If you want better schools, rural or otherwise, improve motivation and discipline of students
My blog entry on rural schools, prompted by an AJC Sunday story on rural education in Georgia, spurred a lot of comments, including this email from retired educator and school head Dennis Brown of Villa Rica. (I have shared other responses by Brown on teacher quality.)
Here is his latest:
There is always a need for more great teachers in the classroom. But the title of your article this morning, “How do we entice great teachers to move to remote rural schools,” suggests there are none there today. That’s just not the case.
There are some great teachers already in place. But their effectiveness is muted and often their hands tied by pedagogy and lack of equipment. Let’s first attack the real problem – and while I hesitate to use it to identify what that real problem is, the saying “If you want to improve the prisons, improve the prisoners” is never more true in our schools than it is today.
State of mind and environment before the student even enters the classroom is the key – and that begins at home and in the community at large. Even the best of teachers can’t overcome a classroom filled with unmotivated and non-disciplined students. And even more than for the teacher, I feel sorry for the one or two motivated students in a classroom filled with another 30 just putting in their time and more interested in the social interaction than the learning.
Expectations are more often than not lowered and even some of the most basic academic challenges abandoned to teach to the masses. Of course, the results are sub par. The results I’m talking about include not only questionable standardized testing scores, but also increased drop-out and decreased high school graduation rates, and youngsters with entitlement mentalities turned loose in society.
Bottom line — let’s stop pointing the finger at the schools and suggest that attracting “great” teachers is the answer to turning things around.
Let’s put the money, the publicity and time where the problem really lies – first defining what educational outcomes are desired in that community and its schools and then addressing through public forums and workshops the parents’ responsibilities at home in the setting of guidelines and expectations for their children’s performance.
–From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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113 comments Add your comment
Ron F.
November 19th, 2012
11:32 pm
“it may be that the Common Core movement will start to drag American education kicking and screaming away from mincomp testing drill and kill rote recall and actually let teachers be teachers again. Let’s hope.”
So far, I think I agree with you. We’ll have to see what the assessments look like to know for sure. Samples we’ve seen so far in Language Arts have constructed response questions (explain in writing) questions along with multiple choice. If that is the final model, I expect a few years will be needed to find out if kids can do that successfully.
Ron F.
November 19th, 2012
11:36 pm
“Half of all the citizens in the USA are below average – deal with it!”
The bell curve has always been there and always will be! I also believe that education needs to tailor itself to meet the needs of those on the lower end and the higher end, and we don’t need to try to do it in the same classroom. I totally LOVE working with the lower end kids, who often learn successfully given a little more time and a lot more encouragement and structure. They are teachable, but their aspirations in life are decidedly different. They have the potential to be quite successful in life, but it won’t be as likely to be the result of four-year college degrees. We have to get back to helping them find a way to be productive via technical colleges and apprenticeships that can lead to very good careers.
Bring back the 60s
November 19th, 2012
11:44 pm
You can thank the lawyers, judges, republican party, democratic party, lobbyists etc. for all the problems within our public school systems. It does not matter which party has been in office the last 40 years, the system has raped itself. I went to school in the Atlanta Public School system in the 50s and 60s and parents and the school system demanded discipline and good marks in school. Parents were held accountable when standards were not met. Teachers were held accountable when standards were not met. There were no rankings which would only create cheating by the schools as we have seen in Atlanta. You abided by the rules or you were sent home and dealt with at home and you came back with a different attitude. I only remember a handful of drop outs. Im sick and tired of poverty being blamed for every single area that people have failed themselves and their children. As soon as I graduated my parents had the foresight to get themselves and my brothers and I out of what had been a prosperous and working middle class Lakewood Heights in south Atlanta. Your political parties have failed you and increased their own wealth at your expense America. When is everyone going to wake up and see this. Blame each other’s party all you want. It is all about them and nothing about us or our children. This country and everything in it isnt going to hell my friend, it is already there.
TeacherNoMore
November 20th, 2012
12:58 am
Unless fists fly, a weapon is discovered, or blood is drawn, students who are referred to the administrative office- more time than not- receive a slap on the wrist and sent back to class. From experience, I know that (at my former school) many office referrals were rejected, not filed, and ultimately disposed of- and this practice occurred for one reason and one reason only: MONEY. If a school accumulates too many office referrals and exceeds the limit of student detentions, in-school suspensions, or out of school suspensions, then the school is subject to receiving less funding. One thing I learned after 20+ yrs of teaching is that when my career began, I could “reach” all but one or two students(you can’t save ‘em all); but my how times have changed since then. During the latter part of my once chosen profession, I considered myself lucky to have “reached” one or two students. People like to talk about leaving a better planet for our children, when really>>PEOPLE SHOULD TALK ABOUT LEAVING BETTER CHILDREN FOR OUR PLANET~~and it all starts AT HOME!
