Mel Riddile is the associate director for high school services at the National Association of Secondary School Principals. His work in turning around schools in Virginia earned him the 2006 MetLife/NASSP National High School Principal of the Year award. This is his first piece for the AJC Get Schooled blog
By Mel Riddile
To answer a couple of the education questions on the minds of Georgia citizens these days:
Yes, we can expect to see a significant drop in the first year of the new Georgia Performance Standards assessments.
No, the sky is not falling.
But the ground is shifting.
Previous Georgia standards and assessments aimed merely to validate a high school diploma. Nothing more.
The new Georgia Performance Standards, which incorporate the Common Core State Standards, call for a much higher level of student performance as indicators of college-and-career-readiness.
Georgia was one of the first states to adopt the new Common Core standards in English, language arts and math. In fact, the standards were rolled out in 2010 at Peachtree Ridge High School in Suwanee, reflective of the major role of former Gov. Sonny Perdue, a leader in the effort.
The standards are designed to provide teachers and parents with a common understanding of what students are expected to learn at each grade level.
Students will be taking new tests, calibrated to new, higher standards, and assessed on a new scale.
Factor in the short amount of time that Georgia students have been exposed to the GPS, and it becomes clear that the first round of scores should be considered not as a definitive summation of Georgia students’ abilities, but rather as a benchmark for gauging progress toward the standards.
While the results are imminent, we can choose how to react to them. Officials in many of the 45 other states that have adopted higher standards are anticipating that an initial wave of lower scores will give way to higher student performance in the future.
Kentucky, for example, pre-empted the drama months before scores were even available. Kentucky State Education Commissioner Terry Holliday delivered a consistent message that, as he predicted to Education Week, “scores would drop because students taking K-PREP [the new Kentucky assessments] now have to deal with longer, nonfiction reading passages, for example, and exhibit greater ‘technical fluency’ in their comprehension skills.”
My conversations with principals in Kentucky confirm that the message penetrated local communities, and while the nation gasped at the first round of K-PREP results, the state itself steeled for the drop and maintained its focus on improving student performance.
Florida assessments generated similar results, but the reaction was somewhat different. Horrified by the mere 27 percent proficiency rating fourth-graders, the state Board of Education called an emergency meeting, at which they decided to shift the proficiency scale so a much more comfortable 81 percent of students were proficient.
As one parent told the Wall Street Journal, “It calls into question the veracity of the entire enterprise.” Indeed. And worse, it robs Florida students of rigor and authentic assessment.
Of course, reactions will be dictated by agendas. Georgia is one of several states that recently made it easier for for-profit education providers to tap public education funds.
Those providers have a lot to gain from perpetuating the “failing public schools” narrative. Going into the assessments with clear expectations will neutralize those agendas and help us lock our focus where it really matters: Student learning.
–From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
197 comments Add your comment
Beverly Fraud
December 28th, 2012
5:33 am
I wonder if some of the questions Invisible Serfs Collar raises will be addressed? Or will those questions be dismissed as “not important” as the values of honesty and integrity seem to be by so many on this blog?
Cindy Lutenbacher
December 28th, 2012
7:17 am
All of the talk about Common Core and assessments misses many fundamental issues, including the central factor that standardized tests do not measure learning. They are truly worthless to help us determine whether or not kids have learned anything. I won’t argue this point with anyone who hasn’t studied the independent research, for the conclusions are very consistent. Only research conducted or financed by entities with much to gain financially from this vast move to “standardize” everything — supports use of standardized testing assessments.
Cindy Lutenbacher
December 28th, 2012
7:23 am
Beverly Fraud, I just want to let you know that I’ll be ignoring your posts from now on. You seem to have a real investment in the belief that “Either you follow me into the Beverly Hall issue OR you must not care about teachers, Herb Garrett, Joe Paterno, etc–in a word, integrity.”
So long, Beverly Fraud.
Pride and Joy
December 28th, 2012
7:45 am
I appreciated this article and I appreciate this comment “now have to deal with longer, nonfiction reading passages, for example, and exhibit greater ‘technical fluency’ in their comprehension skills.”
Reading comprehension is the most fundamental skill we need and I mean all of us, every technician, doctor, lawyer and McDonald’s grill worker. One has to be able to read and understand what you are reading.
Perhaps now with the new common core standards focusing so much time on this skill, we will actually have more focus on reading comprehension in school instead of whatever political agendas are being shoved onto our children.
I just got wind of a new political agenda. Mary Lin Elementary teachers are now being forced to have two lessons a year teaching bi-racial history. That’s two days taken away from reading comprehension.
History is history. There is no bi-racial history. Our children should study READING, WRITING and ARITHMETIC in elementary school. We shouldn’t even study history nor social studies until the third grade, just as we did when I was a kid.
My children are in private school and they do just that. THey study reading, writing and arithmetic. No social studies and no science until they went to the third grade and they are far ahead of their public school peers.
We need to force the schools to allow the teachers to teach the fundamentals instead of forcing them to teach politics and then grading them on the fundamentals…
That’s not fair to anyone. Not for the teachers nor the students nor the tax paying citizens like me.
AnnieAD
December 28th, 2012
7:51 am
I am with you Cindy.
Dewey Cheatham & Howe
December 28th, 2012
8:14 am
Beverly-
You’ve beat it to death. We get it. Nothings gonna happen. All that stuff is way off topic. Give it a rest.Your ox was gored. We get that. ow move on.
indigo
December 28th, 2012
8:22 am
“reactions will be directed by agendas”
Whites will do signifacantly better than minorities on these tests.
Civil rights leaders will bitterly complain about not having a “level playing field”.
In time, one way or another, standards will be “adjusted” for minorities.
dc
December 28th, 2012
8:28 am
Baffling – seriously – to hear educators say that a test doesn’t measure learning. Don’t you all realize how idiotic that sounds? Given that you use tests every week to measure learning?
It does scare me sometimes to think that this thinking so permeates our eduacracy.
Fred ™
December 28th, 2012
8:43 am
dc: Tests measure KNOWLEDGE not learning. I got straight A’s though school and never learned a thing from a teacher. I slept through my classes……. or read books in the ones that wouldn’t let me sleep. But I had the knowledge to answer the insipid questions on the test………
Fred ™
December 28th, 2012
8:47 am
Is everything in moderation?
Fred ™
December 28th, 2012
8:48 am
LOL typo in the address causes eaten posts……
dc: Tests measure KNOWLEDGE not learning.
redweather
December 28th, 2012
8:49 am
@dc, I share your bafflement. Perhaps the word “standardized” is the problem.
SEE
December 28th, 2012
8:59 am
Actually, I don’t use tests to measure accuracy. I use several performance criteria throughout the week to gauge whether a child has learned a specific concept. For example, day 1 – I review place value and then step further to teach subtraction w/regrouping using manipulatives. I judge who got it and who didn’t. Next day, the students work on it using pictorial representations, while I help the ones who didn’t get it yesterday. I check the work and see who understood this lesson and who needs re-teaching The next lesson involves the abstract method that we all learned. Once again, I do a quick problem or two to see who’s got it and who needs help. When I give a “test”, I already know who has learned it, who almost has it, and who is really struggling. The test is for parents to see how well their child is doing.
crankee-yankee
December 28th, 2012
9:02 am
dc
December 28th, 2012
8:28 am
Yes we give tests and use the results as PART of our overall assessment of a student’s achievement. That, along with portfolios of their work, projects, individual & team participation and other assessments are a much clearer picture of what a student has achieved. A single standardized (i.e. multiple choice, T/F) test is not a true reflection of achievement, only a predictor of future capabilities. Short answer questions, essays, oral reports, etc. are part of the arsenal we use over the course of a grading period to assess, something a standardized test does not and cannot do.
It does scare me sometimes that there are people who think a standardized test is the gold standard in assessment.
Centrist
December 28th, 2012
9:08 am
From the last four paragraphs of the blog above, I guess the conclusion is that since “for-profit education providers [are able to] tap public education funds”, we should follow Florida and “shift the proficiency scale” to make it appear that public education is doing better than it is.
Problems solved.
Michele
December 28th, 2012
9:14 am
I am an avid supporter of the Common Core Standards. As a military brat, I attended 11 different schools in my 12 years of public school. I know for a fact that I missed fundamental instruction at times, and that I duplicated fundamental instruction at other times because of all the differences in curriculum between states and school districts across the country. The common Core curriculum professes to standardize instruction schedules and requirements for all states. This would definitely be an advantage in the mobile society in which we live. The higher level of challenge, if it is truly higher, would also be an advantage. My question comes with the incessant testing in our schools today. There needs to be a way that schools could structure their testing to meet their particular make-up of students. The same test for every child in a school is not realistic. There is no way that you can give the same test to the learning deficient student and the highly gifted student. The tests need to be structured to different groups of students, just as the instructional calendar and technics need to be. We should not become “cookie-cutter” schools.
Progressive Humanist
December 28th, 2012
9:21 am
Cindy @ 7:17: Can you cite some of the independent research that you’re referring to that has been so convincing? I am unaware of research in the field of psychometrics that would lead to that conclusion and would like to examine the research you discussed.
teacher&mom
December 28th, 2012
9:24 am
@dc…”Baffling – seriously – to hear educators say that a test doesn’t measure learning.”
What if you went to the DMV to take the driving test and they required you to take the test in a semi truck or on a motorcycle? Would you consider that fair? What if you studied for the written portion and the test contained several questions regarding airline safety? Would you consider that fair?
Yes, teachers test every week. However, standardized tests do not always align with the standards. Remember the 7th grade social studies CRCT test mess a few years ago?
Are you familiar with Pineapple test question that popped up on the NY 8th grade tests?
http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/talking-pineapple-question-state-exam-stumps-article-1.1064657
How sure are you that Common Core tests do not contain similar flaws?
The GA Physical Science EOCT had to be re-scored this past semester because a test item was thrown out. This is a test that has been in place since 2008 and they are still finding mistakes!
Now do you understand why teachers are hesitant to “embrace” standardized testing as the ultimate indicator of student learning?
Progressive Humanist
December 28th, 2012
9:34 am
Multiple choice tests can and do measure more than simple knowledge and memory, particularly if they are well designed. Measuring learning is a slightly different story, but that can also be done with standardized multiple choice tests. Learning is the change in what students know or in the skills they have mastered, so a single test will not be able to measure learning, as crankee-yankeee suggests. At least two different tests administered at different times are necessary to measure learning. You measure knowledge and/or skills at one time and then you measure the same knowledge and/or skills at another time, and it will give you a rough estimate of the change in students’ skills and knowledge, which is what learning is.
I am an advocate of open-ended questions for the purposes of both learning and assessment, but measuring those types of items is notoriously subjective (yes, even with a rubric). Scoring them for tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of students becomes particularly problematic.
Positive change from current procedures would be welcomed by all involved. However, you’ve got to be able to suggest a more valid, more reliable, more efficient, and more effective alternative, and just eliminating standardized testing is not that solution.
Progressive Humanist
December 28th, 2012
9:39 am
teacher&mom- While you are correct that test items may not always align with standards (which happens less and less frequently), it is far more common that teachers have not taught the standards they were supposed to, and then when the test assesses the students on those standards they are surprised by the items and can’t answer them. They never learned it.
Michael Moore
December 28th, 2012
9:39 am
For Florida and Kentucky (a state that adopted the common core before they were anywhere near finished) the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP) had been telling you the same news for years and Georgia as well (http://nces.ed.gov/nationsreportcard/).
And when I think of Sonny Perdue I certainly think Education Leadership Governor.
Private Citizen
December 28th, 2012
9:44 am
On the Beverly thing, I see her point and the validity in her point. Apparently the superintendent’s association that gave the award will not rescind it. Therefore in the long run, they lose legitimacy and standing.
Common Core: seems like “national standards” to me, basic stuff, and a big improvement for Georgia from that bad home-grown dirt weed they were making everybody smoke, the former “Georgia Standards.” I do not see the connection between “Common Core” and the “tell you how to teach” movement and “put these slogans on the wall” poison.
Pardon, I have not “read the article” and I’ve got to run out the door.
skipper
December 28th, 2012
9:45 am
It is funny, and often sad, too, to see what education has become. There are always the new cures of the day, the latest reasearch, and the education gurus who have all the answers. Many are neglecting some of the (or possibly MOST) of the largest problems.
One is that society has changed. With the breakup of the family, schools have been put in the position of having to raise and train kids in the most elementary fundamentals of behaviour, especially in poorer areas. This is not to say that all poor areas suffer this malady, or that it is only these areas, but by and large that dynamic has held water.
The idea that a teacher could get in trouble for touching a student by breaking up a fight, or that a student can cuss a teacher and next to nothing (or nothing at all) will be done is abominable. Discipline has largely been thrown out the window. The punishment for such behaviour should be swift and sure.
Teachers are spending too much time teaching tests, handling (or living with) discipline problems, and having to be made the scapegoat for every child’s failure. The latest feel-good (code for the overused self-esteem mantra) hypothesis is always around the corner. Perhaps it is time to take a step back and quit coming up with some crud that somebody thinks may be the answer.
How about putting teaching back in the hands of the teachers. How about getting the politics out of local school boards, who in many areas are much more concerned about hiring friends and creating a beaurocracy that would make Washington D.C. blush than actual education. How about holding parents accountable for certain problems instead of subscribing to the “not my baby” syndrome. How about real discipline? How about getting political correctness out, and getting educational values in? Teachers have so much to worry about today in this over-litigating “I’m gettin’ mine” ritual that one slip-up could mean a firing, lawsuit, etc.
A wise old fellow once said “I’m not sure what the answer is, but what we are doing is not working!”
We have taken education and it has morphed into a political football that the beaurocrats keep fumbling. (See the EPA.)
Mary Elizabeth
December 28th, 2012
9:46 am
“Kentucky, for example, pre-empted the drama months before scores were even available. Kentucky State Education Commissioner Terry Holliday delivered a consistent message that, as he predicted to Education Week, ’scores would drop because students taking K-PREP [the new Kentucky assessments] now have to deal with longer, nonfiction reading passages, for example, and exhibit greater ‘technical fluency’ in their comprehension skills.’
My conversations with principals in Kentucky confirm that the message penetrated local communities, and while the nation gasped at the first round of K-PREP results, the state itself steeled for the drop and maintained its focus on improving student performance.”
