Post Dallas

Am I first? Shout out to MV7!! Congrats on the come back.

• Link
• Report this comment

Ken Sugiura
Hey Ken, in case no one else has said it, Thanks for stepping up and giving us something to address.

Post Dallas?

Good win, Its a long season. This team is still evolving. It has great character and good unity. Dont let Ken Strickland near them or all hell will break loose. The hate will begin!

Shout out to HC Mike Woodson. Keep up the good work! Way to work the game to game grind. Dont let them get too up or down, and what ever you do ,don’t let the loud negative few, disrupt the beauty and hard work this team is displaying. You guys are doing a great job! Maybe now Sund will find a way to get a real center for you to work the in and out game to perfection. Sund did a great job in Dallas, They have peaked and we are on our way up. We are equal to or better than Dallas now and a center away from competing for a title. This team has great chemistry.

Good Job Woodson and Hawks.

• Link
• Report this comment

“You may have seen this, but Toronto guard and former Georgia Tech star Jarrett Jack stopped during a game to tie his shoes while holding the ball. I’m not sure what’s worse, that he did it, or that the Bulls let him.”

Says a lot about those two teams and where they are headed. How much are those guys making? Not one should be a Hawks. What the ‘be nice’ were they thinking?

• Link
• Report this comment

Actually I think we should stop and analyze the season in 20 second increments. If he is losing in a 20 second time frame we can fire him and get the next coach in before the time out in over. Forget about a 82 games season and 4 or 5 game streaks, lets analyze every 20 seconds. Good Idea Ken Strickland, get Bob Weiss on the phone and tell him to be on stand by at the next game. – How far under .500 pct is he any way?

• Link
• Report this comment

I must commend you on this post ” Hawks real fan.”
Hawks real fan.

December 6th, 2009
12:00 am

You know ken, I thought I d list the hundreds of post that have ask you to STFU this year, and I thought I’d mention how many hawks fans have went elsewhere to appreciate the hawks season rather than continue to accept you and your few loud vocal Bubba Crew members who ignore facts and perpetuate your agenda of getting Woodson fired. Then I realize you can’t help yourself at this stage of your sickness.

The enjoyment of the season gets lost in your agenda of attacking Woodson relentlessly and you ask “why do none of the Woodson supporters answer you?”

Most of them are hawks fans and understand basketball, something you are nor and do not. You continue to argue the same tired point over, and over, and over again.Points that have no merit in the grand scheme of things.Like Ken Sugiura previous article “Move on”, there’s a message there if you can hear it.

You ask “why do none of the Woodson supporters answer you?”

Most of them are productive citizens in the community and have more important contributions to make than to address your maladjusted behavior and ignorant rants. That’s why you are likened to Rush Limbaugh. We have jobs, careers, families and communities where we are involved.

THE REASON’S MANY HAWK’S FANS DON’T RESPOND TO YOU?

Woodson has done, and is doing a fine job, so there is no need to respond.
The hawks are right where the experts said they would be. In fourth seed and will win between 47-51 games. Why should we ignore what the experts are saying and give your angry regurgitations more merit?
Although you and the bubba crew may have deceived Ken Sugiura into thinking your views are indicative of a synopsis of this blogs views what he doesn’t know is that most sane and legitimate Hawks fans have left realizing that you and your gang of thugs, have one mission in mind.
Like most of the guys I will go back to ignoring you and your posse, some of which are fictional characters you’ve created.
You have stolen a lot of joy out of this season already. It’s been a good season so far but you can’t tell listening to your negative mouth. In the last week countless people have ask you both gently and harshly to shut up.
You are unable to neither receive correction nor accept that you are wrong, so why bother?
You ask “why do none of the Woodson supporters answer you?”
Perhaps you should ask a psychiatrist

• Link
• Report this comment

Lou Hudson, we are in the same boat.

• Link
• Report this comment

It was good to see the amount of 3 pt shots attempted down. 10 would be a better average that the 18 we average now. Looked like Woody was explaining to Crawford his displeasure on one of the 3 pt shots.

Woody also seems better at yanking players when they are cold, except for JJ of course. It was good to see JJ get back on track.

I thought those flagrant 1’s energized Josh. He played great after that. When he is not on track, we really struggle.

• Link
• Report this comment

Ken you can use my name to post confusion all you want, as long as you plug and play my name for the coaching vacancy when you get woodson fired, Have you talked to OJ lately? I hope he gets out soon to help me and you with our plan… I promise I’ll make you assistant coach just like you asked!

• Link
• Report this comment

Mr.Sugiura,
Thanks for the new blog- the links are very helpful in getting some additiona; perspectives on the team and its performance. Hope that the new beat writer follows thas practice.
glad that the ajc management invested the resources to enable you to cover the game as well. A big deal in these times. Keep us posted.

• Link
• Report this comment

Thanks for the blog Ken.

Lose at home to the Knicks, beat Dallas in Dallas. The Hawks are so inconsistent, and its partly Woody’s fault. Sometimes we play uptempo, sometimes he utilizes his bench, sometimes the switching defense is minimized. I just hope we can become more consistent as the season goes on. It was a good win, but I didnt like the fact that JJ took 31 shots to get 24 points.

That being said, Hawks deserved the win, and I hope we can use it as a springboard to go on a nice winning streak again. Keep it going Hawks.

• Link
• Report this comment

Great game MV7!

• Link
• Report this comment

Mike Vick got to play against a rotten defense decimated by injuries. This is a triumphant return? I’ll tell you what a return is. When you can take the starting quarterback’s job and lead the team to victory. But that isnt going to happen because Vick isnt good enough to do it. He will return to the sideline for the rest of the season, getting his two plays a game just like it has been. The Eagles won the game before Vick ever even got in to play. They were just “throwing him a bone” pun intended, so he could look good for once this year after not letting his sorry azz play more than a snap or two every game. Vick used to be real good. Nowadasy he isnt. End of story. Eagles win because of mcNabb.

• Link
• Report this comment

http://www.humanhighlightblog.com/2009/12/torn-between-outcome-and-philosophy.html

correctly unsettling

• Link
• Report this comment

what a leader he is

• Link
• Report this comment

Shaq had 1 reb vs the Bucks today. My goodness, at his size and height. I think at least 2 rebs would fall in his hands without even blocking out…

• Link
• Report this comment

K

• Link
• Report this comment

KEN STRICKLAND:

So do you continue to belief that the other people who read this blog but whom you are not addressing by these names are too ignorant or stupid to figure out exactly who you are talking about? I guess we should just agree to disagree on this point and go on to another topic.

From my standpoint I think each year is different and must be addressed based on what is going on in that particular year. This year the Hawks have acquired Jeff Teague, Joe Smith and Jamal Crawford who are significant components of this year’s team. As I pointed out earlier this team overall has performed (so far) at a franchise best level considering only their won and lost record. If you want to criticize all of Woody’s failures then you have to also give him some measure of praise for the team’s successes.

The team has won more games on the road than any other team during Woody’s tenure. They have had more significant wins against really good teams on the road than anytime in the near past. And yes they have failed to take care of business against some weaker opponents. I imagine it is very difficult to learn how to fit all of the teams features together easily especially when so many parts of that team are mixed up with new members. I would imagine that it has been especially hard for JJ since he has been the featured prime time player for so long. It is hard to change the role you have had for so long. I imagine it has been especially hard for Jamal Crawford coming to a new team and no longer being a featured offensive threat but instead being relegated to the role of sixth man and having a coach who is asking him to play defense. I imagine it has to be hard for Jeff Teague to come into the pro’s without knowing exactly what his status will be and how he will fit in. I imagine it must be hard for Marvin Williams to see his role diminished as JC gets more playing time at his expense. ZaZa has also seen his role change as he adjusts to Joe Smith getting some of the burn he would normally have received. Bibby’s role requires an adjustment with the arrival of JC also. About the only people who have not been adversely affected by the changing roles are Josh and Al. Both of them seem to have thrived with the arrival of the new personnel. So for all of the faults many perceive Woody having there are things going on with this team that does require a period of adjustment. And yet this team has shown a new level of maturity. Last year’s team did not adjust well to the injury to Josh and the loss in Boston that changed the perception of the team. This year’s team does seem to be doing a better job of handling adversity. Sure there have been a few bad games. The four game stretch that ended with the Knicks game is one example. But even here they won one game during that stretch that last year they would have surely lost. And before we forget the euphoria of the opening stretch how many of you remember that in some of those games the team would open very lackadaisical in the first half only to really tighten down the defensive hatches come the fourth quarter.

