NBA denies Hawks protest of Dec. 30 loss at Cavs. Also, sun reportedly to rise tomorrow.
The league today denied the Hawks’ protest of their Dec. 30 loss at Cleveland due to a shot clock error.
“From the time we filed our protest, we indicated that we would allow the process to run its course, and today, the commissioner’s office has reached a decision,” Hawks GM Rick Sund said in a statement. “We abide by the league’s decision and will have no further comment regarding this matter.”
At least there will be no real letdown for the Hawks. It seems no one in the organization really expected to get a replay of the final two minutes of that 106-101 defeat.
Probably some of that is because it’s rare for the league to overturn a game result (yes, I know it happened to the Hawks). There’s also the feeling, shared by lots of people who follow (or hate) the NBA, that the league would not make a ruling at the expense of one of its marquee teams (we are back to Dwyane Wade and Shaquille O’Neal’s Heat winning that protest of the Dec. 19, 2007 loss to the Hawks).
That’s not really based on real, hard evidence, just perceptions about the league’s decisions. Which of course is enough to get conspiracy theorists talking about fixes and favoritism. But just because there is no hard evidence to support a theory (please save your Tim Donaghy smack) doesn’t mean it’s not true. See how that works?
Anyway, for what it’s worth, NBA commish David Stern said in a statement that the failure of the shot clock to reset “did not have a clear impact on the game’s outcome and therefore did not justify the extraordinary remedy of granting the protest and overturning the game’s result.”
The Hawks disagreed. They led by a point when the clock failed to reset after they got a defensive rebound with 1:57 to play. That led them to rush their offensive possession, which led to a turnover, which led to Cleveland taking the lead. Also, the officials missed what would have been a Hawks backcourt violation if they’d been paying attention to the shot clock, and there also should have been a Hawks shot clock violation before their turnover. Woody protested, but lead official Ken Mauer shrugged.
(Aside: Considering this isn’t the only controversial call involving Mauer , maybe this is less about conspiracies and more about competency.)
So that was three timing errors in that Cavs-Hawks game. It didn’t matter. Hey, what did you expect, man? LeBron and Shaq play for Cleveland.
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92 comments Add your comment
Rod from College Park
January 19th, 2010
4:37 pm
In the NBA anything involving Lebron should be expected to go his way. Stern’s statement is absurd.
Boom Dizzle
January 19th, 2010
4:40 pm
Wow, they denied the protest from the Cavs game…..why am I not shocked? ……David “the Don” Stern can’t have anybody messing up his Cavs/Lakers finals……..
clarkekent
January 19th, 2010
4:42 pm
its cle and lebron and shaq and the NBA. like we really thought the NBA would do that game over.. and it was labron’s birthday. the NBA does show favortitism. its just like boxig; you have to knock out the champ.. if not and you let it go to the judges for a decision; you will lose.
MannyT
January 19th, 2010
4:46 pm
No surprise. Mauer gets tasered by league outside the view of mortals. That’s all folks.
Next time Woody needs to get a red flag from one of his NFL coaching bretheren and toss it in the middle of the court
BWAF
dstdeelite
January 19th, 2010
4:52 pm
Shocker!
jerrywest
January 19th, 2010
4:55 pm
Remember Garnett didn’t get suspended for stepping into the court during a fight? There were dozens of precedence to that. NBA takes care of its Rainmen.
Josh
January 19th, 2010
5:02 pm
yeah, garbage
possum jones
January 19th, 2010
5:04 pm
no real surprise…i tried to speak it (protest) into existence, but to no avail. the nba would have a significantly better product if officials would just call the game.
GeeMack
January 19th, 2010
5:09 pm
Had we drafted CP3 this game would have been played over. It’s not the NBA fault we don’t have a superstar to promote.
rms
January 19th, 2010
5:23 pm
NBA is rigged! Foolish Mortals!!!!!!!!!!!
Fundamentals
January 19th, 2010
5:50 pm
It’s not about getting it changed to me. It’s about having your voice heard at a national level. Anything that spotlights the “King” treatment before we meet them in the playoffs is good publicity to me.
terrell
January 19th, 2010
5:53 pm
Figures.
