State cracks down on how many remedial courses college students can take

Maybe much of this is fraudlent. Example. If a student wants to study journalism they really do not need much high math. I think we need to upgrade our University System farm more than we do the students. This whole “degree’ mystique does not seem to be serving the student or the state well. If the Universities want to up grade maybe they could find a way to graduate a four year student in four years or less rather than five or six. This is a horrible waste of resources.

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Clear-cut cases of high school diplomas given to students who don ‘t deserve them. You don’t master basic English in high school, you don’t need to attend college. Get tutoring or remediation elsewhere if you just HAVE to go, then apply to college.

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“I think high schools should be responsible for having the students college-ready.” I agree and would add that the student should also be held more responsible for their education. I benefited from taking a remedial math course way back in the late eighties which made me very aware that I had chosen my math and science courses poorly in high school. I took the easy way out. I was on the 5-year plan and graduated in ‘91. Currently I am in grad school and begin student teaching next week.

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mountain man — so, a journalism student shouldn’t understand algebra (the higher math that most remedial students must retake because the high school passing grade was a gift)? Do you want that journalist writing a story on budgets? On the topic of global warming? On whether a statistical model, used to justify reform is real?

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Part of the new CCRPI score (for those who like to say a school can fail, the new score that says how well a school does) for high schools is that a high school is dinged by how many of its graduates attending a Georgia public post-secondary institution require remedial courses. What do you bet guidance departments start thinking very differently about the recommendations they make for their students?

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College is for those (or used to be) who have already mastered a certain level of education that has prepared them to be able to further that mastery in order to obtain a degree. Any child that graduates from high school without a good basis in math, english, history and science will find it hard to be successful in any endeavor. There should be no remedial courses offered at any colleges, it should not be necessary even for the athletes!

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@d, I was not aware of this change as a result of the new CCRPI. Perhaps it will have a positive result. When does this take effect? Beginning this school year?

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High schools are jokes. Nothing more than diploma producing mills; why in the world are teachers promoting/graduating these students??? Never mind, I forgot about that “social promotion” garbage.

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What, you people think entering freshmen should be functionally literate? Before I retired I interviewed college graduates for three positions. Seventy five percent of these applicants were functionally illiterate. If they are not expected to be able to read, write or do simple math after receiving a college degree, why should they be expected to do so prior to entering college.

The worse thing to happen to education was the creation of the Hope Scholarship.

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Not to be elitist, but this is what the technical colleges are for: those students who lack academic skills but who, once motivated, can learn a valued trade and become self-sufficient. (And I’m a welder’s kid; I know the value of skilled labor.)

I’ve seen a stream of hopelessness for the past several years, countless students with remedial requirements in reading, writing, and math, who are burdened, further, by their immaturity. They diminish the academic experience of those who arrive prepared and they, frankly, waste Pell Grant and other financial assistance that would go to better-prepared, more productive students.

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Why do we think that just because someone graduates from HS, they should be ready to go to college?
Hopefully, students who took their studies seriously in HS are ready for college, but the rest?
I understand that after elementary school, a child goes to middle school, after middle school on to HS. Not much choice there. But………..after HS you should have to “earn” your way into college.

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I teach at least one remedial English course each semester. The students who really piss me off are the ones who are unwilling to do the work. That is no doubt why they must take remedial classes in the first place: they were unwilling to do the work while in high school. And if you could see how much they don’t know you would probably be amazed. I wouldn’t hire them to clean toilets for fear they might accidently drown.

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This attitude of don’t hurt anyone’s feelings taking over the feel good institutions, what else could have been expected? Save Hope? Easy, if you can’t pass the entrance exams, legitamte ones, then sorry, no higher education for you. Regardless of who is paying, you have no business on a college campus.

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If one cannot read or do basic math, then one has no business attending college. One can improve their math skills at the public library for free, by logging onto the khan academy and doing the 12 minute video units. One can also improve their reading skills at a free public library. Only after one has mastered the basics does one have any business attending college. We need to stop telling ourselves that college is the solution for everyone, college is an expensive option. A wise man always chooses the free option over the expensive option, especially considering that college credit is not granted for remedial studies courses. Why pay to learn the basics if you are not going to get credit toward your degree for the hours?

