Did Johnson makes the right call?
Did Joe Johnson make the right call on not signing a contract extension with the Hawks? Time will tell. But you can bet the topic will be debated daily until the end of this Hawks season, when he becomes an unrestricted free agent.
HAWKSVILLE – Much has been and will be made about Joe Johnson’s decision to bypass signing an extension with the Hawks and become a free agent at the end of this NBA season.
And rightfully so.
In the minds of us common folk, the idea of staring down $60-plus million more dollars seems laughable in these harsh economic times. But Johnson is not one of us (common folk), and there are at least $70 million reasons for that. He also has something professional athletes have maybe once or twice, if they are lucky, in their entire careers — LEVERAGE.
By playing out the final year of his deal he’ll become a free agent in the summer of 2010, joining guys like LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh in a deep free agent class that has as many as a dozen different (financially capable) teams around the league salivating. So in that regard, he’d have been crazy to sign an extension for just four years if he stands to get not only another year but millions more by becoming a free agent next summer.
My email was flooded Tuesday afternoon by people wondering what JJ was thinking. Fans of the Hawks, writers from around the league and concerned citizens all wanted to know why he’d so such a thing. My response to everyone was the same, why wouldn’t he maximize his leverage at this time? Teams do so all the time when their players are free agents. In recent years the Hawks have had Josh Smith, Josh Childress, Marvin Williams, Mike Bibby and Zaza Pachulia play out the final years of their deals without an extension. In almost every case things have worked out well for both sides.
It’s simply a part of the business of basketball that Johnson explained to me the other day. He could have saved his words. I get it. I don’t assume that his loyalty is somehow in question because he turned down the offer, the same way I don’t (always) question a team’s loyalty when they allow a player to finish out his deal before deciding just how much they want to invest in said player for the future. Again, it’s called leverage.
The reality in all these instances is pretty clear, you have a player for the life of his contract unless a decision is made to change that dynamic. And it’s always for better (JJ) or worse (Flip Murray’s deal was just one year), through sickness (or injury in Speedy Claxton’s case) and in health (Smith has been as durable as any player I can remember through the first five seasons of his career).
I dare anyone to suggest that the Hawks haven’t squeezed every ounce of benefit they could out of having JJ on the roster – he’s got the mileage on his body to prove it if anyone wants to inspect the tread on his tires. He’s been to three straight All-Star games and for at least the better part of his first two years he carried this team on his shoulders as the youngsters grew up and learned the nuances of the NBA game. That’s why it’s so hard for me to digest some of the venom pointed in his direction now.
As I suggested in a comment on the previous post, the idea of a highly motivated All-Star in the prime of his career itching to take his game to another level (for any reason) is an ideal situation for your team. As good as JJ has been in the past, you have to think he’ll be even better this year with the seasoned and talented roster the Hawks have in place, not to mention the quality additions to the roster like Jamal Crawford and Jeff Teague in the backcourt and Joe Smith and Jason Collins in the frontcourt.
It’s the same argument made here by many when Smith, Childress, Williams and the like were put in a similar position as pending free agents in the final year of their respective deals.
Whether or not JJ made the right call for JJ remains to be seen. And we likely won’t have a solid answer until next summer’s free agent frenzy plays itself out. But there’s no way the Hawks can lose in the meantime. No way.
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366 comments Add your comment
newkid
October 1st, 2009
4:15 pm
niremetal, your assertion rings true that JJ gave up the ball in Phoenix to teammates, but the Phoenix chapter is but one in the novel that one has to read if one’s to understand his proclivities with the Hawks. Clearly he was surrounded by talent (much of it superior to his) in Phoenix. I’d argue that if you wish to understand his Hawks behavior, you must look at Joe’s court habits in college and high school where he was clearly the most talented on his side. He did everything for his team in high school (scoring, rebounding, everything); he did just about everything for his team in college. He had too; he was the cream of the crop. For the first four years in Atlanta he must have felt the same, so why wouldn’t he revert to his high school and college habits? He’s not to be ostracized for such habits when it obvious no one else on the side could get it done. Not sure that’s where we are 09/10. The question is does Joe still think he’s the only one on the side capable of carrying the load? Does he want to be the only one on the side carrying the load? Did he leave Phoenix because he wanted to be the only one on the side to carry the load? Just asking.
