Celtics at Hawks, AKA For Some Reason Hawks Are Really, Really Up For This
Star power and rings ought to get Hawks' attention. (Photo by Elsa/Getty Images North America)
So why is it that the Hawks seem to get up for the Celtics more than any of the other members of the East Elite Tri-Council?
Well, when you consider that the Celtics boast three stars, won a championship in 2008 and owned the Hawks until this season, the real question is: Why wouldn’t the Hawks bring a little something extra against the C’s?
“We know we have to play on a totally different level against that team,” J.J. said. “They’ve got so many threats you can’t have no letdowns.”
If you are so inclined–and I know some of you are–you could take all the things that theoretically are working for the Hawks tonight and turn them around into signs of danger:
1. There’s that 3-0 record against Boston this season. That means the Hawks either a) have Boston’s number or b) can expect the Celtics, with prideful KG back, to do everything in their power to avoid their first four-game season sweep by the Hawks since ‘95-’96.
2. The Celtics left their energy in Orlando, where they blew a 16-point lead last night. That means the Celtics either a) will be too spent to do battle with the Hawks even if they really, really want this one especially since KG is still gimpy or b) will re-focus behind KG, who is ticked about giving up a game-winning layup to Rashard Lewis.. From the Boston Globe:
“I’ve got to be better. I told the guys it was on me and I’ve got to be better defensively. I’ll remember it, it fuels me, it will motivate me, so I’m better [tonight]’.’
Or maybe none of that plays a factor and the Hawks really are just better than the Celtics right now. Woody doesn’t think so.
“I still think they are the best team in the East,” he said.
– Woody said Al Horford , who got six stitches for a gash on his left thumb Monday at Houston, never complained about the injury that night or during the shootaround at San Antonio on Wednesday. Before the Hawks played the Spurs, Horford said he had trouble dribbling with his left hand but that’s about it.
Today, though, Horford acknowledged that when he returned to the game at Houston the thumb was “numb, I couldn’t really feel it” and “it was really bothering me” vs. the Spurs.
“Today, it feels a whole lot better,” Horford said. “I’ll be good to go tonight.”
Though he never used the thumb as an excuse, the injury might explain Horford’s 2-for-10 shooting against the Spurs. He still managed to get 10 rebounds vs. Houston and nine vs. San Antonio.
– The Hawks must win to keep alive Woody’s chances of joining Al and J.J. in Dallas for All-Star game. If the Celtics win tonight, the Hawks won’t surpass them for second place in the East by the end of Sunday.
– Talk amongst yourselves, Hawks fans.
MC
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371 comments Add your comment
Birds v. Irish
January 29th, 2010
10:12 pm
Win in Orlando, Boston has Lakers at home sooo … Woody will be personally coaching his All Stars!!
*Just please win in Orlando. You’ve proven yourselves to Boston now it’s time to show Orlando a thing or two!
Melvin
January 29th, 2010
10:14 pm
Let’s get the Magic tomorrow and send Woody to the All Star game…
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:15 pm
Give it to Jamal for keeping things going well throughout the game.
Give it to Al and Josh for holding their own despite being all but ignored on the offensive end in the second half.
Give it to the bench for coming up big.
Give it to Joe for hitting some big shots in the 4th quarter, when we needed them.
We shouldn’t have needed them and in some ways the source of solution was also the source of the problem.
However, WE JUST SWEPT THE CELTS, AND THAT’S ALL THAT REALLY MATTERS!
Welcome to 2nd place, Atlanta. You’ve earned it. Now for the Magic….
vava74
January 29th, 2010
10:15 pm
JJ was there when we needed him.
The game only close due to the bad refereeing. The celts shot 20FT on the second quarter alone!!!!
Any drive by the celts = foul by the Hawks… any drive by the Hawks = “great defence by BOS”…
BONE
January 29th, 2010
10:16 pm
Bigdave u get off the blog all u do is hug Joes nuts. U make it seem like Joe is Michael Jordan up in here. I call him a ballhog becuz he is. I’m not lying. I’m telling the truth.
Melvin
January 29th, 2010
10:17 pm
Hawks in 2nd place… I like it…
Sautee
January 29th, 2010
10:18 pm
Now, now vava,
Don’t hate on Mrs. Sautee. She made a valid observation that Josh seems to be the leader of the cheering section on the bench while the second team is playing.
She thinks Joe should be more of a leader. That’s as valid an opinion as any.
