Taunting of school bus monitor earns boys one year suspension
The four middle school students whose crude taunting of an elderly school bus monitor went viral have been handed year-long suspensions from their Rochester New York, school.
(We discussed this nine days ago. You can view the vile video here.)
The monitor, Karen Klein, has received support from around the world, along with $650,000 in donations. (A day after I posted the video, I received a note from a Hilton Head resort offering her a week’s stay; I forwarded the invitation to the school spokeswoman who promised to get it to Mrs. Klein.)
According to the New York Times:
The four boys who taunted a 68-year-old school bus monitor from Rochester, N.Y., prompting outcry over bullying when a video of their insults went viral, have been suspended from their middle school for one year, school officials said on Friday.
The video of the boys’ heaping insults onto the bus monitor, Karen Klein, also generated more than $650,000 in online donations for her to take “a vacation.” The conduct was filmed by one of the boys on a cellphone and uploaded to Facebook. The video found itself onto YouTube, where it surpassed 7.9 million views.
It inspired a Toronto man, Max Sidorov, 26, to set up an online “vacation” fund for Ms. Klein on the online fund-raising platform Indiegogo.com, with a goal of raising $5,000. In four days, the fund grew to $500,000.
Greece Central School District officials said the four boys, ages 12 and 13, will be suspended from Athena Middle School for one year, prohibited from using regular school transportation and required to volunteer 50 hours of community service with senior citizens, as well as complete a program in “bullying prevention, respect and responsibility.”
Since the school district is legally required to provide the boys with a formal education, they will be able to attend an alternative education program in what is called the district’s “re-engagement center,” in a nonschool facility.
In making the announcement, Barbara Deane-Williams, the district superintendent, said it was unusual to publicly announce school disciplinary measures brought against students. But, in this case, she said the boys and families admitted to the wrongdoing, agreed to the suspensions without a hearing and also agreed for the findings to be made public. Ms. Deane-Williams also said that the district staff members, including some on the transportation staff, would be participating this summer in a previously scheduled bullying prevention training program.
–From Maureen Downey for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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103 comments Add your comment
mark
June 29th, 2012
10:51 pm
I’ve seen kids do worse in front of everyone and not get into trouble. Just because something goes public does not warrant such harsh measures.
Really?
June 29th, 2012
10:57 pm
Baloney. They deserve another year for stupidly filming and posting their ignorance. Plus somebody still needs to beat the crap out of them.
marilyn
June 29th, 2012
10:59 pm
To Mark: Wrong!
Kevin
June 29th, 2012
11:15 pm
Hey Mark,
If that had been your wife or mother that was taunted on the bus would you feel the same way? Part of the problem is that kids don’t get punished enough or at all in most cases which explains why kids think they can get away with this kind of behavior. I’m actually glad the punishment was made public so that other kids can see that there are consequences. My only hope is that, dispite the fact that they deserve it, the boys don’t get bullied themselves after all this. That won’t help anyone.
Sarah
June 29th, 2012
11:43 pm
Mark, you are one of the problems. These kids are out of control and they deserve this. 10 year olds are using guns and this is a big problem. If you think this is OK then where are your limits? I praise the school district for standing up and taking action. No teacher, principle, administrator, driver, monitor or anyone working with these kids should take such an attack. To condone this, well you are no better then they are. I would be ashamed.
Finally!
June 30th, 2012
12:07 am
…School administrators with backbone.
Lee
June 30th, 2012
1:09 am
{{{yawn}}}
The ONLY reason the school did anything was that the little thugs had the Darwinesque idea to post their misdeeds on Youtube. The very fact that this district had to have “bus monitors” in the first place speaks volumes.
CJ
June 30th, 2012
1:13 am
Mark–that’s not ‘harsh’, as you call it. It’s just a modern day behind-whooping for terrible behavior for little monsters who think they are superior to older people. They have been taught no respect for their elders. I think the punishment definitely fits the crime. They need to learn respect and be pulled away from their peers until the problem is corrected. It is now their parents’ responsibility to follow through.
Tired of Teaching
June 30th, 2012
2:07 am
Finally! It’s about time we see a school district offer up consequences. They deserve every day of that year long suspension. Hope they got some physical punishment at home too. Had they gotten enough of that all along they probably wouldn’t be in this situation to begin with.
This is a prime example of typical behavior from middle school students. They would have gotten away with it had they not been stupid enough to video themselves. Kids have no respect these days. I’m sure these were all “good” kids from “nice” families, but parents, let this be your warning. When you don’t properly parent and teach your kids right from wrong and try to be a friend rather than parent, your “good” kid will embarrass you. It might not be this severe, but teachers and bus drivers see it every day…your kids are a reflection of you. A whole lot of parents these days are lousy.
kyle
June 30th, 2012
3:30 am
required to volunteer 50 hours of community service
anyone else see something wrong with this?
you cant be required to volunteer anything
that would be forced to help old people
Good Mother
June 30th, 2012
7:17 am
Kyle, no I don’t think involuntary volunteering is wrong. Maybe the kids will see something in these old people — see them as humans when they spend more time with them.
