A second grader draws one person shooting another and labels them “me” and “you.” Cause for concern?
UPDATE: Folks, I closed comments on this at 10 p.m. Friday. Have a great holiday weekend. Maureen
A former-teacher-turned-advocate has been talking to me about an incident involving his second grader and a classmate. The classmate had handed his child a drawing of one figure shooting another. The boy labeled the shooter “me” and the victim “you.” In the primitive sketch, both the stick figure shooter and the victim are smiling.
Upset by the possible implications of the sketch, the former educator and his wife went to the school but were unhappy with how their concerns were addressed.
Here is a description he wrote about the entire experience. What do you think?
I am a former educator and most recently represented educators on various issues. One would be hard pressed to find a parent more understanding of the demands facing educators today. Schools often talk about their desire to have parental involvement in the education process. This has been the retort anytime challenges present themselves in the school system – “We need more parental involvement, more parents who care.”
So when parents seek open lines of communication and have questions about the learning environment of their child, one would expect the school to welcome collaboration rather than a seemingly ritualistic dance around the issue. My family recently experienced “the dance” from one of Georgia’s premier school systems at an award-winning school when our child was given a picture drawn by a second-grade classmate of a person shooting someone. Most disturbing were the captions; the artist labeled the shooter “me” and the victim “you.”
When our child told us about the picture, we were appalled that school officials had not contacted us immediately. Without knowing the severity of the threat, the school could have demonstrated some care and concern, if its administrators had been proactive, and at least informed us. Nothing.
We went to the school the next morning to inquire about the situation and were told that the administration was going to contact my family “after an investigation was complete.” We were told that the administration was going to ask the school resource officer to look at it and make a determination. To the school’s credit, they later involved the school counselor and the school psychologist.
When speaking with a direct report to the superintendent of the school system about why school psychologists were not automatically involved, we were told, “School psychologists can just say whatever you want them to say; you can pay them to say anything.” I have tremendous respect for school psychologists and was gravely disappointed to hear this from a central office official.
The investigation was deemed complete after two days, and the conclusion was that our child was not in any danger. We asked for the other child to be placed in another class. That was denied immediately. We are still struggling with questions.
–Why was this given to our child? We were told that this child had an entire notebook of pictures.
– Our child has never considered this classmate a friend. When we shared this info with the school along with the fact that our child had not had good interactions with this child, it did not change their perspective.
–Who are the people labeled “me” and “you?”
–Did they find this picture developmentally appropriate for a second grader?
– We were told the school determined that our child is not in any danger. What made them sure of this?
The school psychologist admitted that she was not given all of the information and indicated that the picture was concerning. When we met with the principal, she ended our meeting by saying, “I don’t think there is anything left to discuss.” She did not ask if our child felt safe or if we still had concerns.
When we asked to meet with the other parents so that we could figure this out, we were told that the school does not facilitate parental meetings. If our child had given this drawing to anyone, my wife and I would be crawling over each other to apologize to the family of the other child.
Neither the school nor the system did anything to make sure that our child or my wife and I were comfortable with how the situation was addressed. They were more concerned with protecting the rights of the child who gave the picture to my son.
–From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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281 comments Add your comment
HRPufnstuf
December 29th, 2011
8:52 am
Dang! Don’t know how I made it through elementary school, what with playing cowboys and indians as a child. Guess I should have been yanked out, psychoanalyzed, re-educated, chastised, and punished severely. Then placed in a reform school. Whew! Got away with it!
AGD
December 29th, 2011
8:55 am
What a bunch of pansies we’ve become. No wonder “educators” can’t handle their classes any more, they’re the biggest wimps of all. My school friends and I regularly joked about shooting each other–or more often than that, our teachers, and the last time I checked, none of us wound up as serial killers. I bet everybody reading this sang, “Glory glory hallelujah, teacher hit me with a ruler. Shot her out the door with a Magnum .44, and she ain’t my teacher any more!” when they were in single-digit grades.
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
8:58 am
Beverly: Who looks at a drawing from a 7 yr old and sees “threat”?
When it’s a gun shooting someone, and the shooter and the victim are labeled, it’s probably NOT a Christmas card.
A 7 year old from a NORMAL home, might very well engage in doodling. But this is PUBLIC school, where they let children from VIOLENT, DYSFUNCTIONAL families in the school door everyday.
