Chancellor: Keep guns off Georgia’s college campuses
Should Georgia allow guns on its college campuses? (AJC file photo)
Georgia Chancellor Hank Huckaby spoke in opposition today to House Bill 512, which would comprehensively sweep away most restrictions on carrying firearms in Georgia, including on college campuses, on public school grounds and in churches.
Contrary to other states where the debate has shifted to restricting guns in the wake of the Newtown school massacre, many of two dozen gun bills filed in the Georgia Legislature aim to expand firearms access and reach.
Many educational leaders are concerned with bills allowing guns in schools and on campuses.
Here is Huckaby’s official statement from today’s hearing on HB 512:
I appear before you today as the chancellor of the University System of Georgia – a system of 31 institutions with 314,000 students and over 40,000 faculty and staff members. But I am also a father, and grandfather. I am a gun owner with many lifelong friends who are gun owners and hunters. Like many of you, therefore, I have experience with guns, and kids, and grandkids.
Guns do not frighten me and I do not demonize them, or their owners. I believe in the Second Amendment.
But in the matter before us, I realize and acknowledge that you may see this issue very differently than me. In my position I believe strongly that allowing our students to carry weapons on our campuses will not increase their personal safety but instead reduce it.
I have spent a significant part of my career working on college campuses. I have served in the administrations at both smaller institutions and this state’s flagship. I can tell you I have seen it all while there, and my experience tells me that for our students and the availability of guns will not increase their safety.
Each of the police chiefs of our campuses agree with me. They are charged with keeping the public safety on our campuses, and they will tell you allowing students to have weapons on campus make their jobs harder, not easier; more dangerous, not safer.
Our campus counselors will likely tell you the same thing. The reality of our modern campuses is we have students who come to us with a variety of personal issues, which create stress; they are on medications.
Many develop issues after coming to our campuses. I am not suggesting that every student is a ticking time bomb – far from it. I am suggesting that adding loaded weapons to an already potentially volatile mix of youthful exuberance, stress, and yes, at times alcohol and other factors, could lead to a tragedy of our own making that we could otherwise avoid.
Georgia law already goes further than many states that have passed concealed carry laws. According to the National Conference of State Legislatures, in 23 states the decision to ban or allow concealed carry weapons on campuses is made by each college or university individually – and from the calls we have made, the states are consistent in implementing policy which keeps guns in the hands of only their law enforcement. In Georgia, we permit a concealed carry holder to keep their weapon locked in their car – which the Supreme Court considers an extension of one’s domicile.
To those of you who believe strongly in this bill, I say I respect your views, and your right to hold them. You deal with very few simple issues, and I understand that. I am confident that you are motivated, as I am, by a desire to ensure that our campuses are as safe as we can possibly make them.
I am not sure there is anything I can say to you today to convince you that the provisions in this bill will be detrimental to campus safety. So let me conclude by saying unequivocally the Board of Regents, my administration, our 31 Presidents and their campus security chiefs all believe current law makes our campuses safe, and I sincerely plead that you keep it in place.
–from Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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96 comments Add your comment
Dc
March 4th, 2013
7:41 pm
Mass killings seem to occur primarily in schools, universities, and churches. All 3 of them are typically “gun free zones”. But of course there is NO CORRELATION between the two…..NONE!!
Edugator
March 4th, 2013
7:59 pm
Interesting that the Georgia legislature is considering more gun bills than ones related to improving education.
As an RA, nothing would have worried me more than wondering if some impaired dorm rat had a weapon. Keeping college campuses gun free zones my not stop the freakish terror of a mass killing, but they will keep schools from turning into the OK corral.
Truth Today
March 4th, 2013
8:03 pm
Democracy is too tiring. At the rate we are going, let’s just take guns everyone regardless of the venue. That would be a true embracing of our second amendment rights. I believe the Christian Bible shares that living by the sword will cause death by the sword. We really have it coming as a state and nation if we do not make balanced decisions about gun rights. The zealots are taking this issue too far without regard for what is in the best interest of all, especially our children.
Boris Badnoff
March 4th, 2013
8:15 pm
College officials don’t like to admit it but there is a great deal of drinking going on at frat parties, etc. Guns and alcohol don’t mix. Of course there would be fewer armed robberies if the students were armed. But there will be more shot in drunken revelry. What’s needed is more police presence working on crime prevention.
Carter Thompson
March 4th, 2013
8:18 pm
The only person in the State that has some intelligence on this issue. GA’s economy, public policy, schools…. etc are 200 years out of date from the rest of the country. The rest of the world looks at us and think we are a bunch of ignorant rednecks…I certainly can see why.
Peter
March 4th, 2013
8:19 pm
Nothing like putting guns in the hands of a bunch of immature, hot headed college kids to improve safety!!! While other states are trying to find ways to limit guns in the hands of kids and lunatics, our legislators want to make our state the wild, wild west. Why do we keep electing these same idiots to office over and over again? The legislature has cut billions of dollars from public education in the last 10 years in a state that is already at the bottom of the heap in terms of educational attainment, but their answer to improving education is to arm 18 year olds. God help us!
USC-69
March 4th, 2013
8:20 pm
The presence of unregulated guns should be met with resistance everywhere. On average guns killed 88 Americans and injured 202 each day during 2011 (N Engl J Med 2013:368:397-399). When available, it is estimated that firearm homicides and suicides in 2012 will exceed motor vehicle fatalities – mostly college age males. With less than 5 percent of the world’s population, we now own 40 percent of all firearms in civilian hands. (N Engl J Med 2013:368:397-399) Are they WELL REGULATED as prescribed by the Second Amendment? Obviously not. Gun owners are statistically, significantly more likely to commit murder and to eventually commit suicide (Univ Penn LDI Issue Brief 2003;8(8), 1-4). If guns cause more human damage than automobiles then funds of equivalent amounts should be devoted to registration of each weapon, licensure on one’s birthday, a psychological screening test (MMPI), a practical operation test, and a written test of the weapons laws. Prior behavior predicts the likelihood of committing gun violence. Federal law prohibits felons and those convicted of misdemeanor domestic violence from possession of a firearm, but it allows those convicted of assault and battery, brandishing a weapon, and those making open threats of violence (New York Times, 2/24/2013). That must be corrected. Federal law prohibits purchase by an abuser of controlled substances but allows alcohol abusers to purchase guns. That must be corrected. Where else is more alcohol consumed, than by college students?