What is troubling about this incident is that the bus monitor was unable/unwilling to do anything except ignore the situation. My expectation is that when taunting/bullying occurred she would be abel to stop it. If she cannot stop them from taunting her, how could she stop them from taunting other students? So TRAINING is absolutely important here. The monitors have got to be able to recognize the beginning stages and nip it in the bud along with filming it. SHE should film herself handling the situation.
I’ve been on the school grounds and have seen older children literllay shaking the tiny children out of the swings — while teh teachers watched. I get involved. I go to the child and tell them to stop and tell the little kids to yell, tell their parents and their teachers immediately.
we’ve got to take charge and take control and prevent the bullying.
Josh Valentine
June 30th, 2012
7:35 am
A year of without a bus ride to school will do the kids good. Another punishment that will suit the kids good, make all of them spend time at a senior center will be good. Maybe, they’ll learn to respect their elders.
southernopinion
June 30th, 2012
7:41 am
I see this every school day. I’m called “crippled hoe” (arthritis), bitch, racist (I’m white; students all black) and not a lot is done either. Parents have no idea of their “angels” behaviors.
Solutions
June 30th, 2012
7:46 am
Fear has kept generations of kids in line at school, lack of fear has produced the current generation of thugs and thug want a be’s. That said, you have to wonder what kind of system puts a 70 something who is hard of hearing and over weight on a bus of middle school kids who are usually pushing the limits of proper behavior anyway? The elderly lady inspired no fear in the brats, hence their complete lack of respect for her and the system she represented.
Martina
June 30th, 2012
8:02 am
If “someone who inspired fear” had been on the bus, and proceeded to verbally discipline those boys (or given them a taste of their own medicine by responding with like language and taunts), then the school system would be the one paying $650,000 to their parents. Why does somebody have to be a retired Navy drill sergeant to get respect? Shouldn’t children learn that people should be respectful of each other, just because they’re part of the human race?
South Georgia
June 30th, 2012
8:13 am
I would guest that this Rochester Middle School just lowered their bus discipline for the upcoming FY 2013 school year! Maybe after seeing the video adults not in the school business will get an idea of what goes on.
teacher&mom
June 30th, 2012
9:07 am
Call me old fashioned…..but I believe discipline serves two purposes.
1: Punish the offenders.
2: Serve as a warning to possible future offenders.
We’ve become a society that has a difficult time reigning in the actions of our children.
We are raising a generation of brats.
Maybe the viral video forced the district to discipline the students. Who cares? At least they did something. For 180 days, those boys (and their parents) will have a daily reminder of the consequences of their behavior.
Hopefully, it will be a life-long lesson that will forever change them for the better.
My 2 cents
June 30th, 2012
9:09 am
In reality, the reason for the “stiff punishment” and parents willing for the punishment to be released publicly is because of the public outrage and reports of death threats. I, for one, find the punishment lacking. Parents are responsible for their 12-13 year-old offspring. The fact that these children didn’t stop their attack when the monitor started crying leads me to believe there has been a severe lack of home training. The parents should be sentenced to the community service side by side with their
little darlings. If this was the best child rearing these parents were capable of, they need to keep them at home and not subject the rest of us to such abuse.
Lee
June 30th, 2012
9:25 am
@Kyle, yes, I see something wrong with a school administrator “requiring” a student to work community service hours. That is beyond the school’s limits of authority, IMHO.
Also, for those who think the school should “sentence” the parents, that, too, is beyond the scope of authority for a school administrator. The school has no authority over the parent – nor should we want them to. A school administrator is not a judge in a court of law.
catlady
June 30th, 2012
9:27 am
This will continue to go on, just without the videos being posted, I am afraid. And I wonder, if this thing had not gone viral, if the students would have been punished at all.
Nikole
June 30th, 2012
9:28 am
Mark is right about one thing: I have seen MUCH worse occur and students get off with little to no punishment. I guess I need to start recording and uploading to youtube what goes on in schools today. (I’m just kidding, I would lose my job if I did such a thing!)
Mandingo
June 30th, 2012
9:51 am
I am from the old school like my parents were. At the start of the school year I check in with the bus driver and let him/her know to contact me as soon possible if any of my children are disrespectful or behaving like knuckleheads. I can assure you it will be corrected immediately. ( talk to them, take away privliges, leather belt ) My kids understand the consequences ( talk to them , take away privliges , leather belt ) of an adult notifying me or my wife that my children are behaving like they have no home training.
Solutions
June 30th, 2012
9:51 am
Off topic, but here is a web site for gifted students: http://www.davidsongifted.org/
Georgia supposedly has a good program for gifted students compared to other states! If that is the case, we are in more trouble than I had believed.