I continue to believe that this year’s team may have a chance to be very special. I am not claiming that they are an “Elite” team yet. I will claim that they are on the cusp of becoming an elite team. And you never know when lightening will strike in a bottle. Special years happen occasionally. So for all of you out there who come on this blog and only want to complain and gripe about JJ or Marvin or Woody or poor offensive execution remember that there are at least a few of us who are really more concerned about enjoying a team playing at times with great ball movement and a sense of joy and purpose. One that offers an emerging star in Josh and an undersized center with more heart than almost any player I can remember playing on this team. And if this team sets a franchise record for most wins who will appreciate it more? Those who spend the entire season complaining about the teams faults or those who take delights in its highlights?

• Link
• Report this comment

SAUTEE-Before attending Indiana State, LBird enrolled at Indiana Univ, but promptly left after getting a taste of the real BKnight. He took a job collecting garbage when the Indiana State basketball coach saw him and persuaded him to come there and play for him. And the rest is history.

• Link
• Report this comment

Out side of ken and the bubba crew here is what others are saying about woodson, not to mention that he is still number # 2 on this years coach of the year poll. I think the negative view being regurgitated is the minority view mostly limited to this sites hate cell.

* All-Star
* Group: Squawkers
* Posts: 3,499
* Joined: 23-August 05
* Location:Clarksville, TN/Ft. Campbell, KY area

Posted 14 November 2009 – 12:22 PM
Mike Woodson is the NBA Coach of the Year.

There are a variety of things that has brought this about:

- He coaches Joe Johnson like he’s a superstar, which in turn, brings out the max in the Hawks Captain. Yes, we all know that JJ doesn’t have the talent of the 4 or 5 superstars in this league, but Woody coaches him like he is. The offensive and defensive responsibilities he puts on JJ has made him a more dangerous player that other teams have to treat with superstar attention.

But more importantly, it has made him a more mentally tougher player. While the 3 point shot isn’t there so far this year, the Captain is grinding every night, doing all he can to lead his team to victory . . even rebounding the basketball. And on the defensive end, Woody doesn’t hesitate to put JJ on the other teams best perimeter player, to try to slow or shut him down.

Superstar responsibility = a more dangerous Joe Johnson.

- It is Woody that has told this team as a whole, to drive the basketball whenever they can. Josh Smith has most been affected by this mindset, seeing that he’s a highly efficient offensive player now. LOL . . let me say that again. Josh Smith is now a highly efficient offensive player. While Jamal Crawford loves his jumpshot, even he is driving the ball to the hole at a much higher rate than he ever has. This has led to his efficiency as a ballplayer increasing.

The Hawks are #1 in the NBA in points in the paint. Let me say that again as well. The Hawks are #1 in the NBA in points in the paint. This is a complete contrast to a team that used to live to jack up long jumpers. Even Captain Johnson has laid off the 22 footer, and looked to get in the painted area to take his shot.

- He has not succumbed to the pressure of playing Teague, ( a guy who simply might not be ready yet ), a lot of minutes off the bench. Because of veteran guards like Bibby,Crawford, and Mo Evans on the roster to compliment JJ, he isn’t forced to throw Teague right into the fire. He knows that he’ll need Teague before the season is over, but he isn’t going to force feed the kid either.

- He has managed the Hawks rotation as well as he ever has in his career. While not only succumbing to not forcing minutes for Teague, he has also coached games more sensibly. While having the ability to go 10 deep, he’s using his depth according to the opponent we play. He’s not feeling obligated to give guys a set number of nightly minutes. Instead, he’s dishing out the minutes ( especially in the 2nd half ), according to how the Hawks match up against the other team.

And when the fan base were calling for the reduction of Mike Bibby’s minutes, he stuck right with Bibby, and his numbers now reflect the shooting he exhibited last season in November, with Bibby shooting in the mid 40% FG and over 40% 3FG.

The most important move, is the use of the 3-guard lineup of Bibby, Crawford, and Johnson. He’s using this lineup as his 2nd half offensive catalyst and possible closing lineup. The 4th quarter dominance of the Hawks can directly be credited to this move. With JJ and Crawford being very good shot creators, and Bibby being a deadly 3 point shooter, it prevents teams from employing alot of double teams against the Hawks. He’s smart enough not to start this group though, because the 3 guards do tend to dominate the ball, which would lessen the touches of Josh Smith and Horford.

All in all, Woody ( at least for 3 weeks ), has been one of the best coaches in the league. Because of that, he gets my early vote for Coach of the Year.

Great job Woody.

You guys can find this on hawks squawk.

• Link
• Report this comment

RLP-you obviously didn’t know who I was talking about or you likely wouldn’t have made it an issue, and that certainly isn’t an indication of any lack of intelligence on your part.

I’ve given Woodson credit more than once for holding this team together, keeping them focused and playing hard during the early yrs when all of the distractions with he and former GM BKnight and ownership were at their peak. I’ve also given him credit for perservering during times when the talent level, experience and maturity were in short supply and player turnover rather high(although he was partly responsible for that). The magnitude of those contribution alone cannot be measured. However, we’re way past the point where turmoil, lack of talent, maturity and experience are issues.

Going into his 6th yr as HC, we’re at the point now where I expect this team to have an identity, an established style of play, and for him to have an idea of how to develop young players, manage players mins and effectively utilize a deep, talented, experienced, versatile and more than adequately stocked bench.

The positive contributions Woodson has made to the success of this team in the past, and it’s winning record, still can’t erase the inexplicable lack of strategy, adjustments, bench use, player development, OFF/DEF inconsistency and the long periods of feast and famine this team has been going through the last 2-3yrs. CERTAINLY NOT AFTER 6YRS AS HC.

I look at it like this. MELVIN informed us that Shaq, a former Allstar and future HOFer recently managed to get only 1 rebound . The fact that Shaq has led 2 teams to multiple NBA titles in his past doesn’t excuse the rebounding futility he’s going through now. GIVE HIM CREDIT FOR WHAT HE’S DONE IN THE PAST, BUT HOLD HIM ACCOUNTABLE FOR WHAT HE’S NOT DOING TO HELP HIS TEAM NOW!

Pat Riley and PJackson have both won multiple NBA titles and both are sure fire HOFer’s. Yet, both were fired from the very teams they led to NBA titles. YOU DON’T HANG ON TO A COACH, NO MATTER WHAT HIS PAST ACCOMPLISHMENTS ARE, IF HE’S NOT CURRENTLY DOING WHAT’S NECESSARY TO GET THE TEAM WHERE IT WANTS OR NEEDS TO BE. It appears that a number of Atlanta fans have low expectations for the team and the franchise, which is likely why we have such a sorry and uneven history of success. Well, I’m not one of them. Instead of settling, I’m going to demand more of the team and the HC, no matter who that HC might be.

• Link
• Report this comment

I NO WE DISAGREE ALOT ON THE HAWKS BLOG BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY WE RESPECT ONE ANOTHER THATS WHY I LOVE THE HAWKS BLOG.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

Creating a controversy where non exists is evil.

• Link
• Report this comment

Ray – agreed on JoeS. He’s probably the most versatile player we have on the bench, due in no small part to his high basketball IQ. Woody should find more minutes for him, and I’m somewhat surprised that he hasn’t already.

O’Brien – you got it backwards. JJ took 24 shots to get 31 points. That’s actually pretty damned efficient, especially for a backcourt player.

Sautee – great post on the last blog. As for your only one so far on this one, it looks like a couple others beat me to it . In the interest of further fact checking, though, I’ve never read anything (and I’ve read 1 bio of Bird plus his autobio) that indicated that Knight was even in the top 5 reasons that Bird left IU. The size of the campus, treatment of Kent Benson (a well-known jackass), and just general homesickness were the main reasons.

• Link
• Report this comment

IF WE LOSE TO NJN NEXT SUNDAY, IT’S BECAUSE WOODSON WILL STUCK WITH OUR SUPERSTAR AL HORFORD ON BROOK LOPEZ, AND LOPEZ WILL DROP 30 AND 15 ON HIM.

WOODSON WILL REFUSE TO USE COLLINS OR ZAZA ENOUGH (OR AT ALL) AND WE WILL LOSE BECAUSE OF A BROOKS LOPEZ FIELD DAY. REFER BACK TO THIS COMMENT ON 12/6/09 AT 10:47 pm IN 7 DAYS TIME

• Link
• Report this comment

Medium Sized Ray – I refuse to use the adjective Big for anyone who congratulates that degenerate M. Vick for anything. Mayhaps you can stay on topic. This is a Hawks blog.

