DeKalb’s Eugene Walker: Keep schools in local hands. “No” on charter schools amendment
DeKalb school board Chairman Eugene Walker opposes the charter schools amendment. Here’s why:
For an opposing view, read DeKalb board member Nancy Jester’s piece.
By Dr. Eugene Walker
While most of us are going about our daily lives in our normal routines, there are a handful of folks at the State Capitol who have been up to no good. With our economy still in tatters and our home values still at historic lows, these lawmakers approved a referendum which will appear on the November ballot which would have devastating effects on the DeKalb County School District and the children we are charged with educating.
If passed in November, a governing organization would be created, called the Georgia Charter Commission. Although the words “Georgia Charter Commission” won’t appear anywhere on your ballot, this seemingly well-intended and well-worded question would put the State of Georgia in the local school business and created a new bureaucratic umbrella. Local residents would have no control over this new commission, yet the system would cause these same taxpayers to shoulder more of the tax burden for schools than they do now.
To be clear, this has nothing to do with the whole charter school debate. DeKalb County has 13 charter schools, and the Board of Education believes in them and supports their work.
This would be yet another new state entity which would suddenly erect and operate new charter schools in areas that already have charter schools or public schools, or both. Funding for the students that end up at the new state schools would follow the students. It is estimated that this would amount to $430 million in state funding alone. Who would end up shouldering this $430 million tax shift into the duplicate school system? Local taxpayers, of course.
It’s easy to point out the enormous and obvious cost of this new behemoth, but the sinister is always more subtle, and much more dangerous.
Separate school systems used to be the norm in America. Prior to 1954, children who were white went to one school, and children who were black went to a “separate but equal” school. The Supreme Court unanimously ruled in Brown vs. the Board of Education that “separate educational facilities are inherently unequal”. I could have told them that, because I was in school then.
You see, public schools are constitutionally mandated to educate all children. Charter schools can pick and choose. Since the measure of success of all schools is test scores, charter schools have their pick of the brightest students which often are from households of confortable affluence. Now as long as all of the children remain under the control of a single, locally controlled school system, there is stability of the funding mechanism for all of the students regardless of their means.
It goes without saying that in our current economy, local school systems cannot take a $430 million hit from the get-go, and be able to continue to provide a quality education for all students. The children of the rich will always be able to afford to go to any lengths to attend the best schools. Children of lessor means will be trapped into the underfunded remains of a once-great school system. This referendum places us back on the path to separate and very unequal educational system. No, children won’t be divided on the pure basis of race, but on the basis of economic class.
The referendum before voters is, in short, the beginning of the end of universal free public education, and the decline of the control of local residents to control their own school systems. It would be turning back the clock to pre-1954 segregation, and we must fight to keep this from happening.
It is often said that “those who do not study history are bound to repeat it”. I find it ironic and heartbreaking that this phrase now applies to people who call themselves educators.
–from Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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155 comments Add your comment
@MonicaHenson
October 21st, 2012
6:55 pm
@MonicaHenson
I agree that charter schools in Georgia do not get to choose their students. However, Charters cause students/parents to self-select in several ways:
1.) Parents have to be motivated/educated enough to find out about charter schools and charter lotteries well before the start of the next school year. Parents cannot show up two weeks into a school year and enroll their child in a charter unless they have space. The good charters do not have spaces.
2.) Most charter schools Georgia do not provide transportation. This eliminates many parents who do not have reliable transportation and working hours that can accommodate taking their children to school
3.) Charter schools in Georgia can draw students from all across a district or several districts. Large and medium sized school districts in Georgia cannot. There are specific attendance boundaries for traditional schools unless space is available at other in district schools.
4.) Students with low incidence special needs are routinely turned away from charters because the schools do not have the resources to serve these students.
mountain man
October 21st, 2012
7:01 pm
“I believe that this commission will be a political group that has its underlying intent to supplant traditional public education.”
Too bad. This could have been avoided if traditional public schools had been proactive about solving their problems and not denying charters just because they were competition.
Attentive Parent/Invisible Serfs Collar
October 21st, 2012
7:05 pm
Well miracles never cease. Monica Henson and I are in agreement. Conversion charters in many ways are a scam to gain federal money that was available for innovative programs. The charter does not work as parents assume and schools really are subject to same accreditation rules and must hire certified teachers etc. Nothing worse than a talented chemistry major who has been teaching at a private school with tremendous results but cannot teach in publics because of lack of ed school credentials. Sad for the kids who would have benefited.
I asked this point, clarified it in a meeting, and then asked Maureen if it was her understanding as well. She confirmed in one of her rare responses to me that yes it was her understanding as well that the state authorized charter schools under this amendment would NOT be subject to SACS jurisdiction. Oversight comes from state and let’s face it. How many people will be watching what goes on in these state charters looking for problems to scream out “Told You So!!”
It’s no secret I regard the accreditors as one of the primary social poison delivery systems of what is really going on in education. I have enough of their documents going back decades to back up my opinions.
Wouldn’t it be nice to have a beacon out there not subject to SACS that is being heavily monitored for comparison?