Trainwreck
January 19th, 2010
6:29 pm
Can’t say I’m surprised… The League doesn’t want the Hawks to do well anyway, it would much rather have D-Wade and the Heat as the 4th place team in the east… we get no love from the NBA community and that isn’t changing anytime soon.
blonju aka the ghost of sekou smith
January 19th, 2010
6:29 pm
i’m not suprised about this, but it doesn’t make cheating any less painful when it’s versus our home town team… david stern’s statement is one of the dumbest things i’ve ever heard anyone say about anything in my 30 years on this planet… here’s an analogy that may help us to understand the NBA’s corruption a bit more clearly: “(judge says) even though the defendent shot the victim in the chest, there is no clear evidence to suggest that the bullet wound had anything to do with the death of the victim”
blonju aka the ghost of sekou smith
January 19th, 2010
6:31 pm
….therefore, i rule in favor of the defendant – NOT guilty”
ant banks
January 19th, 2010
6:47 pm
can we be very objective?
woody could have called a time out as soon as he noticed the deficiency. Furthermore, there were a ton of miscues durin’ that game that the hawks had control over, but they didn’t manage well. so to look for a bailout from the nba is like ford and chrysler lookin’ for a bailout after years and years of mismanagement.
O'Brien
January 19th, 2010
6:51 pm
I wouldn’t mind seeing Cleveland losing in the first round. Who wants to see all those LeBron commercials anyway.
ant banks
January 19th, 2010
6:54 pm
the hawks have to take care of their own business. can’t go cryin’ like a biotch over miniscule technical errors.
had we won both knick games, the detroit game, without prince and rip, and if we had won the hornets game, without cp3, and the okc game, WE WOULD BE 31-8!!!!
WIN THE GAMES THAT YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO WIN AND EVERYTHING ELSE WILL TAKE CARE OF ITSELF.
i am a hawks fan but i refused to get on my knees lookin’ for help when i am not takin’ care of my own business.
Blast
January 19th, 2010
6:56 pm
Of course we all knew Hawks would be denied justice. I liked that the Hawks protested, though. Maybe those effing refs will elevate their game. Stern is full of bull doodle.
I hate that Mauer guy with his stupid slick back and greasy hair. He want’s to be the star of the show? Is he Italian? Is he a mobster? All I know is the FBI needs to investigate him. I cringe anytime I see him at Hawks games.
Just shows again nothing is gonna be given to you. Hawks want respect? Then they have to do something special. They have to earn it, by winning big.
Hawk n the Ham
January 19th, 2010
6:56 pm
David Stern is nothing more than Tim Donaghy ….. but with all the power.
ajw
January 19th, 2010
6:56 pm
Mauer should at least be demoted to the d-league. He already screwed up a game with the Mavs a month before the Hawks. The Hawks will always get screwed. At least we still beat the Heat.
We should just screw every team that comes to Philips now. There are no consequences for it.
Melvin
January 19th, 2010
7:06 pm
Astro,
If you watched the Clemson/GT game tonight (7pm/ESPN2). Keep an eye on Clemson #35 Trevor Booker. He’s that tweener forward that you like…
Blast
January 19th, 2010
7:09 pm
Woody said Teague must wait behind the vets. Ha! No surprises there!
David Stern
January 19th, 2010
7:09 pm
The Hawks are my bitch.
carlton johnson
January 19th, 2010
7:10 pm
of course it had a clear impact on the game. one team gained momentum. didn’t expect anything anyway.
Miss Horford
January 19th, 2010
7:31 pm
Who ever you are David Stern…….you know yourself well!
I agree with yall fellas up yonder ways…..The Hawks do not get the butt lick like Lebron does. Wait he does not run the reffs….he IS the reff!!!! Hello! We are never gonna have that treatment!
IF ANY NBA PERSON IS HERE, THEN THINK ABOUT THIS: WOULD A FINALS WITH THE UNDERDOG AS THE POSSIBLE CHAMPION NOT PULL MORE REVENUE THAN THE SAME TEAMS EVERY SEASON? EVER THOUGHT ABOUT THAT?!
michael
January 19th, 2010
7:37 pm
CORRUPTION HAS SPREAD FROM POLITICS TO THE NBA!
O'Brien
January 19th, 2010
7:45 pm
Melvin,
I’m a GT fan, so I’ve been watching the game. Booker looks good, and it sounds like he can play outside and inside.
I did not know Derrick Favors is 6′9″ with a 9 foot wingspan. Wow. He is projected as a top 10 pick, but his potential is raw.
eggie
January 19th, 2010
8:01 pm
Any reasonable person that takes the NBA serious deserves what they get. Might as well watch professional wrestling.
