New AJC investigation casts doubts on integrity of testing nationwide. Is there a whole lot of cheating going on?

Given students with low inherent ability, NOTHING short of cheating will raise scores.

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Where’s Kathy Augustine to tell us “we expect outliers every year”?

Of course the real problem, is that we are not getting outliers, we are getting OUT and OUT LIARS.

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is cheating that widespread?
hell yes. in fact, worse than the article implies.

sad part is, the cheating is just the tip of the iceberg.
harrassement, professional smears, misappropriation of money
out of control administrators …

education in this country, from K-college, is fatally broken.

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“All of the so-called Miracle Workers in the past – Rod Paige in Houston, Michelle Rhee in D. C., et. al – are phony as three dollar bills”

Dr. Trotter, I take strong objection to comparing Rhee and Paige to three dollar bills. At least when you recycle the paper from a three dollar bill, you have the potential to create something USEFUL.

And speaking of recycling, shouldn’t a certain “National Superintendent of the Year” Award be melted down by now and its materials used for a LEGITIMATE purpose, instead of giving “legitimacy” to a lie?

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“These findings are concerning,” U.S. Secretary of Education Arne Duncan said in an emailed statement after being briefed on the AJC’s analysis.

“Concerning”? This is an UNMITIGATED DISASTER.

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unmitigated disaster is being kind.
try FUBAR

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Try fubar SQUARED

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“These findings are concerning,” U.S. Secretary of Education Arne Duncan said in an emailed statement after being briefed on the AJC’s analysis.

Duncan is an idiot. Pure and simple.

After this is over will there be a single “Education Reform Star” left in the room?

It seems that every district Arne has held up as an example of exemplary leadership now has a cloud of doubt hanging over their accolades.

Any guesses on how this will shake out? I’m betting more testing, more instructional days lost, and more money wasted on standardized tests.

I’d love to see this investigation make a meaningful difference in our schools. I have my doubts, There’s too much money at stake for the ed reformers and they will not go away quietly.

It’s going to get worse…..not better.

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“Are we expecting too much of teachers instructing the toughest students?”

In a word, yes. And the reason so at the TOP of the list:

We are expecting teachers to teach these students without the AUTHORITY TO DISCIPLINE, and the AUTHORITY to hold them ACCOUNTABLE.

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This is why we need newspapers.

Good job, AJC.

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The AJC’s blockbuster investigation is the latest example of how the widespread, politically mandated misuse of standardized tests is damaging our public schools and the children they serve. Yes, cheating is very widespread — FairTest has documented confirmed cases of test score manipulation in 33 states plus the District of Columbia in just the past three academic years.

This scandal is the predictable result of over-reliance on test scores as our fact sheet “Tests, Cheating and Educational Corruption” (http://fairtest.org/sites/default/files/Cheating_Fact_Sheet_8-17-11.pdf) demonstrates. In fact, most high-stakes, standardized exam based practices violate the standards for professional assessment and, in many instances, the proper use guidelines of test-makers themselves.

At the same time, the testing obsession has neither significantly improved overall school performance nor closed persistent achievement gaps between racial groups, as demonstrated by the past decade’s National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP) results

Enhanced test security may reduce the number of reported problems, but a real solution requires a comprehensive overhaul of federal, state and local testing requirements. Politicians such as Education Secretary Arne Duncan need to stop mouthing platitudes and reexamine their own failed policies.

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I liked the days of Rick Allen, Bill Shipp, Dick Williams, et al.

Let’s not forget the recently departed Furman Bisher.

And speaking of the VOLUMES of information on the Internet:

How much from the OTHER professional organizations in Georgia, can you find, where THEY were willing to take Beverly Hall to task for what APS truly was while she was winning national accolades?

Hmm…looks like even the Internet can’t produce much on that one LOL

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From Jamie Sarrio

“Almost 180 teachers were implicated in the scandal”

Why is Sarrio using the term teachers, instead of EDUCATORS? By now isn’t OBVIOUS that the pressure to cheat emanated from ADMINISTRATORS?

It’s inaccurate characterizations such as this that allows the “it’s the unions’ fault” nonsense to be perpetrated nationwide when there ARE NO UNIONS in Georgia.

But check the comments on any blog about the APS cheating scandal and see how often John and Jane Q. Public blame “teacher unions”

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Nice going, AJC!

Now to @teacher&mon speaking of Chip Rogers and Jan Jones – and let’s not forget to include Alisha Thomas Morgan, Ed Lindsay, Ralph Long, and some others – when might the AJC do an exposé of these Georgia lawmakers’ involvement with ALEC?

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Part of the problem in education today is the persistent belief that a business model is more effective, than an education model, in effecting change in schools across the nation. Advocates for this business model believe that, if only business strategies are utilized in the education of the young, that that will insure success. They do not realize that they are trying to use gasoline to make the sailboat advance. The gasoline was meant to be used for the motorboat, not the sailboat. Educating each student, well, is a process that unfolds over time.There are no “quick fix” answers to building literacy.

When slavery was part of American society, Caucasians who taught African-Americans to read were often risking their own lives because they were breaking societal norms to do so. Illiteracy among slaves was perpetuated to keep the slaves docile. And one hundred years later, in my youth, during the Jim Crow era, I remember segregated schools in which black schools were lacking in resources and textbooks, and they were housed in substandard buildings. Black students could not go on field trips to learn concepts through direct experiences in the towns because they were not welcomed in most places – the society, itself, was segregated. Illiteracy, like slavery, had been built into American society.

And, now, we expect “quick fix” answers to generational illiteracy. If someone demanded of me that I become fluent in French within the year, I probably could rise to the occasion, but if that person demanded that I become fluent in French within a week, I would not be able to master that. Literacy is created over generations. What you discuss at home and read at home influences not only your children but your grandchildren – and their children. Literacy is generational. If your family is interested in discussing other people at home, you, too, will probably be interested in discussing the affairs of other people. If your family discusses events of the day at home, you probably will, also. And if your family is more interested in discussing ideas with you at home, you will probably want to discuss ideas with them. You may even want read more about events and ideas, on your own, because ideas will have become as real to you as the car in your driveway. Literacy is effected by historical forces, psychological forces, and family dynamics over generations. Seeing education only through the lens of a present day business model limits the depth of the educational process and using a business model, exclusively, for the education of our young will not foster the authentic long-ranged growth needed to build a truly literate nation.

Poverty is directly related to literacy and educational results. To eliminate, or even to curtail poverty, attention must, once again, be placed on improving the socio-economic conditions of the underclasses in our nation. When addressing poverty becomes a priority in America, as it was in my youth, not only will educational results be more substantial and long-lasting, but we will, also be creating kinder and wiser citizens. All citizens are inextricably interwoven and interconnected with one another. The hierarchial business model is not a good fit for the in-depth education of our young.

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@Beverly,

Yup. That Ralph Long. Ralph Long and Alisha Thomas Morgan, a tag team… kind of like good cop (Long) and bad cop (Morgan). That’s how the two play it to push charters and vouchers. So don’t let Long having gone after Beverly Hall fool you.

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“Improbable scores were twice as likely to appear in charter schools as regular schools. ”

I dare everyone to do as I just did and sent this quote to their state legislators. I wonder how much crying is being done behind the scenes as we speak. Do we dare hope that information like this will begin to unravel the system??

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@Ed Johnson, 2:12

“. . .when might the AJC do an exposé of these Georgia lawmakers’ involvement with ALEC?”

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I am still hoping that the AJC will investigate and publish the influence of ALEC on Georgia’s legislators relative to public education. One of ALEC’s goals has been to undercut traditional public schools by creating more charter schools, vouchers for private schools, homeschooling, and online learning, as well as fostering the business model approach to educating, which I discussed in my 2:16 pm post. Public education should be improved, but not dismantled, for it serves the common good.

http://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/78448237?access_key=key-a6hdjq8v38luteku97w

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@Ed Johnson: Correct you are….let’s not forget Alisha Morgan!

http://empoweredga.org/Articles/make-grade-morgan.html

Follow the money

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Another headline is the lottery @$350 million. What has all this lottery windfall been spent on? Where is the original education budget? Lets have a full audit of these 2 budgets since the lottery was initiated, and put people’s jobs on the line. You know, like we do with businesses that don’t provide the results that we paid for.

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@Mary Elizabeth,

This from the link you posted at 2:30 pm:

“ALEC exists specifically so that lobbyists and corporations can influence state legislative policies away from public view. At its meetings, held in some of the most exclusive resorts and hotels to ensure secrecy, corporate lobbyists share their wish lists of legislative proposals to be introduced at state capitols around the country. Legislators take this cookie-cutter legislation, make some changes to it, then introduce it in their own states, often without understanding the full impact of what they are proposing.”

Here’s an example:

“ALEC, the NRA, and the Killing of Travon Martin”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bill-berkowitz/alec-the-nra-and-the-murd_b_1375836.html

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“There is virtually no evidence that charter schools outperform traditional public schools”

Yet they do offer the HOPE for choice (and that if they aren’t working, it MIGHT be easier to dismantle some of the particular schools dysfunctional elements)

, but yet our legislature has spent SO much time trying to push these schools

On the other hand, if the legislature spent even a TENTH of the time they spend on charter schools promoting policy to EMPOWER teachers to hold students ACCOUNTABLE for academics and behavior…

Yet on the other hand

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@Ed Johnson, 2:58 pm

Thank you for posting an excerpt from the ALEC link that I provided at 2:30 pm. I wish to do the same for the link you provided regarding Florida’s gun laws, ALEC’s influence, and the killing of Travon Martin. Here is an excerpt from your link:
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“Less known is the relationship between the Florida ’stand your ground’ law, which may allow the killer of Trayvon Martin to walk free, and a powerful but private, behind-the-scenes organization that has channeled such bills into the legislatures of Florida and other states.

The Florida law that is drawing such sudden attention due to the death of a teenager in Sanford ‘is the template for an American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) ‘model bill’ that has been pushed in other states,’ PR Watch’s Brendan Fischer recently reported.”

==================================

Again, I urge the AJC to investigate and report upon ALEC’s influence within Georgia’s Legislature.

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While we like to cast light of optimism upon the troubles du jour, it often serves next-to-no meaningful purpose to hide from the stark, cruel realities which lurk around the corners of pending reality. Many countries; indeed, many civilizations have “had their day in the sun”, if you will…measured in years, even centuries…only to self-destruct from within; to implode. Our biggest advantage is/could be/should be the advantage of foresight.

Many of you have read my comments; many have issued comments of one ilk or another. Those comments remain intact: WE…teachers, INTERESTED parents, etc, better start thinking of assuming a more-active role in the direction of education…I believe my diction has included the term “TAKING COMMAND OF THE PROFESSION”. It has become all-too-apparent; painfully so, that government is entirely incapable of educating kids; that government, indeed, is the “wrench in the spokes” of education…ala NCLB, and the broad lists of “can’t dos and must dos” under which the education community must labor.

The two options remain, folks: keep the faith that the education ship…foundering as you read…will somehow/miracleously right itself, OR reacquire the educational values which seem to have worked quite well…THE OLE WAYS. You’ve read it before; I won’t belabor the painfully obvious.

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Imagine that government schools and the largest useless union in the nation being called to the carpet for what they are: FRAUDS!!! It goes to show that the purpose of government schools is to produce someone just smart enough to do government jobs and be good employees. What is the one thing you hear from the teachers: the same comments you get from the Obama Administration, “It was someone elses fault.” All these teachers who committed these acts are all screaming “I was forced to do it.” I haven’t heard any reports of anyone putting a gun to their heads at all these Test Changing Parties.

Face it, the Government School Teaching “Profession” is nothing more than a professional baby sitter service. If you really care for your child’s eductation, there are many private schools and state funded scholarships to help you cover tuition of the schools.