Nobody is going to adopt a state charter that is worse than that Fulton conversion charter in terms of taking public money, frustrating taxpayers, and gutting academics. In fact word on the street is that was the whole point of the conversion charter a la Ray Budde’s vision.
To take out and level academic excellence in North Fulton. And that will happen unless we talk about it now. As it is starting. As the Five Year Strategic Plan goes into effect.
Five Year Plan–how ironic. Does anyone in the Central Office know their history? Five Year central plans with a political vision sort of have a bad rep and track record.
Private Citizen
October 21st, 2012
7:18 pm
yuzeyurbrane ,
During the era of Jim Cherry, teachers were not required to sit through indoctrination meetings and listen to shallow programs with funny names and then be required to follow these programs and have their job depend upon it. The dumbing-down is real and part of it is making the teacher workforce do tons of weird crap. Someone is trying to disable the populace and they’re doing a good job at at it, effective, and Georgia government has protected no one in this regard and let every crazy horse through the gate and into the pen and told the teachers that they have to ride it even if it means breaking their neck. The only thing I can figure is that these forces are so powerful and present in the USA that the state politicians do not have any choice but to go along with it, They sure are not representing anybody or anything except getting their pension and going fishing. If the political class stood up to it and stopped enabling and welcoming the weird programs with the trendy names, they would get steamrollered and crushed. So instead, they step out of the way so the steamroller can go crush the teachers and students. The result for teachers is putting in long hours and having to play-act. It is really soulless.
Private Citizen
October 21st, 2012
7:23 pm
Injected with a poison!
LarryMajor
October 21st, 2012
7:39 pm
These are the SBOE approved state charter schools some of you think don’t exist:
Atlanta Heights Charter School, Atlanta Public Schools
Charter Conservatory for Liberal Arts & Technology (CCAT), Bulloch County
Cherokee Charter Academy, Cherokee County
Coweta Charter Academy, Coweta County
Fulton Leadership Academy, Fulton County
Georgia Connections Academy (Virtual), State‐wide
Georgia Cyber Academy Virtual, State‐wide Virtual K‐12
Heritage Preparatory Academy, Atlanta Public Schools
Ivy Preparatory Academy at Kirkwood for Boys, DeKalb County
Ivy Preparatory Academy at Kirkwood for Girls, DeKalb County
Ivy Preparatory Academy, Gwinnett County
Mountain Education Center, Intergovernmental (3 locations)
Odyssey School, Coweta County
Pataula Charter Academy, Baker, Clay, Calhoun, Early, Randolph Counties
Scholars Academy Charter School, Clayton County
Mary Elizabeth
October 21st, 2012
8:47 pm
“Too bad. This could have been avoided if traditional public schools had been proactive about solving their problems and not denying charters just because they were competition.”
==================================
You are wrong in assuming this. Please see below.
From the GAE Magazine, “KNOW,” Volume 11, Issue 1, page 16
“Is this a fight over charter schools? No way. Back in 1993, GAE helped write the charter school legislation that opened the way for public charter schools in Georgia. We believe in trying anything and everything that will help our kids and strengthen our public schools in Georgia.
To date, Georgia has more than 100 charter schools – most of these charter schools were approved by local school boards. As it stands right now, the state Board of Education has the power to overrule a local board that rejects a charter application. So why add in yet another state-created level of bureaucracy that would discard the rulings of both the local school board and the state Board of Education.
The GAE Position on Charter Schools.
We believe that charter schools can be agents for positive change. They have the ability to develop new and creative methods of teaching and learning that can be replicated in mainstream public schools. . . . Proponents of Amendment 1 say it’s needed to clarify and protect the state’s power to authorize and fund charter schools. FACT: There is already a policy in place for reviewing charter school applications by local school boards + there’s already an appeals process in place, too.
Why we’re fighting for a NO on AMENDMENT 1:
* It expands state govenment and creates an unnecessary and redundant bureaucracy.
* It siphons money out of traditional public schools and existing public charters.
* Decisions are made by a small group of political appointees – not the school boards you elect.
* It creates a second and separate state school system.
* Decisions for our local public schools should be made locally – by school board members who are voted on by local community members.
* We believe that money should not be the driving force behind education decisions.
FACT: In four years, 4,280 Georgia teachers have lost their jobs due to budget cuts – while we’ve added more than 37,400 students to classrooms.
‘Let’s use our power to make public education stronger. . . .to make our nation a better place, moving ever closer to our great and noble ideal of equal opportunity – not just for a fortunate few, but for every single child.’ -Dennis Van Roekel, NEA President “
mountain man
October 21st, 2012
8:59 pm
Mary Elizabeth – you have ignored the first part of the quotation you referenced-
“Too bad. This could have been avoided if traditional public schools had been proactive about solving their problems and not denying charters just because they were competition.”
How have traditional schools addressed the problem with discipline? With attendance? How much of the schools’ funding goes to SPED and ESOL? How many students in the eighth grade are more than two years behind grade level? I know that you know the answer to these questions, since you are a retired teacher – you just don’t want to give the answer.
