First impressions | Atlanta Hawks

Melvin

September 22nd, 2009
12:48 am

Get Stackhouse signed Sund….

Melvin

September 22nd, 2009
12:51 am

Good write up Sekou. Maybe this will eased the talk of Crawford not being able to fit in with team or if Teague could contribute. Better yet, the resurrence of Stackhouse. Hopefully, we can sign him instead of the Celtics. For some strange reason, I can see him in Boston if not the ATL….

KevinA

September 22nd, 2009
12:55 am

As being a Crawford ctitic your post is welcome news. Sims also sounds interesting. Stackhouse would be another winner. With West/Rand Mo and Flip still hanging – it will be fun to know who comes out on top. Som many players and so few slots.

KevinA

September 22nd, 2009
1:01 am

No matter what happens we cannot gripe so much about depth. With Woody we still don’t know if it takes injury to get into the rotation or will he bring in players in “waves”. Time is counting down – the season is just around the corner.

Does anybody know if the preseason games will be on radio? Oct 7th is close. If not radio will there be a place to see the game stats?

Gilley

September 22nd, 2009
1:04 am

Glad to see Jamal Crawford getting familiar with his new teammates. But the main question is where is Joe Johnson. He is usually here for the voluntary workouts..I guess since we made the playoffs he feels we ok. Say it aint so Joe. Even though he not required to showup next week, his absence makes people wonder if he isn’t happy about the lack of receiving a contract extension, is he still out partying (word to twitter) or is he doing his own thing. Just too many thoughts. I planned to cancel my NBA TV until the season starts but its right around the corner so I mind as well keep it…lol

Big Hawk Fan

September 22nd, 2009
1:04 am

Stackhouse sounds good but it appears that scoring the ball won’t be an issue this year. Why not go back with a defensive minded player that will do the dirty work and not demand 10-15 shots…( Mario West )

Gilley

September 22nd, 2009
1:06 am

I would love to have Stackhouse. But I just pray Woody actually uses him if we pick him up. Our bench is getting deep if not already, but I want Woody to use his players.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
1:40 am

Melvin ,

The idea that Jamal Crawford has any issues passing the ball is an unwarranted concern, in my opinion. His career average of 4.2 assists per game puts that idea to rest, and is almost identical to someone else’s career average of 4.4. Guess who? Joe Johnson…

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
1:41 am

Ray, ESPN is robbing people.

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
1:42 am

Why pay that much to read about John Hollinger to bash his own hometown team and consistantly tell us how Bibby is about to bite the dust….AGAIN

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
1:45 am

Outrageous price

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
1:45 am

Although, If you are one of the awesome people who HAVE subscribed please, feel free to post that info heheheh!!!!

Ray, also have to agree with your thoughts on Mo & Stack. They bring different things to the table and should be used accordingly. If Woody plays his cards right it could be a beautiful situation for all involved.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
1:46 am

KevinA ,

As far as depth and Woody are concerned, personally I’d rather try and avoid concerns over past observations and “issues.” The way I see it, Woody now has adequate depth. We have some quality guys on this squad, the best squad in years. We’ve got depth. Veteran Depth . However, I think we all agree that if we’re still voicing the same concerns this year as in the past, something is wrong. And I think it will be clear what the problems are.

This roster makes me think we shouldn’t see Joe have to 40 mpg (or 39, or even 38). Notice I said “HAVE TO”. I figure the only reasonable excuse for that would be injuries. We have a number of weapons that are ready for use, if you ask me. Of course, I’m not the one coaching or GMing, so my opinion is what it is.

Ed

September 22nd, 2009
1:47 am

Good work Sekou. Appreciate your taking time away from where your heart and mind truly are nowadays. Looks as if it’s going to be another second year turn around for Rich Rod as is his history.

Let’s hope Woodrow doesn’t have a heart attack trying to juggle all the talent at his dissposal. Just thinking about a ten man rotation has to make him nervous.

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
1:48 am

Ray, I can’t lie. between stargazing or playing a pickup game…..I have my limits. Sorry stars , but I wouldn’t mind every once and awhile. I like just looking up there in the early morining or late at night.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
1:49 am

KevinA ,

Like the Summer League, some of the preseason games will be on NBATV, if you have access to that.

Last year, I found that NBA.com slacked off big time on providing preseason stats (they’d be like, 1 or 2 days behind). I think YahooSports might be better (they’re way better during the season with live in-game updates).

Ariose ,

ESPN is full of themselves. Like Nike, they act like they’re the best, and only game in town. Whatever. But just like you, if I can get the info for free, my cheapskate arse will surely take it! I have no shame…

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
1:51 am

Ariose,

Like I said on the last blog, I’m not bashing anybody for having that as a hobby or an interest. Niremetal made the point that we’re talking about b-ball on a blog, and he’s right, but that was why I made the distinction between it being a hobby/interest, and there being big money donated or otherwise poured into it on the professional level, versus real problems that we have here. But that’s just my opinion, and I’m sure y’all are about sick of that …

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
1:56 am

I’ve looked at the stars plenty of times, telescope and all. It never stuck as a consistent hobby.

JSS ,

No offense meant on the subject, by the way.

You know ….

A lot is said about Teague looking good in pickup games, blah blah blah. And it’s true. You can’t judge a person by pickup games. But when guys who have been in the league for a number of years are saying that a newcomer is good…I tend to give that a little credence.

I don’t want to get too excited about Teague, and I certainly don’t expect too much out of him too early. But there’s a simple fact that we should not ignore: the same things are being said about him throughout the organization, on all levels. Somebody correct me if I’m wrong (and do it with evidence please), but I don’t recall there being that much buzz about Acie.

Again, not putting too much stock into that, and I figure somebody (if not several somebodies) will shoot such statements down as fast as they can. But it NEVER hurts for every facet of the organization to feel the same way about a draft pick. I’ll leave it at that…

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
2:05 am

KevinA ,

Meant to tell you: your series of posts yesterday were damn good. Plenty of good thoughts there, and I think some things were brought up that I hadn’t seen on here before (or at least not recently).

I think one of the biggest factors in the development of our frontcourt (and thereby their contribution) will be the willingness of our veteran guards to include them in the game more. Get them the ball more. THEY have to do this, and establish the trust/rhythm.

Woody’s job, to me, is to encourage his veteran guards to do this. But THEY have to do it. We’ve seen just how far we can go with guard play. They should know by now that the team will only be so successful (especially against the better teams) with versatility that includes the frontcourt.

I came across an article where Sekou was actually the interviewee, instead of the interviewer and author. One thing he said really stuck out to me: He said that last year (I think it was during a certain stretch of the season, but might have been the entire season) The Hawks were 11-1 when both Joe Johnson and Josh Smith score 20 or more points in a game.

That speaks volumes to me…

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
2:12 am

Sick of Ray’s opinion??? Hell Naw!!!

KevinA, Ditto what ray said. Great posts.

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
2:15 am

Teauge is better…..his mini camp footagehad way more action in it than Acies had in his two years as a Hawk…..sorry Acie lovers.

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
2:17 am

Gilley, Joe took down his twitter. I think he’s probably in Arkanses spending time with his Family and working with the same trainers down there that he did in the previous off-season.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
2:18 am

Ariose ,

I read those links you provided at the end of the last blog. Interesting what Hollinger and Bucher had to say. Of course, of what was available, most of it centered on Smith (especially if you read Hollinger’s “breakout season” part on Smith). Interesting what Bucher had to say about Woody. Accurate? Who knows. It could be typical ESPN drivel. Or it could be the kind of rumblings/rumors that only the holy ESPN brotherhood of saints is privy to

Those who get angry at any possibly critical thing to say about Woody are probably better served by not reading that part.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
2:25 am

“The Hawks were 11-1 when both Joe Johnson and Josh Smith score 20 or more points in a game.”

Now, I realize that this can be taken in a number of directions. Some will want to substitute Marvin’s name in place of Josh’s. Whatever. Does it really matter? Yet, call me back when Marvin starts stringing together 20 point games regardless of whether Joe is out with injury . Nothing against Marvin, but it is what it is. We need that other serious scorer to be there ALL THE TIME, not just when times are desperate. And we need that scorer to come from the frontcourt. Who’s it gonna be?

Having said that , it may not have to be exactly that. Imagine an offense that gets the usual 20 or so from Joe, but also gets 17 apiece from Josh and Marv, and 15 from Al?

Straight murderous …

Daniel ,

I have to say, that stuff you posted on planets yesterday was funny as all get out . I was about to fall out from laughing.

The ONLY Hawaiian Hawk Fan

September 22nd, 2009
3:01 am

All I can say is this team looks sick. Rick Sund you have done a great job and more this offseason. This team is gonna light it up this year. The biggest things working for us this year is not the added talent from Teague, Smith, and JC, but it’s the extra year of experience for our young guys. Smoove, Williams and Horford have gotten better every year while adjusting to their new roles last year. Now they can play multiple positions without and major need at the 5. If Smoove got his mid range shot going during the offseason then he would kill at the 3. Horford kills at the 4. Zaza, Siler, Smith, Hunter and hopefully Stack will hold it up at the 5. WOW. The vets here can give us the intangibles to win on the road. Craw takes more pressure off JJ. This team has sooooo many options this year. Look out world, here come the Hawks.

PS Been a Hawks fan since 1990. My PAL BBall team was called the Hawks and I’ve followed ever since. Through Nique to Mt. Mutumbo, Steve Smith, and Mookie to Terry, Abdur-Rahim and Rider to the slow resurgence of what we have now. I can’t wait to shut all these Laker and bandwagon Cavs fans here up.

The ONLY Hawaiian Hawk Fan

September 22nd, 2009
3:12 am

BTW can you get TNT to broadcast some Hawks games so I can get some here. There were only 2 regular season games on ESPN, 2nd one vs. Boston, when Smoove posterized Perkins, and the 3rd one vs. the Cavs, when the refs gave LeBron that BS call in the end, JJ had a good look though. Anyways isn’t TNT in the A? Wassup with that? I watch games if a fan of the other team is broadcasting it. If not then I look for a radio link or just watch the boring gamecast. Man you guys are sooooo lucky to be there. I wanted to watch a game in the Omni when I was a kid. Now I really want to catch a game in the Factory.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
3:32 am

Stack at the 5? Saaayyy Whaaaaaaaat?

KevinA

September 22nd, 2009
5:16 am

Ray,

The Hawks were 11-1 when both Joe Johnson and Josh Smith score 20 or more points in a game.

Was not aware of that stat but it only makes sense.

Geeeze I was ready for some heat lol. Lets root for Woody coach of the year. If that happens, we have seen some awesome basketball.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
5:38 am

KevinA ,

For what it’s worth (less than two cents), I thought you were on point with much of what you said. Can’t argue (not that I won’t from time to time, LOL).

The ONLY Hawaiian Hawk Fan

September 22nd, 2009
6:41 am

LOL my bad. I meant Stack off the bench at the 3. Sorry I was going crazy.

clint

September 22nd, 2009
7:28 am

im actually glad joe is not at these games. too many minutes these 4 years and he should take the rest. any word on his contract extension, if we aint got joe locked up, all of these moves could be for nuthin. I still like Mo as the backup 3, gotta have some defensive minded players out there that dont think ME first. As a carolina fan, I love Stackhouse but he forgot what a good shot was when he left Dean Smith. Please Sekou, give us an update on Joe’s contract

Dos Hawkquis

September 22nd, 2009
8:13 am

BIG RAY, KEVINA, HAWAIIAN HAWK, ARIOSE, ET AL,

Okay, the Hawks have a 10 man rotation. Some say that Woodson can handle it, some say he can’t. Sund has made some excellent moves, teague and crawford appear able to step in, on que.

All things being equal, do you all see anything different that would catapult us to 1-3 seed?

or do you see a 50+ plus win season, with a 2nd round exit? and if this happens, what do you do with Woodson.

Also, we struggled mightily on the road. 12 road wins 2 years ago, 16 road wins last year. We win, on average, 34% of road games or we lose 66%, whichever way you want to look at it.

What will our additions do for us ON THE ROAD, in hostile territory?

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends!”

JSS

September 22nd, 2009
8:27 am

Dos Hawkquis hit on my main point of emphasis when it comes to the Hawks. Winning on the road! No more blowouts or not showing up on the Texas Swing, No being run out of the Delta Center as an example. They took a step in winning in Miami during the 1st Round, can they make the “Great Leap Forward?”

BBgenie

September 22nd, 2009
9:15 am

Damm!! Hawks in 7!!!!!

Daniel

September 22nd, 2009
9:17 am

Ray- thanks for the props!

Daniel

September 22nd, 2009
9:28 am

Sekou- great stuff. Have you heard anything about Stack’s interest in the Hawks vs. other teams? Any other teams sniffing around?

Daniel

September 22nd, 2009
9:32 am

Dos- I am making the call for a 52 win season, which will be either 3rd or 4th seed. I think that a second round appearance is likely, and we could still lose the second round and be successful depending on how that series is played and how competitive it is. A second round sweep will be BAD for Woodson. 52 win and 6-7 game series vs the conference champ, he will probably get extended, just my opinion.

Obviously, the extra 5 wins will come from on the road, which would make us roughly a .500 level team. But, I think the bigger test for improvement will be a decrease in blow out losses. I have never seen a team that won 47 games lose so many by 20 or more as the Hawks did last year. Obviously, that has to do with youth, but that is no longer an excuse.

jerrywest

September 22nd, 2009
9:40 am

Stack’s biggest contribution will be on the road games where Hawks are notoriously weak. Stack has more 30+ points games in Boston, Orlando and Cleveland than any current Hawks player.

JSS

September 22nd, 2009
9:42 am

Ray, was never offended… Never get tired of seeing the view of others… I’m jut glad you die hards may finally start to sniff flowers instead of the landfill (Botanical Garden instead of Moreland @ I-20)

On a serious note, I hope everyone on the Northside is OK… Sekou, everyone OK in Smyrna & Vinings?

jerrywest

September 22nd, 2009
9:46 am

Stack to Hawk is 100% Sund’s call. Nobody would pay him over the veteran minimum.

Since his family already lives here, he’d take hundreds of thousands less just to stay here.

He has already had a few mega contracts. Not doing this for money anymore.

Ken Strickland

September 22nd, 2009
9:47 am

Consider the following. Last yr, we made it to the 2nd rd on the playoffs with 2 starters hobbling and JJ less than 100%. The yr before we took the Celtics to a 7gms playoff series. This yrs team has a deep, talented, versatile bench that could probably successfully compete against some of the teams in the league.

I think we’ll see the true measure of what we have this yr when playoff time comes around. The Teague and Crawford additions pretty much guarantees we’ll run more, and the addition of JSmith and Collins will improve our halfcourt OFF and DEF.

This yrs team is built for the long haul, especially the playoffs. Boston has a solid, but aging starting team, but their bench will be hard pressed to match up with our bench featuring JSmith, Zaza, Collins, Teague, Crawford and Evans. If we add Stackhouse, Boston will definitely be at a disadvantage when they go to their bench or we go to ours. With a guard rotation of JJ, Bibby, Teague, Crawford and hopefully Stackhouse, Orlando and Cleveland, with their limited backcourt depth, will be hard pressed to match up to us.

Nobody will want to go up against us in the playoffs. Our starting lineup, plus the addition of Teague and Crawford, can run with anybody, and with JSmith, Collins, Zaza and Morris coming off our bench, we have the size and depth to get physical with anybody. LIKE I SAID, WE HAVE A SOLID PLAYOFF CALIBUR TEAM. THIS IS GOING TO BE A VERY EXCITING AND SUCCESSFUL ATLANTA HAWKS SEASON.

ant banks

September 22nd, 2009
9:52 am

KEN,

you do realize that if you are correct, that woody will probably get an extension. lol. i wonder does woody know you hate him so much. lol.

Nate

September 22nd, 2009
9:53 am

I wouldnt mind if they signed stackhouse but if they sign him would the other guards get playing time? We have a real good team but still we are fourth with ranking. We will see season is coming up soon.

Daniel

September 22nd, 2009
10:07 am

jerry west- if he signs for the vet min. then he wouldn’t have to take less. The league pays the vet min. salary, not the team. the issue is does Stack want to be a 3rd string Hawk? (big question there) and Does Sund want to get another pg?
I would love to see Stack on the team, IF he is willing to accept a reserve role, which means some nights he might even be wearing a suit. I really think it depends on how much of a contender he considers the Hawks to be vs. offers he might get from other top contenders.

Ken Strickland

September 22nd, 2009
10:09 am

DANIEL-excellent points.

DOS HAWKQUIS-I think Woodson has the ability to manage a 10 man rotation, he’s just chosen not to. Prior to the acquisition of MBibby, and prior to the expectations to win, he managed a 9 man rotation without difficulty.

Having trouble winning on the road is a matter of a lack of experience, talent, depth, maturity, or any combination of the above. The additions Sund has made have successfully addressed all of these issues, to varying degrees. I totally agree with DANIEL assessment of how we should evaluate our improvement. How we lose will be just as effective in measuring how we’ve improve as how many gms we win.

Hawksgirl

September 22nd, 2009
10:16 am

Stackhouse wouldnt be a bad signing. Any word on Siler?

vava74

September 22nd, 2009
10:20 am

Stack would be a nice addition, however, he is in his last wheels and his contribution would be, by default, limited.

As a security, he could be very valuable, specially in the event of short layoff by injury by any of the rotation players on the SG and SF slots.

He is a scorer, but his 3pt range is suspect, is more of a drive and pull / mid-range game type of guy and cannot provide the defense Mo brings to the table.

People around here do not appreciate Mo because he could not stop Wade nor Lebron during the playoffs, however, who does that?

jerrywest

September 22nd, 2009
10:20 am

Daniel

Hawks can pay vet-min, and its worth a few hundred thousand more to him than other team’s vet mins. His family lives here. He already has so much money that he won’t let a few hundred thousand dollar take him go away from his family.

+ League does not pay the vet – min. It pays part of vet-min.

+ Stackhouse, when not injured, is easily a second team player. When Marvin or JJ will be out, Stackhouse will slide right in for them. We could use him in so many ways that I am surprised people are counting minutes. Its a long season. Matchups issures and injuries happen. On the road, Stackhouse will be invaluable.

Ken Strickland

September 22nd, 2009
11:04 am

ANT BANKS-I don’t hate Woodson. My concern has always been about how the Hawks are being coached, rather than who coaches them. And I know you’re just pulling my leg. I have no doubt Woodson knows Sund’s refusal to grant him an extension at this point is a clear indication that he’s expecting more from him as a HC.

Sund has stocked this roster with talent, versatility, depth, size and experience. He’s addressed every excuse Woodson has previously offered, some legimate, some not so legimate. I believe he will expand his roll and spend less effort trying to get the team to play his way and allow them more freedom to play the way they’re best suited to play.

IF WOODSON COACHES THE TEAM TO A LEVEL THAT IMPROVES UPON LAST YRS SUCCESS, HE’LL DESERVE ANOTHER EXTENSION, AND I WON’T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT.

BONE

September 22nd, 2009
11:18 am

If we sign Stackhouse, whats the point of having mo evans.

Daniel

September 22nd, 2009
11:20 am

Ken- thanks for the props… I hope this doesn’t mean I am part of the “bubba crew” j/k

jerrywest- I am assuming that you mean that Stack staying in Atlanta with his family is worth a couple hundred thousand to him. I guess that seems logical. I meant that if he takes the vet min. I doubt any team is going to offer more than that. So, essentially the money will be the same. I was saying that the deciding issues as I see them will be:
1) Does Stack want to play a reserve role with the Hawks or is he looking to jump on another team that may be closer to a title.
2) Does Sund want to use another roster spot (we both agree that at the vet min. he is clearly worth the money) on a guard/swingman or does he want a 3rd pg?
3)I am sure that Stack is in Atlanta makes the Hawks more desirable, but I would say for a seasoned pro that is less of the issue than points 1&2

For the record, I hope the Hawks sign him.

Daniel

September 22nd, 2009
11:22 am

BOONE- the biggest point would be his contract, now if Stack were signed and healthy and plays well, then Mo might become a tradable assest…. but that is so many if’s from now, that you have to keep Mo. I agree with others who have said that Mo is underappreciated.

GeeMack

September 22nd, 2009
11:30 am

Sekou

Thanks for the new blog. We wore the other one out. Lol!

HawksV

September 22nd, 2009
11:33 am

Sekou…please give us an update on Joe and Mike. It sounds like everyone has improved this summer, and I would like to hear how our two leaders have improved as well. Also, I know it is really early, but I would be interested in hearing your opinion about how good this team could be based on your initial impressions!

ant banks

September 22nd, 2009
11:37 am

DANIEL,

at one point durin’ the season last year, the hawks were 11-1 with mo’ in the line up while marvin was out. we don’t appreciate mo’

smartguy

September 22nd, 2009
11:39 am

Woody will find a way to mess this up.

rms

September 22nd, 2009
11:41 am

Its amazing how Sekou leaves us a blog in the wee hours of the morning and we never hear from him again until the next blog comes up. Yes, Sekou I am giving you a hard time since no one else will!!!!

rms

September 22nd, 2009
11:42 am

I agree with you SMARTGUY, Woody will find a way to mess this up. The interesting part will be to see what his excuse will be.

cp

September 22nd, 2009
11:44 am

This might the most excited I have ever been about an upcoming season for the Hawks..If we keep our main guys healthy I think we can have a better year than last..

Ariose I saw the insider about the Hawks posted on another page. I’ll do some searching and post the article if I find it..

To the guys who cant catch any Hawks games due to being out of state or not having the NBA league pass, give me your email addresses around the beginning of the season and ill give u links where you can watch the games.

I would rather have Stack than Mario so sign him up.

A Tribe Called Quest

September 22nd, 2009
11:50 am

Good read — great blog, Sekou

Mink

September 22nd, 2009
11:55 am

Is there a place for Stackhouse on this team? I think the easy answer is “Make room.” but if you add a guy like Stack, you’re going to have to commit major minutes to him. He and Mo Evans would be battling for minutes, and I’m afraid jacking up shots they normally wouldn’t, trying to pad their stats to justify more playing time.