=====================================================
In all due respect to principals, including most of my former outstanding principals, I have found that few educators (teachers, administrators, national and state educational leaders) grasp fully the fact that students will INVARIABLY function on differing functioning levels – at each grade level – because their intelligence, differing capabilities, and experiential backgrounds will always vary. Until that fact is acknowledged and addressed adequately systematically, some students will continue to fall behind others, and thereby will continue to fail, even with excellent Common Core Standards for each grade level established. Students will invariably learn at differing rates, because of the reasons given above. Educators must wake up to this fact – especially those in the power positions to effect positive change for all students.
EXAMPLE to illustrate this fact concretely from my post “Assessing Teachers and Students,” published on my personal blog, “Mary Elizabeth Sings,” February 25, 2012:
————————————————————————–
“I recognize that the value-added-assessment formula measures not only the student’s progress for the current year, but it measures, also, the probability of the student’s progress based on how much that student had progressed for the past three to five years, on the average, for each year. Thus, if the student achieves less than that average amount of progress for his present year, his present teacher could be rated as a poor instructor. (Other factors, such as a principal’s evaluation through observation are, also, considered.)
However, here is the catch. I was taught, as a graduate student, that if a student is reading within two years of his grade level, that he will be able to function in the reading requirements for that grade level. This means that if a 7th grade student is reading on 5th grade level that he will be able to function in the material for the 7th grade, but if he is reading on 4th grade level or below, in 7th grade, then he will not be able to function on 7th grade material.
Now, in considering the variable of IQ score, Johnny has scored in the IQ range of 83 to 88 for several years. That means that he is probably below average in his innate potential. One could, then, reasonably expect Johnny to grow 7 months in a 12 month period. Let’s say Johnny is in 2nd grade and he is reading on grade level 1.5 which is sufficient for him to function in 2nd grade. Next, he enters 3rd grade and he is reading on 2.2 grade level, having grown 7 months in 2nd grade. Johnny should still be able to learn and grow in 3rd grade because he is not reading more than two years behind 3rd grade level. So, he grows another 7 months in 3rd grade, with good instruction, based on his potential.
Now, we have Johnny in 4th grade and he has advanced in his reading skills to 2.9 grade level, which is within the two year cut off point for being able to master the curriculum for 4th grade. Next year, Johnny is in 5th grade and, having advanced 7 months in a year, he is reading on 3.6 grade level, but he can still cope. The next year, in 6th grade, Johnny is only reading on 4.3 grade level which is barely sufficient for coping with 6th grade material. In 7th grade, Johnny is only reading on 5.0 grade level, and he just barely passes his classes, but he does pass to 8th grade. In 8th grade, he reading on 5.7 grade level. Each year, then, from 2nd grade to 8th grade, Johnny has made his maximum progress which was – based on his IQ potential – 7 months of growth for a year’s work.
Johnny has been promoted to 8th grade because he passed 7th grade curriculum, but he is only reading on 5.7 grade level in the 8th grade, or more than two years behind his grade level. Therefore, although his 8th grade teacher may be a good teacher, Johnny may not advance 7 months in the 8th grade, as before, because he will have been taught on his frustration level during his 8th grade year. Johnny’s teacher was not aware of his IQ scores, nor of his academic developmental history, which had shown how he finally reached an academic frustration point in his 8th grade school year. In fact, Johnny may even regress in his reading skills in 8th grade because he will have spent a year being taught on his frustration level. At the end of his 8th grade year, his reading level may only be 5.5 grade level. When he entered 8th grade, his reading level was 5.7 grade level. His teacher is surprised that she received a poor rating based on Johnny’s 2 months’ regression in his standardized test scores. After all, his previous years’ scores had shown that Johnny could be expected to advance at least 7 months in a year’s time. His teacher does not know why he regressed by 2 months since she had tried so hard to help him grow. Johnny does enter 9th grade, however, because he (barely) passed most of his classes even though he regressed in his standardized reading scores, but now he is only reading on grade level 5.5 in 9th grade, or 3 and 1/2 years behind grade level – a perfect candidate for drop-out status. If teachers had made wise and prudent use of Johnny’s IQ scores, as well as having spent time assessing his developmental history, they might have analyzed his unique needs more wisely, earlier, and they might have provided him with the remediation he needed, earlier, even though he was advancing ‘according to how he had advanced previously.’
If student data continues to be used to evaluate teachers, a factor of data so vital as a student’s IQ must also be weighed, along with his curriculum standardized pretest and posttest scores, if one is to assess – accurately – the effectiveness of a teacher’s instruction, as well as how to instruct, effectively, to each student’s needs.”
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Other factors besides IQ, as I have stated, are operative which will make necessary the continuous addressing of the variances in instructional levels of students within each grade level. The above example was only illustrative of IQ variances. Thus, I am linking another of my posts on my blog, entitled, “Mastery Learning,” (which I have previously linked here) especially for the perusal of Mel Riddle, and other educational leaders who are in positions to create schools which will address effectively the continuous (and variable) progress of students in grades k -12. Until this continuously occurring variability in students is acknowledged and addressed, students will continue to fail – irrespective of our good, though misguided, intentions to improve education. See link below.
http://maryelizabethsings.wordpress.com/2012/01/15/about-education-essay-1-mastery-learning/
Dr. Monica Henson
December 28th, 2012
9:46 am
“Georgia is one of several states that recently made it easier for for-profit education providers to tap public education funds.”
OK, people, let’s go over this once again: Every single public school in this country does business with multiple “for-profit education providers” and pays them with public education funds. EVERY SINGLE ONE.
That aside, I am quite excited about the Common Core Standards and the assessments. At a recent educational leadership conference I attended, the keynote speaker was Sue Gendron, former commissioner of education in Maine. (Incidentally, she is now with the International Center for Leadership in Education, a–gasp!–for-profit education provider.) Sue works with the SMARTER Balance Assessment Consortium, a group of states preparing an integrated assessment system for Common Core. (Georgia is a member of the PARCC consortium.)
Sue offered some sample assessment items for us to get an idea of what students will be facing. One of the math items really opened our eyes. We were presented with a list of numbers–4, 8, 16, 64, 81–and asked which one didn’t belong. Of course most of us answered, “81.” When asked why, we responded that it wasn’t an even number. When she asked, “Why else?” some gave the reason that it wasn’t a multiple of 4. She then asked, “What else doesn’t belong?” surprising those of us who expected that there was one right answer. Some folks answered, “8, because it isn’t a perfect square.”
This was a great example of how students’ thinking can be pushed beyond the simple, single-correct-answer box that so many standardized tests have created. This isn’t something to fear–it’s something to welcome.
Private Citizen
December 28th, 2012
9:47 am
Someone said in a post to look to Kentucky for good things. There’s some guy in Kentucky who knows what’s up. (superintendent? state DOE?)
teacher&mom
December 28th, 2012
9:57 am
@Progressive Humanist: Perhaps the teachers did not teach the standards. However, in my experience, what often happens is teachers run out of time to cover all the standards. This is most likely the case if they have a group of struggling learners or special education students.
So what happens the next year….
The teachers revisit the standards and dissect their test results. They learn to skim over certain standards (a strategy taught by many school reform experts), focus on the “power standards”, and push students through the curriculum in order to cover everything by the end of the year/semester.
This results in student gaps in learning for many struggling students. Mastery learning is a thing of the past because the luxury of time has been eliminated by the need to cover everything by April.
The Common Core will not fix this problem. Instead, the state-to-state comparisons will only lead to more “pushing and shoving” through the curriculum.
Dr. Proud Black Man
December 28th, 2012
10:15 am
I see it took six posts until one of the usual “dog whistlers” shows up.
Cindy Lutenbacher
December 28th, 2012
10:19 am
Yep, dc and redweather, the issue is the multiple-choice, standardized tests. Those are the creatures I ask you to explore via solid research studies conducted about them. The studies span decades and show that the tests reveal little to nothing of value, and they replace far more important teaching, learning, and assessments.
AlreadySheared
December 28th, 2012
10:22 am
“… standardized tests do not measure learning. They are truly worthless to help us determine whether or not kids have learned anything.”
“War is peace, Freedom is slavery, Ignorance is strength.” – Cindy heart Big Brother.
Georgia and education not compatible
December 28th, 2012
10:27 am
Why didn’t Georgia start Common Core for Kindergarten students then phase it in like that? As a parent, it seems that all students started this year behind. How and when do teachers get students up to “standards?”
The sky may not be falling but the ground is doing more than shifting…
Interestingly enough, I’m reading “Wasting Minds: Why our education system is failing and what we can do about it” by Ronald Wolk
As I am reading, I decide to ask my college freshman what she thought of high school…her response, “It was a waste of time because they only taught to the test.” Hmmm…
Even more interesting, my daughter told me that many kids from out of state didn’t take ANY Advanced Placement courses!
As I ponder the future for my remaining high school students, I am coming dangerously close to thinking that public education is full of crap. It doesn’t matter about CCGPS standards, GPS standards, etc…it won’t really help the kids b/c teachers will be required to teach to the test since their evaluations will be tied to these assessments. Colleges will still complain that kids aren’t ready. What’s a parent to do?
teacher&mom
December 28th, 2012
10:29 am
Another viewpoint:
http://www.dailycensored.com/emergency-biscuits-and-the-bill-gates-common-core-imperative/
redweather
December 28th, 2012
10:43 am
@Cindy Lutenbacher, “Yep, dc and redweather, the issue is the multiple-choice, standardized tests. Those are the creatures I ask you to explore via solid research studies conducted about them. The studies span decades and show that the tests reveal little to nothing of value, and they replace far more important teaching, learning, and assessments.”
Which solid research studies exactly?
And for the record, I am not a proponent of standardized tests per se, nor am I willing to reject them out of hand as utterly worthless.
redweather
December 28th, 2012
11:01 am
This link http://fairtest.org/facts/whatwron.htm is the sort of thing that many people rely on when criticizing multiple-choice tests. It would be much more persuasive if these Fair Test Fact Sheets contained some citations to authority.
bu2
December 28th, 2012
11:03 am
We have large numbers of students failing, so we are going to raise the standards even higher? I fear we are asking to much at too young an age. 3rd graders are doing math that we did in junior high. Large amounts of material get covered in very short periods. And we spend 4 or 5 weeks a year on standardized testing, reducing the amount of time teaching.
Before figuring out what we want the students to learn and plugging it into the 12 years, we need to make sure we understand what children can learn and at what ages.
redweather
December 28th, 2012
11:03 am
This link http://apcentral.collegeboard.com/apc/members/courses/teachers_corner/40990.html will no doubt be rejected because it appears on the CollegeBoard website.
AlreadySheared
December 28th, 2012
11:05 am
@redweather,
Despite the bleats of eduzealots like Ms. Lutenbacher, hundreds (thousands?) of universities continue to use standardized, multiple-guess tests like the SAT and ACT to help them predict the academic performance of the freshmen they admit.
1) Her gross obtuseness in this regard makes me question the value of any dialogue you might have with her.
2) On average (I repeat ON AVERAGE), education majors currently score lower on the above tests than other professions. Aesop’s story about the fox and the grapes comes to mind.
“Driven by hunger, a fox tried to reach some grapes hanging high on the vine but was unable to, although he leaped with all his strength. As he went away, the fox remarked, ‘Oh, you aren’t even ripe yet! I don’t need any sour grapes.’ People who speak disparagingly of things that they cannot attain would do well to apply this story to themselves.”
bu2
December 28th, 2012
11:11 am
@redweather
Sounds like the person writing that always did terrible on standardized tests, but their teachers liked them. That article encourages subjective evaluations which any study shows are dramatically impacted by the measurer’s relation to the subject. If you like workplace performance evaluations, you would love this person’s suggestions for evaluating students.
bu2
December 28th, 2012
11:16 am
We spend way too much time on standardized tests and make them too “high stakes.” But they are useful tools that do tell you things. They tell me a lot more about my children’s progress than report cards, as easy as it is to get an “A” or “B” nowadays. They are subjective and, if well designed (that probably rules out Georgia’s attempt to re-invent the wheel-CRCT), can measure a lot of things the linked fair test article says it does poorly.
Middle School teacher
December 28th, 2012
11:18 am
Are multiple choice tests perfect? No. But given the alternatives, they are an efficient way of administering assessments. We use them not only for assessing content knowledge in the classrooms, CRCT and EOCT, but also for larger scale tests like the ITBS, SAT, ACT, GRE, LSAT and aptitude tests for entrance into the armed forces (some of these are norm-referenced and not standards referenced). This has been done since the 1940’s. Would it be more ideal to asses students using a long form written or even oral exam? Sure. But the costs and time involved (not to mention the lack of objectivity) are significantly higher. The new PARC tests that will be used for Common Core assessments will contain written portions (also called performance tasks)- so it seems test makers are at least trying to construct more balanced assessments that measure a student’s ability to process and manipulate information, not just memorize it. But it will take time to re-condition students to take standardized tests that are more rigorous.
I agree that the better way to measure what students have learned in the school year is to capture the differential (by using a pre-test at the beginning of the year and comparing this to the post-test at the end). However, I do not think the standardized tests at the end of the year are totally worthless. They do provide some valuable feedback and it doesn’t make sense to throw the baby out with the bath water by discounting their value and validity altogether. Most teachers know the limitations of the test scores and use them as best they can to try to reach students who need extra help and as an overall gauge of their students’ background knowledge. Students who do not meet the standards in gateway years (at my school at least) are given intensive remediation and then re-tested – at which time most of them pass. Some students will never meet the standards and that is what we have to accept as a statistical fact.
bootney farnsworth
December 28th, 2012
11:22 am
I gotta be honest. as soon as she touted Sonny as a leader in anything to do with education, I stopped reading.
bootney farnsworth
December 28th, 2012
11:39 am
common core
common cause
common cold
its all pointless until the real issues of corruption and bloat at the top are dealt with
Pride and Joy
December 28th, 2012
11:43 am
About standardized testing, I disagree that “They are truly worthless to help us determine whether or not kids have learned anything.”
Standardized tests measure reading comprehension very well. One reads a passage and answers multiple choice questions based on the information in the text. They are incredibly easy for anyone who can read and comprehend what they are reading, which is THE MOST fundamental skill every human being needs to learn.
Think about all the things we do daily that require us to read, comprehend and perform: Giving medicine — we have to read the directions on the back of all over the counter medicine —
Every contract we sign, even a simple lease or a contract to buy or lease a car.