As a parent, would you want your children in a school where the teachers are powerless to control discipline problems because the administration doesn’t back them up? Where your children’s teachers spend their time trying to “catch up” students whose ecessive absenteeism has left them years behind grade level but they have been “socially promoted”? Where 50% of the funding for your school goes to a few SPED students who rarely benefit from the level of funds heaped upon them?
If the traditional schools were adressing these problems, I would not be supporting charter schools. If traditional schools listened to and addressed issues brought up by parents, I would not be advocating charter schools.
mountain man
October 21st, 2012
9:06 pm
Mary Elizabeth – what was your position when the old Georgia Charter Schools Commission was under attack and being taken to the Supreme Court Of Georgia. That was the alternative route to the local BOE control.
It was THAT decision that led directly to the current amendment.
DeKalb Inside Out
October 21st, 2012
9:08 pm
Mary Elizabeth
Charters currently cannot appeal to the state.
In 2011 the Ga Supreme Court majority report said the 1877 Constitution of Georgia granted local boards of education the exclusive right to establish and maintain K-12 education. The state cannot therefore establish competing State-created general k-12 schools.
Where are the new state charters??
If the state can commission NEW state charters, where are they since the 2011 GA Supreme Court ruling? Barge estimated 7 new state charters every year.
The Charter School Amendment addresses this.
The SBOE has approved continuing existing charter schools to alleviate the chaos of closing them down (Not to mention a few chartered schools that were in the process of being commissioned by the state when the Supreme Court ruling came down in 2011). If the Charter School amendment fails in November, I guarantee all state charters will be shut down.
DeKalb Inside Out
October 21st, 2012
9:25 pm
Mary Elizabeth: “It expands state government and creates an unnecessary and redundant bureaucracy.”
Answer: 85% of the state chartered schools operate in counties where the local board won’t commission chartered schools. Some boards refuse to even look at applications. This amendment is in no small part for the parents and children in those counties.
Mary Elizabeth: “* It siphons money out of traditional public schools and existing public charters.”
Answer: For every child that goes to a state chartered school, the local school district will have more money per child.
Mary Elizabeth:
“* Decisions are made by a small group of political appointees – not the school boards you elect.
* Decisions for our local public schools should be made locally – by school board members who are voted on by local community members.”
Answer: Our locally elected boards are doing a bang up job thus far. I hope they turn traditional public schools around! Unfortunately ‘hope’ is not a method, but the Charter School Amendment is a method for turning public schools around.
Mary Elizabeth: “* It creates a second and separate state school system.”
Answer: The state board just commissions the state chartered schools. They do not run them.
Mary Elizabeth: “* We believe that money should not be the driving force behind education decisions.”
Answer: Amen!! Although, it seems to be one of the big driving forces behind the opposition to the amendment
Mary Elizabeth
October 21st, 2012
9:28 pm
Mountain Man and DeKalb Inside Out, I had called the state Board of Education a couple of weeks ago and had spoken with a high level official. I was told that the state Board of Education has in the past – and will in the future, regardless of the outcome of the vote on the Constitutional Amendment – been able to approve applications for state charter schools, if the schools, of course, meet criteria and if funding allows for them.
That truth is also confirmed in the GAE Magazine from which I quoted a few posts back. Therefore, the Constitutional Amendment is not necessary. Also, Mountain Man, of course I think that public schools should have discipline in place, attendance taken care of, reading levels addressed, etc. that you mentioned. I have written about all of these aspects of education previously and I have referenced my own blog in order to offer more insight into these areas. These are ongoing challenges that must be addressed within any public school which serves all children. The answer is not to dismantle traditional public schools but to improve them, and to fund them adequately.
Don't Tread
October 21st, 2012
9:28 pm
The Dekalb County school board chairman opposes the charter school amendment, and the best explanation he can come up with is to play the race card?
I’m glad I voted for it. Throwing more money at a failed system (with people like that in charge of it, go figure) isn’t an option.
DeKalb Inside Out
October 21st, 2012
9:54 pm
Mary Elizabeth,
Much like Dr Walker flat out lied in this post, your high level official lied to you … go figure. The proof is in the pudding. Even though Barge said 7 new charters a year will be commissioned, no new state chartered schools have been commissioned since the 2011 ruling.
Spending on education is as high as it has ever been
History of Public Education Funding in Georgia
Take a look at the history of funding public schools in Georgia. Funding has gone up over the last 50 years and we have seen no gains. In 2008, funding went down due to the recession, but we are right back there now. The most we ever spent was $9100/student. We are at $9000/student now.
This isn’t dismantling public schools. This is giving local traditional school districts more money per student.
Mary Elizabeth
October 21st, 2012
10:06 pm
“your high level official lied to you”
————————————–
DeKalb Inside Out, do you realize what an assertion – and assumption – you are making?
I will take the word of an official at the state BOE over the opinion of an anonymous poster. Morever, the GAE Magazine article further confirms what the official had stated.
Since you are wrong on that point, I must place your other assertions in doubt, also.