I guess it also depends on how good Teague really is. If Teague is going to get serious minutes this year, there’s no room for Stack. If it’s going to be a watch and learn year, bring him on.

Its TIME

September 22nd, 2009
12:01 pm

If you are asking AND answering yourself questions under 30 different names on a Blog, Please Seek Help!! If you dont get help at Charter, please get help somewhere.

Andy

September 22nd, 2009
12:08 pm

As someone who watched every game Jamal Crawford played for the Knicks, and someone who has absolutely no malice towards the Hawks (all the while recognizing that players do change sometimes), allow me to fill you in on what you’re probably getting.

Crawford will come to training camp and say all the right things about playing hard, playing smart, doing what the coach asks, accepting whatever role is given to him, just coming to fit in, etc.

Then when the lights come on, you’ll get a tremendously gifted scorer who is streaky, forces way too many shots, shoots a low percentage, can pass a little and plays no defense whatsoever.

Part of the problem in NY is that he played for Isiah Thomas, who basically just rolled the ball out and let his scorers do as they pleased. The end-of-game strategy consisted of nothing more than handing the ball to Crawford for some shake-and-bake followed by an off-balance 25-footer with a hand in his face. He’ll even make them occasionally.

The Bulls got rid of him because he was too wild, the Knicks got rid of him because he makes too much money for too long, and can’t catch and shoot (he absolutely must dribble thru his legs 2-3 times and take a few baby steps while palming the ball before launcing the J, and pouted when D’Antoni’s system didn’t call for that) and even a freestyler like Don Nelson had no use for him.

On the other hand, I always thought his best year – though not statistically – was the year Larry Brown coached the Knicks. He actually played with some intelligence that year, didn’t force as many shots, and even got into a defensive stance a time or two. So maybe he is coachable in the right situation.

I say beware a guy this skilled who is on his 4th team before his 30th birthday – all via trade – and has never been on a playoff team. If he plays a role any bigger than the one Flip Murray had, that might not be a good thing.

I hope I’m wrong.

Daniel

September 22nd, 2009
12:10 pm

well- ant, I obviously didn’t mean you then.

Nookah

September 22nd, 2009
12:20 pm

Daniel, I endorse your points on Stack. Those are excellent points. However, with the addition of Stack can Woody handle the embarrassment of riches?

I too am very excited about this upcoming season. With this current lineup (even without adding Stack), scoring should not be a problem. I am also very pleased with the effort to improve the interior defense. This will help us against the Bostons, Clevelands and Orlandos of this world. We should not be man-handled inside that easily.

Go Hawks!!!

rms

September 22nd, 2009
12:24 pm

Anyone care to comment about how the referee lockout will affect this upcoming season?

JSS

September 22nd, 2009
12:35 pm

RMS…
You may want to cut Sekou some slack today, pretty serious weather matters in his part of Cobb Co/Metro Atlanta this morning… I just hope everyone is OK…

Mink

September 22nd, 2009
12:42 pm

Man it’s good to see some excited Hawks fans. I wish there was a forum or chat or something we could all go to while the games were being played; for those of us who only attend a couple games a year. Sekou, you are the spark my friend. Doing a great job, even if your mind is with the THREE AND ZERO Michigan squad.

jerrywest

September 22nd, 2009
12:44 pm

Thanks Andy (Knicks fan) for your insightful comments on Crawford. Sounds like Isiah’s offensive philosophy with Crawford was just like Woody’s offensive philosophy with JJ.

Stackhouse will make us better equipped to do a mid-season trade for a superstar.

Mink

September 22nd, 2009
12:45 pm

RMS, I think we’ll see more aggressive play towards stars to start the season. The refs that give D-Wade, Kobe, Lebron, and Company all the calls won’t be on the payroll, so guys are going to really go after them in the paint. We’ll find out real fast whether or not the stars will get less or even more special treatment than usual. I expect J-Smoove to complain more than ever to see if he can get some calls his way, and he’ll either get bumped up a notch or brought back down to Earth.

Basically, it’ll be different, in better or worse ways for certain player stereotypes. Won’t be the same for sure. I just hope they let guys play at the end of games. I’m afraid we’ll see a bunch of young refs trying to get their mug on TV…

jerrywest

September 22nd, 2009
12:47 pm

Mink – hawksquawk.net has a chat room where 20-50 hawks fans chat during and after every game. Decent group. Moderator controlled.

Mink

September 22nd, 2009
12:54 pm

Thanks Jerry. In my favorites.

sleepy

September 22nd, 2009
12:56 pm

But Andy you are wrong .

You claim he says all the right things but then when the lights go on he does something different .

Are you saying he was going against what the coach or his team asked of him ? because I havent seen anything about that wherever he has played .

The claims of him playing no defense whatsoever just is not true its kinda like the loch Ness monster of basketball . For as bad as everyone says he is on defense the numbers just dont add up . .You can say he is not a good defender but the way you try and paint is that whoever gets the ball on him scores and there is no evidence of that.

His offensive game is at the point now where he its even stevens. He normally wins or breaks even against all matchups unless its an all nba caliber player like Kobe .

Why is he to be blamed for Isiah thomas ?

He was sign and traded from the Bulls which means someone wanted him but even then I read that the Bulls offered him a deal and he declined and thats when the knicks stepped in. If Im correct David Lee and nate robinson have ZERO OFFERS and minimal offers from the knicks

He cant catch and shoot but he was shooting over 43% 2 and 44% from 3 when he was traded from the knicks and that was mostly spot up shooting ?

h pouted yet the knicks gave him a video tribute when he returned a couple of weeks later ? What did they give Marbury or Zach Randolph ? you are really stretching it here

Nelson had Monta Ellis at over 60 million just signed and several other young backcourt players as well .He had to open up perimeter minutes as the untradeable Stephen jackson and Corey maggette are gonna want there minutes as well.

A veteran player who played for 2 teams in 8 years and then joined a team in the middle of a youth movement and ended up joining a playoff team at a bargain basement price is something to beware ?

And as for the playoff team he has yet to play for a organization that was not in some sort of turmoil.

post MJ Bulls – Ron Artest and Brand couldnt win there either

Knicks – Isiah,Brown,and MARBURY this due was the franchise player and now I see him crying on youtube seriously

Golden state warriors – there is still infighting amongst the management on that team. They extended Stephen Jackson and then he announces he wants to be traded . They signed both of their young players Ellis who injured himself on a Mo ped and Biedrens to 60+ million each gave Maggette 50 million and jackson another 30 million and yet still are not a playoff team.

Please tell me which of these teams were in a position to make the playoffs but didnt because of Crawford ?

Now Crawford is in a place where there is stability in the front office and on the court. He doesnt have to worry about Joe getting mad at woody and running off the team plane. He is finally in a place where the focus is solely on winning basketball games .

Even in NY right now the entire focus is not on winning games but on whether or not James is gonna leave his team and join them.No one is gonna thrive in an environment like that.

jerrywest

September 22nd, 2009
1:11 pm

If you replaced Crawford with Wade/Kobe/LeBron, I see the 9 teams Crawford played with could have made the playoffs. I don’t think any other swingman could have taken those awful teams to the playoffs. The guy had amazing bad lucks with teams.

vava74

September 22nd, 2009
1:22 pm

Crawford will be gamble. We have to admit it. He can be very good for us, he can be so so and he can also be a disaster.

Only time will tell. However, if we look at the highlights of his best games, he had many 3 pointers on catch and shoot situations.

Obviously, he is a possession demanding type of player, however, not exclusively.

My biggest fear is that he is not a penetrator and consequently he has a tendency of having many cold games.

vava74

September 22nd, 2009
1:29 pm

newkid,
in case you have been checking and you haven’t seen any reply to your query, I posted one which is waiting moderation.

dap01

September 22nd, 2009
2:20 pm

SEKOU: Do you need an assistant? I am available!

I appreciate the updates.

icecold

September 22nd, 2009
2:20 pm

with all these good payers we now do not have to accept any players that cant contribute now !!!( othelo hunter thomas gardner and others) we now have a team and a bench that actually have a fighting chance in winning the finals!! not jus makin it!! winning it!! and if we could sign flip murray again then we need to do that too.. he is good. flip jeff mo and ( if we can get him) stackhouse comin off the bench!! we wont have to worry about injuries because we would have back ups for back ups!! if somebody has to step in and start while somebody injured, at least they will have a back up who is even good enough to start even if they also get injured!! all the good teams are deep in there bench, the lakers, boston, and cleveland.. and we are becoming as deep as them, maybe even deeper!!

icecold

September 22nd, 2009
2:23 pm

but i do think we should mario west!! he has great deffense!! i dont see nobody else on the hawks that work as hard as him on deffense!!!

ILL-logical

September 22nd, 2009
2:32 pm

IF Crawford makes a conscious effort to become a playmaker first, then he can be an interesting alternative to Bibby.First, he is a better on ball defender, epecially against point guards. Second, under the current “system”, the offense is run through Joe and Bibby/ point guard sets up on the perimeter for the open shot. Crawford can do this plus he is an effective penetrator-something Bibby is not.Last , but not least, he is bigger and quicker than Bibby.

Bibby has already earned the trust of both his team mates and Woodson. And he knows the “system” and appears to be comfortable in it. Teague or JT 2 is going to play regardless but when it gets down to going for the gold, someone is going to have to step their game for the team to reach its full potential. Crawford can give the team another option for success from the point guard position. And the better news is that whoever is left out will make excellent trade material for future needs.

newkid

September 22nd, 2009
2:52 pm

Thanks vava74. If my experiences with NYTimes ‘awaiting moderation’ comments is any indication, then I don’t expect to receive your reply.

GeeMack

September 22nd, 2009
2:55 pm

Icecold

ECF yes! But Not the NBA finals. The Hawks need another impact player.

Wally

September 22nd, 2009
3:02 pm

Hawk Fans, Please, for your own good, wake up and listen to Andy. My opinion (like that of most Warriors fans), is exactly the same as Andy’s. He is a nice guy and has a world class cross over. But the good ends there. As Andy says, he can’t catch and shoot. His normal offensive set is dribble, dribble and launch… but he can’t shoot the trey consistently. He is incredibly streaky. But most importantly, he may be the WORST defensive player in the entire NBA. He just doesn’t care. Despite his sweet, ‘I am all for the team’ mantra that he repeats everytime he gets dumped, he won’t play D. He won’t. For your own good Hawk fans, drastically lower your expectations. I like the Hawks and think they are a fun team to watch. But Crawford is bad news.

Melvin

September 22nd, 2009
3:18 pm

Nice post, Sleepy…

icecold

September 22nd, 2009
3:18 pm

GEEMack

thats why i feel that they are planning a big trade!!! getting all these veterans, they can trade to free up somebody else cap for the 2010 season!! they might be thinking to trade our veterans expiring contracts for somebody thats good on another team to help free up there cap room for the 2010 free agency!!! never know!! sunds is not dumn!! he knoews everybody cant play!! he might be tryin to do somethin big!!!

To Wally

exactly, thats why he is 6th man and not in the starting five!!! a six man thats instint offense that can penatrate and shoot threes!!! hes not being asked to be a superstar for our team, hes being ask to pick up the scoring slack when our people are tired!!!! the hawks play rotation deffense, not man to man deffense!! he can hold his own as a 6th man!!! he can score with out the help of his team, and he can attack the basket!!

icecold

September 22nd, 2009
3:21 pm

and i dont think he is going to go in at point guard that much! hes joe johnson back up.. jeff teague is mike bibby back up!!! that way we can jus keep killin other teams on scoring!!! hes a good fit for the hawks!! jamal crawford will contribute in a very positive way!!!!!

ant banks

September 22nd, 2009
3:31 pm

DAM PLAXICO,

2yrs in the slamma’ for shootin’ yourself, with your own gun? wtf? talk about injury to insult!!

what happened with matt jones and his cocaine charge?

ToeKnee

September 22nd, 2009
5:01 pm

great blog sekou. i love the part about horford getting excited on the court with jamal, you told that story great. i’d love to hear more stuff about the hawks on a personal level like that, what they’re like, how they act towards each other, on and off the court. and do you think a vet with stackhouses pedigree would demand more playing time than we might need him for though? dont need him taking away minutes from marving or crawford just cause hes a vet. but i could see him subbing for every guy on the team almost, not the bigs of course, but he could spell joe and marvin.

Daniel

September 22nd, 2009
5:02 pm

Appreciate the insights Wally and Andy. How would you compare the role that Crawford had with the Knicks and Warriors compared to his presumed role with the Hawks? Here he will be the main scoring option with the second unit, and as a change of pace player. Just curious

deep

September 22nd, 2009
5:12 pm

Any word on Collins in camp? I hope we sign Stackhouse….

Pg- Bibby, Teague
Sg- Johnson, Crawford
Sf- Williams, Evans, Stackhouse
Pf- Smith, Smith, Morris, Hunter
C- Horford, ZaZa, Collins, Siler

rms

September 22nd, 2009
5:20 pm

Sorry Sekou, I guess now is not a good time to be giving you a hard time about something like blogging, but I would like to hear your perspective on how these new replacement refs will turn out? I aint all that excited about Crawford since its hard for me to believe he is going to change all of a sudden.

ant banks

September 22nd, 2009
5:35 pm

last year we had FLIPMO’ SQUAD for Flip and Mo’ Evans…what about “MOJO” for Mo’ Evans and Joe Smith?

mojo
One entry found.

Main Entry: mo·jo
Pronunciation: \ˈmō-(ˌ)jō\
Function: noun

**: a magic spell, hex, or charm; broadly : magical power <works his mojo on the tennis court**

Samuel

September 22nd, 2009
6:06 pm

Shout out to “MY BOY” Dave Clark from Tupelo by way of Palmetto, Mississippi. My good friend and former teammate back in Mississippi is now the manager of the Houston Astros. Daaannggg!!!!

Doesn’t surprise me a bit. Dude was born to play baseball and one of the best people you ever want to meet. The Verona Blacksox has produced some good ones. Bill Hall(Brewers), and many other pros. I know Charles Williams is smiling from ear to ear.

Actually, I look for Crawford to have a bigtime year this year.Looking forward to seeing he,Bibby and JJ on the floor together. Talk about shot makers.

JerryWest

September 22nd, 2009
6:23 pm

Great post by Northcyde at Hawksquawk.net

http://www.hawksquawk.net/community/index.php/topic/339632-lets-say-joe-johnson-dont-sign-with-us-next-season/

If we lose JJ, we’re looking at 2 options.

1) Do nothing, and let Crawford be the guy taking all of the shots at the end of the game ( unless Marvin or Smoove can become reliable enough to get the job done in this area )

2) Make a trade to bring in another star caliber player. ( and I’m not talking about trading Mo Evans for somebody . . . It’ll have to be a trade that sees Josh Smith or Al Horford leave this team, because those are the 2 guys that most people want ).

Or it could be option #3 . . . re-sign JJ at a lower price

The problem with that strategy, is that if LeBron and Wade switch teams, you’re going to see a domino effect take place throughout the league. There are just going to be too many teams with cap space, that could possibly offer JJ more than a 15 million a year deal next summer, if they choose to do so.

- Minnesota
- New Jersey
- LA Clippers
- NY Knicks
- possibly Houston ( because McGrady’s contract expires next season )
- if Lebron leaves Cleveland, then Cleveland
- if Wade leaves Miami, then Miami ( Hell . . . Miami could possibly do it, even if they do re-sign Wade )

Maybe a 4th option, would be to have JJ still on the market next summer, but not renounce his rights, so that the Hawks could possibly do a sign and trade for somebody(s).

I understand what the Hawks are doing. They’re trying to see if JJ is a guy that you can win a title with, if you have the right pieces around him.

It’s Russian Roulette though. I can see us losing JJ, then not being able to do anything. We’ll end up the exact same way that Chicago did, when they basically lost Ben Gordon for nothing.

My prediction is this . . and I said this over the summer. If the Hawks struggle, they’re going to be looking to trade JJ before the trading deadline.

They’ll end up trading him for a cat like Kevin Martin of Sacramento, along with an expiring contract to make the numbers match . . like a Desmond Mason or somebody. And they’ll try to sell us on the fact that Martin is a good shooter ( possibly even better than JJ ), and that we can rely on his shooting for the next 4 years.

But like with the Danny Manning / Nique trade, the effect probably wouldn’t hurt the Hawks tremendously . . until the playoffs came around.

Then Martin would get really exposed as the non-defensive playing guard that he is. And we’d have 2 of those guys on the team ( Martin and Crawford ), who can score, but won’t play a lick of defense.

We get bounced out in the 1st round in 7 games, and all hell would break loose . . . starting with Woody being fired . . . and probably ending with Smoove being traded.
————
either Smoove or Marvin would have to become a star caliber player. For Smoove, we’re talking about him shooting 50+% FG, scoring 20 ppg and grabbing 10 rebs. It if’s Marvin, we’re talking about him scoring somewhere around 20 ppg, while shooting in the high-40% FG, and at least in the low-40% 3FG.

If a team wants to win a title in this league, this is usually the formula:

- at least 2 All-Star caliber players ( preferably a guard + a PF or C . . with one of those guys being at least a 1st or 2nd team All-NBA player )

- a 3rd player who can occasionally play at a star level

- overall, a top 10 defensive team ( preferably a top 5 one )

If you usually don’t have ALL of those components on your team, you’re usually not winning a title, or in contention for one.

Daddy Long Long

September 22nd, 2009
6:28 pm

Man, with Vince Carter down in Orlando we could use Stackhouse! I hope Hawksville Capt. Woody plays Al Horford more at the 4 & Josh at the 3. I love this time of the year! Let’s go Hawks!!

bigdave

September 22nd, 2009
6:33 pm

ILL-logical…

thats the Crawford im hoping for…a much missed facilitator… get the ball out of Joe’s hands and get him looks off the ball. Crawford is a great ball handler and is a threat to score off the dribble going either direction (see Mike Bibby) i also like his length against smaller pg’s. we’ll see…

ant banks…

referring to Matt “pow’da nose” Jones, a helluva question… smh.
with good behavior Plax does 20mths.

The Truth

September 22nd, 2009
6:40 pm

While we all salivate the idea of a Stackhouse addition to the roster, while the emotion run wild with excitement envisioning us now becoming a new member of the elite east, let us not overlook the cause and effect from such an impromptu roster move.

Stackhouse was not invited to the party; he just showed up and showed out. Unlike many desirable UFA where a pursuing team has to do a sales job of convincing the prospect that their team is the perfect fit (like Joe Smith), the highly productive Stackhouse has already expressed an interest in playing for the Hawks. That has already been documented. Therefore much of the heavy lifting of selling him has already been done. He wants to play here. The problem is Stackhouse was not originally part of Sund’s master plan. I’m sure Sund has laid out what he had envisioned and has proceeded to implement accordingly. Whether his priority included the acquisition of another backup SF/SG after acquiring Joe Smith over a 3rd PG (or over another position), is unknown. My speculation is that it was not because if he was a priority, he would have been invited or been pursued already. Now that Stackhouse is on the radar by popular demand, Sund may have to re-think his strategy and decide how such an addition would impact the team and the chemistry. I have to imagine that Sund has built the roster based on abilities, roles and responsibilities in proportion to the team salary structure. For example, JJ is the “man” therefore JJ is paid the highest salary. The exception to this is the addition of experienced vets whose roles, responsibility and contribution may not match their salary like a Joe Smith or a Flip Murray when he was here. I previously mentioned that Mo Evans would be the most impacted by a Stackhouse addition only because he is also a SF/SG and because of his 2.5M salary which is the next highest behind Zaza. His salary will be higher then Joe Smith and Collins combined. Based on Evans salary, availability, and last year contribution, in all fairness, he deserves to be in the rotation as he was last year. By the way, he was in the rotation before Marvin got injured because Sund built the team that way last year. As I previously mentioned, Evans contribution was appreciated (as was Flip) so this notion that he is underappreciated is way over-blown. But this is a business and I am sure Sund sees it that way as evidence to how Flip got handled. If Stackhouse was added and if he contributed more and as a consequence demanded more minutes, it will have to come at another player’s expense with respect to minutes played (to the cynics don’t missed the if part) . Since Evans was in the rotation last year and he is also a SF/SG then he is the likely candidate. So do we let a 2.5M player (Evans) play the role of Mario and just do rare spot duty on defense as a consequence of a BALLER like Stackhouse? I’m sure no one expects Evans is going to compete with Crawford for SG minutes. Not when Crawford is making 10M a season. Unless its injury related, it’s not going to happen. Would Evans be happy with his new far-lesser role? Like most GM, Sund is looking to maximize his return on his roster assets. He has shown to spend his dollars wisely. As he recently stated, the Hawks are not a robustly funded franchise and boosted about doing more with less; so this idea that they have the luxury of letting the 8th highest paid player sit as a reserve does not equate in my book in a Stack addition scenario. So what, now we have discussed trade talks involving Mo Evans as a consequence from this scenario. As other blog speculators have said, “I could be wrong”. This maybe politically incorrect to say on this blog, but if I have pissed off someone discussing trade talks involving Mo Evans as a consequence for signing Stackhouse then I don’t give a dam. We have discussed much worst on this blog.

vava74

September 22nd, 2009
7:05 pm

newkid,

Let’s see if this time it passes:

Actually I am from Portugal which is about as south as Europe can be.

Holland is a bit chilly and rainy in October (max temperatures average around 50F in the beginning and dropping throughout the month). You can compare the weather at www weather com on the travel page).

I’ve been to Amsterdam four times, once in June (excellent weather then) and three times in late October/early November (rainy and a bit cold as I mentioned above).

It is always great fun since the people there are very friendly and lively. Excellent jazz bars, very nice restaurants, pubs and clubs (if you go and have moderately deep pockets and like to dine at the sound of dance music while lying on a bed mattress, check out Supperclub – www supperclub com)… The red light district is always an interesting but odd visit as well:

The last time I was in Amsterdam I was walking along a channel in the red light district (with my girlfriend, so no funny commentaries please) around 4/5PM and there was an english guy walking along asking and shouting to the h**kers on the windows “is there any transsexual available around?”