Dc
March 4th, 2013
8:26 pm
Yeah, wouldn’t want college kids to be able to actually defend themselves. Much better to call the police or ambulance after they are shot or raped
Tucker
March 4th, 2013
8:31 pm
How about guns in the Capitol Building? Bet they are not applying the Second Amendment there.
bootney farnsworth
March 4th, 2013
8:50 pm
@ USC 69
what a pantload. I got one word for you: Chicago
bootney farnsworth
March 4th, 2013
8:51 pm
@ boris
driving and booze don’t mix, either. shall we ban driving?
bootney farnsworth
March 4th, 2013
8:53 pm
what’s funny is most of the idiots posting seem to think they are not there already.
Bernie
March 4th, 2013
9:04 pm
I Say, Let them BRING THEIR GUNS ON CAMPUS! Allow these students to ARM themselves to the TEETH! Allow them to bring as much Fire Power and High Velocity Piercing ammunition as they can carry.
On the Day of Mass Destruction of the INNOCENTS, Stand BY’s, and the senseless Collateral Damage of those enroute to class or home or to the Library. Then and only then will we see the UNWISESNESS of such a LEGISLATION.
Unfortunately, those who will be caught in such Mindless Madness are among US Now. They are undiscovered, hidden and remotely considered. Its cause will be born from an array of social ills. The Dead, will have no recourse, no trial, no inquest, no inquiry, No right to a fair trial and most of ALL NO APPEAL of any kind. They will only suffer the fate of the depths of the PIT with Eternal Darkness being their Future.
As for those of us who were lucky enough to avoid such carnage, will move on quietly with their lives with very little time of reflection or real concern.
The families, Parents, Brothers, Sisters of the deceased will be haunted with the questions of WHY?
They are the one’s who will be left to carry this BURDEN on BEHALF of ALL of US.
Parents take a look into your child’s eys tonight! Look deeply and think!
Are you prepared to give up their futures, their Lives at the hands of a Mentally ill individual, who have been given the RIGHT to bring such DEATH & DESTRUCTION to your Doorstep?
This decision will more than likely and with a high probability to bring such an ACT to some unlucky families among US as a result of its passage. We still have time to say NO! This is NOT WISE!
Those among US who introduced House Bill 512, have not seriously considered the true WISDOM of their Legislation and the potenial Pain that it will bring on many families. These Individual legislators assume callously they or their family members will not fall victim to such an heinous act as result of their introduction.
As for ME, I hope and pray that it is not a member of MY Family, that will get the DREADFUL news of THAT DAY! as a result of their ARROGANT IGNORANCE!
Kris
March 4th, 2013
9:16 pm
Only if Georgia legislators allow guns in all areas in the Gold dome. To quote our spineless shady dealing (term loosely used) Governor “”I guess its ok.”"
we do not need more useless unenforced laws, enforce the ones we have. I agree the police need to work more on crime prevention and less on writing TICKETS.
Georgia needs better Education for our children, they deserve better than 48th place in education.
Just Sayin
March 4th, 2013
9:22 pm
While I believe in the a person having a right to defend him or herself, I don’t think colleg campuses are generally the place for it. There is A LOT of drinking on college campuses and I feel that adding guns into the mix just amps up the probability that someone will get shot. I am not naive and I know that some kids probably already have them, but the truth is they are less likely to pull them out if they know they aren’t suppose to have them whereas if everyone is allowed one what do you think the first action will be. You all know that if a person believes they are in danger and have a weapon, then they will pull theirs and shoot. This means that now everyone is on a hair trigger anticipating the need to pull their weapon in any and all confrontational situations. College kids do monumentally stupid stuff al the time (alcohol enemas anyone (sp?))….now add about 10 to 15 loaded guns to it.
Dc
March 4th, 2013
9:25 pm
My daughter was at NIU during their mass shooting. The lunatic had time to stop, reload, and kill more innocent kids, because no one could take him out. One of her friends died while shielding his girlfriend. One student or prof with a gun would’ve saved many kids lives that day.
It completely amaze me that the same folks who scream about protecting a right that had to be “found” in the constitution (privacy) and leads to the death of millions a year, turn around and want to kill a right that is clearly in the constitution that at worst leads to a few thousand deaths, and likely nets out to positive by allowing people to protect themselves. Total and complete hypocrites
Pete E. Tong
March 4th, 2013
9:27 pm
This bill literally just passed it’s first committee by a huge margin. 12 – 3.
GSU Graduate
March 4th, 2013
9:27 pm
If they have a conceal carry permit they should understand that alcohol is not allowed while carrying. I would not recommend a dorm dweller to be able to keep is weapon at the dorm unless some kind of security system could be established to keep it very safe when it is out of his site. Conceal carry on campus could be a good thing if done properly. If the person has mental health issues he should not have a conceal carry permit anyway. That should be reported and his permit revoked until it is deamed the person is mentally sound. They are right to be cautious, but it could serve them well if implemented properly.
NorthAtlPistolToter
March 4th, 2013
9:41 pm
@ GSUGRAD what is this “conceal carry permit” you speak of? How to mental health professionals report someone’s condition? I will hang up and listen
Georgia
March 4th, 2013
9:44 pm
It’s like how they shouldn’t allow guns in airports. An accidental discharge of a gun in the public area of an airport, where fuel and planes are just a few hundred yards away, is the worst example of irresponsibility I can think of. People with guns are idiots. Guns just go off sometimes. Idiots with guns increase the probability of a gun just going off around all that fuel by a factor of a quadrillion. College students at spring break. Imagine college girls gone wild with their two .38s on spring break. Then imagine those same babes pulling out a gun. No, the likelihood of getting pistol whipped on the beach at midnight during a beer bong party is just too great. We just can’t risk it.
It’s like when women invented the sports bra by sewing two jock straps together (true). Where was the supervision? It wasn’t there then, and it most certainly is not there now. And we’re gonna give unsupervised college girls gone wild guns?
I don’t think so. I mean come on. Sometimes I wonder if the founding fathers every met college girls.
Nutmeg
March 4th, 2013
9:44 pm
Can’t speak for everyone, but as a graduate student who teaches three classes at Georgia State, I say leave the guns at home. The human brain’s ability to assess risk and think long-term isn’t fully formed until around age 25, and we have many students under age 25.
