Atlanta Hawks: For wear and tear talk ’bout practice, not games
Woody ran his players into the ground when he looked like this.
From time to time I’ve heard concerns that Woody is running his main guys into the ground and I know that’s been his rep. So let’s look at the minutes per game for J.J., Smoove and Al before I point out how those numbers might not even be the most important consideration in the matter.
J.J.’s minutes are down slightly, from 39.5 last season to 38.1 this year–the fewest he’s averaged since he was a bench player for Phoenix in 2002-03. Smoove is playing 35.1 minutes per game, same as last season and down from his workload in his third and fourth seasons. Horford’s minutes are up to 35.2 from 33.2.
(Marvin and Bibby aren’t really in the discussion anymore. Marvin is getting the least burn since he was a rookie. Bibby’s minutes are at a career low, less than Jamal’s.)
OK, those are the overall minutes for the Big 3, but what about the monthly splits? Is Woody riding his Big Three more as the playoffs approach?
For J.J. and Al it depends on how many minutes they log the rest of the season. Al’s minutes took a big jump from January (35.3) to February (39.2) but are way down in March (33.7). J.J.’s average minutes increased in January (38.1) and February (40.1) but are back down in March (37.8). Smoove’s minutes have been pretty constant through January (38.1), February (38.1) and March (39.3).
You can always look through the game logs and raise an eyebrow about the minutes here and there. Recent examples include J.J. playing 42 minutes at Miami after he played 37 minutes while sick the night before. Josh played 45 vs. Golden State and then 40 at Miami, where he didn’t seem to have his usual focus and energy(though Smoove doesn’t have the same age and injury concerns as J.J.)
But players’ work rate outside of games might be as (or even more) important to wear and tear than what happens the rest of the time. How often do they practice? How long are the sessions? And how intense are they? I don’t have any way of objectively measuring where the Hawks rate in those areas–I only get to see the latter part of full practices and usually they are just shooting or walking through plays by then. But my feeling is the practices have shortened and from talking to Woody they’ve tended to be lighter workouts.
The subject came up the other day when Woody noted the Hawks had a good, hard practice on Wednesday before they headed to Washington. Being a coach and all, he lamented that he can’t put the Hawks through those kind of sessions more often.
“I can’t beat ‘em up like I did in the early days,” Woody said. “I’m serious. Ask Smoove. I used to give them no days off. We would practice every day. They used to hate me for that. I’ve learned to back off.”
Smoove says it’s true.
“(Blank) no we didn’t get a day off,” he said. “Especially when I was a rookie, we would come in when the veterans had days off. And we would come in an hour-and-a-half early and do a full practice, three-man weaves and everything. And then we would go out and do the second practice (with the veterans).”
And did they hate Woody for it?
“Hell yeah,” he said.
Woody knows he can’t do it like that anymore. That could matter more than the minutes logged by his horses, at least as it relates to physical wear and tear over the long term.
– Peep my story on Josh’s emerging leadership.
– Ken has the Pistons game tonight.
MC
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
184 comments Add your comment
Nate ArchiBALL
March 13th, 2010
4:27 pm
I’m not going to say it………
Clyde
March 13th, 2010
4:32 pm
Had to check in from Brazil
FIRE WOODY
Cannon
March 13th, 2010
4:44 pm
I think it’s safe to say all that hard work has finally paid off for Smoove,
Luke M
March 13th, 2010
5:00 pm
Good analysis, but another egregious single game example is the loss to Golden State (or was it Dallas?) when Horford played 50 minutes, and Zaza only played 6. That is an awful breakdown of minutes between starter and backup. Small ball or no small ball, you can’t leave your starting C out there for 50 minutes.
Dukester9
March 13th, 2010
5:39 pm
Let me say Woody has done a great job building this team through the 13 wins seasons. But to get to the next level I believe we need a new coach. What bothers me is this organization does not care about the next level of winning. They are just investors who want there return and 50s in most cities will pack the arena. But here we are I just dont feel we have the heart,talent or COACHING to get there.
Grandad
March 13th, 2010
5:55 pm
Using practice time to run 3 man weaves?
Just curious, how many times do you run the 3 man weave
during the course of a season?
I understand that it is a full ct. conditioning drill.*
*used extensively back in the 50’s. [I would know.]
