Hawks Squawks: Pistons 90, Hawks 88
Austin Daye is one of the Pistons fill-ins who beat the Hawks. (AP)
Auburn Hills–No excuses for the Hawks this time. The Pistons saw the Hawks missing their leading scorer (J.J.) and raised them their top three (Rip Hamilton, Tayshaun Prince and Rodney Stuckey, who left the game early).
– In 15 road games since the All-Star break, the Hawks are 5-8 when they either had a lead or a tie in the fourth quarter. Of those games, tonight was the fifth time the Hawks blew a lead in the final two minutes.
– After this latest collapse the Hawks sounded much the same as they did following the others. “Same thing,” Mo said. “We just relaxed a little bit and got careless and thought we had the game in the bag and we let it slip away.”
– “We self-destructed again coming down the stretch,” Woody said. “We’ve got to figure it out.”
– And it’s not simply a matter of getting one of their closers back in J.J., who after all was on the floor for six of those eight blown road losses. “(Even) when he was here, we had to figure that out,” Jamal said.
– “Joe is a big part of what we do,” Woody said. “No doubt we are better with him on the floor. But we controlled this game until the end tonight. We didn’t make the plays we needed down the stretch.”
– Since the Hawks say these things over and over and yet still keep blowing these leads on the road, could it be they simply aren’t good enough? Because the Cavs, Magic and Celtics close out opponents on the road and they are 1-2-3 in the East. The Hawks are good enough to dominate at home and almost always give themselves a chance on the road but they can’t put up consistent Ws, so they are No. 4.
– The glaring number was the 16 points the Hawks scored in the fourth quarter. That’s the fifth time the Hawks failed to break 20 points in those eight blown road losses.
– The Pistons shot just 8 of 21 in the fourth quarter but were 7 of 7 on free throws to 3 for 8 for the Hawks had no turnovers to the Hawks’ three.
–”We missed free throws, we missed shots we normally make, we had turnovers,” Bibby said. “We were up one with the ball and it just didn’t go the way we wanted it to go.”
– That’s because with the Hawks leading 85-84 they threw the ball away and Bibby was called for a foul while trying to get it back. Good start for Bibby but a bad finish. “It was our veteran guards that turned it over,” Woody said. “That just shouldn’t happen.”
– Bibby then had to rush a 3-pointer after Ben Wallace deflected a pass that went into the backcourt. How does that happen on such a crucial possession?
– Before that, Josh missed two big free throws. They’ve become a problem. He’s down to 61.2 percent for the season. He’s also still taking (and missing) long jumpers. If one or the other keeps happening, then maybe it’s OK because of the many good things he does. If both continue, especially in fourth quarters, it could mean trouble.
– It seemed like it took two seconds for Austin Daye to collect Smoove’s second missed free throw and give it to Will Bynum for a ridiculously easy and-1. It actually took 6.5 seconds so I guess that means the Hawks offered resistance by their standards.
– Jamal was just 2 for 7 in the fourth quarter and missed all four 3-point attempts. He probably will benefit the most from J.J.’s return.
– The Hawks were outclassed by a young, ragtag group of Pistons. Daye, Bynum, and Jonas Jerebko all made winning plays. “We just gave this game away, I thought,” Woody said.
– Ben Gordon has done a little something in the league, at least, but then doesn’t that make it worse that the Hawks left him open at the 3-point line when they were up 84-78? Of course, losing shooters in crucial situations is nothing new for the Hawks, either.
– “Ben hit some big threes for them because we were hugging on the weak side because we didn’t rotate,” Woody said.”Those are things we have to clean up as we come down the home stretch and start thinking about playoff basketball.”
– “It’s turnovers, missed free throws, a lot of things that happen that let leads get away from us,” Smoove said.
– “We’ve got to figure it out,” Jamal said. “We play good for 3 1/2 quarters on the road and then we fall apart late.”
– It’s starting to feel like the Hawks will be saying the same thing after they are dismissed from the playoffs. Man, has any 50-win team (probably?) ever had so many issues? Or are these things really correctable and I’m just making too much of it?
– I’m out, Hawks fans.
MC
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215 comments Add your comment
JeJe
April 9th, 2010
7:53 am
IF JOE IS OUT WITH INJURY, WHY NOT START CRAWFORD? HE IS OUR #1 SCORER AFTER JOE
IS WOODSON JUST TRYING TO BE CUTE, SHOWING THAT JAMAL IS A TOP 6TH MAN?
