The task facing Michael Thurmond: Save the system from taking a nose dive
David Schutten
David Schutten, president of the Organization of DeKalb Educators, wrote a column on the challenges facing new superintendent Michael Thurmond from an educator’s perspective.
His essay will be part of a package in the Sunday op-ed pages on DeKalb Schools. Please check out the entire package Sunday.
By David Schutten
Michael Thurmond is a proven and accomplished leader who has undertaken a daunting, difficult and perilous job as interim superintendent of the DeKalb County School System, a system that appears to be in a tailspin.
Much like the passengers on US Airways Flight 1549 crashing into the cold waters of the Hudson River, I feel as if I am on DeKalb Air Flight 2013 crashing into the granite face of Stone Mountain. In the midst of the tailspin we have switched pilots.
As Stephen Dolinger, president of the Georgia Partnership for Excellence in Education and former Fulton superintendent, stated, Michael Thurmond possesses three of the qualities of a successful Superintendent: 1. Great leadership skills; 2. Political savvy; and, 3. Excellent management skills.
I am personally not bothered by his lack of experience in education. There are examples of great and successful superintendents like the late General John Stanford, who had little or no experience in education before he became the Fulton and later Seattle school chief.
He faces many daunting tasks. The first is leading the school board and the school system off of probation. To accomplish this he must have the full cooperation of the nine members of the DeKalb school board. The board members must learn to work together.
I heard each of them testify before the state Board of Education that they would and could work together to move the system off of probation. However, three weeks later, they were unable to muster a simple majority to elect a chair. What I find disheartening is that Dr. Gene Walker, who remains chair on a 4-3-2 vote, does not recognize this as a symptom of their inability to function as a whole. He and any other board member that do not understand the nature of the problems DeKalb faces should resign immediately.
Employee morale is at an all-time low. We are hemorrhaging good teachers and administrators to other school systems. People can go to some neighboring school systems and receive significantly higher pay checks. DeKalb teachers and other employees are working harder with fewer resources. This is not an easy problem to fix given the current dismal financial state of the school system.
But if something is not done soon, DeKalb will have few veteran teachers left. Employees are making far less than they did five years ago. Couple this with the loss of the Tax Sheltered Annuity promised to employees when DeKalb left the Social Security system, and you have a looming disaster that has already started.
We must find a way to bring class sizes lower. Students, parents, and teachers are frustrated by the increase in class size. Kindergarten classes of 29 without a paraprofessional will result in long-term negative consequences for our children.
Students, parents, and teachers are also frustrated by the myriad of tests to which students are subjected. There needs to be far more time devoted to learning, and far less time devoted to testing.
School administrators must be encouraged and rewarded for using shared decision making. Morale is much higher in those Title 1 Schools where many staff members had input into the Title 1 as opposed to those in which the principal and a few people developed the budget. The knowledge and experience of professional educators must be honored, nurtured, and valued. Encourage people to express their opinions and give suggestions.
We must impress upon students and their parents the importance of coming to school, and coming to school on time. There are too many parents who do not see the importance of this. Also, a little bit of time teaching younger students to become organized will pay off later. Have you looked into the lockers of middle school students recently? Students must also be taught to value their textbooks and other resources. When you walk into many high schools and middle schools, you see text books laying in front of the school, in the hallways, gym, and cafeteria. Parents must play a role in this.
The sooner we realize that young children cannot sit still for long periods of time, and adapt our teaching methods to take this simple fact into account, the more successful they will be. This is another reason class sizes must be lowered. We set up children for failure when we do not give them time to move around. Also, parents must help in teaching children self-discipline. In too many classrooms, one or two students disrupt the learning environment for twenty or more other students.
One issue that is out of the control of anyone in DeKalb is the TKES evaluation system for teachers. The sooner the Georgia Department of Education realizes it is impractical and unworkable, the sooner administrators and teachers can concentrate on delivering quality instruction instead of spending so much time on window dressings such as posting the standards. Is a kindergarten student or first grade student capable of reading them? How is the time spent on this improving instruction? And the evaluations are far too time consuming.
The promotion policies and procedures must be fair and transparent. Former Superintendent Cheryl Atkinson made strides in reducing the nepotism, but questions still haunt the school system about the fairness of promotions. The school councils must be brought back into the process of selecting school administrators. They should not have the final say, but they should have input and the opportunity to meet the candidates. Too often the assignment of school administrators appears arbitrary and capricious. All prospective administrators should be required to be required to take and achieve a high score on a writing test before being eligible for promotion.