My point:
Practical modern basketball suggests that any practice time
[wear & tear on legs] should incorporate game situations,
fundamentals, teaching, as well as conditioning.
Yes I’m picking at a nit. There are however, lots of nits to pick.
Michael, once again I apologize to you as I appreciate your inside
reporting then taking your info and using it to dissect Wdsn.
I Must Write
March 13th, 2010
5:59 pm
Good job, MC.
You finally got rid of the stupid AKA’s.
Ha
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
6:34 pm
We have had many blow outs this year. I would think that with closer games the big three minutes would be up instead of down. I would also hazard to guess that’s why we get off of fast start’s at the beginning of the year and play less effective later. Maybe that’s why we go to jump shooting instead of attacking the basket in the second half of games. The million dollar question is would playing the bench more from the beginning of the season cost us wins.
In my opinion Evans, Teague, ZaZa and Joe Smith should have had more minutes in the second half to have our best 5 fresher for the last 10 minutes of the game.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
6:40 pm
Grandad . . have you ever played organized basketball?
The 3-man drill is more of an agility, hand/eye coordination drill, than anything else. You have to watch both the man and the ball, while creating the proper spacing between each other so that you can get the ball down the floor. LOL . . and so you won’t run into each other.
It’s a very helpful drill when it comes to transition basketball because it not only provides conditioning for the player, it helps the player make the right kind of pass when throwing to a person going full speed.
It’s no wonder why Smoove is pretty much devastating on the fast break, whether it be as a finisher or a passer. Of course . . . Woody won’t get any credit for this.
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
6:47 pm
Or his H.S. coaches who undoubtedly ran the weave.
Hawk n the Ham
March 13th, 2010
6:48 pm
*Credit given
Let's Get This Straight
March 13th, 2010
6:48 pm
OK.
Northcyde,
Woodson is NOT a good coach.
He has had the same starting lineup together for 3 years (pretty much). The guys have NATURALLY gotten better. No one on his teams has overachieved in the last 6 years – no, no one has overachieved. OK?
Woodson cannot devise an offensive scheme. Our offense looks horrendous against most teams. We rely on athleticism alone to win games. We have no shot against elite teams in this league and the Hawks crowds are abysmal 95 % of the time. Also, Woodson doesn’t use the bench. While you think guys like Mo Evans and Joe Smith suck, they don’t necessarily do poorly against other bench players.
Woodson is NOT a good coach, is rigiid, does not listen to his assistants, and will NOT be at the helm next year
Hawk n the Ham
March 13th, 2010
6:50 pm
Gatorade nor Redbull make a juice to keep these guys fresh.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
6:56 pm
KevinA . . . once again, those same group of guys that you named, were constantly blowing leads at the beginning of the year. The only time that group played well, was during that stretch in December.
I mean . . damn. Zaza shot 21.7% FG last month. How does a CENTER shoot that low of a percentage . . . EVER?
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
7:09 pm
Go Hawks. bench should get some burn tonite
G-Money
March 13th, 2010
7:09 pm
Let’s Get This Straight- I have no idea which league you have been watching- the fact of the matter is that no team in this league is going to win the championship without elite players. This crap about an overabundance of talent in Atlanta just is not correct. And the players have just naturally gotten better, that one is not going to fly, every off season they are given some element of their game to improve on, and for the most part they have. Atlanta has a nice collection of talented players with no future Hall of Famers. Do the Celtics have future HOFs, Magic, Cavaliers, Lakers, Nuggets? Oh and speaking of the importance of having one- how would the fortunes of the Pistons and Nuggets be at this moment had not Joe Dumars outsmart himself and taken Carmello Anthony?
Dante Fitzgerald
March 13th, 2010
7:10 pm
Tutti Frutti, oh WOODY
Tutti Frutti, oh WOODY
A WHOP BOP A LU A WHOP BAM BOO
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
7:11 pm
Wallace and Stuckey out.
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
7:14 pm
Duckman makes a 3
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
7:14 pm
get hot Marvin!
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
7:16 pm
hopefully teague gets some burn 2nite
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
7:16 pm
Bynum had 20 assists in a game recently.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:21 pm
Hawks playing hard and playing smart early.