Cooking — read the recipe and follow the directions. All these very simple things we need to do everyday and we need to know how to read, understand what we read and be able to perform based on that understanding.
Standardized tests measure reading comprehension extremely well and it is perfectly suited to measure it.
Georgia
December 28th, 2012
11:44 am
Testing Stifles Teaching. It requires a third party observer to judge the same learning curve that the Teacher and Student are creating. Thus a behavioral spectrum emerges and thus everyone is right and everyone is wrong, but at least all 100% try to sell their spam on blogdom. If you click on any of the links here you automatically are contributing to and causing the commercial spam cloud of stink that exists like some gas bubble that din’t get enough motherin’. I dont appreciate it and I know others dont neither nor. TestingRus? Let the students test the teachers for a couple semesters. Lets shake it up. Lets change the curriculum and produce uberkinters! They’ll know what to do with those tests. As a supporter of PTA projects all year long, I demand the resignation of every educator involved NASSP’s neglectfully-juvenile acts of truancy. They are a menace to any just resource allocation, and a scourge to civilization.
Mikey D.
December 28th, 2012
11:46 am
“I gotta be honest. as soon as she touted Sonny as a leader in anything to do with education, I stopped reading.”
+ 1,000!
Has there ever been a worse governor for education in Georgia? Complete waste of space, completely devoid of any leadership qualities, for 8 years! But, he sure knew how to build a fishin’ pond, huh?
Progressive Humanist
December 28th, 2012
12:10 pm
Cindy Lutenbacher @ 10:19:
Again, I’d ask you to cite at least a couple of the “solid research studies” you’re referring to. Redweather has made the same request. I’m a bit skeptical of your claims, but if you can cite the studies we can examine them. Without you being able to cite at least a handful, we’d have to question whether you have really “studied the independent research” yourself. What journals were the studies published in? Were they peer reviewed? Who were the researchers? You’re going to have to support your argument better.
Assessment is a complex field, and you seem to be confusing different constructs. Measuring learning (growth) is a bit different from measuring knowledge, which is a bit different from measuring skills, and they can all be measured with different types of assessments. Your assertion that tests can’t measure learning appears to be too broad and too simplistic. How would you, someone who has studied the independent research, actually measure learning in a valid and reliable way?
Pride and Joy
December 28th, 2012
12:16 pm
indigo, I wish your predictions weren’t true, but based on fifty years of GA education, I agree with you.
paulo977
December 28th, 2012
12:26 pm
Cindy L …”All of the talk about Common Core and assessments misses many fundamental issues, including the central factor that standardized tests do not measure learning. They are truly worthless to help us determine whether or not kids have learned anything”
___________________________________________________________
Cindy ,……….Of course he won’t read it himself , but ,do you think you could write this to the president whose Secretary of Ed. seems to think Standards etc are all we need to improve education!!!…
williebkind
December 28th, 2012
12:32 pm
“and exhibit greater ‘technical fluency’ in their comprehension skills.’”
A liberals nightmare.
teacherwantingachange
December 28th, 2012
12:41 pm
No amount of group work and “differentiated instruction” will compensate for students’ inability to read. Students in the earlier grades may be tested too much. But no one appears to be asking the right questions. What happens to these standardized test results?
Why does Dekalb even administer the IOWAs when it appears to ignore that data? And what, specifically, does Dekalb do with the CRCT data? I’ve asked and asked and asked what happens to that 20-50% of students lacking reading, social studies, science, or math proficiency. From what I’ve learned, nothing. They’re “passed along” and then the high school teachers are expected to “differentiate instruction” in classes with 35+ students.
And teachers will be evaluated according to student growth, but no one seems to be able to explain the following:
1. How are the benchmarks and SLOs valid tests? Who has vetted and standardized them?
2. If students are taught that assignments are only important when there is a grade attached to them (look at Dekalb’s cumbersome grading categories to see just how much this idea is promoted), then what is the incentive for a student to take a test far above his level (no one wants to talk about the lexile scores)? Has Dekalb examined the data to see how long students even spend taking these tests?
3. How are a district’s administrators evaluated? Dekalb’s touted curricula units are an embarrassment with little to nothing that is print-friendly, especially in the areas of “research-based strategies” and “differentiated instruction.”
And if standardized tests are a reality of college students’ lives- from the SAT to the ACT to the GRE to entrance exams and career tests- and students are purportedly preparing for college, then what should be done?
Cindy Lutenbacher
December 28th, 2012
12:42 pm
A number of things here:
Do I have my own bibliography about standardized testing? No. But I have read and read and read studies on the issue for a couple of decades now, including studies funded by ETS and ilk. Redweather, if you dig deeply enough, you’ll find that Fairtest does cite scholarly articles. So do scholars like Stephen Krashen. And activist/teachers like Susan Ohanian. And scholars like Brian Huot and the late Gerald Bracey. And scholar/activists like Alfie Kohn. Et cetera. And, you’re correct; I don’t trust tobacco companies to do rigorous research on the ill-effects of smoking; GA just received some major bucks (didn’t we?) from tobacco company lawsuits because the tobacco industry was horribly devious in its “research” about smoking. Likewise, I don’t trust the corporations (profit or so-called non-profit) who have billions to gain from the wholesale use of their materials; they fund research that they then cite.
Bracey, Krashen, Ohanian, and the multitudes like them have little to nothing to gain from their labors except the possibility of better education for their/our kids.
I am one who actually scored extremely high on standardized tests; my master’s and doctorate (not in education) were entirely paid for in scholarships because I looked smarter than I think I am–due to standardized test scores. The only score I remember is my GRE math score: 780 out of 800. Okay, so that was back in the 80s before I began to investigate standardized testing and discovered what a nightmare it is.
And yes, colleges and universities are slow in letting go of standardized testing, but at last count, I think the number of U.S. institutions of higher ed that are letting go of reliance upon said testing is over 850. Study after study shows that the GPA in high school is a much better predictor of college success than standardized test scores.
I do believe our discussions would go further if we could all try to avoid making assumptions about the writers and try to deal with what is written.
redweather
December 28th, 2012
1:22 pm
I have not made any assumptions about you, I just wanted you to name a few names, which you have finally done. Much obliged.
Progressive Humanist
December 28th, 2012
1:44 pm
Cindy-
Those sources are not particularly strong ones. Krashen, while a very influential professor, is a linguist and more of sociologist. He wasn’t trained and doesn’t publish in the fields in psychometrics, psychology, or educational measurement. Huot is an English professor, and while he is qualified to teach and assess writing, he’s not qualified in cognitive psychology (the construct of learning). It’s doubtful that he ever had the quantitative or empirical training to understand the science of learning or its measurement. English professors do not generally conduct empirical research. Ohanian seems even less qualified. I enjoy Kohn’s writing quite a bit, but he reviews research; he does not conduct it. Bracy, a developmental psychologist, was the only one who appears really qualified to address the concepts of learning and the measurement of it through research. So it seems like you have been basing your views more on commentary than on research.
My understanding is that the SAT and ACT are very accurate in predicting college students’ success during their first two years, but not so much at predicting college graduation. This is logical, though, because those tests assess mainly verbal and quantitative skills, and during students’ first two years they are taking core classes that are heavy in those skills. It makes sense that those tests would correlate with the first two years of college but show little correlation to achievement after that when students are studying material more specific to their majors.
But the question remains, if you assert that tests cannot measure learning, then how should it be measured? Are you saying that it can’t be measured?
Sandy Springs Parent
December 28th, 2012
2:24 pm
It continues to amaze me how many Georgia teachers are scared to death about the common core. Are the scared that it will expose even more how backward and off course the GA educational system is. I really think that they are.
If you do just a little bit of research, a few google hits. You find that 47 or so States are on board. These inclued the top State Mass. along with perinial winners like New York State. When you go deeper you will see that the High School evaluations are basically the New York State Regent Exams.
I was not ultra nerd in the class. In fact I underperformed my first two years in High School to be accepted as cool. My Junior year I had a “Welcome Back Kotter” type of History teacher, who got up and ran off on tangents, about the future magalopolsis’ of “BoWash”. Which sites in the country might be next cold war targets, this was 35 years ago. I ended up getting the highest grade on the New York State Regent’s exam in 1977, in History. The Regents exam is part multiple choice and part essay. What is the fear that the teachers actually will have to grade the essays.
The biggest thing that will be found that will not work with common core is this stupid one track, to graduation that Georgia has will not work. There must be multiple tracts at least by high school. One of those tracts must include a General Diploma with Vocational Education ( Carpentry, Auto Mechanic’s , Plumbing, Basic Machinest Skills, Welding, Culinary, Nurses Aide, Medical Transcription ) The High Schools can provide in the Votech school what the For -Profit midnight advertiserts, ripoff schools provide here for free. Graduation Rates will skyrocket to 90-95%. Change the Math and Science requirements to meet what is required for these Vo-tech jobs. These Jobs should be coordinated with the employeers and employers looking to come into the state.
Teams should even start to consider what are the career aptitutude of students in middle school. Private School already do this. Parents pay several thousand dollars more for their students at Woodward that need extra attention, and may not be college bound like siblings. All Students should rotate through 13 week trials in middle school. I remember 13 weeks of French and 13 week of German ( no spanish offered 40 years ago). My 12 year old often complains that so many kids in her Spanish class don’t want to be their, and disrupt the class, even the native speakers. Where she loves Spanish and is almost Fluent. The other offerings are French and Manderan Chinese, but their is no tryout. I tell her it is because their parents have picked it for them. My other daughter switched to French in 9th grade, Spanish wasn’t for her.)
Another thing that must change for this to be successful we must get rid of these wasteful mega districts. Please GA House and Senate, get rid of just a few little words in the constitution. We need to allow more local control. We need 1-2 high school with feeder school Districts. They work. They are the ones that have made the Common Core Successful in top states. We do not need middle layers of mid management, for Friends and Family, for Church Members, for Soriety Sisters of the Pink and Green. We do not need huge contracts going to the politically connected. Allow Sandy Springs to have a Riverwood -North Springs District. Allow Dunwoody to have a Dunwoody District. Allow Brookhaven and Chamblee to have a Chamblee and Crosskeys District. Allow Tucker to be Tucker. Why should Marietta, Decatur, Bremen City and Buford, be the only ones who get Districts who operate as they should. Counties should not be in the Operation of School Districts. Buckhead should have North Atlanta and its Feeders. Morningside and Inman Park should have Grady/Inman Park. We don’t need county job palaces.
Cindy Lutenbacher
December 28th, 2012
2:34 pm
Dear Progressive,
You are correct in your labels of the voices I cite, but they are scholars with deep training and understanding that they have quite aptly applied to this issue. Furthermore, because learning is a complex issue, psychometrics and psychology have only partial wisdom as well. I also speak as one with a psychology degree (albeit 1975, Vanderbilt).
My understanding is that the standardized tests have greater correlation with student scores in first-year student scores, but not as high a correlation as GPA. Standardized test scores correlate most securely with the financial wealth of students’ parents.
I do appreciate your thoughtful response, and I do wish that you and others would always leave IN the word “standardized” when responding to my posts about such testing. Although I prefer to avoid tests as much as possible in my teaching, I don’t disparage them for all assessments. I simply challenge myself and other teachers to create our classes to include authentic assessments as much as possible. I associate authentic assessment with things like real-world tasks that have actual meaning. For example, my colleagues in the business department require students to create things like business plans and economy models that can actually be used. Colleagues in sociology get students studying social issues and creating possible solutions, working with groups in the community to grapple creatively with making our city and world better places. As an English teacher, I’ve taught for over a quarter century, but I constantly struggle with authentic assessments of writing; the best assessment I’ve come up with so far is a semester-long family/community portfolio project that revolves around a variety of research and writing assignments–the portfolio becomes a gift that students may give to their families. By the end of the semester, I’ve seen the vast majority of students truly excited by the project (no matter how much they may have complained during the semester) because its components are things they they have researched and that actually mean something to them and their families. But my ideas are far from the be-all/end-all! That’s the reason I continually struggle to do teaching and assessing better.
We have to be creative with our teaching and assessing. Standardized tests and the high stakes placed upon them by all the administrations since the 1980s are requiring such absurd demands upon teachers that they are replacing actual teaching and learning. As long as teachers are required to give over so much of their years to standardized testing and test-prep (as we constantly hear from K-12 posters in this blog, alone), then they will never even have the chance to be the creative teachers our kids need and deserve.
Cindy Lutenbacher
December 28th, 2012
2:42 pm
@redweather,
Sorry–I wasn’t responding to you about the “assumptions” piece. Another poster got me side-tracked with that one. I generally find your postings to be thoughtful and helpful.
I gave you some of my sources, but there’s so much more to be seen out there, and that’s what I’ve tried to encourage folks to do: go after the question for yourselves, dig deeply, and review independent research. Do so for many, many years.
We may still come up with different responses to these issues, and that’s what thoughtful discussion is for. Or so I hope.
I’m also sorry if it seems that I sometimes wait a long while to respond. I’m a single, working parent, so, like many of us on this blog, I come to it in snips and snatches.
Cindy Lutenbacher
December 28th, 2012
2:49 pm
@ Paulo77
Have done so. Many, many times. I’m furious that Arne Duncan is in that position. But that’s another subject.
say what?
December 28th, 2012
3:37 pm
Sandy spring parent, with these new standards, your “Welcome back Kotter” style teacher would be shown the door. Teacher creativity is limited because of testing testing testing.
There should be a pre- test at start of year based on what will be taught during the year, then the same test is giving as a post- test at year’s end to measure potential educational growth.
I as a parent recognize that all standards can it be adequately covered in class during the 160-180 days of school in this state. not all can be done by educators, politicians,teachers, administrators.
Only if we could get parents willing to take these same pre/ post test, so that they cAn become more engaged.
paulo977
December 28th, 2012
3:39 pm
Mary E ….Do have a look at this…
http://www.education.com/reference/article/cultural-deficit-model/
Truth in Moderation
December 28th, 2012
4:24 pm
Eva Baker, “queen of psychometrics” at UCLA/CRESST, lays out her ideas on 21st Century assessments. Note the SHE INCLUDES BLOOM’S AFFECTIVE DOMAIN!
