“Are the Hawks legitimate threats to win the Eastern Conference now?”
Apparently he's no fan of Iso-Joe, man.
Dallas–I asked the question, these guys answered at the Hall of Fame presser (where former Hawks player/coach Richie Guerin was included among 19 finalists):
Bill Walton
“The Hawks have to make the leap forward that good teams sometimes accomplish but often fail at. Their success will come when they understand that it’s about the team and it’s about ball movement. Unless you have Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant or LeBron James on your team, or . . . one of the greatest of the greats, a select few in the history of basketball—unless you have one of those guys you are not going to be able to win by playing off the dribble.”
‘Nique
“Oh, yeah. No question. The thing is it is OK for us to be the underdog. In the East they know this Atlanta team is for real and we have a legitimate shot of beating anyone in the East. If you are going to take us for granted going into the playoffs that is going to be a mistake.”
Magic Johnson
“The Hawks are the team that everybody doesn’t want to play because of the athletes, Joe Johnson, Horford now has got his offense going I love his development. You look at the firepower that Jamal brings from the bench, I’m enjoying watching him. What they must not do in the second half is slide. . . . (Now they must) tell us, ‘Have you grown?’ It has got to be in you. Show everybody that you’ve grown, you learned from what happened in a seven-game series (vs. Boston), you learned from what happened last year as well and now you want to take it to another level. Let’s see that. Are you going to show us now?”
MC
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
114 comments Add your comment
BONE
February 13th, 2010
11:07 am
Not until they show they can be a consistent team which they have failed to do. So no right now they aren’t contenders in my eyes.
falcondawg
February 13th, 2010
11:07 am
They have a chance but they have to figure out a way to get past Howard and the Magic
niremetal
February 13th, 2010
11:12 am
Question of the day: Who’s uglier – Bill Walton or Greg Oden?
I’m gonna go with Walton.
dap01
February 13th, 2010
11:15 am
They need a defensive minded big man.
thomas22
February 13th, 2010
11:22 am
I believe that it’s possible- but as Walton stated it all begins with movin the ball- I can definitely see them surprising teams during the playoffs.
Rip Van Winkle
February 13th, 2010
11:23 am
Where has Michael Cunningham been? Doing a two step with an antiquated Bill Walton? On the set of happy days with Richie Cunningham?
Has he slept a thousand years?
Where the hell has he been?
Every one and his mother knows that the Hawks will never win a championship with a power forward masquerading as a center…DUH?
Dude, write something timely and progressive. THE HAWKS NEED A DEFENSIVE CENTER TO STOP THE ABUSE THAT THE OTHER TEAMS DO AGAINST HOE FORD IN THE PAINT! THIS WILL BE MAGNIFIED IN THE LATE ROUNDS WHEN THE HALF COURT SET KNOCKS OUT THE RUN AND GUN…
DUUUUUHHHHH!
WTF!
Where do these people come from!?
KnightHawk
February 13th, 2010
11:23 am
The Hawks are without questions one of the better teams in the Eastern Conference, BUT the gap between the elite teams in the East and the Hawks is still pretty apparent. As currently constituted, the Hawks should get past the 1st round again, and maybe win a game or two in the next round, but that’s about it.
The Miami game showed that without Jamal Crawford and having to rely exclusively on JJ to find offense this team is limited in its approach. They need to upgrade their bench with another player that can create offense on his own. Or, I’d like to see them get a big that can bang with the top centers and let Horford excel even more at his natural position.
Sam Cooke
February 13th, 2010
11:24 am
Question of the day: Who’s uglier – Bill Walton or Greg Oden or niremetal?
I’m gonna go with Walton.
Im going with niremetal
Dick Long
February 13th, 2010
11:28 am
Sam, Ive got to go with niremetal too, the dude makes onions cry…..
The Man
February 13th, 2010
11:33 am
Put me down for niremetal too although Oden is not far behind.
Good question.
Stockdog
February 13th, 2010
11:34 am
I agree with Bill Walton. If the Hawks understand that they can not do the isolation game and play team basketball offensively and continue with the team defense then they can win the east. If in the 4th quarter, they try to dribble drive and shoot then they are toast. However, if they dribble drive and pass or just 5 good passes per possession then the Hawks will have a chance of beating anybody in the east.
The Grinch
February 13th, 2010
11:37 am
The combination of Woodson’s predictable offensive scheme (note I didn’t add an “s”) and the lack of a Center are going to prevent us from advancing past the 2nd round. The Cavs have THREE centers that are better than anyone we ostensibly have at that position, and Howard slaps us around like Ike on Tina. This team is too talented otherwise not to address those two glaring problems.
niremetal
February 13th, 2010
11:41 am
Wow, one person with two brain cells using three different handles is calling me ugly. I’m so hurt.
No Brainer
February 13th, 2010
11:44 am
The hawks inability to protect the basket in the post will keep them from advancing.
You cant win in a half court game if you cant protect the rim. NO BRAIN-ER.
A better question would be;” what will the hawks do to shore up the weakness in the middle?”
Swap Dog
February 13th, 2010
11:45 am
Yea, Niremetal is a hellofa lot uglier than those two. The man has a face that dries a river.