Finally, the citizens of DeKalb need to take a break from cynicism, negativity, and constant criticism. It appears that we have a large percentage of people who are hoping leaders, teachers, and students will fail, instead of rooting for them and helping them to succeed. Instead of constantly pointing out what is wrong, take some time to make things right. Stop believing everything you hear. Stop taking everything anonymous bloggers post as the truth. If their opinion has merit, they would be willing to put their real names behind their statements. Volunteer to read to students and tutor them. Help a primary student learn their basic math facts and vocabulary.
It will take everyone in DeKalb to come together to bring the system out of the tailspin in which we find ourselves. We all bear responsibility. Each of us must do our share. If you are not willing to help, stop constantly criticizing those of us who are working each day to make a difference in the lives of DeKalb’s children.
–from Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
167 comments Add your comment
Bernie
February 15th, 2013
7:45 pm
Well david, only time will tell, if michael’s effort will produce the fruits of a successful outcome. Time will also reveal, even the validity of your own asessment in its evaluation. However, you cannot dispute the fact that the hiring of Michael Thurmond violates the spirit as well as the written policy of the hiring job description of any acting or interm Dekalb County School Superintendent. No matter the confidence of your own personal beliefs of the decision of hiring of Michael Thurmond and his ability to get the job done. Does not erase the fact the particular hiring policy pertaining to the required qualifications and Job experience is not being upheld to the written standards already set forth in place by the Dekalb Board of Education Members from a previous board. There is a reason why this policy is in place. it protects the integrity of the Board and the school system management and insures that the school system has the best qualified person available insure the successful operation day to day. Unlike you I am not so willing to forgive such a grievious oversight being made out of expediency. There in lies here a serious potential of this decision of making things worst. If one would to agree with your opinion, I ask of you to consider this question. What if we put an unqualified Teacher without experience in the classroom to Teach your child. Would you have faith in that TEACHER?
Bernie
February 15th, 2013
7:50 pm
These are the requirements set forth for the Deputy Superintendent.
Deputy Superintendent
The Board of Education of DeKalb County (Georgia) School District is seeking a Deputy Superintendent of Student Support and Professional Services. The Deputy Superintendent of Student Support & Professional Services will report to the Superintendent and serves in the second highest tier of administration in the organization; ensures the daily implementation of student support services which are fundamental to the effective and efficient delivery of instructional programs in a large, urban school system; has oversight responsibility for the planning, organization, and coordination of operations of all programs, services, and matters related to the school system’s Division of Student Support Services; assists the Superintendent in ensuring compliance with established Board goals, the school system’s strategic plan, and all legal and procedural requirement attendant to the effective operation of the school system.
Education and Experience:
Minimum of L-6 from a Professional Standards Commission approved accredited college or university is preferred. Minimum of ten (10) years experience as an administrator in a school system setting with demonstrated successful advancement through the instructional support administrative hierarchy required.
Certificate:
Valid Professional Standards Commission approved certified in educational leadership at level L-6 or above is required.
sam123
February 15th, 2013
8:06 pm
David is a former Dekalb county teacher. He know first hand what is needed in the classroom and in the district. He has such a passion for what he does and is very dedicated to his job, president of ODE. ODE is what it is today because of him and his followers. He has always been a voice for teachers…sometimes getting us raises that we deserved.
Private Citizen
February 15th, 2013
8:45 pm
Lee, That’s $81.6k/month, almost a million dollars a year !!!! It should be noted that the Georgia teacher no-protections situation yields a nice little cottage industry on the side for those motivated to go into the business of professional membership groups.
Regarding proper unions, just saw how the european cruise ship industry union has been issuing warning and documentation about faulty life boat release systems and the danger associated with them (i.e. people drowning). Unions are for quality work conditions and safety!! Why does everything in the USA have to be politicised!!!?
Private Citizen
February 15th, 2013
8:49 pm
A comment from the interwebs that I copy-paste-poach re: posting with identity of any kind:
“You have an identity. You have a profile. You act differently because of this. You are aware that anyone can see your profile and will judge you based on it. Some people think this is a good thing, some don’t. Some say this causes better discussion because people are more careful about what they say and others say this limits it. I agree with swrds, many users comment based on how they want to be perceived, not necessarily how they are.”
Private Citizen
February 15th, 2013
8:51 pm
The man bent over his guitar,
A shearsman of sorts. The day was green.
They said, “You have a blue guitar,
You do not play things as they are.”
The man replied, “Things as they are
Are changed upon the blue guitar.”
And they said then, “But play, you must,
A tune beyond us, yet ourselves,
A tune upon the blue guitar
Of things exactly as they are.
KIM
February 15th, 2013
9:35 pm
A little late to the dance here, but why in the world is a blogger still writing about APS and Beverly Hall? Good blogging can really get stale quickly if that continues to be brought up, Ms. Fraud.