I personally would rather live in a civil society than the Wild, Wild West. Part of that means ceding some–*some*, not *all*–responsibility for our personal safety to the police. That’s why we have them.
Violence abounds
March 4th, 2013
9:51 pm
Nothing says big publicity like a mass shooting, and the best way to insure one happens is to make sure you create the kind of environment in which a shooter knows he/she will face no opposition shooters. Gun-free zones do exactly that. Every human being deserves the right to protect their own life. Government does not have the right to take that away from anyone.
NorthAtlPistolToter
March 4th, 2013
9:52 pm
@ Georgia –firearms are allowed in the ATL airport
Bill R.
March 4th, 2013
10:03 pm
Allowing guns doesn’t mean students will in fact go out and buy guns. Most do not care for guns. Those who want to allow guns on campus are but a small minority of students.
If only the pro-gun people cared about tight college budgets as much as they did allowing guns on campus.
ChicagoDawg
March 4th, 2013
10:25 pm
I love how everyone brings up Chicago whenever there is a gun debate. Yes there are shootings here, but I’ve never been the victim of any crime here. Whereas in Atlanta, I was robbed, my car was stolen, and I was the victim of a hit and run. Try looking beyond the headlines when it comes Chicago and gun violence, it’s really a lovely and safe city.
Mitch
March 4th, 2013
10:26 pm
A few years ago, the CDC reported that in an armed confrontation with a criminal you were more likely to be killed if you displayed a gun. “Proecting yourself” under these circumstances is a fantasy. Why would we want students to get themselves killed? Or worse, George Zimmerman themselves? Guns are not toys and trouble follows them everywhere.
Pete E. Tong
March 4th, 2013
10:27 pm
“they should understand that alcohol is not allowed while carrying”
No such law. Feel free to cite the OCGA number if you can find it.
Pete E. Tong
March 4th, 2013
10:29 pm
“A few years ago, the CDC reported that in an armed confrontation with a criminal you were more likely to be killed if you displayed a gun. ”
Cite please.
I dropped my fried twinkie
March 4th, 2013
10:30 pm
Let us hope the representatives do the right thing and pass this in to law.
Georgia Tech Students for Concealed Carry on Campus
HB 512 passed in committee today! We hope to pass Rules shortly for a floor vote on Thursday in the house. Please contact your representative if you haven’t already. Campus carry could shortly become a reality in Georgia.
21 year olds can be in the army so why can’t they carry a gun on campus?
I dropped my fried twinkie
March 4th, 2013
10:38 pm
PET….I think they mean you can’t have a gun in a BAR and just messed up trying to say that.
I dropped my fried twinkie
March 4th, 2013
11:16 pm
Chancellor………stop the Crime on campus and the guns wouldn’t be needed.
I dropped my fried twinkie
March 4th, 2013
11:19 pm
Truth in Moderation………..that might stop a lot of people from becoming COPS in the future too.
Thomas Pain
March 5th, 2013
12:08 am
All the doom and gloom folks seem to be missing one important fact:
There are several states in the USA where college students, faculty, and visitors who are legally allowed to carry gun can do so.
And they don’t have all the problems that being forecast by the people who are afraid of guns.
In fact, none of those states has had a mass shooting at a school either.
One clever poster mentioned that he was an RA and that he would be afraid of dorm rats with guns. But if a dorm rat really wanted to do harm, would a sign on the door or another law stop them? The only people that these laws inconvenience are the law abiding, because by definition, they are the only ones that will refuse to carry in places where it’s illegal. The criminals will do whatever they want regardless of the law, that’s the very definition of a criminal.
My daughter goes to a school in a state where carry by honest, law abiding people on a college campus is not illegal. If I thought it was a problem, and it’s not, she wouldn’t be going there. But the reality is that her school is safer than Georgia Tech.
Jessica
March 5th, 2013
12:30 am
The unfortunate truth of the gun control debate is something that no one wants to hear, and no politician on either side will ever admit: there is no perfect solution.
If law-abiding citizens are not allowed to own and/or carry guns, they become sitting ducks, especially on campuses and in churches. Bad people will still find ways to get guns, and they will be even more bold because they can be reasonably sure that their victims are unarmed.
If people have unrestricted access to guns and are free to carry them everywhere, there will be more accidental shootings and violent escalation of conflicts.
It seems to me that both sides of this debate are being unrealistic in how they present the issue to the public. They want us to believe that, if we agree with them and help them push their agenda, all the gun-related crime in this country will stop. I think it’s time for people to grow up and admit that neither side can actually deliver that kind of peace, and every possible ’solution’ has some sort of cost attached.
ClydeFr0g
March 5th, 2013
1:03 am
If there wasn’t going to ever be any controversy to the issue, the Founding Fathers wouldn’t have needed to enshrine the RIGHT in the Bill of Rights.
And to you morons that talk about the Second Amendment only relating to people in “a well regulated militia” I ask you this;
Read this paragraph;
“A well-regulated educational system being necessary for the enlightenment of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear books shall not be infringed.”
Does this mean to you that only people attending school have the right to own books? If you say yes you are delusional and beyond reason.
Ath1
March 5th, 2013
2:43 am
I work on a college campus. I have lost count of the number of students and parents who come to us in every disrespectful and belligerent manner, I have had students and parents, not only curse me in the most vile manner to those who curse and attempt to get behind our serving area. When it gets out of hand, we have someone in the back offices to call campus police and try not to engage the student until the police arrive. Up until now, when the offenders see the officers with the gun at their sides, they quiet down. Now imagine that we have a student and, maybe, a parent and they are packing heat, The would not respect the police officer’s presence because they are just as armed as they are. Do we have to experience students and/parents shooting college personnel for someone to realize that guns on campus is a terrible idea? Today, a parent cursed me on the phone as if he knows me…downright disrespectful, rude and mean. What would have happened if he were in front of me with a gun? These students and parents do not care. If you are unable to give them what they want because of federal laws or the institutions policies, the worse come out of them.
This law makes all of us nervous. But trust and believe that going forward, I will cease any interaction with a student who begins to show out. He/She will have to wait until there are at least two police officers in my presence. The job is not work an idiot trying to take my life for something that is almost always their fault.
I won’t even address the need for firearms in CHURCH? Come one…our legislators are DUMB!! Not trying to wish bad on anyone, but maybe this law needs to backfire on one in their family to understand how ridiculous they were!