Wabe
February 13th, 2010
11:46 am
The Hawks playoff success will ultimately be determined by the road they take. If they see Orlando early, then they’ll be an early out. But, if they can get a Boston or maybe even a Cleveland in the 2nd round, then I like their chances.
Cleveland may have the best record in the East, and even though we took two losses to them in that home & home, we still played them tough both times out. We didn’t look as mismatched as we did in last season’s playoffs.
We’ll have to wait and see what the playoff picture looks like, so it’s hard to speculate. But, most Hawks fans have a sense as to who the Hawks want to see as opposed to who they wouldn’t. I’m also curious to see how the Hawks handle that 1st round matchup w/whoever they get. I’m confident the Hawks will get out of the first round, but how they do it will answer a lot of questions before we get into that 2nd round series. We were in a dogfight with Miami last season, and it took us 7 games. We’ll see if they can improve upon that this season. I understand that it’s ultimately about winning the series, but I don’t want to see the Hawks get caught up in a fight in the first round of what’s ultimately a 4 round fight.
Oden
February 13th, 2010
11:46 am
I vote Niremetal too!
Art Vandelay
February 13th, 2010
11:46 am
Hey Rip Van Winkle, that power forward masquerading as a center will be in the All-Star Game — as a center.
Bill Walton
February 13th, 2010
11:46 am
He gets my vote.
Willy
February 13th, 2010
11:47 am
Why does Bill Walton still have a job?
David Smith
February 13th, 2010
11:49 am
The only thing holding the Hawks from achieving greatness is themselves. We have too much talent not to be considered as one of the top teams in the east but, until we beat the teams in the elite class (Orlando, Cleveland, Lakers, and San Antonio) consistently we will continue to take baby steps in the playoffs.
Rip Van Winkle
February 13th, 2010
11:49 am
Art Vandelay, Yea, that is funny, of course Allen Iverson was the starting guard, so go figure. Lopez and J, Oneal are clearly better.
Hey how far to April’s Fool Day?
Bill Walton
February 13th, 2010
11:51 am
Willy , I have a job because I understand what being a center is and I look better than niremetal.
Jokes on you...
February 13th, 2010
11:52 am
Art Vandelay is that a riddle or a trick question. You gotta be kidding.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 13th, 2010
11:55 am
Simple answer to the headline: no.
I kinda wonder what goes through the minds of men who judge the physical appearance of other men that they haven’t seen before…
Wabe
February 13th, 2010
11:56 am
Jermaine O’Neal and Brook Lopez over Al Horford?
I don’t know about that one. O’Neal seems to be past his prime. He’s done nothing to help Dwayne Wade in Miami.
Brook Lopez is a good looking player on a bad team. But truthfully, I honestly don’t see as much as some of you seem to see in Lopez. He’s more of a finesse guy and I wouldn’t say he’s a defensive force -so I’m not sure how you’d think he could protect the basket. His brother Robin Lopez seems like the more physical center that some of you want to battle the likes of Howard and Shaq.
Brook Lopez will pan out to be more of a Pau Gasol if he pans out. I’m not saying he’s as talented as Gasol or will be anywhere near as good, but he’s not that physical prescence that many criticized the Lakers for lacking when they kept falling short of winning a title. What was everybody saying last season about the Lakers with a healthy Bynum? They have the toughness to win a ring now…
ant banks
February 13th, 2010
11:57 am
NIREMETAL,
i am goin’ with oden, but the ugliest basketball player of all time is popeye jones or tyrone hill. these guys are insanely ugly.
Art Vandelay
February 13th, 2010
11:57 am
Jokes on you, not sure what you’re getting at — I didn’t ask a question.
Jody
February 13th, 2010
11:58 am
My take is no, the Hawks are not a threat to win the East. They a clearly a very good team, but they are not on the same level with Cleveland or Orlando and if Cleveland or Boston makes a move before the deadline to better their teams, the Hawks will really have it tough. I know you never make a trade for the sake of doing it. However, the Hawks talk about not making a move for the sake of protecting their current team chemistry; a chemistry that is now 0-5 against the two teams who were in the Eastern finals last year. So, what exactly are they trying to protect?
No Brainer
February 13th, 2010
12:06 pm
Yeah, J. Oneal Just kicked Horford’s but last week but of course, every one does, and Lopez owns Horford.
Horford only pads his stats when the real centers are on the bench. Horford is 0 defense. (rebounds arent defense, defense is what caused the missed shot to be rebounded).
I agree with the professionals analyst and the guys here who know basketball and say wed be better with a real, defensive presence and move horford back to his natural position of pf.
dos hawkquis
February 13th, 2010
12:15 pm
NO, THE HAWKS ARE NOT READY TO WIN THE EAST!!
the hawks labor in inconsistency. we lost twice to new york, lost to the hornets without cp3, lost to detroit without their big 3. the hawks must win games that they are supposed to win and COMPETE in other games against stiffer competition. we lost 3 games to orlando, 2 to cleveland and save the excuses about the shot clock.
“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the HAWKS. Stay thirsty my friends!”