Enter your comments here
But what do I know
October 1st, 2009
4:45 pm
Niremetal, you have & WTF have to know JJ, i have never seen anyone that doesn’t know someone take up for them like you do! Look, All i saying is The Hawks put JJ on the spot! The already knew that he wasn’t gonna extend his contract before they made the offer! I had heard about it a month ago. so, to me the hawks are the blame for all this mess! Look, JJ is Good for a Hawks Player but he is not an Elite player in this league! When Dwade & Kobe or Lebron or Melo play against each other the challenge is competitve! JOE JOHNSON DOES NOT SHINE UP AGAINST ANY TOP NOTCH PLAYER IN THE NBA! SO HE SHOULD HAVE TAKE THE MONEY! REMEMBER THE HAWKS WERE THE LAUGHING STALK OF THE NBA WHEN THEY SIGNED JJ TO THAT BIG CONTRACT! He is good but HE IS NOT A TRUE ALL STAR IS NO SENSE!!! look at the All Star Roster & ask yourself out of the 3 years that jj made the All Star team what players on the All Star team is JJ better then at shooting guard? As a Hawks fan if you could pick any shooting Guard that you wanted off of JJ’s All Star to be The starting shooting guard for Your Atlanta Hawks! No Hawks Fans Would Pick JOE JOHNSON!!! lol
bigdave
October 1st, 2009
5:55 pm
Joe Johnson> Brandon Roy
Ariose
October 1st, 2009
6:38 pm
Possible Hawks alternate jersey Possible Hawks alternate jersey:
http://www.peachtreehoops.com/2009/10/1/1065004/possible-hawks-alternate-jersey
niremetal
October 1st, 2009
7:05 pm
Ariose, I don’t like the ATL…the letters are so big that they’re distracting.
Hoosier
October 1st, 2009
7:09 pm
It would not be the end of the world, if the Hawks let JJ walk. He was no more of an impact player then Josh, Marvin, and Al are, when he was their age. It is time to let one or two of them take more of a role in the offense (just like Joe did when he came to Atlanta), and see if one of them can shine. None of the three will be superstars, but they can be just as good as JJ.
Who knows, maybe Teague will wind up being our superstar?
Hoops
October 1st, 2009
7:26 pm
JJ will play for the Hawks the entire season and will play great! The Hawks will re-sign him as a FA next summer.
I’m kind of taken back by those people that express hatred toward him for not accepting the Hawks extension offer. It’s business! He feels like he can make more money by waiting. What’s the problem with that? All of us do what we can to make more money at our chosen professions all the time.
I really think that we will see JJ and Crawford on the floor together much more than most people think. The Hawks will be potent with those two Cats together!
Ariose
October 1st, 2009
7:30 pm
The Guys at Hoopinion have an interesting take on the JJ situation:
Brett:
I believe Joe Johnson just kept the organization from shooting itself in the foot.
Karry said…
Bret,
Please explain to me how allowing Joe to go helps us build for a championship? Please give me scenerios( players etc).PLEAASE
1:46 PM, September 30, 2009
Bret LaGree said…
As they’re currently proving, you can’t build a championship team by trading a league average player and two first round picks for the right to pay Joe Johnson a max contract to be a team’s focal point. That’s before one accounts for the very real possibility that Johnson’s presence influenced the team’s decisions not to draft Paul or Deron Williams or Brandon Roy when given the chance.
None of that is Joe Johnson’s fault nor does it mean he’s not a fine basketball. However, I suspect that the wear-and-tear Johnson’s experienced, both in Phoenix and in Atlanta, will cause/has caused him to peak early. If he’s a fringe All-Star at this peak what will his decline phase look like? I wouldn’t pay $60 million for the privilege of discovering that over the course of four potentially long years.
By not signing the extension, Johnson has given the Hawks the opportunity to sign him after the season for fewer years/less money or let him go and invest the money that would have gone to Johnson plus Josh Childress’s rights plus, one hopes, Jamal Crawford’s expiring contract into acquiring a true franchise player or multiple players that will complement the young (and potentially improving) core of Smith, Horford, Williams, and Teague and the reasonably priced veteran role players (Bibby, Pachulia, Evans).
2:40 PM, September 30, 2009
Bronn said…
But if the projections for next year’s cap figures are accurate, we’re going to be over the cap whether JJ is a member of the Hawks, if my math is right.
Of course, that’s assuming there’s no Jamal Crawford trade in the works, and I suspect he’s a huge candidate to be traded.
