Is a longer school year a reform worth considering? Or, is the cost too much and the payoff too little?
While 170 schools around the country have added school days, some Georgia students are returning to shorter schools years, a consequence of budget cuts. (AP Image)
With some Georgia districts adopting a shorter school year to cope with budget cuts, I thought this New York Times story on the opposite trend was worth sharing.
The National Center on Time and Learning, a nonprofit research group in Boston, reports that about 170 schools — most of them charters — have extended their calendars to 190 days or longer, according to the Times story.
Here is an excerpt but try to read the full piece in the Times:
A growing group of education advocates is agitating for more time in schools, arguing that low-income children in particular need more time to catch up as schools face increasing pressure to improve student test scores. “It’s not as simple as ‘Oh, if we just went 12 hours every kid would be Einstein,’ ” said Chris Gabrieli, chairman of the Boston group. “On the other hand, the more time you spend practicing or preparing to do something, the better you get at it.”
Education advocates have been calling for more school time at least since the 1983 “Nation at Risk” report presented an apocalyptic vision of American education. Teachers’ unions, parents who want to preserve summers for family vacations and those who worry that children already come under too much academic stress argue that extended school time is not the answer. Research on longer school days or years also shows mixed results.
But studies also show that during the summer break, students — particularly those from low-income families — tend to forget what they learned in the school year. Getting back to school early, supporters of a longer calendar say, is one of the best ways to narrow an achievement gap between rich and poor students. Many charter schools, including those in the academically successful KIPP network, attribute their achievement in part to longer days and calendars.
Advocates of longer school years say that the 180-day school year is an outdated artifact. “The fact that our calendar has been based on the agrarian economy when almost none of our kids work in the field anymore,” said Arne Duncan, secretary of education, “doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.”
Yet several recent efforts to lengthen the school calendar have foundered. The Woodland Hills Academy in Pittsburgh extended its school year to 195 days in 2009, but this year it will return to the traditional 180-day calendar because of state budget cuts. Similarly, Parkside Elementary in Coral Springs, Fla., tried a 200-day calendar for one year before abandoning it because of insufficient financing.
Critics say that with so many schools already failing, giving them more time would do little to help students. “It is true that we have an unfair society, and it is true that kids who are coming from the poorer backgrounds and whose parents don’t do a lot of reading are losing reading skills over the summer,” said Peter Gray, research professor of psychology at Boston College. “But let’s look at other solutions.” He added, “Whatever job we give to the school system, they ruin it.”
Advocates say that schools need to plan carefully how they will use the extra time. Some say that adding the kinds of art, music and other activities that more affluent students typically get outside school is as important as beefing up academics.
–From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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80 comments Add your comment
flipper
August 6th, 2012
12:06 pm
If low income students are failing… give he low income students who need it learning opportunities in the summer. Do not impose more boring class time on students who already are up to speed and who may very well have access to much more valuable experiences than public school in the summer. Focusing extra school days on the kids that need it still closes the achievement gap while saving districts money because they will not be having to educate kids who don’t need it.
skipper
August 6th, 2012
12:14 pm
It is hard enough to keep kids full attention in the regularly alloted time…..now (and I smell the left) folks think that a baby-sitting service is in order. Kids can learn plenty during the regular school day. The fact that some parents are not worth a toot will not mean a longer school day is better. And the fact that the study says lower income kids tend to forget again goes back to parenting. Godd Lord, let kids enjoy their summer; playing ball or whatever! The so-called “Experts” (with emphasis on the so-called) have not done a cotton-pickin’ thing to improve education. They just keep coming up with the feel-good remedy of the day. I know preparation is important…..but so is looking at the REAL reasond kids, especially those from lower income areas, are having difficulty. Until somebody tells the truth, everyone will dance around the topic, with imagined “solutions” that are based on nothing more than a “study” that another “study” could totally disprove!
Ole Guy
August 6th, 2012
12:16 pm
Gotta love these “studies”…during summer break, students, particularly those from lower socioeconomic backgrounds, tend to forget what they learned during that “taxing academic school year”. Hells bells, I generally forgot all that stuff 5 minutes after walking…no, make that runing…out the door following that final bell.
But let’s get semi-serious for just a minute. As usual, the basic problem seems to become intertwined with all sort of extraneous issues. Kids aren’t going to forget all that good stuff because of longer or shorter school years, they “forget”…regardless of socioeconomic considerations…because they were never required to INTERNALIZE that which was presented to them in the educational experience.
Lets howbout we stop attributing problems, with the educational morrass, to non-issue considerations…you can lengthen/shorten the school year all you want…won’t make a gd bit of difference. What will make the big difference of ACTIVE PARTICIPATORY EDUCATION, and that means (once again) DEMAND max performance…no “at risk” nonesense. That’s simply official justification for less than optimal results. ONCE AGAIN…let’s stop babying these kids.