Nacho
April 9th, 2010
8:53 am
Well said Derrell Starks.
SilverSlipper
April 9th, 2010
10:24 am
All I can tell you about the Hawks is: “IF THEY (THE HAWKS) PLAY 100% UP TO THEIR POTENTIAL, the Larry O’Brien trophy is theirs, and they (THE HAWKS) should be getting fitted for championship rings in the offseason after winning the title in June. Thats all I can say about the Hawks. This negative talk is just driving me out of my mind. Think about about it folks, the NBA is DOWN in terms of talent this year. THE HAWKS ARE AMONG THE NBAS ELITE ACCORDING TO THEIR RECORD. The Hawks are just as good as Cleveland, Orlando, Lakers, Nuggets, Spurs, Mavericks, Suns, Jazz, Celtics. The Hawks (THIS YEAR) can beat any or all of those teams in a 7 game series. iF THey manage to do that, they (THE HAWKS) will be crowned as champions in a couple of months. Just be patient folks, its about to happen so just brace yourself for the explosion!
Fundamentals
April 9th, 2010
10:37 am
JeJe – you’re onto Woodson – It’s all about 6th man. He can say Crawford always comes from our bench. Doesn’t matter that he plays starters minutes anyway.
All the Solo talk is funny. Why isn’t he proposed as most improved instead of most likely to fall out of the league along with AC Law, Royal Ivey, ect. I guess Boris Diaw finally fit in with 2 teams, but he’s still not the player we or Woodson wanted. How is this thin 6′9″ kid going to help unless he can guard SF or SG? He can’t manage the post, so he’s no option there. We need some real defensive & rebounding muscle to go big against select teams. I’m sure Joe Smith will leave after the way Woodson has treated him. Collins is taking up space. Morris never got a shot. That leaves us with 2-3 roster spots when Mario gets dropped again. What about Mo? Will he resign? I think he’s going somewhere he can really fit in? That might leave us with 3-4 slots…unless Joe leaves. Who can we really find to fill roles? When will Woodson finally relax and use them?
Not sure what’ll happen tonight. I’m done with the getting ready for playoff basketball. Seems we just want to recoup and take a mental break. We need to be careful. The last back to back was a perfect situation for someone to go down. The extended minutes and tight rotation in Detroit were a gamble. Not smart, not even for a win.
Play your bench, wait for the playoffs. Our team thinks they can just hit a switch and win. Good luck in the 1st round with that, much less the 2nd. The future of the franchise depends on it…No Pressure!
Fundamentals
April 9th, 2010
10:39 am
Can you tell I’m still disgusted with the lackluster effort & stubborn coaching? I’m beat down! I need some playoff excitement!
newkid
April 9th, 2010
10:44 am
Need to move up in the draft to improve our chances of landing a reliable shooter at the SF spot, or a player with center height and girth who is accurate from range and isn’t restricted to competing with Josh and Al for space in the post. Solution: Marvin to Minnesota in exchange for Corey Brewer and pick #16. TWolves biggest needs are at 2 & 3. They’ll fix the problem at SG with their high lottery pick (likely the kid from Ohio State or Xavier Henry from Kansas). Gives TWolves a ‘groomed’ 3 player with a long-term contract that fits nicely into their low salary structure, and gives Marvin a chance for a fresh start with a young developing team. After five years of relative mediocrity, it should be apparent to Sund that we need to discontinue the delusion of the Marvin project.
If Teague’s our future at point (I’m not at all sure about that at this point), he’ll need reliable 3-point shooters (shooters like the Hayward kid from Butler); otherwise his drive/dish ability will be far less valuable. In limited playing time Teague has shown himself to be a dreadful shooter from range, so defenses will continue to ‘invite’ him to shoot from the perimeter. Gotta improve that ugly jumper, and improve his ability to finish off the dribble, then we could exploit the shooting ability of a competent SF. Won’t get that from Corey, but we might get a replication of the chemistry he and Al had at UF; if not, we wouldn’t be committed to him for much money nor more than one additional year. We’ve had five years to come to the inevitable conclusion that we won’t get it consistently from Marvin.
