Hawks starters good for 20 hot minutes
HAWKSVILLE – So this is what the preseason looks like when your team is good enough to know that it means nothing.
The starters play sparingly. You don’t really care if your team wins or loses. And you get to know the free agent campers and rookies a little more than you probably want to in some cases. But until we get closer to the “real” games, this is it.
With a group of reporters in his office 90 minutes before the opening tip of Monday’s game against Charlotte at Philips Arena, Hawks coach Mike Woodson admitted as much, when asked when he was going to unleash his starters for more than 20 hot minutes (by time you finish here they should be done for the night).
“When we get to Washington (Oct. 19), Miami (Oct. 22 in Jacksonville) and Orlando (Oct. 23 in Dwightlando on ESPN),” Woodson said. “Those last three [preseason games], that’s when we’ll really start to burn these guys, because those a three teams we’re going to see.”
The Hawks are going to see all three of those teams in the Southeast Division race and in the Eastern Conference playoff chase all season long. So there’s logic behind this strategy of picking and choosing when you want to press the issue in the preseason and when you want to pull back.
As recently as last year Woodson was in winning-is-everything-even-in-the-preseason mode, to the eventual detriment of his own team (if you ask me). Guys like Joe Johnson and Josh Smith and Al Horford logged way too many minutes in the preseason last year. But Woodson insisted he was trying to teach his team how to win, even if that meant winning games that essentially meant nothing.
His mood has changed completely since then. Credit those back-to-back playoff trips, and the wisdom that comes along with them, for changing Woodson’s ways. You can credit whomever and whatever you want. Just be glad that you can watch games this time of year knowing that your team has every reason to be confident that wins and losses in October (at least early October) have no bearing on what might transpire over the next six months.
FORMER HAWKS IN THE MIX
Guys who used to wear Hawks jerseys were in the crosshairs Monday night here in Atlanta and elsewhere. Flip Murray rolled into the building with the Bobcats but didn’t play against the Hawks (something about a sore shin). Former Hawks swingman Josh Childress (below talking with my main man Branson Wright) was at the Q in Cleveland with his Olympiacos teammates, playing against LeBron and Shaq and the Cavaliers. Their replacements weren’t on the floor Monday night either. Jamal Crawford (calf) and Mo Evans (bone bruise) are still resting for the Hawks and probably will be until this time next week.
| Branson Wright talks with Josh Childress |
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243 comments Add your comment
Melvin
October 12th, 2009
11:17 pm
Interesting statements by Woody and Josh. Who will break their word first…lol
“I know one thing,” Woodson said. “I have to get him more touches to the point where he’s more of a threat. Between him and Zaza [Pachulia], we need to be able to muster at least 20 points a night. If we can get Al at about 12 or 13 points and double digit rebounds and Zaza somewhere around eight to 10 points, then we’re talking.”
“I’m keeping my mouth shut,” Josh Smith said as he exited the floor after Brown was ejected. “I’m keeping my mouth shut.”
Najeh Davenpoop
October 12th, 2009
11:19 pm
Once again, preseason don’t mean sh*t. The two things that stand out at me from this box score are Teague’s 7 dimes and Josh Smith’s 5/10 free throw shooting. The first number is good, the second not so good. I’m not worried about the starters’ numbers in the flow of the game, but there’s no excuse for shooting 50% from the line at any time — that can’t be explained away by the game being meaningless. As for Teague, I think the bench players’ numbers matter more, because even if they are guaranteed a roster spot like Teague they are still playing for something (in Teague’s case, playing time).
Reggie (The Bird and Indian)
October 12th, 2009
11:22 pm
I’m looking forward to Teague a lot. I hope to see him playing a lot of minutes against guys like CP3, DWILL, Felton, and Parker. Bibby can’t run with them but I think Teague can.
Melvin
October 12th, 2009
11:24 pm
Complete highlights from the Hawks/Bobcats game tonight. Jeff Teague is a player…
http://www.nba.com/video/games/hawks/2009/10/12/0010900045_cha_atl_recap.nba/index.html?ls=gt1hp0010900045
bigdave
October 12th, 2009
11:24 pm
thoughts on Rush and the Rams…?
Reggie (The Bird and Indian)
October 12th, 2009
11:30 pm
The Rams just need to try anything. Steven Jackson still hasn’t scored a TD all year for my fantasy team!
bigdave
October 12th, 2009
11:52 pm
Reggie…
just thought id ask… Steven A’s comments sparked it… i swear he makes me puke every time he speaks…
cp
October 12th, 2009
11:53 pm
Teague is a player. He has great speed and looks to get to the rim. The difference Ive noticed so far between him and law is Teague’s ability to finish at the rim. Law could always get to the hoop but had trouble finishing. I think a lot of guys are going to ask themselves how they let Teague fall to 19. I think we got a steal. His play-making ability also looks better than advertised coming out of college. I know he is going to have his ups and downs but I think we took the right guy….. Hunter had another solid game. Right now Dixon is looking better than Mario. And why did we sign Collins?