AnonMom
February 15th, 2013
9:38 pm
Nothing – nothing — will get better for the children in the system before fiscal audits are undertaken of the money and the “trail” of funds starts to be hauled in and unwound. Personally, I believe that the “power players” really don’t’ want this to happen – they are happy with the funds going to support “pet” projects (jobs/people) and they don’t truly care about the kids (yes, this is cynical) but until policies, procedures and systems are put in place to require that the funds are used to benefit the children nothing will change — ponzis are ponzis and until mechanisms are in place to unwind them and trace the dollars, nothing else will really make a difference. Teachers flee because the money doesn’t make it to their classroom for them for their paychecks or for supplies or for toilet paper for the bathrooms or for copy paper for the copiers…. it’s all rooted in the money. There are systems around the country with much better “checks and balances’ in place to check the money – there are “fail safes” in other systems — for instance that would have had the state step in when the reserves dropped below one month’s worth of operating revenue… The very first thing that needs to happen is a forensic audit. But anytime anyone wants an audit in DCSS it gets supresssed so good luck with that….
bootney farnsworth
February 15th, 2013
9:52 pm
@ beverly
seems interesting to me the sudden increase of people taking issue with you. if you ever needed proof you’re on to something….
whatever
February 15th, 2013
11:32 pm
Shouldn’t the interim Sup. be expected to hold some sort of License by the state PSC. Obviously a Deputy needs experience and an L6. Isn’t there some sort of equivalent standard for an interim?
Bernie
February 16th, 2013
3:22 am
David in referencing your analogy of switching piliot. My question to you should not that piliot be qualified to FLY That plane. or can we just let anyone in first class or coach who are willing to step forward for the very first time and take over flying and to get those passengers safely on the ground at their agreed upon destination?
One would say you are being BETRAYED by your own comments in making this comparison. would you not agree?
Private Citizen
February 16th, 2013
6:52 am
Beverly makes a lot of good sharp observations, but as new discussion topics come along, the hearkening back for the APS situation is a non-sequitor, as the saying goes. People worry about discussion board names. For me it could be Jed, Ned, Nelly, or Shelly. Really makes no difference to me. We should have a little dexterity with use of language?
Just a note, of all of the comments of the last week or so, I would like to call-out, repeat two ideas:
1. the DeKalb situation is indeed about the money, where it goes, turning the checkbook box upside down and dumping it out to what is going on. Maybe Dekalb schools finance needs to take that radio-Dave guy’s “Financial Peace University” where you get rid of all of the dross and straighten the books out.
2. A seasoned and wise teacher commented the main difference from when things were is good is the standardised curriculum where many (especially math teachers?) have to keep moving to cover the assigned content. Point is, if the kids do not know the material or assigned content, the teacher is mandated to move on instead of teaching the kids what they need, in a wholesome way, etc. Ever do any professional travel? I spent about a year traveling in airplanes. Everything turns into a blur. That’s what it must be like for many kids in school who don’t get it and then chapter closed, the next thing comes along. A blur.
3. And to add a third, yes, veteran teachers are getting cleaned out of the system and what remains are people who are particularly physically hardy. I’ve before said, now it seems who has the physical endurance as far as who are teachers. Just an opinion.
Private Citizen
February 16th, 2013
6:57 am
It might be better if Mr. Thurmond did not talk the success words about students and teachers and instead said one thing only: “We’re going to clean out the accounting and finance and where the money is going.” Do one job and do it well. That’s on your side of the fence, Mr. Thurmond. It would be nice if you had your sh– together and stopped pandering or talking about other people. Welcome to a mess and good luck. May your sword be sharp and accurate.
Private Citizen
February 16th, 2013
7:09 am
Mr. Thurmond meets the palace gang: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2rJxmqEIqY#t=41m21s
Chris Murphy
February 16th, 2013
8:30 am
The AJC investigations *were not* the result of anonymous poster’s tips: the reporters who worked on the cheating scandal had exposed other failings of the Hall administration, most notably the E-Rate scandal and the graduation rates/missing drop-outs articles(well before this blog existed). As Hall and those under her kept shoveling numbers that didn’t add up and explanations that had no logic to the inquiring reporters, they kept digging. The cheating scandal was then set up by them using APS numbers vs. statistical assessment formulas that showed the test scores to be (mathematically) incredibly improbable.
I don’t post anonymously, anywhere. I can’t see the sense of it. Reading this blog- and others- only reinforces that. Retaliation? Those who claim that would have to show me that they have ever- *ever*- confronted their particular powers-that-be on *anything.* I would imagine that the anonymous posters here most likely act at work like they do here: whiny dissenting voices in the shadows, with no courage nor any valid ideas about solutions. They’d rather protect their pissant positions, and longed-for pensions, than stand up and be accountable. Tough situations don’t build character- they reveal it.
