March Madness (NBA style)!
Dwyane Wade and the Miami Heat are stalking the Hawks for the No. 4 spot in the Eastern Conference playoff chase.
HAWKSVILLE - If you think the college kids are doing it big these days (and they are), check out Dwyane Wade in March.
The Heat superstar has all but ruined the good vibrations from the Hawks’ four-game win-streak, one that can reach five with a win today (provided they can beat back Portland at Philips Arena).
Wade’s not only been the best player in the NBA the past few weeks, he’s been the best player on the planet (sorry LeBron James and Kobe Bryant, but D. Wade’s my pick for MVP and I don’t care what his team’s record is right now).
“I don’t want any part of D. Wade in the playoffs, man,” one of our founding members wrote in an email yesterday. “He’s playing right now the same way he did during the playoffs in 2006. And you know what happened then.”
The Heat won the title that year riding Wade’s cape tails past Dallas in the NBA Finals.
While playing at an otherworldly level in March doesn’t exactly mean your team will get out of the first round of the playoffs in March, Wade’s current tear does pose a clear and present danger to the Hawks.
With the way both the Hawks and Wade (I mean Heat) are playing right now they are setting up a first round matchup in the playoffs. That means the home court advantage fight is going to come down to the final weeks of this season. And the team that gets it almost guarantees itself a win in the series.
That’s why every game the Hawks and Heat play between now and the end of the regular season, including their April 14 tilt at Philips Arena, becomes a battle of epic proportions.
The Hawks already know how important it is to “take care of home” court at all times. They knocked off the eventual NBA champions three times on their home floor during the playoffs last year but couldn’t find a way to even stay close in Boston.
You should expect more of the same in the playoffs this year, with the home teams ruling the roost. The Hawks would best served to be one of those teams. And that means taking care of teams like the Pacers the way they did Friday. Because most of the teams the Hawks will see between now and April 15 are of a much higher caliber.
Slip up against the likes of Sacramento, Minnesota or Indiana – all visitors to Philips between now and the end of the season along with heavyweights like the Celtics, Lakers, Spurs, Mavericks (okay, light heavyweights) and Magic and – and Wade will be kicking the Hawks’ door down for that fourth spot.
Every single Hawks game between now and the end of the season is its own one-and-done tournament.
Did someone say something about March (and a little bit of April) Madness?
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276 comments Add your comment
Chea
March 15th, 2009
11:58 am
Whether Wade plays the way he did during the 2006 playoffs does not matter as much as whether the refs call the games the way they did during the 2006 playoffs. If they do, there’s no hope for anyone. Al Horford will foul out within three minutes of every game on Wade charg…er…drives.
Ariose
March 15th, 2009
12:11 pm
didn’t wetake care of wade AFTER his 50 point outburst in orlando….i’m sorry sekou but the teams he’s(they) are playing right now(the Utah Jazz and their weak single coverage…….and the bulls….and Orlando) are making him look good. He hasn’t looked that good against us and all of our athletic swing players.
Ariose
March 15th, 2009
12:19 pm
He’s not getting the spot we’ve held down all year and if i’m not mistaken the next time we play them it’s here in Atlanta. I expect them to loose in Philly today….wade will be out of gas, it’s not at home, and the sixers will run them into fatiuge by halftime.
Besides, we’re the team with the most home games left. We’re finally reaping the benefits of our horrible schedule this year. Wade should just give up while he’s NOT ahead….If marvin comes back we handle them easily in the playoffs. We’re possibly one big man away from being a contender, to say that we can’t handle this team that has no shot at a title……whatever……
I’m not enamored with the heat like some, and I see our gap increasing in the coming weeks. Hopefully we won’t loose more than four games this season.
Mike
March 15th, 2009
12:39 pm
Not worried about dwade. We have the better team and that is what will count playoff time. Like Ariose mentioned, our boys will create matchup problems. I see us taking care of the heat in 6.
Should be a good one today.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
12:51 pm
Sekou
Now that you’ve had time to think about it. Who does Al Horford remind you of?
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
1:06 pm
are all you Brandon Roy jock riders in place… last meeting the blog was flooded with comments on Roy being better than Joe, yadda…yadda…yadda…
Get em Joe..!!! Go Hawks…!!!
Blast
March 15th, 2009
1:14 pm
We ain’t scared of Wade. Hawks have his number.
ValdostaMike
March 15th, 2009
1:26 pm
I agree with Chea, if you stare a DWade they will call a foul on you. If you get close to his shadow the call a shooting foul on you.
However, I suspect injuries will creep up on him. He has been going to the deck a lot.
I like our chances with home-court, especially if OUR fans show up.
Sekou K. Smith
March 15th, 2009
1:28 pm
That’s a good look Reggie, I can’t decide if he’s more D. Coleman or Mychal Thompson. He’s not flashy but he’s a monster to deal with because he plays so much bigger than he is. He’ll have his hands full today, by the way. Portland is loaded in the frontcourt. He and Josh Smith both are going to have to bring it against these Blazers.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
1:41 pm
Acie and Mario in the 2nd quarter? Is Woody finally starting to trust his young bench players?
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
1:43 pm
Nice 1st qtr by the Hawks. Hawk def was pretty good. Roy didn’t hurt us but he does have the ability to get it going. We have to do a better job against Aldrdge because he had his way in the 1st.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
1:46 pm
What a stat!!! Bob R. mention that AC hasn’t committed a turnover all week. Keep in mind, his playing time has increase over this time as well.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
1:57 pm
Look like Roy is heating up…
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
1:59 pm
We are starting to shoot too many 3’s…..
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
2:08 pm
Good 1st half by the Hawks. Up by 3. Hopefully we can do a better job to contain Roy in the 2nd half…
Sautee
March 15th, 2009
2:13 pm
We need to go inside more, but we’re hangin’ with ‘em.
Big Dave, would you trade Joe for Roy straight up? Just curious.
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:21 pm
Sautee,
No.
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:25 pm
thats beautiful… way to make the extra pass Josh…
ray
March 15th, 2009
2:26 pm
No comment.
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:27 pm
wow Woody… screens…? im impressed…
Sautee
March 15th, 2009
2:33 pm
Big Dave,
I Love Joe, but I’d have to do that trade based on age alone. I think their games are remarkably similar. But Roy’s already where it took Joe 3 or 4 years to get.
Glad to have Joe today, though.
Blast
March 15th, 2009
2:35 pm
Play Joe Johnson one on one, especially how he’s been playing lately, and he will burn you everytime.
I thought that was hip check?
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:35 pm
what a horrible call!!!
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
2:36 pm
Got dang Joey Crawford. You watch LaMarcus tip the ball out…
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:38 pm
I cant say ill make a trade based on age, Joe is still young himself. Roy is a good player but we arent the best perimeter defending team. Roy also plays with a big man that demands a double team in the post, and can stretch the floor with his shooting ability. would love to see Joe with that option..
Joe is a better 3 point shooter, and passer… i dunno… but then again Joe’s my boy…
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:39 pm
Josh with the Dr. J yolk…
Sautee
March 15th, 2009
2:41 pm
Agree wholeheartedly that I’d LOVE to see Joe with a big that demands a double. Maybe Horford can grow into that.
For now, however, I’ll just enjoy watching JJJJJoe.
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:42 pm
that Marvin Williams stat is crazy… undefeated without him..
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:43 pm
our defense has been stout forcing teams to eat the ball and take rushed shots..
Rod from College Park
March 15th, 2009
2:45 pm
No Marvin= wins
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:45 pm
or one that can stretch the floor…
Aldridge is a young Sheed…
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
2:45 pm
For all the talk of how deep the Blazers supposedly are, they have got nothing from their bench today.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
2:49 pm
5 of those 7 games without Marvin were home games. I’m not saying there couldn’t be something to this stat, but I don’t think there are enough games to make that judgment. The Hawks have been dominant at home all year, Marvin or no Marvin.
Astro Joe
March 15th, 2009
2:50 pm
The grass is always greener with Hawks fans. We’re ahead of every team but 3 in our conference but we’re looking in the rear-view mirror and admiring the car behind us. WTF?
Somewhere, a south Florida fan, reporter, sports talk host or columnist is thinking “Wade is playing like he’s all world but we’re not gaining any ground on those Hawks”,
All this admiration for teams behind us or for teams who didn;t make the playoffs last season (Portland) is silly. The grass is green enough at Philips Arena… ya’ll can admire those other lawns with those brown patches (that you choose not to see) if you want.
Go Hawks!
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
2:52 pm
I definitely think we are a better team with Marvin… Marvin just might be our best on man defender…
niremetal
March 15th, 2009
2:55 pm
JJ’s hot, but he needs a rest…
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
2:55 pm
Yes Sir. Here come the Hawks…. Joe is on FIRE……
ajw
March 15th, 2009
2:55 pm
Fernandez can’t even dunk, much less make a 3.
Astro Joe
March 15th, 2009
2:56 pm
Yessir, Nate McMillan, no need to double Joe Johnson. Brilliant coaching strategy.
ajw
March 15th, 2009
2:57 pm
I think more people came to see the Hawks than Duke.
St. Bernard
March 15th, 2009
2:59 pm
Think we can get a big for Marvin this summer?
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
3:00 pm
pull bibby coach…
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
3:01 pm
I would have like to see Woody give Joe and Bibby a rest but he’s done a good job managing mins up to this point….
Sautee
March 15th, 2009
3:02 pm
Great footwork by Josh to get an EASY 2.
Sekou K. Smith
March 15th, 2009
3:04 pm
The Hawks are running a clinic on Portland right now. JJ is leading the Hawks in every category and the Blazers don’t appear to be interested in mounting a serious challenge. Joe Johnson owns the floor once again.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
3:06 pm
Nice alley from Bibby to Josh…
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
3:07 pm
Josh is putting on a show. Nice pass to Alford for the SLAM…
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
3:07 pm
subs coach…
ray
March 15th, 2009
3:08 pm
The fact that Joe is on fire (and subsequently the Hawks) has little to do with Nate McMillan’s coaching. There’s nothing he can do about this, as we’ve finally changed our 5-year old approach to the game.
It’s the fact that for once, we have established other guys as true offensive threats. Without that, Joe gets doubled and tripled each game.
The more we let Joe play one-on-one against defenders, the more he’ll do this.
That’s THIS team finally recognizing it’s own brown patches in the green grass…instead of continually victimizing ourselves with bad coaching and bad player execution. No more JJ playing dual primary roles as pg AND main/only offensive option.
Sautee
March 15th, 2009
3:08 pm
Young guys runnin’ wild!
ray
March 15th, 2009
3:09 pm
Okay, that’s 43 minutes for Joe, and we’re up by nearly 20 with but a few minutes left in the game.
I’m sure it’s okay to sit JJ now….watch Woody say that he kept him in there so Joe could get 40 points. Heh.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
3:09 pm
Roy is trying to boost his stats but the game is pretty much decided with 4 mins left in the 4th…
Astro Joe
March 15th, 2009
3:10 pm
O-tay.
Rod from College Park
March 15th, 2009
3:10 pm
Funny how everyone says Marvin is our best defender, but we are playing better defense without him. His is not our best defender, Josh and Joe are,
Blast
March 15th, 2009
3:10 pm
I am very impressed with the Hawks right now. Are they balling or what? They are making all these good teams look bad in Philips. Can they win all 7 home games?
Hope Marvin does not get his feelings hurt because the Hawks are playing so well without him. This was the game I thought the Hawks would lose.
Joe Johnson is back!!!!!!! Player of the week!!!!!!!
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
3:11 pm
I hope everyone who complains Josh Smith is just a low-IQ athlete with limited skills was watching closely in this 4th quarter. Great post footwork on multiple plays and a beautiful fast-break alley-oop pass to Al Horford.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
3:13 pm
Good win by the Hawks. They have kept all their opponents under 100 pts during this 5 game win streak….
Sekou K. Smith
March 15th, 2009
3:14 pm
As long as Wade and LeBron play games in the same week Joe has no chance for Player of the Week Blast. It’s not fair but it’s the way it is. And the Hawks have made the Blazers look raggedy today. I’m a bit surprised at how easily they manhandled this team. I expected more from the Blazers.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
3:15 pm
Great win for the Hawks — 2 blowouts in a row is real nice, and even more so when Miami is beating everything in their path (although I do wonder whether the game would have been closer if it wasn’t played at 10 AM Pacific time).
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
3:17 pm
Aye Sekou who is the light complexion lady in the red top thats down there with the media…?
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
3:19 pm
Philly looks like they are going to beat Miami… up by 8 with 2 minutes left. Miami has been outscored 23-8 in the 4th so far.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
3:20 pm
Philly up by 7 on the Heat with less than 2mins remaining…
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
3:22 pm
Sekou
I was thinking along the lines of Karl Malone and Buck Williams, when it comes to Al Horford. Great win from the hawks. Know matter how well Dwyane Wade is playing, if we hold on to that 4th seed. I dont think the Heat can beat us.
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
3:23 pm
im liking what ive seen from the Hawks of late… they’ve played identically in these wins. its almost like we’ve found an identity… and its beat quality teams…
bigdave
March 15th, 2009
3:24 pm
well Bob just said the same thing…
terrell barron
March 15th, 2009
3:24 pm
Blazers must have hit the clubs last night. That’s a home court advantage in itself. lol! And Woody, please leave JJ at the 3. Let Marvin back him up if he comes back. Let Flip/Mo handle the 2. Thanks. And I said it before the season started that Evans should start. If Marvin does come back, he could make our bench that much deeper. With all that said, I know good and damn well he’ll be right back in the starting lineup as soon as he’s healthy. Hey Woody, if it aint broke, dont fix it.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
3:27 pm
Miami loses. Hawks are now up 2.5 games. What a huge win.
Blast
March 15th, 2009
3:27 pm
Miami Heat lost, Detroit down 3 with 20 seconds left in game.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
3:29 pm
If there’s any benefit to Marvin being out, I think it’s that Josh Smith becomes the focal point of the offense in the front court, which means more touches in the post, which means more open looks for the perimeter players and more shots closer to the rim. The Hawks have made it a point to get him the ball in the post during this streak, and as many people on this blog have noticed in the past the offense works much better when they play inside out.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
3:30 pm
Miami and Detroit lost… Yes. The Hawks pickup another game on both of them…
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
3:30 pm
Detroit loses too. Darko got a double double in his return to Detroit. Hilarious.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
3:31 pm
Wow, 12-1 without Marvin in the starting lineup. Where are all the Josh Smith haters?
ray
March 15th, 2009
3:34 pm
Sweet win, and yet another example of how to properly use the JJ ISO.
Simple: run enough effective plays through other guys, making them a credible threat, and eliminating the effectiveness of throwing double and triple teams at Joe.
It may have taken FIVE WHOLE YEARS to figure this out, but we’re there now. As long as we continue this, we’ll be okay.
It was nice to see us outplay the Blazers in nearly facet of the game (except rebounding, they always beat us in that segment). Our defense was definitely better, both schematically and by way of execution. PROPS TO SENOR WOODSON on that one, and the players of course.