• Link
• Report this comment

Lopez will get that Azzzzzzza!

Horford better do some push ups. Lopez will take his lunch money. No body on the Hawks can stop him. Tell woodson to suit up if you want JeJe.

Lopez will show you what a center is about.

• Link
• Report this comment

Where are all the Woody haters at? Its after midnight, don’t you guys come out of your caves looking for blood or something? Come get this silver bullet…..

• Link
• Report this comment

Al is our center Lopez is their’s, Al is suppose to guard him.

• Link
• Report this comment

JeJe and TS: you’re on. Big Al wears him out. Lopez can’t catch him.
Even if I prefer Al at the [4] he’s still the 2nd best [5] in the East.
And if you’re cOY continues to go with him why are you not supporting the cOY.

• Link
• Report this comment

K.S.:
I’m perfectly happy with Big Al at the [5]. Reenforcements are what I am looking for. I suspect that I am looking at it from a different perspective.
Think about this: Al and Josh @ the forward positions, with a rangy athlete in the middle. Now that would force mr.w. to rely less on a perimeter/3 pt. shooting game. Of course Josh would have to be a slasher at the [3]. A real coach would demand that he only shoot off the offense and not launch 3’s.
We would still be able to play a 3 guard offense by returning Josh and Al to their old spots and playing Joe @ the 3.[or Marv]
Another thing a real coach could do is dictate to the other team which
team he wants on the floor by going Big or quick, rather than as mr.w. does which means letting the other team dictate to him [knicks].
None of this is anti Marv. I really like the young man in every respect. I do not think under the current set of circumstances that he will ever reach his full potential here.
As far as trades go, maybe Bibby will have to go before J.Teague will ever get his chance.
As we stand right now, I must agree with people, we are a 4 seed or worse. But it is time right now to challenge. Our guys are either in or nearing their prime. Treading water does not cut it. No more excuses about we are young. Those days are over. To quote a famous American:
“Git ‘er done” !

• Link
• Report this comment

If the hawks could get a real center, he would be on the perimeter defending guards just like Al.

Yup…although I think Al already is a real center.

• Link
• Report this comment

Brain Farting at the idiot club.

December 6th, 2009
10:20 pm

“Creating a controversy where non exists is evil.”

Well…… if THAT’S true, then

So what about this, is THIS evil?:

Brain Farting at the idiot club.

December 6th, 2009
11:04 pm

“Vick Kick Butt In the ATL…This is still Vicks house!”

Brain Farting at the idiot club.

December 6th, 2009
11:07 pm

“Lopez will get that Azzzzzzza!”

“Horford better do some push u”ps. Lopez will take his lunch money. No body on the Hawks can stop him. Tell woodson to suit up if you want JeJe.”

We’re 14-6 with Horford at Center. Is it evil to make a center controversy where there is none? Woody sure likes Horford as his Center.

Lopez will show you what a center is about.

• Link
• Report this comment

DEVIN HARRIS = QUICK PG.

BROOK = BIG THAT WOODSON WILL REFUSE TO MAKE ADJUSTMENTS AGAIN

MARK IT DOWN. HAWKS LOSE ON SUNDAY

• Link
• Report this comment

HARRIS IS SO QUICK THAT WE WILL JUST LEAVE BIBBY AND CRAWFORD TO ROT.

LOL @ THIS TEAM HAVING THE RECORD IT HAS. GARBAGE COACH WHO WEARS OUT STARTERS IN ORDER TO GET WINS.

WHAT A JOKE

THIS TEAM IS A TEASE

• Link
• Report this comment

Wednesday night, Horfy goes to war with Noah. I can’t stand that little Chia Pet Hair looking gator. Horfy will dominate, HEAT CHECK!

• Link
• Report this comment

KenSur, those are great questions pose to Woody…I thought he made some excellent responses. I think he is wise not to rush Teague…When you got big shot Bibby and Crawford…why not bring him alone slow.

Teague IS GOING TO BE A BIG GAME PLAYER…in my book…BUT I’M A TEAM GUY FIRST…and base on that Woody is doing a heluva job thus far.

There will be stretches where Teague will carries this team during the season…but first he go to put in work. I said Teague would probably handle the DNPs and spotty minutes better than the previous guys…I was right…the KID has charisma…you can’t teach that.

These, ain’t yo momma HAWKS FOLKS!!!

There is some TRUTH…IN THAT SERUM. lol

DOC, NC has reloaded…I seen the game between Kentucky and North Carolina this weekend…man they were competing at tournament level…that was a GREAT GAME. Kentucky was pushed to their limit…those may be THE TWO TEAMS TO WATCH.

It will be interesting to see GT and NC lock up…tell YO BOYS…they had better be ready…by mid-season NC might be unbeatable…and u no I’m with WF folk. Some much for NC dropping off…they don upgraded brooooooooooooo.

GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

Daniel,

You are an f’ing moron. How dare you make any judgments about me. I’ve been to hundreds of Hawks games in the past few years and have posted on Hawks blogs for a very long time.

Who gives a sh*t if they are the worst team in the NBA at a historic level? We have lost to the f’ing Knicks, Hornets (sans Chris Paul), Bobcats, and Pistons, all while we were at full health or close.
But according to you, I don’t watch the Hawks games. LOL, and who the HELL are you, exactly? Brook Lopez destroys us every time he plays us, and we know that Woodson DOES NOT use his backup bigs enough or efficiently. Why don’t you look at Brook Lopez’s game log this year and notice he has 24+ points in a ton of games.
In addition, Devin Harris is too fast for any player on this team to guard. I am worried about that game and there’s a good chance we lose it.
IT’S MY OPINION.

Why don’t you go to another blog and go piss off

• Link
• Report this comment

Yes, you!

• Link
• Report this comment

Its all about winning. Winning. Just win baby. win,win,win. Just win. do it. win!

• Link
• Report this comment

Id rather play Woody ball than no experience or understanding “ken” ball.” Quit b!tching because Woody wont play”ken” ball. Woody is a proven professional, you are a mental case in denial.

• Link
• Report this comment

Give it a rest! You will find this is an excellent post too.

RLP

December 6th, 2009
8:32 pm

KEN STRICKLAND:

So do you continue to belief that the other people who read this blog but whom you are not addressing by these names are too ignorant or stupid to figure out exactly who you are talking about? I guess we should just agree to disagree on this point and go on to another topic.

From my standpoint I think each year is different and must be addressed based on what is going on in that particular year. This year the Hawks have acquired Jeff Teague, Joe Smith and Jamal Crawford who are significant components of this year’s team. As I pointed out earlier this team overall has performed (so far) at a franchise best level considering only their won and lost record. If you want to criticize all of Woody’s failures then you have to also give him some measure of praise for the team’s successes.

The team has won more games on the road than any other team during Woody’s tenure. They have had more significant wins against really good teams on the road than anytime in the near past. And yes they have failed to take care of business against some weaker opponents. I imagine it is very difficult to learn how to fit all of the teams features together easily especially when so many parts of that team are mixed up with new members. I would imagine that it has been especially hard for JJ since he has been the featured prime time player for so long. It is hard to change the role you have had for so long. I imagine it has been especially hard for Jamal Crawford coming to a new team and no longer being a featured offensive threat but instead being relegated to the role of sixth man and having a coach who is asking him to play defense. I imagine it has to be hard for Jeff Teague to come into the pro’s without knowing exactly what his status will be and how he will fit in. I imagine it must be hard for Marvin Williams to see his role diminished as JC gets more playing time at his expense. ZaZa has also seen his role change as he adjusts to Joe Smith getting some of the burn he would normally have received. Bibby’s role requires an adjustment with the arrival of JC also. About the only people who have not been adversely affected by the changing roles are Josh and Al. Both of them seem to have thrived with the arrival of the new personnel. So for all of the faults many perceive Woody having there are things going on with this team that does require a period of adjustment. And yet this team has shown a new level of maturity. Last year’s team did not adjust well to the injury to Josh and the loss in Boston that changed the perception of the team. This year’s team does seem to be doing a better job of handling adversity. Sure there have been a few bad games. The four game stretch that ended with the Knicks game is one example. But even here they won one game during that stretch that last year they would have surely lost. And before we forget the euphoria of the opening stretch how many of you remember that in some of those games the team would open very lackadaisical in the first half only to really tighten down the defensive hatches come the fourth quarter.