And…”go wash the dishes”? Man that’s not only lame, but insulting as well. I’ll have to say that’s surprising coming from you.
niremetal
January 29th, 2010
10:20 pm
Who was the first person to mob Jamal after he hit the game-winner? Oh. Right. Joe.
That being said, his play tonight won’t cut it against Orlando. Boston is weirdly vulnerable to ISO-oriented offenses. They are so confident in the capabilities of their on-ball defenders that they always are late to help on D. Ironic that a team’s strong defense can actually expose them to the simplest possible offensive scheme.
Against Orlando’s gang-defense, though, it won’t work.
KevinA
January 29th, 2010
10:21 pm
Another win and Woody coaching the All-Star game. Wow
Wabe
January 29th, 2010
10:21 pm
YIKES
4-0
OWNED!!
KevinA
January 29th, 2010
10:22 pm
Such a fun win. Loved the intensity.
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:23 pm
Joe came through. Had a feeling we were gonna need that, but I don’t like that we needed it.
That ain’t nothing against Joe, just that we shouldn’t have frozen Al and Josh out, then gotten away from defending and running. Celtics changed the pace of the game, and we let them. But we won. Great growth and fortitude shown by this team.
As for those getting on Bigdave about JJ, y’all act like this is something new. Dude never has a cross word to say about him, but such is his right, agreed or not.
We just swept the Celtics. Everybody gets a piece of that game ball.
Josh is far and away the biggest cheerleader on his team when he’s sitting on the bench.
Vava clearly has no experience with American women.
jlewis
January 29th, 2010
10:23 pm
A leader, so if you’re jumping up hollering and screaming you are a leader. Does anyone know what Joe does off the court, practice, the guy is durable, verbal isnt the only way to lead.
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:24 pm
The Joe vs. Jamal stuff is nonsense. Doesn’t exist.
niremetal
January 29th, 2010
10:24 pm
Wabe, this is the internet. It’s “pwned.” Get with the program
jlewis
January 29th, 2010
10:25 pm
I agree Ray, you dont have to bash one to like the other. Joe was screaming for more veterans two years ago, he welcomes it.
Sautee
January 29th, 2010
10:27 pm
Actually, Ray, I’ve seen bigdave criticize JJ several different times. A few times I had to ask him if he was ok.
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:27 pm
A leader, so if you’re jumping up hollering and screaming you are a leader. Does anyone know what Joe does off the court, practice, the guy is durable, verbal isnt the only way to lead.
Here we go again….
jlewis
January 29th, 2010
10:29 pm
I just asked the question Ray, many of us are professionals in the workforce, I havent seen it defined on here, I want to know.
vava74
January 29th, 2010
10:31 pm
uuuuhuuuuhuuu…. touchy touchy Sautee…
can’t you stand a joke?
Feeling sensitive after JJ took over the game and saved our asses? You almost sound like someone who would have preferred to lose the game and prove a point on JJ’s selfishness of lack of leading skills…
JJ unfortunately is not an expansive dude. Do you feel that leading is waving towels and chest bumping your team mates??
I am all for a good team spirit but JJ is what he is: a quiet and almost silent guy. His interviews must be a collection of “uhhh…”, “I guess…”, “yeah…” and three word sentences at best.
You and Mrs. Sautee have ABSOLUTELY NO indication that JJ is not a good team mate and that he is selfish.
Does he demand the ball a lot during some games? Too much at times?? Well, he is the top paid guy on the team and probably Woody tells him to go ISO because he trusts him.
Sometimes it goes well, sometime it doesn’t. Overall we should not complain.
I said during half time that JJ had to step up and find his shot in order for us to win and that was precisely what happened when the celts adjusted and Crawford was virtually put out of the game when the defence started to swarm him at the top of the key.
Craw is a genius sometimes but he is also prone to go dry and keep jacking up bad shots.
We have both guys and we should feel lucky instead of trying to undermine what we have.
As for Josh, yes, his energy is wonderful and today he managed – just by a hair – not to get a technical… leader?… no… energizer? yes.
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:31 pm
Jlewis ,
Don’t read too much into that stuff, seriously. Some people just want to see JJ display the same kind of passion Josh does. Well, to me that’s unrealistic in some ways. Shall we also expect Josh to show the same kind of “coolness” that Joe does when he’s not getting a call?
Like you say, no need to bash either player for who or what they are.
Sautee ,
Criticism yes, a cross word, no. Therein lies the difference, although we seemed to be having technical difficulties on that subject this evening.
Bigdave has criticized JJ before, I know. But he doesn’t call him names or use exaggerations to describe what he thinks about him. I can appreciate that.