Private Citizen
November 20th, 2012
1:44 am
Dear Fellow Plantation Dwellers, Blaming children for the condition of schools is unconscionable and represents dereliction of duty and an abandonment of the children by adults. I will address this paradigm in two parts: 1) greater social issues / conditions, and 2) a crisis in government school management.
Greater social issues.
1. You live in a state where half the people do not have access to health care without hassle and / or ruined credit or bankrupcty. Once I began keeping track and discussing it with my teaching team, I saw that 20% of our students were in need of eyeglasses and did not have them. This alone is a significant disruption to learning. You can not seem to comprehend that the rest of the developed world has health care for their people, they care for their people regardless of caste or ability to pay and the result is a functioning, sophisticated, productive, educated populace. This is not the case for the U. S. We have one foot firmly planted in the first world and one foot firmly planted in the third world.
2. You live in a country where anti-trust laws have been removed from the law and put to the side. This gives your corporations inordinate power and little accountability. One result is that your food supply has been tainted. It is a complex thing, but truth is your kids are fat. And maybe the most significant effect of removing anti-trust laws that used to protect against consolidated ownership is the result on your media. Your broadcast programming is cheaply made, often violent and tawdry. This is not how tv is in all of the world. There is not such an emphasis on it or attention to it. It is quieter and not like a violent fantasy stirring up the people who do not know any better. Your tv is not sober. Most people do not know to get rid of it.
In other words, you have allowed unhealthy and uncaring conditions for your children. You are reaping the results as they are being exploited and not cared for. Let’s talk about the crisis in management.
1. Children need and seek caring authority and enforced boundaries.
2. It is true that in Georgia disruptive students are allowed to stay in the classroom. There are a few participants here prescribing progressive methods to engage students. This does not address that there exists some students who are deranged hellions. Some of these have lived at more addresses than they have years of life. There are students who throw textbooks high into the air to see them crash to the floor and then do it again on another day, who jump up as quick as a mongoose and cut telephone cord with scissors and will do it twenty times. There are students, who when timed out in the hall will jump up and bang on the windows of the classroom. There are students who are determined to “run the classroom” and create chaos. There are students who will chant and burble in the classroom, who have “issues.” Currently a teacher is expected to teach their class with all of these type students to be included in the classroom. The net result is a lack of structure and an ongoing inefficient teaching environment. It also plants seeds for anyone who is inclined to join the fun. Why try and focus above this level of disruption. Why not just join the carnival? The state has recently put significant pressure on troubled schools to not discipline students who act out. This is coming from the state and creates significant stress and difficulty for the school. Every government school reports to the state and can be singled out for direction from the state. The state better have it right because they’re in everybody’s business and are directing individual schools based on required reports that include specific reporting on discipline.
3. There is now a culture in the United States where high schools are considered to be caring places of refuge for pregnant teenage students. I’ve had to stop class when a student brought their sonogram images to class and passed them around for everyone to see the wonder of life.
4. One may wish to consider that perhaps? there used to be alternative resources for both troubled acting-out students and pregnant students, too? Seems the inclusion idea has proceeded to become a lack of specialized environments. School becomes a legally required daytime gathering place for students up to age 16.
5. Students are now constantly threatened with testing.
6. Someone needs to take the “Hope Scholarship” and get rid of it and be glad to do so. This mechanism is the sole reason that accurate grades can not awarded to students who do or do not earn them. You may also wish to consider the karmic idea or otherwise of connecting a gambling operation so thoroughly with education. It’s a bad and inappropriate idea. If the people want gambling, give them casinos. State sponsored gambling fits well with a dereliction of duty from adult managers. Is that what you want? And everyone knows that gaming is predatory to the participants. The state should not be in the business of being a predator to citizens.
The basic premise of Mr. Brown’s observation of an unwholesome condition of students should be addressed through looking at the cause and effect of social conditions for students and families. It is ancillary to education issue, not directly related. School is neither the cause or remedy of the life and attitude conditions of students and families, not when the media is non-competing, cheaply made and violent, good food is more expensive than packaged sugars and fatty meat byproducts, and no one in 50% of the populace has dignified or affordable access to health services, which is a standard in every single modern country outside of the United States.
The adults have a say when it comes to quality of management in the schools. As long as the state is telling you what to do and the state has the wrong idea, you’re in real trouble with an outside force literally subverting the management of the school house. Is it ten people at the state telling 10 million what to do? It seems that way. This is same doctrine at play when the state mandates that teachers write their (the state’s) badly written declarations on the boards in the classroom and then the teacher is “graded” for work review on it they have done this. It’s a recipe for an idiot.