Stan the Man
August 6th, 2012
12:27 pm
Cause the University systems have got this thing figured out. You want to know who gets overpaid with little results…Research psychology professors from Boston University. People who have never been in a public school system classroom, but seem to be experts in educating kids gives their “expertise” in education for some reason. If this is so brilliant, why dont music theory professors sell their music? Economic “expert” professors fix our economy. We have too many cooks in the kitchen who make the rules, but have no idea what they’re talking about when it comes to education. I don’t mind competition. Privatize everything if you want, give vouchers, longer school days, whatever…just PLEASE listen to good principals and teachers instead of over paid “RESEARCH” professors, who would not last one day in most public schools. You want to see an injustice of tax payer dollars…Look up professor salaries…see how many days they work…how many assistants and secretaries they have…and then complain about the type of students schools send them…sorry that statment got under my skin. “whatever job we give to the school system, they ruin it” because for the most part under the circumstances, we are given an impossible job.
skipper
August 6th, 2012
12:27 pm
ole guy,
Thats a “right-on”! Amazing…..our Coach had an “equilizer” that suddenly made more attentive students out of disruptive ones. And, we learned alot by repitition……even the slower ones in class knew their multiplication tables, as Ms. Dunn made each and every student go from one to twelve (all the ones; rather easy) then twos, threes, etc. and say them all in ten seconds each. The slowest person in class could do it in his sleep! I’m not saying it hasn’t evolutionized, but have we run past more than we have caught up with? We are too worried about not hurting folks feelings…………
mountain man
August 6th, 2012
12:30 pm
Should we go to a longer school year – only if we want our best to excell. That would be good for the top 10% and would allow them to progress faster.
But for the average student and much more so for the poor student, the lengthening of the school year will not make a difference (regular classes). If they don’t learn during the regular year, they won’t learn in the extended year (if they are even there – see absentism).
What should take place is that teachers should teach all year round (minus vacations, of course), but the summer instruction should be intensive instruction in low student:teacher ratio classes for those students who fail. This would entitle teachers to that needed raise. Then if the child STILL is not on-grade, they should be retained and forced to repeat the grade.
Tired
August 6th, 2012
12:31 pm
Would reducing the truancy rate have the same effect as lengthening the school year?
mountain man
August 6th, 2012
12:33 pm
Of course with the new Common Core standards or with block scheduling, where they teach more material sooner, maybe we need a longer school year.
mountain man
August 6th, 2012
12:35 pm
Tired – good point. If the current school year is 180 days but the average student attends 160 – if you lengthen the year, the student probably will then go 167 days. If you just put some good discipline on the parents, the child would probably go 167 days in 180, without the extrra cost.
skipper
August 6th, 2012
12:39 pm
mountain man,
Bingo….
Dr. John Trotter
August 6th, 2012
12:43 pm
A longer school year of students not trying, laying their heads on their desks and sleeping, or constantly disrupting the class with their antics? Oh, this is going to “improve” public education? Hardly. Ha! These folks just don’t get it. A longer school year won’t do a darn thing to improve public education. Not a darn thing.
When these politicians, policy-maker, educrats, and superintendents get their heads out of their a$ses and realize that trying to improve public education without first addressing (2) motivation — or, a lack of motivation — to learn and (2) student discipline – or, a lack thereof – is like pi&sing into a tsunami, then there might be a flicker of hope down this long, dark tunnel. Until then, these educational bozos are actually comical, starting with the U. S. Secretary of Education, Arne Duncan.
http://www.georgiateachersspeakout.com
http://www.theteachersadvocate.com
Jefferson
August 6th, 2012
12:44 pm
Americans that work full time for the most part work everyday during the week, why not learn the same way. Life a full time event.
Lady GaGa
August 6th, 2012
12:46 pm
We should have had a longer school year for a long time. We need new ideas. Obviously what we’re doing isn’t totally working. All students could benefit from it, poor kids could get caught up and the others could get more enrichment to push them ahead. Educators should be in the classroom year round anyway- there’s so much they could be doing (enrichment, tutoring, science labs & experiments, field trips, technology, running a business, extra-curricular activities, college and career planning, personal finance classes) the list goes on and on.
Dr. John Trotter
August 6th, 2012
12:46 pm
That should have been (1) and (2), not (2) and (2). Ha! Sorry.
William Casey
August 6th, 2012
12:53 pm
I am against a “one size fits all” approach for a number of reasons. However, in the early grades, an intense “mini-mester,” leaving breaks in late May and late July, might be useful for students performing below grade level. I would favor this ONLY if the time were spent on the fundamentals– reading, writing and arithmatic. Realistically, in this “age of austerity,” this won’t happen even though it would probably be cost-effective long term.
Dunwoody Mom
August 6th, 2012
1:01 pm
I wonder if we will ever get “advice” from individuals not involved with the Gates Foundation or Broad Foundation to give us some “real” educational suggestions.