I continue to believe that this year’s team may have a chance to be very special. I am not claiming that they are an “Elite” team yet. I will claim that they are on the cusp of becoming an elite team. And you never know when lightening will strike in a bottle. Special years happen occasionally. So for all of you out there who come on this blog and only want to complain and gripe about JJ or Marvin or Woody or poor offensive execution remember that there are at least a few of us who are really more concerned about enjoying a team playing at times with great ball movement and a sense of joy and purpose. One that offers an emerging star in Josh and an undersized center with more heart than almost any player I can remember playing on this team. And if this team sets a franchise record for most wins who will appreciate it more? Those who spend the entire season complaining about the teams faults or those who take delights in its highlights?

• Link
• Report this comment

I hope you enjoy the season!

• Link
• Report this comment

I appreciate your reach out Mr Strickland, as well as how you view and interpret the game. I can accept that you have a view. I don’t have a problem with switching to compensate for the short comings of horford, Bibby or any other player. They all have strengths and they all have weakness. Part of being a team is accepting that and working together as a unit to minimize weakness and maximize strengths.

I’m OK with it. Switch as much as you like.

I support my team and its coach. I’m enjoying the season. I hope that you will find something uplifting to focus on.

Good luck to you and have a nice day.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jerry West did those players check with Ken Strickland before demanding an extension for Woodson? Aren’t they aware that Ken is against Woodson? Sure ken is more knowledgeable than these professional players and know whats best for them. Arent they complaining about switching defense? You mean to tell me they happy with Woodson? I guess the Bubba crew needs to call a meeting!

The team and player view doesn’t matter what Ken says is________, I’ll let you fill in the blank

• Link
• Report this comment

“Not at all, man. I’ve been in this situation before. You know, I’ve played through contract situations, so it’s nothing new to me. I just have to stay focused and play my game. But I know that there’s no added pressure on Mike Woodson.

Me and him talk a lot. So…we’re just two guys, man, we’re playing this thing out. And we’re just looking forward to getting wins and making this team a better team as much as possible.”

• Link
• Report this comment

Absolutely. He’s been a great coach for us young guys. I mean …if he’s not here….who knows what position we’d be in.

Will everyone say that?

Absolutely. I think you’re gonna get that answer from anybody around the room. We have a lot of faith in coach Woodson. You know, he really brought us along the way. We were 19 year old kids. We’re 24-25 now. We’re definitely playing some pretty good basketball. So, he’s a big credit to that.

• Link
• Report this comment

Yeah….I mean, he’s proven himself. And…he’s a good coach. He’s a good coach. He’s a players’ coach. You know, he works hard just like we work hard. And anybody who’s bettered their record every year that he’s been a coach deserves a contract.

• Link
• Report this comment

This is flat-out hilarious… can’t wait to see the full feature.

• Link
• Report this comment

honest abe- I am one of those people, and I am not stupid. For the record, I actually predicted 52 wins at the begining of the season. I think that is far better than mediocre. You don’t have to agree with me on how the Hawks season is going, but since we are both making predicitions it is really unreasonable for you to suggest that it is “stupid”. Especially when you think we win 50 games, the differenc is 6-7 wins, c’mon man that is not that huge of a difference when looking at the next 62 games.

• Link
• Report this comment

Najeh Davenpoop, I thought that was a smoove rap, they ought to play that @ the nest.Thanks for the link.

Speaking of links. Great Link Jerry West. Now We Know!!!

To win 50 games, with out a legit center and a slow point guard is definitely an accomplishment. To win 57 would shatter all time Hawks records, so yeah, we are playing at a high level. You wont win them all. But if you maintain a certain level that’s whats important. Hawks are playing at a high level. The NBA knows it! RECOGNIZE.

Its nice to read so many positive hawks blog, and links. I dont subscribe to the “doom’s day prophecy” Ken. I am very happy with the team and its direction and its about time for Sund co-sign.

• Link
• Report this comment

I see canniblogging is at it’s best, and we’re not even at mid-season yet. Hooray…..

• Link
• Report this comment

What else are they gonna say?

Joe’s thinking: I’m leaving anyway? What do I care? Even if I stay he let’s me shoot as much as I want. I still get to be an all-star.

Why would Marv say anything but that – He’s had 1 real coach, 1 yr. in college. Really he knows nothing else. I’m willing to concede mr.w. is most likely better than marv’s AAU coaches.

Not exactly a ringing endorsement from Josh.

Players coach, give me a break.

Joe: “We are just two guys hanging out”: Lombardi, belichik, Bryant, Wooden, Thompson, Knight, Saban, Aurbach, Jackson, Old fella from Temple [name escapes] can you see that statement ever being made about them?

Joe Smith: PT…maybe. He’s here 1 yr. why create controversey?

I will concede that they may genuinely like the guy. I don’t know him.
I do not like his erratic, and jaded persona which manifests itself within or players performance.

• Link
• Report this comment

SAUTEE-I followed your suggestion and went over to the Falcons blog, and MAN. It reminded me of why I stopped making a regular appearance over there. There’s no reason to expect their attitudes to change because their attitudes are based on yrs, decades, even lifetimes of conditioning. MVick really isn’t their issue, just their justification.

The only equality that seems to appear on those types of blogs is centered around the level of ignorance and stupidity there is on both sides of the issue. Even PETA is virtually silent when animal abuse is reported unless it involves a celebrity like MVick. Their main interest is in getting publicity to spur donations.

Some of these same idiots that are using Vicks dogfighting exploits as their excuse for expressing their preconceived racist feelings, probably supported Sarah Palin, who liked to fly around with her friends at state expense in an airplane and indiscriminantly shoot moose and whatever else they fancied.

Then we have those equally moronic nuts who think if we bring back MVick he’ll do for this team what he didn’t do when he was here. These idiots insist on blaming everyone but Vick for getting involved with illegal dogfighting, getting caught, lying about it and getting convicted for it. I wish him luck, but not with the Falcons.

• Link
• Report this comment

http://www.celticsblog.com/2009/12/7/1189120/should-woodson-get-extension-hawk

• Link
• Report this comment

Mike Bibby returned to this team with a big pay cut. A favorite player to boo in Boston, it is clear Bibby is a key player on the Hawks roster, bringing mental toughness, and is a team leader. It is also clear Mike Woodson is a big reason Bibby returned and explains why…

I love him and I’ve had a lot of coaches in my time. For some coaches I say I like, and got along with, and some coaches I didn’t. You know, I mean I love Coach Woodson. He’s relaxed. He has fun. I think that’s what you got to do.

I love coming to work here and…I can talk to him. I can give him my input on the team and stuff like that and not a lot of coaches let you do that.

I don’t think, right now, I could be in a better situation and actually that’s another reason why I came here, came back here.

Just how… being comfortable with the coaching staff and my teammates.

How do you rate him with all the other coaches you played for?

Definitely one of the top. I’ve had a couple…I’ve had Lionel Hollins, umm….Rick Adelman and Coach Woodson’s right up there with those two, too.

Adelman? That’s rich company.

I mean… you get a lot of different type of attitudes and personalities with coaches. You know, some coaches are “this is my way” and ‘this is how we’re going to do it’ and you have coaches like Woodson, I mean just…I tell the guys….we got it good (here).

A lot of coaches that you (the Hawks players) probably wouldn’t like playing for. I mean, we have got a good situation with coach Woodson. He definitely deserves an extension.

• Link
• Report this comment

No danger there

• Link
• Report this comment

jerrywest:

Thats weird, why is the Celticsblog talking about whether or not the Hawks should get a new head coach? Why do they care?

• Link
• Report this comment

# Joe Johnson
$14,976,754
# Josh Smith
$10,800,000
# Jamal Crawford
$9,360,000
# Marvin Williams
$7,500,000
# Mike Bibby
$6,217,617
# Zaza Pachulia
$4,750,000
# Al Horford
$4,307,640
# Maurice Evans
$2,500,000
# Jeff Teague
$1,373,880
# Mario West
$1,000,497
# Randolph Morris
$855,189
# Joe Smith
$825,497
# Jason Collins
$825,497

• Link
• Report this comment

Either way you go they are winning and over .500 good point

• Link
• Report this comment

KenStrick, just a follow-up on our conversation about the organic growth by the Hawks in the off-season. In that post you at leased acknowledge that the organic growth by the Hawks has help to compensate for the moves made by the Big Three in the East…save for Orlando. lol

WELL…how can you make that statement about the organic growth by the hAWKS…without giving the coach and his staff credit for nurturing and cultivating that organic growth? Surly, the Hawks are far better off than they were before this whole odyssey began.

