Vacation visions
Might a Smith family reunion (of sorts) be in the works for Joe and Josh (no relation) this season with the Hawks? Time will tell. The Hawks are working on it, though.
THE OPEN ROAD - I’m not supposed to be here right now.
Seriously. I looked it up. Vacation is meant to be “leisure time away from work, devoted to rest or pleasure.”
But the phone doesn’t stop ringing because you want it to (next time, we all need to go on vacation together … or at least at the same time).
After being off the grid (mostly) for an entire family reunion weekend, I’ll admit that I’m a bit foggy on some of the details about what went on in Las Vegas for Josh Smith at the USA Basketball mini-camp and just about any other hot debate that’s gone on around here the past few days (and for the record, I’m told that despite a tepid performance in Saturday’s scrimmage, his time with the USA B’ball folks was a rousing success because it allowed quite a few people that weren’t familiar with him other than what they’ve seen, heard and read to get a much better for feel for him as a person and player).
But I do have some thoughts about a few other things, namely the Hawks’ mini-camp from last week, the state of negotiations with Marvin Williams and the Hawks’ continued pursuit of Joe Smith. So if you’ll forgive your host for leaving the party for a few days (technically, I’m on vacation until August – just in case Wifey decides to check the blog and see what we’ve got going on), here are some of my vacation visions:
JOE SMITH probably didn’t realize he had multiple stalkers until he left Atlanta Friday. That’s when the Hawks’ full court press for the veteran free agent’s signature shifted from face-to-face to long distance. Well, mostly long distance. The Hawks do have a secret weapon in Smith’s Phoenix backyard. Mike Bibby’s basketball royalty in the Valley. And he’s one of several Hawks working hard on the recruiting trail to bring Smith into the fold. Zaza Pachulia knows Smith well from their time together in Milwaukee and said he would use all his Euro-charm (at lunch Friday and beyond) to make sure Smith was aware of just how much he is wanted and needed by the Hawks. All that said, major work must be done to secure Smith’s signature on a contract. It’s not secret the Hawks aren’t paying the same rate for backup bigs that some other teams are (for example, Chris Wilcox got cash – $6 million over two years – in Detroit that he never could have from the Hawks. Same goes for Drew Gooden and the reported $4.5 mil he’ll bring in on a one-year deal with the Spurs). So they have to find ways (PLAYING TIME!!!!!!!!!!) to lure the kind of players they need to help bolster their cause. It probably helps that, in a summer marked by taking care of in-house business (home grown free agents), Smith is the first player outside of the family that the Hawks actually courted. Again, there is major work still to be done on this front.
YOU WERE WARNED THAT THINGS between the Hawks and Marvin Williams would drag out this summer. I wasn’t joking. Nothing has changed. The sides remain on opposite sides of the restricted free agent street right now. I know that other outlets reported that the sides were “close” and all that, but it’s just not true. The sides are talking. And they’ll be back at it this week. Anyone that sees an end in sight has X-ray vision, because I wouldn’t be surprised if things lasted deep into next month. Look back at the Hawks’ dealings with many of their own players in the past (I know Mike Bibby and Zaza coming back as quickly as they did had you juiced but that was out of the ordinary for the Hawks). It usually takes time, especially for restricted free agents.
JEFF TEAGUE is going to make a lot of people forget about the disappointing saga that was Acie Law IV’s tenure with the Hawks. Teague did more than just turn heads during the Hawks’ mini-camp last week. He sparked conversation about point guard play I hadn’t heard in my time covering the Hawks before last week. “He did some things as a young point guard that we hadn’t seen on our practice floor since Chris Paul and Deron Williams were here for predraft workouts,” one Hawks assistant coach told me last week. That’s as strong a statement as I’ve heard from anyone in the Hawks’ camp regarding a young point guard. While they all agree that Teague has plenty of polish that can be applied to his game, there is no debate about who or what the Hawks expect him to become. “I can’t wait to see him in training camp,” Randolph Morris said. “I think he’s going to give people fits with his quickness and his ability to get to the rim whenever he wants to. That’s going to be fun to watch.”
OBSERVATIONS ABOUT A FEW OTHER GUYS that stood out (for various reasons) during mini-camp:
- Othello Hunter was more impressive than any other player in camp, after Teague. His range on his jumper has improved dramatically. But we all know that his chance at making a dent in the Hawks’ roster and playing rotation depends on his ability rebound, defend and provide the hustle plays required of frontcourt journeymen in the NBA. The improved shot is an added bonus. I’d have him locked up on a two-year deal right now. If he keeps improving, someone is going to get a steal.
- Garret Siler’s stock with fans and media types can’t get much higher. He’s become something of a phenomenon around these parts, thanks to some serious hype and the big fella backing it up with strong performances in the Las Vegas summer league and last week. Siler’s raw and would be a super-sized Lunchable for superstars like Dwight Howard, Shaq and Pau Gasol, not to mention brutes like Kendrick Perkins and Brook Lopez. I know you want to believe that he’s the he’s the answer to the Hawks’ big-man problems … but that would mean all 30 teams missed on the guy, twice for some teams, on draft night.
- Randolph Morris has shed the kind of weight all of us “bigger” guys would love to be able to shed. And he did it organically, which makes it particularly impressive. He had his moments during mini-camp but I’m not sure he blew anyone (in charge) away with the work he did. I don’t know what he has to do to make a move up the Hawks’ rotational food chain, though he is under contract for this season, which has to help. But the fact is, even with all the work Morris has done, the Hawks are still hunting reserve bigs.
- Frank Robinson did it again. He showed up. Played his guts out, literally. And his reward, like that of most guys in his predicament, will probably be an invite to training camp. Robinson is the kind of guy that will always make training camp interesting because he’s fearless and is skilled enough to make you wonder why he’s not on someone’s NBA team? He won’t make the Hawks’ roster this season. But I certainly wouldn’t be surprised to see him in the middle of the action during training camp.
