Gifted education: How are children selected and is it uniform across Georgia school districts?
Let’s start off this week with a subject that has a lot of interest: Gifted education.
I received a note from a local educator about the question of how students are selected and whether the process is biased. She asked that we discuss it here on the blog. (Here is a longer blog posting that I wrote on gifted education. )
One of the reader’s observations is that students can qualify for gifted in one county and not in another. I had a new gifted teacher tell me once that there were many students in my local system who would have been in the gifted program in her former county of Fulton. This teacher was surprised that my system did not admit more kids to the gifted program.
I had assumed that the criteria was uniform across counties, but that apparently is not the case as this poster notes:
The sub-level representation of ”gifted” minority students in my county is an issue that has bothered me for years. A coworker and good friend of mine completed her Gifted endorsement class and has shared with me the biased discrepancies in the testing and eligibility requirements of students. She shared with me that the testing and screening items lead in favor toward one group of students, and are counteractive toward other groups of students — specifically Hispanic, ELL, and African-American students.
One of the main criteria of being eligible for Gifted participation is having high grades. But is the child whose parents are providing them with private tutors and are pressuring them to excel in school truly “gifted”?
School systems receive a lot of funds for testing and qualifying students in the gifted program. Many people are oblivious to this fact and I think they need to be educated on it. They also need to know that counties in Georgia have different criteria for a student being eligible and qualifying as a gifted student.
A gifted student in one system, is not necessarily gifted in another. I once had a student who qualified for Gifted participation in Fulton, but was not eligible in Cobb. This is another issue that perplexes me, if the Gifted classes are federally funded, then there should be universal requirements across the board.
–From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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127 comments Add your comment
Dr. Monica Henson
June 25th, 2012
12:53 pm
I’m with Solutions, who posted, “I prefer a system where any student can waive their way into more difficult and advanced classes, but where they must perform at the level of that class or fall back. That removes the biased influence of influence by either the parent or the teacher.”
The problem I see with gifted education programs is that it reserves excellent teaching and strategies only for those deemed “deserving” by virtue of entrance criteria. Public education should be a pump, not a filter. When all students are provided access to great teaching and interesting strategies that engage and challenge them (not just handed a difficult research assignment, but truly engaged by a great teacher first), then you have far fewer bored kids hating school.
As an administrator, I found that many students in the gifted program in middle school left the program due to overwork–not from the gifted teachers, but by their “regular” teachers who insisted that they complete every single piece of minutiae that all the nongifted students did in addition to their gifted program work. This practice was supposed to ensure “fairness,” but it does nothing but work against the concept of differentiated instruction. My rule was that the reg. ed. teacher had to coordinate with the gifted teacher on assignments, and the GT had the final say on which RE assignments the students had to complete, which differed according to the individual child’s skills and abilities. This didn’t help my popularity index with the RE teachers, but then again, that wasn’t my priority in making decisions for kids’ best educational interests.
Good Mother
June 25th, 2012
1:00 pm
Bernie, your comments are hogwash.
Here in APS, black children are given preference, not whites.
Do you ever get tired of playing the race card?
Solutions
June 25th, 2012
1:48 pm
MissInformation – An IQ of 140-145 is three standard deviations above average, you should see only one person in this range for every 10,000 students. Of course, if you are teaching in an elite area such as the Walton school district, you are not dealing with an average population, so you would see this IQ range more frequently. A person who has a change in measured IQ of one SD or more was either incorrectly tested or was performing poorly on one of the tests due to illness, trauma, or drugs.
TeacherMom4
June 25th, 2012
1:52 pm
I have fraternal twins who were both found eligible to be gifted. One of my girls truly is gifted, as evidenced by high CogAT and ITBS scores, the other qualified under the multiple criteria method. Her achievement is great, but her CogAT fell a little short. She did great on motivation but needed a creativity rating scale. I am not convinced she is truly gifted, but she sure does have intense interest in certain academic areas and is verbally very astute. I do think she needs more than the regular classroom provides. I am so glad that both of my girls get gifted education, but more because of how the classroom today is designed more for struggling learners than capable or advanced learners. In addition, this designation will provide insulation from unmotivated disruptive students in middle school and high school.
As a gifted certified teacher, I have mixed feelings about how students qualify (my own child included). I do think we have lots of non-gifted high achievers in our program. However, there are no alternatives for those kids. Their regular classes ignore them, and motivation does go a long way toward success. My observation at my majority-minority school is that we want more kids to qualify for the money and teacher points it brings. My kids are in a 15-16% white population environment, so most of our gifted kids are children of color. Our Latino population is only 2-3%, most of the rest are black or biracial. Clearly, as a school, we don’t need to pump up our minority numbers to make things more “fair”. I just see us stretching to get more kids qualified for the money. I know our gifted teacher has actually counseled teachers on how to use the rating scale to ensure kids qualify. It is unethical as far as I’m concerned.