Melvin
January 19th, 2010
8:12 pm
O’Brien,
Booker added an outside shot to his game this year. He maybe available when the Hawks pick. Not sure if the ASG would pick him but if he falls to the 2nd, I think they should trade up to get him. He reminds me of Dejuan Blair but more atheletic and less weight…
mark
January 19th, 2010
8:24 pm
The NBA should of shuttered the hawks, well should of shuttered the entire league years ago
Jimmy
January 19th, 2010
8:25 pm
The NBA is a joke league.
There is no way the situation the Hawks lost on is substantially different from this one.
O'Brien
January 19th, 2010
8:33 pm
He might be worh taking a chance on, because Mo Evans has a player option for 2010-2011 (which he will probably pick up). But after that, Hawks will need somebody to back up Marvin. And Booker is 6′7″ 240.
Gani Lawal will probably be there too, and the Hawks will need a backup PF soon.
Melvin
January 19th, 2010
8:48 pm
O’Brien,
He’s PF all the way…. No enough handle or shooting ability to play on the perimeter full time
It's the NBA
January 19th, 2010
8:56 pm
If they did something good it would hurt their bad image
ant banks
January 19th, 2010
9:26 pm
i am surprised at the hawks fans complainin’ about a do over. “FREEDOM WILL NEVER BE GRANTED BY THE OPPRESSOR. IT MUST BE TAKEN BY THE OPPRESSED”-MALCOLM X
the nba ain’t givin’ the hawks ish. so get over it!!! the hawks have to take it!!! they can start by winnin’ games that they are supposed to win like the 2 home games we lost to knicks, the game we lost to detroit, the game we lost to the hornets, without cp3, and the game we lost to okc.
i ain’t goin’ to say what yall sound like, but damn. nba didnt “give” nothin’ to jordan. he took the ish. they could not get past detroit, then pippen came and jordan took it. hawks need to take some of these games and build a lead on orlando and quit snivelin’ like a hurt trick after her pimp dumps her.
GO HAWKS!!!
Saint Richt
January 19th, 2010
9:26 pm
Fire Mike Woodson……go focus on winning the games at HOME that you should (Knicks x 2, Thunder).
O'Brien
January 19th, 2010
9:31 pm
Melvin,
If he is a PF, I dont think the Hawks would take him then, because he is only 6′7″.
They might be better off taking Gani Lawal then, because at least he is 6′9″, and he should be available when they pick in the low 20s range.
Well, Raptors down by 6 in Cleveland with under 1 minute left. Oh well. At least the Celtics lost last night. As bad as the Hawks have looked at times, they are only one and a half games from the #2 seed.
richbrave
January 19th, 2010
10:01 pm
David “the Don” Stern can’t have anybody messing up his Cavs/Lakers finals……..
Ain’t that the truth. Sorry CLYDE, no T-shirt purchares for me.
richbrave
January 19th, 2010
10:04 pm
Well, I think HORFORD is a superstar.
Miss Horford
January 19th, 2010
10:20 pm
I agree! I think Horford is our best player. He’s the heart of our team!
Ken Strickland
January 19th, 2010
10:21 pm
BLAST-I believe we play the Kings tomorrow, who have a rookie guard named Tyreke Evans who’s stats are comparable to Joe Johnsons. JJ/TEVANS/ MPG-37.7/37.4, PPG-21.3/20.8, RPG-4.2/5, APG-4.4/5, SPG-1/1.5 & FG%-.452/.459. If we had gotten him in the trade instead of JCrawford, with him being a rookie, what are the odds of Woodson giving him the ALaw/JTeague treatment instead of the JCrawford treatment?
As far as us drafting CP3 is concerned, you must remember he would have been a ROOKIE. Woodson had already publically stated his doubts about his ability before the draft, as well as PG DWilliams. So, you can pretty much count on the NBA being deprived of the talent, production and impact of CP3 if he had to play under Woodson. After all, we did have veterans TLue, AJohnson and SClaxton, and you know Woody’s philosophy of sitting rookie guards indefinitely, no matter what, and playing his vets.
Fundamentals
January 19th, 2010
10:24 pm
Ken,
Will you ever move on? I guess when Woodson does?
We all know about AC, Salim, Royal, ect, but have you checked their stats once they left the Hawks to “excellent” coaching. I’m not defending Woodson for being inconsistent with minutes for Teague, but come up with a new take and drop the we should’ve drafted so an so cause it ain’t helping our cause.