“Assessment Design for the 21st Century
Starts with key elements of performance—what and how students learn and what are a range of desirable attributes, accomplishments and skills
1. 21st Century Skills or cognitive demands
2. Content domain represented in an ontology
3. Blend skills and content together
4. Incorporate in tasks and tests”
“Three: Blending cognitive-ontology architecture”
•
“The ontology is an integrative frame for a database
• 21st Century Skills: problem-solving, reasoning, communication
• Knowledge: declarative/conceptual/procedural/factual for content and age ranges of choice
• Alternative formats and technical quality data
• Affective behaviors
• Alternative learning sequences, schemata
• Situations for learning & transfer
• Data accessed by separate or combined metatags”
http://www.cse.ucla.edu/products/overheads/OTHER_12/eva%20best%20japan1017V5.pdf
Pride and Joy
December 28th, 2012
6:24 pm
Cindy says test scores are tied to parent wealth. My parents came from dirt poor. I mean, on one side, they were literally cotton farmers scratching out a living and on the other side they were scrubbing hospital floors as a second job to put shoes on their kids’ feet. My parents NEVER got involved in my school work — I wasn’t read to, no one signed my home work. No one encouraged me.
I vaguely understood that education was a ticket out of the chicken farm and I took it. I didnt’ know a darn thing about college or even how to apply. I never even knew what an ACT test was until a couple of weeks before I took it — and made a 27 — on every subject. I went to a poor high school in the South.
So, I am not buying that song and dance that a parent’s income determines a child’s academic success.
And let’s get real here about cause and effect.
Poverty is often caused by bad choices. If you choose to have a child at 15 you will most likely live a life of poverty and drag your innocent kids down in it.
If you choose to knock up your girlgriend and walk off and leave her and your child fatherless and penniless, you create more poverty.
This isn’t rocket science.
In the USA, education can cure poverty in one generation or less. Education here is free for the poor. FREE. School libraries have books for FREE.
What mamas and daddies need to do is make sure they are EMPLOYED ADULTS before they become mamas and daddies and that they put more emphasis on reading than they do on sports and their personal appearance.
Beverly Fraud
December 28th, 2012
8:47 pm
“On the Beverly thing, I see her point and the validity in her point. Apparently the superintendent’s association that gave the award will not rescind it. Therefore in the long run, they lose legitimacy and standing”
Yet it apparently bothers educators more that I make a valid point about injustice than it does it actually occurred, and is still ongoing..
Know this then by your silence:
As teaching conditions continue to deteriorate, as you find yourselves increasingly burdened and decreasingly supported, know that you, by your unwillingness to address issues of integrity, are active co-creators in these conditions and as a logical, natural consequence, you are getting the teaching profession you richly and fully deserve
Come back five years from now and say “Oh teachers are being treated with better conditions and respect than they ever have” and I be the first to admit I was wrong.
Beverly Fraud
December 28th, 2012
9:34 pm
“Beverly-
You’ve beat it to death. We get it. Nothings gonna happen.”
Apparently not; and it’s a damning indictment of Georgia teachers that they would sit blithely by while an organization continues to honor someone who was as anti-teacher, and ultimately as anti-children as one could get.
Is it any wonder such a multitude of forces feel fully empowered to denigrate teachers, when teachers themselves apparently lack the mindset to challenge “educational leaders” regardless of how disrespectful their actions are to the classroom teacher?
No rescinding the award won’t change life in the classroom; but the moral and ethical mindset that would demand it be rescinded could change things, both for teachers and the students they claim to care about.
Mark my words: With the mindset that would allow such an insult to go unchallenged, five years from now I sincerely doubt the overwhelming majority of teachers will be able to say “Oh my, teaching conditions have gotten so much better!”
If they do, I’ll be the first to admit I was wrong.
True Blue
December 28th, 2012
9:43 pm
I couldn’t agree more with all of the comments made by Beverly Fraud. The lack of leadership at all levels in APE is astonishing.
bootney farnsworth
December 28th, 2012
10:16 pm
@ beverly
the surest sign you’re on point is the steeped up criticism of you making the point.
Beverly Fraud
December 28th, 2012
10:45 pm
Amen to that bootney…and here’s a quote from Diane Ravitch on Common Core. But before that (so much for me not commenting on topic LOL}
Notice bootney no one could explain why, if the IOC rescinded Marion Jones’ medals, the Tour de France vacated Lance Armstrong’s 7 titles, the Pulitzer folks rescinded Janet Cooke’s award for fabricating the prize winning story, the GSSA shouldn’t be held to just as high a standard as those other organizations given that GSSA honored the Milli Vanlli of education?
No they will “ignore” the messenger and dismiss the messenger. Heck I guess absent any effective rebuttal I would to. Kinda like APS tried to do when they had no legitimate reason for the statistical anomalies in test scores? Hmm…
If you pay attention to the Common Core State Standards as required by the authors, (verbatim treatment, no menu-like choices, close reading), you will see that Mr. [David] Coleman and others expect all students to meet 1158 lteracy and ELA standards K-12 (that total includes parts a,b,c,,d, and so on for each standard).Kindergarten kids and their teachers have 64 “college and career ready (CCR) standards to meet.
A five year old has 64 “college and career” standards to meet? And yet you have those here who just go blithely along, accepting the Common Core like it’s the second coming of the Hale-Bopp comet. (Ohh, but this time it’s for real!)
Why does one get the feeling if Diane Ravitch was head of GSSA, she would definitely rescind the award?
Georgia and education not compatible
December 28th, 2012
11:51 pm
@ Beverly Fraud, your statement:
“If you pay attention to the Common Core State Standards as required by the authors, (verbatim treatment, no menu-like choices, close reading), you will see that Mr. [David] Coleman and others expect all students to meet 1158 lteracy and ELA standards K-12 (that total includes parts a,b,c,,d, and so on for each standard).Kindergarten kids and their teachers have 64 “college and career ready (CCR) standards to meet.
A five year old has 64 “college and career” standards to meet? And yet you have those here who just go blithely along, accepting the Common Core like it’s the second coming of the Hale-Bopp comet. (Ohh, but this time it’s for real!)”
I agree 100%.
Dr. John Trotter
December 29th, 2012
12:31 am
@ Beverly Fraud: I have been away from this blog the last couple of days. But, I see that you are continuing to hit the nail on the head, and educrats like Cindy seem to be inexplicably bothered that you are putting the obvious scandal right in their faces. Hmm. I agree with on this topic. Herb Garrett and his superintendents’ organization ought to take back the phony award given to Beverly Hall. It is a joke. Why aren’t the GSSA’s standard’s at least as high as the U. S. Olympics’s or Penn State’s? Lance Armstrong is stripped of his titles, but, no, GSSA continues to honor Beverly Hall who sat over the largest school cheating scandal in the U. S. History. I personally have encountered and know many, many educators who suffered much (by way of health and finances) from the totalitarian regime of the Hall Administration. It was an insufferable administration which rewarded those who went along with the program and apparently punished those who spoke out against corruption. The AJC is obviously conflicted here, though it did indeed shed much light on the corruption after much damage was already done. But, I still tip my hat to the AJC for finally coming out on the right side. Perhaps it will eventually do the same on this issue. At least, I hope that it will.
Pay no attention to the Cindys of the world. Perhaps your very perceptive and persistent posts simply dwarf the drones of her blathering about her so-called expertise on standardized testing. Or perhaps this isn’t her real name. She might even be Herb Garrett’s secretary. Ha!
Has Cindy and the other rather squeamish critics never learned to use the scrolling device on their computers? When I don’t want to read something, I simply scroll past it. I don’t waste any time trying to get the other poster from posting. This sounds like a backa$sword censorship…or perhaps a severe case of insecurities. Just scroll, Cindy, just scroll.
Dr. John Trotter
December 29th, 2012
12:33 am
@ Beverly Fraud: I have been away from this blog the last couple of days. But, I see that you are continuing to hit the nail on the head, and educrats like Cindy seem to be inexplicably bothered that you are putting the obvious scandal right in their faces. Hmm. I agree with on this topic. Herb Garrett and his superintendents’ organization ought to take back the phony award given to Beverly Hall. It is a joke. Why aren’t the GSSA’s standard’s at least as high as the U. S. Olympics’s or Penn State’s? Lance Armstrong is stripped of his titles, but, no, GSSA continues to honor Beverly Hall who sat over the largest school cheating scandal in the U. S. History. I personally have encountered and know many, many educators who suffered much (by way of health and finances) from the totalitarian regime of the Hall Administration. It was an insufferable administration which rewarded those who went along with the program and apparently punished those who spoke out against corruption. The AJC is obviously conflicted here, though it did indeed shed much light on the corruption after much damage was already done. But, I still tip my hat to the AJC for finally coming out on the right side. Perhaps it will eventually do the same on this issue. At least, I hope that it will.
Pay no attention to the Cindys of the world. Perhaps your very perceptive and persistent posts simply dwarf the drones of her blathering about her so-called expertise on standardized testing. Or perhaps this isn’t her real name. She might even be Herb Garrett’s secretary. Ha!
Has Cindy and the other rather squeamish critics never learned to use the scrolling device on their computers? When I don’t want to read something, I simply scroll past it. I don’t waste any time trying to get the other poster from posting. This sounds like a backa$sword censorship…or perhaps a severe case of insecurities. Just scroll, Cindy, just scroll. Cindy, I am sorry to have to get on your case, but just let others’ write without trying to tell them what to say or what NOT to say, OK?
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2012
4:15 am
Thank you Dr. T! “Inexplicably” is the word I would use as well. I know teachers and educators aren’t this way, but collectively it’s like they have a case of Stockholm Syndrome
You know…Paul Donsky did the original story back in 2001. Yes 2001. What if you and MACE had taken Cindy’s and the other bloggers” advice (namely “it happened long ago” and “give it a rest”) and just stopped talking about APS?
What if everybody had followed that advice? What would have happened most likely is Beverly Hall would have ridden off into the sunset, but the corporate culture of widespread, systemic cheating would have remained hidden
And if it had remained hidden, I imagine you’d have posters who to this day (if Hall had indeed pulled it off) who would say “She left years ago; give it a rest”
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2012
4:27 am
@compatible the first paragraph is Diane Ravitch’s
teacher&mom
December 29th, 2012
8:03 am
@Beverly: You are right to question why GSSA won’t rescind the award.
My guess?
In education, fellow/former administrators have a very hard time holding other administrators accountable. I’ve been told several times that I have no understanding or appreciation of the difficulties of an administrator, therefore, I do not have the right to question their judgement. Ultimately the blame is ALWAYS passed on to the classroom teacher. Somehow, someway, the fault never lies with the leadership.
That attitude is why the professional organizations in this state will not admit the truth and formally criticize Beverly Hall for her actions. They refuse to admit they made a mistake. Deep down inside, they blame the teachers.
We can adopt Common Core, we can win Race to the Top grants, we can implement every single program under the sun….but until the state of Georgia is willing to truly empower teachers and insist on highly trained administrators, nothing will improve.
We desperately need better leadership.
Progressive Humanist
December 29th, 2012
9:17 am
Cindy @ 2:34- Yes, those people are scholars, but not in fields that would give them the expertise to address the specific question we’ve been discussing, and only one of them has the background to conduct research on that question. Two of them have no more than masters degrees, which I don’t think is adequate training to answer such a deep and fundamental question in terms of research. If you were to consult with real experts in the field you’d find that there is a strong consensus that, yes, standardized tests can and do measure learning. But there are many more details that enter the equation, such as how well the tests align with what is supposed to be taught and learned, whether bias is present, how relevant the material is, whether multiple assessments are used to measure growth or a single assessment is used to gauge cross-sectional knowledge or skills, how the data is analyzed and interpreted, etc.
I do agree with your advocacy of authentic assessments. In both the undergraduate and graduate level assessment courses I teach I stress the use of performance assessments using real world problems for classroom assessment. I think this is particularly needed in math and science. Too often, public school students learn to dislike and disregard math because they never see the connection between the abstract numbers and equations they are taught to manipulate on a page and any practical application in the real world. Often I ask pre-service math teachers “how can you take this problem and embed it within the context of some real world problem that students might have to figure out?” Often they return a blank stare because they never think of math in that way. That’s a real limitation of math instruction at the lower levels.
However, just because authentic assessments are very useful in the classroom does not mean that they are practical or even possible in standardized testing, when hundreds of thousands of students must be assessed. Authentic assessments take a great deal of time for students to complete and for the rater to assess. And the biggest limitation is that scoring such assessments is highly subjective, often yielding low interrater reliability. So you’d need thousands of different people to take long hours scoring these assessments, and when they were finished there would be little (insufficient) agreement between them concerning the proficiency of the students’ individual responses. If you think there are protests over testing now, you wouldn’t want to see the controversy when the validity of the scoring of authentic assessments is questioned on a large scale.
We must have an efficient, relatively objective, valid and reliable method for assessing on a large scale whether students have learned the basic material in terms of either knowledge or skills that they are supposed to have learned at different intervals. Authentic assessments, while very useful in the classroom, cannot fill that role for standardized testing, at least not yet. So we are left with the need to ascertain that information, yet limited ways to do it. It can’t be left up to teachers because they vary so much in their content knowledge, adherence to standards, and knowledge of and effectiveness in assessment. That’s why we have the SAT and ACT, to act as another form of data to counterbalance GPAs. GPAs can vary a great deal from school to school and system to system based on rigor or lack of. As you have pointed out, GPAs can hold strong predictive power of future success, but that’s mainly because they are more a measure of long term effort than of academic achievement. When we are looking at discrete courses and the learning students were supposed to have accomplished in them, we find massive variation and massive statistical error in the grades assigned by teachers, which is why we must have additional assessment instruments.
So we are still left with the quandary of how to gather specific information on students’ learning on a large scale, when authentic assessments and teacher grades are not adequate to fulfill that role on their own.
Georgia
December 29th, 2012
9:18 am
Mel Riddle claimed that Charter Schools are perpetuating narratives to tap public education funds. Public Education Funds. PEF (PEF is why Johnny can’t RIF.) But Johhny couldn’t RIF since WW2 ended. The new Common Core Standards (CCS) are not the issue. The issue is resource allocation. How would charter schools perpetuate resource-allocating narratives? They use social media like this public forum newspaper blog. So, the voters are fed personal dramas about real life resource-wresting vendettas. Episode 1: The protest sign ambush by the good Dr. T. The scurrying of the board members. Why the honorable Ericka can’t read a restraining order. All while “Not so Hot for Teacher” by Van Halen riffs in the background.