- Yoroslav Korolev was supposed to be a bust. When he crashed and burned with the Los Angeles Clippers (they made him the 12th pick of the 2005 draft), he joined the ranks of Darko Milicic, Nickoloz Tskitishvili and Fran Vasquez on the list of worst ever Euro-lottery busts. Korolev was just a kid when the Clippers drafted him but he looked grown up last week. He was much better than I expected him to be and showed off a nice shooting touch from long distance. He’d be worth keeping an eye on for the future.
- Brian Hamilton surprised me as much or more than any player in camp. I honestly wasn’t aware of him at all before last week. But mini-camp is a showcase for under the radar players like Hamilton, a smooth 6-6 swingman that impressed on both ends of the floor. His defense is what made him stand out. Yet he showed plenty of offensive ability and a nose for the ball on both ends of the floor that would make Mario West jealous. He’s another guy that will surely be in someone’s training camp pushing someone under contract to the limit.
Those were just some of the guys that made lasting impressions on me. Hawks coach Mike Woodson remarked several times that it was by far the best (rookie/free-agent) camp conducted during his tenure with the Hawks and I have to agree that it was the best I’ve seen in my time dealing with the Hawks (I missed his first one, when Josh Smith and Josh Childress were rookies). But there wasn’t a single player in town last week that didn’t belong on that floor.
IN CLOSING, I’d be remiss if I didn’t give my man Solomon “Solo” Jones a proper send off here. One of the truly unique characters to grace us with his presence the past three years, Jones is moving on this week to a two-year deal with the Indiana Pacers. Solo is moving on at a time when the Hawks could use a big or two like him, which makes his departure for Indiana all the more perplexing. After all, he was a restricted free agent, due close to a $1 million if he had signed his qualifying offer (the QO was rescinded so he would be allowed to sign with the Pacers without any interruption). I needed an explanation and Solo provided one last week. “The Hawks kept it real with me,” he said. “They told me that my role was going to be pretty much the same as it was last year, and that I wouldn’t have a chance to move up and get more time unless somebody got hurt like last year. And I realize that’s just the way it’s going to be with Josh and Al [Horford] and Zaza already in place. It’s cool. I get a chance to go somewhere else and try and start over and see if there’s a chance to have a bigger role. The Pacers want me up there right away to get to work and that’s a good thing. I’m looking forward to the opportunity. But I appreciate the Hawks keeping it straight with me and not trying to sell me something that they couldn’t deliver in terms of playing time and opportunity.”
If it’s good enough for Solo, it’s good enough for me.
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712 comments Add your comment
Dan
July 27th, 2009
9:29 am
Thanks for the updates as always, Sekou. Best of luck to Solo, hopefully he gets a chance to make his mark in Indy. Sekou, what are the chances Marvin isn’t a Hawk on 09-10?
sds3u
July 27th, 2009
9:29 am
first
DJ
July 27th, 2009
9:32 am
FIRST!
DJ
July 27th, 2009
9:33 am
dang it.
I MUS WRITE
July 27th, 2009
9:33 am
I.MUS WRITE
RealSquawk
July 27th, 2009
9:39 am
this first thing has got to stop especially when you are second.
Other than that my x-ray vision and optimism has us locking Marvin Williams and Joe Smith this week.
I really don’t see how we improve at all if Marvin Williams isn’t in the fold. Another prediction if we don’t get higher than a four seed we will be lower than the four seed.
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
9:41 am
Deep made the point at the end of the last blog that the Hawks might be trying to maintain cap flexibility for next summer. I think he might be on target. My guess is that the Hawks are only offering Joe Smith either 1) a one-year deal or 2) a two-year deal at the vet’s minimum. If they signed someone to, say, the full mid-level, that would take them out of the running for signing-and-trading for one of the big free agents because it would push them too close to the luxury tax threshold. It would also put them over the likely cap, which would take us out of the running for signing second-tier free agents (like, say, Travis Outlaw, Damien Wilkins, or Udonis Haslem). With JJ a free agent, Horford up for an extension, and Marvin’s status uncertain, there’s a strong argument to be made for not burdening the payroll for players who are less talented than what we could get next summer…
The current “elite” teams in the
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
9:43 am
*The current “elite” teams in the league won’t have cap room next year thanks to their spending sprees this offseason, so we might actually be in an enviable position as far as going after people looking to join a winning squad next year…
Melvin
July 27th, 2009
9:50 am
I wish SOLO well. I still think he could have help this team if the HC gave him consistent mins. 2-3 days courting Joe Smith and no deal done. Well I think that speaks volumes of this organization. Plan and simple, we need new owners. The BASG are not serious about building a championship team. Get those penny pinchers out of here…
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
9:50 am
(Mind you, I will be very disappointed if we don’t lock up ONE of the few remaining vet big men to a 1- or 2- year deal)
Khao$
July 27th, 2009
9:50 am
With most of the legitimate bigs being taken off the market, it becomes a must, IMHO, that we secure the services of Joe Smith. I hate to see Solo go. With the way things are playing out in FA, I wish we kept him.
ant banks
July 27th, 2009
9:51 am
10th!!!
Melvin
July 27th, 2009
9:54 am
Nire,
Wouldn’t a team like Cleveland be under the cap next year? Considering the expiring contracts of Shaq, Big Z and possibly Lebron. Couldn’t they sign other FA’s than re-sign their own FA’s with the Bird rule?
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
9:54 am
Won’t get drawn in today, Melvin…lol. Have to take some obscure exam tomorrow and Wednesday…
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
9:57 am
first?
