Stand up Hawks!
It's time for the Hawks to stand up, stand together and show the world that they belong.
WITNESSVILLE - Now is not the time Hawks.
And the postseason is certainly not the appropriate place to come apart at the seams.
The Cleveland Cavaliers don’t need the assist.
So to hear the Hawks talk of not “sharing the ball” and needing to “attack from all over” screams of a team in need of reconstitution (and if you don’t like what you hear coming from the Hawks’ locker room since their Game 1 loss to King James and his crew that’s a good thing, because you shouldn’t).
It’s not something that can be done by a coach or general manager intervening. It’s also not something that can be fixed with one of those trendy players’ only team meetings or any of the other conventional tools used by most NBA teams.
This is a calculated regeneration of a team that can only come from individual catharsis, and the Hawks need it to happen 15 times in 15 different rooms at the tony Ritz-Carlton at Tower Center (where NBA soul searching goes on regularly in this city) before Game 2 of this Eastern Conference semifinal tonight at the Q (the arena better known as King James’ Camelot).
As meticulous AJC wordsmith Mark Bradley points out, the choice to either fight back or get smashed, belongs to the Hawks.
Each loss the Hawks have suffered this postseason has been uglier than the one before it. The average margin of defeat (24.2 points) is preposterous at best, and an affront to the game at it’s core.
No playoff team capable of winning a seven-game series, as the Hawks have already done, should be on the receiving end of tail-whippings of 15, 29, 26 and 27 points, respectively. Those lopsided efforts speak to a team that, despite nearly eight months in the fox hole together, still does not trust each other completely, a team that can’t muster the collective energy and focus to at least make a loss respectable as opposed to making themselves a spectacle.
The first thing you hear in the Hawks’ locker room after a bad loss is, “We didn’t play together. We didn’t help each other out. We’ve got to blah, blah, blah.”
If you think I’m making this stuff up, here’s a sampling (edited ever so slightly to omit the verbal offender’s specific identity) of what’s come out of the mouths of your Hawks after playoff losses the past few weeks:
“We just have to play with a sense of urgency like we did in Game 1. We have to get after them defensively. And as long as we share the ball offensively, I think everything else on the floor clicks.”
“We’re up against it now. And we’ve got look at ourselves in the mirror and realize that we can’t get out of this mess without doing it together.”
“We’ve just got to pick up our intensity. We’ve got to do a lot of things. But it all stems from our effort. We have to play hard as a unit. That’s the key for us. And we have to bring that [today]. Because our backs are against the wall now, really against the wall. We’re going to see what this team is made of.”
“We came out and talked about hitting them first and not letting things get out of hand early like they did in Game 2. But we let them hit us first again.”
“We lost our composure, no doubt. Things weren’t going our way, calls weren’t going our way and we lost it. We let them build that big lead and it got to us. We were never in sync defensively and we just didn’t handle ourselves well.”
“In the second half we just didn’t get into any offensive sets. We were careless with the ball. We had too many turnovers. Any time we have 17 turnovers it’s never a good night for us.”
“It was very disappointing, knowing that we’ve come this far. Looking back on the first series that we had (with Miami), that was very tough, and I thought we would come into this game a little more enthused and come ready to play. I thought we had a pretty good first half, but the second half wasn’t so great.”
It never fails.
Whenever things go sideways for the Hawks they all start speaking French (”We, We”). For once, it would be nice to hear someone talk about what “I could have done” or that “I didn’t give my team” what it needed?
Whatever the Hawks do, they'll have to do it without Marvin Williams and Al Horford at full strength.
On paper, there’s no way the Hawks should do anything more than annoy the Cavaliers for a few games. Al Horford’s sprained right ankle won’t allow him to play at full strength during these playoffs.
Marvin Williams has a wrist injury that followed his late-season back injury, shredding what was easily his best (and breakout) season as a pro.
So no one is expecting these Hawks to shock the world.
But these Hawks have defied paper logic since training camp, including making a return trip to the playoffs whenever publication on the planet predicted they would not.
That they’ve made it this far, even with all the setbacks, is a testament to the resolve of this stubborn but flawed bunch.
Just how stubborn they are and just how flawed they are will come into better focus as this series continues, be it three more games or more.
Whatever happens, the time has come for these Hawks to dispense with all the locker room rhetoric and simply play the game like a team that belongs. Play it for 48 minutes, with the required fire in the belly and without any remorse.
Anything else is an injustice to those who have watched this team evolve from the 13-69 train wreck of a four years ago into the promising bunch that has defied all the odds the last year.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
645 comments Add your comment
bagong_sali
May 7th, 2009
3:02 am
Hope the hawks would read this and work together. It’s frustrating that they always points to the same reason whenever they lose a game but does nothing about it, it’s like they never learn. This team can pretty much match up with any team if they come an work together. They need to realize that they don’t have a great player on their team (like DWade, Kobe or LeBron) so the only way they can match up well is by playing together. Hopefully they can watch some games of the Pistons during their 2004 Championship and see for themselve how good players playing together can overcome a team with a player like Lebron
Ed
May 7th, 2009
3:15 am
Hellava blog…you’re dead on!
Ariose
May 7th, 2009
4:15 am
Like I said, If Marvin doesn’t get into a groove we’re not going far in this series’. I hate to play the pessimist but that guy holds the key to this series’. WE NEED YOU MARVIN!!!!!!! Like i’ve said before, I’ve had a wrist injury before. It really is devestating at times, I couldn’t even pick up a pencil, let alone dribble a basketball. I applaud Marvin for his effort, but it might be better if he just shut it down. All it takes is one Screen-Sandwich from the Cavs and Marvin will be clutching that wrist and screming in agaony. Beleive me I know.
Oh and if Woody decides ever to take the shcakles off Acie during this series’, watch out. He has the potential to geve the Cavs all they can handle.
Maybe Horford and Marvin should take pain-killing shots like D-Wade did in the confrence finals back in 2007. Horford may be in trouble, there is nothing structrally worng with Marvin’s writ right now. It’s just that agonizing pain after spraining it doesn’t go away easily. If he could somehow numb the feeling in his wrist for the remainder of the playoffs, we might be in business guys.
Ariose
May 7th, 2009
4:17 am
Man all those errors….That’s when you know it’s time to call it a night lol.
smartguy
May 7th, 2009
4:30 am
FIRE WOODY
TRADE NO SHOW JOE
David Smith
May 7th, 2009
5:27 am
I agree 100% with you Sekuo. This team has infuriated and excited me with their inconsistent play the last four years (infuriated is a less vulgar term than some other words that came to mind). I could care less who is on the floor than what kind of effort they are putting out and this team is clearly not giving their all. We need someone to step up an be a leader (since joe doesn’t want the job) and set an example for this young franchise of players who are embarrising us as a city right now with their lackluster play. Injuries are not an excuse because this is the playoffs and Cleveland won’t slack off to let us win a game in this series without a fight. I’m hoping to see the same passion that made us revalent in the playoffs last year agaist Boston (Let’s hope our guys pack a lunch). GO HAWKS!!!
NCBravesFan
May 7th, 2009
5:38 am
Sekou – brilliant! I’ve been trying to get the words out of my mouth that describe exactly what I’ve been seeing the last 8 games with these guys and you’ve hit the nail perfectly.
From this casual fan’s perspective it’s not THAT they lose, it’s HOW they lose that frustrates everyone most of all.
doc
May 7th, 2009
7:16 am
yes sekou, i pointed that out last week that a leader self appointed or coach appointed needs to say i am letting the team down and not getting the job done. it hasnt happened ever. the effort issue never goes on his own shoulders verbally followed by action. way too passive and not a leader. when you go to war the leader nedes to be at the front taking the risk. say what you want d wade does it, lebron does it, duncan does it and kobe occasionally does it. shaq almost always did it. that is what it is going to take, a guy who succeeds because he isnt afraid of failing and does it on his own if necessary to show others it is about each one of them playing 100% on both ends of the court. there is no tomorrow in the playoffs. im tired of repeating it.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
8:26 am
SEKOU,
I agree. This gets old quick. Same stuff. Same words. And it IS the players. And I really don’t get it. What’s obvious is that this team does not get it, either.
What’s bad here is that we have injuries to Al Horford and Marvin Williams. Both guys contribute to the game. Obviously, that’s not the bigger issue here, though. The guys just can’t seem to get it together and KEEP it together. We do things in the first half of games that keep us in the games. Then we promptly do things early in the second half that take us right out of it. And of course, at that point, we give up.
Now, it would be easy to say that the Cavs are just better than us. Well, they are. But we can compete better than this, and we’ve shown it before. Not playing together is a disease that has few cures. I have no idea what it’s going to take for these guys to trust each other.
And attacking on offense? I saw ONE guy doing that in game 1 with any effectiveness. Even when he was missing some shots, he kept at it…of course until we went away from him in the second half, and the usual suspects either got shot happy or dribble happy. The most annoying thing about this is the fact that this team KNOWS how to play together. They won 47 games that way! You don’t win that many games without at least playing together SOME of the time.
I’m not down on these guys, but they should be able to compete. Winning will happen if they are the better team on the court any given day or night. It’s unrealistic to think they’ll beat the Cavs down. But I do expect to see more cohesion.
Atwork...
May 7th, 2009
8:28 am
Great Article! You can teach chemistry. It comes from playing together and knowing that if you mess up that someone has got your back. They just need to go out there and play basketball like they konw they can and let the pieces fall where they may. For the entire first half of Tuesday’s game i was proud of my Hawks for playing the way they did. I just want to see a complete game now. I think when they are on they can play with anyone…
Also sweet relief to see Josh Smith fake the outside shot for once and put it on the floor.
Westurd
May 7th, 2009
8:39 am
Sekou you should get a pulitzer for this piece. Its dead on my friend and “we” Hawks are in a lot of trouble. Did you say an average playoff lose of 24.2 pts? That is absolutely unbelievable.
I am 100% in support of our HAWKS, but man there is so much to talk about and not too much of it is positive at the moment. We can look back on the season with a smile, but only after the season is done. For now the HAWKS have to buckle down and not be scared of Queen James. Hes a ball player just like anyone else on the court and lets get out there and play 48 TOUGH MINUTES………NOW I’M ALL WORKED UP!
shresee2
May 7th, 2009
8:47 am
All of you are right. The way they lose is horrible. Even in the Miami series how can you blow out a team one night and get blown out the next. Team basketball for this team is key. You noticed in game 7 against Miami the ball movement was excellent. Joe is much better when he just reacts and not try to do a better basketball video on how to lose the ball in traffic. I think Bibby in the playoffs have shown better defense then he sometimes gets credit for. I think Bibby driving the lane getting the hook shot and the and 1 he got often against Miami was key. Everyone heard James say before halftime they have to keep Josh out of the paint. Josh is hard to defend under that basket. The hawks are a better team then the Pistons and need not be swept. The hawks cannot always wait to come home and try to win a game like with the Celtics series. If they want to be contenders and not pretenders they have to win on the road.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
8:49 am
Rod,
Look, we’ll never agree on Marvin Williams, and like you I could give a rat’s a$$ about that. Here’s what I think (and I hate to drag this back up): I think we should have drafted Deron Williams or Chris Paul instead of Marvin. And that is nothing against Marvin. I like the guy. He has potential. No, I don’t think he’s a superstar, and I don’t think he ever will be. But I think he can be a good player.
You can take this as excuses if you like (and I suppose that you will) but there are two major points I will continue to push on the issue.
Number one: Billy Knight thought Marvin Williams was a #2 pick. He’s the guy that picked him over two pgs that became all-stars. You can continue to get mad at Marvin for this, but it’s Billy’s fault. He picked him. Hey, like I said, Joe Dumars picked Darko Millicic over Dwyane Wade and Carmelo Anthony. Should everybody be mad at Darko for not being nearly as good as they are? Or should they point the finger at the guy who picked him?
Number Two. Our offense is chaotic as hell. Guys don’t trust each other. As Sekou mentioned above, this team has trust issues. You tell ME why our #2 pick isn’t featured in the offense more. You tell ME why he’s been the 4th option on offense most nights, for 4 years. Fact is, he’s still managed to average 14ppg and 5/6rpg like that. Should he just grab the ball, and say “hey fellas, I’m just going to score. To hell with y’all, I’m going to shoot if you give me the ball. Look, since you say you played Division I ball, I expect that know better. You don’t just defy teammates and coach alike. If the offense isn’t built for you, then you don’t take it over. Again, tell me WHY our offense isn’t built the highest draft pick we’ve made in the last decade or more? And don’t tell me “it’s because he sucks.” It ain’t that simple.
I used to stay mad as hell at Marvin, and have lambasted him on this blog for the last three years. This year, he really began to turn the corner. But we just couldn’t seem to get him the ball unless either one of our bigger scorers wasn’t available, or they weren’t doing well. When we DID get the ball to him early and regularly, he produced. But that was rare. Now he’s injured. I don’t see the point in kicking a man while he’s down, but hey I guess that’s how you roll. I guess he should be giving us 30 points while playing 12 minutes.
I don’t think he’s a star, but I don’t think he’s roster filler either. You can keep getting mad at a about a former #2 pick who is injured if you want to. I’m much more conerned about an all-star that we paid $70 million to, and traded two first round draft picks and another player for. That’s the real problem.
Funny, if you take away about 2 points or so, that all-star is giving us damn near the exact same thing your hated Marvin was, when he was healthy. Ain’t life ironic.
Rod From College Park
May 7th, 2009
8:59 am
Oh but didnt you know? If you are a number 2 pick in the draft then a hurt wrist cant stop you. We dont need Marvin hes just another body. Horford is out too. Hes a number 3 pick and he sucks for being injured too. Dont you know? If youre a high pick then you are supposed to be impervious to all pain and injury. Sorry azz suckers.
The hawks shoulda drafted me number 2. But they didnt so now I only get to complain about it on my computer.
Joe Johnson
May 7th, 2009
9:00 am
I am so tired. Woodson played me too much.
Mike Woodson
May 7th, 2009
9:01 am
I was trying to help you make the all-star team JOE!
Lebron James
May 7th, 2009
9:02 am
Suckas.
Trent
May 7th, 2009
9:08 am
Sekou, that is some disturbing stuff to hear about the hawks. There is no reason these guys shouldn’t be playing as a tight unit. Nobody will give them any respect, and this is why. They have to take an “us against the world” mentality and show the world that they mean business. These guys can expect to get disrespected by the national media if they continue to play like this. Joe Johnson has to suck it up and play better than this. Nobody expects him to become a superstar over night. And nobody expects him to score and dominate like the top players in the game. But we certainly should expect better than fifteen points a game. That is just not excusable. And being tired isn’t going to cut it as an excuse anymore. Of course it would probably help if we set some screens for him so he’s not dribbling for 23 seconds while thinking of how to beat two defenders.
Rod From College Park
May 7th, 2009
9:09 am
Niremetal, I will fight you and BigRay at the same time just to show you how much of a man I am.
Lacsho
May 7th, 2009
9:21 am
Nice blog Sekou.
To be honest I’d do a straight up trade Artest for JJ.
doc
May 7th, 2009
9:27 am
thanks woody for your contribution. remember that next year when you play the boy so hard he pulls up lame during the derby run.
Mike is back
May 7th, 2009
9:37 am
Great timely article Sekou, ditto for me too on everything that was said…the onus is on the players to trust each other…despite the flawed offensive scheme. Woody does such a poor job of in game adjustments…it’s encumber on the guys to communicate and work to together because the offensive scheme is so predestine. Once you hold that ball your in trouble…you got to trust that next guy will do his part and give up the ball.
We all know who the biggest culprit is I want call his name…Woody is right…when they run their sets they are a different team. What film has JJ been looking at? The problem is JJ is a born scorer his mentally is to score first. Once the offense gets bogs down everyone starts trying to win the game by themselves…they stop trusting each other…then it’s a bunch of F ing one on one plays…which always leads to disaster.
Woody why would you keep running the same play if its not working…haven’t JJ proved that he has problems picking up the double teams. He just does not possess the floor vision of Bibby. You make want to drop that one from the playbook. Exploit your mismatches and quit trying to get JJ going all the time…right now your best match up is Josh. But guys can’t stand there and pound the ball for 16 seconds on the clock…then try to get the ball in the post…it not going to work.
Flip is fine…he just playing to passive…he missing that Jazzy rhythm that make us say FLIP THE DAM SCRIPT. I don’t believe these little guards of Cleveland can shut Flip down for the whole series…Mo got his hands filled with LBJ…somebody else has to step up…U don’t know WHAT YA GONNA GET from JJ. We need another scoring threat to emerge that will help spread floor.
richbrave
May 7th, 2009
9:38 am
niremetal:
Born 1943 and reared in VIRGINIA – lifetime. Living in RICHMOND since 1966. Old VIRGINIA SQUIRES fan. One of only a handful based on the games I attended down at the coliseum. Saw DR.J as a rookie and was hooked for life on the ABA (nee: NBA). Finishing law? What institution? Just graduated from the UNIVERSITY of RICHMOND August 2008 – History.
richbrave
May 7th, 2009
9:46 am
BIG RAY:
Your 8:26 this a.m. sounds eerily reminiscent of the WIZARDS modus operandi. Steer clear of third period swoons. I put those on the coaching staff as much as the players. If the guys won’t pay attention to your half-time admonitions, the lack of respect for the coaches and each other is obvious. Personnel changes are then in order. Easier to replace a coach than a club’s playa’s. Just sayin’….
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
9:52 am
Sekou, don’t sugarcoat it like that, tell us how you REALLY feel!
Who was that masked beat writer, was it a Blog-Z siting?
And to kwooden, PLEASE do not put Joe Johnson in the same breath as Tim Duncan. PLEASE.
joejohnsonneedstomanup
May 7th, 2009
10:07 am
How can JJ talk about his teammates? He played well in 2 of 7 games against Miami. Now, he is in the second round of the playoffs and says he is tired. Josh Smith & Bibby are playing big minutes too. The guy sucked in game one. He is the prime example of we instead of I. Why do you think Smith didn’t get the ball in the second half. Because of our fearless tired leader. Mr. Spalding Ball tester. It can’t be a good offensive possession unless JJ dribbles it at least 8 times.
If he is so smart to see that they can’t win if he only shoots 10 times. Why didn’t he do something about it? We all watch the game he sure has the ball in his hands to make a play. Maybe he should worry about outplaying Delonte West. He hasn’t done that either.
Johnny Red Balls
May 7th, 2009
10:14 am
Fire. Urgency. Intensity. Anger. Killer Instinct. I want more from our Atlanta Hawks. I expect to see it tonight. Now you know.
Rod from College Park
May 7th, 2009
10:19 am
Big Ray,
Of course the above replies are not me. The problem I have with Marvin is that he has no basketball skills. He is a shooter and that is it. No dribble drive skills, can’t finish, no heart, clumsy….. I do blame Billy Knight, with him the same way I blame him for Sheldon Williams. I watched both kids in college, and knew they would not be great pro players. The problem I have with most of you is that you continue to make excuses for him. He is a professional athlete. I can not explain to you how many times I have seen him post up a smaller player and not be able to take advantage of it. You learn these things in high school. My original argument started because most of the blog members were doggin Josh, and giving Marvin a pass. He has done nothing to deserve a pass. Again, Marvin is the easiest guy on our roster to replace. Simple as that. Maybe he can’t step up on our team because he is not good enough. Maybe the guys on the team know that his game is weak, from practicing against him everyday, and don’t pass him the ball in the games, because they know he can’t do anything with it. I was not good enough to make it to the NBA, but I can tell you this, Give me 3 million dollars, no other responsibility, a practice facility that is open at any time, and someone to get the ball out of the net everytime I shoot, and I promise you I would be able to hit a wide open 15 to 20 foot jump shot. His game has not improved on any other level, but being able to shoot the three. I kept hearing what a good job defensively he can do on Lebron. He can’t check Gerald Wallace, how is he going to bother Lebron. It’s been 3 years, how long should we have to wait? Joe has not stepped up, but I actually can respect his game, and see his talent. I just don’t see it with Marvin. Another thing that I stated was that I have a good friend who I played with in high school, who was an advanced scout for the Hawks when Marvin was drafted, and based on the info I got from him, everyone was not on the Marvin Williams bandwagon. I don’t care wheter you are a GM, coach, scout, or a recreational player, if Chris Paul, Derron Williams, and Marvin Williams come in you gym to work out, there would be no comparison as to who you should select then or now.
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
10:41 am
Joe isn’t a leader. Joe isn’t rested. Joe isn’t a superstar. So what is it? On one hand, we acknowledge that Joe isn’t a player capable of picking a team on his shoulders and winning a playoff series. On the other hand, we say that his coach has abused him and that he is too much of a “we” guy. Again, sounds like divergent opinions. If Joe isn’t among the elite, then this team can only win if everyone is producing, including Bibby, Flip, Horford, Marvin, Smith, Zaza & Mo. So why the focus on Joe and his leadership skills? If he isn’t a true leader, then we have to accept that leadership will come from either another player or from the Head Coach (which isn’t optimal even if the coach is Phil F’ing Jackson). If we do acknowledge that Joe can’t do it alone, then it’s time to call-out all the other guys getting 24+ minutes a game and doing very little for the team.
The chemistry is clearly not championship-caliber but neither is the roster, collective player talent nor coaching. We didn’t need a series with the Cavs to highlight that this team is not a contender. The horrific road losses are the only thing that I have found surprising about this team. It suggests (to me at least) that they are a fair-weathered team. They are incapable of withstanding a rain storm. Instead, they allow a few drops to turn into a monsoon. That’s why I previously called them tin-men, they have no heart.
And if Joe decides to take a “it’s either Smith or me, one of us needs to leave town” approach during the off-season, he may find that he is the one packing the bags.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:54 am
I’m confuse by the quotes below. Exactly who’s the veteran that was suppose to have some playoffs experience under his belt and could help lead the younger players on our team during the toughest part of the year. I can’t understand why so many repeatly dog Josh. Here we are in the 2nd round of the playoffs and look at Joe (our team captain) mentality are we suffer our worst lost of the playoffs. Give me JOSH on my team anyday…
“I’m tired,” Johnson said afterward, “but I’d never use that as an excuse.
“We’ve got to tap into our reserve energy right now and get it going,” Josh Smith said. “We’re all tired right now. I think every team still playing has to kick it into that extra gear this time of year. That’s just the way it goes in the playoffs.”
ILL-logical
May 7th, 2009
10:54 am
Because if you give the ball up, there’s now way you’re going to get the ball back. I played 40 minutes and took 10 shots. And we can’t play like that. But I don’t know if everybody knows that. And that’s why, if we don’t figure it out, this might be a short series.”
JOE JOHNSON
And Woodson says don’t worry,don’t worry-cause if there is a h#$% below… .
Sorry about that but the excrement seems to be hitting the oscilating wind device here.
All anyone is asking is that the team play hard,consistently and compete.Period. Now the season’s accomplishments are going to be put under a more intense scrutiny and that may reveal some very,very inconvenient truths.
I am not advocating making the perfect the enemy of the good but
this situation -the blow outs followed by the winning- is not being swept under the rug for a change and accountability may be called for.To bad that it didn’t happen sooner , we still may have had little chance against the Cavs but the effort would be totally different.
ILL-logical
May 7th, 2009
10:57 am
And by the way, the Hawks have a winning record,including road wins, without Joe in the line up over the last 2 years. Look it up
kwooden1
May 7th, 2009
11:13 am
Doc, responding to last nights comments.
Again, I disagree in terms of the comparison with Duncan. Tim does produce and always has because he’s always been top 3 at his position. Joe isn’t. I think everyone is asking for something that isn’t there. If you want Joe to take over a game then you want to see him shoot 20-30 jumpshots! If you want him to work more of screens to get hope, then talk to Woody! You want more ISO JOE!, didn’t think SO. I think Joe can pass out of the double teams quicker, but part of the problem is guys not getting open quicker. Player’s fault and Woody’s fault!
The main issue I always see is the lack of post scoring. The HAWKS aren’t a prototypical team with a top notch low post player to pass into. Woody doesn’t run an offensive that enable pushing the ball after made shots, so there constantly stuck in the half court. Without a consistent low post player (especially with Horford hurt), all five guys are going to have to make the offensive work.
What I don’t want to see tonight is Joe shooting 20+ jumpshots with no else touching the basketball. I hope that Joe plays a smart game, passes quickly out of the double teams and finds good match-ups. Hopefully Smith will not get baited into taking jumpshots either and attacks his defender. This is still going to be a tough game because Evans, is smaller and slower than Lebron! Bad match-up!
GO HAWKS!!!
Rod from College Park
May 7th, 2009
11:22 am
Coach Woodson has to push the tempo. We can not walk the ball up the floor, and try to play a half court game. Pushing the tempo will prevent the double team from coming. See Denver. Joe has to be more aggressive. Stop complaining, whining and throwing cheap shots in the media and sep up. Show some emotion. It might pump your teamates up.
kwooden1
May 7th, 2009
11:25 am
Comment on the Blow-outs.
What I’ve seen is that if the lead gets to 10+, the HAWKS start to trust their sets less and less. I’ve never thought they were comfortable in the sets and Bibby confirmed this by letting Woody know the illogical of a set that puts your PF around the 3 pt line!! I also think they put to much pressure on themselves when they get down. They start missing free-throws and making bad decisions. But I don’t think the HAWKS are the only ones with that problem. See the HEATS 4 losses!! I think we’re all under estimating the lack of Playoff experience this team has also.
Either way I expect a better game all around and a different result!
GO HAWKS!!!
oldmike
May 7th, 2009
11:28 am
Love this post Sekou. I keep wondering what it’s going to take for thsi team to play hard game after game and make the plays to win. They have the talent to do it, just not the concentration. That speaks volumes about the long term prospects for this tram as currently constructed. I think it needs a major forward overhaul. Either guy can go, but one needs to and we need to bring back a center or true point guard and let that PG run the team. Not run the offense through JJ>
Mz. Hawkdafied
May 7th, 2009
11:34 am
Thank you Sekou! I am tired of the talk and excuses too. We should have done this, we should have done that. Yadda, yadda, yadda, blah, blah, blah. Talk is cheap and actions speak louder than words. Forget all that talking, I wanna see some action.
No more blowouts. Blowouts mean you didn’t even try or fight. One to 5 point losses mean you never gave up.
The Hawks’ problem is mental. Did anybody think beyond just making to the second round? It’s like okay we made it to the second round and that’s it. Or you kidding me? That’s why the Hawks’ goal should have originally been to earn that championship trophy. They can’t just quit in the second round. No one controls the Hawks’ destiny but them. It’s not written in stone that the Cavs are gonna win. As long as the Hawks are in the playoffs the possibilities to advance are still there. Another opportunity presents itself tonight. Yes the Atlanta Hawks need to stand together and make the most of it and stop wasting our time and energy. And theirs as well.
dap01
May 7th, 2009
11:38 am
This getting blown out was exactly like last year’s playoff. The Hawks either win or they completely get blown away. Is it preparation? Is it poor game plans? Is it the players? Coach? What is the real issue?
dap01
May 7th, 2009
11:44 am
Has Woody ever said why Josh is camped out at the 3 point line? Has Woody suggested an another spot where Josh should be? Woody laughs at Bibby’s question but surely someone has asked it before because that same pathetic offense has been run over and over and over for years.
Ken Strickland
May 7th, 2009
11:45 am
Although Bibby had a good OFF game, I saw his poor DEF cause Horford to pick up one foul and Zaza to pick up 2. He has got to be the easiest PG in the NBA to screen and the easiest to blow by.
This team has been very frustrating for me, and Woodson’s coaching style, demeanor and limitations just rubs me the wrong way. And as a result, I’ve become too fixated on his issues. After DOC brought it to my attention, I decided to back off and not respond as much. That approach allowed me to see that I wasn’t the only one frustrated with the way the team is being handled, and most of the regulars have become redundant as well, whether any of you will admit it or not.
As long as Woodson is the HC, I’ll limit my comments and involvement with the Hawks, because I just can’t continue dealing with his BS.
The Truth
May 7th, 2009
11:52 am
Sekou
Your article resonates so well. You are hitting all the right nerves these still young Hawk players need to hear. What you say is nothing but “The Truth”.
It is interesting how the post season has shed some new revealing light on these Hawk players that we probably never would have otherwise seen:
1. I think the debate as to whether Josh could be a legitimate low post threat has been answered. He seems to have even more upside potential. He is earning himself the “face of the franchise” label
2. Bibby has definitely emerged to be the leader we all thought he was. Resigning should be a priority.
3. Even though he is injured, Al is still my Mr. Yeomen. However, he does need to hit the game this summer and work on his offense game.
4. Mo Evans has still not convinced me that he is a 3-point threat. He is the reason why the opponent double teaming strategy is working so well against JJ and Bibby. He is always the lone guy wide open for the jumper and he has struggled though he is a descent defender. We could upgrade at this position.
5. Though he struggled in the game 1, I still think Flip is a real baller. He has showed up most of the time so far in the post season. Contract renegotiation should be priority.
6. Even though I like Zaza’s heart, he is more of a banger than a leaper. In fact, he’s not much of a leaper at all but can box out very well. His main assets are his bulk and muscles.
7. JJ (tired prone) is TBD
8. Marvin (injury prone) is TBD
9. Acie Law (injury prone) plays way too passive to be effective. He has lost his Mojo under Woody. Also, he has become too comfortable with the PG in Training Title. He may have earned himself the “trade bait” label.
9. Solomon Jones has shown potential if Woody would trust him more. I still believe he has some offense game as well. His basketball IQ needs some more work.
8. Rest of bench is irrelevant
doc
May 7th, 2009
12:07 pm
ken are you saying this team is a little hot and cold? dont mean for you to hold out on us but yes we all feel your pain.
at some point it has to bear that the team doesnt compete well on the road. it doesnt affect my overall perspective of a grand season, does affect how i view the team long term. that will take care of itself when 5 guys are ready to sign to stay or go. simple math, they dont all stay and that might be part of the rub now as well. to be answered are we stayers or leavers like the warriors, clippers and wizards ended up after their brief shows in the playoffs?
so tonight i watch for signs of life. saturday i go and see what they are made of as the phillips should rock like it hasnt before, and dont come and talk of how great springsteen was there it cant come close to game seen when it wasnt even filled and what is capable when full if this team plays for its home base. optimism does rein even now.
doc
May 7th, 2009
12:13 pm
truth the truth is we arent very deep are we? maybe 8 real nba players on the roster is my take unless coached up or let out of the cage to play. time will tell.
Mike is back
May 7th, 2009
12:16 pm
shresee2, excellent point. The Hawks can’t always depend on home court for a win…especially against LBJ. They must and I think they will step up tonite and become contenders instead of pretenders. I just want them to compete for four quarters. AT LIKE U BELONG TO THE BIG DANCE.
Despite JJ admission of exhaustion…I think he will step. Woody has to share some of the blame. Everyone will be watching to see if JJ comes out with his tail between legs looking tired…will they see a beaten man…or A warrior trying to catapult his team into the Eastern Conference Finals. THIS WILL BE A DEFINING MOMENT FOR JOE!!!!!!!!