I agree, a one-size fits all is ridiculous. School districts should determine their calendars based on what is best for their students.
skipper
August 6th, 2012
1:05 pm
William Casey,
Good point by you, too. Even the kids in class (ESPECIALLY the kids in class) can tell who is slower and who is not. For us older folks, do you remember SRA reading? You went to a different color for each advancement. Aqua, purple, orange, olive, blue, brown, green, red (tan and gold were added in third or fourth grade.) Every kid knew that whoever was still in aqua or purple a few weeks down the road had SOME kind of difficulty…proving that one size does not fit all. Extra instruction for these kids was beneficial…….perhaps in todays model we just need to realize who can or cannot compete and help them catch up. A longer school year (demographics be darned) is not the answer.
bootney farnsworth
August 6th, 2012
1:14 pm
I have been a long time fan of year ’round education.
Dunwoody Mom
August 6th, 2012
1:25 pm
It would be interesting to see achievement data of school systems which are now on “year-round” schools compared to their data prior to converting to year round.
What's Best for Kids?
August 6th, 2012
1:25 pm
6 weeks on, two weeks off…done!
Would just like a full year
August 6th, 2012
1:31 pm
After 4 years of furloughs and a shortened calendar, 180 days would be nice. every study that compares the US to better performing countries points out our short school year, yet we don’t want to pay for what we have much less more.
Mountain Man
August 6th, 2012
1:45 pm
“6 weeks on, two weeks off…done!
”
You DO realize there are 6.5 of these 8-week periods in a year, right?
Bernie
August 6th, 2012
1:58 pm
America is reducing its time of educating its children. The Chinese and Indians are increasing their’s. America is no longer producing top Scientists, Engineers, Mathematicians. China and India’s children are routinely the top students in the high schools and colleges they attend. You do the Math…..texting,sexting and video games are the things America’s children are interested in. Chinese and Indian children are now many of its creators. America continue your reductions, continue with your proposed chart and voucher school plans. Your future will not be as bright as it once was.
Former History Teacher
August 6th, 2012
2:19 pm
Countries that continually outperform the US in educational standards and achievments have much longer school years and more frequent breaks. Standards are higher and there is little dumbing down of the curriculum. Here in the US, in almost every state, we excuse poor performance for a variety of made up reasons. The result is lowering standards rather than raising the standards and our expectations.
We have become a society that relies heavily on excuses to justify our slipping standards. Children from poverty stricken backgrounds need more time in school as do children from affluent backgrounds who simply do not care. We need to raise standards in ALL of our schools. Good teachers should be rotated to all schools regardless of where they are in a county/school system. Bad teachers should not be able to hide behind tenure and should be eliminated. Let’s face it–teachers are responsible, along with parents and children, if the kids are not learning in their classrooms. All share responsibility. Teachers who pass children to the next grade when they have not mastered the material should be immediately sacked. No discussion or excuses.
As a teacher one of the most difficult problems I had was at the start of school many students could not pay attention longer than 5 or so minutes at a time—about the length of time between commericals on a TV show.
Something that could be avoided with a longer school year.
edugator
August 6th, 2012
2:40 pm
Bernie is spot on. Most of those nations of who seem to be achieving so much have longer school years, by as much as 30-40 days. I’m not going to go that far, but two added weeks makes a lot of sense. Perhaps the problem is the long days we have. Instruction over a longer period of time, rather than a longer period of instruction is the way to go.
ColonelJack
August 6th, 2012
3:12 pm
In 23 years of teaching, I expected a lot from my students. I expected them to master the material I taught, and – up until the middle of the past decade – they did, with 90% on average meeting or exceeding expectations on whichever tests we were using.
Then, for some silly reason, the focus in our system shifted from *what* we were teaching to *how* we were to teach it … and it didn’t matter if the method a teacher used was effective or not, everybody had to be doing it the same way. (Never mind that kids learn differently; the teaching had to be done in the same way.) I had a very difficult time adapting to this new way of doing things; so difficult, in fact, that I finally gave up. After 21 straight “satisfactory” evaluations, I earned two “unsatisfactory” ones because my teaching style didn’t fit into their box. So I retired.
Longer school year? Ha. Let teachers do their jobs during the school year we currently have (and keep administrators OUT of the way) and there will be improvements.
living in an outdated ed system
August 6th, 2012
3:15 pm
Longer school year – MAYBE
Longer school day – NO
Hillbilly D
August 6th, 2012
3:24 pm
I’m dead set against a longer school year. Kids still need time to be kids. When I was a boy, I spent my summers with my Grandparents and I learned things that I never could’ve learned in school. I wouldn’t trade any of that for any amount of money, or anything else.
For those who need the extra time, there is still summer school (I assume) or they can be held back a year.
Then, for some silly reason, the focus in our system shifted from *what* we were teaching to *how* we were to teach it … and it didn’t matter if the method a teacher used was effective or not, everybody had to be doing it the same way.
Interesting point, Colonel Jack. When I was in school, all those years ago, a few teachers stood out to me. Time has faded the memories but there’s still a half dozen or so that I remember as having a big effect on my learning. They each had their own methods, that worked for them. Trying to put square pegs in round holes, or vice versa, never works.
living in an outdated ed system
August 6th, 2012
3:28 pm
And remember, it’s the QUALITY of time spent learning, not QUANTITY. We’re not educating our kids well right now, so why do we want to give them more bad medicine?