Ken Strickland
October 13th, 2009
2:32 am
It’s official, SAMUEL says Cleveland and LeBron will win the East and the top 3 teams are so much better than the Hawks there’s absolutely no reason for us to even play Boston, Cleveland or Orlando this season. He also feels there’s no way Shaq will be as detrimental to the Cavaliers as he was to the Suns. Now, the Suns were a premier outside shooting team with a dynamic PG(SNash) and PF(AStaudamire), yet he still had a negative effect on them. Cleveland isn’t even in the Suns class as an outside shooting team and they don’t have a dynamic PG or PF.
Along with ANDO, I’ll bet you were convinced Philly would be much better than the Hawks after acquiring EBrand last yr. With the starting lineup you listed for Cleveland, we’d have the advantage at SG, PF and center. LeBron is the only Cleveland player that’s shown he’s capable of matching the scoring ability of our backup PG JCrawford. Who do they have that can match the speed, quickness and demonstrated OFF potential of PG JTeague? Zaza can more than match Ilgauskus, especially at this stage of his career, and Joe Smith certainly knows them well enough to be effective since he played for them last yr. JCollins gives us the size we lacked last yr to compete against them inside and RMorris gives us added depth and versatility. I’m not saying as a team, we’re as good right now as they are, but I just don’t see that BIG GAP you keep referencing, especially when it come to Orlando.
Ariose
October 13th, 2009
5:27 am
Is Bibby a Liability for Atlanta?
http://www.nba.com/video/channels/nba_tv/2009/10/10/20091010_atl_scout.nba/
That voice is creepy though lol…
Ariose
October 13th, 2009
5:36 am
Hawks will be SE division Champs…..
vava74
October 13th, 2009
5:56 am
Ken,
I think that you just got caught up with the “optimism flu”…
I am also very very optimist about our future but I am truly convinced that this will not be our year yet.
I think we will do well (#3 seed and maybe conference final if we do not match up with Cleveland or at least a seven gamer in the semis if we do match up with them).
JJ will renew and next year we will rock with Teague taking over from Bibby who will be the seasoned vet at the point coming off the bench with his savvy and long range daggers.
vava74
October 13th, 2009
6:51 am
Both Marvin and Josh’s spin moves looked terrific (Marvin’s was sick!).
Teague looked really good, however, let us not get too carried away.
Both layups shown on the video highlights came in plays where he was matched up against Dontell Jefferson, whoever that is…
Melvin
October 13th, 2009
7:58 am
Vava,
You are right, JT move was against a lesser known but we cant deny the talent to complete the move. I will admit, I didnt know this Kid was that good. I think the Hawks got a steal picking him at 19. Heck, I haven’t seen any highlights during preseason worth mention of the other PGs pick ahead of him. We gotta comeup with a nickname for him…
TRUTH-SERUM
October 13th, 2009
8:05 am
DUH?!!
“I know one thing,” Woodson said. “I have to get him more touches to the point where he’s more of a threat. Between him and Zaza [Pachulia], we need to be able to muster at least 20 points a night. If we can get Al at about 12 or 13 points and double digit rebounds and Zaza somewhere around eight to 10 points, then we’re talking.”
DUH!!
I WONDER WHAT OFFENSIVE TOOLS THE POWERFORWARD WILL USE AGAINST CENTERS WHO ARENT MASQUERADING POWERFOWARDS. NEITHER ZAZA NOR HORFORD CAN CREATE THEIR OWN SHOTS AND WILL TAKE THE OFFENSE OUT OF RYTHEM TRYING TO SET THEM. ZAZA IS A TURNOVER WAITING TO HAPPEN AND HORFORD HAS VERY LIMITED OFFENSIVE TOOLS.
vava74
October 13th, 2009
8:06 am
Let’s make a first list of suggestions, select the best and then make a poll to vote the winning name!!
Maybe he will adopt it!!
vava74
October 13th, 2009
8:13 am
Thruth Serum,
We were all wondering what had happened to you… we were missing your constructive contributions!
Maybe the sight of Zaza dunking woke you up from your slumber…
Daniel
October 13th, 2009
8:28 am
caught the highlight package. Loved the Marvin move in the paint. If we get more of that from him this year, we will really push for a 3 seed.
Teague looks so quick and aggressive on the court. Yes, Vava it was against a camp player, but he will mostly be going against second unit guys this year.
As for nicknames, one suggestion (I don’t know just came to mind)
JT-0, like the GT0(sports car)?