Hold on to sixteen as long as you can, my friends, like the good Dr T and the honorable Ericka. They both saw their duty and they done it. Lets give Beverly Hall’s award to them. So what if Snookie can’t read. She can tweet, and that’s all the RIF she needs.
teacher&mom
December 29th, 2012
10:22 am
@PH: ” It can’t be left up to teachers because they vary so much in their content knowledge, adherence to standards, and knowledge of and effectiveness in assessment. That’s why we have the SAT and ACT, to act as another form of data to counterbalance GPAs. ”
True….but….
Which SAT score would you consider the most valid?
A student who took the SAT maybe once or twice without any excessive test prep
or
the student who had the luxury of attending a high school that offers a SAT prep course and/or the financial means to hire a SAT tutor.
Isn’t it true that even SAT scores can be manipulated if you have the time and money to pay for test-prep and the funds to pay for multiple SAT tests?
Pride and Joy
December 29th, 2012
10:29 am
Teacher&Mom — I consider both tests valid. I didn’t prep for the ACT and I did well the very first time I took it and I never took it again. It was also a good indicator of how well I would perform in college. I went to collge on an academic scholarship, graduated, and became a good, tax-paying citizen and parent.
For those who prep and study for it, those results are valid as well. Those who prep and study for the test are performing exactly the way colleges need them to perform, meaning, colleges expect students to prepare before the exams.
So, both are valid measurements. They are meant to predict college readiness and they do that very well.
Progressive Humanist
December 29th, 2012
10:51 am
They are equally valid. Yes, some students may have better preparation for one reason or another, but that doesn’t mean that the instrument is not accurately measuring students’ knowledge of the material. With what you are suggesting, by extension, the SAT would be less valid if one student had a good teacher leading up to the test and another student had a bad teacher. What you are describing is not a problem with the test. That is a common misunderstanding in education. The test gets blamed for extraneous variables that probably should be addressed, but it doesn’t make the measure any less valid. The test doesn’t tell you why a student knows what he or she knows; it just tells you roughly what they know. If you use a tape measure to measure students’ height, but one student had a hormonal imbalance and is much taller than the others, does that mean that the tape measure is flawed or that it’s not measuring inches correctly?
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2012
10:52 am
@Beverly: You are right to question why GSSA won’t rescind the award.
Thank you @teacher and mom. Cinnnndeee…Annnnieeee, are you listening? Or scrolling past LOL
Vindication is nice…INDEED!
And Maureen must be thinking “God this is insufferable but in my ethics I can’t ban it, because no matter how insufferable, it has merit”
Then she gives thanks to God I’m not her neighbor LOL
Hmmmmmmm
December 29th, 2012
11:01 am
@Cindy L
You are much too rational and logical for most of the attendees on this blog… I use the KISS method on education… Reading, writing, and arithmetic… and holding kids accountable. But hey, in a sequence of numbers to know which number doesn’t belong is soooooo important…
HS Math Teacher
December 29th, 2012
11:07 am
Amazing. We put so much emphasis on standards and standardized testing, but allow social promotion to flourish in the lower grades. High school teachers in rural and urban, inner city schools are starting to buckle under the strain. Many affected teachers have quickly learned that to avoid so many hours spent in RTI meetings, and endless documentation of fruitless endeavors, just find “creative” ways to “pass-em-all”. I wonder what the cut score will be on this school year’s Math EOCT . . . 40 or 50%? Even then, the average pass rate will probably be around 50%. Think about it, 50% of kids getting 50% of the problems worked correctly. What a charade.
It’s apparent to me that our policymakers and legislators are getting tired of seeing our state near the bottom on national SAT rankings. It’s equally obvious to me that what is keeping our state down at the bottom are the poor rural and inner-city schools. Nonetheless, education funds will be cut, and class sizes will still be large. I liken this approach to this: We have a sinking boat, but instead of fixing the hole in the hull, we’re given a large Dixie cup to get the water out.
If you’re going to raise the bar, stop lowering the floor.
HS Math Teacher
December 29th, 2012
11:09 am
correction: “I wonder what the cut score will be on this year’s COMMON CORE Math EOCT….”
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
12:00 pm
I’m having trouble with the auto-moderate of this site contraption. I put two links, one to Mel Riddile biography, and one to Washington Post article on same, and it throws the comment in auto-moderation. As a person posting, this is distracting and time consuming. Site participants should be fully informed of what actions put posts into moderation, for example, a work list (yes it exists) and what type of sites. It is difficult to make a post and include documentation. Checking back to see if a comment is removed from moderation is demeaning, particularly without being informed of the chess game of post that goes through or is moderated. Have I just wasted my time writing a post? Is operating under unknown conditions a requirement for participating in this forum? It seems to be the case.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
12:01 pm
typo correction: for example, a word list (yes it exists) and what type of sites
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
12:04 pm
Here is my comment without the links to document information:
First question, who is Mel Riddile? Dude is a super player in the current politics, “national and international recognition from National Geographic magazine, the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation, NASSP, and the International Baccalaureate of North America… As principal of both a Breakthrough High School and an ICLE Model School, Dr. Riddile is a recognized leader in efforts to reinvent America’s high schools. He has received White House and U.S. Department of Education recognition for this and was a member of the U.S. Secretary of Education’s High School Reform Task Force.”
_____________
This guy is no ordinary commentator, he is a super-surfer on the waves of power.
____________
The thing that makes me cringe about this article is that everything is voiced in “Georgia speak.” That was my initial reaction, question, how the “Common Core” gets subsumed as “The new Georgia Performance Standards, which incorporate the Common Core State Standards”
Wait a minute. Full stop. Why is Mr. Riddile using “local talk.” He is a propagandist / salesman extraordinaire. Anyway, one question is why can not Georgia just use “Common Core” in place of still claiming “Georgia Standards?” This is like politics happy-hour or something. Seems Mr. Riddile is a mastermind of building up the local / state fiefdom as political power to, in-turn, implement the wishes of the power interests than he represents.
Is it not a little queer, that Mr. Riddile, from Fairfax, Virginia, starts off this essay with, “questions on the minds of Georgia citizens these days” as if he has anything at all to do with the state of Georgia? The article is manipulative for sure and is a piece of neighbor-friendly propaganda.
Nice try, Mr. Riddile. It might be a lonely road, but there is one reader who sees that you are complimenting the state power while using them to deliver the directives from the groups you represent.
Dear Mr. Riddile, we still do not have eyeglasses for children, and in many schools we do not have textbooks or resource materials / consumables / work-books and such. They’re basically extinct and individual teachers are spending hours of their time assembling / creating lesson materials from the internet. Truly, I do not know what you stand for Mr. Riddile. It would be much more easy for everyone if you just made an outline of what you are implementing / who you stand for, what you are fronting. Many of us really do not need to sales job / marketing to go with it. it is not like we have any choice in anything. So, please, just make it clear what are the conditions you are dictating.
Redux: Political super player from Fairfax, Virginia (right next to Washington, DC) issues 517 word article and uses the word “Georgia” 8 times.
Sports connection: “former linebacker at the University of North Carolina”
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
12:12 pm
Awarded Mr. Riddile is from managing high school in Fairfax, VA is a wealthy, WEALTHY WEALTHY area supported by lots of tons of TONS OF TONS OF Washington, DC political / lobbyist salaries.
Kind of having difficulty seeing the connect to Athens / Clark County (dirt poor), Macon, Valdosta, and points in-between. Mr. Riddile I think there is an ethical question that you ought to spend a month in Clark County schools (DIRT POOR) before you issue a good-neighbor propaganda article using the word “Georgia” 8 times.
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
1:03 pm
@Progressive Humanist
Anyone with a knowledge of the current “best practices” in the area of psychometrics and assessments is very familiar with the work of UCLA prof and co-director of CRESST, Eva Baker. You complain that Cindy L. quotes individuals who are not psychometric specialists, therefore their conclusions are invalid. I just quoted the specific plan laid out by Eva Baker, “queen of psychometrics”, for “21st Century assessments, INCLUDING MEASURING FOR THE AFFECTIVE DOMAIN (attitudes, values, and beliefs). You have made NO COMMENT on this post. (December 28th, 2012
4:24 pm). Yet in the past, you claimed that you advised your students NOT to measure for this domain. DO YOU NOW AGREE WITH EVA BAKER’S plans for the countries new assessments? Please comment.
Georgia
December 29th, 2012
1:03 pm
It looks like The Riddler got what he……TOUCHDOWN AIRFORCE!!!
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
1:04 pm
oops! Should read “country’s”.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
1:10 pm
2011 Fairfax County, Virginia median household income – $105,797
2009 Alexandria, Virginia median household income: $77,095
2009 Athens / Clarke County Georgia median household income: $32,019
note: Mr. Riddile’s experience / awards are from Fairfax County and Alexandria.
Just A Teacher
December 29th, 2012
1:15 pm
My concern with these Common Core standards is that they focus on “longer, nonfiction reading passages, for example, and exhibit greater ‘technical fluency’ in their comprehension skills.” There is a much higher level learning than comprehension. At what point do we begin to test abstract reasoning and symbolism?
Furthermore, I am very concerned that the focus on technical knowledge will drain much needed funding from the humanities.
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
1:18 pm
@Progressive Humanist
I’m still waiting for your explanation…..
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
1:22 pm
Fairfax County, Virginia, median value of owner-occupied housing units, 2007-2011 $493,100; Homeownership rate, 2007-2011 71.0%
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
1:36 pm
Clarke County, Georgia, median value of owner-occupied housing units, 2007-2011 $161,100; Homeownership rate, 2007-2011 45.6%
Bibb County, Georgia (where Macon is located), median value of owner-occupied housing units, 2007-2011 $121,900; Homeownership rate, 2007-2011 57.5%
Looks like Mr. Riddile is making a visit to Georgia from the “ownership society.”
Progressive Humanist
December 29th, 2012
1:41 pm
Robin, as I’ve told you before, you’re not qualified for this type of discussion. You can’t Google your way to a PhD, although I know you’re trying. Maybe if you took off the tinfoil hat for a minute someone would take you seriously.
Maude
December 29th, 2012
1:42 pm
Am I the only one on this blog that has figured out the Beverly Fraud and Dr. John Trotter are one and the same??
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
1:44 pm
@ Just a Teacher
You seem to be confused. You believe education is the goal. Documents indicate otherwise…..
http://www.cse.ucla.edu/products/policy/coherence_v6.pdf
“Coherence: Key to Next Generation Assessment Success”
“AACC: Assessment and Accountability Comprehensive Center: A WestEd and CRESST partnership. aacompcenter.org
Copyright © 2010 The Regents of the University of California
The work reported herein was supported by WestEd, grant number 4956 s05-093, as administered by the U.S. Department of Education. The findings and opinions expressed herein are those of the author(s) and do not necessarily reflect the positionsor policies of AACC, WestEd, or the U.S. Department of Education.
To cite from this report, please use the following as your APA reference:
Herman, J. L. (2010). Coherence: Key to Next Generation Assessment Success (AACC Report). Los Angeles, CA: University of California.”
“What can we do differently?
In a single word but with many steps, I suggest the word “coherence.” I believe that by making our assess- ments more coherent in both design and use, we can create assessment systems which will measure the right stuff in the right ways while better serving intended purposes, particularly the purpose of improving teaching and learning. The current Race to the Top Assessment Program (RTT) provides states a sizeable carrot—$350 million—to do just this, creating a next generation assessment system that reflects new Common Core State Standards and supports accountability and improvement at all levels of the educa- tional system: state, district, school, classroom.
The way forward to better assessment begins with the conception of assessment not as a single test but as a coherent system of measures. Coherent systems must be composed of valid measures of learning and be horizontally, developmentally, and vertically aligned to serve classroom, school, and district improvement.”
After reading this, compare with CRESST co-Director Eva Baker’s power point outline (post (December 28th, 2012 4:24 pm) on the same subject. Note the inclusion of MEASURING FOR AFFECTIVE DOMAIN.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
1:45 pm
According to Google Maps, it looks like Mr. Riddile’s principalships have been done between 3 (Falls Church, Virginia) and 16 miles (Alexandria, Virginia) from CIA headquarters in McClean, Virginia.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
1:50 pm
Principal at a school 3.6 miles from CIA headquarters! C’mon folks, you can’t make this stuff up!
Needless to say, neighborhood school has a different meaning there.
(no offense meant, Mr. Riddile)
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
1:52 pm
As usual, a pitiful defense by so-called Progressive Humanist, who claims to instruct college students in assessment design. BTW PH, who is “Robin?” Are you jousting at ghosts again? Irate students?
“Robin, as I’ve told you before, you’re not qualified for this type of discussion. You can’t Google your way to a PhD, although I know you’re trying. Maybe if you took off the tinfoil hat for a minute someone would take you seriously.”
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
1:59 pm
Let us not forget that Ronald Reagan did the “folksy grandpa” routine while he was removing the anti-trust laws that lead to the current consolidation of media. Mr. Riddile has written an essay sounding like he is your “Georgia neighbor.”
Repeating, Mr. Riddile, it would be easier for all of us if you just indicated your agenda without the folksy “Georgia speak.” It’s not like we have a choice in anything, or the will to resist. The will is already broken, the public mind is scattered. We are ready for the “normalisation” phase of your program. You can pass this message to your bosses. They don’t have anything to worry about in Georgia.
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
2:04 pm
Wow, Fred “trademark”/Private Citizen, you must be working on a PhD in “distractor strategy”, LOL!
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
2:15 pm
Teachers, if you want to be as smart as Fred “trademark”/Private Citizen, take a few tips from Noam Chomsky, MIT linguist. He boils it down to 10. Here’s tip #1:
“1. The strategy of distraction
The primary element of social control is the strategy of distraction which is to divert public attention from important issues and changes determined by the political and economic elites, by the technique of flood or flooding continuous distractions and insignificant information. distraction strategy is also essential to prevent the public interest in the essential knowledge in the area of the science, economics, psychology, neurobiology and cybernetics. “Maintaining public attention diverted away from the real social problems, captivated by matters of no real importance. Keep the public busy, busy, busy, no time to think, back to farm and other animals (quote from text Silent Weapons for Quiet War ).”