Ath1
March 5th, 2013
2:45 am
That should have been…BEFORE IT GETS OUT OF HAND…
Ath1
March 5th, 2013
2:54 am
…Geesh, this site/format needs an edit or preview button;
The would not respect…should be “THEY would not respect”
the worse come out of them…should be “the worse COMES out of them”
The job is not work an idiot…should be “the job is not WORTH an idiot…”
…on one in their family to understand how ridiculous they were!…should be “on one of their family MEMBERS so that they can understand what an irresponsible law they passed.”
I am disgusted!
Hope those are all my errors!
Jack ®
March 5th, 2013
5:22 am
Allowing guns on campus is stupid on the face of it. More police and a lock-up room on campus makes sense.
gdfo
March 5th, 2013
6:16 am
Student who qualify for a conceal/carry permit should be allow to conceal and carry.
It is not a requirement that Frat parties where drinking is going to occur will have gun-fights. Ummm, you know girls can conceal/carry too.
Then they can stay that, that is not a banana in my pocket.
Colleges do not ban sports cars or college football. There is a higher probablity that a college aged person will die or get injured in an car accident than a college shooting. There is also a higher probablility that a college football player will get injured that get shot.
Some people who attend college have been known to use illegal drugs. Banning illegal drug use has been an exercise in futility.
If some folks want to ban somthing, how about banning the situations that lead to these kinds of problems? Now thats not so easy you might say.
Ban Bullying! Teach self respect. Learn to deal with mental and emotional problems in people. If someone obvously need help, SAY something!
redweather
March 5th, 2013
6:48 am
I had a student “go off” in class two weeks ago. He is a young veteran with PTSD who is not having the easiest time getting reacclimated to civilian life. He is impulsive and wears his emotions on his sleeve. But he is also bright and articulate. To many observers he might look like someone to keep an eye on. As for me, I’m more worried about the students who have almost nothing to say in class and don’t seem to have any emotions.
But whether we are talking about veterans with issues or loners with issues, I sure hope we don’t allow them to bring guns into the classroom. They can already bring them on campus. And as others have pointed out, if the State Capitol is off limits as far as the Second Amendment is concerned, then so should be a lot of other places.
12a10
March 5th, 2013
6:54 am
As a retired professor at a state school …. do not allow guns on campus. Teachers are at the front of the room and make great targets. As to comments om 19 year olds being in the military …. except in war zones their weapons are kept locked up in arms rooms and are only carried while on training.
GB
March 5th, 2013
7:27 am
Huckaby doesn’t address the obvious. Having a rule that prohibits students from having guns from campuses does not really prevent students or anyone else from having a gun on campus. These troubled students he is talking about, the ones on meds, can easily have a gun with them without regard to the rules.
Always Skeptical
March 5th, 2013
7:28 am
to PET: There may be no “law” directly relating to alcohol and concealed carry, but if you get caught driving while intoxicated and you are carrying, your concealed carry permit can be suspended. Same with getting caught intoxicated in an altercation and you are carrying concealed. The weapon does not need to be drawn, you put your concealed carry permit at risk. In most states, firearms are not permitted in drinking establishments. So no, there are no “laws” but there are consequences for carrying while intoxicated.
to everyone else: If someone is unbalanced enough to commit a mass shooting whether it’s a student with PTSD or just the “quiet” student, THEY WILL GET A FIREARM ANYWAY! You can take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens, but you will never be able to control guns in the hands of criminals or anyone who is hell bent on causing harm to others. There are students who have grown up handling guns their entire lives and know and respect what they can do. Why limit their ability to defend themselves? Anyone who does not believe that firearms are already on college campuses is delusional. Do you think that drug dealers and gang bangers care about concealed carry permits? And yet they carry concealed anyway.
Maude
March 5th, 2013
7:34 am
Chancellor all the laws in the world will not keep a crazy person from carring a gun on campus and killing many people. What you want is to make all the other students sitting ducks!! As long as students with legal permits are not allowed to bring their guns on campus, the campus will always be open season for crazies. Because even crazy people do not want to shoot up somewhere that might shoot back. Chancellor you are putting thousands of innocent people at risk!
Pardon My Blog
March 5th, 2013
7:48 am
There is not a right or wrong answer to this one unfortunately. My child was at Virginia Tech and in class at the time Cho went on his rampage. Would armed students have minimized the loss of life? Hard to say, perhaps if the ROTC students had been armed maybe. Perhaps that tragedy never would have happened had the University been allowed to be made aware of his mental issues that stemed back to middle school.
The reality on a college campus is there is alot of drinking, drug use and pressure. Some handle it better than others and a perfectly normal kid could snap.
Mountain Man
March 5th, 2013
7:49 am
When I was at UGA, my girlfriend (later my wife) was having problems with an ex-boyfriend, who was threatening to kill her and then kill himself. We were looking seriously at getting a gun for her (she lived in a dorm). I lived off-campus and I had a gun for protection.
What is needed is a better system to ensure that guns do not end up in the hands of the wrong people. I have no qualms about guns in the hands of sane, rational, well-trained people.
Mountain Man
March 5th, 2013
7:54 am
“The reality on a college campus is there is alot of drinking, drug use and pressure”
There CANNOT be a lot of drinking on campus! Most of the college students are not old enough to drink, and AS WE ALL KNOW, when you create a law, it immediately results in 100% compliance. That is why nobody has to fear anyone coming onto campus with a gun – there is a law against that, and laws are never broken. It is just like guns are never brought onto the Grady High School campus. That is becasue if a gun ever WAS brought onto that campus, the perpetrator would be immediately arrested, denied bond, and tried and sentenced to 10 years in jail (hysterical laughter follows…)
redweather
March 5th, 2013
8:18 am
@ Mountain Man, Guns are already allowed on campus in Georgia, but students must leave them in their cars. Trust me, I know. I spend a lot of time on a college campus and never forget that.
indigo
March 5th, 2013
8:43 am
Guns don’t kill people.
People WITH guns kill people.
Ronin
March 5th, 2013
8:51 am
You must be at least 21 to obtain a concealed carry permit. That will eliminate the majority of students.
While I see Mr. Huckayby’s position. Nothing screams “I’m a target” like a government declared gun free zone, just look at GA Tech.