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
9:57 am
Mel,
They actually still have the large contracts of Mo Williams and Varejao on their books. Add to that the cap hold for LeBron, and they are in the same position we were this year – a couple million under the cap, but not far enough to sign anyone to more than the mid-level straight up. That’s why I was so surprised that they threw $50M at Varejao. If not for that, they WOULD have the cap space to make a play for one of the other big guns next summer. By not just paying but overpaying for him, they actually made it so that they can’t even make a run at a guy like Outlaw…
Anakin Joe
July 27th, 2009
9:58 am
In other words, Crawford’s contract strikes again. I fully expect him to have an Al harrington-type of impact on this team. Some good. Some bad. Mostly forgettable.
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
9:59 am
not even close!
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
10:02 am
hmmm… I guess are hopes of getting something for Solo are gone. I am going to assume that by not signing the QO the Hawks were doing Solo a favor. I hope this is a sign that they are trying to build good will amongst players. The move doesn’t change one bit the outlook for this team though. We still need a veteran big (or two) to add to the bench same as before. I hope to hear some news soon on the Joe Smith front.
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
10:02 am
Also, Mel – you can’t get around the cap rules by simply signing other teams’ free agents before you re-sign your own. That’s the whole reason they have cap holds – unless you renounce your rights to re-sign that player, there’s a cap hold on the book for them. I would guess that the Cavs will renounce both Shaq and Z next summer, but the kicker isn’t them, it’s LeBron – his cap hold will be the max contract, and that’ll take them to within $5M of the cap when it’s added to the other people actually on the payroll.
A Tribe Called Quest
July 27th, 2009
10:06 am
Man, look at pictures of Jeff Teague and Jason Terry and then compare their games (3 pt shooting off-guards, explosively quick) and tell me that they are not the exact same player (height may be off a bit). Same initials too. Jet Terry got way too much hate from ATL media. And I’ll be damn happy if Teague turns out to be close to as good as Jet is.
A Tribe Called Quest
July 27th, 2009
10:07 am
CAVS WANT LEON POWE NOW. WHO DO THE HAWKS WANT?
NO ONE
CHEAP B@STARDS
Wink
July 27th, 2009
10:08 am
“I can’t wait to see him in training camp,” Randolph Morris said. “I think he’s going to give people fits with his quickness and his ability to get to the rim whenever he wants to. That’s going to be fun to watch.”
Can get a rotation player’s opinion, other than this one from the Sleeping Giant, that will surly be watching from the bench.
Wink
July 27th, 2009
10:09 am
Morris’s comments regarding our new rookie point guard Teague,
Anakin Joe
July 27th, 2009
10:11 am
Seems like Joe Smith or bust. I agree that at this point, we need more of a PF than a back-up C (at least in terms or priorities). Unless Kurt Thomas is set free this summer, I can’t think of anyone who would make a true impact other than Smith. Guys like Brian Skinner, Mikki Moore and Malik Rose are closer to the Stromile Swift/Melvin Ely/Michael Ruffin grouping than they are to the McDyess/Bass/Gooden class.
Solo will be competing with Hibbert, Murphy, Foster and Hansbrough for playing time. And he feels that it a better situation than competing for time with the Hawks? Either Sund is REALLY convinced that he has someone imminently walking through the door or Solo was just looking for a nice way to explain why he wanted to get away from Woody. Because I don’t see him cracking the top 4 bigs in Indy.
Melvin
July 27th, 2009
10:13 am
Nire,
Thanks. I forgot about the cap holds. Well, we can’t overlook NY b/c they have a history of overpaying for players. Even if they don’t land the big fish, they could sign several mid-level players. I wouldn’t mind getting Jared Jeffery from them….
Anakin Joe
July 27th, 2009
10:16 am
Randolph Morris has become a regular scout all of a sudden. Dude is analyzing Siler and now Teague. Maybe we can have a 3rd blog on the Hawks here at AJC. Sekou (beat writer’s angle), Hawks Hacks (fan’s view) and MoBlog (a player’s perspective from the 11th seat on the bench). I’m not hating on the weight loss, however, good for him.
Melvin
July 27th, 2009
10:17 am
Anakin,
I think Solo problem was more with Woody than Sund. Sund has stated that he’s hands off when it comes to the coaching decisions and personnel for the team…
Melvin
July 27th, 2009
10:19 am
Well to RandMo defense, he’s the only roster guy to play with rookies and mini-campers. Not sure that’s a good endorsement for him….
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
10:38 am
Melvin that tells you everything you need to know about Randolph. He will get invited to training camp only because he is already under contract.
Why do you guys think that Solo had a problem with Woody? Woodson gets too much blame around here. How is he responsible for a lower tier player moving to another team for 1 milion dollars? Does that suddenly swing the balance of power in the East? Veteran starters on this team all really like Woodson and have backed that up with their contracts. Outside of Josh, who has had issues with Woody? Acie Law? Salim Stoudemire? Gee, if my coach is the kind of guy that barely NBA talent level guys have a problem with, then I am ok with that.
Anakin Joe
July 27th, 2009
10:41 am
ESPN’s Chris Sheridan provided this summary on Josh Smith’s USA Basketball performance and chances for a future roster spot (it is an Insider article, he summarized every participant from the weekend minicamp):
Josh Smith: Appeared to be packing on a few extra pounds, and his game still seems too unrefined for him to be seriously considered in the big man mix for next summer. But if he shoots 80 percent at the line and 50 percent from the field in ‘09-10, he’ll help his cause.
Ben
July 27th, 2009
10:48 am
What would it take to get Joe Smith on a 1 yr deal – 2 Mil – 2.5 Mil?
2 yr deal 3 Mil – 3.5 Mil
Is Ryan Hollins decent?