TimeOut
June 30th, 2012
9:52 am
Lee, do we want the courts to do all of our work for us? School systems have elected school boards; hence, we’ve given them their authority. Many of these systems include community service in their graduation requirements. While it is true that the publicity most likely generated the appropriate severity of the consequences, we cannot expect the courts to resolve all of our youth or adult conduct problems. If we don’t have faith in those who make such decisions in our school systems, then perhaps the real issue is the need to change how select those to fill such positions, how we define their roles, and our perception of such roles’ importance. Antisocial behaviors have been around since the dawn of humanity. Some societys have dealt well with it and others have glorified sociopaths and their abuse of others. It is up to us.
catlady
June 30th, 2012
10:00 am
I think YDC might have been a good first step, legally. Let the law mete out punishment, as well as the school.
Solutions
June 30th, 2012
10:11 am
catlady, I don’t think the kids committed a crime under the law. Their comments were not slanderous if they were true, truth is the first and best defense against slander, and slander is not a crime, rather slander is a civil tort. You could argue it was verbal assault, but if the elderly lady could not hear the words, is it indeed assault?
teachergirl
June 30th, 2012
10:17 am
With all the new anti-bullying laws popping up around the nation, this punishment is not surprising. I believe in Georgia it’s a “three strikes and your out” situation. I have seen students in my classes get taken out by this rule. They not only bullied students, but they bullied teachers, custodians, parapros, bus drivers, cafeteria workers, etc. I know our SRO (school resource officer) was very involved with these cases and a few of them went to YDC for at least the day because they pulled that crap on him, a cop. I just hope that because these kids mentioned above have been punished and have other requirements to meet that they become better adults.
GwinnettParentz
June 30th, 2012
10:32 am
The suspended students will no doubt benefit from a year in private schooling. And the $650K Mrs. Klein will receive (after the government grabs half in taxes) from her fellow Americans demonstrates yet again our American exceptionalism those on the left prefer to ignore.
V
June 30th, 2012
10:33 am
The kids behaved like monsters. But as a parent, it frightens me that an employee paid to supervise kids on the bus allowed and failed to report this behavior. Did she allow vicious attacks on other children to occur also? These boys didn’t just decide to pick on her all of the sudden. If my child has been on that bus with her as bus monitor, I would be afraid for my child.
Ashley
June 30th, 2012
10:55 am
The kids won’t be attending school with their posse or friends, that in itself is punishment ….we all know middle schools kids want to be accepted by their peers. This bandishment we surely knock them down a peg or two. Maybe they will begin to know what it feels like to be humiliated and bullied by someone else because I’m sure some teasing and ridicule will be coming their way.
Lee
June 30th, 2012
11:03 am
@Timeout, our very wise Founding Fathers rebelled against tyranny and established a system of checks and balances to protect the rights of the individual. In the 236 years hence, our politicians have been trying to restablish that tyranny – and they have succeeded in many ways.
So no, I do not want the school administrator to have any authority over me just as I don’t want the garbage man to have any authority over me. We have granted authority to the courts of law, which has systems of checks and balances and appeals.
To your final point, no, I do not trust most school administrators as far as I can throw them. Google “Tweety Bird Keychain” or “student suspended for DRAWING a picture of a gun” for a couple of reasons why.
ScienceTeacher671
June 30th, 2012
11:11 am
I have to agree with Good Mother on this one:
What is troubling about this incident is that the bus monitor was unable/unwilling to do anything except ignore the situation. My expectation is that when taunting/bullying occurred she would be abel to stop it. If she cannot stop them from taunting her, how could she stop them from taunting other students?
What’s the point of a bus monitor if she can’t stop the bad behavior?
Chris Murphy
June 30th, 2012
11:20 am
“But, in this case, she said the boys and families admitted to the wrongdoing, agreed to the suspensions without a hearing and also agreed for the findings to be made public.”
Let’s hear it for Upstate New York!
Pompano
June 30th, 2012
11:22 am
I’m w/Science & Good Mother on this one. So what’s the purpose of a “Bus Monitor” if they are incapable of controlling the kids? Sounds like a wasted position (and taxpayer money).
ISeeItEveryDay
June 30th, 2012
12:05 pm
If you are not in the classroom, you do not see the behavior teachers see every day. You have no idea what teachers go through with your “perfect” children!! Most kids are completely different at school than they are at home and give the illusion that they are perfect angels to their parents. If a teacher calls a parent, the parent almost immediately turns it around on the teacher and tells them they are not doing anything for their child or they give too much homework or they don’t allow the student to be themselves. Don’t get me wrong there are good students, but unfortunately teachers cannot pay attention to them because they are busy trying to train the ones who don’t give a rip; a lack of home training on the parent’s part. On the flip side, school administrators are afraid to punish students because of lawsuits the parents threaten to file. I agree with another comment about posting videos (which will never be allowed) of the classroom. We all know that will never happen because parents will then see exactly how their child acts and the parent will look bad. Had it not been for this video that was posted on YouTube, no discipline would have ever happened because it would have been the student’s word against everyone else. My two cents.
Really amazed
June 30th, 2012
12:07 pm
Let’s see if the actually will be susp for the entire year!! Remember…NCLB for no matter what! Not sure the DOE can actually allow them to stay out. Very, very sad.