Have a good evening.
mountain man
October 21st, 2012
10:20 pm
“I will take the word of an official at the state BOE over the opinion of an anonymous poster.”
You would take the word of a POLITICIAN???? Telling you something that he has no control over???? If the Supreme Court of Georgia overrules him, then what of your blind trust???? I used to have a little respect for your positions.
Attentive Parent/Invisible Serfs Collar
October 21st, 2012
10:28 pm
Mary Elizabeth-thank you for that link between GAE and 1993. I had tracked the origination of the duplicitous use of conversion charters to Budde and Al Shanker and then to the Democratic Labor Party in Minnesota in 1992. In fact Ed Week did a story commemorating the 20th anniversary a few months ago. I recognized the link to the Transformational Outcomes Based Education that Minnesota was supposed to be piloting at the time. Except the legislature was pulling back when they realized how little academic knowledge was involved with the model they had enacted.
If Georgia was also involved in 1993, it plays into what was going on in Atlanta Public Schools that then became known as the Georgia Initiative in Math and Science and those controversial Frameworks. The ones that showed back up with the integrated math implementation.
My. My. My. No wonder there is so much fighting over this amendment providing a safety valve and exit.
Mary Elizabeth
October 21st, 2012
10:52 pm
Mountain Man, 10:20 pm
“You would take the word of a POLITICIAN????”
=======================================
I did not speak with a politician. I spoke with the administrative assistant to a high official in the State Department of Education who establishes educational programs and policy as part of his job function. That would not make this person a politician. That would make him an educator at the state level.
My goodness, the rhetoric has gotten intense on this issue this evening. Also, let me repeat the writing from the GAE magazine which confirms the state official’s statement to me. Here it is from the GAE magazine: “Proponents of Amendment 1 say it’s needed to clarify and protect the state’s power to authorize and fund charter schools. FACT: There is already a policy in place for reviewing charter school applications by local school boards + there’s already an appeals process in place, too.”
Moreover, Dr. Barge, Georgia’s State Superintendent of Schools, himself, stated that application could be made to the state Board of Education for a state charter school. That makes three (3) different sources which all corroborate that this is true. Therefore, the constitutional amendment is unnecessary because application can be made to the State Board of Education to establish a state charter school.
Mary Elizabeth
October 21st, 2012
11:01 pm
Also Mountain Man, you said you had read the link that I posted on this thread at 2:23 pm today with gave my remarks to a poster named “Phil” on Jim Galloway’s blog regarding the fear that the Supreme Court might take away the state DOE’s right to establish state charter schools. In case you missed that post, here is the content of what I had said to “Phil” regarding his concern on this issue.
===========================================
Phil, 2:08 pm
“. . . the only way the State Board will get to continue authorizing state chartered schools is if this Amendment passes. Not only that, but all of the existing state chartered schools will lose their authorizer. . .”
=========================================
Your words above sound remarkably like fear tactics to me. Moreover, no one has the ability to “play God” with the future.
But even if what you fear were to materialize in the future, I would be prepared to fight a battle, then, for the right of the State Board of Education, as part of Georgia’s traditional educational delivery system, to be able to grant appeal to parents who wish to form a state charter school when denied by their local districts, but I will not fight that battle for a separate state agency, such as the State Commission for Charter Schools, run by appointees who happen to be of a certain political ideology, to grant those state charter schools.”
Mary Elizabeth
October 21st, 2012
11:11 pm
And below was “Phil’s” response to me (from the Galloway link) and my further response to “Phil” on this same issue:
=============================================
Phil, 2:38 pm
“You just described the State Board of Ed – every member of which is appointed by the Governor.”
=====================================
You are correct in that, Phil, however those State Board of Education members are primarily educators, not politicians; otherwise, you would not have witnessed the dissent of Dr. John Barge, Georgia’s Superintendent of Schools and a Republican, who has disagreed with Republican Governor Deal by opposing this Constitutional Amendment which would establish a State Commission on Charter Schools. Dr. Barge has proven himself to be a true educator, not a politician, in his core.
Moreover, the membership of the State Commission of Charter Schools would come from a list supplied by Georgia’s House Majority Leader and Georgia’s President of the Senate, as well as from the Governor, all of whom are Republican politicians. In addition, Rep. Jan Jones and Rep. Edward Lindsey, who sponsored HR 1162 which became the Constitutional Amendment, are both members of the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC). Please preview the link, below, to see how ALEC has had its political influence into this legislation. Rep. Jones is part of the Educational Task Force of ALEC as well as on the Education Committee of Georgia’s House of Representatives..
http://mediamatters.org/research/2012/05/09/how-alec-is-quietly-influencing-education-refor/184156
Private Citizen
October 21st, 2012
11:25 pm
Philippians 2:8
And being found in appearance as a man,
he humbled himself
by becoming obedient to death—
even death on a cross!
Mary Elizabeth
October 21st, 2012
11:26 pm
Also, regarding cuts to traditional public education by Georgia’s Legislature:
================================================
“FACT: The state (of Georgia) has already cut $4.4 billion from schools since 2008.”