Open up the purse Spirit! This couple of hundred thou that you might be squabbling over is not going to be the difference in resigning Marvin, Joe, Al over the next 2 years. You need a quality, veteran big man who can hold his own down low. Why let Solo go if we are not going to get anyone better than him! Wonder why Atlanta never gets any unrestricted free agents, never pay enough and always drag out negotiations. They don’t even show their own players the love (Childress, Marvin, etc.) Who wants to play for an organization like that? Who would take a discount to play here- no one.
doc
July 27th, 2009
10:51 am
seems solo is loaded with class.
what is BASG’s problem. they choked up 3 mil a year for a suit on the bench, that could cower rookies, pop popcorn and slice open zaza’s head and they cant find the bucks for joe smith? what is wrong with this picture?
Anakin Joe
July 27th, 2009
10:52 am
Melvin, Sund doesn’t make playing time decisions but let’s face it, if Sund is bringing in Siler or Hunter or Earl Barron to join Zaza on the bench, then surely Solo could feel like he could prove himself against those guys. But if Sund hinted that he will be adding a proven rotational big man, then that’s another story.
If Solo feels like he won’t get enough playing time as the team’s 4th big, then that kind of flies in the face of Sekou suggesting that playing time may be the bait to lure someone like Smith. Or, if Solo feels like Woody will truly only play 3 bigs, then will Smith’s camp feel the same way and try to land him with a Western team (like Portland)? It just doesn’t really fit together (IMO). Unless, as I suggested, Solo was mostly interested in removing himself from Woody.
ant banks
July 27th, 2009
11:00 am
for all of you all talkin’ about ASG, Sund, and Mike Woodson you have to give them credit for handlin’ solo honestly. i like when people shoot straight, so that you fully know where you stand.
i applaud the hawks in this regard!! as a result, solo was able to make a clear choice that he and his fam could benefit from
ILL-logical
July 27th, 2009
11:01 am
Best wishes to Solomon Jones, a class act and hard worker. The continuing stream of talent away from and the trickle toward the Hawks in the last few years is interesting to say the least.
Since Joe, there has not been a major “star” sign here and his arrival was via a trade. However, several Hawk first round draft picks have been sent packing while no comparable free agent talent has replaced them.Certainly a cost effective strategy because of the difference in the rookie scale versus the free agent market but sometimes the last piece of the puzzle has to come from somewhere besides a young but talented rookie or a mid season trade.
Mike is back
July 27th, 2009
11:19 am
Sekou, great stuff as usual…I’m with you on Solo…if Solo is happy with it…I’m happy with it…I wish him the best of luck. I like what I little I saw out of Othello…glad to hear he is having a great camp…he could provide some help off the bench to offset the loss of an energy guy like Solo.
I felt like I heard some positives things from Woody during his interview…but, we’ve all said that before. It will be interesting to see how Woody handles Teague…now that Acie and Solo is gone I can turn the page on that sad saga. However, I am very excited with the prospect watching Teague and hopefully Siler filled the role of the aforementioned player.
I agree with Woody…alone with the resigning of Marvin…the Hawks need to bring in two vets Bigs to realistic have a chance to hold down that 4th spot. Still hoping for a miracle when it comes to ASG and spending money on FA Bigs…Sund is starting to feel BK’s pain!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
doc
July 27th, 2009
11:22 am
yeah aj the man has been very candid and accurate in his comments it seems. maybe he has a chance in talent evaluation.
I MUS WRITE
July 27th, 2009
11:50 am
Danny Ferry is that dude….. I mean dam..who have’nt they signed. JMoon,AParker,Shaq,Powe,Danny Green..Those are big signings -I thought they would have beat Orlando if they didnt have 2 6′1 guys holding down the back court… Parker and moon should help alot-the rich get richer
Good luck to Solo- He handled the situation with class. I dont know where he’ll find time with Hibbert,Foster,Hansboro all in the mix for minutes. Good guy but after 3 years in the league I dont see him improving much but none the less good luck to that yungn…..
What two vets …every big man worth a dam has signed with the Spurs……… Estaban Batista anyone Alvin jones maybe-what happened to him i thought he would be alot better.
darrell starks
July 27th, 2009
12:09 pm
You build a player up and he improve every year and then you let him go the same old hawks with no player development at all i wish you luck solo.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!
Traceman
July 27th, 2009
12:12 pm
I don’t think the fact that we haven’t signed a big yet makes the ASG cheap. I think the reality of the situation is that like most teams, the Hawks are willing to spend UP TO the luxury tax threshold but they are not willing to EXCEED it. The penalty for exceeding the luxury tax is SIGNIFICANT and only a few owners are in a position to do it. As such, until they actually get Marvin’s name on the dotted line so they know EXACTLY how much room they have under the cap, they are only willing to commit so much to a veteran big man (most likely at or slightly above the minimum).
For example, they may not WANT to pay Marvin more than a certain amount but if a team comes in with a 5 yr/$40M offer for Marv versus the 5 yr/$35M the team wants to pay (just an example, I have no idea what Marv wants or the team is offering), they can’t let a $4M/yr contract to Drew Gooden or Joe Smith prevent them from being able to match an offer to Marvin, particularly when that is only $1M/season more than they wanted to pay.
While we definitely need another big man, whatever big man we get will likely be behind Zaza in the rotation. You can’t let your 4th big man prevent you from resigning your starting SF.
For those who say Marv is not worth $8M a season (or whatever number) I’d rather give that money to someone else, it’s not that simple. We are over the salary cap. We can give Marv $8M a season because he is our own FA but we can’t just give that money to any FA.
Bottom line, the best move for the team is to get the Marvin situation worked out first (whether he plays for the QO this season and becomes unrestricted next year or he works out a long term extension). If they can get that done, then they will know exactly how much money they have to work with going forward.
