Woody: Short bench strategy “backfired on me” vs. Suns

TMac is on the bench with 7mins remaining in the 4th and the crowd is chanting “We want Tracey”… Too Funny

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Astro,

Keep in mind, how this conversation of TMac started. I said if he was bought out of his contract then it would be nice for the Hawks to sign him. It would have been a low risk move with potential to have high rewards. Hawks would have sign him for pennies and his presence on the court demands the other team attention and he possibly could generate more tickets sales b/c he’s still has a good following. Dont forget he’s only 29 unlike Hill who was in mid 30’s when he finally got healthy again.

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This is crazy. TMac first game back after in over a year with a new team and team are running ISO TMAC in the 4th qtr… Oh yeah, he’s delivering too..

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I think we should be officially worried about Toronto. They’re now only 4 games back. If you check their sched, right after that game where we killed them in December they’ve been on a big run.

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Melvin,

Even if TMac was bought out, I doubt he would sign with the Hawks. He would want to go somewhere where he could get more minutes, and with JJ and Jamal, that would not happen here.

And I cosign AJ’s 10:06 pm post.

I wonder what kind of salary Josh Howard will get next season. If he cuts down on the partying and the smoking, he might actually have alot of suitors.

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Anybody watching T Mac right now? Absolutely crazy how well he is playing. Damn good game going on here.

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Astro,

I remember you saying some of the same thing about Jamal and look how well he has mesh with this team. Also, we could have used 3rd legit scorer last night that could create his own shot when the Hawks scored 30pts in the 2nd half….

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Astro,

Good link. Looks like Mo is over paid…lol… I wish we could play like his look-a-like Darvin Ham, remember him?

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AJ,

For the Hawks to upgrade their bench as necessary, ASG might have to open up their wallet, because we will not win the Eastern conference with bench players like Joe Smith, Mo Evans, Collins, West etc.

I was hoping Sund would have been able to make a deal at the deadline for a backup SF, because Mo is getting worse offensively, and his defense is overated (plus he is too small to play backup SF).

He averaged 4.5 ppg in January, and 1.5 ppg so far in February. Horrible nimbers. I hope Sund and Chills are able to work things out this summer. Either sign him, or trade him.

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I’m going to buy this franchise and i will be moving this team to Seattle(Mexico City if I could.)

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I tell you what, if T-Mac were bought out, the Hawks would be extremely foolish not to consider the guy. He defenitely could provide that third guy on the floor who can consistently create his own shot and would make the Hawks that much stronger come playoff time. When the opportunity presents itself, you don’t turn down talent.

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Mexico City Brown Eagles. Too bad Mexico isnt a good place for an NBA team.

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One Day

We will kmow one day if our problem is Woody or our players. We will know if he wasted talent and draft picks or got the most out of this team. I think our problem is Woody…just like Clevelands problem is Brown. The lack of player development and in game adjustments has always been our problem. OKC has done in 3 years, what it has taken the Hawks 6…How good would OKC be in the east? Teague will go the way of Law in Woodys system and be another wasted draft pick.

As good as our team is on defense at times…you win championships by offensive and defensive development. Woody has proven he is a defensive coach..maybe Golden State should hire him, because we now need an offensive coach.

PS..I think a new coach would be atleast as good as Woody

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cp

February 20th, 2010
7:07 pm

Every year we hear the same crap from Woodson. Its as if he has this stuff written down just in case he gets asked a question. 6 years as the head coach of this team and he still cant make adjustments, never has a reliable plan B, still under utilizes the bench, still no offensive system, still no team identity, and still cant figure out how to stay with the hot hand or take the cold guys out and try something different, and he still has an answer for our problems after the game but nothing during the game. Our talent has improved but coaching wise I still see the same crap.

I LOVE THIS POST!!!! THIS IS HITTING THE NAIL SQUARELY ON THE HEAD!!!! GREAT ONE CP!!!!

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ASTRO JOE-I would not only bring the entire bench back, I’d actually play them this season. MWest can have a positive influence on some gms with his hustle, DEF and athleticism. RMorris has size, height, mobility and a very good inside OFF gm than can make a difference in gms where our outside shooting is off. Playing him at PF can also create some serious and interesting matchup problems for certain teams, like Orlando. JCollins has proven to be effective against bigger less mobile centers like himself. JSmith gives us a still talented and versatile player who can effectively replace Smoove and play center against less physical centers.

The problem is, your beloved Woodson allows his personal feelings to influence his judgement and treatment of players, often to the detriment of the team. As a result, when it comes to certain players, he will focus on what they don’t do well and respond to them accordingly, rather than taking advantage of what they can do well. And since when did ADMITTING a mistake become more important than CORRECTING that mistake?