Son of a teacher
August 6th, 2012
3:39 pm
The last time I looked, and it was within the past eighteen months, there is NO solid empirical evidence that a longer school year raises achievement levels or increases retention. Charter schools are not succeeding because they have longer school years, they are succeeding because the parents are far more involved/engaged with their child’s school and with that school’s teachers, who are revitalized by getting admin out of their day to day lives. We keep looking for the magic bullet when there is none and never will be.
ABC
August 6th, 2012
3:41 pm
So my kid has to be stuck in a classroom all summer instead of playing, swimming, running, and exploring because other kids are slow? HELL NO.
If they some people suffer from “brain drain” or need “catching up” they can go to summer school. Mine will be at the pool, at camp, at the beach, or just in my back yard dreaming and playing.
Atticus Joad
August 6th, 2012
3:42 pm
Nobody has 180 teaching days as it is. At best in my high school, I have 150 or fewer actual teaching days due to testing and retesting and other distractions.
Lee
August 6th, 2012
3:43 pm
Did this remind anyone else of the punchline “We’re losing money on every transaction, but making it up on volume”?
Jefferson
August 6th, 2012
4:08 pm
Lazy is lazy.
Pride and Joy
August 6th, 2012
4:09 pm
flipper is right, for those that really need it, summer school is good. My kids have better learning opportunities in the summer than a traditional public school can provide.
Pride and Joy
August 6th, 2012
4:16 pm
A longer school year won’t improve learning. A longer year means teachers will relax and think “I got all year to teach the same things I was teaching in nine months prior year” and….let’s get real here….are teachers going to work full time like the rest of the workers in the United States? Not many are likely to, especially if we don’t increase their pay.
Put slow learners in remedial classes before school starts so that they’ll be up to speed by the time the rest of the class arrives in the Fall. Instead of being reactive, be proactive.
Public HS Teacher
August 6th, 2012
4:17 pm
Sure. They will add 60 days of school – oh, and also add 60 “furlough” days for teachers to save money. LOL!
Bernie
August 6th, 2012
4:19 pm
Maureen, The landing of the spacecraft Curiosity earlier this morning offers proof beyond all reasonable logic. If one were to go back and review all the participants that celebrated that magnificent achievement at the Jet Propulsion Lab and see who and what group of American citizens were missing in the celebration.
Not one African American Male or Female was present dressed in the politically correct dress code of Khaki pants and blue emblematic sport shirt. It reminded me of what the faces of Georgia’s Charter Schools and the proposed school voucher plan would look like in the coming years. Surely out of the millions of intelligent African American students that could found across this great Nation, that at least one could be found as a willing and competent contributor to this great crowning moment.
That Act alone demonstrates at least for one community that longer hours are not only needed, but a required necessity for them to remain inclusive into a ever changing technological society that is so willingly to leave them out in the cold and far away from such gains.
Beverly Fraud
August 6th, 2012
4:20 pm
In a word, no. The reason. At the FUNDAMENTAL CORE OF OUR BEING, “we the people” are not willing to have HONEST discussions about education.
Not willing to talk about discipline.
Not willing to talk about the role of parents.
Not willing to talk about how we set teachers up to fail, THEN blame them for failing.
Not willing to talk about BLOATED central office staff.
Not willing to set teachers up to SUCCEED, so that even good teachers can feel comfortable that when peers are “counseled” it’s done with INTEGRITY.
For whatever reason, we’ve just lost the WILL to be honest; yet somehow, someway, we expect things to “improve”?
WHY would we expect that?
another comment
August 6th, 2012
4:23 pm
Let the lazy ill equiped parents pay a penality with their $4,500 or so tax refund and send their children to year round school. After all they can then receive the free breakfest and lunch. My children will be at home with me enjoying being kids, swimming, going to visit realitives, going to the beach, going fishing on the intercoastal water way with their uncle. As it is we only have one month in common to meet during the summer with their cousin’s from up North during the summer.
When we were growing up the slackers went to Summer School, the rest of us go the summer off. Your parents paid for summer schoool and had to drive you back and forth. So you knew you better not get summer school. Who was going to cut the acres and acres of grass that we had if anyone did?
Beverly Fraud
August 6th, 2012
4:30 pm
“Research on longer school days or years also shows mixed results.”
Is there ANY “reform” that doesn’t get “mixed results”?
Oh that’s right…DISCIPLINE.
Can you point to any study where, when chronically and severely disruptive students were removed, in order to maintain the sanctity of the learning environment, learning didn’t improve?
Even one?
bob
August 6th, 2012
4:30 pm
Another example of liberals punishing all for the action of a few. If some low income students need time to catch up then those students should be in school, the rest should not be punished by sitting in class with them. ” Advocates of longer school years say that the 180-day school year is an outdated artifact. “The fact that our calendar has been based on the agrarian economy when almost none of our kids work in the field anymore,” said Arne Duncan, secretary of education, “doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.” That calendar worked fine until the schools were dumbed down by letting kids graduate with 6th grade skills. The parents of the kids that cause the problem will be rewarded with year round school, they will now have a year round babysitter.