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Another aspect of the testing debate relates to whether teachers “add value” or not. Our society has some really mixed up ideas about who’s valuable. Compare professional athletes salaries to firefighters, teachers, or police. How about the salaries of the Wall Street crowd? After all, huge salaries are supposed to be an indicator of productivity, right? Are those guys really worth salaries like this?

http://www.alternet.org/world/154671/a_single_hedge-fund_hustler_makes_more_than_85%2C000_teachers%3A_why_are_our_priorities_so_messed_up/

These are the guys who are bankrolling the charter school laws in all the states.

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@teacher&mom Pearson, et al, are really going to kick up their bottom lines over the new Common Core. They will be able to streamline textbook production, align them with the required state tests, print and score the tests, and conduct the erasure analyses after the tests. The profit margins will be much better because of the unified curriculum.

I am already being hounded by the big publishers to buy their new Common Core aligned products that will help kids be prepared for the new tests. My job is to make sure students have good materials for their classes, not just test prep booklets.

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I like the comment about re-introducing vocational classes to high school students. Thats a great idea. I love how everybody wants college, college, college. People now and days use the “oh I’m more educated than you! I have my masters degree. I got news for you college and education doesn’t teach common sense. I believe thats what a lot of people lack now and days. College education seems to take away peoples common sense by teaching them to open their horizon on thinking. There fore everybody in this county over thinks and nothing ever gets done. If we kept things simple this country would be in better shape. I strongly believe universities and higher education is a huge scamming money machine. If my kids want to learn a blue collar skill or join the military I strongly support it.

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As a young teacher in an extremely urban, extremely poor neighborhood, I have to say that this is disheartening. I’ve always believed that putting students in a box is the wrong way to go about things. You cannot determine everything through standardized test scores. What should be used instead is a series of progressive classroom observations to see if students are responding positively to a teacher’s classroom methods. I also agree with the poster who said that we need to bring back technical school. Yes, every child can learn, but not everyone can learn in a classroom environment. Some students are academic, some students are more hands-on. We have to start responding to what the children need rather than what our government officials want.

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we have spent a generation or two telling people that the govt will take care of them. Now they think that’s the case. They think all they have to do is drop their kid off at the school door and in a few years, their kids will come out educated. That is hardly the case…seriously.
So then now, decades later, we’re shocked – shocked – that the govt didn’t have our best interest at heart.
The edu

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Is there a reason DeKalb is not included in the Georgia database?

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“It’s going to get worse…not better.” You have hit the little old nail squarely on its shiny little old head. When the schools abandoned reading and math for sensitivity studies, the down-hill slide began.

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mountain man, part of the problem with testing students is that many of them don’t give a damn how well/poorly they do! They blow through it, rather than giving it maximum effort. Not to say some kids don’t feel a sense of personal pride–they WANT to do well because it is a challenge, but many, many don’t give it their full effort because they know “it doesn’t count.” Even in the gateway grades (3, 5, students KNOW, because they have observed, that virtually NO ONE is retained. For example, at my school, with 3-5 graders, we don’t hold back even a half dozen kids total, out of a total of 600+. (see the AJC expose of this from a few years ago–it isn’t just my system.)

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While I don’t know for a fact if there is cheating on the tests nationwide, I wouldn’t be the least bit surprised to find out that’s the case.

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Sadly, this enlightenment (brought about by the ajc-kudos), will have come too late for many educators. The testing mania will have driven out many fine teachers before people wake up to the misinformation of this over-reliance on data.

Schools and kids will suffer for it. Bless the teachers that are able to stick with it.

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Oh lord! Trotter is in here spamming his crappy union! Figures!

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“A business model would be one in which profit is the foundation of the school’s existence, instead of public taxes. ”

Public taxes are analogous to the revenue stream in business which is not the same as profit. Employee salaries and building and transportation maintenance, etc. are the expenses. The profit – also called Return on Investment (ROI) – is student achievement.

The ROI for schools is student achievement. We invest our tax dollars, and we expect student achievement in return. That is actually a reasonable expectation of profit from the educational system.

There is much discussion about holding parents, teachers and students responsible for student achievement. However, the component we don’t hear very little about is the managers. In business, the managers (lower, mid and upper level) are ultimately held responsible for results. We have not held our “managers” in education responsible for the results. We can change the people on the manufacturing floor (teachers), and we do with high rates of teacher turnover in our low income schools, but at some point we must ascend the chain of command to hold the upper management who sets the framework responsible.

The “Charter School” movement is a crude variation of the desire to circumvent the “managers” of education. While I don’t agree that charter schools are the answer for many reasons I have elaborated in this blog, I can understand their goal of wresting power from the increasingly bureaucratic system that plagues so much of education today.

Education has been impervious to attempts to hold the decision makers (and by decision makers I don’t mean teachers) accountable for the many mistakes they have made from relaxed discipline to increasing paperwork at the classroom level to staff development conducted by individuals who have scant knowledge of and experience in the classroom and its subject matter. At some point we must hold them accountable. Businesses who do not hold their managers accountable do not stay in business for very long.

Without a significant reinvestment at the classroom level, there will be little progress for low income students.

Every student should have:
1. A clean and safe environment
2. Reasonable class sizes taught by a well compensated and competent teacher
3. Adequate access to cutting edge technology and equipment

It seems we have the money for every program and test and new idea that comes along in education, but little to fund the three components above in low income schools.

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bootney: sometimes they have no interest because, from a very age, the system shows them via the test scores just how far behind they are. By 2nd grade if not before, the kids know who ranks where in the score pile, and the kids on the bottom will give up in not too many years. I’ve been working with struggling 5th graders on Saturday mornings to help them get ready for the CRCT, and I can see how easily they get frustrated. The sad part is, many of them won’t pass- not because they don’t know how to do it, but because a pencil and paper test for several hours is just more than they can stand. They already know they struggle, and by 8th grade we will have beaten them into nothingness. They’ll believe they can’t do, so why bother to keep trying? And they work so very hard for me because they want, more than anything, for someone to tell them they’re good and smart and worth believing in. After sitting through another frustrating, long, boring test, you can see the gradual onset of worthlessness when the scores come back and, yet again, they miss the mark. These talented, wonderful children start school behind their peers and get nothing but reminders, printed out in detail, of just how deficient they are. No wonder they lose interest.

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“A whole lot of cheating going on?”

Is today Sunday, March 25, 2012?

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Maureen, has the AJC ever used the Open Records laws to request correspondence between Beverly Hall/APS officials and Arne Duncan/DOE officials?

Who knew WHAT, and WHEN did they know it?

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@Tony: I agree, many cultures in this country do not value education. As to why we pay athletes the way we do, when was the last time you saw 50,000 people show up for a school debate?

Let’s face it, many countries in this world are far supperior in education then the US. Yet, the US spends MORE per captia than any other country in the world, and we rate lower than most third world countries. Politicians and teachers say we need to spend more? Let’s spend less, reduce pay, and weed out the free loaders. When we have teachers who really care about teaching, then we can discuss increasing spending.

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“When we have teachers who really care about teaching, then we can discuss increasing spending.”

EMPOWER teachers, by giving them the AUTHORITY to hold students accountable, and you’ll be surprised at how many DO really care.

I’m guessing (though I don’t know him) that Fled cared, but when we demonstrate, REPEATEDLY that we don’t care about those who teach, they flee.

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Three problems-MONEY-there is too much money going to education. I have never seen so many greedy, self centered teachers in our system. Trips all the time, rewards, honors, new computers. All this breeds more whining. Teachers make great pay and most wouldnt qualify for a real job at that pay and benefit scale. RACE-why are all the videos by news showing just black students. We should be outraged by all of them. GOVERNMENT-need I say more.

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@Ed Johnson and others,

I am not completely certain what you mean when you speak of Ralph’s “involvement with ALEC”. I can only assume that you’re referring to Ralph’s vote in favor of public charter schools. As you well know, Ralph was the only elected official to unequivocally call for Beverly Hall’s resignation and the removal of those administrators who set an environment that forced some teachers to cheat.

It sounds like we will never agree with you on the role effective public charter schools can play in preparing our children. That’s completely fine. However, you have no right to question Ralph’s integrity or his commitment to the educational outcomes of the children in his district, a district that had at least three elementary schools among the worst of the CRCT cheating.

Ralph knows that th state and federal government must do all it can to support an environment where public schools can flourish. That environment should also include public charter schools. Clearly, we are in dire need of a national recommitment and reform to public education. That comprehensive reform is likely to take years. Parents like us need right now solutions to this crisis for their children. We do not have years to wait. For many families, that right now solution comes in the form of a public charter school.

I will never convince you, and that’s fine. But, you don’t get to question Ralph’s integrity. Period.

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I can’t find Dekalb County Schools in Georgia in the drop down menu. Was DeKalb left out for a reason?

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I wonder if the LA Times and NY Times will reconsider publishing the rankings of teachers? DId a teacher receive a poor rating because he/she had a number of students whose test scores from the previous year are inaccurate? Given the data, how confident are they about the accuracy of the rankings?

Perhaps the AJC should give them a call and ask?

Perhaps someone should compare the teacher rankings to the list of flagged schools to see if there is a correlation?

@Jordan K brings up an important point. “The testing mania will have driven out many fine teachers before people wake up to the misinformation of this over-reliance on data.”

How many good teachers have been driven out of the profession? What will it take to return sanity to the system?

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This was bound to happen when the primary goal of education was converted to the primary goal of increasing self esteem. Our educational system has been shaped by college and university professors who were a product of the 60’s and 70’s…free love, all things are equal, I’m o.k, you’re o.k…These profs have taught this crap for nearly 3 decades and our school systems across the nation are full of administrators who refused to allow teachers to hold students accountable.

As an example: Just the other day, teachers in an unnamed Georgia school were asked to send letters home to parents of students that are in danger of failing the CRCT. When the principal saw that the list accounted for nearly 20% of the school, she demanded that the teachers go back and “re-evaluate their findings” because that many students indicate that teachers aren’t doing their job. The result: less than 5% of the parents received any notification that their children weren’t performing well. The principal feels better, the parents feel better because they didn’t get a letter, and it still doesn’t change the fact that many students aren’t going to make it. Meanwhile, the teachers know the truth and they know that they will be the ones with the fingers being pointed at them when the train wreck happens later this spring.

We demand results, but won’t hold students accountable. Students fail the material but are socially promoted anyway. The next year, teachers are forced to deal with children who are not only not on grade level, but may be multiple grade levels behind…and then the administration points fingers and says teachers aren’t doing their jobs. (sigh)

It is a shame that cheating is going on. It should be grounds for dismissal if it is proven. But please remember, it is just a symptom of a far greater disaster if our educational system doesn’t start being honest about where we are.

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@ Erica Long “For many families, that right now solution comes in the form of a public charter school”

What I don’t understand is why some are so willing to jump on the bandwagon that seems to be a promise of a quick fix to our Educational System in America. I am sorry to say this Erica but the current push for Charter Schools is the new “shiny and sparkly” promise to be dangled in front of the noses of parents who are disillusioned by the education their child receive. This seems a short-sighted point of view. Even when it has been shown that, in most instances, Charter Schools do not perform better than traditional schools, in many instances are run but companies whose only motivation is making a profit, and are not held to the same levels of accountability than tradition schools (why?????). As a nation, we take the individualist approach (what is good for me and mine) rather than what is good for all. School choice is already alive and well in our society-let’s get behind our traditional school model and work on making it better.

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@sneak peek into education : “As a nation, we take the individualist approach (what is good for me and mine) rather than what is good for all.”

Here’s a news flash for you. The education model that the US Education System is built on Karl Marx’s theory. The system is designed to educate people just enough to make them good employees and government subjects.