You WOODY LOVERS seem to be satisfied with him continuing to make the same stupid mistakes and poor judgement, as long as he continues admitting to it. WHAT KIND OF BS IS THAT? I know he’s making it hard for you to justify supporting him, but DAMN!

Woodson likes being the HC more than he likes the responsibility of coaching. He maps out a pregame strategy, and if at some point it fails, he simply puts the gms in the hands of his key veteran players, then stands on the sidelines and allows them to do whatever they want. If we win, most fans are happy, especially those like you who defend him no matter what. If they fail, Woodson blames the players, and supporters like you single out certain players to blame, in order to deflect any criticism of Woodson.

RSUND HAS SIMPLY GIVEN WOODSON MORE TALENT, VERSATILITY AND DEPTH THAN HE HAS THE ABILITY TO EFFECTIVELY HANDLE.

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My ten grains of salt:

1. I couldn’t watch the game, it was way to late for me over here (tip off @ 2 AM), however, after reading all the info and analyzing all the data made available in the net, it is easy to conclude that we lost a tight game against a strong opponent almost exclusively due to Woody.

I am also downloading the game so I can check it out in detail later today.

2. I have always been a moderate Woody supporter because I am a firm believer that coaches can also grow and improve.

I am a strong believer that part of the team’s success is due to Woody and that he has instilled good things in this group.

I also thing that the players like him and listen to him. This is an extremely important factor and something which cannot be disregarded.

3. However, Woody is proving to be a very slow learner. Why? Probably because his a** in on the line and he is too afraid to take risks and use his bench (including JT0).

Maybe, like I have read in the blog earlier, he is an excellent Assistant, rather than a good HC. We just have to wait until the end of the season.

I know that everyone sees RandMo under a very bad light due to his poor conditioning last year, however, he is UNDOUBTEDLY our best and most refined low post threat. He has very good fundamentals and his moves are sharp and well executed.

I concede that his defense and rebounding are still below par, however, when we have trouble scoring why not give him some minutes and some possessions? How can he develop into something useful to us if he does not play?? And how many times have we seen our own starters failing to defend well and having match up problems against scrubs??

The fact is with our current use of the bench, we are delusional if we thing we can go beyond the second round. PURELY DELUSIONAL, EVEN IF WE GET THE #2 spot in the East!!!!!!!

The 1989 BAD BOYS had Vinny Johnson, James Edwards, Mahorn and Salley ALL PLAYING a minimum of 18 minutes. NINE guys played consistent minutes.

The 1990 BAD BOYS again had 8 players getting a minimum of 22 minutes (they didn’t resign Mahorn).

Even the 2004 Pistons’ much shorter rotation had Okur and Lindsey Hunter averaging 11 minutes, Corliss Williamson averaging 15 and Mike James and Elden Campbell averaging 8/9 minutes.

I mentioned already a few weeks ago that we need to “sacrifice” (meaning accepting the possible sacrifice of – and not that it’s a given fact that there will be an actual sacrifice) a few wins by playing our bench more, INCLUDING JT0!!!!

Yes, he is raw, but not playing him does only bad things to him. How can do much worse than Bibby is right now?? Let me tell you: HE CAN’T.

I like Bibby and I still consider that he can still have a very important role in our future success, however, I cannot shake the feeling that Bibby is a bit lazy and is feeling a little bit too comfortable regardless of what he brings to the table:

a) He should shed some weight;
b) He should be forced to penetrate more (yes, he is slow, but we have seen him drive and pop, off picks, in occasions with acceptable results – Woody has to demand that from him) – remember, Bibby’s best game was not only his 3 point shot but also his mid range shot.

c) His game dropped dramatically after his ankle sprain. How many games did he miss? ZERO and everyone knows that ankle sprains do not get better by playing injured. TO REST is essential!!

4. Nonetheless, that is not the only thing going bad with Woody: he’s in game analysis is poor and I believe that his opponents scouting is also.

This is the second time in just a few games in which the opposing team’s bench completely trounces us.

MIA won the game with their bench and now PHO won the game with their bench. How can you be so ill prepared that you let Dequan Cook score at will in almost every single game against us??

How can we play the Magic making the exact same mistakes? Leaving their 3pt shooters completely free to turn the games around?

How can he play PHO at home, see Dragic do a good job against us and not be prepared to see him do it again?? Dragic in ATL was 5-10 for 10 points, 2 reb, 6 assists, 3 steals in 23 minutes!!!!

