Bench Guys Want More Burn, Woody Says They Are Getting It . . . Another Day in the NBA
Crawford gets his minutes off the bench but what about the rest of the reserves? (Photo by Curtis Compton/ccompton@ajc.com)
Let’s start with a couple doses of perspective.
First, the Hawks have won 27 games halfway through the season. They are within a half game of Boston for No. 2 in the East. It doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be better. It does mean any discussion of Woody’s rotation has to be viewed through that prism. You can argue about who should be playing more and when but remember the Hawks are doing pretty dang good.
Second, all bench players want to play more, and starters usually tend not to want the bench players to take their minutes. Notice how J.J. responded after the reserves sparked the Hawks to that victory over the Kings Wednesday night.
Wasn’t it nice to be able to rest while the second unit did some heavy lifting?
“I guess it was all right,” Johnson said.
So with those truisms in mind, it’s evident that the Hawks’ reserves would like more games like Wednesday, when four of them not named Jamal Crawford played more than 10 minutes, and lots of those minutes came at key times. When Mo Evans says “I was just happy to get a chance to get out there and contribute” after playing 18 minutes, and you see he had played a total of 17 in his previous two games, you know what he’s getting at.
It’s nothing controversial. It’s just the way it is in the NBA. Heck, it’s human nature, right? Woody, being an NBA coach and all, knows this. He says he’s not as inflexible with playing his reserves as they and others might think, and it’s true that Al Horford is the only starter playing more minutes this year than last season. The other four are playing at least two minutes less per game (yes, that includes J.J., even after six 40-plus minute games this month).
“I say it all the time, (the reserves) are just as important as our starters,” Woody said. “They may not think that because they are in and out. But the bottom line, as a coach I am going to do what it takes to win.
“There have been a lot of games this year where starters haven’t even played in the fourth quarter. I didn’t put them back in like a lot of people would. I’m not against playing our bench, even down the stretch. But when they come in, they got to bring it.”
It’s worth noting that when the Hawks’ reserves put the Kings away after halftime, it was their second stint of the game. The lineup with Jeff Teague, Zaza, Smoove, Crawford and Evans gave ground in the second quarter. But Woody came back with his subs in the third quarter and left them out there for the first four-plus minutes of the fourth. So he showed some flexibility there.
Smoove, for one, is fine with more burn for the second unit.
“When you can be able to not rely on the starters all the time to generate energy and play the bulk of minutes it makes our team deeper,” he said. “When we can rely on guys off the bench to provide instant offense and get it going, it doesn’t always have to be the starters to do it.”
Zaza, another sub who was happy the second unit was out there for winning time, said the reserves had to win Woody’s confidence in practice. Now, he says the bench is ready to ball.
“We have great offensive player, inside presence, shooters, pick-and-roll–we can do everything,” he said. “It made the starters’ jobs easier. They didn’t have to be on the court for 40 minutes for the regular season, that way they can save the energy for the playoffs.”
Woody is mindful of that, and points to the starters’ decline in minutes this season. Most of all, though, he said he’s willing to lean on his bench because: “Our bench is better.”
Injury Report
– J.J. (foot), Smoove (thigh) and Joe Smith (ill) missed practice today. All are expected to be ready for Charlotte on Friday.
Smoove took a knee from Kings forward Jason Thompson. “It’s still sore,” he said.
He said he stuck with his plan to sleep with the leg bent so it wouldn’t tighten up. “But I woke up a couple times and it was straight,” he said.
Joe Smith came to practice but was sent home with a headache. “I won’t count him out,” Woody said. “He’s old school.”
J.J. has said he wouldn’t miss any games due to the nagging injury.
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104 comments Add your comment
Fritz
January 22nd, 2010
7:29 am
Ken Strickland,
If I was a young point guard and my options were being drafted by a Coach Woodson Hawk organization I would run as far and as fast as I could in the opposite direction Who in their right mind would want to risk a CAREER-ENDING move like that before his career could get on track. It isn’t JUST that he doesn’t play young PGs – but the man #1) doesn’t give a sh*t about offense, #2) it SHOWS, and #3) obviously has NOTHING to teach me to help me grow into a better player.