Another Math Teacher
June 30th, 2012
12:10 pm
ScienceTeacher671: “What’s the point of a bus monitor if she can’t stop the bad behavior?”
If you’re a teacher you already know why she couldn’t stop them. After a few tries to report student behaviour and being ignored, people stop trying. It’s the same for teachers with bad behaviour in the class room. It’s better to not write a referral than to write one and have administration back the student.
Really amazed
June 30th, 2012
12:13 pm
Sorry…they actually will be susp for the entire year. Maybe the kids did it to actually NOT have to go to school. This could be their reward for what they were trying to do. Why else would they record it??? Stupid is as stupid does!!!
ScienceTeacher671
June 30th, 2012
12:14 pm
Another Math Teacher, which just goes back to the other thread about school climate being the most important thing as far as retaining good teachers! Who wants to be in a system where the inmates are in charge of the asylum, which is the case in many schools today?
catlady
June 30th, 2012
12:14 pm
Soutions: I was thinking affray or the use of “fighting words.”
catlady
June 30th, 2012
12:16 pm
The bus monitor was unable to control the behavior (and we all understand that) but she could probably not lose her job due to being disabled.
William Casey
June 30th, 2012
12:28 pm
In my days as an administrator at Chattahoochee H.S, I sometimes had to ride busses which had especially unruly kids. When I did, we had “silent ride,” no talking for the duration. Sure, it helped that I was a 6′-4″, 240 lb. former football coach. The real trick, though, was that I had the AUTHORITY to deal out immediate In-School Suspensions, Out-of-School Suspensions and bus bans. The kids hated “silent ride.” Word quickly got around and I didn’t have to do it often. It was such a simple and inexpensive solution. The bus drivers loved me.
I hope that the parents add some effective punishments such as taking away cell phone, computer and TV for awhile. Have the kids read “Crime and Punishment.”
William Casey
June 30th, 2012
12:29 pm
I think that it’s “buses.”
gateacher
June 30th, 2012
12:32 pm
Excellent! Done, and done!
gateacher
June 30th, 2012
12:36 pm
I’m also curious to know what consequences the PARENTS of these boys are giving them! The school should not be disciplining their children for them!
Fred ™
June 30th, 2012
12:38 pm
Good Mother
June 30th, 2012
7:17 am
Kyle, no I don’t think involuntary volunteering is wrong.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Involuntary volunteering? Really? You don’t see how insipid that is? How can you “involuntarily” volunteer?
Just damn…….
Hillbilly D
June 30th, 2012
1:01 pm
I still say they need their little butts busted but in fairness, a one year suspension is more than I expected them to get.
Dr. Craig Spinks/ Georgians for Educational Excellence
June 30th, 2012
1:06 pm
We teachers, the currently practicing as well as the recently retired, need to educate the remainder of THE PEOPLE about the nature, frequency, intensity and duration of the student misbehaviors which have typified many school buses, hallways, classrooms, cafeteria, auditoria, gymnasia et al…
before the talented, conscientious Jordan Kohanims of this world throw in their towels and our PubEd system devolves more and more rapidly toward third-world status.
catlady
June 30th, 2012
1:22 pm
Mr. Casey: According to my dictionary it can be either way, but to me busses=kisses and buses=more than one bus.
RCB
June 30th, 2012
1:58 pm
The boys were disciplined properly, but let’s not pretend that this bus monitor is capable of doing her job. From her physical and emotional appearance, I don’t think she has the ability to monitor a bus. I’m glad nothing happened that would have required her immediate response.
William Casey
June 30th, 2012
2:11 pm
@Catlady: Yes, I missed the “busses.” LOL
Really????
June 30th, 2012
2:47 pm
Ok, I think I understand now. It’s the monitors fault for not making these student stop abusing her. You have got to be kidding me!!! We may have to go to new rules. Those of you who have never worked in a school or monitored a school bus should not get to reply until you have done so. Bottom line is these children were horribly disrespectful and there is absolutely no excuse for such behavior. Parents who refuse to discipline their children are doing them a disservice because the rest of the world can’t stand to be around them.
AlreadySheared
June 30th, 2012
2:58 pm
Headline should be “Embarassed Administrators Compensate for Their Ineffective Discipline Policies by Overreacting and Suspending Students for a Year”
Yeah, the kids are wrong, but the administrators who let things get this bad are wronger.
Bumblebee
June 30th, 2012
3:08 pm
I’m sorry….but how does this woman deserve this money? There are millions of people who get bullied their whole lives and don’t get a penny from it. I understand that what these kids did was wrong and she was humiliated….but to receive that much money is kind of a joke. If anything we should be giving that money to programs to educate young people about the effects of bullying and help prevent some of these cruel acts.
carlosgvv
June 30th, 2012
4:14 pm
I rode a school bus for years in the 50’s. It would never have occured to me or any other students to do what these boys did.
Good Mother
June 30th, 2012
4:40 pm
V said it best “Did she allow vicious attacks on other children to occur also? These boys didn’t just decide to pick on her all of the sudden. If my child has been on that bus with her as bus monitor, I would be afraid for my child.”