I agree Evans is an extremely rare talent. I’d guess he would excel in most any system. His size will give all of our guards fits tomorrow. Should be a good game. Just gotta hope Kevin Martin doesn’t pull a Nate Robinson on us.
Dan
January 19th, 2010
10:30 pm
I hate David Stern. Unreal…not that I am surprised, but I am amazed the guy makes no attempt to hide is love affair with the superstar players in the league.
Anytime the Hawks play the Cavs or Celtics, they are playing at an 8 on 5 disadvantage. The next time a shot clock problem like the Hawks had in Cleveland happens to the Cavs or C’s will be the first time.
Fundamentals
January 19th, 2010
10:31 pm
SAK seems to have a lot of bigs, but few shot blockers or folks on the boards. Should be a good night to showcase Al & Josh.
Fundamentals
January 19th, 2010
10:35 pm
Love the quote and commentary Ant Banks. We will definitely have to reach the ECF to begin to get respect, but Stern will only give us equality and preference when our team draws good national ratings. That will only come with high profile players and consistent wins. Being a great team pulling the underdog card wont work. We’ll have to earn our respect by winning at the highest level consistently. That is the nature of the NBA.
P from the C
January 19th, 2010
11:00 pm
If it wasn’t for that shot clock f-up Atlanta would have won the night before. Just win Atlanta.
TheAntiMe
January 19th, 2010
11:28 pm
There’s no way that Pope David is ever going to rule against either Saint LeBron or Saint Kobe or against their respective teams.
Just Saying
January 19th, 2010
11:47 pm
No one in the Hawks organization cares about this just like they don’t care we will get booted second round of playoffs again this year.
Keep buying those Chick-fil-A family plan tickets everyone and welcome Woodson back next season for that big second place eastern conference push they have planned for 2011 season.
bigstack19
January 20th, 2010
12:08 am
The NBA refs are horrible. They call fouls that are committed against marquee players like King Over-rated LeBron James when he isn’t even touched yet I watched a game recently where Horford basically got mugged and assaulted and a foul wasn’t called. As far as conspiracies, it always has struck me as odd how the Magic always fare so well when they are in the lottery yet the Hawks were God awful for years and got no higher than 2nd. The lottery is absurd anyway. What a lame ass way to determine the draft order. It isn’t as bad as say an All-Star game deciding homefield in a championship series, but it is close.
RaJaH
January 20th, 2010
7:17 am
Maybe this will be the chip that the Hawks need on their shoulder.
vava74
January 20th, 2010
7:33 am
The shot clock malfunctions was only one of the several horrible calls that went against the Hawks in that game. One in more than 20.
darrell starks
January 20th, 2010
8:12 am
NOW SEE THERE THEY GO AGIAN SORRY AZZ!!!!! DAVID PEACAN HEAD STERN.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!
Astro Joe
January 20th, 2010
8:18 am
Melvin, I could have swon Tech was playing Clemson tonight… I was looking forward to “scouting” Booker because you have been talking him up since last year. I’m sorry I missed the game, I’m sure that he’ll be on TV again soon.
OB, yeah, he’s small but I have wanted one of those Brandon Bass, Dajuan Blair, Jason Maxiell players for a while to come off the bench, grab boards and run the floor hard. Those tweeners have found a role as a key bench player for a bunch of teams (like Big Baby in Boston). I’ve also heard some good things about the shot-blocker from either Miss or Miss State (I’m sure Smauel knows who I am thinking about). With our roster and our record, the best we can expect is to draft a rotational player who will address a specifc niche. Energy and rebounding (like what Zaza used to bring consistently) in a powerful, athletic package would be cool to add to our current mix.
I read that Favors may go top 3.
O'Brien
January 20th, 2010
8:45 am
AJ,
Booker looked good last night. He is a load and very energetic. Favors has a lot of talent, but he is inconsistent, and picks up a lot of easy fouls. But he has a 9′ wingspan, and he has tons of potential.
Guys, check out Mark Bradley’s blog. He talks about 5 things that bother him about the Hawks:
1) The decline of Mike Bibby
2) Crawford and JJ not meshing as well as JJ and Bibby
3) Al Horford being underutilized (FYI, Combined, Bibby, JJ and Crawford have taken 742 more shots than Al and Josh combined)
4) Woody shrinking his bench
5) Hawks not dominant enough at home
Daniel
January 20th, 2010
9:14 am
O’breien- Booker did look very good last night. Sort of a poor man’s Paul Pierce. Favors does have some athletic ability, but I really haven’t seen a serious “game” from him, yet. Gani has really being playing great. He could be a nice piece in the second round for some team. Really mature guy with a great work ethic.
ant banks- I agree with some of your sentiment, but quoting Malcolm X in reference to a basketball game is largese and misguided. A people that our oppressed in a society due to their race, religion, or orientation is not comparable to a team getting unfair treatment by officials in a professional sport.