Any PG would have to be out of their mind to come here young – BUT YOU KNOW THAT. You know it, I know it, and anyone else who’s paying any attention to what Woody DOES should see it.
Contrast that with Larry Brown – also known to prefer veteran players. He’s hell on young PGs – but the man can teach them to grow and succeed.
dap01
January 22nd, 2010
7:46 am
Does Joe Johnson want to not sound like a leader or is it just his natural tone?
He wants to play as many minutes as possible. Screw what is best for the team. He is great but…..
Does anyone else like what they are seeing in Randmo like I do? I think that he is becoming someone who could play a role with the Hawks in the future. He can score against anybody and he is slowing developing a NBA body that can compete.
Come on Woody, stretch the bench and have a deep AND fresh team in the playoffs. Besides, the style of play when not so dependant on our favorite play is best. (limit ISO Joe)
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
8:29 am
I still really don’t get it. Michael starts off by saying the Hawks are winning, the relationship of bench and starters does not reflect on wins and losses and of course EVERY NBA player wants more minutes, but some of the posts on here continue to use those points as vindication for their arguments. I guess I shouldn’t be suprised.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
8:30 am
Been arguing for Randmo since his the first game he got in this season. The kid’s different this year! Excellent almost each minute he’s been in. Great to see the improvement.
The Real Hawk
January 22nd, 2010
8:33 am
The proof is in the box score. It does not lie.
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
8:33 am
Fritz- how do you justify a statement like Woodson doesn’t give a (flip) about offense and it shows when the team is leading the conference in scoring?
Do you actually pay attention to the games or do you just have an agenda?
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
8:35 am
Fundamentals- You know I have SLOWLY come around on RandMo, and I think that his improvement is reflected in Mario being on the squad and not Othello. (of course, contracts and money is involved in that decision as well)
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
8:35 am
Daniel,
He’s trying, but I agree it didn’t say a whole lot to me. I’d like to see Woodson use the bench effectively to attack different matchups as much as possible to reduce the starters minutes so we could save their legs for the playoffs and increase the confidence on the bench so they’ll be ready when called on for any situation – like game 7 instead of the last 2 minutes during a blowout.
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
8:39 am
Buz thompson- The answer is yes it is and it is a shame that you “don’t think so”. You have the “right” to think however you want, but you don’t get change the meaning of words.
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
8:41 am
Well Fundamentals all the starters minutes (except Horford’s) minutes are down and Joe is 17th in the league in minutes behind a lot of players whose team’s bench and legs in the playoffs are not questioned. Is that not enough? How many minutes are enough?
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
8:49 am
I agree on the offense Daniel. Ranking that high shows we can score.
Folks just don’t like Woodson’s system. They see winning and think they could get an immediate championship without Woodson. I’ve got my own issues with Woodson, but I feel he deserves the chance to stay with the team until he doesn’t meet Sund’s goals. It’s nice to see the organization respect Woodson’s efforts from the beginning. I think if he competes in the 2nd round they’ll extend him. Time will tell if it would be a good decision.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
8:54 am
I’m not griping for specific minutes. Would you agree kids like Randmo & Teague deserve real minutes? What about Collins, doesn’t he need burn during real situations to mesh chemistry-wise during games? We can’t expect him to just drop in and succeed like he did in the one CLE game every time.
I’d agree ZaZa and Mo seem to handle it well. Crawford gets plenty of minutes. Rio seems to be used effectively for matchups.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
8:56 am
Woodson’s has only proven to consistently use his bench during 30+ point blowouts. When a real game is on the line he sticks to 6-7 man rotations. We lose our chance to build depth by doing that. That’s my main point. We have good bench guys. They can play a role in most any game. Give them a chance, especially when the starters can’t “generate energy”.