A well educated populace is a dangerous animal for any government.

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Mom, do you have a college degree? If so, you too can teach. Why don’t you try out the cushy job of teaching middle school, with four hours of work per day, generous vacations, and great benefits?

I can assure you that it’s not as easy or cushy as it looks. And I worked in the corporate world for 15 years before I began teaching, so I do know how “both sides” work.

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The new tax package the General Assembly is passing reduces taxes on many things. How’s this going to work for education funding?

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@Mary Elizabeth: “including funding it properly.”

We spend more per capita than any other nation in the world. Our children rank last in the world among Industrialized Nations, and well below many Third World Nations in education. Funding the system IS NOT the problem.

If the system was is great, why is it that very few local politicians and NO Federal Level politicians send thier children to Government Schools?

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Amen…..reality

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Not trying to point fingers but let us be honest here, our public education system, (a contradiction in terms) started going to hell in a hand basket when Liberal controlled unions got a choke hold on it – of course the break-down of the two parent family didn’t help much either!

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@Sneak Peek,

There are many public charter schools that work. In Atlanta, we have Drew, Wesley and Kindezi all performing very well for our children. They are locally chartered public schools. In the case of Unversity Charter, a schools that was not performing well, APS did the right thing and shut them down. I’m sure you don’t intend to insult all parents by suggesting that they are only following the latest trend toward public charters. There are plenty of parents in neighborhoods across this city, who have spent years investigating their neighborhood public schools and the public charters in order to find the setting that works for their family.

You speak of an individual approach as if it’s completely a bad thing. While we should all be concerned about public education as a tool for the greater good, mothers and fathers have a Biblical duty to their own offspring. Further, there are parents at public charter schools who volunteer and invest tirelessly in the neighborhood school as well as the public charter.

Elected officials and educators have a duty to defend and support public education for the good of the community. Individual parents have an entirely different set of responsibilities.

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Reality, 9:23 am

“A well educated populace is a dangerous animal for any government.”

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One of the primary architects of our nation, Thomas Jefferson, believed that a well educated populace is a dangerous animal for the upper class elites who would attempt to control the lives of the ignorant masses, without the masses realizing it, unless the masses were well educated to see through the self-serving machinations of the upper classes who woul wish to control them. That is why Jefferson supported public education paid for by public taxes, not corporations. He wanted the masses to be aware of how they could be used by those in power, above them, and he wanted them to be able to handle their own self-government. He wanted power in the hands of the masses. That is why Jefferson supported not only the American Revolution, but the French Revolution.

I would argue that, today, if the new wealthy elite of America, i.e. the corporate world, controls (through ALEC’s statewide agenda) the education of the young and, then, afterwards “inherits” those young to become their unquestioning workforce who will help to gather profits for the top eschelons of corporations, that that is what is dangerous to individuals and to society-at-large.

Public education, as Jefferson well knew, is the antidote to keep power in the hands of the masses for their own self-government instead of in the hands of the top elite only, who will use the masses for the accruing of their own wealth and power, just as the wealthy elite of aristocratic rule tried to do in Jefferson’s era. Jefferson’s mind was far-reaching and that is why he was the primary architect, along with his friend Madison, of our nation’s tenets. Jefferson well knew that elite power, in whatever form, whether within the aristocratic rule of his day or within the corporate rule of our day, would try to take power from the masses for their own self-serving ends. Public education, he felt, must be secured so that the people would be aware of what they were and would be about, and not accept this universal human tendency to hierarchial rule. He wanted our nation to be one of self-government which embraces an egalitarian concept of human beings. So do I.

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@Sneak Peek,

How many children should be sacrificed while we wait on reform? How much longer can we afford to do the same thing over and over with the same dangerous results? For ten years, Beverly Hall was allowed to run a racket in our schools while tens of thousands of kids were disenfranchised.

You say that public charter schools are not held to standards, but that is entirely false. Public school children who attend public charter schools must pass the same standardized tests as children at their neighborhood public schools. In some instances, those children are meeting and exceeding standards.

I find it disheartening that so many people refuse to acknowledge that there are highly effective public charter schools that are performing for our children.

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@Mary Elizabeth, while you are correct on Jefferson, you are misinterpretting his views in the light of the nation as it stands today. The Government Education System has progressively gotten worse since the introduction of “The Great Society” model that was implemented by the government. This model’s foundation can be found in Karl Marx’s writtings. As is evident by your anti-corporate comments, you should be quite familiar with Marx’s writtings.

Let’s face it, this country is no more self-governed that China. When was the last time this government did something other than what the 536 Members of the Political Elite wanted?

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politicians cheat,policemancheat,lawyers cheat,mechanics cheat, ministers cheat,etc., so whats the big deal…theres no such thing as an honest person

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Reality, in Georgia, we’re also trying to “prepare everyone for college,” which is another thing other nations don’t do.

In most other nations, those with no academic aptitude or motivation are separated out somewhere around age 12-14, and sent to either a job or to vocational training.

We keep them in school, and pretend that even the 9th graders who are reading at a 2nd or 3rd grade level will somehow miraculously become “college material” in 4 years, if their teachers work hard enough.

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let’s be brutally honest about what’s going on here:

the system at the state level has two primary interests. the apperance of graduating a large number of students and fielding winning football (occasionally basketball) teams.

the system at the federal level has two primary interests. making sure on paper inner city/urban/minority kids are graduating in large numbers and making sure the populace is not educated enough to actually see what the government is up to.

fat, dumb, and beholden.

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@Erica Long “I find it disheartening that so many people refuse to acknowledge that there are highly effective public charter schools that are performing for our children.”

I acknowledge that there are highly effective public charter schools that are performing for our children. I also acknowledge that there are highly effective PUBLIC non-charter schools performing for our children. Don’t hear much about them either, do you?

What do they BOTH have in common?
- Involved, concerned parents who value education and respect teachers.
- Strong administration
-Dedicated teachers
-Community support

Why not look to the public schools that are succeeding to see what works rather than deciding the whole system is broken?

Maybe because there isn’t enough corporate profit in that.

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@ Charter Fodder: This situation in Newton County doesn’t surprise me one bit. School boards tend to think that they are above law like the Open Meetings Law. Look at the Cobb County Board of Education. A couple of years ago, this school board admitted to having 57 illegal school board meetings. The school board attorneys come from Brock and Clay. Ha!

@ Me: MACE must be doing something right. Teachers keep joining each week. MACE’s message resonates with teachers. Perhaps you can get your union to adopt MACE’s mantra: You cannot have good learning conditions until you first have good teaching conditions. Ha! Don’t let jealousy get the best of you.

http://www.teachersadvocate.com

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That would be http://www.theteachersadvocate.com. I left out the “the” in the address. Ha! Sorry.

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@DeKalbite@Mary Elizabeth, 10:36

“Public taxes are analogous to the revenue stream in business which is not the same as profit. Employee salaries and building and transportation maintenance, etc. are the expenses. The profit – also called Return on Investment (ROI) – is student achievement.”
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Again, I agree with most of your post. I think you perceive that we are in opposition in our thinking in some way. I disagree. I simply believe that public schools must be improved instead of being dismantled to serve corporate interests, and that is why I write so often of the importance of assessing individual instructional levels of students, as well as the importance of being aware of each student’s potential, as indicated on IQ tests, so that instructional growth can be maximized, realistically, within public education. However, when we try to overreach expectations of each child’s achievement in terms of insisting on unrealistic expectations that overreach each childl’s ability level, or that overreach his skill development level, at point in time, then that is a business model that is counterproductive in education. The unnecessary and unproductive tension that that business model produces by placing students and teachers on unrealistic frustration levels is, also, counter productive to maximiing academic growth.

For more information about profit motives in turning traditional public schools to public charter schools and other school choice arenas, read the following:
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“The American Dream is promised to all those who strive to pull themselves up by the bootstraps. If you want your child to get ahead, make sure that he or she is one of the lucky few to get a seat in a charter school. For the rich, charters have added benefits; they are being used to dismantle the power of teachers’ unions, and they are excellent tools for channeling tax money into the pockets of enterprising individuals. This is true even when the charter schools are run by nonprofit companies. And no matter what the rhetoric dished out for public consumption, siphoning public money into private hands is the goal, as the statement by the Montgomery Securities group quoted above shows.

According to U.S. Census data, well over $800 billion is spent on education, public and private, at all levels in the United States each year.20 This makes it roughly the same size as the U.S. trade deficit with China. The private sector wants to get its hands on this money. Along with politicians, it is determined to break the power of the teachers’ unions and to attack one of the last bastions of decently paid American workers. The budget problems resulting from the current recession will provide them cover in doing this.

And then there is corruption. Celerity, a nonprofit charter school that made an attempt to co-locate on the campus of Wadsworth Elementary in Los Angeles, contracts out all its services to a for-profit firm, Nova, run by the same owner. This backdoor model—of a nonprofit funneling dollars to a separate, for-profit entity—is common. Kent Fischer explained it in the St. Petersburg Times:

The profit motive drives business…. More and more, it’s driving Florida school reform. The vehicle: charter schools. This was not the plan. These schools were to be “incubators of innovation,” free of the rules that govern traditional districts. Local school boards would decide who gets the charters, which spell out how a school will operate and what it will teach. To keep this deal, lawmakers specified that only nonprofit groups would get charters. But six years later, profit has become pivotal…. For-profit corporations create nonprofit foundations to obtain the charters, and then hire themselves to run the schools.

Whether it’s technically legal, ‘contracting out’ or direct corruption and profiteering, abounds. In their article “The Corporate Surge Against Public Schools,” Steven Miller and Jack Gerson cite many cases of such corruption.”
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These paragraphs, above, are excerpted from the link below. I urge all readers of this blog to read this long article in full. The details of information are extensive and the writer’s (a Los Angeles teacher) style is riveting. You will not be bored, even though the article is long, and your eyes will be fully opened.

http://www.isreview.org/issues/62/feat-charterschools.shtml

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Post Script: I am not against all public charter schools; I simply do not want to see them, or other areas of school choice, used as a vehicle to dismantle traditional public schools. They should be working in harmony with traditional public schools to improve the education of students. But traditional public education must remain the mainstay, improved.

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@ScienceTeacher671, I agree. By far we are forcing kids into something they have no desire to persue. While states like Nebraska, North and Soth Dakota only offer college prep courses and the SAT only to those who wish to persue that avenue, Georgia continues to force the square peg into the round hole. In the words of Foerst Gump, “Stupid is as stupid does.”

The current government education system is too focused on the self esteem of the child. We need to stop teaching at the dumbest denominator and get back to teaching at higher levels. Let’s model the system into a Darwinism Model, keep up or be eaten.

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Beverly Fraud, 10:42

“Mary Elizabeth, is it not fair to those who ‘fund it to demand that it be SPENT properly?”

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Yes, I agree, all public schools should be held accountable that their public funds are spent properly, including the systems of DeKalb and APS. But we must not dismantle those public systems, and others. We must, instead, as taxpayers and citizens, insist upon educational improvements which are realistic and nonthreatening, as well as insist upon their giving accountability to the public for their the use of public funds.

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why are we forcing kids onto unrealistic college paths?
simple.

PR and federal dollars.

its not like we give a damn about the kids in question.

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Blacks overwhelmingly drop out of school and become prison fodder primarily because their culture does not value education and their parents either don’t care or are so overwhelmed that they cannot supply support. Not because of some “inherent inability”. There are numerous cases every year of successful blacks breaking the grip of their poverty and emerging into a better world. There are also a lot of cases of whites who follow the same route as a lot of blacks, with drug-addicted parents and poverty and drop out at sixteen. It is not a race thing, it is a poverty thing.

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I had a dream last night after reading the AJC’s excellent report on the educational system in the United States.