There are valuable anonymous sources- like at the police station or the district attorney’s office. But do note that these sources are generally part and parcel of the crimes they are informing on- and I consider the anonymous voices here and elsewhere in the same light.
Mary Elizabeth
February 16th, 2013
9:25 am
“Point is, if the kids do not know the material or assigned content, the teacher is mandated to move on instead of teaching the kids what they need, in a wholesome way, etc. Ever do any professional travel? I spent about a year traveling in airplanes. Everything turns into a blur. That’s what it must be like for many kids in school who don’t get it and then chapter closed, the next thing comes along. A blur.”
====================================================
Well said. This instructional design is the opposite of a Mastery Learning instructional design, and it will, eventually, lead to more students who will fail their courses, and more students who will choose to drop-out of school, as a result.
Students must – each and all – be instructed on content and skills where they are individually functioning regardless of grade level demarcations, and, likewise, the rates of learning for each and all students must be individually adjusted if students and school systems are to meet with success.
William Casey
February 16th, 2013
10:11 am
@CHRIS MURPHY: Thank you! You stated it much more eloquently than I could have.
Prof
February 16th, 2013
11:01 am
@ Chris Murphy, Feb. 16, 8:30 am. “I would imagine that the anonymous posters here most likely act at work like they do here: whiny dissenting voices in the shadows, with no courage nor any valid ideas about solutions. They’d rather protect their pissant positions, and longed-for pensions, than stand up and be accountable.”
Oh for Heaven’s sake! You question why people might want to keep their jobs and their pensions rather than express themselves freely on an education blog under their real name? If a person is going to do that, one should really throw away one’s job and future in a way that’s going to make a difference: send a whistle-blower’s email to one’s entire school, with a CC to the State BOE, for example.
I don’t use my name because I have dealings with administrators on University committees that could be jeopardized; I have adult students who might retaliate in some way (I don’t list my address and phone number in my University directory, either); some elitist colleagues would sneer at anyone even reading public blogs; I may not care to reveal to my students my private opinions on issues covered here.
Not everyone is as carefree and footloose as you apparently are. Don’t chastise their choices.
Prof
February 16th, 2013
11:34 am
P.S. I’m aware that if they wished my students could find my home address and phone number, for if persistent enough one can find all public records through Google. But usually a poor grade isn’t enough to create an implacable enemy. However, some of the unbalanced rants that do manage to get through the filter here on Get Schooled are enough to make me want to keep my real name private when I express my opinions.
Chris Murphy
February 16th, 2013
11:35 am
I’ll chastise their choices because they make claims they can’t back up, and hide behind anonymity. Rumor, innuendo and personal attacks have been the rule, not the exception.
If what you’re doing is “sneered at,” either change your posts or change your attitude towards the sneerers. If the posts contain real, credible information- and that has been exceedingly rare- that might “make a difference,” but I doubt any of you anonymous posters make a difference anywhere, except as a payroll item. I think that what you’re really afraid of is your colleagues seeing in print just how inconsequential you really are, adding evidence to suspicions they already have.
If you’ve ever stood up to wrong-doing, incompetence or just bad judgement, having presented a case in a cogent, logical and fact-based way (as opposed to an emotional appeal), you’d know that you become someone to be reckoned with. People like that are not easy to get rid of- they most often leave of their own volition, because others of integrity value them and their professionalism, and hire them. You base your actions on fear, that becomes exactly the way you are treated. Put another way, it’s karma- you reap what you sow.
Beverly Fraud
February 16th, 2013
1:36 pm
ODE is what it is today because of him and his followers
And what would that be? A mute, emasculated voice for teachers, that can never speak with full power because if its inherent conflict of interest wrought by trying to represent teachers and their supervisors?
AlreadySheared
February 16th, 2013
4:14 pm
@Chris, WC:
I also would find it much easier to say “Stand Up! Be Brave!” in a hail of bullets if I myself was wearing body armor. Or if I was standing up inside a tank. If you haven’t noticed the muliple reports of capricious, unprofessional, and petty political acts of retaliation and retribution reported in this [education-centered] blog, then you haven’t been paying attention.
In that vein, WC, I am genuinely puzzled by your request that I refer to your work as dean of students 20 years ago. Were you making non-anonymous, provocative posts on the internet back then? Was that even possible? Or were you sending signed letters critical of your bosses and the educational establishment off to the newspaper for pubulication? I’m not being deliberately obtuse – what is your point?
Beverly Fraud
February 16th, 2013
4:29 pm
“A little late to the dance here, but why in the world is a blogger still writing about APS and Beverly Hall?”
Because it’s instructive KIM. It’s the same reason people bring up the Holocaust and Rwanda. Because those who forget history are condemned to repeat it. And since we are talking about a decade’s worth of academic genocide (and the perpetrators still haven’t been brought to account) it early, far too early to forget it.