Malcolm’s statement was meant to reflect that people cannot expect those in power to benevolently give away their position, but it must be earned or “taken”. His statement was meant to be a reflection/reaction to Dr. King’s vision of non-violence and moral rightness being the catalyst for change. These are complicated and important concepts and should not be deamed by using them to justify a position about a game.
Daniel
January 20th, 2010
9:18 am
I meant demeaned
Mike is Back
January 20th, 2010
10:22 am
Ken, this time I gotta agree with you on Woody. He keep saying he not going to throw these kids to the Wolves…BUT BY DEPRIVING THEM OF PLAYING TIME…he is indirectly doing just that. When you throw them out there poorly prepared…you are still throwing them to the wolves. Go figure.
He can’t expect every PG they draft…to fit in the same box…daaaaaaaaam….bend yo box Woody…at lease once. This is the third time…You can’t blame this one on BK. heh heh
Not just Teague…MORRIS, JS, and COLLINS…they all look like they are ready to contribute.
It is becoming increasingly obvious that the Hawks will need to get more production from the bench…to perform at a HIGH LEVEL on a nightly base. We focus on JJ and Bibby minutes…but night in and night out AL and JOSH battle these BEHEMOTH IN THE POST…they never complain or make light of it… Now that you have some reserve Bigs that can contribute…why not use your reserves Bigs more to ease the wear and tear on your young SUPER STARS…that way they will something left in the tank for the playoff.
Over all…I still give WOODY a B+…THE HAWKS are the number three seed in the EAST…and in first place in their division…but there is still plenty room for improvement…before they reach that elite status.
B Fire
January 20th, 2010
10:31 am
I fired the NFL this year for just reasons. I was hoping to re-hire the NBA due to the Hawks resurgence. Obviously David “The Don” does not want “my fanny” in a Phillips Arena seat anytime soon!!!!!
ILL-logical
January 20th, 2010
10:53 am
A POSSIBLE solution to the current(ongoing in some minds) malaise the Hawks seem to be in: Since there is no money for free agents and only a marginal ability to trade, Mr. Sund could have a conversation with Woodson and “suggest” that coach Drew be given more responsiblity for the offense,INCLUDING the option of changing the starting line up.
While Mr. Sund has stated that his policy is to not get involved in coaching issues; something must be done now to avoid the result every commentator/analyst/ observer from the national media has warned against: when the ball stops moving the Hawks lose. And there are some who have openly commented on the predictability of the switching defense employed by the Hawks and how the better teams exploit it.
Perhaps some line up tweaks could spark ball movement and also ease some of the defensive pressure on the front court created by the backcourt’s lapses/ skills.At this point in the season there aren’t many options; Woodson is not going to change on his own because of his contract and Joe is pressing trying to play for his next contract so we left to try to work on the margins to improve on an already promising season to ensure the Hawks have the best chance to reach their full potential.
rick sund
January 20th, 2010
11:08 am
trade bibby for lebron.
dap01
January 20th, 2010
11:13 am
I am tired of seeing JJ play with a motive other than a team motive. I am tired of hearing that CMW is coaching for a motive other that the long term success of the Hawks.
BILLY KNIGHT
January 20th, 2010
11:46 am
Im call david stearn today and see whats up with that its clear that there was clock malfunction.
Mike is Back
January 20th, 2010
12:24 pm
I’m not going to dump on LBJ…with or without the ref…He is still a phenomenal athlete with super human strength…no denying that. Heck, I wish we had him. lol
However, I never gave any serious thought to the notion that Stearns would reverse a call…let alone a game against his adopted son…KING JAMES!! heh heh
Like Sund said…no since in looking back…time to move on…the Hawks still control their own destiny…THAT’S WHAT’S UP.
O'Brien
January 20th, 2010
12:31 pm
ILL-logical,
The Hawks do not need a lineup change. What they need is a change in offensive philosophy. When Acie was here and he brought the ball up, once he crossed half-court, he would give it to Flip, and then go stand by the 3 pt line off to the side(did anybody really think Flip would pass it?).