“FACT: In four years, 4,280 Georgia teachers have lost their jobs due to budget cuts – while we’ve added more than 37,400 students to classrooms.”
Source for the facts, above: Lifted from GAE’s Magazine, “KNOW,” Volume 11, Issue 1
Private Citizen
October 21st, 2012
11:31 pm
Philippians 2:14-15 Do everything without grumbling or arguing, so that you may become blameless and pure, children of God without fault in a warped and crooked generation. Then you will shine among them like stars in the sky
Private Citizen applies etiquette theology
Another angle
October 21st, 2012
11:34 pm
The status quo must go. Dr. Walker’s feeble attempt to slow the steamroller of change by stoking fear is irresponsible and it is all the more offensive since he elected to raise the race card. Let’s set this aside and talk money for a moment. The schools are not lacking in money. It would not surprise me if the facts show that we spend more per pupil today than we did forty years ago. Throwing money at the schools to solve the education problem has been thoroughly discredited. This is one of the reasons why the charter school movement has life. Charter schools are not about money. Hey are about trying something different. Consider one other item. What if the Dekalb or Atlanta school systems waved a magic wand and suddenly all the citizens in private school had no choice but to attend public school. Guess what? There wouldn’t be any more $. All the folks who send their kids to private school are subsidizing the public schools bc they are paying for the schools but “not taking advantage” of the free education available to them. Dr walker should send to those parents a note each year thanking them for forgoing the public schools, thereby allowing him to spend more $ per enrolled student than otherwise would be the case. I imagine this is going to change somewhere down the line (20+ years). Dr Walker best save the race card for future change. And even then, that is a lame stunt. Race is not motivating anyone to push charters. People just want their kids to have a better education.
I love teaching. I hate what it is becoming...
October 22nd, 2012
6:24 am
@Another angle “It would not surprise me if the facts show that we spend more per pupil today than we did forty years ago. ”
Well, of course we are! It’s called INFLATION! People paid a lot less for a car 40 years ago too, but somehow they don’t expect to be able to buy a car for what they did 40 years ago, but they expect to be able to educate a child for that? Not to mention the growing number of children with special medical and educational needs due to medical advancements that allow them to live these days, when before they would have died. Those needs cost money.
mountain man
October 22nd, 2012
6:36 am
I love teaching, etc – See my post earlier. Even accounting for INFLATION, we are spending about 4 times as much money (on the average) per student as we did in the 60’s.
A lot of that is increased expenditures for ADMINISTRATION. And a lot of it goes to SPED and ESOL, that were not as prevalent in the 60’s.
mountain man
October 22nd, 2012
6:37 am
“Not to mention the growing number of children with special medical and educational needs due to medical advancements that allow them to live these days, when before they would have died. Those needs cost money.”
But are we (society) getting any benefit from these increased costs?
Pardon My Blog
October 22nd, 2012
7:13 am
DO AWAY WITH CHARTER SCHOOLS, PERIOD! If the methods, creative thinking, and curriculum are working then utilize that in all the public schools instead of using tax money to provide a private school education for a select few. As a resident of DeKalb, I personally think the State should step in and take over the running of our school system because of the likes of Eugene Walker who are in control.
Mountain Man
October 22nd, 2012
7:35 am
“If the methods, creative thinking, and curriculum are working then utilize that in all the public schools instead of using tax money to provide a private school education for a select few.”
If the traditional public schools used the methods of the charter schools – were effective in giving a good education, gave parents the choices they want, there would be no DEMAND for charter schools. If traditional public schools would clean up their own messes, you would not see this demand for charters. But they have had 40 years and they have only become worse.
Mountain Man
October 22nd, 2012
7:40 am
As someone pointed out ealier, one of the advantages of charters is that there is a self-selection goin on. The parents who are apatheitic, who don’t care, and therefore their kids don’t care – won’t be bothered to apply for a charter. These are the parents that allow their children to miss 30 school days a year in absenteeism. You cannot teach an empty seat. The problem is that traditional schools have made no attempts to rein in this problem (their solution is to socially promote the student and then cheat on the standardized test to cover up the lack of learning).
Dr. Monica Henson
October 22nd, 2012
8:34 am
@MonicaHenson posted, and I have included my comments following each item in the list as MH:
I agree that charter schools in Georgia do not get to choose their students. However, Charters cause students/parents to self-select in several ways:
1.) Parents have to be motivated/educated enough to find out about charter schools and charter lotteries well before the start of the next school year. Parents cannot show up two weeks into a school year and enroll their child in a charter unless they have space. The good charters do not have spaces.
MH: Agreed, and this is one of the reasons why we need more good charters. My school does not cap its enrollment because we are looking toward the future with an eye toward replicability of our model and methods by district high schools. If we cap our enrollment, that’s not replicable, so we don’t do it.
2.) Most charter schools Georgia do not provide transportation. This eliminates many parents who do not have reliable transportation and working hours that can accommodate taking their children to school.
MH: I agree that this is a method that prevents many families from taking advantage of charter schools. Most of our students work from home online, and we provide loaner laptops to students who need them if they qualify for free and reduced lunch. For high-risk students in the inner cities where we are putting our hybrid learning centers, students who meet income-qualification guidelines will also be provided public transportation passes.