As such, there is ZERO excuse as to why the school can’t say (at least in GENERAL TERMS) what constitutes a threat, and what doesn’t.
Then, the parent can make an INFORMED decision as to the school’s thought process on the matter.
I see… a drawing from a 7 yr old. Again, show probable cause that a crime has been committed…
northatlantateacher
December 29th, 2011
9:01 am
The school did not ignore this by any means. In fact, it seems like they did quite a lot of investigating – the most you’re going to get from a government educational agency, anyway. This parent seems to miss the point that a stick drawing does not equal murderous intent…even if it might look that way on first glance.
What more does this parent want? As a mom I might ask for my child to be moved to another class, maybe.
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:01 am
I see… a drawing from a 7 yr old. Again, show probable cause that a crime has been committed…
Sorry but that’s a RED HERRING. You don’t need to show probable cause to explain what CRITERIA you use to make sure the safety of children is reasonably assured. And you CAN do that in general terms WITHOUT violating confidentiality.
Jeff
December 29th, 2011
9:01 am
Beverly: Prove that this kid was from a “VIOLENT, DYSFUNCTIONAL famil[y]“. Oh wait… you still haven’t shown probable cause to question anyone…
Sk8ing Momma
December 29th, 2011
9:01 am
If the parents’ feathers are still ruffled after the school’s unsatisfactory response why can’t they:
Go straight to the other boy’s parents to discuss the matter? Perhaps they can call or send a note home if they don’t have a phone #. Ideally, they should talk to the other boy (with his parents’ permission and in their presence) to get their questions answered about the drawing. IMO, going to the source is always best.
IMO, there just aren’t enough facts for others to opine on matter. Yes, it could be absolutely nothing to lose sleep over. Yes, it could be something to be concerned about for myriad reasons. One just doesn’t know.
Sk8ing Momma <—– Who allows her kids to play w/ toy guns (including air soft, Nerf etc.)
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:03 am
What more does this parent want? As a mom I might ask for my child to be moved to another class, maybe.
Well for those who want the parent to be “proactive” one thing the parent could do is sit in on the class. There is certainly NO legitimate reason the parent cannot observe her child’s class is there?
anonymous
December 29th, 2011
9:05 am
In today’s world, things like this cannot be tolerated.
Sorry, but even 2nd graders must be taught NOT to do this.
That’s the way it is.
Don’t blame those parents for trying to protect their “precious snowflake.”
Everything and everyone must be held to much higher standards of conduct in our schools today.
DAY 1 Lesson 1 in EVERY CLASS IN EVERY GRADE:
“Kids, while at school, never, EVER draw figures of you or anybody else shooting another person. Not even as a joke. Everybody understand?”
Now, let’s all sing Ponchanella.’”
LibertyBell
December 29th, 2011
9:05 am
Beverly
You missed my point-
If the system is not doing whatever you deem is in your child’s best interests, then you as a parent need to take the steps and make the sacrifices to get your child out of the system.
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:07 am
Beverly: Prove that this kid was from a “VIOLENT, DYSFUNCTIONAL famil[y]“. Oh wait… you still haven’t shown probable cause to question anyone…
Another RED HERRING Jeff. The parent wants to know, based on an incident that bothered the child enough to tell the parent, what is the school’s CRITERIA to assess a potentially violent child?
Now if this is not a LEGITIMATE question then complete this sentence: We, as a school, do not have ANY obligation to explain how we assure YOUR child’s safety because______________
Because what? Because schools have been so honest and forthright in the past when it comes to school violence?
Ronin
December 29th, 2011
9:07 am
Drew @ 7:25, you are correct. Homeschooler @ 7:17, good points. You are wise to take the time to educate your child. It is time well spent. Two days is more than enough time to investigate the “threat” of a stick figure drawing incident. It amazes me that our Republic has lasted this long when we have become such a nation of whiners. I guess that they would have sent the seven year old to detention and called the police if he had used his thumb and finger and went “bang, bang” while pointing at the other child. They are definitely “helicopter” parents.
catlady
December 29th, 2011
9:10 am
I have a mixed reaction to this. First, as a teacher, I have seen so many times that kids drew pictures like this over the last 40 years, and I was rarely worried about it.
