Without “affirmative action” for athletes, fewer football stars on the field
What do you call a Division I school that doesn’t lower its admission standards to admit star athletes?
Probably 0-12.
While many people condemn any consideration of race in college admissions, few complain about the routine acceptance of lower-performing student athletes admitted because of their outstanding abilities on the field rather than in the classroom.
In an investigation three years ago of admission standards for athletes, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution found that football players average 220 points lower on the SAT than their classmates — and men’s basketball players average seven points less than football players.
At the University of Georgia, the average football SAT was 949, which was 239 points behind the average for an undergraduate student at Georgia at the time. The Bulldogs’ average high school GPA was 2.77, or 45th out of 53 big-time college teams for which football GPAs were available.
The U.S. Supreme Court’s decision last week to revisit the issue of race-conscience admissions policies is sparking new discussions of admission standards and deviations.
The court last addressed race in the 2003 Grutter v. Bollinger decision. In a 5-4 vote, the court upheld the affirmative action admissions policy of the University of Michigan Law School, saying that the Constitution “does not prohibit the law school’s narrowly tailored use of race in admissions decisions to further a compelling interest in obtaining the educational benefits that flow from a diverse student body.”
In Fisher v. Texas, a far more conservative court will now take up the claim of a white student who said she lost a spot at the University of Texas Austin because of her race.
Under the “talented 10” policy, students in the top 10 percent of any Texas high school are assured admittance to any state institution of higher learning.
Abigail Fisher was not among the top 10 percent of her class, but contends that she would have merited admission in the general applicant pool had it not been for racial preferences.
“Teaching students that their skin color is what defines them should not be part of the curriculum at public universities,” said Joshua P. Thompson, of the Pacific Legal Foundation, which filed a brief urging the court to take the Fisher case.
“A policy of race-based preferences and discrimination in admissions is not just unfair, it is unconstitutional under the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment,” he said.
But are college admissions ever fair, given how many exceptions are made, including the lower bar for top athletes and the little-discussed benefits accrued to “legacy” students whose parents and grandparents attended the school or to children of a celebrity or potential donor?
Could it be that Abigail Fisher lost her spot in Austin to the daughter of a Texas legislator, the son of a country-western star or a placekicker with a 50-yard range?
In a study of legacy admissions at prestigious Duke University, researchers Nathan D. Martin and Kenneth I. Spenner found that these students trail their peers in academic credentials: “The average SAT score for legacies is about 40 points lower than students with professional degree parents, and about 12 points lower than students with other degree parents.”
An editorial earlier this month in the independent Duke student newspaper, the Chronicle, attacked legacy admissions, noting that children of alumni made up 20.4 percent of students in 2008, and 13 percent of the graduating class of 2015.
The editorial said, “Duke’s legacy admissions policy is not only unfair but unjustified. Because Duke cannot rationalize its legacy policy on the grounds of financial necessity or community enrichment, the admissions process should no longer grant any consideration whatsoever to legacy status.”
–From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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142 comments Add your comment
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
2:51 pm
@carlosgvv
I don’t know the answer, what is it?
Maureen Downey
February 24th, 2012
2:52 pm
@TW, Never mentioned black athletes. The AJC data reflect all athletes on these powerhouse teams.
DebbieDoRight
February 24th, 2012
2:58 pm
sorry about the double post — my first post was “in moderation” and I thought it might be because i put in the equals sign.
who knows why these things get held up.
Maureen Downey
February 24th, 2012
2:59 pm
@Debbie, I will take the second one down, if that’s OK.
Maureen
DebbieDoRight
February 24th, 2012
3:03 pm
Thanks!
Dacula
February 24th, 2012
3:03 pm
Flawed argument you hear everytime from liberals. There is nothing in the Constitution that says anything about legacy students or rich kids or running backs- there is however a prohibition against using race. Liberals have just tailored the Constitution to fit their needs.