GaSouthernGrad
March 5th, 2013
8:55 am
I knew people in college that had guns, both rifles and handguns, I dont recall an incident where any was used in a manner for which it wasnt meant. I had a roommate that had 2 shotguns under his bed in our apartment and we had great crazy parties all the time and neither if them ever climbed out and shot anyone. The fact of the matter is most all people are complacent when it comes to safety, most Georgians are able to carry firearms now depending on if they have a GWL/GFL or not, and only a very very small percentage of the population does. The fact is that law abiding citizens that go out and get the license are the last group of people you need to worry about.
USC-69
March 5th, 2013
9:01 am
Who has been murdered bya legal registered gun at Georgia Tech? The Institute of Medicine and the National Research Council report that U.S. firearm homicides are 20 times higher and firearm suicides are 6 times higher than in other developed countries. What regulations do Canada, Japan, Australia, France, Germany, and Spain have that makes them so much safer and provide their young males, specifically, with significantly longer survivals. Maybe we can learn something. Many Americans are educable and some have experience at a college where they survived happily with no gun. Time to move into the 21st century. It is a crowded, complex culture and we do not need more guns.
GaSouthernGrad
March 5th, 2013
9:04 am
Fact of the matter is if you dont live in an inner city and arent suicidal the likelihood of death by firearm is about .5%
Dr. Proud Black Man
March 5th, 2013
9:13 am
“They cling to their guns and religion.”
GaSouthernGrad
March 5th, 2013
9:17 am
oh lawd Dr Proud, blacks are known for clinging to guns and religion too
Another Reason why Republicans lose
March 5th, 2013
9:18 am
This is another example of how out of touch this state is with most of the nation and why the Republican party in general is on its way to being a regional not national party.
Ronin
March 5th, 2013
9:20 am
Students at GA Tech are often victims of predators coming from and going to a gun free zone.
Don't Tread
March 5th, 2013
9:31 am
Huckaby “believes in the 2nd Amendment” and then advocates denying that right in the very next paragraph. Some “belief system” you have there, Mr. Huckaby.
“the Board of Regents, my administration, our 31 Presidents and their campus security chiefs all believe current law makes our campuses safe”
That’s nice. Why don’t you ask for input from the armed robbery victims at GA State and GA Tech? I wonder how safe THEY feel. “Gun free zones” don’t make anyone safe except the criminals…recent history should make that one obvious to anyone with two brain cells.
Just A Teacher
March 5th, 2013
9:36 am
I think guns should be required for every student. Furthermore, since most of the mass shootings are taking place in K – 12 schools, I believe every person in every school (including colleges) should be required to carry a concealed weapon at all times. If having more guns on campuses makes schools safer, this would make Georgia’s schools the safest in the entire world!
Synonomous
March 5th, 2013
9:40 am
Yeah, gun free zones are working real well for Tech students, aren’t they Chancellor? How many muggings have they had so far this week?
frankie
March 5th, 2013
9:52 am
ok evryone step back and look at the big picture…you want guns on campuses, go for it,
those college campuses that allow guns will loose students because the parent and students who do not want to buy into that ideology (which is what it is) will not send their kids to thoe schools which means reduce enrollment and reduced revenue and possibly funding from the federal and state government.
Some people argue that if drinking and driving is an issue then ban driving, well we ban consuming alocohol before getting behind the wheel how is that working for you.
the point is the reason why the number of deaths have increased at shools and or churches if you will is because of the mental aspect.
Do you know for sure without a shadow of a doubt that the person standing or sitting next to you in class is in his or her right mind every second of evry day…if so then go for it.
but the studies have shown that the people who have been committing these mass shootings have been out of their minds.
Now mix that with alcohol and partying and for get black on black shootings, fraternity and club shootings will be on the rise….
frankie
March 5th, 2013
9:56 am
i have been living for 47 years, gone to college, pledged a fraternity, and spent the last 25 ears working and have never owned a gun and I am bullet free. i have even gone to movie theaters in what some would call rough neighbor hoods…still bullet free. drive 285 for the last 18 years still bullet free. own a home, no break ends, bullet free.
lived in decatur, lithonia, snellville, conyers and atlanta….BULLET FREE….just sayin
ClydeFr0g
March 5th, 2013
9:57 am
USC-69;
“What regulations do Canada, Japan, Australia, France, Germany, and Spain have that makes them so much safer”
You think it’s regulations that make these people safer, huh? Are you sure it has nothing to do with culture? Maybe you can explain why Switzerland is awash in guns but they have a very low homicide rate and very low rate of guns used to commit crimes.
Laws are the answer to everything! I have a great idea…heroin is bad, kills lots of kids. Let’s make that illegal! Oh, wait….
Just A Teacher;
“If having more guns on campuses makes schools safer, this would make Georgia’s schools the safest in the entire world!”
Typical militant-left hyperbole. Can you show me even one conservative or Republican that has said we should be arming children?
When THE RIGHT people have a CHOICE to protect themselves (you know, like is granted by the Second Amendment to the Constitution you liberals like to use for toilet paper) schools can most certainly be safer. Do you think it’s coincidence that almost every “mass shooting” takes place on a school campus or religious institution where people are denied their Second Amendment rights? Does it even enter your feeble little mind as a possibility that just maybe the criminals perpetrating these crimes picked these places because they knew they would meet no resistance at all?
I remember the shooting at the Sikh temple in Wisconsin…the leader of the temple charged at the gunman with a ceremonial knife and (big surprise) was quickly killed. What if the leader had a handgun he could have ended that tragedy with? I know there was at least one teacher/administrator at Newtown that charged at Lanza but she had no weapon whatsoever, and of course she too was quickly killed and never had any chance at all against the killer.
Why is it so hard for you libs to get it through your thick skulls that laws ALLOWING people to defend themselves on campus and in church does not mean laws FORCING people to carry weapons if they don’t want to? And why is it so hard for you to understand that criminals will have guns on campus and in church no matter what laws are on the books, so the ONLY people you are disarming are peace-loving, law-abiding citizens?
Any logical, reasoned responses or just more emotional hyperbole?
frankie
March 5th, 2013
10:05 am
So how does the criminal gt his hands on guns….he buys them from legal gun owners….via gun shows.
He breaks into homes where guns are stored and steals them, he(i am sorry she is inlcuded also) into gun stores, pawn shops and steals them.
@Clyde…ARE you 100% sur that the person carrying a gun that sits next to you in class or in church is of sound mind. when you drive on 285, do you not get upset at the person driving slow in the fast lane….being upset means that you are not of sound mind…100% of the time….that is the problem.