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
7:21 pm
pistons having a T party
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
7:22 pm
Josh with the nice pass
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
7:22 pm
Smoove and Joe sandwiched Bynum on that loose ball. lol.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
7:26 pm
OK.
Northcyde,
Woodson is NOT a good coach.
Woody is not a GREAT coach. He is a good one though. Especially when you compare him to other guys in the league. When you do that, he’s a good coach. Woody gets a grade of B from me this season.
*********
He has had the same starting lineup together for 3 years (pretty much). The guys have NATURALLY gotten better. No one on his teams has overachieved in the last 6 years – no, no one has overachieved. OK?
* People said that Joe Johnson would NEVER be a #1 guy on an NBA team. 5 years later, he’s on the verge of getting a near-max contract, mainly because Woody uses JJ like he’s Kobe and Lebron ( even if he doesn’t have their skills ). JJ has 4 All-Star appearances after people thought he was crazy to come to ATL . . . so JJ overachieved as a player.
* Jay Bilas on 2004 NBA Draft night said that Josh Smith would be a bust. Once Harrington was sent out of here, Woody moved Smoove to PF. He’s steadily improved as a player ever since, almost to All-Star level ( and he should’ve made the team ) . . . so Smoove has overachieved as a player
* `Horford is not playing his natural position, yet, he made the All-Star team this year . . . so as a cener, Horford has overachieved as a player
* Flip Murray was left for dead last year, until he came to the Hawks. Woody trusted him to be our scoring option off the bench. Flip responded with one of his best seasons of his career. He leaves Atlanta, and he’s a scrub again. So Flip overachieved as a Hawk.
* Jamal Crawford was widely regarded as having the worst shot selection in the league. He was a player that, while good, NO ONE wanted. The Hawks get him, and Woody immediately tells him that he wants him to lead the league in scoring off the bench. Crawford responds with THE BEST shooting season of his career so far . . . so Crawford has overachieved as a Hawk.
*************
Woodson cannot devise an offensive scheme. Our offense looks horrendous against most teams. We rely on athleticism alone to win games. We have no shot against elite teams in this league and the Hawks crowds are abysmal 95 % of the time. Also, Woodson doesn’t use the bench. While you think guys like Mo Evans and Joe Smith suck, they don’t necessarily do poorly against other bench players.
We’re one of the best ball handling teams in the league and is currently #3 in the league in offensive rating. We rely on athleticism, and smart play by our vets to win games. Our transition offense is one of the best in the league. We’ve battled Cleveland down to the wire in both games this year. We’ve split with Dallas, Denver and Utah. We’ve swept Boston all 4 games. We’ve swept Portland. The crowd is sorry, only when we don’t play good teams ( the problem is that they don’t come out for non-big games ). The bench is ranked #25 in the league ( which means they’re sorry ). Evans and Joe Smith have played sorry for most of the year . . against the other team’s bench players, because they hardly play with the starters.
**************
Woodson is NOT a good coach, is rigiid, does not listen to his assistants, and will NOT be at the helm next year
Woody is a stubborn coach at times. But he’s also a player’s coach that those guys respect. Woody has increased his win total in each of his 5+ years as a coach. If the Hawks win 52+ games, and make a real good showing in the playoffs, Woody WILL be back at the helm for at least the next 3 to 4 years.
*********
By the way . . a GREAT 1st quarter start by the Hawks. Everyone looks good tonight so far.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:26 pm
Marvin looking good early, on both ends.
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
7:28 pm
Now I know this is getting old on my behalf, but, wouldn’t this be a good time to plug in some minutes for JT0 with the starters? We’re in control of this game.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:29 pm
This, folks, is what it looks like when a good team plays well against a bad team.
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
7:29 pm
uncontested dunk for Max
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
7:29 pm
Damn good quarter though
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
7:33 pm
Man put teague in dammit. U see how the flow has just been messed up?
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
7:33 pm
Josh is the best passer on the team
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
7:34 pm
Smoove running the break and making a great pass. Learning what Woody and the assistants taught him in all of those daily practices as a rookie.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
7:35 pm
12 assists already
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:35 pm
“Woody gets a grade of B from me this season.”
Funny you should say that. For all the differences in opinion you and I seem to have, I give Woody a B too (sometimes it slips to a B-, but for the most part it’s a B).