In relation to country side Holland and other cities, I think it would be far better for you to visit in May, when tulips fields (and other flowers) are in full bloom.

In October, I think you will better served traveling to southern Europe: Lisbon, Barcelona, Madrid, Rome, …

I hope it helps!

Big Ump

September 22nd, 2009
7:27 pm

BigRay

I agree with your post at 1:46 am that Joe should not play 38 mins to to 40 Mins a game. Great post as alwyays.

vava74

September 22nd, 2009
7:36 pm

I’m completely against Sekou’s commentaries here in the blog and at foxsports:

http://msn.foxsports.com/video/NBA?vid=69f29939-87df-43c1-96e0-b68230d1ca81

I don’t think it is wise for us to make ANY move in February. Our evolution will not come with a new trade.

It will come with time and organic growth.

Next year, the Celtics will be a bunch of pre-retired stars, Orlando will not evolve this year and the Vince experiment will be aborted.

Lebron will be rebuilding, either elsewhere or in Cleveland since Shaq and Ziggy will be both too old to contribute at the level they need.

Also, I don’t see Miami progressing as much as we can, and beyond Miami, I can’t see anyone else close to us. Maybe Philly or Toronto can make a move up, however, it will not be at our same pace.

The rest are dead meat in comparison to us.

Joe Daddy

September 22nd, 2009
7:41 pm

“What did he do LAST YEAR? Dont violate the statistic abuse law by telling me how good ZaZa was When he was starter. What did he do last year? Thats where hes at. Have you ever did the cyber date thing where women show you pictures of what they looked like 2 or 3 years ago only to meet them and she how huge they become? You are only as good as your most recent performances.”

Woodson’s most recent performance?

0-4 against Cleveland. OOPS! Careful what you wish for.

KevinA

September 22nd, 2009
7:49 pm

Worlds longest basketball shot

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Video-World-s-longest-basketball-shot?urn=nba,191193

niremetal

September 22nd, 2009
7:50 pm

vava,

So you’re saying we should avoid making a trade just for the sake of continuity? How does that make any more sense than the people who say we should make a trade just for the sake of continuity?

If a trade would improve the team for this year and not hurt us down the road, we should make it. If it wouldn’t, we shouldn’t. That fits with what the Hawks did in trading for Crawford and Bibby and it fits with what Sekou was saying – if we are in the hunt come February and a deal that would improve us comes up, we should consider it. I don’t think Sund should shut off his phone just for the sake of continuity.

KevinA

September 22nd, 2009
8:02 pm

Joe Daddy,

Against big teams. I would like to see ZaZA start and Al at the #4. Maybe even Josh at the #3 to add some size. At least as an experment. Sund thinks ZaZa could start for other teams. I take it you disagree.

vava74

September 22nd, 2009
8:34 pm

Nire,

There are no viable trades around which make any sense to me.

Any trade would either mean the loss of young and still evolving talent or bringing in veteran being dump for salary purposes.

I don’t believe in relenting possession over JJ, Al, Josh or Marvin. I also don’t believe that we can jeopardize the re-signing of JJ by pushing our salary limit up.

Any of the two routes would mortgage our future for very limited (if any) results.

The above four guys are our only significant trade assets, and sincerely, unless you could bring Dwight Howard, Chris Paul or Deron Williams without losing more than 2 of the 4, I can’t see any trade which w/could benefit us.

And pleeeease don’t bring up any Amar’e or Bosh suggestions.

Even if we are, by mid season, a bit below our initial expectations, I don’t think we should do any roster moves.

Sometimes, it is better to have a less positive regular season in order to finish strong and have a good rotation and incorporation of all the new pieces entering into the playoffs.

vava74

September 22nd, 2009
8:42 pm

Big Ray,

I don’t want to annoy you, but could you please watch this top to bottom?

Pretty please with sugar on top? )

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tue-august-18-2009/the-gun-show—barrel-fever

JerryWest

September 22nd, 2009
8:47 pm

Sekou,

Did the Sixers ask for JoshSmith+Marvin for Iverson 2 years ago? Did we offer only one?

JJ’s organic growth will happen this year when he won’t be double/triple teamed as often.

The easiest way for Josh Smith to become an all star – Just become the best offensive rebounder in the league. With that kind of hop he should be playing volley-ball with the board.

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
8:50 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-28Z8yRUZw

vava74

September 22nd, 2009
8:51 pm

Jerry,

I am with you on that one. If Josh does realize that he will become an all star faster by rebounding rather than by shooting the rock, we will be heading the right direction.

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
9:04 pm

72 reasons to be excited about the Atlanta Hawks: #39 the Boston Celtics http://sbnation.com/e/814752

truly1

September 22nd, 2009
9:06 pm

I dont understand why anyone could think that adding a starter to a team as a 6th man one who put up 50 point games is not a good thing. Crawford is a great addition we needed offense off the bench and if he does do all the bad things some of you are talking about which I dont think he is going to do. Sit him on the bench. He is a 6th man I repeat. Crawford is a win win situation.

niremetal

September 22nd, 2009
9:17 pm

Vava,

Then you totally missed Sekou’s (and my) point, man. I agree that there’s probably no viable trades NOW that could add us an All-Star caliber player (well, unless you count my Josh-for-Biedrins-or-Bosh pipe dream). But trades that sound impossible now could start looking a lot more viable in January/February when the playoff picture starts shaping up. Teams out of the playoff hunt may start trying to unload their stars with heavy contracts. Happens all the time. It’s impossible to predict what trades will be “viable” 4 months and 40 regular season games from now. You missed one rather obvious trade asset – Jamal Crawford, whose contract expires in 2011. A team looking to unload someone with an even longer-term deal might be willing to take his contract on for a year and a half…not unlike the Warriors did with us in the Crawford trade.

You also seem to forget that we couldn’t possibly be adding THAT much payroll with any trade thanks to the 125% rule. So since we don’t have any huge expiring contracts, no trade that we could make would make a real dent into our ability to re-sign JJ.

It’s clear you’re pretty set against this. But again, I’ll just say that the attitude of “continuity for the sake of continuity” is no more sensible an approach than “change for the sake of change.” The view should be towards whether a trade improves the team, not whether we simply need a change or simply need to stay the course.

Ariose

September 22nd, 2009
9:30 pm

http://www.sporcle.com/games/nba_team_3points.php

ILL-logical

September 22nd, 2009
9:52 pm

I would like to suggest to those who believe that leaping ability equals rebounding in the NBA that your opinions do not comport with reality. Rebounding at the NBA level is more about strength and heft than anything else and that is why the Hawks suffer . Their “bigs” are undersized and overmatched in most matchups. Woodson has sought to off set this disadvantage with speed but ironically doesn’t run enough to capitalize on that advantage.

When the Hawks find a center who fits into Woodon’s “system” and has the strength and heft to bang with the big boys THEN they may be able to compete for the Larry O’ Brien trophy consistently.

Me, I would start Jason Collins and give him 20 minutes a game at center- he has been a starter on an NBA finals team and has demonstrated the low error rate that Woodson likes; Al at power forward -20 minutes ; Josh at the 3 for 20 minutes with Bibby and Joe in the backcourt. Marvin would be my 6th man and my scoring threat off of the bench at 2,3 or 4. ZaZa ; Joe Smith, JT 2 and Jamal round out a second unit that would be second to none. Plus on any given night you could mix and match to go big, small-Al at the 5 and Josh at the 4- or any number of permutations and combinations.Whatever anyone threw at them, the Hawks could match and trump. And don’t throw Stack in the mix because you then could have 5 former NBA starters on your “second team” that would not be plussed by hostile crowds or home cooking. Just a few things to think about.

Hoops

September 22nd, 2009
10:00 pm

deep,

I like your line up. One problem though. Sund has said that the Hawks are not going to sign 15 players. You’re going to have to let somebody go. Hunter?

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
10:20 pm

Vava74 ,

I checked out the link you sent. I’ve generally liked John Stewart, he’s a pretty funny guy. As to the subject matter, I have one thing to say: No freedom or privilege given, no matter how big or small, is proof against a fool, who will find a way to abuse or pervert it. Problem is, this world has no shortage of fools.

And no, you are NOT annoying me.

loyalhawktillidie

September 22nd, 2009
10:21 pm

keep dreaming guys, you are banking your whole season in that vince carter does not work in orlando even if does not work orlando is still a better team than us so is cleveland and boston plus we dont know for a fact that crawford will fit are team so how can you dis vince carter when we also have new players i like to bank on are season from the talent we have on are team not on what ifs like what if all the other 29 teams failed to score a single point this season or what if every team when on stike except us thats a bunch of garbage and i feel we are going to make it to the second round and loose come on guys we cant be homers here we act like stackhouse is gonna be kevin durant or dwayne wade hes gonna get 10 minutes and 4 points at the best, while orlando and boston are getting their front line beefed up and cleveland is stacking up on wing players we are depending on a ball hog of crawford an unproven rookie and old players like stackhouse and joe smith give me a break…..

Jody

September 22nd, 2009
10:34 pm

ILL-logical,

I think you make a VERY valid point about the sucess or lack there of when it comes to rebounding and at some point in the future, the Hawks will have to address this if they are to reach the next level. If people stop and notice, the teams ahead of the hawks just in the East don’t have the problem the Hawks have up front and that’s a reason why they’re ahead.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
10:44 pm

Jerrywest ,

I really wish that offensive rebounding was the simple trick to Josh becoming an all-star. But I really don’t think it is. Yes, he has great hops, but being a human pogo stick is not all there is to it, or guys like Tyrus Thomas would be there already. And it hasn’t worked for the best offensive rebounder on the team (Zaza and Horford are tied at 2.2 a game).

Besides, I heard somewhere that Zaza only gets so many offensive rebounds because he’s lazy ….. Not sure how that fits a reasonable argument, but….

Anyway, your idea does have some merit that cannot be ignored. Josh averaged 1.9 offensive rebounds per game last year. If he doubles that (not an easy feat), then he ends up with 3.8 per game. Now if his defensive rebounds stay the same (5.3 per game), then the two added together ends up being a total of 9.1 rpg. None too shabby, but added to 15.6 ppg average? Not all-star level.

I wouldn’t complain if his offensive rebounding went up. But I’d rather it go up slightly, while his defensive rebounds took a good spike. So, he could get say, 1 more offensive board per game, but raise his defensive rebounds about 1.8 per game. That would be 7.1 def rpg and 2.9 off rpg for a total of……10 rebounds per game. Now for the second part.

A lot of people want Josh to just stay in the paint and shoot no jumpers. I don’t think this is a good idea. Why? Because Josh is not a “post player” by any traditional definition. He lacks the fundamentals, instinct, and skill set. Oh, he can score in the paint, but he is not a low post scorer along the lines of Duncan, O’Neal, Howard, Jefferson, Yao, not even Stoudamire or Bosh, J O’Neal, or the lighter weight guys. He can learn some fundamentals/skills, but let’s be honest, the guy is a slasher.

And only the best/biggest post scorers like Howard and Shaq can excel without a jumper. Even then, Howard is working on one…

If being athletic and being able to jump out of the gym makes a guy a sure thing down low, then Tyrus Thomas should be an all-star already, and Harold Miner should have never faded from the league like he did. Josh needs a decent midrange jumper and better handles so that he is not limited to being in one specific area on the floor. An area that he can’t dominate against teams with big enough bodies and better coaches. Why? Because there are bigger players out there than can be used to push him off the block (he’s not weak, but he ain’t a pure physical force either) and frustrate him.

He has to be able to use that quickness, and for that to be possible, he must have space. There ain’t much of it in the paint. I’m not saying he should be out jacking up 15-18 footers all day. Far from it. He still needs to do the bulk of his scoring by attacking the rim. But to continue to be a threat, he also needs to be able to make teams respect him outside of the paint. The only way to do that is to be able to hit a mid-range jumper consistently enough, and to be able to draw opposing forwards away from the paint, and use his speed/first step to get past them when they seek to keep him from shooting the 15-footer.

But that’s just what I think.

niremetal

September 22nd, 2009
10:44 pm

Doc,

I never thought I’d see someone more allergic to punctuation than you…until now

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
10:45 pm

Loyalhawktillidie,

Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t cheer our team on. By the way, all those periods you left at the end of the post? I think some of them were supposed to be scattered throughout the post.

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
10:46 pm

LOL@ Nire ….

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
10:48 pm

That and I think Josh and Al can play a bit of hi-low sometimes. If Josh can hit a midrange jumper (Al already can, seen it a few times and it was nice) then he can draw a defender off of Al. And Josh DOES know how to pass.

loyalhawktillidie

September 22nd, 2009
10:56 pm

yea big ray i dont need a english lesson from you…….. lol yea but there is a line between supporting your team and being ablivious to reality i love are team but hate when we make excuses or dumb reasons to explain how we can beat teams the fact is we have to base are input on facts not if’s because we make a lot of ifs for other teams but have no ifs about are team like we are fast to say what bad things are going to happen to other teams but avoid doing the same for our team like what if the hawks loose a key player or there chemistry is not good

Israel's dad

September 22nd, 2009
11:26 pm

I always appreciate your articles when I get a chance to read them. I can’t tell you how excited I am to get this season started. New additions, new draft picks, solid nucleus…. watch out Boston, I think we got youz this year.

Tony

September 22nd, 2009
11:36 pm

I am going to say this again, I do not care (no offense) about anyone on this team except JOSH SMITH. If we go or do anything this year Josh (along with horford and Marvin) will get it done. Period!!!!

niremetal

September 22nd, 2009
11:48 pm

Tony,

Your parenthetical kinda contradicted the rest of your post, no?

The Truth

September 22nd, 2009
11:52 pm

I notice from reading some blog comments that Crawford got Warriors and Knicks haters following him all the way to the AJC Blog. You would think true haters would rejoice in him gone and move on. Why would they continue to follow him here and dump past bad memories on us about him is something beyond me? It appears strange and a rather obsessive agenda if you asked me. To those Crawford Haters: Let the man make a fresh start and wish him well. Let it go!!

doc

September 23rd, 2009
12:45 am

ok nire, be kind. heh heh or scroll.

Hawks Fan In New Orleans

September 23rd, 2009
3:04 am

wow! Training camp can’t start soon enough. This is first time Woodson will be playing with hot hand. It will be interstimng to see is he can play his cards right…You know what – it will be impossible not to succeed with a roster this deep. Much success to all involved this year, and here’s too Sund potentially signing Stackhouse and Coach woodson effectively using a 9-10 deep roster.

vava74

September 23rd, 2009
6:03 am

Big Ray,

I glad that you took it well. I could dwell on the subject reminding you of another guy in New Hampshire who… wait… I am dwelling on it!

Let’s get back to business, namely the discussion on Josh’s potential to become a good rebounder:

Rebounding effectively is not necessarily a direct result of size: Dennis Rodman is the best contrary example and the Knick’s Curry the opposite.

Rodman was 6′9” and about 230lbs which is exactly what J-Smoove has.

Rodman used in his rebounding technique a specific physical ability which J-Smoove also has: he could jump repeatedly keeping almost the same bounce.

Allied with that, he perfected the art of tipping the ball his way (also repeatedly) until he managed to get it to fall when he was the only guy still jumping.

Big guys may jump well and bump bodies around, however, they can’t jump repeatedly at the same level.

Rodman did it and J-Smoove also does it.

What is missing in Josh are three things, of which the first two should be easy to accomplish:

1. The desire to clean the glass;
2. Him learning to tip the ball instead of trying to grab it immediately;

And the last and most difficult (where Rodman was a master)

3. Him learning to read the bounce of the ball out of the rim before it hits it.

I would also like to say a last word on Rodman: there is NO WAY that a credible Hall of Fame can leave this guy out.

He could be a loony, but on the court he was the ultimate professional, an unbelievable on the ball defender with the ability to cover any player from SG to C, an outstanding team defender, and an ultra talented and relentless rebounder.

BBall cannot be seen only about scoring, dunking or dishing out assists.

With a different set of tools, I would also like to endorse our former Hawk Sydney Moncrief which is another name which has been overlooked unfairly: he was as complete as one can get (due to my age, I saw very little of him, however, if you look at his career and read about it, you can immediately determine that he is deserving of this honor).

JSS

September 23rd, 2009
8:02 am

Vava, check around the net and see if you can come across some footage of the 1977/1978 Arkansas Basketball team with Moncrief, Marvin Delph, and the older Brewer. They put that program on the block. When he was in his prime with Junior Bridgeman and Marques Johnson, that was special… Unfortunately, they had Boston and Phildelphia teams that were stocked in front of them… And having Tree Rollins North (Alton Lister) did not help the cause..

All World

September 23rd, 2009
8:10 am

Flip Murry, period!

Ray S

September 23rd, 2009
8:44 am

Sekou,

Do you know when the training camp roster will be announced?? Thanks..

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
8:46 am

All World- Tyrone Corbin, question mark:
Manute Bol, backslash”
World B. Free, asterik ^
Von Wafer, bracket &
Cherokee Parks, exclamation point #
Chris Jackson, comma $
Tree Rollins, quotation mark %
Pluto, period,……

top that

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
8:48 am

vava- nice post on Rodman

Samuel

September 23rd, 2009
8:49 am

Vava,

I totally agree with you on Rodman. While I believe there are plenty of guys in the league with the athleticism to do what he did, there are zero with the desire to do it.

How many rebound highlights do you see on ESPN or EA sports?

Like you said, Rodman may not even make the HOF even though he was clearly one of the best in his era.

Josh said some good things in his recent interview, maybe he “has seen the light” and will become the Rodman of this era. If he does, the Hawks make another move upward. If he falls back into his old ways, we are having this conversation over and over i’m afraid.

On the guns: It’s funny how when certain people are gun owners if becomes a national emergency while with others it’s very “sexy”. Just sayn.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
8:52 am

That last post makes me wonder who is the most unattractive person in the NBA?

Sam Cassell?
Scottie Pippen?
George Muresan(sp)?

I actually vote for Tyrone Corbin…

now, there is a topic that will stir controversy

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
8:57 am

I am sure there is at least one team that has told JJ’s agent that a max offer will be extended in 2010.

Dennis Rodman guarded and frustrated Magic Johnson and Kareem Abdul Jabbar in the same game. He guarded and pissed off Mark Jackson and Patrick Ewing in the same game. He would have been a great basketball player in any era. 100 years from now when the current players would look slow and small, Dennis Rodman could have played well. Basketball IQ off the chart. Undoubtedly first ballot hall of famer.

Andy

September 23rd, 2009
9:42 am

The Truth,

Following him to the AJC blog? The AJC blog is on the internet, just like all the rest. It’s not like one has to get on a plane to Atlanta to post an opinion here. I think those who have watched Crawford play a lot were just offering some insight on what might be coming there.

Not sure where the hate stuff is coming from. It’s just a basketball discussion. Nothing more.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
10:02 am

Sekou’s blog is national news now. The links are posted in many NBA related sites like hoopshype etc. Any NBA followers could stumble into this blog.

rainman

September 23rd, 2009
10:02 am

Hey Sekou — If you had to choose between Mo and Stack to backup Marvin. who would you pick?
The news on Teague is very encouraging. In a previous blog, you said that he should get at least 14 or 15 minutes a game. I’m hoping, that as the season goes on, he proves good enough to warrant even more. The Hawks future would look pretty good if we could finally score on an impact PG, ala Rose or CP3.

vava74

September 23rd, 2009
10:18 am

JSS,

Thank you, I will take a look.

I actually still have somewhere a Hawks – Lakers game in VHS where Moncrief had his best game as a Hawk.

One could see that his knees were hurting like hell but he put on a great game coming off the bench scoring 14 (or something like that) points and filling in the stat sheet.

The Truth

September 23rd, 2009
10:28 am

Andy

This is just an example:

Wally

September 22nd, 2009
3:02 pm
Hawk Fans, Please, for your own good, wake up and listen to Andy. My opinion (like that of most Warriors fans), is exactly the same as Andy’s. He is a nice guy and has a world class cross over. But the good ends there. As Andy says, he can’t catch and shoot. His normal offensive set is dribble, dribble and launch… but he can’t shoot the trey consistently. He is incredibly streaky. But most importantly, he may be the WORST defensive player in the entire NBA. He just doesn’t care. Despite his sweet, ‘I am all for the team’ mantra that he repeats everytime he gets dumped, he won’t play D. He won’t. For your own good Hawk fans, drastically lower your expectations. I like the Hawks and think they are a fun team to watch. But Crawford is bad.

What may be unsolicited insight to some may come-across as a hater to others. I would also wager that there are no Hawks Fans on the Warrior’s website bad-mouthing AC Law for his past Hawks performances. If so, prove me wrong.

GeeMack

September 23rd, 2009
10:34 am

Ken,

I agree with you the Hawks are a very deep team, but so are the Celtics Cavs and Magic. As Hawks fans we have to recognize the teams ahead of us did not stand pat and what the Hawks. They improved their starting line ups as well as their bench.

Boston added Wallace and Daniels to a bench that already featured Big Baby and Eddie House. Rondo and Perkins don’t need a lot of rest they are under 25 yrs old. The Celtics top 8 player all have championship experience. I think Daniels was still with the Mavs when they made their championship run.

The Cavs added Shaq as a starter. Moon & A Parker potential reserves. More than likely Parker will start and West will go to the bench. That means your reserves are West, Moon, Big Z, Powe, Gibson. That’s a solid bench

The Magic added Vince & Bass as starter. With Gortat, Barnes, AJ, Petrius as reserves that’s a solid bench.

I think the Hawks got better adding the veteran depth & size, but so did the teams we are chasing. Those guys improved their bench and starting line up.

Andy

September 23rd, 2009
10:52 am

The Truth,

What would be the purpose of “hating” Crawford? If someone who watched him play thinks folks in Atlanta might be in for a rude awakening, what’s wrong with expressing it? I don’t think very much of Crawford either, but I also stated that with proper coaching, you might get something more than we got here, where there was no coaching.

As for Acie Law, I don’t think folks in Oakland are exactly celebrating the fact that they got him, whereas Crawford is expected to be a major part of ther Hawks’ rotation.