Great game by JJ. He’s a beast when you let him do HIS thing, instead of making him do EVERYTHING, a point that my friend Niremetal has brought up repeatedly (but has been largely ignored).
Nice game by Josh and Al, though they struggle against such sizeable lineups. The fact that we still won by nearly 20 tells you something, though. And I see their haters are conspicuously quiet…
Basically, we did to the Blazers what most teams have been doing to us for the past 5 years: limited them to one effective offensive option. Sure, Roy more or less did his thing. And Aldridge had a decent night. But he wasn’t the amount of trouble he usually is, and only Outlaw was able to muster double digit scoring other than those two, despite McMillan’s extensive use of his bench.
All of our starters played fairly well at the least. It was nice to see Bibby get a few dimes and hit some shots. He’s been starving out there on the court lately (still takes too many 3s).
Gotta give Woody credit. He used, but did not overuse the bench. The starters were playing pretty well, especially in the second half.
It was great to see us FINALLY compete with, and beat the Blazers. I loved this one!
ray
March 15th, 2009
3:36 pm
Co-sign Najeh….
Blast
March 15th, 2009
3:42 pm
Portland turned the ball over 18 times! Hawks playing the kind of defence and rebounding that got them to a 6-0 start. Hawks are meshing just in time. Glad to see them crank up their play to playoff level at this time. Josh and Al seems able to read each other’s minds, Bibby is flipping up sweet alley-ooh’s for Josh to smash down, Joe is back to being a scoring machine, Marvin is our wild card, 6th man Flip is an assasin, and Mario finally gets to show the world how crazy he is. Damn! Life is good….Now if only Marvin would volunteer to come off the bench….
ray
March 15th, 2009
3:45 pm
Rod,
I disagree. It’s Josh and Al. Joe takes plays off on the regular. He rotates slowly sometimes, too. But that goes unnoticed a lot.
Having said that, Marvin is a better defender than he gets credit for. Try putting JJ on Lebron. See if he scores 35 then….Try putting Mo on any of those guys. There’s a reason he’s on the bench, dude.
Blast,
We’re great at home. And yeah, we could actually win all 7 games here. Remember, we beat the Celts down in the arena in the playoffs last year. But it’s the road that bothers me….Gotta be able to win on the road to go far…
Man that was a great win. And is Gardner a gunner or what? Young cat could have a future with this team. He ain’t scared to shoot, I know THAT…I’m even happy enough to ignore the inevitable nonsensical “COY” BS…
ray
March 15th, 2009
3:46 pm
Wondering where all the Josh Smith haters are…
Astro Joe
March 15th, 2009
3:47 pm
Najeh, Marvin has NEVER been the “focal point” of te front court’s offense. OK, maybe he was for like 4 games this season, but no more than that. I agree that Marvin and Smith rarely have good games together but when they are healthy and playing together, there is no doubt which one is most likely to take the majority of the shot attempts (and which one will ultimately be accused on being too passive).
Blast
March 15th, 2009
3:50 pm
1 win from 40! What rarefied air the Hawks are breathing in! Hawks trying to hang with the big boys! It’s great being a Hawks fan!!!!
Blast
March 15th, 2009
3:56 pm
You right Ray, the road worries me, but the Hawks have more home games to play now, and they need to keep that fourth spot to make it out of the first round.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
3:57 pm
Ray, you will need to put an APB out on the Josh haters. They are sure to stay in hiding now that he’s found his groove again. I (along with you, doc and many others) try to tell them that he was going thru a slump and well surely return to form…..
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
3:57 pm
“Najeh, Marvin has NEVER been the “focal point” of te front court’s offense.”
That’s not what I was trying to say. It’s just that when Marvin is in, neither he nor Josh gets consistent touches, whereas when he’s out, the touches he gets tend to go to Josh. It has worked the other way around too, like when Marvin scored 30 against Denver when Josh was out a couple of weeks ago. Of course, the difference is that the Hawks are undefeated without Marvin and 6-7 without Josh.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
4:00 pm
Those two loses to Charlotte and NYK may have cost the Hawks their 50 wins goal but I’m still hopeful. Hopefully we can sweep the Celts and Lakers at home while I’m in attendance…. Go Hawks
Blast
March 15th, 2009
4:02 pm
Today’s loss dropped Portland to 7th in the West.
Astro Joe
March 15th, 2009
4:03 pm
Najeh, OK. I agree that when Mo or Zaza start the other two get more touches. I think “focal point” was the term that didn’t quite sound right to me.
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
4:05 pm
Wow. They just showed Joe Johnson 3pt shot against the Celtics in the playoffs last year for the NBA commerical “where amazing happens” during the Mavs/Lakers game on ABC…. Hawks getting national exposures…. Yes Sir….
Ken Strickland
March 15th, 2009
4:09 pm
It’s really amazing and enjoyable to see the Hawks play the way we knew they were capable of playing. (1)We’re running, playing uptempo and getting easy baskets. (2)We’re going deeper into our bench and getting more production, which has allowed our starters to get more rest. (3)Having our starters start the 4th qtr rested has allow us to play better DEF, make our FT’s, all but eliminate unforced turnovers, rebound better, shoot better, get leads and hold on to them.
The change in this team, and the consistent OFF and DEF play, started with the change in approach of HC Mike Woodson. The recent attitude, approach, decision making and adjustments Woodson has made, along with the positive results, have revealed the main cause of the Hawks previous lack of consistency, energy, focus and poor OFF and/or DEF.
The question is, WILL HE FINALLY ACCEPT THE OBVIOUS, AFTER OVER 4YRS OF STUBBORN DENIAL/RESISTENCE? WILL HE FINALLY ACCEPT WHAT THE TEAM AND THE PLAYERS HAVE REPEATEDLY DEMONSTRATED IS BEST FOR THEM AHEAD OF WHAT HE WANTS TO SEE FROM THE TEAM? THE WAY THE HAWKS HAVE BASICALLY DOMINATED QUALITY COMPETITION THE LAST 5GMS IS WHY MOST OF US HAVE BEEN UNABLE REST ON THE FACTS WE MADE THE PLAYOFFS LAST YR, AND WE’RE THE 4TH SEED THIS YR. WE SHOULD HAVE PLAYED LIKE THIS ALL YR.
Blast
March 15th, 2009
4:10 pm
Looking at the seedings, whoever wins the West is going to be so beat up, that I can see the Championship staying in the East again. Those west matchups are going to be brutal. If the playoffs started today, in the 1st round Lakers would play Dallas, San Antonio would play Portland, Houston vs Utah, and Denver playing the Hornets. No matter how the season ends, west matchups is going to be crazy, man.
bigjohnhawksfan
March 15th, 2009
4:13 pm
We need to talk with Portland in the offseason about Prysbilla… *evil plan!*
ILL-logical
March 15th, 2009
4:25 pm
I need to get Comcast on the ‘phone because something has got to be wrong with my set: I saw a line up with Josh at the 3;Al at the 4; and ZaZa at the 5? And I thought I saw ZaZa dunk! Where is that number… or maybe I just need the number to the 8th floor at Grady.
terrell barron
March 15th, 2009
4:32 pm
Big John, I doubt they move Prysbilla with Oden’s health issues. But you never know.
REGGIE
March 15th, 2009
4:34 pm
Other Reggie: Can you like put a 2 beside your name because you are confusing me with these posts. I’m thinking I didn’t post that. Also please don’t compare Horford to Karl Malone. Seriously?
Great win for the Hawks. In no way are we a better team without Marvin. It’s stupid to think that. He just stretches out the floor even more for us with his solid perimeter game. He is another offensive option and a very solid defender. He could be our best man on man defender as he has showed when guarding Melo and LBJ this year and doing very well against them. Joe looks great and put up 30 tonight without having his perimeter shot. That’s very nice and Sekou is right about JJ getting Player of the Week. It won’t happen. Wade will probably grab it this week. Good win for the Hawks and for some reason I never thought we would lose this game right when it started. I just had a comfy feel about the game.
Take it to the Kings EARLY!
terrell barron
March 15th, 2009
4:35 pm
Wher you been Ill-logical? Zaza had a steal and through one down against Utah. lol!!
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
4:40 pm
ILL-Logical: We run Smith 3 Al 4 Zaza 5 at least twice a game when Marvin is healthy and a lot since he has been out. Also Zaza has dunked numerous times this season.
RLP
March 15th, 2009
4:40 pm
The Hawks have home games against the Celtics, Lakers, Magic, Spurs and Heat before the season ends. What a great time to be a Hawks fan. Maybe it is time to get some revenge for all of those close games against quality teams that we lost earlier in the season. And even if they lose some of these games the way they are playing now the games should still be interesting. If they continue to play like they are now I am picking them to beat the Celtics, Magic and Heat out of those games.They may beat the Spurs. And wouldn’t it be great if they could steal a win from the Lakers?
I do think the Hawks need Marvin back. I could see Woody putting Marvin on Roy today and shutting him down because of his size. But I also like how the rotation has changed since his departure. We need him to get back, if possible, and get in shape before the playoffs begin.
Rod from College Park
March 15th, 2009
4:48 pm
Ray,
I will have to agree with you. The two best defenders are Josh and Al. Marvin has never shut anybody down, so I don’t know where all this great defense he plays is coming from. I still think Joe is a better defensive player than Marvin also. Just my opinion.
Rollins Tree
March 15th, 2009
4:57 pm
Joe Johnson is back!! Funny how the team turned around after the Smith / Woodson fight. Whatever it takes right?
hawkfan
March 15th, 2009
5:06 pm
this is something interesting i found, Josh Smith says:
“I think Coach is doing a good job of subbing. Everybody that’s coming out there, it’s like an automatic gel. Flip’s coming out there and playing his butt off. Everybody’s helping out on defense, and when we do that, we’re at our best.”
hmmm, can i say that josh smith is seeing the difference in woodson letting the bench play like everyone here has been addressing all along
Mark
March 15th, 2009
5:08 pm
Ray, I have to admit Josh is playing much better. If he and Al average double-doubles consistently with
good post defense then this team might get out of the first round and may shock Cleveland.( Even though the league wouldn’t allow it. Especially to King James.) We just need JJ to get concentrate on getting and finding his shot early in games so that we won’t have to play so much catch up.
Ariose
March 15th, 2009
5:08 pm
Nice game, I was there……Portland looked lifeless in the4th lol. I wanted to see more Acie though…
Mark
March 15th, 2009
5:13 pm
I think that we are better off without Marvin for now. Woodson is using his bench more and I am scared that if Marvin came back he would go back to that eight man rotation crap. Just like he did when Horford and Josh came off of injuries. He stopped playing Solo. Woodson does stupid stuff like that. If Marvin were to come back, you wouldn’t see West or A.C.
cp
March 15th, 2009
5:15 pm
The Hawks are playing the way they did to start the season. Its great to see Joe find his groove again. Bibby looks like he is starting to get his rhythm back. The bench is producing. I know it looks like we are a better team without Marvin right now but come playoff time we will need him.
Astro Joe
March 15th, 2009
5:19 pm
Funny how the Joe fans never clamor for the “Joe haters” to vindicate themselves, like Smith’s afans do. Joe was rigtfully ripped during his woeful play much like Josh was… and it’s great to have both back playing at their typical level.
Big Ump
March 15th, 2009
5:33 pm
Ken Strickland:
The Hawks won but most of your blog is about the HC. Do you really hate HC that much. Hatered always affect a person process of thinking. Please don’t give me that line again that you speaking for most of the Hawks fans. Sure the HC have faults like other coaches do. The Hawks HC is not
the greatest coach in the NBA and he not the worst HC either. Your next comment will be that the player won 39 games without him, but lost because of him. Can you imagine any team.in any sport
that can be successful without a HC or Manager. Who will make line ups out, who will say who play of who won’t play and etc. I don’t think the Hawks or any other NBA team have that kind of maturity
to play without an HC. If you did not have an HC there will be a lot of bickering among the players and fighting among each other and it would be a totally diaster. Ken take a clue from Ray, Doc,
Kirkanga, Aroise Samuel and other veteran bloggers who always recognize the success or failure of the Hawks and will speak their mind if it’s the players or HC at that time. I’m not speaking for the most of the Hawks fan or any Hawks fans I’m just speaking for myself…
kirkinga
March 15th, 2009
5:36 pm
The Hawks remembered what happen to them when they visited Portland and today avenged a horrible loss. I think we have to give credit to the Hawks, it’s not so much that Portland didn’t play as well as expected so much as it was the Hawks who imposed their will upon the Blazers. Sometimes an embarrassing loss can be great motivation.
I agree with Astro Joe, it’s high time we see the brown spots in other fields as well as our own. And as Ariose predicted, no 50 for Wade today “just” 18 as he said he “didn’t have the energy” today.
Hawks now 2.5 games up on the Heat who only have 7 home games remaining.Hawks have only 7 road games remaining.The Hawks really could help their quest for the 4th spot by wining a game or 2 on the road just in case they lose a game at home.
It looks harder and harder for the Sixers and Pistons to reach and hold on to the 4th spot.Both teams with double digit road games remaining and the Pistons the only team besides the Celtics and Cavs with a wining road record in the East.
Um, now who was it that said the Hawks would go 3-17 the rest of this season?
Go Hawks!!
kirkinga
March 15th, 2009
5:40 pm
Correction…the Magic also are above .500 on the road.
darrell starks
March 15th, 2009
5:53 pm
DEFENSE , DEFENSE, DEFENSE , THATS HOW YOU PLAY BALL LONG AS WE PLAY GOOD DEFENSE BOX OUT REBOUND AND PUSH THE BALL UP COURT WE WILL BE OKAY.GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
niremetal
March 15th, 2009
6:04 pm
Rod,
We get it. You don’t like Marvin. But since you are nearly alone in thinking that he hasn’t shown himself this year to be a dangerous scorer and our top perimeter defender, I’d suggest you find a new line of conversation before people start seeing your name and hitting “Page Down.”
Ray,
Man, it feel good to see JJ playing like this again. Sekou said awhile back that if you don’t double-team JJ, he’ll score pretty much every time. Today, he proved that. I was really amazed that McMillan didn’t make the adjustment quickly and start double-teaming JJ every time he touched the ball. But I think that might be a testament to the recent resurgence of Josh and (more importantly) the rapid rise of Horford. And with the way Flip has been playing lately, I guess you can’t blame McMillan for at least wanting to start by just single-covering JJ. After all, if the Hawks have Flip, Bibby, Josh, and Al on the floor, who do you leave open to double JJ? I think Al actually got more double-teams today than JJ did – which goes to illustrate your point that when we run our offense through the frontcourt on a more regular basis, it opens things up for us hugely.
Lacsho
March 15th, 2009
6:11 pm
Great win, it was good to see the entire team participate!!
Melvin
March 15th, 2009
6:49 pm
Forget all this Western Conf is the best talk. Utah, New Orleans and Portland all came East and got stomp…. The West has 6 teams under 25 wins for the season. The Hawks would have 50 wins if they played in the west…lol
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
7:05 pm
Rod:
Marvin is the best man on man defender we have. He has gotten put on Melo, LBJ, Pierce, VC, and Granger this year and has shut them down a lot. Do you remember the game against Cleveland when we shut him down the whole game and the only time LBJ went off was when Marvin was sitting. He also killed Melo when we played Denver. Marvin can really play hard perimeter defense and is the best at it on our team.