Thank you sincerely Mr. Brown of Villa Rica for making haste to remove some of the scapegoating from teachers. Let’s not move the scapegoating onto the students. It makes little sense to blame the driver if the car is crummy or the roads are not kept or designed well. Let’s place credit where credit is due, credit for dysfunction, to the greater social conditions that we need to take responsibility for, including the removal of anti-trust laws that used to protect us from too much centralized power and over-consolidation, and that formerly required competition from companies, and also for the greater school management that seeds and encourages gambling and uses it to require high or passing grades for any student who shows up, that keeps in the classroom students who are determined to disrupt, and provides little other support remedy for these same students, and …. well, you finish it. Have a good day.
Private Citizen habenero 101 cause and effect specialist, hit the center of the dartboard and bowl 300
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
7:19 am
“For most students, learning stops when they enter the school door. Instead of blaming students and parents, I challenge all educators to bring the 21st century into your classrooms. You might be surprised at how quickly those thugs become superstars!”
So all we have to do is make learning a video game, and we are home free, right?
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
7:22 am
“What matters is: “How many kids started the 9th grade in year one, and how many kids graduated at the end of year four?” When administrators throw out troublemakers, all that does it make it harder to make AYP.”
You are right, Old Physics Teacher, the NCLB program was fatally flawed when it was put into place.
We are aghast at APS’ blatant cheating on test scores, but ALL of the schools are cheating when they graduate students who can’t read or write.
Logical Dad
November 20th, 2012
7:46 am
Private Citizen gets it. There is no cookie-cutter solution to a systemic problem that has taken root in our schools due to years of intransigence by state and local administrators. For too long, the focus has been on sneaking religion into public schools (i.e. prayer, “Rally Round The Pole,” moments of silence, the bible as a historical text), athletics (actual quote from the school board chairman in my home county: “Yeah, we probably do need to build a second high school, but I don’t want to dilute the power of the football team.”) and this preposterous notion that beating kids will improve test scores (despite Mountain Man’s lies, there were in excess of 22,000 incidents of “corporal punishment” in Georgia schools in 2011. Sad, really, that all were in rural schools. You know, the ones with low test scores?)
The answer, to me, is simple: If a student does not want to be in school – don’t force him to be. As the spouse of a small, VERY small, business owner, I can attest that the absolute worst employee is the one who does not want to be there. Even if an otherwise dedicated employee is having trouble grasping the core duties, that employee is easy to work with and the problem is relatively easy to solve. No amount of motivation will convince a disinterested employee to (a) do the job, or (b) not become a cancer in the office. Students are exactly the same and should be treated the same way.
To those that say we are throwing away young lives. I disagree. They are throwing their own lives away. We are just watching them do it after years and years of trying to tell them not to.
Culling the herd may be a bit of a “tough love” answer, but it is a guaranteed success.
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
7:56 am
“No amount of motivation will convince a disinterested employee to (a) do the job, or (b) not become a cancer in the office. Students are exactly the same and should be treated the same way.”
I agree wholeheartedly with logical dad (even if he did call me a liar) – we need to concentrate on teaching the students who WANT to be taught and whose parents WANT them to succeed in school and remove the trouble makers to their own “pre-prison”.
What is the future of public education?
November 20th, 2012
8:09 am
Public education will never be the same. Too often, excuses are made and accepted for misbehaving students who are not interested in learning. Parents must parent, there is no other solution. Teachers are subjected to the most dismal working conditions. In fact, if student’s misbehave, there is a brand new principal in Clayton County who coddles the students for cursing and threatening the teachers. She does not discipline them at all. Single parents have choices; among them the ability to control the number of children that you bring into the world. No, the children are not responsible, but parents need to understand that raising a child is not easy or cheap.
Lee
November 20th, 2012
8:25 am
@RonF, re “The bell curve has always been there and always will be! I also believe that education needs to tailor itself to meet the needs of those on the lower end and the higher end, and we don’t need to try to do it in the same classroom.”
That’s what I’ve been advocating for years. It makes little sense to plop the student with a 120 IQ next to the student with an 80 IQ and expect them to learn in the same manner and same pace. But that’s what our public schools do for the first eight years of a child’s education. Only in high school can the students begin to segregate themselves by ability by enrolling in the A/P, Honors, College Prep classes.
Unfortunately, political correctness will not allow grouping by achievement level. The predictable result would be that the advanced classes would be filled with asian/white students and the lower achieving classes would be filled with hispanic/black students. Lord knows we can’t have that…
———————————
Fifty years ago, Lyndon Johnson set America on a path to destruction with his “Great Society” initiatives – among which, we began paying parasites and idiots money to procreate. The end result are these two Obama supporters.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DL-a-r7iJIU&feature=g-vrec
Failing schools are just a symptom of a much larger problem.
