The breakdown
The Hawks finally scratched their seven year itch and moved on 2002 draft pick David Andersen ... by moving him to Houston for cash, considerations and a future second-round draft pick.
HAWKSVILLE - Things are moving so quickly around here these days, you might mistake this for a regular NBA offseason.
It’s been a long time coming for the Hawks. But for the first time in years, certainly in my years here, things are moving at a fast and furious pace that I think we can all appreciate.
Trades. Free agent signings (and re-signings). It’s all going down before mid-August, which is a welcome change to the Hawks’ recent past, when summer transactions always seemed to stretch into fall.
But in the interest of our collective sanity, can we please cease and desist the needless attacks on Josh Childress (here, on Twitter and everywhere else)?
He’s moved on for another season – back to Greece if you haven’t heard. We can joust about him next summer, when it might actually mean something.
In closing, however, both sides did the right things. Childress couldn’t in good faith turn his back on the kind of money he’ll make with Olympiakos this coming season for a sub-mid-level deal in either Milwaukee or Charlotte, cities that haven’t sniffed the playoffs lately (ever in Charlotte’s case). The Hawks did the right thing in not losing an asset like Childress for a player (be it Kurt Thomas in Milwaukee or Raja Bell in Charlotte) that doesn’t offer much value beyond an expiring contract. They were right to demand more in exchange for a player in his prime (Childress is just 26), be it a future draft pick or cash or something else. The Hawks remain the (NBA) team with leverage where Childress is concerned, and they’d be wise to hold on to that leverage as long as possible.
Moving on, there was this afternoon’s mild surprise that the Hawks traded David Andersen’s rights to Houston for a future second-round pick, cash and future considerations. That could be counted that as yet another shrewd and calculated move by a Hawks team that has made many this summer, so long as Andersen doesn’t turn out to be the second coming of Luis Scola.
Andersen’s 29 and a longtime pro of consequence in Europe. He’s hardly prepared to surrender his ability to earn more money in Europe for a situation in the NBA that won’t allow him to recoup his losses in a fit to his liking. With the Hawks he would have been stuck behind Zaza Pachulia in the rotation, his only real opening for playing time coming if someone else suffered a serious injury (I don’t know about you, but that doesn’t sound like an ideal set up to me).
In return, the Hawks snagged not only a future second-round draft pick to replace Andersen, they also collect cash believed to be in the amount of $2 million, which comes in handy as this summer goes on (and they continue to scour the free agent landscape for big man help). After years of sitting on their assets it’s time the Hawks started cashing in a few of these chips (Cenk “Blame it on the a-a-a-a-a-a” Akyol is the next international talent the Hawks must evaluate, to see if and when he might be ready to help the cause).
This is a win for Andersen as well. He should have a clear path to playing time in Houston, provided the Rockets work out a deal to free him from his contract with FC Barcelona. With Yao Ming’s injury situation and the departure of Ron Artest, the Rockets will have to reinvent themselves on the fly (if any coach is capable of coming up with something, Rick Adelman is the man to do it).
It’s just nice to see the Hawks immersed in routine summer business for a change, stuff that doesn’t involve them squandering assets the way they did when guys like Antoine Walker, Al Harrington and Tony Delk moved on without the Hawks getting much of anything in return.
Think about it, had someone told you this time a year ago that the Hawks could get a player of Jamal Crawford’s caliber for Acie Law IV and Speedy Claxton you’d have jumped on that without hesitation.
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354 comments Add your comment
vava74
July 15th, 2009
6:26 pm
Ben Wallace is washed up and Tim Thomas has always been a washed up looser. Why would be add a short and rapidly aging Center (6′9”) who depended on his physical play or a tall perimeter shooter who does not defend, does not work hard and was never involved in anything resembling successful basketball (apart of a few dozen games with PHO)???
Drew Gooden is known to be an extremely dumb player who thinks he is better than he is (kind of a J-Smoove type of character).