5:06 PM, September 30, 2009
Bret LaGree said…
No doubt, losing Joe Johnson does not equal cap space in and of itself but one would think that in his absence the team might be motivated to get something for Josh Childress, trade Crawford’s expiring contract (wait, there might be a downside cap-wise to acquiring $19 million worth of Jamal Crawford’s contract), and explore their sign-and-trade options in free agency
Ariose
October 1st, 2009
7:38 pm
Nire, The guys at peachtree hoops made that Jersey up. It’s not an offical one, but I think the next jersey will defenetly be red like that.
Ariose
October 1st, 2009
7:42 pm
Opportunity beckons for Pacers’ Jones:
http://www.indystar.com/article/20091001/SPORTS04/910010456/Opportunity+beckons+for+Pacers++Jones
niremetal
October 1st, 2009
7:49 pm
What an idiot. Sorry, but “trading” JJ + Crawford for Wade or even LeBron doesn’t get the Hawks a title. The only team that has won a title in the past 30 years that didn’t have at least two All-Stars was Duncan’s Spurs in 2003. Hell, you don’t just need two All-Stars. As a general rule, you need two Hall of Famers who can score 20ppg with their eyes shut. The only exceptions I can think to that rule from the past 30 years are, again, the 2003 Spurs and maybe the 2004 Pistons (do the Wallaces and/or Billups make it to the Hall? Now there’s a topic for debate…). The playoffs are just too deep and too tough for a one-star team to win it all, as Kobe discovered and LeBron is discovering.
Josh will never scare people enough on offense to play Pippen to a Jordan (or Manu to a TD or Drexler to a Hakeem or whatever other title-winning duos you want to throw out there). Sorry, he just won’t. He’s been in the league 5 years, and teams routinely leave him wide open when he’s more than 15 feet from the basket, just daring him to take a mid-range jumper or three. That’s not Josh’s game. Horford never will be a phenomenal offensive weapon either, and I’m saying that as a guy who owns a Horford jersey. Neither will Marvin. And my guess is, neither will Teague (and you don’t really want your PG filling that role anyway). No one else on the team is even worth mentioning.
The answer isn’t getting rid of JJ, just like the answer for the Celtics wasn’t getting rid of Pierce. The answer is keeping your All-Star and finding some way to scrape together the contracts and draft picks to trade for another one who is as good or better. That might mean trading away almost everyone but JJ…same as the Celtics traded away everyone but Pierce and the Heat cleaned out everyone but Wade and Zo.
So anyone talking about letting JJ walk has it backwards. Because in the entire history of the NBA, I can’t think of a single team that has won a title after letting their one and only All-Star go elsewhere.
Ariose
October 1st, 2009
8:00 pm
Nire, I said it was an “Interesting” take lol. I wasn’t endorsing it. I do agree with your thoughts.
Ariose
October 1st, 2009
8:07 pm
We need to sign stackhouse, along with Sims, and Siler. Then We trade Stackhouse, Mo Evans, and Randolph morris and a future(unprotected) 1st Rd. Pick for Rudy Gay.
Then the second unit looks like:
Jeff Teague
Jamal Crawford
Rudy Gay
Joe Smith
Zaza Pachulia
Super Reserves:
Garrett Siler, Jason Collins, and Courtney Sims…..that also gives us space to put Mario Back on the roster(or call him back from the D-Leauge (^_^)
niremetal
October 1st, 2009
8:08 pm
Btw – the good thing about the spate of non-expiring contracts the Hawks will have next summer is that it opens the door to LOTS of sign-and-trade possibilities if we can talk LeBron/Bosh/Wade into coming here.
The thing that LaGree doesn’t seem to get is that without a Pippen-in-waiting, those guys are much less likely to be interested in coming here. Remember – there is absolutely no way that the Hawks will have the cap space next summer to sign Bosh, LeBron, or Wade outright. That means that in order to acquire one of them, we would have to both convince the player to come here AND convince their current team to work out a sign-and-trade with us where we give up about the salary that we give away.
For instance, we could convince Bosh to come here, and then work out a sign-and-trade with Toronto where we give them Crawford and either 1) Josh or 2) any two of Zaza/Bibby/Marvin (to get us within the cap) and a first round pick (so they don’t feel like they’re walking away emptyhanded) to make the deal work under the CBA. We then fill out the roster with solid veterans excited about the prospect of playing alongside two healthy All-Stars. That’s a recipe for a contender.