How can he – as certainly did – not prep talk the team to be careful with Dragic? Both times we came prepared for Nash and then we relaxed when his replacement came in…

BAD PREPARATION. You need to remind the players of what has happened in previous games and know your opponents (the same goes for MIA’s Cook)

5. Our record is now dwindling slowly as the season progresses. This is obviously linked with the fact that Bibby’s game has gone down, Crawford missed a game and is playing hurt and below his standard.

AND WOODY does not adapt… well, to be honest, he does, BY SHORTENING THE ROTATION!!!!

You have 2 players out of your top 6 playing hurt and you SHORTEN the rotation??? WTF???

5. I already suggested a few times and will continue to do it again:

Marvin is playing a lot worse than last year. Many factors certainly contribute to that, including some which are not of his responsibility.

Despite Woody’s commentaries that he hoped that he would step up his game, the fact is that now that we have Craw, there are less minutes and less touches for Marvin: he his seldom involved in the offensive game.

Marvin is a natural shooter (the shots are not going down, but his release is good) who is now reduced to an utility player.

He brings a low key type of defense which is precious within the switching defense (his +- against PHO was positive), however, the overall balance of his presence on court seems in many occasions negative.

Why not bring him off the bench like he played in NC? Why not try JJ at the SF spot and Mo at the starting SG slot?

Mo is playing out of position and looking at his log YOU CAN SEE that he is suffering from lack of minutes. He had a few good games early in the season WHEN he played 20+ minutes.

He should start and get 20/25 minutes and he would certainly deliver. Since he is not producing under the current assignment, why not try this?

JJ at the SF slot would be able to use his dribble and superior comparative speed against most SF and we could have JT0 coming in at the PG spot with Craw and JJ attracting the opponents defense.

I am sure that JT0 would get to the rim and score (or dish) with that ATL line up since he would not be – FOR SURE – the focal point of the defense.

This would allow us to have a much deeper rotation. IT IS NOT a given fact that your starting 5 has to be the top 5 talents in the roster, but the combination which allows you to have a better ROTATION.

We need to have a second team which keeps enough pressure offensively and but points in the board, even if they do give away on defense as well.

The fact is, how can you motivate you bench to play good defense, be focused and produce if you don’t give them enough minutes to even warm up??

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Shouldn’t you have run that experiment before the trade deadline to see if ya’ll needed to make a move?

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MC- I have an idea, ask Woody to let the 2nd unit start tonight and let the hawks get the lead before bring in the 1st unit (starters) and see what his reaction would be. I think it would be very interesting to say the least to watch. Heck- he may be surprised as to how well they would do.

It appears that the starters are getting tired legs, and it isn’t like we are burning up the month. We currently stand at 4W and 3L. JJ seems a bit slow and ISO happy. Maybe he is getting worn down a bit.

Maybe we could find a replacement from within for Marvin and his shooting woes. Just a thought.

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Clyde,

Thanks for the props.

By the way, the Pistons’ rotational stats that I mention relates to the PLAYOFFS, not regular season.

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I just noticed this…Andris Biedrins is shooting 13% from the line this year. Granted, he’s only attempted 23 but my goodness…

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Mike Woodson: “I had to see something for myself,” Woody said. “I condensed things last night almost like it was a playoff game, when your backs are against the wall and you have to have one.”

Funny but in the Finals, Game 5 when ORL “had to have one” SVG played TEN players. And I’m no SVG fan, by any means.

In fact, for the 5 games of the Finals, NEITHER team played fewer than 9 players in ANY game.

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d.carter & nire: thanks!

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That interview alone should get Woody canned. Seriously!

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Shoulda picked up T-Mac. I’d rather have an often injured McGrady for 45 games or so, than a healthy Marvin for the entire season. And btw, here comes Toronto, Miami, and Chicago. Hawks better step their game up.

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Melvin, one of my mentors always used to say “never assume that lightening will strike twice in the same place”. And therefore, no thanks to TMac. I’ll gladly watch him rehabilitate himself elsewhere.

Strickland, Im not privy to any of Woody’s “personal feelings” about his players. I used to be on the anti-Woody bandwagon but I had to jump off when he had the nerve to start winning. So yeah, count me as a fan… because I also have some very specific thoughts about the ASG’s level of funding and the price of bringing in a proven coach. The Hawks are in a tight battle for 2nd/3rd place and not entirely because BK and Sund have been exceptional GMs with an exceptional salary to purchase exceptional players. The whole works and that whole includes Woody. So I tend to defend the whole, Marvin, Joe and even Woody. The whole works… the ish does in fact work.

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