3.) Charter schools in Georgia can draw students from all across a district or several districts. Large and medium sized school districts in Georgia cannot. There are specific attendance boundaries for traditional schools unless space is available at other in district schools.
MH: Not true that districts cannot extend attendance boundaries. Any school district anywhere in Georgia, no matter how large or how small, can admit students from across attendance boundary lines if they choose to. Some districts have “reciprocity” agreements (we’ll take yours if you’ll take ours). Some districts allow intradistrict choice–families can send their students to any school in the district, regardless fo attendance zone, as long as space is availabe. Some districts charge admission to accept out-of-district students. All perfectly legal and at the option of the local BOE of each district.
4.) Students with low incidence special needs are routinely turned away from charters because the schools do not have the resources to serve these students.
MH: I cannot confirm whether this happens in other charter schools, but it doesn’t at mine. We have 14% special education students and have not turned away a single family, including those whose children will require GAA instead of traditional state testing. It’s against the law for a public school district to turn away special needs students,and we are a district as well as a school. A locally authorized charter schools could direct a family to a centrally located special education classroom in the district, with transportation provided by the district, that could better meet the child’s needs, after a meeting by the IEP team. But a state-chartered school cannot legally turn away a special needs child.
Dr. Monica Henson
October 22nd, 2012
8:37 am
Larry, don’t forget us: Provost Academy Georgia. We are a state-chartered special school, formerly a Commission charter.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
8:54 am
Mountain Man, You bring up an interesting point, and that is what to do with the children who get out of grade level. I certainly do not scapegoat these kids and families and why this happens. So of the families have very hard circumstances. Some of the kids get in a rebellion rut and clearly are not having their needs met, even if they are peculiar they just can not go along with things so they rebel and are made by law to go to the school building like they have a ball and chain around their neck. Some kids gets out of synch with grade level because of something transitional in their lives, maybe a divorce or moving or something else within the family.
Where I am going with this, is that right now as far as I can tell, when a child gets 2-3 years out of synch with grade level, in many places in Georgia, well you’ve got kids 2-3 years outside of the kids they’re in class with. It gets weird. 20 year olds in high school. High school age kids in middle school. Yes, if I was a parent, I would be concerned for my age appropriate kid going to school and spending the year with kids older in the same classroom who both do not fit the age group and who have pretty severe issues. This is a loop hole right now. Someone complains about “Don’t pass them along” but I tell you it would be better to pass them along to be with their age group than to trap older kids with social issues / rebellion issues and put them in the general ed. classroom with kids 2-3 years younger than them and I think this is what is happening now.
I’m not sure what the answer is except maybe kids who get in this predicament should be in a separate environment where grade level is achieved by doing certain work in sequence and is no longer age related, because there are some kids who threw all of that out the door. Again, I do not doubt their circumstances and reasons for doing it. Usually this type kids have a high level of personal discomfort, are sort of like “a cat on a wire.” I like working with them, but I do not like working with them in the general ed. classroom when they’re 2-3 years physically out of synch and are acting out in place of trying to fit in. I once met one of these dear souls and the first thing I said to him, took one look at him and the first words out of my mouth were, “You need a driver’s license and a job driving a delivery truck!” He was just just just under the cusp of 16 years of age at which time the state releases them into the wild if they so choose.
By the way. I had had 3 jobs by the time I was his age and probably already worked 2000 hours – with pay. Businesses used to hire young people to work.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
9:12 am
It would be better if kids could get after school jobs or on weekends, even if it only paid $2./hr to do some clean-up. It would be more wholesome than so much x-box and tv.
-got a neighbor with a bunch of kids, never see them. I asked him why his kids don’t go outdoors and he said they stay inside and play video games and the like, that is what they prefer. He takes them out and does things, too, outdoor activities. They call me to fix / tune-up some computer problem. I go over to their home and take care of it. While there I see one of the kids sitting, mesmorized by the wall screen, with the remote game controller thing. It was weird, the kid was nice enough but mesmorized like a zombie.
One time I drove through Frisco, Texas. Frisco is just north of Dallas and used to have one road go through it and no traffic lights. Now it is a corporate class subdivision. When I drove through there I saw all of these three story brick homes, built like fortresses, and the streets were completely empty. The kids stay inside and play with their gadgets. When the parents come home they press the button and the ground level garage door opens and they go inside their fortress and the door shuts. No kids on the streets anywhere, sterile. They probably have indoor playgrounds inside the big houses.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
9:16 am
Same kind of thing in Plano, suburb of Dallas, where several years ago it became trendy for teenagers to commit suicide. In my opinion, it is not the best time for kids right now.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
9:21 am
If I was king, I would write a law that said businesses could hire 12-17 year-olds for non mission-critical work at a rate of $2./hour or more, limited to 20 hours / week.
Mary Elizabeth
October 22nd, 2012
9:43 am
I am a retired teacher, now. But, during my active years, I never centered upon judging students or blaming them or their families, but upon nurturing them and in finding solutions in how to best reach them for their advancement, academically and emotionally.