GeeMack
January 22nd, 2010
9:00 am
Ken Strickland
Good information. You really did some homework.
doc
January 22nd, 2010
9:03 am
daniel @8:33 … i think most folks agree that the defense and running are what gets us the points not an offensive style or pattern. some here also see comments from woody himself saying the offense will take care of itself. it doesnt when teams change to a different approach such as strong interior defense with perimeter pressure of a zone defense and we find ourselves helpless as we continue to jack up shots because they “look to good to pass up” per woody.
so, i dont know how you can throw out such an abrasive statement like this: Do you actually pay attention to the games or do you just have an agenda? are you not paying attention yourself or are we all just supposed to be offended by your comments that see it a different way but just keep oit to ourselves because it is no secret? what is your agenda or did i miss something?
GeeMack
January 22nd, 2010
9:09 am
Hawks fans
Here is my question…with all the suggestion of a different systems defensively & offensively, and coaching . Where should this team be?
Are we underacheiving?
How many more wins should we have?
Is there champioship level talent here now?
Is coaching stoping us being champioship contenders this year?
doc
January 22nd, 2010
9:16 am
rich, thanks for the link on crit. my read is it seems he got shot down by some jealous rivalry from arenas is my guess. agent zero saw something in crit that was a threat, so he started pulling strings. seems he found a big one all to protect a bet he made and he owed on. most pranksters as well as the funny guys that do the don rickles routine had a lot of enmity in their hearts was what i saw and to play pranks or make fun of others was their mask to get it out. a lot of anger was in there. it is a sad story that i hope can come to a positive outcome for crit. funny, when he was traded from l a kobe felt he was losing a brother that he had been watching over.
Westurd
January 22nd, 2010
9:22 am
Geemack, I was think the same thing. A quick snap shot of the Hawks
1st place in the SE Division
3rd in the confenrece (by only a 1/2 game)
On the road to 54 wins
Potentially (3) all-stars
I like the criticism though. Shows the hunger to be better. I think we want and deserve more out of our team, but do realize we in a much better place than a 13-69 team of the past.
Westurd
January 22nd, 2010
9:23 am
GO HAWKS……..see everyone in the Highlight Factory !
jerrywest
January 22nd, 2010
9:35 am
Great post Ken Strickland.
O'Brien
January 22nd, 2010
9:36 am
Woody can say whatever he wants people to believe about playing his bench more, but that is not true. The main reason for the bench averaging more minutes is blowout wins and blowout losses.
And its not just about averages. It is also about timing (when he gives the bench guys some burn), and thats where I think Wooody can improve.
There are 20 games this season where JJ has played 40 minutes or more (Hawks are 11-9 in those games), 13 of those he has played 43 minutes or more. I know Woody wants to win, but he must also keep in mind the playoffs.
Daniel,
The Hawks started off top 2 or 3 in scoring. But they were running, and blowing people out. Recently, that has not been happening. In fact, we have too many instances recently (Cleveland 4th quarter, Miami game, Suns early 4th Q, OKC 4th Q) where our offense grinds to a halt. Those are the times we need Woody to give a *%#* about the offense.
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
9:38 am
doc- my statement was made in direct response to Ftriz’s statement, which you would agree is certainly more abrasive, and yes, I do have an agenda, which is to root for the Hawks to have a successful winning season. I take umbrage with the idea that we are a poorly run offensive team when the facts do not bear that out. You certainly have every “right” to your opinion, and obviously you are not one to make gross overstatements, etc. So I do respect your opinions and views, doc, but I have a hard time with the usual “stuff” about this team which keeps being repeated over and over without challenge or perspective. Does this team play perfect basketball all the time? No, of course not, but what team does? Woodson’s comments about not caring about the offense were meant to reflect his position that this team has plenty of offensive ability it is on the defensive end and our “energy” where we tend to lose games. He obviously didn’t mean for that statement to be taken literally. I also happen to agree with the intent of his statement, which I (and many others, also) observe to be true. Doesn’t your own belief that many of our points come from good defense and run outs prove his point. The team is leading the conference in ppg but is third in the record, so the problem is the way we score points???? I am sorry if you took my post personally, it certainly was not meant to be directed that way. I will state again for the record that you tend have a good deal of reasonable insight and a lot of passion for the Hawks and I always respect your opinion.
rms
January 22nd, 2010
9:41 am
will be sitting in Section 305 at the Hawks game tonight!!