The President went on the airways declaring a state of emergency due to the lack of educators’ effectiveness in teaching the students (in my dreams people are translucent, so I cannot discern race, could be current or future president). Therefore, all those involved with students would be fired. This would include everyone in the school house, as well as outside of the school house from; school boards, superintendents, principals, psychologist, counselors, social workers, teachers, librarians, Para-professional, bus drivers, food service workers and anyone else of such classifications.

These incompetent people would then be replaced by educational experts. Including in that classification would be; senators, congressman, lobbyist, parents, reporters, bloggers, and any other citizen that has offered public expression of solutions to affect positive change in the current failing educational system.

This is a state of emergency; all selected citizens must comply with this order. The only exceptions would be the president, the vice- president, the Supreme Court and FEMA. FEMA would be used to ensure compliance. All schools would close at the end of May. All new “citizen educators” would come on board after Labor Day. A commuter program would randomly select each citizen’s assignment. Due to this emergency all selected would be paid a flat rate of 50,000 dollars a year. It is realized that this will be a sacrifice for most, but “war” calls for sacrifice. Your nation and the children of America need you.

Unfortunately, this was the end of my dream. I woke up smiling and relieved that the expertise of the public will straightened out the dismal mess caused by incompetent teachers and educators. Sweet dreams.

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Reality, 10:20

“Mary Elizabeth, while you are correct on Jefferson, you are misinterpretting his views in the light of the nation as it stands today.”
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I disagree with you on that. In fact, I believe that Thomas Jefferson would be quite proud for me for attempting, in spite of great financial odds against my voice and others like mine being heard, to sustain the America, that he envisioned, into the future.

Lincoln was, also, captured by Jefferson’s vision for American and Lincoln so believed in Jefferson’s vision for our nation, that he was willing to give his life that our nation would continue to be “of, by, and for” the people – as a model to the world, into perpetuity, that self-government can work.

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The system was working decently prior to the creation of Teacher’s Unions and the Federal Department of Education. The original model was that the States new what was best for the children within its borders. The local BOE’S made recommendations to the State, and the State DOE determined the best options.

Since the Federal Government took over, local BOEs serve no purpose but to hear the complaints of parents. The State DOE recieves the directives from the Federal level and puts it in action across the State. The Federal DOE could care less what you have to say as a parent. They only implement what they view to be in the best interest of keeping the populace at a level that is easy to control.

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@Erica-you ignore the fact that Charter Schools, for the most part, do not provide better learning opportunities for students-this is proven time and time again in the number of studies that show they do not perform better than their neighborhood traditional school. Of course, there are a few exceptions but these are called outliers and are never deemed to be the norm. Also, you ignore the fact about the profiteering that will happen at the hands of the businesses running these for-profit educational models; their only concern is making a buck. How many children have to be sacrificed under that model? Read what is happening in Florida now that charter school systems have been given a green light (see the link below) . Please don’t be so short-sighted in thinking that this silver bullet is going to be the answer. And, yes, charter schools are freed up from some of the bureaucracy that traditional schools face. ‘Tis a fact.

http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/Bridging-Differences/2012/03/the_lesson_of_florida_1.html

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The elephant in the room is gonna stampede soon.

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@ mountain man

true, but its not that simple. much of what we allegedly are allowed to teach is somewhere between meaningless and useless.

kids aren’t stupid. they know crap when they see it.

simple truth is we’re not usually offering an education worth making an effort for.

we need to fix our end first, so then there is no doubt the kids aren’t holding up theirs.

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@Mary Elizabeth, Jefferson was against a Centralized Government. His statement regarding an educated populace was to prevent the government from becoming centralized and powerful. He would be appualled by today’s status of the government he helped create. He would be equally appualled by the status of the education system.

One of the most misquoted and misinterpretted quotes is: “A government of the people, by the people, and for the people.” Liberal and those who believe we are a Democracy, say this quote shows that this government was founded on the principal of majority rules. The correct meaning of this quote is that this Republic is to be to run by members of the populace at large, not the political elite (of the people), those representatives are to be chosen by those members of the populace (by the people), and the representatives are to provide voice of those they represent (for the people). Jefferson’s vision was for the states be more powerful than the federal government. His vision was for the states to do what was in the best interest of it’s people, not for a centralized government to determine what it felt was best for the people at large.

Today, we have a Centralized Government (the US Department of Education) setting the standards and the guidelines for everyone to follow. The States and the local BOE’s have no voice in this matter, and all they can do is implement what the Federal Government demands of them. First thing that needs to be done is return the power of educating the citizens to the States.

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@Mary Elizabeth, check your party card. There is no DEMOCRATIC Party. It’s the DEMOCRAT Party. Also, as proven time and time again with the current administration, the DEMOCRAT Party is NOT the primary voice of the people. Check the poles.

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@bootney, I do have to sort of disagree with you on number 2 on your list….. I think there is a place for competitive athletics in school, but in the event that the jocks are receiving special treatment, they need to (as I told one of mine a couple of weeks ago in a term not as “friendly” or politically correct as I will use here) to be brought down to reality. My principal has a policy in place – if you are failing even one class, you’re benched. I had one of my football players beg me to “give” him a passing grade last semester. I refused….. I told him being benched was probably the best thing I could do for him as his teacher. He buckled down, got to work and pulled his grade up and, after 2 weeks of missed games, was allowed to participate again. This young man still comes to me and shakes my hand every time he sees me to show his appreciation for how much I really cared about him.

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“Check the poles”

Would that be the North and South Poles? Geographic or magnetic?

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@Erica, you at 8:29 am beg a frank response, so here it is.

Integrity? Have you and Ralph awareness enough to know integrity cannot substitute for wisdom? For sure, Hitler had integrity, but not wisdom as regards humanity. Similarly, although Ralph demonstrates a kind of integrity, neither of you demonstrate wisdom as regards wanting to improve public education for the sustainment of democratic ideals in service to the common good.

Do you and Ralph have wisdom enough to know you aid and abet those who, through so-called “school reform,” in general, and “public charter schools,” in particular, aim to use especially “African American” children in urban settings as objects – again, objects – of financial investment with expected returns on investment? Do you have the wisdom to see the similarity with for-profit prison systems? What difference might there be in children as financial objects and prisoners as financial objects? (Hint: no difference.)

Thus what awareness could you and Ralph possibly have of your projecting, however benignly, a callousness toward children’s humanity, short-term, and our country’s humanity, long-term? Your behaviors say you have none. However, the awareness might come, and the callousness might dissolve, if you and Ralph were to trace the origin of, say, Atlanta Public Schools’ latest charter school, The Latin Academy.

ALEC and the financial investors have been smart in pursuing what they want. To them, you, Ralph, Alisha Thomas Morgan, and similar other people of integrity without wisdom are the best proverbial frog to place in pots of comfortable water, to which to gradually apply heat, so that you will happily sit there and cook to death, without awareness but with integrity.

So, here we are, with you, Ralph, and your cohort of people of integrity without wisdom helping ALEC and financial investors to cook to death public education and, by extension, our country. What have you to gain beyond a testing-driven indoctrination of your very own children?

Now, then, do you and Ralph have the wisdom to know why “Improbable [test] scores were twice as likely to appear in charter schools as regular schools,” as the AJC’s wonderful investigation of nationwide cheating found? Please do address the question.

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@Grammar Police, I believe it would be the North.

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“The unnecessary and unproductive tension that that business model produces by placing students and teachers on unrealistic frustration levels is, also, counter productive to maximiing academic growth.”

I do not think the tension is coming from the business model as much as the globalization and interconnectivity of the business world today coupled with the threat of losing our military edge on the world stage.

Business is what generates the goods and services that we depend on to live our lives. Unfettered it will naturally overreach and place profits over people, so of course we need restraints. However business is the lifeblood of our economic system. As our lifeblood drains away to countries that provide either cheaper labor or a more educated workforce, the U.S. becomes weaker and our middle class becomes smaller.

Our military might will not remain if we lose our middle class, and that is ultimately what our nation’s greatness really rests on. Our unparalleled military might provides for the the stability of the world’s currency, protects by patents the generation of ideas that create whole new industries, and discourages takeovers of our industries located in countries around the world. No large corporation exists on its own. They must depend on a stable economic and military world if they are to be successful. Wars and economic chaos will topple even the most successful businesses.

Education is about jobs. IMO – Obama is asking the right questions. Are those jobs going to be good paying jobs with highly skilled labor (via technical schools) and mainly high tech jobs that establish whole new industries (via colleges)? We simply do not produce enough highly skilled labor (machinists, computer programmers and operators, etc.) or high tech (science, technology, engineering, and math) graduates to compete in a world that is rapidly becoming about energy (oil versus alternative) and water and who controls these two resources.

The best way to encourage deep thinkers and thoughtful citizens is to ensure as many as possible have attained not only an appropriate education but a also good paying job.

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Reality, 11:41 am

“@Mary Elizabeth, Jefferson was against a Centralized Government. His statement regarding an educated populace was to prevent the government from becoming centralized and powerful. He would be appualled [sic] by today’s status of the government he helped create. He would be equally appualled by the status of the education system.”
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You are correct that Jefferson was against a centralized government. (Jefferson was also against having the government sustain too much debt and he actually decreased the national debt by $27,000,000. when he was President.) I do not deny that fact, nor am I attempting to indicate that my thinking and Jefferson’s thinking totally overlap. That is not the case, as it is not the case in the thinking of any two human beings, but I have tried to understand the essence of Jefferson’s thought processes as I have read his words, as well as books written about him. Of course, you realize that Alexander Hamilton, in opposition to Jefferson, was in favor of a centralized government and that Hamilton had the support of George Washington on that issue. (Hamilton was also a proponent of corporate and industrial growth, of which Jefferson was not, although Jefferson, in his old age, acknowledged that corporate and industiral growth would be a growing force in America in years to come, especially after his death, so that he was willing to compromise, somewhat, with the realism of that fact. His belief in public education, however, remained consistent throughout his life.

Jefferson had an extremely erudite and fluid mind. As I said previously, he encapsulated the past, present, and future into his mind and thinking as he operated daily. In the Saul K. Padover book, “Jefferson,” I read that Jefferson thought that even the U. S. Constitution, itself, should be altered, if the people, in time to come, wished it so. Moreover, he even believed that the present U.S. Consitution should be looked upon as able to be discarded and built anew, if doing so became the will of the people, in a future period of history. He believed that the Constitution served well the will of the people of its day, but he was insightful enough to under the basic raison d’etre underlying the creation of the U. S. Consitution and he could envision a future time in which that Constitution might not be sufficient to reflect the will of the people. That meant that Jefferson’s fluid mind understood process, and especially the process of the evolution of the people’s will – in point of history. Jefferson, therefore, said that the only things that should remain immutable to alteration were the human rights of the people, themselves, and their right to their own self-government.

As I have quoted here before, Jefferson said, as engraved in the Jefferson Monument, “I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostitlity against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.” Jefferson also said, “An enlightened society needs less government than an unenlightened society.” Hence, his belief in public education.

Personally, I believe in an America that will secure reasonable social safety nets for its citizens. I believe doing that will create a more humane, less judgmental, and more secure nation. I believe, as did FDR, that every citizen has the right, through his government, to a good education, adequate healthcare, pension in his old age for social security, and the right to a decent paying job. I believe that a centralized government helps to secure these rights for the people. I believe that if, in time, the people’s will is for their government to secure these rights for every citizen, that their will should be done through their votes. And , I believe that Thomas Jefferson, although he did not believe in centralized government in his day, would support the overriding will of the people to choose whatever form they wished from their government to take which served their will, in unfolding ages in history. After all, the reason of the government should be to serve the will of the people.