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:31 pm
Jlewis ,
Part of my post was missing, sorry. I wasn’t after you on that one, I meant to also cut and paste another related post and illustrate how people like to take small differences of viewpoint and turn them into something they aren’t. After I realized half my post was missing (still not sure what button I hit), I then tried to re-explain myself. Maybe I better put the shovel down, eh?
jlewis
January 29th, 2010
10:34 pm
Ray
I didnt read too much into it, this franchise has been down, no one wanted to come here and play in a bunch of empty seats described as people, Joe did, and thats where it started, where is the loyalty? Fans want it, but they never give it, he grew up with these guys. The venom sometimes is just sickening.
niremetal
January 29th, 2010
10:36 pm
Remarkable way for the Chi-NO game to go to OT. Wow. Godawful pass by David West.
Sautee
January 29th, 2010
10:37 pm
jlewis,
I agree, and that’s not her point (the cheering). She hears me talk most games (yes, i said most) about Joe taking defensive possessions off, about missing the bigs when they have their man pinned in the lane, about making shots harder than they have to be, etc. She ALSO hears me saying how great he CAN be. She likes Joe just fine and enjoyed the profile on SportsSouth. She just thinks as a Captain, he should be more demonstrative, AND should be an example on defense. And so do I.
KG and MJ are well known to DRIVE their teammates on defense. THAT’S the kind of leadership Joe fails to show. But hey, we won and I’m delighted. And Joe WAS big in the 4th.
vava74
January 29th, 2010
10:39 pm
jlewis,
right on! JJ did not came only for the money, he came to start a new thing and be the leader.
he has done that. he was there when we took BOS to 7 games… was he perfect? no, but in the wins we had in ATL he had pretty good games.
without that series, we would not be where we are, that was the spark and JJ was there igniting it
Astro Joe
January 29th, 2010
10:39 pm
Man, y’all should go back and look at the comments during the 4th quarter. Joe can’t catch a break. Dude scores 16 (I think) in the 4th quarter after the Hawks are up by a single point. If he had missed the shots the comments would have been “Joe isn’t clutch”. But when he took the shots the comments were “Joe is a ball hog”. I guess no one was calling Pierce a ball hog when he exploited his advantage in the 3rd quarter. And I’m sure when other stars score 15 4th quarter points against an elite defensive team, they too are behaving in a manner detrimental to the team.
vava74
January 29th, 2010
10:43 pm
Astro,
Exactly:
16 points by Kobe, Wade or Lebron against BOS: genius, out of this world, super star…
16 points by JJ: ball hog!!!!
Melvin
January 29th, 2010
10:44 pm
Astro,
did you spilled your popcorn when Jamal stole the game winning pass? LOL
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:44 pm
Vava ,
You’re truly hilarious sometimes. Nothing is funnier than the guy who pushes a button, then tries to act surprised when something happens….
Feeling sensitive after JJ took over the game and saved our asses? You almost sound like someone who would have preferred to lose the game and prove a point on JJ’s selfishness of lack of leading skills…
Oh that’s rich. You know, it sounds as though you feel that the team had been floundering all along, then got saved by JJ when they just couldn’t do any more to help their poor little selves. Tell me, who was “saving our asses” when we were up by double digits, despite JJ hitting just 3 of 11 shots and having just one assist? I would be very interested in hearing your account of what the entire rest of the team, coaching staff included, was doing that caused them to lose this game that JJ saved for all of them?
Don’t get me wrong. I posted much, much earlier in the game that despite JJ’s struggle to be effective in the first three quarters (yes, THREE quarters), we may need JJ’s scoring by the end of the game. However, last I looked it was a team game. Ah yes, and the typical downplaying of what Josh brings. He’s just an energizer after all. For all that, we could save money and play Mario West instead. He’s an energizer too. Heh….
niremetal
January 29th, 2010
10:46 pm
Sautee,
Phil Jackson has written and said repeatedly that Pippen was the Bulls’ defensive quarterback. And he was, as you can tell pretty easily if you watch old tapes of their games. Jordan did not fill the role you just described. When he was vocal to his teammates, it generally was not to say nice things.
Astro Joe
January 29th, 2010
10:47 pm
I would suspect that the players who average 36+ minutes per contest find ways to take a breather while on the court. And my guess is that they sometimes take off defensive possessions. Likewise, I’m guessing that they do NOT do that during critical times in a contest. All I know is that when the Celtics needed a basket, Joe was the one defending Pierce. And his strong defense on Pierce forced the pass to Rasheed which led to a miss and ultimately to Crawford’s steal to clinch the game. But the initial defensive stop came when Pierce tried unsuccessfully to take Joe off the dribble and was forced to give up the ball for a 25 footer.