EXACTLY.
If she is unable to do anything except turn her head and cry, she is useless as a bus monitor. No doubt these kids learned that they didn’t have to respect her.
I sympathize with the woman and feel some of the pain of her son’s suicid but she is not an effective bus monitor.She isn’t qualified for the job. How many other children did she allow to be bullied? How many CHILDREN were hurt because she allowed them to be taunted?
The mean-spirited monsters on the bus no doubt saw her as an easy target.
It’s not just her age or her gender. She needs to be up out of that seat and giving the boys the low-down with a threat — shut that trap up now. She should be able to physically grab the monsters by the collar of their shirt and force them to sit in the front of the bus away form one another and she should film their behavior. If I was that bus monitor and I coulnd’t physically do that — I would stop that bus and put in a call to the parents, school and the assistant princiapal in charge of discipline and if those mean-spirited boys couldnt’ behave on the bus their parents should have to take them and if that doesn’t solve it — alternative school.
I feel the same way as V — she was paid to prevent and stop bullying. If she cannot handle the job step aside for someone who can. Our children deserve and I demand safety at school. that’s why my children have never been on a school bus without me and why next year they’ll be going to private school.
bootney farnsworth
June 30th, 2012
5:11 pm
the little thug should have been turned over to her family for “disipline”
NTLB
June 30th, 2012
6:04 pm
@Bumblebee–she deserves it because the media outlets (social) exposed the students’ vile behavior. Thank God for cellphones and Facebook!
NBCT
June 30th, 2012
6:57 pm
I am really sick of hearing about these unruly, disrespectful, horrible children with no comprehension of manners or authority. I say send the parents to parenting school, fine then and make conditions that if their children do not improve they will then enter into a program to improve.
kyle
June 30th, 2012
7:13 pm
im not on the kids sides, i just am wondering what has happened to freedom of speech?
i should be able to say anything i want to you, whether it be racist, ignorant, retarded.
the kids never touched her correct?
did they threaten her or something?
just a little confused, could use some clearing up.
Sharkman
June 30th, 2012
7:34 pm
Those little twerps got off way easy. Hopefully Mrs. Klein’s donation fund will net $2,000,000, so she can get a cool Million after taxes.
Archie
June 30th, 2012
7:48 pm
“Required to volunteer (?) 50 hours of community service working with senior citizens?” That sounds like something a juvenile court might hand down as part of an approved sentence! Is the Greece Central School District that powerful? The glare of publicity works wonders!
Archie
June 30th, 2012
7:56 pm
@NBCT: Don’t make me get out my tired old argument that people ( as a minimum requirement before being allowed to reproduce) should have to take a written examination and get a license. Hmmm! Sending them to parenting school before taking the written examination and getting the “License to Reproduce” might be a pretty good idea!
Tired of Teaching
June 30th, 2012
7:57 pm
@kyle
They touched her and threatened her. Watch the video before you spew your uninformed comments.
I love teaching. I hate what it is becoming...
June 30th, 2012
8:07 pm
@GwinnettParentz “And the $650K Mrs. Klein will receive (after the government grabs half in taxes) from her fellow Americans demonstrates yet again our American exceptionalism those on the left prefer to ignore.”
Personally, I think it demonstrates Americans preference to reach for their wallets and pull out a few bucks to feel better about themselves, rather than putting forth the much harder effort of actually dealing with complex societal problems – like a growing lack of manners among members of society, and weak disciplinary measures in the schools. Are Americans generous? Yes, when it really doesn’t cost them much in terms of concerted, long term effort.
kyle
June 30th, 2012
8:14 pm
@tired of teaching
they were not uninformed comments, not sure if you noticed the question marks.
teachers these days…..
also not really interested in the video, more about the punishment
if they touched her it should be very simple to set up an assault charge, not sure why she just didnt start there, must really be itching for some money.
I love teaching. I hate what it is becoming...
June 30th, 2012
8:20 pm
@GM “She needs to be up out of that seat and giving the boys the low-down with a threat — shut that trap up now.”
And parents would complain about her bullying their child and she would lose her job.
” She should be able to physically grab the monsters by the collar of their shirt and force them to sit in the front of the bus away form one another.”
And parent would sue for physical abuse and she would lose her job and possibly everything else.
“… and she should film their behavior.”
Illegal. She would lose her job and likely get sued.
“I would stop that bus and put in a call to the parents, school and the assistant princiapal (sp)in charge of discipline and if those mean-spirited boys couldnt’ (sp) behave on the bus their parents should have to take them…”
And parent’s number would be disconnected, or they wouldn’t answer, or they would refuse to do anything about it, and tell you it was YOUR problem. And the AP might not be any better.
“… and if that doesn’t solve it — alternative school.”
There are very few alternative schools out there, and they likely would not take these students. Their offence was not “serious” enough – this kind of thing goes on daily in schools across the nation.
All good ideas, but unrealistic in the school environment, as it exsists. Welcome to our world!