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If the remedial classes aren’t available at community college or trade school and kids/people aren’t learning this in high school, where are folks that need the basics supposed to learn? Night school could be an option but not sure it is offered currently. If the current school system has let these kids / adults down, we can’t just write them off and say if you don’t have basic skills you can’t go to college or get a job.

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@ Gwinnett Mother, You make an excellent point. And even students who bypass remedial classes can have pretty severe skill deficiencies. The main difference is that some will work to correct those deficiencies and some will not.

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A failure of the Hope System is the low (60%) retention rate after Freshman year. There must be a better way than HS grades to screen worthy motivated students for this valuable money. So many could benefit. Today those who slide through HS with EZ courses get the money and then face reality in college. Clearly more emphasis should be placed on helping students find a minimum set of skills that can make them a functioning member of society; then aspire to higher education. With a HS dropout rate of 30-40% we are dooming them to a life below the poverty line.

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I am willing to bet a good portion of those taking remedial courses are attending on Hope scholarships. Some of our public schools are so bad that they will give out A’s to students barely doing C work. Our public schools so often come up short and this fact is reflected in many ways in higher education and in the work place. It is time to introduce competition to our schools. Give the parents vouchers and let them send their kid to the best school available, not just the one nearest their residence.

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Finally, incentive for students to learn basic material before they get to college. The real question is, why didn’t we require them to do this to get the high school diploma instead of coddling them for 12 years? I’ve been asking that question for over 10 years… and Georgia public high schools (and Cobb County in particular) have yet to even acknowledge the question. Guess they’ll have to now, but it’s too late for the victims of the sham that have already graduated.

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“Another key element requires public schools to graduate students better-prepared for college.”
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This may mean that certain students may need more than four years to graduate from high school – under a directed, specific plan-of-action for 5, or even 6 years, in high school for those students to become proficient in reading and math skills, as well as in all of the high school curricula. Their reading and math scores should be thoroughly known and documented in 9th grade (as well as before 9th grade) so that all high school teachers are aware of their scores, via computer access, and remediation should be an ongoing process that should occur, with precision, well in advance of their beginning college or technical school. This approach is consistent with learning theories. See link below in which the rate of achieving mastery of content is adjusted to individual student’s instructional need.

http://maryelizabethsings.wordpress.com/2012/01/15/about-education-essay-1-mastery-learning/

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I’m a big believer in everybody but the 2 year and tech schools having a hard admissions cap, even for the football players (dreaming, I know). anyone with University in its name should not be accepting remedial anything.

while I was always a supporter of GPCs open enrollment policy, I do feel it needs to come with limits such as no HOPE for remedial students and no open ended tries to work thru the system.

the sorry truth is it we pull the places and the funding for remedial ed, we are creating a lost generation (educational wise) of Georgians. if we don’t pull the funding, we enable the system which produced this disaster in the first place

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@ Tired

GPC had several initatives for helping at risk students legitimately qualify for college. but instead of reinforcing them, we chose to spend our moneys on things like forced volunteerism, community gardens, and massive “dig me” events.

we put our money where our priorities were – and students weren’t high among them

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@Catlady – Sometimes you can throw alot of money at an issue and it will just be lost. The students have to want to learn and the parents need to be more like Tiger Mom. Unfortunately, there are some “teachers” who have no business being in the classroom, some will give out good grades as an easy way out and some may be smart but really can’t “teach” the material.

I do agree there needs to be other avenues for poorly prepared students to get remedial education but not at the college level. Perhaps a Prep school would be more appropriate for some but it would be more helpful for the teachers to know an incoming 9th grader has defenciencies in certain areas.

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It’s understandable that people over 36 might need some remedial work but those just out of high school, not so much. A question needs to be asked, I think: If you’ve graduated a kid from high school but he isn’t prepared to go on to college or technical school, why did he/she graduate?

In my opinion, a lot of this stuff starts in low elementary school. If a kid is behind in 2nd or 3rd grade, odds are they’re never going to catch back up. The first 3 grades are probably the most important, in my opinion. Don’t let them out of there, if they aren’t ready to move on.