Read the other 9 at http://parisis.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/noam-chomsky.pdf
Sandy Springs Parent
December 29th, 2012
2:35 pm
Some of you just lack the ability to reason. You are so stuck in GA. First of All Northern Va, has a high level of Federal Government employees. Most Federal Employees today have colegee degrees. The non-college degree employees have mostly been contracted out. Federal Employment of non degree holders has always required a test to determine employment. To prevent the friends and family fiasco’s of local governments and school districts.
So you are comparing area’s consisting of mostly college degree employees. Vs. areas in Georgia that as a state only has a 26% college degree completion.
Of course Athens Clarke county is going to have low home ownership, it is a college town. If my child gets into UGA, it makes more financial sense for me to purchase a house nearby,Then have her get 2-4 roomates and collect 3K a semester in rent from each for rent. Then I sell the house in 3-4 years. The same thing in many small college towns.
HS Math Teacher
December 29th, 2012
2:38 pm
Man, you guys need to lighten up. Go to Applebees & get loaded, then call a cab.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
3:01 pm
Truth, Allow me to clarify for you that I have posted under no other pseudonym, nor has my user name been applied by another. PS Chomsky has been well nigh useless at addressing any specific events. He’s like Jon Stewart and NPR. There are a lot of events that they will not touch, as each depends on big power for their paycheck. Chomsky can sing a song, but the truth is MIT has so many defense contracts that he can not speak a word to big power. You seem a little confused by who has what to gain with distribution of information. If you need a for-profit corollary for me, look to Joan d’Arc. Here, maybe this will bring you down to earth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxJSGMK9yRE The film was lost for years until a print of it was found in the storage closet of an insane asylum. I suggest for you to watch it if you wish to be culturally literate.
Georgia coach
December 29th, 2012
3:06 pm
That was a lame picket in Macon, John trotter
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
3:14 pm
The Passion of Jean of Arc film was originally silent, therefore various contemporary versions may have differing music accompaniment. The traditional sacred music on this version may be more appropriate to the film http://vimeo.com/25035903
bootney farnsworth
December 29th, 2012
3:27 pm
as I’ve said countless times before, if you really want to fix the problem, start with the corrupted top.
we have more than enough resources, if they ever actually got to us.
bootney farnsworth
December 29th, 2012
3:30 pm
http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local/ban-may-end-free-football-tickets/nThZw/
case in point
bootney farnsworth
December 29th, 2012
3:37 pm
@ beverly
if this was all we got for Tricoli nuking a single college and 282 careers/lives, its not likely we’ll get anything other than a lifetime achievement away for B Hall taking down an entire system
http://www.collegiannews.com/2012/05/aaups-regret-statement/
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
3:38 pm
Sandy Springs Parent, where I live in Georgia, it is 2% of the populace who have graduate degrees. And you have to wonder how many of those are from mail-order or office park “schools” that feature the debt-based for-profit expensive abbreviated programs. I dare say “reality” in Georgia is very different from what is represented with the official indoctrinations.
The featured article is written with the “up” and “down” method, the last time I’ve seen this was from someone transient selling talent search services with a speech about “the highs” and “the lows” they had been through and how they conquered them (therefore you should pay up for your photo portfolio leading to becoming a “star.”). Lots of “we” speak, using “the royal we” and “While the results are imminent,” I’m missing the connection to reality, something else that is also “imminent.” Ahem. I’ll give a dollar for anyone who wants to make a chart with “reality” on one side, and “directives” on the other. Maybe we can commission t-shirts or a custom printed calendar, popular in small business.
Here’s something about the use of “we”-speak in writing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majestic_plural
bootney farnsworth
December 29th, 2012
3:38 pm
@ Cindy
like you, I sometimes run into posters I’d rather not read. perhaps you’ll join in in requested an ignore feature?
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
3:39 pm
Retraction:
Forget Noam Chomsky’s association with this. I couldn’t verify. Another blog had these credits which make sense. The poor grammar in some of the items is because it was translated from French to English (by a non-native speaker). The points are still powerful because we see them used every day.
“Article written by Sylvain Timsit, collected in Pressenza: “TOP 10 MEDIA MANIPULATION STRATEGIES. Paris. September 21, 2010. The article is derived from: http://www.syti.net/Manipulations.html
Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars. This document dated May 1979, was found on July 7, 1986 in an IBM copier bought at an auction of military equipment. Negligence or intentional leak, this text has been in possession of the secret services of the U.S. Navy. For safety reasons, the document does not include the signature of the organization where it came from. But information and dates clippings left believing that these Bilderberg Group, a ” discussion club ” that meets the extremely powerful worlds of finance, economics, politics, the armed forces and services secrets. Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars was published as an appendix to the book “Behold A Pale Horse” by William Cooper, Light Technology Publishing, 1991.”
bootney farnsworth
December 29th, 2012
3:42 pm
Chomsky? that jew hating clown?
Lord God, this topic has gone to hell
HS Math Teacher
December 29th, 2012
3:43 pm
Hmm… maybe somone’s been to Applebees already.
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
3:52 pm
Bootney, you tip your hand. I just retracted his association w/ the document because I could not verify it. The book, BEHOLD A PALE HORSE, is verified. It was included in the appendix. The author was a member of the military.
So, why would you make an unrelated statement like that? It had nothing to do with my post or the topic at hand. Hmmmm?
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
4:08 pm
Truth, here’s your source link with English translation. http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=fr&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.syti.net%2FManipulations.html
For this essay, I like #10, “Knowing people better than they know themselves.” #5 may be appropriate with the prominent use of the Chicken Little children’s story (one who warns of or predicts calamity) and “The sky is falling.” Let’s check for use of emotion. Yes, I think the piece has a tone of “tension” and perhaps to create fear (which then needs the article’s remedy to remove the “threat.)
For example, use of the past-tense form verb, steeled. “Mentally prepare (oneself) to do or face something difficult;” rob “Take property unlawfully from (a person or place) by force or threat of force;” neutralize “Render (something) ineffective or harmless by applying an opposite force or effect.”
Yes, to a careful reader, this essay suggests a “threat” and therefore the reader should apply the essay’s “remedy.” Yep, classic propaganda.
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
4:10 pm
@Bootney
Why have you not commented on my document links which DIRECTLY CONNECT Eva Baker, CRESST, UCLA, Affective Domain assessment, Assessments for the 21st century, Race to the Top funding for teacher and Common Core assessments, and TAX PAYER FUNDING IT ALL?
Is that not “ON TOPIC” enough for you? You must be working on your destractor strategy PhD as well.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
4:18 pm
Truth, Outside of the United States, there is nothing racy about the term “propaganda” which means “information.” When a government has a “Ministry of Propaganda,” one is supposed to be a little keen for the manipulative nature of such. In U. S. engineering programs, they used to teach classic forms of propaganda so that licensed engineers could recognise when it was being used. There is a well-known classic short list of propaganda techniques used for purposes of manipulation. Your link is in the category of this type of information.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
4:19 pm
Truth, kind of in a mood today, eH?
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
4:21 pm
I wouldn’t trust Google translate. Here’s the original source:
“Chapter 1 “Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars” Summary and Analysis
Chapter 1 presents a document entitled ‘TOP SECRET – Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars – An introductory programming manual – Operations Research – Technical Manual – TM-SW7905.1;’ Cooper re-titles the document ‘The Illuminati’s declaration of War upon the people of America’ and notes that it was dated May 1979. Cooper explains that the document was found inside a used, photocopy machine, which was purchased as surplus property in 1986. According to Cooper, the document conclusively demonstrates that a reputed Third World War commenced in 1954; the war pits a shadowy organization known as the Bilderberg Group against the governments of the world. The Bilderberg Group uses a method of warfare known as “quiet war”—their weapons are information, disinformation and control, instead of traditional explosives. Aside from a brief introduction, a few interspersed comments, and a conclusion by Cooper, the chapter purports to be a verbatim reproduction of the accidentally-discovered document.”
http://www.bookrags.com/studyguide-behold-a-pale-horse/chapanal003.html
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
4:32 pm
@ PC
Since you seem to know everything about everything, could you please tell me where Perdue Pharma gets its legal opium supply to produce its Oxycontin brand pain killer?
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
4:46 pm
But truth, there’s a thousand websites that list out the classic techniques of propaganda. No insult, but having difficulty with why your list of 10 methods is so “highly charged” to you. I’m not going to list them out here or go looking for links (I have been behaviorally modified due to this sites aversion to links). You think it is special because it was found on a photocopier? I mean – get used to it – I mean… post 9/11 there were whole paid entourages going online and invading discussion groups and posing as “Joe plumber” and “Redskins Fan” and loads of this, each promoting disinformation. This activity too was paid for with your tax dollars. Here. Okay. I’ll go fetch something for you. Here, if the topic interests you, do a Google search for “paid disinformation agents.” Sort of the same thing as dropping leaflets from airplanes in a foreign country, but unfortunately the intelligence apparatus has been unleashed on the public at home. There is information about budgets and monies spent on people to sit at computer terminals and invade discussion groups for the purposes of opinion shaping. There is quite a lot of use of this type activity with internet. It seems that applied politics is hardly a passive thing, my friend.
Along these same lines, there is serious concern about all of this “affective” standardised testing, the results are stored in databases. When you’re a grown adult, somebody can access a database and check your “affect” from testing as a school kid. Oh yes. It is “big brother” to the maximum. What’s her name, B.K. Eakman, has done scholarship on it, and also written about the difficulty of accessing information / records of this type, but she’s done it. She’s really a heroine of sorts.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
5:02 pm
where Perdue Pharma gets its legal opium supply to produce its Oxycontin brand pain killer?
Well, silly, it is not illegal for pharmaceutical research to get any number of things. I imagine they buy their supplies based on market. If I rephrase your question to be, “Where does opium come from,” here’s some good answers: Turkey, India, Tasmania. http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=87555
Prof
December 29th, 2012
5:11 pm
The only one missing here is Ole Guy, pointing out that today’s HS diploma is worth about as much as toilet paper.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
5:36 pm
Hey truth, the soviet KGB guy Yuri Bezmenov who came to the USA said that 85% of intelligence agency work is doing opinion shaping, i.e. applied propaganda.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
5:46 pm
A guy who owns a store in Buckhead told me one time of when he was a little kid in the government schools, they had to do drills and crouch underneath their desks because “the Russians were coming.” I think it would be better today if big power stopped using marketing to try and “massage” everybody. Just do what you’re going to do. Get on with it.
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
5:52 pm
@ PC
Thanks for proving my point with your continuous blather. Your o#p#i#Um links are dead. I posted a whole slew of good links on the topic, but the old filter or “sponsor” money put me in moderation. I guess this is a touchy subject. Your dodge of all my posts and questions is predictable. What test co. do you work for? Do you have stock in Perdue? Oh, I forgot…..it’s privately held. Headquarters are in Stamford Conn…..same town where Adam’s dad now lives. Hmmmmm.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
5:54 pm
Hey truth, here you go. http://www.alt-market.com/articles/964-disinformation-how-it-works Sleep well.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
6:07 pm
Truth, I’m having difficulty navigating what you’re saying. I’m not dodging anything from you. Why the burr in your saddle? It’s like you’ve gone on a rant of ridiculing. Well, do your thing, I guess. (?) You can certainly look up where does medical opium come from, if that is a real question from you. I can’t tell. My links are dead? Those aren’t my links and I’m not your paid researcher, I simply answered your question with a general pointer. ?Have you lost your mind? What, do you want me to find you an online order form and company address from distribution network Alibaba.com? Your question was “where” not from whom.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
6:13 pm
hey truth, go here http://www.cbn.nic.in/
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
6:15 pm
You ask, I shall deliver! http://www.uwmc.uwc.edu/academics/departments/political_science/opiumprod.html
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
6:24 pm
@PC
This says it all:
“In some years when excess opium cultivation has been discovered, officers and staff in the O*pi um Department have been either reprimanded, brought up on charges, or dismissed.”
So who sets the price? What if it is more than street price?
Here’s a quote:
“The company, however, insisted that its only crime was misbranding, the legal term for making false representations about O x*yC* ontin in its advertising, labeling or sales pitches to the medical community.
“Any attempt to connect today’s plea of misbranding by Purdue to abuse and diversion of OxyContin is completely false,” company spokesman James Heins said on the day of the plea agreement. “The papers filed by the government do not make any such allegation and the company did not admit to any such wrongdoing.”
Still, those who tangled with the company earlier during its aggressive defense of lawsuits found some vindication in this week’s criminal prosecution.
“This is long overdue,” Yeary said.
“These corporate drug lords have done more devastation to the Appalachian region than the Colombian drug cartel ever thought about doing.”
http://www.roanoke.com/news/roanoke/wb/116597
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
6:27 pm
Look what happened in Georgia:
http://oxycontin.legalview.com/jury-verdicts/650000-patient-dies-of-overdose-and-psychiatrist-settles-death-claim/1046586/
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
6:39 pm
Well, that’s a turn in perspective, but I appreciate your concern and observation and I look forward to learning more about the topic. Thank you. For real.
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
7:04 pm
I wonder if they have more of these cases close to home in Connecticut?