Hoops
July 27th, 2009
12:16 pm
Ken,
You’re right, the Bucks would not make the trade I purposed of Jefferson and Brewer for Josh, Evans, and Morris. The Timberwolves on the other hand might look into it since those players play for them and not the Bucks! My bad!
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
12:22 pm
Traceman- I agree that signing Marvin is important, but that shouldn’t limit the Hawks ability to sign FA’s, because they have the full MLE and Biannual to use which is not affected by Marvin’s contract.
Clearly, they are offering Joe Smith so we will see what it takes to sign him. I would rather go with a slightly rich number for one year than a 2 year deal. I would rather give him 3-4 mil for one year than 5-6 for 2. But, we will see a two year deal would not be bad.
A Tribe Called Quest
July 27th, 2009
12:22 pm
I can understand why a lot of people weren’t impressed with Josh Smith’s performance on Saturday.
The reason is because his whole “basketball game” is based 100% entirely off of his athleticism. He has a lower basketball IQ than any other rotational player in the NBA. He probably was trying to be Kobe Bryant on Saturday (haven’t seen the highlights if there are any), which he tries to do in Atlanta, but fails miserably. He also looks at the player he is going to pass to, and has that pass intercepted. I can go on for 3 hours typing about how pathetic his basketball IQ is – but that would be considered negative – something not allowed here.
And if we can’t provide minutes to Solo, how would Joe Smith get minutes here? The bottom line is that Woody will give Horford and Smoove 38 minutes or so each, and ZaZa will get about 20, so why would Joe Smith want to play 8 minutes a game (my calculations are a bit off)
Myrak43
July 27th, 2009
12:23 pm
Ben,
“Who wants to play for an organization like that? Who would take a discount to play here- no one.”
That is not true…. Bibby and ZaZa settled for less money to stay in Atlanta.
darrell starks
July 27th, 2009
12:27 pm
What kind of crap is that, woody told solo that his role will be the same and the only way he could move up if some one get hurt, woody never develop solo as a player nor did he give him a chance just like he did acie law thats woody for you.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!
Mike is back
July 27th, 2009
12:28 pm
Well, Theo is going to the Spurs…hopefully there will somebody left once the Marvin deal is done…right now it ain’t looking good.
It’s laughable when you hear people saying money isn’t an issue in our failed attempted to land a Vet Big. Still hope we can close the JS deal.
Farmer
July 27th, 2009
12:37 pm
What was the outcome of Akoyl’s performance at camp? We going to see him on the bench?
STRETCH
July 27th, 2009
12:41 pm
THE HAWKS ARE HAVE A PLAN. THEY ARE GOING TO SHOOT THEIR WAY THROUGH THE SEASON. LOL!
darrell starks
July 27th, 2009
12:43 pm
THE hawks keep talking about a big man there is no one out there that i can say that will help the hawks and if any one think joe smith will help this team then follow the yellow brick road in to darkness because i can’t see it.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
12:46 pm
darrell- Is anything not Woody’s fault? Is it too hot because he didn’t spend enough time developing new weather patterns?
c’mon Solo seems like a good guy who is a low level NBA player who got a better offer from a team that is in a full blown rebuilding mode where players will get a lot more of a look. The Hawks are not rebuilding they are a playoff team who are looking to continue to move forward to a second round wins in the playoffs.
Solo is not the difference for any team in the league.
And Acie is already on the short bus in Golden State.
STRETCH
July 27th, 2009
12:47 pm
Myrak43
Bibby and ZaZa settled for less money cause the reality of it is, nobody was going to give them(especially Bibby) more money, and in ZaZa’s cause he was and is probably one of the last bigs teams would have wanted anyway.
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
12:47 pm
Joe Smith can’t help this team but Solo can?
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
12:49 pm
STRETCH- Myrak43 is exactly right on that one. No Bibby wasn’t going to get 14 mil, but he negotiated quickly and fairly with the Hawks. Za was getting interest from lots of teams around the league, so that is blatantly a false statement. Please pay attention.
Tyger
July 27th, 2009
1:02 pm
Best of the rest…
Hawks down to roster filler at this point.
1. Linas Kleiza – big shooter 2. Stromile Swift – Solo w/ exp. 3. Johan Petro – 7ft. flasher 4. Aaron Gray – 7ft plodder 5. Rodney Carney – athletic wing 6. Gerald Green – athletic wing 7. Steve Novak – 6′10 shooter
If Mighty Joe were coming we wouldv’e heard by now; at this point, we may as well expand the search for the best available.
Hawks have 10 players signed including Marvin, must have 12.
Sundiata Gaines, PG
Garrett Siler, C
Rodney Carney, G-F
Johan Petro, C
STRETCH
July 27th, 2009
1:11 pm
Whatever you say Daniel. But where’s the beef? No matter how you try and stack it, its still a veggie burger! ASG are cheap and didnt spend to get atleast one big? Are you kidding me?!
Coach Woodson is still selling those pipe dreams by saying we have been building. Ok, its going to be what…year 5 coming up and at year 3 they won 37 games(whoopdie doo), year 4 after barely making it past a not so good Miami Heat team, they got swept in the second round.
Coach Woodson was talking through an interview the other day saying “for sure we are trying to be 8-11 deep in our rotation” but they tell Solo he’s NOT in their plans after 3 years? Whats that about? THE HAWKS WILL BE A 6th or 7th SEED AT BEST!
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
1:19 pm
STRETCH- The Hawks are right now aggressively trying to sign Joe Smith or did you not read Sekou’s blog?
So how do you figure the Hawks are going on the cheap? Because we didn’t trade for Shaq?
As a Hawks fan for 20 years now, how is winning 47 games and the first 7 game playoff series win in like forever just whoopdeedo?
You are right the Hawks are not the Lakers or the Celtics, but if you are just now finding that out then I think it is your perspective that needs help.