Furthermore, he definitively does not want to come to ATL to be a bench player. He will look for a starting job on a lesser team or a bench player on a contender or in a team with a visible star and media exposure (Miami, for instance).
Dan23
July 15th, 2009
6:30 pm
I really like the Ben Wallace idea. He would bring the toughness and experience we could really use on our front line. Also, it seems that everyone agrees that we need some bigs and I understand that Sund wants to get the Williams thing done but unless I missed it, I have really not seen exactly who they are targeting. Does anybody know?
rainman34
July 15th, 2009
6:58 pm
Im sure this has been answered but why did the hawks not have a summer league team. Many guys have been discovered in summer leagues and we could have seen cenk and the latest second rounder play some with teague.
Anakin Joe
July 15th, 2009
7:06 pm
rainman34, Hawks only have 1-2 young guys to evaluate and it wasn’t worth the expense to send 10 guys to LV for a week. I understand that Teague will play with another team at a future summer league. Next week, Hawks hold a mini-camp and will invite some undrafted FAs to workout with Teague.
Here’s the article on Law, sorry if it was already posted.
http://www.mercurynews.com/sportsheadlines/ci_12839636?nclick_check=1
niremetal
July 15th, 2009
7:21 pm
Wink,
It’s hilarious that you minimize the height of every Hawks player…and suggest we should have signed two guys (Millsap and Bass) who are undersized power forwards.
niremetal
July 15th, 2009
7:23 pm
Ben Wallace will not be here. He won’t want to come here (home for him has always been the Great Lakes) and we shouldn’t want to bring in a guy who has looked like he doesn’t give a rat’s behind for the past 2-3 years.
O'Brien
July 15th, 2009
7:24 pm
vava74,
Considering our budget/PT available, who would you like for the Hawks to sign?
In my opinion, we should not get our expectations too high for the next big man the Hawks (might) sign. All we want is 10-15 minutes of banging/rebound/hustle/post defense/energy.
kirkinga
July 15th, 2009
7:28 pm
Thanks Sekou, you are as gracious as ever.
I guess no one has an answer as to why the Hawks don’t have more minutes available for another big that can help them?
So is Wallace or Gooden going to be good with just playing 8-10 minutes ppg?
I just can’t shake this feeling that the 8-10 minute limitation only applied to Anderson.
In fact, if the Hawks should acquire another quality big man, I would wager that he will play more minutes. Coach Woodson would be negligent if he only used that player 8-10 game.
Anyone for frontline improvement via Randolph Morris and organic growth? Anyone?
Hello?
Go Hawks!!
Kappy
July 15th, 2009
7:30 pm
Everyone settle down on Andersen. If anything, this excites me to know Sund has to have another big man in mind to help. If not, why do this? Why now?
We’ll be fine everyone.
Rise Up!
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
7:35 pm
AJ, yeah. Hope Acie gets it together.
Blast
July 15th, 2009
7:37 pm
It ain’t the playoffs yet, is it? So how come Houston fans are talking smack on our blog. It’s only a trade in the off season, people! Hawks must be coming up in the world.
Hope Acie Law makes out well. If he doesn’t have confidence, then he can’t play pro ball.
Fire RandMo!
Hawks still need Flip.
And a big or two. I know Sund knows that.
Go Hawks, Go!
Kappy
July 15th, 2009
7:38 pm
kirkinga- I’m all for organic growth. There’s no way you could be a Hawks fan the last decade and not appreciate some player development. But what did you ever see out of Randolph that made you believe he’s worth developing. I’m not into attacking players usually, but I just never saw the guy give a damn. Every time he came in, it looked like he was spending too much time thinking about the play, as opposed to just throwing his body around and being active. At least Solo comes in and realizes that he has to play hard. I want another big man that wants to be active and is OK playing behind Al and Zaza for 5 or 10 minutes a night.
Frankly, the fact that we’re all contemplating the 3rd center on this team is a victory in and of itself. Times certainly have changed around here, and I love it.