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
7:16 pm
If I may take the liberty of paraphrasing what Truth is spontaneously railing about,
“The company (Purdue) and the three executives pleaded guilty at a small courthouse in this small city at the edge of Appalachia, a region where OxyContin abuse became so widespread that the drug was dubbed “hillbilly heroin.”
and the observation that OxyContin is basically heroin in a pill that has resulted in “hundreds of thousands of cases of addiction, and almost 15,000 deaths” http://www.healthguidance.org/entry/16526/1/The-Legal-Heroin-Promoted-by-Big-Pharma.html
Whewww (exhale). Yes, it is not exactly the regulator’s brightest hour. Makes me think of the situation of Comcast having a 100% condition of monopoly for wire internet for me, yet there is no regulation of it. I sure wish the people would come to life a little bit on their quality of government. Everyone acts like they’re asleep at the switch. I mention the Comcast monopoly here and at least one person is repelled. Meanwhile, new-technology education is dependent on internet? Sort of like “everyone goes to college” means “everyone goes into heavy debt.” At least that’s what the script says. And if you work in the school house, you’re expected to follow the script, as one shrewd young student plainly observed and verbalised to me one day. It’s like they saw the whole thing in front of them and how it worked. I have to give this student credit.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
7:27 pm
Hey truth, I recall the trade-show launch of the drug Bextra was done in Atlanta. Read it and weep. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valdecoxib
“Pharmacia & UpJohn Company, pled guilty to marketing four drugs including Bextra “with the intent to defraud or mislead.” Pharmacia & UpJohn admitted to criminal conduct in the promotion of Bextra, and agreed to pay the largest criminal fine ever imposed in the United States for any matter, $1.195 billion”
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
7:29 pm
July 16, 2002 “Georgia World Congress Center in Atlanta to prepare 5,000 sales representatives from both companies for the launch of Bextra, an arthritis drug that is expected to succeed blockbuster Celebrex.” http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1026766916969476960.html
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
7:39 pm
“The OxyContin Generation” “2500 pre-teens/teens misusing an opioid for the first time every day” “relaxation of state boards of medicine in their view of “overprescribing” http://rmpc.bitnamiapp.com/wordpress/accidental-death/the-oxycontin-generation
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
7:48 pm
Kind of like state regulation of anything education is out-the-door. The state just redelivers the national mandates / initiatives. PS I contend that over-testing takes behaviorally agitated children and makes them worse. Year around testing emphasis in the schools is a consistent interruption of wholesome schooling, and creates a rigid environment and even more negative stimuli for an agitated student to rebel against. Combining year-around testing with state-level orders to not discipline children makes for an unfair situation for teachers and students. This is my opinion speaking as the highly qualified test administrator doing this to children in my classroom. The excessive testing combined with required “lock down” testing conditions gave me the intuitive feeling that I was doing something wrong toward my charges, the students, and I could see the effect on their demeanor. Even the well-behaved loyal students and “troopers” I witnessed these just sort of resign themselves to the situation that was repeated throughout the school year.
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
7:49 pm
Why do the public and teacher-professionals accept excessive year-around testing?
Private Citizen
December 29th, 2012
7:52 pm
Yes, captain, wear a helmet if you come into the school house because the sky is falling, and it’s got nothing to do with Common Core standards. It has to do with excessive testing and lack of teaching materials, and kids and families with sparse public health resources.
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
8:01 pm
@PC
Good link about Oxycontin. Coming full circle to “on topic”, Purdue plans to market it to CHILDREN! How could a child taking this stuff go to a “drug free” zone? TEACHERS SHOULD PAY ATTENTION TO THIS!
“Purdue Pharma claimed to have “solved the problem” by remanufacturing the OxyContin pills such that they were harder to crush and abuse, but DEA officials and health care professionals say that it hasn’t worked; there is still as large a market for the illegal uses of the drug as there is for its legitimate use.”
“That’s the scariest part of this whole thing. OxyContin, although it has its legitimate uses, is an opioid, and thus habit forming. Purdue Pharma has recently begun paying for dozens of clinical trials around the country to perform studies on the effects of OxyContin on children. They claim that this is being done out of their concern for the large number of children who suffer from chronic pain, or even headaches.
Critics of Purdue Pharma point out that the real reason for such pediatric trials may be twofold – first, to develop new markets to enable them to sell more of the drug, and second, to find an “end run” around the fact that their original patent on OxyContin will expire in April of 2013. ”
http://www.healthguidance.org/entry/16526/1/The-Legal-Heroin-Promoted-by-Big-Pharma.html
Truth in Moderation
December 29th, 2012
8:20 pm
WOW!. It didn’t take long to find a recent criminal Oxycodone pills possession in Westport Connecticut. This guy seems to be a career petty thief and involved a 19 year old relative in stealing copper gutters. They live in the same house in Norwalk Connecticut, according to the article.Maybe the thefts are to support an opiate addiction…
“The occupants were detained while other officers checked the property. It was determined that the copper in the vehicle was part of a gutter system taken from the construction site, police said.
Arrested were Christopher Rodia, 42, and Cassandre Scire, 19, both of 19 Vollmer Ave., Norwalk, police said. Officials said Rodia was also carrying Oxycodone pills in a plastic bag.
Rodia was charged with larceny, conspiracy to commit larceny, criminal trespass, possession of narcotics, and failure to have prescription drugs in a prescribed container, police said. He was held on $10,000 bond for a Aug. 7 Norwalk Superior Court appearance.”
http://www.westportnow.com/index.php?/v2_5/comments/39302/
Mary Elizabeth
December 29th, 2012
10:17 pm
paulo977,December 28th, 2012
3:39 pm
“Mary E ….Do have a look at this…”
http://www.education.com/reference/article/cultural-deficit-model
========================================================
Paulo, thank you for sharing the link, above, with me which dismantles many stereotypical thoughts about poor and minority students’ (and their familes’) desire for quality education. I hope that others will take a few minutes to read your link, especially the last paragraph in the article. Here is a quote from the article:
“Because this model frames the problem as one of students and families, the remedies informed by deficit perspectives created to ameliorate student underachievement and failure often fail meaningfully to address problems within schools or society at large that combine to depress the performance of certain groups of students.”
—————————————————————————
Blessings to you and yours in the New Year, Paulo.
True Blue
December 29th, 2012
11:13 pm
@ME, My reality is sending my first grader to an APS school in SE Atlanta where I see the apathy staring me right in my face. Any attempts to explain it away is wishful thinking. I see children dropped off at 10am because the mother couldnt be bothered to get herself out of bed. Sending a child home due to a behavioral issue is simply a day off for the child. A call to a parent from our room mom to coordinate a classroom activity was met with a vulgar response that indicated no support would be offered. Maybe five parents in a class of twenty participate or provide support in anyway.
It breaks my heart but this is my reality.
Mary Elizabeth
December 30th, 2012
12:22 am
True Blue, 11:13 pm
I am truly sorry that your reality is as you describe. Nevertheless, there are many “realities,” as Paulo’s link substantiates. In the course I my life, I have learned that nothing good generally comes from blaming. A better outlook, both toward one’s self and toward others, is to try to understand, to forgive, and/or to seek to improve as one is able, without judgment.
Since you addressed me, I wanted to respond to your post as positively as I could. I do not want to pursue an extended dialogue on this, however. I hope that you will understand. Best to you.
True Blue
December 30th, 2012
2:36 am
Yes, many realities in the world of theoretical sociology…..one reality in the public school classrooms of south Atlanta.
Jack ®
December 30th, 2012
8:26 am
Calving children with no thought of their future is the elephant in the room. No amount of sophisticated theoretical bs is going to improve our public schools. As long as our system supports and promotes promiscuous lifestyles, the schools will suffer.
Dr. John Trotter
December 30th, 2012
9:42 am
@ Georgia Coach: Lame picket in Macon? Ha! Wow, this topic has indeed strayed. Actually, this was a rather lively picket, attracting many locals on the historic Mulberry Street in front of the Courthouse and was covered by the media, including Macon’s NBC affiliate. Hey, man, I was even decked out in beautiful seersucker suit and a resplendent madras tie. Ha! Lame? Not hardly, but, then again, you may actually be one of Romain Dallemand’s educrats making the teachers’ jobs so insufferable in Bibb County. We expect you guys not to like the pickets. We would be concerned if you did like them.
http://www.theteachersadvocate.com
http://www.georgiateachersspeakout.com
mountain man
December 30th, 2012
10:06 am
I say again – we would not need standardized testing if the grades given were truly reflective of material learned (mastery of subject, not “learning to think”). We could use regular grades, like we did in the sixties. But grade inflation is so rampant, not just from teachers, but from policies (no grade below 50), and administrators changing grades.
So if we test to new standards (common core) and the student fails, what do we do? Why, the same thing we always do, pass them along until they give up and quit school. Or keep them and give them a meaningless diploma at the end of 12 years. Employers know it means nothing, so they require a college diploma for any important jobs.
redweather
December 30th, 2012
10:39 am
@mountain man, a big chunk of education has always been aimed at getting students to learn how to think, and there is not one thing wrong with that. I get the distinct feeling some of you don’t know why we have students study subjects like algebra and geometry.
Mary Elizabeth
December 30th, 2012
10:52 am
Per my December 28th, 9:46 am post, I have tried to demonstrate how different students will take differing rates to master the same curriculum concepts.
That being true, perhaps educators should rethink having all students graduate from high school within a set 12 year time period. Some students may be able to master the required curriculum content, for a high school diploma, within 11 years, whereas other students may take 13 years, or longer, to master the same required content for the diploma. The important factor is that all students do graduate, with mastery of the required curriculum having been achieved.
If a given student is identified as needing to take longer than 12 years to master curriculum concepts to graduate, then perhaps that student would be better served by taking 3 academic courses in a given quarter (as well as 2 on-the-job training courses, or 2 remedial courses) instead of taking the standard 5 academic courses per quarter, every quarter. To master all of the academic curriculum requirements, that student might need, then, to take 13 years to graduate from high school, with true mastery of all of the curriculum content having been achieved. Better to extend the time to master all of the curriculum, than to force some students to drop out of school because the required rate in which they must master concepts is too rapidly set for them. As a result, these particular students are being taught on their frustration, not instructional, levels.
It is time for educators (and the public) to stop blaming the students, and find a more feasible educational model for them to meet with success throughout their years in school. Look to a continuous progress model, with mastery of concepts tailored for each student throughout the student’s tenure in school.
redweather
December 30th, 2012
12:06 pm
@ Mary Elizabet, Graduating students from high school once they have achieved mastery might provide some additional incentive to learn. And if we are going “to stop blaming students” we should also stop blaming tachers.
redweather
December 30th, 2012
12:07 pm
I meant “Mary Elizabeth” and “teachers.”
Mary Elizabeth
December 30th, 2012
12:28 pm
@redweather, 12:06 pm
“And if we are going ‘to stop blaming students,’ we should also stop blaming teachers.”
=============================================
Amen to that!
“We” should simply change the instructional design of our schools to accommodate a realistic, continuous progress, mastery of curriculum, model for every student in grades k – 12 (or more), in the ways that I have tried to explain, and then “we” should educate teachers, administrators, parents, and students as to how that effective design would operate, in practice, for each student.
Private Citizen
December 30th, 2012
1:48 pm
Paulo / Mary Elisabeth, the culture deficits model link is really good information. A#1. http://www.education.com/reference/article/cultural-deficit-model Definitely the right information from the right perspective. Thanks!!
Private Citizen
December 30th, 2012
3:21 pm
Do you think repeated testing is “in conflict” with students’ needs and values and therefore contributes to student agitation / behavior?
” Irvine introduced the concept of cultural synchronization to describe how teachers’ beliefs about certain student groups may be in conflict with the actual motives, values, and needs of those students.” http://www.education.com/reference/article/teacher-beliefs/#C
Mary Elizabeth
December 30th, 2012
3:54 pm
@ Private Citizen, 1:48 pm
You are most welcome. Paulo shared the information in the link. I merely confirmed its value.
mountain man
December 30th, 2012
10:25 pm
“I get the distinct feeling some of you don’t know why we have students study subjects like algebra and geometry”
I learned geometry so I can lay out house corners. I use trigonometry to calculate volumes to do monthly inventory. I use mathematics to solve problems every day. I use English to write comprehensible reports and correspondence. I understand history so I know what people are arguing about when they talk about the Second Amendment and gun control.
Now, tell me how you judge if a student has “learned to think”? How do you test for that? Or is this just some vague term that only teachers can see and judge (ever read “The Emporer’s New Clothes”?)
mountain man
December 30th, 2012
10:29 pm
Tell me how many tons of rock are in a stockpile (cone-shaped) that is 100 feet across the base and has an angle of repose of 38 degrees (given the bulk density is 100 lbs/cu. ft.). If you have “learned to think”, you should be able to calculate this without having learned any facts about geometry or trigonometry. “Learning th think” will not tell you the formula for volume of a cone.
mountain man
December 30th, 2012
10:31 pm
You are in a restaurant and you get the bill for $38.26. You want to add a 15% gratuity (tip, that is). How much do you add? Or do you have to pull out your “smart” phone? Will “learning to think” tell you the answer?
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
2:21 am
@Mary Elizabeth
You might enjoy this encouraging story. Eboni defies the “culture deficit model” and gets accepted to Columbia University:
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/education/normandy-high-senior-overcomes-hardships-to-land-slot-in-ivy/article_d6b9f853-73ad-57af-9d71-6635a9a8b76b.html?mode=story
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
3:47 am
I was talking to a guy this past evening, asked me how it is going. I said, “Good!” He asked about the schoolhouse. I said, “Many places, there’s no textbooks.” He said for his kid in high school in Cobb County, for sports medicine class they watched all of the episodes of the tv series “House.”
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
4:11 am
?hey truth, It is unlikely that Eboni got the entire administrative staff removed from her school because they didn’t throw a party for her to recognise her acceptance at Colombia.
Which brings to mind, that along with BF’s complaint about Beverly Hall getting a superintendent’s award after the largest organised cheating scandal in the United States, there has still been no closure or explanation on Mr. Davis’ use a “racist remove” to remove staff at a school. I find this unacceptable and a blight on Atlanta. The message is: If you are non-black, do not work for Atlanta Public Schools of any other school system in Georgia with majority black management because you are a target for harassment. As far as I am concerned, this is the current legacy of Mr. Errol Davis and he appears to have zero interest in altering it. If I was rich, I would commission a bronze statue of him with the inscription, “Racist Player – A Blight on Atlanta.” Oh, is that too harsh? I think someone needs to do a government open records request to get the documents or justification used for the force-removal of those staff.
Message to non-blacks looking to work at schools in Georgia – due to the example set by Mr. Errol Davis of flagrant use of power, do not work in Georgia schools. You risk worker harassment and rough treatment with no explanation from the highly compensated managers who practice this abuse and who have no checks and balances on their professional activities. Avoid.
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
4:57 am
Professional Engineer exam guide: http://www.peexamguides.com/
10 Reasons to Become a Professional Engineer http://www.ieeeusa.org/careers/files/How%20To%20Become%20A%20PE.ppt
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
5:11 am
Taking the mechanical engineering Professional Engineer test http://felixwong.com/2007/04/mechanical-pe-exam/
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
6:05 am
Mr. Davis’ treatment of labor is akin to when Mr. Romney tied a dog onto the roof of the car for a family trip. Any professional would be crazy to put themselves in the position of working in that condition.
redweather
December 31st, 2012
8:04 am
@mountain man, You have proved my point, although I have one quibble. Students don’t learn geometry so they can build houses, but it sure enough comes in handy. You are on much firmer ground when you contend that you have used your education in various ways. Ergo, you passed the test of learning how to think.
mountain man
December 31st, 2012
9:19 am
“Ergo, you passed the test of learning how to think.”