I guess my posts reflect that I want to see him become an A+, whereas you want everyone to be happy that he has the HOPE scholarship.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
7:37 pm
Great defense Mo.
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
7:37 pm
best D i’ve seen Mo play
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
7:39 pm
Najeh . . you’ll drive yourself crazy, expecting a coach to be A+. I don’t think there’s a coach in the league that’s an A+.
While your B fluctuates downward to a B-, My B will fluctuate upward to a B+ at times.
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
7:39 pm
Who says Mo can’t play D?
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
7:42 pm
Najeh,
I’ll join you in the loony bin. I’d like to see Woodson be an A+.
And I’ll bet if you asked Woody, that HE’D say he wants to be an A+.
If he doesn’t, get him out of here.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:43 pm
Nice drive-and-dish by Jamal.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
7:44 pm
Now if the bench keeps playing like this every night, they’ll get more playing time. They look like a legit 2nd unit tonight.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
7:46 pm
LOL Sautee. A+ is perfect. So if you expect these coaches and players to be perfect, you’ll always have something to complain about.
This is close to A+ basketball tonight though.
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
7:48 pm
They sometimes do look like this though. Yet, they still don’t get the PT. Just think back to the Miami game when J.Smith clocked 43+ minutes. In that game, Joe Smith came off the bench in the 1st half for about 7-8 minutes and he actually had about 8 points and was doing work on the boards. But, we never saw him again.
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
7:48 pm
northcyde,
Agreed.
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
7:49 pm
J.Crawford is ballin.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:49 pm
The old man with the and-1.
Jamal is running the offense with precision right now.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:51 pm
Where the F-CK did that come from?
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
7:51 pm
Wow Zaza lol
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
7:51 pm
WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooo
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
7:51 pm
Z!!!
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
7:51 pm
zazaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
7:51 pm
LOL, “Magic” Pachulia
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:51 pm
“Magic Pachulia”
Haaaahahahahahahaahahhahahahahaha
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
7:52 pm
That is tooooooooooo hilarious. You see the bench after that pass.
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
7:52 pm
And I typed it just before Stinger said it.
Melvin
March 13th, 2010
7:53 pm
Oh my, just got home and see the Hawks up 51 to 27… Yes, I like this…
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:53 pm
Josh got away with like 5 steps on that fast break. When it’s going good, it’s going good.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
7:54 pm
Teague looking like Tony Parker two possessions in a row, hitting the floater the first time and drawing the foul the second time.
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
7:54 pm
lol yea josh got away with that one
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
7:57 pm
Teague getting minutes with the starters . . . this is what ya’ll want . .right?
Tony from Stone Mountain
March 13th, 2010
7:59 pm
Teague gets to play with the starters. About time!
Tony from Stone Mountain
March 13th, 2010
8:00 pm
That didn’t last long for Teague.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:02 pm
There isn’t a more fun team to watch when they are sharing the ball.
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
8:03 pm
yea the problem is they don’t share the ball like this every game
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:04 pm
Who says our system can’t expect good passing – and deliver
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
8:06 pm
lol they got him that time
Sleepy
March 13th, 2010
8:07 pm
Northcyde I dont think Crawfords overachieving hes playing the same way he always has. Larry Brown,Lenny Wilkens and Isiah Thomas all loved the guy . He was putting up 21 and 5 before the knicks traded him under Mike D’antoni. He was stuck for 8 years on teams similar to Joes first year here. Once he had enough talent around him that he didnt have to shoot 20+ times a game you are seeing the result.
I dont consider that to be him overachieving but rather getting awfully close to reaching his full potential.
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
8:08 pm
I know Bob had to look at Nique after he just said BIG NIMBERS LMAO thats why there was a strange silence.
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
8:10 pm
wow. great half.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:11 pm
On a different note it’s really amazing to see how far the Pistons have fallen. At the beginning of last season, before the Billups-Iverson trade they were considered a legit contender for the Eastern Conference title. Now they are in the worst situation for an NBA team — no cap space and no young talent to build around (unless you like Rodney Stuckey a lot more than I do).
Melvin
March 13th, 2010
8:11 pm
JTO, JTO, JTO
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:12 pm
Teague with another floater. Who says he doesn’t have the skills to contribute quality minutes right now?