If you care to read my analysis of how my thinking compares and contrasts with the thinking of Thomas Jefferson, in a little more depth, you might be interested in reading my entry on my own blog, entitled, “Egalitarianism and Capitalism.” Link, below:

http://maryelizabethsings.wordpress.com/2011/12/08/egalitarianism-and-capitalism/

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@Mary Elizabeth, Ron F., et al…Have you guys seen this recent post on Education Week, Teacher: Teacher in a Strange Land, “Not Common. Not Core, Either”? http://blogs.edweek.org/teachers/teacher_in_a_strange_land/2012/03/not_common_not_core_either.html?qs=Common+Core

This quote from Joanne Weiss (Arne Duncan’s Chief of Staff) is both revealing and appalling re:business interests in education:
“The development of common standards and shared assessments radically alters the market for innovation in curriculum development, professional development, and formative assessments. Previously, these markets operated on a state-by-state basis, and often on a district-by-district basis. But the adoption of common standards and shared assessments means that education entrepreneurs will enjoy national markets where the best products can be taken to scale.”

Yes, making money by increasing the market potential is the goal here–not what might be best for students. Appalling.

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Oh, and I left out the anti-education culture: when students think education makes you act “too white”.

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@Mary Elizabeth ” that every citizen has the right, through his government, to a good education, adequate healthcare, pension in his old age for social security, and the right to a decent paying job”

This comment is going to be off topic, but I just want to understand something. You believe everyone has a right to an education, healthcare, a pension, and a job? So you believe that everyone has a right to another person’s life?

In order for you to have a Right to an education, someone must be forced to give up a portion of their life in order to educate you.

In order for you to have a Right to healthcare, someone must be forced to give up a portion of their life to treat you.

In order for you to have a Right to a pension, someone must be forced to give up a portion of their earned income in order to support you.

In order for you to have a Right to a job, someone must be forced to give up their capital in order to give you something to do.

You know who else believed in all this? The Soviets…and where are they today?

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DeKalbite at 12:32

Again, we agree in large part, but we also disagree somewhat.

Let’s look at these remarks of yours:

“I do not think the tension (in public schools) is coming from the business model as much as the globalization and interconnectivity of the business world today coupled with the threat of losing our military edge on the world stage.”

[ I think what you are overlooking here is that there has been a concentrated and stealthy effort of conservative ideologues of the past 30 to 40 years to dismantle public education, as well as to "starve the beast of government" as they see it, in America. That movement has created undue tension within public schools by insisting upon test results - across the board - that are not realistic to the ability levels of some students. I agree that America must educate students to compete in the world of increasing technological advancement and globilization. However, business leaders who insist on rapid change in public education must realize that there will always be a wide range of achievement in public schools because the ability levels (IQs) of students will not all be the same. The top students must continue to reach their potential, and the slower ones must be nurtured to reach their potential, also, without demanding that they achieve more than is realistically possible for them to achieve, in point of time. It is that last point that is a main contributor to unrealistic and unproductive tension in public schools today.]

“Business is what generates the goods and services that we depend on to live our lives. Unfettered it will naturally overreach and place profits over people, so of course we need restraints. However business is the lifeblood of our economic system. As our lifeblood drains away to countries that provide either cheaper labor or a more educated workforce, the U.S. becomes weaker and our middle class becomes smaller.”

[I do not disagree with anything in this paragraph you wrote. I, too, believe that "business is the lifeblood of our economic system." I simply believe that business should do what it knows best, and that is to continue with business affairs, securing profits for its investors, and bringing economic viability to our nation. I believe that business simply needs to focus on its own raison d'etre in American society and stop telling educators how to run education which educators know much more about than businessmen and women (as well as legislators, for that matter). It is the height of arrogance to for businessmen and women to assume that they can run public schools better than educators.]

“Our military might will not remain if we lose our middle class, and that is ultimately what our nation’s greatness really rests on. Our unparalleled military might provides for the the stability of the world’s currency, protects by patents the generation of ideas that create whole new industries, and discourages takeovers of our industries located in countries around the world. No large corporation exists on its own. They must depend on a stable economic and military world if they are to be successful. Wars and economic chaos will topple even the most successful businesses.”

[I do not agree with paragraph in large part. Remember Eisenhower's warning to Americans to beware of the military-industrial complex. I think you could heed his words. I do not believe that the military is the answer for our future security on this planet. Nor did Jefferson.]

“Education is about jobs.IMO – Obama is asking the right questions. Are those jobs going to be good paying jobs with highly skilled labor (via technical schools) and mainly high tech jobs that establish whole new industries (via colleges)? We simply do not produce enough highly skilled labor (machinists, computer programmers and operators, etc.) or high tech (science, technology, engineering, and math) graduates to compete in a world that is rapidly becoming about energy (oil versus alternative) and water and who controls these two resources.

The best way to encourage deep thinkers and thoughtful citizens is to ensure as many as possible have attained not only an appropriate education but a also good paying job.”

[Again, I agree with all of this. I am not in contention with you. Remember I quoted from FDR's Second Bill of Rights for Americans, given in his 2nd Inaugural Address, that every American had the right to a decent paying job. That is certainly one of the most important elements of education. President Obama, and Gov. Deal, are both correctly [placing a priority on vocational and technological education. However, education is about also more than that. Education is not only about training to secure good jobs, it is also about developing higher consciousness so that people are able to reach a greater enlightenment than they had previously attained. Examples of that kind of enlightenment are the formation of this government in the 1780s, the removal of slavery as an institution, creation of child labor laws, the ending of segregation and Jim Crow, the building of a more egalitarian world in which military power does not dominate.]

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Reality, 2:06

I am not a Communist. I am a liberal Democrat.

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Brandy, 1:48

@Mary Elizabeth, Ron F., et al…Have you guys seen this recent post on Education Week, Teacher: Teacher in a Strange Land, “Not Common. Not Core, Either”? http://blogs.edweek.org/teachers/teacher_in_a_strange_land/2012/03/not_common_not_core_either.html?qs=Common+Core

. . .Yes, making money by increasing the market potential is the goal here–not what might be best for students. Appalling.”

==========================================

Brandy, thank you so much for this link and for all of this information. I find that I am presently getting a little “shopworn” from all of the blogging that I have done on this thread today, so I am going to “bow out” for the remainder of the day. But, rest assured, I will certainly read your posts and your link in full, by tomorrow, and I will respond to them, by late tomorrow.

Thank you, again, for your continuing effort to keep all readers substantively informed.

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It is a sad thing that administrators are bullying teachers to cheat on test. Yet, these teachers are still being held responsible for their actions. What about the principals, Beverly Hall, the state of Georgia education department. It is ashme the principals and administration feel the need to bully the staff to make themselves look good. However, what goes around will come back around.

There are many principals that bully their staff in DCSS. These principals do a lot of under handed things toward their staff. Allgood Elementary is a good example. This principal has taken money from the staff to cover up the underhanded spending that is going on. These principals hire their friends to come in and teach a class charge the county one price and pay the teacher another price. This is also, happening at other schools Flat Shoals. They get away with it because they use Title one funds. Title one funds are for supplemental programs for student learning. However, you don’t see any supplies for students. You spend 23,000.00 on consultants. The principal at Redan Elementary told the staff she wanted them to all wear signature blazers by which she called in her friend’s company to sell the blazers and logo. Flat Shoals principal is so low down that a dying teacher he put out of his school. He told the young lady that he needed a teacher that comes to work.
His skills as a principal and human being leave a lot to be desired.

Bullying in the public school system is alive and well. Education has truly lost it way. How and will education ever find its way back or was educating ever what education was about.

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@ mountain man: Real quick, OK? Very busy today. I’ll give you just one of my radical proposals which will surely have people howling for its barbarism, but it will work because kids are very smart and they want to be cool.

Each school system should establish a Non-learning Center (NLC). Make no pretense of sending a defiant and disruptive “student” to the NLC with him or her doing some school work. No. School work is not permitted here. It is the non-learning center. Hence, the name. The students will hate this stigma of “non-learning.” Good. This is the point.

If some kids want to play cops and robbers and cut the fool and act like learning is just not important for them or their fellow classmates, then they get a sentence to the Non-learning Center…with fully armed guards. (The fully armed guards are not so unusual because many of our large high schools currently have five or more police officers or armed security personnel with arrest powers walking the halls.) The “student” at the NLC is not permitted to talk one bit. He or she looks straight ahead at a wall in a carousel. This atmosphere has to be highly structured, rigid, and unpleasant. This will give these miscreant students some idea of what prison life is like. If a student bows up and acts the fool at the NLC, he is taken before a student tribunal to be expelled from the school system. Trust me, the great majority of these thugs will get the message and earn their opportunity to return to the regular school environment with an attitude adjustment. The word will spread about how bad the NLC is. The NLC should not be some glorified Alternative School. © MACE, March 25, 2012.

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I like Germany’s education system. The Stated collects the tax. Instead of the money going to one particular system, the parents enroll their child into whichever school system they choose. The school system then sends the information to the government. At that point, the government sends the money to that school in order to cover the cost of educating that child.

It provides school choice for the parents, giving them the freedom not only to decide where their child goes to school, but also their money. The schools in that country compete with each other for the students and the money.

The system has two advantages over the American system. The system works because it is a free market education system. Second, the parents maintain an interest in their child’s education and stay involved because they want their child to be in a particular school and will see to it that the child does what is needed to be done to stay there.

The end result, Germany ranks higher in education and the cost to educate a child is far less than it is here in the States.

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“Teachers’ union apologists and defenders of the status quo: What is it you fear about testing and parental choice? You will have every flawed argument at your continued disposal … ”

First- read carefully. There are NO teacher unions, BY LAW, in the state of Georgia. Our professional organizations are no more powerful or influential than any other lobbying organization out there. Right now, the NRA has more ifluence than we do on anything at the state level.

Second- change the system all you want, test all you want, and you’ll still get the same bell curve of results. Teaching has increasingly become nothing but “teach to the test” anyway, so you won’t have to change much. As many have posted here (if you read without judgment), parental choice is fine. I BEG parents to get involved in their children’s education. If more were, would we have the problems we have now? How many parents bother, even in affluent districts, to come to more than just Open House night performances? I’ve taught 20+ years and can count on one hand the number of parents who have come during a regular school day just to check things out. If charter schools can do it better, then bring them on and let’s see. Problem is, you can’t change the pool of kids you have to teach, their needs, or the quality of home life they have. There’s no magic cure-all, and we have to work together to figure it out.

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@mary elizabeth: It has been a financial priority (to the billions) to eliminate poverty by our government in the 60’s and SINCE the 60’s. Throwing money at the problem has not changed a thing, made it worse. Until people realize the value of an education, poverty will continue. Until people return to living like a nuclear family, it will continue. Most children from two parent homes have an advantage as they come to school. I do agree with your point that what children “see” at home, they value in life. Also, poverty in the US means TVS, cell phones, fake nails, etc. Real poverty means no home, no food. Big difference in poverty in the US vs. other countries.

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@Prof, I would be suspicious of anyone who quotes Wikipedia. It’s not a valid source of information in that anyone can make changes to any listing. The owners of the site make no effort to validate the information. If you are a professor as your screen name leads, you’d know that.

Feel free to research the information on Marx’s Communist Manifesto. The basic principal of Communism is “From each according to their ability, to each according to their need.”

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@Prof, feel free to prove me wrong on the basic principal of Communism, “from each according to their ability, to each according to their need.” In order for you to have a right to something, someone else must give something up. That’s why there is only 1 Amendment in the Constitution that applies to the People, while rest applies only to the Government. That is a discussion for another article, not this one.

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Digger

March 24th, 2012
12:02 pm

Given students with low inherent ability, NOTHING short of cheating will raise scores.