Everything time you read Josh comments he is sounding more and more like the team leader. If he wants people to take him more serious…he has to get rid of the bonehead plays. He always had the emotional quality…now he has learn to play to his strengths…we have seen flashes of brilliance…now he has to make the commitment to take his game up a couple notches if he WANTS HIS NAME to be mentioned among the elite in this league.
Josh appears to be growing up before I eyes. LBJ didn’t say he would stop’em…he said…we got to stop him. THAT’S THE ATTITUDE THE HAWKS HAS TO ADOPT!!!
GO HAWKS…SHOCK THE WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
12:18 pm
If Smith is literally next to the paint on each and every possession (as everyone who seems fixated on Smith being on the perimeter at times seems to desire), you do realize that means that Varejao (in the case of this series) is standing close to the rim to stop any drives to the rim, right? Here’s what I guess you see on the opposite end of the floor. Teams find ways to position their PF away from the basket to keep Smith from being able to provide help defense close to the rim. If the Hawks want to create lanes for guys like Joe, Flip and Marvin to drive and get into the paint, doesn’t it make sense for our C and PF to take the opposing C and PF away from the lane? It doesn’t mean you do that on each and every play but you have to do that on sets where a drive to the basket is an option.
Horford isn’t Shaq and Smith isn’t Karl Malone. Those others guys were clearly good for 25+ points in the paint. There are VERY few offenses designed that way these days. With the no-hand-check rule in place, finding ways to create driving lanes is essential.
ZULU
May 7th, 2009
12:20 pm
Blogs are for the purpose of us (the public)to respond to. I enjoy reading a number of the ‘regulars’, I have missed Samuels comments as of late. Sekou, you said all that needs to be said at this time. EXCELLENT COMMENTARY(!),S.K.S.-S.
Nick
May 7th, 2009
12:34 pm
Because of injuries, our best chance is to play small ball tonight …
PG – Bibby
SG – Flip
SF – Joe
PF – Evans
C – Josh
Look, without Horford and (yes) Marvin, we aren’t going to even come close to snatching more boards than the Cavs. Z is simply too big (he didn’t have a lot of rebounds Game 1, but his ability to box out cleared the way for LeBron and Varejao) … so why not just concede that aspect of the game to them? Even Za Za looked mortal on the boards against the Cavs.
Let’s push the tempo and let Josh run Z off the court. Force them to play fast. The Cavs are the best defensive team in the NBA, so let’s not let them get set. Joe won’t have to face double teams if the offense is moving. LeBron in the open court is scary, yes, but if we run, you reduce them to a three man team (Williams, West, and LeBron). Z can’t run. Varejao is a man-on-man guy, not a transition guy. Wallace, Wally, Smith, etc. off the bench are all old.
For real. Take the fight to them. Get out of the horrid offensive schemes that get Joe trapped/doubled and leaves everyone complaining about playing “team ball.” The best way to share the ball for these Hawks would be to just run. And if it doesn’t work? You say you did it because of injuries and go back to the way you always play the next home game …
The Truth
May 7th, 2009
12:57 pm
Astro Joe
I agree, if Al (C) and Josh (PF) were more of an offensive threat from the perimeter, I can see an offense picnic of easy lay-up baskets for JJ and Bibby because the C/PF defenders would have to follow them out to the perimeter to guard them. However, because Josh jump shot is still suspect and AL mid-range game is also inconsistent; their defenders are baiting them to take that shot. The defenders are playing the odds of them misfiring and winning the battle.
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
1:02 pm
No joke – give Hunter and Pachulia lots of minutes tonight and make it a tough, physical game. If they’re gonna beat us, at least make sure they feel us in the morning.
King James
May 7th, 2009
1:22 pm
After tonight:
HAWKS = 0 – 2
Hawks will lose the series in four games
Barry
May 7th, 2009
1:35 pm
Hey Y’all:
It’s ROUND 2 of a 7 Round fight. The Hawks got “hooked to the jaw and are dazed” from the walloped they got from the Cav’s, but they are not out. Just a little dazed. Their hands are on the ropes and the referees are looking into their eyes to see if they can continue. They say “YES!”. The Hawks, on the other hand, are clearing their heads. They are going back to their game plan and to what has got them to this fight toward the Championship of the NBA. They are upset with themselves for getting hit like that. They can not believe it. Now they are mad. They are looking for blood in 2nd Round. The Cavs can ahve the 1 round. But the 2nd Round, the Hawks will be going for the gusto. They have rid themselves of the “butterflies” and are ready to play. They are ready to “SHOCK THE WORLD!!”. The are angry as hell and they are not looking to take any prisoners. They are going to leave the game on the floor. Again, “THE FIGHT IS ON!!!”. NOW ARE YOU READY TO RRRRRRRRRUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUMMMMMMMMMMMMMBBBBBBBBBBBLLLLLLLLEEEEEEEE!!!??
WE are “toe to toe” in Round 2 tonight. AND GUESS WHAT!!!!???? WE HAVEN”T EVEN DONE THE SHUFFLE YET!!!!!
LET’s GO HAWKS!! LET’S GO HAWKS!!!!! LET”S GO HAWKS!!!!
SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is a SECRET from a HAWK FAN! TELL EVERYBODY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
………………………”ATLANTA HAWKS,BOOM-BYE YEAH!!!”……….
………………………….”SHOCK THE WORLD!!!!!”…………….
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
1:42 pm
The Truth, without having paid close attention to the Spurs, I’m going to guess that sometimes Duncan stands far away from the basket to create open driving lanes for Parker and/or Ginobli. Because their ability to score is increased by not having Duncan’s defender close to the paint to stop the drive. Duncan is not positioned 20 feet from the basket because he is Dirk-like from deep, but because there are times that the team runs plays that simply don’t involve the future HOFer.
Cuz
May 7th, 2009
2:03 pm
Sekou, way to write a late night column. I notice that when I get inspired late night the next morning my writing reads like, dhyou evrn tinkk ragt ih badd. Well you get the picture.
There is no I in, “We are awful”. There are several I’s in, “I failed miserably”.
Get rid of the Frenchmen and get us some tatoo covered Americans who play this game with some heart.
Oh and did Bradley make you pay for dinner last night? Sorry that was my suggestion.
newkid
May 7th, 2009
2:14 pm
Good job Sekou, but does any of what you wrote surprise you? You’ve been up close and personal with this lot for awhile now, so have you not clearly seen this mindset previously exhibited? What about our GM Rick ‘I’ll need a year to evaluate them’ Sund? Is this news to him or was he clueless? Is this ‘flaw’ perhaps part of the reason Sund indicated prior to the playoffs that he’d be happy with the season even if we didn’t successfully navigate the 1st round?
Our guys are what they are; they just ARE. There’s no rise of a Phoenix of leadership – of the sort likely to be followed – likely to emanate from this group. And if this offering is true, if Sund is to succeed he must address this ‘flaw’ in the months ahead. Otherwise we’re all kidding ourselves if we expect to have a realistic chance at snatching the O’Brien trophy and proudly parading Peachtree with it aloft.
The discussion of ‘needed parts’ can’t begin and end with a description of the desired ‘on the floor’ skills. At some point individual and team heart must enter the discussion. When it does, it could lead Sund to personnel actions he would not have anticipated if he is content with merely considering ‘on the floor’ skills. So, perhaps Bradley needs to revisit his description of how best to address the 1 1/2 players he thinks we need if we’re to get to – and through – the next level.
Great GMs think – and act – outside of the box in building winning programs (or get lucky). Hope we’ve got a great GM, but it ain’t looking very good so far. Where’s Dimitroff? Perhaps we can clone him.
Marcus
May 7th, 2009
2:21 pm
I think we have all the talent in the world to get Ws, but common theme among most playoff teams is a certain “toughness” and the associated instinct that comes with that.
Zaza gives us effort and some of that, but I am talking a Charles oakley-Anthony Mason (NY Knicks)/DET Bady Boys (pick any starter)/’80s Celtics (C. Maxwell and crew) kind that bring a certain level of “enforcement”.
are we soft? I would say ‘No’, but we seem not to have the playoff-hardend guy that will get in the face of a fellow Hawk or an opponent, technical foul be damned, to take the opponents best blow if it means a ‘W’ for our team.
By no means do I advocate on-court violence for our Hawks, but just like the 80s Pistons (finally overcoming the Celtics), 90s Bulls (overcoming the DET Bad Boys), and even the contemporary Cavaliers (same Pistons w/Ben Wallace ), we, just like them, have to forge our playoff resolve vs. the comtemporary ‘best team in the conference” and hope it bodes well for the future.
cp
May 7th, 2009
2:31 pm
Great blog. If Woody is brought back next season they really need to consider bringing in someone to run the offense and let Woodson focus on the defense. We don’t play towards our strengths with Woodson and he is not creative enough to come up with anything other than iso Joe……I like Joe but its clear he is a number 2 option.. I wonder just how much better this team would be with a true number one option and letting Joe play the Pippen role……We cant fall in love with the jumper.. We need the guys attacking the rim.. Woodson needs to find a way to get Law in the game..Tell him to push the tempo and get in the lane. I want to see a competitive game tonight…We know they can win at home but they have to show they can win on the road.
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
2:39 pm
We all know that JJ never places the blame on himself
Ariose
May 7th, 2009
2:40 pm
Rasheed Wallace and Antonio Mcdyess are unrestricted Free Agents this Summer…….I Also think we should Look into Aquiring Steve Francis as a backup PG. He’ll be cheap but he has bigtime game.
I’m just Sayin’, If we want to be a contender in the next few seasons we’re going to need some seasoned vets. These guys are beasts in their own right, and they will probably be overlooked this summer…..especially Rasheed and Francis. None of them are Superstars, but I’m guessing if you put enough all-stars on one roster, something good will come of it. All of theses guys are on Joe’s level, effectively nullifying the constant doubleteaming of him by the oposing squad.
Ariose
May 7th, 2009
2:41 pm
……or we could just trade for Rudy Hehehehehe…..
bali
May 7th, 2009
2:42 pm
good article……… my question is how do the hawks get better? Is it the players being so young……… which is getting old………. the coach and his staff………….. what……….. I have never seen a series like the hawks and miami series… good first half against cleveland then get waxed in the 2nd half/ hope they play 4 quarters tonight
Brandon
May 7th, 2009
2:45 pm
Joe Johnson has to be an all-star he is making to much money to let these small gaurds CLevland has contain him. He is starting to make Steve Belkin look like he was right.
O'brien
May 7th, 2009
3:05 pm
I have been very disappointed in Mo Evans. He was supposed to be a legit 3 point shooter, but he misses a lot of 3’s. Also, he misses them at critical junctures in the game. eg, the other team is making a run, and they are up 8. if Mo makes the 3, it’s back to a 5 point game. But instead, he misses, the other team scores to go up 10, and then it’s all downhill from there.
Sekou, We have basically the same starting 5 from the end of last year. And if Bibby is re-signed, we will have the same starting 5 next year, and the same coach of course. As a result, I think this team will be the same inconsistent team next year. There needs to be a change somewhere. Maybe Woody can hire an offensive co-ordinator. Del Negro (in Chicago) has Del Harris and Bernie Bickerstaff on his bench. Doc Rivers has the defensive coach (Thibedeau (sp)), even Mike Brown in Cleveland has an offensive co-ordinator.
The bad thing is we all know Woody is too controlling, but this team needs some infusion of something…
Dwayne
May 7th, 2009
3:05 pm
Brandon – How can Belkin be right about anything when we run freakin 13 games when he was around and now we are in the Eastern Conference Semifinals?
cp
May 7th, 2009
3:12 pm
O’brien I suggested we get somebody to take over the offense in my post as well. But as you stated Woody is so stubborn he probably wont go for it… Ive been disappointed with Evans most of the year to be honest. He hits the occasional 3 but his defense is overrated and has trouble finishing in traffic. Nice player but ehhhh……Ariose I’m sorry but Francis has nothing left.. Its kind of strange to see how far he has fallen off but he has nothing left in the tank…
Marcus
May 7th, 2009
3:13 pm
Ariose,
Didn’t we already have ’sheed for a hot second?!?!? naw, I will pass.
Hawks Fan In New Orleans
May 7th, 2009
3:15 pm
Well its nice to know The Hawks have the diagnosis, now they need to implement the solutions they have come up with. Stop the insane cycle of thrilling victories and embarrassing blow out losses.
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
3:21 pm
Ariose, yes to McDyess and a BIG no to Rasheed. And an even bigger NO to Stevie “I Don’t Have a” Franchise. We need vets with a winner’s attitude, not just any vet. Heck, if we just needed a vet, we could have brought back Antoine Walker. There’s a reason guys like Walker and Francis are outside of the league and guys like Joe Smith and Drew Gooden get snapped up the minute they are released.
Dan
May 7th, 2009
3:26 pm
Ariose, are you really Isaiah Thomas? Good Lord! No to McDyess and a F-No to Francis! I will grant you that Sheed could be an OK pickup. He would, however, have to come cheap and understand that he would only play limited minutes.
I would rather have Josh Childress back than any of those guys, though…
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
3:38 pm
Ariose, It’s been reported that Sheed is seeking 8 mil for his next deal or he will retire. I think it’s safe to say that we seen the last of Sheed if he standpat on his demands. However, he’s too big of a risk for me. I think McDyess should be our number target this summer. Just like you, I would love to see Rudy Gay on this team. He’s a player that could take some scoring pressure off of Joe. He would be a perfect compliment to our starting 5 b/c he has the ability to shoot the 3 and dribble drive to the rim. Maybe we could package Marvin for him. It’s been reported that Rudy was unhappy with the lack of touches in Memphis b/c of the mad bomber OJ Mayo. Funny you mention Francis b/c I said that we should have sign him and Antonie Walker around the trading deadline. We could have signed those guys for the remaining of the season for cheap (vet minimum). I would prefer to have Francis and Walker as the 13th/14th man versus Othello Hunter and Thomas Gardner. At least those guys are former All-Stars and played meaningful mins in the playoffs before.
Samuel
May 7th, 2009
3:44 pm
Ariose,
I would love to have Sheed here. He still has a few years left. We had this conversation this summer when R Artest was available. Many here said they didn’t want him because of his “baggage”. Look where he has the Rockets now.
Joe, thats all well and good if you got somebody who can score from outside such as a Sheed. Otherwise, no body is gonna guard you. Ando loves the “Big Chuckers” only he loves the ones who play no defense.
Josh smith can average 20, 10, 5 and 5 if he stays on the post. I see absolutely no need for him to venture out. Doc says his athleticism will dwindle as he gets older. Maybe so but for the next 5 years. Camp out on the blocks and become an AllStar.
As for tonight, I can’t say that i’m too confident that we can win. I’m looking past this one to our first home game. Hopefully, they will surprise me but we got too many things going against us.
Word is that Portland is looking to deal Outlaw. Marvin is from the Northern West Coast area. Marvin and Acie for Outlaw and Frye or Priz.
Ellis and Turiaf for JJ. We need some Mississippi blood on this team.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
3:48 pm
Dan,
I will take JChill back in a NYC min and we should bring the big guy David Anderson across the pond as well. But we don’t need that headcase Sheed. With this team having questions in the leadership department, we definitely don’t need a guy like sheed that’s going to divide the locker room especially when things go sour. That guy would be the leader of the rif-rafts..
Government Schools
May 7th, 2009
3:50 pm
“One pass and won’t shot on offense won’t get the job done against Cleveland.”
Apparently the headline writer won’t get the job done either.
Wow. Have ya’ll hired Buckwheat at the AJC?
doc
May 7th, 2009
3:55 pm
astro i think i remember seeing duncan stand near the lane protecting his nads and setting hard screens for parker and ginobli. unfortunately he didnt play here this ear, just a picture i have of him taking a beating for the quick guys. i think he does move away when they cut for a quick outlet pass and a 12 to 15 ft jumper if his man leaves him, his reward. we dont have the quick guard to consider it.
King James
May 7th, 2009
3:55 pm
Dang Barry, lots of bravado but I dont see the Hawks matching up with the Cavs in any measure except three point desparation shots. If you cnat drive the lane and sink the layup consistently your 7 round fight will end up a KO after the 4th round.
Lebron and the Cavs are just too much for the Hawks. Sorry
no id
May 7th, 2009
3:59 pm
Maybe we need u Sekou to give the pre game locker room speech, cause u sure as hell fired me up! Im going to see if I can catch me a pick up game now..lol
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
4:02 pm
Doc, you posted that same comment as Government Schools did last nite…. hmmmmmm
doc
May 7th, 2009
4:03 pm
oh yeah a quality 15 to 18 footer is all josh needs not a 3 point shot, just his coach needs to find out where to spot him or run screens through him,
SSSSHHHH!
May 7th, 2009
4:05 pm
My goodness, Barry REALLY stinks.
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
4:05 pm
O’Brien and cp,
For the season, believe it or not, Evans was our best 3 point shooter at .395. Better than Bibby or Joe.
Yes, he’s shot poorly in the playoffs, but so have JJ and Flip.
And we didn’t get Evans to be a starter, but that’s how it is now. Flip certainly gave us more bang for the buck between the two of them.
RickNole
May 7th, 2009
4:05 pm
Sheed and Josh Smith should never co-exists on the same team.
Rod from College Park
May 7th, 2009
4:09 pm
Samuel,
I would trade Marvin for a bag of chips at this point.
O’brien,
I do agree that Mo Evans, has been a slight disappointment, but his three point percentage was higher that Marvin’s during the year, so what does that say about Marvin.
Rod from College Park
May 7th, 2009
4:20 pm
Wow,
I actually agree with Sautee. what is the world coming to.
RJ
May 7th, 2009
4:23 pm
Why is AC on this team? somebody answer me
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
4:34 pm
Rod,
Actually we agree on far more than you think. I just took issue with your “looseness” with things presented as facts. If you went back to the archives from last year, you’d see that I was taking Marvin to task as well.
I sincerely hope you didn’t bet the Southside crib on game 1.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
4:43 pm
“It’s tough right now,” Williams said. “We’re just trying to get through it with all these injuries the20best we can. Hopefully, we can find a way to get it done tonight and head back to Atlanta for Game 3 [Saturday] with some momentum.” – Marvin Williams
We. What about you need to get thru with your injury. I’m with you on this one Rod. Marvin need to strap it up and play…
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
4:44 pm
I guess I need to pay more attention to these offenses that give each and every player an equal opportunity to score from their individual best spots on the court on every offensive possession (without having to take more than 2 dribbles).
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
4:45 pm
We need to S&T Marvin (who sucks…14 ppg in his 4th season and #2 overall? Get outta here) for Artest
EAST ATLANTA HAWKS FAN SINCE 1971
May 7th, 2009
4:46 pm
LOOK HERE YOU MIKE WOODSON HATERS,HOW ABOUT YOU LAMES GO AND CHEER ON YOUR 4TH PLACE BRAVES.
LBJ23
May 7th, 2009
4:47 pm
King James: Actually the Hawks can match up with us. I was pissed when I figured out we were playing them. I would rather play the Celtics. The Hawks are a scary quick athletic team that when clicking is as good as us. If they can hold my man under 30 then they win. Only thing they are missing is a 7 foot guy to stop Big Z and they need JJ to click. I’m gonna say Cavs in 6? But the Hawks are scary for me at least. Also we will probably double them in FT attempts.
EAST ATLANTA HAWKS FAN SINCE 1971
May 7th, 2009
4:52 pm
NOPE ON SHEED. HE`S THE SECOND COMING OF DERRICK COLEMAN,TWO BIG MEN THAT DIDNT USE ALL OF THEIR POTENTIAL. THEY BOTH PLAYED WITH A LAZY STYLE INSTEAD OF PLAYING WITH POWER.
doc
May 7th, 2009
4:59 pm
i guess i will have to go back and check since comcast had my system down from 12 to 6 little contact with the blog world melvin.
O'brien
May 7th, 2009
4:59 pm
I didnt know that Mo Evans had the better 3 point percentage. I still think he misses them at crucial times though.
cp, an offensive co-ordinator could be very useful. If the Hawks are down by 2 with 12 seconds, does anyone have confidence that Woody can draw up a play that will give Joe (or Bibby) an open/high percentage look?
For tonight’s game, even if the Hawks dont win, they need to keep it under 10. Going back to the playoffs last year (on the road), they are 1-6, and I think they lose by an average of 20 something points. That’s inexcusable.
In the first quarter of the Lakers game, Kobe was determined to get off to the quick start, and that’s exactly what he did. That’s the kind of determination I want to see from Joe tonight
The Truth
May 7th, 2009
4:59 pm
I’m not a big fan of Mo Evans as a SF starter. His offense is way too limited to his set 3-pt attempts. That sizes up his whole game; very little aggression toward the baskets; no off the dribble moves. These are absolute requirements for a SF. Those leading 3-pt percentages are misleading anyway because he rarely shot them during the regular season. They never really impacted the outcome of a game. They were not so-called “Big Threes” or “Timely Threes”. Some were even during garage basket time. However, his attempts did help his average so I will give him that. With his skill set, he seems better suited to a SG than a SF; he’s a descent bench player and defender that can give you quality minutes; but not a starter.
MannyT
May 7th, 2009
5:16 pm
While we could use the excuses, I’ll try to find the diamond in the rough before this all implodes.
During the regular season, we got blown out in the 1st quarter and just finished the game. On Tuesday, we were fully in the game for 2 1/2 quarter even though we turned the ball over too much.
If Al & Marvin are out, the next guys down the bench that might get time are Solo and Mario/AC??Maybe the route to success is to run a few more players into the game and make it more helter skelter. Forget less turnovers, just look for more opportunities to take the Cavs out of their comfort zone. A fast game minimizes big Z. It also helps Bibby’s defense–where his strength is lurking in passing lanes.
Go wild, go hyper, go, go, go. Let play like it’s 1979. I want 135-130 in regulation.
If we keep losing by 20+ the other way, what have we got to lose?
BWAF
manny_pacman
May 7th, 2009
5:21 pm
bagong_sali! pinoy ka no??
Ariose
May 7th, 2009
5:52 pm
All of you guys knocking my suggestions, i’ve said the same things you’re saying plenty of times before. BUT, this team is at the point where it needs that one piece to put us over. Ever since Bibby got here we’ve sying, “Well, we’ve got the point guard, now we just need the center”. Well Rasheed is the Best Available option, and a pretty darn good one at that. I’m willing to bet the collective hunger of our team will be infections to him. Not to mention he’s been coached by woody before, and Woody is a no-nonsense type of coach. I really think Sheed would work here.
It’s either that or draft some, inexpericed guy that needs five years to develop. We’ve got enough young bigs on our roster (Smoove, Al, Solo, & Zaza) We just need that Anchor. As long as the foundation is in place, we can keep switching out vet centers. San Antonio does it all the time Duncan, Parker, and Ginobili ae always there, but they have a new starting center every year. At the very least, I think a player like Rasheed is worth the gamble. If Woody can Keep he and Smoove in the post, watch out.
Rasheed has the Length, defensive tools, offensive skills, and the experince that we need and that’s exactly wht Woody is drawn to. I think it would work.
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
5:54 pm
LOL, Manny,
If we scored 135, Woody would have a heart attack!
Not that there’s anything wrong with that……. scoring 135, I mean.
Sekou Smith
May 7th, 2009
5:59 pm
The Hawks’ co-exist just fine off the court. They’ve been all over the food court here at Tower Center and a group of them took in a movie after practice Wednesday. There’s something about their roles on the court that just isn’t clicking. Think back to the Miami series and ask yourself if they ever really got into a groove for more than a few minutes at a time?
In the losses they didn’t resemble the team that waxed Miami. That inconsistency is what would concern me. That and the fact that energy and effort are always mentioned when they lose, as if those things should be negotiable.
O'brien
May 7th, 2009
6:05 pm
Ariose, Rasheed woould help with JJ’s doubles, because we know he can knock down the 3’s. And since Woody goes back with the Pistons, maybe he feels like he can handle Rasheed. However, Rasheed is not coming here to come off the bench. He wants $8 million, and he wants to be a starter. So how would he fit on the Hawks?
The reason I like McDyess is because he knows his role as a bench player. And he has a consistent midrange jumper (unlike Al).
Skicky
May 7th, 2009
6:12 pm
All the teams in the play-off have leaders. Boston KG, Houston Artest, Cav Lebron, Lakers Kobe, Denver, Mr. Big Shot, Orlando Dwight Howard, Atlanta_?__. Someone needs to light a fire under these guys if not the leader than the coach. They need to take offense and have more pride in their play. Letting Lebron drive down the lane as fast as he can go and no one takes a charge. That is the only way to stop that guy is to stop him from driving down the lane is someone has got to have the balls to take a charge to get him in foul trouble.
braveshater
May 7th, 2009
6:21 pm
THE PROBLEM IS OUR IDIOT COACH DOESNT EVEN KNOW WHERE THE GUYS NEED TO BE ON THE COURT, SO THEY’RE OUT THERE TRYING TO FIGURE IT OUT THEMSELVES. HOW ABOUT GOING OUT AND HIRING SOMEONE WHO KNOWS HOW TO RUN A DAMN OFFENSE. HOW LONG DO WE HAVE TO WATCH THIS GUY RUIN THE CONTINUITY. MIKE WOODSON IS A MORON.
Mike Woodson
May 7th, 2009
6:25 pm
It doesn’t take a moron to see that Joe Johnson…is tired.
Steve Belkin
May 7th, 2009
6:33 pm
Tired of Joe Johnson yet?
EJH
May 7th, 2009
6:50 pm
If Joe is tired, what about Kobe, Lebron, and D-Wade, they played in the Olympics during the summer Kobe played in the finals before going to the Olympics and then came backs to training camp for the upcoming season, so did carmelo anthony, Dwight Howard, deron williams, chris paul also they all have played a lot of basketball but not one time have they said they were tired. Joe Johnson wants to be mentioned with those guys, but he is nowhere near there level, Josh Smith is closer to those guys than Joe.
joe j
May 7th, 2009
6:59 pm
I need help, This team is not championship, that is a big word, calibre.
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
7:05 pm
and some wonder why i have such a problem with WOODSON!! this is the same ole $hit and it’s still happenin’ from the top down…all the way to the top. a real HC would have had this problem solved. the actual ISO scheme feeds into the lack of trust. same ole $hit for the last 2 years!!! develop a damn ‘real’ bench with some better schemes and some of this would have taken care of itself…by now!!! CLUELESS!!!
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
7:10 pm
what other HC in the NBA would have a ‘lack of trust’ issue runnin’ for 2 yrs str8??? seriously…name one!!!
vava74
May 7th, 2009
7:12 pm
Many interesting post and opinions.
I also believe that we should try to get some veteran help, someone tough and capable of giving good advice to our young team. Remember, our age average is lower than 25, including Zaza at only 25 and then Al, Marvin and Josh below that.
My take on some of the names mentioned: no, no, no, no, absolutely no to loosers like Francis, Sheed, etc… Sheed only got his ring because he had a momentary lapse of reason and played hard for about 40 games with the pistons. After he got the title, he has been just a huge waste of talent, always avoiding to play on the low post and to work hard, settling for 3-pointers with occasional spurts of actual BBall contribution.
Drew Gooden is also a bust: horrible shot selection, total lack of brain, also a loser. Look how better are the Cavs without him and how little impact he had with the Spurs (an error in judgement by Pop).
About our performance: we are undermanned. We sorely miss having Marvin and Al clicking on all cylinders. I also believe that, in spite of the fact that both Flip and Mo were good additions, we miss Josh Childress’ in n’ out energy game coming out of the bench. Anyone saying the oposite can only be saying that out of spite. Yes, he f*cked us real hard, but who can actually blame him for going for the money and a new experience, at his age, specially in light of the fact that we were not offering him neither similar money nor a starting job?
Given Al and Marvin’s situation, it is not shame if we are swept by the CAVS, although the players’ mind set should be to leave their blood on the floor on ALL GAMES up to the very END. This includes the bench on garbage minutes: effort starts on practice and continues on EVERY oportunity given to play.
Anything less than that is unacceptable.
About Woody: I have my doubts and I have criticised him in the past, however, they way he handled the team in light of the horrible officiating in game 4 of the Miami series was superb (remember, amongst dozens of others, the illegal screen set by Wade on Bibby that triggered the two 4-point plays in succession?), asking for everyone to stay calm and just play BBall.
Obviously, in some occasions the officiating is so damaging that remaning calm is impossible, however, he handled that game well and that speaks a lot in his favour.
His X’s and O’s are, in my opinion, very suspect, however, the low age average is an indication that the team is still inexperienced and lacks the BBall IQ which is acquired by experience (some players are born with that IQ (R. Rondo, D. Williams, …), most acquire it as they play through the years and some never actually acquire it).
I love J-Smoove’s passion for the game and his committment to always give a good effort is never at stake, however, I am very concerned that he falls on the latter category: he may never acquire the BB IQ necessary to be a consistent and dependable player.
He has 4 years of experience and he constantly puts us in a bad spot with his bonehead outside shooting.
Later he has shown to be a bit more focused, driving more and in particular when shooting FT, so there might be some space for me to be wrong.
In relation to JJ: JJ has several problems but by no means we should ditch him. His low profile character is his most significant problem, typically leading to two seriously bad effects: he sometimes shies away from the game and he does not get the calls he should when he drives to the basket, making him settle and depend too much from his outside shooting. If got the calls he deserves, he would put 4 to 6 ppg more, easily and the defenses would have a lot more trouble knowing what he intended to do.
Finally, it his obvious that he is extremely tired and that he did not fully recover from his ankle woes.
So people, relax and hope that the effort is good. This is the most important issue, regardless of the result.
Terry Stotts
May 7th, 2009
7:12 pm
Terry Stotts? What do I win????
Fire Mike Woodson Express
May 7th, 2009
7:18 pm
Mike Woodson is the worst coach in the NBA. And Rick Sund is so damn stupid for keeping woody around. Just watch him on TV tonight, he looks like a dear caught in head light its awful.
Avery Johnson
Would have this team together no question about it.
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
7:18 pm
figured it would be a past HAWKS coach!!LOL
Fire Mike Woodson Express
May 7th, 2009
7:22 pm
Terry Stotts and Mike Woodson are both terrible.
Fire Mike Woodson Express
May 7th, 2009
7:23 pm
HIRE AVERY JOHNSON and fire Mike Woodson
LeBron
May 7th, 2009
7:27 pm
You all should lay the 13 points and bet us to cover the spread tonight. You might as well make some money while watching the beat down.
doc
May 7th, 2009
7:29 pm
melvin i have no clue to what you are referring in connection to me and govt schools.