On the other hand, imagine if the Hawks win 50 games this year, and then the Hawks don’t re-sign JJ. JJ then signs with the Nets or Knicks for 5/$90M. Remember, the Hawks won’t have the cap space to sign any big-name free agent outright, which means we have to do a sign-and-trade. That means we have to give up some combination of the players I listed above. Given that prospect, why would a marquee free agent want to come here, knowing that he will be coming to a team recently depleted of its best player and 3 of its 4-5 next best players?
Is it likely that we can land any of those three guys? No. But it should be clear that it is much more likely to happen if we bring JJ back than if we let him walk.
niremetal
October 1st, 2009
8:09 pm
Lol…Ariose’s playlist:
Salim
Flip
Patrick Mills
Gerald Green ($800k!!!!!!!)
Rudy Gay
…and counting…
niremetal
October 1st, 2009
8:17 pm
Got my salaries messed up there. Assuming that the max salary next year is ~$16.5M, we would have to give up either Josh or Crawford and any one of Zaza/Bibby/Marvin to make the salaries match…I think. I know there are always hidden kinks in player’s contracts that can make them hard to trade, and there are even more variables with a sign-and-trade (not to mention that the CBA could get renegotiated between now and then, in which case everything I just said might become obsolete). But the general points hold about 1) having to deplete our roster to bring in a star and 2) a star being more likely to want to come to a team with JJ than he is to come to a team without him…
jerrywest
October 1st, 2009
8:26 pm
Toronto has no defense. They’ll suck so badly that they’ll be forced to trade Bosh by mid-season.
Welcome back Bosh.
icecold
October 1st, 2009
8:44 pm
i hope joe realize if he stick wit this team and can actually win a champion on this team at anytime of his career.. he will go to the hall of fame.. but if he go to a team thats already a contender, he will get a ring. but they probally will say they could of won it with out him. or somethin like that.. this has been his team.. his team to grow with. he bacame a all star on this team. not on another team. he is a elite player because he took a team and put it on his back and literally carried them in the worst situations, ( 20 points in the 4th quarter against boston in the playoffs, game winning shots, takin over games when nobody else will step up ) now the roster this year is almost garenteeing him that he will always have the peices he need to win a championship!!! and the young players aint gon do nothin but get better!! they still got a young talented.. imagin when everybody in there prime with hoe johnson runnin the show.. the championships can come back to back to back.. the chemistry and the skill will be there.. aint nothin stoppin them!! as long as they stay together!! just somethin to think about!!!!
icecold
October 1st, 2009
8:46 pm
Ariose
rudy gay would start over marvin williams!!! i would
Hoosier
October 1st, 2009
9:12 pm
Ariose, that is a very interesting out-of-the-box take from Hoopinion. I for one agree with them, maybe Sund does to. Maybe he made this offer to JJ knowing his EGO would be too big to accept it, and it would also get the fans off their backs……could get interesting.
KevinA
October 1st, 2009
9:46 pm
niremetal,
Josh and Marvin have reached the point in their careers that they have the potential to become like JJ, a fringe all star player. If they get close to 1,000 shot attempts not only will you see a better team balance but easier attempts for JJ. We don’t need to look for another star at this point, we need to feed the ball to the budding talent in our own house.
KevinA
October 1st, 2009
9:47 pm
3.06: Mike Bibby was eighth in the league in assist to turnover ratio. He needs to keep up the pace. John Hollinger rather insightfully points out in his Hawks preview (insider only) that Atlanta was one of the few teams (ever) to have a low turnover rate and high free throws attempted (FTA/TO). I did not even know this was a stat, but apparently, it is, and apparently, it is important. The Hawks were the only team in the league in the top five in FTA and bottom ten in TOs. Basically, the team got to the line without turning it over a lot. Those two things are normally mutually exclusive. I really don’t know how the team did this. I feel Joe, Josh, and Zaza turnover the ball all the time, but that is apparently just a feeling and not a fact. Regardless, the reality for this season is the Hawks need to keep it up, and that starts with Mike Bibby again in the top ten of assist to turnover. And if Woodson wants to give Horford and Josh more shots around the basket to increase that free throw attempt rate, fine by me.
http://www.peachtreehoops.com/
This is a fascinating stat that I had not heard before but explains and shows our unique strength.
Josh and Marvin drive the ball on a regular basis and if both improve the handle just a little bit more will be extremely difficult to stop. The amount of fouls the Hawks shoot is one of the strengths of our team. With even more aggression the Hawks can and I believe will get even better.