Daniel
October 13th, 2009
8:28 am
There goes Vava poking him with a stick.
vava74
October 13th, 2009
8:59 am
Daniel,
Nice suggestion! The analogy with the sports car is excellent, fitting both his quickness and the number.
I support it unequivocally! JT-0!
vava74
October 13th, 2009
9:05 am
I meant to say: “…his initials (phonetically) and number”
TRUTH-SERUM
October 13th, 2009
9:20 am
vava74
Yeah… even a broke clock is right twice a day!!
A grade for your humor… I got block when the discussion of whether Horford or Josh is better. Apparently my input was being censored, and I’m not surprised or discouraged.. Bottom line is Josh is much better than Horford.
Horford has good basic skill and is a sound blue collar worker. He puts up average numbers against the other power forwards who masquerade as centers, which to me makes him about average. You cant win championship with average. Josh on the other hand is significantly better than Al in jumping, blocking and intimidating. Josh can create his own shots and horford need to be set up or hope for a put back from a rebound (garbage points). Josh brings an attitude to the game and has an players edge in competition. Josh is clearly a better power forward who can lead a break and can pass too.- point forward anyone…?
TRUTH-SERUM
October 13th, 2009
9:23 am
Josh can back a player down and finishish with the best of the nba, al cant back anyone down.
niremetal
October 13th, 2009
9:36 am
I lvoe JT-0 too. To make it even better, we can call him “Little JT-O,” in homage to Ronny and the Daytonas.
C’mon and turn it on, wind it up, blow it out, JT-0
niremetal
October 13th, 2009
9:37 am
*love
vava74
October 13th, 2009
9:50 am
Truth Serum,
You are obviously entitled to your opinion, however, I think you disregard certain aspects of the game which are extremely important in my opinion.
Al is a much superior on-the-ball defender than Josh is.
There is no question that Josh is an excellent help defender and intimidator, however, his inferior man defence (in relation to Al’s) makes him a defensive liability against the more offensively gifted PFs of the game.
I also agree that Al is not (at least not yet) a true C however, as someone as mentioned around here, this is not NBA2K10 and we have to accept what can be achieved cap wise and market wise.
If you told me, get Howard for Horford, I would agree, however, that is not an option and there are not too many actual Centers out there which I would take over Al.
Apart from Howard, only Duncan and Shaq (as a short term things), Bynum (if he gets his head and legs right, which is something that is not certain at all) and Brook Lopez (which ability and physical durability levels are not yet certain).
Actually, I don’t think that there are any which would be a true upgrade in relation to Horford (don’t bring up Al Jefferson who also is not a C and defensively is a highway to the hoop).
I also believe that you neglect another extremely important factor for success in a team sport: the intangibles which some players bring and some others don’t.
Al Horford has an excellent character and is a hard working, un-selfish young player who brings a lot to the table collectively.
vava74
October 13th, 2009
9:52 am
Sekou!
Pass on to the guys our nickname suggestion: we want Teague to be known as JT-0!
I don’t think we need any other suggestions nor a poll! I’m sold!
Melvin
October 13th, 2009
9:59 am
JT-O, sounds good to me as well…
Melvin
October 13th, 2009
10:00 am
Vava,
You know Sam is going to get you for talking about AL Jefferson like that…
TRUTH-SERUM
October 13th, 2009
10:08 am
Why dont we call him rumeal teague robinson, or Acie teague law…what ever happen to that russian guard we drafted in the late ninties?
Daniel
October 13th, 2009
10:23 am
wow- I am flattered that my nickname suggestion is getting such good reviews. Love the reference Nire. Anyone who is good with computers(I am not) could photoshop a pic of Jeff in a GTO with the new letters.
Daniel
October 13th, 2009
10:36 am
In terms of Josh and Al, I would not say that Al is a better player at this point than Josh. But, I also wouldn’t say that Josh is CLEARLY the better player. They both have strengths and weaknesses, both are still young and developing. I am glad to have both on our team, and both are starters in the NBA and should be.
ILL-logical
October 13th, 2009
10:39 am
Sekou, good piece on ZaZa’s new restaurant. I learned two things from the article: First, ZaZa did do some due diligence before the purchase and Woodson has a real estate company.
These types of stories could use some further development because the off court activities of the Hawks are for the most part positive and the stories help solidify their community support and standing. Thanks for the what I hope was the first instalment.