Beverly Fraud
August 6th, 2012
4:34 pm
“The fact that our calendar has been based on the agrarian economy when almost none of our kids work in the field anymore,” said Arne Duncan, secretary of education, “doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.”
Let me tell you what doesn’t make sense; that the Secretary of Education would come to Atlanta twice to POLITICALLY PROP UP the so called “award winning” education who was at the heart and soul of THE biggest cheating scandal in American educational history.
What makes even less sense is that he believes, after doing THAT, that anybody would believe anything that came out of his mouth ever again.
long time educator
August 6th, 2012
4:34 pm
I think we should look at the resources we have (staff, time, money, and buildings) and use them in the most efficient way. Why should a band teacher become the chief financial officer of the largest employer in my county? Kindergartners and prek are most attentive in the morning and have lunch, recess and pe in the afternoon. If half days won’t work for working parents, then pay parapros to babysit in the afternoon. We need to look at everything we have always done and question its efficiency, and that includes the length of the day and the school year.
Hillbilly D
August 6th, 2012
4:42 pm
“The fact that our calendar has been based on the agrarian economy when almost none of our kids work in the field anymore,” said Arne Duncan, secretary of education, “doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.”
I’ve always thought that was a bit of a misconception. My Grandpa told me, that when he was going to school in the 1890’s, at the one room school house, they only went to school for 3 months during the dead of winter. The rest of the year, they were needed on the farm. They had about a week or two after lay-by time in the summer and that was for revival.
Eddie
August 6th, 2012
4:43 pm
Is this a true extending of the year or away to give teachers more holiday time throught out the school year. Having the school year extended by 15 days and then turn around have additional five days at Christmas break added or 5 days at spring break etc. Who does that help?
yuzeyurbrane
August 6th, 2012
4:43 pm
And there are Georgia counties with 140 school days. Let’s cut funding more and get more proof that public schools are failing. Let’s shoot for 100 days of trade school training.
Old timer
August 6th, 2012
4:45 pm
Amen, Dr. trotter……
Old timer
August 6th, 2012
4:49 pm
There was an experiment in Nashville,TN schools. Schools in low performing areas were allowed to add extra days and extra time to the days….well guess what??? Parents complained that their child was being picked on, discriminated against….and so on. They then made the extra time optional ….no one came, or rather so few that the program could not be supported. Now all the schools have the same hours.
catlady
August 6th, 2012
4:50 pm
I have to laugh out loud. We can’t afford 180 days, and we should go more? Who will pay the bus gas, lights/ac, salaries? Then you have federal lunch costs, somewhat different now because the USDA/schools are giving meals 5 days a week at central sites for ALL kids (not just poor, not just school-age) up to age 18.
Here is an idea: Have parents work with/pay attention to their kids in the summer. That is what my folks did, and what I did.
Beverly Fraud
August 6th, 2012
4:52 pm
Why is it I can picture Arne Duncan, Beverly Hall, Michelle Rhee, Rod Paige, Herb Garrett, and some mouthpiece from the NEA at a round table saying:
“You’re for the children”
“No YOU’RE for the children”
“No, but you’re REALLY for the children”
Until they all pass out in some communal ecstasy?
Ron F.
August 6th, 2012
4:55 pm
Old Timer is right: you gotta sell those who need the extra time on the idea of it. They need it but don’t understand what the extra instructional time in the summer could do for them. As I’ve said before, if we talk to them instead of about them, I bet we could get more of them to agree to it. I would be willing to work the extra 20 days or so if it meant I could have the small classes with very individualized instruction. I’ve taught “summer school” for many years and have been allowed to work with the struggling kids in that setting on specific needed skills. The challenge is getting the parents to realize that it is a very important time for their kids. The extra pay would be a nice bonus for doing what I love too!
Beverly Fraud
August 6th, 2012
4:58 pm
Let’s not forget Kathy Cox, who was MORE than willing to embrace “miracle” test scores, in order to validate HER paycheck.
She was really, REALLY “all about the children”
Beverly Fraud
August 6th, 2012
5:04 pm
Yes, yes, yes, this is the answer. Just look at the recent discovery of the “God Particle”
You think top of the line physicists discovered it?
God no! It was a bunch of 2nd graders. On day 178, they were struggling to identify parts of the atom. But on day one hundred eighty ONE, they discovered Higgs-Boson!
They let the scientists claim the credit, because NEA agents pressured them into doing so, because they were so fearful the public would find out just how beneficial extra school days were.
Those d@mn unions! Satan’s spawn for sure.
Halftrack
August 6th, 2012
5:17 pm
A longer school year means more costs all around for the taxpayers to have to pay. The current school year includes too many inclement weather days, fall & spring breaks, Holiday season & individual holiday days, and teacher work days. Schools could use the summer to shorten the time until graduation by advanced grade subject teaching. Colleges in Georgia are now trying to figure out how the best method of remedial classes can be addressed. Also, it may be that teachers are looking for a way to get a raise without much extra output to the student’s benefit. I think that energy costs are going to go up and we will be forced to make some decisions that we don’t want to make anyway.