It’s just a basketball discussion.

Now if we were talking about Kobe Bryant and someone chimed in and said, “I wouldn’t get so excited about this guy,” then I could see your point.

The Truth

September 23rd, 2009
11:21 am

Andy

I asked that same question, what would be the purpose? I couldn’t think of an answer either. That’s why I posted my thoughts. Incidentally, I make no reference to your comment since yours appeared a bit more objective and open minded. But I will say this; just because a player performs poorly on one team doesn’t automatically means that will be his NBA history. There are too many factors to list them all here that could cause an alteration to past performances both good and bad. As I often tell my daughter when she is faced with challenges, I will not deny the right to a creative struggle. My point is, let us determine Crawford abilities for ourselves without carry-over baggage from the past.

Andy

September 23rd, 2009
11:40 am

The truth,

I agree that players can adapt, and as I referenced earlier, he was hurt by playing so many years for an Isiah Thomas run “organization” which was basically glorified streetball, though I did see some signs of coachability when Larry Brown was there.

My only point was that he’d be perfect for the Flip Murray minutes – if he’s hot, you ride him. If he’s too wild, nail him to the bench. Too much reliance might be dangerous.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
11:52 am

Most of us thrive in organized and well structured situations, but would suck in unstructured chaos. Go visit a third world country and you’ll realize how easy you have it here. Crawford has lived in NBA’s version of slums all his career.

Even Billups, in his first 6 years of oblivion, played in some adequate teams. Crawford played with so many underachieving head cases that its a miracle that he doesn’t sound bitter.

Larry Brown loves Crawford and didn’t think much of the rest of the Knicks team.

Isiah said Crawford can play defense on point guards, but not on strong shooting guards.

It seems to me that he should be able to handle back up shooting guards and big point guards for the hawks. His strengths and weaknesses just fit in very well with the Hawks. The offensive mismatches with JJ+Crawford backcourt can’t be solved by Orlando/Boston/Cleveland small backcourts. If Flip could drive here, Crawford should fly.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
11:54 am

Andy, what do you think of Crawford’s PG skills? How does it go with JJ, who can handle the ball quite well.

The Truth

September 23rd, 2009
12:07 pm

Andy

If he can put up (at least) Flip numbers off the bench then we should be fine. If Crawford was JJ 4 years ago, then I might be concern. Our team was so green during that period, adding a Crawford might have a disaster as to your point. He just needs to be a good role player not a hero on this team. Woody legacy as a Hawks coach may very well rest on the team accomplishment in general and also on how Crawford perform specially this year with such high expectations. Woody could either validate past coaching actions on Crawford or prove them all wrong. We shall see.

vava74

September 23rd, 2009
12:26 pm

Akin to what The Truth as said,

I would like to remind some of the ungrateful Hawks fans which constantly rant about “JJ’s inability to take it to another level”, “that he is not up to Kobe, Lebron or Wade’s level” and that don’t consider his re-signing as absolutely crucial for our future success, how valuable and important was his poise and low key leadership in the steady development of the Hawks.

If instead of JJ we had signed a flashy “me-first-wannabe-star” type of player, we would still be bottom feeders.

JJ is a “next generation Joe Dumars”, a blue collar player with all star skills with a little bit more spark.

If you took Joe out of the Bad Boys, they wouldn’t have one a single playoff series. The same applies to the Hawks: if we remove his all rounded and balanced game we will loose it.

Right now, we need that one of the young guns (or all of them) steps up and takes it up to the next level.

If we manage to have at least 2 guys playing at an all star level (JJ and another) and have 2 or 3 close by, we will be unstoppable within 2 years.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
12:28 pm

Crawford’s role on this team is exactly as you said Andy. He will be our primary scoring option off the bench to play against second units. His pt will vary based on matchups and how hot he is. He will not be this teams primary, secondary or even third scorer. I appreciate the insight, but I do think it is unfair that you and Wally somehow think that we as Hawks fans are overblowing Crawford’s potential and impact on this team. Most of us think we have improved 50-55 wins depending (remember we won 47 last year) and still will make a second round playoff appearance, and we will hope from there.

No offense, glad you are here, but both yours and Wally’s comment were condescending in a way, that you probably did not intend. But, just so you know we watch a lot of basketball here in Atlanta, too.

GeeMack

September 23rd, 2009
12:35 pm

vava74

You are correct JJ is like a Joe Dumars type player. The Robbin to someones Batman. Put him with LBJ Kobe, D-Wade or CP3 and we talkin championship. Trying to lead a team and you talking 1st or 2nd rd playoff exit each year regardless of how well the younger guys play. Champioships are won by teams that have great player with a good supporting cast. Not good players with a good supporting cast. That’s a formula for a good regular season but no playoff success. Check the Hawks of the 80’s & 90’s.

vava74

September 23rd, 2009
12:52 pm

GeeMack,

The example I gave you was not made in vain: Zeke got more credit than he deserved in comparison to Joe. I personally believe that their contributions to the Bad Boys were more or less equivalent, with Zeke launching too many bad shots and with a me-first attitude which was balanced by a cool and poised Joe cleaning up the scraps with his defense and his clutch shooting.

My take is that you can win with a collection of players at the same level, just below the super star level and proof of that has come from Detroit TWICE.

And at this stage comes another interesting fact: Woody was there when they won last time and that shows in the way that the team plays help defense and in the the way that all sound so “collectively into it”.

In relation to our Hawks teams of the 80’s, I believe that this team has the potential to be much better than those Hawks. Apart from ‘Nique and Doc, the rest of the cast was mostly role players who collectively produced beyond their capabilities and when Mo and Theus arrived, that just killed the team spirit.

Also, as much as I loved ‘Nique, he had tremendous flaws in his game: he was a streaky shooter from outside, a poor defender and passer, a “bit” of a ball-hog and almost exclusively wanted the ball on the left box limiting the game flow since Willis also only wanted the ball there.

It was only late in his career – after his achilles heel injury – that he learned and worked to contribute in a more well rounded and unselfish way and that showed. When we traded him, the Hawks committed one of the biggest crimes in sports history.

In relation to the Hawks teams in the late 90’s, yes, they were similar to this one, however, I think that JJ is a better player and more capable to take over a game than Steve Smith was and the rest of the roster is more talented as well collectively.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
1:00 pm

GeeMack- do you consider Howard a superstar level player? Pierce? Vince Carter? I dunno… I do agree that one of the our young three (hopefully all of them) needs to take it to the next level in order for this team to go deep in the playoffs.
This may shock you but I think CP3 is overrated.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
1:05 pm

vava- I would like to agree with you that this team is better than our 90s teams but….

Steve Smith vs. Joe Johnson- I like Joe, but not by a landslide
Bibby vs. Mookie- Mookie
Augmon vs. Williams- Williams
Smith vs. Willis- Willis
Mutombo vs. Al- Mutombo

do you agree?

vava74

September 23rd, 2009
1:16 pm

Daniel,

The starting 5, player by player, I agree. But I think that this roster is more balanced and all players are in the same page and mesh better physically and mentally.

I think defense wise, this team is superior collectively, although some of the 90’s Hawks were excellent/outstanding defenders and better in direct confrontation with today’s Hawks.

I am still predicting 57 wins for this year.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
1:26 pm

Daniel,

We traded away Augmon to have the cap space to sign Mutumbo.

We traded away Willis and got Steve Smith.

You can’t have it all.

A truer lineup would be

Mookie
Smith
Corbin
Laetner
Mutombo
Allen Henderson
Royal
Stiff
Stiff
Stiff

That bench was one of the worst in NBA history.

Crickets

September 23rd, 2009
1:28 pm

chirp, chirp, chirp, chirp

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
1:31 pm

jerrywest- I am aware that all of those players were not part of the same line up, I was going more for a sense of the “90’s team” vs. Todays unit. Didn’t we get Glen Rice in that deal with Miami?

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
1:32 pm

vava- I am all for you. Man, I hope they when 70. I am going to stick with 52 though.

Andy

September 23rd, 2009
1:44 pm

JerryWest,

I think Crawford can play the PG in a pinch. He can handle and pass, the problem is the decision-making. The shot selection will drive you nuts sometimes, especially if he’s made a couple in a row.

The Truth,

The 6th man role is perfect for him, the only question is if he’ll accept it and embrace it. This is a chance for him to shed the “loser” tag, fair or not.

Daniel,

I am sorry you felt like my comments were condescending. That was not the intent. If the Knicks were to get someone from the Hawks, I’d certainly welcome some input from Hawks’s fans who might have seen the guy play every night, whether the reviews were good or bad.

I know that folks in Atlanta watch basketball too, but no one, anywhere, can watch every player, every night. Just submitting an opinion.

I used to live in Atlanta, saw much of Dominique’s career, and likewise suffered through the Jon Koncak/Snoop Graham/Priest Lauderdale years, and was at the CNN Center draft parties booing the Doug Edwards/Cal Bowdler picks back in the 90’s, so I have a bit of attachment to the Hawks, too.

I hope this move works out for them.

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
2:23 pm

Daniel,I’ve gotta side with Andy and Wally on this one. I said it a few weeks ago. All of these fans(from his previous) critiqueing and saying the same thing about crawford on a consistant baisis; they can’t all be crazy. I still think we will win 55+ based on the crawford, and the other roster moves we’ve mad this off season. But i’ve got a pretty good idea if who crawford is at this point. But woody doesn’t care about that, he’ll let any player have an earfull if their not giving effort on the defensive side of the ball, so there is hope.

Rick, please sign Stackhouse….and Siler or Sims. If he’s taking the roster to 15 G.Green has to be in the mix, but I still think OKC is going to sign him.

Ramon

September 23rd, 2009
2:25 pm

Daniel, you’re telling me at that point of his career you would take Willis over Smith? Every one has their own opinion. But that is a very interesting one. Especially considering it wasn’t until his 7th year in the league that he consistently averaged a double double (in that is 7 years after going to college, so that puts him around the age of 27-29 at least). And also remember Willis very rarely shot better than 70% from free throw line. Willis averaged only 3 ft attempts a game, and Josh already averages close to 6 a game. Defensively, only one time did Willis average more than 1 block a game (1.5 bpg), the rest it was 0.4, 0.6, 0.5 bpg season after season. So as I said, taking Willis over Smooth is very interesting. And remember 93-94 was his last year on the roster as a starter producing heavily. And then there was no Mutombo, Steve Smith on the team. Another thing you do realize Josh’s FG% is way higher than Willis’ right? Just asking.

Ramon

September 23rd, 2009
2:26 pm

Daniel, this is the roster you’re speaking of. http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/ATL/1994.html And you would take THAT roster of THIS starting line up? Manning wasn’t better than Joe any year.

Ramon

September 23rd, 2009
2:27 pm

Matter of fact, Josh Smith is already giving more than Danny Manning who was consider an all star player then. And he’s not in his prime yet.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
2:50 pm

Andy- I know you didn’t mean to be condescending, and as I stated at first glad you are here. I appreciate your input, and along with Ariose agree to with your assesment. I think the part that I had trouble with was that you seemed to assume that we as Hawks’ fans had some unrealistic expectations of Crawford. I think we all agree he is a talented scorer with short comings, but will be an upgrade in the “Flip” role. I don’t think anyone on here seems him as a savior. I welcome your input. If I thought you were a scrub or some jerk, I wouldn’t have even responded to you.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
2:54 pm

ramon- appreciate the link, I was really just refrencing the talent on those 90’s teams that vava compared to these Hawks. Honestly, my knee jerk reaction is that this team is better, deeper and younger. Just kinda pointing out that there was some serious talent on the 90s team.

Willis vs. Smith. I dunno which Josh Smith do we get? That is the big question. You know I love Josh, but…. I hope he is better than Willis, if so then you have your 52-57 wins.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
3:15 pm

Manning did not have a chance in Atlanta, he could never live up to being traded for ‘Nique, and he played like he didn’t want to be here, which was strange considering he was traded from the Wizards.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
3:15 pm

Manning did not have a chance in Atlanta, he could never live up to being traded for ‘Nique, and he played like he didn’t want to be here, which was strange considering he was traded from the Clippers.

Daniel

September 23rd, 2009
3:16 pm

I swear I did not type Wizards!!!!!

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
3:48 pm

Ten Games To Watch – #3

http://www.hawksbasketblog.com/2009/09/21/ten-games-to-watch-3/

vava74

September 23rd, 2009
4:06 pm

I completely stopped followibg the Hawks and the NBA following ‘Nique’s trade.
I felt betrayed.
Hence I didn’t realize that Daniel’s starting five never existed. It did sound too good to be true.
We have an excellent roster right now which with a little bit of maturation will be very dangerous.

newkid

September 23rd, 2009
4:26 pm

vava74,

Many thanks for the information and advice; beautiful images you’ve painted. Daughter will soon be on extended work assignment there, so we’re considering a visit sooner rather than later. Indeed the pleasant and colorful mental images of spring in a countryside bursting with color evokes thoughts a bit more pleasing than chilly (but tolerable) autumnal days, doesn’t it? Don’t think the red light district will be in the cards under any circumstances, but thanks for the tip.

Will share my own visual images with you if we decide to travel there soon.

Obrigado!! Adeus.

hawks

September 23rd, 2009
4:35 pm

can’t wait to see crawford and jeff play. I hope jeff turns out to be an all-star in the future! GO HAWKS!

GeeMack

September 23rd, 2009
4:52 pm

vava74

Most of the items I think we can agree. However Zeke was a superstar. Dumars was Zeke’s Pippen. Some of the same things that was said about Zeke was said about Jordan early “ball hog” “Me first”, but they wanted to win more than anyone else.

The collection of good players wins a championships once every blue moon. The proven formula is superstar talent leads good player fill out the roster. As for the most recent Detroit team that won it all. That’s the only team in the history of the NBA that won it all without a HOFer.

Daniel

I do consider those guys superstars, but it’s funny how the GM put other stars around them to win a title.

hawks

September 23rd, 2009
5:21 pm

joe johnson is not a real all-star, he is a good player but not an all-star. you never know when he is going to have good game. JOSH SMITH should be an all-star!

rob

September 23rd, 2009
5:30 pm

jj + crawford in the starting line up = Hawks Win!

ILL-logical

September 23rd, 2009
5:34 pm

Interesting twist on Bobby Cox”retiring: recent internet reports-none locally- had Wren and Cox at loggerheads over the Smoltz and Glavine departures. The local spiin is that cox is bowing out gracefully with a 5 year “consulting contract”.

Sounds like another new GM wants his own person running the show deal. Wonder what is going through Messers Sund and Woodson’s minds right about now?

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
5:35 pm

Thomas Gardner signs with the Memphis Grizzlies:

http://blogs.hoopshype.com/blogs/sierra/2009/09/23/gardner-from-atlanta-to-memphis/

Dos Hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
5:39 pm

DANIEL, RAMON, VAVA74, JERRY WEST, ANDY,

How do you all see us mathing up with the following teams during the 09-10 season:

Hawks vs Chicago
Hawks vs Clev
Hawks vs Boston
Hawks vs Orlando

The reason that I picked these teams is because I feel that these are the top 5 teams in the EAST-Orlando, Clev., Boston, Hawks, Chicago.

On paper, we have nice additions, but how do you think that we will match up. How did Crawford do against Clev., Boston, and Orlando the last 2 years. How did Joe Smith do against these same teams last year. How did Collins do against these teams?

This is really the questions that we need to look at.

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends.”

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
5:46 pm

OMG!!!!WATCH THIS!!!!! FUNNY!!!

http://www.therundown.tv/videos/wtf-files/all-the-single-babies/

rob

September 23rd, 2009
5:54 pm

anybody agree with the guy saying that jj is not a real all-star and that josh smith should be the guy representing atlanta at the all-star games?

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
6:00 pm

Jamal Crawford torches Dwayne Wade for 52 points

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxKEou4vPHk

and then sits much of the 4th quarter.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
6:03 pm

The Golden State Warriors aren’t going anywhere fast this season, so head coach Don Nelson is going to give the youngsters a chance to shine by cutting some of the vets’ minutes.

Said vets include newly-acquired Jamal Crawford, who will sit out tonight’s ballgame against Charlotte, and his agent is not handling the shift in his client’s playing time well. From the Mercury News:

“Jamal wants to play,” Goodwin said. “That’s what he came here for. If the coach doesn’t want to play him, he should have a valid reason why he doesn’t want to play him.”

“What is the message that Coach Nelson is sending the team? That he does not care about winning?” Goodwin said. “You would think, in this day and time, when fans work hard to pay for these tickets, that the coach would field the best possible team. Jamal may not score 50 points on the Bobcats again, but he would work hard to get a win and reward the fans for their loyalty to this team in this hard time…”As an agent and a longtime fan of the Warriors, I totally disagree with this.”

For what it’s worth, Crawford says he will not question his coach’s decisions. That’s his agent’s job.

http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba/2009/02/jamal-crawfords-agent-isnt-enjoying-the-don-nelson-experience/

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
6:06 pm

and that was after scoring 50 pts against the bobcats in their previous encounter.

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireStory?id=6503704

Jamal Crawford scored 50 points to help the undermanned Golden State beat the Charlotte Bobcats 110-103 on Saturday night, giving Warriors coach Don Nelson a win in his first game with a new coaching strategy.

A night after Nelson announced he would no longer have anything to do with the Warriors’ NBA-worst defense, assistant Keith Smart handled that part of the game, while Crawford handled the offense — and then some.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
6:13 pm

Hawks bench (Zaza+ Joe+Collins+ Crawford + Mo Evans) have played in

2.937 NBA games and

started in

1,693 NBA games.

If Jerry Stackhouse comes here that number goes up to

3,791 and 2,256 respectively.

That should take care of our road issues.

Wally

September 23rd, 2009
6:26 pm

Truth, I think that term “hater” is one of the most insdiously damaging phrases that anyone can use on the web. The word does not simply mean a “critic” when one is posting on the web, but instead still has the English definition of one who hates. Now, given that I said Crawford is a nice guy and that I am concerned about Hawks fans getting too high of expections, I don’t even remotely see hate in there anywhere.

Now, if you think Joe Wilson, Serena and Kanye are just the bomb, you might not agree with my interpetation of your use of the term in question.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
6:30 pm

Juan Dixon

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Dixon

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
6:33 pm

Dixon had issues with his Achilles’ over the last few weeks of last season, but he played through the injury.

Wally

September 23rd, 2009
6:38 pm

Daniel, I just don’t get the interpretation of Andy’s or my post as condescending. Yes, I was trying to burst a bubble. But I didn’t think the bubble was based on ignorance by Hawk fans. It is simply a bubble all sports fans get when new blood comes to town. And Crawford’s gaudy numbers and summer pick up game skills could support that bubble. In fact, that bubble follows Crawford wherever he goes!

Yes, Crawford could be used for limited purposes as a microwave type player. But he stunk off the bench for the Warriors as he likes to start and even when in the mood, he is very, very inconsistent on offense. One game 32, the next 2. Occassionally, he gets in a passing mood – and has the talent to pass. But 90% of the itme, he is the classic black hole – pass it to him and no one is getting it back in this universe.

But there is something Crawford is consistent about – defense. He is perhaps the worst and laziest defender in the NBA. Your coach would simply have to be a genius and diplomat to use him well. I don’t like Nelly – but he is not a dumby. And even with a skill set that Nelly likes, Crawford was a negative presence on the court and was really disliked by fans as he just doesn’t bother to play defense. That will not change after 10 or so years in the NBA. I hope your coach recognizes this huge flaw and utilizes Crawford well, as … ta dum, I LIKE the Hawks.

rob

September 23rd, 2009
6:43 pm

this is how i see the east. 1. boston 2. cleaveland 3. hawks 4. orlando 5. detroit 6. toranto 7. wizards 8. heat, bulls, or 76ers

Wally

September 23rd, 2009
6:49 pm

Jerry West – And how does Crawford’s agent childish trashing of the Warriors make Crawford a good guy? A good teammate? A good defender?

My impression of Crawford is that he is a decent locker room guy but he was not loved by his teammates on the court as he is a black hole. Just wait for his signature move: head down, dribble back and forth between the legs and launch a 27 footer. You will see him score wtih this on ESPN and Youtube. And I am sure Al Horford thought it and the crossover are pretty cool. But he only hits this when very hot and it really obstructs the offensive flow.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
6:51 pm

Sekou,

Please make a poll. – Do the fans want Stackhouse – Yes or No.

How do we petition Sund for Stackhouse?

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
7:25 pm

Acie Law realeased from hospital.

Head injury from a 3 on 3 practice game.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/09/23/SPI119QTKR.DTL

ant banks

September 23rd, 2009
7:26 pm

JERRYWEST,

thanks for the tidbits on how crawford did against the scrub charlotte, but i am wit’ dos hawkquis, how did he do against the top tier teams? ie. orlando, clev. etc. who gives a rip that he lit charlotte up for fity?

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
7:29 pm

Wally – Its the agents job to get his players the max exposure. Why would Nelson not play Crawford after he scores 50 on Bobcats in their previous game. Any agent would be pissed.

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
7:38 pm

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/jamal_crawford/game_by_game_stats.html

niremetal

September 23rd, 2009
7:39 pm

And while we’re petitioning for over-the-hill Mavs retreads, why don’t we petition Rick to go after Keith Van Horn and Shawn Bradley?

rob

September 23rd, 2009
7:42 pm

can someone tell me how they see the east standings next season!

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
7:44 pm

Nire –

Huge exaggerations. Shawn Bradley/Van Horn retired long ago. Stackhouse, as Sekou mentioned was the best player in our practice. All the Hawks players loved his game. Do you think you are a better judge of talent than Hawks players and Sekou?

Are we not suppose to hire over the hill veteran minimum salary players? How many over the hill players do we have? Bibby/JJ?/Collins/ Crawford?/Mo?/Joe Smith… All teams use them.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
7:50 pm

Check all those memorable players in the box score:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=260405018

Don’t just look at Crawford’s 37 and LeBron’s 36.