Art Vandelay
February 13th, 2010
12:16 pm
So, for everyone who thinks the Hawks are doomed without a center who can bang with Howard and Shaq — who do you suggest? Other than maybe Camby (who would be a nice fit but wouldn’t come cheaply), what are our options? I agree that Horford isn’t the ideal size to match up with some of the bigger centers in the league, but I also think that we’re probably stuck with what we’ve got, for the most part. Yes, there are matchup issues in the frontcourt, but on the flip side, we’ve got matchup advantages in the backcourt with JJ and Crawford, and Josh Smith is a handful for even the best defensive power forwards in the league, especially when his head is in the game.
Like the rest of you, I’d love to add a dominant big man, but they’re in short supply and I don’t think it’s worth breaking up a team that has the potential to be very successful as currently composed.
nash
February 13th, 2010
12:21 pm
if the team stays healthy and can pick up a big or to in a trade that can come of the bench and not look completely lost in to game and maybe if teague can play like a first round pick they can make it. anyone else see the fire sale the washington is have we missed out on haywood but they might be willing to part ways with drew gooden in a trade or something
rms
February 13th, 2010
12:47 pm
Are you smoking crack? Heck naw the Hawks aren’t Conference championship material. They are just a good team, and thats it!! Settle for second fiddle and roll over and let Orlando and Cleveland duke it out-teams that have heart, a will to win EVERY game, and the ability to stay focused and play smart basketball!! DUMMIES, the HAWKS and EASTERN CONFERENCE CHAMPIONSHIP dont even belong in the same sentence together. With the current roster we have we have no chance of playing a seven-game series against better teams.
Jethro
February 13th, 2010
12:56 pm
I think Josh Smith is the “next level” guy. He’s playin’ there now, should be an all-star…. I think Walton’right. Move the ball around. This is a good team.
Grip
February 13th, 2010
1:01 pm
According to Bill Walton’s view we are screwed, this team is not designed to move the rock around, and we still have not figured out the team thing, (joe’s contract) is an issue. We are really weak at the point and at the pivot defending. Plus Woody. The funny part is how in sam hill do we have the record that we do? Who is weak in the middle and at the point and still wins? Orlando and the Lakers are the only two teams that I really think we could not beat in a 7 game series, our issues with cleveland are league related,(if you know what I mean) all that being said, I’m gonna enjoy this year, because we play an exciting brand of basketball, and we thump the heck out of people, more than most others.
rique
February 13th, 2010
1:03 pm
lol i love how everyone says we’re not consistent…we’ve only won 33 games and we’re a whole 1.5 games back of orlando…yes we’re not consistent
Wabe
February 13th, 2010
1:07 pm
Common now, seriously, if you swapped Brook Lopez or J. O’Neal for Al Horford straight up, are the Hawks NBA Title Contenders?
I can’t even say we’d be a better team.
Wabe
February 13th, 2010
1:10 pm
I agree with Art.
Sure, we may be in need of some size, but you can bring that size off the bench if we could pick up a quality backup CENTER to play behind Horford.
Wabe
February 13th, 2010
1:18 pm
2 inches and 15 LBS seperate Brook Lopez and Al Horford. Jermaine O’Neal has an inch on Horford and about 5 LBS.
Wabe
February 13th, 2010
1:21 pm
rms:
“Are you smoking crack? Heck naw the Hawks aren’t Conference championship material. They are just a good team, and thats it!! Settle for second fiddle and roll over and let Orlando and Cleveland duke it out-teams that have heart, a will to win EVERY game, and the ability to stay focused and play smart basketball!! DUMMIES, the HAWKS and EASTERN CONFERENCE CHAMPIONSHIP dont even belong in the same sentence together. With the current roster we have we have no chance of playing a seven-game series against better teams.”
I mean no disrespect by this, and I’m not tryna come at you, but I found this funny:
“Settle for second fiddle and roll over and let Orlando and Cleveland duke it out-teams that have heart, a will to win EVERY game, and the ability to stay focused and play smart basketball!!”
A will to win every game? Common now man, the Hawks are how many games back from that team that has the will to win every game?
Joe
February 13th, 2010
1:23 pm
Yes, if we had a Coach like Larry Brown and a Center.
UNCLE RUCKUS
February 13th, 2010
1:38 pm
YOU SO CALLED ATHLETIC GIFTED PEOPLE HAVE NO IDEA OF WHAT YOU ARE TAWKEN BOUT..BILL WALTON,LARRY BUD,ARE THE GREATEST PLAYERS NUMBERS 1 AND 2 THAT HAVE EVER GRACED US WITH THEIR PRESENCE IN BOTH THE PAINT AND IN THE GAME OF BASKETBALL..
IF YOU QUIT YO HIP HOPPITY PLAY AND SHOWTIME,THEN MAYBE YOU WILL “GET SOME PROPERS”..
YOURS TRULY,
UNCLE RUCKUS
NO RELATIONS
Ree Roe
February 13th, 2010
1:46 pm
I think alot of us Hawks “fans” are much tougher on the teams chances than most national analysts are. With that said, yes the Hawks are a threat to win the East. We’re a 1.5 games back of the #2 spot & we play well against CLE. We own Boston. Will we win the East? Who knows? But if we get the Southeast Division & the #2 spot who knows? Noone saw us taking BOS 7 games in 08…I think it’s much more likely than not that we can win the East
-REEsurgently Roe!!!