Melvin
January 29th, 2010
10:48 pm
The Hawks move into 2nd place in the conference after beating the 2nd place team and we are having an ALL OUT bird fight on the blog tonight…unbelieveable….
Ree Roe
January 29th, 2010
10:48 pm
Real proud of the effort tonight by the bench & by Jamal & Joe. Good coaching, good all around effort. Now can we do this in ORL? A win tomorrow down there would be huge
-REEcently Roe!!!
DecDawg
January 29th, 2010
10:50 pm
Sautee…you hit the nail on the head. To get to that elite level as a player (and the Hawks as a team), Joe needs to step up on the other end of the court. He doesn’t lead the team defensively (or hustle) which is why his place as the team leader is always in question…as it should be.
Astro Joe
January 29th, 2010
10:51 pm
Melvin, were you peeking through my window? LMAO! I had a… wait for it… I’m about to use Woody’s favorite word… HUGE bowl of popcorn. And I never spill the good stuff… popped on the stove like my father taught me. Hawks games require the real deal… not that microwave crap.
niremetal
January 29th, 2010
10:53 pm
Ray,
Now you’re caricaturing what vava said. He never said that Josh is nothing more than an energizer. Just said that the actions in question are indicative of an energizer, not a leader.
That being said, JJ isn’t a team leader, from what I can tell. That role falls more to Bibby and Horford. Nothing wrong with that. The vocal, motivating “team leader” on the title-winning Lakers was Rick Fox. For the Rockets, it was the Jet and Clyde. For the Bulls, it was more Pippen than Jordan (mythology to the contrary notwithstanding). Your best player need not a traditional “team leader.”
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:53 pm
Jlewis ,
I think we were talking about two different things. I was talking about Josh’s passion vs. Joe’s “not so passionate” displays. I think you were talking about Joe and the venom he gets in general.
Well, you’re right, he did want to come here, but it was a mutual thing. He also wanted the hell out of Phoenix and told Sarver not to match the Hawks’ offer. Glad he’s here, and glad so many of his current teammates are here. Loyalty? You do know that when the Cavs lose, Lebron gets burned in effigy, and the same happens in L.A. with Kobe, right? Loyalty can be had with a side of criticism, though I agree that often times people go overbooard with what they have to say. Such is their right….though that is little comfort to the more sensitive of us. Luckily for JJ, he has $70 million to fall back on. By the way, it all started with trading Diaw and two first round picks ALONG with offering homeboy $70 million. Think that might raise expectations a hair? Naw.
Astro Joe ,
Some of us saw it coming in the first place, and KNEW we’d need Joe in the 4th. It’s our nature to make things hard on ourselves, it seems.
Sautee
January 29th, 2010
10:54 pm
vava,
wtf????????????
“You and Mrs. Sautee have ABSOLUTELY NO indication that JJ is not a good team mate and that he is selfish”
Tell me where we said that. WTF? Stop making ish up.
And would YOU be pleased if a blogger denigrated YOUR wife? Maybe that’s ok in Portugal, but here…. well don’t try it in a sports bar. To say “can’t you take a joke” denies the insult, which it WAS, whether you perceive it that way or not.
Fundamentals
January 29th, 2010
10:55 pm
Maturity, resolve, hustle, team play! Great win. Everyone contributed to this win, with our 4 stars shining. Let’s get some rest for tomorrow. Everyone will need it! Awesome game.
Astro Joe
January 29th, 2010
10:56 pm
Some of y’all are equating defense to blocked shots or steals. Joe has done a really good job of defending everyone from Derrick Rose to LeBron James and a whole bunch of folk in between (and not just on switches but by assignment). No, he’s not an All-World defender but he isn’t the indifferent defender some are making him out to be.
Melvin
January 29th, 2010
10:57 pm
Astro,
You are a funny dude. Glad to see ya back…..
niremetal
January 29th, 2010
10:57 pm
To answer your question, vava – yes, Sautee apparently is touchy. Then again, I’ve noticed that off-color jokes about women seems to be more in vogue among we of the younger generation, who recognize that it was mean purely satirically (and know that their friends will also recognize it as such). Generation gap.
Sleepy
January 29th, 2010
10:57 pm
Those shots Joe took was horrible . YES HE MADE THEM but that doesnt make them good shots and it doesnt mean he wasnt ballhogging.