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
1:20 pm
BTW- Love the whoopdee do.
STRETCH
July 27th, 2009
1:33 pm
Wow, Joe F. Smith (F for freakin) is supposed to make the Hawks an instant contender again next season? All im saying is this team didnt get bigger, and thats on management.
Im a big Hawks fan, heck, i love all my Atlanta sports teams, but i do know after years and years of being frustrated by managment and having my hope’s shattered like so many others that this organization will continue to be close but never puff that cigar!
So take your pick…Boston, Cleveland or Orlando in the East?
terrell barron
July 27th, 2009
1:35 pm
So a coach admits that Deron and Chris lit it up in the pre-draft camps, yet we still found an excuse to pass on BOTH of em? How much sense does that make, knowing that we were in desperate need of a pg at the time? What’s done is done, but that statement makes Woody and Nique look even more clueless, if that’s possible. So what Coach was it Sekou? Larry Drew?
terrell barron
July 27th, 2009
1:38 pm
And one more thing, Joe Smith is not coming here for 100.00 and a Big Mac. This could be his last contract. He’s smarter than that. Quit being cheap ASG. If you want him, pay him.
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
1:43 pm
STRECTH- Who were they supposed to get? I just am not sure what you mean. Were they supposed to get Gortat?(talk about Koncack) Trade for an aging Shaq, with what?
Yes, I would have liked to see them have made a move for Bass(who is undersized btw). Otherwise you add a Joe Smith, another veteran big (Petrovic) and we are good to go, maybe even resign Flip on the cheap, then you keep a Siler or Hunter deep on the bench.
Clyde
July 27th, 2009
1:53 pm
After reading your post Sekou I might have to give up on the Hawks until they get a new coach and new owners. Solomon Jones gave it his all when he went out there on the court but just wasn’t enough for good ole Woody. I would have liked to see us give Zaza up because he gives us no effort on the defensive end but Woody is Woody. I wish Solo luck as he goes to Indiana. With a coach that believes in him I’m sure he might crack a starting lineup one day.
Clyde
July 27th, 2009
1:54 pm
Oh yea and that’s another draft pick that has left us due to Woody.
Hoops
July 27th, 2009
2:03 pm
terrell barron,
“Joe Smith is not coming here for 100.00 and a Big Mac.”
terrell, that’s funny!
STRETCH
July 27th, 2009
2:03 pm
And can somebody tell why they are wearing those Blue ball caps?
STRETCH
July 27th, 2009
2:08 pm
Sorry wrong blog on the 2:03! LOL! Daniel, i see your point, but that will raise my eyebrows if they could get Joe and a Petrovic, then things start to get interesting!
Ken Strickland
July 27th, 2009
2:30 pm
This is an example of the ignorance Woodson brings to this team, and the money and lack of production it deprives the team of having.
MINS PPG RPG APG STL BLK FG%
Joe Smith 19.6 6.5 4.8 .08 .33 .67 .496
ZPachulia 19.1 6.2 5.7 .7 .45 .34 .497
SJones 10.7 3.0 2.3 .2 .11 .54 .604
These stats show SJones could have provided OFF production the rivaled both ZPachulia or Joe Smith, if given the same mins and consistency, and definitely better DEF production in the area of shotblocking. That production would have come at a much cheaper price, but the team gets deprived of that potential production because of Woodson’s habit of retarding a young players progression and limiting his mins and opportunities because of personal feelings, as well as other issues.
We desperately need another Big. We’re currently persuing JSmith as a backup, and we’re definitely going to give him the mins and opportunity to produce. Based on statististics, JSmith won’t provide much more production than Solo could have, if given the same mins. Solo’s production would definitely come a whole lot cheaper, and he’ll get better with the added mins and opportunities, JSmith won’t.
To tell a young developing Big like Solo that no matter how dedicated he is at working this off season, and no matter how much he improves, he definitely won’t get a chance to show what he can do, shows we have a HC with no vision and no interest in developing young players.
BY NOW, SUND SHOULD BE AS TIRED OF CATERING TO WOODSON’S HANGUPS AND INSECURITIES AS FORMER GM BILLY KNIGHT WAS WHEN HE TRIED TO FIRE HIM.
Willie Coyote
July 27th, 2009
2:31 pm
Boy, I just never get tired of that “first” thing about 12 people do every blog. It’s the joke that just never gets old.
Anakin Joe
July 27th, 2009
2:47 pm
If Solo doubled his minutes, he would have quadrupled his fouls.
Sund must have told Solo’s agent that a bonafide big is on his way to the Hawks and that Solo will at best be playing for the 5th big man spot. Nothing else makes much sense. Because Solo decided he’d be better off competing for a 5th spot in Indy vs. a 4th spot with the Hawks. Woody didn’t rescind the QO, Sund did.
I’m still predicting a trade in August. Now more than ever.
A Tribe Called Quest
July 27th, 2009
2:48 pm
SUND SAID LAST YEAR THAT HE CAN GO INTO THE LUXURY TAX IF IT MEANS PROVIDING A WINNING PRODUCT. WE ARENT EVEN CLOSE TO THE LUX TAX. FREAKING SIGN SOME PLAYERS ALREADY
A Tribe Called Quest
July 27th, 2009
2:49 pm
AND WHERE DO WE GET MINUTES FOR A VET BIG LIKE JOE SMITH. HORF AND SMOOVE GET WAY TOO MANY MINUTES AT TIMES AND ZAZA WANTS HIS
THIS SUCKS
UGA
July 27th, 2009
2:51 pm
Trade just read:
The Oklahoma City Thunder have acquired veteran center Etan Thomas, it was announced today by Executive Vice President and General Manager Sam Presti. In addition to Thomas, Oklahoma City receives Minnesota’s 2010 second round draft pick and a conditional 2010 second round draft pick in exchange for guards Chucky Atkins and Damien Wilkins. “We are pleased to welcome Etan Thomas to the Thunder family,” said Presti. “Etan adds experience and depth to our front court as well as a defensive mentality and competitiveness that we value.”