Blast
July 15th, 2009
7:47 pm
As for this minutes thing for extra bigs. I can’t imagine anybody believe that. If they watched all the season games and saw the playoffs, they must remember Horford limping to the bench and Zaza having to play extended minutes and the only other bigs off the bench were Solo and RandMo? U trying to win a playoff series with Solo and RandMo? How come Boston has minutes for all the big men they have? Wave after wave of big men they consistently threw at the Hawks? Isn’t everybody here complaining that out starters play heavy minutes? They play heavy minutes because the guys that sub for them are not very good. Hawks need to cut all the dead weight players and invest their money and minutes on players that will actually contribute on the court, so your starters do not get worn down during the long seasons. Hell yeah, their are minutes to go around!
O'Brien
July 15th, 2009
8:02 pm
There are 96 minutes to share between PF and center. Looking at a potential minutes breakdown:
Josh – 32 minutes
Al – 30 minutes
ZaZa – 20 minutes
backup PF – 14 minutes.
I hope we get another big man, and I hope Woody knows how to handle the minutes of his bench players. (And our bigs minutes should depend on matchups etc.). Obviously, with foul trouble and potential injuries, more minutes can be found for another big.
cp
July 15th, 2009
8:15 pm
I have never seen so much love for a second round pick who did not even start on his last team. If you have NBA TV they are showing the summer league games now. Law looks timid and scared out there. He might be on his way to becoming a journeyman if he doesn’t get his head into it.
Steve
July 15th, 2009
8:21 pm
Ben Wallace – reports are saying he may retire. Playing basically on 1 leg.
Drew Gooden, Chris Wilcox, Tim Thomas – are any of those guys better than Solomon and Morris? Myabe so, but I don’t know.
Jazz are trying to dump Boozer – Give’em Mo’ Evans, and a 1st pick next year, re-sign Flip and your set. If Marvin signs that is.
Steve
July 15th, 2009
8:26 pm
P.S. For the cap implications of Boozer’s contract, maybe the Jazz could throw in some cash.
As far as playing time, Booz’ needs less minutes – oft injured. Would really help the front court.
RaJaH
July 15th, 2009
8:29 pm
Another poster questioned why the league would deny us the injury exception after Jason Collier’s death yet approve Houston for Yao’s injury. Can anyone explain this?
Sautee
July 15th, 2009
8:33 pm
Ariose,
As far as Flip vs. Bibby I’ll say this. Flip gave a LOT more bang for the buck last year, but his career AST/TO ratio is like 2.3 / 1.63. Terrible.
By the way Bibby was 8th in the league at AST /TO ratio ahead of Nash, Billups and Parker.
Flip never should have gotten minutes at point guard. It robs him of his natural aggressiveness on offense.
AND, as I posted on Bradley’s blog last week:
It’s an underappreciated fact that when we got Bibby our turnovers went down by over 2 per game. And in a close game 2 turnovers can easily be the difference. That CERTAINLY wouldn’t have happened with Flip as PG.
I liked Flip as our “microwave”, but with Crawford here, I just don’t see it happening.
Hoops
July 15th, 2009
8:36 pm
When we sign Marvin and Teague, which will eventually happen, we will have 10 players under contract. West has a QO for 1M. If he accepts, then that’s 11 players for roughly 63M.
So, we have ~6M to sign 2 players (13 players is the league minumin.) and stay under the L. tax. I think these two players are very important to the success of the 2009-10 Hawks!
What players do we go after? Josh is the only PF that we have if we start Horford at C. Most of the time, Horford moves to PF when Josh goes to the bench and Zaza plays C. We have to have another quality player in case Josh or Horford are injured or in foul trouble. I say we get the best player at either position. If the new player is strickly a PF, then Horford would stay at C if Josh goes out. If he is a C, then Horford backs up at PF.
We have 6M. Go after the best BIG available. Who is that? Big Baby, Wilcox, Wallace, Hollins?