Nat Turner
February 24th, 2012
3:05 pm
Good job, Maureen and Debbie. Both of you make very valid points.
sheepdawg
February 24th, 2012
3:10 pm
i hope this court decision accelerates the move to reform all big time college athletics. Ralph Nadar has the right idea, remove the athletics (and corruption) totally from academics. Athens could still have a bulldawg team but they would in no way be associated with, or bring shame and disgrace to, our state’s flagship university. And they could get paid, which is the other grossly unfair component of the big time programs and revenue dollars earned. Another law suit waiting to happen.
Frankie
February 24th, 2012
3:12 pm
@carlosgvv….lets do a study and determine how many affirmative action students actually graduate compared to the number of legacy and alumni donor students actually graduate..
CARLOS (charles) my spanish named blogger…do be fooled affirmative action extends to your latino, hispanic relatives…but you already knew that.
Accept who you are….
bootney farnsworth
February 24th, 2012
3:32 pm
odd, something which gets bandied about here regularly is the overemphasis on athletics in education.
sorta blows the premise out of the water that nobody cares.
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
3:33 pm
@dacula
“there is however a prohibition against using race”
Then please explain what the civil rights struggle was about num nuts.
bootney farnsworth
February 24th, 2012
3:34 pm
but its not like we value education in this state
Devil's Advocate
February 24th, 2012
3:40 pm
I don’t even know what stance Dacula is taking based on that comment…was that just a canned shot at liberals?
dc
February 24th, 2012
3:41 pm
letting children of rich black families into college ahead of poor white kids who are more qualified academically is ridiculous, inane, and completely inexcusable. Race preferences are abused by the upper crust of Black society, and should be completely ended, in favor of economic considerations.
dc
February 24th, 2012
3:46 pm
Maureen, would appreciate you reconsidering the US constitutionality of race or sex based admissions…it at least seems clear that discriminating based on race, sex, religion etc is unconstitutional. As someone else pointed out, some of the other “considerations” are no where in the constitution, and I think that’s pretty much what the SC has to use to determine the case.
carlosgvv
February 24th, 2012
3:49 pm
Dr. Proud Black Man – Frankie
Nobel prizes were first awarded in 1901. Since that time not ONE single Negro has ever won in Physics, Chemistry or Medicine. I guess we can blame poverty, lack of affirmative action and just plain white racism for this too? Or is it too much for you to admit these dogs just won’t hunt anymore?
Devil's Advocate
February 24th, 2012
3:54 pm
“letting children of rich white families into college ahead of poor black kids who are more qualified academically is ridiculous, inane, and completely inexcusable. Race preferences are abused by the upper crust of White society, and should be completely ended, in favor of economic considerations.”
Sounds like something that would have been said during the Civil Rights Movement and ultimately leading to AA. LOL.
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
3:57 pm
@carlosgvv
Ok and your point is…..?
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
4:02 pm
@carlosgvv
How many Noble prizes have YOU or ANY of your extended family members won? Kinda hard being left of the bell curve huh? Another example of white skin privilege people; this jethro thinks that by way of skin color he can co-opt Nobel Prize winners. What a 24 karat maroon!
the prof
February 24th, 2012
4:20 pm
Pseudo DPBM….racism goes both ways moron.
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
4:24 pm
@prov aka perv
Let jethro answer the question. You slack jawed yokels stick together don’t you.
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
4:25 pm
Meant to say the prof but Becky temporarily distracted me…;)
Brandy
February 24th, 2012
4:27 pm
@Maureen, Legacy preference in admissions has nothing to do with the quality of education provided, nor does it reflect an idealized view of what becomes of particular school’s alumnae. Rather, it is about the almighty dollar.
Alumni (not all, but often many, especially the wealthier ones) donate money to their alma maters. If that alma mater rejects their children, that money stream could very well dry up.
Again, a completely different issue from Affirmative Action.
Bernie
February 24th, 2012
4:29 pm
Without Affirmative Action on the field UGA and the State of Georgia would be soooo much poorer.
carlosgvv
February 24th, 2012
4:34 pm
Dr. Proud Black Man
I do not make up the facts of Nobel Prize winners. Trashing me is nothing more than shooting the messenger. Another thing. Are you proud of your Black heritage? If so, do you know how silly that makes you look?
Like I said before...