A Tribe Called Quest
July 27th, 2009
2:51 pm
We could’ve just gotten Etan Thomas, who was traded for Damien.
A 31 year old 6″10 player.
This is pathetic
I have no confidence in this ownership or GM
I MUS WRITE
July 27th, 2009
2:54 pm
Dam Tribe you’re a little rough on yung smoove i see…LOL I meant this is his 6th year -im wondering when the light will come on or if it ever will……. I dont argue against the guy -because he will be here long term but you cant help but wonder what would be if he played within himself……….. folks have been sayn the same thing for years ….he sure is athletic or he sure can dunk- when are we gonna say Josh just made the All Star team ????
Darrel- Who’s minutes are Solo gonna take on our team -Horford,Zaza.Smoove…………………… cant fault woody on that one he was just stating the obvious…. Solo wont play unless sumone gets hurt- It will probably be the same in Indiana…….. ^’8 225lb powere forwards with no real skill dont get alot of luv ….Just say’n.
dam has Joe smith gone premadona on us -whats taking so long to get the deal done-maybe he’s thinking about San Antonio as well……
If sund needed help all he had to do was call Mus…… i woulda sent some women to that mans room butt naked with a contract glued to their hind parts …..WEll DAM
Ben
July 27th, 2009
2:57 pm
No big name, MLE and up, unrestricted free agent from another team wants to come to Atlanta. I never read that we just missed out on some of these guys. Luckily Eddy Curry and Dampier did not come to Atlanta!!! We will still be eating those big contracts. We need Teague to be a stud!!
Rich
July 27th, 2009
2:58 pm
Lets up grade our bench with Yoroslav Korolev and Cenk Akyol . Does Mario West give us anything but defense off the bench . How about a couple of guys that can do both
Chea
July 27th, 2009
3:00 pm
DANG SEKOU CHI-CITY IS TRYING TO END YOUR GIRL KERI HILSON’S CAREER!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjUaM9S_qWE
CRAZY!
I MUS WRITE
July 27th, 2009
3:00 pm
6′8 power forward….long night need coffee
I MUS WRITE
July 27th, 2009
3:00 pm
6′8 power forward….long night need coffee
I MUS WRITE
July 27th, 2009
3:01 pm
6′8 power forward….long night need coffee
Chea
July 27th, 2009
3:01 pm
BANANAS!
Like the Hawks would be if we signed Ike Diogu.
Najeh Davenpoop
July 27th, 2009
3:01 pm
Looks like Solo is a pretty classy guy. I’m still not losing too much sleep over losing him. I’ve criticized Woody in the past over not playing certain young guys (Acie Law in particular) but in Solo’s case, he had one fatal flaw — despite his shot blocking ability and decent mid-range shooting, he was never physical enough to be relied upon to guard the Dwight Howards of the league. It is my belief that this is what held him back here. Maybe in Indiana this weakness will not matter to those coaches so much.
“In other words, Crawford’s contract strikes again. I fully expect him to have an Al harrington-type of impact on this team. Some good. Some bad. Mostly forgettable.”
Al Harrington was a starter when he was here, and the offense ran through him on many occasions. As a bench player, Crawford is not going to have nearly the central role in the offense that Harrington had. Crawford would not be the first supposedly chemistry-killing, me-first player to make a positive impact on a good team in a limited role after having a prominent role on bad teams most of his career.
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
3:03 pm
Ken,
I’m with you on Woody not developing Solo enough, but there’s no way you can extrapolate Solo’s stats and minutes like that. Solo played in spurts against the other team’s bench. He’s athletic, but doesn’t bang and he doesn’t scrap for every loose ball and rebound. No way he gives us what Zaza did on increased minutes.
If Woody had spent more time developing Solo, he might be our 4th big man and he might have made it so we weren’t looking to pick up a free agent vet to plug the hole, but he wouldn’t supplant Zaza.
PF Othello Hunter (official thread) - Page 16 - BuckeyePlanet Ohio State Forums
July 27th, 2009
3:07 pm
[...] OBSERVATIONS ABOUT A FEW OTHER GUYS that stood out (for various reasons) during mini-camp: – Othello Hunter was more impressive than any other player in camp, after Teague. His range on his jumper has improved dramatically. But we all know that his chance at making a dent in the Hawks? roster and playing rotation depends on his ability rebound, defend and provide the hustle plays required of frontcourt journeymen in the NBA. The improved shot is an added bonus. I?d have him locked up on a two-year deal right now. If he keeps improving, someone is going to get a steal. Vacation visions | Hawks Blog [...]
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
3:07 pm
Najeh,
Don’t bother reasoning with Anakin Joe on that. He’s trying to bash Crawford and say we’ll be trading him for a big man because he wants to have a fallback plan to say “I told you so” when Woody runs the team into the ground again.
Just askin'
July 27th, 2009
3:17 pm
Why the hell is everyone freaking out about the Hawks not signing a big man who’d be the 10th man? We got the same frontcourt as last year assuming that Williams comes back. All we’re talking about is someone to replace Solo.
This is the Hawks last year:
PG: Bibby, Law IV
SG: Johnson, Murray
SF: Williams, Evans
PF: Smith, Jones
C: Horford, Pachulia
Here’s what we looking at now:
PG: Bibby, Teague
SG: Johnson, Crawford
SF: Williams, Evans
PF: Smith, [Someone to take Jones's 5 minutes a night]
C: Horford, Pachulia
Considering that they already won 47 games, just got a better 6th man in Craw and a better backup PG in Teague, the team is already better than last year’s and 9 deep. Most teams don’t go deeper than that.