If we go after a Mike Miller type (in free agency) to replace a traded Marvin, we’d have other options with a pick #16. Maybe package it with our 23/24 to move up to the 10-13 position and a chance at a 5-spot player who has skills that would complement Al and Smoove on the front line. Gotta be realistic in our expections of Smoove at 3. He’ll never be a face-up shooter (mechanics are hopelessly and irretrievably flawed), and shouldn’t be asked to try. Proper utilization of the Smoove skillset requires we use a PF/PF/C front line, with Al continuing to improve his 15-18 footer, Smoove continuing to operate around the basket, and a center who’ll take the ball out on the floor (e.g., Z, the Italian kid in Toronto, etc) on offense, but defend the post of defense. Not sure how we’ll defend quick SFs in this scheme though.
Ken Strickland
April 9th, 2010
10:48 am
If Horford is considered undersized for a center, how can bringing in someone smaller and shorter going to improve the situation? And don’t we already have a shotblocker in our starting lineup? Besides, even if we did have a shotblocking center, Woodson would still use his beloved switching DEF, in his warped attempt to hide Bibby’s NO D, which means he’d end up like the rest of our Bigs, above the key trying to defend the opposing teams PG or SG.
Horford, Smoove, Marvin and JJ are very good DEF players. But because of Woodson’s foolish and stubborn insistence on playing Bibby and his nonexistent DEF major mins, instead of utilizing Teague’s quickness, speed and solid DEF more, their DEF abilities are compromised by having to defend PG’s and SG’s on the permeter. Even JJ is unfairly taxed because of having to defend PG’s that Bibby can’t handle, which is most of them.
Somehow, in Woodson’s limited and distorted way of thinking, Bibby is better off switching off on C’s and PF’s and trying to defend against them under the basket. Since a chain is no stronger than it’s weakest link, how stupid does one have to be to think you can strengthen that chain by weakening the other links? You strengthen the chain by removing the weak link. STUPID IS AS STUPID DOES!
We’re not dealing with a HC that’s capable of coaching on the playoff level. Hell, he’s having difficulty handling the regular season.
BIG RAY-The bit of reasoning was simply brilliant. With Woodson as our HC, there’s no way any rookie will be given a change to produce playing behind our frontline. If he won’t give Teague more than 10 inconsistent MPG, while playing behind a PG that’s regressed as badly as Bibby, who plays absolutely NO D, there’s no way he’s going to give a young player mins playing behind an Allstar C and an Allstar calibur PF? Hell, he won’t even give a veterans like JoSmith and Zaza consistent mins behind them. Woodson doesn’t seem to like change of any kind, and is very slow to institute change when he absolutely has too.
Sautee
April 9th, 2010
11:48 am
LOL at northcyde willing to give Varnado 14 minutes per game BEFORE he’s even drafted, but insisting that Teague (who has SHOWN his worth even to Woody) doesn’t deserve 15.
Mike is Back
April 9th, 2010
11:50 am
Newkid, I disagree with you on some of what you said about Teague…his jump shot might look dreadful now…that doesn’t mean you can write him off as a dreadful shooter. Those are the same comments made about Chill shot…but he turned out to be a good player. Teague needs to work on his shot no doubt…and I’ve seen improved rhyme in shot of late. I think he will be a keeper at the PG position. With the spotty minutes he has played, there is going to be some rust in certain aspects of his game. I think he can be a great asset to the team…he just needs to keep working and make the most of the opportunity he gets. The jump shot is coming alone…his defense is where he needs to focus more of his attention on.
Interesting scenario on the Marvin trade, especially coming from a NC guy…I would like to see Marvin’s impact on the second unit before I would consider trading him away. Marvin has a long-term contract at a reasonable amount over the life of the contract…that is flexibility that will be invaluable during Al’s negotiations…I don’t see Sund making a knee jerk trade involving Marvin unless it is a deal like JC’s.lol
Rod from College Park
April 9th, 2010
12:28 pm
Mike is Back,
Teague remminds me a lot of Tony Parker when he first came in the league. The difference is Parker had a hall of fame coach to push him, he recv’d quality minutes early in his career, and was not scared to make a mistake. Parker’s jump shot was terrible early as well.
There is nothing reasonable about paying a guy 40 something million dollars over five years who has absolutely no impact on the game offensively or defensively, and is not a strong rebounder. You could pay someone 1 or 2 million a year to give you the same production Marvin does, i.e. Matt Barnes, and spend that money elsewhere. Our only hope with Marvin is that the old phrase is true that there is a sucker born every minute. He is one of the worse starting small forwards in the league.