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
7:33 pm
it’s funny that when BIBBY called out WOODSON while on the court that WOODSON said, to para-phrase, he smiled ’cause he was glad to see the fire from his veteran PG. BIBBY might not be the player he once was but he STILL f’n knows what it takes to really compete in a playoff atmosphere(sp?). WOODSON smiled ’cause he got called out by BIBBY…PERIOD!!! it’s just plain stupid to keep puttin’ JS on the 3pt line if you don’t wanna take the ‘chance’ that he might take the shot!!??? (WTF emoticon!!) i mean, what’s JS’ habit???!!! could that be a clue to what he might do!!??? yeah, we all can wish JS’ bball IQ might be a tad ‘different’ but it’s not like he hasn’t shown us what he’s likely to do in certain situations!!?? and i ain’t hatin’ on SMOOVE either. he is who he is as a player!!! i’m as proud as the next HAWKS fan but i HATE CONTINUED STUPIDITY…especially across MULTIPLE seasons!!!
Zup
May 7th, 2009
7:34 pm
Poor Woodson. . .I love the guy, but you guys are right. His actual Xs and Os ability is lacking. He’s smart but can’t string together a game plan, involving intricate offensive and defensive schemes (though I think he is a better defensive coach). He would make an outstanding assisstant coach.
drmaryb
May 7th, 2009
7:36 pm
HATERS’
DX (diagnosis): Hater-itis , Associative – Not enough hugs, Concomittiant – visceral headaches, back pain & anal pain.
Onset: Childhood
TX (treatment): Self-Love
PX (prognosis): Bleak
RX: Love Pills Bid (2x/Daily) for a Lifetime
Recommended: Psychological Counseling & LOA from work 12 months continuous
Fees: $75/minute – 1 hour session daily
drmaryb
May 7th, 2009
7:38 pm
Hawks,
Your team has a DRUG Problem, LeBron & ‘Nem DRUG the Hawks UP & DOWN the court last game.
What are you HAWKS gonna’ do about it?
Fire Mike Woodson Express
May 7th, 2009
7:49 pm
Avery Johnson just said on ESPN, that somebody from the reseach team pass him a note that Joe Johnson said he was tired. Avery words we’re, ” tired tried? please joe it’s playoff time” That’s the kind of coach the Hawks need.
Fire Mike Woodson Express
May 7th, 2009
7:51 pm
Woodson uses those sorry ass excuses, Joe and our team is banged up but we are battling. Maybe try fixing your defense and offense.
Fire Mike Woodson Express
May 7th, 2009
7:55 pm
LOL. BIBBY just told ESPN Live that they have to do a better job with the other calvs players because they can’t control James lol. That’s something what Woodson would say.
vava74
May 7th, 2009
8:08 pm
bad, stupid shot by J-Smoove…
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
8:09 pm
ready girls for round 2 of the 4 round knoutout .
vava74
May 7th, 2009
8:10 pm
awful one on one defense by J-Smoove
doc
May 7th, 2009
8:15 pm
couldnt find folks to go to the prayer hall so i am sitting in front of the tv with my white now you know and the retro red smith number 5 jersey on. got to try something, need huge gaems from the survivors we got. seems we sent some key folks off the island.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
8:17 pm
Doc, i saw that post on Mark Bradley’s blog last nite….
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
8:17 pm
i hear ya doc…
FrenchyFries
May 7th, 2009
8:17 pm
Hawks learning how to control the ball unlike they did in game 1?
Nope not this Hawks team, two Cleveland steals and 3 Atlanta turnovers.
RJ
May 7th, 2009
8:17 pm
this hawks team is full of bullsh.it excuses
RJ
May 7th, 2009
8:19 pm
Look in every Hawks player’s eyes. There isn’t one player that looks like they want to win.
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
8:19 pm
long live king james.
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
8:22 pm
and don’t boome on atlanta i don’t want to score 100 pts on your sorry ass team.
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
8:22 pm
CHAAAAARGEE!!! SHYT… HE TAKES THE COLLISION AND DOESNT EVEN GET THE CALL!!
vava74
May 7th, 2009
8:22 pm
atrocious shots by J-Smoove and atrocious defense on Varejão…
pensacola dawg
May 7th, 2009
8:22 pm
Hawks suck!
vava74
May 7th, 2009
8:22 pm
bad call against us… they are starting
doc
May 7th, 2009
8:22 pm
refs going to work on us.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
8:23 pm
Terrible call on Josh. Im glad Hubie Brown is calling it down the line tonight….
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
8:23 pm
MOVING SCREEEN…!!! SHE DONT CALL SHYT..
pensacola dawg
May 7th, 2009
8:24 pm
If Joe Johson is tired maybe he should work as hard as James!!!!!
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
8:26 pm
Melvin,
u can trust Hubie and Co to do a good job tonight.. they are the best team on…
well, besides Bob &Nique’ …
Pete
May 7th, 2009
8:26 pm
Look, the Hawks are no different than 90% of all NBA teams. They are a collection of “spare parts”, shamefully overpaid, each player having the work ethic and inner character of a 12 year old child. With kids like this, when the going gets tough they shrink like week old flowers. Can you imagine any of these “children” having to spend ONE MONTH in the U.S. armed forces ?? They would shrivel up and die……….on the spot.
And you wonder why they play like they do ??
vava74
May 7th, 2009
8:26 pm
Yes, Hubie Brown was right on the money: instead of an offensive foul, we got a second foul on our second best player.
Instead of a defensive stop, we got one point against and a diminished offense… instant impact of a single bad call…
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
8:27 pm
Glad to here Hubie calling the game. He does a great job in analyzing the game instead of riding the Superstars jock straps…
vava74
May 7th, 2009
8:28 pm
zero fouls by the cavs by now!!! nice stat!
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:31 pm
Well they are only go to give the cavs a foul when the bench is in.
Firsty McFirst
May 7th, 2009
8:32 pm
Wow, apparently Zaza Pachulia is a spokesman for Travelers Insurance.
Suckers.
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:33 pm
Put it on Wikipedia. LeBron had a call against him.
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:34 pm
LeBron is a monkey.
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:35 pm
Put a curly tail on LeBron the freak.
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
8:36 pm
Poor Solo didn’t deserve to be on an island with James.
Who designed that defense?
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:36 pm
Put a curly tail on him.
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
8:37 pm
we have no goons on our team that would grab him out the air…
Za Za didnt even rotate over… why not bring him on the double team Wood? let Joe Smith have at it… dont let him get to the rim to energize the crowd…
geesh…
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:37 pm
hoo hoo…hoo hoo…
vava74
May 7th, 2009
8:37 pm
very poor defensive rotation, how could Lebron end with Solo as the defender? Also, if you want to win games, you need to have the baseline rotation done by the remaning frontcourt players (zaza in this case) rotate and jam the elbows in Lebron’s face telling him to keep shooting from outside…
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
8:38 pm
cant afford to let Josh sit..
have to bring him back in the game for some sort of low post threat…
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:41 pm
Evans has to take tht 3.
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:42 pm
WE SUCK BAD!
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
8:43 pm
i guess Evans can only hit 3’s from the baselines…
Murphy
May 7th, 2009
8:43 pm
This is really embarrassing….
Sean O'Shaughnessy
May 7th, 2009
8:43 pm
CLEVELAND (Reuters) – When asked by Heather Cox of ESPN what the Hawks needed to do to stop LeBron James, after James finished the first quarter with a defense-splitting reverse dunk, Atlanta coach Mike Woodson explained, “well, I mean, we’re playin’ ok.”
Ariose
May 7th, 2009
8:43 pm
Put AcieIn there with Joe, Flip, and Josh…
vava74
May 7th, 2009
8:46 pm
F*ck Josh Smith, the man is a f*cking idiot! Launches jump shots and backs away instead of taking the ball to hole when he has Szczerbiak as his direct opponent!
Not to mention his one on one defense on Varejão at the start of the game!
ajw
May 7th, 2009
8:46 pm
Its a absolute miracle we ever won on the road in Miami. Just awful on the road.
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
8:46 pm
please put acie on the floor…
Acie, Bibby, Joe, Josh…
Ariose
May 7th, 2009
8:50 pm
I Wish hubie brown was our coach….
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
8:52 pm
Rod,
I hear you. I had to laugh about the comment about people doggin’ Josh Smith. If you’ve read this blog regularly, you will see how many arguments I have gotten into by defending Josh (and criticizing what he’s doing wrong, but more defending him). Man, they’ve spanned for blogs and blogs. The funny thing is, I felt like Marvin came into the league with more skills (mostly via jumpshot) than Josh did. But it’s clear which of the two is the pulse with this team. Even if people don’t like it, or want to admit it. People have been waiting for HIM to “put it all together”, and he’s been here longer than Marvin. Of course, I feel like the system is a factor that effects all of this, but Josh still makes some bad decisions. Yet, if he doesn’t play well, this team struggles. Aside from JJ, he’s really one of the biggest keys to this team. And when he’s on, he can’t be stopped. People dog him, but other than Bibby, who’s played better in the playoffs on this team? Exactly.
I don’t make excuses for Marvin, but I see ways to better utilize him than we do. I feel like he’s improved, just not by huge leaps and bounds, or the numbers would reflect that. He’s not a defensive dynamo by any stretch of the imagination, but he’s quick enough and long enough to cause problems. And when he’s defending with intensity, he does. Unfortunately, like his teammates, he’s not always that intense.
I couldn’t agree more with your last paragraph or two. I just got over being frustrated with Marvin because he is what he is. And he didn’t put himself here, Knight did. I will never agree with the decision to do so, but my opinion counts for nothing. As to the Marvin bandwagon, when he was drafted…I know not everybody was on it. And if we hadn’t had that pick, I don’t see anybody drafting him that high unless they already had eveything they needed at pg, center, and other key spots, and just wanted one of the higher rated small forwards, potential-wise.
You’re right. He is the easiest person to replace. To put a finer point on it, his position is the easiest to replace. Small forwards and shooting guards are really a dime a dozen. The hardest positions to find solid, let alone good or top tier, are point guard and center. But that’s just my opinion.
Gerald Wallace is simply faster than he is, and one of the best natural slashers in the game. As for Marvin not backing guys down, I don’t know what to say other than he’s always been a jump-shooter more than anything else.
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
8:53 pm
Fearless Leader 0-2 FT
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
8:55 pm
Why would Mo help Lebron off the floor. Lebron didnt help Josh up after he ran him over. My goodness, show some toughness…
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
8:55 pm
Why would Woodson play Mario before Acie while Bibby’s on the bench…
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
8:56 pm
why in the sh$tt is joe in the game he act like he dont wont to even be there take his ass out iff the game. GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
8:57 pm
From Samuel:
“Word is that Portland is looking to deal Outlaw. Marvin is from the Northern West Coast area. Marvin and Acie for Outlaw and Frye or Priz.”
Tempting….
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
8:57 pm
Looks like our little girls have already packed it in for the night. Please, Hawks, at least pretend, that you’ve got some nads.
j
May 7th, 2009
8:58 pm
joe johnson is awful.
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
8:58 pm
Melvin, come on…a WOODSON thought process question…mutually exclusive brah!!! can’t even watch this one based on the blog!!! check in later…
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
8:58 pm
I said lets keep woody for another year the more i see this guy coach the more i say get rid of him.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
9:00 pm
Marvin for Outlaw…anyday!! gotta get a coach first tho!!! Outlaw might walk if he’s subject to WOODSON after NATE!! just sayin’…
back to MSNBC…
MANNY out 50 games!!
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:01 pm
Thank You Mike Woodson. About time you stand up to these refs.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:02 pm
I guess I need to pay more attention to these offenses that give each and every player an equal opportunity to score from their individual best spots on the court on every offensive possession (without having to take more than 2 dribbles).
Ha! Good one. While exaggeration is the name of that game, there are teams and coaches who actually look to try to do such a thing. Just not HERE….
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
9:03 pm
People are mad at joe i say blame the coach for playing joe 42MIN a night i say let get rid of woody and bring in AVERY JOHNSON.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
9:04 pm
The Cavs have been on the Power Play for the last 18 minutes. Brutal.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:05 pm
I like Bibbys shooting but he gotta do a better job playing defense. Bibby has scored 9pts but his guy has scored 12pts…
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
9:06 pm
Woody must have beef with acie there is something wrong with that pic.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!
vava74
May 7th, 2009
9:06 pm
We have be realistic: we had just a small chance of getting a win in Cleveland WITH Al and Marvin.
Without them we have to play with Solo, who is, at best, a D-League player.
With JJ struggling again and J-Smoove doing his typical off-game routine, we are fried.
CJ
May 7th, 2009
9:07 pm
It was said perfectly on the radio Wednesday afternoon…the Hawks were likened to a bunch of side dishes with no main course. There is no person on this team that demands the ball, no person on this team that can will his team through effort and intensity, no person on this team who will lead verbally and through play. Worse still, there is no coach on this team that can motivate and get across a game plan.
No one expected the Hawks to win, from the biggest Hawk fan to the staunchest Cav fan, but AT LEAST play the part, lie to me, lead me to believe that you WANT to not be a laughingstock, just scrimmages for the Cavs until the Finals.
Just awful…bring on Falcons minicamp.
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
9:08 pm
Woody have never devolop his bench at all.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:09 pm
OMG! Hunter is in there!
Eski
May 7th, 2009
9:09 pm
Hawks need a line up shake up in the offseason…I actually think we OVER ACHIEVED this year.
There was a reason the “experts” picked the hawks to not even to make the playoffs this year
The weakneses of the team are glaring and plentiful.
No D or Penetrating ability from the PG
A “Star” SG that doesnt have a Killer Instinct
a PF that half of the time plays INTO his weakneses ON HIS OWN (shootling jumpers)
lack of size in the front court or the bench…no real centers or dependable PG’s on the bench
Horrible half court Offense
Having 2 guys of the likes of Mo and Flip to come off the bench…and Marvin’s improved range is about the only things to build on with this team
Its really amazing we even made the playoff, alot of hawks fans on here think we are waaaay more talented than we really are.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:09 pm
Vava74,
Funny. We sure have a rough time playing well without that F’in idiot. By the way, he’s played better than just about anybody else on the team in the playoffs. So what does that say about the rest of the team (besides Bibby and Zaza?) Strange, NBA.com has him averaging 17 ppg, 8.5 rpg in the playoffs, and has the highest player efficiency of anybody on the team. You’re right. What an idiot. We’ll play much better if we just suspend him for the rest of the postseason.
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:10 pm
don’t cry girls this is just the beginning .
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
9:12 pm
NICE PLAY WOODY…!!! I WOULD HAVE RATHER SEEN JOE PULL UP FROM 35
Murphy
May 7th, 2009
9:12 pm
I dont see how anybody can be mad at Mike Woodson right now! Our MAIN guy has no HEART! The rest of the team feeds off of JJ and when he leads like how he has been leading we are not going to play good. Woodson can tell them which offensive plays to run and where to be on defense but if Joe and the guys dont want to execute how does that fall on Woodsons? Dont make him the scapegoat cause our star dosent have any HEART!
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:12 pm
Delonte is on Joe and he doesn’t get the ball. Fire the coach!
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
9:12 pm
KINDA LIKE THAT….
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:13 pm
we need a worthy opponent not this girls
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:13 pm
Ugh. Ugly game. Even when I knew it would be.
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:13 pm
And the monkey swings his arms after the freaky shot from half court.
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
9:13 pm
Can’t blame any one person for that half. This is one of those games where I wanna scream “Trade ‘em all! (except Zaza and ‘Rio)”
FrenchyFries
May 7th, 2009
9:14 pm
Hawks play like they’re satisfied with meeting their goals of Home court advantage and making it to the second round.
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
9:14 pm
It looks like Woody will get to use the scrubs a little early tonight.
D Hawk
May 7th, 2009
9:14 pm
Turn out the lights, the party’s over. Lebron is making it look like his high school days.
HawksSuck
May 7th, 2009
9:14 pm
“Maybe the Hawks will steal one” – har dee har har. Maybe they’ll score more than 70.
Game, SET, MATCH. CAVS DOMINATE!
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:14 pm
Wally gives credit to the Cavs coaching staff. Has a single Hawk ever done that?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:15 pm
ajw i’m a monkey but you are a cry baby girl
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
9:15 pm
good post Eski…
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:15 pm
puss hawk fan
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:16 pm
Im turning my TV off. Not b/c Lebron made that last second shot before the half from Akron but the ball hit ZaZa in the head after it went throw the net. Bad sign when the ball beats up Rocky (I meant ZaZa)….
Witness
May 7th, 2009
9:16 pm
The Cavs have this on lockdown. The Hawks appear ill prepared for the Cavs. This is the playoff, the Hawks look as thought they are in the Pre-Season. This is ugly, just ugly!!
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
9:16 pm
Telling moment of the first-half for me – Hunter goes in and doesn’t notice the shot clock. Woody has so under-utilized his bench that Othello didn’t even know to mind the clock when he actually gets in the game. Ugh.
No mental focus from anyone tonight.
D Hawk
May 7th, 2009
9:16 pm
Why the Flip does Murray dish to a guy that barely knows what the floor looks like when he and Joe are on the floor? When I watch these guys play on the road they look like the dumbest team in the NBA. Sadly, they don’t look that much smarter at home. The just play better.
James
May 7th, 2009
9:17 pm
Well, the Atlanta Dream are playing pretty good in cleveland considering they are all women playing men. WOW.
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:18 pm
ready for vacations girls bahamas is waiting.
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
9:18 pm
This is what happen when you dont devolop your bench during the season your starters get burn out during the playoffs 1playoff game is like 5regular season games there is no way you can win a nba tittle with a 7 or 8 man rotation.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:18 pm
Hey I like monkeys.
doc
May 7th, 2009
9:18 pm
samuel, cant wait for josh to start practicing the shot we just saw from queen labron. heh heh
vava74
May 7th, 2009
9:18 pm
J. Smoove is still an idiot and a huge one simply because he has the hability to play consistently but doesn’t on account of his absolute lack of BB inteligence.
When we win, we win because he plays a huge role in getting us there, but when we loose, typically he is involved in the momentum changing bone head plays which lead to our demise.
Look at his line today and tell me that I am wrong. Look on how he defended Varejão, an absolutely worthless offensive player who got 6 points and many, many rebounds with J. Smoove on the “watch”.
Please don’t mix up blocking shots actual defense.
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
9:19 pm
it doesnt matter if it wont work Coach Johnson… he wont change or adjust…
richbrave
May 7th, 2009
9:20 pm
Without BIG AL and DUCK, I just don’t see ATLANTA prevailing.
Eric Amous
May 7th, 2009
9:21 pm
These guys suck. How on earth did they make the playoffs. They can’t even get a shot off. The “best” player on the team is shell shocked and can’t even make free throws! I don’t want to hear excuses. Everybody in the playoffs have played the same amount of games. Sissies!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:21 pm
“we need a worthy opponent not this girls”
That’s what the Lakers will be saying about you in the Finals…
D Hawk
May 7th, 2009
9:21 pm
This is what happens when you play the same 7 guys all season, and then you lose 2 to injury and your best player to lala land. The backups don’t have a clue of what to do.
CJ
May 7th, 2009
9:21 pm
The Hawks could bring in Avery Johnson, Phil Jackson, or even exhume Red Auerbach…wouldn’t do any good. This team was beaten before the lineups were announced. It doesn’t really matter who your coach is when the players aren’t interested. It’s simply easier to get rid of a coach than players with multiyear multimillion dollar contracts. But again in the Hawks’ case it wouldn’t matter who is calling the plays.
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
9:21 pm
It looks like all the Hawks ever cared about was winning a Game 7 in the 1st round. They’re all already halfway to the Bahamas in their minds right now.
Actually, this looks more like a freaking Air Tran commercial than a playoff game. Want to get away?
doc
May 7th, 2009
9:22 pm
always felt manny was hiding something under that loose uni he wore. those here for a while have heard me say it. not surprised that he finally got caught.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:22 pm
Vava74, Josh pickup 2 quick fouls and 3rd cheap foul. What can he do when he’s sitting on the bench…
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
9:22 pm
JERRY SLOAN with this same team…entirely different effort if not result!! just sayin’…
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:23 pm
awj you can stop your pain, move to cleveland problem solve.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:23 pm
Darrell Starks,
Yeah, developing the bench has been a long-standing issue. One that will get re-hashed from time to time. You want to see the value in developing your bench players, so that you can survive when your big guns go down? Look no further than Boston’s Glen “Big Baby” Davis. ‘Nuff said…
HawksSuck
May 7th, 2009
9:23 pm
Nice BigRay – cant do the job yourself, so you have to rely on someone else. We’ll see…. Might do you some good to see how the Cavs and the Lakers have been playing the last several years – not just this year. and please pay close attention to LBJ’s and Kobe’s stats when you look.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:24 pm
Lebron shot 1 fewer free throw than the Atlanta Hawks team in the 1st half…
Murphy
May 7th, 2009
9:24 pm
I agree CJ
RJ
May 7th, 2009
9:24 pm
the hawks could sure use some steroids
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
9:25 pm
Please don’t mix up clueless hatin’ with actual basketball posts.
NoleRick
May 7th, 2009
9:26 pm
Where is Matt Ryan when you need him??
Le Brown… no one in their right minds would move to Cleveland.
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:26 pm
I *want to get away* but it will be with Southwest, not the dogfighter sponsor.
atlstew
May 7th, 2009
9:27 pm
le brown. “move to clevland problem solved.” Yeah or siberia or detroit right. Even your boy lebron cant wait to get out of that $hitty city.
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:27 pm
4-0 anyone disagree?
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:28 pm
Vava74,
Isn’t that what I just said? If he struggles, the team struggles. If he plays well, we tend to play better.
Meanwhile, the so-called best player on the team can’t even play up to the level of the so-called idiot, but that’s okay. Wow.
As for his performance in this game, yes it’s bad. So is everybody else’s. The guy who seems to be having the best game right now is Mo Evans. What does that tell you, huh? I’m sure it’s Josh Smith’s fault. He’s screwing everybody over, and that’s why they’re all playing so badly. Typical, typical, typical…
MAC-TOWN
May 7th, 2009
9:28 pm
Hey, even with the playoff experience from the “thriller” with boston last year….it seems one of our main problem is that the guys have no energy, no swag. I’m not josh smith’s biggest fan, but he seems to be THE ONLY PLAYER who has got pumped up at some point during the playoffs.
They have looked uptight in both series. No emotions at all. That’s pretty weird to me.
The Hawks need a Fiery, emotional leader out there.
Josh Smith gets openly emotional but its not usually the “yea im gettin in my teammates face to pump them up” …aka positive way….its usually the cryin about a no call or call on him…..which furthrer depresses an already depressed lookin/playing teams.
vava74
May 7th, 2009
9:28 pm
J-Smoove: 11 minutes, 1-6 FG, 1 Rebound! and Varejão (!) scored 6 points on him!
In his defense, one of his defensive calls was totally wrong and the offensive also questionable BUT he is 6′10”, he should get more than 1 rebound in 11 minutes and he should not launch stupid jump shots.
In one of them he was two steps from the basket with not defenders and on another he was guarded by a 6′7” white guy with no jumping hability and defenseless.
His has a peanut for a brain. FACE IT: hugely talented, no judgement, resulting in terrible inconsistency.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:29 pm
ASG, get a good look the results of tonight game when you decided to invest money in bench players such as Mario West, Othello Hunter, Randolph Morris and Thomas Gardner. I hope you are happy with the return on your investment.
cp
May 7th, 2009
9:29 pm
Game over. I’m about to start researching available players in the draft. These guys are not showing any hear, energy, or any type of emotion period…… We need offense and Woodpecker puts in Mario who has no offensive game what so ever… Cleveland lets him have open jumpers and he passes them up…. Hunter got in the game before Law. If I was Law I would go head and shower and catch a flight back to the A…. Bibby is getting destroyed on defense and Evans cant guard Lebron. Flip is looking horrible again.. I guess it would be too much to ask to let Law handle the pg duties, move Bibby to the sg, and leg Joe guard Lebron.. I have never seen a coach not make adjustments but Woodpecker does not know what that is. This team is soft. Get some guy with some damn heart in here.
CJ
May 7th, 2009
9:30 pm
Look at the bright side, Hawk fans…Cleveland is head and shoulders better than us but, dang…they have to have something don’t they?
Their weather is deplorable, the city is drab, Brady Quinn is their QB, their women are fat, the Indians haven’t done much, they live by a lake that actually caught fire. Give them their moment, the Cavs are good…let them gloat.
Meanwhile, go downtown, stroll up Peachtree, walk through Centennial Park, look at a beautiful Atlanta woman, enjoy the weather…and thank the Lord above, even though the Cavs are making the Hawks look like a rec league team, that you don’t live in Cleveland.
Bring on Falcons minicamp.
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
9:31 pm
It kind of looks like even if Woody could have the starters and the entire bench on the floor all at the same time against the Cavs 5 that the Hawks still would be getting their tails whipped. When was the last time a team lost a playoff game by 70 points. It looks like it really could happen. Wow.
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:33 pm
and don’t boo me on your sorry arena i don’t want to embarass your sorry team on your sorry city.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:34 pm
Melvin,
Exactly. But I don’t expect everyone to understand that, obviously. Still, he’s not having a good game. But neither is anybody else, and last I looked, this was a team sport. But hey, what do I know?
Hawksuck,
I know. You can’t do it all by yourself, and that’s the problem here. I’ve been watching the Lakers and Cavs play for several years, thankyou. Until they added a second consistent, credible threat in Mo Williams (which still won’t be enough against the best in the West), Cleveland was going to hit a ceiling every time.
Boston was going nowhere until they got ahold of two aging but still very dangerous all-stars to play with Paul Pierce. Of course, Pierce’s dumb ass likes to act like they were champions all along, but he’s full of it. What he is, is lucky that Ainge managed to pull it off.
The problem with the Hawks is they have other weapons. They don’t use them properly. But I also happen to think they don’t have that “other stand-alone weapon” yet either. I don’t know if we’re going to be able to develop such a thing, given the current state of affairs, so we might have to trade for it.
HawksSuck
May 7th, 2009
9:34 pm
Yo CJ – The RIVER caught on fire, not the lake!
Murphy
May 7th, 2009
9:35 pm
How can people crap on Josh when Joe is not doing anything out there, and hasnt done anything except for one game when he was hitting 40 foot three pointers? Joe gets no respect from the league and obviously none from the hawks fans if your not willing to sh*t on him as much as u do Josh. At least Josh wants to try to win the game
le james brown THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:35 pm
I AM AN IDIOT OF GLOBAL PROPORTIONS.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:36 pm
Murphy,
That’s how things tend to go around here. Ain’t nothin’ new.
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
9:36 pm
joe might be the only all star in nba history who cannot take delonte 1 on 1 on offense
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:36 pm
wow your wnba team is realy bad .
CJ
May 7th, 2009
9:37 pm
Okay…you live in a city where the nearby water is flammable. Doesn’t make much of a difference in the grand scheme wouldn’t you say? Geez…as if that makes it better.
That’s akin to me saying…Joe Johnson had 10 points in a 50 point loss, not 8…and I only say that because it’s likely a true stat by the close of business today
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:38 pm
LOL @ CJ….yeah, we could have the freakin’ Browns to cheer for…thank God we have the Falcons…
…And Cleveland isn’t winning the NBA championship, sorry…
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:40 pm
Is Hubie driving home the fact that our guards are getting toasted on the primeter or what….
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:40 pm
Melvin,
You have a point. But these guys almost never play. I’ll say this: I think Hunter is a guy who will turn out to have some value. West can be used to do certain things simply because he plays hard every freakin’ second. Can’t say too much about Gardner and Morris. What a waste, as we don’t play them anyway. And there were other options…but hey, it’s not MY money.
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
9:40 pm
LOL LEBRON JUST FLAGRANTLY FOULED JOSH AND NO CALL
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
9:41 pm
Come on Hawks, can’t you guys at least stick your hands up in the air on defense and make the Cavs players shoot over you? That’s just not acceptable.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:41 pm
Hubie Brown was a heck of a coach. I’d love to have him if he wasn’t so old and tired of coaching. He really knows b-ball. Turned things around down in Memphis…
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
9:41 pm
Plan A for relaxation and enjoyment tonight: Hawks-Cavs
Onto Plan B: Beach Boys and swing music
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
9:41 pm
Woodson yell the refs off after the game. PLEASE
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:42 pm
Its nice to see Joe attacking.
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
9:42 pm
Nice defense Bibb
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:43 pm
stop crying girls move to cleveland stop your pain.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:43 pm
Hey look, Lebron just sledgehammers Josh Smith, and he gets a technical for not liking it. Gosh, what an idiot.
Go ahead and say it, Vava74. He’s an idiot, right? Let me hit you from behind (or in the face) and see if you’re still smiling…
jhan
May 7th, 2009
9:43 pm
How pathetic! No effort or heart. Very weak.
Witness
May 7th, 2009
9:44 pm
NoleRick, I’m here in CTown for the game and I would not hate on Cleveland. Great restaurants, nice downtown – nothing like dangerous ATL downtown, Condo’s all over, the lake, great restaurants, good pulbic transportation and JOBS. It feels like a city, not plastic like ATL. You see tons of people walking around, you don’t see that in ATL.
We all know ATL is over rated, but don’t hate on Cleveland. I’ve been here four days and have been to OC, Tremont, Detroit-City, China Town, and have eaten at some AMAZING restaurants, no Cheesecake factories or ESPN zone places like you’ll see in ATL. I went to their museum district, blows away anything I’ve see, it’s like going to Europe.
Here in the Q, the crowd is insane. It’s unreal, I see why the Cavs only lost two games at home.
CJ
May 7th, 2009
9:44 pm
LOL @ Niremetal…I’m taking my own advice and heading downtown to a local watering hole…wait, that place has multiple TVs in it and one of them will likely have the game on…I’m going to need to find a late night library…no TVs in there.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:45 pm
“joe might be the only all star in nba history who cannot take delonte 1 on 1 on offense.”
I know I’m not supposed to laugh at that, but I couldn’t help myself.
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:46 pm
best places to live in usa :#1-cleveland #100 atlanta.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:46 pm
Now that we are down 30pts, the refs will make a few calls for the Hawks so at the end of the game the fouls wont looks so lopsided…
WE GET IT, David Stern. WE GET IT..
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
9:46 pm
Rafer gets suspended 1 game for hitting Eddie House. LeBron hit Josh in the head there. SUSPENSION.
we should just start a fight and get fines. i’ll be satisfied if that happens
MAC-TOWN
May 7th, 2009
9:46 pm
I knew tonight wasnt the night when I say Wally sizzurpbiack backin down Flip for the point blank bank shot off the glass
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:47 pm
“stop crying girls move to cleveland stop your pain.”
Maybe we can stop girls from crying by NOT letting them move to Cleveland…
CJ
May 7th, 2009
9:47 pm
Great, Witness…and I’m sure that you get to enjoy all of that during the two months that the place isn’t frozen over. I’ll take Atlanta everyday and judging by the scores of northerners that make their way down here on a yearly basis, it’s safe to say that most others do too…
…but hey, if you like gale force winds, lake effect snow, and flammable water…be my guest, my friend.