Other than money, there is no way to account for the push. If we know that no more than 10% of the population are really gifted, why are we pushing for more? Ten percent of the population is left handed; why are we not training more kids to be lefties? There’s no money in that.
Old Physics Teacher
June 25th, 2012
2:03 pm
The “original” definition of “special education” was 2 standard deviations from the “norm.” That mean to receive federal/state funds for the low end of the scale, the student had to be in the 5th percent of “ability.” To receive funds for “gifted,” the student had to be ABOVE 95 percent of his/her classmates. This means that in a school of 2000 students – or 500 students per class – [which is HUGE] only one hundred students TOTAL(or 25 students per class) would be ALLOWED in gifted education.
Now in today’s enlightened society, gifted education is used to sort the “good” kids from the “bad” kids, because ALL children will respond to gifted teaching techniques, and ALL children can benefit from being taught by gifted teachers, right? Why should they get special consideration? Who cares about the kids at the top end – tomorrow’s leaders? Well…. you really don’t need to teach those kids, do you? They’re smarter than the teachers and they’ll teach themselves, right? Who cares about the truly gifted kids, really? In today’s society it’s all about getting the powerful people (and the people who complain), and their kids, taken care of, right?
I remember a long quote from Robert Heinlein about the definition of “bad luck.” It’s what happens when you ignore and mistreat the gifted. Your society falls apart… and it’s just accidental, right? It’s… just… bad… luck.
Atlanta Mom
June 25th, 2012
2:08 pm
“Other than money, there is no way to account for the push”
Of course there is, every mother wants to have a gifted child.
TeacherMom4
June 25th, 2012
2:16 pm
Touche, Atlanta Mom. LOL
Teaching Vet
June 25th, 2012
2:20 pm
Motivation and creativity were added as criteria about fifteen years ago to help expand the program to more diverse populations. Prior to this only mental abilities and achievement scores were used for placement. The Torrance, used to test creativity, must be scored by someone who is certified to do so. The Torrance Center at UGA completes this course a couple of times a year. The test can also be sent to Scholastic, the publisher, for scoring, this, of course, costs more money. I have seen Torrance results I disagree with, but overall the validity is good. I do have a problem with motivation check lists which are used in K-6. The subjectivity of the evaluators can be easily swayed. We have to rely on the professionalism of those who are completing the ratings scales, but they are human. Despite popular opinion, gifted students are not always the most well behaved in class. and they can easily antagonize teachers and sway opinions on the motivation scales. They are the students who walk to the beat of a different drummer, dance on top of the box, or sometimes are the silent loners in the back of the room; they are not always the “perfect” students some may think should be in a gifted program.
Panthergirl
June 25th, 2012
2:22 pm
Oh, I think “gifted qualification” can be very subjective. I have the seen measurement of gifted criteria differ among 2 schools in the same county (Forsyth). When my son was in 5th grade, he had to take a multiple choice test to measure motivation. Apparently, the test was not easy and was designed to trick the students. When my neighbor’s son was being tested for gifted in 7th grade, my neighbor was told that her son’s grades could be used as evidence of motivation. Really?
I have also noticed, albeit anecdotally, that teacher’s kids seem to be admitted to the gifted program at a higher rate than non-teacher’s kids. I just find it curious that teachers (who mostly seemed to me to be of average intelligence) have so many brilliant children.
This is an interesting story. My son’s kindergarten teacher’s daughter was being tested for gifted at the same time as my older son. My son’s ITBS scores were 99 percentile in total reading and 97 percentile in total math. However, his highest COGAT score was only in the high 80s and with his low creativity score, he did not qualify. His teachers daughter, on the other hand, was 93rd pecentile in total math on the ITBS. Her ITBS reading score was below 90 along with her highest COGAT and creativity score. Yet, his teacher’s daughter, did qualify. How? The gifted teacher gave her a second creativity test. The child told her mother that the second creativity test was ridiculously easy. Yeah, its really not a level playing field.
skipper
June 25th, 2012
2:40 pm
I (unfortunately) was one of the so-called “gifted” students, and KMHSmom was right about one thing; stuff seemed so easy that once I did have to go to work in college, I was unprepared. Most who succeed in college have good study/work habits, and have been taught how to study. I never really had to, but was not “brilliant” enough (lol) to ease by once I hit the challenge. Then, I had to bust my tail! Hard line figuring “gifted” and “advanced”!