Mark:
How can you say we are better without Marvin. That is plain stupid. With how hot he was before he got hurt I don’t understand how we are better? Are we better because he was becoming our 2nd offensive option? Are we better because he is our 2nd most versatile player and can spread the floor out with his range? Marvin coming back shouldn’t affect our rotation anyways since we sub Mario and AC in for guards. Marvin Williams isn’t a guard. Of course you’ll find some way to complain about Woody after the great job he has done as of late. Seriously Mark tell me how we are better without Marvin and why are you always complaining or saying something negative.
Eric
March 15th, 2009
7:42 pm
JUST LAST WEEK AFTER THE HAWKS BEAT THE PISTONS, EVERY SPORTS RADIO STATION IN TOWN WAS TALKING ABOUT TRADING JOSH SMITH AND BREAKING UP THE ENTIRE HAWKS TEAM. ATLANTA HAS THE WORST FAN BASE IN THE COUNTRY. IT’S THE REASON THIS TOWN HAS ONLY ONE WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP. THEY’RE TOO QUICK TO BUST A TEAM UP BEFORE THEY SEE THE FINISHED PRODUCT. JOSH SMITH IS AN EXCITING PLAYER, YOUNGEST PLAYER TO 500 BLOCKS IN N.B.A HISTORY. JOSH IS 23 YRS OLD, AND IS ABOUT 5YRS FROM HIS PEAK. THE HAWKS ARE ON A 5 GAME WIN STREAK AND THE CITY IS QUIET, NO ONE WANTS TO TALK ABOUT THEM NOW THAT THEY’RE WINNING. ONLY IN ATLANTA, HOME OF THE WORST FANS IN AMERICA!!!
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
7:52 pm
Eric:
I highly doubt every sports radio station in town was wanting to trade Josh Smith. We were upset with his play at the time but he has picked it up since then. Also don’t think because of some radio stations that Atlanta has the worst fans in America. Also what does fans have to do with Championships. Most of the fans are usually mad because we don’t win championships. It’s not that the fans cause teams to not win championships. Just be gald you don’t live in Seattle or San Fransisco or Detroit except for their one NBA title their sports are pretty bad right now.
Clyde
March 15th, 2009
7:54 pm
This is the best I’ve seen the Hawks play all season. Its good that they are hitting their stride heading into the playoffs. If it goes down how bout Miami and Atlanta in a seven game series. Watching two of the hottest teams in the NBA going head to head would be exciting.
Eric
March 15th, 2009
8:05 pm
REGGIE, I WAS BORN AND RAISED IN ATLANTA. I REMEBER WHEN FANS RAN DOMINIQUE WILKINS OUT OF TOWN, BECAUSE HE WAS A BALL HOG. I REMEBER WHEN LENNY WILKINS HAD MOOKIE, STEVE SMITH, AND MUTOMBO, AND THE FANS SAID THE TEAM WAS BORING AND THE GAME HAD PASSED LENNY BY. WE BROKE THAT TEAM UP AND IT TOOK ALMOST 8 YRS TO JUST MAKE THE PLAY-OFFS. ATLANTA IS THE ONLY CITY IN AMERICA THAT HAS HALF OF THE AREANA OR DOME CHEERING FOR THE OPPONENTS, AND THATS EVERY GAME. P.S. AND IT’S NOT BECAUSE THE CITY HAS TRANSPLANTS, BECAUSE THE ONE’S CHEERING FOR THE OTHER TEAM WAS BORN RIGHT HERE!!!
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
8:08 pm
Wade’s team went 3-1 this week. JJ’s team went 4-0.
Wade scored 18 in the game Heat lost. JJ scored in the 30s in every win.
JJ’s team increased their lead for the 4th place this week.
This week goes to Joe.
Mo scored 2 pts, 2 rebounds and had 4 fouls. He has a hard time guarding and rebounding against bigger guys after we switch. Did you see how many offensive rebounds were snatched by Portland big guys when Mo was switched to them.
Hawks are more focused when Marvin, Joe or Josh are out, and we have to depend on an inferior player to sub any of them. That focus has helped us surge when Mo starts. I’d like to see Mario West and Acie get regular roles even after Marvin comes back. If anything Mo’s minutes should be cut.
Mario has changed two games in a row. He got Dennis Rodman’s determination. If he had 4 more inches, he’d have been awesome.
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
8:10 pm
I want sixers or pistons to overtake Miami. Refs will tilt the field if we play Miami in the first round. It would be nice if Wade takes out Boston in the first round in the 3 vs 6 series
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
8:16 pm
Reggie – Marvin didn’t shut down all those superstar small forwards, but he considerably slowed them down. Mo would be Lawn MOwed by those bigger stronger Small Forward studs. Mo has a role in this team, but Marvin is a far better rebounder, scorer, shooter, defender and everything else. If Joe and Josh didn’t get hot suddenly, we would have been in deep trouble.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
8:28 pm
Eric:
We probably shouldn’t have let Wilkins go but once again do you think the fans traded him? Also Wilkins didn’t have many years left in him. Also have you been to a Hawks game this year? Times have changed since 3 years ago when there were no Hawks game in the arena. I go to most home games and even against Boston we killed them in fan numbers and it wasn’t even close. Did you go to a Falcons game this year? Once again times have changed. Actually The Dome usually doesn’t sport many away team fans in games. Also the Braves are one of the biggest national teams behind NY, CHI, and BOS. Those are the only teams that even have many people at Turner when they come here. To say our stadiums/domes/arenas are filled with Away teams fans shows you don’t go to or watch games.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
8:30 pm
Sorry I was trying to say when there were no hawks FANS in the arena 3 years ago.
Eric
March 15th, 2009
8:47 pm
REGGIE, I WAS AT PHILLPS WHEN THE HAWKS PLAYED THE MIAMI HEAT TWO WEEKS AGO, AND ABOUT 30% OF THE FANS HAD HEAT GEAR ON. IT WAS SO BAD THAT AT THE END OF THE GAME A LADY, WHO WAS A HAWKS FANS YELLED OUT ” ALL YOU MIAMI HEAT FANS CAN GO HOME NOW”!!! THE LAST TIME I WAS AT A FALCONS GAME WAS WHEN NUMBER 7 WAS HERE, IT WAS AGAINST CLEVELAND AND AS SORRY AS THAT FRANCHISE IS THEY BROUGHT THE ENTIRE DOG POUND WITH THEM TO ATLANTA. I’VE NEVER IN MY LIFE SEEN SO MANY DOG HEADS, THEY REALLY SHOW PRIDE IN THEIR TEAM.
Mark
March 15th, 2009
9:02 pm
Reggie, you gotta be kidding me to think that times have changed. The question is, did you go to the games. Obviously, we are gonna outnumber the opposing teams’ fans, but that doesn’t mean that other teams fans aren’t there. Even though the Falcons sold out every game there were not full until the last couple of games (Tampa Bay, St. Louis). You must not have been at the Bears game. It was a fact that companies bought remaining tickets to several falcon games and that is why the games were sellouts and weren’t blacked out locally. The only reason the Braves were had fans. Honestly, fans have good reasons not to show up. The Braves teased us with division titles, the Falcons have never had back-to-back winning seasons and Hawks haven’t been past the second round of the PLAYOFFS in their history in Atlanta. The fans aren’t losers, the teams are. Atlanta fans know what to expect when it comes to their teams. I will admit more fans are coming to the Hawks games, but we all know that they won’t get past the second round of the playoffs. You know it too Reggie.
Oh yeah Reggie, as far as Marvin goes we are better without him because of Woodson. Reggie gotta be stupid or plain delusional to see that when Woody has all of his starters he goes with that same eight man rotation in which the only bench player that play are Flip, Mo, and Zaza. Heck, ask Solo. He was playing well while both Al and Josh were injured, but as soon as they were healthy Woody started giving him the A.C. Law treatment. Reggie I have never criticized Woody, only Josh.
So please shutup! If Marvin is hurt badly, I don’t know if we should resign him. He is having a decent season, but it is his contract year so I am sure he wants to be paid. (sort of like Josh last year).
Mark
March 15th, 2009
9:06 pm
The Braves had a solid fan base, but as they won more and more division titles we knew what to expect from Bobby and his dumb managing as soon as the playoffs hit.(Correction from previous post.)
Rod from College Park
March 15th, 2009
9:07 pm
Niremetal,
Why don’t you take your own advice and page down when you see my post? If you don’t want to read my post, then I will be the first one to tell you to PAGE DOWN. My points are valid, and have been, and will be proven. Other people seem to enjoy my post, and let me know that they do. NO MARVIN=WINS!!!!! Marvin is not our best perimeter defender. THAT IS A FALSE STATEMENT. SEE BELOW. I was one of the only ones still supporting Josh when the majority of you were crying about how terrible he is; so let me have my moment please. Thanks!!!
Reggie,
Players you named that Marvin shut down this year against the Hawks:
Vince Carter – 26, 29, 18, 18 avg = 22 ppg
Granger – 34, 25 = 29.5 ppg
Lebron – 24, 33, 26 = 27.6 ppg
Carmelo – 16, 23 = 19.5 ppg
Pierce – 34, 18 = 26 ppg
Durant – 28 extra one = 28ppg
These are the numbers, now please help me understand who he shut down this year? This myth about Marvin being a great defensive player is hilarious. 10-1without him. I know you addressed this question to Mark, but I thought I would help him out. THIS POST IS IN RESPONSE TO REGGIE’S POST. IN NO WAY AM I SAYING THAT MARVIN WAS THE ONLY ONE GUARDING THESE PLAYERS WHEN WE PLAYED THEM.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
9:10 pm
Since Marvin has been out, the Hawks are holding opponents under 85 points per game. We are a better team without Marvin “duck” Williams.
mred1943
March 15th, 2009
9:30 pm
Sekou
The hawks will go along way as long JJ be agressive and drive to the basket instead of dribbling away most of the time and then taking long off balance jump shots
Eric
March 15th, 2009
9:30 pm
MO EVANS IS A SOLID ON THE BALL DEFENDER, AND HE GIVES THE HAWKS A BETTER DEFENSIVE ROTATION TO DEFEND THE THREE POINT LINE. THE HAWKS LIKE TO SWITCH ON EVERYTHING DEFENSIVELY. MARVIN IS A SCORER AND REBOUNDER, AND WE NEED EVERYBODY WE CAN GET IF WE WANT TO MAKE A SERIOUS PLAYOFF RUN.
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
9:36 pm
Sam – that’s because Hawks know that they are short handed and they have to make it up by being more focused. Defense is a result of focus and efforts.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
9:39 pm
Niremetal, I too agree with Rod. He’s not alone in thinking Marvin hasn’t shown himself as a top perimeter defender or dangerous scorer. Where are you getting this information from? Marvin is a number 2 pick and people continue to hate on Josh Smith, as if Josh Smith was picked number 2. A number 2 pick should be in All-Star conversations. A number 2 pick should be a go to guy. Marvin can’t create his own shot. Marvin’s stats are not that much better than Josh Smith. Marvin is a liability. The Hawks need to sign and trade Marvin and Bibby and trade 1st round pick to the Clippers (Baron Davis wants out) for Kaman or Camby and first round pick and get Stephen Curry. Trade the rights of Josh Childress and if we can’t resign ZaZa, to Portland for Pryzbilla. Starting lineup next year, Curry, Joe, Josh, Horford, Camby or Kaman. Off the bench Mo, Flip, Acie, Pryzbilla. Just a thought, but get rid of this Marvin character.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
9:39 pm
Mark:
Actually I was at the Bears game. I am not a die hard Falcons fan. (like the saints) But They are my second favorite team. The falcons games weren’t going to be sold out for the first few games because of last year but towards the end they were and next year you bet they will be. I’ve been to many Hawks games and the support is great. So there is no way you can say that there are a lot of away teams fans because there isn’t. The Braves have always had great support and will continue to have great support. To say the Hawks WON’T get past the second round is not right. You don’t believe that the Hawks can’t beat the Cavs or Celtics in 7 game series? Will they, well odds are against us but we are perfectly capable of beating them.
We should run a 9 man rotation and maybe get Mario in a bit. I bet you when Marvin gets back Woody will do this. I believe he started doing it before Marvin got hurt. Woody isn’t stupid. He sees it’s working and he has said he should have gone to it earlier. Woody is still an educated basketball coach who notices the bench is providing. If Woody goes back to an 8 man rotation when Marvin gets back than I will be pretty pissed at him and will become a Woody hater. Also I was on Josh a bit but I know his talent and know he would figure it out. He still scares the crap outta me with the ball but I trust that he will be a solid player for us.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
9:42 pm
I would like to see Mario West work on his 3-point shot. If he can develop a standstill 3-point shot that’s as accurate as Mo Evans (around 40%), he could make Mo (and his contract that expires next year) expendable this offseason. He’s still pretty foul-prone, but he provides a lot of the energy and offensive rebounding that the team has been missing since Josh Childress left.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
9:42 pm
Jerry West, no. That’s because Coach Woodson is playing his bench more, and has realized that Mario West and Acie Law can also play defense. Kyle Korver killed us the first time we played Utah in Salt Lake. Here, everytime Korver entered the game, Woody put Mario in. He shut Korver down. I think Solo needs to play a little more though. Mo Evans is better for us because he knows his exact role. Marvin is still trying to live up to his number 2 pick status.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 15th, 2009
9:46 pm
The thing about a lot of ATL’s fans is that they are front-runners. The same ones who come to games wearing Kobe and LeBron jerseys are rooting for the Hawks at the end of the game when it’s close and the Hawks seem to have the upper hand. They are not the worst part about ATL sporting events. By far worse are the corporate suits who clog up the lower levels with their company-bought tickets and sit there silently like they are at a movie theater, contributing nothing to the game atmosphere, barely paying attention to the game, and taking seats that would otherwise go to fans that actually cared. And from what I’ve seen, there are plenty of those who are native ATLiens as well as transplants.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
9:49 pm
Are you people stupid? How can you tell me we are a btter team without Marvin? Did you not see how he was performing before he got hurt. Do you not know a single thing about basketball? Sam your last post was hilarious. Marvin can create his own shot. He was the only guy doing it a couple weeks ago. He can shoot and drive and draw contact. I didn’t know a liability puts up around 30 points in a 4 game stretch or so. I don’t feel like looking it up but the week before he got hurt he put up like 30, 28, 31 I believe and was really rolling.
Rod:
I was making examples of the best SF we have faced and saying Marvin has had to defend them. Telling me stats is proving nothing. Against Clevekand Lebron had about 17 points in the quarter Marvin sat because of fouls (via refs loving LBJ). Also he SHUT down Melo the night he had 16 points. Once again those points were in a quarter that Marvin rested. I don’t think Marvin guarded VC much because he plays 2 usually I believe. Rod stars are going to score their points but when Marvin has had to guard the suy he has done a solid job. I wonder why JS doesn’t usually get put on this guy. Because JS is a help defender to get his block. Marvin is our best perimeter defender. I have been disappointed with Smith this year because he hasn’t done a good job of helping the Guy guarding their star when he gets past him. Again though saying we are better without Marvin is absurd and stupid.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
9:57 pm
I believe a reason we are winning without Marv is because we know we have to step up on D and play better. It’s crunch time and we have a lot of intensity right now. This will only increase when he gets back.