That was one of the best halves the Hawks have played this season, regardless of the opponent.
joBjo
March 13th, 2010
8:13 pm
how about rookie of the month Jerebko for young talent, and Will the thrill.
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
8:14 pm
Najeh,
Word
Sleepy
March 13th, 2010
8:15 pm
Nice to see the November hawks show up. Its been a long time since our starters came out and actually put it to someone like tonight and now the question is will they keep this intensity to start the 3rd .
We should be really hyped for the rest of the season as we have a good schedule and we can have a shot at top 5 all time finish .
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
8:17 pm
Will Josh get enough minutes for a triple-double?
Sleepy
March 13th, 2010
8:17 pm
You cant say Teague can play quality minutes because he looks good when we are up dang near 30 pts .
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:18 pm
ZaZa behind the bk assist the play of the game
Sleepy
March 13th, 2010
8:19 pm
Dumars has basically destroyed that franchise. Just horrible……….
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:21 pm
Let the bench start the second half. Is Woody that smart?
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:21 pm
Hawks shooting 73% FG. LOL . . . pretty much the perfect game so far. We are being outrebounded by 2 . .and have given up 7 offensive rebounds though. So it’s almost perfect.
Ken Strickland is getting his “See . . Teague should play more” speech ready.
No hate about Teague from me though. This is what the kid has to do, if he wants to play more. Come in a game, make some shots, and have some sort of an impact on the game.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:21 pm
“how about rookie of the month Jerebko for young talent, and Will the thrill.”
Compared to other currently struggling teams like Golden State (Stephen Curry, Monta Ellis, Anthony Randolph), the Clippers (Eric Gordon, Blake Griffin), even New Jersey (Devin Harris, Courtney Lee, Brook Lopez) or Sacramento (Tyreke Evans, Jason Thompson, Omri Casspi), those guys don’t even compare. I can’t see any of the Pistons’ young players ever being anything more than a 3rd option on a good team.
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
8:22 pm
But how much better does he have to look for get on the court when Bibby goes for 21+ minutes with 1 point and 1 assist.
Seriously. We’ve seen what JT0 can do when he’s on the floor, but Woody hasn’t shown the confidence to go with him enough. I’ll admit, he’ll have his bad games and make mistakes, but we’ve seen bad games out of Bibby all throughout the season without seeing any reduction of minutes. You can’t seriously be telling me JT0 doesn’t have enough of a skill-set to play some of those meaningful minutes Bibby gets when Bibby’s having an off-night.
truly1
March 13th, 2010
8:23 pm
How do you know teague cant play quality minutes because we have never tried it. It better for teague to look good when we are up by 30 because he contributed to it. What would you say if he looked bad
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
8:24 pm
Outrebounded by 2.
Damn, we’ll NEVER beat an elite team.
Blast
March 13th, 2010
8:24 pm
Looking like a good old fashioned beatdown so far.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:24 pm
KevinA . . . why should Woody do that?
Let the starters play for 8 – 10 minutes, then give the rest of the game to the bench.
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
8:24 pm
The sole difference between Bibby and JT0 is this. Even if he’s making mistakes, he still stays aggressive and penetrates. When Mike Bibby has a bad game, it usually means he’s had a bad shooting game or he was basically irrelevant throughout the game, like a ghost.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:25 pm
Oh yeah, and let’s begin the J-Smoove Triple Double watch now. 6 points, 6 dimes, 5 steals at the half, and it’s entirely possible he could get the 8 boards necessary to get double figures there too. The only real question is whether he will even play long enough in this game to reach that.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:25 pm
LOL . . no coach would do that.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:28 pm
They earned it. Give them their due.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:29 pm
What? No BONE tonight?
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:29 pm
Perfect game to rest our starters. Joe,Josh and Al.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:30 pm
quick 6 – 0 run by pistons
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:30 pm
A little sloppy starting this half.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:31 pm
We have Collins and West – they are well rested
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
8:31 pm
josh why shoot a jumper? WHYYYYYYYYYYYY
Don’t let them come back
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
8:32 pm
choke time
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:32 pm
Oh well . . so much for the perfect game.
Is Woody to blame for the lackluster start?
