Atlanta Hawks at Raptors: Woodson gives Bibby some needling
Toronto–Made it to Canada, where somehow it’s a nicer day than any I can remember in Atlanta for like the last week. (When I saw the border agents, for some reason all I could think about was: “She got a cousin at customs that get (stuff) through . . .”)
– Chris Mannix of SI.com asked Woody if he’s concerned about Bibby’s problems with quick point guards as the Hawks head to the playoffs.
“You think Bibby has trouble with quick point guards,” Woody said, smiling. “I’m going to tell Bibby that. Maybe he better speed it up in the playoffs.”
Bibby and one of those quick guards that can give him trouble. (Johnny Crawford, Jcrawford@ajc.com)
Chris Sheridan of ESPN.com got to Bibby before Woody could and relayed the exchange.
“You keep some things, some things you can’t,” Bibby said, and it looked like he would let it go and that would be it.
But after a bit he added: “I aint’ the only one who has trouble with quick point guards, I can tell you that.”
Bibby was offered the hand-check rule as an out but he wouldn’t take it.
“I’ve got other things to worry about,” he said.
My take: Bibby is Woody’s guy, and the coach knows Bibby gets motivated by talk about his decline. So Woody will use such slights to coax him.
When Woody met with Bibby a few weeks back, he told him he needed to be more aggressive offensively. He was back on that theme again last night.
“He’s passed up a lot of shots he should have taken this year,” Woody said, adding with a smile: “Maybe he’s saving it up.”
From what I’ve seen, Bibby is a prideful player who cares about winning. He’s a gamer, too, so it’s no surprise he was back in the lineup last night after sitting out practice on Monday.
Look for more of Woody’s sly needling of Bibby to get him fired up for the playoffs. Or maybe more of this will do the trick.
– Woody keeps insisting he’s not really looking at the playoffs picture beyond still trying to catch Magic from 3 games back with 16 to go: “We still have a legit shot to win the division”
His standard line about the postseason: “We’ll figure that part out when we get there.” I believe him.
He’s been getting questions about Milwaukee lately but he keeps deflecting them.
“It could be Milwaukee, Toronto, Charlotte, Miami,” Woody said. “Or if any of those teams fall back Chicago could slip in there. It’s not just Milwaukee we’ve got our eyes on. But I haven’t given much thought to the playoffs. We are focused on the regular season.”
– The Raptors have become the anti-Bucks. They are reeling, losers of five straight and nine of 10. Assuming the Bulls get healthy at some point and that avoiding D Wade still is a good idea no matter what he’s got around him, the Raptors might now be the team everyone wants to see in the first round.
Raps coach Jay Triano might replace Jarrett Jack with Jose Calderon in the starting lineup tonight. Not that the Raptors think that’s the ticket. Calderon in the Toronto Star:
“It doesn’t matter who starts, it doesn’t matter who plays more minutes, we’ve got to win games. We’re upset because we’re losing games. We’re not upset because I’m not playing or I’m not starting or something like that. Let’s keep things simple: We’ve got to win, and everything else doesn’t matter.”
Here was the part in that story that should make the Hawks’ eyes get big: “(The Raptors) once again are being hammered on the defensive glass – Golden State had 18 offensive rebounds and Portland 19 in Toronto’s past two losses – and their transition defence is lead-footed.”
– The Hawks might be for sale.
MC
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565 comments Add your comment
Melvin
March 18th, 2010
12:31 am
Astro,
Najeh beat me to the Acie Law status. Do you still think he can’t play?
Maavelous
March 18th, 2010
12:41 am
I Marvelous Marv am tired uh ya’ honky no talent punks rippin’ on me. You’s kin kiss mah’ Ferrari.
MsDee
March 18th, 2010
1:09 am
Way 2 go..Acie!!
AG
March 18th, 2010
1:14 am
Hortford for the most part checked Bosh all night. That was Josh who let the Raptor center go wild.
Big Ray
March 18th, 2010
2:01 am
Najeh ,
My guess is you won’t hear too much about that. Looks like “non-baller” Acie Law may not be out of the league just yet, but then…what do I know? Some guys improve and produce once they get back on their feet and in the right situation.
I laugh when it’s mentioned that Acie had his chances in Golden State. Yeah right, playing for a coach who probably didn’t want him anyway, and was more interested in getting rid of a 20ppg scorer that he said he loved, then suddenly flipped on. His loss, our gain.