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This is when we need to stop worrying about kids’ self-esteem and be truthful with them. If they aren’t prepared for college, the kindest thing colleges can do is send them an honest rejection letter. Accepting students who are highly unlikely to successfully earn a degree is deceptive and cruel. Those students can then take more time to prepare themselves for college with private tutoring and study, or accept that they are not college material and find a more suitable way to prepare for the future.

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@ Jessica

you’re correct, but it isn’t gonna happen.

and even if it did, the current crop (in my math, the last four and the next six generations) of students are already screwed. we gotta deal with them either in the classroom or in the social system. I prefer the classroom

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I agree that we are sending students off to college unprepared. When I taught eleventh-grade English, I saw students who read at an elementary-school level go off to college. I wondered how they were accepted in the first place, but that’s another story.

We know this already. But an important question in the “one student in four” statistic is whether or not students earn four-year degrees at colleges other than the ones where they took remedial classes. Several college professors have told me that there that limitations in the reporting and record-keeping systems make it difficult, if not impossible, to track students who transfer to other colleges; so those who may appear to be drop-outs actually do go on to finish their degrees elsewhere.

While this complication does not dismiss the problem of secondary preparation, it does affect our perception of the issue and should be addressed.

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“But, we cannot blame the high schools for what they are turning out. The “product” merely reflects the lack of financial input from the state, the regs the USDOE puts in place, and the student’s own “relaxed” attitude toward education.”

We might not be able to blame the high schools for what the students LEARN, but we CAN blame them for giving high school diplomas to those who have not mastered the basics. The GHSGT test should be a minimum requirement for a diploma. Correct me if I am wrong, but I understand you can get a waiver from your school if you try to pass the GHSGT several times and continue to fail. These waivers result in people walking around with high school diplomas that are just so much waste paper.

The other side of the coin is this: a high school diploma does NOT mean COLLEGE-READY, nor should it. It should just indicate mastery of the basics, not higher level to enter college. But colleges do not HAVE to include remediation – that could be done at a different school. Or remediation could be limited to one class only, if you fail that, you are out of college. You should not be able to take a remediation course three or four times – if you can’t pass it the first time, you probably don’t belong in college.

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What ever happened to a minimum SAT score to get accepted to a college?

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@bootney——–Comment at 10:18. This has to be the first comment that hits the nail on the head about our college system in Georgia.Good comment and it should be sent to the Board of Regents since the majority are politicans and not educators.

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“they should not be graduating without knowing the difference between “there, their and they’re” ”

There are a lot of people on the blogs I follow that fall into that category. Or the other one I love – “your” and “you’re”.

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@bootney 10:27

I think we all prefer the classroom to the “social system.” Students come to us unprepared, and they leave us unprepared. Colleges look to the high schools,high schools look to the middle schools, middle schools to the elementary schools, and elementary schools to the parents. Meantime, we’re all looking for the silver bullet.

Call me old-fashioned, but if you look at the bottom level of Bloom’s Taxonomy, you see a basic foundation of knowledge, which translates into memorization of multiplication tables, phonics, etc. These are not meant to be learned for a test and forgotten; but we seem to have fallen into that pattern. Higher-order thinking skills and abstract ideas are essential in a person’s education; but a student can’t solve a complex equation without those multiplication tables he or she should have learned in elementary school. I know that this basic information is being taught, but it isn’t being retained. Have students become accustomed to “brain-dumping” for a test and moving on, thinking that they won’t need skills or information obtained in the early years of school?

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“Meantime, we’re all looking for the silver bullet.”

We KNOW the silver bullet – the problem is that it is too difficult and angers too many parents.

Silver bullet:
Mandate attendance
Control discipline
No social promotion
Let those who fail fail.
“you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t teach a kid who doesn’t want to learn”

You will NEVER achieve a 100% graduation rate – unless you just hand them a diploma with no requirements attached.

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mountain man, 10:46 am

Not “social promotion,” but “continuous progress” for mastery. There is a difference, instructionally, in those two phrases that you are, evidently, not willing to see.

To be better informed, please read the link that I posted at 9:53 am on Mastery Learning.

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Realistically, teachers cannot keep a 12 year old, about ready to shave, in 3rd grade, for years.

No Mary Elizabeth, but they could keep an 8 year old in third grade for another year, when he is actually only ONE year behind; instead of waiting to do remediation in high school, when he is YEARS behind.