O'brien
May 7th, 2009
9:48 pm
Ray, one thing that frustrates me is after 5 years in the league, we are still talking about Josh’s maturity. That’s unacceptable to me. And I think as long as Woody is here, him and Josh will always clash, and there will continue to be issues.
That being said, I hope Rick Sund makes a change this offseason (or forces Woody to do something different). We cannot continue to hang our hats on how we play at home. At what point do we take the next step?
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
9:49 pm
Call me crazy, but I think Smoove and ZaZa are the only 2 players on this team who want to win this series
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
9:49 pm
Joe makes a bad pass, leading to a Lebron steal, which leads to a foul on Josh.
All Josh’s fault…
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
9:49 pm
like i said, i have NEVER seen this team ‘prepared’!!! seen ‘em win but not ’cause they were ‘prepared’!!! ‘preparedness’ would have to include coachin’!! down 30 pts huh???
vava74
May 7th, 2009
9:50 pm
Melvin, the T on Josh is precisely because he complaint about EVERY call.
This way he is on the referees’ shortlist featuring Sheed, Artest, etc of players who will always get the calls against them, even when they should get them in their favour.
He is harming himself complaining all the time. He gains the credibility as a whinning bitch and the refs will always get him.
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
9:53 pm
ANOTHER FLAGRANT ON LEBRON. WHATS THAT? HIS 25TH?
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:53 pm
move to cleveland be happy
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
9:54 pm
oH WELL, THERE GOES THE SERIES
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:54 pm
Melvin you are right on.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:54 pm
Obrien, funny we are talking maturity when it comes to Josh. When has he been suspended, fine, arrested or been discipline for anything since he has been in the league….
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
9:55 pm
Oh lord…not JJ too.
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:55 pm
Josh is our best player PERIOD. He was fouled really bad and they didn’t call it. that’s it!
The Hawksta
May 7th, 2009
9:56 pm
Vava74 you are a jerk! DWade complains about every call! AI complains about every call! Your logic stinks and it’s only your idiotic opinion! Go back to your Cleveland blog sucker!
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:56 pm
where is the white flag or maybe a mercy rule this is pathetic.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
9:56 pm
vava74, please read Big Ray’s 9:43 post…
The Hawksta
May 7th, 2009
9:57 pm
T Gardner in over Acie Law? Pathetic
ajw
May 7th, 2009
9:57 pm
Can we just peg the refs in the head with a really hard chest pass?
NoleRick
May 7th, 2009
9:58 pm
Staying positive here, we got blown out in teh first two games in Boston last year too.
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
9:58 pm
Ray,
Plenty of blame to spread tonight. Joe played weak in the first half and even you have to admit that Josh hasn’t played smart all night on either end of the floor.
vava74
May 7th, 2009
9:59 pm
The Hawksta, Wade has “star status” which benefits from a different level of benefits from the refs.
We saw that on the first round.
By the way, nice shot by J-Smoove… again…
The Hawksta
May 7th, 2009
9:59 pm
Now Josh is shooting BS! Man this is bad…real bad! Joe quit… His ankle will be ok. It’s his ego!
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 7th, 2009
9:59 pm
we need a worthy opponent not this wnba team.
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
9:59 pm
47 points in almost 3 quarters. All we need to do is play with some energy.
heh heh.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:00 pm
A Thomas Gardnet sighting and he hits a 3.
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
10:00 pm
I’m almost ashamed to admit it, but I can’t turn the channel. It’s almost the same compulsion watching this game as watching a train wreck.
CJ
May 7th, 2009
10:00 pm
Something has to give…either Woodson has to go or Josh does. The unfortunate thing is that the Hawks are full of good complementary players but they won’t make the next step until they get a bonafide Alpha Dog superstar in here and those don’t come dime a dozen. We already missed on those chances when Chris Paul and Darren Williams went elsewhere.
So we’ll likely be on the outside looking in just like we were when Nique was running into Bird in Boston, then the Bad Boys in Detroit, then Jordan and the Bulls. We don’t have that player and in a superstar driven league you HAVE to have that player or else you look like we do now.
Witness
May 7th, 2009
10:00 pm
CJ, those old sterotypes are long ago. That like saying all us southerners are toothless, redneck hicks that drive trucks, wear overalls and talk with a slow drawl.
The area where the river caught on fire now has a ton of condos and restaurants and clubs in it with about 1500 more units in the progress.
Come on HAWKS do something! Don’t give up!!
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:00 pm
O’Brien,
Believe it or not, I agree. I really hope for better with Josh. But guess what? You do what you have to, to get better. If that means trading Josh, then do it. But make sure that it does make the team better, not worse.
Only thing is, I don’t feel that the clashes between Woody and Josh are the crux of this team’s problem, although it is one of a few problems.
You’re right, though. Sund has his work cut out for him. The thing is, GMs hire coaches to coach, since most of them don’t/can’t coach. So he has to respect Woody as a coach. Which means trying to force him to do something is a bit of a tricky proposition. You have to either give him the tools that he says he needs, or you build the team and try to fit the coach to it. Either way, Sund has to look at the entire body of work, which is a lot of detail. And then make a decision.
One thing I don’t see is this exact same team (coaches, players and all) doing as well next year. Chemistry problems, and all sorts of other things. Maybe it takes some big changes. Maybe just some tweaks. I’m not sure. But we can’t go forward like this.
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
10:01 pm
how many times has LeBron fouled josh in this game? whats he have? 1 foul?
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:01 pm
If you are not going to play a lottery pick it a 40pt blow out then it’s time for him or the coach to leave town…
Dan
May 7th, 2009
10:02 pm
If the Hawks somehow manage to win game 3 (or any game for that matter), it would have to be the biggest win after getting your a$$ kicked in NBA history.
I understand they are short handed. I did not expect them to win tonight. It is, however, terrible how this team just refused to compete some nights. I can’t figure it out. It is more than just coaching. It is a culture of losing that is just embedded in these guys. I am not convinced it will ever go away..
NoleRick
May 7th, 2009
10:05 pm
Antime…same here, I dont know why i cant turn it off…lol
HawksSuck
May 7th, 2009
10:05 pm
I love how all folks crack on the river catching fire – (CJ) – forty years ago buddy! were you born yet? Maybe we should discuss General Sherman here too….
All – please quite whining about the refs – live in the road in the NBA. You’ll get the calls in Atlanta… That nonsense has been going on in the NBA for years and years….. Do you really think if Lebron had 3 more fouls that would make up 30 points?
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:06 pm
Niremetal,
What do you mean “even I have to admit”?
No, Josh is easily overcome by his emotions, and there is no one to rein him in, either. He took himself out of the game by frustration with fouls (some of which were absolute bogus). Hasn’t been right since, and doesn’t know how to recover. Everything’s ugly when you lose, and lose badly.
I don’t know what it will take for him to get over this. But we may be out of time putting up with it. Sund could send him packing, talent/potential and all…
By the way, good point on bench development. Although, don’t you know that playing with energy automatically makes you aware of everything?
CJ,
They both might have to go.
NoleRick
May 7th, 2009
10:07 pm
Hawks suck… no one was comparing cities until one of your “fans” came on here comparing Cleveland to Atl.
DeeMack
May 7th, 2009
10:08 pm
You want to know the problems with the Hawks? They do not have a star player. Y’all talked a lot of trash about D-Wade and the Heat, but D-Wade is the Heat just like LeBron James is the Cavaliers. Those teams build their team AROUND their stars. Atlanta need a “WINNER”, someone who will sacrifice EVERYTHNG and ANYTHING to win. I do not see a player on the Hawks team with that kind of caliber. It is called CONFIDENCE. LBJ has confidence in his other teammates and a helluva lot in his own game. Mark Bradley took a picture of LBJ on the court 2-3 hours b4 the game shooting the 40 footers. Guess what? One of them went in tonight. HARD WORK PAYS OFF!
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:08 pm
“If you are not going to play a lottery pick it a 40pt blow out then it’s time for him or the coach to leave town…”
Word…
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:09 pm
Why not play AC the entire 4th quarter. Why risk the chance of having one of your regular rotation guy getting hurt….
NoleRick
May 7th, 2009
10:10 pm
Heres hoping we dont get blown out at least one game.
Josh Smildress
May 7th, 2009
10:10 pm
I could not stand to watch this game anymore. It made me too depressed. Now that Joe is out for the game, I am going to go do anything other than watch this game. Read my piece here.
http://www.mvn.com/billyknighttookmylunchmoney
Witness
May 7th, 2009
10:10 pm
Can someone light a fire under the Hawks???. They look like the walking dead! THIS IS THE PLAYOFFS!!! Come on man!!!
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
10:10 pm
not an either-or situation IMHO!! it’s a HC must-go situation!
RJ
May 7th, 2009
10:11 pm
woody hates ac
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
10:11 pm
Heather: Coach, what do you have to do to keep playing as well in the 4th quarter?
Mike Brown: Well, we have to keep our guys from falling down from laughing so hard at these Atlanta Hawks. It won’t be easy but I think we can do it for one more quarter, at least.
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
10:14 pm
and what’s so bad is that, somehow, when they show better at home ’some’ will think they were better prepared…FALSE!!! they are not bein’ coached to win on the road and they feed off the crowd to play better at home…SIMPLE!! no leadership on the team except for BIBBY and he can’t do it by himself…gotta give AL leadership props too tho!!
O'brien
May 7th, 2009
10:15 pm
Like the rest of you, I am very surprised that Acie is still not getting any burn.
And now JJ is in the locker room with a sever ankle sprain. I guess Woody will have the excuse he is looking for when the Hawks get blown out again.
Ray, the easiest way to change the starting lineup is to not resign Bibby. But then who would we get? If Woody stays, I would be fine trading Josh, but like you said, the problem is who would we get? i dont know. We need a big and a PG.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:15 pm
With Joe going down to injury tonight. We only have one guy capable of playing the 3. Why would you continue to play him in the 4th qtr of a 40pt blowout????
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
10:15 pm
Come on, Woody. Now is the perfect time for Speedy Claxton to show his stuff.
DenverHawk
May 7th, 2009
10:15 pm
they do realize this performance is on national TV, right?
never saw Mike Fratelo’s scrappy bunch of the 1980’s come out and lay this big an egg – overmatched or not, they would fight you to the end….
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:16 pm
The refs do seem pretty intent on running up the score, though. JJ was attacking the rim every time he touched the ball in the 3rd, drew contact every time, and never got a call. And that was after they called touch fouls on Josh early, as Ray pointed out.
Having the calls go our way wouldn’t have made a difference tonight, but it’s disheartening to feel like the whole world’s against you.
Sam from da Swats
May 7th, 2009
10:18 pm
Hawks suck, nobody is whining about the refs. This is what happens when the refs give you extra calls. You play a little more defense because the refs are letting you play. You go to the hole a little stronger because you know that you can just TRUCK the defensive man and not get a foul. All this changes the whole flow of the game. I’ve played on winning teams before and teams that were aggressive. We struggled when we couldn’t get after people defensively when refs called tight games. So stop with the whining accusations. Truth is not whining. The NBA refs are the worst of all professional sports.
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:18 pm
Finally, Acie! Now I can die happy.
Injury Report
May 7th, 2009
10:18 pm
The entire team is experiencing mild vaginitis.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:19 pm
An Acie sighting! Alright, time to develop your lottery pick point guard that might be the only pg you have a few months into the offseason!
NoleRick
May 7th, 2009
10:19 pm
wow!! an Acie Law showing. I hope we can trade Acie, i mean, why just let this guy rot on the bench..
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
10:20 pm
i’m gettin’ depressed just readin’ the blog…not even watchin’ the game. damn!! WOODSON CANNOT command nor demand anythin’ as a HC!! NO COACH with any kinda impact on his team would see his team get CONSTANTLY BLOWN OUT on the road!! this team has no road pride…PERIOD!!!
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:20 pm
What was the purpose of playing Flip the 1st 5 mins of the 4th. If Acie can play the final 7:24, then why can’t he play the entire 12 mins of the 4th…..
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
10:21 pm
Injury Report….LMAO
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:21 pm
Haha…the announcers gloss over the key point – they mentioned that one of the reasons Acie doesn’t play is that “Woodson is worried about keeping his job.” Yup. Too bad you kept talking after that and ended up defending him.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:21 pm
Dear Kirkinga,
Please send for help. The squishiness has taken over.
P.S. You knew it would…
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
10:22 pm
and watch, ALL OF A SUDDEN, they are gonna have SOOOOOOO much pride at the next ‘home’ game!!! PITIFUL!!!
TheHawksFan
May 7th, 2009
10:22 pm
Well the refs were terrible AGAIN!! You know why? Woody and Josh both try to get tossed and get nadda nothing zelch. That said we are still getting whooped like Tina Turner after Ike just snorted and eight ball. The Hawks chemistry is Jacked right about now. There was some harsh words in the locker room at halftime. Man just come on HOME guys hopefully Phillips can cure some of the ills. GOOOOOO HAWKSS!!!!
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:23 pm
So JJ finally goes from tired to hurt. I wonder if “getting him to the all-star game” was worth it, Woody?
Well, now Woody has yet another excuse to lay before managment…
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
10:24 pm
is there a 2nd game tonite?
HawksSuck
May 7th, 2009
10:25 pm
“This is what happens when the refs give you extra calls.”
Sounds like a whine to me….
Sautee
May 7th, 2009
10:25 pm
Injury Report,
That was some funny ish!
mykhalc
May 7th, 2009
10:25 pm
HAWKS are gonna secede from road games!!!
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:25 pm
Can the 2nd group get this lead down to 15….
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:27 pm
Ray,
Exactly. Two lines of though going through Woody’s head when JJ went down:
1) Damn! There goes our shot at the series.
2) Phew! There goes the threat to my job.
CJ
May 7th, 2009
10:28 pm
Okay, HawksSuck…I’ll lay off the flammable water in Cleveland but I stand steadfast behind the Lake Effect Snow and other facets mentioned earlier. If you want to mention Gen. Sherman though, feel free, I’ll even give you directions to the Cyclorama downtown so that you can see the battle of atlanta for yourself.
DeeMack – I totally agree…of all the team sports this is the one where you have to have a transcendent star on your team. The only other team sport where HAVE to have a #1 guy is hockey. you can get away with it in football, baseball as well, but basketball, you have to have that guy and the Hawks don’t. A superstar can’t be groomed or grown, he has to be that from the beginning. Lebron was a star from the jump and everyone knew it…Jordan was the man from the beginning…Duncan, D. Howard, Garnett…superstar has to be hard wired in you and we don’t have that guy and we’re not likely to find him with the 20-something pick in the draft this year. LOL
No coach change or player dismissal this offseason will likely change that. don’t think the Magic will be dealing Howard or Wade leaving the Heat either.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:28 pm
Oh no, Acie you better not score too many points or Woody is going to put you back on the bench. You better not make him look back for not playing you earlier in the game…
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
10:28 pm
Seriously, maybe Woody should start the 2nd unit on Sat. as they look much hungrier than the first team has so far this series.
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:29 pm
PS – Can you tell that I have more free time now?
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:30 pm
O’brien,
That IS the easiest way to change the starting lineup. Of course, you might have to trade Joe and fire Woody if you do that. They both love the guy. And as you say, who do you get? Joe has gotten used to Bibby, and it would be hard to find another veteran pg (for Woody’s sake) of nearly the same caliber and confidence (for JJ’s sake). It’s a tough call.
As for trading Josh, the gamble/risk is that you trade him elsewhere, only to find out that he finally matures at the age of 24 or so (not everybody matures at the same age), and starts playing incredibly well. Of course, it’s not just that by a mile. The most important thing is that if you trade him, you become more stable, not less. It has to be something that makes the team better, or at least stabilizes the team while you work another move to improve it.
Tricky stuff, as you must get the right assets in return. Sund has his work cut out for him.
Sam from da Swats
May 7th, 2009
10:30 pm
Hawks suck, its an explanation idiot, not whining. That’s what happens when refs call a game a certain way dummy.
vava74
May 7th, 2009
10:30 pm
nice move by AC… last year against Boston he had a couple of good drives to the basket too… he is obviously talented and we can point the finger to Woody for not using him more.
He does look shaky on his dribble though, always stopping the dibble at the 3-point line.
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:31 pm
Agreed. This is why I don’t get why Woody doesn’t go to his “10th man” unit earlier when the Hawks come out with more energy. If nothing else, these guys play hungry and leave it all out there. The only member of our front 7 who has that much heart is Zaza.
Hawks Fan In New Orleans
May 7th, 2009
10:33 pm
The Hawks 2nd unit is playing with “intensity” the starters only TALK about. The game was lost when Josh took the charge and the refs charged him with the foul on Lebron. Woodson benched our only sparkplug and that was a rap. The refs are making up for the bad calls in garbage time.
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:33 pm
Gardner has a lot of Flip in him with his fearlessness on offense.
Blast
May 7th, 2009
10:35 pm
Damn! Came out of church, turned on the car radio and Hawks down by 30 to start the 4th? They said Joe and Josh went out with injuries. What happened to them?
vava74
May 7th, 2009
10:36 pm
the second unit is not playing out of their own devices, they are executing what they practice.
since they are playing well, we can guess that they are well trained?
if so, then the problem is on the first unit…
harry the hawk
May 7th, 2009
10:37 pm
BLOW THIS TEAM UP:
Let’s not beat around the bush—this team suffers from a lack of heart.
Starts at the top—ownership in shambles. Rick Sund? Please…
Coach—nice guy…x’s and o’s—competent. Leader…doubtful. Have you listened to his speeches in the huddle? More insight and inspiration from a dishrag.
Mike Bibby—nice guy…fairly good shooter. Leader…no
Josh Smith…great physical talent…Young. Leader…Not even close
Joe Johnson…Underrated player…Leader….Could be, but isn’t
Horford/Williams…developing…Leaders…Nope
Bench…except for Flip and an occasional Mo sighting, invisible
This team is destined for the same–or worse—results in the near future unless the chemistry is changed drastically.
Get rid of Mike B.–too much money, not enough value in return.
Get rid of Mike W—good coach but not the right leader for this group.
Bite the bullet and trade Josh and/or bring in a leadership-type player/floor general to really run the show with he and Joe as comp pieces.
ATL won’t ascend to the next level without drastic changes.
richbrave
May 7th, 2009
10:37 pm
The referees are not being paid to bounce LeBRON from the play-offs. HE is the anointed one to play opposite KOBE and the LAKERS.
Four steps to the rim – four.!!!! Not a dribble in sight, or is he just so-o-o fast I missed it? WHEW. I predict the HAWKS will win one at home.
TheHawksFan
May 7th, 2009
10:38 pm
Why did the show Joe in that wheelchair? Thats just wrong.
Poor Woody
May 7th, 2009
10:38 pm
I ain’t got no Joe Johnson no mo’. Can I have a 4 year contract extension?
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:40 pm
I love it…the second unit doesn’t give a crap what the score is. Even if it’s “garbage time,” they’re determined to play with dignity.
Chicken Little
May 7th, 2009
10:41 pm
The sky is falling! The sky is falling! The sky is falling!
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
10:42 pm
Well, then the Hawks should, at least, get a free Taco Salad. They sure as crap helped too.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:42 pm
Harry the Hawk,
Interesting thoughts. Most of them are correct. We’ll see what happens next year. Because unless drastic changes happen this summer, you WILL be seeing this same team next year. However, if that happens, and we see the same results (or less successful ones), we’ll know for certain that certain guys have to go, be they players or coaches.
And to be honest, that might be Sund’s plan. He gave Woody a two year extension. He may wait the full two years to make any changes.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:44 pm
Chicken Little,
No. The sky is NOT falling. We’re just hitting the ceiling…
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:44 pm
vava74, no need to worry about Acie’s handle b/c he could dribble the ball thru a needle hole….
bigdave
May 7th, 2009
10:44 pm
so doubtful for sat. Sekou…?
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
10:46 pm
LMAO… Blast, you said that you just left church and the 1st word you type is “DAMN”. That’s too funny…
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:48 pm
Well, garbage time or not (as some will certainly claim), it’s obvious that our “on the end of the pine” players can do some things. Gardner is not afraid to shoot, and can hit threes. Say what you want about him going 4-11 from the field. Not any worse than JJ, Flip, or Bibby.
Hunter can rebound and play defense.
Acie can play pg. And next year, he might have to take on a much larger role. Funny, all I ever asked for was 15-20 mpg game to get him ready. That would basically give Mike Bibby good rest time, as he would be playing 28-33 mpg. Huh…
cee
May 7th, 2009
10:51 pm
wooo boy the hawks look bad real bad man i cant beleive i dont know what to say well i know what to say the cavs r better i mean way better and they want it more than the hawks true indeed the refs but u pjay through that u dont whine i never saw a ref change a call becuz of a players whine i mean do the hawks even practice it looks they they ju show up to the game on game day no chemistry what so ever how is it that mo williams is in his forst year wit the cavs and him and lebron play like theve been together for years but u look at the hawks u cant say the same i dont know what to say but i will b at the game saturday hope i see a good show i mean i know th ecavs will sho wup but will the hawks?
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
10:52 pm
Well, that was fun.
Ed
May 7th, 2009
10:52 pm
Let’s face it…Woody was only concerned about this year and winning now. He was on a short leash as he only got a one year extension and he knew they had to win early and often get enought W’s to get into the playoffs. Then if they could win the first round his job was safe and he would get another extension. Therefore he didn’t play or develop his bench and his regular rotation got totally burned out. The next extension has got to be for a longer period of time where Woody has the confidence he will be there or the same senario will happen next year. Otherwise the ASG / Sund should just let him go but that will not happen.
JOHN BARRY
May 7th, 2009
10:53 pm
HA HA HA HA HA U DUMB HAWK FANS TOLD YOU SO
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
10:54 pm
cee…are you doc’s son?
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
10:56 pm
I think that Woody could possibly do okay as a HC somewhere else in this league, but IMO it just looks like he’s done all he can with this group of players.
It’s not realistic to think that the ASG is going to bring in anyone through free agency to make a difference on this team so it’s probably going to be the same core group of players next year. Especially if they do re-sign Mike Bibby.
In the offseason last year the starters pretty much all were lobbying for Woody to return as coach but not because they respect him so much but moreso because they are all so comfortable with him (even Josh, I really think). So much so, that they have pretty much tuned him out all season and it really is very apparent that the starters have Woody tuned-out here in the playoffs. All they hear is blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Frankly speaking, the starters really have no respect at all for Woody or anything he has to say anymore. At least, that’s the way it looks to me.
cp
May 7th, 2009
10:57 pm
The second unit showed more heart than I have seen out of the regulars the first two games combined… Law should have been in earlier as Flip was terrible once again. For some reason Woodson just refuses to play Law regardless if the guys ahead of him in the rotation stink…. Hunter looks like a guy who should have received more pt in the regular season. Gardner looks like he should have gotten a few more minutes too. Too bad we got Woodpecker as a coach.. Joe probably wont play the next game and even if he does I don’t expect much from him… I guess the injury to Joe gets Woodson an excuse to lose.. I wonder how much longer we have to suffer with this cat as a coach.
MyVIew
May 7th, 2009
10:57 pm
Thanks to this blog, I now know what will happen with the Hawks. Joe is a free agent after next year. Since he failed to show up in the playoffs, he will be an expiring contract player for next year. I can see Sund trading him this summer. For who? Who knows? But I will bet he has played his way out of ATL given his contract status and playoff performance. His value just went up for the Hawks and some team looking for cap space for the 2010 offseason.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
10:58 pm
With Joe out, even winning one at home will be a tall order.
Unless some dirty ATL fan hires Tonya Harding’s co-conspirator.
Nah, we can win. We can even win the series. Just need energy. Heh…
doc
May 7th, 2009
10:58 pm
gee, i wonder if our luck changed when i took off my good luck white out t shirt and the retro smith jersey and threw it haslem style at the tv after the second blown call by the refs. my count is queen labron should have sat down earlier than josh did. tell me stern doesnt have a play in this? samuel how can you explain it any other way? the only way you can play him and stay alive is say ole’.
forgive me guys, i will have better composure next time instead of bringing us all down with my bone head move to rip the shirt off. my bad. I accept all the blame and I aim to do better when i get to the highlight factory for one last stand on saturday.
looking like my expense account that is open with the hawks will be safe for the 15th, not being negative or anything. rod which year did you make that play for? that can be your only exit strategy.
harry the hawk
May 7th, 2009
10:59 pm
Ed:
I think Woodson may be in for the shock of his life if the Hawks get blown out (yet, again) in one or both of the games at the “Highlight Factory”.
No matter how good his regular season was, there are not many front offices that will stand for getting blown out—upwards of twenty points–on national TV six times in two rounds
Rollins Tree
May 7th, 2009
11:02 pm
The right head coach will unite this team and take us to the next level. Woodson has peaked in Atlanta. He sure can’t motivate them to win on the road. Playoffs or regular season!! Michael Jordan had to go through a head coaching change before getting to the promise land and thats whats needed here.
But will the Hawks make a move or be happy with a number four seeded team that barely made it out of round one in the playoffs?
Vick Supporter
May 7th, 2009
11:02 pm
Man I’m so f’ing pissed…..these dudes body language was bad from the beginning. You can overcome a great player (LeBron) if you play team ball. The 04 Pistons proved it. They need to find a way to get JJ some good shots…….They’re bringing the double team with Zydrunas and Joe can’t see the basket…….when he swings the ball no one is converting. Hell, if we had Marvin playing, it would make no difference…he disappears….until we get a superstar player (no disrespect to JJ) or WE PLAY AS A TEAM, this is going to keep happening. Hell, the second unit played harder than the starters.
Vick 09
kwooden1
May 7th, 2009
11:05 pm
UGLY, UGLY GAME!!!
I don’t think there’s any reason to believe that Joe is playing on Saturday. Marvin’s probably out and Horford is going to be limited. Injuries happen but I think the extended minutes is starting to take its toll. I’m glad to see the second unit come in and take care of Cleveland’s second unit. I told myself I’m not going to talk about the offensive system, but clearly the bench should get more burn. Without Joe, Marvin or Horford, the starters should be Bibby, Flip, Evans, Smith and Zaza. Not a terrible lineup, but not much resistance for the Cavs. At least this will force Woody to use Acie, Gardner, Hunter and West. Hunter, looks like a guy that can play, would like to see more of him.
GO HAWKS!
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
11:05 pm
Trading Joe. Hmmm. Perhaps a bigger risk than trading Josh. The question is what do you get, and how does it fit?
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
11:06 pm
Check out this article below. Note what the POPCORN MAKER said as other players shy away from the question. Is he part of the James Entourage?
Cleveland Cavaliers’ LeBron James and Atlanta Hawks’ Josh Smith: Who can jump higher?
Sure the games will be intense, but who can jump higher, LeBron James or Josh Smith?
Thursday, May 07, 2009
Brian Windhorst
Plain Dealer Reporter
In a league filled with relative gi ants, many with remarkable leap ing ability, LeBron James and Josh Smith are a head above nearly all others. And sometimes shoulders, too.
For a number of reasons, the conference semifinal series between the Cavs and Hawks, which the Cavs lead, 1-0, heading into to night’s Game 2, is attractive. But one would be remiss not to keep an eye on a rather unique subplot, a display of perhaps the two highest jumpers in the NBA.
Smith and James have played against each other since they were teens in AAU tournaments. They could both dunk by the time they were 13. And they can now see eye-to-eye. . . . with the rim.
There are some other contenders but Smith and James are generally regarded as the two highest leapers in the NBA.
When Smith goes airborne for his trademark soaring left-handed dunks, it sometimes seems as if he’s using a hidden trampoline.
Meanwhile, James’ signature defensive play, his “chase-down” block, is predicated on his ability to simply outleap the poor opponent trying to score. Not to mention James’ own series of high-altitude slams.
So to the point, who can jump higher?
“Josh Smith,” said James.
“LeBron gets pretty high, I’m not sure,” Smith said.
“That’s a really good one, I can’t say for sure,” said Hawks guard Flip Murray, who has been a teammate with both.
“I’d have to go with LeBron,” said Lorenzen Wright, a current Cav and former Smith teammate with the Hawks.
“I don’t know. That’s a good question to put on the Web site to get a poll going,” Mo Williams said.
Beyond the opinions there is some data. When players come into the league they go through a series of standardized measurements at the Pre-Draft Camp, which was held in Chicago when James and Smith came into the league. Among the measurements is vertical leap, which is done from a standing position.
In 2003, James recorded one of the highest jumps in history when he reached 44 inches at the camp. To compare that, slam dunk contest champ Nate Robinson hit 43.5 inches in 2005. Former dunk contest champ Gerald Green, who famously blew out a candle on the back of the rim, was recorded at 39 inches as a rookie. Dwight Howard, who has shown off his ability to kiss the rim, hit 35.5 inches in 2004 when he was 18.
Smith, who was measured the same day as Howard, was recorded at 39.5 inches.
But that was when Smith and James were teens. Now full-grown men, it seems much closer, especially when running and jumping off one leg, which might add about a foot to each of their ceiling.
In March, James and Smith ended up on the floor tied up with the ball at a game in Atlanta. The result was perhaps the most entertaining jump ball of the season. Slow-motion replays might be needed but it appeared Smith won it by a centimeter or two, but the Cavs ended up with the ball so James technically got the win.
“If we did it 10 times, I’m not sure who would win,” Smith said. “I can jump pretty good off two feet, but I’m really good with one.”
His left especially, which Smith pushes off on when he takes off in transition. Then James has, as teammate Wally Szczerbiak calls it, “Go-Go Gadget calf muscle on his left leg” as well.
Smith believes he could dunk on a 12-foot rim. James in the past has said the same. A reverse version of limbo – “How high can you go?” – would make a popular halftime show.
But it seems their peers don’t need to know who can get higher. They have both left an impression.
“Those are two freaks as far as jumping. Josh Smith is bouncier. For some reason when he jumps, he just bounces, and automatically, you step back and get out of the way,” Williams said. “LeBron is more power. He’s more of a power jumper. When he jumps, you look and say, I don’t think I have a chance with that one either.”
Sean O'Shaughnessy
May 7th, 2009
11:10 pm
CLEVELAND (Reuters) – When asked by reporters, after the Cavaliers’ 105-85 win over the Atlanta Hawks, whether he felt bad for Mike Woodson’s injury-plagued team, Cleveland coach Mike Brown explained “Mike Woodson has to take care of his own problems.”
rms
May 7th, 2009
11:12 pm
Dang Blast what did you do. Walk through the back door of church and out the front door of the church and into your car! At least put the swear word at the end of the sentence….
TheAntiMe
May 7th, 2009
11:13 pm
It does look pretty bad right now. Maybe, just maybe, if they can get Big Al back at near full strenth the remaining games might at least be competitive. It ain’t looking so hot but, hey, you never know.
Hopefully the starters were watching as the 2nd unit actually ran plays, got a hand in somebody’s face on D, and just plain hustled. The problem, of course is that the Hawks starters will have to do it when LeBron is out there.
rms
May 7th, 2009
11:14 pm
Well dont the let the guys on 790sports talk radio tell you. They will certainly defend Rick Sund and the ownership and tell us we should be proud of the Hawks regardless. We should keep Woodson and hopefully next season we will win 53 games and maybe even compete in the 2nd round of the playoffs. Now thats progress…. YEAH RIGHT!!!!!
