his own team in that kind of way. even the coach has conceded. i expect a loss by at least 20…the hawks are losers…blow it up and start over.

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Big Ray

It is no doubt that Miami will retool which is exactly why we should not just “tweak” I predict that Orlando will lose some parts as well (mainly M Barnes perhaps) so no one will really stand still. All kidding aside, as JJ claim to have been frustrated saying thing he may not mean (as coached by his agent no-doubt), so can the fans claim a level of frustration as well. Some of us may have also said things out of frustration. I don’t know if redemption is even possible (at this point) but in this next game, if JJ doesn’t play for the Hawks fans, at least he should play for pride .For the last time, he should prove to himself what he is made out of in playoff competition.

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If I recall correctely, woody said after Hawks loss :” I do not coach efforts.” well, enough is said…He needs to go..

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The Hawks threw in the towel and is ready to for the summer break

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vava74:

Interesting theory given that Barkley said last eve:
“something’s wrong with Hawks on the inside” [paraphrase].
Also, excellent posting today.
It gave me a diferent perspective about why, all of a sudden,
new Josh reverted into old Josh.
vava – something tells me Jamal is in with the younger hawks!
Older Hawks = Joe/Bibby/???
Young Hawks = Al/Josh/+Jamal/Marv/Teaguer
Anti Wdsn Hawks = Mo/Zaza/Teager/Joe Smith(why am I here?)
Just glad to get a check = Cheeseburger/Mario/RandMo/

O’B:

C’mon man.
Those trades [fans throwing out ideas for fun]:
Najeh – N.O. Trade Josh for Collison
(had us taking on Stojakovic’s contract in return) to match sal.
My idea – Chi. S & T Joe for Noah
(taking on Hinrich’s contract) reasoning followed.
O’B – loosen up enjoy this time of “Hawks X-mas shopping”
*new coach
*a couple of new players to get excited about
As opposed to thinking about the stinker of a series with Orl.

Big Ray – where you been?

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Question: Do you boo Joe Johnson tonight?

I was disgusted at what I heard him say after Saturdays game…..after going to +20 games this year and being in his corner since he got here, I for won am done with him. I’m still pissed…..you don’t care if we’re in the stands…….well then we don’t give an F if you’re on our court. Get out of Atlanta you loser.

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ha, I mean “one” not “won”

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ouch…….http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2010/news/story?page=DisappointingPlayers-100510

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One passing thought about JJ:

JJ is a player that seems to be too pre-occupied with his contract situation perhaps could explain why his game is so effected by what the fans are doing and what we think of him. If he would play the game he loves as if he was playing for free (as back in the day on the playgrounds) he might look like the JJ of old (which is better the current JJ). Perhaps all the money JJ as earned over the years and the prospect of future earnings might have “spoiled” his game. Even his attitude has changed since he been here. He has gone from been the mild mannered soft-spoken leading by example player, to being a rude and arrogate millionaire who seem to really don’t give a dam one way or another.

Just a thought

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If I were JJ tonight, I’d go in front of the firing squad tonight, and address the fans at the game before tip-off. He WILL BE BOOED as soon as he grabs the mic by some people, but he needs to endure that.

Give him a microphone . . stand him at center court . . have him apologize to the fans for his comments . . let him make like a halfway farewell speech, thanking the fans and the organization and the coaches . . and then say that this team will do everything they can to win the game tonight.

And see if that will calm things down to a certain extent. If I were a PR person for the Hawks, that’s what I would try to convince JJ to do.

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Tony . . that’s just you talking emotionally. You know good and well that we wouldn’t be in the position we’re in right now, without Joe Johnson. It wasn’t a single free agent even thinking about coming to Atlanta, despite all of that cap space we had. Even an old Sam Cassell didn’t want to come here, after Minnesota let him go.

JJ may have tarnished his Hawk legacy due to his comments and his lackluster play in the playoffs. But make no mistake . . . Joe Johnson is one of the top 5 best Hawks to put on that uniform, in the last 25 years.

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Grandad,
I hear what you’re saying, but the booing that was coming from my seat on Saturday night was never focused on JJ. It was focused on the disbelief at the effort and heart that was being shown on the floor for majority of the playoffs especially on our home court? Where is the pride?

The boos that would be coming out of my seat tonight would be for Joe and his pathetic comments he made after saturdays blowout. Was it not Joe who complained early in the season that there were not enough Hawks fans in seats for the games? We gave him what he asked for only to be Sh$t on.

Thanks for the memories Joe, but you spit in my face Saturday night and I no longer sit in your corner or got your back. Loser!

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Booing during introduction is classless. Agreed. I will wait until we are down by 30…..probably somewhere near the 2:00 mark in the first quarter.

GO Hawks?! (Its hard to say that with any conviction right now)

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Man imagine if Woody gave Teague a chance and tried to develop him.

Look what happened to Rondo.

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JJ proved in this series with the magic that he is not in the same class with Kobe, LaBron, D-Wade and Carmello. Ive been defending Joe for years saying he was the third best player in the league and then when I saw him blow that uncontested layup in saturdays game, after missing shot after shot after shot (most of them were good looks), Ive come to the conclusion that Joe is a second tier player; i.e. in the same league with Mo Williams, Antoine Jameson, Glenn “Big Baby” Davis; players like that. Joe does not deserve a maximum contract because he is not in the category with Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett, D-Wade, Carmello Anthony, Dirk Norwinski, Tim Duncan (those are hall of fame talent). Joe is one level down from that. Joe is great but joe is not in a superstar category, although he has sometimes played like one throughout his career. If Joe would just forget about playing for a contract and give it his all, Joe would be the superstar category but I can tell JOE IS PLAYING SCARED RIGHT NOW and that is why he is underperforming and playing at such a low level. JOE IS PLAYING FOR MAX CONTRACT AND HIS PLAY SHOWS HE DOESNT DESERVE ONE.