William Casey
February 16th, 2013
4:31 pm
Dear Sheared,
I spoke up publicly about the massive cheating going on at the school. Principal Bob Burke fired me as Dean. I returned to the classroom for the last ten years of my career. Best decision I ever made. Your snide remark about the safety of my pension was uncalled for. Once again, what’s YOUR EXCUSE for failure to publicly stand behind your opinions? I think I know but I’ll listen.
Beverly Fraud
February 16th, 2013
4:46 pm
@ Chris Murphy, Feb. 16, 8:30 am. “I would imagine that the anonymous posters here most likely act at work like they do here: whiny dissenting voices in the shadows, with no courage nor any valid ideas about solutions.
@Chris Murphy, I’m glad to see you had the intellectual integrity to qualify your assumptions with words such as, “most likely” and “I would imagine.”
While many posters are perhaps as you describe, let’s not discount the possibility that some who post here have indeed taken attached their name to a stand in the workplace and have indeed had the courage of their convictions to offer valid solutions to systemic dysfunctions.
Private School Guy
February 16th, 2013
5:11 pm
As a long time follower of this blog as well as DeKalb School Watch I have noticed over the years that Mr. Schutten has ben a bit thin skinned when confronted with anonymous criticism. Great leaders let this type of thing roll over them and come out looking better in the long run. Being critical of bloggers comes off as whining. But overall what he says here is on target. Morale is at an all time low and the blogs do work as a release and a sign of hope for many workers. DeKalb needs change and it needs to come fast.
Beverly Fraud
February 16th, 2013
5:12 pm
The AJC investigations *were not* the result of anonymous poster’s tips: the reporters who worked on the cheating scandal had exposed other failings of the Hall administration, most notably the E-Rate scandal and the graduation rates/missing drop-outs articles(well before this blog existed).
@Chris, can you say with 100% certainty that blog postings, tips to reporters, “off the record” conversations and emails with reporters had nothing to do with the AJC’s decision to continue Paul Donsky’s groundbreaking work back in 2001?
Unless you can (to take a page from your handbook) definitively show us that people who blogged, posted, and spoke to reporters off the record had zero influence it’s not unreasonable to assume they do have at least some influence.
Beverly Fraud
February 16th, 2013
5:30 pm
@Chris Murphy a definitive example of how the blogsphere has made a difference.
Back when the ClayCo board was in the news, there was a pointed emphasis on the so-called “MACE affiliated” members of the board. (Strangely enough the majority of the board was “GAE affiliated” but the AJC ignored that.)
What they also ignored was that a GAE affiliated board member used his influence to get a law enforcement official a nice gig as a “bodyguard” for the Superintendent. Unfortunately this official was under investigation for inappropriate actions with minors.
It was shortly after this issue was repeatedly brought up on the old Clayton County blog, that some other ClayCo blogs brought it up and eventually (if memory serves) a local rag started asking questions and eventually the AJC did as well and the guy resigned.
Because of the blogsphere, because anonymous bloggers brought heat to the AJC (despite the anti-MACE slant in the AJC it became impossible to ignore after other media picked up the story from the blogsphere) a possible child sexual predator was removed from a position where he might possibly have had access to children in a school setting.
A definitive example of how anonymous bloggers made a positive difference.
Sure a lot of bloggers spew hot air, and add nothing to the debate; don’t doubt that. But also don’t doubt it can help shine at least some sunlight. Come to think of it, yet another example:
Remember the $73k “secretarial position” that Maureen helped expose in DCSS? Didn’t that start as an (correct me if I’m wrong Maureen) off the record tip in an email to Maureen, knowing full well she had a blog to give it traction?
Beverly Fraud
February 16th, 2013
5:36 pm
Those who claim that would have to show me that they have ever- *ever*- confronted their particular powers-that-be on *anything.*
@Chris you don’t recall the hundreds of teachers who suddenly lost their contracts after testifying in the APS cheating scandal? And when it became public, per the AJC how many of them became suddenly restored?
DeKalb Inside Out
February 16th, 2013
5:40 pm
Schutten said
“We all bear responsibility.”
Is that right? Heads up all teachers, parents and students. If you weren’t aware, each and every one of you are partly responsible for DCSD’s problems. If somebody says “No one is to blame” or “Everyone is to blame”, that person is usually the one to blame.