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:32 pm
Know thest starters – they come out lazy with a big lead. Just in their DNA
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:36 pm
lazy is not a fair word – cold or not as focused or in rythem is better.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:38 pm
Every NBA team makes a run…
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:38 pm
…but with turnovers like that, the Hawks certainly are making it easier for them.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:39 pm
ok – it’s 18-7 detroit – bench cannot do any worse
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
8:39 pm
Joe with the okey-doke
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
8:39 pm
seriously why is it that the hawks just start makin bad plays when they try to protect a lead. I don’t get it.
Melvin
March 13th, 2010
8:39 pm
Nice 1 hand catch and shot by Joe…
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:39 pm
The Hawks and the crowd alike are looking a little restless right now.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:40 pm
the excuse of a game of runs
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:40 pm
Please run the offense through Josh.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:41 pm
Teague, Jamal, ZaZa in
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
8:41 pm
this is actually a lil sad
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:42 pm
+/- is a really unreliable stat that I don’t put much stock into, but let me just throw this out there anyway: Bibby is at -2, Teague is at +16.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:44 pm
Damn, Orlando is really on a roll. They are beating the crap out of Washington tonight. Seems like nearly every game recently has been a double-digit win for them.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:46 pm
Has anyone figured out that when we pass we win? Besides me?
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:46 pm
Nice gesture by the Hawks organization . . by bringing in the Bennett family ( the family that Smoove reached out to )
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:46 pm
Josh is gonna be in SI? The last thing the Hawks need is a curse right now…
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:46 pm
Offense isn’t the problem folks . . . it’s the defense.
25 pts by the Pistons so far.
Cannon
March 13th, 2010
8:47 pm
Hopefully Smoove gets the cover of SI. He’s deserving. Can’t wait to read the article.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:47 pm
Orlando is Al hitting that 12-15’shot. All game long. Get Howard out of the paint.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:48 pm
The entire Hawks team had a double digit +/- number in the 1st half . . so Bibby’s number will definitely drop.
Foul #4 for Crawford . . . Woody sticking with him for right now.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
8:50 pm
Josh is 1 dime, 7 boards and 5 steals away from that quadruple-double…
Sleepy
March 13th, 2010
8:54 pm
36 pt quarter for the Pistons …………….
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:54 pm
36 pts that quarter.
That can’t happen again.
Hold them under 25 in the 4th.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:55 pm
36-23 in 3rd qt – Should have played the bench
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:55 pm
Hawks didn’t panic though. It’ll be interesting to see how much of the bench Woody comes back with.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:55 pm
did say DNA or what -
VenomSpitter
March 13th, 2010
8:56 pm
Get bibby out the game
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:56 pm
Bibby in . . no Teague
Teague has played his 10 minutes though . . but Teague people will be heated, seeing that Teague is +16 tonight
Sleepy
March 13th, 2010
8:56 pm
Joe needs to get on some defense Rip had 14 points in that quarter. Always talking about focus where this is where he has to step up his play on defense
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:57 pm
northcyde ,
He will overplay his starters and wear
then out it’s our DNA
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:57 pm
LOL @ bob and Nique . . . on pins and needles right now
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:57 pm
You do watch these games – right?
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
8:58 pm
no chance at overplaying his starters tonight. No one will reach 40 minutes, unless Smoove doesn’t come out of this game.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
8:59 pm
Bench leaking in – will restore order
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:00 pm
JJ out of the game . . everything falls apart offensively.
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
9:00 pm
lmaoooooo did he fall
Melvin
March 13th, 2010
9:02 pm
This would have been a good time for Teague to get some extend mins/experience but Woody rather play Bibby. Dang it…
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
9:02 pm
Why Bibby is in there I will never understand
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:04 pm
LOL . . well. . maybe Smoove will play the rest of the game. Not out of the game yet
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
9:06 pm
I’d like to see someone break down the Hawks’ shooting percentage on possessions on which Josh touches the ball vs. possessions where he doesn’t get a touch. I’d be willing to bet there’s at least a difference of 10% in favor of Josh touching the ball.
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
9:06 pm
We need Horford back in. Maxiell wasn’t stopping him.
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
9:06 pm
bibby is geting blowned by put teague in geez
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:07 pm
Horford in . . Smoove still in . . .
suck it up Smoove, you’re playiing until we secure this game.