________________________________________________________

ARRRRRRRRRRRRR …!!!!!!!!

This is the ‘philosophy’ that is guiding those who are ‘driving ‘ the education system here !

.

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He added: “states, districts, schools and testing companies should have sensible safeguards in place to ensure tests accurately reflect student learning.”
Teachers and all school system staff should be REMOVED from the testing process altogether. A third party should administer the tests. No tests should be shipped to teh schools. The testers should come in with their tests while the entire staffs of all the schools are gone.
They should administer the test, leave and take the tests with them and grade them.
This will take ALL the pressure off of the teachers because there is no way they can cheat. They cannot be forced to cheat because it will be impossible.
The test should be given at the beginning of the year and at the end of the year.
The results would be pure.
Sure, it will cost money but not nearly as much as all the scandal, cheating, lawyer fees, administrative leave fees….and the horrible feeling when that seismograph measures the tsunami of cheating later.
GM

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@Ed Johnson: Thanks for defending public education!

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Reality, I’m guessing you live in the metro area. For those of us in “the other Georgia,” letting parents send their children to the school of their choice, no matter which district, wouldn’t be much of a choice in any case, unless there was a huge, expensive bus network set up to transport the students.

For instance, it’s 20 miles from my home to the nearest school. It’s not the best school, but it is a school. It’s 30-40 miles to the nearest good school.

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“For those of us in “the other Georgia,” letting parents send their children to the school of their choice, no matter which district, wouldn’t be much of a choice in any case..”

That’s why quite a few rural Republican legislators did not want to sign onto this bill.

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Another article about education & what a crappy system we have in the country.

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@AJC is NOT Credible,

What a sad commentary about our country that public education must be defended, at all. But, alas, a lesson: Ralph and Erica Long and Alisha Thomas Morgan, along with Jan Jones, Ed Lindsey and that cohort, teach one to appreciate why revolutions start.

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“The teachers really don’t want to have prove themselves worthy of their paychecks (accountability).”

Reality: If you were a teacher, you’d know that’s as far from the truth as the North Pole is from the South Pole. I’ve been doing it for over twenty years, most of those spent teaching kids labeled as “at-risk”, “remedial”, etc. I have no problem with accountability- but I do have a problem with it being tied to a test score. I have administrators, county folks, and a school improvement specialist who have all, over and over again, given me excellent ratings based on what they see going on in my classroom. I have parents who have told me I was the only teacher who ever got their child interested in learning or had anything nice to say about their child. But, my kids typically don’t do well on standardized tests. The vocabulary is difficult for them, and they can’t talk or move during the test. These are kids who need to talk and move around to show you what they know, and they do in fact know a lot. One test is in no way indicative of their learning, and their scores will always make me look bad. But I keep teaching them anyway because they need someone to keep caring and keep believing in them even if the scores don’t show their abilities. Bring on accountability- I welcome it. But be fair, be realistic, and let me show you what my kids CAN do instead of giving them a test that repeated shows what they CAN’T do. The tests are flawed, they’re unreliable, the pass rates are a moving target, they seldom test what the curriculum stresses, they go against every known good teaching technique and fair assessment technique, and they will never be a valid means of testing what kids know, period.

There are those out there who will complain about accountability, and some of them probably are scared of it. The vast majority of us are ready for it, provided it’s done fairly, accurately, and doesn’t end up creating the cheating mess we’re in now. How would you suggest we provide accountability if, as you said in your earlier reply, that we shouldn’t rely so heavily on standardized tests? As long as those god-awful things are around, the pressure will be on from too many angles to get the scores up.

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@ Reality. You take me to task for quoting Wikipedia on the political nastinesses of using “Democrat” rather than “Democratic.” There aren’t many scholarly sources on the subject…perhaps more reliable for your purposes is the Aug. 7, 2006 article in the “New Yorker” by Hendrik Herzog, “The ‘Ic’ Factor.”

First to use the term was Harold Stassen in 1940, continued by the demagogue Senator Joe McCarthy… you’re in good company.

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DeKalb’s Interim Superintendent Ramona Tyson appointed Morcease Beasley to the position of Deputy Superintendent of Teaching and Learning in charge of curriculum and instruction for DeKalb Schools. Dr. Beasley was formerly the Deputy Superintendent for Curriculum and Instruction for Port Arthur Independent School District from 2006-2009. He was hired by DeKalb because of his success in raising test scores.

The AJC report “Cheating Our Children – Suspicious test scores nationwide” shows Port Arthur as a “hot spot”:
http://www.ajc.com/news/cheating-our-children-1393866.html

The AJC report says:
“In any year, a typical (non-cheating) district might expect to have about 5% of its classes flagged for unusually high or low performance relative to their performances in the previous year. Districts which consistently have 10% or more of their classes flagged or which have an extremely high flag rate in a particular year certainly deserve further examination.”
http://www.ajc.com/news/cheating-our-children-find-1396820.html

“This database shows the number of classes in each district and the percentage of those classes that were flagged over a four-year period. A class is a group of students in the same school from one year to the next. For example, fourth grade students in 2009 and fifth grade students in 2010. A “flag” only indicates a test-score shift outside the norm. Smaller districts with fewer than 20 classes are not included.”

State TX
District name PORT ARTHUR ISD
Street address 733 5TH ST
City PORT ARTHUR
2008
Number of classes 32
Percentage of classes flagged 9.38%
2009
Number of classes 35
Percentage of classes flagged 20%
2010
Number of classes 38
Percentage of classes flagged 15.79%
2011
Number of classes 32
Percentage of classes flagged 9.38%
http://www.ajc.com/news/cheating-our-children-find-1396820.html?appSession=101934421188474&RecordID=2706&PageID=3&PrevPageID=2&cpipage=1&CPIsortType=&CPIorderBy=&cbCurrentRecordPosition=1

*For the 2008-2009 school year a greater percentage of Port Arthur classes were flagged than Atlanta Public Schools experienced

Dr. Beasley was chosen on the basis of test score improvement to be in charge of improving student achievement as measured by standardized test scores in DeKalb. While this in no way implicates Dr. Beasley with any wrongdoing, it begs the question – were the 2006 through 2009 test scores that were used to justify his appointment to the most critical decision making job for students in DeKalb valid?

While Dr. Beasley has been recently replaced by one of Dr. Atkinson appointees, he still remains with the school system as the Executive Director of Race to the TOP. His salary and compensation for the 2010-2011 school year in DeKalb was around $170,000 in salary and benefits.

These questions about test score validity need to be answered as school systems are hiring personnel to critical decision making positions that directly affect every student’s education on the basis of the job candidate’s test score record.

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What is so amazing is the NON leadership shown by USDOE when these things have cropped up in Texas, DC, Atlanta. Shouldn’t Arne and crew, with all their money and expertise, have performed this research? Sort of like the NON leadership shown by the Georgia DOE when confronted with Atlanta’s obviously doctored scores!

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Michael Hinojosa, superintendent of Cobb County Schools, was the former superintendent of the Dallas Independent School District through 2011.
“In the wide-ranging interview with the Journal, Hinojosa mentions that there is no reason why his school district should not be a top contender for the Broad Prize for Urban Education, an annual award given to urban districts who make big academic gains.

As you can recall, winning the Broad Prize was Hinojosa’s big goal while superintendent in Dallas ISD. He set a five-year timeline to do just that but the district never even made it to finalist status. We’ll see if he can capture the coveted prize in Cobb County.”
http://dallasisdblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2011/12/will-former-superintendent-hin.html

What are the odds that Dallas ISD test scores were valid?

From the AJC:
“DALLAS

Enrollment: 157,575

Eligible for free or reduced-price meals: 76 percent

AJC analysis: In 2006, 2008, 2009 and 2011, 242 classes exhibited suspicious scores; 130 would be expected. Odds: 1 in 100 billion.

History: In 2011, an investigation found that students at one elementary school were being taught only reading and math – the only subjects taught on the state tests. The students’ social studies and science grades were fabricated.”

http://www.ajc.com/news/cheating-our-children-list-1397020.html

In addition to casting doubt on the integrity of testing nationwide, this study casts doubt on the way school districts, particularly large urban school districts select their superintendents and upper level management. Selecting superintendents and the upper level management who direct student learning on the basis of bogus results is disastrous for students.

The same managers of these educational systems keep getting recycled as they go from school system to school system commanding high salaries and immense power over the educational process primarily on the basis of these test scores that have a 1 in a 100 billion chance of being without suspicion.

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The students are not being cheated out of an education by their teachers! Teachers are expected to teach or should I say,throw curriculum at these children that they are not cognitively prepared to grasp. When a concept has been introduced, children are not allowed to stay with it long enough before they move on. The schools in Georgia have been experiencing this with math. Now with the new exploded Lexile scores expected to guide the reading curriculum next year, expect big declines there next!!! If I could do it all over again, I would not be a public school teacher, nor would I ever send a child of mine to a public school!

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@Nice Deflection, Maureen, I’m not sure how the AJC pays you but I bet it’s not nearly enough to put up with the crap you get from idiots like Deflection. There is no way that anyone reading your blog today could think that you or the AJC were excusing APS. I would ban these trolls..

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Ed: Delpit offends a lot of people, but within her often curt rhetoric are some good nuggets of wisdom that I fear we’re never going to be able to apply in the Age of Testing. All we do is tell kids who are already bewildered by much of what we expect them to know when they get to school that they are below the “norm” on every test. We reinforce the mistrust that many from poverty already have of the system, and then further alienate the kids year after year by shoving more curriculum at them in an attempt to add rigor. I wonder if we’ll ever figure it out.

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Oh, c’mon! Anybody with a lick of sense could have predicted the disaster that would follow the imposition of NCLB. It was a knee-jerk reaction to a perceived problem. Just as those concerned with crime never stopped till they got the death penalty fully activated, those concerned with a lack of educational attainment decided the draconian solution was to punish the teachers and schools. Why, it simply couldn’t be one-size-fits-all Walmart schools—the larger, the better—oh, and pour the learnin’ in, teach, but make sure little Johnny qualifies for Hope. And it couldn’t possibly be class size. And it couldn’t be college education departments that turn out bottom-of-the-barrel attainers who know how to fill out forms in triplicate but couldn’t pass a test in their own subject areas.

No, it had to be those danged teachers and administrators. And lo! When those teachers and administrators turn the punishment against the punishers by fudging test scores, what outrage! How dare they!

I would laugh if the consequences of this charade were not so tragic.

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In the end, if kids are to get the most out of education, parents must value education and encourage and reinforce good study habits and good behavior overall. They must also be involved in their school, coming to conferences and letting their children know what’s expected of them.

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@ScienceTeacher671 I am proud to say I am not a resident of the Metro area. The county I live in has strived to get all of it’s schools converted to charter schools. The county allows the parents to decide which school you want to send your child to, and does provide transportation to those schools within a given radious, outside of that, you have to provide the transportation. Unfortunately the law does not allow the county to send the taxes you pay to the school of your choice.

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Reality, I’m not sure I’d worry about where my tax dollars go. I’ve been paying property taxes for longer than some of my parents have been alive, and I’m pretty sure that I still haven’t paid enough to pay for my children’s tuition for 12 years of public school each.

You, of course, could have higher taxes, fewer children, and/or a larger house (or maybe even several houses), but I think the majority of us get more than we pay for.

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Are only high % free/reduced lunch school systems targeted? It appears from the list of systems that inner city systems were the focus of this investigation. I do not have any answers and know that the current educational system has serious flaws. I retired from teaching so I have experienced the system a work. I have taught teenagers that could read at a high level in the 5th grade but could not write their name in the 8th grade. I have heard the threats from administrators, wtinessed the student’s fear of the test, heard the comments from the public and seen the “slight of hand statistics”. I now have only one question left. Is the current educational system for the child or for the politician? Maybe if we made education fun for the student we might make some progress. I once read that the definition of insanity is doing the same behaviors over and over and expecting a different result. If you have spent any time in a school you might agree that our educational system is insane.