MiltonMan
November 20th, 2012
8:26 am
Teachers/Education majors bragging about being A students??? As an undergrad, it blew me away how easy it was to obtain an education degree and numerous studies have pointed this out. I will take a C math/science/engineering major over an A education student anytime.
http://www.aei.org/article/education/k-12/grade-inflation-for-education-majors-and-low-standards-for-teachers/
indigo
November 20th, 2012
8:30 am
Private Citizen – 1:44
I really enjoyed reading that excerpt from you book. Have you published yet?
Solutions
November 20th, 2012
8:31 am
With uncle stupid providing free food via food stamps, free health care via medicaid and obamacare, free housing via section 8, and free public babysitting via property taxes on innocent property owners, these lazy rural kids have nothing to fear, their future is secure! Sleep till noon, do what ever they want, food, housing, health care, and child care are all covered by uncle obama!
Solutions
November 20th, 2012
8:34 am
The kids could use a car, so in his second term, perhaps ObamaWheels will pass, allowing the poor to have a new Lincoln Town Car every three years, plus a carton of cigarettes every week via CigaretteStamps!
Grandpa
November 20th, 2012
8:34 am
Well said. He is absolutely correct. It does start at home. People that do not feel any responsibility for themselves will unfortunately never be productive member of society, i.e. “youngsters with entitlement mentalities turned loose in society.” They learn that entitlement mentality at home (or wherever they go when they are not in school.) Their problems are always someone elses fault. This is not a problem fixed by better teachers. I dare say all people fresh out of college with their degree in education set out to change the world one student at a time. But I can tell you from experience, many fall prey to the pitfalls noted by Mr. Brown.
Solutions
November 20th, 2012
8:36 am
Oh, don’t forget the free ObamaPhone, paid for by the Universal Service Fee on each and every telephone you own, land line or cell.
Grandpa
November 20th, 2012
8:39 am
Private Citizen, you’re a schmuck. Your type of thinking is a large part of what generated the first group of entitlement babies.
rural county dweller
November 20th, 2012
8:40 am
“Private Citizen” has no clue.
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
8:42 am
“despite Mountain Man’s lies, there were in excess of 22,000 incidents of “corporal punishment” in Georgia schools in 2011. Sad, really, that all were in rural schools. You know, the ones with low test scores?”
I am not advocating corporal punishment as the “magic bullet” to end all our discipline isues. In some schools, if a teacher pulled out a paddle, the student would just say “F*** you, teach” or else pull out a gun and shoot the teacher. I believe that a little paddling could make a difference in the lower grades ONLY.
My point was that teachers are left with NO EFFECTIVE SOLUTIONS to the discipline problems that plague their classrooms. What do you do? Stand them in the corner? Good luck with that. Time out in the hall? They leave, or continue to disrupt your and other classes. In the past you would send them to the office but I have described how that turns out. Can’t put a “dunce” cap on them anymore – might hurt their feelings, which will directly cause them to become thugs and end up in jail. That is why I think discipline should be handled and enforced by ADMINISTRATORS. Get the hard-core discipline problems out of the classroom and deal with them separately. IN-school suspension? It is a joke – why not give the kid exactly what they want – to get out of studying. Keep them after school? Used to work, but, oh, I forgot – not every parent has a working car, so we have to cater to their issues. Can’t have their child miss the bus – no transportation.
sloboffthestreet
November 20th, 2012
8:50 am
Mountain Man responds,
“I agree wholeheartedly with logical dad (even if he did call me a liar) – we need to concentrate on teaching the students who WANT to be taught and whose parents WANT them to succeed in school and remove the trouble makers to their own “pre-prison”.
That is one way to solve the problem. Another is to use peer pressure against the ill behaved classmates. When a majority of classmates are allowed to become vocal against disruptive cruel classmates once a day for 15 minutes it is much more effective than pulling a ticket with a certain color or being put in the corner with a dunce cap or walking laps at reecess. One thing we all desire from birth to death is to be accepted by our peers. Allow fellow classmates to fix the problem and determine the punishment. It’s amazing just how smart children really are. Try thinking of them as people instead of “Your Students.”
Another point I would like to address is a comment I hear all too often. “The Rules In My Class are,,,,” Well wouldn’t it be better to make the rules in every class the same. That way when students move from grade to grade they don’t have to adapt to each teachers idiosyncrasies. Instead they are already well versed in what is expected of them and can immediately direct their efforts to learning.