Want to change it? Parents of well behaved children need to start demanding that schools and administrators DEAL with problem children. Tax payers need to be willing to PAY for the building of more alternative schools. People need to stop undermining teacher authority by constantly blaming them for all of society’s ills and vilifying them in the media. And all parents need to step up to the plate and admit their children might not be perfect, and THEY have a duty to instill manners and values in them. Parents of children who get in trouble in school need to look past the knee jerk reaction of “blame the teacher and sue the school” and actually make an effort to investigate what happened fully. Then, if their child was really the problem, admit it and DEAL with it!
I love teaching. I hate what it is becoming...
June 30th, 2012
8:21 pm
kyle @”i just am wondering what has happened to freedom of speech?
i should be able to say anything i want to you, whether it be racist, ignorant, retarded.”
Freedom of speech, does not mean freedom from consequences.
TimeOut
June 30th, 2012
9:06 pm
The presence of an adult witness should be sufficient to curtail most misconduct. Unfortunately, it is not enough today. It was most likely not enough yesterday and will not be sufficient tomorrow. Unfortunately, we do not wish to pay for ‘bouncers’ on our school buses. We don’t want to pay their higher salaries nor face potential lawsuits from the parents of those students who attempt to instigate trouble just to see if they can get someone arrested, fired, sued, etc. We could choose to pass laws that remove a minor’s right to free transportation or even free education should he/she engage in chronic antisocial behaviors.
CCMST
June 30th, 2012
9:29 pm
@kyle – freedom of speech does not mean you “should be able to say anything i want to you, whether it be racist, ignorant, retarded.” That is a common misconception, unfortunately (and one students often make).
Unprotected speech includes the following: obscenity, fighting words, defamation, perjury, blackmail, incitement to unlawful action, and true threats. I would think a legal argument could be made that some of what the students said could fall in those categories. Additionally, the SCOTUS has ruled that school can limit speech (both Tinker and Fraser could likely be applied to this), and other courts have ruled that the school bus (and stop – remember the Josh Belluardo case here in Cherokee??) is an extension of the school.
Bumblebee
June 30th, 2012
9:33 pm
Part of the problem with punishment is that it doesn’t address the real problems of bullying. I think it’s a good start but it seems to me that everyone is ignoring this widespread problem that happens everywhere. Yes this particular case was caught on video and everyone feels for the poor woman….but this happens everyday to millions of other people. I agree with “I love teaching..” on this one
Lee
June 30th, 2012
11:02 pm
“Parents of well behaved children need to start demanding that schools and administrators DEAL with problem children. “
We have.
- We go to the teacher who tells us their hands are tied.
- We go to the office and are met by a weak-willed administrator who wields the student handbook like a Roman Gladiator shield.
- We try to go before the school board and find out we must take a day off to go to the central office IN PERSON to fill out the paperwork to get on the agenda at least two weeks before the BOE meeting and then you only get 15 minutes, in which the BOE will sit there staring off into space while you present your issue to them. Then they will thank you and tell you they will take your input into advisement.
We push for Charter Schools, Vouchers, hell, ANYTHING to get our kids out of the cess-pool that many public schools have become.
Finally, we get tired of the crap and place our children into private schools where they THRIVE.
…and we shake our heads wondering why we didn’t do that years ago…
Student
June 30th, 2012
11:37 pm
In 8th grade, One of my classmates threw a Georgia History textbook at a teacher. She did not recieve any type of punishment. She was moved to another “team” so she would no longer be in his classroom. I agree with Mark. I’ve seen kids do MUCH worse than these kids and saw them go unpunished. No ISS, no supension, NOTHING! The schoolboard only handed down this punishment because of the media attention.
susie
July 1st, 2012
12:00 am
Are they being punished for the way they treated the bus monitor or for the bad publicity they brought the school system? Call me cynical, but why do I suspect the punishment, if any, would have been much more lax if it weren’t for the PR angle?
bug
July 1st, 2012
4:45 am
This problem will grow until we work on the parents. The apple does not fall far from the tree.
Good Mother
July 1st, 2012
7:11 am
Cameras in schools should be mandatory. We need to film the good and the bad and save for records. Heck, if gas stations can keep a camera on at the pumps, why can’t we do it in the schools? It would help prevent some crimes by teachers and students and help to prove crimes and punish the criminals too.
I WILL send my childrne to school with a high tech cell phone with audio and video recording and maybe even some hidden cameras in their collars as one parent has already done. I will teach them how to use it discreetly so that if any bully — teacher or parent or bully-kid breaks the law I’ll have proof for the criminal court and for the media.
It’s one of the few ways to get results in schools nowadays — put it on the news or social media and then watch the results.
Good Mother
July 1st, 2012
7:14 am
bug you said “This problem will grow until we work on the parents. The apple does not fall far from the tree.”
By punishing the kids we ARE punishing the parents — the future parents. These kids are future parents. They need to learn the lesson now. For the “adult” parents I’m afraid it is already too late for them. Their “values” are already formed.