However, these are different times. Guns seem to be more casually handled by some in society now, as a cure-all for problems. It was suggested in this picture that the “victim” did not have a gun in the drawing. THAT would concern me. Little boys drawing “playing” would arm both. Was the child being “shot” falling down, dying, or standing there? (That the victim was smiling does not make me feel better– he could have been unaware of the danger.) As a teacher, when I saw this, I would ask the drawer to tell me the story. I would also know, as his teacher, something about the child and his homelife. However, I would still take it to administration.
As a parent, nowadays, and living where I do (heavily gun-toting area) I would have concern over this, and would probably expect my child to be moved to another class. If the school had had previous violence from the child, I would expect him to be moved, but I doubt the school would admit it.
Some of you who advocate ignoring this have NO IDEA what the school sees on a daily basis. It isn’t 1955 any more.
Homeschooler
December 29th, 2011
9:10 am
I agree with “Teacher”. The parents were likely given an explanation but didn’t like what they heard. I’m sure they were not happy with. “Kids tend to draw and act out things that we think are violent but there is no harm…Johnny has no behavior problems and has never threatened your child or any other child verbally or otherwise. We simply were not concerned”. No, they want school officers, psychologists etc.. involved and the kid moved out of the class. I guess they would have been happy if he was transported to Scottish Rite and had a full mental health assessment or handcuffed and taken to be interviewed by the county police department. I agree that the school should openly address the parents concerns but they probably did blow them off a bit b/c the parents were overreacting.
No one hates the school system more than I do but, typically they are the ones who are over reacting which is why I think they were certain that there was no threat in this situation.
Good Mother
December 29th, 2011
9:11 am
I know for certain boys do play gun fights. It’s a timeless tradition. It does bother me. I’d much rather my kids not play with anything that resemebles a gun but it’s pointless. They pick up a pencil and pretend it’s a shooter. They love to squirt water out of “guns” and so on. I used to believe it was nurture, not nature but now I feel differently. Boys will be boys.
As a parent, of course I would be concerned if I got a message from one child to mine with that drawing on it but given the age of the child (7?) I wouldn’t overreact, instead I would be calm and investigate, politely and quickly.
The school psychologist stepped in — I applaud that but I also know they are paid by their employer and want to keep their job so I would have instead visited my own psychologist and asked questions.
What I do fault the parents for is asking the child to be removed to another classroom instead of asking that the child in question seek counseling from the school’s counselor. The parents seem to advocate getting a “dangerous” child away from their own child but not away from other children. That’s not right. If a child is a bully or is a threat, I’d want the threat removed from ALL children, not just my child.
What the school has done wrong is that they haven’t counseled the child about the drawing. They should have explained that drawing a picture of “you” and “me” with guns is not appropriate and then explain why — that it is considered scary and may imply a threat.
Some overreaction by the parents here for sure but also some fault on the school’s part for not creating an atmosphere that made the parents feel like their child was safe. After all, young kids will and have brought loaded guns to school. That’s certainly the fault of the adults at home who owned them and did not lock them up and completely away from a child.
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:12 am
Two days is more than enough time to investigate the “threat” of a stick figure drawing incident.
Yes Ronin, and THREE days is more than enough time to figure out if a student is willing to PHYSICALLY ASSAULT a school resource officer, he just MIGHT pose a threat to the safety of others.
But that didn’t stop Westlake from allowing him back to school, where he promptly assisted his classmates in BREAKING another student’s jaw, did it?
SEE
December 29th, 2011
9:17 am
Beverly,
It is the parents who state, “we are still struggling with these questions”. That is not the same as “the school never answered these questions”. I suspect the school DID answer those questions, but the parents were not satisfied. I can’t believe the gall of the parents to ask that the other child be switched and not their child. I am sympathetic to bullying issues. My son was bullied in school (i.e. his stuff being torn up, he was being tripped, and called offensive names). I brought it to the attention of his teacher. The office dealt with it and I never even had to meet with the administration. As far as I know, the administration merely spoke to the child that was bullying my son. This child remained in the classroom with my son, and there were no further issues. I know because I asked my son about his interactions with this child frequently. “They don’t bother me anymore” is what he would state and he is satisfied with the outcome. I am proud of my son for dwelling on the past behavior of this classmate. I don’t know what the administration did and/or said to this child, but it was effective. Stop trying to micromanage the school. If the other child continues to threaten your son, then you have an issue. Otherwise, your statements seem more centered on “retribution” for the other child.