I’m glad for him having two good games in a row, maybe he will get more opportunities like this. In the meantime, Teague is our latest and youngest Hawk, and I’ll support him the way certain people claim we should be supporting the team and coaching staff.
Big Ray
March 18th, 2010
2:02 am
Co-sign Grandad’s 12:13 post all the way…
o.O-Mac-Town -Macon, Georgia- Westsider-O.o
March 18th, 2010
2:12 am
Hey guys, I hate to say this, but am I the only one getting a feeling that last year’s playoffs might be a mirror image of this year’s???
Originally, I was expecting The Hawks to win a first round series in 5-6 games, and move on to the second for a tough fought serious with a “contender” that could go either way.
As of right now, it looks like we’ll have our hands full with eather Miami, Charlotte, Milwaukee, Toronto or Toronto for 7 games…..only to get embarrass by ORL and CLE in the 2nd round.
Just Saying
March 18th, 2010
2:44 am
I have had enough and I’m jumping off of this roller coaster we call the Atlanta Hawks.
Good thing we kept the coach around for another year to “finish” what he started.
What a joke!!!!!!
truthspitter
March 18th, 2010
2:45 am
Give me Joe, Josh, and Al. Move Bibby to the bench, draft Jarvis Varnardo with 2nd rd pick, give Teague until half way through the season before you ship him off, get rid of Marvin Williams ASAP. Marvin is the biggest piece of waste that this team has as of now. You got rid of Sheldon and Acie while getting Bibby and Jamal back, now you need to find a way to get rid of Marvin, but it will be hard. Sund made a dumb moving by signing Marvin for 5 years, that’s just stupid, Marvin has to be laughing at the foolish Hawks management he fooled them twice, now you know what that means, shame on the Hawks management
northcyde
March 18th, 2010
4:19 am
Keep it real about Acie
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/gamelog?playerId=3219
He’s had 2 great games in a row, with Rose out. But it’s about consistently playing at a certain level. He doesn’t even have to play this well, just consistently play well, whether he’s a starter or coming off the bench.
When Rose comes back ( which could be Friday ), he needs to keep playing at a high level, if he wants to continue to get playing time.
But keep it real about that dude.
Ken Strickland
March 18th, 2010
7:42 am
GRANDAD-Excellent post and analysis. Last yr I made mention of Woodson being more heavily influenced by his college mentor, BKnight and his heavy handed approach to coaching and dealing with players. You can see it in the uneven way he deals with his players. It was said Knignt loved IThomas, AHenderson and QBuckner, they could do no wrong and he never raised his voice or chastised either of them. We all know how brutal he was with those he didn’t have an affection for, and we see that same crap with Woodson.
The difference between the two as HC’s is BKnight knew fundamentals and how to teach them, how to coach and how to win championships, and WOODSON DOES NOT! Woodson’s major malfunction is he’s completely hungup on trying to establish an identity as a HC, like his mentors LBrown and BKnight. But rather than borrow from, and take advantage of, what has worked so successfully for his 2 fundamentally sound championship calibur mentors, he’s determined to establish OFF/DEF systems developed by him.
O'Brien
March 18th, 2010
8:10 am
Isn’t it obvous that Mo Evans is much better at SG than he is SF? Why hasn’t Rick Sund addressed the backup SF position this past offseason, or at the deadline?
Rick Sund thinks Chills is a utility player, while Marvin is worth 5 years, $37.5 mil? This season has been a major disappointment for Marvin, so I hope he turns it around next season. Although 5 years in, and we are still waiting on Marvin to turn it around.
northcyde,
For various reasons, Acie never worked out in ATL. The interesting thing to me is why did Salim regress under Woody, Acie also regressed under Woody, and it looks like Teague has regressed a little (I have flasbacks to the Lakers game early in the season, and an earlier Nets game, he looked much more comfortable back then).
Obviously, the players deserve most of the blame, but shouldn’t part of it be attributed to the coach and the GM as well?
Ken S,
Since the all-star break, we dont run as many ISOs as we used to, so maybe Woody is slowly leaning on the bigs a little more (although we should have gone to Horfrod more often down the stretch).