Private Citizen
February 16th, 2013
5:58 pm
Everybody knows to keep your name out of internet opinion posts, as that stuff is there forever and routinely now for hiring, a search of internet activity is done. Anyone who is telling you to post under your real name is either very naive or is giving bad advice on a known subject. Maybe there is room for a tenured professor of independently wealthy person who has no formal job needs, or else people with real name with their mostly useless gently tea-time commentaries. But anyone, it is pretty well know out there that for regular people to keep your name off casual internet, and for a school teacher required to be a “role model for the community according to community standards” it is completely off the map to advocate posting opinion with name. Ever heard about the Georgia teacher who was fired for posting a photo on personal Facebook of holding up a beer stein while on vacation in another country? Georgia schools are low performing and backwards because Georgia professional teachers not only have no power, they have a deficit of power and are forced to endure harassment rituals in the workplace. Despite whatever hoke-um people say about unions, I’d take a real single professional union with real power to shape the work place any day of the week. For example, enough power to not have to work under people with distance learning “leadership” degrees that are then bosses and tell educated teachers what to do and evaluate them and are paid double what teachers earn. Just today some citizen was telling me “there is so much corruption on government it will never change.” Swell, huh? A real problem solver that person is, huh? With friends like that, school teachers don’t even need enemies. I ran into one of my former students today (now an adult). Told me he is doing well and I did well for him, that I am a good guy, and there was never any trouble in my class and they did their work. So, with a reference like that why am I harassed by a school district admin., stalked by them, and put in writing I need retraining? School districts are run by criminals. They’re deeply rooted, well paid, and not regulated. And when I taught this student, I worked under a really great principal that the student and I both agreed was a #1 great person. Well, the school district ran this principal off and now they work in another state. But that cabal of control-freak highly paid busy-bodies are still pulling their $100k salaries from the tax base. And I thought of another person, good talent, who got brick-walled by the same bunch. Once this person saw they could get nowhere by not being part of their criminal gang, he applied to a very wealthy district in another state. They interviewed 50 people and hired him, he’s now a principal with good job and stability. The first thing he told me over the phone is “Private Citizen, the way it is done in Georgia is NOT how it is done elsewhere.” Bottom line is that there is no one at home at the state level. It’s an empty nest. In another state, the AGs office would clean a lot of this out. In Georgia, the AG is a private law firm to represent select parties. Don’t believe me? Just call up the Georgia AG and ask them what the do. They don’t regulate anything or investigate anything and they’ll tell you so, too. How can DeKalb be hundreds of millions of dollars off the mark and the state regulation is a cuckoo clock with a note on the door “Nobody home.” And then they subcontract their regulation to
Prof
February 16th, 2013
6:00 pm
@ Chris Murphy. Perhaps some of the anonymous bloggers here HAVE “confronted their particular powers-that-be,” and thus know quite well what can happen. I certainly have… writing publicly on an education blog is not worth going through that again.
Prof
February 16th, 2013
7:22 pm
@ William Casey. I think the point is that right NOW there is no cost to you in signing your real name to whatever you post here because you are retired. Your actions in speaking up as Dean 20 years ago were admirable, but were for the specific, justifiable reason that cheating was going on at your school. Signing one’s name to a blog post today is not the same sort of action, and is general and diffuse. Simply put, you had power then, but the blogger here does not now. And Private Citizen’s point is a good one: nothing really dies once it’s put on Internet.
David Schutten
February 16th, 2013
8:07 pm
Please do not confuse my not taking seriously the criticisms if anonymous bloggers with being thin skinned. I simply do not take the anonymous criticism of anyone seriously. If people with whom I worked 25-30 years ago are able to track me down, certainly anyone in DeKalb who disagrees with me can call or e-mail me to chat. DCSS employees, parents and stakeholders do it several times every week. Most decision makers do not even read anonymous blog posts, let alone take them seriously. I will not dispute the fact Dr. Trotter blogs with his real name. However, his base is in another county, and he has few working relationships established with the people in DeKalb who make decisions. In a state in which public school employees are barred from entering into Collective Bargaining agreements, relationships matter. I guess that is why so many non-members and former members of ODE/GAE/NEA contact us when they have to report to Internal Affairs. Of course I understand why employees are afraid to use their real names. But I have never been afraid, and it is why I received a Letter of Redirection 20 years ago when I first came to DeKalb and refused to allow a suspended student on a field trip. Dr. Trotter is correct, discipline is major issue. The media makes it more challenging when any parent is able to get on front of a TV camera with a false accusation without the media verifying the veracity of the accusation. One of GAE’s biggest victories was successfully changing the law so that a public school employee accused of wrong doing has a hearing in front of a Superior Court Judge. How many of you remember the days when a someone could make a false accusation against a teacher or other emoyee and obtain an arrest warrant with no proof to back up the allegation.
Society has changed since DeKalb was one of the best school systems in the country. DeKalb has failed to adapt to the changes. The emphasis on promoting within “The Friends and Family Network” that was acceptable overcthe last two decade instead of promoting the best candidate for the job has only accelerated DeKalb’s descent.