February 24th, 2012
4:35 pm
predomintately white schools that play at the D1 level will continue to pimp poorer black kids with low 40 yd dash times or a jump shot and dreams of NFL or NBA. in exchange for lowering admission standards schools can fill up 95,000 seat stadiums every Saturday and get alum to scratch checks. before the kickoff of the first game the football team has funded all sports on campus. now if schools could find an endless supply of white athletes with great 40 times and jump shots then they would. legacy kids are getting in because the school will look for mom or dad to scratch a check to help fund projects on campus.
@HS Teacher
February 24th, 2012
4:52 pm
You say “If a college wants to lower their standards to admit basketball players, then let them.”
Uh,,,not with my tax dollars. Most universities receive money from taxes, that’d be my taxes so, not it is not OK to discriminate. Your comment is interesting though because you were the one who says charter schools are not OK because they discriminate and they only pick the best students. So it is OK with you for colleges to discriminate (even public ones) but it’s not OK for charter schools to discriminate? Where is the consistency in your logic?
Like I said before...
February 24th, 2012
4:52 pm
carlosgvv…that fact of the lack of Nobel Peace Prizes does not diminish the contributions made by blacks in the sciences.
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
4:56 pm
@carlosgvv
No one is “shooting the messenger.” HOWEVER you are trying to set up a straw man. YOU do understand what I mean by this do you? Or are you too inbred to understand? You stated earlier that no Negro had ever won the Nobel Prize in the sciences. What YOU are trying to infer is that WE are lacking in I.Q. to receive such a prize. Fair enough BUT my question to YOU, once again, is how many Nobel Prizes have YOU or your extended brood has won? Now wipe the tobacco spittle off of your chin and answer the question Snuffy.
Sarah
February 24th, 2012
5:02 pm
I understand why a school would rather have a talented student from an underpriviliged background rather than (yet another) kid from a good school with better test scores. I understand that a school is not just admitting students but is creating an educational environment.
I don’t understand using race or national origin as decisons for admissions. This is just lazy thinking of people as groups, not as individuals.
Lee
February 24th, 2012
5:03 pm
“While many people condemn any consideration of race in college admissions, few complain about the routine acceptance of lower-performing student athletes admitted because of their outstanding abilities on the field rather than in the classroom.”
Ahhh, but Maureen, people have complained. Whenever the NCAA tries to implement minimum standards of GPA or SAT/ACT scores (Prop 48 & 16), the Pavlovian cries of “racism” erupt from racebaiters such as the NAACP, Sharpton, Jackson, historically black colleges, ad infinitum.
The end result is that big time football and basketball programs hold their noses and recruit the “5 Star” athletes with little regard to the academics. The AJC, like most politically correct news media, tucks its tail between the legs and runs at the first cry of racism.
The only real solution to this practice is to prohibit colleges from admitting the academically sub-standard student/athlete and force pro football and pro basketball to create minor leagues in each of their respective sports. That’s the main reason you do not hear about many student/athlete academic infractions with the baseball program. Major league baseball has a robust minor league program which gives the gifted athlete an alternative route to the majors.
However, when ESPN and the major networks makes billions off college sports, don’t look for change anytime soon. They like things just the way they are.
carlosgvv
February 24th, 2012
5:06 pm
Dr. Proud Man
People who look like me have been winning Nobel Prizes in Physics, Chemistry and Medicine since 1901. People who look like you have NEVER won. Now, please answer the question. Are you proud of your black heritage?
Sarah
February 24th, 2012
5:09 pm
If I spoke of black people with the same harmful, ignorant, racist stereotypes as Proud does, I would be a racist.
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
5:12 pm
@sarah
So it’s ok when carlosgvv infers that all black people are lacking in I.Q.? Btw that Dr. Proud to you.
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
5:19 pm
@carlosgvv
“People who look like me have been winning Nobel Prizes in Physics, Chemistry and Medicine since 1901.”