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
11:16 pm
Acie can not be on this team next year if Woody is the head coach period if so he still coaching this team and acie is still here it will be another waste year for acie because WOODY will never devolop him.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
MyVIew
May 7th, 2009
11:16 pm
Big Ray…….Big Risk indeed. But if that guy shows up on a team looking for cap space it could work. I’m glad I don’t have that decision. But if they want to pay me to make decisions…………
In any event, next year will be his last unless he redeems himself. I’m not saying I absolutely know this is the best thing, but his performance in this postseason will be hard not to consider if he wants another big payday. This would make me hesitant unless I had my horse in place on the roster already and about to add joe.
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
11:18 pm
Accordng to pundts like Bill Simmons, trading Joe will be significantly easier than trading Smth. No, he didn;t say that exactly but he did indcate that trading a 4-year deal with over $45M remaining will be a lot harder than dumping a 1-year deal. Of course, I believe that the owners will make a financial decision and not a basketball one. Said differently, I wouldn’t bet on many changes amongst those players with contracts. Change will come amongst the FAs. And as I have been saying for weeks, don’t count on next year’s payroll being as high as this season’s payroll.
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
11:18 pm
We must trade acie if WOODY is the coach next year.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
11:19 pm
Nice one, Melvin.
rms
May 7th, 2009
11:21 pm
Moses=Woodson
Joshua= New Headcoach…get it!! Moses never took the people to the promise land, Joshua did. Maybe we outta get a new, fresh face and voice in here that can take this team over the hump and into elite territory instead of hanging around the borders
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
11:25 pm
Astro Joe,
But if it was worth it to have payroll as high this year (hey, we kept Bibby), then why not next year? Curious about your view on that.
MyView,
Good point. And I’m glad I don’t have that decision either. I don’t want to dump on Joe. But at times like this, and after all this time, do you think 2 first round picks, a serviceable player, and $70 million was ultimately worth it? That’s what is going through some people’s minds, I guarantee. Sorry, but that’s what you pay for a superstar type. Now we can argue all day long about what kind of player JJ is, but the price…is it showing itself to be right? Ancient history, and some people will automatically be pissed off at having it dragged up. But just like the draft, it’s still haunting us…
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
11:27 pm
Can we get Rudy gay hmmmmmmmmmm.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
11:35 pm
Ray, I’m guessing that corporate sponsorship and luxury suite renewals will be down significantly due to the economy. They probably had a lot of those contracts locked in before thngs started hitting rock bottom around September. So assuming what we have heard is true, that most arena-based revenie comes from corporate sponsors and luxury suite purchases, that will reduce revenue. Supposedly, the salary cap will decline across the league next year, since it is based on a percentage of league revenue. That means the luxury threshold comes down too. Whatever the avg. team payroll is this season, it will almost certainly shrink next season and there is no reason to believe that our owners will go aganst the gran and have a spending spree. I’m really hoping that I’m wrong, but when I see Hunter, Gardner and West at the end of the bench, I’m not expecting our owners to shop at JCPenney. More like Dollar Tree.
Melvin
May 7th, 2009
11:35 pm
Ray, I think we could improve this team with keeping both Joe and Josh if the ASG is willing to spend the money. Signing some free agents, drafting good young talent and making some valuable trades. I don’t think we have to gut this team apart but we could add a few quality guys and be better next year. However, this is a discussing for the offseason as I’m sure we will cover all the bases than. As for now, lets get a win on Saturday….
MyVIew
May 7th, 2009
11:36 pm
With where the Hawks were, the trade for joe was well worth the price. Joe is a big reason we have even come this far. I just feel that what I am seeing means we probably cant get much further with him as our main focus.
King James
May 7th, 2009
11:37 pm
The lead of 20 points was a gift from the Cavs
History has shown that the results dont go Atlanta’s way when the boyz from Ohio come marching through the town.
Cavs in 4 folks. sorry hawks fans
Poor Woody
May 7th, 2009
11:41 pm
Hey Rick, can I have a contract extension? If it wasn’t for injuries, we could have beaten Miami 4 games to 2. If it wasn’t for injuries, things would be better. Can I have an extension? You know I will help this team win more and more games every year. Next year, we will win 57 games.
A Tribe Called Quest
May 7th, 2009
11:43 pm
Joe said he warmed up 3 hours prior to tipoff to “try” see if that would help him. Does he not know hwo to get it going?
WAKE UP
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
11:44 pm
SERIES IS OVER WHAT CAN WE DO TO IMPROVE THIS TEAM NEXT YEAR IF IM GM
1.if we are trying to win a title and not settle for less woody have to go.
2.new coach avery johnson who will coach these team and make better adjustment and take this team to the next level.
3.i would trade marvin and this year 1st and next year 1st for Rudy gay.
4. let bibby go.
5. do what every it take to bring back chill.
6. keep zaza and give flip more money.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
11:44 pm
My View,
I agree to the idea that considering where the Hawks were, a good talent was needed. I also agree that we can only get so much out of him. He’s not going to become any more than he is. Fact is, we need to get him some serious help. Paul Pierce knows what the feels like, though I think he forgot in two year’s time what it meant to work so hard and not get but so far.
The question is, how do we get him this help? And for what it’s worth, Mike Bibby is NOT the answer.
MyVIew
May 7th, 2009
11:49 pm
Astro Joe……….good point. Our owner hide their lack of spending, on the bench. I always thought our talent evaluating was sucked. Truth is, when it comes to reserves, we’re cheap. More bench vets would make this a better team. I think woody always feels like he is coaching for his job which is why he is reluctant to use his bench more. Risk vs Reward. If they dont play well, the Hawks might not show enough improvement to keep his job. But it may ultimately cost him, because if ownership is not going to pay for a more seasoned bench, then they are counting on him to develop what he has. Another tough decision.
darrell starks
May 7th, 2009
11:50 pm
COACH AVERY JOHNSON
STARTING FIVE ACIE, JOE, RUDY, JOSH, HORFORD,
BENCH PLAYER FLIP, MOE, CHILL, ZAZA.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
11:51 pm
Ray,
JJ was worth the price. Boris Diaw, and two mid-to-late first round picks? Might have been overpaying, but come on. Diaw was scrap metal around here and we would not have picked Rondo with that #21. In any case, like you always say about Marv – JJ didn’t decide what his trade price was.
In any case, it’s beyond laughable that a team would trade for JJ just to clear cap space. Seriously. Barring serious injury, JJ will get max money from somebody next year. To even consider trading him basically for liquidation purposes would be insane, because the teams that strike out on signing LeBron and Wade next summer WILL offer him max money, I guarantee it. He’s in the next tier of NBA players right below LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Duncan, CP3, and Dwight Howard (the only “one-man franchise” players in the league today) alongside players like Brandon Roy, Deron, Yao, Garnett, Nowitzki, Amare, etc – guys who can be the best player on a 45-50 win team or a co-star on a title contender. And he’s in his prime. You don’t give up a player like that unless you get a clear-cut franchise player back and/or a top 3 pick in a good draft. Period.
cdog
May 7th, 2009
11:51 pm
THE PROBLEM FACING THE HAWKS IS SOME OF THEIR HIGH PRICED PLAYERS HAVE QUIT ON THE TEAM. SUCH AS MARVIN WILLIAMS AND AL HORDFORD. THIS IS THE PLAYOFFS. YOU FIND A WAY TO PLAY.JOE JOHNSON IS TRYING TO FIND A HOLE TO HIDE. IF THEY WOULD STOP LISTENING TO THE MEDIA AND OTHERS AND GO OUT AND GET AFTER THE CALVALERS THEY WOULD WIN. BUT THEY HAVE ALREADY CONCEDED THE SERIES SIMPLY BECAUSE PEOPLES ARE TELLING THEM THEY DON’T HAVE A CHANCE. CLEVELAND IS NOT A DOMINATING TEAM. THE NBA IS TRYING TO MAKE JAMES LIKE JORDAN. THE OFFICIATING IS ONE SIDED PLUS THE HAWKS IS PLAYING INTO THEIR GAME. ITS FUSTRATING WHEN I KNOW WRONG IS BEING DONE AND NO ONE IS SAYING ANYTHING ABOUT IT.IF THEY CONCEDE THE SERIES TO THE CALVALIERS SOMEONE SHOULD STEP IN AND DISBAND THE WHOLE FRANCHISE.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
11:53 pm
Astro Joe,
That makes sense. Of course, a lot more happens at Phillips than just basketball, and it’s a year-round revenue thing. But as you say, the cap will fall, and thus the luxury tax. The ASG may be looking to weather the storm per se, and try to continue building a true contender when brighter financial days come. That doesn’t give us much to look forward to in the short term, but this is a business, and it’s not OUR money (except when you’re talking tickets, that is). We shall see. I agree about guys like Hunter, Morris, and West.
Again, I think West has some value if played properly. I don’t think the same of Morris. I’d rather pay a couple dollars more and get Mikki Moore. No, he’s not very good, but he’s better than Hunter, who doesn’t even look as good as he did with the Knicks (and that was no great thrill either). He’s not motivated. Hunter, on the other hand, seems to have some solid skills, and has hunger, unlike Morris. Gardner is hungry too, and the kid will/can shoot it from anywhere.
You have to work with what you’ve got, the best you can. I’d develop the youngsters we decide to stick with, and see what they can give us. Of course, a certain amount of trust is involved with that, but that ain’t Woody’s strong point. Of course, I wouldn’t trust much of anything if I were him either. His job isn’t the most stable in the league (unless your name is Poppovich, Sloan, or Jackson). And he’s only on a 2-year contract.
Melvin,
I don’t believe gutting the team is necessary or realistic. If you gut the team, you have to make big trades, which are always expensive. Or, you build through the draft, which means you have to go back to sucking during the regular season and praying hard over the ping pong balls. I agree that we do need some smart trades. We will get to discuss more of this once the season is over, of course. Look for some serious hot and heavy stuff on the Hawks Hacks regarding this, over the summer when we’re all bored.
niremetal
May 7th, 2009
11:54 pm
Joe,
ASG is in a better position than almost any owner/ownership group in the league to weather this economy. Trust me.
MyVIew
May 7th, 2009
11:54 pm
Ray……I never mentioned getting Joe More help because, I have no faith in ownership spending more money. From everything I hear, that is just not likely. That would definitely be the better move keeping our core in tact.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
11:55 pm
Niremetal,
Rhetorical question to somebody I’ve never talked to before (that I know of), and was curious about his thoughts on the matter.
Hence the disclaimer “…I hate to bring this up…I know it will piss some people off..”
You know where I stand on this issue.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
11:57 pm
Niremetal,
That’s also why I said trading Joe was riskier than trading Josh…
Astro Joe
May 7th, 2009
11:59 pm
What has Avery Johnson done in his most recent playoff appearances that has you guys convinced that he is an upgrade? Isn’t he the same coach who made Jason Kidd (Jason Kidd, not Jason Hart but Jason Kidd) run plays as opposed to letting Jason Kidd run the team’s offense? And aren’t the Mavs who are in the second round of the playoffs pretty much the identical team that Avery did nothing with last year (didn’t they miss the playoffs last season)? Do you not remember the Mavs-Warriors series when his playoff strategy resulted in the biggest playoff upset in NBA history?
Talk to me about Doug Collins or Mike Fratello. Heck, Mark Jackson or Bill Laimbeer. I’ll even entertain names like Keith Smart or Brian Shaw. But Avery Johnson? No, thanks.
Big Ray
May 7th, 2009
11:59 pm
Trading Joe is something that is easy to say after watching him average 15ppg in the playoffs. It’s easier than dealing with the larger issues surrounding the team.
What’s more difficult is accepting the fact that Joe was acquired to build a team around. And if you trade him, you better be getting something ELSE to build the team around in exchange. Unless of course, you think you have something to build your team around on this roster, ALREADY. And other than Joe Johnson, what might that be?
Tough question, eh?
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
12:04 am
MyView,
You never know. I didn’t expect them to keep such a high payroll this year, but they did. As Astro Joe says, don’t look for that NEXT year, but some smart trading could aleviate the issue. Don’t ask me how to go about that, but certain names come to mind from our team. The question is, who to get…Unless of course, we can expect to develop existing players. That hasn’t worked so far, for a variety of reasons. But we’re speculating into the future…however close or far that may be.
MyVIew
May 8th, 2009
12:06 am
niremetal…..sure some team will give joe max money, but I bet that team won’t have to place the same priorities on him as the hawks. Having j0e makes plenty of sense if you have other veteran leaders or a star. THe hawks dont which is why for the money he would be expendible to the hawks. And just because some team gets him as an expiring contract says nothing against joe. That team is ridding themselves of some other contract and simply using joes contract to do so. He would still hit the free agent market where he can get his money.
The hawks need a leader who holds others accountible in crunch time. That leader has to pull the team together during games. Thats what leaders do. They get in peoples faces if needed or rally the team in adversity. Not all people have that in them. Not a bad thing, just reality.
For what its worth, my personality is more like joes than an in your face leader.
Astro Joe
May 8th, 2009
12:07 am
niremetal, I’d love to trust you but I have no evidence. No history of investment when things were good. If they had done something as basic as cut loose Gardner and make a run at Adonal F’ing Foyle, then I would be inclined to trust you. Had they traded Harrington for a basketball player and not salary cap space, that would help. Had I not read several articles about hiring a GM on the cheap, then I may have some inkling of an optimistic notion. If I didn’t watch them gut the Thrashers and fire 2-3 of the top execs in the ASG, then I could possibly feel hopeful. And if I believed that the reason we initially had 8 owners was because these guys just enjoy a partnership (as opposed to none of them having the Cuban-like wealth to go it alone), then I could truly believe. Don’t take it personally, but I ain’t buying what you’re selling. And man, I hope you’re right and I’m wrong.
J.J.M.
May 8th, 2009
12:11 am
josh is playing hard. its just the injuries. when joe gets doubled that leads to one person open that can really shoot and thats bibby. mo evans can only shoot threes. if marvin was healthy the double team would hurt the cavs badly because marvin can shoot mid and long range shots.
calico cat
May 8th, 2009
12:12 am
cdog,
You are an idiot . . . Horford and Marvin are injured – how do you equate that to them quitting on the team?
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
12:12 am
AVERY would be perfect for the hawks if it wasnt for that silly gm who wanted jason kidd for devin harris avery would still be coaching dallas and may be would have won a title that was one of the worst trade for dallas and that franchise.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
A Tribe Called Quest
May 8th, 2009
12:12 am
CAN SOMEONE ON THIS TEAM PLEASE COMMIT A HARD FOUL? FOUL LEBRON. FOUL MO.
DO SOMETHING
STOP BEING TIMID LITTLE LOSERS. SOLOMON JONES WAS ABOUT TO PISS HIS PANTS OUT THERE
harry the hawk
May 8th, 2009
12:16 am
Ray:
One other trend point….all of the teams that have ascended to the elite level now generally have three legitimate scoring/cover options (Cavs,Bos,Lak,Den,Hou,Orl,etc….Phil,Dal and Mia are questionable…but so is their status as elite teams.
With that in mind, the Hawks have 1 1/2 sure-fire candidates (Joe and whoever shows up)…two on a good night (Joe/Josh, Joe/Mike)….soemtimes, three when they’re firing on all cylinders.
If we keep Joe, can Josh become a CONSISTENT scoring threat bringing us up to two bodies we can count on every for scoring/legit cover every night? Assuming Mike B is not the answer, does that option exist on the bench now? If not, who might it be?
Know I’m looking ahead a bit but the Hawks current holes are being magnified as they play better teams every night in the playoffs. As we assess moves, let’s also keep in mind that our competition is assessing this same issue: I.e. Chris Bosh potentially going to Miami to help DWade
Thoughts?
hawkman
May 8th, 2009
12:16 am
when did they let the Clippers in the playoffs. Who was that team in Cleveland tonight?
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
12:17 am
Y’all are funny… the Hawks get their asses beat in a couple of playoff games against a far superior team and y’all are talking about gutting the roster. We all knew at the start of this season that this was not an elite team, and we’ve known throughout the season even as the Hawks fought their way to home court advantage in the first round that the Hawks are not an elite team. Is it really surprising, then, that the best team in the league is kicking their asses at home when the Hawks are missing two starters and have a third in (highly questionable) foul trouble throughout the game?
I think we all know at this point that Joe Johnson is not the same caliber player as the best player on any of the other remaining teams in the playoff field. That was apparent even before tonight’s game. Joe is a very good #2, not a legit #1. Would I trade him? Not unless I was getting a legit #1 in return. If the cash-strapped Hornets offered CP3 for a package including Joe on the condition that the Hawks take one of their other hideous contracts like Peja or Chandler, hell yeah I’d do it. But if not, the Hawks could do a lot worse than Joe Johnson as their best player.
There’s usually not much you can learn from a thorough beatdown like tonight’s game. But if there is one thing we can learn it’s that the bench players Woody has neglected throughout the season are capable of contributing here and there, and it’s in the Hawks’ best interest to give them spot minutes. Yeah, they were playing mostly against Cleveland’s scrubs, but that doesn’t mean Thomas Gardner, Othello Hunter, and most importantly Acie Law can’t play some quality possessions in closer games either. I wouldn’t go as far as to say Woody’s overuse of the starters has led to this injury quagmire in which the Hawks currently are, but you gotta think there is some relationship between the two.
Astro Joe
May 8th, 2009
12:18 am
Marvin’s injuries are literally costing him millions in free agency and yet people are calling him soft. I’m sure that his agent would have him on the court in a wheelchair if he could. All of the good things he did this year have been essentially forgotten as his team has been forced to play without him. Dude is obviously injured. No one should question if he is truly incapable of getting on the court.
EAST ATLANTA HAWKS FAN
May 8th, 2009
12:18 am
YOU GUYS ARE MAD AT WOODSON? YOU WANT HIM FIRED?
YOU ARE RACISTS
JOSH SMITH PICKS UP A TECHNICAL AND EVERYONE GETS MAD?
RACISTS
JOE GETS INJURED AND YOU ALL ARE UPSET/
RACISTS
ALL OF YOU ARE WHITE SUPREMACIST RACISTS. I HATE YOU RACISTS
Astro Joe
May 8th, 2009
12:26 am
Two Joe Johnson trades to leave you with for the night.
Joe for Vince Carter?
Joe for Baron Davis and Ricky Davis (need Ricky to make the salaries match).
hawkman
May 8th, 2009
12:27 am
Coach Larry Brown got the Bobcats up and coming.Chris Bosh maybe going to Miami.Orlando Magic is at their strongest.And the Wizards will have agent zero coming back. Is Mike Woodson the man to get through this division next year. I know his record improve, but to improve next from 47 wins up he would have to win more road games,and beat elite teams who is also going for 50 wins.Also the Hawks have to beat bad teams on their off nights. Coach Woodson has prove he can do any of these things.
MyVIew
May 8th, 2009
12:29 am
Did anyone hear the reporter say Mo says the other team having fun is demoarlizing. I was disappointed to hear he said that, and I hope he was misinterpreted. That is probably true, and that in and of itself is why we have looked so bad on the road. Playing basketball demoarlized while the other team is riding high is a sure recepie for an L. That mentality may be impossible to change.
Astro Joe
May 8th, 2009
12:29 am
Darrell, the same Avery that was up 2-0 and headed back to Dallas in The Finals against Wade & Shaq and then lost 4 consecutive games? That Avery? Who returned the next season and lost in epic fashon to the Warriors in a 1-8 match-up? That Avery? And then refused to give the offense to Jason Kidd? That Avery? Or is there another one that you’re thinking about?
Astro Joe
May 8th, 2009
12:34 am
MyView, Hawks learned ntensity last season from the Celtics. Maybe, they will learn the importance of chemistry this season from the Cavs. Of course, that assumes that some off-season bonding would do the trick.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
12:37 am
Despite my somewhat weak defense of Joe Johnson above though, I will say this: in the long term, I don’t think Joe Johnson is any more valuable to this team than Josh Smith. As much criticism as Josh takes on this blog and from other sources, Joe takes just as many bad shots and attempts just as many ill-advised passes, especially in road games like tonight. If you are going to criticize Josh for having a low basketball IQ (which is bullsh*t) then that should apply to Joe as well. And between the two, in the long run I’d rather have the guy who does the occasional dumb sh*t mixed in with several great plays and actually showing that he’s emotionally invested in the outcome of the game (Smith), than the guy who does the occasional dumb sh*t without any apparent indication that he cares about the play of his team or the outcome of the game in general (Johnson). J-Smoove may not be anywhere close to being a leader at this point in time, but you need that fire in order to be a leader at any point in your career, which leads me to believe he can become that. I doubt Joe will ever be that guy.
I would definitely not trade Joe for Vince or Baron though… Joe is nowhere near as injury-prone or as hot and cold as those two, and both of them have proven that they can’t get their team any further than the second round as their team’s centerpiece.
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
12:39 am
astro what are you talking about marc silly ass cuban made that dumb trade kidd for harris avery did not want kidd he even said it that trade destroyed the hole chemistry who avery had coach that team to a 63-19 and had the best record in the nba.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
MyVIew
May 8th, 2009
12:42 am
Astro Joe… Yeah I still remember when KG said the Hawks only get up for the Celtics, but the Celtics get up for all 82. And the Cavs chemistry is very fairytale-ish. You always hear football coaches saying that the championship teams all love each other, and you can literally see that on the cavs. Mike Brown must be a very nice guy when nobody is watching. I don’t want to diminish his accomplishments, but LeBron is the reason for the chemistry and the W’s. He is unstoppable one on one, but at the same time, he makes all of the role players feel important. That is why they play the way they do. Lucky Mike Brown.
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
12:43 am
OKAY ASTRO WHAT COACH YOU WOULD LIKE TO HAVE INSTEAD OF AVERY?
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!
niremetal
May 8th, 2009
12:44 am
Astro Joe,
I hope you don’t take this personally either, but none of the things you just said has any substance. Of course they didn’t invest in signing new players when the Belkin litigation looked like it might deprive them of the team and leave them with only 8 cents on the dollar of what it was worth. But as soon as it got reversed on appeal, they overpaid to get Mike Bibby. How is that not investing when things were good?
THEY didn’t trade Al for a draft pick, Billy did. AND that was in the midst of the Belkin litigation. AND not to put too fine a point on it, but what player could we have gotten for Al that would have been worth it at that point?
And the articles you read saying they were looking to hire a GM on the cheap were obviously written by guys talking out of their a$$ since they hired Sund, who I promise did not come cheap as NBA GMs go.
They downsized because there were people around there getting paid $2M/year and working only part-time. Most of their downsizing has been at the Thrashers which, I’m quite convinced, they would not have purchased in the first place if Turner weren’t intent on selling the Thrashers off along with the Hawks and Phillips Arena. And Turner was trying to unload the Thrashers for good reason – that team has been hemorrhaging money almost continuously since it was established. Not sure if you’ve noticed, but Atlanta’s not a hockey town. It actually speaks volumes about their willingness to invest in the Hawks that they increased the Hawks’ payroll significantly in each of the past two seasons despite the fact that they were posting massive loss margins with the Thrashers.
And how on earth can you think that having Cuban-like wealth is somehow more stable than having 7 different owners with holdings in several different industries and in several different geographical markets? Not sure if you noticed, but a bunch of billionaires have been pantsed by this economy, which is why you see stories popping up in the Wall Street Journal about professional sports franchise owners quietly looking for minority partners to spread the risks associated with owning a franchise. In this economy, you want to spread ownership, not consolidate it. The last thing I’d want in this economy is for us to put all our eggs in the basket of a single owner.
Anyway, that’s a portion of my take
.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
12:44 am
“Marvin’s injuries are literally costing him millions in free agency and yet people are calling him soft. I’m sure that his agent would have him on the court in a wheelchair if he could. All of the good things he did this year have been essentially forgotten as his team has been forced to play without him. Dude is obviously injured. No one should question if he is truly incapable of getting on the court.”
At least for the purposes of this response, I’m not questioning whether or not he can play. I am questioning, however, whether he really is worried by the prospects of losing millions in free agency. We are talking about a guy whose entire basketball career has been based on potential. If being a 6th man in college was good enough for him to be drafted #2 overall, why wouldn’t he once again be inclined to assume that he will get paid in free agency based on his potential as opposed to actual production?
Some players have a higher pain tolerance than others and it’s completely believable that he doesn’t think he can play with the pain he’s currently experiencing. But the fact is that players with lower pain tolerances come to be labeled as soft in sports. Maybe it’s not fair, but that’s how it is. And when Marvin’s front court teammate can come back from a very severe-looking ankle injury to gut out a deciding Game 7 while he rides the bench in street clothes, it does create an impression in the minds of people watching, fair or not.
tiger woo
May 8th, 2009
12:56 am
Stop the nonsense !! Did anyone really expect anything different?
The Hawks – still worn down and fatigued after a 7 game series with Miami, go up against a Cleveland squad – well rested after an easy 4 game sweep of Detroit – led by the league MVP – and his deep and talented supporting cast – in an arena they have only lost 2 times this year – one was the final game when Lebron and other starters didn’t play – not to mention that the Hawks are missing 2 starters – forcing then to start 2 bench players. Then to add insult to injury, JJ gets hurt.
One can only hope that some home cookin’ will somehow motivate the Hawks to get a win or two at home !! No matter what happens, it has been a good run. Go Hawks !!
mykhalc
May 8th, 2009
12:57 am
get a real HC and we’ll get a real ‘team’ outta this same group. book it!!
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
12:58 am
NO WAY TRADE JOE OR JOSH WE NEED A STAR POTENTIAL PLAYER AT THE 3 WHO IS YOUNG AND UP IN COMING SOME ONE LIKE A RUDY GAY WHO WOULD BE GREAT TO COMPLIMENT JOE AND JOSH.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
mykhalc
May 8th, 2009
12:59 am
i don’t think many really thought we’d a have a chance in this series but playin’ without pride and urgency is inexcusable even on the road!!
kirkinga
May 8th, 2009
12:59 am
Lesson #2 In the books and it was still a very hard lesson. The Cavs are the superior team though we need to wait and see how the Hawks respond to the challenge at home. How quickly we forget they took a superior team(and eventual champions) to seven games despite horrendous blow outs on the road.
I love all the easy talk of max contracts going on. Seems people have forgotten that many teams are broke! We saw a “slow market” for free agents last year and the economy has gotten worse.Even it things do turn around sometime next year there are only going to be so many owners that recovered sufficiently enough to go throw max contracts at the true superstars. The second-tier players like JJ are not going to get max contracts there just isn’t enough money for excess.
Remember how many were shocked at what Josh eventually signed for after overestimating the market.
Rick Sund will have to earn his money the next two offseasons. I don’t envy his task as whatever he does, or does not do will no doubt catch the ire of some contingent of Hawks fans.
I predict another intensely fun Summer here on the Hawks blog!
But the season is not over. The Hawks are who they have been all season long including in Round 1. There really shouldn’t be anyone surprised at how the Hawks played in the first two games.
No time to be jumping ship folks!
Go Hawks!!
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
1:00 am
Harry the Hawk,
Good thoughts. I’ve thought the same thing a few times myself. In order for Josh to become that second option, he has to 1) Grow up quickly, and become a steady veteran, if not a leader. 2) Get better on that jumper. 3) Play to your strengths as a slasher/dunker/low post scorer.
And it’s not all up to him. His teammates and coaches have to trust him and encourage him to be this type of player. And that means getting him the ball in the right spots as much as possible.
Bottom line though: Josh has to play like a legit all-star (voted in or not), for this to work.
But he has to do all of this NEXT YEAR. Otherwise, what are our options? I think we can expand what Marvin does for us. He has the skills to score more. But he’s not a second option right now. In fact, I’m not looking for him to be. I think he’s a good third option, properly used. But we would need him AND Josh to step up their games significantly, chemistry-wise if nothing else. If they play together better, they’ll both score more. But we have to run that system the right way, instead of trying to run every stinking play through JJ, or Mike Bibby. I think both guys can reliably give you 17ppg. JJ can still give you 22 a game. Isn’t that about how Orlando gets by? One guy who gives you 20-something a game, and two guys who give you 17-19 a game? But I digress…
Mike Bibby is past that point, period. He does fit, however, on a team that features a 2-guard who gives you 20+ a game, two forwards that give you 17 or more per, and all he has to do is give you double figures in scoring and half a dozen assists or so.
But again, do we have that team? And if not, then why not? Then you have to figure out who to get, to solve that issue.
This is why I wasn’t totally willing to throw away the idea of getting a guy like Amare Stoudamire.
Here’s an idea: try to figure out a way get Bosh to not go quite as far south as Dade County…
tiger woo
May 8th, 2009
1:05 am
mykhalc,
Don’t blame Woody for this one – gotta go back home and somehow get that first win. Not optimistic though – no Marvin, no Al, and probably no JJ or a hobbled JJ in game 3.
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
1:05 am
Kirk,
I see you got my note. Squishiness at all time level. MUST…STOP…THE…SQUISH…
tiger woo
May 8th, 2009
1:08 am
Chris Bosh is Josh Smith with a jump shot. Now way those 2 could co-exist on the floor.
mykhalc
May 8th, 2009
1:11 am
tiger woo, i wish i could excuse the cat. but to see the same $hita$$ effort on the road, all year, is directly tied to not bein’ ‘prepared’ to play. coaching has got to be able to get the team thru some games, right?!!? NEVER have i seen coachin’ be the positive difference for this team!!! NEVER…EVER…PERIOD!!!
mykhalc
May 8th, 2009
1:13 am
gimme BOSH and OUTLAW for JS and MW!! just sayin’…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
1:13 am
Najeh:
“There’s usually not much you can learn from a thorough beatdown like tonight’s game. But if there is one thing we can learn it’s that the bench players Woody has neglected throughout the season are capable of contributing here and there, and it’s in the Hawks’ best interest to give them spot minutes. Yeah, they were playing mostly against Cleveland’s scrubs, but that doesn’t mean Thomas Gardner, Othello Hunter, and most importantly Acie Law can’t play some quality possessions in closer games either. I wouldn’t go as far as to say Woody’s overuse of the starters has led to this injury quagmire in which the Hawks currently are, but you gotta think there is some relationship between the two.”
Co-sign that, brother. Co-sign that.
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
1:14 am
Astro Joe:
“Marvin’s injuries are literally costing him millions in free agency and yet people are calling him soft. I’m sure that his agent would have him on the court in a wheelchair if he could. All of the good things he did this year have been essentially forgotten as his team has been forced to play without him. Dude is obviously injured. No one should question if he is truly incapable of getting on the court.”
Co-sign that, too.
zen
May 8th, 2009
1:16 am
You guys have been complaining about flagrant fouls committed by cav players while that thug ZsaZsa or Zaza breaks one of our player`s nose on a non-call in game one with an elbow, Then in game two, he elbows our starting point guard in the face,taking him out of the game on a non-call injuring his eye.