We can get Big Baby or Wilcox for 5M. If we can’t sign them after we try, then get Wallace or Hollins for less money. Then sign Solo for 1M right?
NO, NO, NO! GO FOR IT!!! Why wait??? LEE or Odum can be had! The Knicks or the Lakers don’t want to pay for either player! See what you can get them for. I know we will have to make a trade. We will not pass the Cavs, Celtics, or Magic if WE DON’T MAKE A MOVE THAT COUNTS!!! Can you imagine the Hawks with Lee in the line up? A 3 team trade can make it happen!!!
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
8:41 pm
http://www.peachtreehoops.com/2009/7/15/950470/a-brief-reprieve-on-mike-woodsons
Hmmm….
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
8:47 pm
Sautee: Kobe, Fisher, Shannon, Farmar, Vujacic
That’s five guards for two positons. So how did Phil Jackson give them All regular minutes? Boston Rotates at least five Front-Court players when healthy between the PF/C positons.
Bibby, Joe, Flip, Crawford, Teauge
So you’re saying it’s not possible to give these guys regular minutes, or are you saying that b/c we have woodson as our HC, it just won’t happen?
bigdave
July 15th, 2009
8:57 pm
Samuel,
id have to agree… we would be making a lil’ noise with the acquisition of one Lamar Odom… only if it were possible…
Nire,
no fan of the move but the closest NBA home to Ben Wallace “Home” is the Hawks…
niremetal
July 15th, 2009
9:05 pm
Further proof that the AJC should just turn the whole damned works over to Sekou. Here’s the headline for the story on Antoine Walker’s gambling difficulties as of 9pm:
Ex-Hawk Antoine Walker has $822,500 gambling debut
Um…debut? Could, perhaps, you mean DEBT? Because an $822,500 gambling debut would mean something quite different. I’d like to have a debut like that…
bigdave
July 15th, 2009
9:08 pm
the boy game is something ignorant or as i call it (ig-nant) its gonna be fuuuun to watch… ill take him over Flip any day…
Ariose this one for you… you can appreciate good quality youtube… i owe you one for that Smitty throwback…
he does Uncle Ray something dirty at 3:05
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyEuysbhirQ
Drewscrilla
July 15th, 2009
9:18 pm
I just hope the Hawks cotinue to improve and make a run at the finals sooner or later
niremetal
July 15th, 2009
9:28 pm
bigdave,
Wallace hasn’t lived in the South since he graduated high school, and his home and family are up in Ohio. If he wasn’t willing to play hard for the team that was both closest to his home and the team with the best NBA record, I don’t see why he’d play hard further from home for a less-hyped team.
Wabe
July 15th, 2009
9:32 pm
I’d rather get Powe over Big Baby.
I don’t think Big Baby would really fit for the Hawks. We need a bruiser, someone who can get in the paint and bang bodies. Honestly, I’m more accustomed to seeing Big Baby step 10-15 FT away from the basket and look for the jumper…
I don’t think Odom would ever consider moving from the world champion Lakers to a team that’s still a ways back when it comes to championships…
And I just don’t see the Hawks being the team that’s capable of snagging the best FA still available on the market…
Therefore, I think you guys should start spitting out some more names – DIFFERENT NAMES – AIM A BIT LOWER. Wish I were wrong, but I just don’t see Sund making that kind of splash…
Wabe
July 15th, 2009
9:35 pm
And Ariose, I’m 100% w/you on Flip bro.
As you so wisely put it in one of your earlier posts,
“Resign Flip dammit!”
bigdave
July 15th, 2009
9:42 pm
Niremental…
personally i dont know Ben Wallace, but obviously you do since you say “home for him has always been the Great Lakes…”; yea, the same place he left…for a worse team…for the “bread”. nor do i know who he wants to play or as you say, “play hard” for. i only commented to say that he was born and raised in the deep south, college in VA… where his family lives (or has moved to) none of my concern… i have no idea as to where he would or wouldnt make his final NBA home.. but hey, you’re the insider… to me, he doesnt have it anymore.. looks as if he lost a little weight/muscle too…
D From H-Town
July 15th, 2009
9:46 pm
I’m a Houston resident and Rox fan.