TheGoldenRam
August 6th, 2012
5:33 pm
I’m on both sides of this issue.
I think it’s both beneficial to a lot of the students to have a longer school year/year-round school, but that’s because it’s essentially a babysitting/childcare service. You’re just mitigating all the other ‘real’ issues that are dragging these kids down. Until our society can have very candid discussions about those issues, this will be just another band-aid with limited results. I put it in the same category as Universal Pre-K. Government can’t figure out how to solve parental deficiency, cultural failings and a lack of community accountability, so it tries to fill the ‘gaps’ with these educational add-ons.
Bernie noted something in a post on a previous story that I was already going to address. I also tuned in to watch the live broadcast of the Curiosity Rover landing on Mars last night. That was AWESOME to see. The scientific and engineering prowess that made that possible is beyond impressive. If I had my way, I’d make ever channel break coverage to show that live. It has it all. History in the making, a profoundly inspiring demonstration of human achievement & a great sense of patriotism, all rolled into one event.
I was struck by how young so many of the engineers and personnel in the control room looked. A lot of those men & women must be in their twenties and early thirties. These are young people at the top of the scientific game. Again, really impressive to see. However, I too noticed that there was only one older black face in a broadcast that showed a lot of participants. There was a lot of diversity in that room, but I couldn’t help but think that this was another glaring example of how a certain demographic is always so scarce in these venues. I’ve noticed the same thing in many of the other documentaries I’ve watched about space exploration, engineering projects, scientific discoveries, etc.. I’m a junkie for those shows. There is rarely a black person in the room and almost invariably when there is, they have a strong foreign accent. African Americans are like unicorns in these high-level fields. In other words, they’re almost non-existent.
I wondered who that older black gentleman was, so I looked him up today. His name is Charles Bolden and it turns out he is the Administrator of NASA. He is THE boss and he has a very impressive resume. Graduated from the Naval Academy, fighter pilot in Vietnam and advanced science degrees. He was also a four time astronaut. One of his flights launched the Hubble.
What a surreal contrast. A black man, born & raised in South Carolina, who graduated high school in the same year as the passage of the Civil Rights Amendment, is now the head of the most prestigious space program on the planet(sad irony, his Alma mater is now considered one of the worst public schools in South Carolina based on test scores and the drop-out rate. It is 98% African American.).
I would argue that there is another distinction regarding Maj. Gen. Bolden that had more influence on his remarkable lifetime of achievement than anything else. He was born to a married couple that were both TEACHERS. He was a child of committed parents that were educators. I find the same thing when I look up the bios of so many other highly successful people. The black kid from my Alma mater that was recently named as a Rhodes Scholar. Again, high achieving mom AND dad involved throughout his upbringing.
This isn’t rocket science, even when it is. There is only so much society and government can compensate for a culture of parental failure and abandonment. Teachers would be well served to publicly concede what we all know. You can’t fix these problems, nor should they be your problems. To do otherwise is to tie your professional destiny to impossible outcomes.
I’ll close with this example that puts this problem in stark relief.
One of the absolute worst public school systems in the United States is the Memphis City School system, the largest in Tennessee. There are about 100,000 students in this system. Of MCS ‘graduates’, only about 4% are deemed college-ready. They spend more that $11,000 per student. The ancillary social service and other ‘intervention’ programs involved in that system go on & on & on. None of it makes a substantial difference in the collective outcomes. The reason why is in plain sight.
An editorial in the Commercial Appeal from several weeks ago talked about a 3rd-party company that had been brought in to deal with the city’s woeful child support problems.
From the story, “As of May, it’s juggling a stunning 117,455 cases in Shelby County. In more than 50,000 of those cases, the office is still trying to locate the father or establish paternity.”
Good luck with longer days, longer classes, more remediation, “Waiting for Superman”, charter schools or anything else. Until we can address the underlying disintegration of family/social/community values that are the real cause of broad academic failings, we have a better chance of finding poor, minority kids ON Mars, then seeing them heading into a science program getting us there.
Teacher Reader
August 6th, 2012
5:37 pm
If the state wants to spend more money on education, lowering the class sizes, is where I’d rather see money spent.
Status Quo Schedule O.K.
August 6th, 2012
5:49 pm
The existing schedule is adequate enough for students
to achieve, but if increased instructional time is the
goal, students can gain the same amount of instructional
time by adding thirty to forty-five minutes a day on the
existing academic schedule.
Derwood
August 6th, 2012
6:06 pm
To salvage education in America we must first dissolve the Dept of Education in Washington. THye have no idea whatt do with education circulium.
Megan
August 6th, 2012
6:21 pm
What a dumb idea. We do not have the money to support 180 days as it is now.
