Hawks at Thunder, AKA Could You Help a Beat Writer Out?

The debate over Iso-Joe got me to thinking, and that’s always dangerous. Wouldn’t it be cool to have some numbers that shed some light on the effectiveness of Iso-Joe?

So it’s my hope going forward to track the results of fourth quarter Iso-Joe situations, defined as any play where it appears the primary aim is for J.J. to take his man one-on-one in a set halfcourt. The possible results are a made shot, missed shot with defensive rebound, missed shot with offensive rebound, turnover, assist, foul with no free throw or foul that leads to a free throw, all by either J.J. or a teammate (holla if there is a possible result I’m missing).

Some of you stat types might know a better resource than me, but the best fourth-quarter numbers I could find are these ‘08-’09 breakdowns at 82games.com. They are interesting but they don’t say anything about this season, nor do they break it down by play type or possessions. So I think tracking this myself is the best way to go about it.

But I need your help tracking Iso-Joes for two reasons. One is transparency–I wouldn’t want you to think I’m juking the stats. Another is expediency-sometimes I’ve got a lot of things going on during games and maybe I miss an Iso-Joe here or there. If I post my Iso-Joe numbers and lots of you have something different, we can work that out, agree on the numbers and move on.

My goal is to have a quantitative way to evaluate Iso-Joe by the end of the regular season (that’s 36 more games counting tonight). Maybe no meaningful conclusions come out of it. It could be that we end up with a weak sample size. The inability to compare Iso-Joe numbers going forward to games already played is a drawback. It also might be more illustrative to compare the results of Iso-Joe to the other play types the Hawks run in the fourth quarter but, to be honest, I think that might just be too ambitious and time-consuming for me on deadline. But if any of you want to give it a shot, I’m down.

At the very least the numbers we come up with can be part of the Iso-Joe conversation. Even if that amounts to pointing out all the ways they aren’t useful, that’s something, right? Because then we are talking about what else should be considered and doing our best to analyze Iso-Joe. Anyway, let me know if you think I’m onto something and if you are willing to help me out.

– I’m not on the road with the team, so I’ll be watching it on television like most of you. It’s not the best situation, but is what it is, you know? I’m still going to do the best postgame blog I can even though it’s better to get locker room perspectives.

– Talk amongst yourselves, Hawks fans.

MC

265 comments Add your comment

vava74

February 2nd, 2010
7:52 pm

MC, is ajc going cheap on you and the Hawks? :-)

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
7:59 pm

Durantula might shred the hawks

vava74

February 2nd, 2010
7:59 pm

This will be an interesting exercise, however, you should tell JJ that we will be keeping track! :-)

in order for this work you will need a constant panel of at least 5 or 6 people since there some around here that are soooo biased that the 4th quarter against Boston lastima week would have produced a negative stat line for JJ’s ISOs… :-)

bigdave

February 2nd, 2010
8:01 pm

lets get it…

vava74

February 2nd, 2010
8:01 pm

Slow bizzaround here today… zzzzzz zzzzzz zzzzzz zzzzz zzzzz zzzz….

Blast

February 2nd, 2010
8:02 pm

Hawks better take OKC seriously, because they are coming to play.

On the iso talk, no Hawk player should hold the ball longer than 5 seconds. That’s all AL needs when he posts up, dribble dribble, back his man down and shoot a hook shot. 5 seconds. If Joe pounds the ball longer than 5 seconds, he’s gonna see a double. And he needs to pass out quicker on the double.

Hope Hawks brought it tonight! Go Hawks!

vava74

February 2nd, 2010
8:06 pm

BONE,

positive as usual!

I’m sure that you were happier when we won only 13 games!

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:07 pm

VaVa I didn’t say we couldn’t win. As long as we shut the other players down then I could care less how many he scores.

vava74

February 2nd, 2010
8:10 pm

If Durant goes for 50 but we win, he win not be schreding anything.

He will be doing what want we consented him to do.

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:12 pm

Glad to see Josh go inside. LOL @ bibby again

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:15 pm

Damn Marvin Box out U duck

JB

February 2nd, 2010
8:15 pm

Durantula game-winning 3 again? It’s gonna be a fun game

bigdave

February 2nd, 2010
8:18 pm

foul… and he initiated the contact…

joe has looked quick last 3 games…

vava74

February 2nd, 2010
8:18 pm

We are squandering an oportunity to open a good lead by playing careless and dumb.