I read Jerry Eads is not in favor of teaching students math facts. How sad. Here is someone who claims to be at the forefront of education and does not realize children require being taught a fact 10 -12 times before the average student retains this fact. Some children need to be taught that 6+9 is the same as 9+6. Who knew? Once armed with this simple fact they do seem to move on at a accelerated pace and beam with pride having command of “The Facts.” So called “Kill & Drill.” It appears the great educational leaders prefer having middle school students using fingers and toes to accomplish correct answers on their Algebra tests. I imagine they arrive at the correct answer. Perhaps it just takes a little longer. Perhaps these are the “Higher Order Thinkers” I hear educators speak of all the time.
And would someone please explain how John Madden, a high school graduate, had mastered a “Smart Board” years ago and Highly Qualified Educators struggle to grasp how to use such a high priced blackboard filled with all the free educational material the internet has to offer? Perhaps it was his middle school education attending “Our Lady of Perpetual Help.” I am not a fan of religion in schools but just maybe there is something to it? NNNAAA,,,, Can’t be!
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
9:27 am
“And would someone please explain how John Madden, a high school graduate, had mastered a “Smart Board” years ago and Highly Qualified Educators struggle to grasp how to use such a high priced blackboard filled with all the free educational material the internet has to offer? ”
The problems in our schools have nothing to do with “smart boards” or materials. Do you need to look it up on the internet to discover that 7 times 6 equals 42? They make multiplication cards for that – printed in 1946. But you can’t teach a student that isn’t at school, no matter how many “smart boards” you have.
“Another is to use peer pressure against the ill behaved classmates. ”
Peer pressure? What if the majority of the class wants to be just like the troublemaker. Sorry, your ideas sound like more of the touchy-feely, don’t-hurt-their-feelings, mumbo-jumbo that has put us on a downward slide for the past forty years.
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
9:30 am
“It appears the great educational leaders prefer having middle school students using fingers and toes to accomplish correct answers on their Algebra tests. I imagine they arrive at the correct answer. ”
As long as it is less than 20 (ten if they can’t get their brand-new Nike shoes off).
HS Math Teacher
November 20th, 2012
9:37 am
Unmotivated students? Ha! How about those teachers who were once motivated, but lost their zeal and enthusiasm when forced to teach rigorous courses to ALL kids, 30+ kids in a room at a time. Now, we have a faction of unmotivated teachers trying to teach a faction of unmotivated students. It only takes a few unmotivated students to cause problems in each class.
Education leaders at the state and local level just baffle me. They make it easy for kids to hop & skip through the early grades, but clamp down on them once they get to high school. When these ill-prepared kids start failing, here come the RTI nazis, and create a bunch of work and documentation for the poor teacher who has to be on the front line teaching these “unmotivated” kids. A kid gets a dozen write-ups for discipline, and they’re right back in the class with that Cheshire Cat grin…gleaming gold tooth and all.
Fortunately, my environment isn’t this bad. However, I have friends who teach at other, larger schools, and they are in a living hell. They can’t get out of teaching, in that they’ve had too many years invested (retirement).
There are some students who will never conform, and won’t do what you tell them to do. For these kids, teach them basic algebra, basic geometry, basic statistics, and put them in vocational courses that keep them busy with something that has a half-chance of working. I’m convinced that most of the troubled kids act up because they know they either can’t, or won’t succeed in the academic classroom.
IF YOU WANT BETTER SCHOOLS, STOP CHARGING AT WINDMILLS! DO WHAT MAKES SENSE. DO WHAT WORKS!
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
10:00 am
“A kid gets a dozen write-ups for discipline, and they’re right back in the class with that Cheshire Cat grin…gleaming gold tooth and all. ”
Thank you, HS Math Teacher, for backing up what I have been saying all along. There is no ADMINISTRATION support for teachers.
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
10:01 am
“IF YOU WANT BETTER SCHOOLS, STOP CHARGING AT WINDMILLS! DO WHAT MAKES SENSE. DO WHAT WORKS!”
Why would ADMINISTRATORS want to do that? That would require gonads!
Proud Teacher
November 20th, 2012
10:07 am
I was lucky enough to have an administrator to gently let me know repeatedly that the thug in the classroom who led the disruption and the street attitude of the failing students were my fault. Even though I taught a core subject that included an EOCT, I needed to put less stress on the students with tests and learning specifics I knew they needed for the EOCT and have more fun projects and engaging activities on block scheduling. No pressure there!
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
10:28 am
“I was lucky enough to have an administrator to gently let me know repeatedly that the thug in the classroom who led the disruption and the street attitude of the failing students were my fault.”
Which is why I will NEVER be a k-12 teacher and I will discourage ANYONE thinking of being a teacher from entering this profession. Until there is a severe shortage of teachers, things will NEVER change (probably not even then, they will just bring in teacherrs from China – and endless source).
sloboffthestreet
November 20th, 2012
10:33 am
Hey “MOUNTAIN MAN” chuckle, chuckle,
Have you ever solved a problem in your entire life or does your entire skill set stop at complaining.