Jannie
June 25th, 2012
2:43 pm
I have had three children to go through Cobb school and all three were tested but only two made it into the gifted program. We always told our children that the Target program was not about being smart but about a way of thinking. These kids tend to think outside of the box and granted, if you ever saw one of the projects or the way they researched it, you would totally agree. There is nothing in the testing process that would profile or discriminate against races. If you read to your children, engage them in lively and meaningful conversations and take them to museums, art shows and historical outings, they will overcome any limitations that they could possibly have later when testing. However, if you are a lazy parent and choose to put your children in front of the tv all the time while you talk on your cell phone, expose them to second hand smoke and profanity and unhealthy living practices, your child will test poorly. But don’t blame the school system for your lousy parenting.
ATL mom
June 25th, 2012
2:47 pm
Unfortunately, the gifted programs are not tailored to meet the needs of kids in the areas in which they are actually gifted. You can test in for reading and are automatically in for math, even if you’re unable to perform basic arithmetic. And visa versa is also true…there are kids in the gifted programs for 2nd grade and up that are still reading picture books. As a result, kids who are gifted in both areas don’t get pushed at all. And of course, things like history, science, writing and so forth are not accounted for at all b/c of this 2 subject approach. So again, we are good at meeting kids in the middle, but are not challenging kids in each area in which they actually excel. That’s great for kids that need a boost, but this program is really supposed to be for the gifted kids.
EduKtr
June 25th, 2012
3:04 pm
With gifted programs robbed of their value through politically correct racial quotas—don’t we have reason #999 to finally pull the plug on the public school system and grant parents the right to freely choose schools which best meet their kids’ needs?
Wondering
June 25th, 2012
3:21 pm
I am one of three brothers that went through the gifted program in California during the 70’s. Between us we employee over 100 people in the IT and engineering fields. We have started over a dozen companies, and many are still in business today without us.
The point is, please understand the point of the gifted program. It is not to accelerate learning, which can be done in accelerated classes. It is instead to identify children that learn and synthesize quickly. Gifted children are both intelligent and creative, and need to know how to combine the two.
The gifted program taught me how to apply my learning and create new ideas that I had to defend. It was challenging and it taught me to work. It also taught me to question but to do it from a researched point of view. It also taught me there were others like me including many of my teachers.
Many of my classmates in the program also started companies and have contributed to our country in numerous ways. One just retired as a Rear Admr. and several are in the entertainment field. We all owe a great deal to our teachers in the gifted program.
What I don’t hear in all of these discussions is how we attract the right types of teachers to the gifted programs. Raw inputs such as gifted children and materials are important. How do we identify and retain those special teachers that can drive kids to work hard and put in the time required for truly gifted classes?
TeacherMom4
June 25th, 2012
3:25 pm
Panthergirl, I’m sorry for the issues you’ve had and that you feel your child was unfairly treated–that may be true. There are lots of teachers’ kids at my school who have not been tested or were tested but didn’t qualify. My AP’s kid was one of them. There are lots of gifted kids who have average parents. There are lots of average kids who have gifted parents. Kids do have 2 parents; if you’re equating the child’s intelligence with their teacher parent, remember, there is another parent, too. My husband was designated as gifted under the old criteria. I was tested multiple times (because I had teachers who were convinced that I was) and never qualified. Maybe my kids have their dad’s IQ genes.
another comment
June 25th, 2012
3:31 pm
My oldest daughter did not meet the gifted aka Target program, due to the creativity score in Cobb. Her teacher’s in 1st, 2nd and 3rd, were all dumb founded. The teacher’s regularly begged the Target teacher to put her in. They had her tutoring kids in the grade level below. The Target teacher would never tell me, until right before she retired what the Target creativity test was about, so that I might help my daughter study. Then she told me it was creative writing. This made no sense as my daughter’s writing in the 2nd grade was choosen for a best in School award and submitted to Cobb County for a Countywide award.
In the end, I have found that Target, doesn’t mean a thing. My daughter went to Catholic school from the middle of 3rd to 8th, she was properly put in the top of the classes there. She got A’s and B’s. She made it into the Counties IB program. Which we found after a semester, was a ridiculous waste of homework assignments and stress. She switched to AP and Honor’s classes. She has a 3.92 GPA is in the top 10% of her class. She has gotten all natural A’s and only 1 natural B on her AP classes.
On the other hand, her 4 friends from the same Cobb Elementary that did make it into Target. None have even come close to her performance. They all went to different private schools, none of them were more than a C student.. One was even asked to leave one private school and go to another one. One girls came back to public school and is currently in Summer School for Math III.
So as far as I am concerned the gifted program is completed biased, and it doesn’t mean a hill of beans.