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
9:42 am
Fundamentals- I would agree that I would like to see Teague get “real” minutes. I am not as concerned about Collins or Morris’s minutes, they are 3rd string for a reason. Although, it is great to see our third stringers play well when given the opportunity. You also know I am ALWAYS in favor of going to the bench when the starters come out flat.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
9:47 am
When we bring the energy and effort on defense we can overcome the 4th quarter problems, as shown when we got right back in those games. There needs to be play calling by Bibby, Teague or Crawford to effectively use the post to get real shots from the perimeter. Chucking up jumpers at the end of the clock b/c they looked too good is an excuse. It all hinges on play calling, ball movement and not letting Joe/Crawford pound the ball for 15 seconds before making an attempt at a play. We shut down when we don’t involve the Team in the offense.
Where should this team be?
Possibly 1 or 2 in the East if they hadn’t blown a few easy to win games.
Are we underacheiving?
Somewhat in the area of inconsistency of effort.
How many more wins should we have?
3-4
Is there champioship level talent here now?
Yes, if Teague and Randmo/Collins were utilized and developed.
Is coaching stoping us being champioship contenders this year?
In the area of bench use/development – YES.
In the area of play calling – YES.
Does he have the ability to correct his own mistakes & grow = YES.
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
9:52 am
O’Brien- I answered your question, but it got eaten by the blog monster. So, I will give it a few minutes before repeating myself. Good questions though.
I say that on pace to win 54 games (I predicted 52 at the begining of the season). 2-4th place finish with a strong second round showing/ECF appearance would be VERY successful for this team at this stage of their development. Don’t get me wrong, I want the whole thing, but trying to be reasonable.
Fundamentals- interesting assesment, a little harsh IMO, but I see what you are saying.
doc
January 22nd, 2010
10:29 am
daniel, thanks for your clarification and time to answer. i respect your opinions and your response was right on point. one of the reasons i dont post as often is there are plenty of folks that talk the talk and walk the walk for the hawks and say what i want to say. so, why should i just repeat things? carry on!
go hawks!
big game tonight. we need to make sure the cats dont get anymore confidence against us than they already have. this might be a team to meet in the first round and one i would not want any part of.
MsDee
January 22nd, 2010
10:34 am
I dont have a problem with Teague’s mins in the 1st half with the 2nd string..my problem is in the 2nd half. I feel Teague should be in the game in the 2nd half with Crawford & JJ, Al & Josh..that way he can get some true burn with the starters. I dont care what no one says, a player plays up when they have a squad running with them. JJ would look like boo-boo if mario west, randmo, joe smith, & collins were on the floor with him. Teague need not only be in the game with the 2nd unit but with the 1st unit also!! His performance would improve dramically cause he would have some outside shooters in JJ & crawford to pass it out to and also if he drives the ball, he has Josh to drop it off to or Al for a baseline shot he has improved on..so many options for Teague IF he was used correctly!! Just my 2 cents.
ILL-logical
January 22nd, 2010
10:36 am
What a lot of the comments on this board concerning Woodson’s coaching allude to is that the regular season’s winning may become Pyrrhic victories if the team’s playoff performance is hampered by fatigued players/ inflexible offensive and defensive systems that are easily beaten by opposing coaches.
And these concerns are heartfelt expressions of Hawk fans , althought sometimes the tone of their concern can be abusive. There is a recognition of the progress made during Woodson’s tenure, albeit grudgeling in some , however there is more than a little paranoia about the success of the season will somehow go up in smoke at any moment because of the history of the Hawks and other Atlanta pro franchises achieving championship status.
Woodson has done a lot with a litle and inspite of his and the organizations’ shortcomings, progress continues to be made. but we still can hold their feet to the fire when they screw up.