You wrote,
“Peer pressure? What if the majority of the class wants to be just like the troublemaker.”
Do you need someone to hold your hand. Perhaps your MOMMY can help you. If you are a school teacher please find another line of employment far away from children.
If you care to remove your head from the sand you may find that peer mediation is the best solution to solving classroom problems and conflict between students. If the entire class hates you as the teacher and are in full rebellion against you, please refer to my first piece of advice. Get out of education. What many educators dislike about peer mediation at any grade level is that it removes the educators personal power and hands it to the students. “Their Students.” How could it be possible that “Their Students” could solve any problem so complex they ask themselves? Maybe your Big Foot thinking mind doesn’t fit the inner city school student way of life. To some people Nike sneaks are a status symbol. For others it is the moose on their clothes and some must drive the BMW or Benz. So when we lack as individuals we seem to turn to having a possession that we feel makes us stand out. Identifies us. Makes us unique. Makes us special or different than everyone else. The “LOOK AT ME” syndrome. So sad we as a society require such material possessions to make us feel complete. Or do they?
As for smart boards, once again a teacher dismisses their greatest resource for educational material and prepared lessons. THE INTERNET. Teachers cry about not having time to lesson plan when in fact it is so often already done for them. They cry about THE STANDARDS. Let me see if I can be of some help. If the standard for the week is Adaptation in science for example, you as the teacher go to your search box and type in, “ADAPTATION.” I just did that very thing and look what I found in less than 2 minutes.
http://www.cotf.edu/ETE/modules/msese/earthsysflr/adapt.html
Now send home the link, email the link to parents or print out the lesson for those who do not have internet service and the work is done for you and done very well. I know you have already created an excuse why this will not be effective. I say BS on you.
Oh, you are teaching 5th grade math and need resources to help students in class and at home? IXL to the rescue. This also took less than one minute of lesson planning.
http://www.cotf.edu/ETE/modules/msese/earthsysflr/adapt.html
Pick the grade level, then the discipline and click on it. Now if you need anything simpler than just that, there is no reason you collect a check weekly from the state taxpayers impersonating a public school teacher.
As to your flash card comment I am a huge fan of kill & drill for addition, subtraction and multiplication facts. Make it fun with a side of challenge and you just might find your students respond in a positive manner. They may even learn something. If not, please once again, rethink your career choice. It just may not be for you.
sloboffthestreet
November 20th, 2012
10:42 am
IXL link
http://www.ixl.com/promo?partner=google&phrase=IXL%20-%20Branded%20-%20Georgia&gclid=CMjtmtbl3bMCFQiqnQod3xYArA
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
11:11 am
“Now send home the link, email the link to parents or print out the lesson for those who do not have internet service and the work is done for you and done very well. I know you have already created an excuse why this will not be effective. I say BS on you.”
This could be an effective procedure – at, say, Walton High or Pope in East Cobb. I have been talking about raising the bar for the worst of the worst schools. How are you going to e-mail the link to the parents when they don’t own a computer? When they don’t care or are working two jobs or they (she) is strung out on drugs? How are you going to get the students to do the work when they don’t want to be seen as “too white”.
And, no, I have not ever been a k-12 teacher, nor will I ever be. I have solved many problems in my lifetime, but you are correct, I do enjoy complaining. PLEASE, improve the schools and take away my reasons for complaining.
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
11:34 am
Slob – you are trying to teach science students “adaptation” and I am just trying to get students to be able to read basic sentences, to write coherent thoughts, and to do simple arithmetic without a calculator. Especially if they hold a high school diploma.
It really bugs me when I go through McDonald’s and they tell me I owe them $3. 05, so I give them a five and a nickel and they have to call a manager, who then instructs them to give me back two dollar bills and 95 cents in change.
frankie
November 20th, 2012
12:40 pm
And what do yodo with the students who don’t get it…because of their upbringing and parents. Throw them away, unleash them on the streets…believe me we have enough of the students and their parents on the streets causing other issues, ie crime, murder, etc….
Archie
November 20th, 2012
1:51 pm
@Mountain Man: I’ve also noticed in recent years that the number of cashiers that can’t count change is increasing. A word to the wise, always count your change!
Archie
November 20th, 2012
2:02 pm
@Frankie: We once had special schools for chronic severe behavior problems. We need to bring them back. The old state mental hospital in Millidgeville is empty now and gathering dust (with the exception of the forensics unit) Perhaps the GDOE could arrange to take over the old facility and turn it into a residential school for socially maladjusted students. It would bring back many of the jobs the “locals” lost when Central State Hospital closed down. If the envioronment is the problem, take ‘em out of the envioronment! (I know this is all “politically incorrect!”)