I was reminded by one of my cohorts at work…just how little talent Woody had to work with doing those lean years. You were here…Surely, you remember those dark days of mediocrity…Clyde should too. lol

I think we take for granted at times the difficulties of turning a bunch of raw talent into a contender. These Hawks are a fun and entertaining team to watch…the way they get after it on defense…yet they are still extremely raw. The thing that is the most impressive…is the road wins. Last season DALLAS would have run us out the gym after a back to back…especially after a lethargic game like we played against the Knicks. Again, I haven’t been able to see many games…too many obligation right now…but I feel like I hit the jack pot with the season tic.

No one is saying the Hawks will play this way all season…that would be insane…but when you look around the league…the Hawks are right there…Woody’s detractors should not easily overlook that feat.

HECK, even Mark Bradley said he would pay to see the Hawks play…and trust me…in Bradley hey day…his negative criticism of Woody easily far exceeded yours. lol

After that debacle in the Dome Sunday…my Hawks Tic are looking better and better…
Stick with a winner…and heed THE SERUM brooooooooooooo. Heh heh

MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU…GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

My bad, didn’t realize it inappropriate to respond to a post by another member. Animal torture is just not my thing.

Hope Teague gets some extended minutes Wed. Will be interesting to see him head to head vs Harris. Surely Bibby will not be trying to cover Devin.

Thanks to all for some great reading on this paper’s Hawks blogs. Many insightful comments and tons of 3 Stooges style comedy from the regulars. Some egos are off the chart. Everything from informative links to serious concern over the impact a particulare player will make on an upcoming game when they won’t even play due to placement on the IR. Priceless!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

TS: Why the bitterness? We actually, almost, are in agreement on a thing or two here and there. I actually agreed with some of your premis in the 12:08 PM post. There can be dissenting opinions between grownups w/o all the muckraking.

• Link
• Report this comment

GRANDAD-I actually find her to be a reasonably attractive women, but when it comes to politics, I find intelligence a far more attractive trait. And when it comes to intelligence, she’s a BEAR-RILLA. Aren’t we still waiting for her to name a single book or magazine shes ever read?

Have you noticed whenever I address TRUTH SERUM with a really strong point about him or his beloved COY, there suddenly appears a series of posts under different silly monikers in retaliation? He’s so limited in his ability to offer an intelligent defense and/or response to any logical challenge to his stance. He’s too insecure to offer any of these stupid responses in his name, so he uses other identities to launch his tirades, which are often heavily laced with vulgarity, a sure sign of a limited vocabulary and underdeveloped mentality. WHY DOESN’T HE/THEY JUST SAVE HIMSELF/THEMSELVES AND EVERYONE ELSE TIME AND EFFORT AND JUST POST UNDER THE NAME THAT BEST SUITS HIM, SYBIL. Afterall, a rose(psycho) by any other name is still a rose(psycho).

Did you see that caption about Teague showing improvement? Isn’t that virtually the same comment that was issued sometime last yr about OHunter? And, isn’t he still trying to remove parts of last yrs bench from his butt?

• Link
• Report this comment

BUT IF I JUST HAD A PENIS LIKE JOE MAMA, I WOULDNOT BE THE B!ITCH I AM NOW!

• Link
• Report this comment

Thanks Ken! I hope you are able to remove that b!tch in you. Good luck.

• Link
• Report this comment

Ken Strickland – W/O getting into politics, I must agree. My point on my friends was that [her looks] was their prime reason for voting for ‘her’, as I’m sure you understood. What’s that ol’ song………..
“A little on the Trashy Side”.

Ahh Sybil – You know on occasion, I see promise. Then….~!@#$%^&*….

J.Teague – It’s a crying shame. mr.w.’s comments are nothing more than a smokescreen. He has no intention of playing the young man. It’s so obvious that he is managing this team for a contract rather than most astute leaders who would be coaching to perpetuate their program and the franchise.

• Link
• Report this comment

TS: If you did not agree with the post then why re-post it, sir.
[12:08 PM]

• Link
• Report this comment

Good points

Mike is Back

December 7th, 2009
4:26 pm
KenStrick, just a follow-up on our conversation about the organic growth by the Hawks in the off-season. In that post you at leased acknowledge that the organic growth by the Hawks has help to compensate for the moves made by the Big Three in the East…save for Orlando. lol

WELL…how can you make that statement about the organic growth by the hAWKS…without giving the coach and his staff credit for nurturing and cultivating that organic growth? Surly, the Hawks are far better off than they were before this whole odyssey began.

I was reminded by one of my cohorts at work…just how little talent Woody had to work with doing those lean years. You were here…Surely, you remember those dark days of mediocrity…Clyde should too. lol

I think we take for granted at times the difficulties of turning a bunch of raw talent into a contender. These Hawks are a fun and entertaining team to watch…the way they get after it on defense…yet they are still extremely raw. The thing that is the most impressive…is the road wins. Last season DALLAS would have run us out the gym after a back to back…especially after a lethargic game like we played against the Knicks. Again, I haven’t been able to see many games…too many obligation right now…but I feel like I hit the jack pot with the season tic.

• Link
• Report this comment

ZaZa has also cut down on travelling. I remember he used to get 2-3 called every game, which means he did it every time he got the ball. I used to think I was special for yelling “ZaZa!” in a very gutteral voice, but others are doing it as well now so I don’t feel as special. But I’m the only one in my section, so that makes me feel a little better.

• Link
• Report this comment

theZaZaguy Yea, I remember that, I gave him the nick name “turnover waiting to happen.” Now I have confidence in his game. I think Id like to see Randolf Morris get a little more burn. Horford,Zaza and Morris should be maybe 20,20,8 minutes in the post. Morris has stepped his game up too.

• Link
• Report this comment

MIKE IS BACK-Go back and read my Dec 06, 9:32pm post and you’ll see where I’ve acknowledged giving Woodson credit for holding this team together under some very trying times for himself, the players and ownership. But I’m not willing to give him major credit for developing the players he’s been given when there are only 3 remaining draft picks on his roster after 4yrs in the lottery.

Are you willing to give him credit for developing JJ, Bibby, Crawford, Flip, MEvans, Joe Smith, JCollins, RMorris OHunter or Zaza? Can you honestly say his approach to developing PG JTeague is any different than the failed tactics he’s used to develop the other departed draft picks? Anyone can coach a team when there’s no expectation of winning, but now that there’s an expectation of winning, he’s rapidly showing he’s not up to the task.

Former GM Billy Knight and current GM RSund deserve the majority of the credit for the development of this team. When it was determined we needed an inside scorer, Smoove spent his time and money to live and work in Houston with Hakeem to develop his inside gm. What did Woodson do to accomodate those efforts? Did he modify his OFF to include going inside to Smoove? As we all know, but some refuse to admit, Smoove got so frustrated that he started floating outside to the 3pt line, which was were the ball usually was, and started hoisting jumpers to get involved in the OFF. WHAT KIND OF DEVELOPMENT ON WOODSON’S PART WAS THAT?

For the last 2yrs, there has been a constant series of complaints, some legimate, about the lack of development and/or inconsistency in Marvin, Smoove, and even Horford. My biggest complaint with Woodson, other than his inconsistency, is although he now has a quick, fast, athletic, experienced, talented, versatile and deep team, he’s still trying to coach it as if none of these things exist.

He complained and said he didn’t use his bench because it had no talent or experience. Well, this yrs bench has an abundance of both, and he’s still doing the same stupid crap. When he SStaudemire and ALaw, he complained and wouldn’t play them because he said he needed a player with actual PG skills. Well, he made the decision to draft PG JTeague and he’s still doing the same stupid crap with Teague.

Hell, everything on this team has developed but Woodson. There isn’t a NBA HC or assistant that couldn’t have gotten out of this team what Woodson has gotten, most could have gotten a lot more. His biggest contribution to this team has been the perserverance and direction he provided through those turbulent times, but on the court, he’s done very little by comparison.

His inconsistency, and obcession with having the team play WOODY BALL, is actually having an adverse effect. We’ve gone from leading the NBA in pts in the paint, fastbreak pts, shooting percentage, ranking near top in scoring(108PPG), rebounds(especially OFF), assists and wins over the 1st 13gms to having difficulty doing all of the above. The is the same thing that happened last yr.

I’m giving him credit for the underdevelopment of this team, especially over the last 2yrs.

• Link
• Report this comment

Enter your comments here

• Link
• Report this comment

Even a cave man can do it.