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If only ‘Joe’ would go for it;
New Orleans would be a great fit.
Proximity to LR Ark./playing with C.Paul.
N.O. not the media [beast of NY or Chicago].
Joe will melt under the scrutiny! [NY]

S & T:
N.O. gets Joe
We get Collison, *Stojakovic (contract) *[per Najeh]

They would do it in a heartbeat if we would take Okafor.
Maybe the worst contract in all basketball.
For us it would be Koncak all over again. *(Okafor)
*or Blair Rasmussen, remember him?
We may still be payin’ him.

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Hey Grandad…Marvin is not a 4……he is so weak, he gets pushed around by guards……..he could never consistently guard a 4 in the NBA.

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GoldenRetriever:
Where can I get my hands on some of the good stuff your smoking…

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You know guys are pulling muscles from reaching when they think we should have taken Mullens who did even less than the guy we took this year.. I watched a lot of Thunder games this year and I didn’t even see flashes from that guy. Just because he is tall doesn’t mean the kid is going to be good. He was a disappointment at Ohio State and I wouldn’t be shocked if he didn’t turn out to be any good on the NBA level.

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I’ve checked the trade machine and this one works like a charm for both teams. We send Marvin to the Nets in exchange for an off-brand, 12 pack of new headbands. Anyone have Sund’s email?

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Tony . . look at it this way. Have you ever said something out of frustration, but then thought about it . . and realize that you didn’t mean it? Be honest.

I mean . . we as sports fans come on these boards, blogs, and sports talk shows, and literally rip into players on a daily basis. Up until this moment, people may have said that JJ wasn’t a superstar caliber player, but they’ve never questioned the guy’s character.

We have a group of guys in ATl who have NEVER been in any sort of trouble. Not even a minor incident. And JJ has never spoken out about anything like this before. He’s even been criticized about not doing this sort of thing to address teammates.

It was a bad and stupid comment that he said. But it was obviously said out of frustration. A lot of the comments being tossed at JJ and the other Hawks, are being said out of frustration.

In essence, it’s basically the same thing. These players, like the fans, are not robots. We all have feelings. Just think how Marvin has felt the past 5 years, having to know that he has to constantly be reminded that the Hawks shouldn’t have taken him. How he’s not lived up to the #2 pick. And then listen to the fans constantly rip him ( even when he plays decent ), because he’s not a budding star like a Dany Granger.

That HAS to affect Marvin. And while he deserves some of the criticism, he doesn’t deserve the flat out hatred people throw at him.

But most of those fans say those things out of frustration to what he hasn’t become, compared to what his potential was supposed to be. some of those fans don’t mean to rip into Marvin and call him names ( some do though ).

It’s the same situation with JJ. Be mad at him if you want. But realize that it was said out of frustration.

If Bostn fans can forgive Kevin Garnett for telling fans to their faces to . “don’t come to the f—ing games” . . after the Boston faithful booed the Celtics after being trounced by the Wizards in April . . then surely Hawks fans can forgive JJ for these comments, starting tonight . . and especially if he’s brought back here next season.

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I won’t boo Joe at the start because as idiotic as his comments (and Woody’s comments) were, Joe has still done a lot for this long-suffering franchise to lift them back towards relevancy, and if tonight is the last game he plays here, that would be a sh-tty way to send him off. But if he and the rest of the team play as lifeless as they did in Game 3, you can bet the boo birds will be out by the end of the first quarter.

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as much as I love the Hawks they make nearly impossible to watch the game tonight. I refuse to watch them get beat by 50. They can say what they want about better effort tonight I know when someones blowing smoke for PR. They know they won’t compete tonight.

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Flamethrower, Big Baby Davis is no where near the player Joe Johnson is. Are you kidding me? I’m not the biggest JJ fan right now either, but lets be realistic here.

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northcyde,

about this: “It was a bad and stupid comment that he said. But it was obviously said out of frustration.”

I agree, but why didn’t HE say THAT. It really bugged me that he had a wonderful opportunity to apologize, and instead talked around the subject, and said how tough it was, and ended up saying “If they come out and show us support, it would be great,”

In other words, don’t come out to boo us, even if I deserve it. That’s pitiful in my book. No accountability for his gaffe.

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OK I got the fix for everyone: Cp3 wants out of N.O. we send marvin, bibby,crawford for Cp3 and some dead weight big they want to get rid of…enough said

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JJ is capable of being one of the best closers in the game. He has proved that over and over again, which is why he wants a MAX CONTRACT. The only problem is that I think that Joe is not giving 150% effort all the time. Sometime, as in the Hawks playoff run this year, Joe is probably giving only 5% effort, which is why he looked so bad and shot so poorly at only 20% from the field. If Joe gives 100% I promise you he will average a minimum of 25 points a game and shoot 50% from the field. Three years ago in the Boston series with the Hawks, JOE SHOWED THE WORLD THAT HE IS ONE OF THE TOP THREE CLOSERS IN THE GAME. Joe didnt show the same thing this year. Go back and watch the tape of the Boston series from 3 years ago and compare it to this years playoff run. Joe looks like LaBron or Kobe in the Boston series of 3 years ago. Joe can still play like that, but since he hasnt yet received his max contract, has decided not to play that way until he inks the new deal.

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