HS Math Teacher
November 20th, 2012
2:14 pm
Frankie: We will ALWAYS identify a student who cries out for help, or even those who suffer in ignorance & SILENCE. WE SEEK THEM OUT, and you better believe our pants are on fire to help them learn as much as they can.
However, there are limits to our patience with those who come to school to pollute the learning environment.
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
2:40 pm
“@Mountain Man: I’ve also noticed in recent years that the number of cashiers that can’t count change is increasing. A word to the wise, always count your change!”
That is because we are spending about 4 times what we used to spend (even accounting for inflation) for education. Spending more and getting less.
Mountain Man
November 20th, 2012
2:42 pm
“And what do yodo with the students who don’t get it…because of their upbringing and parents. Throw them away, unleash them on the streets…”
And the ones who don’t care – lock them away in prison and throw away the key.
southside teacher
November 20th, 2012
2:57 pm
Thank you for saying what multitudes of teachers have observed and stated before. But, we’re just ‘part of the problem’, right?
HS Math Teacher
November 20th, 2012
3:29 pm
I waited for others to respond, but, yes, Southside Teacher, we are just PART of the problem.
Liberal thinking is justified by misty-eyed sorrow, thinking that we can ignore ignorant parents, some whom are on welfare, and others who are raised by alcoholic parents who only get upset if their TV don’t get their programs that night. They want us to be the “Parents” (I still capitalize out of respect).
The trouble is, we have a Department of Education that stays up in Atlanta, and just in campaign swings with the Governor’s wife, visits our little corn-cobb schools, and flashes that photogenic grin. Give me freakin’ break.
Stay down here a little longer, and try to figure out why Kathy Cox had to AMSCRAY!
Cobb History Teacher
November 20th, 2012
9:24 pm
Exactly….the analogy I always use is that of teaching someone how to swim currently it’s the teacher doing all the kicking and paddling while the student just stands their expecting to be the next Michael Phelps. It should be the student who is kicking and paddling, but currently there is no motivation. I mean if you were in middle school would you work hard. You’re as big as an adult I most cases, you are given more privileges yet you can still hide behind the child label, you don’t work yet but you still get stuff. I mean why would you be motivated at this point in your life? No work, no responsibility, you feel as though you can tell your parents and others off, and you still get swag like really nice cell phones and nice clothes.
Private Citizen
November 20th, 2012
9:35 pm
Proud Teacher I was lucky enough to have an administrator to gently let me know repeatedly that the thug in the classroom who led the disruption and the street attitude of the failing students were my fault.
You are killin’ me! Tell it!
Pride and Joy
November 20th, 2012
9:43 pm
about a middle school student this poster wrote “yet you can still hide behind the child label,.”
Dear Lord, a middle school student IS a child.
This post is waaaay off base. CHILDREN ( and middle school students AND high school students as well) cannot be expected to be motivated by earning money and working and earning their cell phones and clothes and other things. THEY ARE CHILDREN!
If any teacher expects a middle schooler to understand working for a living and expects the child to act like an adult — that teacher needs to get out of teaching.
CHILDREN are children, not adults. No one in their right mind should expect a child to have the maturity of an adult.
Sheesh…what are they teaching in that education department in our colleges and universities?
Lisa B.
November 21st, 2012
2:15 am
November 19th, 2012
3:07 pm
I quote Mountain Man’s post “The number one reason that people don’t get hired for jobs or lose jobs that they have is because of basic personal skills – such as getting up on time and being to work on time – every day.
And it all starts in the school system.
I am a high school administrator, and believe part of my job is to help students learn basic skills of deportment expected in the work force. I spend huge amounts of time counseling students on dress code, tardiness, and disrespectful behavior. Teachers are expected to refer students to me to handle these behaviors so they can teach. Employers expect schools to graduate work ready (or college ready) students. I hear many comments from students, I.e., “I don’t want to do this,” “this is boring,” I will respect him/her when he/she respects me,” the rules are stupid,” etc. Still, the teachers are expected to engage ALL the students, to create relationships with them, to stay current on new curriculum requirements, post all grade in a timely manner, collect data and meet with for RTI meetings for students who need academic or behavior intervention, supervise a host of after-school and extra-curricular activites, and at the end-of-the day, take care of their personal lives. I see excellent work performed by teachers day in and day out. Do I see excellent results every day? No. Too many students lack support systems at home, while others are simply disengaged for a multitude of reasons.
.
Ron F.
November 21st, 2012
2:54 am
“And would someone please explain how John Madden, a high school graduate, had mastered a “Smart Board” years ago and Highly Qualified Educators struggle to grasp how to use such a high priced blackboard filled with all the free educational material the internet has to offer?”