So why are people whining over the Hawks taking their time to sign someone who’d only get 8 minutes a night anyway? A training camp guy could plug that hole and they’d still be a better team than last year’s.
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
3:17 pm
IMUS- the 2:54 post is hilarious, we need you to get Sund’s number.
Najeh Davenpoop
July 27th, 2009
3:19 pm
Looks like a possible double whammy for Ariose — not only might Flip Murray leave here, but he could be going to Philly to steal minutes from the pride of South Gwinnett, Lou Williams.
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
3:20 pm
Just Askin’ : your points are very valid, but front court depth that provides real minutes(Joe Smith would be getting more than 8 mins) gives our team some flexibility with providing more bench scoring which we didn’t have last year, outside of Flip. Yes, Crawford is an upgrade from Flip, but outside of Za we don’t have any front court players that can rebound and defend at the rim. This was our biggest weakness last year, and it needs to be addressed.
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
3:23 pm
that was poorly written, but I think you get my drift. A real good team has a couple of developmental players like Solo, Siler, Morris, etc. as their 13,14th players not their 9th and 10th. I want two veteran bigs and another back up pg. Our team is young enough and has enough developing players in the starting line up, we don’t need a bench full of them as well.
Daniel
July 27th, 2009
3:25 pm
niremental if Solo ever develops into someones quality 4th big man, I will eat my hat.
Ariose
July 27th, 2009
3:26 pm
I.Mus, I seel you dawg!! Just say no to 6′8 Power Fowards lol!!
Nire, GOODLUCK!!!!I’m assuming it’s the bar right?
Chea, LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!! I can’t beleive i’ve never ran across that guy’s videos on youtube b4!!!!
Anakin Joe
July 27th, 2009
3:27 pm
nire, why would I need a fallback plan if Woody wins 45+ games? Some of you act like before Woody arrived, we were the freakin Auerbach Celtics or something. And I am quite certain that my posts have absolutely no impact on Woody’s job security.
But I truly do not understand how anyone could let Sund off the hook if his year of evaluation results in Crawford and scrub big man joining the roster. And with every passing day, we move further and further away from landing a quality big in free agency. I’d love it if Joe Smith comes on board but something (Marvin or another suitor) is holding up progress.
Najeh, true, but I expect Crawfrod to get close to 30 minutes a game off the bench and will be very prominent in our offense. But I still say that adding Crawford is like Frank Wren trading for a starting pitcher this afternoon. While it is true that a team could ALWAYS upgrade their starting pitching and expect some benefits, there are other “pot holes” that need to be fixed first. And if adding a $10M pitcher keeps us from adding a significant bat (as opposed to a Norton-rehab project), then I think that the opportunity cost may out-weigh the benefit of that starting pitcher.
At this point, we will likely have to leave open a roster spot or two and some salary flexibility and hope that we can sign someone like Kurt Thomas, Etan Thomas or Tony Battie when they are cut loose in late February.
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
3:41 pm
Anakin,
How on earth do you not see how much of a problem it was for us to not have ANY offensive weapons that scared teams last year besides JJ? That WAS one of our biggest issues. Teams would throw two or three guys at him EVERY TIME HE TOUCHED THE BALL because there was no one on the team to keep them honest.
I was right with you thinking that Crawford wasn’t a good move when it first happened. But then I thought back to how many times I lamented our over-reliance on JJ on offense and the fact that Woody felt he had to play JJ 41 minutes every night. Crawford helps solve both of those issues.
Oh, I think we would have done ok without Crawford except for the fact that our coach is Mike Woodson, who is allergic to feeding the ball to the post. But I get it. Woody’s your boy, Sund isn’t. So you won’t even recognize the benefits of a trade that helps plug our single biggest issue on the offensive end, because then you’ll have to admit that such trades wouldn’t be necessary if Woody would feed the ball to the post more.
Crawford gives us a second player that other teams will have to cover and he’ll also allow us to cut JJ’s minutes, which will reap huge benefits late in the season and in the playoffs. And we got him for two of our spare parts. Add drafting Teague to that, and I’d say that’s a pretty damned strong roster upgrade going into the season.
niremetal
July 27th, 2009
3:43 pm
Ariose,
Thanks man – yeah, that’s the one. Time for me to be clutch like Horry…
Mike is back
July 27th, 2009
3:53 pm
Just askin, that’s an improvement over last year Eastern Conference teams…not over Eastern Conference teams for the upcoming season. That’s the problem.
5 Questions: Bret LaGree on Solomon Jones
July 27th, 2009
4:01 pm
[...] and (E), Solomon is happy to be in Indiana, where he hopes he has a better opportunity to earn a spot in the rotation than he would have had [...]
Anakin Joe
July 27th, 2009
4:02 pm
nire, because I saw our offensive problems being more related to the injuries of Joe, Marvin and Al. We were an “ensemble cast” last season… 6 players averaged in double figures. Half of the cast were banged up, I think that affected our offense more than anything else. And maybe I just tend to focus on things differently, because to this day, when I think of the Cavs series, I envision them getting one offensive rebound after another. I fully expect to score fewer points in the playoffs, I don’t expect that one team will play “monkey in the middle” with our deplted and out-sized front-court. Again, I’m not saying the offense couldn’t use a fuel-injector, but it would have been lower on my priority list. And I certainly would not have addressed that issue with another jump-shooter. I would have looked under many a rock for someone capable of getting in the lane. I think I saw that 80% of Crawford’s FGAs were jumpers. And his FG% suggests that he is more cold than hot. I would have rather acquired a slasher than a shooter.
Chea
July 27th, 2009
4:06 pm
I’m telling you Ariose, there is not one Chicity video I’ve seen yet that’s been remotely boring. The man is too hilarious.