Just A Teacher
March 5th, 2013
10:09 am
“Any logical, reasoned responses or just more emotional hyperbole?”
You are correct, Clyde, in your characterization of my comment as hyperbole. However, I teach in a public high school and have taught in 2 different colleges, and I haven’t felt safe on my job since the mid 90’s. We teachers (and professors) know that we could be killed at any time by an armed lunatic who holds a grudge. If I seem hyper emotional on this issue, it’s because I’d like to stay alive.
frankie
March 5th, 2013
10:11 am
By the way I am not a liberal….I belong to the COMMON SENSE PARTY
ClydeFr0g
March 5th, 2013
10:30 am
frankie, do YOU know if the people sitting next to you are of sound mind all the time? Do you know if they are armed? Isn’t that all the more reason that I should have the choice to arm myself to defend myself from people that may not be of sound mind? I can’t answer for everyone else, but I know that I have been vetted by the state to have no criminal past and no mental issues sufficient to allow that I was issued a concealed carry permit. Why can’t I defend myself in church from someone that might be of unsound mind and come into the church with a weapon intent on killing? frankie, are you saying you are afraid of people that have weapons permits issued by the state? If so, you are afraid of the wrong people pal! Be afraid of the thugs/criminals/mentally defective that can’t legally carry BUT DO ANYWAY! What’s your plan to disarm *those* people? Tell you what…when you have completely disarmed every criminal and completely removed any possibility any criminal might use any kind of weapon against me I’ll freely turn in my entire gun collection.
Just A Teacher,
So you say you are afraid. I believe that, and probably with good reason. So you haven’t felt safe in your job since the mid-90’s…you feel unsafe from high school students that couldn’t legally carry a gun no matter what? You feel less unsafe from them than you would knowing that some of your fellow teachers or admins, that have been vetted by the state to be issued a carry permit, might be armed? Newsflash – you could be killed at any time be an armed lunatic that holds a grudge, and if you are in high school there is 0% chance said lunatic would be legally armed or following any law. You don’t want to give yourself a fighting chance, that’s fine, you have a right to NOT carry a gun. Why deny your fellow educators their right to defend themselves?
I don’t get it. Who are you afraid of? It sounds to me like you are afraid of kids and criminals with guns, but you won’t allow for even the possibility that ANY “good guys” can have guns to counter the very people you fear! How does this make ANY sense at all? What law do you think is going to prevent an insane criminal from coming onto a campus/church with a gun? NONE!
You guys want guns to have never been invented. Fair enough, I bet many of us would. However, that is not the world in which we live. You can’t un-invent guns and there is no way to put the genie back in the bottle. You want to ensure that ONLY criminals have guns though?
frankie
March 5th, 2013
10:49 am
even people with gun permits commit crimes. hell where do you think criminals get there guns from….permit carrying gun owners…by stealing or purchasing…
I am not afraid of anyone….You seemto be afraid of everyone..
Not coming down on you or your beliefs…
I do have a gun permit, but chose not to buy a gun…at this time.
I have thought about it many times, but have not had the need to, so i haven’t.
It is not only the criminals that have the problem…is it the gun totten person who wants to take the law into his own hands.
It sounds like you want things to return to the OLD WEST, wher everyone has a gun and if you look at me the wrong way i have the right to shoot you then find out if you infact meant harm to me…when infact i was just looking at the woman behind you…just sayin..
frankie
March 5th, 2013
10:57 am
guns are here…i have been formally trained to handle and own a gun, just have not had the need to.
I see more people who legally own guns get into more trouble than those of us who do not have guns…are they stupid or just unlucky legal gun owners.
Every week someone forgets there gun is packed in there suit case a goes through security, only to be stopped and arrested and now has a record and a hefty fine to boot.
I here about people shooting there spouse over an arguement about nothing, i here about accidental shootings of kids, and adults.
These are all legal gun owners….maybe not smart gun owners like you CLYDE. but nonethe less legal gun owners that yuo pair yuorself with.
Hell we even have COPS who are paid to protect thecitizens, helping the drug dealers and supplying them protection and guns.
we have the government providing guns to “allies” only for them to come back and use them against us.
Hell maybe I should be afraid of the LEGAL GUN OWNER, he/she seems to be more of a threat than the criminals….just sayin…
Just A Teacher
March 5th, 2013
10:59 am
” . . . “good guys” can have guns to counter the very people you fear!”
The problem with that argument is that everyone considers himself a good guy. Most violent acts are committed by very unlikely people. They are committed by typically law abiding citizens who make mistakes or suffer a mental break. I am not afraid of guns, but when I go hunting, I am very selective about who I am with. I’m sure Adam Lanza’s mother thought he was a good guy too. Unfortunately, her death and the deaths of those little kids make him appear to have been criminally insane.
Dr. Proud Black Man
March 5th, 2013
11:30 am
@GaSouthernGrad
“oh lawd Dr Proud, blacks are known for clinging to guns and religion too”
zzz
ClydeFr0g
March 5th, 2013
11:48 am
frankie,
I can assure you I’m not afraid of anyone. I’m quite well-trained and well-armed!
I hear about accident’s with cars where people get killed too…does that mean no one should have a car? Accidents with space heaters where people get killed…should no one own a space heater? MANY accidents involving alcohol…should no one be allowed to buy beer or wine?
So more people that legally own guns get into more trouble than people that don’t? Can you show me some statistics on that one? Most gun owners I know (all legal) take GREAT STRIDES to not get into idiotic arguments over petty nonsense because they understand what being a responsible gun owner/carrier means. Most people I’ve known that got into most trouble got into that trouble in bars and guns were definitely NOT involved, but that’s just anecdotal.
And the accidents and murders you attribute to legal gun owners…you KNOW they are legal gun owners? Most of what I see in the news, especially regarding accidents, occur because some ex-con (NOT legal gun owner) left his loaded pistol on the table where a toddler could reach it while he was getting high.
Oh well, you are kind of all over the place frankie. I can’t discuss how to keep guns away from cops or how the government shouldn’t arm countries like Pakistan, that’s not a debate for this thread and has no bearing whatsoever on Second Amendment rights and how they should or shouldn’t be eliminated in “gun free zones” in schools or churches.