We’re obviously happy to get Andersen. In my opinion he fits, in some ways, the mold of a Brad Miller from the Adelman Kings, Good Passer, Shooter etc. Though Miller is still more physical and a better rebounder than it appears Andersen will be. But you guys certainly made out well for yourselves. Most importantly, you get a do-over on a draft pick (possibly protected) and $2M cash in this economy and falling cap limits.
I also wanted to say I really liked reading your comments. You guys do a good job asking good questions and interacting with each other.
You also did a good job not paying too much attention to that hater from Houston. I was happy to see you guys take Boston to 7 games a couple seasons ago and was glad to see you guys get to the 2nd round this past season. Your bigs really are something to see.
I don’t know how you guys feel about Bibby but I thought that was a great move to help you guys get some veteran leadership from a seasoned pro like Bibby. He’s never been much of a defender but he knows how to run a team. I was secretly hoping the Rockets might be able to get him because of his experience running an Adelman offense but that’s not how it went down.
Sautee
July 15th, 2009
9:48 pm
Ariose,
Answered it yourself. Woody is no Phil Jackson.
If Flip WERE to end up here, then we’d have a bunch of folks complaining about Teague’s minutes.
Skywalker
July 15th, 2009
9:49 pm
Pray tell . . . . . what does future considerations mean? Any guess on this one?
ATMAN
July 15th, 2009
9:50 pm
Hoops, well said. For the approx. 6 mil left to reach the luxury tax, I’d be OK with picking up Wilcox or Big Baby or Lee and in addition sign Siler (he’s playing solid in Summer League). We need size, rebounding, and defense in the middle.
Sautee
July 15th, 2009
9:52 pm
D From H-Town,
Thanks for showing up and being polite. You’re welcome back anytime.
Best of luck this year, except for two games. heh heh.
The Truth
July 15th, 2009
9:58 pm
In his defense, Randolph Morris has been the whipping boy too long without properly framing the situation appropriately. In all fairness, Morris epitomizes the ultimate “3 second” man perhaps through no fault of his own. The way in which he was acquired spelled his demised destiny. His resume suggested he never got honor status out of college into the NBA even though he came from an esteem basketball culture as Kentucky.
Morris was technically a free agent after putting his name in for the 2005 NBA Draft and not being drafted. He returned to the Wildcats after sitting out an NCAA-mandated 14-game suspension. A provision in the NBA’s collective bargaining agreement prevented Morris from re-entering the NBA draft and he was given free agent status throughout the 2006-07 seasons. He was acquired by the Knicks as a FA out of college making only 800K/per year and got lost in the rotation against better centers. Since the knock on Morris game was his lack of intensity and poor defense, these unfavorable traits hurt him as he was trying to break into the rotation especially with an uncelebrated past. So he comes to the Hawks seeking a fresh start but still carried the old baggage. Whatever you think about Morris, his faults perhaps can be corrected but only with the right coach whom he does not have. I would say that Woody may be the worst thing that could have happened to Morris trying to jump-start his career. As the 4th and last option, he rarely saw garbage time. If you are perceived to be unworthy even of garbage time, how can any player be motivated to play; especially in Morris case, who is already a genetically uninspired player? It seems that there is no action plans to address the Morris motivation mystery. Woody seems to be content to let him rot on the bench and hope he goes away. The problem with this strategy is when the injury bug hits; Woody tends to just throw him in expecting a miracle and subliminally blame him for any bad outcome.
I don’t expect this year to be any different than last. In fact this year maybe even worst for Morris since another “Big” add-on may make him the 5th option. Then he really will be the ultimate whipping boy.