Johnson an All-Star starter
February 13th, 2010
2:05 pm
Art Vandelay, I agree in part with your assessment. You want to blame hoe fords inability to play defense and protect the rim on his size. OK, If you say so. I also agree that we are probably stuck with him, defense or not, but, that is the point.We cant get to that next level with him being the center. He is more like a green lite to the rack and we will never get away from switching as long as he is the center.
So we will have to settle for being a good team.
Yes, Stodumire, lopez, camby and Oneal (both of them) are better centers than hoe ford I trade Hoe ford for Stoudumire or lopez any day of the week. And J Oneal utterly embarrassed hoe ford last week.
Idiot Watch
February 13th, 2010
2:08 pm
Size is not the issue, idiots, its the lack of defensive tenacity from horford, Hes a automatic greenlite to the rim and yes, hes to small to push anyone off the block too.
Michael Cunningham
February 13th, 2010
2:12 pm
@ Rip Me Van Twinkle: first, let me say i have never heard that richie cunningham joke before. never, ever. and think about how funny it would be if i actually were a dorky white dude. which, come to think of it, are you a dorky white dude?
second, all i did was ask the question. looking at the standings, it’s not an outrageous one. it’s not like i cover the Nets, man.
@KnightHawk: solid, reasonable analysis.
@ Art: also a solid, reasonable analysis. Camby would be a perfect fit but the Hawks would have to give up a core player to get him so then you leave a giant hole elsewhere long term for a guy on an expiring contract.
darrell starks
February 13th, 2010
2:14 pm
Michael cunningham your kidding right dont insult our intelligence, lets keep it real like i said before this will be a wasted year unless the hawks can get a big man, and be able to controll the boards, our front court no way can match the CAVS, ORLANDO, and if garnett become healthy by playoffs BOSTON WOULD BE EVEN STRONGER THAN CAVS,AND ORLANDO.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!
JSS
February 13th, 2010
2:25 pm
Popeye uglier than Sam Cassell? No one with the exception of Sydney Wicks was uglier than Cassell!
TNT
February 13th, 2010
2:33 pm
this team will not go deep in the playoffs if they dont get a true big man
darrell starks
February 13th, 2010
2:52 pm
MICHAEL CUNNINGHAM why are the hawks afraid to make moves 2 get 2 the next level are they just satisfied with just winning and not winning a title?
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!
chad
February 13th, 2010
3:00 pm
How could they be consedered real threats when in the last game before the all star break they are playing a bad miami team and instead of gaining som mo before the break; they get thumped by them. Same old hawks but only slightly better. All the talent in the world no heart.
Jeff
February 13th, 2010
3:00 pm
Top 5 “All Ugly”: Sam Cassell (looks like a cross between Golum and ET), Joakim Noah (looks like a black “Carrot Top”), Popeye Jones (1922’s Nosferatu), Tyrone Hill (not quite evolved yet), Nick Van Exel (any cartoon character), and Andrei Kirilenko (a very skinny Ivan Drago)
chad
February 13th, 2010
3:04 pm
Trading Joe Johnson before the dead line would be beneficial. Need a big center. Joe doesn’t want to be in the ATL anymore and it shows. Either he is the biggest black hole in the East or Woody’s playbook is one page but there is a problem with the half court set. Makes you wonder why Woody hasn’t signed an extension yet?
darrell starks
February 13th, 2010
3:05 pm
LETS SAY THE NETS CALL THE HAWKS AND WANTED HORFORD AND SAID WE WOULD GIVE YOU LOPEZ FOR HORFORD WOULD YOU DO IT? YOU DAM RIGHT.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!
Jeff
February 13th, 2010
3:10 pm
Sorry…put Manute Bol on the list too…
darrell starks
February 13th, 2010
3:13 pm
The hawks are going 2 have to make a choice in the future on horford and josh, on who play power ford unless they decide to move josh 2 small forward.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!
newkid
February 13th, 2010
3:24 pm
Could the ‘other’ banger indeed be Kurt Thomas. Silence from MC regarding the rumor suggests he doesn’t think there’s anything to it, and he’d probably be on point. But can Sund REALLY hold his water if ‘playoff’ moves are made by Cleveland (Amar’e) and Boston?
Looking further down the aforementioned roster one also spies JStack, who has garnered more than a little attention in these parts over the past 5 months. Why wouldn’t Sund consider a Mo Evans, RadMo, & the nebulous ‘future considerations’ dogs for Thomas and JStack if the other side were interested? Five days and counting.
If such a deal happens, could we expect Sund to use the $2.5M savings from moving MO and the impending – and probably less financially forgiving – ‘11/’12 CBA to entice Chill to sign a 3 yr, $16M deal this summer?
rms
February 13th, 2010
3:49 pm
WABE,
I mean no disrespect here either its just that when I see teams like Cleveland and the Lakers, and the Magic and any champoinship caliber team play they just have a certain tenacity and fire about them when they make their run to the title. I just cant say that about the Hawks, no matter what Nique or other Hawks analysts say. Of course they are going to say that but if they were honest with themselves they could see that this team is a very good team but hard pressed to believe that are capable of remaining focused on the same team for a seven game series playing a halfcourt offense most of the time. No knock on them, thats just what they are right now, I dont even think its Woodsons fault he is just doing the best with what he got.