JJ Fan
January 22nd, 2010
10:38 am
It’s always going to look like the bench guys are doing better than the starters. They come for short bursts, so they don’t have to reserve any energy. They’re trying to get Woody’s attention for more PT. And they’re usually playing against the opponent’s bench; and the Hawks have one of the best benches in the East.
I agree with Ken Strickland about Woody and PG’s, but it’s not just the young ones on the bench. He doesn’t seem to care about the starting PG either. They stand around while the offense goes through the SG. Bibby, Jeff Teague, Kenny Anderson, Tyronn Lue, Royal Ivey, Acie Law, Speedy Claxton…none of them have ever been All-Star point guards, or will be, in Woody’s system.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
10:48 am
Our starters shouldn’t have to reserve energy if they know Woodson is going to use the bench to relieve them. It’s all in effectively using your players to ensure they’re not fatigued.
Strickland may have a point on the system preventing effective play calling by the PG. I keep wishing Bibby or Teague would come down and run something. We struggle when we dump it to the SG for an isolation.
Loved MsDee’s comments on giving Teague some real burn with the 1st unit and burn in both halves…not just in blowouts. Randmo needs this too. I firmly believe both players can develop and produce.
Astro Joe
January 22nd, 2010
11:13 am
My goodness, do we run ISO every play and I am missing it? How can we have 6 players averaging in double figures if we only run one offensive set? Isn’t this ISO thing getting WAYYYYYYYYYY too much hype? The teamis among the top 10 in assists, Horford is averaging a career high… surely those things would not be true if 99% of the plays were ISO-SG. Give it a break already and go chew a new bone.
MsDee
January 22nd, 2010
11:20 am
If Woodson was smart, he would put Teague & Randmo in and out with the 1st unit in the 2nd half. I dont think that would hurt the team at all. Al is already getting a lot more mins than last year, Woodson could allow Randmo some of those mins with the 1 unit to develop more.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
11:22 am
Astro, it’s nice to win and yes we move the ball around when we’ve got the D clamping down. The ISO issue in my mind comes into play when you hit 2-3 key opponents who force us into a 1/2 court game. We’ll see alot of 1/2 court games in the playoffs. The focus on figuring out when and how to use the ISO and other plays is our key to getting out of the second round. If that’s not important, we can just win 60 games and check out in round one.
Would you not agree ISO led to our demise against CLE, ORL, LA?
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
11:24 am
MsDee – it’s worth an honest effort to try. With our draft options, limited $$ and slots for free agents it’s obvious to me seeing what Randmo & Teague can do is an important issue to our long term success.
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
11:33 am
Ms Dee amd Fundamentals- I agree with you both on Teague and disagree strongly with Morris. He has made vast improvements in his fitness this year, but he is still just barely above a D-league player in his 4th season as a pro. He will be a career hangeron, I like the hustle and glad to see some work ethic (FINALLY) but I am not going so far as to say that this guy needs some starter time to develop. No way.
GeeMack
January 22nd, 2010
11:40 am
ILL-logical
I am you I think Woody has alot with little.
Fundamentals
I think we can do a better job with the bench, but mainly Teague, Joe Smith with Zaza, Mo, & JC.
However I disagree that this team is a championship level talent even with a developed bench.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
11:41 am
Definitely not as a starter, but what about running him in the game along with Teague PG, Joe/Craw/Marvin SG, Horford at PF and Smoove at SF to really go big and fast? Not for a long set, 3-4 minutes here and there? Just to experiment. Practice it to get sets down and then give it a run one night? Especially if you’ve got a 10-15 pt lead early?
Ken Strickland
January 22nd, 2010
11:52 am
WESTURD-I think you missed the point of GEEMACK’S very insightful questions. Yes, we’re all aware of the success this team has achieved so far this yr. However, the gist of his questions was, IS THIS TEAM TALENTED ENOUGH TO BE CAPABLE OF ACHIEVING EVEN MORE THAN IT HAS WITH MORE EFFECTIVE COACHING AND A MORE EFFECTIVE OFF/DEF SYSTEM?