TRUTH-SERUM
October 13th, 2009
10:57 am
Vava There is not enough meat of disagreement with what you feel and what my opinion is. I like Horford hes a blue collar worker who doesnt have good offensive tools but his a nice person and a good worker. Josh hasnt peaked. Al has. Josh is a star bordering superstar. Yes, he intimidates and does block shots well. He can back you down and score. Al cant. Josh plays the game above the rim. Al plays the game for territory. Josh is clearly a better player although there styles are different. I dont find enough disagreement in our views to spark a debate. They are both assest. But when and if we get a center, Al will be the back up to Josh and the new center. In that case Josh starts over al.
TRUTH-SERUM
October 13th, 2009
10:58 am
he is a nice
their styles
assets
niremetal
October 13th, 2009
11:02 am
Co-sign ILL.
Daniel
October 13th, 2009
11:12 am
Ill- I missed that article, where is it?
Today’s Celtics Links 10/13 « Flceltsfan’s Weblog
October 13th, 2009
11:30 am
[...] Attitude Green Street Pierce Turning 32 Going on 20 Garnett: The wings are coming AJC Hawks’ starters won’t be out here long, so take a good look Patriot Ledger Celtics’ captain Pierce feeling fit as he celebrates 32nd birthday Da [...]
vava74
October 13th, 2009
11:37 am
Truth Serum,
I don’t think that Al has peaked. There we disagree strongly, even if his numbers do not evolve dramatically, he can still become more effective (for instance, I think his defence will continue to improve for at least 3/4 years until it peaks).
I think that a midway solution could be viable for us: to get a C/PF backup for Al and Josh who has a good offensive game and that could come in to keep interior defences honest (for instance, if we found someone with Curry’s bulk and offensive game).
In the absence of that, I think that contrary to your vision, we are moderately well with Zaza, who is a perfectly acceptable backup C/PF (who also brings excellent intangibles).
The problems come when we hope for the moon and the moon is out of reach.
I really believe that the only way forward for the Hawks is steady progress and a strong team concept. Hence, I am completely against any trades, given my perception that the limit of the current roster’s potential is still unknown.
gwite
October 13th, 2009
12:15 pm
“Hawks Trim Preseason Roster
Tuesday, October 13, 2009
By Micah Hart
As we move closer to the start of the regular season, we know the Hawks will have to trim some players to get at least to the league maximum of 15 roster spots.
Tuesday the Hawks got a little bit closer to that number, as they requested waivers on guards Aaron Miles and Frank Robinson.
Not a huge surprise with the depth the Hawks have in the backcourt, but we certainly wish both players well in the future.”
http://www.hawksbasketblog.com/
Gamarjoba
October 13th, 2009
12:29 pm
Al’s better than what Mr. Truthiness thinks. And if you don’t think Zaza can score, you haven’t been watching the Hawks for the past few years.
Ramon
October 13th, 2009
1:22 pm
Al is a solid pro. Josh is an All Star pro. Josh is better, and will continue to be better. The Hawks struggles more if Josh goes down, than if Al goes down.
niremetal
October 13th, 2009
1:58 pm
Funny. I seem to remember the Hawks going 5-7 when Al went down and 6-6 went Josh went down. Must have dreamt that.
Methinks that Al is more important to this team’s success that you’re giving him credit for.
niremetal
October 13th, 2009
2:06 pm
And actually, the injury to Horford was the only time this year that the Hawks didn’t follow their usual pattern of winning a couple games after a starter goes down and then starting to struggle. The Hawks lost back-to-back games right off the bat, and went 5-7 during one of the easiest schedule segments of the season. Amazing how short some people’s memories are…we struggled mightily when Horford went down.
TRUTH-SERUM
October 13th, 2009
2:12 pm
vava74
October 13th, 2009
11:37 am
Yeah I do think Al is about as good as he gets. You dont and you think he will be better in three quarters of a year. OK I appreciate your opinion. Its not enought for me to dispel or address. Nothing you have said merits any further response. Al is a nice man an a decent pf who has limited offensive skills. You disagree. OK nice chatting with you.
TRUTH-SERUM
October 13th, 2009
2:14 pm
Ramon
Ill co-sign that. Its readily apparent. Good call.
The Truth
October 13th, 2009
2:22 pm
I was at the last night and I thoroughly enjoyed watching the backcourt tandem of Teague and J Dixon. Dixon is making a strong case for a roster spot. Woody apparently has a strong eye on him as he logged the most minutes of any invitee. For those who miss Flip Murray, Dixon plays like he could be the consolation prize as an aggressive combo guard. When Teague often draw double team, Dixon made them paid as he was on his game last night.
Ariose
October 13th, 2009
2:25 pm
Franchise Guys?
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/features/vince_thomas/10/13/franchise/index.html
The Truth
October 13th, 2009
2:25 pm
Correction: Dixon made them pay as he was on his game last night.
Ariose
October 13th, 2009
2:26 pm
Dixon sucks…..trust me. I’ve seen him play a ton over the years…..just…..no.