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Teachers are not the problem, but they take all the blame and the parents and the students none of it. There is an epdemic of lazy that is permeatiing Public Education that has students caring more about the cell phones and texting their friends during class it is pathetic.Many can’t be bothered to come to school prepared with paper and pencils, they have the latest cell phone, though. Student underperforming, the parent comes in to have war with the teacher about what the teacher should be doing for their child. If there were cameras in the class room and parents could see how little they children do in school it might shock them. On the other hand, they would probably think it is still the teacher’s fault for not making not “making” their perfect child do work. If these students were on a job site they would be fired. Only Public Ed is required by law to keep the deadwood. The real world sends lazy people home so they can get on welfare. Until lazy students do some work nothing will change.

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Your comment is outrageous “Teachers are not the problem, but they take all the blame and the parents and the students none of it.”

TEACHERS changed the test scores, NOT parents and NOT the students.
Teachers lied, cheated and stole NOT the parents and NOT the students.
EVERY human being must take responsibility for their actions.
No one put a gun to the teacher’s head and force them to cheat. Teachers cheated because they wanted their bonus money or they wanted to keep their salary.
Morals and ethics in the classroom are sold out for very low prices these days.
Makes me sick.
GM

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Sandy springs parent, you wrote “There is a huge correlation between the free lunch population and the cheating. ”
No, there isn’t.
Teachers do not get free lunches. No teachers get free lunches. The teachers did the cheating, not the students.
It doesn’t matter whether the kids eat for free or not — they didn’t cheat. The teachers cheated.
The cheating has nothing to do with poverty. It has everything to do with integrity and honesty and morals.
You’ve made your point yourself. In taht area you mentioned there was poverty yet no cheating. It’s because the teachers in that area have honesty, integrity and a morally ethical code of conduct they live by.
GM

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Mom wrote: “My student is in MS and his core teachers teach exactly 4 classes a day. That is four hours more or less. The rest of the day is to plan and grade theoretically. They arrive at 8:30 – out by 4. 9 months with generous vacation all throughout. Week for Thanksgiving, two weeks for Christmas. Come on – let’s try a little harder!”

Wow. The above post is just a sampling of one of the major problems teachers face today – lack of respect for what we do, which is transferred from parent to child. I am a middle school teacher. I teach four classes a day. We have to report at 8, but most everyone is there by 7:30. I have students from 8:00-2:00. The rest of the day is my planning period which is filled up with SSTs, IEPs, conferences, various meetings and training and collaborative planning. Grading papers and entering grades requires me to either work well past 4 o’clock when I am allowed to leave or taking them home with me. In addition to these hours that I am paid for, I tutor kids before and after school, sponsor a club, stay late for more meetings, conferences, and professional learning. Yes, I only teach 36 weeks a year plus a week for preplanning and a few days post planning, but I only get paid for the days I work. It is a common misconception that teachers get paid for these breaks. We get paid for the days we work – which is then divided over 12 months. Much of the time during these breaks I am working. On average I work about 55 hours a week at school which does not count the hours put in at home grading papers and doing more planning. As I type this, I am printing lessons I worked on all weekend. So, mom, don’t judge until you know the facts.

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Your comment is just plain weird. You wrote “A simple and cost-effective way to reduce cheating is to make test results of every student public.”
Your solution is to shame the student.
The students did not cheat. The TEACHERS cheated.
If you want to bring shame on a wrong-doer, a liar, a cheat, you have to shame the one doing the cheating.
GM

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First, I hope that Digger is not a teacher. To that point, I noticed in Georgia that Screven County was not included in the report. Their sixth grade CRCT scores in Social Studies jumped 40 points last year. Red flag? No, they were smart enough to recognize that the curriculum materials made in Georgia were precisely aligned with the GPS. A teacher in Screven was excited to see their scores improve so much but was worried that the state was going to red flag them. Perhaps they should investigate Screven and determine what is going on down there…

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If I read correctly, the AJC examined 69,000 schools and found evidence of cheating in 200. Statistically, that’s zero. Shouldn’t the headline be how few schools are cheating?

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SRC: the 200 school statistic is probably a higher “skew” than you make it out to be because the schools reviewed are highly concentrated urban districts and most of the country contains small districts with small schools. I think if you delve into it — there is most likely a correlation between large class sizes and higher rates of cheating. It’s easier that way and there’s also much less focus on what any particular child is doing, academically, in any given year and much more emphasis being put on just “taming the circus” that the classrooms have become with the “new” (since the 1960s/1970s) discipline “rules” — so an interesting ’study’ would be on that issue vis a vis class size in the urban environments. E.G. DCSS is one of the top 20 largest systems and has enormous ratios (although it is only 4th biggest in Georgia).

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Dear Senior Citizen, I have a couple of serious questions for you:
Have you ever worked a real job in your life?
Have you ever been a victim of a crime?
So, let’s say your child is kidnapped. You report the kidnapping to police. The police officer says “Well, we have 69,000 kids and only 200 reported kidnappings, so statistically, we have zero kidnappings and we aren’t going to look for your child.”
HOW would you feel?
How would you feel if you worked hard at your job but you didn’t get paid. you go to the HR office to complain and they say “Well, we are a big company. We have 69,000 employees but only 200 complaints of not getting paid, so statistically, that’s zero. So we’re not going to look into the probem.”
Again, how would you feel?
GM

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When the APS story broke a few years ago I was on a return flight from Portland, OR sitting next to a gentleman who worked for one of the large testing companies. When discussing cheating he said if I thought Atlanta was the only one cheating then I was a fool. Even then the companies selling these tests were fully aware of rampant cheating. Someone should have a conversation with the testing companies as well.

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HAHAHAHAHAHA The irony just grows and grows. The science teachers have been trying to tell everyone since the GHSGTs were conceived the goals were ill-conceived due to the laws of statistics. Everyone ignored us because they couldn’t see past the end of their noses. We predicted this in the 1990’s. When everyone MUST pass a test – and EVERYONE MUST PASS THE TEST – then the test must be made unrealistically easy , e.g., (Q) What is the sum of 2 + 2? (ANS) a. 4; b. 4; c. 5; d. 4! Or, if the test accurately measures the content taught, the “cut score” must be set at the lowest IQ taught. OR THE EXAMINERS MUST CHEAT.

I’m shocked, SHOCKED to find cheating has gone on! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

The irony continues: The journalist who wrote the article is proud the ajc used statistics to PROVE the laws of statistics are valid and then used the word CLAIMED when a teacher rep did the same thing. HAHAHAHAHAHA

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All the bashing of NCLB because of cheating. What are the actual results of the students? I know that the kids I see in part-time or entry level service jobs are much better at math, speaking and dealing with customers than they were 20 or 30 years ago. You don’t have to figure out the change for the cashiers anymore.

What I see in the workplace is that the students in the lower level jobs are improving in their skills. I see that school districts are paying more attention to all children instead of just ignoring certain groups. The math they are teaching in schools is several years ahead of what we did when I was in school.

NCLB has made sure failing groups aren’t ignored. Its put accountability in the system and measurement. Obviously that measurement process has lots of flaws. But a system that doesn’t measure at all can’t be rationally improved.

NCLB has put some competition in schools. Charter schools do the same thing. What has been clearly proven about human behavior is that competition improves performance. Failure motivates. Success breeds complacency. Many in educational leadership are very hostile to competition and seem to have no grasp of how to deal with it other than cheating so that everyone feels good.

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@bu2

Anecdotal evidence is always suspect. I’ll see your’s and raise you mine. I started teaching 20 years ago. I’ve kept all my old tests, and I modify them year to year so that siblings can’t pass along their tests to “cheat.” I teach the same content, but the specific questions change. The grades for the lowest kids have gone up. Instead of making 30’s, 40’s and 50’s. They now make 70’s because the standards are so low. The middle kids now also make in the 70’s – just barely higher. The high kids??? Well… actually their test scores have stayed the same, BUT that’s because the standards -and cut scores – are so low. For a lark, I gave a test from my 1995 year covering the same material. Everybody flunked. I gave my advanced class the same test. They barely passed with 70’s.

In the 90’s I had students take my tests without calculators. Now I’m asked every day (by mid-kids) if i have a calculator for the students to use. They “forgot” to bring their’s. They then complain that my calculator is different than their’s, and they want me to teach them how to use mine. They then screw up the math because they don’t KNOW the order of operations.

All these standardized test have done is force teachers to “teach to the test.” That’s actually bad – not good. So that we HONEST teachers don’t get in trouble, we cover the basics in class over and over. Material that students were EXPECTED to do at home is now done in class because it is the TEACHER’S RESPONSIBILITY for the student’s learning. As it’s my responsibility, I make sure EVERYONE can do the basics. I have no time for the student who wants to UNDERSTAND further. Everybody has regressed to the mean. Now we’re trying to make everyone average or above average.

Oh and Senior Cirizen Kane?

The statistics the ajc used were like dropping an atom bomb on Atlanta and looking for effects by measuring the temperature change over the entire state. The statistics were of the sort that Los Vegas uses to hire guys to look for cheating. It tells them that cheating is taking place everywhere

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The Common Core Standards should be tabled until the US government can find funds to increase teacher pay. You will no longer get more for less. Public schools are a disaster, and the federal government needs to take a hands off approach. Too much involvement.

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@ Senior Citizen Kane

“If I read correctly, the AJC examined 69,000 schools and found evidence of cheating in 200. Statistically, that’s zero. Shouldn’t the headline be how few schools are cheating?”

It is 200 “districts”, not “schools”. So, it is not “200 out of 69,000″. The 69,000 figure is “schools”. So, 200 districts would be a much larger number of schools; perhaps there is a figure for the # of schools in the research.

However, I do agree that the research shows there are some school systems that are not cheating. Even if the numbers of cheating systems are small, they are unacceptable. Also, I believe this statistical analysis is looking for extreme/obvious cases of cheating. When you broaden to cheating that is more borderline, the number would be much higher.

Many of these school systems are such a mess. Children deserve much better. I am glad that I chose to home-school my child from the start.

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Addendum to my 12:12 post:

Not to mention, incorrect placement in courses, to begin with.

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Also, I agree there is TOO much emphasis on the tests and there should be more than 1 measure of success. I don’t believe my school is “teaching to the test,” but they are spending too much time on them. 5 weeks out of my child’s 3rd grade year was spent testing or preparing for tests.

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@bu2:
“I share your concerns about the 10th to 50th percentile students, but that’s not what NCLB is targeted at”

Unfortunately, that is exactly what NCLB is targeted at – NO – as in NONE left behind. Our schools, businesses, and our society, value excellence, not failure. NCLB was designed to take the kids we were leaving behind and make them successful. Actually, that can’t be done – large scale. We “save” kids one at a time. We lose most of the ones that are “behind’ – the artists, dreamers, etc. But when we save one,… that’s why we stay teaching. But we lose a lot more than we win – that’s called life…, and a test that measures a performance of a performer and blames the director for the performance is… exactly what we have now.

Now, maybe we were leaving behind children who learned at a slower rate. Maybe we were leaving behind kids who don’t have the upper-level abilities and “forbidding” them from taking harder courses, but so does business and society. I know that’s not “right,” but that’s life. NCLB tried to change that.

“…I don’t believe my school is “teaching to the test…”

and I don’t believe in gravity, but your own facts say otherwise. In your school, 15% of your child’s 3rd grade year has been spent in these worthless tests. QED. And by the way… No school currently uses the expression “teach to the test.” Our current buzz words are: “teach to the standards,” or “teach using the language of the standards.” You say potato…

And to the poster who talks about Steve Jobs going to China to get engineers because we don’t produce enough….