• Link
• Report this comment

IM CALL TED TURNER AND SEE IF WE CAN BUY THE HAWKS BACK.

• Link
• Report this comment

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nuzx7-PjwEo&feature=fvw

this is the type of assertiveness a real center will bring us.

• Link
• Report this comment

Those Det. teams did Isaiah have to sit and watch, gather experience through osmosis, take a turn around the league, not get thrown to the wolves too quickly by Coach Daly. Was it his 2nd or 3rd yr. before he got traded to San Francisco or were they already GS by then. Oh! Never mind, they had a real coach, who was interested in developing talent and setting his team on a path for a championship. Kudos to HOF Coach Daly! Also to Isiah [the plyr] top 50 all-time, HOF, playing career.
Off topic but kudos to D.Rodman an all-time great who rarely if ever gets the credit he deserves. Even though he was a nut-case, no one
played harder, rebounded better for his size, nor was a better team player (virtually unnoticed by most), or defender. Except for his attn.getting devices (strangeness) he was all that any coach could/would ever want in a player!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

Rick Mahorn > hmmmm > errily similar to young Mr. Horford.
MaHorn: 6-10, 260, pos. C.
MaHorford: 6-10, 240, pos. C.
RM goes on the Adkin’s diet and we’ve got the same player.

• Link
• Report this comment

Rick Mahorn was the power forward, Laimbeer was the center.

If Al took Steroids he could be a power forward like Mahorn.

• Link
• Report this comment

Let me clarify, I meant that Bill Laimbeer wasn’t a real low post center like Shaq or Hakeem. His offense consisted of floating to the top of the key and drilling the jumper (which Jon Kontract try to emulate). He and Mahorn defended and rebounded well, just like our two headed rebounding monster.

They didn’t have a Shaq or Hakeem that could get points down low at the end of a close playoff game. They did it by forcing turnovers, rebounding well, and finding the hot hand whether it was Isaiah, Dumars, or Vinnie (the microwave).

That is how the hawks will go deep in the playoffs. Their atheleticism and team chemistry is very similar to that Pistons team.

The Hawks and the Celtics schooled the pistons through most of the 80s until they peaked. And they didn’t peak until most of the guys were in their late twenties. Our core is in their mid twenties. I see great things ahead even without a dominant 5.

• Link
• Report this comment

And people knock Josh and Al for being small. They’re both 6′9″, but they play bigger for some reason.

• Link
• Report this comment

I am a Vick fan. Yes, he did badly and made poor decision. I dont throw out the baby with the bath water, neither am I unforgiving or unable to see the racism behind his conviction. 2 Months before he was arrested the crime he committed was a misdemeanor. Im very proud of him that he has chosen to renounce his ways and be the best person he can be from this time forward. Im a fan of the underdog(pun intended), and Vick is an underdog.

• Link
• Report this comment

Truth Serum,

Having fun today, I see. Don’t worry about waking me up. The wife managed to do that this morning while I was sleeping really good, and enjoying the day off. Happens every time, I swear….

Grandad ,

I understand yours and Truth Serum’s issues with our lack of size. There is an alternative to this issue, but I’m not sure it’s anymore feasible at this point than simply adding a bigger guy to the roster, and moving Al to the PF position.

I hate to go back to the “Detroit Model”, as I feel that our team doesn’t fit it. However, there is a reason why it was liked. And it’s what Woody was doing with that awful switching defense. The switching defense isn’t a problem if you 1) Have an entire team that buys into it, and 2) Have the kind of personnel that are capable of executing it.

Detroit had great team defense, the kind that only needed the two Wallaces to cover up mistakes on occasion. They also had length, strength, and/or toughness at each position. What each player may give up in size, they made up in length. What they make give up in height or weight, they made up in near perfect, consistent execution and toughness. Billups could guard 1s and 2s. Rip Hamilton could guard mostly 2s, but also some smaller 3s. Prince had the length and quickness to bother anybody but 5s and the bigger 4s. ‘Sheed and Big Ben had the length and strength to handle 4s and 5s, and got help from Prince when they needed.

Thing is, they all bought into it, and nobody was caught totally or consistently in a mismatch nightmare. It was very hard to exploit their defense.

Not so with Atlanta. Bibby has enough trouble guarding his own position, much less a bigger player (most 2s or 3s). JJ can guard some 1s, most 2s, and some 3s, but he doesn’t do it all game, as the team needs him more on offense (though lately the contrary is certainly arguable). Either way, he doesn’t do it all the time.

Marvin can guard 3s, some 2s, and some 4s. Not always committed, however.

Josh is the greatest help defender in the game. He can guard 3s and 4s, but has to avoid direct confrontation with many 5s.

Al can guard most 5s, and some 4s.

But the problem begins at guard. Which is why our undersized frontcourt is continually exposed….

• Link
• Report this comment

Truth Serum ,

I don’t dislike him, and as I said, I forgive him. I’m glad he’s casting off his past and trying to do the best for himself and his family in the future. I hope he’s cast off those friends and relatives as well. Bottom line, those a$$holes are the ones who dragged him down. He let them use his money to have some illegal fun, and then they turned on him when the interrogations started. You can call it a racist situation if you want, and you may be right. What I see is a man’s own friends dragging him down to save their own asses. What I see is a justice system that found a high profile target.

Vick wasn’t prosecuted because he was black. It was because he was rich and famous. Had he lived next door to me or you, it would have barely made the local papers.

And screw PETA. Somebody needs to send their asses to some version of Jurassic Park so they can hug those dinosaurs, along with the trees.

• Link
• Report this comment

Furthermore we could be in a better situation if we had chosen the path of supporting a young man who had made some very poor decisions.

I get where you’re going with this, but we’d still have been out of a starting quarterback for two years. That, and nobody was sure what the League Commissioner was going to do. Who were we going to play in the meantime, Redman? You see how THAT’S going.

• Link
• Report this comment

Ray its a combination of both one was gasoline the other was fire.

• Link
• Report this comment

Where do I co-sign Big Ray? Ditto.

• Link
• Report this comment

The only thing I don’t agree with is the switching defense. We actually are winning in spite of it. For example, look how we got beat when Smith got ejected from the New York game. Everybody wants to blame Horford for not protecting the rim, but forgets that this switch defense is exactly what kept drawing him AWAY from the rim.

Mike D’Antoni knew this, and they kept running plays that brought David Lee away from the basket, which pulled Horford right along with him. That left protecting the rim up to Marvin and a bunch of guards. It failed, as expected, and the Knicks ran us out of the gym with layups.

We win because we can play enough lock-down defense for enough stretches in games, and because we can score. Dallas was one game that we won without scoring, only because the Mavs shot nearly as bad as we did, because we defended the heck out of them as well. That, and Joe actually shot well (’cause no one else was). But if teams find ways to exploit our switching, then we have to outscore them.

• Link
• Report this comment

Ray your above post is a gem. Its where I’m at with the big picture but it has beeen difficult finding someone to go there with.

In my opinion this problem of getting of the few good centers is not new to the NBA. Its about as old as the league. Being a GM is not a unskilled position. Behind the doors , there is leverage, dirty pool, hustles and moves. Thats why I posed the question earlier(an echo from a question some one else asked) Why is the Boston Celtics interested in whether Sund offers a Contract to Woodson? There is some ulterior motive why the Celtics publicity page is pumping this story, seeing that we are fast becoming their chief challengers and have proven we can kick their butts. Message sent! So why are they running this players comment story about Woodson? Is it possible Woodson has Docs number and they need to disrupt our growth? Remember when Detroit put that move on us with the Kontact Move?- (credit theZaZaGuy ).

Woodson is good for the Hawks and they are within a year or two…. a player or two from the top. Boston knows this, just like Detroit knew back in the day.

Im sure you caught the link. But just in case;

http://www.celticsblog.com/2009/12/7/1189120/should-woodson-get-extension-hawk

Its up to Sund now to show his talents or lack there of. How good is his pool. How strong is his hustle? Can he force a hand, use some leverage?

He built Dallas but they have never crested the top, never got over the hump stuck in the good but not great mode. Is this going to be the Hawks destiny too?

• Link
• Report this comment

Ray we can agree to disagree and move on.
The switch works because of the personnel we have. If a major piece like Josh is taken out of the equation sure, It comes unglued. People blame horford for not being the physical presence that you hope for in a center. OK. I have no problem with that. But like you said. hes the best we have for the spot so we have to play with him there. I don’t think Josh is going to get throw out of every game. I hope not. He has a lot of responsibilities. Just because we compensate for the lack of talent in key area’s with the switch doesn’t mean that the switch is with out weaknesses. It is however the best defense for this team to help Bibby from getting backed down and Horford from getting exploited. When our personnel changes then our options will to.