See,

3 cavs players.
Flip Murray 18 pts.
Alen Henderson 0 pts.
Ira Newble DNPCD

Aren’t you glad Cavs signed Larry Hughes over Joe Johnson to max contract. Imagine if they got JJ and we had Larry Hughes.

jerrywest

September 23rd, 2009
8:00 pm

Horford + Marvin + Joe Smith had a combined 34 games with 20 pts or more.

Jamal Crawford had 32 of those despite the in-season trade and constant abuse by Don Nelson. We really badly needed that 2nd scoring punch who would protect JJ from double and triple teaming defense.

espn

September 23rd, 2009
8:06 pm

I say “trade marvin william!”

dos hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
8:09 pm

ROB,

I see the EAST as such: 1.Orlando, 2.Clev. 3.Boston 4.Hawks 5.Chicago 6.Indy 7.Miami 8.Charlotte/Toronto.

Even though I like the Hawks’ addition, I don’t see it overtaking 1-3, barring any injuries on those teams. I see a 2nd round exit. However, I like our chances of making it out of a 7game series if we play Boston. You saw what Chicago did to them.

HOW DO YOU SEE IT?

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends!!”

jones

September 23rd, 2009
8:10 pm

anyone agrees with espn’s comment?

rob

September 23rd, 2009
8:25 pm

the only reason i picked the hawks over the magic is because the magic let hedo go to toranto, the magic lost key bench players in the vince carter trade. plus I think the hawks have gotten better.

rob

September 23rd, 2009
8:31 pm

dos hawkquis what do you think about my comment

vava74

September 23rd, 2009
8:37 pm

I see the Hawks doing a good job against all 4 teams mentioned.

I think this year’s Orlando team is substantially weaker than last year’s. We should win 3/4 games

Boston is old, but they will use their experience and the refs to come out on top of us more than they deserve on our match ups. We should win 1/2 games

Cleveland will be very difficult to us, more than last year. I really think that they have a good chance to go to the finals and even to beat LA. We should win 0/1 games

Chicago will cause match up problems at the point, but that is the only position where they are in advantage to us. We should win ALL games.

My prediction: 1. Cle (65/70wins) 2. Bos (58/62 wins) 3. Atl (52/57 wins) 4. Orl (49/52 wins) 5. Mia (42/45 wins) 6. Chi (42/45 wins) 7. Tor (40/42 wins) 8. Phi (40/42 wins)

rob

September 23rd, 2009
8:37 pm

trust me hawks fans I really see the hawks as the 3rd best team in the east

dos hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
8:41 pm

ROB,

I still have the Hawks behind Orlando because of The Dwight Howard. He always gets a double-double!! I think that he lead the league in dunks and dbl-dbl. I know that Orlando will have some chemistry issues, but Jameer is still there, D. Howard and Vince is tryin’ to get a ring before his career is said and done.

If the Hawks do finish 4th in the EAST, in the 2nd round, they would play whoever finishes 1st. Over 7 games, I don’t think that we would match up with Clev, because they are just as young as we are and they got some player named Lebron, who is supposed to be a “decent player” lol.

and yes, you are correct, the Hawks have gotten better but I don’t see us better than Orlando.

Jameer, Rashad Lewis, Vinsanity, D. Howard > Bibby, JJ, Marvin, Josh, Horford

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends!!”

dos hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
8:43 pm

VAVA74,

You don’t think that Indy will be in the mix? Also, over 7 games, we won’t win against Cleveland to make it to the Eastern Conf. Champ game.

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends!!”

rob

September 23rd, 2009
8:43 pm

vava 74 you know what you are talking about! i also see the hawks 3rd in the east and orlando 4th

dos hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
8:45 pm

VAVA74 & ROB,

If Woodson doesn’t play JJ 46 minutes per night, JJ may be fresher for the playoffs and maybe we can get over the top. I like our chances of 7 game series with Boston better.

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends!!”

Hoops

September 23rd, 2009
8:52 pm

vava74 & rob,

I agree with you that the Hawks will finish ahead of the Magic. I also agree with you that the Cavs and the Celtics will have better records than the Hawks, but the Hawks will be seeded 2nd because they won their division.

My concern is we don’t have enough roster positions for the talent that appears to be available to the Hawks this year. It’s amazing how winning attracts good players to your program!

vava74

September 23rd, 2009
9:02 pm

I don’t like Indiana’s roster one bit.

35 wins at best. Apart from Granger and Foster (and a long shot maybe for Tyler Hansborough), I wouldn’t even consider signing anyone else on their roster to add to our bench.

Samuel

September 23rd, 2009
9:05 pm

1. Cleveland
2. Orlando
3. Boston
4.Atlanta
5.Washington
6.Chicago
7. Miami
8. Philly

Big Ray

September 23rd, 2009
9:06 pm

I’m confused.

Why are non-Hawks fans here to “burst a bubble?” To save us all from ourselves? Ha!

Somebody is late to the party, because we did all of this back in July (and August) We spent several weeks trying to hack each other to pieces over that trade. Or rather, over the amount of money Crawford makes. Through all of the noise and hoopla, not ONCE do I recall ANYBODY voicing truly overblown expectations for Jamal Crawford.

In fact, more people argued over whether or not we were paying a guy $10 million (Crawford) to do exactly what we were paying another guy $2 million (Flip Murray) to do. Of course, some people still don’t get that essentially we traded two pgs that we didn’t have a use for (and that didn’t have very much trade value) for a guy we could use, and had better trade value.

Either way, pretty much everybody acknowledged that Crawford is here to be our first/top scorer off the bench. Everybody knows he’s a career 40% shooter. Everybody knows where he’s been, what he’s done, and what kind of player he is. So what are these wild expectations that need culling? I don’t know about the rest of y’all but I don’t see them. Jamal will come off the bench, he’ll have the green light to shoot, and he’ll score. And he’ll do so most likely shooting somewhere in the 40 percentile (hopefully a bit higher than his career average). I think he’ll like playing for Woody better than he did for crazy Nellie, out-of-his-depth Isaiah, and Scott Skiles. I think Woody will get better results out of him.

Is that too wild of an expectation? I hope not, because it mirrors much of what is expected here.

And if I was a Knicks fan, I wouldn’t talk too much about expectations. How the devil does one of the NBA’s richest teams and highest markets (with enough money to sign ANYBODY) manage to suck for that long? I mean, if you are a Hawks fan, you know the deal. But a Knicks fan? Only thing you can do is be thankful that the Dolans finally strung together two good decisions in a row: Donnie Walsh and Mike D’Antoni.

Now, all we need is for a Phoenix Suns fan to go on a Knicks blog and tell them not to have too many expectations with Mike D’Antoni. After all, he never could get those Suns over the hump we call THE SPURS. I mean, Mike D’Antoni is a nice guy and all. And he’ll say all the right things to the press. But he came to New York because the money was right (please, don’t lie to yourselves). Oh, and he never coaches defense. Ever. So uh, don’t get so unreasonably expectant of good things from him. I heard he was kinda streaky.

Heh heh heh…..

rob

September 23rd, 2009
9:09 pm

dos hawkquis nice slogan

Big Ray

September 23rd, 2009
9:15 pm

Dos Hawquis,

I’m with you. Orlando is still better than we are. They may have chemistry issues, or they may not, we shall see. To me, there biggest problems will be defense and ball distribution.

If you ask me, Jameer Nelson benefitted from Hedo running that offense. With Carter replacing Hedo in the lineup, all the ball distribution falls on Jameer. I didn’t think he was an all-star when they named him one. How are his numbers really any better than Mike Bibby’s, especially if you look their entire careers over? Don’t expect him to get a second invite. Why? Who’s he going to take shots from? Howard? Vinsanity? Rashard? He’s going to be 4th option on this team, and there is no way around it. Howard is the top center in the league. Vinsanity, if you aren’t letting him score, then you may as well not have him. Rashard….let me put it delicately: The man scores close to 20 a game, and they’re paying him TOO MUCH MONEY to not put the ball in his hands.

As for the defense, Van Gundy has to figure out which defensive helper he wants in the lineup…Bass or Pietrus. Bass isn’t necessarily a premier defender, but he is a rebounder and hustler. He’ll make the effort and take some of the pressure down low for Dwight. Pietrus can guard twos, threes, and even some ones. He’s your man on the perimeter. If I were Van Gundy, I’d start Pietrus. But that’s just me.

Big Ray

September 23rd, 2009
9:18 pm

I’m interested in hearing how Courtney Sims does in camp. Who knows, maybe he gets the nod over Siler. I still hold out hope for Othello Hunter. Always liked him.

rob

September 23rd, 2009
9:19 pm

samuel: i don’t see the bulls being any better than detroit, i think detroit is going to be good. if you think toranto is not going to make the playoff you are wrong. with bosh and hedo they are going to be good.

Big Ray

September 23rd, 2009
9:22 pm

Samuel ,

If Josh Smith has the same issues over and over, I don’t expect us to be having these same old conversations over and over. I expect Rick Sund to start looking for a way to ship him out. A good GM knows when to make that move, and I think Sund is one of those guys. Much as I like Josh (did I really have to say it ), there comes a moment when things shift from “time out” to “time up.” Unfortunately, we may lose out in overall value in a trade. However, sometimes making your team better requires a bit of painful pruning. We shall see how this goes.

rob

September 23rd, 2009
9:39 pm

big ray: josh can’t go he is the future! with out josh we would have a hard time in the playoffs. jj needs to go he is a good player but he is no good in the playoffs, I have only seen jj have 2 good playoff games, one againts boston in game 6 when he took over the 4th quater and the other one in game 7 againts the heat. plus jj is planing to leave the atl. and think about this” by trading josh smith you would trade a future star!”

dos hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
9:42 pm

BIG RAY, ROB, SAMUEL, VAVA74, ET AL,

I hope that the new additions to the Hawks have HEART!! There were several games that we got “punked.” winning 16 games on the road? Getting blown out by the Clippers at home? Josh seems to be the only player who isn’t afraid and who plays with passion every night…oh yeah, ZaZa when he got in Garnett’s face.

That’s why I am leary in calling JJ a superstar. He doesn’t have ICE WATER flowing though his veins. If he doesn’t resign with us, I would not be too terribly upset. The cap space that he would bring should allow us to get some one decent to fill his shoes.

If you take Kobe, Lebron, CP3, M. Jordan, Magic, Bird, D. Williams, or D. Wade off their teams, you have a TOTALLY different team. If you take JJ off our team, the overall make-up of our team doesn’t change DRASTICALLY, because he doesn’t make his presence known on both ends of the court or to the refs. Thats why the refs treat him like an undrafted rookie.

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends!!”

KevinA

September 23rd, 2009
9:45 pm

Ray my buddy,
Somebody is late to the party, because we did all of this back in July (and August) We spent several weeks trying to hack each other to pieces over that trade. Or rather, over the amount of money Crawford makes. Through all of the noise and hoopla, not ONCE do I recall ANYBODY voicing truly overblown expectations for Jamal Crawford.
I say – wrong –
I have read many times the idea of Crawford scoring 20 pt’s a game and playing the #3. Then we heard of the great play of Teague and getting 15 min per game.Then we have heard of the contributions of Evans and don’t be fooled into him losing minutes. Then we here Sund/Woody saying Bibby will still be a major factor and is a house fav.
Clearly all these factors don’t add up.We have posted golden state fan posts about his lack of defense and not being able to finish around the rim. And except for the fourth quarter shooting a dismal shooting FG%. I even mentioned his preference to the left side of the court where JJ also likes to shoot from.
You said, Of course, some people still don’t get that essentially we traded two pg’s that we didn’t have a use for (and that didn’t’t have very much trade value) for a guy we could use, and had better trade value.
wrong again -
We love what Sund did and have stated so many times. But like with any business you go from where your at. Not from what happened 90 days ago. Not 1 player in the NBA is indispensable if the GM thinks they can advance the team. Until play on the court proves other wise – Crawford is the most overpaid for the least amount of skill on the Hawks. At least in my opinion.
I think we have explained in detail how the Crawford impact may be fantastic and/or overrated.Most of us have moved on until Sund posts the actual roster. Why do you stir the pot? I know your memory is not that bad. lol These types of posts are not like you.

JSS

September 23rd, 2009
9:46 pm

Mr. Ray…
It is really nothing new for the Knicks. Remember that cold streak from 1975 to 1982 when they finally lucked into Bernard King? Money has rarely helped them to be competitive They have streaks of excellence…

Samuel

September 23rd, 2009
9:48 pm

I don’t see Detroit doing much of anything this year. The Bulls have probably the best young player in the game in D Rose. He showed in last year’s playoffs how much a difference one superstar playing at a high level can make and he was just a “rookie”.

Actually, I was torn between Toronto and Philly. I definitely think Toronto has a chance. It kinda depends on E. Brand. If he stays healthy and gets back to his pre-injury level, Philly with Eddie Jordan will be hard to beat. Toronto still has serious issues on the defensive end. They will be exciting to watch but still may not make the playoffs. The East has definitely surpassed the West from top to bottom.

Indy, Charlotte, Jersey or Detroit could make the playoffs if things fall the right way.

This is just one man’s opinion.

rob

September 23rd, 2009
9:55 pm

hawks fans am changing my name to beto! GO HAWKS!

KevinA

September 23rd, 2009
9:59 pm

dos hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
9:42 pm

While I understand the idea of what your saying, the Hawks last year or any previous year (jj era) would have been lost. If the more matured kids play to thier potential this year you may have a point. Until proven otherwise JJ derserves the credit.

I still have the hope the kids will come through and maybe JJ scores 17 pts a game (and does not make all star) he could shoot a much higher FG% and even add to his high assist totals and still be the star of the team. How about 400 less attempts and get into the best of the best and shoot a .477 FG%. Josh/Marvin/Al need to make their imprint on the game.

beto

September 23rd, 2009
10:05 pm

samuel did you forget who the bull lost this summer and who detroit got this summer?

KevinA

September 23rd, 2009
10:17 pm

I loved what Sund did. You have to do what you have to do. Missed oportunities, but only in hind sight. Sessions went cheaper than Bibby. Rondo for what money? Iverson for what money? Crawford for Nate and David Lee and Mo? Love David Lee. Just to stir the pot. Sund did great.

beto

September 23rd, 2009
10:17 pm

unless marvin can score at least 17 points per game he can stay a hawk if not he needs to go. i see more potential on josh than in marvin. marvin was just a huge mistake that day in the draft. sorry marvin fans.

beto

September 23rd, 2009
10:22 pm

i could be wrong. let me know.

KevinA

September 23rd, 2009
10:29 pm

beto

September 23rd, 2009
10:17 pm

Hard to do with Bibby and JJ taking so many shots.

Samuel

September 23rd, 2009
10:38 pm

No, not really. Gordon was good but Hinrick can score and play much better defense. They also picked up a sleeper rookie in Johnson. He’ll be a serious baller in the NBA. And don’t forget how much Thomas and Noah improved last year. D Rose with a full year under his belt will be scary.

Detroit got Charlie V(who is overrated IMO) and Gordon and lost Rasheed. They also have “another” new coach.

cwilliams

September 23rd, 2009
10:39 pm

Rick Sund has done a great job of reloading the roster after last year’s great run that ended in the 2nd round.By adding JC,Joe Smith,J Collins and resigning Bibby he not only added more firepower but also size and battle tested veterans to a good team.Go HAWKS!

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
10:43 pm

“Pick up was cool… Got elbowed n the mouth by Jerry stackhouse.. Got punched in the stomach by Anthony Johnson. Lolol. Still played coo tho”

Frank Robinsons Twitter:

http://twitter.com/banklin5

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
10:47 pm

Just say no to Juan Dixon….waste of space..Rick loses points for that pickup.

Chicago will not make the playoffs No Gordon=No Chance….or did you all forget the about guy who’s bailed Chicago out in the fourth quater for the last five years?

Don’t sleep on Philly either. They will be battling for the final few spots along w/the Bobcats and Raptors.

The Pacers have no chance.

dos hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
10:51 pm

Can we start with some cold hard truths?

1.The Hawks will not win a title this YEAR.
2.The Hawks will not win THEIR division this year.
3.The Hawks will not make it out of the 2nd round this year.
4.The Hawks will not win 60 games this year.
5.The Hawks will not finish above 4th seed.
6.SPIRIT the Hawk will not fly in from the rafters like he did the past few seasons. LOL!!

These are the LIMITS that I see, a Hawks fan, mind you. Now that we have the parameters, we can fill in the blanks on what the Hawks will do this season.

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends!!”

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
10:51 pm

If we loose JJ, then I don’t mind Management throwing the Bank(and the kitchen sink) at Wade. That’s an automatic title with this roster. No questions asked. BUT NO WAY do you let Crawford take over full time at SG. That’s not smart.

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
10:56 pm

Dos, Did u forget that Rashard Lewis is suspended for the first 10 games of the season. Also, the magic WILL have chemistry issues initally. If we come out of the gates blazing like last season(minus the injuries) I’d say the southeastern division is ours for the taking.

…and depending on how hot our streaky players(Craw,JJ,Bibby, & Smoove) I’d say we have a fairly reasonable shot at a title as well. Think back to the 2008 playoffs. Look how far a Hot JJ & Smoove will get you. Game 7 in the ECF sounds good to me.

PDubATL

September 23rd, 2009
11:02 pm

Based on Frank’s Twitter, it sounds like Lewis Clinch and Anthony Roberson are likely camp attendees.

niremetal

September 23rd, 2009
11:05 pm

Jerry,

Sorry man, but come on – you’re taking a secondhand account of what happened at one pre-pre-pre-season scrimmage. Rick Sund has been around the game for longer than I’ve been alive and was probably at the practice in person. Sund has shown himself to be a smooth operator when it comes to getting veteran talent…so don’t you think Sund noticed if Stackhouse was really tearing it up in a way that indicated he could be an asset this season?

The idea that a bunch of couch potato fans who didn’t even see the (pre-pre-pre-season) scrimmage should petition a career scout and GM who saw the scrimmage firsthand…I mean, you gotta realize how silly that sounds.

Melvin

September 23rd, 2009
11:07 pm

Dos,

Did you predict the Magic going to the Finals last year? Further more, what make your opinions cold hard truths????

niremetal

September 23rd, 2009
11:08 pm

Ariose,

I don’t think the Hawks win a title if we “trade” JJ for Wade. Kobe or LeBron, yes. Dwyane “I’m-having-a-bad-game-oh-wait-I-know-I’ll-whine-at-the-officials-and-fake-an-injury” Wade? No. He’s a star, but I’m not convinced he’s a superstar.

dos hawkquis

September 23rd, 2009
11:09 pm

ARIOSE,

How many times do we play Orlando during Rashad’s 10 games suspension? We play them 4 times. I wish we could have faced them twice without Rashad to get an up on them in the SE Division.

ARIOSE,

I don’t think that the Hawks have the HEART to make it out of the 2nd round. We will see what type of team they are this year. If they can win 22 road games, I think that will go over well for the playoffs in a hostile road environment.

But if they win 12-16 road games again, that will mean that they still get intimidated in a hostile environment.

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends!!”

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
11:12 pm

That takes your list from 6 down to 3 truths…..maybe even two. 60 wins is also a reasonable possibility…

Melvin

September 23rd, 2009
11:13 pm

Nire,

Exactly how many NBA championships does Sund have in his 30+ years of NBA affiliations???

The Truth

September 23rd, 2009
11:14 pm

Wally

The only thing that’s worst then a self-proclaimed hater, is one that does it without exactly knowing it (Although my definition is in the area of blogging only). If I could meter your entire comments and those that followed about Crawford, I would conclude that about 95% of everything you said has been negative. I would list them all here but it’s too many. So the idea that you said a kind polite sentence about Crawford before you went wailing away doesn’t resonate. You obviously expected the man to be a savior for the Warriors and he was not. His career stat numbers doesn’t exactly translate to your description. The way you describe him, the man should not be playing in NBA; not even in the D-league. Basketball is a team sport that involves many factors that determines a successful outcome. You sound as if Crawford was the sole reason for the demise of the Warriors. Are you exactly saying that? If your answer is yes then you are embarrassing yourself. Surely there must have been other factors beside Crawford. Let’s go ask Stephen Jackson. Perhaps he can shed light on this question. My previous point was why do you still care about what Crawford is doing? What is you point. Regardless what our expectation are for the upcoming season, the fact is, it hasn’t happened yet. I’m sure most NBA teams and fan-base are upbeat about the upcoming season (except for maybe NY and GS) You want to talk about past events that are, frankly, irrelevant to us since he now is on a different team. Everything changes when that happens, maybe for the good or maybe it could turn out for the worst. Let’s give the man a chance to (at least) go through training camp and pre-season before you start singing unsolicited blues songs on our behave.

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
11:14 pm

Dos, i’m saying that ORL won’t have a good record during that 10game stretch….and then it’s gonna take time for R.Lewis to get chemistry with all of his new teammates…….we got this

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
11:16 pm

Wally, Don’t listen to him. He just likes to start arguments for no reason. Thanks for the useful Crawford info.

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
11:21 pm

Nire, That opes up a good can of worms for a debte!

Would this roster be BETTER if we had Wade instead of JJ????

Would we be closer to a title?

Would we be instant title-contendors???

Would that place us 1st or 2nd in the ECT pecking order???

Weigh in with youer answers now!!!!!

…I vote yes to all of the above, unless JJ shows me some 05-06 spunk this season

Ariose

September 23rd, 2009
11:21 pm

*Opens

The Truth

September 23rd, 2009
11:24 pm

Ariose

That am I going to do with you?

bigdave

September 23rd, 2009
11:24 pm

Ariose… you my boy… but…

NOOOO WADE!!! No crybaby’s in the A!! personally, though restricted, id look at adding a Rajon Rondo (reports last year had Celts shopping him anyway) + Rudy Gay… assuming no Joe=no Woody… id change our style of play… thats 2 solid perimeter defenders with dumb athletic ability. the major flaw in this is Bibby/Teague… bottom line lose Joe and start all over, instead of contending in about 2 years…

personally i like Joe with what we have…we ARE a totally different team with out Joe.