Jeff
February 13th, 2010
3:55 pm
The Hawks best shot came in 1988 when they had the Celtics on the brink with a chance to move the East Finals, but couldn’t get it done (thanks to a missed easy shot by Cliff Levingston in the lane in the closing seconds during Game 6). Since that game, the Hawks haven’t come close to reaching the East Finals. Their only chance is if they play the Celtics in the second round. However, at the end of the day, no one is beating the Cavs. Just not going to happen. Spring Training anyone??
Najeh Davenpoop
February 13th, 2010
3:58 pm
Camby is not a banger. He gets a lot of blocks, but you’ll notice Denver’s team defense got much better once he left. He’s not a guy who is going to body up Shaq or Dwight.
Honestly I think the fuss about Horford matching up against Shaq and Dwight is overrated. In the case of Cleveland, I don’t think the Hawks can win a 7 game series even if they acquire someone to neutralize Shaq. Nobody on the Hawks has the combination of size, lateral quickness, and strength to limit LeBron defensively. Moreover, LeBron is big enough and strong enough to severely limit what Joe Johnson can do. I don’t think any sort of personnel or tactical move is going to get the Hawks over Cleveland, since the Hawks simply don’t have the kind of firepower to counter the league’s most talented player. Shaq is a role player on that team, and whether or not the Hawks can limit him isn’t what will decide a series between these teams.
But I do think the Hawks can beat Orlando with a simple change in tactics. Instead of doubling Howard and allowing the supporting players to get hot from 3 point land, play Dwight straight up and shut his teammates down. You’ll find that if Dwight has to go one on one, even against someone shorter than him like Horford, he may put up good numbers but he doesn’t have the moves or the free throw shooting ability to really make the other team pay consistently. The Hawks have lost the last few meetings with Orlando not because of Dwight, but because of players like Rashard Lewis, Jameer Nelson, Vince Carter, and JJ Redick. When Dwight is doubled, these players either get open jumpers in rhythm from 3 or open layups from cutting down the lane vacated by the double team. That’s what the Hawks need to stop. They can live with Dwight scoring 40 points and getting 20 boards if the rest of the Magic shoots 30% and throws up brick after brick, which is entirely possible if they play them straight up.
osama
February 13th, 2010
3:59 pm
Consistent overall effort, focus and intensity in combo w/ ball & player movement on offense will make this team a legit candidate to compete for the Eastern Finals.
cp
February 13th, 2010
3:59 pm
I think Walton made a great point. When the Hawks share the ball they look like one of the better teams in the league. I don’t think they are a threat to win the east though. Boston and Cleveland are talking about making moves to improve their team while it looks like we will stay put. I don’t like the Kurt Thomas move because we then have no back up sf. Not that Mo is a good back up sf but I would rather have him back up Marvin than Mario. We need to make a move but im just no sure we will.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 13th, 2010
4:02 pm
newkid, Kurt Thomas from a few years ago would be an ideal acquisition to deal with Howard (and another example of why height isn’t the most important attribute of a good post defender). I haven’t seen him play the last couple of years, but I don’t know how good he is anymore. If he still has something left in the tank, that’s a good trade. In fact, they would probably be better off moving Zaza or Joe Smith for him if they were to make such a move, since he would essentially eat one of their minutes in the rotation anyway.
William in Pasadena
February 13th, 2010
4:08 pm
No way the Hawks will win the East (they are perpetrators with no heart, no center and no coach). What’s with my Atl teams (Braves & Hawks)? They always seem to be one player away. I think they are too cheap, and are satisfied to be above .500. I say get a center, move Horford to PF, Josh to SF, get rid of Marvin & Bibby, let Iso-Joe walk, and sign D-Wade. Then send coach packing. Maybe then, they can compete for the Eastern Conference crown. Let me be first to inform you all that the Hawks will not win in the 2nd round of the playoffs. They fold too much in the 4th qtr and Woody does not haveany plays, other than Iso-Joe. Joe is not LeBron or Kobe or D-Wade. I think Jamal should be the man in the 4th qtr, but I guess they are paying Joe too much.
Jeff
February 13th, 2010
4:12 pm
Kurt Thomas???? You’ve got to be kidding. He was marginal even during is “prime”. There isn’t anyone on the Hawks current roster I would give up for him…except for maybe some locker room towells
loyal hawks fan
February 13th, 2010
4:12 pm
Dennis Johnson and Larry Bird have to be part of the “ALL UGLY” Team
tale of woe
February 13th, 2010
4:23 pm
Until we can beat the Cavs and Magic this conversation is irrelevant.
Rip Van Winkle
February 13th, 2010
4:25 pm
darrell starks I think the outdated Mr Cunningham has seen,”happier days”. I agree with you that if the Hawks are serious about getting to the next level they will need the right tools to get the job done. It would be nice if we could trade horford for a center….like Zach Randolf, Lopez,Camby. I dont think wed miss horford that much because we have a strong powerforward in Josh and Randolf, Lopez, Camby or Stodumire , would be a clear up grade at a critical spot. Yes, any of those four would make us more competitive for the stretch run. Also there are others centers who could help our team.orford is only good for an occasional rebound, foul trouble and a free pass to the basket- See Turner, and Tony Parker among countless others.