About Sk8ing Mother from Good Mother
December 29th, 2011
9:18 am
SHe writes “IMO, there just aren’t enough facts for others to opine on matter. Yes, it could be absolutely nothing to lose sleep over. Yes, it could be something to be concerned about for myriad reasons. One just doesn’t know.”
I agree completely.
We really just don’t know enough here to judge the school, the counselor, the parents, the kids. Without a discussion, in depth, with all of them, there just isn’t enough information here. I could only guess to fill in the blanks.
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:18 am
Homeschooler
I agree with “Teacher”. The parents were likely given an explanation but didn’t like what they heard. I’m sure they were not happy with.
@Homeschooler it looks like it was the LACK of explanation that has them concerned. Do you really think that school systems have EARNED our trust to the point that we should take what they say AT FACE VALUE?
It SOUNDS like they were told “we did an investigation,” yet at the same time the psychologist says the drawing raises some concerns.
Doesn’t that sound like OPEN and HONEST communication to you?
Greg Kaiser
December 29th, 2011
9:21 am
99.9% of the time, this kind of thing is going to be absolutely meaningless. It is by all means developmentally appropriate for a seven year old child to draw pictures that may contain “violent” images, such as the use of guns, bombs exploding, etc. The school may have not communicated with the concernedaremts as clearly and as efficiently as they could have. However, a simple conversation with the child who drew the picture, followed by a conversation with his parents, is all that was really necessary here. Assuming there were no extenuating circumstances found in those conversations, the school should then have a conversation with the parents of the child who received the drawing, explaining to them the steps taken, and why they feel there is no legitimate threat. Following that, the child who received the drawing should be brought into the conversation, with his parents present, to be reassured that he is safe.
If the parents of the child who received the drawing are not satisfied after these steps, then it is up to them to take steps for alternate education for their child. It is completely unreasonable for them to demand that the artist be removed from their child’s class, unless they would like the same standard to be applied to their child the next time he draws a picture that could be considered “violent” or offensive in any way.
If the school has taken reasonable steps to ensure the safety of its students, and has been transparent (within legal boundaries) regarding those steps, and if the school has communicated those steps clearly to all involved, it has handled the situation appropriately.
Chicagojeff
December 29th, 2011
9:22 am
Dial it down a thousand Man!! It’s important that the school looked into it and the counselor and psych was notified. Unless you have had multiple incidents and not “never had good interactions” then I think you are making a mountain out of a molehill. This is an example of the school responding reasonably to an incident but the “Parents” don’t feel catered too. Their are OTHER children at the school you understand??
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:27 am
Trust me SEE I know ALL about “helicopter parents” (even the point of accompanying their child to a job interview) But, knowing school systems and how they are I suspect the school DIDN’T tell them what they wanted to know. Review the original post
– Our child has never considered this classmate a friend. When we shared this info with the school along with the fact that our child had not had good interactions with this child, it did not change their perspective.
–Who are the people labeled “me” and “you?”
If the “you” was THEIR child, they have EVERY right to know.
–Did they find this picture developmentally appropriate for a second grader?
– We were told the school determined that our child is not in any danger. What made them sure of this?
Again, a SIMPLE, DIRECT, question that deserves a SIMPLE, DIRECT answer.
-The school psychologist admitted that she was not given all of the information and indicated that the picture was concerning
They had TWO days to investigate, yet the school psychologist admits she wasn’t privy to all the information. And we blame the parents for being concerned that the investigation/assessment may have been lacking?
Really?
Mark
December 29th, 2011
9:29 am
I’m pretty amazed at the responses here. Is there a threat? Yep, there is. What if the doodler had simply said “I’m going to shoot you.” Is there a difference simply because he communicated it differently? If you think it’s harmless, then try it at work today. Draw that picture, hand it to a random co-worker, and see where it goes. If you hand it to me…I’ll take it as a credible threat, and if I’m told by authorities that it is not, then I’ll handle it myself.
As for context…I don’t know if these kids are friends or not. I don’t know if the doodler is joking around or is deadly serious. Do you?