I wonder if when Bibby is gone, if Woody will still employ the switching defense…
wordy
March 18th, 2010
8:12 am
what happened in the last 3 minutes? They had total control in the 2nd half. Then nothing. Crawford was awesome last night. So I am going to pretend they didn’t lose in light of his superb performance.
Keeping it really real
March 18th, 2010
8:19 am
Keep it real about Acie
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/gamelog?playerId=3219
He’s had 2 great games in a row, with Rose out. But it’s about consistently playing at a certain level. He doesn’t even have to play this well, just consistently play well, whether he’s a starter or coming off the bench.
When Rose comes back ( which could be Friday ), he needs to keep playing at a high level, if he wants to continue to get playing time.
But keep it real about that dude.
Keep it real about the minutes while we at it. Acie gets good minutes in two straight games, he producing something. In thirteen out of the previous 14 games, he gets very low minutes. What he supposed to do with those low minute games? His minutes go up and down but he is shooting 50% from the field. Sounds pretty consistent to me. The man cannot do in 5 minutes what he can do in 25 minutes. Maybe if he got more consistent playing time he could do more. Until then 50% shooting from a guy who you say can’t shoot is pretty good when he either does not get to play or gets inconsistent minutes. I must be missing something. He has even played for three different teams this year. Still shoots 50%. Can’t get past the facts, Jack. Can’t get past the facts.
JOE
March 18th, 2010
8:20 am
Marvin, 2 pts and 3 rebounds in 30 min. He is a BAD joke at this point
Keeping it really real
March 18th, 2010
8:22 am
Rose gets the minutes in Chicago, when he come back that is it for Acie. Back to five minute games and you going to blame him for not producing the same. Some things never change kind of like bald woodrow during a game. Never change no matter what changes in the game.
GeeMack
March 18th, 2010
8:45 am
Woody Haters are in full effect today.
Woody deliveres the city a top tier team without top tier, and the fanbase says he’s a bad coach. How dumb does that sound?
BILLY KNIGHT
March 18th, 2010
9:01 am
I drafted acie law and woody never develop him as a player, that was 1 of the issue me and woody had.
I WISH A.C THE BEST I THINK HE WILL STILL BE A GOOD PRO.
Ken
March 18th, 2010
9:06 am
Woody needs to attend a coaching clinic, someone needs to chide him aabout those boneheaded blunders. Does he listen to his assistants because at Woody detongued them?
Mike is Back
March 18th, 2010
9:12 am
I like Woody’s response after the game…Clearly, he was pissed with Marvin for falling to box out and get the rebound. U think Marvin know it.lol
Ken
March 18th, 2010
9:13 am
Sorry woody made a mistake Does he listen to his assistants , because during games I never see them coaching, they looked kind of drugged, maybe woody got the good s–t like Ron Washington got hold of. I call woody Black Fratello, thanks woody it was a good ride, but you are at your limit. If you stay then no inkling of a championship,it would be a waste of talented young men we watched nique, kevin, doc, battle, tree and the rest get old and put out to pasture all in the name of loyalty to a coach who could not coach the team beyound their peak.
R
O'Brien
March 18th, 2010
9:36 am
Except for one or two good games sprinkled in, Marvn has been a major disappointment this year, and I can’t say that he deserves to be starting right now.
I like the idea (vava proposed weeks ago) of starting Mo Evans and bringing Marvin off the bench.
I wonder if Woody is open to that idea this late in the season?
I MUS WRITE
March 18th, 2010
9:40 am
Theres a warrant out for Woody’s arrest, he seems to have killed sum point guards. Also an attempted mured of one JTO…. Curry Collinson and Lawson would all be lost under woody -dont know ifhe’s back nex year but if not I wont be sad to see him go.
Bibby is the worst Pg in the league -defensively seriously give me another name if you can think of anyone worse
terrell
March 18th, 2010
9:41 am
What’s the NBA record for most blown 4th qtr leads in a season? If there is such a record, where making a run for it. And bty, is Marvin still a starter?? Woody looked liked he wanted to throw them bows at his butt when he didn’t get that rebound.
terrell
March 18th, 2010
9:48 am
Sund drafted Teague because he knew this was Woody’s last year. I think he already has a Coach in mind. Why would he draft a pg when the Head Coach only likes veterans at the position? He’s said so himself on numerous occasions. It’s a forgone conclusion. Hell, BK only drafted Acie too piss him off because he couldn’t fire him.
terrell
March 18th, 2010
9:57 am
Marvin sux, but this game shoulda never came down to that rebound. What about the ill-advised jumpshots from Josh Smith early in the shot clock, when Horford was killin em inside? What about Woody taking out Mo for Marvin when he was clearly on a roll? Why does he seem to want to limit the bench players min instead of limiting the starters min? What about Bibby’s horrific defense down the stretch? There are a lot of reasons why we lost this game. Cant put it all on old huggabutt.