Good Mother
July 1st, 2012
7:21 am
I love teaching says “Personally, I think it demonstrates Americans preference to reach for their wallets and pull out a few bucks to feel better about themselves, rather than putting forth the much harder effort of actually dealing with complex societal problems…”
I find it really sad, I love teaching, that you criticize Americans for sending money to the bus monitor and criticize their motivations as well. Americans from all over the country and others outside the country sent money. You have absolutely no idea what their personal motivations are and do not know what their thoughts are.
I think you’re angry that no one shells out money for you as a teacher and are bitter no one gives you money when you compalin about mean-spirited children. The truth is, you’re jealous.
Good Mother
July 1st, 2012
7:30 am
Really?? You said “Ok, I think I understand now. It’s the monitors fault for not making these student stop abusing her.”
You misunderstand, Really??.
The concern I have expressed and others have expressed about the bus monitors behavior is the fear that she is ineffective in her job, which means, other children, our children, are at risk. When we parents hear there is an adult driver and an adult bus monitor, we feel they must be qualified to do their job just as we need to feel assured that teachers are doing their jobs.
The bus monitor is a waste of money and time if she cannot or will not handle bullying on the bus, which puts our children at risk.
No one is blaming the bus monitor for what the kids did, we are concerned that out children and other good children are being harmed because she cannot or will not do her job.
Dr. Craig Spinks/ Georgians for Educational Excellence
July 1st, 2012
8:14 am
Too bad for these miscreants that they were not my late maternal grandmother’s grandchildren. Mamie and her peach switches would have taught them necessary, life-long lessons about respect, albeit in a paradoxical manner.
Dr. Craig Spinks/ Georgians for Educational Excellence
July 1st, 2012
8:16 am
Bumblebee and I love teaching,
You’re correct.
a differnt mark
July 1st, 2012
9:12 am
In my county school, those students would have suspended off the bus,arrested, and sent to an alternative school. But my county video tapes and audio tapes our busess. These has been used for evidence in all sort of crimes that occur on the bus. (false imprisonment, sexually activity, interfering with a bus at a railroad crossing, bullying, assult, vandalism, drug use/sale, indecent exposure ie mooning out the window)
Due to budget cuts, the digital upgrades to this audio/video system will be cut. The analog video tapes are eventually erased to reuse the tapes (VHS). But the digital stays, so they can be look back at if a crime is found to have happened at an earlier date.
BTY: The students at my school that can no longer ride he bus, have to wait sometimes until 5 or 6pm for their ride if their parents work. Some are dropped off an hour early as the parent goes to work. One student waiting for his ride, asked a group of teachers one day for a ride home,we said “we are not allowed to drive students and next time, behave on the bus”. Justice will prevail!
Ray Brent Marsh
July 1st, 2012
9:19 am
This could make for a great new reality/contest show. “If you can endure a whole semester with these kids you could walk away with half a million dollars.”
mr. buckley
July 1st, 2012
9:25 am
for those of you such as lee. you are part of the problem. schools have been handcuffed in the ability to punish these kids. if parents allowed teachers to do their job, this woudnt happen. just to blanket blame administrators is wrong. in my day i knew not to do anything that would warrent a call to my parents. there was nothing the school or police could do that would match my punishment at home. and thats where it all starts. parents need to be engaged. when a parent is contacted by a school. most parents blame the school. discipline requries a fear of the consequences
Really???
July 1st, 2012
9:56 am
@.Good Mother…school personnel are limited in their response to student behavior. It’s not fair to call personnel ineffective until you’ve read the job description and the board policies and administrative rules that go along with it. I would like to ask you one question about all the good children who are at risk. Why did they not speak up? Why didn’t they tell school administrators or their parents? I taught my boys that even if you can’t change the world, you can make your corner of it a better place. This included being a voice for those that don’t have one. We talked about their day every day and they certainly would have told me about this and attempted to get them to leave her alone.
bootney farnsworth
July 1st, 2012
10:02 am
@ GPC we had a student caught in the act of stealing from other students. when the victim wanted to prosecute, the full power of the system came down on the victim and the campus police to make everything go away
bootney farnsworth
July 1st, 2012
10:03 am
@ lee
your children aren’t worth a day off?
says much about your priorities.
Good Mother
July 1st, 2012
10:40 am
TO Really?? You said “It’s not fair to call personnel ineffective until you’ve read the job description and the board policies and administrative rules that go along with it. ”
Really, really?? YOu think sitting silently and crying with your head turned away is an APPROPRIATE response to bullying?
This bus monitor did absolutely nothing. What good was her presence on that bus? Money and time wasted and more importantly — who was hurt, which child was bullied because this monitor did NOTHING.
Good Mother
July 1st, 2012
10:43 am
Bootney, you are barking up the wrong tree. you mock Lee and say “@ lee
your children aren’t worth a day off?”
OBVIOUSLY, his or her children WERE worth the effort and he or she said as much in a long list of items he or she did in response to bullying. Lee’s ultimate response was the same as mine — the personnel in public schools are unwilling to take responsibility so we are GONE — to private school. OF course our childrne are worth a day off — worth much more — we have to work more than one day to pay for that private education while still paying teh taxes to pay your salary NOT to teach our children.