Just A Teacher,
Do you REALLY believe everyone considers themselves a “good guy”? Lanza considered himself a good guy? Holmes? The guys that committed Columbine? I don’t think so! It doesn’t matter anyway what others consider themselves. What do YOU consider a “good guy”? Someone that can protect you from someone intent on causing you harm or harming your friends, family, coworkers, students? There is one person I know for certain will always help protect me, my family, and my friends without hesitation or delay – ME!
You REALLY believe that most violent acts are committed by unlikely people? You think most of the 500+ killings in Chicago last year were committed by unlikely people or by gangbanger thugs? Be honest and not PC. Yes, there are some high-profile instances where “unlikely people” commit violent acts which is exactly why you see them hyped up on the news but you hear NOTHING about the nightly gang murders in every major city.
And talking about Lanza…that shouldn’t have happened because there were laws against having guns on school property, RIGHT? So how did those laws protect anyone BUT Lanza? I know you won’t answer that one!
Neither of you have even touched on how any law prevents a criminal from taking a gun into a school or church and killing people. You talk a lot about the extremely rare good-guy-gone-bad scenario you seem deathly afraid of, but not a word about REAL CRIMINALS or insane people and how to stop them from breaking the law by writing more laws!
Chamblee Dad
March 5th, 2013
12:04 pm
@ Mountain Man Creepy. My current wife, had a very similar problem with an ex-fiance, leading up to our wedding some said, only half-jokingly “let’s hope he doesn’t show up with a gun & shoot the place up.” Didn’t that day or after, but a few years later, the news came out that he had shot himself. Fortunately he didn’t take anybody else out.
Not really arguing either way, but hard to prepare fully for something that can be hard to predict when & where it might happen, even if threatened. Prepare & defend against something random, huh. I owned a gun while at UGA, although not on campus. Double barrel 12 gauge with buck shot followed by a slug. Intruder only. I’m not qualified to whip out a pistol & take someone out in public like Dirty Harry. But I know many people are, and in an ideal world would great to see them jump out & get these idiots.
frankie
March 5th, 2013
12:52 pm
DO you know that the “legal” gun accidents aren’t legal gun owners.
So basically collateral damage is okay with you in any situation…
If you drink and drive, you should loose not only your license but the car you own too…and not beallowed to buy alcohol, but tha is not the world we live in…
You mentioned the 2nd amendment…which was written over 200 years ago, and becauseof that fact the things that took place then, should be amended to reflect the world we live in today, just like other parts of the constitution have been amended.
so your training hs prepared you to anticipate a mass shooting and the nerve to engage in return fire without killing innocent people…
You must have been trained by GOD because the last i checked even the special forces, red berets, green, berets, seal teams black ops, and secret service have all had some one killed in action.
No way can you tell me that you would be able to react to someone you don’t know is carrying a weapon (automatic rifle) and starts shooting at random (which means you may be the first on hit before you get your gun out of the holster…..
USC
March 5th, 2013
2:07 pm
Thanks Maureen for allowing an open discussion of this hotly debated topic in the Deep South. A University should be a peaceful setting for advanced learning and research. The presence of guns in the classroom and on campus inhibits the open discussion of ideas which can frequently lead to argument and differences of opinion. The name calling and disparagement in this blog is exactly the environment that should be discontinued and discouraged – on college campuses, in political discourse, in civil society. This atmosphere of threat and intimidation is currently being fostered worldwide in the U.S., Syria, Africa, Iraq, Mexico, etc. Guns allow the bully to attempt to intimidate and insist that his opinion be accepted and agreed to, which is not the purpose of University education. Opinions should be proven to the student and accepted because of intellectual facts. The student must be allowed to debate and reject ideas but only based on facts. The student must be willing to listen to ideas with which he is not familiar and to understand the facts associated before drawing his own conclusion. The student must leave the University capable of critical thinking and knowledgeable regarding the ideas of the current and historical thinkers. Guns would inhibit this process and should always be eliminated. A well regulated militia (on campus) can maintain the peace and ensure reward of the First Amendment to all present. Will there be criminals? Of course. Should we just shoot and kill everybody who looks intimidating? Not in the 21st century if we want to maintain civilization.
ClydeFr0g
March 5th, 2013
2:08 pm
frankie you should probably keep it under 5 cups of coffee when you’re trying to think!
I have no idea what you mean by the “collateral damage” rant in the first part of your ramblings…can’t really reply to that.
Yes, the Second Amendment was written over 200 years ago. It’s not some historical artifact frankie, it’s the law of the land in which we live. The Founders were very wise when they wrote it and they knew that history repeats. Yes, some things have certainly changed since the Constitution was written. For example, there was no internet, TV, or radio when the First Amendment was written, so should the First Amendment be edited out of the Bill of Rights like you’d like to edit out the Second Amendment? If you want to amend it, go right ahead, there is a process for that and good luck to you. In the meantime though, any laws that infringe on the Second Amendment, including barring carry in a church or school, are unconstitutional.
It’s really an all or nothing scenario with you libs, isn’t it? You think that if someone comes into a theater where I’m watching a movie I’m obligated to go into combat mode and take him out? Is that why you think I need special forces training? HARDLY! If some guy pulls out a rifle in a movie theater I scramble for cover like everyone else. If he comes to me with that rifle however, you better believe I’ve got the wherewithal to point my 9mm at his chest and/or head and squeeze the trigger. What, you think every gun owner thinks he’s going to be some super hero and defend all of you that could have exercised your 2A rights but chose not to? What would you do frankie, plead for mercy? GOOD LUCK WITH THAT.
ClydeFr0g
March 5th, 2013
2:15 pm
USC – HILARIOUS! (Nice second incarnation of yourself by the way)
So you think that allowing permit holders to carry on campus means that when debate is happening in a classroom that permit holder is going to brandish a weapon to “persuade” others to agree with him? Are you a freaking moron?
Tell me, how many times has that happened to you here in Georgia, anywhere in the state? Because there are about half a million of us that LEGALLY carry here. Do you realize that almost everywhere you go – the grocery, restaurants, movie theaters, the park, the mall, just walking down the street – SOMEONE around you is carrying a gun? I’ll bet you never even realized, and I’m sure you couldn’t pick the carriers out in the crowd. We cross all races, both genders, all sexual orientations, Dems, Repubs, and Independents (like myself), all age groups (21 and over), all economic strata….
You don’t have a clue!