Right now we are winning considerably more than we are losing. Thats a key point.

• Link
• Report this comment

Grandad,

I’d take any of the three off the bench. Don’t have any idea how we could get any of them though.

• Link
• Report this comment

Saying AHorford is a NATURAL PF is like saying 6′10″ 240lb Willis Reed was a natural center because he played the position in college and made the Allstar team playing the position. He also became an Allstar playing PF next to center Walt Bellamy as well.

Elvin Hayes was an All American center in college and earned NBA ROY and Allstar honors his rookie yr while playing center. He also earned Allstar honors and won a title or 2 while playing PF next to Wes Unseld, 6′7″ 260lbs HOF and top 50 CENTER, would likely be considered a NATURAL PF by you as well.

Is Allen Iverson a NATURAL PG, because he had his most successful season while playing SG next to PG Eric Snow under HC LBrown. Stop all of this crap about natural this and natural that. Some players are just talented and versatile enough to successfully play more than 1 or 2 positions. If they can do it successfully, they should be labeled NATURAL ATHLETES if anything.

It’s revealing how all of you who are so fond of categorizing Horford as a so called NATURAL PF or undersized center, are the same one’s campaigning for us to acquire another center. And in most cases, the centers most of you want as his replacement, usually aren’t more than an inch taller and not much bigger, if as big. TOO MANY SELF SERVING AGENDAS.

• Link
• Report this comment

TRUTH SERUM-The Hawks are already in the 6th yr of their rebuilding plan under Woodson and you’re saying he needs another 2yrs to get there. He’s gotten rid of all but 3 of our previous draft picks, and he’s taking so long to get the job done the only FA signees on the roster that he’s willing to play will be approaching retirement soon.

In other words, you’re saying that although we’ve made the playoffs 2 consecutive yrs, won 47gms and advanced to the 2nd rd of last yrs playoffs, Woodson needs another 2yrs to do better? Hell, during Woodson’s 8yr plan, the Hawks will have had 2GM’s, ownership will have resolved their legal issues and Teague’s rookie contract will be expiring while we’re still waiting on Woodson to make this team better within the next 2yrs, WOW. I GUESS IT’S OBVIOUS TO EVERYONE THAT NO OTHER HC COULD HAVE DONE A BETTER JOB WITH THIS TEAM OVER A 6YR PERIOD THAN WOODSON, WITH ANOTHER 2YRS NEEDED TO FINISH THE JOB.

• Link
• Report this comment

They have only had five years of work to make that determination.

Six year Hornets’ coach, Byron Scott, was fired for a 3-6 record following a poor playoff showing the year before.

Seven year Nets’ coach, Lawrence Frank, was fired for working the Nets plan and far harder than his players did.

Mike Woodson’s done everything that has been asked of him for 5 straight years, yet had to survive one reported attempted firing from a GM (Billy Knight) who quit afterwards, and is being scrutinized by that GM’s replacement, Mr. Rick Sund.

To be fair, Sund believed enough to give Woodson a ‘show me more’ two year extension that ends at the end of this season.

It sounds like Woodson is a survivor. But he’s really been far more that. He’s been downright successful – anyway you want you to measure it. So the delay and non-negotiations until this year is finished are, on the surface, simply puzzling.
Yet, through ownership turmoil and a change of general managers, the Atlanta Hawks have improved 5 straight years. Navigating that rise is head coach Mike Woodson.

Is there any truth to Woodson not being a good tactician?

Joe Smith…

So far this year, (it’s) been so good. Every night different teams are going to present us something different. I think he does a good job of watching enough film, him and his staff do a good job of watching that film and trying to put us in the best situation to be successful out there.

Might there even be a bit of similarity between Woodson and Rivers in the people skills department?

Joe Smith…

I haven’t played for Doc, but outside looking in, I can see the resemblance. And if I never played for Coach Woodson, I’d have never known that. So I really can’t speak on both sides but I know he brings a lot of light to our locker room.

Like the stock market, Mike’s team’s annual jumps have climbed a ‘wall of worry’. Or maybe it is a ‘wall of expectations’. From the youngest team in the league to a second round playoff team last season, they have moved forward every…single….year. But, just like the Cavaliers, and just like the Magic before them, they are not without their doubters.

Keeping score? It goes like this…. 13, 26, 30, 37, and 47 wins. This season, the beat goes on as the Hawks are currently 14-6 and two games off the EC lead to the Orlando Magic.

Credit
Should Woodson Get Extension?: Hawk Players Say Yes

Tiny by tenaciousT on Dec 7, 2009 1:17 PM EST

• Link
• Report this comment

If I were Sund Id sign Woodson to a 3-4 year contract. He deserves it.

• Link
• Report this comment

Question of the day to me is why is Boston covering the Woodson saga through the players view? Why is Boston concerned?

• Link
• Report this comment

Ken Strick is funny.

He doesn’t want to take a 20 game snapshot to project how we’re playing, but would rather take a 7 game snapshot of inconsistent play, and us that to justify his rants. Of course, he’ll say it’s because it’s the most recent 7 games, but it’s still an innacurate reflection of how this team has played overall.

Honestly, you could spin this anyway you want.

- we’won 14 out of 20 overall
- we’ve won 10 out of our last 14 games
- we’ve lost 4 of our last 7 games
- we’ve won 3 of our last 5 games

Take your pick

To me, the major thing that separates good teams from bad teams, are LOSING STREAKS. Bad teams routinely go through 4 to 8-game losing streaks. Even when they play well for a week, you can’t count on that, because they may lose 6 in a row.

Good teams may have a week or two where they play inconsistent at times. And they might have a real bad stretch ( for them ) in which they may lose 3 to 5 games in a row. But overall, they take care of business.

Great teams hardly ever go through even a 3 game losing streak. They tend to dominate teams, and maybe drop a game here or there against a mediocre team. Most of the losses great teams suffer, are against good teams on the road.

This time last year, we had already gone through a 4-game losing streak. This year . . . . only a 2-game losing streak. And we’re winning games that would’ve been automatic losses last year:

- get embarrassed by the Lakers, but then turn around and gut out a win @ Portland? ( traditionally one of the toughest places to play in the league )

- a bad loss to a Bobcat team ( after traveling cross country ), but turn around and manhandle Denver at home?

- get embarrassed by Orlando, but turn around and win in Philly? ( although they were banged up )

- lose a bad game vs the Knicks, but turn around and win in Dallas? ( a place we hadn’t won at in the Woodson era )

Those are 3 road wins that we’d almost surely lose last year. And the home back to back vs Denver, even without Kenyon Martin, would’ve probably have been a loss as well. By the way, 3 of these wins occured on the 2nd night of a back to back.

It’s ironic though. Most Hawk fans feel that Woody should use his bench more. But in 3 of our last 4 losses, the +/- numbers of Crawford, Zaza, Evans, and Joe Smith have been significantly lower than most of our starters..

Even in the Detroit game, in which JJ shot 5 – 19 FG, he only had a +/- number of -1, while

But here are the +/- numbers of our bench in that game:

Crawford: -7
Zaza: -9
Evans: – 5
Joe Smith: -5

And if you look at the Knick, and Hornet game, it’s the same occurence.

In fact, you saw this trend where most of the bench had a significant negative +/- rating in games, compared to the starters, vs:

Indiana
@ Boston
Portland
Houston

And it’s occuring even when we have only one or two of these guys are on the floor. It’s one of the reasons why the only positive +/- lineup we have, are the lineup with the starters, and the lineup with Crawford in place of Marvin. All other 5 man lineups are either near zero or below zero in the +/- department.

The HAWKS are only showing that they may not be a great team. But they’ve more than shown most of the characteristics of a good team. A team that should win 50+ games.

• Link
• Report this comment

“this is the type of assertiveness a real center will bring us.”

For the record, I don’t agree at all with your repeated assertions that Horford’s lack of size in the post is hurting the Hawks regularly. But I thought I would mention that Andrew Bynum was picked 8 spots after Marvin Williams, so it’s not like the Hawks didn’t have a chance to draft him.

Just another example of NBA GMs not doing their homework and unfairly undervaluing a player that chose not to play in the NCAA.