I believe that that caring approach is not only the best, and most effective, approach to take with students who are having difficulty in school, but it is also the best approach to take with adults who are part of the underclass in society. As citizens, we need to urge our legislators to place more focus on these students – and their families – not only within schools but also within society, itself, outside of the educational arena.
Educator for Life
October 22nd, 2012
10:29 am
I am so confused as to the sources of the misinformation that is floating around. I have heard some ludicrous statements regardng this issue. One Principal stated that Charter Schools hire teachers off the streets! How in the world are you a Principal? Charter Schools only get 5 years to prove it is educating our scholars; otherwise, they shut down as they should be. A city councilwoman stated that “if this vote goes through, more private schools will convert to charter schools”. How dumb is that? Why in the world would a private school with a $15,000+ tuition decide to become a charter and accept $7000 per child? Laughable.
Segregation? We are already segregated. The minority schools, on average, are failing to educate the students. Schools with a more diverse population seem to be doing okay, while the mostly white /asian populated schools are doing great. Please stop with the segregation statement. Schools in DeKalb (I attended Columbia and Druid Hills) are not doing well and dropout factories need to be closed. Parents need to have a choice, considering their children’s future is at stake.
Some people always think money is the issue. Money helps in some cases, but good old-fashioned teaching trumps all. I have been inside public schools in all Metro Atlanta local school systems and they have technology and resources to spare. Then, why are they still failing? I know that most failing schools have minimal to no parental support,which is another issue in itself.
If a bank fails, they close. If a restaurant struggles, it closes. But, why does a failing school get to stay open? I guess we need someone to do the menial jobs, such as garbage collecting, cashiering at a local market, cleaning offices, etc. We should have a choice. Blockbuster was a monopoly and could charge whatever it wanted. Look what happened when competitors came along. Atlanta Gas Light was the only provider. Now, companies compete to get your business. Bellsouth had a stronghold on the home telephone. Now, there are several options (even not having a home phone). Look, educational systems offer a product. If a school does not offer a product to the parents’ likings, then parents should shop elsewhere.
I can go on and on as to why we need to vote “YES” for this, but I digress.
mountain man
October 22nd, 2012
12:37 pm
“I have been inside public schools in all Metro Atlanta local school systems and they have technology and resources to spare. Then, why are they still failing?”
Because of the quality of the students and the parent(s).
It is NOT the teacher (mostly) as some people like to think. You could take a cadre of Teachers of the Month from the best schoosl in Georgia to APS and they couldn’t raise test scores.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
12:43 pm
E’erbody ought to read this, give it some meaning. http://www.granta.com/New-Writing/The-Plano-Suicides
Reporters arrived, en masse, to deliver familiar and vague explanations: the lonely plight of latch-key kids, the existential emptiness of a town without history, parents’ relentless pursuit of wealth to the neglect of their children, the strange psychological phenomena of suicide clusters… Eighteen kids had killed themselves, and now our school counselor, too. The dust was doing something I had never quite seen dust do, hanging over fields and roads in shapes that seemed to defy physics. I felt exhilarated and afraid, subject to…
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
12:50 pm
mountain man, as an educator I take responsibility for the results of my work and do not place it anywhere else but me and my side of the fence. If there is a structural problem, I will say so. As far as success of students is concerned, the responsibility for this is inside my building and those of us who are paid to do a job. I do not blame the students / families for lack of results. You and I are in agreement on many observations and you make excellent real-politik observations re: behavior, age of students, etc. but for me being paid to do a job, the answer to these issues is with the institution and how it organizes / sorts / directs activities. Let me repeat, I do not blame families. It is our job to deal with them, mold, shape, etc.
mountain man
October 22nd, 2012
12:52 pm
“I never centered upon judging students or blaming them or their families, but upon nurturing them and in finding solutions in how to best reach them for their advancement, academically and emotionally.”
That is great, Mary Elizabeth, you are a saint among teachers. But it doesn’t answer the big questions. Did you ever give a grade that was not earned? Were you ever made to change a grade? Did any of your students receive diplomas when they could not read or write? I am sure you were a firm disciplinarian. Did you occasionally short-change the good students because you were having to deal with the misfits? What did you do when students habitually were late or absent from your class? Buy them alarm clocks? Were you ever made to teach a course in subject matter in which you were not prepared (e.g. asking a math teacher to teach history)?
Self_Made
October 22nd, 2012
12:54 pm
You VOTE your local school board out if you don’t like how you’re being represented or how you school system is run. You DON’T strip power away from your local government and give it to the state’s APPOINTED bureaucrats!!
What is it with government hater types who want to take power away from an institution we ultimately control and hand it over to unelected and/or private entities who have little or NO accountability to US…the citizens, voters, taxpayers??
Mary Elizabeth
October 22nd, 2012
1:00 pm
Educator for Life,
Have you actually ever taught students? Of course, students are segregated now because of their variant neighborhood situations. Please read my post just prior to yours. There are many factors which must be addressed by society-at-large, some of which are outside the educational domain, for all students to have the opportunity to do equally well in all neighborhood schools.