The other thing they could do is offer swift, sure, compelling and most of all CONSISTENT consequences for those who those who CHOOSE to not follow the school rules.

Or we can just wait for the employer, landlord, or most sad of all a JUDGE to offer those consequences, when they will be FAR more damaging than they would have been in 3rd grade.

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If a student needs remediation in reading, writing, and math…they probably shouldn’t be in college to begin with. The biggest drawback our educational system has…compared to other educational systems around the world…is that we don’t haven benchmark tests along to way that students have to pass in order to move on to the next educational level. What tests we do have we make ridiculously easy…and when students don’t even pass those, we promote them anyway.

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@Mary Elizabeth, it makes sense to teach children where they are at but…

…when one goes to take tennis lessons, they often offer three levels:

-Beginner
-Intermediate
-Advanced

We don’t put the beginner in the advance class, because well, it’s “advanced.” It’s just foolish to think that putting Serena Williams and Betty White in the same tennis class benefits either one of them.

We wouldn’t expect the instructor to teach beginning, middle, and advanced all at the SAME time. So why do we expect it of class teachers, to teach a student on a 2nd grade reading level at the SAME time as they are teaching one at the 9th grade level?

Does that make COMMON sense?

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“Not “social promotion,” but “continuous progress” for mastery.”

If a 3rd grader is having to shve, there hasn’t been a lot of “continuous progress”. Yes, I am unwilling to see the excuses for social promotion; I don’t like the idea of 9th graders who can’t do simple arithmetic. At some point “catching up” is impossible. Especially with 30 kids to a class.

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ESSENTIAL QUESTIONS: To what extent is the prevalence of remedial classes in USG schools a function of the lack of rigor in GAPubEd secondary schools’ college-prep programs? To what extent is it a function of USG schools’ admitting HS grads who did not complete a college-prep program?

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@Mountain man how would you like to be (so it doesn’t damage your self-esteem) “socially promoted” in boxing class so that you were “matriculating” in the ring with Mike Tyson and Evander Holyfield?

If it were me I’d say, “Put me back in the beginner’s class where I BELONG!”

Maybe if educators saw it THAT way, they’d get a real sense of the DAMAGE they are doing by pushing kids through who aren’t ready.

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Whether it’s a big “hootn’holler” over rising CRCT/ACT/SAT or the diminishing rates at which kids get lost within the confines of the “reading room”…When are the powers that be going to stop behaving like a bunch of rubes celebrating the psuedo-successes which are the hallmark of mediocrity. Is this supposed to signify a leap and a bound in the educational leadership which seems to have infested the whole damn mess which passes for education.

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Another nameless and faceless entity ” THE STATE” is cracking down on the most neediest students who are making an effort to attain a higher level of education. Instead of this reporter identifying what agency,group or specific individuals responsible for such a DASTARDLY and UNCONSCIONABLE ACT. Her story further shields them by allowing them to remain anonymous! I call on the AJC and Maureen to provide a additional information other than “THE STATE”. As we all know
“THE STATE ” cannot act without PEOPLE implementing policy.

SHAME SHAME! on You Maureen for allowing this to got to print as is! and for not demanding more information!

For those of us who are informed are well are aware what groups this effort is specifically targeted for dis encouragement. At least (85%) of all enrolled minority students that are enrolled in Georgia’s colleges typically are remanded to remedial courses in their first year of college. The Georgia Board Of Regents instead of providing a helping hand of assistance to these students, they are giving shoving BOTH HEELS in their faces, that says TOO BAD! for you, if this is your LOT in LIFE.

This move smacks of past Racial and cultural insensitivity of Georgia ugly discriminatory past of years gone by. This move is SHAME and an OUTRAGE!
What does this say to student who comes from a failing HIGH SCHOOL unprepared and still want to someday attain the American DREAM? Education has always been the KEY. The State Republicans as usual wants to take us ALL back to the era 1950’s when it comes to educating our Children and the Healthcare of Women.

If WE ALL remain SILENT….Soon and pretty soon these same polices will one day find themselves at your Front Door refusing you or your family members a better opportunity and chance to improve their lives and reach the AMERICAN DREAM!

A people’s SILENCE is the first conspirator when the “STATE” enacts a dictatorial policy it wills on the DREAMS and HOPES of its citizens!