• Link
• Report this comment

Also, comparing heights of players 40 years ago to heights of players now is stupid. Elgin Baylor scored 27 points per game as a 6′5″ forward. As someone pointed out earlier, Bill Russell won 11 titles at 6′9″ playing center. Forty years ago, the idea of a 6′9″ 260 pound player initiating the offense from the perimeter would have been unthinkable. Players have gotten significantly bigger since the beginning of the NBA. Keep your comparisons limited to the last twenty years or so.

• Link
• Report this comment

Ken, I happen to be of the same mind set as North Clyde. I think you are micro analyzing to justify your view, which, has clearly been proven erroneous.I am enjoy this season. The team is play @or above the “Professional”, analyst prediction. We keep getting better and better. Whether you look at this in 10or 20 game snippets we are doing very well. I think its better to look at it in the first half of the season and the second half. You seem desperate. If you dont mind, I wont bother you but Im going to try and connect with people who are excited about the direction the hawks are moving in and are joyfully dancing about this season.

May I suggest that maybe you could create a doom and gloom blog page, and every five minutes you can look for a reason to tear down the Hawks successes. Yes, right now…Woodson= COY

Good post NorthClyde!

Najeh Davenpoop. That’s a point well taken. There were 7 other teams that passed on him too…. which doesn’t excuse us. But your point is exact. As hard as it is to get a legit center and a corner stone of a franchise how could we….

That still hurts to day. Had we made the right choice we wouldn’t have to worry about our guards getting beat as KevinA is addressing. A good center changes the why the game is played. Defending guards will slant you towards their center and dare you to cut that way and cover you from the other angle.

Also every one wants a quick guard.They get faster every year it seems. The younger ones are faster than the older ones and the smaller ones over the bigger ones. At one point there was a move on to switch to big guards. Magic became the prototype, A 6′9″ point guard who could handle the ball and run like a gazelle. It turned out he was a freak of nature and a rare find.

The center is usually the fail safe against getting beat in the paint against guards whose sole purpose is to break down defenses by penetrating the paint and scoring or dishing.

KevinA and I have agreed to disagree with out radical confrontation or disrespect. We actually agree on most point. Our area of disagreement is whether the defense and or offense starts inside as i believe or outside as Kevin subscribes.

Id rather have the center as assurance in case you beat my guard to the spot. Kevin, I believe, would rather have a guard that you cant beat.

All of that to say although I don’t completely agree, Kevin, I enjoy your post and can see the merit in your point.

Yes, thank God for Josh!

• Link
• Report this comment

JeJe- This will be the last time I post anything on this subject with you. My statement was made in response to your statement that “LOL @THIS TEAM’S RECORD. WE HAVE A GARBAGE COACH THAT OVER USES THE STARTERS. WHAT A JOKE. THIS TEAM IS A TEASE” You of course based this assertion on the fact that Devin Harris and Brook Lopez would completely dominate the Hawks, Horford “self-proclaimed superstar” (can anyone tell me when Horford described himself as a superstar?) would be smacked around, etc…

I do realize the error of my ways in addressing anyone who posts in all caps. Clearly, I made a mistake there, and since you are not willing to remain civil, I would again ask you not to address me in the future.

• Link
• Report this comment

I assure you Horford thinks he’s a superstar

• Link
• Report this comment

NORTHCLYDE-talk about spinning it any way you want. What I actually said was you can’t use a 20gms sample to project the potential outcome for the entire season. I didn’t say you couldn’t use it to judge how the team was currently performing. And along those lines, how would you say the Hawks are currently performing? Do you judge them by the first 13gms(11-2), the last 7(3-4), or do you single out gms like the Toronto blowout(146pts) or the strong Dallas win and pretend everything else is fine, since we’re 14-6.

When we were winning 11 out of our first 13 gms, we were doing the following:

(1) Playing uptempo, pushing the ball and attacking the basket rather than settling for jumpshots and playing ISO and one on one.

(2) Scoring a lot of easy NBA leading fastbreak baskets, which allowed us to average 108PPG, which ranked 5th.

(3) Rank near the top of the NBA in RPG, APG and OFF RPG.

(4) Lead the NBA in pts in the paint, which were high percentage shots that allowed us to lead the NBA in shooting percentage.

(5) Effectively utilized a 10 man rotation that took pressure off the starters.

Starting with the loss against New Orleans, can you say we’ve come close to matching any of the above accomplishments? Do we ignore the fact we’ve suddenly done what amounts to a 180 degree turnaround in what we so successfully did during that streak. Because we’re 14-6, do we ignore the fact we’ve gone from averaging 108PPG during that 13gm stretch, to suddenly having trouble reaching 90pts.

Because we still have a winning record, do we pretend not to notice we’ve gone from leading the NBA in wins and other OFF categories to a stagnant, jumpshooting, ISO, one on one team that struggles to score and win. Because we’re 14-6 do we continue pretending not to notice how teams are now outrebounding and scoring more fastbreak and pts in the paint than us, while shooting a higher percentage. We were NBA leaders in these areas during our streak.

Do we pretend not to notice how Woodson has gone into his coaching shell and started to totally ignore his bench beyond a 7-8 man rotation. What about the fact he’s started to ride JJ’s back to the tune of 40+mpg just 20gms into the season. Hell, he’s already coaching scared. But that’s all right, because we’re 14-6.

After being 7gms removed from our solid, if not spectacular start, why can’t or won’t Woodson get the team back to doing the things that were done to get us off to that solid start? Why add fuel to the fire of our 7gms stetch of inconsistency and futility by continuing to do all of the things as a HC that has contributed to these types of lulls in the past?

BUT, ACCORDING TO SOME, WE HAVE NOTHING TO WORRY ABOUT. WOODSON IS DOING AN OUTSTANDING JOB, AND WE’RE STILL 14-6, EVEN THOUGH WE’RE PLAYING POORLY IN EVERY PHASE OF THE GM AND STRUGGLING TO DEFEAT WEAK TEAMS AT HOME. AFTER ALL, WOODSON LED US TO THAT 11-2 EARLY SEASON MARK, AND ALL OF OUR CURRENT STRUGGLES CAN BE ATTRIBUTED JJ, MARVIN, HORFORD, BIBBY AND/OR SMOOVE, BUT NOT WOODSONS. THESE PLAYERS JUST GOT TIRED OF RUNNING, SCORING, REBOUNDING, PASSING, GOING INSIDE, DEFENDING, WINNING AND PLAYING AN UPTEMPO STYLE OF BALL AND DECIDED THEY WOULD MUCH RATHER PLAY WOODY BALL AND STRUGGLE IN EVERY PHASE OF THE GM. BS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Since we’re starting our 2nd set of 20gms, we’re due to immediately come out of our OFF/DEF funk and start another 7gm winning streak and win 11 out of 13. It can happen, especially if we pretend we’re still playing like the team that played the first 13gms instead of the current team that’s struggled to win 3 of the last 7.

• Link
• Report this comment

ILL-LOGICAL-you’ve made an excellent point, and it goes straight to my comment about Woodson putting the limitations and/or asperations of certain players ahead of team interests. No thinking HC with any type of coaching ability would completely alter the entire OFF approach of a team that’s winning at an 11-2 clip and enjoying a 7gm winning streak would jeopodize all of that to accomodate an already slow footed PG when he has greased lightning on the bench in Teague. He should have benched Bibby and taken advantage of an excellent opportunity to give Teague some valuable time running a team that was dominating the NBA at the time.

A good HC will aways seize an opportunity to turn a negative into a positive, not make a bad situation worse. I have absolutely no doubt Woodson wants to win a badly as anyone associated with the gm. But, he seems obcessed with wanting to win with his players and team playing the halfcourt, jumpshooting, guard dominated, DEF minded style of ball he seems to value and cherish above all else, instead of the fastbreaking, uptempo, attacking style that results show favors his players and team.

I DON’T WANT HIM FIRED BECAUSE HE’S NOT A GOOD HC, BUT BECAUSE AT THIS POINT, HE’S PROVEN NOT TO BE A GOOD HC FOR THE HAWKS.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay

• Link
• Report this comment

player/coaches squawks

• Link
• Report this comment

I guess youd like to think that you covered both sides but you did not. You only made the case for his getting fired. Whatever.

• Link
• Report this comment

I hope my comments aren’t being censored on here. I thought my long winded post was a good one? I’ve posted it twice, but I don’t even see it.

LOL . . this is why I stay on the Squawk.

• Link
• Report this comment

Noah’s going to need an ark to withstand Horford’s storm!

• Link
• Report this comment