The parents of the threatened kid have a responsibility to protect their child. If that means removing him from the classroom, or from the school, or however far they need to legally go in pursuing this.
As for the lesson being taught? The child now knows that his parents will go to bat for him, and will protect him. That’s not a bad thing.
Questions
December 29th, 2011
9:32 am
1. What was the content of the other pictures the child drew?
2. How does the “artist” interact with other students on a day to day basis?
3. Has the “artist” exhibited violent outbursts previously?
4. If the child had drawn a picture of himself committing suicide and the teacher saw it and didn’t report it in my school system, the teacher would be sitting in Internal Investigations and would be referred to the PSC. What is the difference?
5. Of course we can’t know if the artist a Student with Disabilities? Due to fears about IDEA these students are given latitude for outrageous behavior that regular students would never receive.
Opinion: The drawing in and of itself is not disturbing? It is the labels of me and you that are disconcerting. Who knows if the “artist” knows where to find his parents’ handgun and bring it to school? One only needs to look at where the minds and famtasies of the Columbine killers were prior to their murderous rampage to be concerned about this. The parents are right to be concerned and should ask to have their child moved out of the classroom. Others principals and other school systems would handle this differently.
Cosby
December 29th, 2011
9:33 am
AHH..THE GOVERNMENT SCHOOLS…BUT THEN AGAIN, MORE PROOF OF THE DEGRADING OF sOCIETY BROUGHT ON BY gOVERNMENT PROGRAMS AND THOSE WHO HAVE KIDS BUT DO NOT THINK THEY HAVE ANY RESPONSIBILITY. TIME TO RE LOOK AT SOCIETY IN GENERAL AND GOVERNMENT INVOLMENT THERE IN!
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:33 am
@Greg Kaiser,
EXACTLY. If they had communicated, in the clear, effective manner that you laid out, they could have put the parents mind at ease. But instead, it looks like they went into “dance” mode, like the parents indicated.
And for some inexplicable reason, posters seem to support the school in doing this…
ScienceTeacher671
December 29th, 2011
9:33 am
I tend to agree with catlady’s 9:10 a.m. post, and that of 3rd Grade Teacher at 7:15 a.m.
Yes, boys will do this sort of thing, but back when we were in school, elementary school students had not actually brought guns to school and shot their classmates. A student in my county threatened another child with a large kitchen knife a couple of years ago, and was back in class a few days later.
It’s hopefully nothing, but given the family life and living conditions of some students, you really can’t be sure of that anymore.
DeborahinAthens
December 29th, 2011
9:34 am
My husband and Ihave raised two wonderful men who are married and have kids of their own. One son always drew weird pictures, some of which I framed because they are unique. Once a school teacher called us into a conference because, when this son was in the second grade, he drew pictures of people with one leg. The psychologist had a lot of concerns, but when we asked my son why he was doing this, he said it was too hard to draw two legs! Boys will always play with guns and pretend to shoot each other. For God’s sake, don’t you remember playing cowboys and indians? What has happened to this world? No wonder this young generation is a bunch of pantywaists!
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:38 am
As for context…I don’t know if these kids are friends or not. I don’t know if the doodler is joking around or is deadly serious. Do you?
@Mark. Do these parents know? Do these POSTERS know? No, they DON’T know, which is why, as you say, they have EVERY right to be concerned.
And if the school had sat down and communicated with them in an OPEN and HONEST manner, they could have put the parents minds at ease.
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:41 am
Boys will always play with guns and pretend to shoot each other. For God’s sake, don’t you remember playing cowboys and indians? What has happened to this world?
I’ll tell you what happened DeborahInAthens. Some boys, MANY boys stopped “playing” and started shooting for REAL. And many boys DIED, and are still DYING today.
That’s what happened DeborahInAthens. NOW do you understand?
Man up
December 29th, 2011
9:45 am
Hmm. Former educator parent. Three guesses why the writer is no longer teaching.
Now imagine a school of 1000 or more kids where maybe half have parents like this whiney know it all who all think their precious snowflake deserves special treatment and everyone’s full attention at all times. We should be paying school administrators twice what they make to deal with what they deal with.