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
9:08 pm
another miss open 3 from bibby
Melvin
March 13th, 2010
9:08 pm
No Teague or Joe Smith in the 2nd half. This is just crazy…
Wabe
March 13th, 2010
9:08 pm
WTF happened?
I left my house at halftime. I guess it was another 2nd half lull?
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:11 pm
Pistons have made a lot of jumpers in the 2nd. Hawks have made 2 jumpers outside of 15 feet in the 2nd half
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
9:12 pm
10 dimes for Josh. Beautiful pass.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
9:14 pm
Great fast-break. Hawks have officially regained control of this game.
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
9:14 pm
As Danny Devito would say “Now THAT oughta do it!”
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:15 pm
great defense by Bibby, leading to the JJ layup
Up 16 with 3 to go . . . that may do it folks
Teague will get back in with 2 minutes to go, as long as the Pistons don’t cut it back to 10
Blast
March 13th, 2010
9:15 pm
Nobody can tell me that LeBron passes the ball better than Josh Smith! LeBron might rack up the assists, but he does not make more scintillating and needle thread passes better than Josh, especially this season!
Josh Smith is awesome! And I’m freaking glad he plays for Atlanta!
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:18 pm
Here comes Teague and Mario . . 2 minutes to go. . .
(( clapping for the starters ))
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:19 pm
Blast . . don’t get carried away now. Lebron may be the best passing forward of all time, next to Bird. Smoove can pass . . but not like Lebron.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
9:21 pm
Teague wit 17 min – a good thing
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:22 pm
wowwwwwww @ Mario’s block/foul
J.J.M.
March 13th, 2010
9:23 pm
that wasnt a travel
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
9:23 pm
northcycde
Labron lives with the ball. the ball goes through him, If we lose JJ he may have as good or better passing strats
Melvin
March 13th, 2010
9:23 pm
Good win for the Hawks.
Blast
March 13th, 2010
9:24 pm
Northcyde,
I know Bron-Bron can throw it down, but have you seen the passes Josh has been making lately? Especially to non All Star players?
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
9:24 pm
he being smooth
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:26 pm
Are you guys seriously going to argue that Smoove passes better than Lebron? Seriously?
I love Smoove like everybody else, but Lebron is on a different level as a passer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPr3NNGL_fg
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:28 pm
And oh yeah . . . 8 wins in our last 11 games.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
9:35 pm
It’s not really fair to compare anyone to LeBron, because nobody has LeBron’s combination of skills. LeBron has the ball-handling skills and lateral quickness of a point guard, and most of his dimes are a result of his ability to use those handles and quickness to drive inside against anyone. It’s hard to disregard those advantages of LeBron’s game and just isolate his court vision to compare it to Smoove’s, because LeBron is able to set up so many of his passes in a way that Smoove can’t.
I think it’s more fair to compare Smoove to true forwards and centers, who don’t handle the ball as much and who can’t take anyone and everyone off the dribble. They tend to get their assists in ways more similar to Smoove, such as finding people underneath the hoop out of the high post, for example. And if you do that, I’d say Smoove is fast approaching Kevin Garnett, Arvydas Sabonis, and Vlade Divac territory with his court vision.
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
9:41 pm
Northcyde,
Yeah, but we’re only 2-2 in our last 4.
Sorry man, but SOMEBODY had to say it.
I don’t see how anybody could be hatin’ tonight.
KevinA
March 13th, 2010
9:41 pm
What makes the Josh pass so special is they want him to take jumpers – they just lay off
Josh makes them pay by his passing
.
Blast
March 13th, 2010
9:42 pm
Northcyde,
I saw the video, and I can say I am not impressed at all. Those passes were phased out over several years, when James was still playing with Donyell Marshall, Ben Wallace et all. I’m talking about this year, man. I would love to see them put up a video of Josh’s assists this year alone, much less his whole year in the league.
I know Bron is a great athlete, but we all get so caught up in what he can do, that we forget to credit those that do some things better than him.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
9:43 pm
If you look at northcyde’s link, for example, it’s highly unlikely that Smoove can ever make that first pass. That’s not because he doesn’t have the necessary court vision; it’s because he doesn’t have the lateral quickness and handles to shake his man and get in the paint like that when facing up. So I don’t know whether it’s even possible to say one guy passes better than the other, since they are usually playing in such different situations. The only situation that both players find themselves in regularly is when they are leading the fast break, and Josh has made plenty of amazing passes in that situation himself (like the 2nd pass LeBron makes in that video to Varejao).