BlahBlahBlah
August 6th, 2012
6:24 pm
School should be “year ’round.” 4 quarters a year. 11 weeks on, 2 weeks off.
testerbill
August 6th, 2012
6:35 pm
If a three month break is too long, consider the Quarter system. 3 months of school, 1 month off. Works well in some areas of the country
HSTeach
August 6th, 2012
6:42 pm
They can’t afford to pay teachers now, let alone a longer school year. I heard from a 28 year vet that their new evaluation will be 33% performance, 33% student test scores and 33% student/parent feedback. Now that’s the way to evaluate a professional! Do we pay doctors based on whether the patient feels they were knowledgeable? Or ask lawyers to be paid based on the percentage of cases they win? On another note, they have been told their curriculum is moving to scripted lessons, which should really help this almost 30 year professional feel that her experience is valued.
dekalbed
August 6th, 2012
6:51 pm
Until school districts like Dekalb commit to teaching students how to function successfully as citizens and students it doesn’t matter how many hours struggling students spend in schools. And no amount of edutainment can compensate for the absence of critical reading and thinking skills-thre real reason why students “forget what they [supposedly] learned.”
SayWhat
August 6th, 2012
6:58 pm
Forget costs and all the other hoopla – KIDS NEED A SUMMER VACATION!! It’s already been cut to two months.
living in an outdated ed system
August 6th, 2012
8:41 pm
@Catlady et al – I am laughing out loud too. I’m laughing at everyone commenting on this blog that keeps saying “we can’t afford 180 days so why are we having this discussion?” If we fixed our outdated education system and streamlined the bloated infrastructure, we’d have PLENTY of money to do what we we wanted. But you are all unwilling to have that conversation, and you think that everyone is out to attack public schools and teachers.
Well, if our public schools were run better and we had better achievement results and graduation rates, we wouldn’t have to have this discussion, now would we ?????
Animal187
August 6th, 2012
8:54 pm
Regardless of how long the school year is, if the parnets do not encourage their kids to read, study, or prepare for the upcomming year they will never be prepared. I encourage my daughter to read during the summer months, she also does activitiy books for the next grade level, and I also go over things with her and take her on educational trips as well. A parent has to make time for their kids and show an interest in their education in order for them to take an interest as well. She is only in the 2nd grade but she already told me that she wants to go to college.
Mama S
August 6th, 2012
9:10 pm
Low income kids forget because their low income parents cannot help them to retain the information.
As a former teacher, I have “summer school” for my grandchildren K and 3rd grades. We go to the library every week and participate in the Read-A-Thon. We play school and do grade level worksheets to review concepts learned. Perfect papers earn points toward swimming time. We went to Fernbank Science Center (wanted them to see it before it was closed). We played lots of educational and fun computer games. We practiced math and measurement while baking brownies. I am not pushing then ahead, but I am sure they did not forget information. It is not the job of the school to be a 24/7 babysitter.
bootney farnsworth
August 6th, 2012
10:18 pm
@ living
and why do you think we have no interest in talking to you?
not talking to people of goodwill who are sincere in trying to fix the problems we all know exist-but not wanting to talk to you?
simple: there is nothing on earth we can say which you’ll hear. you’re not interested in a conversation, you wish to lecture than enforce.
and you claim to wonder why we aren’t interested in talking with you….
Mountain Man
August 7th, 2012
7:42 am
“If a three month break is too long, consider the Quarter system. 3 months of school, 1 month off. Works well in some areas of the country”
Why do they call it the “quarter system” when there are only three periods a year/ (3 months + 1 month= 4 months, 12months /4 months =3)
Why not call it a trimester system?
I give some credit to Blahblah blah – at least his math is sound. (not necessarily his idea).
catlady
August 7th, 2012
8:13 am
Thanks, Bootney.
Kathy
August 7th, 2012
8:55 am
It’s not the length of the school year. If we just allow teachers to teach, 180 days is plenty. Children with good parents will benefit from the extended time off. As for the others, who are we kidding? Until we stop coddling irresponsible parents, nothing’s going to change. My county is on a year-round schedule, and from what I’ve heard, it hasn’t made a whit of difference.
Pride and Joy
August 7th, 2012
9:27 am
The GoldenRam,
Having good parents makes for better outcomes but saying that having good parents determines your outcome is wrong. Dismissing children from poverty and single-parent families is silly.
For every black person who succeeded who has good parents, you can also name many who didn’t.
Oprah Winfrey came from poor, black, rurual Mississippi. She was raped at a very young age by a relative. Look what an intelligent human being she is and by all standards of measurement, happy, successful and generous.
I’m sure it is more difficult to teach childrne who don’t have good parents but not impossible. That’s a cop out.
You need to read the Lemon Swamp, a real story about educating rural blacks in South Carolina.
Every kid is teachable. Little girls in Afghanistan have acid thrown in their faces for wanting to go to school. Teachers teach girls there and are threatened with their lives.
Those are some terrible teaching conditions, yet the children learn.
Pride and Joy
August 7th, 2012
9:32 am
Mama S low income kids don’t forget what they learned over the Summer. They never learned it in the first place. They only memorized things.
Something one memorizes is the something you forget.
Something one learns is something that stays with you.