Ken Strickland
April 9th, 2010
12:30 pm
Wasn’t the lack of an effective jumpshot the knock on Magic Johnson? And didn’t he develop an effective push shot, much like the one Teague uses? It’s amazing how the lack of an effective jumpshot is considered justification enough for keeping his speed, quickness, penetrating and solid DEF ability anchored to the bench. Yet, slow, methodical, one dimensional, regressing MBibby, who’s DEF ineptitude and inability to penetrate and create easy scoring opporunities for others, is somehow not seen as a problem.
Yet, there are some WOODY LOVERS who think no other HC could possibly do a better job of coaching this team, or developing and utilizing JTeague than Woodson. If you were JJ, would you really what to resign with Woodson as the HC, knowing you’d have to play heavy mins, play hurt, defend primarily PF’s, C’s, PG’s, and constantly get blamed for using ISO’s to closeout gms, because of the lack of an effective halfcourt OFF system?
I hate to say it, but I’m not confident about our chances of beating the Raptors, even though we’re at home and they’re missing CBosh. After all, we’ve lost to worse teams at home that were missing key starters. It’s funny, the 2 players Woody depends on the most no matter what, are the same 2 players that don’t listen to him or pay him any attention.
DawgNole
April 9th, 2010
1:17 pm
Get a grip, Grandad, and let it go. I owe you no response–especially to your “satisfaction”–beyond what I’ve already given you a number of times.
You refer to me as “young fella,” but you know nothing about my age; I may well be older than you, in which case it is you who have disrepected your elder.
What you do with your time is no business of mine–except that you asked me for a response. I obliged, and you didn’t like it. Again, don’t ask if you’re not prepared for an answer that may not be to your liking.
Yes, you have issues (just as Anthony does). They will be obvious to most on here, but never to you, so I don’t need to spell them out.
There was no “big talk” at this end when we got started–only cold, hard FACTS about the Hawks (which is what this blog was supposed to be about) and a brief observation triggered by your oppressive response to Anthony’s angry but accurate assessment of the team.
Your apology to me “for not handling your criticism as well as you would have liked” rings hollow for obvious reasons. No need to apologize for my father; he taught me to respect elders and youngers–and to address the subject at hand (the Hawks, in this case) clearly and accurately, not in rationalizations, glittering generalities, and aimless babblings. He also spanked my butt when necessary.
I am not Anthony, nor sybil. I am DawgNole, and I’m not pissed off (except at the disgraceful history of Atlanta pro sports teams) or pissed on. I read your entire post; thanks for trying to end it on a positive note. We’ll see if that happens again.
newkid
April 9th, 2010
1:31 pm
Mike is Back,
I’m admittedly biased, but not blinded by my bias. And while I’m not even close to being in the ‘camp’ of those who share the views of ‘Rod from College Park’, my bias doesn’t prevent me seeing that Marvin just hasn’t worked here. In my opinion, it’s foolish to think (after a five-year trial) he ever will. Doesn’t mean he doesn’t have serviceable attributes others may find useful in their constructs. Hope so; that’s our best hope of salvaging something from this less than bountiful marriage. I’m not the least bit distressed by where he was drafted or the level of his current compensation. Both immaterial to what he’s contributing TODAY on the floor. Whether he’s paid 600K, 6M, or 60M, to paraphrase Magic GM Otis Smith, ‘…he’s not helpful us win.’ And as Mr. Smith says: “If he’s not helping me win, I move him.”
I’m certainly not convinced Teague can NOT become effective from the perimeter; justing stating the obvious: he’s not even close to being effective from range at this point. WILL he work his tail off during the summer to correct this deficiency? Hope so, but do we really know? If he doesn’t fix it, revert to previously cited quote from Mr. Smith.
Mike is Back
April 9th, 2010
1:37 pm
Rod, I was really talking over the life of the contract, I’m not basing my reasonable on Marvin current production. I’m saying for someone with Marvin’s projected upside at the time the contract was consummated…that was a reasonable amount. Which mean that it’s not so bad that Sund would have trouble making a deal. So no am I’m not suggesting you can’t get someone of equal talent for less money, just that people need to be patient and let the rest of the season play out before writing Marvin off for dead.
Mike is Back
April 9th, 2010
1:50 pm
NewKid, u no I’m a WF guy…my daughters a freshmen there…so I admit a little bias myself. lol