Idiot Watch
March 18th, 2010
10:08 am
“The difference between the two as HC’s is BKnight knew fundamentals and how to teach them, how to coach and how to win college championships, and WOODSON DOES !”
There is a difference between with a blogger with sense and one without. A blogger with sense understands that at the college and high school level teaching fundamentals is a must. Most of the athletes have been recruited based on there physical assets not their court knowledge. Training at the Bob Knight level is very high schoolish, sophomoric. Thats why he often had to yell and get physical with the boys.The Bob Knight level is to prepare you from the pros by teach fundamentals and work ethics so you will be ready for the pros.
Unless you are a project child, like ken Strickland, you are suppose to know the fundamentals when you are drafted. Thats why it was said of Horford that he was the most NBA ready player in the draft.
Yes, Bob Knight was Woodson’s College coach, and woodson did have a very good college career. But It was Larry Brown who was Woodson’s mentor. Get your facts straight, ken.
Larry Brown knows how to win championships, and KEN STRICKLAND DOES NOT!
Yea, GeeMack, The Woody haters, AKA, Le Bubba Crew are wide open! It use to be they would only come out after dark, I guess they have taken some sort of potion and now they dont shrivel up in the day light.!
The pros are not a “lets start from the basics” and give it the old college try league. The NBA is a Billion dollar business and its about winning, not teaching the fundamentals. If you need fundamentals stay in school or in Kens case, go to school. I wont buy tickets to the park and rec league, ken.
Since Acie law is the Topic of the day, how many teams has he been with know? how much organic growth is his game today? Acie is a very slow learner and will never be a starter and never have an impact on the game. He will always be a bench guy, just like Ken Strickland. So Ken, sit you assssss back on the bloggers bench, you and team Bubba.
Gamer
March 18th, 2010
10:30 am
Jarett Jack would be a good pick up for Hawks. A quick defensive guard for post-season.
truthspitter
March 18th, 2010
10:33 am
Woody is good coach. Marvin is garbage and I hope he just has a nervous breakdown and retires today. Josh since he decided he wanted to play skilled has forgotten how to finish around the basket. Al is not a C. Jamal is the backup QB in town that everyone loves but he does just as much or more ISO’ing as Joe. This team is a mess
Maktar Ndiaye
March 18th, 2010
10:43 am
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNtwNpbPOCU
The description of this video is startlingly accurate.
VickSwitchHitter
March 18th, 2010
10:47 am
I knew that when “Starvin” Marvin got his hands on the rebound last night at the end of the Raptor game, I knew he would lose the ball out of bounds. I need to point out it wasnt just Marvin making mistakes. When the Hawks were trying to close the game out, Zsa Zsa Pachula inexplicabilty turned the ball over as he was trying to drive the ball inside. Josh Smith also had a crucial turnover; so I’m not blaming Marvin for the loss. It was a collective loss but Marvins mistake was inexcusable because he should have boxed out and secured the rebound and the Hawks victory. Marvin is a liability in the starting lineup and should be replaced by MO Evans. MO was unbelievable last night and kept making 3s thoughout the evening. I didnt know Mo was that good a shooter. I think if Evans were to play more he would score at least 20 points a night and give the Hawks the scoring to finish off teams. I think we discovered an unsung hero in Mo Evans last night and I believe Mo should be promoted to the starting lineup. Can I get a witness here? Mo was sensational, he shot about 80% from the field and made I believe all of this 3 pointers. Thats more than Marvin Williams has given the Hawks IN HIS ENTIRE CAREER! lINEUP CHANGE SUGGESTED: Start Mo Evans and give Crawford more playing time; also start Teague in place of Bibby for the rest of the season and the playoffs. Results: World Champtionship this season.