What type of brain thinks we can live with Howard getting 40 and 20? What type of brain thinks a playoff caliber team is going to shoot 30%?
Is there any logical thinkers around?
Swap Dog
February 13th, 2010
4:31 pm
I still think Niremetal is the ugliest dude ever! Trick a mudder frocking treat.
Benjamin
February 13th, 2010
5:00 pm
I do not think we’re quite there yet. We’re getting incrementally closer, and with Boston’s aging and Cleveland’s future with LeBron in the air, could continue the slow build next season, but if I had to peg us right now, I think we’re probably the third best team in the East (behind Orlando and Cleveland), and if Cleveland can land Amare to package with LeBron and Shaq, I think they’ll be hands-down favorites to get to their second Finals in three years.
Either way, unless a serious upset occurs, we’ll likely not see an Eastern Conference finals appearance.
Still love the team, though. I hope we become more Mavs-like than Kings-like in the next few years… comparing this team to those of recent memory….
niremetal
February 13th, 2010
5:03 pm
Ding
niremetal
February 13th, 2010
5:04 pm
(I’ll let the regs figure for whom that bell was tolled)
Najeh – co-sign both of your posts.
Dick Long
February 13th, 2010
5:11 pm
Benjamin, good post, I think your points are well taken. That Offense of Stoudemire is a serious weapon for the inside out side game. I dont want to become the Mavs either, they are a good team that never gets over the hump. If we dont address our weaknesses we will be come the Kings.
Barry
February 13th, 2010
5:13 pm
As bad as I can’t stand Bill Walton, I think he is spot on. There is no way the Hawks can compete with the elite teams if they don’t move the ball. When they do, they absolutely can. It would be nice to have a banger, but Horford and Smoove can out-athlete the other teams if they play an up-tempo offense. But if they go with iso-Joe (or iso-Jamal for that matter), great teams are going to shut them down and we are going to be disappointed and frustrated again. They might win a game or two in the second round, but no more. But if they share the ball, they can get all the way to the conference finals.
wasted days and wasted nights.
February 13th, 2010
5:16 pm
It tolls for thee!
Sautee
February 13th, 2010
5:16 pm
“I agree with the professionals analyst and the guys here who know basketball and say wed be better with a real, defensive presence and move horford back to his natural position of pf.”
I guess Magic Johnson doesn’t know basketball. heh heh.
Sautee
February 13th, 2010
5:18 pm
By the way, any talk of all-ugly HAS to include Georghe Murhesan.
wasted days and wasted nights.
February 13th, 2010
5:18 pm
Id like to co-sign some ones bull crap so they can co-sign mine when my argument is proven invalid. I dont care about the truth, I just want to win.
Ding!
Swap Dog
February 13th, 2010
5:22 pm
I dont think Murhesan was as ugly as the other three, Walton, Oden and Niremetal , Saltee but hed surely be on a top ten list. I have to agree with you and magic, Horford plays better at power forward.
Astro Joe
February 13th, 2010
5:31 pm
I just hope that the Cavs acquire Amare. That would make virtually force Lebron to become a jump shooter as tehe lane would be clogged for any drives to the hole. Not to mention that team chemistry would likely be destroyed (I honestly don’t see all of that silliness standing the up to adversity). A combo of Bron, Shaq and Amare features some all-time front runners. Please, let it happen.
And no, the Hawks are not true contenders for the East. We’re absent an elite player, an elite coach and an elite roster/salary. The sum is better than the individual parts but ultimately we’ll fall short. But it won’t stop me from enjoying the ride.
Geemack
February 13th, 2010
5:43 pm
newkid
The Cavs are talking about adding Amare, and you’re talking about adding JStack and Kurt Thomas? Wow, those 2 should really help us against the Magic and Cavs!
niremetal
February 13th, 2010
5:54 pm
Sautee,
You’re absolutely right. I have no clue how I coulda left him off the list of nominees! So we’ve got Walton, Oden, Popeye, Ty Hill, Cassell, and Muresan. Shelden and Noah might crack the rotation eventually too…
Sautee
February 13th, 2010
5:58 pm
Horford would indeed make a dandy power forward, but the Head Coaches (not the media cocgnescenti) named him the second best CENTER in the East.
Gee, how could the “professionals analyst and the guys here who know basketball” have been SO wrong about Big Al?
I think the Head Coaches are more in a position to know than the outside onlookers.
rob
February 13th, 2010
5:59 pm
Offseason Priorities:
Resign JJ if possible, if he leaves we are doomed. I think he stays.
Get rid Of Mo Evans: really, what is he doing for us? but taking up part of our cap. Imagine if Josh Childress was coming off the bench now, thats a rebounder and can score points and drive. MC, whats the deal on Childress, i think we should try to get him next year to be on the bench with Crawford. We really need Bench help, besides Crawford, and occasional spurt from Zaza and Mario, we are hurt in that department.
MC, would Brendan Haywood sign with us to be a backup to Horford? I think his price tag is hefty, he would want to start, i dont know about Josh at the 3.
kiki
February 13th, 2010
6:28 pm
For some guys in this blog (or maybe the same 2 or 3 persons with multiple identities) Horford is never going to be a player that the Hawks can use. There’s always going to be something to say: he made the ASG because of pitty by the other coaches; when he had a good game against other “real” 7″ centers (all of them except Howard), it was because of the opposing center did not came to play; if the Hawk advance to the finals or win a title (big IF), it would be because of luck.