The man should be playing hockey,not basketball!
The winning strategy the Hawks need is to put “windmill” “Petunia” on James and try to mug him so you guys can win at least one.
If I was Mike Brown, I`d have Ben Wallace clean the dude`s clock every time he touched the ball `till he`d beg Woodson to take him out of the game!
mykhalc
May 8th, 2009
1:17 am
sadly also, is i think the HAWKS have accomplished their goals for the year. i think the coach and team are satisfied that, 1) made the playoffs with a better record 2) made it into the 2nd round. their hearts are ready to go FISHIN’!!!1
tiger woo
May 8th, 2009
1:21 am
mykhalc,
Baby steps – the Hawks won their first playoff series in years – good accomplishment – they need to watcj\h how Cleveland does it’s business and learn from this.
Hawks are simply not a good road team – at the same time, the Utah Jazz, coached by the great Jerry Sloan, had a worse road record that the Hawks, not to mention the drilling they took in the first round
So you might ask, is it the coaching? Is Jerry Sloan overrated?
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
1:21 am
Tiger Woo,
No, Bosh is a steady rebounder who needs no motivation. Josh is more athletic and scarier on defense. One is an all-star who doesn’t take games or plays off. He leads his team better than some I can think of. The other is trying to find his way in a chaotic offense. And I didn’t say anything about the two of them co-existing….
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
1:27 am
Tiger Woo,
Baby steps, I agree with. But it’s been 4 or 5 years. Why can this team not PLAY TOGETHER….STILL?
And are you going to compare us to Utah? They played the freakin’ Lakers, dude. Anybody was going to get drilled except Houston…
Sloan is a top coach.
tiger woo
May 8th, 2009
1:28 am
Big Ray,
I wasn’t disputing anything you said – just makin’ an observation that the 2 have similar post games – Bosh is the better shooter – probably one or the other but not both in the same lineup.
J.J.M.
May 8th, 2009
1:30 am
I like Horofrd but how come when he post up he always fade away from the contact instead of banging and trying to draw the contact? I would keep joe no matter what. the hawks are what they are because of him. Josh smith, gotta keep him good on D and is improving playing in the paint(coach has to keep him away from the 3 point line when running the offense.)and of course hes a fan favorite(fills up the arena seats) mike bibby, I would keep him and it shouldnt cost us a lot to keep him. i wouldnt wanna break up the team chemistry by letting him go. marvin im not so sure about. he had a good season but if we can save money by trading him and bringing in more players im up for it(saving money could lead us to resigning horford and joe)
tiger woo
May 8th, 2009
1:31 am
Ray,
Just like we’re supposed to get drilled by Cleveland – same difference.
I know Sloan is a top coach – just making a point that it’s not necessarily coaching (Woody) that makes the Hawks a poor road team.
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
1:33 am
TO GET BOSH YOU WOULD HAVE TO TRADE HORFORD OR JOSH WHO GOES?
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!
Rollins Tree
May 8th, 2009
1:34 am
YOU IDIOTS WE DONT TRADE ANY OF THESE GUYS!!!! WE GET A NEW COACH THAT KNOWS HOW TO MAKE THEIR CHEMISTRY HAPPEN MORE THAN THE CRUNK HOME GAMES.
You telling me that that magical chemistry we see off and on should be ripped apart? Nope!! You get a head coach that gets them to play like that night after night. Woody has done all he can do in this town.
J.J.M.
May 8th, 2009
1:35 am
darrell starks
what are you talkin about lol we dont have to make a trade just wait till 2010
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
1:36 am
I LIKE BIBBY BUT THE PRICE IS TO HIGH PLUS WE HAVE TO MANY BREAK DOWN AT THE POINT ON DEFENSE.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sharif Abdur Rahim
May 8th, 2009
1:37 am
Yall could have used my intensity out there.
tiger woo
May 8th, 2009
1:39 am
Rollins Tree,
It’s gonna take more than a new head coach to get to the next level – gotta bring in more talent, if possible – look at Cleveland – look at all the talent they’ve brought in to compliment Lebron.
So, maybe we’re all not idiots after all . . .
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
1:40 am
TREE WHATS UP BRO YOU NO BASKETBALL AND I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU HEY TREE GIVE ME AVERY PHONE NUMBER I NEED TO CALL HIM ITS IMPORTANT.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!
calico cat
May 8th, 2009
1:42 am
Avery who? How many championships has he won? Oh, my bad . . .
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
1:48 am
TREE THERE ARE 4 CHANGES I WOULD MAKE BRO
1.TRADE MARVIN AND 1ST AND NEXT YEAR 1ST FOR RUDY GAY.
2.LET BIBBY GO BECAUSE OF THE MONEY AND HE IS A LIABILITY AT THE POINT ON DEFENSE.
3.BRING BACK CHILL.
4.CHANGE COACH YOU CAN TELL THAT WOODY CANT TAKE US TO THE NEXT LEVEL.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
1:55 am
TREE WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT THIS TEAM
AVERY COACH
STARTER ACIE, JOE , RUDY, JOSH, HORFORD
BENCH FLIP, MOE , CHILL, ZAZA. AND WE PICK UP A SOLID BIG MAN.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
kirkinga
May 8th, 2009
2:01 am
I see you got my note. Squishiness at all time level. MUST…STOP…THE…SQUISH.
Darn skippy Big Ray!
The squish has confounded many all season long, I’m thinking about looking into the possibility of getting some Mike Woodson Fat Head’s made to help address the issue.
Go Hawks!!
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
2:07 am
Tiger Woo,
I agree. It will take more than better coaching, we need more talent. But we still need somebody to do more with what we have, whether it’s what we have, or more. Somebody has to put it all together. Get the talent. Fire Woody if he can’t put it together.
Darrell Starks,
The answer is Josh Smith. Yes, I said it. Why? Bosh is a proven all-star who will bring it every night. He’s not the fire-it-up scary shot-blocker that Smith is. But he’s 6′11″ of firey competition EVERY SINGLE NIGHT. He’s a legit #1/#2 option. Look at his stats.
The other reason is, out of Horford, Smith, and Bosh…only Horford can truly play center. And he’s the only one who has no problem doing it. Horford, Bosh, Marvin (unless he’s gone), JJ, Bibby.
No more double and triple teams for JJ. No more 40+ minute games. Two huge punches in the lineup with three good supports. Now just develop the bench and add another big.
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
2:12 am
LOL! Good one, Kirk….
Spud Webb
May 8th, 2009
2:13 am
Jon Koncak and I are the point guard and center you need. ASG, holla at me!
tbhawksfan
May 8th, 2009
2:15 am
Four years ago I said Woodson was an inneffective coach. Three years a go I said there were two camps on the Hawks; Woodson / JJ and Smoove and the rest. That’s why JJ supported Woodson the last two off-seasons. He knew that without Woodson, he would loose his majority power. I never could belive that JJ actually thought Woodson was good. Woodson was only good for JJ’s stats.
Now we are where we were two or three years ago; the only improvement is due to natural maturation of a very young but talented group. We need NBA coaching and team chemistry. Can’t have your two best players in separate, conflicting camps. That’s what we have.
New coach, rework the roster. Not a blow up, but these problems need to be addressed. Should have been two seasons ago.
47 games and a second round reality check are not going to cut it. This group is approaching maturity and Woodson has under-achieved, as have the group of players.
What is the solution? New coach and settle the player rift by any means (without of course entering into bad trades).
Redundancy is doing the same thing over and over when there is nothing to gain from continuing.
Crazy is to redundantly make the same mistake over and over.
The Hawks have been and are redundantly crazy.
New coach, eliminate player rift.
Enough time and potential has been WASTED with poor coaching and team disfunctinality.
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
2:15 am
BIG BROTHER RAY I LIKE THAT BUT ITS HARD TO GIVE UP ON A PLAYER LIKE JOSH WHO HAS SO MUCH POTENTIAL.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Lon Kruger
May 8th, 2009
2:19 am
darrell,
who needs Avery Johnson. THE HAWKS NEED ME!!! When I was coach, I did not have the likes of JJ, Bibby and Mo Evan. I COULD TAKE THIS ROSTER DEEP INTO JUNE.
Lon Kruger
May 8th, 2009
2:24 am
thehawksfan,
DITTO!!!
I am the coach needed to mend this rift between JJ and J Smith. Rick Sund should rehire me.
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
2:49 am
Darrell Starks,
Trust me, I don’t like it. And I don’t want to give up on Josh either. But this is a business, and it’s about putting the best product you can on the floor. Again, if it’s Horford you trade, then you’re either also having to go get yourself another center (unless you want Zaza starting), or you force Bosh to play out of position, which he will absolutely hate (which is why Bargnani plays that spot in Toronto these days). And then, are you putting Josh at the 3? Not the best idea, especially with such a suspect jumper.
Josh is an over-sized 3 without a good jumper. And neither he nor Bosh can hold the paint without a rugged guy behind them. Zaza is a bit rugged, but he’s off-the-bench rugged, not starter rugged. Love him in his role. But a starting center he is not.
Bob Weiss
May 8th, 2009
2:49 am
Suckas
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
2:56 am
And I agree that it’s hard to make a decision like that. But we can either add another “already legit” all-star caliber player, or we can figure out how to make one on our own. Your choices are Josh, Al, and Marvin. Neither Woody, nor the players involved have shown me that this is going to happen. Josh can’t seem to play to his strengths, while some of his teammates can’t seem to get him the ball in the right place, and his coach has him going to spots on the floor where he is at a disadvantage on offense.
Al will never become the offensive player he could be as long as we keep him at the center position, simply because that calls for him to try and score MORE against bigger competitors. He struggles against guys that are 6′11″ and bigger, unless he’s in a position where he can use his superior quickness and floor speed. We don’t run, so that nullifies his ability.
Marvin is the 4th option on offense. He has very little post game, is better at driving than he used to, and shoots the jumper well. But he’s less aggressive than Josh at times. I still see more potential in him, but there’s no guarantee he can put up 20+ a game, and he doesn’t command double teams by any stretch of the imagination.
And we’re not like Larry Brown’s old Detroit Team. We just don’t share and trust each other that much, nor do we set all the screens they used to set for Rip Hamilton and Chauncey Billups.
That’s why I say if you have to trade for Bosh, your best bet is to trade Josh.
BosnianBaller
May 8th, 2009
3:10 am
Trading Joe and Josh would be stupid.You are building around Joe,Josh,and Al.Now Marvin Williams is a different thing.The Hawks showed in the regular and post season that they can win w/out him.I would ship Marvin and Law and maybe the 1st this year to get a real good player(Bosh).Or better yet trade Marvin and Law to move up and get a True Center in Thabeet since we haven’t had a true center since Ratliff or Mutumbo.Doing this would put Al in the 4 spot Josh in the 3.We would be one of the best teams on Defense and sign shooter to come off the bench.
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
3:27 am
Thabeet? Are you kidding? That guy doesn’t even try on the court. He’s 7′3″ with enough weight that he should be dominating. But he’s not. I’d rather have Roy Hibbert than Thabeet. That guy plays like he’s the second coming of Manute Bol.
Josh at the 3. How many 3s in this league have to do nearly all of their scoring in the paint? I’m just sayin’….
BosnianBaller
May 8th, 2009
3:37 am
It’s all about D.By the way Thabeet is projected number 3.You can have scorers off the bench,What would you do Ray?No team in the playoffs gives up lay ups and dunks like the hawks.Thabeet will be like Camby
Ed
May 8th, 2009
3:38 am
J-Chill has been sorely missed. He was the glue on the court and his contribution was vastly underrated.
Ray, the Cavs will win it all and not the Lakers. There’s so much that can be argued about the talent between the two teams but not the chemistry. Cleveland’s is off the charts…
EAST ATLANTA HAWKS FAN
May 8th, 2009
3:49 am
Zaza Pachulia, a bulldog who scuffled with seemingly every Miami Heat player in the first round, taps Mo Williams on the chest, acknowledging that he fouled him in the second quarter. Maurice Evans, his team trailing by 18 less than 18 minutes into the game, extends a hand to James, picking him up after fouling him on a drive to the basket.
BosnianBaller
May 8th, 2009
3:51 am
Ray the reason I like Thabeet in my line up is because I think that Al will eventually score inside on a consistant basis.Smith plays all over the floor.Hawks would take more inside shots and shoot a higher percentage.All the Hawks do now is shooy jumpers you cant win like that
E343
May 8th, 2009
3:55 am
try playing 41minutes a game, 82games.obviously JJ is not the problem. i think that the hawks need to play more people even if its for the shortest period of time. it will help the chemistry and JJ gets to rest. the hawks also need to get another 3 point shooter to stretch the court+ give passing lanes when that double team goes to JJ. PG of the future acie law needs time, with the office up front bibby might not come back and neither will flip. the hawks will NEVER make the finals with a seven man rotation. in terms of the season im just amazed at how much the team has improved. people need to stop jumping the gun with this no shoe joe bull. your lucky we have an allstar and have way more than 15wins
E343
May 8th, 2009
4:15 am
1 more thing, sum of y’all never think, it makes y’all sound ignorant on the fact that we have a young team. all these trade scenarios wont workout. they upgrade one spot but downgrade another. Centers develop into the league its one of the more risky spots on the court Horford will only take in so much at a time.. FA is the best bet to improve , trading picks for veteran players is your second option your last option should be the draft, we seriously don’t need any more rookies to groom
McGarrett
May 8th, 2009
4:46 am
I will support a squad that goes out there and competes but these Hawks are sumn else altogether. There is no heart, will nor pride out there at all. I don’t know why I expected anything different.
Coach D
May 8th, 2009
4:47 am
Didn’t get to see J. Johnson’s sprain, but it sure seemed to me that’s his ankle/feet/legs have been hurting since game 5 or 6 of the Heat series. He has not been moving fluidly at all. Saekhou, got any insight into this assumption?
Just hope we won’t get embarrassed in Atlanta. Still cheering for ya’ Hawks!
Mike
May 8th, 2009
4:49 am
Remember the Hawks weren’t in any of those games in Boston last year. It’s a different game in Atlanta. The Hawks can still make a series out of this. If 37-45 can take 66-16 to seven…47-35 can too.
A Tribe Called Quest
May 8th, 2009
5:28 am
1) The Cavs are extremely rested and LeBron barely has to play any minutes
2) I’m so sick of this excessive celebration the Cavs do. Every time they score and LBJ isn’t in the game, he runs what seems like to half court to hi-five his teammates.
arrogant idiots
A Tribe Called Quest
May 8th, 2009
5:38 am
WHY DOES NO ONE ON THE TEAM COMPLAIN ABOUT LEBRON FOULING AND NOT GETTING CALLED?
HE HAS 1 FREAKING PERSONAL FOUL IN THIS SERIES. I SAW 5 TIMES HE SHOULDA BEEN CALLED FOR THE FOUL YESTERDAY.
WHERE WAS WOODSON TO COMPLAIN ABOUT THAT? INSTEAD, HE GETS HIS T ARGUING ABOUT TACKY SH*T LIKE BIBBY’S LAYUP. WHO CARES ABOUT BIBBY? HE’S BOWLEGGED AND HAS TO TAKE 2 STEPS SIDEWAYS BEFORE HE TAKES 1 STEP FORWARD.
FREAKING GET IN THE REFS FACES ABOUT THESE BS NO-CALLS AND SHOW SOME HEART. COMMIT A HARD FOUL. DO SOMETHING
A Tribe Called Quest
May 8th, 2009
5:41 am
WE CANT GET 1 EASY BASKET AGAINST THIS TEAM. JOE HANGS ONTO THE BALL FOR 49033 SECONDS WHILE HE’S DOUBLE TEAMED. OUR EASIEST SHOT IS A TRIPLE-TEAMED JOE JOHNSON FLOATER FROM 15 FEET AWAY OR A 35 FOOT CONTESTED BIBBY SHOT, SINCE THAT’S ALL HIS OFFENSIVE GAME CONSISTS OF. LET’S GET AN AARON BROOKS, NOT THIS FAT MINI-ME WHO PLAYS NO DEFENSE
A Tribe Called Quest
May 8th, 2009
6:02 am
JOE HAS NO HEART.
SMOOVE GETS NO CALLS
HORF HAS NO OFFENSIVE GAME
BIBBY PLAYS NO DEFENSE AND DOES NOTHING ON OFFENSE BESIDES SHOOT 3′S. WHAT’S HE HAVE IN THIS SERIES? 3 TOTAL ASSISTS? CAN’T EVEN GUARD HERPE-LOOKING DELONTE WEST
HOW CAN WOODSON BE COACH AFTER WE LOSE EVERY ROAD PLAYOFF GAME BY 60 POINTS? THE ONLY REASON WE WON THAT GAME IN MIAMI IS BECAUSE WE WERE DOWN 2-1 AND OUR PLAYERS REALIZED THAT MIAMI ACTUALLY SUCKS
terrell barron
May 8th, 2009
6:24 am
No wonder Stern hates the Hawks. They are an embarrassment to the League and to the city of Atlanta. How in the hell can you play 6 games on the road in the freakin Playoffs, and get blown out in every one? That’s unheard of. Hey Sund, it’s time to blow this thing up man. Coach, players, assistants, everybody!! Nobody is untouchable right now, if you ask me. Maybe Josh Smith, but that’s about it. How bout Marvin and Horford to Jersey for VC and Brooke Lopez? And then draft Patty Mills. Mills/JJ/VC,Smoove/Lopez. Or JJ and Acie to Detroit for Hamilton and Stuckey? We can pick up Sheed while were at it, and leave Woody in the motor city. Stuckey/Hamilton/Marvin/Smith/Sheed-Horford Something has to be done. This team is going NOWHERE as constructed. Time to make some moves. Thoughts?
MAC-TOWN
May 8th, 2009
6:52 am
Witness says “NoleRick, I’m here in CTown for the game and I would not hate on Cleveland. Great restaurants, nice downtown – nothing like dangerous ATL downtown”
nothin like dangerous ATL…I guess thats why Cleveland is thr 11th most dangerous city in America…ahead of ATL
http://os.cqpress.com/citycrime/CityCrime2008_Rank_Rev.pdf
doc
May 8th, 2009
7:34 am
lot to read, no time to do it. glossing over will comment:
najeh whether we like it or not this roster is prime for gutting only by the expiring contracts. sund will have his opportunity to place his stamp without even trying as we wont be ble to bring back all five folks with expiring contracts. unfortunately the five is not he bottom five as you well know.
gee kirk can i get one of those woody fat heads. i can put it up against what some feel qualified as well, my own.
again guys, I AM sorry I didnt want to win last night and didnt act like I deserved to be in the second round by losing my composure and throwing my shirt at the tv last night. I promise I will not do that at the home game on saturday, heh heh no one deserves that siting anywhere near me.
good day all. we still have lives to live if you are reading this, do it!
ignition
May 8th, 2009
7:44 am
Does Lebron have to blow someone’s head off on court to pick up a foul. I mean dude straight up committed open court fouls and never got a call…
Dude Woody should have gotten ejected last night .. I’m amazed Josh didn’t pull a Ron Artest..
dap01
May 8th, 2009
7:50 am
Bibby: Great 3 point shooter, no defense, no penetration (1 assist in 30 minutes last night)- Good role player, but not worth 1/2 of what he makes or will demand next year.
Woody: Good guy, not the coach that is capable of utilizing what he has, an athetic team.
We need a (one) center who can defend. Hortford is good but in the wrong position.
We need to be healthy.
Sam
May 8th, 2009
8:37 am
“Comments coming for the Hawks’ locker room suggest there are still trust issues on this STEAM.”–Your lead-in. Great editing.
leggomyego
May 8th, 2009
8:53 am
This is embarrasing. Plain and simple. The Hawks were supposed to be a better defensive team than this.
Mike is back
May 8th, 2009
9:04 am
Doc, I will submit to a miserable loss. All bow to Kings James…he is an amazing athlete…and he wants to be great…that’s what makes him special. But if I’m not mistaken this same Cavalier team got humiliated by the Spurs in the NBA Final…they know what it feels like too…WE GOT TO BE READY TO PUNCH SOMEBODY IN THE MOUTH…GAME 3 AT PHILLIPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You could tell by their body language that they already felt defeated. Did I mention how predestine our offense is…it’s a strategy for failure. You are running the same plays repeatedly hoping for different results…that’s insane. JJ had already mention he was tired and he’s is right…WE ALL SAID GOING INTO THE ALL STAR BREAK…JOE WAS TIRED…IF WOODY DON’T CUT DOWN ON HIS MINUTES…HE WANT HAVE NOTHING LEFT IN THE TANK…hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!!!!!! Why not keep JJ ON THE BENCH in the second half…lets give him a little extra rest going into game 3…you are already down by at lease 18 points…no we gotta get JJ going that’s when we are at our best…what JJ do Woody be seeing…cuz to me… JJ looked like he wanted to be anywhere but Cleveland.
THERE’S NO CRYING IN BASKETBALL…YOU GOTTA STRAP UP YOUR HARD HAT AND LUNCH BUCKET…AND GET BACK OUT THERE AND FIGHT. That the only choice the Hawks have…the 64 hundred questions is…will they let LBJ humiliate them in Phillips…we better see some bodies flying when the Cavs take they ass to the hole Saturday!!!!!!!!
ACIE BACK MUST BE STILL BOTHERING HIM…CUZ WOODY REFUSE TO PLAY HIM.
YEAH ,NOW IT’S OUR TIME TO RISE THE ROOF ON THE MADDA…LETS CRANK PHILLIPS THE F UP…THE HAWKS BETTER GET OFF THEIR ASS AND FIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cj Steele
May 8th, 2009
9:35 am
Man its plain and simple and someone has said it on here. Fire Woodson he cant coach i dont care if they made it to the 2nd round. N either trade NO SHOW JOE or Trade Marvin Williams for T Mac since Houston has no use for him anymore. Then Mac can take on the burden of being a leader and Joe can go back to being a role player. O and cut his contract tremendously. Hes a 90 million dollar sucka. I lost all respect for this guy. Josh work on ya jump shot then you will be the man on that team. Let Bibby go and start Acie Law. That guy is gonna be good once he finally get some playing time.
dap01
May 8th, 2009
9:44 am
AC CAN be the guard that we need.
A Thinking Fan
May 8th, 2009
9:53 am
Playoffs expose your flaws, Cleveland was exposed last year. JJ is playing on a flawed team ran by a flawed org, coached by a flawed Coach – period!
Some of these comments expose we Bloggers, way too much negativity or too much smokin’ & drinkin’ goin’ on!!!
Astro Joe
May 8th, 2009
9:56 am
A Thinkng Fan, I (hiccup) resent that drinking (hiccup) comment. I was pefectly slobbered (oops) I mean sober (hiccup) last nightttttttttt
ILL-logical
May 8th, 2009
10:02 am
Trust issues-is than a euphimism? Maybe you are alluding to the fact that there is a power struggle that has existed for the last three years between Woodson and his philosophy-iso Joe; forget athleticism and I can and will will say one thing to get the heat off of me but I will damn well do what I please’cause I’m the Coach-and Joe-I’m not getting anything from the promises that were made to me me about building the team around me and why can’t I take all of the shots-and the rest of the team-publicly identified by Josh- ain’t we players too?
It happens on every team but it is usually addressed by management. Here, it was swept under the rug until the national media’s attention to the glaring problems forced the I am shocked to discover gambling gambit.
But the eye of scrutiny is on the the organization and the excrement is getting ready to hit the oscilating wind device.And the shame of it all is that for the most part , the team could have been in a much better posistion to compete had there been some simple adjustments earlier in the season.Instead of playing to get into the playoffs, a better move would have been to preparing to function well in the playoffs,injuries notwithstanding.Let the second(and third,fourth) guessing begin!
bakerman
May 8th, 2009
10:12 am
The word team and these Hawks should never be used together. They don’t know the meaning of the word.
Volman
May 8th, 2009
10:18 am
I don’t mind getting blown out.. well, I do.. but nothing compares to letting LeBron James do whatever THE HELL HE WANTS TO DO out on the court (celebrating, joking around, RUNNING ON THE COURT WHEN HE IS NOT IN THE GAME) and even fouling the Hawks players with no calls. I mean, come on… you’re going to call charges for LeBron but when he lowers his sholder into Smoove it’s a no call? Give me a break.
Get off your knees, referees. We need to start that chant on Saturday.
Is Thomas Gardner going to start? What a joke. This team is done for the season.
A Thinking Fan
May 8th, 2009
10:22 am
AJ – LMAO!
doc
May 8th, 2009
11:40 am
mike i made that same point within the past few days, lebron took it and learned from it it seems, that is what he is made of, jordanesque.
ast03001
May 8th, 2009
11:48 am
Fun read on the Hawks:
http://www.aarontorres-sports.com/?p=706
DeeMcKenzie
May 8th, 2009
11:56 am
What happened in Ohio was supposed to happen. I told y’all earlier this is about DESTINY! This you have to understand. Hawks may win 1 game, with a little more effort maybe 2, but as Bugs Bunny says, THAT’S ALL FOLKS. I see a fire in LBJ’s eyes and that will to win that is impossible to defeat. Never figured the Heat or the Hawks were on the Cavs level this year anyway. So let’s not act surprised and b/c angry about this 2nd round. Cleveland was and is the team to beat this year without a DOUBT! LBJ is on a mission and I for one do not think HE CAN BE STOPPED!
WILD BILL
May 8th, 2009
12:08 pm
What we have here is the end results of the brainchild of the infamous Billy Knight! Lets see we chose Marvin W. over Chris Paul/ Deron Williams, we used a #5 pick on Shelden W.(which turned out to be Mike Bibby in a trade) we signed Speedy for big bucks(he should wear a mask when he gets paid, what kind of injury keeps you out for two years, how the freak is he still on the roster, please tell me) Knight drafted 3 guys that all play the same position at power forward(Josh, Horford, & Marvin) Bibby is servicable but not the answer, Acie looks like a bust(a #2 pick) so in the end we have no point guard. ZaZa is fine as a back up center, & Mo Evans & Flip were good additions off the bench but we need a real center & real point guard. We need to decide who to trade at the #4 spot, we dont need 3 power forwards, Thanks Mr. Knight no wonder you left
Super Lou
May 8th, 2009
12:08 pm
The Atlanta Sparrows, er.. Hawks. What a boring, lifeless team. What’s up with a nick-name like J Smooth?! WTF. Sounds to me like some pretty, little b***ch. Someone soft and flashy. The kind of person who’d were a Jheri Curl instead of a Philly Fade. LOL
Ain’t quite like being called the Diesel or Black Mumba huh?
Hawks er.. Sparrows get swept in 4! HA HA HA.
doc
May 8th, 2009
12:33 pm
super j smoove is the sh!t, cant say it only josh or j smash.
d lauer
May 8th, 2009
12:48 pm
the hawks cannot do what they did to miami thats why they look so bad,hawks are pretty good but are outclassed by teams like cavs,lakers hawks look slow and confused just trying to stay in game
ATLien
May 8th, 2009
12:51 pm
Hawks are hurt, and I hope the fanbase can understand that. No team can overcome losing significant starters to their lineup, especially when playing the best team in the NBA. Look how the Celtics losing only 1 starter (albeit Garnett) allowed a 7 seed to give them all they could handle. They got lucky to win that series in 7. The Hawks are having to overcome more injuries against a better team. Unless Horford, Marvin, and Joe heal up to 95% or better in the next day or two, its sweep time. They did well to get out of the Heat series despite the injuries. I am happy and proud of them, though disappointed with the circumstances they got dealt. I hope they heal up and make a series out of it. But I am not holding my breath. . .
RickNole
May 8th, 2009
1:17 pm
Honestly the turning point of this game was in the first quarter when Josh picked up his 3rd foul on the non-charge call on Lebron. From that point Josh came out and the game was never the same.
I am not saying that the fouls would have mattered, but, its quite interesting that the only player (josh) that played with intensity last night picked up really quick fouls, while Lebron had only picked up 1(one) foul the whole series. Just makes you go..humm…..(Where the hell is Arsenio Hall??))
CheshireCat
May 8th, 2009
1:44 pm
The hawks are not falling apart, theyre just short-handed. I call tell you this, that if Al Horford, Marvin Williams and Joe Johnson are unable to play in the next two games in Atlanta, Clevland will sweep the Hawks. If however those 3 all-star calibre players are available for the next two games, then the series will be tied after 4 games; plain and simple. Anybody who feels that Cleveland will run away with this series in a sweep needs to have their head examined. The Hawks didnt go 31-10 at Phillips Arena this season for nothing. The Highlight Factory is the House that Nique built. And if you come into Dominiques’ house, you are leaving getting beat. Dont worry fans, the Hawks will still win this series with Cleveland in six games; I stand behind my prediction. Get ready because the Hawks are about to win 4 straight games! Awesome! P.S. Joe Johnson is as great as ANY player who has ever played in the history of the NBA.
Clyde
May 8th, 2009
1:51 pm
Wake me up when its football season
Disappointed Hawks Fan
May 8th, 2009
1:57 pm
These Hawks are the most mentally weak playoff team I have ever seen. They have no ‘fight’ in them. They let the other team push them around without pushing them back. The way this team faces adversity is pathetic. No one in the league respects them. The excuse of immaturity is overused, and the actual problem is a lack of leadership. Until this team decides to ‘man up’, play physical, and stop feeling sorry for itself, there will be no respect (or wins) for these Hawks…
kirkinga
May 8th, 2009
2:10 pm
Wow. Some of y’all have completely come off the tracks. What team have you been watching all season? The Hawks have played this way before, especially on the road. The Cavs are on a mission and the Hawks are just learning how to get out of the 1st Round.
That said, I agree with the analysis of Ray and Wild Bill, the problem with the Hawks is not just one or two things. Things are not going to get magically better by replacing Woodson because you still have the same players with the same limitations and chemistry(or lack thereof on the road at least).
The Hawks are essentially in basketball purgatory and have to decide which direction lies in the immediate future. Someone has got to go, I think we all know that. I think we all are guilty of wanting the guys we like to stay and the ones we don’t to go. We all best prepare to lose someone we really don’t want to see go.
I believe Bibby is the bellwether. How they address the PG position will tell us if they believe this team is close as presently constituted, or if we’re looking at another 3-5 year plan. No need for a seasoned veteran if you don’t have the pieces surrounding him as Ray has talked about.
If you keep Bibby, then you must bring in a low post threat. The Hawks need a guy or two, that is willing to man the post. Josh and Al or not a threat offensively in the post. Josh doesn’t want to stay in the post where he is most effective, whereas Al will stay in the post but doesn’t have the offensive skill set to really challenge the defense.
With Marvin, who the heck really knows? We’ve seen that he can be worthy of his draft position, or he can disappear..healthy or not.
No easy answers, but we still have games to be played. Let’s all hope for health(if they’re injured it could diminish trade value).
Go Hawks!!
Mike is back
May 8th, 2009
2:12 pm
Doc, less hope we can get the one win you gave us Saturday…then we can go from there…NEVERTHELESS I’LL BE THERE CHEERING MY LUNGS OUT WITH YA BROOOOOOOOO!!!!