Eric
March 15th, 2009
9:58 pm
REGGIE, I WISH WE HAD MORE FANS LIKE YOU IN THE ATL. SAM FROM THE DA SWATS WANTS TO TRADE HALF THE TEAM, SEE WHAT I’M SAYING. NO LOYALTY, NO HOPE, NO OPTIMISM ABOUT OUR TEAMS HERE. BELIEVE IT OR NOT FANS TALK, RADIO SPORTS STATIONS HEAR THIS CRAP AND PUT IT ON AIR, AND THEN GM’S IN ATLANTA MAKE THESE DUMB MOVES THAT SET OUR TEAMS BACK 8 YRS.!!!
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:00 pm
Reggie, WE ARE 12 AND 1 WITHOUT MARVIN YOU IDIOT!!!!
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
10:01 pm
Sam –
are you kidding when you want to make Josh a SF?
are you kidding when you want to pick up max money over the hill injury prone Davis when no team in the NBA would touch him with a chopstick?
are you kidding when you think Chillz+Zaza=Priz?
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:02 pm
Eric, I don’t want to trade the team, but if you know basketball, you know we won’t be able to resign everybody. So we will have to do some sign and trade deals. Believe me, I wish we could keep everybody and add a couple of pieces, but I know we can’t . We can’t resign Bibby, then have to turn around and resign Marvin and Joe in 2010. We will have to make some moves.
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
10:03 pm
Sam-
are you kidding when you say Marvin can’t create for himself?
Do you think Mo can?
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
10:04 pm
Sam we are not 12-1 without marvin. thats a lie. don’t parrot other people. do you own research.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:04 pm
Jerry West, read and comprehend. I said we can trade Bibby to the Clippers because Baron wants out. Since Chillz went overseas, you’re not going to get much for him. We may not be able to resign Zaza.
RLP
March 15th, 2009
10:05 pm
Kudos to Najeh Davenpoop. Your 9:46 post was right on.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:10 pm
Najeh, you are right, it is too many nice fans. You all can blame me for that first Celtics loss at home. I was about 3 rows back from the basket talking mad stuff to Garnet. He was woofing back and forth with all the people in my section. Then he commenced to hit 5 shots in a row. It took me and a couple others to get people to make noise and get into the game. Everybody is trying to be all cool and cute.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:11 pm
Jerry West, check the stats. WE ARE 12-1 THIS YEAR WHEN MO EVANS STARTS.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:12 pm
This is what you will see in the playoffs this year.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLsHMb-tnNI
Eric
March 15th, 2009
10:14 pm
SAM, JUST GOING BY WHAT NEW GM RICK SUND SAID A FEW WEEKS AGO. HE SAID IT IS VERY POSSIBLE TO SIGN EVERYBODY BACK, SPEEDY COMES OFF THE BOOKS THIS YEAR OR NEXT. ALSO THE HAWKS STILL HAVE THE RIGHTS TO JOSH CHILLDRESS, THAT THEY CAN TRADE OR DO WHAT EVER WHEN HE COMES BACK IN A YEAR.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
10:16 pm
Sam: We aren’t 12-1 without Marvin. We are 12-1 with Mo in the starting lineup, but that is a pointless stat because he hasn’t even contributed much. Once again you are dumb to say Marvin can’t create his own shot. Bibby isn’t going to want to make anymore than he is making right now. Also to create space I believe next year we will throw away some contracts at the trade deadline like many teams did this year. We’re not in a bad money situation right now anyway. We’re not going to try to draft another rookie PG trust me.The only way we don’t resign Bibby is if we know we can go somewhere else to get a PG.
Najeh:
You are right about that but I don’t think we should be considered the worst fans in sports. That’s not true and we definitely shouldn’t be considered the worst sports town in sports. It does annoy me seeing all these stuck up “fans” sitting down low not giving a crap about the team. Go sit in the suites where you belong.
darrell starks
March 15th, 2009
10:16 pm
Reggie i totally agree with you its not MARVIN its our coach if you notice when HORFORD got hurt we won when JOSH got hurt we won when JOE got hurt we won now MARVIN hurt we are winning it always take for someone to get hurt before WOODY finally UTILIZED HIS BENCH we have been telling woody all year long to devolop YOUR bench AND THIS TEAM WOULD BE STRONG and i hope when marvin come back that he doesnt go back to being the same old WOODY and STARTE BACK using a three man rotation FLIP, EVANS, AND ZAZA WOODY HAVE TO CHANGE HIS COACHING STYLE IN ORDER FOR HIM TO BE SUCCESSFUL AS A HEAD COACH. GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:26 pm
If Marvin can create his own shot, somebody tell me why he only averages 14 points per game as a number 2 pick? Josh Smith your number 17 pick that you all are always hating on, 15.1 ppg and 7.1 rpg, Marvin 14.0 ppg and 6.4 rpg.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:28 pm
We beat Orlando without Marvin, we are 5-0 without Marvin, and 12-1 without Marvin in the starting lineup. YOUR NUMBER 2 PICK SHOULD NEVER BE CONSIDERED NOT TO BE A STARTER ON YOUR TEAM.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
10:38 pm
Sam:
You must be a guy that only looks at the box score. Wait never mind just the stats for the year. Have you not seen Marvin lately? Did you not see him put up 30 twice and high 20s the other night in the same week. I believe those were the stats but I watch things not just look at stats. Marvin has gotten his confidence down and was getting extremely hot. How is Marvin not considered a starter when he starts every game for us when he is healthy. That made no sense at all. How are we 5-0 without Marvin but 12-1 without him in the starting lineup. Once again that makes no sense. We are 12-1 with Mo in the starting lineup! Not 12-1 with Marvin not in the starting lineup. Mo also started when Smith was out. I wasn’t hating on Josh he is playing well right now. I was upset with his play before the feud but have never questioned his potential or talent. He was a steal at 17. Why are you making such a big deal about marvin being a number 2 pick. You should be complaining more about drafting Big Shelden in the top 5.
Mike is back
March 15th, 2009
10:38 pm
Great stuff guys, haven’t been able watch many games lately, but I know I always come to the blog and get THA HOOK UP ON THE HAWKS. Can’t wait for ESPN FOLK!!
DITTO ON THE BLOG. KEEP DOING YO THANG HAWKSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:39 pm
Darrell Starks, we were .500 when we lost Horford, Joe, and Josh. We’re undefeated with Marvin totally out. WE HAVEN’T LOST A GAME, and I can see if we’re playing bad teams. WE BEAT ORLANDO, UTAH, PORTLAND, AND HORNETS WITHOUT MARVIN. I hope you’re right. I hope when Marvin comes back, we don’t get the same old Woody. Bring that guy off the bench.
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
10:39 pm
Sam – you not only make up things, you also try to change what you said before. This is internet. There is record of what you said. Your logic is also sophomoric. You are repeating what has already been debunked. Perhaps I should scroll down when I see your childish posts.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:48 pm
Reggie, let me go slow with you. Read very carefully. We are 12-1 without Marvin in the starting lineup or out period. This means he was coming off the bench in some of those games. We are undefeated when that guy hasn’t played at all. That’s Orlando, Utah, Portland, New Orleans, and Portland. I watch all the games, and not only have I watched all the Hawks games, I have the NBA package and watch a lot of the other teams as well. Marvin put up 30 twice, I’m happy for him. A number 2 pick should have about 10 of those this year by now. I’m upset at that number 2 pick because I see guys drafted after him that are All-Stars. He hasn’t lived up to his potential. 14.0 points per game is an average NBA player. You have to admit, there are many small forwards that are better. Mo Evans is shooting 40% from the 3 point line, Marvin 35%, just saying.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:52 pm
Jerry, You can scroll wherever, facts are facts. 12-1 without Marvin starting or in the game period. It may not mean anything to you. Hypothetically, if that record was 5-7, you guys would be on here saying how much we need Marvin and we miss him. We don’t miss him, we don’t need him.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:53 pm
Sorry Reggie, the other team was Indiana we beat without Marvin.
darrell starks
March 15th, 2009
10:54 pm
SAM WHAT ARE YOU SAYING ABOUT MARVIN ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT THIS TEAM IS BAD WITH HIM. GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
10:57 pm
I will say this, I like that there is finally some healthy conversations about my Hawks after years of nothing to cheer about other than last year. I’ve been a Hawks fan since John Drew, Tom McMillan, Armond Hill, and Steve Hawes, just to name a few. If you don’t know who that is, then I will just blame it on age. So don’t come at me like I’m some new Hawks fan. I know basketball, and I just know the one weak link on our team.
darrell starks
March 15th, 2009
10:58 pm
SAM FROM SWATS WHAT ARE YOU DRINKING I WOULD LUV TO HAVE SOME POUR ME SOME OF THAT HENDOG BRO. GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The Truth
March 15th, 2009
11:04 pm
I think the Mo Evans factor in the Hawks win streak is nothing more than a coincidence. Mo seems to always be in the right at the right time. For instance, during this recent win-streak, JJ is very motivated shooting lights-out and playing aggressive to make-up the scoring deficient with Marvin being out. JJ just happened to come out of his shooting slump during the starting-Mo-era. I notice he’s not just a jump shooter anymore as before. It seems; he’s doing most of offensive damage in the paint with a new game of floaters, runners and lay-ups instead of the tuff fall-away jump shots as his primary weapon. To be honest, Joe has re-invented himself offensively and it came with Mo in the starting line-up. Also, the Hawks in general has adopted an all-hand-on-deck approach with each player stepping-up the defensive game to make-up for the loss of Marvin. I’ll give this credit to both the players and Woody for the outstanding defensive performance. Simply stated, the numbers don’t add-up. Marvin’s stat numbers far exceed Mo Evans on both sides of the ball. Having said all of this, I will also say, however, if the players and coaching staff believe Mo Evans is better as a starter by being very superstitious, they could continue this lineup against conventional wisdom.
Eric
March 15th, 2009
11:05 pm
SAM, NOT TO DUMP ON YOU, BUT WHEN JOE JOHNSON WAS OUT MARVIN HAD 29/7 AND 23/10 AND THE HAWKS WON BOTH GAMES. DOES THAT MEAN WE ARE BETTER WITHOUT JOE???
KevinA
March 15th, 2009
11:12 pm
The better play of ZaZa, Al, Josh, JJ and Flip have more to do with our late success rather than the loss of Marvin. The entire team is playing with more energy at home. Bibby is the only starter I would trade and that is because of his 14 million dollar contract and defense skills. Don’t get me wrong, I am a Bibby fan. If he would resign for 10 million I would say, do it. We need the money to help pay off ZaZa, Flip and Marvin. Would love to see Childress come back. Nice exchange for Evans who I like but is not the player Chills is.
I am not convinced that Solo can’t be the guy were looking for down low. He just needs to eat more during the off season and keep working. Keeping evey one paid over the next 4 years should be our main concern. We need Bibby and JJ to take a little less so the others can fit in. I hope it happens. Remember we are still young and have a lot of upside potential. Why trade it away.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
11:13 pm
The Truth:
I co sign that those are the points that Sam can’t seem to get in his head.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
11:16 pm
Yeah Eric and we played the Bobcats, and lost the next game after that against the Clippers.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
11:18 pm
Actually Eric, when Joe was out we played Minnesota and Charlotte without Gerald Wallace when Marvin had those two big games.
Reggie
March 15th, 2009
11:19 pm
Kevin:
I wouldn’t be surprised if Bibby does go for about 10 million this year. He knows he is not as quick and knows he just isn’t quite the player he was and I think he like Atlanta. I wouldn’t be surprised if we see him back in Atlanta next year getting about 10 million for 3 years or so.
Sam from da Swats
March 15th, 2009
11:24 pm
Now Eric, if you want to tell me about how good somebody is against the Timberwolves and the Bobcats without arguably their best player, then good night. No need to waste my time on here.
doc
March 15th, 2009
11:27 pm
you know since josh chewed woody’s arsh out at half time in charlotte woody has been a very good coach. way to go josh it took several head butts but maybe just maybe woody has finally gotten it. what do you say to that astro. heh heh maybe ken and clyde will agree if no one else. double heh heh
thought it was a real interesting interaction between acie and woody the other night. he called acie ver and acie put his hand on woody’s shoulder then as he returned to the court he tapped woody reassuringly on the butt. never would have seen that two weeks ago.
josh really shook this team up. good stuff josh, you even got jj out of his doldrums. never have i seen such a smart player to take it on himself to shake things up like that. he is a psychological wizard.
sam swats the team is 8 and 0 with marvin not playing for what it is worth and as someone said 2 and 0 with jj out. does that mean they can do without jj as well as do without marvin?
JOSH = MVP!
Eric
March 15th, 2009
11:30 pm
BOTTOM LINE IS WE HAVE A GOOD YOUNG TEAM THAT WE ALL SHOULD PUT SOLID SUPPORT BEHIND. THE HAWKS ARE BETTER WHEN THEY HAVE ALL THEIR PLAYERS, SO LET’S END THIS. EVERYBODY GO TO BED!!!
JerryWest
March 15th, 2009
11:48 pm
Doc – that was ROFLMAO.
Ryder
March 15th, 2009
11:51 pm
I see Philly beat Miami earlier today and are now just two games behind the Heat for 5th place in the East. I hope Miami holds on to the 5th spot so they can play Atlanta in the first round. Since the media will be so quick to worship Wade (as will the refs) it will give Atlanta more national exposure (as well as give Joe Johnson more respect) once they beat the Heat.
I think with Marvin being hurt the team is playing with a bit of more urgency. Of course being at home helps, so hopefully they will take care of business against Sacramento on Tuesday and Dallas on Thursday.
Samuel
March 16th, 2009
12:28 am
Just got in. I missed all the fun. I’ll have to watch it later. Looks like the “haters” did too.
Mighty quiet around here after a big win like that.
Two COY candidates in one week.
Woody=Coy
niremetal
March 16th, 2009
12:29 am
Funny. “Rod from College Park” seems to have left. But some guy we’d never seen before named “Sam from da Swats” showed up using similar writing style and syntax and making the same points.
Hmmmmmmm…
Ken Strickland
March 16th, 2009
1:01 am
BIG UMP-I DON’T HATE WOODSON. It seems you read what you wanted me to say about Woodson, not what I said about him. If you had read WHAT I ACTUALLY SAID in my last few posts, you’d know I’ve given HC Mike Woodson credit for the Hawks’ sudden resurgence based on his recent decision making and strategy. This isn’t the first time he’s relaxed his imposed restrictions, reached beyond his 8 man rotation and allowed the team to run and excel. This isn’t the first time we’ve gotten these ssme results after he’s made that change. However, in the past, after we lose a gm or two following a winning stretch, he’s always reverted back to his slow down, ISO, one on one style, which feature JJ and Bibby and we become inconsistent and boring.