Sautee
February 13th, 2010
6:41 pm
kiki,
One would THINK that ALL true Hawks fans would celebrate Horford’s All-Star selection. Even some with the opinion that he deserved it less than Josh or David Lee (Najeh and others) have given Al his props.
Unless of course there is an agenda that is more important than showing respect for just what an honor this Hawks player has EARNED.
kiki
February 13th, 2010
6:48 pm
Sautee,
Agree 100% with you. The Horford topic has become a pointless discusion.
niremetal
February 13th, 2010
6:50 pm
Yup.
Najeh Davenpoop
February 13th, 2010
6:52 pm
In good news for the Hawks, the Wizards have officially traded Caron Butler and Brendan Haywood to the Mavs. This, of course, means those players are not going to the Celtics, Cavs, or Magic.
In addition, DeShawn Stevenson goes to the Mavs too, while Josh Howard and Drew Gooden go to the Wizards.
Blast
February 13th, 2010
6:59 pm
With Jamal, Hawks have vastly improved this year. If they draw Boston in the second round, then they have a chance of reaching East Finals. Then the buck probably stops there unless they play like they want it and not just happy to be there. AND, they share the ball. On the half court, Hawks have to swing the ball around to be successful. No player should pound the ball longer than 5 seconds. Hawks always say they can beat any team in the league. The playoffs is when you prove that.
That, said, I love the Hawks, but based on their cheap, flawed roster, coupled with how they don’t come to play everytime (meaning focus, mentality, killer instinct) I don’t see them beating Cleveland any time soon. Maybe they have a chance with Orlando if they play Dwight the way Najeh suggested. I can see them playing Cleveland hard, but no way the refs let Hawks beat them.
And the Cavs are not done tooling their team yet!
Geemack
February 13th, 2010
7:02 pm
At this time I don’t think the Hawks are contenders. I believe the Hawks have the players to trade to get peices to make them title contenders.
At some point the Hawks will have to make a decision on who the best PF on the team is Horford or Josh.
Whoever we keep the other needs to be traded to obtain a player to take us to championship status.
newkid
February 13th, 2010
9:02 pm
Geemack, it would not have been my desire to ’stay the course’ as Sund has indicated he will with his core, so just following up on someone else’s rumors regarding Kurt Thomas. Not my recommendation bro. Don’t believe we put ourselves in a position to win now by ‘holding’. But if he (Sund) is indeed going to ‘hold’ the core through the trade deadline, why wouldn’t he look to strengthen elsewhere? Unless of course you join the ONLY other earthly being (i.e., Jeff) who thinks that RMorris will give us more from the bench in the playoffs than Kurt Thomas.
Dezz Nuttz
February 13th, 2010
9:37 pm
Geemack Good post, Horford and Josh are good power forwards, I do think Josh is better and I do agree that we should get something for horford… good post.
Dezz Nuttz
February 13th, 2010
9:40 pm
New Kid I agree, This holding status means we will be where we were predicted to be in the beginning of the year, in 4th hoping the other teams center or start players get injured. We are a center away from breaking into the top echelon and a”fold” away from falling back to the pack.
Dezz Nuttz
February 13th, 2010
9:43 pm
If Hoe ford could play defense and protect the rim and hold his position in the paint Id be Happy for the Hawks. Be he cant and wont so lets get some one who can and will…
Dezz Nuttz
February 13th, 2010
9:44 pm
* a Hold away
doc
February 13th, 2010
11:49 pm
anyway to get drew gooden now?
mavs are now for real. go mark.
Dennis G. Berdanis
February 14th, 2010
12:11 am
It’s funny that Boston and Orlando have been just as inconsistent at the Hawks, (only Cleveland has consistenly played at a higher level) but we’re the ones not considered a contender. Hmmm.
Harpie
February 14th, 2010
12:18 am
The Hawks could win it all IF THEY HAD A COACH; but they don’t, so they won’t . Woodson is just not up to the job!
Ken Strickland
February 14th, 2010
2:33 am
I just can’t believe how anyone with an actual basketball IQ could think Allstar center AHorford is a bigger problem for the Hawks than PG MBibby, who should be benched or have his mins drastically reduced. Among all centers, Horford’s ranking is: DD-10th, PPG-#12, RPG-#10, BPG-#18, APG-#6, SPG-#11 & FG%-6TH. Among all PG’s Bibby is ranked PPG-#23, APG-#23, SPG-#19, FG%-#22, 3PT%-#23. Bibby doesn’t lead the team in a single category and is a complete liability on DEF. Part of the problem Horford and Smoove have on DEF is the complete absence of pressure on the ball to prevent the easy entry passes, and Bibby’s STARGATE PORTAL INTO THE LANE DEF.
Since some of you seem to think Horford isn’t good enough to take a team to a NBA title, I looked at the centers that played on the last 6 NBA championship teams, and here’s what I found.