The bottom line remains: If you are not working to improve the educational experience of the 99,000 students, you are a willing participant in the ongoing problem. If you value your opinion, contact me directly.
PSDad
February 17th, 2013
12:03 am
My children attend schools within DCSS. I can send my children to private schools. I choose to send them to public school. I post anonymously to protect them. When I chose to post publicly, it will mean that I have lost faith in the ability of our government to educate my children. My children are fortunate to live within a community that supports its public schools. We will be fine and I could remain quite, but all of our children deserve so much more. For David Schutten to suggest that my (our) criticism of the BOE and DCSS leaders translates into “hoping leaders, teachers, and students will fail” is the purest example of the nasty, self-serving, political bile that has infected our education system. I don’t know who Mr. Schutten is catering to with that statement, but I wonder if our teachers could be better served by a different representative.
Beverly Fraud
February 17th, 2013
4:30 am
“I simply do not take the anonymous criticism of anyone seriously.”
@David, that’s a classic red herring and you know it, because you won’t address criticism of people who do give their name.
You’ve been hiding behind this “anonymous blogger” meme, by dodging the issue of how you can fully represent the best interest of teachers when you also have to represent the best interest of administrators who are abusive to them.
In other words you have to defend the abusive actions of administrators appointed not on merit, but “arbitrarily and capriciously” (your words) This is an inherent conflict of interest; in that you can’t fully represent the best interest of the teacher aggrieved while at the same time represent the best interests of the management.
Example: if a teacher was fired unfairly, and the principal who did it deserves sanction how are you going to fully advocate for justice for the teacher (rehire and sanction for the principal so he/she knows not to try it again) while at the same time try to protect the best interests of the principal not to have a sanction on record?
Can’t be done without compromising the best interest of at least one of the people you represent.
Maybe you thought you could dodge by hiding behind the “anonymous blogger” meme, but now that Dr. John Trotter has come to this blog and pointed this out, what is now your excuse for not addressing it?
In short, your bluff has been called.
Beverly Fraud
February 17th, 2013
4:35 am
I will not dispute the fact Dr. Trotter blogs with his real name.
No you don’t David; you just avoid discussing what others before him have pointed out. Despite your claim of “working relationships” you organization has a built in conflict of interest in that you support teachers and the administrators who violate their legal rights.
How you you fully support both a question I’m sure you are now more than willing to address, since a “name” brought it up.
Beverly Fraud
February 17th, 2013
4:43 am
Please do not confuse my not taking seriously the criticisms if anonymous bloggers with being thin skinned.
Gee David, wonder how people got confused? Wouldn’t have anything to do with your retort that these bloggers stop hiding behind their white robes would it?
Beverly Fraud
February 17th, 2013
7:11 am
By the way do we have any conclusive evidence that those who post anonymously are more factually incorrect that officials such as Crawford Lewis, Beverly Hall, Kathy Augustine, Pat Pope, Cheryl Atkinson and others who have had their real names attached to their statements?
William Casey
February 17th, 2013
7:40 am
@PRIVATE CITIZEN:
February 16th, 2013
5:58 pm
“Everybody knows to keep your name out of internet opinion posts, as that stuff is there forever and routinely now for hiring, a search of internet activity is done. Anyone who is telling you to post under your real name is either very naive or is giving bad advice on a known subject.”
That’s the point. My words are posted forever. I’m proud of them. My son and my friends can read them. Down the road, if I’m wrong about something, I make it right and/or apologize. If I post something stupid, God and everyone will know it. If I have an ax to grind, everyone will know it. If it was good enough for John Hancock, it’s good enough for me.
I’m not going to win this one. I appreciate Maureen’s work and still read her articles but have seriously reduce the time I spend posting here. I’ve quit getting into sports arguments in bars as well. So life goes.
AlreadySheared
February 17th, 2013
9:59 am
@WC,
I salute you for your public stand on academic integrity, and I am glad that its consequences were bearable, and even positive, rather than disastrous for you.
That said, since you have requested my “excuse”, I will reiterate: “If you haven’t noticed the muliple reports of capricious, unprofessional, and petty political acts of retaliation and retribution reported in this [education-centered] blog, then you haven’t been paying attention.
”
@Beverly,
Your comment above raises an interesting question: does the discounting of anonymous opinions constitute a sort of ad hominem attack on same? Certainly, when proferring damaging accusations based on personal experience, anonymity discredits the accuser.
However, when an anonymous blogger offers an analysis/opinion on a public question, I think the offering should stand on its own merits, and not on whether the analysis is ’signed’.