That’s “Apple propaganda.” Jobs when to China for the cheaper labor – period. It is common knowledge in the hardware/software fields that the USA has the best engineers, the best schools, and the best instructors – and we have plenty. Many of them are currently out of work, because they cost so much, and businesses have moved the work “off-shore.” What Pakistan, India, and China have is cheap, basic labor. The USA engineers design and the cheap Asian (and Middle eastern) labor produce. There’s a reason the rest of the world beats a door to our colleges. It’s simply because we teach better and produce better workers – we just cost a lot more than ASIA’s.

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SOG, you wrote “The Common Core Standards should be tabled until the US government can find funds to increase teacher pay. ”
Why throw such a softball?
If you really mean what you say, go on strike. What’s stopping you?
GM

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“Our schools, businesses, and our society, value excellence, not failure.”

Really? One might reasonably argue that our schools, businesses (especially), and our society value winners and losers, not excellence.

Just look at President Obama’s “Race to the Top Competition.” Yes, competition – a competition that, by design, aims to create winner states and loser states; a competition where becoming a winner state requires compliance with competition rules; a competition that puts NCLB on steroids; a competition that amounts to not only a blockade on learning how to improve public education but also amounts to a frontal assault on holding to democratic ideals in service to the common good.

Somehow we’ve come to believe winning is the same as excellence. It is not. And while our businesses keep leading us into “global competition,” the rest of the world seems in pursuit of global cooperation.

For example…
https://sites.google.com/site/globalexcellencemodels/

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Thanks AJC for your journalistic integrity. If other systems are cheating, I want them caught. However, none of this excuses any behavior by any teacher in Georgia. I stand firmly by what I have said all along: there is no excuse for cheating on standardized tests. We have all known for a very long time that NCLB’s reliance on standardized test scores is nonsense. What should have been done is fair administration of the tests and then let our legislators deal with the results. If you are teaching to the best of your ability and the kids are learning, the rest is hogwash! The only way we will ever get over this idiotic fascination with standardized test results is if people have to deal with the real results. Besides, how can people who regularly punish students for honor code violations fail to live up to basic levels of academic honesty themselves? What a bunch of hypocrites!

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sell you

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@catlady

There are many that are obviously still HS kids working as cashiers.

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@tony
“dumber” can’t be seen. Fatter and softer maybe you have a point. Weaker in emotional intelligence maybe so. “Dumber,” I don’t agree. Many of those from 30 years ago are now administrators in APS and DCSS and the DOE.

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@bu2,

Sorry for being late getting back to you. Yes, the demographics has changed. Like most of the schools in the state, when a kid proves he can’t or won’t do the work, we transfer him to an alternative school This means that the lowest level (straight F’s) isn’t here past the 11th grade and raises our test scores.

What has changed is NCLB, HOPE-caused grade inflation, 2nd (and 3rd) chance taking tests, dumbing down the curriculum, standards-based learning, learning-focused schools, etc, etc,

“On the 10th-50th percentile, my concern is not that they are failing. Its that the system is settling for adequate, not excellent.” Didn’t you read my post? Excellence for everyone is not possible! The term “bell curve” has been co-opted by sociologists who have trouble with Algebra I so I’ll use the correct term: the Normal Distribution Curve. Haven’t you read Garrison Keillor and his stories about Lake Wobegon – as in Woe-be-gone? THAT’S THE ENTIRE PROBLEM WITH NCLB AND HIGH STAKES TESTING!!! It can’t be done – average is average half above and half below. No amount of wishing won’t change that. But the politicians and society keep trying to believe three impossible things before breakfast like Alice. Now they’ve said it so much and so often that average kids who used to say they wanted to graduate high school, get a job, buy a home, get married, and raise a family, now say they want to go to college so they can make real money as if college degree grew on trees, and the conferring of a degree was a guarantee of success. That was never true, and is less true today. These kids are getting out of college and owing as much money as they will make in the next 15 – 20 years and are mad as you-know-what. And everyone of us who thought NCLB was the right way to go IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS!

I just re-read what you said, and I realized that you might have been talking about teachers letting the upper kids settle for adequate. If that’s what you meant, that’s a whole ‘nother kettle of fish.

The only way we can make the kids excel is to make sure that all kids are ability-grouped and then teach to improve each group’s skill-levels and force them to excel. We used to do that in the 40’s, 50’s and 60’s. Unfortunately, someone opened Schools of Education in which these individual Ph. D’s of Education taught open-eyed and gullible college students who wanted to be teachers that content knowledge was less important than teaching students about self-esteem and psycho-babble. When these guy die off, maybe we can fix the problems. I hope so. Some states are going back to requiring public school teachers to have a degree in their content area and don’t give a flip about the edu-babble courses. Maybe there’s hope for the future – in other states. As for Georgia, unless the legislature gets out of education and admits they screwed it up, I don’t see much hope.

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Mary Elizabeth, I’m glad to see that SQ3R is not dead. We were taught that method many long years ago. I know that my mother, who taught reading for many years (she retired a quarter-century ago) thinks it is an excellent method, and I have used it with my own students for a number of years.

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@ScienceTeacher, I, too, use SQ3R regularly.

@Mary Elizabeth, My lengthy response disappeared, so I’ll just sum up:
Thank you, I agree. What confuses and troubles me the most is this: Why the Common Core? Every single subject area’s national board or council has rigorous, well-researched, and proven standards that are available for free and materials (and lessons) that are aligned are already available. I know from experience that both the ELA standards and the visual arts standards are phenomenally written. So, why not buy into them? Because, “buying in” is what is at the heart of the issue, as Arne Duncan’s representative so elucidated.

My mother, in addition to being a certified and trained EBD and interrelated special educator, is a reading specialist. Her response to the article, others I shared with her, and the materials on EngageNY was this: “I’m not sure if it will raise test scores or not, but it sure will bore students AND teachers into hating reading.” We spent a good bit of the weekend discussing this and both felt that everything presented in this methodology flies in the face of everything we have ever been taught about literacy education–and everything we know works. She regularly uses pre-teaching in both small group special education classes and co-taught courses to much success (her small group students, on average, are mainstreamed after 1 year working with her). We both incorporate programs from Reading is Fundamental, Reading Rainbow, and Wishbone into instruction to pre-teach, review, present a different approach to a concept, or simply to engage (thank goodness for YouTube!). We both feel that cold reading as value, but it should in no way be the norm, because very little real world reading is cold reading.

Teaching in Baltimore, I was required to incorporate job applications, memos, advertisements, and other examples of “real world” reading into my lessons. Unfortunately, these materials are rarely above a 5th grade reading level, generally far below, around a 3rd grade reading level. The students enjoyed these lessons because the material was too easy–not because they were getting anything of value out of them. Is real world reading important? Yes, but it should not replace fiction which engages, challenges, and entertains.

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Oh, and did you all catch TFA’s new partnership with Imagine International charter schools? Imagine, one of the largest for-profit charter companies, is barely hanging on in terms of student performance but TFA is hanging its hat on the program’s success: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/teach-for-americas-new-partnership-with-largest-for-profit-charter-network/2012/03/13/gIQAbsfrLS_blog.html
Odd, just odd.

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@Mary Elizabeth, Just darn crazy. I dearly hope the average person starts to wake up about this issue. Did you catch that Florida parents (yes, parents!) just shut down that state’s effort to introduce a broad charter bill that would have given parents the ability to take over any public school and turn it into a charter if they had 51% of the vote. Maybe, just maybe, people are waking up.

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@Brandy, no, I hadn’t known about the Florida parents opting to go against the state’s legislative effort to introduce that bill that would have given the parents the ability to turn any public school into a charter if they had 51% of the vote. Thanks, again, for keeping this old retired, but still activist, teacher informed!

Of course, what needs to be highlighted, also, is why the Florida legislature would be submitting such a transformational bill regarding public education, anyway? Do you think that it might, just might, have some connection to ALEC. Thank God for Krugman’s voice. I surely wish the AJC would become as passionate about ALEC as they have become about cheating in schools. Of course, ALEC is more political and, thereby, more precarious for the AJC to tackle, I would imagine.

Nevertheless, we are in danger of losing our democracy to these rightwing corporate ideologues and their self-serving interests, if the 4th Estate does not reach deep into its conscience and expose what is going on. The press MUST keep our beloved democratic Republic – as designed by our Founding Fathers and sustained by Lincoln’s commitment – alive not only for present day Americans but to demonstrate to posterity that self-government is possible to sustain itself, over time!

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@To Mary Elizabeth from GM, 6:43 am

Thank you for your kind words to me, personally. As within any profession, there will be some incompetency among a few of the profession. Within the teaching profession, I have found that those teachers who are incompetent are minimal.

Those teachers who are incompetent should, first, have the opportunity for remediation. If that remediation is not effective, then they should be dismissed. However, that is for the teacher’s direct administrator to decide because administrators can best assess the whole panaroma of a given teacher’s needed skills, relative to the curriculum area that a teacher teaches. A teacher’s ability to nurture and foster growth in students is important as well as teacher’s mastery of specific skills, such as subject/verb agreement. The principal can weigh the needed balance.

However, I continue to maintain that, as a professional group, “teachers should be treated as the professionals that they are.” Poor teachers are, by far, the exception, according to my particular experiences in working with hundreds, if not thousands, of teachers over a 35 year period of time.

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@FYI, GM/Good Mother/other names is a troll. Nothing more, nothing less. He or she always comes up with some personal experience that fits every single situation, even when those personal experiences conflict. For example, many, many weeks ago he or she claimed to have children in Decatur, but then magically shifted to having children at Mary Lin, which is in APS, no? As they say at zoos: “Don’t feed the animals.”…or, in this case, “Don’t feed the trolls.”

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@ Brandy. Yes…and notice how GM always race-baits in some way? Here, it’s obviously African American Vernacular English. Other times it’s been black schools such as Coan (”turd in a punch bowl”) or Toomer (”tumor”). Loves to set intown neighborhoods against one another……..

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“Tying money to educational achievement is totally unethical in itself. Education is not business. Most teachers are there because it was a calling, not extrinsic reasons. . . .Tying money to education, not only attracts the wrong people but also creates a very unhealthy atmosphere in the field. Look at the bigger picture people.”
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I certainly agree with those statements, above. However, I do not believe that “(t)he whole system needs to be torn down.” I believe traditional public education needs to be improved from within. Public charter schools can help in this regard, if they will work with, and not in opposition to, traditional public schools. Standardized testing should be used, mainly, for diagnostic/prescriptive purposes. Standardized testing can exist in harmony with teaching students for critical thought, exploration, and creativity, if educators have the will and insight to balance both testing knowledge with a creative delivery of instruction. Those in top leadership positions must recognize the value of this balance before it can be filtered down to teachers to implement it.

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I respectfully disagree — I think the underlying motive of public education is, after having experienced it for myself and my children for over the past 3 decades, is to create a bunch of citizen willing to do what the government wants and not to be “educated” to think for themselves to the best of their ability. I stand now firmly on the side of competition in the marketplace as being what is in the best interest of our nation and our future. The current system is not working and will not produce the citizens we need for our survival as a country into the 22nd century — the paradigm of what we need as a county has changed drastically from what it was when the system of public education was created and we are a nation that is supposed to be about the free market. Let the free market have education as well for all of our children — just like it does in Europe. Our current public education system is corrupt and bust and is producing, on the whole, an uneducated mass of beings that will not be able to compete in the future and there are too many interests at work within the system to truly fix it without the open market.

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[...] is a response to the AJC review into inhabitant disparities in examination results from Robert Schaeffer, open preparation executive of FairTest: a National Center for Fair Open [...]

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