Where are MARTIN”S DREAMERS?, Awake for your NIGHTMARE is starting AGAIN!

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[...] link: State cracks down on how many remedial courses college students … ← BPO Industry Expects More Dramatic Growth Ahead – My News [...]

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This is what happens when schools allow social promotions to exist…..this only leads to remedial courses in college. Why are they even in a place of higher learning if remedial courses are needed? Most colleges and universities require the SAT/ACT pair that with an adequate GPA and this should weed out the less than stellar high school senior. When will these bureaucrats get it through their head that not all high school students are college bound. It would appear that the 4-year plan is not enough anymore, we are now suppose to accept the idea that it takes 6 years or more to complete college. Anyone who can’t read and write on a 12th grade level shouldn’ t be in college in the first place. High schools use to be about readiness and academic achievement , not social promotion or mediocrity. This “diploma mill” education needs to cease, until then Georgia education will continue to be a laughingstock when it comes to preparing student for college and the real world.

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I don’t know if they still do this or not, but when I worked in Gwinnett several years ago, they had a program for students who may have mastered part of a grade-level curriculum but not the entire curriculum. It was almost a grade 7.5 – OK, so you got the English, Social Studies, and Science curriculum. We’ll let you take those 8th grade courses, but you need to redo 7th grade Math so you get that. It is a better solution than holding the student back an entire year when they only need help in a certain area…..

As far as my comment earlier, I was without internet access to reply earlier, but I believe the CCRPI is the measurement that will be used for the 12-13 year moving forward. There is also a component about the “number of tested students exceeding X on the SAT/ACT (I forget the exact numbers off of the top of my head). I’ve had students who take the test – most certainly not ready for it – scoring in the triple digits on the 2400 scale. That student should have NEVER taken the test to begin with. Honestly, if you look at most of the issues with Georgia’s SAT scores as compared to places like North Dakota – look at who is taking the test. Huge numbers of students take the test here (many of whom shouldn’t be) but only the top students take the test in North Dakota. That is not showing a failing of Georgia education as compared to North Dakota, but rather we need to realize not everyone should be preparing to go to college.

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Beverly Fraud, 11:15 am

“We don’t put the beginner in the advance class, because well, it’s ‘advanced.’ It’s just foolish to think that putting Serena Williams and Betty White in the same tennis class benefits either one of them.”
—————————————————-
We agree on this point.

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“We wouldn’t expect the instructor to teach beginning, middle, and advanced all at the SAME time. So why do we expect it of class teachers, to teach a student on a 2nd grade reading level at the SAME time as they are teaching one at the 9th grade level?”
——————————————————————–

You are assuming that all teachers simply lecture to a class – at one time – for every period of every day of the school year. This does not happen. Teachers vary their instructional delivery, often by subgrouping their students, and they will act as facilitators to learning to individuals in those various subgroups within their classrooms, in addition to lecturing at other times. In my own classes, I had sometimes lectured for 20 to 25 minutes, and then subgrouped students to work on the concepts of the lecture for the remainder of the class time. During the last half of the class period, I would rotate to each group to work with the individual needs of each group. Furthermore, master scheduling can place students more precisely in correct instuctional settings to start with, thus avoiding unnecessary failure; teachers can team teach to address student variances between their classes; paraprofessionals can aid teachers in accommodating instructional variances among students, and at times school volunteers, or instructional “coaches,” can work with individual students within a teacher’s class period. There are many ways to address individual variances, but first we must see the value in trying to do so.

(At the beginning of every school year, the first goal I had was to ascertain, through analyzing the individual reading scores of all of my 150 advanced reading students, if my students were correctly placed in my advanced reading class. If I believed that any were misplaced, based on their standardized reading test scores, I talked with those particular students, their parents, and their counselors, individually, to recommend highly that they be changed to the “personalized reading” course for that year, or at least for that semester, until they had increased their reading skills enough to be correctly placed in my advanced reading class. Invariably, because my suggestions, based on these students’ reading data and their previous performances, parents, students, and counselors agreed to the switch of course at the very beginning of the school year because my suggestions were sound ones and would alleviate unnecessary failure. Often, the following year, many of these students, then, would enrolled in my advanced reading class at which time, they would meet with success, and not failure.)