Idiot Watch
March 18th, 2010
11:03 am
A. Bargnani 22pts against no defense from horford.
03/17 Atl W 106-105 38 8-14 .571 2-4 .500 4-6 .667 0 1 1 3 3 8 11 2 22
truthspitter
March 18th, 2010
10:33 am
Excellent post!
Sautee
March 18th, 2010
11:36 am
Double ding!
BatmanPritchard
March 18th, 2010
11:38 am
Woody blew the game last night. Most people feel that the game was lost when Marvin Williams botched the game by failing to box out. The game was lost when the ball was not given to Hoford late for Horford to close it out. Thats part of it but the Hawks could have closed it out before Crawford missed his final shot at the buzzer. As a blogger pointed out, Horford was killing the Raptors inside, and the ball should have been continually pounded in to Horford until Horford missed, since Horford was having his way inside and the Raptors couldnt stop Horford at all. The Raptors dont play defense so Horford was going to get anything he wanted, as he had been getting all night. Another mistake last night. Josh Smith should have posted up deep inside close to the basket. There should have been countless alley-oops tossed to josh eye-level at the basket for him to STUFF it home. Those are easy baskets and the Hawks should have made a ton of them. You cant make those on the orlando magic because Howard will block them at the rim, but the Raptors are completely defenseless and there would have been no one there to stop the onslaught. No one on the Raptors can jump with Josh and Josh should have been fed at the basket all night long. In fact, Josh should have feasted making layups because he would have gotten absolutely no resistence from the Raptors. The Lesson the Hawks should have learned last night is that IF YOU DRIVE THE BALL TO BASKET HARD TO MAKE A LAYUP, THE RAPTORS WILL GET OUT OF YOUR WAY AND GIVE YOU A CLEAR LANE to the basket uncontested. THE RAPTORS PLAY ABSOLUTELY NO DEFENSE WHATSOEVER. Oh well, if the Hawks face the Raptors in the first or second round, Im sure they will sweep them because they will know now how to destroy them, if they have read my blog.
Sautee
March 18th, 2010
11:39 am
Anyone who actually WATCHED the game could see that Horford was guarding Bosh most of the time and Josh was guarding Bargnani.
Of course one who thinks Horford has been here 4-5 years could easily get confused.
O'Brien
March 18th, 2010
11:41 am
BatmanPritchard,
So what was Woody supposed to do? Throw the ball into Horford himself?
Or was that the responsibility of the veteran guards Bibby and Crawford?
Of you’re going to blame somebody, at least point the finger in a logical direction (for this loss). The players.
O'Brien
March 18th, 2010
11:43 am
Should read “*If you’re going to blame somebdy…”
I MUS WRITE
March 18th, 2010
11:47 am
Thanx Maktar ur video just reconfirmed that Marvin is a wack sandwich with pickle on the side. He has the ability to be 17/7 but refuses to step up ….Im so disgusted -thanx again
Grandad
March 18th, 2010
11:50 am
Sybil, Sybil, Sybil: Where to begin. You’re all over the place.
Nba billion $ business or about winning…pick one ?
Bob Knight = fundamentals = winning = success = fannies in seats…
= $ = billion $ business. Never mind I just answered it for you.
But you still don’t get it.
Larry brown, bounced back & forth college & pro before he ever mentored Wdsn. Knight mentored Wdsn [admittedly] before LB.
Best pro coaches = best teachers: ?
Aurbach…Pop…Jackson…Brown…Wilkens…Daly…KC Jones – reckon ?
Now Josh Smith – I’m glad you admitted that Wdsn never taught him anything. Fundamentals, that is, like shooting, boxing out, footwork, etc. Maybe he can just rely on college coaches to do that…wait Josh didn’t go to college. Now Marv, ol’ Roy, should have taught him to box out that one yr. so he would have boxed out that young man last night. Roy had marv 1 whole yr. Wdsn has had Marv, how many yrs. now?
Oh yeah, the’re s’posed to be ready when they get here. Wdsn’s job is to yell @ ‘em when they don’t do what the’ve never been taught.
I’m oughta here, goin’ to watch ball, rest of the evening.
You gentlemen have a great day.
Ken strickland & Big Ray Thanks and kudos as well.
vava74 I’m nearing the end slowly/purposefully* on Simmon’s book.
*Is that a real word or did I just make up a new one?