When Bibby brings the ball up, he gives it to JJ, and then he goes and stands at the top of the key, (so he can shoot if he gets it back) and there is little ball movement.
What the Hawks need to do is do NOT initiate the offense with JJ. Instead, go inside first, where Josh and Al are good passers, and both are shooting over 50% from the field. Show some ball movement, and that might even get JJ some more open looks.
Even if they start Teague instead of Bibby, he would bring the ball across half court, give it to JJ, and then go stand aout of the way. If they start Mo Evans instead of Marvin, he would stand off to the side and wait for JJ to kick it to him for a shot.
And the Hawks are #3 in the East, leading the SE division. I think a change in starting lineup sends the wrong message.
Fundamentals
January 20th, 2010
12:36 pm
Watch some tape on how the Pacers used Reggie Miller or how the Sonics used Ray Allen. Joe has the shot. He’s just gotta run the curls and plays that allow Josh or Al to kick the ball to him when he’s open and it’s time. It’ll also give our team a chance to know when to crash the offensive glass b/c they’ll know when and where the shot is coming from. Surely Sund can remember some of his days in Seattle?
Joe isn’t good at isolations and driving against 2 defenders. He’s awesome at shots in rhythem and open drives. We’re not using our pieces effectively.
You can’t tell me Marvin, Joe, Bibby, Crawford and Evans wouldn’t benefit from that type of system!
tidog
January 20th, 2010
12:56 pm
Most habits are hard to break. They can be as addictive as nicotiene. The Iso Joe offense has been in effect since Joe arrived. Hell, iso Joe was the only legit means to score for years. Now with the maturation of talent and the addition of talent Coach simply must do a better job. The end.
Daniel
January 20th, 2010
1:38 pm
Wow, to read these comments you would think this team is in last place and one of the worst offense teams in the league.
Both of which are not true.
You guys do realize that we are in the top of the league in scoring? Our losses have come at the expense of effort on defense?
Some times I think I must be watching a different team.
theZaZaguy
January 20th, 2010
1:48 pm
One word… inertia. It’s a powerful force. I agree with tidog that it is hard to break. But I think the hawks will do it. It’s just going to take a little longer than we as fans expect. Were Josh and Al as strong offensively 2 years ago or even last year? They’ve really come alive the first half, but it takes time for coaches to see it right away. Because coaching isn’t about one game or even 10 games, it’s recognizing patters throughout the whole season.
Woodson isn’t comfortable going away from his superstar and I don’t blame him, but he has shown an ability to grow with the players and being a “player’s coach” means that he ignores Josh and Al at his peril.
I predict that things will click come playoff time. We’ll move the ball better, fewer but better touches for Joe, and an all around game will emerge.
Then onto the finals.
Go hawks!
terrell
January 20th, 2010
1:50 pm
Would Woody dare put bibby on Tyreke Evans tonight? lol!
Raps Fan
January 20th, 2010
1:55 pm
Lol at you Hawks fans complaining about conspiracies. You guys did this stuff to us alone THREE TIMES!! Karma’s a bitch huh?
theZaZaguy
January 20th, 2010
1:55 pm
Bibby isn’t a bad as defender as he seems. He’s kind of wily and slick. And the number of times that he’s abused is more than made up by his positive turnover ratio.
Fundamentals
January 20th, 2010
2:07 pm
I’m with Daniel. Our losses are 100% due to lack of effort on the defensive end and rebounding. We also need Woodson to use all our pieces cohesively. It’s a maturity and professionalism problem from top to bottom – coaches to mario.
terrell
January 20th, 2010
2:17 pm
Give it up guys. Woody’s ran the same offense for 5 years.(Iso Joe) Do you really think ole stubborn butt is going to change his offensive philosophy in year 6?
Fundamentals
January 20th, 2010
2:22 pm
I think Woody is growing each and every year. He give some of the haters reason to fire him, and lovers plenty to love him for. Face it, it’s his first real head coaching job. He too has room to grow each year and improve. He’s starting to notice that he’s got some potential pieces inside. He’s trying to use them. It’s not going to happen overnight. Iso Joe was a necessity to get to the playoffs, now TEAM ball is required to go further. Don’t judge the man until after the chance has passed. He hasn’t passed or failed this next step. I think he’s well on his way to proving some folks wrong.
theZaZaguy
January 20th, 2010
2:27 pm
Change offensive philosophy? No. Use more of the tools at his disposal? yes. Teams started covering the smoove cut back-cut alley-oop. So we started doing the Bibby cutback alley-oop from Smoove. We do run plays. And believe it or not we’re using Iso-Joe less and less. Iso-joe was prominent because that was all we had. I mean, did you really want to depend on a ZaZa post-up when he started? Or a rookie Horford when he took the starting job? Horford is getting a lot more touches than last year. It just so happens we think he should get more. But it will come.