My concern is will he do as he’s done in the past in these situations, or will he finally realize, after over 4yrs, this team functinos best playing the style of uptempo ball it’s best suited for, not the slow down, one dimensional ball he’s best suited to coach.
doc
March 16th, 2009
6:32 am
samuel, glad to see you back safely. since you were out and probably missed this from the last post, and you made such a point to ridicule what was said i will bring it forward from the last post:
your quote samuel:
doc, “You got to be kidding me about Outlaw. You oviously don’t really know how the game is played with that comment. There are plenty of players in the league with these “learning disabilities”. Hell, half the students in the public school system are diagnosed by you guys with some kind of disability.
Has nothing to do with him on the court, trust me. You can have your scholarly “heady” guys and i’ll take the SPED players and beat you by 50.”
no samuel, i wasnt kidding, here is the article describing how heady guys saved the kid outlaw and how the portland organization from the gm to the head coach and assistants have done something pretty special in their commitment to their young players. just no dog houses there. they have committed themselves to teaching the young guys to succeed. i applaud it. truly hope you take the time to read it. here it is and again, no, i am not kidding:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-outlaw121807&prov=yhoo&type=lgns
it has everything to do with how outlaw is on the court doesnt it? i really hope you took time to read it as you may stop your constant anti-intellectual theme for lack of a better way to say it and realize there are some folks out there where it is more about who you help to succeed rather than the other way around. i dont expect it because your beliefs are pretty ingrained.
also not too sure what you meant by the “you guys” comment. if i read it right you seem to be implying or inferring something about me that is truly sad. i think most that really know me would say you are so far off base it is shows where your heart, uh no, mind, really is on just about every argument. do you really generalize that much on “us guys”? sad, truly sad.
with that said samuel, i was pulling for woody and our guys yesterday, yelling loud. i assure you i am not one to say he needs to be fired, only held accountable to up his game and follow through on what he admits are his faults, just as the players are held accountable to continue to progress. i imagine the basg and my boy rick see it very similar. change for the sake of change is disastrous usually unless there is a sure bet.
glad josh got wooody’s attention. he might truly turn into a special coach and vice versa.
JOSH = MVP!
ILL-logical
March 16th, 2009
8:44 am
Is it me or did anyone else raise an eyebrow after reading Woodson’s quotes in Terrence Moore’s column about how the fans are expecting too much from this team?
I know what I expect is that the team be well coached: use of the talent to construct a system rather than forcing a system on the talent; effective in- game adjustments; and, strategic decisions based upon factual circumstances and not personal feelings. Hey, maybe it is my fault to expect that?
Re: Marvin. The short answer is that when he is out there is more ball movement and better team defense.( When joe is out there is even better ball movement ). His improvement has been an asset to the team and he does have a good future in the NBA. With the Hawks, that future could be at the 2 when joe departs. The trend around the league is big,physical 2’s like Durant,Kobe and Joe.His skills ,ie shooting and ball handling, are comparable to some of those guys; all he needs is some confidence.
The core talent on the Hawks is very good but it is still not being used effectively IMHO. I quess I am just expecting too much. My bad.
Daniel
March 16th, 2009
9:00 am
Ill-
I have to say that I agree with you about Woody’s comments. Although, not in every point. In truth, if you would have told me at the begining of the season that we would be where we are right now, I would have said great. However, watching this team play so well many times, and downright LOUSY at other points, it is very hard for us as fans to gauge where this team really should be. Honestly, on paper and when playing well I see this team as better than Orlando, but are we really?
In Woodson’s defense, his stated goal at the begining of the season was 50 wins which is a very high goal. I really do hope that Marvin can be back and contribute this season, and I agree with you that I hope that Woody does not shorten his rotation too much. West gives so much that is not recorded in stats in the game. By running the other team ragged when the other team starters are already thinking about the break; takes its toll. Keep using him 5-10 minutes a game. Acie should be getting 15-20 min. And solo really depends on matchups. Also, I don’t care how big we are up, I don’t ever need to see Randolph Morris in the game again.
MannyT
March 16th, 2009
9:28 am
doc, nice point about Woody’s improvement since he & Josh went all soap opera spirited in Charlotte.
Just to show my objectivity and note Samuel’s concern about recognition for Woody. I think he has done a good job since Marvin went down. He has added some wrinkles and taken the krazy glue off the bench seats. That probably get’s him coach of the week, just don’t tell Truett, Dan, & Bubba Cathy, yup…
Woody = COW
Ken Strickland
March 16th, 2009
9:37 am
ILL-LOGICAL-WHAT YOU SAID. Already, there have been comments suggesting our winning streak in the result of Marvins loss. Just how rediculous can some of our fans be. With or without Marvin, after that blowup between Smoove and Woodson, this was going to happen regardless. None of us knows what the exchange between the two was, but it seems obvious that what each individual said to or about the other had a positive affect on both. Josh is playing inspired ball, and Woodson has expanded his range as a HC, at least for now. As a result, we are all benefiting.
I seriously doubt if any of the regulars on these blogs that’s been critical of Woodson’s approach, attitude and control issues, wants him to fail. I know I don’t. All I’ve wanted from him is a lot more of what we’re getting from him now, along with the results. The thing that frustrates and puzzles me to no end about him is why has he been unable or unwilling to see or accept what has been so obvious to most everyone else?
If his coaching philosophy or technique were analyzed scientificically, the results would be obvious and already included in some scientific journal. When the Hawks play an uptempo style of ball and Woodson consistently goes deeper into his bench, the result has been predictable. We get more easy baskets, have better ball movement, have more assists, play better DEF, become way more consistent, successfully overcome the loss of key players, have no sideline or lockerroom issues, and win far more consistently. WOULDN’T THIS BE PREFERABLE TO THE RESULTS WE’VE GOTTEN OVER THE LAST 4+ YRS WHEN WE’VE GONE AWAY FROM THIS FORMULA, WHICH, UNFORTUNATELY, HAS BEEN FAR TOO OFTEN?
TO HC MIKE WOODSON. KEEP UP THE RECENT GOOD WORK, AND DON’T TIGHTEN UP THE LEASH AND REVERT BACK TO WHAT HASN’T WORKED VERY WELL FOR US IN THE PAST AS SOON AS WE HIT A BUMP IN THE ROAD.
Mike is back
March 16th, 2009
9:38 am
ILL, C’MON MAN, we’re talking about Terrance
Cleo Moore, the Self Absorbed Prince, who seems to always come with dubious
comments that either alienate that fans or players, or coaches.
Between, him, Bradley, and Shultz you always count
on one of those JAsses to come up with something controversial, that’s
the only way they can feel relevant.
Astro Joe
March 16th, 2009
10:00 am
doc, funny. There was clearly more going on in that Charlotte intervention than Smith vs. Woody. The whole team has stepped up, including Joe. At the same time, we’re playing at home and that may be the biggest factor in all of this. including our record without Marvin. We’re a very good home team and have been able to win at home without Marvin, Horford and Smith (at various points in the season). We’ve been fortunate that these most recent set of games have not been against an elite SF (Granger missed the Indy game). No doubt that Joe can outplay most comparably sized wing players and with Bibby & Flip in the line-up, those 3 present quite the challenge.
For all of this “Woody is using his bench” talk, Joe still played 40+ minutes in each of the last 5 games (including blowouts against Indy and Portland). I guess everyone is excited about these cameo appearances by Acie and Mario. But those guys seem to be filling the Marvin void… the other 7 are still getting the same PT as normal. But hey, whatever makes you guys feel better about our coach. Since winning 10 more games and improving 4 playoff spots won’t do it, maybe playing Mario and Acie for 8-12 minutes a game will get r done.
Rod from College Park
March 16th, 2009
10:21 am
Niremetal,
Remember to please page down when you se my comments. It will save you a lot of agony. Maybe Sam from the Swats is a true south side Atlantan, who actually played the game of basketball, and can determine if a player is above average or not. Maybe he has looks at the games the same way I have and can see that we have been playing better ball without your superstar “Marvin Williams”. Believe it or not, it’s true. Maybe you live in Decatur, Lithonia or Flowery Branch. That would explain everything.
Reggie – You said this
“Rod:
Marvin is the best man on man defender we have. He has gotten put on Melo, LBJ, Pierce, VC, and Granger this year and has shut them down a lot. Do you remember the game against Cleveland when we shut him down the whole game and the only time LBJ went off was when Marvin was sitting. He also killed Melo when we played Denver. Marvin can really play hard perimeter defense and is the best at it on our team.”
I say that is not a true statement:
Players you named that Marvin shut down this year against the Hawks:
Vince Carter – 26, 29, 18, 18 avg = 22 ppg
Granger – 34, 25 = 29.5 ppg
Lebron – 24, 33, 26 = 27.6 ppg
Carmelo – 16, 23 = 19.5 ppg
Pierce – 34, 18 = 26 ppg
Durant – 28 extra one = 28ppg
Your statemnt is false!!! If you can’t believe the stats, then what can you believe. Ask Sautee. I’m sure he can check the math for you.
KevinA
March 16th, 2009
10:48 am
I think most of like increased use of the bench. We can only hope this continues when Marvin returns. The team seems to be getting better at situational awareness. Flip was 1-6 and was smart enough quit shooting. This has been a problem in the past. JJ and Bibby would have a higher shooting percentage if they would pass more when they are having off nights.
The improved play of multiple players means the Hawks don’t have to rely on the back court. Fan-em and feed-em should be the new motto. Our front court has proved the ability to take over parts of games. ZaZa is proving his worth while Al has taken his game to another level. If every one on the Hawks team gives Josh a hug and gives him 13 shot attempts he can go double double every night.
I believe we have a ways to go in exploiting this area but the signs are encouraging. JJ and Bibby need to feed and fan these studs.
One area Woody could do better at is playing Acie against quicker guards. When Bibby is hot he can offset great PG’s but we need Acie’s defense when Bibby is not shooting so well. There is still time to work with Acie on his consistency before the play offs. Were going to need him confident and happy.
Speaking of happy, the chemistry of the Hawks is evident. The psychological wizard that is Josh has cleared the air and more team ball is the result. All of us are human and need encouragement and support. Woody is the hard boss that rarely likes to dish it out. Lets hope he’ll chill a little and feed the good vibes. I think giving bench players even 3-4 minutes in important games gives them the feeling their needed and important to the teams success. When Marvin comes back we can only hope the bench is not forgotten.
Luke Cage
March 16th, 2009
11:57 am
I listen to you guys and people are saying that you can’t resign everybody, which is correct, but I see teams like the Spurs (Ginobali, Parker, Duncan), Lakers (Bryant, Gasol, Odom, Bynum), Celtics (Garnett, Pierce, Allen) Suns (Shaq, Stoudamire, Nash) & even the Magic (Lewis, Howard, Nelson) with big big contracts, and some of their second tier players have nice contracts also, so what I’m sayin why not the Hawks also, the team is young and is on the cusp of being a elite contender for years to come, so why not ante up and pay the guys, now if they want max deals then I say no way other than for JJ & AL
doc
March 16th, 2009
12:21 pm
aj i had a feeling it might at least get a chuckle out of you. what i have seen is that jj is playing more of the three as we have often seen three “guards” on the floor during the time marvin is out. said it earlier and have seen a few others make the same observation, joe looks to be a formidable force when he plays the three spot maybe more so than the two spot as there are still some quick guys and shooters around to give him support from the perimeter. i have also seen him use the baseline ala chills a couple of times with marvin out which is a new move for him away from the floater or iso joe of the past.
fudd21
March 16th, 2009
12:23 pm
Sam from CP Your quotes are not facts. We are 12-1 when Mo starts. Marvin has not missed 13 games and has started every game he has played in never coming off the bench.
I think some of you put too much weight on where a player was drafted. It’s not Marvin’s fault he was drafted 2nd, just like it’s not Shelden’s fault he was drafted 5th. Adam Morrsion was drafted 3rd, does that guy even touch the floor. Darko was drafted 2nd ahead of Melo, Boss and D Wade and last I checked his numbers have always sucked. Blame the GM not the payers fault.
Daniel
March 16th, 2009
12:23 pm
Luke- first of all, how is your unbreakable skin?
secondly, I agree with your point entirely, but until the court decision is final, we won’t be able to make any big moves. Obviously, Joe is a max guy. Horford probably is but if you were able to renegoiate early, then you might get a Smith like deal. The two big issues are Marvin and Bibby. Those two contracts or lack thereof will define Sund and this ownership group for years. Hopefully, they will get it right.
Rod from College Park
March 16th, 2009
12:38 pm
Doc,
Great observation. There is actually hope for this blog. Someone who actually understands the game. Joe has been much more effective at the 3. Maybe everyone else still thinks that we should get rid of Josh and let Marvin play the 4 since he can do everything else. (LOL)
Gumby Williams
March 16th, 2009
12:48 pm
After Tuesdays game with Sacto (worst team in the league and assuming that is a Hawks win) the Hawks will face perhaps the toughest stretch of five games that Ive ever seen in their history. #1 – Dallas Mavericks (tough team, but a winnable game for the Hawks); #2 – San Antonio Spurs (streaking at the right time; have won four championships in the last 7-10 years; impressive!); #3 – Cleveland Cavaliers (LaBron and Co. have been UNBEATABLE AT HOME). The Cavs are either undefeated at home or might have one home loss this year (almost impossible to do that); #4 – Boston Celtics (currently the defending NBA champions); and #5 – Los Angeles Lakers (Kobe & Co. have been fabulous in the western conference and hold the top record in the NBA). This is the most brutal schedule Ive ever seen a team face over a five-game stretch, but I tell you if the Hawks continue to stay hot as they have been the last three weeks, I believe the Hawks might blow through that schedule and win all five games (5-0) with very tough opponents. Luckily for the Hawks, they are playing fabulous basketball at just the right time to take on such a difficult schedule. Go Hawks!
Daniel
March 16th, 2009
12:50 pm
Wow Gumby..
1st- I hope you are right
2cd- will I get a contact high if I stand near you?
hawkfromhinesville
March 16th, 2009
1:06 pm
the south georgia brigade is up again for our hawks…this team could go far[ask the celtics] and they are improving each year…HAWKMANIA IN THE SWAMP!!
yessir
March 16th, 2009
1:14 pm
All the Marv haters are hysterical. Rod/Sam from CP/da Swats, I love the effort. No, seriously!! It takes a lot of creativity to try an argue that the Hawks are a better team without Marv. Gee, I guess snice the Hawks cleaned up without JJ and won their first two games witout Josh (ON THE ROAD) that we’re better without them too, huh?? I know!! Let’s trade all our starters and go with Flip, Acie, Mo, Solo, and Zaza!! WE’LL BE UNSTOPABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
doc
March 16th, 2009
1:40 pm
thanks rod!
JOSH=MVP!