And a person who LOOKS LIKE ME is the most powerful man, and YOUR leader, in the world! Kind of sticks in your caw don’t it Jethro? Btw I’m very proud of my heritage. Why shouldn’t I be? Because a racist one note johnnie troll like yourself thinks I shouldn’t? Later loser…
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
5:32 pm
@carlosgvv
One last thing, just got through looking at some past Nobel Prize winners and none of them had pointed heads or stained and missing teeth. Kind of defeats your argument huh?
td
February 24th, 2012
5:39 pm
Maureen Downey
February 24th, 2012
2:43 pm
You said it correctly that most people object to a preference or set a side set up based solely on race. A football player, basketball player, baseball player, swimmer or other athlete requires just as much ability as being a Rhodes scholar. Matter of fact the skill set required to become an elite athlete markets the same type salaries as a CEO of a major corporation. Our university systems prime responsibility is to give our young people the skills necessary to become the next generation of leaders in all fields be it business, music, art, law, politics or academia. Are you to refuse to advance the skill sets and not prepare athletes?
Nat Turner
February 24th, 2012
5:40 pm
But Lee, you keep failing to mention what Maureen has pointed out more than once. It is not just the black athletes that are inferior, it is across the board. But don’t let facts stand in your way. Keep on assuming that the white players on the team are also academic scholars.
Good job, Dr. Proud. It is sad that people like carlosgov have that mindset. I guess that winning a Nobel Prize in Economics isn’t worth jack. I guess carlosgov should let his fellow economists know that economics is the field that idiots and people with inferior I.Q.s and intellect go into.
carlosgvv
February 24th, 2012
5:42 pm
Dr. Proud Man
Think about this
1. Every human being on this planet has a heritage.
2. No one heritage is any better or worse than any other heritage.
3. Your being “very proud” of your heritage suggests you think a black heritage is better than any other. And you call me a racist?
4. On the other hand, if you agree no one heritage is any better or worse than any other, it makes you look foolish to be proud of yours. That’s like saying you are very proud to be a human.
I never said I or anyone in my family ever won the Nobel Prize. I also voted for Obama and will vote for him again. I never infered all black people are lacking in IQ. Are you really a doctor? If so, I hope you are not on who treats people. Your posts here show a serious lack of intelligence, education and maturity.
Negatory to the Lowest Common Denominator
February 24th, 2012
5:48 pm
Considering how few college football and basketball players make it in the nfl or nba, I see no reason to waste a classroom space on one if their SAT score is more that 15% below the school average. Most do not graduate or play professional sports, so where is the value added to society by their attending college? Let the nba and nfl run their own farm systems, at their own expense.
Reading, wRiting, aRithmatic
February 24th, 2012
5:52 pm
Can you say DEXTER MANLEY?
Talk about a sad story…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dexter_Manley
Dr. Proud Black Man
February 24th, 2012
5:53 pm
@carlosgvv
“Your being “very proud” of your heritage suggests you think a black heritage is better than any other.”
“suggests?”
Only to a racist loser like yourself.
“Your posts here show a serious lack of intelligence, education and maturity.”
For your examination, one of your earlier posts:
“People who look like me have been winning Nobel Prizes in Physics, Chemistry and Medicine since 1901. People who look like you have NEVER won.”
Wow! Lot of critical thinking went into that screed didn’t it? Look I’m done grading papers and planning, it’s time to head home. Later Snuffy…
Georgia , The "New Mississippi"
February 24th, 2012
5:56 pm
Without “affirmative action “Coach Mark Richt’s salary would not be $5,000,000 dollars a year…. The football revenues average $ 30,000, 0000 dollars a year. President Michael Adams makes $ 700, 000.
You guys should go sit in the corner and suck your thumbs.
td
February 24th, 2012
6:05 pm
Negatory to the Lowest Common Denominator
February 24th, 2012
5:48 pm
Seeing how few students every make it to corporate leadership positions with degrees in English, sociology, music, art and PE then when should we prepare them for such unproductive careers?
Nat Turner
February 24th, 2012
6:20 pm
Seeing how few students every make it to corporate leadership positions with degrees in English, sociology, music, art and PE then when should we prepare them for such unproductive careers?
Each of these degrees can be used in a variety of fields. English majors are needed for law school, entry-level positions (don’t you want somebody that can write really well working in your company), publishing, editing, etc. Sociology degrees:
Criminal Justice- In corrections, rehabilitation, law enforcement, the justice system, parole system.