Patience terrel-san. The Karate kid didn’t hit his stride until about the 70th minute of the movie.
Fundamentals
January 20th, 2010
2:36 pm
ZaZa – you’re seeing what I’m seeing. I also think Woodson needs to go 10 deep every night to develop the entire team and to rest our starters. We’re headed for another injury plaqued playoffs.
GeeMack
January 20th, 2010
2:39 pm
Daniel,
Thanks for reminding me we are one of the top offensive teams in the league. Becaused based on the blog we are in last place, or we should be 40 and 0, but were not because alot of Hawks fans thinks Woody offense is horrible.
Fundamentals
Excellent observation people seem to think coaches can’t grow. Well like you stated Woody has gotten better.
theZaZaguy
I could not have said it better myself.
Astro Joe
January 20th, 2010
2:45 pm
Daniel, be careful… you sound like a Hawks fan.
Fundamentals
January 20th, 2010
2:55 pm
By next year or possibly by the end of this year Al & Josh will begin to dominate the touches. As they do, we’ll see Joe, Bibby & Crawford excel from easier looks. You can’t say you haven’t seen the shift to more post play since the season started. We’re a work in progress. Right now we’re headed in the right direction.
Daniel just wants effort night in and night out. AMEN to that argument.
Ken Strickland
January 20th, 2010
3:08 pm
FUNDAMENTALS-You answered your own question. I’m very much aware that I’ve made a consistent issue of Woodson and his numerous shortcomings, and their negative impact on the team. Although others have been just as vocal, I doubt if anyone else has been as detailed in pointing out his specific liabilities, and that’s why WOODY LOVERS have singled me out for their rath.
So far, there have been 1 or 2 WOODY LOVERS that’s make feable attempts to address anything I’ve said about Woodson. But most simply follow the old tactic of attacking the messenger, while avoiding the message/facts/truth. Think of all the guards that have had outstanding rookie seasons. Now think of whether any of them would have been given the opportunity to be as successful if there were more HC’s that shared Woodson stupid, old fashioned approach to dealing with rookies, especially rookie PG’s/SG’s.
What’s most disturbing is how you, and certain others, appear far more concerned about the consistency in which I, and certain others, complain about Woodson’s coaching inconsistency, liabilities and overall limitations, rather than the fact he continues to do the same stupid things we’ve been complaining about, which produces the same predictable results.
I hope we do a better job against the Kings tonight than we did against the Thunder. We need to start running, attacking the basket, playing inside out and moving the ball again, and stop playing WOODY BALL, with it’s predictable negative results. GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
Daniel
January 20th, 2010
3:16 pm
Gee, Astro and Fundamentals- thanks.
You know, why should we let things like the facts get in the way of a good argument.
Fundamentals knows exactly how I feel; the one thing that gets me angry is lack of effort. The rest I leave up to you know… the professionals.
Fundamentals
January 20th, 2010
3:22 pm
Ken, I see your point. I’m not proclaiming to love Woodson. I just pray every day he sees the light and continues to grow. Granted he does it slowly and honestly reverts back in times of adversity. He just can’t committ to a 10 man rotation because he fears for his job. Sadly he’d get the big bucks if he would develop them in time to help us in the playoffs. Time will tell, but I just don’t think the guards he “killed” were really that good. They definitely didn’t bloom elsewhere. Hopefully Teague has that talent. He seems different, and thus deserving of a chance.
The inside out game is coming. Al & Josh are coming along. In time we’ll move from our guard oriented offense regardless of Woodson’s ideals. Hopefully in time Teague or a quicker point will assume the healm and our team will be able to run and gun, while still dominating the 1/2 court offense with our post play. That’s the dream. Can Woodson get us there? Time will tell, time will tell. It’ll all be over in June. We’ll see where we/he/they end up.
Daniel
January 20th, 2010
3:51 pm
Just to back up my point the Hawks are currently number 1 in the Eastern conference in ppg at 102.8(7th overall). Clevland is ninth in the league at 101.9.