Melvin
October 1st, 2009
9:54 pm
Woody getting some shine on the NBA main page…
http://www.nba.com/video/channels/tnt_overtime/2009/04/02/nba_20090331_strength_woodson.nba/index.html
Big Ray
October 1st, 2009
10:28 pm
John Hollinger is a sharp guy, but I tire of his Hawks diatribes. Here’s my reply to Mark Bradley. Aw, nevermind, it was too lengthy to cut and paste. If you care at all to hear me rant against Hollinger like the homer that I am, just go to Bradley’s blog. If not, avoid it like the plague.
Big Ray
October 1st, 2009
10:29 pm
KevinA ,
Nice link. That is an interesting stat that bears some consideration.
KevinA
October 1st, 2009
10:34 pm
If Teague plays well and Crawford plays well and if Bibby plays well Just how much will JJ get to play? Spurs do this to save vets for the end of the year. Is it time to slow Joe for the end?
KevinA
October 1st, 2009
10:39 pm
Ray when are you starting your blog.
BaghdadHawk
October 2nd, 2009
7:58 am
The Hawks made the right decision to offer, and Joe made the right decision to decline. Bot the Hawks and Joe Johnson will be better for it. Joe, true Hawks fan believe in you and know that our team will go as far as you take us. My bigger concern is that Coach Woodson can play us at 10 deep every night. We can talk money later. Good luck this season Joe Johnson. Go Hawks!!
BaghdadHawk
October 2nd, 2009
8:02 am
I don’t understand all the hate on Joe? Be honest, who available is better? Lebron and Wade won’t be. No one is better fit or a better player than Joe. I hope he resigns.
dmortone
October 2nd, 2009
9:53 am
The fact that Marvin led the league in FTA/TO last year and then spent the offseason working on his ball-handling excites me more than anything else about this upcoming season. Marvin’s physical talents lends him to being a foul magnet aka…dare i say it…a potential number 1 option? That Charlette game when JJ was out is probably my favorite regular season game of last year.
fudd21
October 2nd, 2009
10:01 am
Nire,
I agree with your post regarding having two all-star caliber players or at least two bona fide players that are “go-to” guys and can get 20 on any given night. That’s why I am so excited about the addition of Crawford. Do I think he will average 20, No but he has the ability and he is respected for his scoring prowess around the league. That will take some of the doubles off JJ. I don’t know how much they will play together, but with the game on the line in the 4th quarter I do expect to see JJ and JC on the floor together.
As for Josh, Al or Marvin stepping up to be that 2nd player I would love to see it happening but I honestly don’t think it will. Some of you talk about the touches they get, but there is a reason they don’t get more touches. Woody offense basically consists of a lot of clear outs and players going one-on-one. Al isn’t best suited for that type of offense. How many times have we seen the ball go into the post to Al, he try and make a move only to kick the ball back out. The re-entry pass goes back into Al, he tries another move only to throw up an awkward, off balance shot. No, I’ll pass on him getting more touches in the post. Now if he’s getting the ball on the elbow for the 15 fotter that’s a different story as he can hit that effectively and most centers can’t/won’t come out and guard him there.
Josh said during the summer that he had no business hanging out around the 3 point line shooting 3’s. Whether that was by design or his own actions could be debated but we all will see what happens during the season. For him to become that go-to 20 ppg guy he would have to develop some type of consistent mid-range shot. I’m just not convinced that will happen. I think his shot would have to be totally revamped to ever become consistent.
Marvin I personally think he has the skill set but lacks the agression. I would like to see him develop the ability to back smaller people down. It frustrates me to watch guys that are 3 inches shorter and 20 lbs lighter guard Marvin in the post for him to kick the ball back out. He should attend JJ class on how to back smaller people down.
Kevin A,
I read that article too. Did you see the part where Hollinger said Marvin actually lead the league in that category. WOW! Marvin lead the league in a category that’s positive. Somewhere Rod just threw up in his mouth. LOL
Stating the Obvious
October 2nd, 2009
10:10 am
Marvin COULD be that second 20ppg with his eyes shut guy that we need if Woody had him do more than stand in the corner waiting for a last-second pass in case IS O Joe breaks down. I remember that Charlotte game too, and the other one right before it against Minnesota where Woody made him JJ for two days and he scored 25 points or something like that. Then JJ came back and he got sent back to his hideout in the corner.