I remember early in the season when we were blowing teams out, I had this feeling of confidence and something a little less than certainty that they would win the next gm. It was a feeling of NOT IF THEY’D WIN, BUT BY HOW MUCH. I haven’t had that feeling in quite a while now. In fact, I don’t have the strongest confidence that we’ll actually defeat any team we play now, although I know we’re capable.
After working hard during the off season and during training camp, apathy has to have set in for JTeague, RMorris, JCollins, Joe Smith and even Zaza and MEvans. I’m certain they all thought they’d be able to contribute more towards making this team better. However, they’ve been given inconsistent mins and opportunities, and seeing the starters and team struggle with inconsistency makes it harder for them. On top of that, we have JJ concentrating more on putting himself on display for a potential max contract rather than concentrating on playing more team ball.
The Big 3, plus the Heat, aren’t as good as they were last yr. Yet, we still struggle to be competitive against Orlando and Cleveland, and all of a sudden we’re barely competitive against teams that are under 500. If fact, we’ve gotten our butts kicked by far too many of those teams. How many Eastern conference teams have had the same starting 5 and backup center for the last 3yrs. We have a perennial Allstar in JJ, the leading 6th man of the yr in JCrawford, and a PF(JSmith) and C(AHorford) that’s played at an Allstar level all season.
We should be leading Orlando by much more than a half gm, especially after their poor play and extended string of losses. Instead of sticking your chest out and bragging about us having half gm divisional lead over Orlando, you should to be concerned about us not being competitive against them in head to head competition. Would we be where we are today if the top 3 teams were playing at last yrs level?
Remember, Cleveland won their division and led the NBA in wins with a 66-16 record last yr. But that didn’t mean a damned thing when the playoffs started, and it didn’t help them one bit when it came to that butt kicking they got from Orlando in the playoffs did it. We’ve become an inconsistent team that’s slowly reverting back to old none productive habits.
theZaZaguy
January 22nd, 2010
11:54 am
I honestly don’t understand the trade talk. Maybe next year, but this year?
Right now, the hawks are playing quality ball. Why mess with a good thing? Orlando changed out half the team and how is it working out for them? Boston got Rasheed, Cleveland got Shaq. Has it really helped them that much?
When I watch this team closely, I see lots of exchanges that can only happen when guys have been together awhile and are comfortable with each other. The JSmoove cut back and dunk from Bibby, three quick passes in the lane for an easy lay-up between the 3,4, and 5, and lots and lots of no look passes. Either these guys have amazing peripheral vision, or there’s some chemistry there.
Do we really want another Reggie Theus?
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
11:55 am
Its a thought Fundamentals. I wonder what Woody is doing with him in practice. The problem is that in order to practice that set you have to run the regular guys a little more in practice for something that may or may not work that you may or may not use and we are in the middle of a long, long season. I am not totaly rejecting the idea. Just playing devil’s advocate.
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
11:58 am
Ken- I thought westurd got Gee’s point exactly right.
ZaZa guy- I would have to say the Shaq thing is starting to look a lot better right now. The rest I agree with you.
Ken Strickland
January 22nd, 2010
12:07 pm
FUNDAMENTAL-excellent points on RMorris. I feel he is an totally untapped resource. I believe the refusal of the Hawks to utilize Bigs like RMorris and JCollins, or consistently go inside to Smoove and Horford, reguardless of how well they’re playing, or have played, is because they’re not effective jumpshooters. This seems to hold true for PG JTeague as well. The philosophy and mentality of this team seems to be narrowly focused on LIVING AND DYING BY THE JUMPSHOT. I GUESS THAT’S WHY OUR BIGS SPEND MOST OF THEIR TIME HANDLING THE BALL AROUND THE TOP OF THE KEY, AND ALMOST ALL OR OUR OFF ACTIVITY TAKES PLACE OUT THERE AS WELL.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
12:07 pm
I’m on board with Ken today it seems. Not sure what the answer is, but involving the entire team in important rotations will definitely help us grow. This culture of running 7 man rotations and only using the bench in EXTREME blowouts or at the end of obviously won games is a token way of keeping your starters minutes down. They should play in the flow as matchups dictate. Woodson can’t seem to do that on a regular basis. If someone goes down, we could be in serious trouble.