Wow, that horrible offensive “system” and isoJoe is just crippling this team.
Daniel
January 20th, 2010
3:53 pm
We are also 2cd in the EC to Boston in assists at 22.1 pg. Man, we never share the ball!! Joe just hogs the ball and Bibby never passes.
Daniel
January 20th, 2010
3:59 pm
Joe Johnson is 17th in the league in minutes per game behind Kobe, Lebron, Wallace, Gay, Roy, etc… Yeah, clearly Woodson rides his starters too hard not like those genius coaches: Phil Jackson, Larry Brown, Mike Brown, etc.
Yet, he is 12th in the league in scoring… you know because he is sooo inefficient.
terrell
January 20th, 2010
4:37 pm
Tell it like it is Ken. Tell it like it is.
terrell
January 20th, 2010
4:43 pm
Daniel, a lot of those assists come from the frontcourt.
Astro Joe
January 20th, 2010
5:06 pm
Sure Daniel, things look good if you ONLY look at the big picture… but if you focus on the individual grains of sand, it is clear to see that we are the one and only flawed team in the league. WTF is wrong with you?
Ken Strickland
January 20th, 2010
6:56 pm
FUNDAMENTALS-It’s obvious we share the same passion for the team, and place the team above any personal attachments to Woodson or any particular player. I know I tend to be overbearing when it comes to Woodson. I don’t dislike him personally, but I really do dislike his overall approach and philosophy towards coaching the Hawks and dealing with young players.
I was a Hawks fan during the days of John Drew, when we were losing frequently and fan support was poor. You could buy a $5 nose bleed ticket and sit anywhere you wanted, except directly behind the bench. Now that we finally have a really talented, versatile, athletic and deep team that’s capable of playing an exciting, uptempo, fastbreaking style of basketball, it just BURNS THE PURE HELL OUT OF ME TO SEE IT HELD BACK BECAUSE OF A STUBBORN, RIGID, SLOW REACTING, OUT OF DATE HC THAT CAN’T ADMIT OR ACCEPT THE NEED TO CHANGE, AND WHO’S OVERALL APPROACH IS HOPELESSLY GROUNDED IN THE PAST AND DETRIMENTAL TO OUR FUTURE.
If Woodson could improve overall as a HC, and adjust his outdated approach, I’d have no problems with resigning him to a longterm contract. But after 6yrs of his BS, I don’t see it happening. He’s still making excuses instead of changes and adjustments. For yrs, Woodson claimed that his excuse for playing his top 6-7 players into exhaustion was the lack of experience, size, versatility, depth and talent on his bench.
This yr, GM RSund not only resigned every player Woodson said he wanted back, he stocked this yrs bench with depth, experience, talent, versatility, height and size. And what has Sund gotten from Woodson for his efforts, the same stupid halfcourt reliance on WOODY BALL, slow to no use of strategy and/or adjustments, inconsistency, limited use of the bench, and the systematic throwing under the bus of rookie PG JTeague.
I WOULD JUST LOVE TO SEE OUR TALENTED HAWKS BENEFIT FROM THE DIRECTION AND INSTRUCTION OF AN UP TO DATE, PROGRESSIVE, FORWARD THINKING HC LIKE SCOTT BROOKS, WHO’S GETTING MAXIMUM PRODUCTION AND RESULTS FROM A TEAM THAT’S FAR LESS TALENTED AND EXPERIENCED THAN WE ARE.
I’m glad we’re winning, but when you consider the overall talent and depth on this team, it would be hard not to win and make the playoffs. I’m not satisfied with us having a winning season and making the playoffs, which is what I call FOOLS GOLD. In Dominique Wilkins’ heyday, there was MJordan and LBird standing in the way of a shot at the title. This yrs team has the overall talent, experience and ability to make it to the NBA finals. But the biggest obstacle standing in this teams way is its HC MIKE WOODSON, and the limitations he imposes on the team.
richbrave
January 20th, 2010
10:22 pm
KEN STRICK:
“FUNDAMENTALS-It’s obvious we share the same passion for the team, and place the team above any personal attachments to Woodson or any particular player. I know I tend to be overbearing when it comes to Woodson. I don’t dislike him personally, but I really do dislike his overall approach and philosophy towards coaching the Hawks and dealing with young players.”
I bow down to you, Sir, as you have coached, and I have not. Thanks for your input.
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