Mr. Todd
June 25th, 2012
3:50 pm
About twice a week or so in morning homeroom, Spike drops to the floor, pulls both ankles behind his head, locks them together, pokes his arms out to the side like airplane wings, and rocks back and forth on the bony knobs of his spine while he smiles and gladly answers our questions.
That’s gifted. In a sort of a way.
http://www.adixiediary.com
Ann
June 25th, 2012
4:03 pm
Both of my sons were in the gifted classes from elementary school thru middle school, then honors and AP classes in high school. It did afford them exceptionally good educations. As a PTA officer and substitute teacher, I spent many hours in classrooms. One of the saddest things I ever encountered was an entire class of students with behavior problems and slower learning ability. Some of the students in one of my classes explained to me why they couldn’t learn the material I had just taught another class. The reason – the class before them was gifted and they were the “dumb” class. These children could learn. Maybe they needed more time or a different way of learning, but they could learn. I cried and told them not to let anyone tell them they were dumb. One timid child raised her hand and asked, “Not even your parents.” Oh, the things I wanted to tell her parents. We do need to have “gifted” education, as well as remedial education, but we need to EXPLAIN to all the students (gifted included) what that means. It simply means “gifted” students learn easily in the school environment. We need to teach all students they have something special to offer, it just may not be academic. If everyone could know how it feels to have elementary school children talk so badly about themselves, some things would change.
southside teacher
June 25th, 2012
4:13 pm
As far as funding: The Javits Act (Gifted and Talented Students) was gutted about 2 years ago, when I was working on my gifted endorsement. Unlike SWD, there is no requirement to fund GT programs. So, it all comes down to the state formula, which offers a little extra to districts for each gifted student.
Eligibility; the state defines four areas of evaluation,a nd you have to meet the bar in 3 of the 4. Those are achievement, intelligence, motivation, and creativity. Part of the reason for this is to ensure opportunities for non-traditional groups to qualify for the program, including kids learning English, kids with attention problems, etc. This does have the effect of stackng the class with creative kids, teacher-pleasers, and other high achievers who may not be particularly talented. But, as has been pointed out, these kids are also not well served in RE classes either. If they are willing to make the effort it takes to succeed in GT, why not let them?
NTLB
June 25th, 2012
4:32 pm
I think many people here are missing the original issue: little to non existant participation of minority students in Gifted classes.
It’s like there is a big white elephant in the room that many choose to ignore on this blog and in our schools.
Solutions
June 25th, 2012
4:32 pm
You don’t need gifted or AP as long as you have the khanacademy dot org, just do the modules and blow past your competitors on all standardized tests. You don’t need the permission or approval of anyone to use the khanacademy and it is better than 99.99 percent of all classroom instruction (how many public school teachers have a BS in Electrical Engineering form MIT, and an MBA?). Start with basic arithmetic and go through differential equations…..
Solutions
June 25th, 2012
4:34 pm
NTLB – Send the minorities to the khanacademy, they can learn at their own pace, and Sal Khan is himself a minority, as is his physician wife!
Old timer
June 25th, 2012
4:46 pm
Maureen…the boring quote is one I also used. And it is true. Most really bright, creative, and motivated kids were almost never bored. Lazy kids are often bored.
Lexi
June 25th, 2012
4:53 pm
Maureen: You are asserting that academic performance of blacks is below average because it was illegal to teach blacks to read in 1848? That’s 8+ generations ago. How long will that explanation last? Many immigrants come unable to read or speak english and become outstanding students in a matter of a few years. Motivation of individuals, parenting and cultural influences are stronger determinants of academic success, or lack of it.
Jarod Apperson
June 25th, 2012
5:02 pm
“She shared with me that the testing and screening items lead in favor toward one group of students, and are counteractive toward other groups of students — specifically Hispanic, ELL, and African-American students.”
I would be interested in knowing more specifics on how the testing and screening items are suspected to be biased and how this was determined. Has anything been published?
William Casey
June 25th, 2012
5:24 pm
I agree with OLDTIMER. In my experience, the truely gifted kids are almost never bored. They’re quite capable of entertaining themselves. Einstein’s famous “thought experiments” are the ultimate example. It was also my experience during 31 years in the classroom that the kids who most complained of “boredom” almost never said anything remotely interesting themselves.
Sisyphus
June 25th, 2012
5:34 pm
Come down at look at Pierce County in SE Georgia. It touts itself as the “best system in SE Georgia” where “Excellence is the standard”. This system has administrators who tell parents that teachers who’ve just begun the Gifted certification process are “just as qualified” as teachers who’ve been successfully teaching the gifted for 10 years? And in just the past month , its superintendent (who has been in the system her entire career) discovered that Pierce County had “no gifted policy” (as was reported in the local paper, The Blackshear Times).