The Truth

September 23rd, 2009
11:29 pm

Ariose

Correction: What am I going to do with yoy?

bigdave

September 23rd, 2009
11:32 pm

yall can have the class of 2010 with those characters… im waiting on 2012′ better save our pennies…

D12!!!!

YOOOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUULLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!

The Truth

September 23rd, 2009
11:34 pm

Time to shut it down

I am having trouble with my key board

Big Ray

September 23rd, 2009
11:35 pm

Ariose ,

Info is what it is. Remember when we got Bibby and Sacramento fans said all those things about him? Well, some were true, and some weren’t. Now answer me this: did he help this team, or did he make those Sacramento fans look like geniuses?

As for the Bulls and Ben Gordon, I’m not going to hate on Gordon. Gets his shot like nobody’s business. However, he’s one-dimensional and Derrick Rose deferred to him a lot. Too much in some cases. Rose will be the undisputed leader of this team now, and there’s a cat up that way who can get plenty of points on his own. He’s bigger, a better team player, and can even play some small forward when needed. Name’s Johnny Salmons. He’ll fit right in at the 2, and Gordon won’t be missed much, especially with Rose coming back even better (which is scary as hell).

Not only that, but Gordon’s role (and constant green light) is in part due to Luol Deng being injured for a large part of the season, and off his game when he came back. Chicago will be fine. In fact, I think they will be better. But I’ll buy ya a cold one or two if I’m wrong and you’re right.

Big Ray

September 23rd, 2009
11:37 pm

Truth,

But I was enjoying your posts….

Big Ray

September 23rd, 2009
11:40 pm

Melvin ,

“Exactly how many NBA championships does Sund have in his 30+ years of NBA affiliations???”

Good point. Uh…what was the point again?

niremetal

September 23rd, 2009
11:40 pm

Melvin,

If you’re using that as a barometer of success, then there aren’t many GMs in the history of the league who have been successes. My entire point was that if Stackhouse showed something in that practice that indicated he could help the team, it’s absurd to think Sund would need to be petitioned in order to recognize it. He has shown a very good eye for getting veteran role players. Why would he suddenly become blind?

bigdave

September 23rd, 2009
11:47 pm

i feel in a few years where Dwight goes will determine the favorite for the title not James/Wade/Bosh/ etc. … similar to the Shaq effect of years past…

Melvin

September 23rd, 2009
11:59 pm

Ray,
Just picking at Nire about his boy Sund.

Nire,
Just b/c Sund hasn’t signed Stack (for whatever reason) doesn’t mean he don’t think he’s able to helpp this team. There could be other factors such money, coach approval, etc….

niremetal

September 24th, 2009
12:05 am

Mel,

One more before calling it a night:

We have 12 players under contract. Stack would make 13. That would leave us with, basically, one roster space left open because my guess is that we’re saving spot 15 for a rainy day (ie if we get hit hard by injuries this season at a particular position). Stack would only get the vet minimum anyway, so money isn’t the issue. It’s roster space. Frankly, I’d rather have Siler or Hunter and a third PG than Stack, unless Stack looks like he can be a serious upgrade over Mo as a rotation player this year. Otherwise, I don’t think it’s a wise use of that roster spot.

That’s my personal take. I don’t know what’s going through Sund’s mind, but I doubt he’d look away if Stack both 1) looks capable of being a rotation player; and 2) seems like he’d be a good “fit” for the team (and coach approval is a big part of that).

Big Ray

September 24th, 2009
12:35 am

Melvin ,

I know. I was just wondering what the alibi would be. And I knew that it would get him just a wee bit fired up.

Big Ray

September 24th, 2009
12:35 am

Bigdave,

Interesting viewpoint. You could be right.

rms

September 24th, 2009
12:39 am

Dang Sekou, way to express your point!!

KevinA

September 24th, 2009
12:45 am

Ray
geeze, so many circles I got dizzy.

KevinA

September 24th, 2009
12:51 am

bigdave

September 23rd, 2009
11:47 pm
i feel in a few years where Dwight goes will determine the favorite for the title not James/Wade/Bosh/ etc. … similar to the Shaq effect of years past…

Dwight in my opinion is already the best player in the NBA. The jump jacking guards didn’t feed him enough. Sound like our problem? Kid is a stud and can do much more. Who can stop him? Al and JJ for Howard any time.

KevinA

September 24th, 2009
12:54 am

PS and I love JJ and Al. Howard already the next Shaq.

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
1:18 am

Ray, Good point! I’ll shut up about craw now I HOPE he proves all of the doubters wrong. It’s defenetly to our benefit.

Nire, SIGN STACK NOW!!!! OR G.GREEN!!!!

P.S Crawford is our 3rd PG….If Craw,Stack,JJ,Marv,Horford Sounds nice from time to time!!!

LOL@ The Truth. I was just teasin’ Get that keyboard fixed!

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
1:20 am

rms, that was Ray lol…

bigdave

September 24th, 2009
1:40 am

KevinA…

wish it was our problem… i still dont think we have anybody that can finish at the rim consistently from the blocks. you’re right though… they dont look for him enough (kinda how they do that kid up at G-Town Mr. Monroe).. i think thats the sole reason why he’ll kiss Disney good bye… as long as they dont make a coaching change… i mean im not sold on his relationship with VGDY… who seems to think Dwight should just concentrate on reb. and blk shots. in his jump shot happy offense…

bottom line someone gets an unhappy 27-28yr./old beast… who will be ready to win some rings (cause he wont presently constructed). for once i think Atlanta would have a chance at a legitimate megastar. you knew the Jordans/LBJ/Kobe/Bonds/A-Rod’s of the world showed no interest in playing for and representing Atlanta … however, i think hometeam will consider and become savior… probably to a Hawks team that would be a piece away from a title…

nothing but hypothetical here folks… just dont see championships a given with the class of 2010.. nothing but a publicity/cable television class… the grand prize enters the market 2012…

ask Phil Jackson…

bigdave

September 24th, 2009
1:50 am

Bosh goes home to Big D… D. Wade goes home to Da Chi…. Lebron leaves home to go play for his puppet masters home in NY (what a lame; yes massa type dude pfff…)

and in 2012

D. Title comes home !!!

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
1:50 am

Ray, IDK about Gordon. I was watching that shootout between him and Mr.Shuttelsworth in the playoffs this past season on NBA TV a few weeks back. It just reminded me of Benny Gordons crunch-time clutchness. The guy put in work for the Bulls, serious work. They’ll be OK without him, but they’ll defenetly be missing a key factor in their attack, the clutch factor. And Rose was nasty in that series, but the next game after his 36pt outburst, Boston held him to a quiet 14pts in a loss I beleive. But the kid is defenetly a force to be reckond with.

…And for those of you who say Bibby can’t handle the kid, look at the Bibbsters numbers when we played the Bulls last season. He mean business. He wasn’t about to get shown up by a younger fellow to PG draft pick.

And that was a nice little Shameless Promoion there Ray; Still being logged into wordpress n’ all. we see you

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
1:56 am

bigdave, I really hope i’m wrong about Wade. I don’t like the guy. What I really want is for JJ and J-Smoove to step up. Specifically JJ….Thats a good point about our style changing w/o JJ in the mix. Like I said, i’d rather have JJ step up, than having to resort to crybaby Wade. Could you imagine he and Josh crying to the refs all the time? He cartainly woudn’t be a good inflence for smoove

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
1:58 am

The Truth, Seriously though I think I typed too qickly earlier today. I mistook you for a similarly named nemeisis on this blog….musta been a Freudian slip

Stories AJC(redneck paper) wont cover

September 24th, 2009
1:59 am

(CNN) — A man accused of screaming racial slurs while beating an Army reservist in front of her daughter outside a restaurant in Morrow, Georgia, was jailed and held without bond Wednesday after being indicted on felony charges.

Troy Dale West Jr, of Poulan, Georgia, is being held without bond on new felony charges.

1 of 2 Troy Dale West Jr., of Poulan, Georgia, is facing one count of aggravated assault, two counts of battery, two counts of disorderly conduct, false imprisonment and cruelty to children for allegedly beating Tashawnea Hill outside a Cracker Barrel restaurant on September 9, according to a Clayton County Court online docket.

West had been arrested on misdemeanor charges following the incident, but Clayton County District Attorney Tracy Graham Lawson took the the case to a grand jury asking for more serious charges.

Hill’s attorney Kip Jones told CNN that several hundred supporters, believed to be with the NAACP, Al Sharpton’s Political Action Network and Rainbow Push, gathered outside the courtroom Wednesday morning in support of more serious charges against West.

Jones said he and Hill were pleased with the new indictment.

“We look forward to a conviction as Tasha and her 7-year-old daughter move forward to recover from this heinous incident,” he said.

West’s lawyer, Larry King, had no comment about the indictment, according his assistant.

Hill, 35, said the attack occurred after she warned West to be careful after almost hitting her 7-year-old daughter with the restaurant’s door as she was leaving.

West, according to a police report, admitted striking Hill “after she spit on me and accused me of trying to hit her daughter with a door.”

During an interview on CNN following the attack, Jones denied that she spat on West or did “anything to provoke the attack.”

Hill, an African-American, told police that West, 47, yelled racial epithets at her during the attack. Police said witnesses confirmed her account.

“He did punch me with a closed fist repeated times. My head is still hurting today. I have knots on my head,” Hill told CNN. She also said she was kicked.

Police say Hill stated that “West punched her in the left cheek, forehead, kicked her body in several places, and punched her head in many areas several times.”

Hill’s attorney said he was “convinced this was a hateful, racist attack … based on the N-word, the B-word, etc.”

“The language was vile. It was racist. It was sexist. It was completely offensive, completely unprovoked,” Jones said.

Morrow is a racially diverse city in the southeast suburbs of Atlanta, Georgia, with a population of about 4,900, according to the 2000 census.
Racism and Bigotry • Criminal Assault • Atlanta

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
2:00 am

bigdave, that would be sweet if it happend! I doubt the city of Orlando would forgive him though. Especially after Otis Smith put his neck out there by going over the salary cap to feild this team full of all-stars.

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
2:02 am

What a horrible story….

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
2:05 am

….justice will be served.

The Real Truth Is

September 24th, 2009
2:09 am

DEEZZ NUTTZZ

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
2:11 am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w_K34hfeow

bigdave

September 24th, 2009
2:12 am

Rose…

Otis Smith needs to address his coach’s philosophies… the matchup hell they create sometimes is a gift and a curse. if Rashard Lewis can play some SF then they need to look into that because he is a liability on the defensive glass big time for them… i can remember seeing Dwight being the only guy who could secure a rebound. they just remind me of a eastern conference HGH version of Dantoni’s Suns… i dont think they’re style wins them a title against those front courts out west. now they insert Bass into the starting lineup turns them into a more traditional group…

wow… Nelson… VC… Shark… Big Bass… D Title…

thats kinda scary….

bigdave

September 24th, 2009
2:14 am

*their

its late…

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
2:15 am

Ray, I hope Crawfords latest 50pt outburt makes up for my transgressions lol :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjulTveN6Ts&feature=PlayList&p=324BCEC18BC06763&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=10

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
2:17 am

bigdave, I agree. And Lewis can def. play SF. To the tune of 26ppg up in seattle w/Ray Ray.

bigdave

September 24th, 2009
2:20 am

damn sure did…

but hey… who knows… these are the Orlando Magic who found a way to lose the most dominant player of all time…

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
2:34 am

hahaha yeah lol. They’ll never be able to live that one down!

Wesley Barresi

September 24th, 2009
5:46 am

I agree with him……If we sign Stackhouse, whats the point of having mo evans.

http://www.goarticles.com/cgi-bin/showa.cgi?C=1992738

rodney

September 24th, 2009
7:03 am

Stack in da house, question is where will he fit in? Can coach find a way use him, without messing up the chemistry of the team. Who will get less minutes and still be happy…I don’t think we need Stackhouse, like him but not for my hawks.
Is JJ gone this year in a trade? No because he will have help and don’t have to carry the team into the playoffs and won’t be so tired come playoff time

HGN

September 24th, 2009
8:27 am

The Hawks have put together a great training camp roster… Lets be patient and see what shakes out. Someone may get hurt in camp, injuries happen, and we will need this depth. I say DO NOT trade anyone. The ONLY problem , as I see it, is will Woodson play his depth in games and not wear down his starters during the season by playing them 38-40 minutes a game. He does not trust his bench players enough to give them quality minutes so he wears out his starters. And come Playoffs they are either worn down or injured. Woodson is too afraid of playing bench players for fear of losing the game and jeopardizing his job. Come on Woody, don’t be scared of losing and give the Hawks and Hawks fans a chance to Win.

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
8:44 am

HGN_ Woody gave the Hawks fans 47 wins last year and a playoff series win. Has been a long time coming for us. So keep your shorts on.

Yung A$E

September 24th, 2009
8:54 am

we need to sign stackhouse but he will have to split minutes with mo evans. Im afraid that will make mo want more minutes and playing time. Hopefully coach woodson will play everyone . Hawks will go to the eastern conference finals

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
9:08 am

In response to Ramon’s much earlier question: I really, really like vava’s prediction, but I cannot say I am quite as optimistic. I do like this team to win 50-52 games. However, for this team to break the top three either Boston’s agining line up breaks down(likely!), The Shaq expierment blows up in Clevland (possible) or VC is so disruptive and Rashad is not the same player without the juice that Orlando takes a step back(doubtful)

I still see this team as a 4th place team, but a stronger 4th than last year if that makes sense.

I think Orlando made the best off season move wih Brandon Bass, no I did not like the VC move or the Gortat money, but Bass will be a big addition to that team.

Rasheed sounds great for Boston, we will see how Garnetts’ knees are and if Allen and Pierce have one more run in them.
I think Boston is the most likely of the top three to fall out if the Hawks were to move up. Not saying I am predicting that, but if I had to choose one it would be Boston.

vava74

September 24th, 2009
9:19 am

newkid,

Thank you for digging up the right portuguese words to wrap up your post!

I assume that your nickname is a bit deceiving, taking in consideration the contents of your post.

If I had known, I would have been more careful with the contents of my own!!

In summary, I would like to say that Holland is always nice, even in Autumn. If you do go, check out the area around The Hague and Harlem (southwest from Amsterdam). There are some very nice towns over there.

Amsterdam has extremely nice museums which should occupy you at least 3 whole days. The most obvious ones: the Reijks Museum (where you’ll find the best of the flemish masters), van Gogh’s Museum and Rembrant’s Museum (his former house), Anne Frank’s House, …

5 Js

September 24th, 2009
9:28 am

Enter your comments here

I can’t wait to see the impact that Jamaal, Jason, Jeff, Joe, and maybe Jerry (Crawford, Collins, Teague, Smith and Stackhouse) will bring to the Hawks!

Go Hawks!

GeeMack

September 24th, 2009
9:29 am

dos hawkquis

I agree with you. Orlando is a better team. Those who thinks there will be chemistry issues I beg to differ. Vince is a 10 year vet with an oppurtunity to compete for a championship. Veterans know how to adapt.

If any thing there will be more chemistry issues with the Hawks than the Magic. Young guys create chemistry issues, because they are still trying to make their mark on the league.

I see the Hawks as the 4th seed as well. I think as Hawks fans we are not looking at teams like the Wizards who are instantly better if Arenas is back healthy. Washinton has 3 bonifide all stars in their starting line up & a 7 foot defensive minded, shot blocking center. That averaged 10ppg on a team that featured 3 20ppg scorers.

GeeMack

September 24th, 2009
9:45 am

Daniel,

I think KG PP & Ray have at least 3 years where they can play at their current level. Daniels, Big Baby, & Perkins are all younger and able to spell those guys for long periods of time.

I think boston will a contender for the next 2 years.

The Cavs same thing they will be contenders as long as LBJ is there. Also they have over 30 million coming off the cap through Big Z and Shaq.

Hoops

September 24th, 2009
9:49 am

It will be interesting to see how a change in ownership affects the future of the Nets. Has the NBA ever had a non American owning a team?

rms

September 24th, 2009
9:51 am

Hoops: NEVER!!

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
10:04 am

GeeMack- I am going to respectfully disagree with you about Boston. Ray had a pretty lackluster season (by his standards) last year. KG’s knee problems have never been fully explained and are likely to be worsened over a season. Paul has always been a mystery to me; I have thought he was done before.

Now, let me be clear I am not saying this will happen to the Celtics this year. I am say IF (BIG IF) the Hawks were to crack the top three then which team would have to have fallen out. Of Orlando, Boston or Clevland… I am going with Boston as the most likely candidate. Who would you choose?

Mike

September 24th, 2009
10:08 am

There arent many roster spots left with 12 already signed and if we land Stackhouse that is 13 under contract. Meaning Siler, Hunter, Sims, Mario, Frank RObinson and Juan Dixon are all fighting for one maybe 2 spots. I’d like to see us find a way to drop Randolph so we can keep 2 of these young guys.

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
10:09 am

As far as Clevland goes, I see this year as their last real shot. I really expect LeBron to go to NY/NJ. Just my feeling.

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
10:10 am

Mike- I 100% support any effor to drop Randolph Morris from this team!!!!

GeeMack

September 24th, 2009
10:12 am

Daniel,

I would say the Cavs, because Shaq is on borrowed time. The one thing you know about KG Ray & PP they have always taken care of their bodies, and this is when it comes into play later in your career.

Melvin

September 24th, 2009
10:40 am

Considering there are no major injuries, I think Boston is the team to beat. Orlando squeak by them last season because they didn’t have KG. Had KG been healthy, Celtics would have repeated (Sorry Kobe but KG punks Gasol/Odom everything time). Now add a healthy KG, Rasheed and Daniels this year team could be stronger than the 2008 team. Cavs and Magic made some nice additions but i don’t believe they will be stronger than the guys in green.
Hopefully we will signed Stackhouse b/c I can see him in Boston before the season is over if we dont.

PDubATL

September 24th, 2009
10:58 am

Melvin, keep in mind that Orlando didn’t have Jameer Nelson in that series and Rafer couldn’t keep up defensively with Rondo. Were both teams healthy, I think it would’ve been a fairly evenly matched series. Either team could have had a shot to win in 7 (and as it was, both teams lost a game at home).

macaroni tony

September 24th, 2009
11:25 am

Melvin,

The Celtics maybe the team to beat but, I beat you that KG will not punk Artest. People better hope that he’s back healthy, and you want punk JS also. It’s ON: Go Hawks.

Sautee

September 24th, 2009
11:27 am

GeeMack,

“If any thing there will be more chemistry issues with the Hawks than the Magic. Young guys create chemistry issues, because they are still trying to make their mark on the league.”

This is my biggest worry about this team. If the frontcourt doesn’t see their touches increased, we WILL have chemistry problems IMHO, because they are all ready for a bigger role. Touches doesn’t necessarily mean scoring chances, but we need the ball to move more.

I sure do hope Joe, Bibby and Crawford are aware of this.

The Truth

September 24th, 2009
11:31 am

Ariose

Regarding your September 24th, 2009
1:58 am post:

This will be the code:

In that order

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
11:52 am

GeeMack- true that Shaq is larger, but PP has never been a physical specimen. I wonder how healthy Garnett really will be. I will give you Ray is always in peak form.

I could see the Shaq thing blowing up in Clevland, plus all the angst about LeBron leaving could add enough distractions to the team that they slip.

Can’t wait for the season to start

bigdave

September 24th, 2009
12:06 pm

Sautee…

in coach Woodson’s offense touches mean iso and try to score… by the time you figure out if you have a good look the shot clock is at 3 secs and the fun begins…!!

Hoops

September 24th, 2009
12:07 pm

Daniel,

Not to mention the D. West saga!

HGN /KEN

September 24th, 2009
12:16 pm

I sure hope Woody is not afraid to use his bench this year. I know that last year and the year before he had a lot of scrubbs and had been pressure to win. Regardless of that fact, and the fact that most of those scrubbs players are out of basketball or traded and are now scrubbs on someone else’s bench, I want to take the time to ignore facts and hate on Woodson anyway. Although I know Woody has increased win totals every year in the Hawks rebuilding, has given the fans an exciting and improving product, Id like to slander him anyway. Woodson I know you have done a great job and we are now a fourth seed and playoff material, but Id like to ignore that and say dont be scare of losing and give the Hawks and its fans a chance to win.Yes. you have already done that and the city and team appreciate you very much. Id just like to spread some doubt and ignorance and hate towards you. When you earn the forth seed and lose the second round im going to ignore the fact that you dont have a center and cant compete with out one at the higher levels. I will hate on you regardless, Coz thats what I do.

Hate

niremetal

September 24th, 2009
12:40 pm

The Rockets have figured out the secret to NBA success…playing “tag”
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/bk/bkn/6632311.html

vava74

September 24th, 2009
12:44 pm

We should not be worried about Woody. He is bound to either improve or be canned midway the year.

Sund has played his cards perfectly: since he has not extended him now, I am 100% sure that he has told Woody the following:

1. Here are the guys you were missing and kept asking;

2. Play them, spare the starting five and evolve our offensive sets;

3. If you improve from last season without resorting again to ISO-Joe and without reaching the playoffs with the starting five exhausted and if we have a good second round showing (not necessarily winning the series), we will extend you.

4. If you fail to improve your offensive schemes and continue to rely on ISO-Joe, we will fire you before the end of the year.

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
1:03 pm

you know guys, the people that blog about the Falcons are crazy!!! We have a couple of annoying posters (truth serum) but he and his many names doesn’t come close to the wackos over there. I love the Falcons, but it is painful to even read

I MUS WRITE

September 24th, 2009
1:59 pm

I think we finish 3rd behind Cleveland and Orlando, We are not a better team than Orlando but we should able to give Boston fits this year. Rasheed Wallace was’nt that big of an upgrade-at this point he’s a 6′11 3pt gunner ala Donyell Marshall

Courtney Sims will make the team, Siler,Hunter,Mario…UP IN SMOKE

Hell he might even get sum playinbg time,Collins and Morris are just insurance policies -Sims really has a decent game and size to match….Its gonna be hard for him to get minutes as the 3rd PF but when given the chance to play i think he will show alot better than SOLO/Morris etc….