Sam from the Swats
March 16th, 2009
1:43 pm
yessir, what happened the two games that Woody didn’t play Josh at all in the second half? We lost. Don’t get me wrong, Marvin is an average player. All this talk about him being this defensive stopper and unbelievable scorer is mind boggling. He’s slew footed, he can’t create his own shot, he gets his shot swatted at least twice a game, he’s our weak link. The main reason I’m against this argument is after the draft, everybody was saying how good Marvin will be. Josh Smith was just an extra piece. Now, Josh Smith is more of a piece than Marvin. Take away the 3 point and FT percentage, he’s a better defender. He finishes on the break. He’s averaging more points per game. His rebounding is up. Why can’t anybody else see that? Are you guys North Carolina fans? I get it, its because Marvin is the Mr. nicey guy and Josh acts as if he doesn’t give a …..We need to sign and trade Marvin.
Barry
March 16th, 2009
1:45 pm
Round 9 of a 15 roud fight still going down. The opposition tried to rally but the Hawks stood firm amd took their best shots. Left hook. Right Hand. The Hawks catches the punches off the glove. The opposition is wondering what is this new defense tactic. They cautiously throw more flurries at our Hawks, but to no avail. Our hawks dance back, swing around, and hit the opposition with a round house punch to the head. The opposition is dazed. They are frazzled and confused, as the Hawks step in a slams a right hand to the body. The opposition keels over, looking up at our Hawks for sympathy. Our Hawks, however, don’t want to take them out now. They want them to suffer for all the negative talking they previously done about the character and resilency of the team. The Hawks hit them with two more right hands to the head and a left hook to the head. The opposition is phased. They are crying. They want an end to this and what is possibly to come. The referee inteferes, check the opposition and waves our hawks to a neutral corner. Our Hawks eagerly awaits the referees decision to knock some more opposition head. Will he end the fight? The crowd is screaming “BOOM-BYE-YEAH!!! BOOOM-BYE-YEAH!!!!
To be continued………………………….
SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!
This is a SECRET from a HAWK FAN. TELL EVERYBODY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SEE Y’ALL AT PHILLIPS!!!!!!!
GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
“SHOCK THE WORLD!!!!!”
Sam from the Swats
March 16th, 2009
1:45 pm
You guys are being stupid now with the Josh=MVP. Nobody is saying that. You guys think however, Marvin=MVP….ROTFLMAO!!!
Astro Joe
March 16th, 2009
1:54 pm
Hornets, Jazz, Pacers (without Granger) & Blazers. Four teams that would allow Joe to effectively play at SF. Kings won’t present any real problems. I’m not sure what is going on with Josh Howard but I’d hate to see Joe playing Brandon Bass for more than 5 minutes. So it will work for several more games but I don’t think it is sustainable. But I’d much rather see Joe at the 3 than Josh Smith, that’s for sure.
I wonder how many teams would have had each of their 3 front court starters miss at least 10 games due to injury this season and still make the playoffs (with homecourt in the 1st round no less). Either we have a deep bench to handle those absences or a coach who is having a decent season at the helm. Must be the wickedly good bench.
Sam from the Swats
March 16th, 2009
2:00 pm
Astro Joe, good analogy. I think what has helped is we have a deep team this year. Picking up Mo and Flip helped us tremendously. I think we’re unstoppable when we go Bibby, Flip, Joe, Josh, and Horford. I’d hate to see Joe guarding Bass as well, but Bass would have to guard him on the other end. Can you say 30 more points?
Rod from College Park
March 16th, 2009
2:09 pm
Sam from the Swats,
Excellent point. Brandon Bass would get 40 dropped on him. Again I ask this question. At the end of the game, who do you want on the floor, Bibby, Joe and Marvin, or Bibby Joe and Flip. I will take the latter.
yessir
March 16th, 2009
2:11 pm
Hey Rod aka Sam. Ya know they have pills for schizos now, right?? Just checkin!
Astro Joe
March 16th, 2009
2:11 pm
Sam from Swats… Bass will either bang Joe when he tries that floater in the lane (and darn near break his hip) or Joe will decide to avoid the punishment and shoot 8 3s during the game. Neither is a particularly great scenario for the Hawks. But if both Josh Howard and Devean George are missing we may see a lot of Mr. Bass (who is a UFA next season and who I would LOVE to see in a Hawks uniform).
MO EVANS = MVP! According to the stat boys… how many other players can claim their team’s are virtually unbeatable with them in the starting line-up. Who needs Kobe, LeBron or D-Wade when we have Mo!
doc
March 16th, 2009
2:13 pm
aj, jj has a lot more moves to put on the other guys three than he can with a two guard. his to’s go down if he is left there. again who would know what kind of bench there is. as far as the injuries adelman, karl, mcmillan and pops have had there own injury problems. we can alomos say it doesnt matter about the loss of marvin as we go on and win 8 straight when he doesnt play. seems it almost helps this team whereas without josh and al we go sub-500 at 12 and 15. it would be misleading to say we are 20 and 15 with the loss of the three wouldnt it?
who matters most on our front line? i think the results are pretty obvious. we also know we have more depth at the guard position and jj plays out of position when marvin isnt around. bibby, flip, mo and acie are more able to handle the loss of marvin than when we are left with only solo, zaza and randmo to sub out for the injury to either al or josh. again we have known for a long time we are weak in bigs off the bench. marvin doesnt quite slide so effortlessly to the four does he by the results?
JOSH = MVP!!!!!!!
take that sam. we would be lower than the sixers without him. if you dont believe me ask horford who would have to take huge amount of abuse. he is the hawks and woody’s meal ticket, get over it. what are you a hata too?
doc
March 16th, 2009
2:16 pm
i knew a virus would spread.
MARVIN aint MVP!
that is safe to say, though he is improved.
JOSH = MVP!
Sam from the Swats
March 16th, 2009
2:26 pm
yessir, you have to be a schizo to know such information….
Sam from the Swats
March 16th, 2009
2:31 pm
Astro Joe, Bass would be a nice pickup for the Hawks. Doc, that’s why we should trade Marvin for another big. Then we would be good to go.
niremetal
March 16th, 2009
2:43 pm
In case y’all haven’t seen it yet:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Kobe-and-Artest-The-lost-trash-talk-audio;_ylt=AvtC7JtM8AaWFHtokAHKswW8vLYF?urn=nba,147982
Rod from College Park
March 16th, 2009
2:54 pm
Yessir,
They also have pills for people who hallucinate (seeing things that don’t exist). I might be able to help you with that. Holla.
Doc,
Another great point. Hope these clowns are reading your post. Niremetal said I was almost alone. Maybe I’m not.
Astro Joe
March 16th, 2009
2:58 pm
doc, I agree, Joe’s ability to move to the 3 off-sets Marvin’s absence more so than Zaza does the absence of Smith or Horford. But isn’t that more about player’s replacement and less about the original starter?
5 of the 7 games Marvin has missed were at home. The majority of games missed by Smith and Horford were on the road. Kind of an interesting fact. Are we better than we think on the road (because we played about half of our road games without a front court starter) or were the injuries to Smith and Horford magnified because we were playing so many road games at the time? Can’t be both.
I don’t think Portland ever had to learn to play without Oden (if that is the injury you were referencing). Houston routinely has to play without Yao and T-Mac. But I hope that you realized that you used 2 of the coaches that you have often discussed as your legit COY candidates (Karl & Adelson). Interesting!
Check out what Joe did last season after a lackluster Jan/Feb. Maybe he just warms up with the weather?
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/splits?playerId=1007&sYear=2008&sType=2
ray
March 16th, 2009
3:13 pm
Hah! You gotta love this place.
Astro Joe,
Easy answer to your question about the “Joe Haters” from a day ago. It’s simple. There never have been, nor will there ever be nearly as many “Joe Haters” as there are “Josh Haters.” And you know it’s true…
I’m sure Samuel will let you onto his Woody Wagon, but you can’t drive. See, Sam has been there all along (to his credit). YOU didn’t show up until after this 5 game homestand. I don’t recall you making so much noise up until that point…
Rod,
I think Marvin has more value than you give him credit for. If he’s as bad as you say, then what could we hope to get for him in trade? You always want your assets to be valuable. I don’t know what to say about the fact that we’re 12-1 without him, other than this kind of stat can be misleading.
You can take any stat and make an argument with it. Marvin was only providing 14ppg on offense because our offensive design didn’t consistenly involve him that much. In games where he was more of a focal point on offense, he produced more. In games where he was less involved, he produced less. Really, the same can be said of Josh Smith. The difference is that Josh feels that he has to be more aggressive out there, and therefore he takes more shots. He’s always been more aggressive. But if you look, he’s only averaging one basket more a game. So in fact, offensively he’s worth little more than Marvin….right? See how one stat can be used to make a statement?
On the flip side, Marvin has played adequate defense. I did notice the guys you listed as having scored well against him. Well here’s the problem with that. That’s only what, 8 guys? And guess what? Every last one of them is an all-star level talent. They CAN’T be guarded one-on-one. There is a reason why Granger averages 25ppg. He’s doing that against THE LEAGUE…not playing Marvin every night.
No, Marvin has not clamped anyone of these top level guys completely down. NOBODY DOES, man. But guess what you missed? Out of that group of guys, and the games you’ve listed they’ve had against us this season, which totals 14 times…only 3 of those instances were 30+ point games. Some of those guys have had 40 or 50 point games this season. None came against us. None of those guys season highs came against us either.
Yeah, we’re 12-1 without Marvin. But that says something about the way we play offense, and our ability on defense when we decide to play it. the guys getting PT now that Marvin’s out? Solo, Acie, Mario, Mo Evans? All of them can play “D”.
I’m not saying there’s no merit to the fact that we’re winning without him. I’m just saying he’s got more value (and so does our bench) than he’s given credit for.
ray
March 16th, 2009
3:21 pm
Man, I swear.
The minute you WANT to give Woody credit for doing something good, he goes and opens his mouth.
Whatever he’s eating he needs to keep eating it,” Woodson said. “He’s been on a roll. And he’s got to play like that the rest of the way out. Even when we get into the playoffs, he has to play at that level. And the supporting cast has to do their job and play at a high level as well.”
For crying out loud. It’s not like Joe hasn’t been trying. He’s been taking roughly the same number of shots per game all this time!
But when you have to play pg all the time, it doesn’t help. When you have to defend the opposing pg all the time (because your veteran teammate can’t), it doesn’t help. When nobody else is stepping up or is featured on offense, it doesn’t help. When opposing teams’ defensive gameplan inlcudes throwing double and triple teams at you all night because they know nobody else is going to get the ball enough to make a difference…IT DOESN’T HELP!!!!
How can this not be so obvious?! Teams can no longer fade away from Smith and Horford, because both guys will score. So, no more doubling up JJ all the time. And guess what? Like any NBA all-star, he cannot be guarded one-on-one. That’s the difference. Coaches finally coaching a gameplan that works, players finally trusting each other and stepping up to the plate, and executing.
Duh!
fudd21
March 16th, 2009
3:25 pm
OMG! Ray defending Marvin, let me run outside and see if it’s snowing. Next Rod won’t include a negative comment about Marvin in his post. What is the blog coming too?
ray
March 16th, 2009
3:27 pm
I’ll give Woody credit for making some good, effective bench moves since Marvin went down.
And maybe his tiff with Josh made them both better for it.
But what can be said about the performance of Horford, which has been even more impactful? Dude stepped up and out on his own. While Josh had his issues, Horford became a consistent double double threat. He made teams pay when they thought they could sag off. This guy deserves a ton of credit. And just think, he’s only a second year guy.
A guy that some people were ready to cast off as somebody who “might be a solid NBA player, but nothing all that good.” He’s a future leader. He’s a leader NOW.
Bill
March 16th, 2009
3:30 pm
Nice Hawks blog here-
http://crashingtheglass.com
Astro Joe
March 16th, 2009
3:38 pm
Ray, remind me who your partner, Ando, compared to Horford? I can’t remember, but I think it may have been someone like Michael Cage or Antonio Davis. I should have bookmarked it (like I did the playoff bet).
And actually, I think (no, I know) that players like Smith create far more passion than a player like Joe. Much like Horford doesn’t stir many passions around here either. But that’s okay, there’s a guy in San Antonio who doesn’t move the emotional meter but will go down as a top 10 player in the history of the freakin’ game. When people were all hot and bothered by KG 8-10 years ago, I recall siding with the boring guy from San Antonio. I’d choose 16 points each and every night over someone who goes for 20 on 2 nights and 8 on the 3rd night. But the latter player is typically the one who gets the most pub, because folk only recall the 20 point games.
nique
March 16th, 2009
3:43 pm
why did woody play joe 43 minutes in an 18 point win?! joe’s going to be burned out again come playoff time if he can’t rest up a bit before the playoffs.
Sam from the Swats
March 16th, 2009
3:45 pm
ray, I have been on here, but I’m a busy person. Don’t have time to sit on blogs all day and conversate with the mentally unfortunate as yourself.
Ariose
March 16th, 2009
3:58 pm
Wow, it’s amazing to me how similar Blogger-Fans can be. I was on a couple of Blazer blogs, and while some of their fans just accepted that it was a poor defensive effort from the Blazers(and like us…..and the Jazz they’re not great on the road)/Joe was on Fire/The Hawks are stingy on their home floor, Some were calling for Nate McMillan to be fired. Others wanted Bayless to get more PT, Some wanted to trade for J-Kidd or at least get a decent starting veteran point guard, some wonderd what it would be like if they drafted Horford instead(to wich someone replied: “People would have rioted in the strets”)lol!!! Others wanted to know Greg Oden’s Time-table for his return…….my point is, fans of every team goes through this sh#%!t.
Rod from College Park
March 16th, 2009
4:08 pm
Ray,
Good points, but remember, the stats I posted were in response to the clowns on this blog who stated how Marvin shut those stars down (see my post), and how great a perimeter defender he is. If that were the case, why would the stats not reflect that? I have stated before that Marvin went from a terrible defender last year to ok this year, but lets not act like he is a defensive star. I mean people on this blog actually tell me that Marvin is a better defensive player than Josh Smith. So am I supposed to throw out the last two years when Marvin continuously got beat of the dribble, and Josh had to leave his man and help Marvin on every play. Do you see any players changing their game because Marvin Williams is guarding them? I don’t. Is it understood that Josh Smith can defend the 2 thru the 5. Remember the one on one block on Wade at the end of the game last year. Can Marvin guard Garnett, Gasol, West? They would eat his lunch. I personally don’t think his value is that high because there are 15 to 20 or more players starting in the NBA right now who can give you the same thing OR MORE than Marvin can at his position. Some examples are: Granger, Durant, Melo, Prince, Gay, Ariza (Somebody on this blog laughed when I said I would take Ariza over Marvin), Howard, Igoudala, Deng, Harrington, Pierce, Magette, Butler, Jefferson……… and the list goes on. Do you not think that the kid from Duke (Henderson) could not come here next year and give us the same production, or more than Marvin? I do. His draft position does dictate to the Atlanta Hawks management that he should be a starter. I personally think he would be better coming of the bench, but that is just my opinion. Again, lease answer my question. At the end of the game, whom do you want on the floor? Bibby, Joe and Marvin, or Bibby Joe and Flip? Your answer to that question might help you understand why I don’t think his value is that high. He is the easiest guy in our starting lineup to replace, and the highest drafted I might add.