So how has Pierce County justified accepting Gifted funds from the State all these years – and where did it go? Parents need to ask more questions, especially in the “Good ‘ol Boy (and gals)” systems.
Ditto...
June 25th, 2012
5:36 pm
…what Old Timer and William Casey said!
gifted mom
June 25th, 2012
5:42 pm
I have three gifted children, and they are all truly gifted. They were recommended for the gifted program by their teachers in either K or 2nd grade. They were admitted to the program by qualifying on three out of four criteria. Contrary to many of the earlier gifted-hater postings, the gifted testing and admittance was completely fair and unbiased.
The gifted program in our county is amazing and my children have benefitted in many ways from being in the program. The high level asssignments, the creative instruction, teh focus on indpendent responsibility in learning, the interaction with other gifted students, and the separation from the masses have made their experience in school close to (and probably better than) what I would approximate a rigorous private school to be. All three of my children made straight A’s all through school, take all honors and AP classes in high school, participate in sports and clubs, and are leaders within the community and their church. One daughter is in college at UGA and continues to make straight A’s and is on the dean’s list. Their teachers frequently take the time to tell me what a joy they are to teach and are impressed by their “giftedness”. And because I know many of tehir friends, I am aware that they are not even the smartest kids in the program, there are many kids (I agree with a previous poster that says 3% of the population) that really need this kind of education. Without the gifted program in public school, we would have chosen to put our children in private school to ensure they were appropriately challanged.
Yes, I am a mom that did all of the right things to support my children’s academic and social success. I am not sure if I “made” my kids gifted or if they were born that way and I encouraged and allowed it to flourish. Either way, as a teacher, I certainly wish more parents were like me! The gifted program works for truly gifted kids, and should not be watered down for any reason.
CTPAT
June 25th, 2012
5:48 pm
I’m not sure if it’s that mom wants little Johnny to be gifted vs. gifted education in our schools provides some of the only opportunities to do learning activities that require thought. My daughter is in Gifted. I think she’s really bright. I’m not qualified to determine if she’s gifted, although she easily met the criteria used by our county. Her program is pull-out, like the old days, but it’s in Discovery that she gets her most interesting projects that she enjoys researching and preparing for. Certainly more than the routine worksheets she brings home from her regular classroom.
MB
June 25th, 2012
5:52 pm
LEU’s should not have the flexibility to bypass the requirement that at least one of the qualifying criteria be a nationally normed test. (Grades, checklist, CRCT may be used for achievement or motivation, but none of those are nationally normed.) The ITBS (achievement) and CoGAT (ability) are nationally normed tests, so should be solid scores. The Torrance is considered to be a nationally normed assessment of creativity; HOWEVER, as someone noted above, UGA trains on the Torrance and some systems swap out their tests for scoring rather than sending them to a central location. A teacher who was trained last summer and who’s paid $3 per test is likely to not have the same accuracy (and consistency) as someone who does the scoring under controlled conditions. If there was a place to “game” the system, I would think it would be the Torrance in those circumstances. If the students were tutored on how the test worked, their scores would be higher…)
raknox
June 25th, 2012
6:02 pm
For those of you interested in reading more about elements of gifted identification and their implications, you might investigation Dr. Scott Hunsaker’s book Identification: The Theory and Practice of Identifying Students for Gifted and Talented Services.
http://www.creativelearningpress.com/identificationthetheoryandpracticeofidentifyingstudentsforgiftedandtalentededucationservices.aspx
MB
June 25th, 2012
6:02 pm
Your reader is also misinformed on the status of federal funding. The ONLY funds the federal government has invested in education of the gifted was in the form of JAVITS grants for research in the field of gifted education, and that program, never large, was hit hard by federal budget cuts. Our state is one of relatively few who has directed funding to gifted education; class sizes were waived last year. Ask your teachers how that, and the mixed ability grouping, impacted their ability to deliver the same quality units to their gifted learners!
IF YOU CARE about gifted education, you should join a local (or the state) support group for gifted education. As the state looks at changing the funding for schools (QBE replacement), you may rest assured that questions are being asked about whether gifted students need different avenues for education. If the members of those subcommittees (and legislators) don’t hear from the parents of gifted students (and some of you who benefited from the program in the past), they may very well assume, as many do, that the gifted kids “will do just fine,” no matter how their education is approached. (BTW, studies have shown that the high school drop-out rate is above average for gifted students!)