Y are these folks questioning the production of Crawford……AC/Speedy=8.2 milli a year Crawford-10 milli…………………Wow 1.2 mill a year-uhhhm yeah ….GET OVER IT

Dos Hawkquis

September 24th, 2009
1:59 pm

HYPOTHETICALLY SPEAKING,

What if things don’t go as predicted for the Hawks? How many losses and by when would it take before you consider giving the Wooden one the proverbial axe?

Also, what would our record have to be to consider trading JJ? He may not re-sign with us, thus we get nothing for him. Trade him by the deadline and you may get some serviceable parts for him.

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks!! Stay thirsty my friends!!”

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
2:24 pm

Dos- I prefer not to think about a scenario where things blow up so badly for the Hawks that we trade JJ mid season or fire Woodson.
C’mon man that is just a downer.

IMUS- anything more than just a gut feeling about Sims?

Dos Hawkquis

September 24th, 2009
2:28 pm

DANIEL,

I hear you buddy, but I am the type of person who looks at both ends of the spectrum, preparing for the worse, but expecting the best. If the worse case scenario happens, I have an exit strategy, if the best happens, that was expected.

I think that too many times leaders are short-sighted and don’t have an exit strategy to what at first appeared to be a good idea. I just wanted to know what numbers would make people say that both have to go.

I still want the Hawks to go as far as possible.

BESIDES, I AM BORED AT WORK!!

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends.”

Daniel

September 24th, 2009
3:37 pm

DOS- that is hilarious. I am going to stick with 52 wins. Team gets shaken up if it sub .500 and doesn’t make the playoffs. Unless like 4 of the starters have season ending injuries or something you may not over react. See what you have me doing talking about injuries… I am not going to get sucked in Dos…. Dang you.

Dos Hawkquis

September 24th, 2009
3:45 pm

I, Dos Hawkquis, being of sound mind and body, we would to recant all statements regarding the negative possiblities surrounding the Hawks!!

Sincerely,

Dos Hawkquis
#1 Hawk Fan since ‘85

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends.”

rob

September 24th, 2009
4:25 pm

jj is overated

Dos Hawkquis

September 24th, 2009
4:31 pm

ROB,

I agree!! JJ is overrated and he is definitely not worth 18mil/per. With 5 seconds left on the clock, we are down by 1pt. JJ doesn’t want to take the last shot. JSmoove will, though.

Everytime that I suggest that the Hawks will be okay, if JJ opted out, people freak out and talk about his 3 all-star appearances and how “clutch” he is.

IF WE LOSE JJ, THE HAWKS WILL BE OKAY!!

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends.”

rob

September 24th, 2009
4:36 pm

dwight howard takes on a mariachi band.

rob

September 24th, 2009
4:42 pm

por mexicans getting bullied by superman

rob

September 24th, 2009
5:05 pm

I mean poor

GeeMack

September 24th, 2009
5:22 pm

Dos Hawkquis

Man I wish I would have thought of that name a slogan first. I absoultely love it.

Dos Hawkquis

September 24th, 2009
3:45 pm
I, Dos Hawkquis, being of sound mind and body, we would to recant all statements regarding the negative possiblities surrounding the Hawks!!

Sincerely,

Dos Hawkquis
#1 Hawk Fan since ‘85

“I don’t always watch basketball, but when I do, I prefer the Hawks. Stay thirsty my friends.” Lol!

Former Energy MVP Sims Opens Eyes- Energy Hoopla – Iowa Energy Basketball Social Site

September 24th, 2009
5:37 pm

[...] It’s no surprise to those that followed the Energy that Courtney Sims is making a great first impression at the Atlanta Hawks training camp. Per the Atlanta Journal Constitution. [...]

SUPER NUTTZ

September 24th, 2009
5:44 pm

What is Wack is stumbling on to this ignorant bubba cult where this crew of Dic Breath haters, continue to call the Good work of Woodson with distain and hatred. The bottom line is the Hawks will finish fouth, bow out in the second round because they dont have a legit center and all you haters will still be here hating. Woodson will finish in the top ten of the coaches polls again this year, this cell of anti Woodson sentiment will continue only on this site. Woodson will get his extention and you guys will hate him more. Now, hate on.

SUPER NUTTZ

September 24th, 2009
5:47 pm

THE RADIO TELEVISON PERSONALITY WOULD BE A PERFECT FIT IN THE BUBBA BLOG CELL. HIS HATE AND THE BUBBA POSSES HATE IS ABOUT THE SAME.

SUPER NUTTZ

September 24th, 2009
5:47 pm

THAT IS IMUS

MannyT

September 24th, 2009
6:19 pm

GeeMack, that’s why he IS the most interesting Hawks Fan in the world

You can catch up if you start doing things like speaking French in Russian!

Niremetal, So it was the Houston Rockets that took all those kids harnesses from the the kiddie playgrounds. What will Mike Myers/Phillip do when he finds out?

BWAF

Ramon

September 24th, 2009
6:30 pm

Daniel, I can say you’ve made reasonable predictions. I will say though I think Cleveland has the greatest chance of all to fall to the 4th spot. Out of all of their moves, they didn’t add any consistent shooters. So there will be many games where you can double down the post (Shaq) and not worry about a deadly spot up shooter attacking you. Another thing is, Lebron has been healthy since he’s enter the league. And I don’t want to jinx the man, but its hard to believe he won’t end up having to miss at least ten games this season. Also remember Leon Powe will be out for a good while. So their depth at the 4 will be limited most of the season unless Hickson steps up.

Another team I think is overrated is the Celtics. The Celtics formula worked wonderful long as Rondo was a pass first PG. But now that Rondo’s attitude has caught up to Pierce’s, his demand for FGA will be a falling rock that starts the landslide. Rasheed and Garnett sounds great on paper, but neither really prefer to be on the block. So if you have Allen, Wallace, and Garnett both wanting to be around the perimeter to start their offensive stance, that leaves other teams at a strategic advantage when it come to rebounding. JMO

rob

September 24th, 2009
6:37 pm

mike woodson has only improve the hawk’s record every year so why hate?

espn

September 24th, 2009
6:46 pm

this year I see lakers againts boston or cleaveland in the nba finals

niremetal

September 24th, 2009
7:27 pm

Actually, I take credit for the Dos Hawkquis name, although my proposal was “Dos Hawquis.” But I might have to reneg on that credit if he keeps talking crazy sh!t about JJ, who has hit more than a couple big shots with the game on the line.

And when has Josh ever taken the last shot? I remember him throwing a tantrum when Woody didn’t give him the last shot once, and I think that was as close as he ever got. I also distinctly remember him passing to Bibby when he could have taken the last shot earlier this year (which was the right move). So where exactly is this evidence that Josh is fearless in the clutch and JJ somehow shies away.

Taking the last shot isn’t Josh’s game. He’s not a jump shooter. Even he’ll tell you that at this point. I can see an argument that Josh could/will a better all-around player than JJ if he plays a bit more within himself, but I’ll always rather leave the “last shots” for the shooters.

I MUS WRITE

September 24th, 2009
7:43 pm

Daniel-I just based that on his numbers from the D League from last year, 20/10 D League MVP. Thats respectable IMO…. Last year we had 5 guys on the roster that wouldnt give u that type production if they were over there so…..

espn

September 24th, 2009
7:57 pm

If Josh Smith can learn to shoot like JJ, he would be just like Lebron. Both Lebron and Smith dunk with power and both can block shots. So josh learn to shoot, so you can be the next Lebron!

niremetal

September 24th, 2009
8:01 pm

So josh learn to shoot, so you can be the next Lebron!

Yeah, because it’s that easy.

espn

September 24th, 2009
8:04 pm

Josh Smith for all-star not JJ.

spy

September 24th, 2009
8:19 pm

yeah, It that easy.

spy

September 24th, 2009
8:23 pm

It’s

Big Ray

September 24th, 2009
8:28 pm

Daniel ,

Crazy ain’t even the word for the Falcon blogs. However, go over to the Falcons Fan blog, known as The Bird Cage . The blog host/author there is a GREAT guy (he does some nice work), and the blog is full of true falcon fans. But you’re right, there are some nutcases over there that make our resident multi-named, misguided, starved-for-attention closet racist look like a harmless loony. Wait. He IS a harmless loony. Heh…

VaVa74 ,

You’re right, rubber meets the road this season, and for more than one person. I hope for the best for all parties concerned.

Ariose ,

Believe it or not, the whole “logged into wordpress” thing was an actual mistake. The words I posted weren’t though.

KevinA ,

Circles, eh? Yes, I would be dizzy, too. Fortunately, my line of thinking is very much linear, especially in this case.

Big Ray

September 24th, 2009
8:48 pm

Nire ,

Wow, is there a difference in the taste of bait, or what? I mean, there is the harmless but hardly unexpected stuff Melvin gives you, then there’s….well, you see what it is. LOL….

celtic spy

September 24th, 2009
9:32 pm

Hello fans of the Atlanta Hawks, am a spy from the Boston Celtic’s sent to Atlanta to spy on the Hawks. I have attended the Hawks training camp and I most tell you, your rookie teague is going to turn out to be a bust. And what can I say about Josh Smith he has not improved his jump shot. I do have to give creadit to your team for trading two bench players that never played for Crawford, that move will take your team far next season.

niremetal

September 24th, 2009
9:36 pm

Ray,

It’s training camp time. I’m just getting into shape after lazing off for a couple months

Doublenought Celtic spy

September 24th, 2009
9:43 pm

Yeah, You wasted roster space and salary by not using Flip in the space where you now will us Crawford. The two bench players only had one year left on their contracts, so it would have been wiser to go through the year and then be poised to go after a legit center while keeping your core intact. That was dumb of you guys but us Celtics appreciate your stupidity.

celtic spy

September 24th, 2009
9:46 pm

Hawks training camp starts (Sept. 29)

richbrave

September 24th, 2009
9:46 pm

HAWKS have learned how to use those fledgling wings and now are going to soar. This is getting to be a dangerous club for anyone to play. Back in D.C., the HAWKS are just a bunch of pretenders with no legs since savior GILBO is once again on the scene. October 29, lesson numberr one with three to follow right HAWKS fans. Man has this club traveled from September 2007 when I first stumbled onto SEKOU’s blog along with “Dr’” D. Mary B………

richbrave

September 24th, 2009
9:49 pm

As witness to the angst stirred up around the league by HAWKS moves this off-season, I give you the comments of Doublenaught Celtics Spy as exhibit #1.

celtic spy

September 24th, 2009
10:16 pm

Soon I will travel to Orlando to spy on the magic.

Celtic Spy my Arse

September 24th, 2009
10:28 pm

…yeah, if you can ever get out of the library.

Celtic Spy my Arse

September 24th, 2009
10:32 pm

CNN_

A chinese crack monkey was arrested for public exposure outside of Phillips Arena. He was wearing a Ku Klux Klan hood and top shirt with Chinese triad pants and shoes that said Black Panthers on them. He was trying to show everybody his NUTZ. He said they were so EXTRAORDINARY that he thought he should share them with everybody. Protestors wonder if there will be any relief in sight because apparently the jail has internet access and he can blog to his hearts content.

BeFrank

September 24th, 2009
10:32 pm

Sekou – How many slots are available for another big? Will Siler, Sims, Hunter really be given a legitimate shot to make the team?

celtic spy

September 24th, 2009
10:36 pm

have the hawks become that good that other team have to spy on us? I think so. GO HAWKS !

Ramon

September 24th, 2009
11:18 pm

Interesting, Flip is scheduled to sign with Charlotte.

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
11:19 pm

Aww hell, Flip just signes with the Charlotte Bobcats over Denver. Shaw university is right down the street from him so it works, but I KNOW he wants a little payback

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
11:24 pm

Info on FLip:

http://www.seattlepi.com/basketball/2030ap_bkn_bobcats_murray.html

The worlds biggest d ! ck

September 24th, 2009
11:28 pm

Id like to take the credit for The spy guy, but hes his own man. Its funny how anyone who exposes you guys, nonmental and Daniel,(by the way Dan, im not interested in your review on nutz), is quickly converted into truth serum. Just face it, once you get outside of this bubba milita get woody hate cell, most of the people like Woodson and the Hawks.

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
11:29 pm

GOON-SQUAD IN THE BUILDING!!!!!!!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4501615

o_0

I am personally relived. He was so great for us last season, i’d hate to see a guy like him have to go overseas to find work.

A Tribe Called Quest

September 24th, 2009
11:32 pm

The Nets have an owner worth almost 10 billion dollars.

The Hawks have 91 owners, all of whom are barely millionaires.

Stating the Obvious

September 24th, 2009
11:37 pm

Yeah, those real estate and telecom tycoons that own the Hawks are dirt poor. They probably have to shop at the salvation army thrift store and scrounge through the trash.

And besides, the Clippers are doing sooooooooooooooo well with a multi-billionaire owner. And the Knicks are just going gangbusters with their google-billion-trilllion-dollar ownership group.

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
11:37 pm

I’m calling it!!! Bobcats in the 2010 playoffs!!! New players & New Jerseys!!!! Don’t sleep on LB, they were 37-45 lastseason….sound familiar? They’ve got a nice roster too:

Flip, Felton, Gerald Wallace, VladRad, Raja Bell, Tyson Chandler, Nazr Mahammed, D.J Augistin, Gerald Henderson & Boris Diaw

Underrated, but with LB as the coach and a full training cam with eahother, they will be fun to watch. That means either Chicago, Philly, or Toronto WON’T make the playoffs……and Detroit already vacated a spot lol.

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
11:39 pm

*camp

*each other

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
11:39 pm

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=NBA&id=888&line=117829&spln=1

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
11:41 pm

Wally Sczerbiak ang Stackhouse are the last decent Vets out there….oh, and of course G.Green hehehe…..

Rick, where you at!!!!!

Ariose

September 24th, 2009
11:42 pm

Miami, might not make the playoffs either….

niremetal

September 24th, 2009
11:42 pm

Actually, it’s “Salvation Army.” And they’re “Family Stores,” not “thrift stores.”

icecold

September 24th, 2009
11:59 pm

can we stay on the hawks please!! its already alot to read!!! can we stick to the topic!!! but i kind of feel that the hawks should change that blue color to black!! it would be fi!! but any way!! did joe johnson touch in for training camp yet?

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
12:01 am

The Boston Globe has relaeased a Mental Health Article in light of the summer incidents involving NBA stars like Delonte West, Beasley, and Stephon Marbury:

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/articles/2009/09/13/coping_with_fame_is_no_slam_dunk/

Najeh Davenpoop

September 25th, 2009
12:08 am

I don’t know if a score-first swingman off the bench is a real need for the Hawks right now, but signing a veteran with playoff experience like Stackhouse definitely couldn’t hurt. If the Hawks have some spare change lying around, go for it.

Can’t wait for this season to start. I really haven’t been this excited about an upcoming Hawks season in forever.

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
12:15 am

http://multimedia.boston.com/m/26569054/globe-10-0-does-matt-ryan-remind-you-of-tom-brady.htm

Ramon

September 25th, 2009
12:17 am

Here’s a riddle for you guys. Does Woody need Bibby more? Or does Bibby need Woody more?

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
12:20 am

AAAAhhhhhhh!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wiNsa6-upWM

icecold

September 25th, 2009
12:24 am

Big Ray

September 22nd, 2009
10:48 pm
That and I think Josh and Al can play a bit of hi-low sometimes. If Josh can hit a midrange jumper (Al already can, seen it a few times and it was nice) then he can draw a defender off of Al. And Josh DOES know how to pass.

EXACTLY!!!!

thats y we need a better coach!! he make the plays he tells them what to run and what to do!!! mike woodson is doin good cuz he got good players!! but good coaches turn good teams into great and great teams into dynasties!! and dynasties into legendary teams!! got the great roster!! now all we need is a good coach!!!

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
12:54 am

I think theres a strong possibility that we could have the whole SouthEastern division in the playoffs this season…

Big Ray

September 25th, 2009
1:01 am

Ariose ,

Thanks for the update on Flip. I know you were watchin’ homeboy closely!

Big Ray

September 25th, 2009
1:06 am

Najeh ,

Where in the devil have you been? Good to see you are still kickin’.

Ariose ,

No doubt, the southeast, and the East overall is fairly loaded this year. Teams like Miami could go backwards. In fact, I expect them to. If Beasley can’t turn into a major contributor for them this year, then what are they going to do? Sixers figure to be in better shape with a healthy Brand and Eddie Jordan at the helm. Or so I figure, anyway, could be dead wrong.

We’ll see how it goes.

Hawkshurrah

September 25th, 2009
5:47 am

Does J Crawford remind anyone here of Terry Furlow who was with the Hawks briefly in the late 70s? Yes, Michigan State. Not the off the court issues. A top notch scorer off the bench can make a world of difference. He sure did. This blog is about Crawford, right?

vava74

September 25th, 2009
7:02 am

Big Ray,

Wade is an asset which the NBA cannot have the luxury of missing the playoffs hence, Miami will be carried by the refs to the 8th seed, at least.

In relation to Philla, I think they lack a proven PG (Williams is nice but…) to be successful.

Furthermore, Eddie Jordan’s interpretation of Princeton’s offense needs a stronger perimeter game than they currently have and does not match neither Iguodala nor Brand’s games.

I think they will have chemistry issues at least until January.

niremetal

September 25th, 2009
7:18 am

I’m not sure Flip’s such a great fit in Charlotte. He’ll be fighting a lot of guys (Felton, Augustin, Bell, Henderson) for minutes, and I could easily see him ending up in Brown’s doghouse. I’m also sad he won’t be coming to Philly, because I woulda liked to see him in action up here…

Melvin

September 25th, 2009
7:48 am

Hoopsworld evaluation of the Hawks…

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=13885

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
7:51 am

Flip Murray

Congratulation in finding your new home with the Bobcats; your time with the Hawks was much appreciated. We wise you nothing but the best(except when you play the Hawks). A shout-out to all your Shaw Alumni

Sincerely

The Truth

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
8:15 am

Congrats to Flip, wish him all the best.
What did he sign for?

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
8:25 am

melvin- thanks for the link
I think that they gave a very fair and balanced outlook on the Hawks this season.
Interesting that rebounding is such a glaring area to improve, will Joe Smith and Collins help that number? Will Josh Smith’s new plan to stay inside the arc change that number? We shall see.

A couple of blogs ago, Sekou mentioned he wouldn’t worry about JJ and the extension until October. We have only a week to go. Anyone worried yet?

Big Ray- When is the fans blog going to get running?

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
8:27 am

Ramon- Woody needs Bibby more. Bibby has established himself as an upper tier player in the league, yes his run with the Hawks has reignited his game, but Woody is still trying to establish himself as a legitimate NBA coach. Just look at this blog.

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
8:29 am

Flip Deal

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
8:32 am

Daniel, he signed for the Bi-Annual 1.99 mill. I beleive with Denvers cap restriction, they were only offering him a non-gaurenteed contract.

Nire, Maybe Flip choose not to come to Philly because of Local hero/family distractions. I think Flip WAS coached by LB up in Detroit for a season(??) and Charlotte was ranked dead last in the leauge in scoring last season, so I think he will help them out a lot.

The Truth, LOL @ Your September 24th, 2009
11:31 am post!!

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
8:34 am

Nire, It’s good that he can swing between the PG/SG spots though, but the minutes will defenetly be a little scarace for him there.

JerryWest

September 25th, 2009
8:41 am

Sekou,

Does Randolph Morris have a non-guaranteed contract this year?

Hoopsworld says so: http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9154

EXTRAORDINARY NUTTZ

September 25th, 2009
8:52 am

Flip signed for 2.1 mil on a 1 year contract- Congrats to Flip. Hell get the job down were ever he is. Instant offensive and will play defense.

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
9:01 am

JerryWest

Interesting link: If Morris is non-guaranteed, that makes things easier for Sund. It could open up enough roster spots to satisfy all concerns; nice, very nice indeed.

Bubba shift leader

September 25th, 2009
9:02 am

icecold,rob and celtic spy are all truth serum. As long as you guys continue to acknowledge the good work of Woodson and question the hate in our blog cell we will paint you as truth serum. You better get in line and ignore Woodson’s success like we do and say cruel and hateful things that are clearly unfounded or else.

Paid for by a committee of ignorance

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
9:08 am

Wow- he got their bi-annual? Good for Flip, seems like the Bobcats overpaid to me.

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
9:10 am

Jerry West- that is the first time I have seen that. Thanks for the link. I was sure that this year is guaranteed. That changes a lot.
very good question. I hope Sekou can clear that one up for us.

JerryWest

September 25th, 2009
9:12 am

Could someone twitter Sekou on Morris’s contract situation? and the link: http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9154

Mike

September 25th, 2009
9:14 am

I was also sure his contract is guaranteed. If not, then it would be a big help for guys like Siler, Sims, Hunter and Mario to make the team. I’d rather have any of those 4 over Morris.

niremetal

September 25th, 2009
9:18 am

The more interesting thing from jerrywest’s link is the stroke of genius Sund pulled off with the structures of the Zaza/Marvin/Bibby contracts. Each of them has a salary that dips next year and rises thereafter. That means that we’ll have more room under the cap and tax thresholds next year with which to re-sign JJ and/or sign/trade for another big name player. I honestly didn’t even know you were allowed to structure contracts with a trough like that – I certainly never had seen it before. But it’s genius.

Mike

September 25th, 2009
9:18 am

Great Link…I hope it is true. Did you also notice that Bibby, Zaza and Marvin all took less money for the 2010-2011 season. Great move by Sund and by those guys for looking out for the team instead of themselves. It will allow Sund extra flexibility with Joe or potential future trades and FA signings

Mike

September 25th, 2009
9:19 am

Niremetal…great minds think alike!!

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
9:36 am

I just HAVE to post this Hoopsworld Atlanta Hawks preview again. It’s Freaking Exellent

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
9:39 am

It shouldn’t be great shock if Morris contract was non-guaranteed since he was basically a walk-on last year. The way it was described, he just showed up and asked if he could play. Sund needed an extra big so Morris was lucky. Since Morris had no real leverage from a negotiation prospective, I’m sure what ever terms Sund draw-up in his contract, Morris probably accepted. They could structure a player’s contract in way that if he is waived for performance related reasons; he leaves with no pay.