Sam from the Swats
March 16th, 2009
4:26 pm
Rod,
Exactly my point. This is a number 2 draft pick. We are getting mediocre numbers from a number 2 draft pick. Somebody said that we should be more upset at the Shelden Williams number 5 pick. Not exactly, because we dumped him, Anthony Johnson, Lue, and Lorenzen for Bibby. So we actually were able to get a decent point guard. We need to sign and trade Marvin next year for either Camby or Kaman. If we can resign Zaza and Bibby let’s do it. I don’t think we can, then be able to turn around and resign Joe and Al. We’ll see.
Astro Joe
March 16th, 2009
4:30 pm
Ray, some might wonder why after a five game winning streak and the likelihood of securing the 4th seed, there are still rioters at the door of Philips Arena with lighted torches and screaming for Woody’s head on a ball cart? Some are bemoaning the stock price while it is at it’s 52-week high… what sense does that make? Make room, Sam, I’ll climb aboard your hoopty!
Ariose
March 16th, 2009
4:30 pm
Clowns? Do you remeber in the Cleveland Game what happend when Marvin went to the bench with those fouls????? We wen’t down by like thirteeen and didn’t rally until the second half(I’m pretty sure Marvin played all of the 3rd and 4th quaters in that game)
Look, it’s a team effort. LB get’s past marvins defense only to meet J-Smoove at the top of the mountain only to be denied another sportscenter highlight.
I don’t even want to think of what would happen if Joe or Mo had to defend LeBron for 48 minutes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWC7RfUbMBg&feature=related
……nope, don’t want none of that. People forget that Marvin is 6′9 245 lbs……virtuallly the prototypical Small Forward size and the same size as LeBron(Though Marvin is an inch taller).
Ariose
March 16th, 2009
4:34 pm
You thought 33 points was bad? Boy you’re lucky we have tons of swingmen who can switch Clevland’s pick n’ rolls. He’d work us just like he does the knicks and every other unathletic team out there……50 points, Easy
Tyger
March 16th, 2009
4:43 pm
**Big Pass Joe**
Seemingly better late than never, but Big Pass Joe has decided that being “aggressive” is better than being “passive”. Well, after dividing the Spirit ownership over his $70M contract, one could reasonably conclude that he was brought aboard to be “aggressive”.
I might be wrong but somehow I think the absence of JJs name in the MVP race: DWade, Kobe, Lebron, may have irked this reluctant star’s feathers a bit. He’s playing harder, he’s going to the hole rather than settling for 3’s, he’s taking big shots, he’s showing leadership.
Now, if he could only take his show on the road and not shy away from the bigger names. i.e. Put up good numbers when Kobe, Wade, Lebron in town. Stop resorting to being a 2nd tier star, show us that you belong with the elite, not that you respect them.
Sam from the Swats
March 16th, 2009
4:55 pm
Ariose, thanks for your explanation over one game. I appreciate your input. Astro Joe, thanks, I’m just saying when Marvin comes back, bring him off the bench. It won’t happen because he’s a number 2 pick and Woody won’t do it. If I recall, Lebron still had 26 points. You guys act like Lebron had like 8 points or something, no, Marvin has games like that, not true superstars living up to their draft status.
Freshmaker
March 16th, 2009
5:21 pm
Sam, why do you bang on Marvin so much? He averages 14ppg because he’s the 4th option in our offense behind JJ, Bibby and Josh. You’re not going to have every starter average 20+ppg. When we play through our frontcourt, he does pretty well. I’m fine with the way Marvin’s played this year. He’s stepped up when we’ve needed him to. I’m fine with him being the 6th guy off the bench too if that’s what Woody ends up doing. Bring him in to put up some points.
Samuel
March 16th, 2009
5:47 pm
Doc,
Sorry it took me so long to respond to your post.
Yes, I did take the time to read the article. It was an ok article. A bit long and boring. Reminded me too much of Ray and (prebirth) Ando’s stuff. I just can’t get too excited about a guy named Wojnarowski being an expert on basketball. You know me.
The article pretty much talked about how unprepared a high school boy from a “cow” town like Starkville was in coming to the bright lights of the NBA. The guy, Bobby Hurley was trying to prepare him to match up with a mature 30 year old “grown ass” man, LeBron James. What rookie wouldn’t be lost.
The article mentioned a learning disability one time towards the end:
“Too many times in this league, they’ll dismiss a guy as, ‘Oh, he can’t think,’ or ‘he’s learning disabled,’ when you could take the time to help him learn,” Williams said.
“Too many times” means that it has been done before. Like I said, there are plenty of professional athletes and professional everything else, including MD’s, who have succeeded with learning disabilities. I don’t know if Travis really has a learning disability or not but I do know that many are being misdiagnosis. If you doubt me, spend a few days in the public schools.
What really “pissed” me off about your little sermon was:
“he would be out of the league with another coach and on the street otherwise”.
Doc, what may I ask were you “implying” in that statement? Is it that Outlaw is a thug maybe and that if it weren’t for basketball he’d be “on the streets”?
I don’t personally know Travis or his family but I have seen him play high school ball many times. I also know that he is a very respectable and humble young man. He actually has a “real” family with a good support system so I doubt he would be on the streets right now, even without basketball.
Furthermore, I don’t believe the Blazers have done any more than any other organization would do if they drafted a guy right out of high school and invested Millions into him. I’m sure he’s not the only rookie who has been given extra practice time. Give me a break.
“samuel, i know you will shove it down my throat if we win tomorrow. just the same i will be very vocal that we win. anyway it will be only one game. mcmillan has a better record”.
Doc, I haven’t even seen the game but from what I can understand, there’s not much to shove in your face. Woody and the Hawks “owned” Mc and the Blazers.
Woody=COY
RLP
March 16th, 2009
6:04 pm
Doc – Thanks for the link on Outlaw. A good story.
doc
March 16th, 2009
6:48 pm
samuel, you missed the point. his disability is he has problem with verbal spatial situations. he has a hard time learning by listening and figuring out where everyone including himself needs to be. as they said he got lost on the court before they intervened. pretty debilitating for a basketball player maybe a sure exit from the league. it can be tested for and is pretty specific.
as far as being on the street it was meant he would be out here where you and i live rather than the comfy confines of the NBA, maybe doing something as insipid as blogging about basketball. it was to show an organization that makes an emphasis on making sure its guys succeed and on the cutting edge of teaching ball. maybe too high brow or intellectual for you as that seems to be your bent.
Melvin
March 16th, 2009
7:07 pm
Will somebody tell the AJC staff that Jermaine O’neal does not play for the Raptors anymore. He’s been in Miami for almost a month now. My gosh. Who come up with these polls. They are wrong often…
Melvin
March 16th, 2009
7:11 pm
Also, how come they omitted Dwight Howard and Rashard Lewis in that poll???
ray
March 16th, 2009
7:28 pm
Astro Joe,
Again, easy answer (in response to the rioters outside Phillips). It’s because….Clyde sells t-shirts out there!
No seriously, I don’t recall who Ando was last comparing Horford to. Who knows.
As for KG and The Big Fundamental, yeah they are definitely different when it comes to their approach. I’d have taken either guy. Both put up incredible numbers. But until he got to Boston, weary and nearly played out, KG got the short end of the stick every single time. Bad coaching (except for Saunders), horrible GM, and virtually no real help on the court. Duncan not only got to play with and learn the ropes from David Robinson, but he had the benefit of the same brilliant coach in Popovich, and a shrewd GM.
Doc,
Looks to me like somebody saw what they wanted to see in your post. Wow, I don’t ever remember you saying you thought Travis Outlaw was a thug, or that if it weren’t for basketball, he’d be “in the streets,” as in living on the streets. Where I come from (the real world), if you’re out of the job you were doing (as Outlaw would be if he were suddenly out of the NBA), people called that “out on the street.” As in, jobless. As in, looking for another job. I don’t see what’s so hard to understand. Then again, I don’t have a short attention span and a constant thinly veiled racial agenda…..
Rod,
I see your point, really I do. And I’m not trying to debunk what you’re saying as much as I am offering a different opinion from another angle. No, I don’t believe Marvin is the best defender on this team. He has become a solid one this year, though. No, he’s not better than Josh either. On the perimeter, yeah probably. But Josh is a game-changer on defense. Marvin is more of a steady guy. And no, he’s not going to guard Gasol, West, and Garnett. Those guys are low post guys. We use Horford and Smith to guard them. Marvin’s a SF. But more on this in the next post.
Reggie
March 16th, 2009
7:32 pm
Ray: Great post. Right on point.
Rod aka Sam: I really shouldn’t have put shut down. That’s my bad. The point is he contained him. Maybe you don’t watch the games but Marvin made them work for their points and they didn’t go off on him. I remember right now that when LBJ scored most his points in that quarter it was when Marvin was benched and JS was on him. For Pierce it was the same thing. I would take Marvin over Flip any day. I love Flip but he can get some quick scoring but other than that he does nothing for passing the ball, rebounding, or defense. Earlier this year Marvin was playing mediocre ball. If you watched though the last few weeks he found his groove and confidence. He WAS CREATING HIS OWN SHOT, he was driving hard and getting to the line (believe he was 10-11 at the stripe one night) and he was draining perimeter shot. Also Smith is a help defender. When he is one on one with a guy he isn’t great. What Smith can do well is track down other guys and get blocks. If you stick him out on the perimeter with Danny Granger he will likely get blown by a bit. He could catch him and pack it but who knows. I love Smith and his defense but I like Marvin also. Marvin is better than a few of those guys up there especially Ariza and is only what 22 years old, and you’re calling him a bust. He is our 4th scoring option and has put up 14 ppg 2 years straight and a lot more as of late. Back off the guy and realize your point about being better without him is stupid and uneducated. Of course you have to always criticize something though.
ray
March 16th, 2009
7:48 pm
Rod,
To continue. You’re absolutely right about several guys in the league providing what Marvin does, or doing better. But is that solely a reflection on Marvin and those other players, or is it also a reflection on the teams they play for? As stated before, Marvin is more often the 4th option on offense here. Those guys you mentioned in your post? Most of them are option #1 or #2 on offense. But then there’s Tayshaun Prince. Look at his stats. They are almost identical to Marvin’s…I’ll give him the edge on defense. Prince has been a better defender for longer. But Trevor Ariza? I’ll give him this: he’s more aggressive. But I’d rather see how he does starting for a full year first. Who knows, you might be onto something there. The thing is, if it weren’t for Bynum’s injury, Ariza wouldn’t be starting.
As for your question, who would I want on the floor at the end of the game? That’s really hard to say. Depends on who the opposing team has on the floor, what the score is, what we need to do. If we need to defend, I’d rather have Joe, Flip, and Marvin. Leave Bibby out of it. If we need to take a shot, it’s a toss-up. Any one of those guys can hit a shot, and any one of them can shoot a 3. I’d have a hard time picking between Flip and Marvin to be honest. Depends on who has the hot hand. Flip and Bibby might need a screen. Joe and Marvin are big enough to get a shot off against most guys who would be defending them. And all four can hit free throws. See my point? It’s not as simple as it looks.
As for Marvin being a #2 pick, does than not say more about the guy who drafted him than it does about the player himself? Wouldn’t you say that Josh Smith looks better than a #17 pick? Yet that is where he was picked. Ariza was picked 43rd overall (second round). To me, where a guy is picked is more about how people see him than about how he actually is.
By the way, if Marvin is so mediocre, how the heck are we going to convince the LA Clippers to trade a good starting center for him? They already have Thornton. And I’ll be you think he’s better than Marvin, too. So why would they do that?
ray
March 16th, 2009
8:01 pm
Reggie,
Thanks. I used to clown Marvin all the time. But he really is better this year. We just have so many options on offense (when we get our heads out of our butts and quit trying to do everything from the backcourt). It actually works out good for us a lot of times when Marvin defers the ball. Smith and Horford are our low post guys. Marvin is not that type. Yet, JJ and Bibby are our perimeter threats. That leaves Marvin (who does a bit of slashing, a bit of perimeter shooting) floating in space.
Marvin was picked 2nd, but that was because our GM then had a major forward fetish. He’s never consistently been the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd offensive option for this team. It’s never been designed that way. So I’m okay with his production. Now if Josh gets traded for a center, then I expect more out of Marvin. And we’ll probably get it, too.
Reggie
March 16th, 2009
8:08 pm
Exactly and I don’t know if these guys watch games because how could they have not seen his progress the last month or two. He got confidence and started really showing some stuff. He actually became our 2rd maybe even 2nd scoring option for a bit. Last year I couldn’t stand Marv and wanted him gone but I have loved his game lately. I’m not sure where Rod aka Sam gets this thing that Marvin can’t create his own shot.
Woody
March 16th, 2009
9:09 pm
Ray who do you think is the 2nd best overall player on our team?
The bird
March 16th, 2009
9:13 pm
Reggie ad Ray your posts have been truly right. your points are extremely accurate. I really enjoy reading your blogs. Sam and Rod are insane.
HawksFan85
March 16th, 2009
9:32 pm
It’s probably a roommate / laptop thing again.
ProudTechFan
March 16th, 2009
9:39 pm
I was at the game as well and it was good to see Joe get off early. I think he scored the first 12 of the hawks 14 points. I did get worried when Roy started to heat up, but the defense picked up late and thats what made the difference. I like the intensity Za Za plays with and the attitude of the entire team lately. This last home stand will pay off in the end come playoff time. This team just does not lose at home, and that means alot in the playoffs. I hope we dont get complacent down the stretch, because I dont see any reason why we cant win at least 48 games this season…
Go Hawks !!!
Sam from da Swats
March 16th, 2009
9:43 pm
The bird, you are insane. For you and the rest to sit here and be satisfied with Marvin’s production is ridiculous. He is a number 2 pick and all I hear is, oh he’s improving. He’s only 22, he’s still learning. David Lee is averaging 16 and 12, HE WAS PICK 30TH OVERALL IN THE SAME DRAFT AS MARVIN “DUCK” WILLIAMS. I’m just saying, quit letting this guy off the hook for the bust that he is. He wasn’t even picked to play for the rookies or the sophomores in the All-Star rookie challenge. I mean give me a break. An average player should be picked where Josh Smith was. Josh Smith gets hated on as if he were picked 2nd. Insane? You guys have helped my argument. Ray you said how do we expect the Clippers to trade for Marvin? YOU’RE RIGHT!!! How the hell is anybody going to want this clown. He doesn’t score 20 ppg because he’s the 4th option? Ever wonder why he’s the 4th option? How can a guy who can create his own shot be the 4th option? You guys are incredible!!!
Reggie
March 16th, 2009
9:59 pm
Sam you are truly an idiot. Answer the question I’ve asked 50 times Have you seen Marvin’s play as of late? Also admit you and Rod are the same person.
The Bird
March 16th, 2009
10:06 pm
Sam you sound like a sour old man who has to always complain about something. Go somewhere else. Your points are off mark and old. Who cares if he didn’t make a rookie challenge.