AtlSouthside
March 18th, 2010
12:10 pm
1. Bibby is old, but clutch… I have faith in him for the postseason.
2. Horford is weak on defense, and never establishes himself in the post on offense. Josh Smith could play Center better than Horford. (Hawks should trade Horford, since all the coaches favored him so much in the All-Star voting), we could get a true Center in return.
3. Marvin Williams is a keeper, but he’s not a starter in the NBA, not on a winning team….
4. I’d prefer to play Cleveland in Rd 2.
The Truth
March 18th, 2010
12:18 pm
Some of you here are so blinded with your long-standing opinions; you have lost the ability to be objective. All this chatter about Marvin losing the game is “Not True”. Go back and replay the last 2:00 minutes. Yes I agree he did not have a good night and was mostly invisible. But he did not lose the game. If anything, that honor should go to Josh Smith for not boxing out his man after Hedo missed his last free-throw. It allowed Johnson (who substituted Bosh) to slip into the lane and push Marvin (who had the ball) out of bounds. When Woody made the comment during post game that we failed to box out, he was really talking about Josh because Johnson was on his side. If Josh had boxed him out, Marvin would have gotten the rebound and the Hawks would have won the game.
O'Brien
March 18th, 2010
1:08 pm
MC,
How come we didnt’ get a blog with coach and players comments this time?
There were comments in the article, but we’ve been spoiled (already) with the after game blog…
JeJe
March 18th, 2010
1:48 pm
I don’t understand how Acie Law and Jeff Teague cannot make jumpshots. I have not seen Teague make a jumpshot in about 3 months.
And this isn’t a joke.
HIs form is horrendously ugly
Rod from College Park
March 18th, 2010
2:33 pm
The Truth,
“If Josh had boxed him out, Marvin would have gotten the rebound and the Hawks would have won the game.”
Assuming that Marvin would do anything is just that, an assumption. Guess what, Josh can’t do everything. He’s one of our best assist men, he one of our consistent scores, He’s one of our best defenders, rebounders, leads the team in steals, blocks, imtimidations……. People are not solely blaming Marvin for the loss, they are just realizing that a guy who makes 8 mil per year should be able to bring something to this team besides goofiness. If Marvin made 1 of those 9 wide open (nobody checking him) shots, that he missed, we would not even be discussing any of this. How is it possible to play 32 minutes being 6′9 with a 7 foot wingspan, and only score 2 points and grab 4 rebounds against a terrible defensive team. Like someone else stated, I’m really interested to know what Marvin’s shooting percentage is this year outside of the paint. I would gues it’s probably 20 something percent.
red
March 18th, 2010
2:34 pm
can we trade marvin for either maggette or stephen jackson?
The Truth
March 18th, 2010
2:55 pm
Rod from College Park
“If Marvin made 1 of those 9 wide open (nobody checking him) shots, that he missed, we would not even be discussing any of this”.
Remember I said this:
“Yes I agree he did not have a good night and was mostly invisible”
Josh is not untouchable. For this particular game, Josh did not have a “Josh-Like” game either. While we are discussing Marvin 1 of 9 wide-open jumpers, let us not overlook Josh shooting 5-15.
northcyde
March 18th, 2010
3:06 pm
Marvin outside shooting:
10 – 15 ft: 41.7% FG
16 – 23 ft: 35% FG
Threes: 32.8% FG
It’s the long 2 point shot that has left him for some reason. In the 3 years prior, he has shot 43% – 45% – and 41% from that range.
The league average is 39.6% FG
northcyde
March 18th, 2010
3:22 pm
Plus Josh had that horrible play, in which Bargnani caught the ball, and he just turned his back to him to guard a guy down low, leaving Bargnani wide open for a 3. That happened with just under 3 minutes to go. If we get a stop on that possession, we have the ball with a 7 point lead. Instead, they cut it to 4.
bigdave
March 18th, 2010
3:33 pm
thats what switching assignments does… you’re more vulnerable to blown coverages…
Sleepy
March 18th, 2010
3:34 pm
That rebound speaks volumes about what has been hurting us in 4th quarters of games we lose but the real problem as I said last night before I drank myself to sleep after the game in disgust was the play by Zaza. Bench players on contending teams just dont do that stuff as they know they may never see the floor again .
That was a road game A WINNABLE road game and we pissed it away with silly errors and some of them by role players and that is what bothers me more than anything else .