I still believe the team is playing for a 50 win season and a trip to the 2nd round. They’re not setting their goals for ECF or the Finals. They’re happy to meet expectations. Nice expectations at the outset of the season, but things have changed now. We need our players to raise Sund’s bar.
They should want & expect more based on the flashes they’ve shown all season. We have the potential to at least make a hard push for the ECF. Once there, anything can happen.
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
12:08 pm
Shaq or Z will have nagging injury problems come playoff time. Mark it down.
hawkfan
January 22nd, 2010
12:35 pm
For the Hawks, I really feel that the results of the upcoming playoffs will have a great impact on the chemistry and composition of next year’s squad. The reason being that I don’t think management and fans alike will be content with just a “hard fought” 2nd round exit. The team has shown constant improvement for many years now, but that trend will clearly face its biggest challenge this postseason if the Hawks dont advance to the ECF.
With that being said, a second round exit should have a dominant bearing on the future of Woody and JJ. By now, everybody knows Woody’s style and that’s very unlikely to change, but I think most people (myself included) are waiting to see how JJ performs in the playoffs to decide if they really want him to resign. Of course, having already rejected a contract extension, nobody knows if he even wants to resign.
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
12:45 pm
Fundamentals- Which team or coach is the model of using his bench? Phil Jackson?- His starters play more minutes
Doc Rivers?- Team injuries have dictated much of his rotations
Greg Popovich?- (IMO-the best) He does a great job keeping his starters minutes lower, although that hasn’t helped them avoid injury, plus the Spurs are very comfortable using the regular season as a tune up to the playoffs, because they have a tradition of winning. The Hawks don’t.
hawkfan
January 22nd, 2010
12:50 pm
“This culture of running 7 man rotations and only using the bench in EXTREME blowouts or at the end of obviously won games is a token way of keeping your starters minutes down. They should play in the flow as matchups dictate. Woodson can’t seem to do that on a regular basis.”
You are absolutely right. So if you agree with that statement, and he cannot lead the team to the next level now, why should we believe he is the right man for the job?
Daniel
January 22nd, 2010
12:50 pm
Do you really think this fan base would tolerate the Hawks winning less games and understanding that we are trying to perserve our starters, working out rotations, etc.? We haven’t had enough winning to give us that confidence or maturity as fans. Why should we expect the team to be different?
Fundamentals
January 22nd, 2010
1:08 pm
Daniel, I see the point loud and clear. It’s all a Catch 22. Do we win at all costs or develop the team for when it really matters? In terms of Joe, Woodson’s contracts they vote win now. In the ATL fans they say win now. Organization, win now. Everybody is impatient.
I guess I’m a minority. I’m seeing underutilized potential on our bench. I’d like to see what the team looks like truly going 10-12 deep regularly.
I don’t really care about the wins or losses. It’s how you play the game. Give a hard effort with the entire team. See where it goes. If someone honestly beats you, shake their hand and move on. I’m not gonna sweat it. Problem is we haven’t really been beaten this year. Most of our losses come when we let down and don’t really try. We play lazy D, we watch Joe on offense, and Woodson just stands there disgusted. If folks aren’t doing their job on a given night hold them accountable and play someone else.
I guess in all this today it’s telling me I don’t think Woodson is showing he’s the ideal fit for this group today, or possibly the future. Being a “new” head coach, he’s growing. He’s paid his dues to us, and he’s paid dearly. He deserves an honest shot to see where we go through the remainder of the season. After that we can all decide.
Joe is what you see. He needs support to play at the high level we see him flash. Is he a superstar that can overcome double and triple teams…NO, but neither was Kobe last night. Everyone needs support. Joe is no different.