Please read the link below about an excellent 5th grade science teacher who did subgroup to accommodate instructional variances in her classroom, and changed the lives of her students by doing so. It is called “Cyndie’s Story.” It is a true story.

http://maryelizabethsings.wordpress.com/2012/02/11/cyndies-story/

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“Seems more logically to place children initially where they’d have their BEST chance of success. . .”
—————————————————————————

I agree. See my 12:19 pm post for pursuing correct placement, in depth.

Precise instructional delivery for each student has no simple answers, but it can be addressed, effectively, throughout every student’s elementary and secondary educational tenure.

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@ Claudia Stucke
re: 12:06 p.m.

I think that you and David Granger are talking about two different things when you talk about “benchmark” tests. As he pointed out, we don’t have mandatory tests that students MUST pass in order to move to the next level. Most European countries (and just about ALL Asian countries) do…and they are absolutely ruthless in enforcing that. They don’t have tests every year like we do, but most students take the exams at about the Jr. High level…and then again after High School. And if you don’t pass, then that’s it. One strike, and you’re out…go learn a trade. Some countries do allow failing students to take a test again, but only after taking private remedial courses (at their own expense)…and some countries do not. (To be fair, most of those other countries do have much better technical training programs than the U.S., and skilled laborers are not looked down upon like they sometimes are in this country, unfortunately.)
In the U.S., as you point out, if a student doesn’t pass the benchmark test…they are given other chances and their parents have the option of signing a waiver that lets their kids advance no matter what. The benchmark tests are for information only, not an absolute requirement that must be passed successfully in order to move on to higher grades.

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. I think the state of
Georgia should subsidize college, but I also understand
that no matter how great the SAT,and ACT scores of
the student may be, the responsibility for paying for
the education rest with the parents and students.

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Jane W. @ 1:00 pm – Who if not the Republicans that are behind this policy I ask of you? Is it the this Republican administration that is moving ahead for the first time with a state funded Charter School push? Is not the precursor for a ultimate push for a state wide school voucher payment system that is so popular with mostly Republican supporters?

Yes, I do get emotional and upset when see unfairness inflicted upon an already struggling segment of our population be further cheated and denied a chance to get
the very thing that YOU and your ilk take for granted.

As for my Mother at least I have ONE!……. I am not so sure about YOU!

This is what happens when you anger the powers that be and pay your AJC subscription online through your son’s e-mail account. Assumptions are made and alleged when the real truth remains unknown and unavailable.

Remember Richard Jewell, slander is a sue able and winnable defense.

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you really want to see a reduction in tuition?

end HOPE. today.

HOPE opened the door to runaway tuition increases.

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My argument is that the students should have been allowed to
enroll in college courses, and get supplemental tutoring ,or
building of skills through an adviser on the student’s own time.
If the students didn’t pass, then they would face the same
problem that students with higher SAT scores face when they
received poor grades from partying too much-academic
probation, or enroll at a junior college to enhance their skills.
The role of the professor is to teach whoever enrolls in the course,
and it is the role of the student to obtain understanding and
mastery of the concepts. It is not the role of the professor
to pick and choose the students to be educated.

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@ Mountain Man

Why didn’t you view the challenge as an opportunity to
help the students appreciate the subject matter that you
care about? The fact that the students had low skills did
not mean that they were incapable of reasoning and
learning.

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My other question is: at an insitution like the University of Georgia, there are many more qualified applicants than there are spots available – why does UGA accept students that require remediation while turning away qualified applicants? Is it some sort of quota?

Again, I am exempting football players because that is a totally separate system.

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one of the dirty little secrets of recruiting /admissions is your grades matter about 1/2 of what your demographic happens to be in a given year. if a school needs more Asians, we’ll make room. if a school needs more open gays, we’ll make room. if a school needs more point guards, we’ll throw some one out if we need to.

grades, SAT scores – secondary consideration to demographic of the term.

in Tricoli’s early days GPC would bring in anyone with a plus who could qualify for aid. faculty and staff knew most of these kids would not finish out the year, much less graduate. but in a corrupt system with no room for dissent …

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@bootney-sometimes you make excellent points, and I have respect for your intellect. But goodness gracious, did you really write that “HOPE opened the door to runaway tuition increases?” Talk about living in a vacuum. I’ve got news for you Bootney – Georgia is just one state out of 50 states, and runaway tuition increases are not unique to Georgia. Massive fail on the point you are trying to make, unless you can show that HOPE is to blame for massive tuition increases in Texas, California, etc.