Sam from da Swats
March 16th, 2009
10:07 pm
We are not the same person, dummies. I have seen Marvin’s play. Funny how his play hasn’t constituted a change in stats. He played 26 minutes the last game and had 4…FOUR POINTS!!! Yeah, I see an improvement, what a improvement…great job Marvin! Ur the idiot Reggie!! U hated his game last year and you like his game this year? HE HAS THE SAME STATS AS LAST YEAR, NO IMPROVEMENT!!! WHO’S THE IDIOT?
Sam from da Swats
March 16th, 2009
10:08 pm
The Bird, so do you think Marvin is this great player?
jhan
March 16th, 2009
10:46 pm
Who really cares where Marvin was drafted? What does that have to do with how he’s playing?
I say we permanently move JJ to SF. I really like the front line of JJ/Smith/Horfod. In the offseason we use the combination of cap space (Bibby/ZaZa) players (JChill/Marvin) & our 1st round pick to fill out the squad.
Plenty of money available to put together a nice squad.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 17th, 2009
12:01 am
I think Joe’s game is suited to small forward too, because his physical strength is well above average while his quickness is below average for a shooting guard. It depends on the matchup though… I wouldn’t want to play him at SF against a team like Houston for example, where he’d be matched up against Artest all game.
jhan
March 17th, 2009
12:22 am
Joe is so versatile you could play him at 1-3 depending on the matchups.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 17th, 2009
3:42 am
Sean Williams arrested for throwing computers in Denver
Maybe we were wrong all along. Maybe he needs to smoke more weed.
Awaiting comment from Clyde.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 17th, 2009
3:44 am
On another note, apparently the Thrashers won their franchise-record 6th straight game today. i don’t know anything about hockey, but damn, they have been around for 10 years and they have never won 6 in a row until now? That is unbelievable.
doc
March 17th, 2009
7:10 am
najeh i imagine jj gets the defender of artest whether he likes it or not. their decision would be to put their best on him whether he is 2 or 3. it doesnt matter where jj plays if artest is quick enough then he and jj go at it. the only way to stop it is what surrounds him to keep it honest or who woody moves into the game as a chess piece to counter balance that match up.
Clyde
March 17th, 2009
8:00 am
Leave The Weed Alone!!
In America That Is
Sautee
March 17th, 2009
8:21 am
LOL Clyde. So THAT’S why you go to Rio!
Astro Joe
March 17th, 2009
8:52 am
What’s that? Two arrests in two months. Williams and Matt Jones (J’ville Jags) should hang out at the unemployment line together.
Samuel
March 17th, 2009
9:20 am
Doc,
I know you didn’t mean anything by it. You never do.
Hey, maybe we can swap Outlaw for Marvin. Then he(Outlaw) would only have to learn one play.
Hey, your other COY candidate. The almighty Pops got beat by the Thunder last night. You think their bloggers are calling for his head.
Woody=COY
KevinA
March 17th, 2009
9:42 am
If Bibby and JJ had the same amount of shot attempts as Marvin would Marvin look better? I think so. Instead of trashing Marvin I think it would be more productive to trash Bibby and JJ. These fellers need to shoot fewer jump shots and feed the studs down low. We play our best when were banging bodies and taking it to the hole.
When are JJ and Marvin playing their best? Yep, taking it to the hole. Why do we like Acie in the game? Yep, he takes it to the hole.
When do we get the most wide open jump shots? Yep, it usually happens on a drive and kick.
When do we play our best defense? When were banging bodies on offense.
I think there is a theme here.
When does our offense get stagnate? The JJ iso and to many jumpers by Bibby, JJ, and Flip possession after possession after possession. Not staying physical and attacking the rim.
How do we usually get out of this funk? Taking it to the hole.
The improved play of Marvin, Josh, ZAZa and Al makes this style of play possible. Maybe we could not have played this way a year ago but we certainly can now. Our young players games are finally maturing as individuals and as team players.
In a hypothetic world would we trash JJ for scoring 16 a game and Bibby Scoring 14 a game if that meant Al and Josh averaged 18 a game and the result was 1st seed? Sometimes things change and maybe sooner than you think. .
doc
March 17th, 2009
10:08 am
heh heh heh, yeah samuel it would allow outlaw to use his instincts and be the chills our team needs. the kid is good and has stuck with it. do you think jj would say something along the lines of “these young kids need to learn how to do something other than run around or something like that”? it starts at the top.
it was also fun to watch ya boy ellis delivering a bit the other night against phoenix. talk about a track meet. the warriors just didnt have the horses or staying power. they are done and are putting it on display like they did in memphis to showcase the kids for trades or drafts in the upcoming year. their rise and fall was quick.
it is just amazing how quickly things can fall apart in the nba these days. that is why i am enjoying the year and hoping for the best in the playoffs. this could be a one and done or the peak and i expect to revel in it a bit. i like the team as a whole and really enjoy it when they play defense. i said it a long time ago when folks were wondering what is distinctive and the main character of the team; it is defense. really first saw it when they played detroit the first time around. that is their true personality.
as far as pops. he is again without ginobli, without him they dont stand a chance against la if they do at all. great coach with staying power, maybe woody has that too. something folks dont realize is maybe woody and josh really need each other to excel in an odd sort of way. diamonds dont get the shine without some kind of buffing substance.
JOSH = MVP !
has a nice ring to it doesnt it samuel?
Sam from the Swats
March 17th, 2009
10:27 am
Kevin A says, “The improved play of Marvin, Josh, ZAZa and Al makes this style of play possible.” What improved play of Marvin? He added the 3 point shot? Wow, he did that and still averages the same amount of points as he did last year. I’m just trying to see where the improvement is. I don’t see it.
Hms
March 17th, 2009
10:51 am
The idea that Travis Outlaw would only have to learn one play if he were playing for the Hawks is indicative of the severely limited offensive philosophy of Mr. Head Coach Woodson more than anything else. Meanwhile comparisons between this bald fellow and San Antonio Spurs Head Coach Gregg Poppovich continue to be preposterous because no Spur fan in the right mind would want him gone on the face of one loss. No one calls for his dismissal due to the number of NBA Championship rings on his hand which have all been earned as Head Coach. Mr. Woodson has a singel championship ring that he got while riding Mr. Larry Browns coattails as a do nothing but preach defense assistant coach. Mr. Poppovich has his team at the top or near it year after year and has a proven system that works and is competitive at the elite level. Mr. Woodson and his system if it can be identified and called as such has proven no such thing and is actually experiencing his first winning season in five years. There is some serious doubt that Mr. Poppovich or any other credible coach would have taken five years to have a winning season but no doubt supporters of Mr. Woodson will point to anything and everything as being at fault because of course he is a near perfect coach who is constantly victimized by players and general managers alike. It is pure mularky but something willingly swallowed by anyone who chooses to be a fool in the face of fact after fact. Mr. Woodson and Mr. Poppovich belong not in the same sentence or even paragraph when comparison of accomplishments is the subject of convarsation.
fudd21
March 17th, 2009
12:02 pm
Sam, based on your rationale that Marvin hasn’t improved because his stats haven’t gone up, then I guess Josh has digressed since his stats have gone down. I’m just saying.
Also what does being the 4th option and the ability to create your own shot have to do with anything. If you remember our own JJ was the 4th option in Phoenix and I could be wrong but I think he can create his own shot. I’m just saying.
Ariose
March 17th, 2009
12:13 pm
Sam, you have to sacrifice numbers for wins bruh. look at the Celtics, you don’t see Ray Allen averaging 26ppg game like he was a few years ago…..the same goes for Pierce and Garnett as well. Career lows for all of them as far as numbers are concerned(But they WIN all the time and they all have rings now). They find the open man and play team oriented ball no ego involved.
David Lee puts up those numbers on a team 13 games under .500 there is a big difference. Like B-Roy dropping 29 on us the other night but they still lost by 18. Getting your numbers when your team is down by 20 points already doesn’t mean anything. Your opponent isn’t worried about you scoring because they know 1) The game is already over 2) You can’t stop them from coming back and scoring on you 2) If the game was in jeopardy they would shut you down.
That’s why players put up big numbers on scrub squads.
Marvin plays team ball. Joe Averaged 25ppg during the 06-07 season and we were still only fighting for the 8th seed before he went down with that calf injury. He’s not putting that up now but his assists are up and we’re WINNING more. Why do you think players accused of being offensively selfish like Steve Francis, Antione Walker and Stephon Marbury are always being shipped out of whatever team they are on…….usually because their selfish play results in a loosing effort.
Like I said before, it’s a TEAM sport, and Marvin is doing what was asked of him and what is necessary for the success of this team.
Ariose
March 17th, 2009
12:26 pm
……Most of the players’ numbers are down from last season…..but we have already won 2 more games than we did last season and we have like 15 more games to go…….If we can avoid five more losses we will hit the 50 mark.
doc
March 17th, 2009
12:30 pm
i suck
Blast
March 17th, 2009
1:10 pm
Sekou’s report about the chemistry Al has developed with Josh is spot on. Joe Johnson is right. If those two are playing at a high level defending and rebounding, and other teammates play their role, Hawks are hard to beat. As Josh goes to the post more, are we now seeing the results of his workout with Hakeem Olajuwon two years ago? I do believe his post moves have some fake and shake to it, reminiscent of the Dream Shake. Al Horford gets more agressive in the paint, we could start seeing double teams on him and Josh. Imagine, Hawks have the possibility of developing 3 guys that can command the double. Wouldn’t that be something to see?
Mo Evans needs to hang around the offensive glass more. He had two putbacks the last two games that were huge. He needs to stop being to foul prone, though.
Loved to see Joe use the ball fake some more, either to fake his man out and score, or draw the foul.
Almost every shot Portland took in the last game was at the buzzer, with the Hawks able to force them into at least 3 24 second violations. Kudos to the Hawks defence and as posted earlier, defence should be the Hawks identity.
Anybody think Portland regrets choosing Oden over Durant, yet? If Oden turns into a bust, that would be twice a 1st pick big man did not pan out for the Blazers. While Portland has done well in the draft, those two picks could make anything Billy Knight ever did wrong in the draft pale in comparison, assuming Oden turns out to be a bust, which I suspect will be the case because I do not think he will be healthy enough to be able to play an entire season and dominate. Far as I know, Shelden Williams has been the only total bust Billy selected. Say what you will about Marvin Williams, the man is going to have a great future in this league.
Ray, hopefully, the Hawks great play at home will help them out on the road. I know if they play with any kind of intensity close to how they are doing at home, they should be fine.
Break over. Gotta to go back to work. See you guys on the blog later tonight.
We need a new blog, Sekou.
Go Hawks! Beat Sac-Town!
Melvin
March 17th, 2009
2:12 pm
GREAT posts (12:13/12:26) Ariose. Stats doesn’t tell the whole story…
KevinA
March 17th, 2009
2:45 pm
Ariose, your comments support the point I was trying to make. Feed the studs down low and the JJ, Bibby shooting percentage will go up.
Sam, I see his improved driving ability, the three point shot and improved defense. Marvin is rarely asked to be a scorer. But remember the game he had 20 pts from the foul line? Marvin is a great team player and does not look for stats. JJ and Bibby could learn a little from him and defer to the front court.
KevinA
March 17th, 2009
2:51 pm
Nice post.
http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/29728683/
Don’t get me wrong JJ and Bibby are ballers, just an oopportunity for a little more balance.
Ken Strickland
March 17th, 2009
3:09 pm
It seems some of you aren’t reacting with your emotions/attotide and not your intellect. WHERE MARVIN, OR ANY PLAYER, WAS DRAFTED IS FAR LESS IMPORTANT THAN WHERE THEY RANK WITHIN THE HIERACHY OF THEIR TEAMS OFF. Marvin might have been the 2nd player drafted, but he’s been the 4th option in Woodson’s OFF, behind JJ, Bibby and Smoove. However, whenever he’s been featured in our OFF, he’s put up the kind of across the board numbers one would expect from even a #1 pick in the draft. Anyone that feels Marvin is that valuable, do a little research and tell me how many players that are 4th options in their teams OFF that have produced at Marvin’s level.
Some of you are too hung up on numbers or stats alone. That focus would eliminate outstanding players that have become Allstars and HOFer’s based in large part on intangibles. Players like Centers Bill Russell, Ben Wallace and Bill Walton, Forwards Dennis Rodman, Paul Silas or Guards TR Dunn and Jason Kidd, just to name a few, wouldn’t be held in such high regard if they were judged based on their scoring alone.
paul revere
March 17th, 2009
3:27 pm
You Atl fans kill me. You gripe back and forth about nothingness. You are holding the 4th spot in the east by the hair on your chinny-chin-chins. Beantown is the big bad wolf and we are going to blow your arses out of the water.
Garnett is scheduled to come back around March 21st, just in time to beat the crap out of you all on March 27th!! I can’t wait to read this blog on March 28th and hear y’all cry about how KG used Horford. LOL!!
Go Celts!!
terrell barron
March 18th, 2009
1:25 pm
Blast, funny thing is, we woulda took Oden if the ping pongs balls had’ve bounced our way. And everybody on this board would have been estatic, except me and a few others. His health has always been a concern of mine. And I never thought he’d develop any offensive skills whatsoever. With that said, I wish him the best. I’d really like to see how he would pan out, if healthy. And btw, THANK GOD FOR HORFORD!!!
terrell barron
March 18th, 2009
1:38 pm
Lol at Paul Revere. Funny how Boston can lose 1 of your key guys and cant beat Milwaukee, Miami, Chicago, Orlando, or Detroit. Hmmm??? You just better hope and pray that KG or Pierce dont go down before the Playoffs. Reason being, the Celtics LAY DOWN when somebody’s out. The Hawks STEP UP. 6 in a row my friend. And you should be worried about catching Cleveland, who’s suddenly 3.5 games ahead Boston. And btw, you wanna talk about hanging on to something. Boston has 1 foot on the #2 seed, and the other one on a banana peeling.
terrell barron
March 18th, 2009
1:40 pm
Paul Revere, make that 4.5 games, not 3.5.
terrell barron
March 18th, 2009
4:52 pm
To everyone saying we are a better team without Marvin: I coldheartedly disagree. However, I do think that we’re a better team without Marvin IN THE STARTING LINEUP. But to say that we are a better team without him on the team is ludicrous. My Hawks Playoff roster: 1st team: Bibby, Evans, JJ, Josh, Horford. 2nd team: Acie, Flip, Marvin, Solo, Zaza Defensive stopper: Mad Mario
Gumby Williams
March 19th, 2009
1:44 pm
If the Hawks manage to win 50 games this year, I wonder if the Hawks will acknowledge the job that Billy Knight did during his tenure with the Hawks. Think about it. The work that Knight did couldnt have been that bad if it produced a 50 win team. On the other hand, should the Hawks fall short of 50 wins and finish in fourth place in the Eastern Conference, that is still an improvement from finishing eighth last year and just getting into the playoffs. Knight was right.
Ariose
March 22nd, 2009
12:10 pm
[Once Again](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWC7RfUbMBg&feature=related)