RickNole, Yeah you call it right. They seem determine to get him off the floor…once he went out the rout was on. THAT’S WHAT HAPPENS WHEN DON’T DEVELOP YOUR BENCH!!!!
If Marvin and Al can play Saturday…I would go with Bibby or Flip at the Point alone with Marvin, Josh, Al, and Solo in the starting lineup…let JJ get some rest…he’s not giving us anything anyway…Solo made Varejao work…Woody need to get him in the game…just like the Miami series…too many uncontested shots.
Personally, I would try Acie…he’s the only one with enough quickness to breakdown the defense and create open shots for the interior guys…that’s provided he’s recovered from his back injury. I would roll the dice and Start Solo alone side Josh and Al. Then you have some semblance of interior defense. Keep bring Zaza off the bench…he’s got tremendous heart…but he’s not a shoot blocker…I would like to see him body slam somebody though.
SONY PURDUE ONCE PRAYED FOR RAIN…I WONDER IF WE CAN GET HIM TO PRAY FOR HAWKS!!heh heh
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
2:47 pm
i just had to come and see whats the talk about my [Cavaliers]..you guys are to funny to be hoping knowingly knowing you guys don’t stand a chance this year..and then hate on the MVP..when its all said and done..cleveland have the better team..though, i do wish you guys luck..all i ask is for you guys to stay strong for cleveland to bring that [RING] to the east…SUCKERS
RickNole
May 8th, 2009
2:55 pm
Cleveland, if you go through the pages of post on here, you will find that no one is hating on the Cavs nor Lebron, most people on here are trashing the Hawks, Coach-No Woody, and the lack of heart of this team. So dont come here and gloat and try to start an argument about how we are “dissing” your team.
You guys are doing what you are supposed to do. Its like a bully beating up a quadraplegic and bragging about it. Really makes you look like a tool.
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
3:02 pm
well…i’m just rubbing things in your face..ATL get lost..we got business to take care of…GO CAVALIERS >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
WaltHazzard
May 8th, 2009
3:02 pm
I’m hoping that Al Horford gets well in a hurry. I wouldnt continue to bring in Zsa Zsa because as I have pointed out on numerous occasions: ZSA ZSA PACHULLIA IS A WALKING TURNOVER. The minute he touches the ball he either throws it away; bobbles the ball and turns it over; or he travels with it. Im not trying to be negative, but if you check his stat sheet for turnovers hes probably leading the team in turnovers, and Im not talking about bringing apple turnovers and donuts for the team. ZSA ZSA IS A TURNOVER MACHINE and maybe he needs to be turned upside down to finally get straightened out. I really dont know what the problem is. The other guy who is notorious for turnovers is Josh Smith. Smith is a great talent but he continues to dribble the ball upcourt as if he is a point guard and he subsequently turns the ball over frequently before he can get into his offensive set. These two guys are hurting the team with their turnovers and they need to be straightened out as soon as possible.
beki
May 8th, 2009
3:04 pm
I began,again, watching the Hawks after many years of preferring the Braves; but, only because of ZaZa’s nose to nose confrontation with KG last year. The Hawks need to draft a 7 footer,charismatic,attitudinal intimidator of a Type A personality. The Hawks have too many passive ( at least to me, it seems so )players;and,they make me seem aggressive.
Dominique Wilkins
May 8th, 2009
3:05 pm
So it’s the second round of the playoffs, they played game 2 last night, and there’s STILL not a new Hawks post up? Wow.
EAST ATLANTA HAWKS FAN SINCE 1971
May 8th, 2009
3:08 pm
CLEVELAND FANS ENJOY YOUR EASTERN CONFERENCE CHAMPIONSHIP TROPHY,BECAUSE KOBE AND THE LAKERS ARE GOING TO TAKE YOU GUYS IN 6 GAMES,FUNNY WHEN KOBE AND THE LAKERS CAME TO CLEVELAND AND BEAT YOU GUYS,WE DIDNT SEE ALL OF THAT JUMPING AROUND AND PLAYING ON THE SIDELINE WHEN KOBE STOP YALL UNBEATEN HOME WIN STREAK.
P.S.PHUCK THE CAVS ANYWAY LEBRON IS GOING TO NEW YORK AFTER 2010,SO ENJOY HIM FOR NOW,AND DONT GET TO ARROGANT BECAUSE HE WILL NOT BE WITH THE CAVS FOR LONG,AND GUESS WHAT? YOU GUYS WILL ONCE AGAIN BE THE LOWLY CAVS.
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
3:11 pm
AND YOU GUYS BETTER SHOW CLEVELAND SOME LOVE WHEN THEY GET THERE..DON’T WORRY WE WILL DO THE SAME IN RETURN..GET THE POPCORN OUT FIRST..A KING WILL BE SOMEWHERE IN THE HOUSE..ENJOY THE SHOW..I KNOW I WILL..
KingCobra
May 8th, 2009
3:15 pm
I think Zsa Zsa has been one of the most consistent players this post-season. In fact without Zsa Zsa’s contributions in the Miami series, Im convinced the Heat would have eliminated the Hawks. Up to now, Zsa Zsa is one of the Hawks who have saved our season. However, EVERYONE NEEDS TO STEP UP right now because if the Hawks go down 0-3 to Cleveland the series will be over. If the Hawks tie the series at 2-2, I believe the Hawks will prevail against Cleveland and upset the upstart Cavs. After watching last nights game against the Cavs, Im convinced that Mo Williams, DeLante West and LaBron James and going to continue to knife through the lanes untouched, unless the Hawks put up a brick wall in the paint to stop these guys. Make the Cavs shoot jump shots with a hand in their face, and you will defeat the Cleveland Caviliers.
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
3:16 pm
since we are speculating and talking fantasy land; in my dream world Amare Stoudemire would be my major move……
we need production in the paint consistently… Horford is expendable… so is Marvin, who will eventually be a 19-20 ppg guy..
id be content with Amare and Barnes…
i just wish we had some sort of rotation, offensive/defensive identity (with ability to adjust), and discipline…
and boy… perimeter defense…
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
3:17 pm
EAST ATLANTA HAWKS FAN SINCE 1971…you talking out the side of your head…where LEBRON grew up as a kid he can walk home from where he work..its like a dream come true for any kid..you haven’t heard..DON’T BELIEVE THE HYPE
A Tribe Called Quest
May 8th, 2009
3:20 pm
Keep Josh and get Bosh in here to teach him how to play. Firesale the rest. Nba Champions in 2011
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
3:23 pm
KingCobra… If the Hawks tie the series at 2-2, I believe the Hawks will prevail against Cleveland and upset the upstart Cavs…LOL…THATS A LONG SHOT AND YOU KNOW IT…WISHFUL THINKING…PLEASE STOP
BigAl
May 8th, 2009
3:25 pm
If the Hawks go out and get Amare Stoudemire AND Antionio McDyess, they will be set to win a championship. What the Hawks need right now is about two key acquisitions; a couple of BIGS to help our team. We have been playing small ball with out main guys out. I know the Hawks are close to being a championship calibre team because they finished in the final EIGHT. Wow!! what a heck of an accomplishment. But I dont think its gonna end at Cleveland because I think the Hawks will wipe out the Cavs in the next four games. The Hawks will win ALL FOUR games. Go Hawks!
Ken Strickland
May 8th, 2009
3:35 pm
With injuries to 3 starters, doesn’t it seem like POETIC JUSTICE that the very bench that’s been ignored over the last 2yrs is reluctantly being counted on to rescue the team from total embarrassment?
mykhalc
May 8th, 2009
3:40 pm
a HC is the most dire need for this team…PERIOD!!!
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
3:41 pm
BigAl ..LETS SAY YOUR HAWKS GO DOWN GAME 3…THEN WHAT…????
Mike is back
May 8th, 2009
4:08 pm
cleveland,ohio..216 , THEN IT’S A CHANCE THE HAWKS COULD GET SWEPT LIKE CLEVELAND DID IN THE 2007 NBA FINAL.
YOU AIN’T TOO FAR GONE TO REMEMBER THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
4:32 pm
Mike is back …THEN IT’S A CHANCE THE HAWKS COULD GET SWEPT LIKE CLEVELAND DID IN THE 2007 NBA FINAL.
YOU AIN’T TOO FAR GONE TO REMEMBER THAT!!…SWEPT..GLAD YOU SAID IT…TOO FAR GONE TO REMEMBER…RIGHT NOW, I’M JUST UP TO DATE…BUT MIKE YOU HAVE A NICE HEART TRIP..UP NORTH WE BORN FOR THIS SHIIIIIIIII..JUST TO STRONG…YOU FEELING US…
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
4:40 pm
2009..THE HAWK RAN OUT THE BUILDING…WINGS GOT CLIP..NOW WALKING NORTH..BUT STILL STUCK IN THE SOUTH..GET OVER IT..KNOW TRUE BALLERS REST IN THE SOUTH..NEVER DID
cleveland,ohio..216
May 8th, 2009
4:51 pm
HEY HAWKS FANS…ITS A GOOD TIME TO PRAY…YOU GUYS GO DOWN GAME 3 AND THATS YOUR A–..ONE GUY ON HERE SAID YOU GUYS COULD VERY WELL WIN 4 STRAIGHT..HE MUST BE THE FIRST PERSON LIVING GREEN..CAUSE I WISH RIGHT THEN..WHEN HIS MIND FIRST THOUGHT THEM THOUGHTS..THAT I COULD HAVE BEEN THERE TO SLAP HIS FACE…RIGHT OFF HIS FACE…LOL
Melvin
May 8th, 2009
5:10 pm
Doc, below is the post I was referring to on yesterday from Mark Bradley’s blog. I know, it old news but just wanted you to know that I was making things up…heh,heh
doc
May 6th, 2009
9:52 pm
“One pass and won’t shot on offense for the Hawks won’t get the job done against Cleveland.”
That is what it says on the AJC Hawks page. It’s said this for an hour.
Do any of you people actually proofread what you write?
Link Report this comment
BigAl
May 8th, 2009
5:13 pm
cleveland,ohio..216: Its obvious what will happen if the Hawks go down 0-3. I will concede that the series will be over. No one has ever come back from 0-3 and you certainly cant do that against a team as good as the Cavs. The only way the Hawks will have a slither of a chance to win the series with the Cavs is the HAWKS MUST WIN AT LEAST THE NEXT TWO GAMES and tie up the series. If the Hawks win the next one and then drop the following game in Atlanta and go down 3-1, Ceveland will still win the series. Being down 3-1 is possible for a comeback, but against Cleveland, its virtually impossible. The only way for the Hawks to salvage their season right now is to win two straight games at home, tie the series and then go from there. It may take seven games to beat the Cavs but I believe the Hawks can do it if Horford, Johnson and Williams are available to play the remaining games. If any of those guys are unable to suit up next game, the series is over and the fat lady has sung!
Astro Joe
May 8th, 2009
5:41 pm
Cleveland fans, act like you’ve been to a Finals before and show some class… even if you have to fake it.
Sautee
May 8th, 2009
5:50 pm
cleveland,ohio..216,
You are in for a bigger disappointment than you realize. I personally think that the Cavs will win the title this year. Oh Joy, until you realize that Bron Bron, having BROUGHT a title to Cleveland, is now free to leave for Brooklyn in 2010.
Enjoy him while you can. It won’t be for long.
darrell starks
May 8th, 2009
5:52 pm
KEN your right we have been telling Woody all year to devolop your bench and he never did that this is what happen when you run your starter in the ground and play joe 41min a game more than any player in the nba look at the CAVS thats why they have so much energy because they go 10man deep and his starter stayed fresh all year when will WOODY learn.
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Trent
May 8th, 2009
7:04 pm
BY EAST ATLANTA HAWKS FAN
“Zaza Pachulia, a bulldog who scuffled with seemingly every Miami Heat player in the first round, taps Mo Williams on the chest, acknowledging that he fouled him in the second quarter. Maurice Evans, his team trailing by 18 less than 18 minutes into the game, extends a hand to James, picking him up after fouling him on a drive to the basket.”
Sounds to me like our players have class. But a moron like you would not understand something like that.
enott.
May 8th, 2009
7:11 pm
The inconsistent play, the lack of effort offensively or defensively,the lack of effective and efficent play calling. Results in players not believing in each other, the coaches or the coaching system. And this makes the entire team look foolish. this is the absolute worst playoff series of any sport that I’ve ever seen…. It should be evident to someone in the hawks front office by now that a new direction is needed, if only because of the magnitude of embarrsement being displayed on a national stage. But maybe loosers are accustomed to nothing more than loosing.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
7:33 pm
If y’all want to dwell in fantasy land and talk offseason acquisitions, why do you keep bringing up players like Amare and Bosh who are no more legit championship-team-carrying superstars than Joe Johnson? Do you really think bringing in either one of them here to pair with Joe Johnson puts this team on the same level as the Cavs, Celtics, and Lakers?
Y’all need to aim higher. With the economy in its current state and small market teams hemorrhaging money, all it takes is the willingness to take on one or two bad contracts to seriously upgrade the starting five with a legit superstar. I’m looking squarely at the New Orleans Hornets, who play in one of the league’s smallest and most fragile markets, just got waxed even worse than the Hawks in the playoffs, are keeping their coach solely because they don’t want to pay another one, and have three hideous contracts (Peja Stojakovic, Tyson Chandler, and Morris Peterson) on the books. They are currently set to pay about $75 million in 2010 to the same team that just lost by 58 at home in the first round.
If the Hawks dangled Joe Johnson, Al Horford, Acie Law, Speedy Claxton’s expiring contract and this year’s first rounder to the Hornets in exchange for Chris Paul, Tyson Chandler, Morris Peterson, and a throw-in like Julian Wright, I wouldn’t be surprised if it got the Hornets to at least sit up and pay attention. A core of CP3 at the point with Josh and a re-signed Marvin on the wings, Tyson Chandler at center, and the current bench plus Peterson and Wright wouldn’t be much of a dropoff, if at all, from the current Hawks squad. I would think if Chris Paul can drag the steaming pile of feces that is his current supporting cast to 49 wins in the West, he can surely match that number in the East with two talented and athletic forwards supporting him. The Hornets in exchange get a little less top-heavy in terms of talent and much more financially flexible, with the possibility of still being a playoff team if Acie Law pans out. (I didn’t check to see if salaries match up perfectly, but I think they are probably pretty close).
Is it far-fetched? Maybe a little, but then again, so was Al Jefferson + a pile of stinking garbage for Kevin Garnett. Would George Shinn, the Hornets owner, consider this deal, considering the Hornets’ financial situation? I would think so, considering that he tried to give away Chandler to the Thunder during the stretch run, only to be denied by a failed physical.
We keep whining about not having a true superstar… well, CP3 sure is one, and if the DASG is willing to swallow a couple of bad contracts for the next few years and get creative, it may be more likely than you might think for them to acquire him. At the very least, if they (like many people posting on this blog) see the current team’s ceiling as being below that of a true title contender, it would probably be smart to pick up the phone and try.
Aiight, that’s enough fantasy world for me. I’ll reserve the possible trade scenarios and what not until after these playoffs are over for the Hawks.
Blast
May 8th, 2009
7:54 pm
Melvin, RMS
My bad on throwing church and a curse word together. Wasn’t too shocked at the score, was just shocked they said Joe was injured. Then, I didn’t think ‘damn’ was that bad a curse word!
It was nice to see the full bench play last night, and give it to those guys, they showed HEART. They could easily have allowed the game to get out of hand and embarass Woody for not playing them all year, but they were ultimate pros, unlike the starters. All Mario need to do all summer is practice shooting the basketball.
If Woody had developed his bench more, Joe wouldn’t be playing tired and hurt now, we wouldn’t have so many injuries to key players. But then what can you do? Woody was hell bent on keeping his job, so he wore out his starters in other to gain home court in the first round and win that series. Mission Accomplished. So we stop playing in the semi’s?
Hawks lose game 3 and it’s a sweep. But we all knew Hawks wouldn’t win this series, I just want them to compete!
Blowing this team up makes no sense. They were blown up five years ago, now you have a core group to build on. What you do is improve the team by addition and subtraction. This season and playoffs are enough for Sund to know what the team needs. Hawks glaring weakness from the 5 position for example.
Truth is, LeBron and co are good enough without needing help from refs. It just shows how conditioned the NBA refs are to calling the game in favor of their team, regardless how large the lead is, or how badly the team not getting calls are playing. Does the NBA really want blowout games in their playoffs?
I would be mad if Hawks do not send LeBron crashing to the ground before the series is over. At least once. One very good, very tough, playoff foul. Legal, but hard as hell. Mario, knock down the ‘king’.
LeBron so strong though, dude might just bounce back up.
rms
May 8th, 2009
7:58 pm
Blast, thats okay its just watching the Hawks during the playoffs is what keep the T.V. repairman in business!!!
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
8:06 pm
Cj Steele,
No offense, but I’ll take Joe Johnson over Tracy McGrady ANY day. McGrady never could get his team out of the first round, despite numerous attempts. Plus, he’s got a bad back, and the team seems to play much better without him (they’re out of the first round now, aren’t they?).
After the way he did Houston, you can have him. Hell, I’d rather have Gilbert Arenas, another monumental waste of money…
Blast
May 8th, 2009
8:24 pm
Check out AJ and Tyron Lue, former Hawks shinning in Orlando playoffs.
rms
May 8th, 2009
8:26 pm
did any one hear Sekou on the radio this afternoon? I keep hearing the same comments about dealing with the Hawks offseason moves and what to do next. In my opinion its obvious that we cannot continue with the current roster we have. Either Woodson has to go or shifting some players around must happen. You cannot keep the everything the same and think the next time around you can get 50 wins. Time to raise the bar guys and start talking going deep in the playoffs and contend for a NBA TITLE, dare I say.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
8:29 pm
Yeah, pretty strange that T-Lue, Anthony Johnson, and the Popcorn Bandit may all be going farther in the playoffs than Mike Bibby, the guy for whom they were traded.
Not that I regret that trade at all, just saying…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
8:34 pm
Melvin,
I don’t feel so bad now, knowing that a REAL writer (who actually does it for a job) like Bradley, is making grammatical errors as well…..heh heh heh.
Kirk,
I think that’s pretty damn balanced, expectation-wise. Something has to happen this summer, and it will be something that will make some of us unhappy. Such is life, and such is sports. I’d like to say that I’m prepared for just about anything (including “nothing” happening, though that’s technically not possible), but you know how that goes. The minute I say that is the minute that the very thing I dismissed will happen. I think it will be interesting and informative, as you say.
Excellent comment on the point guard position, by the way. I think you have it pegged there, as any talk of how a roster is constructed usually begins at that position. Certainly on a team like ours.
Najeh,
All I can say is “wow.” Interesting lineup ideas. Like Chandler, but hate to lose Horford, who although I feel is a natural PF, has more skills than Chandler, though Chandler is a natural center. Chandler and Smith make for a nasty shot-blocking combo, and rebounding combo if Josh stays after the boards. Julian Wright gives you an option with Marvin (especially for those disappointed in Marvin), and better size/talent if he’s coming off the bench…than Mo Evans.
But who is playing the SG spot for us? Mo Pete? Hmmmm. Then there’s a question of how this all works with Woody (and we’d need to re-tool the bench again, while we’re at it). Still, that’s an interesting thought, especially if you’re up to “gutting” the roster.
I’m sure your suggestion will get shot all to pieces, but that’s what happens to all suggestions, right?
?
josh smith
May 8th, 2009
8:40 pm
SO MAKE UP YOUR MINDS DO YOU WANT ME TO SHOOT THE THREE OR NOT OOPS I JUST SHOT A THREE SORRY WOODY
Blast
May 8th, 2009
8:54 pm
Orlando Magic versus the Cleveland Cavaliers in the East finals. Y’all know I will be rooting for the Magic. Now, that is one team I do not think the Cavs can run all over.
I’m picking Houston Rockets to come out tops in the West. Wouldn’t that just ruin the leagues dream match up?
bigeasy830
May 8th, 2009
9:01 pm
It ain’t over till the fat lady sings. I know she is warming up and the band is playing the interlude, but it still ain’t over yet. I will be in the highlight factory cheering my behind off.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
9:02 pm
“Like Chandler, but hate to lose Horford, who although I feel is a natural PF, has more skills than Chandler, though Chandler is a natural center.”
I agree with all this… I’m honestly not a big Chandler fan, but there’s no way the Hawks can acquire CP3 unless they take on one or more of those three contracts, and Chandler easily gives you more bang for the buck than Peja Stojakovic. And for all his faults, at least he has played with CP3 for a few years and is big enough and strong enough to be a force on the boards and body up opposing centers.
“But who is playing the SG spot for us? Mo Pete? Hmmmm.”
In the long run, the Hawks would have to acquire a better SG, maybe in the 2010 draft. There’s no question this trade would leave the Hawks weak at that position. The positive thing is that the three best players on the team — CP3, Marvin, and Josh — would be locked in for 5 or 6 years, giving the Hawks plenty of time to find a SG who would be the missing piece to the puzzle.
“Then there’s a question of how this all works with Woody (and we’d need to re-tool the bench again, while we’re at it). ”
True… with Woody you never know what you’re going to get. I don’t think the bench would necessarily need to be re-tooled… the current Hawks would probably try to sign Flip and Zaza this offseason anyway, and if they can’t they will probably look to find similar players in free agency. So in that sense I don’t think the approach would change. And of course, I haven’t mentioned Josh Childress at all — clearly he would be a valuable asset either as a player or a trade piece.
“Still, that’s an interesting thought, especially if you’re up to “gutting” the roster. ”
I’m actually not up to gutting the roster. I don’t think two short-handed blowout losses to a far superior team on the road indicate that this roster needs to be gutted. But since the topic of discussion on this blog has swung that way, I do think that if the Hawks go down that road, they should go after a legit team-carrying superstar like Chris Paul, as opposed to someone like Amare or Chris Bosh who are not really at much higher a level than Joe Johnson.
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
9:04 pm
Nejah…
CP3 is a Hornet until he wants out…
what makes Paul more battle tested, or more championship mettle than a Bosh or a Amare… we need a low post threat… teams can double our perimeter game because nobody on the block, in the paint, down in the trenches strikes fear in the hearts of opposition..
im not saying that Amare or Bosh are post terrors but they are polished low post scorers and will make it impossible to double. these guys get the ball and attack quickly. no hesitation, deliberate assault. they have established games and play within themselves. been doing it since they came into the league. Josh is untouchable in my eyes.. but Horford… i woulda pulled the trigger in Feb.
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
9:05 pm
damn… spelled your name wrong…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:06 pm
Blast,
Not only would that ruin the tv broadcast conspiracy plans, but just think….Tracy McGrady gets a ring…for doing nothing. Punk-ass…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:07 pm
But his team would go all the way without him playing, so he couldn’t say jack, seeing as how he never got them out of the first round, promises and all.
Sautee
May 8th, 2009
9:07 pm
Good point, Najeh
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
9:08 pm
whhhhhhuuuuuuuuuuuuuuttt………….?
BOSH IS BEASTLY MAN….
ARE U KIDDING ME…
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
9:10 pm
“damn… spelled your name wrong…”
Ain’t like it’s my real name or anything, so don’t really care, haha…
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
9:10 pm
Anyone else watching Anthony Johnson scrapping with Stan Van Gundy? The TV’s on mute so I don’t know what’s going on, but damn… wonder what the reaction would be here in the ATL if it was J-Smoove and Woody…
Blast
May 8th, 2009
9:17 pm
So right, Ray. Tracy gets a ring for doing nothing. That was a good one!
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
9:19 pm
Bosh is a 22-10 guy. Nothing to sneeze at, obviously. But what has he done in the NBA that Joe Johnson hasn’t? Has he carried a team beyond the first round? No…
And this year with no D’Antoni, Amare was a 21-8 guy. Again, nothing to sneeze at. But Phoenix was the 9th best team in the conference most of the year until he got injured, and he’s been a bad defender his entire career. From a “making his team better” standpoint, what does he provide that Joe Johnson doesn’t?
I’m not trying to hate on either of these players. I just don’t know if having two Joe Johnson-caliber players at the expense of some of the team’s young talent makes this team any better in the long run than having one Joe Johnson-caliber player with the current young talent around him.
Chris Paul, on the other hand, has taken his team to seven games in the 2nd round as his team’s unquestioned best player. That’s one thing he can say that Bosh and Amare cannot. He can say he has been to the 2nd round with a clearly inferior supporting cast, something Amare definitely cannot say, since he has played nearly his entire career with a two-time MVP, and something Bosh definitely cannot say, since his team bowed out in the first round in his only playoff years.
To me, CP3 has clearly established himself as a guy who will instantly transform a mediocre team into a playoff team. I don’t think Bosh and Amare have proven that yet.
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
9:21 pm
true… haha…
bout time somebody check Stan Gundy… the more i watch him the more i agree with Shaq..
he overreacts, and its almost as if he craves the attention. plus he throws his players under the bus. like Jeff way more…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:23 pm
Najeh,
Sorry, didn’t mean to sound like I was accusing you of gutting the roster, but such a move tends to look that way. And I’m not damning it, because as you say, any deal going after a guy like that involves taking on bad contracts. If Billy Knight were still here, you’d never see a deal like that for two reasons: 1) The bad contracts involved, and 2)Involving a pg he unceremoniously passed over in the draft…but enough of a history lesson.
I certainly understand your idea behind the “legit team-carrying” type of guy. The only logical question behind it of course, is how good can this guy be for a totally different coach, with some different players. There are chemistry questions here (both with players AND coaches), but again, I realize all of this is fantasy thought, so no need to delve too deeply there.
The only point of possible debate here is involving what kind of player to go after. CP3 is a legit star, and he solves a major question at pg. But I wouldn’t dump too quickly on a guy like Bosh. Stoudamire has some issues, but is a legit talent. I think Bosh is a better fit, and he brings you numbers somewhat similar to a young Kevin Garnett, though less of a defensive force. I think putting him alongside a guy like Joe, but obviously spaced down low (opposite of Joe) makes us pretty potent. Especially if we have a steady pg (another question).
I think we would see a much different set of results from Joe if he wasn’t getting doubled all the time. He’s one of the hardest guys to stop one-on-one, and he doesn’t even have the pure athletic ability of an LBJ, Kobe, or Wade. But he’s tricky as hell, and strong for his position.
Again, fun debate, as going either way is making a splash. CP3 gives us an answer at the pg position in a conference (even a league) that is getting stronger at that position every time I turn around. And, he’s unquestionably a leader, something we are lacking right now. Bosh gives us an all-star low post presence with range, and somebody who’s willing to share the heavier burden as a team leader by stats. We’d still need an unquestioned leader/captain of the team. So I can see where you’re going with this…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:25 pm
LOL!
Najeh,
You forget. Anthony Johnson also fought with Woody. Hell, when he was here, he totally left the building one time, during practice.
JASon
May 8th, 2009
9:29 pm
People need to stop over-reacting: we’ve had key players out this series. And the cavs are a great team. Nobody is perfect, and the hawks have always played much better at home. You’re not going to change that, so just accept it.
We made it to the second round, for chrissakes. We need to stand behind this team instead of saying oh get rid of such and such…
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
9:29 pm
“I think we would see a much different set of results from Joe if he wasn’t getting doubled all the time. He’s one of the hardest guys to stop one-on-one, and he doesn’t even have the pure athletic ability of an LBJ, Kobe, or Wade.”
This is all very true. Joe’s definitely capable of putting up better numbers if he’s facing single coverage… but then again, that’s one of the things that separates the true, team-carrying superstars from the mere stars…
Blast
May 8th, 2009
9:32 pm
Loving this, man! Magic blowing the hated Celtics out of the water!
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
9:32 pm
“I think Bosh is a better fit”
So do I. If we were picking between going after Bosh or Amare, I’d definitely take Bosh, as much for the intangibles as anything else. Amare’s never been the centerpiece of his team; he’s never had to take on any kind of leadership role with Nash and Shaq in the locker room. I wouldn’t want to try that experiment on him at this point in his career. But I definitely think a CP3-led team can contend for a title. I still have my doubts as to whether a Bosh-led team can do the same.
Like you said though, it makes for an interesting debate…
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
9:36 pm
thats the thing though… another “Joe Johnson” for some young unproven talent. all Joe needs is another Joe meaning someone with equal ability. all Marvin, and Al are is talent.. thats all i see.. as far as numbers go, who does Bosh have around him…? Amare had to share touches with Shaq… and most of the year they were playing a style of basketball that didn’t compliment talent (remind you of something).
i cant say that Paul carried that team.. i mean, if he got them out off Denver then sure (got swept and poor numbers). he has a cast brother.. Mr. WEST, a big who can score the ball.. thats all a distributer needs… plus shooters around him with a big man that controls the paint.
Amare, theoretically would “go ham” on this conference… as far as the defensive argument that everyone presents… the guy was never taught (meaning a coach stressed or cared) defense… his alphabets go; A..B..C…E…
the question is not what have these guys done that Joe hasnt? its what would these guys do with Joe… the help that Joe asked for every year in my eyes was never granted…
besides.. Joe just started making the playoffs with regularity… and Paul just got into the league… we’ll see how far he can take them when they break up that team do to good ole’ recession…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:36 pm
Najeh,
You make some very compelling points. As you say, CP3 is an unquestioned leader and a guy who makes his team/teammates better. He can score 30+, but he’ll also get double figures in assists.
Neither Bosh nor Amare can claim to have done so much for their teams, but to be honest, it’s not about acquiring THAT type of player. I think both guys belong in the category of very good players that need another very good player on the team with them to make the team a contending team. The problem in Phoenix definitely was chemistry and coaching, amongst other things.
Bosh brings a lot, though, and he brings it having been through what JJ goes through: double teams, and being nearly the sole focus of his own team’s offense. I like him better than Stoudamire, as he has a more versatile game and plays with more competitive fire on a consistent basis. That, and he would probably be a more positive addition to team chemistry than Stoudamire.
No, Bosh hasn’t carried a team as far as CP3. But then, the last two big men I’ve seen carry a team like that were named Shaq and Duncan. And they BOTH had more help than Bosh has. Even Dwight Howard can’t say he’s in that elite category…yet. But we’re watching that era begin as we speak.
I like the idea of getting CP3, and I think a deal like that would have to get George Shinn’s ears perked up. Except, while saving money, he’d be trying to figure out how to rebuild. Because I don’t see a player like JJ sticking around down there. He’d be gone in a year. And the last guy to trade away a young, top level point guard is known as Mark Cuban. And he’s been looking like an ass for it ever since, despite landing an aged Jason Kidd. Mavs aren’t going anywhere, while Devin Harris blows up the East. Heh. You don’t trade franchise-level point guards. Not unless you’re crazy, or have one hell of an encore coming…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:38 pm
“but then again, that’s one of the things that separates the true, team-carrying superstars from the mere stars”
Can’t argue with that, my friend.