Actually in my school (small fairly rural setting), most teachers do use the Smart Board, Activboard, or Promethean Board quite well. Like any other tool we have, it takes time to learn and time to plan for its use in very tightly packed curricula. I even have kids use some of the interactive features of it, and it can be very engaging. Technology is great, but there has to be a balance. At some point, kids need to be able to problem solve or think without an interactive display entertaining them. That is the challenge for this generation of kids, but we’re working on it in many schools, I assure you.
Private Citizen
November 21st, 2012
7:22 am
I hate Smart Boards. I really do. I do not like them. I think it depends what subject they are used for, they may be useful for math teachers. I like tactile things,. Sometimes if I am teaching a paragraph I will write a paragraph of the board or go type it at computer so it is displayed on projector – takes about 2 minutes. This is teaching by setting example of doing. If I sit down and write “I have wanted a dog for a long time. There are many thing involved in having a dog. My favorite dogs are…” and fill up big block of print and then go circle my organization structure, I can guarantee to you you pretty much got a classroom of kid then writing like mad to emulate the model that was just custom made for them in front of their eyes. (*and this is not good enough for many principals. nothing is unless you have a social relationship with the principal. there is a lot of “negative compensation” for good work*) Another thing to consider is that if every teacher is using a “Smart board” it will be dulling on students. Also, instinctively I do not like trendy names for objects of initiatives. Sounds like noise to me. I think “Smart boards” can be useful for teaching math.
___________________
There are a lot of relevant comments in this thread. If I prioritized them, the one comment I put at the top is about the new Clayton Co. principal who is coddling troublemakers. This principal is doing exactly what the state was principals to do. If a principal does otherwise, the state will identify them (the school / principal) and tell them to do less discipline. Sounds kind of weird, eh? Well, that is what is happening. From a teacher perspective, one awkward thing is we do not know who mandates this from the state, or what is their rationale of the scholarship they use. Nothing. It is quite anonymous command. It is weird and I do not like it, like receiving direction in this manner. I do not like so much that I walked.
Lots of resonant comments from teachers reporting the current irrational conditions re: no response to the determined trouble maker. I call this state lack of discipline or basic order, I call it “abandoning the student.” Agreed students should be kept off the streets. Therefore, in a practical way, what we are lacking is alternative environments for some students. This is not simple. Some of these existed and have been closed down. They are being replaced by charter type programs specifically for kids who can function in the regular classroom. Point is, the kid needs to know “If you do this, this will happen.” Currently there is an awful a student can do and nothing will happen besides the adults being loaded in paper work, meetings and reports of the trouble kid. But then nothing happens. It’s a rotten system for the adults. If I was a kid, I’d be laughing about it.
_______________
Grandpa, You and me are talking about two different things. Having a functioning society is different than handouts for housing, food, and whatever, which if you read my initial post is not what I am saying.
Vienna to Valdosta going to make some people twitch. It’s about time, here on the plantation.
PS The state came into my professional life and refused to leave, so I got out of their life. Maybe the state should just buy a bunch of chairs and have one of their employees sit in the corner and watch every classroom in the state. That’s about what they’re doing now. “with a smile” ™
Private Citizen
November 21st, 2012
7:33 am
Maybe the state has a strategy. Keep bad behavior kids bottled up in their schools while the current alternative schools are closed down. After the charter remediation schools are in place, then send the chronic behavior kids to the new charter environments. This will take a decade?
One thing is certain. No one at our dearly beloved “state” is tell you what they’re doing. But they’re sure doing it.
Back to scapegoating students, when a student (one of mine) is caught climbing out a window of a house her is robbing, with his pistols dropping on the ground before he makes a run for it, this is not passively seeking “entitlements” as some suggest. In the main, many kids are being treated like trash and perhaps react in kind. The administrator commenting says their assigned mission is to have kids ready the norms of the work world. But that’s not the mission of education. The mission of education is to transfer knowledge and let the kid make their own decisions.
Private Citizen
November 21st, 2012
7:34 am
more coffee.
Private Citizen
November 21st, 2012
7:38 am
If someone was trying to prepare me for a job at the mall, I’d say, It’s a trap!
Education should teach valuing self and a love of knowledge.
join Walmart
November 21st, 2012
7:41 am
Georgia’s teachers should take a risk and strike. There is no way that I would work in Georgia as an educator!!! You guys are taking the rap for everything. You all need to find someone to start a union and strike. Forget right-to work state. Watch how fast the state’s educrats react when schools are shut down. Strike NOW while the state is in the midst of securing million dollar companies like Porsche. Teachers you do have a voice: USE IT!!!!