Business and Industry- Advertising, Consumer and Market Research, Management of Non-profit organizations, Human Resources, Training and Human Development, Leadership Training.
Research and Planning- Governmental and regional planning departments, research firms, evaluation research, public opinion research.
Agencies-Social Services, Mental Health Services, Adoption, Child Care, Youth Services, Developmental Disability Services.
Government- Social Science Analysis, Census Bureau and other federal agencies, Administration, Policy Analysis, Personnel, Homeland Security.
Education- Public and Private Schools, Colleges and Universities, Administration, Alumni Relations, Placement Offices, Educational Research.
Advocacy- Environmental, Child Welfare, National Policies, Victims Rights, Labor Rights, Community Organization.
Communications- Technical Writing, Newspaper and Magazine Reporting, Public Relations.
P.E. careers:
Career Examples
• Chiropractor
• Physical Therapist
• Occupational Therapist
• Athletic Trainer
• Physical Education Teacher
• Fitness Specialist–Personal Trainer, Fitness Director
• Recreation Worker
• Dance Medicine and Science
• Geriatric Fitness Specialist
• Gerontology
• Careers in Gerontology
• Athletic Coach
• Dance Educator
• Exercise Science / Sports Medicine
• Sports Management
• Sports Medicine
• Health Educator
Art degrees
• Architect
• Archivist
• Art Appraiser
• Art Therapist
• Cartographer
• Computer Animator
• Critic
• Curator
• Designer
• Educator • Fashion Illustrator
• Florist
• Graphic Designer
• Interior Decorator
• Jeweler
• Painter
• Photojournalist
• Sculptor
• Sign Painter
Nat Turner
February 24th, 2012
6:21 pm
Don’t downplay those degrees. So try again.
Like I said before...
February 24th, 2012
6:21 pm
carlosgvv…there is alot ot be proud about black history. starting with the fact that man originated in Africa. there are many contributions made by blacks in this country. despite what you’ve been told and sold by government schools. take the time to enlighten your mind and look up some of the contributions.
td
February 24th, 2012
6:24 pm
Nat Turner
February 24th, 2012
6:20 pm
I was not down playing any degree but the previous poster made an absurd statement that since most college athletes do not make it to the pros then we should do away with college athletics, so I was making an equally absurd statement in the use of sarcasm.
Hillbilly D
February 24th, 2012
6:25 pm
Are colleges and universities there for academics or sports?
They’re a business and guess which one brings in the big $$$$?
Truth Today
February 24th, 2012
6:49 pm
Well, I find myself compelled to respond to this topic as I read the many posts that appear to be superficial and without depthful analysis. First, it seems that many do not clearly understand why such imperfect affirmative action policies are needed in the first place as it pertains to college admissions. Our school districts are unequal in many respects to quality teachers, instructional resources, school readiness, parental involvement, course rigor, school leadership, district leadership, and economic power. The lack of equal distribution of these impacts on educational levels will only reinforce educational access for those students who are the most fortunate or lucky to be born in ideal or less unfavorable circumstances. The United States and her citizens who have not advocated for equal educational environments and funding have created the need for affirmative action by de facto. Consequently, the nation finds itself trying to manipulate outcomes by social, gender, and racial gerrymandering. Secondly, until the nation has the cuts to create a national standard for college admissions and then work to ensure that ALL children are provided equal and fair opportunities to meet those national college admission standards, then the United States only will continue its tradition of debate of complicated without appropriating a solution that could potentially launch it towards a more perfect union. Lastly, the use of race, legacy, gender, may be warranted until the nation has a more just and equitable approach to achieving improved secondary achievement outcomes that will result in a decreased use of race, legacy, or gender for determining admissions to post-secondary institutions. This nation is great in debate and scapegoating as it pertains to racial, gender, or social issues, but it lacks the fortitude and possibly the will to make fundamental changes that would be in the best interest of all and not just the powerful or educated. May we move with all celerity toward a more perfect union wherein race, gender, economic status, and legacy are not factors in decisions that may determine the future of the nation and the world.