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:40 pm
Bigdave,
I do agree with that point. Due to recession, what CAN the Hornets do to make the team around Paul better? And if they can’t figure it out in time, he’ll want out. That’s one of the areas that Najeh’s argument really stands out. However realistic or unrealistic we may think it is.
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:43 pm
Najeh,
That is another good point. It raises a question. On a team featuring Johnson and Bosh, WHO IS THE LEADER? Bosh has more fire. Joe was the guy signed to be “the man.” Which defers? Would it be a 70-30, 80-20, or a 60-40? Would Joe mind giving up his “favored pupil” status? I mean, I’m not trying to dog Joe, but outside of Bibby, he has the most leeway with Woody, while also being ridden hard and put up wet…
Blast
May 8th, 2009
9:43 pm
Out of all the 8 teams left in the playoffs, Hawks and Mavericks are clearly the weakest. Coincidence that they are 0-2?
Najeh putting up some interesting points, man.
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
9:46 pm
exactly Ray…
yea guys… definitely beats talking 20+ whoopings…
but all in all as far as the year is concerned.. yea we living in fantasy land playing GM’s and speculating, but we would definitely need our heads checked if we couldnt collectively agree that we over achieved this year..
i mean, we did the same things night end and night out, with the same 7 (for the most part) guys, and still managed to win 40+… wow…
i could never dump on Joe, or Josh.. cause for one, they get ALL the heat, and secondly.. hell they simply DO (are called on, have to bail us out) the most. Joe on offense, Josh on D.. and sometimes they switch… Joe on D, on Josh on offense… with minimal talent and breathers..
i watched Joe play the whole 1st qrt. and halfway into the 2nd last game.. and when he shot those free throws.. i said.. “short”… and it was clear…
I JUST DONT THINK JOE IS AS “SOFT AND HEARTLESS” OR JOSH IS AS “STUPID” as folk like to make it seem… you put one of those caliber players around those two.. with a PG who sees the floor, can penetrate, and defend… i see contention…
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
9:55 pm
“thats the thing though… another “Joe Johnson” for some young unproven talent. all Joe needs is another Joe meaning someone with equal ability. all Marvin, and Al are is talent..”
Do you think the Hawks can get a Bosh or an Amare using only Marvin or Al as trading chips? In my opinion, either one of those teams would be crazy to trade those players without asking for Josh Smith in return. He’s easily the most talented of the Hawks’ young front court draftees, and he’s also accomplished by far the most.
If all it took was Marvin and Al to get Bosh or Amare, I’m on board too. Replacing Marvin and Al at SF and C with Bosh/Amare and (insert athletic role player like J-Chill here) is an obvious upgrade. I just don’t think that’s realistic though. And if we’re talking about giving up Josh, I think he’s an adequate right-handed dribble and a reliable mid-range jumper away from being a double-team-drawing 21-8 post player himself, so at that point I wonder whether such a trade would be worth it, especially when you consider that Josh is signed to a pretty reasonable long-term deal.
“he has a cast brother.. Mr. WEST, a big who can score the ball.. thats all a distributer needs… plus shooters around him with a big man that controls the paint.”
I’m not at all a fan of West, Chandler, Stojakovic or any of the other players CP3 has on his supporting cast, but I guess that’s a difference of opinion that neither one of us can prove one way or another. To me West is a lot like Carlos Boozer, a guy with some offensive skills who looks a LOT better than he really is thanks to his MVP-caliber teammate. Stojakovic and Rasual Butler are stand-still shooters who contribute very little other than 3-balls. Chandler is a physical player who crashes the boards and provides some defense but he is meaningless offensively and most of his points come on dunks and put-backs. I just think running pick and rolls with CP3, catching alley-oops from CP3, and camping out on the 3 point line waiting for CP3 to penetrate, draw defensive attention, and kick out a perfect pass to the perimeter makes all those players look a lot better than they really are.
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
9:56 pm
Heh! And you’d think it would be Dwight Howard who was mauling the Celtics.
Oh no. It’s Rashard Lewis and Hedo Turkoglu. I love it!!
Sautee
May 8th, 2009
9:57 pm
I guess all of this conjecture supposes that Woodson is still here. If that’s the case, then we should be including draft picks and possibly Acie in any trade proposal, since they would be otherwise wasted as benchwarmers. Asset management, folks.
JoeBrave
May 8th, 2009
9:59 pm
Any way the Marx brothers can end this embarrasment tomorrow night?? To hell with this sickly bunch of sissy-assed QUITTERS!!!!!!!1
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
10:00 pm
“If that’s the case, then we should be including draft picks and possibly Acie in any trade proposal, since they would be otherwise wasted as benchwarmers.”
No doubt, and if the Hawks do decide to make big trades this offseason, let’s hope there are NBA GMs who feel, as many of us do, that Acie can still develop into a very good NBA point guard.
Sautee
May 8th, 2009
10:01 pm
Najeh, I realize that YOUR original proposal included Acie and a 1st
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
10:02 pm
As satisfying as it is to see the Celtics get routed, it would be even more satisfying if they were losing like that at full strength. Seeing Dwight own Kevin Garnett would be that much better.
JoeBrave
May 8th, 2009
10:03 pm
Why is everyone on the Joe Johnson bandwagon??? All i saw last night was a Quiet Quitter, with no heart,no guts,and no legs left!!!
wheelchaired out with a sprained ankle!!!C’Mon Joe grow a pair ,and learn how to be tough!!!!
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
10:03 pm
I JUST DONT THINK JOE IS AS “SOFT AND HEARTLESS” OR JOSH IS AS “STUPID” as folk like to make it seem… you put one of those caliber players around those two.. with a PG who sees the floor, can penetrate, and defend… i see contention…
Very strong point, Bigdave.
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
10:04 pm
took the words out my mouth Sautee…
of course just those 2 wouldn’t get i deal done.. but hey, what good are draft picks to these current Hawks? id throw in an early 2 and possibly a 1 depending on what we got back… but there is nothing in this draft that we couldn’t pass up on to get one of these guys…
Najeh… not really a fan either but production is production.. and he has skilled specialist around him… and you can’t lie, Boozer was becoming Boozer long before Utah.. thats why Clev. couldnt keep him…
Najeh Davenpoop
May 8th, 2009
10:09 pm
“I JUST DONT THINK JOE IS AS “SOFT AND HEARTLESS” OR JOSH IS AS “STUPID” as folk like to make it seem”
I agree too. They do look bad when they lose, which is not a good thing, but they do win nearly 60% of the time, which is definitely good…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
10:10 pm
Najeh,
Good points about Josh being that close to putting up the kind of numbers that Amare was putting up. I think we have to add a few things for that to happen, though. The thing about it is, they all have to come together at once, and fairly soon. They are: 1)more maturity and better decision-making on his part, 2)a point guard who will consistently feed him when and where it benefits him the most, and makes a living more off of penetrating than shooting jumpers, 3)a coach who initiates and encourages more trust in him to take on such a role.
And none of those factors can come necessarily significantly after the others. They have to come together at once, or it doesn’t work. Period. Or so I say, anyway…
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
10:13 pm
Big Ray,
to the first half of my point there, i really think thats the key here, players react to situations differently. i credit them for not calling for Woody’s head by now. not putting coaches on blast? thats unheard of in todays NBA… maybe its that they think they owe Woody that much respect, i mean he “raised” them in a sense. or maybe they no at the end of the day, its all up to so called mgt.
i wonder how other donned “elite/superstar” players would react to a system like ours, substitution methods like ours, predictability like ours, non-adjustments, road regular season losses/post season blowouts like ours…?
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
10:16 pm
ill take my “dummies”, “quitters”, “cowards”, etc. over whiners, bit#@ers, excuse makers, over protected bailed out “elite” players any day…
I FUXS WITH MY HAWKS BUDDY… WIN.. LOSE (by 50 dammit).. OR DRAW…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
10:39 pm
BigDave,
I feel you. Here’s what I think. I think you’re right about our younger guys. Since day 1 in the NBA, all they’ve known is Woodson. So they don’t know any different, NBA coach-wise. You put it well: he “raised” them.
Joe is different. He is the prize pupil, head of the class. He wanted out of Phoenix, and came here to be “the man.” He’s not going to down Woody. Not yet, anyway. Joe has some class about him.
Flip and Mo won’t either. Why? Journeyman, plain and simple. These guys don’t play for a contract. They play for a freakin’ JOB. The contract is a set of details that describes how they get paid, is all.
Zaza strikes me as the type of guy who wants to play hard, wants to play well, enjoys camaraderie, and wants to be a good teammate. And he is. I believe he is more idealistic than most. He wants to belong. And he does. Any team would want someone like that, and we’re lucky to have him.
Here’s the one guy who is different than all the rest. Mike Bibby. I also think he’s the one that the ASG and/or Sund should consult on a number of things, especially if he’s part of the forseeable future ( And I can’t say that without quoting Niremetal, who actually said it himself) Bibby is playing for a contract, because at his skill level and experience, a job is all but guaranteed. He’s been with more than one coach, with more than one system, and has played at the highest levels, with the greatest competitors.
Bibby can give you a much more educated, much more informed opinion on Woody. And guess what? He has the least to lose from it, of all the Hawks. He can also tell you what this team can do, and who can do what.
Those words that Sekou quoted Bibby as saying to Woody during one of the past playoff games? Those words spoke volumes to any who chose to pay attention to them, both those who didn’t believe prior to it, and those of us who have been screaming about it all this time. Bibby knows what this offense does, how it’s designed, and what it CAN do. He knows what this defense can do, too. He put it in rare, fine form when he told Woody “if you don’t like the shot that player is taking, then DON’T put him in a position to take it. But you’re the coach. YOU tell him to go elsewhere.”
That’s a man who has nothing to fear, and knows what’s going on. He’s the guy you talk to. He’s the one guy who will tell you the unadulterated truth, and not be worried about a job or contract. Because he’s going to get one. From somebody.
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
10:50 pm
good quality shyt right there Big Ray… i agree 100 %
bigdave
May 8th, 2009
10:58 pm
too bad this dialogue is at the tail end of this blog, Sekou will probably begin a new one tomorrow… maybe he will highlight some of the discussion.. hopefully most of it will get read…
Big Ray
May 8th, 2009
10:58 pm
Thankyou sir
The Truth
May 8th, 2009
11:09 pm
I really don’t know what the fear factors are in next game. Those that are whining need to stop. We shouldn’t whole our heads low because we got beat in their building. They have just met their expectation and won their 2 home games. We are so preoccupied on the margin of the losses. A loss is a loss no matter how many points. They are playing psycho warfare on us and winning. They are mugging us, getting no calls and laughing on the sideline. We need to take the Bobby Knight approach for the next game. Woody are you listening? Knight would say “WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS KNOCK SOMEBODY ON THEIR AZZ!!!!” In other words: WE NEED TO SEND MORRIS OUT ON A HEAD HUNTING MISSION!!!! WHAT EVER WE DO, WE MUST NOT LET THEM PARTY IN OUR HOUSE!! IF THEY WIN FAIRLY, THEY BETTER SHOW SOME RESPECT OR ELSE THERE WILL BE FLAGRANT CALLS!! THERE IS TWO WAYS TO LOSE: YOU CAN LOSE WITH SOME RESPECT AND KEEP YOUR DIGNITY AND WALK UPRIGHT OR YOU CAN LOSE, PUNK STYLE, AND WALK WITH YOUR HEAD HANGING LOW. AS A FAN, I DON’T WON’T TO GO OUT LIKE THAT
calico cat
May 9th, 2009
12:10 am
Blast
May 8th, 2009
8:54 pm
Orlando Magic versus the Cleveland Cavaliers in the East finals. Y’all know I will be rooting for the Magic. Now, that is one team I do not think the Cavs can run all over.
I’m picking Houston Rockets to come out tops in the West. Wouldn’t that just ruin the leagues dream match up?
…………………………………………………………….
Blast,
You don’t have a clue . . .
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
12:13 am
BIG RAY, that was one of the best posts…PERIOD!!! and to top it off, i don’t believe it has ever really been covered like that…at least not in my readings!!! well said brah!! you summed it perfectly!!
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
12:20 am
just to add..BIBBY is not used to such a ‘fragile’ team either!! all of his SAC teams played with confidence regardless of their makeup. and you can attribute that to the coaches he’s played for there. THEUS, for all is lack of NBA coachin’ experience, had his teams playin’ with confidence. i really don’t know why they canned him so quickly!!?? but then again, SAC has some great owners ‘expect’ to win. our HAWKS are a different story.
the HAWKS, i believe, could have a great 1-2 punch at PG if they had a different HC. ok…now i’m repeatin’ myself!!! nuff said…
doc
May 9th, 2009
12:22 am
bibby goes to houston to be with adelman, old buddy artest, yao and battier. tough team there without the star back early.
niremetal
May 9th, 2009
12:32 am
Thanks for the h/t, Ray, although you obviously improved on my offhand thought considerably
Big Ray
May 9th, 2009
1:26 am
Mykhalc,
Thanks, bro! What I wrote was my personal conclusion that is based on some very good conversations I’ve had with some of our fellow Hawksters, Niremetal and Sautee to be more specific. Gotta give them credit for the input.
And you’re right about Bibby. He’s used to playing on teams that have more confidence and chemistry. I’m not downing our Hawks, but we don’t play like that night in and night out. And as Sekou has said, these guys keep saying that. But at some point, words must become actions. What it takes to make that transition…well, your guess is as good as mine, but I think we both agree on what (or who) helps the situation (or in this case DOESN’T help it).
Niremetal,
Gotta give credit where it’s due. But I did think some more about the last conversation we had, and that’s what I came up with. More to follow…
Doc,
That was my initial thought on Bibby. Back to Houston, with a shot at contending, a familiar coach, etc. That, and he wouldn’t be counted on to run the team more or less by himself (or be the only one setting good screens), show the coach how to run the offense (okay, that was a low blow, but…), etc. Besides, Houston would rather have him than Kyle Lowry, I’m sure. Aaron Brooks has the con right now, but Bibby could spell him. It may not happen, but if I was Bibby, that’s where I’d want to be.
And let’s not forget that fateful interview where Chris Webber accidentally let that cat out of the bag on air…
Again, it may not happen. But him being back in a Hawks uniform is hardly a foregone conclusion, whether people think so or not. In fact, the only pg type guaranteed to be back next year is Acie Law. I’m sure I don’t have to say it….
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
2:15 am
RAY, what CWEBB have to say?? the BIBBY to HOU thing?
Big Ray
May 9th, 2009
5:14 am
Mykhalc,
It was actually brought up by somebody else, but CWebb said something to Bibby in a tv appearance or something a while back. I can’t remember all the details, but he asked or made mention of Bibby going to Houston in a not-exactly-direct way, and Bibby gave him that “hey, quiet!” look. I’ll have to dig that one back up…
Steve
May 9th, 2009
7:21 am
I really don’t see a good future for the Hawks. The ownership is in flux. There GM Rick Suud was a failure in Milwaukee and Seattle. Mike Woodson the players don’t listen to him and their most talented player Josh Smith really don’t get along.
TW
May 9th, 2009
8:34 am
The word for Josh Smith is simply LAZY.
All that potential and he’s simply too lazy to develop it in the offseason. For him to not have a jumper after this long is a joke. The most glaring difference, however, between him an LeBron is hard work.
Have you no pride, Josh Smith?
Waste of height.
NEOhio Fan
May 9th, 2009
9:40 am
Going into the playoffs, I was afraid of four teams – Atlanta because their athleticism matched up well against the Cavaliers, Orlando because of their kick-out 3 point ability, Houston because of their late season defensive prowess and the Lakers because of Phil Jackson’s ability to mold his players to his style.
It’s unfortunate that so many injuries occurred to the Hawks at this time of the year, it would have been a good series if both teams were healthy, but there’s nothing anyone can do about that.
As far as everyone jumping on your coach, when Mike Brown got the Cleveland job, I’m not sure there were too many people who were big cheerleaders of his, including some of his players. However, he and the team grew together, he’s allowed his assistants to become more procactive as coaches and along with Danny Ferry’s trades/signings, the Cavaliers are where theyare right now.
With the players the Hawks have, I think patience will show that they are headed in the right direction. You only need one player who is mentally strong enough to lead the team and this blog site will turn in to a gloating forum.
Keep your hopes up, it’ll get better. I’m speaking from quite a few years of negative sports experiences in Northern Ohio.
cleveland,ohio..216
May 9th, 2009
10:07 am
THE HAWK IS NOW READY TO WALK…WINGS BEING CLIP BY CLEVELAND…GET OVER IT…REAL BALLERS DON’T REST IN THE SOUTH..JUST A HANGING..YOU GUYS SHOULD’VE RAN NORTH WHEN YOU HAD A CHANCE..THE ONE GOOD PLAYER YOU GUYS HAD RAN OVERSEAS..AND THE GM THERE SUCKS…
A Tribe Called Quest
May 9th, 2009
10:26 am
THIS IS WHAT.
WE NEED TO SHOW CLEVELAND WE’RE PLAYING AGAINST THEM TONIGHT.
ZAZA COMMIT A HARD FOUL.
PUT LEBRON ON HIS BACK
STOP BEING SCARED
cleveland,ohio..216
May 9th, 2009
10:35 am
A Tribe Called Quest ……PUT LEBRON ON HIS BACK
STOP BEING SCARED…lol…bring it …LEBRON was a football player first…get over it [PAL]
ILL-logical
May 9th, 2009
11:13 am
..”biggest challenge, though, may be to get star power — either by showcasing current players or finding new ones, the experts said. While Hawks Joe Johnson, Mike Bibby and Josh Smith are strong players, none command the recognition of Los Angeles Lakers’ Kobe Bryant or Cleveland Cavaliers’ LeBron James.
“If you get marquee players, you get people,” Newton said. “Cleveland was dead before LeBron came along”
A qote from an article in today’s deadtree edition of the AJC. Just some food for thought.
Ken Strickland
May 9th, 2009
11:32 am
How in the he!! can you expect a team to consistently play team OFF when all season long certain players have been allowed, even encouraged, to take over the OFF and play iso and one on one whenever they get frustrated with the way things are going. Refusing to force these players to stick with the gm plan and consistently allowing them to disrupt the OFF, as well as ignoring bench and player development, has suddenly come home to roost. WHY COULD ANYONE WITH A CLUE BE SURPRISED.
There’s an old saying that definitely applies to any head coaching situation, especially the Hawks, and it goes, “AN OUNCE OF PREVENTION IS WORTH A POUND OF CURE”. NO PERSON IN CHARGE OF ANYTHING, ESPECIALLY A PROFESSIONAL SPORTS TEAM, CAN BLINDLY IGNORE OBVIOUS PROBLEMS FOR THE DURATION OF AN ENTIRE NBA SEASON AND NOT EXPECT THOSE PROBLEMS TO JUMP UP AND BITE THEM IN THE BUTT WHEN PLAYOFF PRESSURE IS BROUGHT TO BARE. IT’S NOT SURPRISING THE PLAYERS ARE UNABLE TO DO A MUCH NEEDED 180 FROM THE SELFISH STYLE OF PLAY THAT’S BEEN THE RULE OF THUMB THROUGHOUT THE REGULAR SEASON, AND OBVIOUSLY SANCTIONED BY WOODSON.
I admit that I went overboard with my complaints about Woodson, his coaching style, and the probable effects it would have on the team and it’s players. NOW ALL OF YOU ARE SEEING THE RESULTS OF WHAT I SAW ALL ALONG. IT’S DOWNRIGHT EMBARRASSING, ISN’T IT? AS LONG AS WOODSON IS THE HC, I REFUSE TO SUPPORT THE HAWKS.
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
12:11 pm
[/i] do hmtl tags work in the blog…testing [i]
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
12:12 pm
uhhhh, guess not
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
12:27 pm
might help if i do it right???
Sautee
May 9th, 2009
12:50 pm
Ken,
Did you see this quote:???
“They are the players, but I’m the one to push the right buttons and get them to play,” Hawks coach Mike Woodson said. “I understand that.”
Does he understand that he pushed the wrong buttons in Games 1 and 2?
Yes, with the injuries, it’s not realistic to think we’d win in Cleveland where virtually no one else has.
But my God, could he not find a button that says PRIDE. Or one that says COMPETE, regardless of the score?
steve
May 9th, 2009
1:02 pm
Who is the bigger hack?
Sucku, Schultz,or Bradley
Could all three of these guys be game-time decisions too? Except I wan’t all of them to sit this one out
A Tribe Called Quest
May 9th, 2009
1:11 pm
Based on some of the comments from players/coaches I’ve seen in the last 2 days, I would not be surprised if we get down 10 in the first and are swept.
Wtf is with all this laid-backness the players off? Smoove basically saying that the series starts now.
Woodson saying that we will come back in the series based on last year.
THE TEAM WE ARE PLAYING HAS LEBRON JAMES YOU IDIOT.
LeBron will try get up 20 in the 1st.
DON’T BE COMPLACENT
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
1:13 pm
KEN, it is impossible to go overboard with complaints about the BRAINLESS ONE. he is simply CLUELESS…PERIOD!!!
EJH
May 9th, 2009
1:16 pm
I would like to say thanks to the Atlanta Hawks team forgiving us a season of positives going forward. Forty seven Wins, a 1st round playoff series win, even if they are swept by the cavs or loose in 7 they have given us the beginning of something that will be special in the coming years.
Now as for as the off season, whenver it begins for this team. There are a lot of questions and moves that have to be made. The first is what to do with Mike Bibby. I feel Portland is going to try and sign him and I do not think the hawks will be able to match, so let’s say bibby is gone. Give the job to Acie Law and bring in a veteran to back him up like kyle lowery or rafer alston just in case acie does not work out. Scenario No. 2 trade acie and Joe to Milwaukee for Ramon Sessions and Michale Redd, or trade joe for chris Bosh straight up and move marvin to the two spot smith at three bosh at four and Horford at five and resign Mike b. or aganin turn the reigns over to Acie, bring back childress, Zsa Zsa, flip, and sign McDyess, these moves will make the bench real deep and don’t forget you still have speedy claxton’s expiring contract and draft picks to work with. I think the hawks are in good position to improve this team and return as a top four seed next year if not higher.
Big Ray
May 9th, 2009
1:24 pm
” However, he and the team grew together, he’s allowed his assistants to become more procactive as coaches and along with Danny Ferry’s trades/signings, the Cavaliers are where they are right now.”
Quite the fundamental difference between Cleveland and Atlanta right now…
Big Ray
May 9th, 2009
1:26 pm
EJH,
I agree with the first sentence. These guys have made some achievements here.
Your other thoughts on roster changes are…interesting…
Ken Strickland
May 9th, 2009
2:25 pm
MYKHALC & SAUTEE-apparently it is possible because I received some complaints about my constant complaints about Woodson, and a suggestion to let it rest. Some Hawk fans’ perception and acceptance of this teams accomplishments are based on the Hawks inconsistent and lowly past. There’re just elated to see us make the playoffs and get home court advantage in the 1st rd, and that’s quite an accomplishment when compared to our accompliahments the last 10yrs.
However, that elation often makes them overlook the fragile foundation upon which we stand and that we’ve created a catch 22, so to speak. Because we’re such an awful road team, we don’t stand a chance of winning a playoff series without having homecourt advantage. We’ve proven throughout the regular season that our road woes aren’t limited to the playoffs. There’s a problem when a team is good enough to win 47gms but can’t win more than 16 rd gms.
LOOK AT ANY TEAM WITH A GOOD RD RECORD AND YOU’LL SEE A TEAM THAT HAS GOOD COACHING AND USES ITS BENCH. When I saw how we struggled against the Heat, I knew we didn’t have a chance against the Cavaliers. We lack the coaching, the system, the discipline, the strategy and the depth to compete consistently against quality teams, especially in the playoffs.
Former GM Billy Knight put together a young, quick, fast, athletic and versatile team. Contrary to popular belief, not drafting PG’s CPaul and DWilliams, or SG BRoy weren’t his biggest mistakes. His biggest mistake was hiring Mike Woodson and thinking he would/could maximize the talent and potential of the young players and team. Unfortunately for him, he tried multiple times to correct his mistake and it cost him his job.
Now the team, its fans and the entire city of Atlanta are embarrassed because the SAASG made a bad decision and got rid of the wrong person. A lot of you keep saying the Hawks don’t have any leaders. Well, we have leaders, just not the right kind. After all, who do you think is taking control of the OFF and refusing to pass the ball or hustle on DEF. They are leaders, but selfish leaders that consistently reflect the same lack of trust in certain teammates that HC Mike has demonstrated over the last 2yrs.
LEADERSHIP, STRATEGY AND DISCIPLINE STARTS AT THE TOP AND SO DOES ORGANIZAION. THE PLAYERS HAVE TO SHARE SOME OF THE BLAME, BUT IT’S NOT THEIR FAULT THEY CAN’T CONSISTENTLY OVERCOME A FLAWED SYSTEM, A FLAWED OR NONEXISTENT STRATEGY AND A FLAWED HC. MY ONLY CONSULATION IS THAT FORMER GM BILLY KNIGHT HAS TO FEEL MUCH WORSE THAN I DO ABOUT HOW THE TALENTED YOUNG TEAM HE PUT TOGETHER IS BEING MISHANDLED AND UNDERACHIEVING.
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
2:50 pm
KEN, i hear ya man. the only part i disagree on is that i think WOODSON was the right ‘type of hire’ hire 5 yrs ago. perfect for a team where dismantlin’ was the objective and winnin’ an after-thought…perfect for 19yrs bein’ drafted. WOODSON gets a shot to audition and show his asst coachin’ skills as a HC. it’s obvious WOODSON was not given the tools initially. but it is also obvious NOW that even with the tools he does NOT know how to maximize this team. and that was evident last year and definitely this year. people can holla all they want that the team won 47 games. well if they don’t wanna look at ‘how’ this team wins and under what circumstances this team wins then that’s on them. it’s clear that WOODSON’s skills are not a match with the team’s makeup. and maybe the SAASG is just happy they continue to have a team much less ‘really’ chart a winnin’ course for their team. maybe they feel obligated to WOODSON despite the obvious. but the embarassin’ road efforts, now and thru the season, should be a wake up for SUND and the SAASG. i hope they make the required efforts to continue to move this team forward in a winnin’ way. and it HAS to start with the firin’ of WOODSON…PERIOD!!!
Sekou Smith
May 9th, 2009
2:51 pm
If I’m reading the mood here right like I read the Hawks’ body language shortly after halftime in Game 2, most of you are expecting this season to end early this week, say as soon as Monday night. We’ve got to much to talk about as soon as the season is over that I agree with bigdave, that there are too many good points to lose in the ether. So feel free to cut and paste (for a later date) some of the stuff you’ve written here Ray and others, so we can have these discussions when the ball stops bouncing on the 2008-09 season.
I’ve been arguing for two days with several people about where the Hawks have to go to get better and it’s pretty radical (you have to take a Rambo knife to the roster and start removing and replacing pieces liberally to get your championship mix right). But again, that’s a discussion we’re going to have another day.
As for tonight, Game 3 is the series for the Hawks. Pull off the miraculous win and there’s a chance to put at least a little scare into the NBA and the Cavs. But if they can’t muster the energy to fight off LeBron and his boys, it’s pretty much a wrap. There’s no shame in it. These Cavs are going to be a tough out for anyone, including Kobe and the Lakers.
le brown james THE KING OF ATLANTA
May 9th, 2009
3:29 pm
ready girls for round 3 of 4 round knoutout.
rms
May 9th, 2009
3:49 pm
dang Big Ray, That was probalby the best post I have ever read (10:39pm). Smart, well thought out, and makes sense. The question is will ownership ever consult with Bibby or just show him the door because they cant “afford him”
mykhalc
May 9th, 2009
4:08 pm
s/b 19yrs old bein’ drafted
Hawk Fan In New Orleans
May 9th, 2009
4:13 pm
Time for series introspection into our lack of motivation. It starts with coaching.
Coach Woodson has a lot of postives and fewer negatives IMO.
HOWEVER!!!
My biggest gripe with Woody is his deficiency of developing his bench which goes hand in hand with his knack for over-working his starters. Burnout and injuries are inevitable with his selfish insistence on running his top 7 players into the ground ( I feel its selfish b/c he is putting his job security first at the expense of playing and developing his youngsters and underplayed role-players.) Now – that injuries have caught up with us, the 2nd unit are thrown up the creek without a paddle. I love the hunger they display – but that obviously cannot be coached or else the 1st unit would display that same characteristic that’s rarely displayed when they play on the road – Mike Vick said it best when he said “sometimes you have to overcome coaching.”
Hawk Fan In New Orleans
May 9th, 2009
4:26 pm
Time for series introspection into our lack of motivation. It starts with coaching.
Coach Woodson has a lot of postives and fewer negatives IMO.
HOWEVER!!!
My biggest gripe with Woody is his deficiency of developing his bench which goes hand in hand with his knack for over-working his starters. Burnout and injuries are inevitable with his selfish insistence on running his top 7 players into the ground ( I feel its selfish b/c he is putting his job security first at the expense of playing and developing his youngsters and underplayed role-players.) Now – that injuries have caught up with us, the 2nd unit are thrown up the creek without a paddle. I love the hunger they display – but that obviously cannot be coached or else the 1st unit would display that same characteristic that’s rarely displayed when they play on the road – Mike Vick said it best when he said “sometimes you have to overcome coaching.”
Ken Strickland
May 9th, 2009
6:32 pm
MYKHALC-ANEN TO THAT. When you watch tonights gm, pay close attantion to how often Cleveland uses our DEF strategy of switching to isolate their Pg or SG on our C or PF. Once they get the mismatch, they clearout and the PG/SG backs it out and blows by our PF/C, leaving either Bibby, JJ, Flip or Evans to defend the basket. Is it any wonder why teams are running uncontested layup drills on us?
My biggest complaint is Woodson’s refusal to make a single adjustment. Instead, he chooses to ignore the problem and blame the players for playing poor DEF. Is it really poor DEF when our C’s & PF’s are unable to keep the other teams quicker, faster PG’s or SG’s in front of them when Woodson’s own cherished PG can’t do it. Is it really poor DEF when our PG’s, SG’s and SF’s are unable to defend the basket against the other teams C’s and PF’s?
The logical solution would be to send a double team as soon as the mismatch occurs, there’s a clearout and the PG/SG backs up to run an iso against our C or PF. A double team will force the ball out of the PG/SG’s hands and allow our C/PF to drop back under the basket where he belongs. It also forces the opposition to take extra time off the clock.
WE HAVE AN INCOMPETENT HC THAT WOULD RATHER BLAME HIS PLAYERS FOR THE TEAMS DEF PROBLEMS RATHER THAN SEEK A NEEDED SOLUTION TO THOSE PROBLEMS. I CAN ONLY IMAGINE HOW FRUSTRATING IT IS FOR SOME OF THE HAWK PLAYERS BECAUSE IT’S SOOO FRUSTRATING TO ME, AND I DON’T HAVE TO DEAL WITH WOODSON’S BS DIRECTLY.