The Hawks already have a second offensive weapon, Woody just doesn’t use him unless his first offensive weapon is out.
Daniel
October 2nd, 2009
10:19 am
fudd21- Your take on Marvin “he has the skill set but lacks the aggression” is 100% right on the money.
I have been saying for awhile that of Josh/Marvin/Al the most likely to make that next step towards All Star calibre is Marvin.
As a Hawks fan, I hope they all do.
But, Marvin has to play with an aggressiveness that can be lacking at times. I wonder how much injuries last year played a part in his up and down season (I am going with a lot). For stretches he played like an up and coming all star. Now we just need to see it for a season.
I really hope his back is OK and doesn’t turn into a chronic problem. If it does the Hawks will be set back worse than if Joe leaves.
Sautee
October 2nd, 2009
10:31 am
Daniel,
I was gone all day yesterday, but thanks for having my back regarding the “selfish JJ post”
niremetal
October 2nd, 2009
10:47 am
Dear lord…were there really just 4 straight posts that were strongly positive about Marvin??? Has someone checked the temperature in hell recently?
And Sautee, I think you know this already, but I was responding more to Daniel’s assertion that no one was calling JJ selfish than I was attacking your post. You got my email on that anyway
Daniel
October 2nd, 2009
11:11 am
Sautee- No problem dude, and Nire- we know what you meant, your always cool. Sautee did you see the heat that I took for saying something about Truth-Serum. Good grief that guy needs meds.
Daniel
October 2nd, 2009
11:15 am
Throwing something out there to generate a conversation, maybe.
We keep getting great reviews on Crawford, love it. But, we have heard from Knicks and GS fans that Crawford is a great guy, always says the right things and comes into camp great but then the season start and well….. you have seen the critisism.
What are we to believe? (I know we really won’t find out until the season) Is this a new Jamal in a winning situation who will be awesome or are we being sold a bill of goods?
Big Ray
October 2nd, 2009
11:51 am
KevinA ,
Actually, we started the fan blog back up around a week ago. It’s called “Hawks Fan Nest” now, not Hawks Hacks. Come on by, was wondering where you were.
Daniel ,
The fact that Crawford has yet to play one game in a Hawks uniform can’t be ignored. At the same time, we have to consider how fans of a team react when a player leaves their team. Look what some people said about Childress when he left. Yes, those were different circumstances, but the application is there, I think. Also, Golden State and New York are two highly disfunctional ballclubs (New York far less so, now with D’Antoni in town). I’d hesitate to be too critical of a lot of guys who have recently played there. I mean, even Baron Davis wanted out of Nellie’s madhouse. And has ANYBODY been upset that they got traded away from New York before D’Antoni arrived? Knicks fans are gonna say whatever, because their team stunk up the joint like crazy, despite a lot of money spent, and some serious talent being there.
Golden State fans should be complaining 50 times as much as some of us do about Woody. Maybe even 100 times as much. That is a LOSER team that lost one of it’s best players ever, due to a crazy coach who controls way too much within the organization, and will turn on his players at any given moment.
Seriously, Woody has his flaws, but he’s straight up. If he likes you, that doesn’t change. If he doesn’t, you know it from the start. But he doesn’t say “hey, you’re the man”, then next week “pack your bags, I don’t ever wanna see you again.” Woody’s never been two-faced like that. He’s straight up. Nellie? If Truth Serum ever wants to do another “Forked Tongue Review”, Nellie should be his subject…..
Let’s not also forget what Sacramento fans had to say about Bibby when he got traded here. They were down on him, too. And you know what? They were right about some things. Dude has flaws to his game (some were always there, some have developed as his game has declined to a degree), but FIT is what’s important. And I think we’d only be lying to ourselves if we didn’t acknowledge that he has fit us well and the Hawks have been a better team for it, regardless of what his former team’s fans had to say about it.
With that in mind, I expect positive results from Crawford. It’s not impossible for him to cause chemistry issue, but I think it’s improbable.
Daniel
October 2nd, 2009
12:06 pm
Nice post Ray- that is the direction I am leaning too. Isn’t awesome to think that the Hawks are now an orginization where we expect players to play better because we are already a high functioning team!!! This is new territory for us.
Truth-Serum
October 2nd, 2009
1:12 pm
Big Ray
October 2nd, 2009
11:51 am
Im On it!
Daniel
October 2nd, 2009
1:27 pm
Truth-serum: I am trying to help you here, but you do realize that Ray was mocking you right?