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
9:39 am

WOW! Good Work Rick!!!! Randy has a non-gaurenteed goint into training camp this season!!! Bye Bye Butterballll!!!! Hehehehe

Mike

September 25th, 2009
9:52 am

Truth…you are right, it shouldnt be a shock to us if his contract is non-guaranteed but everything we have been told and heard all summer was saying that Morris had a contract and would be a Hawk this season. I would much rather see a young, hungry guy like Siler and Sims fill his spot.

Sekou, need a new post…camp starts in a few days…any last updates for us.

niremetal

September 25th, 2009
10:27 am

I’d like to get confirmation that Morris’s contract is non-guaranteed…this is the first I’ve seen or heard anything like that about him.

icecold

September 25th, 2009
10:37 am

randolph morris contract not garenteed!!!! thats the best news i heard all day!!! i hope they got it right!! cause i rather have mario west othello hunter garett sillers thomas gardner, etc!!! the list goes on and stretch!! cuz he can not be a factor this year at all and dont nobody want him in a trade!! but siler should have that spot, him or mario west!! and i think mario west should get at least a 2 year contract!! dont be suprised if another team gets him!! and he be guarding joe johnson in clutch siatuations!!! lol

icecold

September 25th, 2009
10:41 am

can u imagine this bench with hosh childress too!!! that would be great!! but things had to happen like it did to get the players we got now!! if sheldon williams was playing a little good!! we would have never got al horford!! for every action, i feel that there was a bettter chain reaction!! so somebody is doin a good job right after somebody fails!!!

icecold

September 25th, 2009
10:57 am

i jus looked at the knicks roster and how much everybody gettin paid!! literally everybody roster expires this year and the ones thats not expiring this year is a option for the team if the team wanna keep them!!! they can get lebron and dwayne wade if they wanted too next year!!! or joe johnson at that!!! damn!! its possible!! here is the link
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=9155

but the hawks can easily afford to get joe johnson back or dwayne wade or lebron james at that when joe johnson contract expires!! so we really only rellying on his decision instead of how much money we got!!

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
11:01 am

Most of the hard core Hawks fans already knew that Sund pulled a coup by structuring Bibby, Marvin and Zaza’s contracts to take a dip in 2010, but none of us knew that RandMo had a non-guaranteed contract for his 2nd year. Rand Mo’s contract situation has been a cause of endless arguments and frustrations throughout this summer.

Sekou – please confirm.

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
11:19 am

Enter your comments here

icecold

September 25th, 2009
11:29 am

tracy mcgrady, kobe bryant, joe johnson, dwayne wade, lebron james, paul peirce, ray allen, raja bell, shaq oneal, yao ming, amare stademire, manu ginobli, chris bosh, carlos boozer, are all big names that could be free agents next year!! if they all switch teams its gonna be a major shift of power in the NBA!!! its gon be a busy summer!!! i always did wanna see t-mac in a hawks uniform, or chris bosh, or amare stademire… (just a thought)!!!(0_0)!!!

gwite

September 25th, 2009
11:30 am

I just contacted Hoopsworld. The mistakenly published “non-guaranteed” status of RandMo’s contract is confirmed to be a mistake. Will be corrected.

Another example of how many of us just start flying all over the place, forming all sorts of opinions, conclusions, etc. based on “FLAWED PREMISES”. Again, a whole lot of that going on around here.

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
11:32 am

I wonder why you put Raja Bell in this list of mostly future hall of famers free agents? Some are merely multiple allstars, if not future hall of famers. But Raja Bell? LOL.

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
11:38 am

gwite

Thanks for the update; just wishful thinking on our part. But still not an outrageous idea since Mario contract was non-guaranteed in the beginning of his 2nd year. I remember he had to fight through hell to make the team again.

The Flash

September 25th, 2009
12:21 pm

**OFF TOPIC**Injury to Smith could be the opportunity of a lifetime. Smith should be out playing around with the ball close to the rim, doing everything right-hand only, catching, bringing up to shooting, releasing. Starting real close in, try different points of release, different body shapes (this for him is huge!!!!), different paths of bringing the ball up, different amounts of knee bend (another biggie), seeing how the length of kneee bend should or need not correspond to the length of the arm extending into the shot (where you start from as compared to where you release), whether you are better off with your chest sticking out or concaving in slightly, etc. Only on small shots (real small) than only slightly bigger shots. Learning opportunity could be huge. One other thing (**NOBODY ELSE AROUND HIM, ESPECIALLY NO SHOOTING COACH**, HE SHOOTS FROM IN CLOSE, NO NEED FOR NO REBOUNDER, ONLY HIM, THE FLOOR, THE BALL, AND THE BASKET, THAN BECOME THE SCIENTIST WE ALL BEGIN AS!!**)

Or, he can spend his time getting “how to” directions from one coach or trainer or the other. Have enough of that yet, Smooth? That’s what I thought.

The writer “is no hero, that’s understood, all the redemption I can offer is beneath this [bald] hood” da flash

niremetal

September 25th, 2009
12:39 pm

Jerrywest sounds like Kobe, who always dismissed Raja as a nobody. Bell is still, amazingly considering how long he’s been at it, one of the most underrated players in the league. He is Bruce Bowen with a jump shot and without the occasional dirty play. Think Battier but not quite as intelligent (which is no insult, considering that Battier probably has the highest basketball IQ in the league). Bell will definitely be a hot commodity next summer – especially since Larry Brown, unsurprisingly, loves the guy.

Not shocked about HoopsWorld. I diss them all the time for a reason. Come to think of it, I won’t bite on the 2010 salary dips for Marvin/Bibby/Zaza until I see it confirmed, although that seems like a much tougher thing to screw up…

MannyT

September 25th, 2009
12:45 pm

Niremetal,

Don’t get so excited about the salary structure. I recall that JJ’s current deal started with a $20 mil 1st year to discourage Phoenix from matching. It dipped a lot in the 2nd year and went up from there.

If BK could figure it out when he had NO salary cap issues to balance out, I think Sund could do the same when he knows the economy is in the tank and his best player needs a new deal for the next season.

Ariose, It would take Flip awhile to get to Shaw from Charlotte. Shaw is in Raleigh.

As for all the guaranteed contracts (or not) I think anyone on a minimum deal needs to show their worth. Even now, I think you cut a guy on a minimum deal for another guy on a minimum deal if one is significantly better.

BWAF

Hoops

September 25th, 2009
1:01 pm

I keep telling you guys that another trade is going to happen. I’m not saying it will involve any of our front line players, even though it could, but I just feel that Sund is working on another move.

Just my prediction!

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
1:03 pm

Damn- I knew it was too good to be true.

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
1:04 pm

Hoops- ok, I will bite, why in the world do you think that?

niremetal

September 25th, 2009
1:22 pm

Manny,

I thought that there was an 8% limit on raises and cuts in a multiyear contract? The FAQ only mentions raises, and I assume that the Union would have insisted that that apply to paycuts too. Also, Basketball-Reference says JJ got $12M in his first year. But, as always, I’m open to being proved wrong . What is important is how it counted against the cap and tax thresholds…

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
1:38 pm

Sund could trade Rand Mo to a team that needs cap relief next year, and we could pick up a much better player with simlar salary but a longer contract.

We could package Mo with him since that team could buy out Mo (2.5 mill) next summer and get further relief. Does Mo own a player’s option next year?

That’s an attractive package for a lot of teams. An additional $3.355 mill cap relief for that team. We could pick up a player who makes between $2.5 and $4.2 million dollar per year for more than 2 years.

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
2:29 pm

Manny, I didn’t mean that literally lol ^_^

Jerry, Yes Mo can opt-out after this season. He probably won’t though. His name would get lost amongst all the big time stars. He’s better off just waiting it out until 2011. He probably won’t get 2.5per again if he opts out.

gwite, DAMMIT!!! Oh well, I had a case of Yayfullness for few a fleeting seconds lol….

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
2:31 pm

*connecting with my inner Kanye*

Sekou Smith doesn’t care about Blog people!!!

GeeMack

September 25th, 2009
2:44 pm

Hey guys where would yall rank the Hawk in the entire league? Here is my list

Lakers
Boston
Spurs
Cavs
Magic
Denver
Dallas
Portland
Atlanta

All the teams I put above them won 50 games last year and improved their team during the off season.

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
2:44 pm

Ariose-(2:31) nicely done sir, nicely done

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
2:46 pm

GeeMack- I go LA, Clevland, Spurs, Magic, Boston, Denver, Atlanta, Portland, Dallas

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
3:01 pm

Mo could opt out for $2 million and then sign at minimum with any team he wants and come out way ahead of his $2.5 mil salary.

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
3:03 pm

Daniel-Why thank you lol. Oh and I agree w/your latest post, we’ve passed PDX this off season.

From Frank Robinsons Twitter Feed:

“Just finished a crazy shooting drill wit Team Dime and Marv Williams….”

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
3:05 pm

Jerry, Umm I’m not sure about that, but check w/either Manny or Nire. If he opts out, I’m not sure if he gets paid any salary…

Melvin

September 25th, 2009
3:14 pm

GeeMack,
I posted the link below on the last blog. I agree with Daniel, I think we are better than Portland and Dallas.

Not a bad ranking for the Hawks although I think they could be as high as number 6 or at least number 7 with the offseason additions that they made.

http://www.hoopsworld.com/teams/Rankings.asp

Ariose

September 25th, 2009
3:15 pm

Hawks Announce List of Roster Invites!!!!!

http://www.hawksbasketblog.com/2009/09/25/hawks-announce-2009-training-camp-roster/

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
3:19 pm

Win win for all:

Team that will acquire Mo can give him $2 million to opt out, and then he can sign at minimum with any team he wants to.

1. Mo will come out way ahead of his $2.5 mil salary. ( $2 mill + minimum salary or more).
2. He can play for any team he wants to in 2010-11.
3. In 2010-11, a team under salary cap can save $0.5 mill and a team that needs luxury cap relief can save $0.5 mill + 2.5 mill = $3 mill.
4. Team that wants to sign someone will go an additional $2.5 mil under the salary cap.
5. add Rand Mo and that’s an additional 855k relief. Total relief $3.335 mil. That’s priceless for 2010 free agent market.

All they have to do is give us a much better player who makes $2.5-$4.2 mil for at least 2 years.

Who is that player?

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
3:26 pm

I’m getting the impression that Cleveland will be in hot pursuit of Stackhouse based on the Twitter Buzz.

Maybe he’s gotten too much exposure from Sekou. Now Sund got his work cutout for him if he’s interested.

Melvin

September 25th, 2009
3:27 pm

jerrywest,

Mo has this 2.5 and player opt for next (2.5 I think). Thats 5 mil gaurantee at his disgression. Why would he accept a buyout now for 2 mil? Keep in mind, training camp is going to start next week and most teams have already filled out their rosters.

PDubATL

September 25th, 2009
3:35 pm

Melvin, agreed. The only move we might make with our existing lineup would be to buy out Morris and use his roster spot to add someone who impressed us at camp.

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
3:43 pm

buy out at the end of this year when he’ll have 2.5 left for 2010-11.

GeeMack

September 25th, 2009
3:44 pm

Melvin & Daniel

The only reason I give Portland & Dallas the slight edge is because they both won 50 games last year and added key componets during the off season (Dallas Marion & Drew Gooden) (Portland Andre Miller).

I will say this if Josh takes the next step mentally like I think we will have the impact player needed to compete for at least the ECF.

I like both of guys list.

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
3:47 pm

Cleveland needs a ball handling guard badly. Stackhouse doesn’t fit in.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2009/09/cleveland_cavaliers_may_not_be.html

icecold

September 25th, 2009
3:49 pm

okay!! i jus threw raja bell in there cuz he is good.. i didnt say nothin about he was a future hall of fame’er!!!

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
3:50 pm

I think Cleveland will go for Chucky Atkins.

Najeh Davenpoop

September 25th, 2009
3:52 pm

Heh… Big Ray, I’ve still been reading the blogs, but I haven’t really had much to say because nothing major has been going on with the Hawks in the last couple of months other than the Joe Smith and Jason Collins signings. It kinda seemed like the last couple of months’ blogs kept turning into the same 5 or 6 people arguing about the same sh*t, which I guess is what happens when there is nothing new going on. Hopefully with preseason right around the corner there will be more to talk about and I will go back to posting regularly.

icecold

September 25th, 2009
3:55 pm

Hoops

September 25th, 2009
1:01 pm
I keep telling you guys that another trade is going to happen. I’m not saying it will involve any of our front line players, even though it could, but I just feel that Sund is working on another move.

Just my prediction!

EXACTLY!!!

i feel the same way man!! somethin thats gon really change this team for the better!! alot better.. almost equal to gettin mike bibby!!! and it might see one of our starters leavin.. it could be marvin or even bibby, since we have jeff teague!! i hope not bibby though!! cuz i think he is one of the best point guards in the league still!! but who knows what might happen!!!

icecold

September 25th, 2009
4:02 pm

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
1:38 pm
Sund could trade Rand Mo to a team that needs cap relief next year, and we could pick up a much better player with simlar salary but a longer contract.

We could package Mo with him since that team could buy out Mo (2.5 mill) next summer and get further relief. Does Mo own a player’s option next year?

That’s an attractive package for a lot of teams. An additional $3.355 mill cap relief for that team. We could pick up a player who makes between $2.5 and $4.2 million dollar per year for more than 2 years.

EXACTLY and also!!!

!!!!if they get stackhouse then we wont need mo!! that way we wont be losing anything if they do trade for somebody!!! sunds trades or signing is always risk free!! he traded for mike bibby ( sheldon williams anthony johnson tyrone lue and that that other center we had who i cant think of his name right now and dont feel like searchin) then we traded acie law and speedy claxton for jamal crawford!! two risk free trades, we got rid of scrubs for good players!!! and then we jus signed these veterans to the veteran minimums ( j collins joe smith and maybe stackhouse) all risk free!! we keep gettin a whole lot of somethins for nothin!!! i think it made up for drafting sheldon williams ( probally the worst top draft pick for the hawks in the last 20 years )!!!

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
4:03 pm

Mo and West are really combo guards (not traditional PG) which explain why Flip was appealing. Stackhouse could work in that kind of a backcourt rotation based on the style Cleveland play. Danny F has defied logic before so I wouldn’t put anything passed him.

icecold

September 25th, 2009
4:06 pm

GeeMack

i believe that the hawks roster this year is going to be up there with the elite teams IF everybody has gotten better and the players we picked up come through and dont let us down then it could really be like this

Lakers
Boston
Cavs
Atlanta
Magic
Portland
Spurs
Denver
Dallas

Hoops

September 25th, 2009
4:11 pm

Daniel,

If there is not a trade and/or a signing in the works, then why would we sign Collins before camp starts? Is he that much better than Morris, Siler, and Sims? Signing Collins for Vet. minimum makes him very attractive. It also makes it easy to move Mo and/or Morris for a draft pick which frees up 3.3M in salary. Stackhouse is waiting in the wings!

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
4:32 pm

Najeh- are you suggesting arguining about Woodson’s extension or Crawford’s salary or where Stackhouse might go isn’t exciting?

Dang, I guess you have a life.
I honestly would like to post on the Falcons stuff, but they just go insane over there with this weird Vick/Racism stuff over and over and over. So I just hang here with my fellow Hawks fanatics.

Good to have you back.

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
4:35 pm

Hoops – do your research before you compare Collins to untested players.

http://www.hawksquawk.net/community/index.php/topic/339352-interesting-thread-nba-players-say-collins-is-extra-fierce/page__hl__collins__fromsearch__1

Sund has one more trick up his sleeve, but he isn’t trading away any of the players he just signed or resigned. Its downright unethical to trade away vet-min players who just signed with you.

Daniel

September 25th, 2009
4:35 pm

Interesting ideas Hoops. I would say that Collins is that much better than Siler, Sims, Morris (who has a contract already, too).

I see what you are thinking…. I am not so sure. we will see, we will see.

jerrywest

September 25th, 2009
4:38 pm

Jerry Stackhouse could add several road wins to this team. That’s where we can make maximum gain this year.

rob

September 25th, 2009
4:41 pm

thanks to flip, Acie Law never played. I saw potential on Acie, he was quick and could finish with both hands. he just needed minutes to show us what he can do. I remember when law scored like 20 points in a game againts Dallas or San Antonio. I hope Acie gets more playing time in Golden State. I wish him the best. I also wish flip the best he really helped the hawks. Mostly when JJ could not score.

GeeMack

September 25th, 2009
5:14 pm

Icecold,

I think you’re sleeping on the Spurs. Keep this in mind our best player JJ is the 2nd or 3rd best player on any of those team on your list. Josh Marvin & Al would be a sixth man on the Lakers, Spurs, & Boston. I like what the Hawks did, but they are not an elite team at this point. Even Sekou admitted that on the training camp show for FOX when they covered the Hawks.

icecold

September 25th, 2009
5:15 pm

acie law might still develop as a player,, its hard to develope point guards under woody!! thats y i kind of fear for jeff teague!!! and i hope if jamal crawford can do wit flip murray did… then i will be satisfied!! cuz flip did come through when we really needed him

icecold

September 25th, 2009
5:16 pm

but i still think we got somethin for nothin!!

KevinA

September 25th, 2009
5:44 pm

Daniel,Hoops

Training camp would be fun to watch as Siler and Sims try to prove the Collins move was a mistake. If Sims can’t make the squad does that show just how poor the D-League talent pool is? After all he had a great year including MVP.

jerrywest

After reading the posts from your link, Collins would be the (Howard/Shaq) man we need against big men. Does that make him a starter in specialized situations or 1st man in after ZaZa and Al get in foul trouble.

I MUS WRITE

September 25th, 2009
5:55 pm

Can we everbody join hands and bow your heads in prayer…..If Morris really does have a non gauranteed second year then our bigs should be- Josh,Al,Joe,ZaZa,collins,Sims

Hoops you maybe on to sumthing there- Give me Stack/Sims all day over Rio/Collins

Dam it…..I really wished Flip would have signed with Denver, O well congratulations to him!

IceCold- That list is kinda suspect Denver and the Spurs should be higher and Boston should be lower- Dallas maybe not at all…

vava74

September 25th, 2009
5:56 pm

People are going completely overboard about a 35 year old streaky shooter with no 3pt range…

For godness sakes, they guy is on his last wheels.

Sure, he could be useful, but only for spot duty, specific situations and match ups…

The guy barely brakes the .400 fg% mark for his career and people are talking about him as if he was a basketball god!

Breath deeeeep… Breath deeeeep…

You are all hyperventilating! Mo did a terrific job for us last year. As good as Flip’s (in a different role, obviously) and doesn’t get any credit around here… Just because he couldn’t stop Lebron, as if he was supposed to do what no one is able…

terrell barron

September 25th, 2009
6:08 pm

Cant believe Flip went to Charlotte. Oh well.

espn

September 25th, 2009
6:20 pm

trade JJ!

andrew

September 25th, 2009
6:25 pm

We should.

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
6:25 pm

From the roster breakdown, we have 6 PGs invitees including Mario. I would expect picking up our 3rd PG from this list. That’s highly likely. With the 2 center invitees, we will likely pickup at least 1 more center as well. The chance of us picking up both centers will depend (in my opinion) on how well Morris performs. So if Morris sucks, we could pickup both Siler and Sims and waive Morris. With just 1 forward invited, Hunter appears to have no competition unless there is a Stackhouse factor which is still probable. So Hunter chances remain unknown for that reason. All these scenarios suggest up to 3 more add-ons which totals a roster of 14 players.

The Truth

September 25th, 2009
6:34 pm

Correction: 5 PGs

niremetal

September 25th, 2009
6:39 pm

trade JJ we should

Dialing Yoda…

Reggie (The Bird and Indian)

September 25th, 2009
9:16 pm

Well folks after a season of Braves blogging, it is getting near the time to jump on here again. I was thinking I would already start to but the Braves are making it interesting again.

Good to be back.

bigdave

September 25th, 2009
9:39 pm

Reggie…

big win again tonight… after the Padres and Reds series i thought we were done… looks like we found that LA series resilience again… things are about to get interesting…

just been reading for the most part on both blogs but it is about that time…

MannyT

September 26th, 2009
5:03 pm

@niremetal from last blog.

Joe’s deal with the Hawks was 5 yrs/$70 mil with front loaded payment in year 1 of 20 mil. That left 50 mil for the other 4 years which dipped in year 2 and then had raises.

I think there has been a revision to the CBA since JJ signed that deal. The differences between what you expected to see in the contract may have been due to those changes.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=stein_marc&id=2120960

BWAF

icecold

September 26th, 2009
10:35 pm

espn

September 25th, 2009
6:20 pm
trade JJ!

Link Report this comment

F-U-C-K YOU!!!!!! lol.. jus playin
but for who would we trade him for, cuz if it aint for wade lebron kobe, rudy gay, or danny granger … then who!!!

JSS_62

September 29th, 2009
10:07 pm

Stories AJC(redneck paper) wont cover
September 24th, 2009
1:59 am

http://www.ajc.com/news/clayton/army-reservist-beaten-in-138917.html
I’ve never been one to defend the AJC, but they did post a story on within 8 hours of the initial attack.. It was on the front page of the AJC web site. I used it as an example of the double standard by certain bloggers who believe African Americans see racism where supposedly none exists…

Romblurbamoli

November 26th, 2009
4:04 am

Sony upscales PS3’s PlayTV to HD and also adds Aino ‘PlayStation phone’ support now: reghardware.co.uk/2009/11/05/playtv_update/

Romblurbamoli

November 26th, 2009
11:32 am

Look for at $100 cheaper consoles, minor but welcome upgrades, and more pressure on Nintendo and Microsoft in the gaming console market wars.

Dual Action Cleanse

December 26th, 2009
2:33 am

Hawks is very fantastic and well player of this year . he is real player and i like him ………Dual Action Cleanse Review

Crawford makes a great first impression

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Crawford makes a great first impression

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