This is not the same team it was 3 seasons ago I expect Joe to be preparing this team to go further in the playoffs. I dont think what Joe did tonight prepared this team for anything instead he padded his stats against a good team .
I dont get why people just cant recognize bad play for what it is BAD PLAY. We got a big win but do fans honestly believe that teams dont watch tape of Joe refusing to pass it.
Joe had 1 assist even though the team was leading by double digits when he couldnt even make a shot .Its amazing instead of just recognizing what it is and expecting better people will argue to death about how.
When House is making shots Pierce will use House to help stretch the floor for himself and if the defense cheats too hard HE WILL PASS IT.
If Gibson or Williams is making shots Lebron will feed them until they are off because he understands that them making shots and him showing confidence in them making shots will only open up things for himself down the road .
If Fisher, Sasha,or Brown is on fire Kobe will go for a triple double
yet somehow Joe routinely ignores his teammates to get his points and shots and people applaud him and try to elevate him to superstar status thinking that kinda of play can take us to the next level.
At this rate Joe will implode in the playoffs and then sign elsewhere wasting a plum opportunity for this franchise to get to the finals . It really is disturbing.
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
10:57 pm
Now you’re caricaturing what vava said. He never said that Josh is nothing more than an energizer. Just said that the actions in question are indicative of an energizer, not a leader.
No kidding. Now why does that method of addressing the underlying issue seem so familiar?
To hell with it. I’m not going to get into this nonsense this late at night. What’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander, no matter who likes the gander more than the goose, and that’s all I’m gonna say.
vava74
January 29th, 2010
11:01 pm
I see that my refined humour is not matching the public…
well… JJ saving our asses:
The Hawks lost control over the emotions with the bad refereeing, Crawford went cold and we were missing FTs and not buying a basket. Al was not getting calls inside against bigbaby and Josh was not getting anywhere inside when KG stepped up defensively: he also had a turnover which could have been a very costly one: with a double dribble… go figure. He also missed 5FT…
On the other hand, JJ scored 16 (Crawford also woke up again for 5 or 7, if I am not wrong). I say that this qualifies as a “saving asses performance”
Josh being a leader:
Anyone who has to be removed by 5 guys away from hostile refs in order not to be kicked out of a game does not qualify as a “leader”.
I love Josh’s game, in particular this year, now that he does not launch so many stupid jump shots and is complaining a mite less.
Having said that, he is an energizer: someone who changes the flow of the game with his exuberance and effort (which sometimes is miss guided – see above).
JJ’s leading capabilities: could be a better but are not bad at all. it’s the way he is and there is little to nothing we can do
Astro Joe
January 29th, 2010
11:01 pm
Ray, yep, I saw your forecast that “we need Joe to make some shots”… and he did. Of course, in order to make shots, you kind of need to take them. I know that you understand that but others, not so much. Seems Joe should be able to score without shooting. That would be a REALLY cool trick. Like sweeping a team with a lightening quick All-Star PG without playing Teague for extensive minutes. That would be another awesome trick.
Big Ray
January 29th, 2010
11:03 pm
Button pushers unite….I’m going to bed, y’all can have it, amused to see we still know how to take sides.
Hawks are 30-15 y’all. 2nd place in the East. Staring at Orlando tomorrow night. Round 2 of the canniblogging begin. Man do I wish we were all in a sports bar sometimes….
O'Brien
January 29th, 2010
11:04 pm
I didnt see the game, but from looking at the comments and checking the boxscore, I think I have a pretty good idea of what happened.
Crawford on fire early, and JJ’s shots weren’t falling. Second half, JJ decides to keep shooting until the shots start falling (instead of finding the open man). JJ finally gets it going in the 4th. Hawks win.
I can always find something to complain about, but for tonight, I will enjoy the Hawks being in second place in the East.
JJ said we need to be mentally tough for the Orlando game tomorrow, and he’s right. Orlando is well rested, they’re playing at home, and they have a chance to send Van Gundy to the ASG.
Great win tonight. Lets beat Orlando tomorrow.
Sautee
January 29th, 2010
11:04 pm
vava,
“You almost sound like someone who would have preferred to lose the game and prove a point on JJ’s selfishness of lack of leading skills…”
Seriously man, that’s WAY over the line. Do you REALLY think I care more about that BS than WINNING THE GAME? Have you been reading my posts?
And, once again, where did I say Joe was selfish? The only comment I made regarding that was to say that Jamal should have had the last shot of the half, which YOU AGREED WITH.
So once again, I say WTF? Why the attack?