Here is the link for information on local chapters of Georgia Association for Gifted Children: http://www.gagc.org/content/page/Local-Chapters.aspx
Atlanta mommy
June 25th, 2012
6:02 pm
Our daughters have really benefitted from the Gifted Program in APS so far. For what it is worth, I know of a bunch of white, middleclass parents whose children did not get in. Many were surprised. I was too. Definitely thought a bunch of these kids would qualify. Maybe they were too young to be tested. Maybe they will get in later. Think it’s interesting that all of the kids who did not get in are the type of kids who have great, educated parents. Their parents do so many of the ‘right things’ like take them to museums and travel with them. They do enriching activities like sports and scouting, etc. They get great attention. They went to pre-school. They get great nutrition. Their parents are involved at the school. All that great stuff and they still did not get in. So for people who claim bias, which I think is fair to wonder about and that we SHOULD wonder about it, I thought it was interesting that so many who you would think would be prime candidates for the easy way in, did not actually get in. What does that all mean? Is the testing not finding the people it should? Are we trying to get the kids in too early? Are the tests kind of working the way they should? Don’t know. Wasn’t surprised that our kids got in because my husband and I were both in it and are high-achieving people. But many of the parents about whom I am speaking were in the program when they were little too and are also successful people, etc.
Gifted if by name only
June 25th, 2012
6:12 pm
Maureen, I assure you, there are students who are not “gifted” in some of the gifted classes in APS. Some schools have unnaturally high numbers of “gifted” students. Statistically, it is not probable. Furthermore, some of the students, in the regular classroom setting struggle with writing and math.
MB
June 25th, 2012
6:18 pm
Two oldies, but goodies, which succinctly explain
1) How we treat our athletically gifted differently from our academically gifted in “What Would Happen if We Ran Our Football Teams As We Do Our Classrooms” (and vice versa) http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/what_would.htm
2) How a gifted child is different in “Is it a Cheetah?” by Stephanie Tolan http://www.stephanietolan.com/is_it_a_cheetah.htm
As you read these, consider this quote: “As a society we must be able to admire ability, to support ability, to celebrate ability and to nurture ability. It must be as socially acceptable to support genius that is intellectual as it is to support genius that is athletic.” – Michael Clay Thompson
Lee
June 25th, 2012
6:48 pm
The very fact that we are having this discussion illustrates the number one reason public schools are often dismal failures. That is, they stuff students of all abilities into the same classroom for their entire Elementary school years and try to get them to the same minimal place at the same time. The Gifted programs are a vain attempt to try to segregate the high achieving students – if even for a brief time.
Even the Gifted programs are not immune to the political correctness crazies, as they demand “equal representation” for minorities.
Tell you what, segregate by ability/achievement level, provide instruction at a level and pace commensurate with each groups ability/achievement level, and watch the truly gifted blow through the curriculum.
But no, much better to sit the future valedictorian next to the future welfare queen so as to not OFFEND anybody.
———————————-
@Maureen, so the reason a black parent in 2012 does not read to their child is because of a Ga law 160 years ago??? ROFLMAO. That’s a stretch, even by AJC’s standards.
HoneyFern School
June 25th, 2012
6:57 pm
Argh. Truly gifted kids are quite frequently bored in our schools. Just because they test into a gifted class doesn’t mean the gifted teacher has a CLUE what “gifted” means. Gifted doesn’t mean more; it is truly a different way of thinking, and it has nothing to do with color or culture. GA Tech has a little helmet you can plop on your head to measure brain activity, and the brains of gifted people make connections faster and with less stops along the way (that’s the simplistic explanation, but you get the picture). The question of who gets identified as gifted is as simple as looking in a classroom: upper SES students, regardless of color but generally white or Asian. This is from both experience and research. It is simply a fact.
Gifted DOES NOT EQUAL MOTIVATED. They are not the same thing. This is why you have gifted kids who fail. Please click here for more myths about the gifted: http://nagc.org/commonmyths.aspx
NTLB @12:15, no, not every mother wants a gifted child. Gifted kids often come with hypersensitivity, and an inordinate number of them have undiagnosed AD(H)D (see info and stats here: http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/eric/faq/gt-add.html). They are often defiant and utterly unmotivated by tasks they find useless or repetitive (which is much of public school these days). Profoundly gifted kids, those with a tested IQ of over 145, are a whole other ball of wax. They have a greater capacity for thinking much earlier than the adults in their lives. Our public school systems, and most private schools, are utterly incapable of properly educating these kids. What do you do with a ten-year-old who is writing and publishing papers at the doctoral level (Gabriel See in Seattle)?
NTLB @12:15, ID criteria are set as law across the state, but if you have teachers who are not trained in identifying gifted kids, they will not recommend for testing, especially those kids who are twice-exceptional (or thrice; I had a profoundly gifted kid with Asperger’s and Tourette’s, plus a seizure disorder. I have taught several highly gifted kids with Asperger’s and a solid 40% of my gifted classes had ADD/ADHD (most undiagnosed). When I taught the gifted endorsement, it was astonishing at the level of ignorance of teachers who would not know a gifted kid if they ran over one.