Vox Populi
March 5th, 2013
4:56 pm
maybe “Huck” oughta stroll around Tech or GSU at midnight…unarmed.
That would solve ONE of USG’s problems…
Just A Teacher
March 5th, 2013
6:01 pm
“The presence of guns in the classroom and on campus inhibits the open discussion of ideas . . . ”
Thank you, USC, for shedding some light on the issue. People outside of education don’t realize the importance of maintaining an atmosphere of enlightenment. There are many places where guns are not allowed: court rooms, airplanes, Congress, and the White House to name a few. These places are sanctuaries just as schools should be. If current governmental policy is in favor of the proliferation of firearms, why aren’t people allowed to walk into the Capitol building brandishing assault rifles? Or into the Supreme Court carrying hand grenades? The reason is obvious: somebody might get hurt!
Truth in Moderation
March 5th, 2013
6:58 pm
IF YOU CARE
TELL YOUR REPRESENTATIVE TO VOTE NO
ON Safe Carry Protection Act!
HB 512
CALL BEFORE THURSDAY!
Truth in Moderation
March 5th, 2013
7:00 pm
REMEMBER THE LA RIOTS OF ‘92!
GUNS ARE NOT SAFE!
VOTE NO ON HB 512 TOMORROW!
Truth in Moderation
March 5th, 2013
7:03 pm
OUR COLLEGE STUDENTS’ SAFETY IS AT STAKE!
Tell your representative to vote NO on HB 512 TOMORROW!!!!!!!!!
Safe Carry Protection Act HB 512
Truth in Moderation
March 5th, 2013
7:07 pm
ACT LIKE A STAR!
HOLLYWOOD SAYS “NO” TO GUNS!
TELL YOUR REPRESENTATIVE TO VOTE NO!…..and be a STAR!
ON HB 512
Safe Carry Protection Act
Truth in Moderation
March 5th, 2013
7:11 pm
THERE’S NOTHING “SAFE” ABOUT CARRYING A GUN!
VOTE NO! ON HB 512
CALL TOMORROW!
unarmedprof
March 5th, 2013
8:30 pm
One thing we teach in college: Correlation is not causation.
Calka
March 5th, 2013
8:43 pm
Good morning, class!
As you enter the room, please store all the weapons under your desk. Did you remember to bring your safety locks? If not there are a few on my desk. Your weapons have to be secured – no exceptions. Johnny, I just told you, all weapons have to be secured!!
Yes, just like yesterday – it is mandatory to wear a bullet-proof vest in class. Please make sure that they are fastened. Now to our lesson today – how to discuss issues in a civil manner….
…
Don’t forget your weapons on your way to the next class. See you tomorrow – stay safe!
Roxy
March 5th, 2013
10:19 pm
I would prefer to send my student to campus with a gun and adequate training rather than a HUGE target that says–hey I’m totally defenseless because only the lawbreakers can have weapons on any GA campus.
Roxy
March 5th, 2013
10:24 pm
WHOA–”Just a Teacher” at 6:01p–DUH–because those people are surrounded by people with BIGGER GUNS.
Funny
March 6th, 2013
7:41 am
Indigo’s post on March 5 at 8:43 should be corrected to say that People who have guns illegally kill people. In the vast majority of deaths caused by guns the shooter did not have the legal permits for the gun they used. Most people with permits have been trained in the use of the gun, have great respect for the weapon and never shoot it unless it is for target practice.
frankie
March 6th, 2013
11:38 am
Funny….and you know te people with permits have been trained in the use of guns. I have a GEORGIA FIREARMS LICENSE….NO TRAINING REQUIRED…
Hillary
March 6th, 2013
1:50 pm
This is a “which is the lesser evil of the two” question, since criminals will remain armed and dangerous despite any gun rights or conceal and carry laws in place.
So which is the lesser evil in this case: Expecting a teacher to take responsibility for their own personal safety in the classroom setting and elsewhere (by carrying their own gun if they are afraid, and treating students respectfully, so they will not have a reason to be angry enough to shoot them), or asking students to arm themselves with knowledge of all sorts–except how to defend themselves against a rapist or robber on a college campus, where college security is stretched to about 1 officer per every 500 to 1,000 students or so?
Yankee Prof
March 6th, 2013
5:00 pm
At my previous institution, a state university in the Middle Atlantic region, a student returned to his off-campus apartment after a night of drinking and decided that he no longer liked the figure in the poster on his bedroom wall, so he drunkenly took out his gun and shot it. The bullet pierced the wall and struck one of his roommates who was sleeping in the adjacent bedroom. When that boy began screaming, the drunken shooter realized what he’d done, panicked, turned the gun on himself, and pulled the trigger.
I agree with our Chancellor. We are in the service of educating our young and have a charge of protecting them while they are with us. There are already guns on all of our campuses, and they are in the possession of professionals trained in using them for our protection. Adding guns indiscriminately to the mass of those who visit our campuses daily will not add to that protection.
Michael Noll
March 6th, 2013
6:38 pm
I have been working at Valdosta State University for more than 12 years. There has never been an issue with gun violence, but plenty with alcohol, drugs (legal and illegal), and simple examples of immaturity. You do NOT want to add guns to an environment that is designed for teaching, learning, at times heated debates, and, well, growing up.
There are plenty of reasons why counselors, police chiefs, faculty, students and anyone else familiar with college life are opposed to guns on campus. As Chancellor Huckaby put it: “allowing our students to carry weapons on our campuses will not increase their personal safety but instead reduce it.”
I agree 100%, and if you take the time to reflect on it, so will you. Keep guns off campus!
Guns on campus bill meets greater resistance now that it passes House and moves to Senate | Get Schooled
March 13th, 2013
10:36 am
[...] The bill was opposed by the chancellor of the University System of Georgia. “I am suggesting that adding loaded weapons to an already potentially volatile mix of youthful exuberance, stress, and yes, at times alcohol and other factors, could lead to a tragedy of our own making that we could otherwise avoid,” Chancellor Hank Huckaby told lawmakers. [...]
Kevin
March 23rd, 2013
10:19 am
I find it sad that the chancellor and all of his experience doesn’t realize that the demographic of a the student body has changed in the past few years. At my college a large portion of that demographic is well out of the so called immature 18-24 range. I’m 33 and a Navy vet in college, but since I’m a student now I must revert back to a maturity level of an 18 year old. That’s funny because I was still trusted with a firearm back then.