Sautee
March 13th, 2010
9:43 pm
And LeBron has the size and vision of Magic. I don’t like him, but I admire his passing.
doc
March 13th, 2010
9:47 pm
josh is becoming a baller par excellance. nice to watch him come of age and quiet the doubters. the lightning rod no longer.
i am just as amazed that he continues to say the right thing in all situations. even in his clashes with woody he never brought it out of the club house. i have admired his athleticism and work ethic, it is nice to see it all come to fruition for him and the hawks organization. he will be one of the better mid first rounders in the league soon and rank with the best.
northcyde
March 13th, 2010
9:47 pm
Smoove is most comparable to Lamar Odom. Lamar can shoot better and a better rebounder, but Smoove is more athletic and much better defensively. But the passes that both make, are very similar.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvSCBY1bYTg
Smoove is like a Lamar/Shawn Kemp hybrid . . which would make him extremely scary, if he could shoot the basketball.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
9:48 pm
If I was making an All-NBA 1st Team Passing, though, LeBron is my starting SF and Smoove is my starting PF.
I have no idea who I would have at the other positions though…
Najeh Davenpoop
March 13th, 2010
9:51 pm
I’ve liked the Smoove/Odom comparison for a while for comparing their talents on the court, but the biggest difference between them by far is their mentality. Smoove has the mentality of a star and a locker room leader, whereas Odom has always had the mentality of a complementary player who doesn’t want to shoulder too much of the load. And even before Smoove became a star and a locker room leader, he was always much more aggressive than Odom has ever been.
O'Brien
March 13th, 2010
10:13 pm
Although I would have liked to see Joe Smith and Teague get more minutes in the second half, props to Woody for playing his bench extended minutes. For 2 games in a row, the bench has produced.
Hopefully they will continue to play well, and Woody will continue to give them playing time.
Good win Hawks.
Grandad
March 13th, 2010
10:35 pm
northcyde:
I’ve been away watching ball all day.
I mentioned that back in the 50’s…inferring…that I played once upon a time. Admittedly, I wasn’t very good. That’s why I bacame a coach.
Loved the game, studied it, absorbed all I could for the past 40 yrs.
After a lifetime in the game, one learns not to waste time in practice
on situations that will never occur in a game. I understand, hand eye coordination, etc., but any drill should be game specific.
As for Josh:
Why hasn’t Wdsn taught him fundamental footwork, how to shoot FT’s,
How to shoot a mid range jumper in rhythm (and why doesn’t he run
plays designed to do so). I’ll stop there for now.
I’m sure Wdsn did a good job teaching Josh to:
*jump high *run fast *block shots *dunk and many other things which require hand eye coordination.
Sautee – I’m not sure many HS coaches run 3 man weave anymore.
I’m fairly confident it’s a staple for AAU teams.
Grandad
March 13th, 2010
10:51 pm
northcyde:
Josh has the ability to be another Ron Artest.
Now the question is:
have I ever seen a basketball game?
LbJ can make pretty passes.
Josh is unselfish.
They both see the floor.
LbJ…2nd best passing forward ever! Quite the hyperbole.
Did you consider Rodman?
Never mind his passes were plain, he was crazy, and he was
just a ‘team player’.
I’m gonna have to think about that 2nd greatest passing
forward ever. [Rick Barry]
Sigh
March 14th, 2010
3:17 pm
Why is that all the Hawks analysis always have to say something negative? I’m not poing fingers, but it’s true. This is random, I know, but talking about how the Atlanta fans are no good, and such; it’s not going to help bring fans. Instead of talking negative about players/coaches/fans, why don’t you change that and start talking good, and support the fans to come, instead trying to support us by talking negative.
REALLY?
March 14th, 2010
3:38 pm
Josh is better than Ron Artest! but he, Josh is a power forward.
drmaryb
March 14th, 2010
8:27 pm
The Last time I checked Mr. Woodson……
Has a Championship RING! How many of you on this blog can say the SAME?
I didn’t think so!
drmaryb
March 14th, 2010
8:28 pm
How many of you EXPERTS on here have ever tasted cheap champagne run down your faces in a
NBA locker-room?