Gifted programs are underfunded and seen as superfluous. Teachers are untrained and lack the time (interest? wherewithal?) to get trained. Most teacher training programs spend an hour or two of gifted kids and move on.
“Gifted” programs are watered down in GA so they receive more funding. Simplistically, a regular kid is worth 1 block of funding, but a student in a “gifted” class recieves 1.5 blocks of funding, and even more if they are ELL or also in SpEd. It behooves the school to put more kids in gifted programs (although there are rules about who counts, and not all schools are strictly aboveboard in their accounting). “Gifted” programs are thus moving towards the middle as well, and gifted kids are once again being given short shrift.
I could go on. Gifted kids are my specialty. There is a lot of misinformation on this blog (not to be confused with MissInformation @12:10, who explained very well) and in the world on who they are and what they need. It has nothing to do with color, culture, language or age. To say otherwise displays ignorance which can be remedied with a little research.
Teacher of Gifted Students
June 25th, 2012
7:01 pm
As a teacher of Gifted students in Georgia the past 10 years, I’d like to echo the information provided by “Misinformation.” The criteria for identifying “gifted” students is set by the state and all counties are required to adhere to the law. Students who are identified as “gifted” in one county are “gifted” in all counties and eligible for services. However, there is no reciprocity across state lines since many states do not have equally as rigorous criteria. (For example, in Florida when I taught there the criteria was a single measure – an IQ test.) There are four different measures evaluated to qualify for “gifted” services in Georgia: Cognitive Abilities, Achievement, Creativity and Motivation. The first three are determined using nationally norm referenced tests. In our district motivation is measured by GPA in middle/high school (while I’m not certain what scale is used in elementary school, I do know it is a norm-referenced scale). A common criticism I hear from parents is that “my child missed qualifying by one score,” this is never the case. Of the four measures, any three will qualify a child as “gifted;” it is not necessary to meet the cut-off on all four – only three.
Once a child is determined eligible for gifted services, he/she qualifies for the remainder of his/her education (except in rare circumstances where children fail to perform and are removed, but this involves parent meetings and remediation through a “plan of improvement”). Sometimes students who qualify early in their education do have problems later, and sometimes non-gifted, advanced students can out-perform some less-motivated “gifted” students. However, it is not up to the teacher to decide if a student is “gifted” or not, the State of Georgia clearly prescribes the process for identifying “gifted” students, who once identified, must be served in at least one area.
South Georgia
June 25th, 2012
7:14 pm
In our county, the gifted teacher took three months during the year to test…August, January and May. She also had every Friday without classes plus planning periods and free time during recess every day too. No one ever questioned the lack of time spent with these children.
abacus2
June 25th, 2012
7:15 pm
NTLB – I have not had a gifted class that has been less than 50% children of color in over 6 years. The testing system does work when applied properly. I am the coordinator for the gifted program at my middle school and I see to it that the testing is done fairly. I have been offered bribes by parents, threatened with lawsuits, and have coworkers who won’t speak to me because I didn’t “let” THEIR little snowflake in.
I was a gifted child and raised a gifted child, and I know for a fact that gifted children are different. They need to be with peers who can process at their level and will challenge them. It is very true that gifted children falter when in classes that require research and study because they have never been properly challenged. They don’t know how to study because they’ve never had to before.
I would like to see children placed in classes by ability. Differentiated instruction only works in the classes that are sponsored by the education companies that have a program to sell.
Sherry Neal
June 25th, 2012
7:39 pm
A few comments: 1. I’m going to disagree on the reliability of the Torrence test as administered by APS at least. The test is considered an extremely reliable measure of creativity IF administered properly. Proper administration, however, includes giving the test multiple times, a minimum of twice, and then evaluating all of the results as a group. APS relies on a single testing, so if your child is sick or having a bad day, the results may be skewed. 2. There is a problem with a system that does not test all students at some point in time. While teachers and administrators are trained to avoid subjectivity, people are subject to bias. A child who appears to be a “problem” in the classroom could be very bright but unchallenged. A quiet child may be smart but may not appear to be “motivated” to a teacher. While it is helpful that parents can nominate children for testing, not every child has a parent who will request testing when a teacher does not recommend the child for evaluation. The most fair system would test all children at some point in time. 3. There is currently no appeal process, so if your child is borderline on the admission criteria but not admitted to the gifted program, there is no process for retesting, challenging the results, or requesting an alternative assessment. Plus, your child has to wait two years to be retested.