In the meantime, unless all students are placed in charter schools, some will remain in traditional public schools. When that happens, those students who will be left behind will be left in an even more impoverished, homogeneous environment when those students whose parents have more resources, of many kinds, move to charter schools and private schools. The remaining students will be segregated not by race but by class. Just because students are already segregated by school neighborhoods and performance, does not mean that the educational situations of some of them might not become even worse, and even more segregated, through the expanse of the charter school movement.
Of course, there is another option, and that option is that ALL students could be placed in charter schools so that none would be left behind. However, if that is the game plan, why not simply improve traditional public schools for all students, equally, without such a dramatic educational overturn, about which end results can only be speculated.
The problem with what you suggest is that the charter school model (perhaps ?) will help the few, at the expense of the many.
Vote NO for the constitutional amendment in NOvember.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
1:08 pm
Self_Made It’s not that simple. This is a state wide issue. In a lot of places in the state, the local newspaper and the school board are hand-in-glove together as one. The fact the AJC has enough school systems around it, and enough business sense and ethics that is not the propaganda wing of a school system is unusual on a state wide level. You say “vote them out” etc. but most communities are struggling and disabled and the people’s idea of interesting media is the five AM radio stations all owned by Clear Channel Communications where you can take your pick of the Limbaugh, Hannity, or Bill O’Reilly. There’s a story about a town (not in Georgia) with a bunch of these Clear Channel radio stations, and there was a big fire so the townspeople run over to the radio station and what find is a building with a fence around it and no one in it blasting away with it’s radio transmission / broadcast. A lot of that station ID stuff and messages are pre-recorded and they insert the local town. Self_Made, Ronald Reagan changed the law that used to protect te citizens from centrally owned media. This is probably the biggest, most determinant change in U. S. reality / policy. Broadcast media used to be owned my many different companies.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
1:20 pm
Of course, there is another option, and that option is that ALL students could be placed in charter schools so that none would be left behind.
-might be how it goes in the long run.
However, if that is the game plan, why not simply improve traditional public schools for all students
You’re comparing a monopoly with an open market. You should read the history of U-Haul. Great company, real innovation and service to the people. The family got so conflicted and messed up there was some real tragedy. Shoen transferred all but 2% of control to his children when two of them, Edward and Mark launched a successful takeover of the business in 1986. Family scrabbling over the U-Haul empire turned to physical confrontations between some of his children at company meetings, even before the 1986 takeover. The takeover sparked a major family dispute that led to a $461 million judgment in favor of Leonard Shoen and others. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U-Haul
But they don’t tell you this on the company website. http://www.uhaul.com/About/History.aspx
Sounds about like some school systems, where certain persons root and appropriate.
DeKalb Inside Out
October 22nd, 2012
1:30 pm
Has anyone considered blaming the administrators? The school districts on average are getting $9100/student in Georgia. That’s record levels even accounting for inflation. Teachers have enormous classes, are getting RIF’d and furloughs while administrators are getting raises.
I honestly don’t think executive administrators care about children as much as they do their salaries and perks.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
2:08 pm
Has anyone considered blaming the administrators? Well, sure. What good is that going to do? Building administrators (principal, assistant principals) take their orders from outside the building and can get rooted around, displaced, and/or vaporized as much as anybody. See where the greater admin. every couple of years move principals around like musical chairs, keep everybody on the edge of their teeth. Unless your friends with the local power and talk-the-talk, you get over-observed, over-evaluated, and rooted and the people that are doing have been there for years and have big fat paychecks. The children are no more to them than greyhounds or horses on the betting track, use and discard. Never seen this type narcissistic self-serving power in my life. Georgia school admin exist to advantage themselves, end of story. If they were any different, they’d be working in the classroom. I know I’m generalizing, but this state has no teacher union and no regulation. It is a predictable enough result.
Private Citizen
October 22nd, 2012
2:24 pm
Dekalb Inside Out You ought to see the administrators who retire, draw retirement pay, and then come back and get a second income as consultant and go around and abuse people and go into buildings, pull rank, and conflict with the principal as if they’re the second principal and the one in charge. Seen it. Their main object is to screw people around who are not connected to their clan. Pure destructiveness. Key word: Any place there are “acting” so & so as job title used as placeholders until the clan can get one of their own in place. See this in both K12 and public college. You have to wonder if anyone is home at the state university system Regents Office or if they’re all just playing golf while the crooks run wild in the hinterlands.
Did a quick search on the internet and found this gem: Acting Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for Reserve Affairs. … Seems to be the operations model for a lot of places, imitating this method. Welcome to government management / politics 2012. It is ridiculous and undignified, like no one has a position any more in the system of shimmy-shammy while the managers are spilling their dominoes on the floor while they’re running around in circles.
Beverly Fraud
October 22nd, 2012
2:32 pm
“The answer is not to dismantle traditional public schools but to improve them, and to fund them adequately.”
Yes Mary Elizabeth,but at what point does one say “It’s a YUGO” and give up the ghost?
At