YR TEAM PLAYER PPG RPG BPG APG SPG
04 PISTONS BWallace 9.5 12.4 3.04 1.70 1.77
05 SPURS NMohammed 9.5 7.6 1.12 .4 .75
06 HEAT SOneal 20.0 9.2 1.76 1.90 .39
07 SPURS FElson 5.0 4.8 .84 .80 .44
08 CELTICS KPerkins 6.9 6.1 1.46 1.10 .40
09 LAKERS ABynum 14.3 8.0 1.80 1.4 .36
10 Hawks AHorford 13.4 9.4 1.22 2.1 .69
It doesn’t take much of an IQ to figure out you can win an NBA title with Horford at center. However, it makes little difference who we have at center if we continue to rely on a starting PG that plays no DEF, struggles to score in double figures, barely dishes more assists than our PF, can’t penetrate or create easy scoring opportunities for others, and is basically relegated to shooting 3’s.
fellow student in Ken's third grade class
February 14th, 2010
7:05 am
Enter your comments here
The teacher of Ken's third grade class inwhich he is currently enrolled
February 14th, 2010
7:08 am
Ken so you are saying that Hoe ford cannot and will not be able to defend the post because he is the #18 center as far as blocking shots? I agree with that analysis. He not much of a defender.
not going to happen
February 14th, 2010
7:22 am
Getting your butts kiced by 16 at home by the Heat shows what kind of team this is….would never happen to Boston or Cleveland. Will not make the semis.
Mac-Town'z Finest 478
February 14th, 2010
8:54 am
Dennis G. Berdanis
“It’s funny that Boston and Orlando have been just as inconsistent at the Hawks, (only Cleveland has consistenly played at a higher level) but we’re the ones not considered a contender. Hmmm.”
Dennis there are several things to consider
1) Boston, Orlando, and Cleveland have proved themselves in recent years to get DEEP in the playoffs, we havent.
2) Boston and Orlando have been banged up with injuries, we havent.
3) When you talk of the east’s 4 best teams, We are the only one who have thrown complete goose eggs against atleast “2″ of the other teams. Boston is the only one of the other 3 top teams we even have wins against.
That’s why many look at them as contenders, but not us.
bigdave
February 14th, 2010
10:39 am
i dont see why we would be campaigning for Amare in Cleveland.. sure in theory there will be some immediate chemistry issues etc. thats until they figure it out and go on runs like their on now… bottom line is they are acquiring talent and free throw attempts, its no question as to who’s team it is.
as it relates to Hawks v Cavs Z’s size and ability to stretch the floor has always been a problem for us so there’s a plus. however, Amare’s jumper is respectable and he brings youthful legs. im sure Z feels betrayed after all those years with Cleveland. could we pick him up? Hickson’s game has taken strides and he will be a better player than i initially thought next to Nash. like ours, at times Cleveland’s offense stalls. Hawks are a decent at defending iso’s (probably b/c they see it so much in practice). with Amare i think we’ll see a lot less short clocks against them b/c they can play much faster with more ball movement, which is when the queen is at his best. please someone tell me how you defend an Amare/ queen pick and roll…?
Sautee
February 14th, 2010
11:17 am
bigdave,
“please someone tell me how you defend an Amare/ queen pick and roll…?”
Switch and avert your eyes?
jerrywest
February 14th, 2010
11:54 am
Each elite team not only has a superior superstar, the team also spends $20-$25 million more on its supporting cast. The elite teams also get the calls from refereees because the advertisers who pay the tabs demand it. How can we compete against that?
jerrywest
February 14th, 2010
11:56 am
Joe must demand that we fill up our 15 man roster with players who can contribute toward a championship run. I hope he has the understanding to use this leverage. Obviously, his agent is dumb.
LY Munz
February 14th, 2010
12:13 pm
As long as Marvin Williams is on this team we are going nowhere. God, just the thought of his fat duck butt on the court makes me vomit. What a disgraceful draft pick by Knight and even more disgraceful 5 year deal by Sund.
LY Munz
February 14th, 2010
12:14 pm
Imagine Deron Williams in Hawks jersey
LY Munz
February 14th, 2010
12:15 pm
Also, MC, keep up the good work man. You are more than taking care of the loss that was Sekou. Keep it up!
Rip Van Winkle
February 14th, 2010
5:13 pm
Why werent we smart enough to go after stodumire? Imaging JJ and crawford playing an inside out side game with Amare. We would have a near impossible to stop offense. Instead Horford offers a welcome mat to anyone who wants to drive to the basket. What a joke to think we could go to a championship.
No, our management wont spend the money to get the talent necessary to win championship. I Wouldnt blame JJ or Woodson for going some place where the management is serious about championships!
Donnie Hammonds
February 16th, 2010
10:23 am
Of course they (Can) be contenders but they won’t if they keep allowing joe johnson hold the ball 20 secs out of the 24 shot clock poss. The hawks can be an elite team if they use what they have correctly. I think woody needs to demand more ball rotation from the guys because thats when their most successful. Joe is a allstar not a Superstar there’s a big difference. We have enough solid core players where we don’t have to rely on one guy for scoring move the ball and the offense will come easily.
We have to get scrappy on the defensive end of the ball from the begining til the end if we won’t to contend. We have to have that defensive intensity that the celtics had when they won the championship two years ago and we can win the big dance