No, I have always known “how to think”. Any six-year old who fashions a pretend pistol from a tree branch in order to play Army knows “how to think”. What I learned in schools were the skills and rules to apply my thinking in ways that can be beneficial.
And you still didn’t answer the question about measuring “thinking” apart from academic skills.
bu2
December 31st, 2012
10:10 am
“A guy who owns a store in Buckhead told me one time of when he was a little kid in the government schools, they had to do drills and crouch underneath their desks because “the Russians were coming.” I think it would be better today if big power stopped using marketing to try and “massage” everybody. Just do what you’re going to do. Get on with it.”
It was called a fallout drill. You’re obviously too young to remember the time when we expected a nuclear war. After WWI and WWII, most people expected III. I did fallout drills in my public elementary school. Sometimes you did fallout drills, sometimes fire drills (fallout-the radioactive material after the big blast).
It wasn’t any brainwashing experiment. You’re conspiracy theories require the government to actually be competent.
redweather
December 31st, 2012
10:18 am
@mountain man, “And you still didn’t answer the question about measuring “thinking” apart from academic skills.”
Why would we need to “measure thinking apart from academic skills”? Could it even be done? Wouldn’t there have to be an academic subject involved? And wouldn’t thinking have to be part of learning any academic subject? I can’t see how they can be separated. And I am not trying to be obtuse by asking these questions.
Mary Elizabeth
December 31st, 2012
10:23 am
@ Truth in Moderation, 2:21 am
“@Mary Elizabeth
You might enjoy this encouraging story. Eboni defies the “culture deficit model” and gets accepted to Columbia University. . .”
======================================================
I did thoroughly enjoy reading Eboni’s story, Truth in Moderation. Thank you very much for sharing Eboni’s inspiring story with me. Eboni is a young lady with many gifts who wants all of her talents to bloom, as well she should. I am very supportive of her efforts, and I am equally impressed with her qualities. Eboni was especially drawn to the maxim that “circumstances do not define your destiny.” Hers is a beautiful attitude, and there is much truth in that maxim, especially when one has an attitude as positive as is Eboni’s.
I, also, want to share a section of her story in which Eboni describes how her young mother exposed her to reading and language development, when she was a baby. I encourage all parents, or guardians, to read to their children early in their lives. This practice, alone, could help your children learn to read well in school. You are exposing your child, early, to the cadences of language in its written form, as well as exposing your child to many storylines, varied experiences, and interesting characters. You are aiding in developing your child’s ability to sustain concentration, and you are enhancing your child’s early language development, and imagination, by reading to your child with enthusiam and interest. The next step will, naturally, be that your child will want to read his, or her, own books. Start with easy to read “picture books” (with sequential plots) from public libraries, and then advance to picture books with some minimal word use under the pictures. Read the book first with your child, and later your child will be able to read those minmal words, by sight, for himself or herself. After that, begin to build your child’s knowledge of consonant names and then sounds (i.e. “b” sounds like “buh” and “d” sounds like “duh”) so that your child can work through sounding out unknown words in the context of the easy-to-read book’s plot development.) Note to interested readers: In my personal blog entitled, “Mary Elizabeh Sings,” one of my posts has been developed – in outline form – to teach parents and teachers “Word Attack Skills” (title of my post) in how to instruct their children and students in phonics and word attack skills from consonant and vowel sounds through syllabication and the meanings of prefixes, root words, and suffixes.
See below for the excerpt from Eboni’s story in which her mother reads to her as a baby:
“But when Eboni was a baby, Flurry (Eboni’s mother) began reading to her. She read through many of their moves, though it stopped when the family was in homeless shelters. She used letter-shaped refrigerator magnets to work on spelling.”
——————————————————————————————————
I want to share Cyndie’s story with you, Truth, as well as with other readers who may not have read Cyndie’s story, earlier. This is a true story of one of my previous teaching experiences, when an African-American junior in my high school Advanced Reading class approached me, late on one Friday afternoon, with her story. Cyndie’s story is not as dramatic, in impact, as Eboni’s story, but Cyndie “gave” her story to me that Friday afternoon, after school, with the understanding that I would continue to share her story with other students who are behind their peers in their reading skills. I will share it again, today, in behalf of Cyndie, for all of those students – and for all of their teachers and their parents who want to find ways to help their children and their students – who are behind others in their grade level in their reading skills. The good news is that these students can “catch up” to their grade level peers, and that they can eventually even optimize their own potential, as Cyndie did. Cyndie’s story will show the way.
http://maryelizabethsings.wordpress.com/2012/02/11/cyndies-story/
mountain man
December 31st, 2012
10:25 am
“And wouldn’t thinking have to be part of learning any academic subject? I can’t see how they can be separated.”
Exactly my point. I apologize if I misunderstood you, but I took it that you were arguing for less testing because we should be teaching “learning to think” rather than academic skills (which can be measured by testing).
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
11:02 am
redweather, yes, there are all kinds of ways to measure thinking, reasoning and logic. go look at sample questions for the LSAT law school entrance test, most of it is testing reasoning and logic. I recently emailed to me friend a link to YouTube video of forklift accidents. My friend immediately emailed back, “Yes, most people can not think in three dimensions.” I was impressed by his answer. A forklift moves on an x/y Cartesian plane on the ground (named after Rene DeCartes) but when you add the forks going up and down, that is the third axis. Sort of the difference of a circle and sphere or ball. Two dimensions to three. I have before thought the same of humanities study, using thee dimensions to look at a subject, one being time, one being location. The same applies to music and persons who write music scores with eight things going on. How does that work?
Tests are not my thing, but certainly higher order skills up to “olympiad” thinking level can be “tested” and there are techniques for same. Testing can be view as a fine art, like expensive champagne. Not sure what testing has to do with anything relevant as long as kids do not have eyeglasses and support materials and organization is as spotty and vacant as it is now.
Hey redweather, maybe you ought to have a look at the “MENSA” test. It is pretty popular for someone calling themselves smart. I knew on “Mensa” approved person who worked at CNN. This person didn’t seem too smart to me. They lived in a concrete bunker type apartment downtown and acted very cool. Meanwhile CNN was lying like nobody’s business, telling whole clothe lies repeating war propaganda. “Osama bin Laden has new golf clubs!” “Osama bin Laden has a new golf cart!” “Meanwhile, let’s blame him and then go bomb a different country, Iraq!” If industrial level lying and treating people that way. Well, let’s just say they must leave off morality and ethics from the “MENSA” test. Sample questions: http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1989-01-04/entertainment/8902220824_1_typists-chickens-eggs
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
11:13 am
If you want to teach “learning to think,” the way this is done is through the formal teaching of logic, a branch of philosophy. It is not taught in U.S. high schools. Some places it is?
Here is a paper from Israel technology school talking about the importance of teaching logic (how to think) to high school students. http://jite.org/documents/Vol8/JITEv8IIP001-016Bouhnik681.pdf
There is also information online about “Good Ideas for Teaching Formal Logic to Middle School & High School”
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
11:34 am
““Mensa” approved person who worked at CNN. This person didn’t seem too smart to me. They lived in a concrete bunker type apartment downtown and acted very cool. Meanwhile CNN was lying like nobody’s business, telling whole clothe lies repeating war propaganda.”
Are you talking about Wolf Blitzer?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2QMQi-m63E
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
12:18 pm
@PC
You are quite right about the need to teach logic. Many home schoolers now teach it. My public high school used applied logic to teach Euclid’s geometric proofs.
Christian author and professor C.S. Lewis championed the teaching of logic:
“Why don’t they teach logic at these schools?”
At one point in the classic book The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe by C.S. Lewis, an exasperated professor utters the words, “Logic! Why don’t they teach logic at these schools?” 1Lewis not only believed in truth, but also in our ability to use logic as an aid in determining truth.
http://www.focusonthefamily.com/faith/faith_in_life/defending_the_faith/defend_the_faith_like_cs_lewis_part_1.aspx
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
1:33 pm
hey Truth, after reading a page of CS Lewis, I sort of saw this author as a Mark Twain knock off. ha. I know he is well regarded by many. Allow me to dial up a story for you, I printed out the first part for one of my “advanced” students (differentiated instruction?). Well that went absolutely nowhere. Anyway, I think of this as an example of superb writing. Maybe it will interest you. There is a “moral to the story” as well, but it is perhaps a more sublime approach that what we are accustomed to over her in the land of marketing, required store “discount” cards, and computer morphed talking animal commercials made by graduates of trendy “art” schools. Here’s a teaspoon of the real elixir: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/1237/1237-h/1237-h.htm
Note, there are other, perhaps better, more crisp translations into English, but this is easily accessible.
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
1:42 pm
“I discovered Dorothy L. Sayers through homeschooling as the author of “The Lost Tools of Learning”. It was only after I read that, learned she was a contemporary and friend of C.S. Lewis and J.R.R. Tolkien that I stumbled on her original claim to fame–Lord Peter Wimsey.”
Comment on Goodreads blog
@PC
Your link to “Israel technology school” opens with this Dorothy Sayers quote:
“For we let our young men and women go out unarmed in a day when armor was never so necessary. By teaching them all to read, we have left them at the mercy of the printed word. By the invention of the film and the radio, we have made certain that no aversion to reading shall secure them from the incessant battery of words, words, words. They do not know what the words mean; they do not know how to ward them off or blunt their edge or fling them back; they are a prey to words in their emotions instead of being the masters of them in their intellects…” Dorothy Sayers, “The Lost Tools of Learning”, speech at Ox- ford, 1947.
Lewis and Tolkien were both Oxford dons.
BTW, some of the “Lost Tools” are the study of Latin (word origins, pre-fixes-root-suffixes) and LOGIC.
The public schools began removing these tools after WWll. All that was left of logic was the study of Euclid’s Geometry proofs. Now, they don’t even teach that.
True education has been replaced by Outcomes Based Education (Bloom’s Taxonomy) and its assessments.
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
1:43 pm
Interestingly, Benjamin Bloom served as “educational advisor to the governments of India (1957) and Israel (1963-1968)”.
http://www.citejournal.org/articles/v7i4CP1_module1.swf
Perhaps that is why the technical school was trying to recover the “lost tools of learning,” yes?
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
2:01 pm
@PC
LOL! YOUR DISTRACTOR STRATEGY BACKFIRED!
No one cares about your unprofessional opinion of Lewis’ book. THE TOPIC WAS LOGIC, remember?
LOL!
Observer
December 31st, 2012
2:36 pm
@ Truth. No-one cares about CS Lewis, either.
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
2:43 pm
“Observer” only appears when PC., Prof, or inHumanist go down in flames…LOL!
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
3:22 pm
Wow that hypocrite video is hilarious. What a bunch of voo-doo these actors are.
Synonyms
bewitch – enchant – witch – charm – spell
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
3:41 pm
@PC
Yeah. I hear lot’s of citizens won’t be spending their Federal Reserve notes supporting the Hollywood fools.
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
3:54 pm
“Thank you for telling me about Dorothy Sayers.”
@PC
Ummmm. YOU WERE THE ONE THAT POSTED THE LINK TO THE SCHOOL THAT HAD HER QUOTE AT THE TOP OF ITS PAGE.
I guess you post first, read later?????????????
I think your handlers need to get a new obstructionist. Do you make minimum wage?
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
4:02 pm
Well, maybe Selena G. will have to get back with Justin B. She just might need someone to support her lifestyle now. LOL!
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
4:02 pm
Dear Wacky Truth, I post a link to a paper about teaching logic. You’re the one who culled the Dorothy Sayers thing and expanded on it that she lectured CS Whazzit and JRR Tolkien. By the way, pretty much anyone I have know who reads/like CS Lewis and Tolkien seems to be hermetically sealed and it is like they read these works and are done. They have found “reading” and their “home base” and it ends at these two authors as if they have found heaven. Meanwhile, I think of them as bubble gum in the round glass bowl gum machine in the corner of the book store…
hey, flipping the coin, have you ever met an enthusiast for Madame Blavatsky? Now that’s a strange bunch, closed off in a different way.
Truth in Moderation
December 31st, 2012
4:46 pm
Well, maybe Sarah S. was a little set up in that vid. If you feel sorry for her, just watch her You Tube video so you can get the views up to 4 million….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3RYrQSir7k&feature=player_embedded
Private Citizen
December 31st, 2012
6:40 pm
Truth, I request that you immediately stop posting information as satire of me, paragraphs of nonsense speak. Okay? Sound good? You’ve done it twice now, like a new hobby. This is a proper / formal request asking you to observe good boundaries. If you have an idea to express, please do so. If you have a dialogue response to a post, please say so. If you wish to recreationally spam me, please refrain from doing so.
Truth in Moderation
January 1st, 2013
12:26 am
@PC
What are you talking about?
Prof
January 1st, 2013
11:23 am
@ Truth, Jan. 1, 12:26 am.
Evidently, Maureen has diplomatically removed your two posts from yesterday afternoon and evening, one on the “STEM degrees” thread and one on this one, in which you supposedly “quoted” Private Citizen as posting in some gibberish-Latin. But I can testify that you did post them, for I read them and so I guess did PC. I thought at the time: “That’s not a very Christian thing to do.”
Truth in Moderation
January 1st, 2013
12:50 pm
“That’s not a very Christian thing to do.”
Hmmm. Exposing the works of darkness, the obstructionists to truth, and using a little satire to do it sounds just like what Jesus would do. Well….actually, He was more direct! Forgive me.
27 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which indeed appear beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men’s bones and all uncleanness.”
Matthew 23:27
Prof
January 1st, 2013
1:40 pm
Indeed.
Mary Elizabeth
January 1st, 2013
1:58 pm
For any who may perceive that my support of Eboni’s overcoming of her unfortunate “circumstances” to be admitted to Columbia University is in contradiction to my endorsement of the “cultural deficit model,” as shared by Paulo’s earlier link, I wish to state that there is no contradiction in my perception.
I have frequently avowed that improvement in the education, and in the class status, of the underclasses will take a combination of personal initiative and societal programs which are targeted to help the underclasses. Both approaches are needed for our nation to achieve the realization of the “more perfect union” to which are forefathers aspired for America. In order to achieve this more perfect union, imo, citizens must come to see that some dichotomies which are seemingly in contraposition may, in fact, work in harmony when we perceive with the larger vision of inclusion, not only of ideas, but of all people.
Happy New Year to all!