The shots are being rushed and there is no focus.

bigdave

February 2nd, 2010
8:20 pm

Joe been reading the blogs…

JB

February 2nd, 2010
8:23 pm

What’s up with our slow starts?

vava74

February 2nd, 2010
8:27 pm

Poor ball movement… Marvin biting every fake Durant made and then Mo matched against a guy which is 5 inches taller…

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:27 pm

Jumpshots again?

Najeh Davenpoop

February 2nd, 2010
8:28 pm

I wonder if the “Josh Smith doesn’t have post moves and lacks fluidity” crowd saw that last play.

Ree Roe

February 2nd, 2010
8:28 pm

Good move Josh with the and 1. Ree Roe likey

-REEcently Roe!!!

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:31 pm

Teague sighting. When he makes 1 mistake he’s out tho

The proAtl

February 2nd, 2010
8:31 pm

Thank You, Josh…Finally somebody taking the ball to the rim…SHEESSH!!

JB

February 2nd, 2010
8:33 pm

I don’t think this business of drawing contact is that simple. It’s not an on/off switch kind of thing. The players who can get to the line do it because they have the unique ability to do it. They grew up playing that way. Joe’s game is much more about craftiness and angles. He’s just not a very in your face type of player. When do you see him dunking and crashing boards and all that stuff?

O'Brien

February 2nd, 2010
8:34 pm

There is more ball movement when we have a PG in the game. Imagine that

JB

February 2nd, 2010
8:36 pm

“I wonder if the “Josh Smith doesn’t have post moves and lacks fluidity” crowd saw that last play.”

They saw it and said “Josh Smith still doesn’t have post moves and lacks fluidity”

Wabe

February 2nd, 2010
8:39 pm

Teague with the strip when he gets in the game. Then he follows it up with what looked like a pretty clean block, but I guess the official saw contact.

Najeh Davenpoop

February 2nd, 2010
8:42 pm

Man, if Teague can get that floater going with confidence, we will have Tony Parker 2.0.

Astro Joe

February 2nd, 2010
8:43 pm

Joe Smith STILL doesn’t have his legs. I understood it earlier this year, but dude is still leaving his shots way short. And speaking of the percentage of shots that are blocked, Teague may be close to 40%… his stuff is routinely swatted. I admire his willingness to return the favor (especially on fast breaks), but I thought he was supposed to have all of these fancy shots once he gets in the lane.

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:43 pm

See teague is driving. Something Bibby doesn’t do

JB

February 2nd, 2010
8:45 pm

I think Teauge is just a typical athletic guard whose game got overrated in college. He can’t pull that over-aggressive driving in the NBA.

O'Brien

February 2nd, 2010
8:45 pm

AJ,

Those fancy shots worked in college, but he has to make the adjustment to the NBA game. I think he just needs time.

Cosign Najeh,

If Teague can ever start hitting the floater (and the jumper) more consistently, I can’t imagine Woody not giving him more minutes.

Melvin

February 2nd, 2010
8:46 pm

I wonder if ZaZa could jump over his shoe lace…..

terrell

February 2nd, 2010
8:46 pm

I swear Joe Smith hasn’t made that shot all year.

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:47 pm

Josh player of the game so far

Blast

February 2nd, 2010
8:51 pm

Joe has been to the line 4 times already in the 1st half. Who would have thunked it!

Now Josh needs to hit his free throws.

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:52 pm

Nice Nimbers off the bench LOL

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:53 pm

OMG they played who let the dogs out lol

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:54 pm

Can the hawks guard a 3pt shooter for once

Melvin

February 2nd, 2010
8:57 pm

Josh easy going to take it to Jeff Green tonight after he go showed up by Green on MLK day…

JB

February 2nd, 2010
8:58 pm

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
8:59 pm

Yes Josh. Keep driving. No jumpers

Wabe

February 2nd, 2010
8:59 pm

Smoove really doing his thing tonight.

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
9:00 pm

Damn Marvin sucks

Blast

February 2nd, 2010
9:00 pm

AL has to make those shots.

Melvin

February 2nd, 2010
9:00 pm

*Josh is going

Jody

February 2nd, 2010
9:01 pm

Lol. Who says Josh can’t score on a small forward. :)

Wabe

February 2nd, 2010
9:02 pm

Marvin needs to be taking notes tonight.

BONE

February 2nd, 2010
9:03 pm

Only if Marvin played like Durantula

Melvin

February 2nd, 2010
9:03 pm

Mo is a foul magnet. Bring in the attack dog Mario..

Blast

February 2nd, 2010
9:03 pm

They average 30 a night because they go to the free throw line a lot!