Let’s get real here. Is it possible to “forget” how to read?
Is it possible to “forget” how to ride a bicycle?
No, of course not.
However, if one is only memorizing sight words instead of learning to read, yes, one can forget the memorized sight word, which is not reading.
I had Summers off as a kid. I didn’t play and have a good time; I was required to work, physically. There was nothing academic about my job. I didn’t forget anything over the Summer and didn’t have parents who ever read to me — ever.
Blaming parents is a cop out for poor teaching.
Beverly Fraud
August 7th, 2012
11:06 am
” I didn’t forget anything over the Summer and didn’t have parents who ever read to me — ever.”
Yes Pride and Joy, but how many times during the school year did you or a classmate say “F-ck you B-tch. I ain’t doing sh-t!” and then the classmate was allow to remain in class with ZERO consequences?
Just how good do you expect teaching to be if school systems ALLOW that behavior to happen?
That’s the difference. And if we think this type of thing doesn’t happen, and doesn’t happen OFTEN, we are SERIOUSLY deluding ourselves.
Pride and Joy
August 7th, 2012
2:06 pm
Beverly, what’s your point?
If students say hostile things to the teacher, additional teacher planning time won’t solve that problem.
I get you, Beverly Fraud. You want discipline enforced in school. I hear ya and I agree but Bev, this blog is about a longer school day — stay focused please.
catlady
August 7th, 2012
5:10 pm
To me, it hinges on the magic word MASTERY. That which you MASTER, you do not forget during the summer. H3ll, you don’t forget much of it in 40 years! And if you don’t MASTER, you should be retained until you do.
hardworkingteacher
August 7th, 2012
11:38 pm
I agree with “another comment” . It is ridiculous to increase the school for everyone. Many children are going to be forced to fore go educational opportunities so we can appease the slow, low students. BTW- the system is now so slanted to accommodate those students to the detriment of the the average and above average students. Summer school would be a great experience for some students who need the extra attention.
Special Ed Reading teacher
August 11th, 2012
9:37 pm
Yeah Dr. Trotter. Many of my students need a longer year and more time to master the same material that general education students master in a year. Why? Because they need more time to understand and more time to do more of the same thing until they can remember it ( notice I was politically correct and did not say drill). I’ve been asked how many “I” failed? I didn’t fail anyone. My grades were set up so that if you acted like you were paying attention and did something you would get at the least a passing grade. Why? because we’re not allowed to fail them. Students are “administratively” placed in the next grade, even when they fail. They fall farther and farther behind. I had students this year who missed 40 – 60 days of school and passed. Beverly Fraud is also right. We’re not to embarass a student who is cheating. Shouldn’t they be embarassed and ashamed of themselves. Adults who cheat are fired, divorced, or maybe shot. We spend weeks of time in testing alone, not to mention practice tests and test prep. It seems everyday there is a new bunch of tests made up by someone somewhere for our kids. Taking more time from instruction and learning. Most kids who are happy in school also have something there they like. We have the money for football but art, music, and all of the electives, which can grow into jobs are being cut. My students asked what I did when my kids got a refferral? I said,” They didn’t. They knew better.” I don’t even know what would have happened to them because it was unacceptable and unimaginable.
Oh and by the way, during my summer break, I take workshops and classes to improve my teaching for the coming year. I buy paper and pencils and sharpeners and pens and colored pencils and colored markers, etc. with my money. I did have 2 weeks this summer that I did not have some school related free work that I did, and my 2 weeks were unpaid as is all of my time off except a few holidays, like Christmas and Thanksgiving. otherdays at those times are unpaid. I’m sure everyone out there appreciates a week without pay at Thanksgiving and 2 weeks without pay at Christmas. Get a grip. Get real disciple. Require students to turn in electronics at the door and wear school appropriate clothes that cover their bodies. Require parents to come in and sit with their children if they are a behavior problem, the Chinese do, and they have 40 or more in elementary classes. No we’re not all superman. You can’t be when you have to read someome elses words instead of teaching. We teachers are like everyone else some better than others. The teachers I know work long hours at home preparing lessons, grading papers and calling parents, if we can get a current phone number. I’ve done many different jobs over my lifetime and teaching requires the most time the most energy and is a soulsucking job. My union says it’s the hardest job you’ll ever love.
N. GA Teacher
August 14th, 2012
7:44 pm
My colleagues are right- a longer school year will make little difference for most kids. Summer school is currently a disaster in most districts, where kids are resentful (their parents made them go) and unmotivated. The fact is that most students can handle high school in a 90 day calendar! The only classes the better (say top 15%) students are challenged by are AP classes, and usually they still get As and Bs. Success in school CANNOT be achieved by lengthening the year. It has to be facilitated by HOME LIFE support and different types of schooling. Vocational schools are terrific. Schools need much more flexible curricula (do all kids REALLY need 4 years of math, social studies, English and Science?). If we REALLY want to be “student-centered” then we must encourage individual kid’s strengths and interests, whether they are art, music, physical education, technology, journamlism or construction.