O'Brien
July 15th, 2009
10:02 pm
Hoops,
With the ~$6 mil we have left, I would sign Drew Gooden, Jamal Magloire or Adonal Foyle, and Solomon Jones. That way, we have a good rotation, and a lot of fouls. Our front court is way too soft (except for ZaZa sometimes), so I hope we come with a nasty attitude, especially no dunks/layups. How many dunks/layups did we give up last year? Foul them clean and hard, and send them to the line.
Samuel
July 15th, 2009
10:22 pm
Bigdave,
I just hope our management doesn’t have the attitude that some around here have. You know that “we have no chance” so don’t even bother to try. According to reports he is negotiating with Dallas and Miami and they can offer him only 5.8 million. They are definately no closer to winning a ring than us and ATL is just as desirable a city as those two.
Again, I like Marvin Williams but he’s no Lamar Odom. But hey, what do I know.
Steve
July 15th, 2009
10:39 pm
Rasho Nesterovic is a 7-0 ft. 255 Free Agent from the Pacers – think he played with some good Spurs squads before that – maybe he should be in the mix also?
bigdave
July 15th, 2009
10:40 pm
Samuel…
agreed… i read the same thing, i think Portland is in the mix as well… he’s such a versatile player and is a team first guy. will do whatever is asked of him on the floor. defends, rebounds, scores in a variety of ways. im guilty of seeing great potential in Marvin game however. i dont know… if the Lakers lose him, i dont see a repeat… i tell you what, landing Odom would be a beast of a move… however, i am a realist. one of those that feel it has no chance of happening… dont know what it will take but i hope we at least give him a holla…
bigdave
July 15th, 2009
10:42 pm
*and is= and a
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:42 pm
Sautee, I hear ya lol. But if it’s late August and Flip doesn’t have a home. Sund would be foolish not to snatch him up. It’s always good to have insurance for injuries etc. Remeber the games Joe missed? Or how horrible Bibby was when he was sick? Maybe it was really Acie that had the problem and not Woodson. Maybe Teauge will be assertive and TAKE his minutes from the vets with his aggressive play. I think keeping flip gives us “contender-type” depth, but I understand and agree with your concerns.
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:46 pm
Bigdave, Yes Craword is filthy with his, but he’s certainly not “more explosive” then flip like some ppl seem to be saying.
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:46 pm
He’s just like Joe, a glorified and adequately hyped jump shooter. But Got to youtube and search for Jamal Crawfords Dunks. You’ll ONLY find one. ONE out of all his highlight on the internet.
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:50 pm
Guys i’m trying to break a long post into smaller ones so AJC will accept it…..
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:52 pm
That confirms my concerns about him. Like Joe and Bibby, when he gets cold from the perimeter, it can get ugly. Pretty much everyone who’s familiar with his game has called him streaky.
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:53 pm
On the flipside (pun-intended), if you search Flip on youtube, you get tons of facials and Gangster-thug like abuse to the rim and his helpless, unsuspecting victims. Which tells me (and you all know this) flip may miss a few jump shots, but he never really goes through “scoring-droughts” because of his ability to attack the rim and get to the foul-line. He’s just a good piece for us to have on our team. And he fit in great with the core; he helped minimized our scoring droughts which plagued us when Childress(no jump shot) was on the squad.
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:53 pm
I actually don’t believe that making him a backup PG hinders his game. A lot of times when you pit him at the SG he gets a bit out of control, but when you put him at point he becomes more responsible and kind-of reels his aggressiveness in a bit and makes better decisions. I think that had a lot to do with his game growing and him maturing as a player (in DET that wouldn’t have been the case).
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:53 pm
Believe it or not, Woodson aided in Flips growth as well. He got into it a few time with flip because of his bad decision making at PG, but at the same time he afforded Flip with the playing time to learn from his mistakes and get better as a result of that because Flip is a Vet.
Ariose
July 15th, 2009
10:54 pm
One can only hope Woody does the same for Teauge.