MiltonMan
June 25th, 2012
10:14 pm
Nice job on blasting Fulton County. My child is in the gifted program in one of the best schools in this state that just happens to be in Fulton County. She studies hard every night and makes straight As.
Laurie
June 25th, 2012
10:24 pm
“I agree with OLDTIMER. In my experience, the truely gifted kids are almost never bored.”
This is such a silly, strange, and self-serving thing to say. The National Association for Gifted Children disagrees (e.g., http://nagc.org/commonmyths.aspx) … if you think they know anything about “truely” gifted kids.
I mean, just think about it. If you’re reading and doing math on the college level, and yet you’re sitting in a 6th grade class with kids being taught at a 6th grade (or lower!) level and being required to do 6th grade level worksheets 6 hours a day, day after day after day, year after year after year, you’re not possibly going to be bored?
My kids are rarely bored when they are allowed to do what they want. Within a short period of time, they’ll make projects even with very limited physical resources. But kids are for the most part not allowed such freedom in schools; they’re usually not even allowed to just read their own books when they long since mastered the content being covered.
Some kids are imaginative enough, and cognitively and emotionally capable enough of tuning out their surroundings that they are able to avoid severe boredom in schools (at least if no output, like worksheets, is required), but that comes at a cost too.
Jennifer
June 25th, 2012
11:06 pm
How does the gifted waiver included in the IE2 contract impact gifted education? One former staff member at the GaDOE was quite concerned about the waiver’s impact but I never did dig into that one. Anyone know?
love2teach
June 25th, 2012
11:12 pm
Two of the most gifted students that I have taught were both ESL. One of the students spoke Mandarin Chinese at home and the other spoke Spanish(Mexican immigrant). None of the parents spoke English. Both came from “disadvantaged” homes. Both were identified in a Cobb County school and continue to thrive.
Jumbo Mahone
June 25th, 2012
11:13 pm
Arguments like this, whether by plan or happenstance, tend to misdirect. In education and life, one size does not fit all. The child who shows an aptitude for music is no less gifted than the child who does well in math or the child with a keen sense of humor. Children without academic aptitude are left behind by two categories of mainstreaming. The ‘equality’ that should be addressed is that which results from helping individuals find something to enjoy and earn a livelihood from.
love2teach
June 25th, 2012
11:24 pm
@ abacus2. My experience is similar to yours. When I attended the GA Tech parent orientation, the Dean of Engineering pronounced most of the students “average”. We were told to EXPECT grades (low ones) that we had never seen before. This should have been the expectation from kindergarten forward. I have often wondered what kind of result schools would get if teachers taught to the highest ability in the class.
Angela
June 25th, 2012
11:35 pm
One question. Even if the criteria were uniformed across the states, counties, and systems would the rules still be followed strictly?
MOK
June 26th, 2012
12:57 am
My experience is that the Torrence is not necessarily always reliable and its own author never intended that it be used for inclusion or exclusion into gifted programs. Like these other tests, if the people administrating the tests don’t know what they are doing, the children are not likely to understand the purpose. Mr. Torrence states very clearly that the test taker must understand the purpose and objective of the Torrence to perform well. APS just started using this test this year and during the session one of the administrators walked in while the kids were testing and said to the other, “that is not the way you are supposed to do it.” That didn’t make me too confident in the results. Also, my understanding is that APS wide, the kids had low scores on the Torrence. My son, who is not a teacher-pleaser but is a highly creative type (he did win the most creative award for his class but scored low on the Torrence), will most likely never get a teacher to rate him highly on a rating scale and may never get into the APS gifted program. He is, however, what is considered profoundly gifted in terms of his IQ and has standardized reading and math Scores off the charts. He does meet the State of Georgia’s ‘Option A’ criteria but may never get into the APS program. He really does need the services but I have come to realize that the process is flawed and don’t give the school’s test much weight. In fact, I think at my son’s school, they are trying to limit the number of kids since the gifted classes are so overcrowded. One APS gifted teacher told me that she didn’t have a single child qualify at her entire school last year.
Parents know their children and should trust their instincts. It turns out that there is a very high correlation between parents suspecting giftedness in their children and actual giftedness. I know that my son is creative and if the school doesn’t want to look beyond one flawed test or teacher’s rating, I say it’s their loss. I will do what is best for him in the end.
I do believe in the value of a gifted program that is working. Both my son’s father and I were in gifted programs growing up. For me, it was instrumental in my education. On the other hand, getting into the program was not complicated and certainly didn’t involve test after test. Unfortunately, like the rest of education, bureaucracy has gotten in the way of gifted programs. The kids who may need the program the most are likely not to be the ones getting in.