Chris Murphy
February 17th, 2013
10:24 am
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/17/nyregion/online-battle-over-ancient-scrolls-spawns-real-world-consequences.html?ref=nyregion&_r=0
Beverly Fraud
February 17th, 2013
11:23 am
@Beverly,
Your comment above raises an interesting question: does the discounting of anonymous opinions constitute a sort of ad hominem attack on same? Certainly, when proferring damaging accusations based on personal experience, anonymity discredits the accuser.
My point exactly
Beverly Fraud
February 17th, 2013
11:26 am
@Chris this is clearly not just a case of an anon blogger; it’s a case of someone pretending to be someone else.
It’s comparing apples to red herrings.
Prof
February 17th, 2013
11:49 am
@ Chris Murphy. I’ve read your link to the NY Times article, and don’t see how it relates to the present issue of whether bloggers should use anonymous pseudonyms on “Get Schooled.”
It does illustrate how nasty and petty academic scholars can become, rather like courtiers in the Italian Renaissance. The son of a scholar on ancient Gnostic manuscripts felt that his father was slighted by another such scholar with different theories about the manuscripts; and so he created “sock puppets” on various blogs that he also created, attacking the second scholar and creating the impression that a group of academics supported the ideas of the first scholar. This extended to a general scholarly war on those young academics who supported the second scholar. Rather like the poisonings of the Borgias.
But if Maureen is going to register bloggers’ pseudonyms under their IP addresses, then how could these sock puppets be created, anonymous or named? I assume that she won’t allow one IP address to register numerous pseudonyms, or otherwise what’s the point of the registration?
David Schutten
February 17th, 2013
12:14 pm
@Beverly Fraud
Administrators represent less than 5% of ODE/GAE/NEA members. We always provide representation first to the teacher or other employee rather than administrator or supervisor. The fact remains, that other organizations very rarely if ever provide in person representation when employees are called to the Office of Internal Affairs or Area Superintendent’s office. Just ask the teacher who called his organization that does not represent administrators last week and was told they weren’t able to send someone to OIA for his meeting there. The silence and invisibility of the other organization is deafening. (Frequent picketing that translates to little if any change does not count as effective visibility and advocacy.)
Beverly Fraud
February 17th, 2013
12:50 pm
@David, well fair is fair; can no longer say you won’t address the issue of conflict of interest. Though you say 5%, one can’t help but wonder if the 5% have an outsized influence (as they do have more power than the average teacher) Perhaps some teachers will share their experiences here as to whether or not they ever felt “compromised” in representation.
I’ll let “the other organization” address the particulars of the rest of your post, as I have no first hand knowledge of the example you cite (but I suspect overall, they would strongly take issue with the claim they “rarely” provide in person representation to those having to deal with OIR or Area Superintendents)
I do know (because I read it on this blog, and it would be waaay to easy to refute if it weren’t true) that “the other organization” was indeed representing a member when (as they allege) State Senator Ronald Ramsey illegally shut down a grievance hearing. One might say it’s past the time to work in “spirit of cooperation” with DCSS when officials seem willing to openly violate state law.
Perhaps teachers as a whole would be wise, really wise to develop a “fighting mindset” because on way too many fronts, they can be rightly described as being under assault.
Be that as it may, one can’t say you didn’t address the issue. Now if Michael Thurmond will answer some questions, we may be on to something…not holding my breath though.
Dekalbite@David
February 17th, 2013
1:18 pm
“Within one year ODE experienced a dramatic 45% membership growth. Membership has grown steadily for the past seven years. Today we represent approximately 1,700 DeKalb County School System employees including teachers, paraprofessionals, custodians, bus drivers, secretaries, cafeteria workers and administrators. We are now the largest local teachers’ organization in Georgia. We are the Leading Voice for Public Education in DeKalb County, Advocating Excellence in DeKalb Public Schools.”
http://www.odegaenea.org/html/about.html
The AJC quoted your organization as saying teachers did not want outsourcing of custodial personnel. Outsourcing was taken off the table even teachers class sizes increased (poor outcome for students) and teacher compensation was cut (also negative for students since attracting and retaining good teachers is the single most important factor in students achievement). IMHO – Looking at the umbrella of represented employees it is easy to see how cutting, consolidating and outsourcing in the non teaching end is so difficult. The AJC let you speak for teachers and Ramona Tyson got cover as she really didn’t like cutting, consolidating and outsourcing anyway.
Dekalbite
February 17th, 2013
3:41 pm
Are all comments on moderation?
Lee
February 17th, 2013
5:31 pm
Oh good grief, its a freakin’ blog. Doesn’t matter if you use a proper name or “The Wizard of Oz”. We’ve got some trolls, some folks looking for a little back and forth banter, and a few who take themselves waayyy to seriously.
As a general rule, I believe about 1/2 of what I see and about 1/10th of what I read or told. That includes the news media, which gets it wrong far more often than people realize.
To paraphrase Paul Harvey, there is always “the rest of the story.”