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Well that’s a different point you’re making. Now you’re on to something: government loans are a common denominator across states. HOPE? Not so much.

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@bootney – I wish more GPCers would speak up. Thank you. GPC’s explanation of layoffs is that they are to minimize the effect on students. However, the layoffs in tutoring, computer labs, and libraries show this to be a lie. Student success is tied to these services, and the drastic cuts to these departments will not go unnoticed in retention and graduation results. These departments depend greatly on part-time staff also, which has been cut by well over half. The 3 full-time Newton campus tutoring staff were ALL fired. Please explain. More tutoring part-timers are being laid off. We’re keeping vice-presidents of anything you can name and all sorts of mid-level managers hired under Tricoli. How is firing student success and retention employees “minimizing” the effect on students? GPC will feel the effects of these poor decisions for many years.

No one can possibly believe that the Regents or Tricoli were so completely mislead or kept in the dark. The Regents decide how to dole out the $$$ to 35 institutions, and yet they say there are too many institutions for them to keep up with the yearly financial situation of each. Sure. I believe that. If they are no more responsible than that, then the financial decisions should be taken away from them good ol boys.

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Beverly Fraud, 9:14 pm

You seem to have your own educational agenda that you wish to express, regardless of the context.

Cyndie’s story does not mention discipline, for there was no need to mention discipline. The point of her story – and even Cyndie as a perceptive teenager realized this – was that if teachers will address the correct instructional levels of their students, in whatever grade the students are assigned, they can change their students lives for the better, and often dramatically so forever, as happened in Cyndie’s case.

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Georgia Perimeter College is an open-enrollment insitution, so anyone with a pulse used to be admitted. Now that the Legislature has decided to tie funding to graduation rates, however, the school has had to change its policy regarding the admission of students who place into more than one learning support subject. So demographics did not and do not play a roll in admissions at GPC.

At other colleges demographics are obviously a consideration. Whether it is true to say that “grades, SAT scores – secondary consideration to demographic of the term” is an exaggeration to say the least. Some would probably characterize it as bullsh-t.

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I don’t believe that high schools should be held responsible for not having every graduate ready for college any more than I think colleges should be held responsible for not having every graduate ready to pursue a graduate degree. Some people are not studious or intelligent enough to handle college courses. There is no shame in that. My father never finished the 8th grade yet learned a valuable skill (truck driving) and was able to support a family of 5 children.

I am a high school teacher, and it is my job to teach every student as much as I possibly can while he / she is in my class, but I can’t prepare someone who shows up in my classroom reading on a third grade level for a college literature course in a semester.

I have tutored remedial students in a Georgia university, and many of them should never have been admitted to college in the first place. College is not for everyone, and we will always need truck drivers, sanitation engineers, plumbers, and many other types of workers who do not need a college education in order to perform their jobs well. The problem is that many people devalue physical labor as menial or somehow beneath their offspring. I have worked climbing telephone poles, digging ditches, driving a forklift, and even cleaning out stalls on a dairy farm before I became a teacher, and all of these were important jobs that my employers wanted done well. None of them required a college degree.

The bottom line is this: if a person shows no aptitude for academics, he or she should not pursue a college degree. No amount of remediation will ever turn a dull mind into a sharp one, and no lack of instruction will ever stop a bright and truly motivated person from mastering his / her lessons.

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When I graduated high school in the early 1970’s, things were somewhat simpler. In those days, if you had a strong back, could follow instructions, read a carpenter’s rule and do basic arithmetic, you could get a decent-paying job and expect to stay in it until you retired or your back gave out, whichever came first. Those jobs are pretty much gone now, thanks to automation and/or outsourcing. There is now some demand for qualified machinists but technical entry-level skills are a lot higher for them now because most machine tools are computerized. Workers have to be a lot more flexible now because the days when a guy spent 20-30 years at (for example) GM spot welding the same joint, are pretty much over. I would say apprenticeships need to be brought back and they could work in conjunction with the technical schools.

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