Good Mother
July 1st, 2012
10:47 am
and yet REALLY?? blames the GOOD KIDS for the bullying…
He or she writes “I would like to ask you one question about all the good children who are at risk. Why did they not speak up?”
Uh, Really, why don’t you speak up?
And by the way, good kids DO speak up just as they DID SPEAK up about Jerry Sandusky raping them and what happened there?
They weren’t believed. The parents went to the cops who did nothing. You are severely out of touch, Really? when you blame the INNOCENT GOOD children for the bullying of the bad kids and the bad teachers and adults who don’t handle the situation.
Good Mother
July 1st, 2012
10:48 am
To a different mark — Bravo!
Good for you!
Proof that cameras and digital tapes work!’Love your story and thanks for sharing!
bootney farnsworth
July 1st, 2012
12:07 pm
@ GM
I stand by my comments.
troll all you wish.
bootney farnsworth
July 1st, 2012
12:10 pm
@ really,
don’t waste your time feeding the troll.
statistically, the odds are very good most people doing the whining haven’t been regulars at PTA, parent teacher conferences, never volunteer, ect. they don’t show to school board meetings, don’t contact their state representatives, or do anything to attempt to influence the direction and methodology of their schools.
they just bitch.
Bumblebee
July 1st, 2012
12:35 pm
If the adult bus monitor couldn’t even stand up for herself, how do we expect students to stand up to their own peers?
Really???
July 1st, 2012
1:05 pm
I am NOT blaming the good children for the attack. I’m defending the bus monitor. Calling her ineffective sounds like blaming her for the attack when you don’t know what limits are placed on her by the BOE. If blame must be placed, I put it all on the parents of the abusers.
For the record, I did teach my sons to stand up to their peers when necessary. You know the old saying if you don’t stand for something you will fall for anything. My sons are now young adults and contributing members of society. My Mother taught me the way to know if you have been a successful parent. Of course we all love our children, but if we like them after they have grown up we have been successful.
Student Advocate
July 1st, 2012
1:38 pm
Another Math Teacher is exactly right.
Really??
July 1st, 2012
3:21 pm
@ bootney farnsworth. You are correct, I really know better than respond, especially when all the experts on the subject have never worked in a school. Some people attending private schools is beneficial to all.
Ole Guy
July 2nd, 2012
12:51 pm
Mark, do you not feel that it’s about time we start getting “harsh” with those…both kids and adults…who feel completely immune to the edicts of common decency. In fact, receiving a mere suspension from school may be viewed, by these gd kids, as a gift. I don’t want to disturb the fragility of many, but I…and I am quite certain many out there…would have expected a good six-warming on the stage in front of their classmates. This is exactly how some of the transgressions…some commited by yours truly…were handled in an era of no-nonesense manageing of kids’ behaviors.
I simply cannot understand why adults, in this era of “enlightenment”, where decision-makers with impressive titles by their names, insist on handling these glaring problems with unparalleled delicacy. These gd bratts should be considered fortunate that they managed to escape accountability. The action they “must endure” only places the problems in someone elses lap.
Ole Guy
July 3rd, 2012
12:56 pm
Casey, your story bears out the inescapable, undeniable truism…kids react favorably out of FEAR. At some point in time, that fear translates into discipline and, eventually, a “let’s do the right thing” outlook on life and our tiny perches in the big picture. That kids, throughout their entire school lives…and often far beyond…face absolutely no fear; no concern for the mere possibility that undesirable behavior just might lead to undesirabe consequence, is the unfortunate byproduct of taking REAL discipline out of the schools. A few pops on the six, and the denial of privilege go a long long way.
Prof
July 3rd, 2012
1:37 pm
@ Ole Guy. “A few pops on the six” in schools is illegal in Georgia.
Archie
July 3rd, 2012
5:28 pm
@Prof: It varies from county to county in Georgia. Corporal punishment had been abolished in the last Metro Atlanta county I was with. However, the system in South Georgia where I spent 10 years in the 1980’s and 1990’s, the “board of education” was alive and well and from about 7:30 a.m. to noon on weekdays was very active, as miscreants were driven down the “flowery path of knowledge.” I couldn’t help but notice that Andy Griffith made his transition from this earthly plain today. To me, he will remain as a reminder of a bygone era when America was great and people were decent and friendly.
Prof
July 4th, 2012
12:16 pm
@ Archie. Right you are, technically speaking. The law states: “Code Section 20-2-730, et seq. Corporal punishment allowed, subject to various restrictions. Circumstances Allowable: It may not be excessive or unduly severe or be used as a first line of punishment; it must be administered in the presence of a school official; a written explanation must be provided on request; and it may not be administered if a physician certifies that the child’s mental or emotional stability could be affected.”
Somehow I doubt that Ole Guy’s “a few pops on the six” is going to follow those restrictions.
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July 12th, 2012
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