Stating the Obvious
October 2nd, 2009
1:39 pm
No, truth-serum doesn’t get when he’s been mocked, just like Sam/Rod:
http://blogs.ajc.com/hawks/2009/08/05/extension-talks-for-joe/comment-page-5/#comments
Stating the Obvious
August 9th, 2009
8:16 pm
You’re not fooling anyone but yourself if you think anyone is buying into “Sam” and “Rod” being separate people. But we’ll know what’s up if “Ben from East Point” suddenly shows up making diss posts on Marvin.
Tom from Bankhead
August 9th, 2009
8:27 pm
Marvin sucks.
Sam from the Swats
August 9th, 2009
8:32 pm
Thanks Tom
They both are also convinced that anyone who disagrees with them are the same person. Schizo and stupid, a great combination!
Stating the Obvious
October 2nd, 2009
1:40 pm
Oh, I meant to say that they both are convinced that anyone who disagrees with them are both the same person AND A RACIST/UNCLE TOM. Gotta love it.
Daniel
October 2nd, 2009
1:44 pm
STO- your previous comment on Marvin, I agree with for the most part. I don’t think that Marvin backsliding had anything to do with Woody. I think it had more to do with injury and Marvin’s own deferance to JJ. I think he needs to step up and insert himself into the game more.
Daniel
October 2nd, 2009
1:45 pm
Also, to be fair Rod has been a lot more middle of the road on Marvin lately.
kirkinga
October 2nd, 2009
2:00 pm
In reading the responses to this provocative blog, there seems to be an underlying assumption that the economy is going to be robust by this time next year.Everyone is salivating at the big names available and then we have the second-level players also wanting to get in on the action generated by those big names.
Trouble is, every economic forecast that I have read expects the economy to still be slow, though improving. Tickets sales may not be robust this season because consumers are holding on to their money and there is a great deal of unemployed who aren’t likely to take in many games or buy much merchandise.
Sure there are a few owners that will be able to absorb a huge contract or two, New York for example, but if he goes to New York, that kind of defeats the “he wants a ring” idea that some are pushing.
I believe what will happen is that teams will not be as aggressive as people are predicting and that almost all the big names will stay with their current teams and sign for big money. Then we will see the same thing that happened in baseball with the next level of players finding willing suitors but at discounted prices some will be smart enough to quickly take deals (Bibby) others will have to go through some ego adjustment before finally landing a contract (Iverson).
In the end it is mostly about the economy which makes JJ’s refusal to sign a risk right now. We will not know if it is a mistake until the offseason. If he ends up signing a deal for less than he was offered this Summer, then it was a mistake. I think he will come to understand market forces the same way Smith, Marvin, and Bibby eventually came to understand them and stay with the Hawks (assuming they don’t pull a surprise).
Stating the Obvious
October 2nd, 2009
2:02 pm
Daniel,
Maybe. But how does Marvin assert himself more if no plays are run for him? Is he supposed to scream at Bibby and JJ to pass him the ball? You know that ain’t how it works in the big leagues.
big tone
October 2nd, 2009
2:33 pm
joe johnson is called selfish because the other atlanta hawks free agents took less money to be part of a winning competitive team.what good is a star with no supporting cast.personally i wouldnt re-sign him.he has no heart.it showed in the playoffd earlier this year,definitely overrated.
Daniel
October 2nd, 2009
2:34 pm
STO- I hear you, but you can be aggressive in positioning yourself for the pass. Delivering when called upon. Going inside and drawing fouls(he needs to do that more). I really think that we were seeing that transformation for the first half of the season last year, but injuries really set him back, and his team did not involve him as much when he came back.
Stating the Obvious
October 2nd, 2009
2:56 pm
Daniel,
I get you, but thats dodging the question. How was he supposed to be aggressive in positioning himself for the pass when the plays called for him to stand in the corner while JJ or Flip went one-on-one? In half-court offenses, players don’t decide where to position themselves. They go where the play calls for them to go.
He did go inside and draw fouls plenty when he got the ball, as the 18-20 at the line game against Charloote showed. But that doesn’t answer the question I had, which is how is he supposed to get the ball more if the offense calls for all the plays to be run through JJ or Flip (or now Crawford) with him standing in the corner, Bibby and Josh on the wings, and Horford on the block? It’s no coincidence that he and Horford get the fewest touches, they’re always the furthest from the ball. Is Horford not aggressive enough either?