And we wonder why academics are suffering.
nelson
December 29th, 2011
9:50 am
Making comments with the AJC is really difficult. I have to type extra slow so it can be read before posted. I do not see the seriousness of small children drawing a picture with them pointing a gunat therir best friend. It is play, and besides all the news is about violence. The old saying”if it bleeds it reads>” Maybe the media should soften their rhetoric about viloence.
catlady
December 29th, 2011
9:50 am
BTW, Ms. Downey, the “former teacher turned advocate:” For what is he an advocate?
Ronin
December 29th, 2011
9:51 am
@Catlady, your comment: “Some of you who advocate ignoring this have NO IDEA what the school sees on a daily basis. It isn’t 1955 any more.” ***** I agree and respect your opinion, however, each case has to be judged on its on merit. If an investigation was required each time a second grader did something like this, there would be no time for teaching children.
Bev, your statement: “Yes Ronin, and THREE days is more than enough time to figure out if a student is willing to PHYSICALLY ASSAULT a school resource officer, he just MIGHT pose a threat to the safety of others.**** Your comparison of the two cases is ridiculous, a seven year old is not a threat. You better double up on the Xanax.
Going to the gym…
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:55 am
@Man Up if they had done what Greg Kaiser suggested, they probably could have cleared this up with the parents in 15 minutes. But I strongly suspect they went into “duck and cover” mode and the parents are NOT at ease with that.
And nor should they be.
Dr NO / Mr Sunshine
December 29th, 2011
9:55 am
The child in the picture, holding the gun, was probably contemplating the best way to obtain some Niki Air Jordans.
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
9:56 am
Ronin, tell Kayla Holland a 7 year old is not a threat. Oh sorry you can’t; she’s no longer ALIVE having been shot by a SIX year old.
And no amount of Xanax is going to bring her back.
SouthGADawg
December 29th, 2011
9:58 am
“Beverly Fraud” sounds strikingly similar to the helicopter parent who made a big deal about a kid drawing a doodle. Regardless, she obviously has no idea that boys like to draw people shooting each other and also play with toy gun shooting each other. Furthermore, does she own a television? Kids shows regularly show the characters shooting each other…or gasp…fighting with each other. She better go out and sue the television networks for “harming” her child.
Over Christmas, I watched my little cousins run around the yard shooting each other with toy guns. I guess I should have called the cops and/or a mental institution so I could go ahead and stop this psychotic behaviour before these kids grow up to be murderers. Because their behaviour was “clearly” disturbing.
Uggghhh….its stories like this one, coupled with yesterday’s “Pagan” story, which really make we wonder why I even read this garbage.
I suggest that Maureen stop posting garbage like this and actually get back to real issues like cheating in schools.
Call it like it is
December 29th, 2011
10:02 am
@Beverly
Your continue comparsion to Kayla Rolland is beyond silly. The young boy who shot Kayla was a known trouble maker, had been suspended several times for using the f-word, his father is an ex-con, the gun used had been traded for with drugs. The kid lived in a known crack house, had just been beaten up that morning by his uncle, and had been in trouble numerous times for messing with Kayla. You are takeing one serious issue and trying to compare it to this child.
If we use your logic we might as well say we need to seperate whites and blacks from each other, because Kayla was a little white girl and the boy who killed her was black, therefore we must assume that all little black boys might be a threat to all little white girls.
Man up
December 29th, 2011
10:02 am
Beverly. If they did it was probably because they have dealt with this parent 100 times before this incident on even more trivial ” big deals”. I would bet their kid is an instigator who just hasn’t. Edn caught yet and these parents are playing offense as defense. Seen it 100 times.
Questions
December 29th, 2011
10:04 am
@SouthGADawg. You just showed how little you know and understand about how everything that goes on in a classroom and a school is interrelated. There is more to school than standardized tests.
frustrated APS mom
December 29th, 2011
10:04 am
One of my kids is in kindergarten. There is a child in his class that repeatedly makes very odd comments to him like “I hope you drown and die” yet for some reason the teacher doesn’t think this is an issue because my kid is much bigger than this kid and is not at all afraid of him. My kid never says things like that back to the kid, but he does tell the teacher. He also tells us. After the 5th or 6th thing he told us about that involved the kid wishing my kid was somehow dead, my husband called the teacher and let her know that if it happens again we will demand a meeting with the principal and the other parents. The teacher’s answer? “But his mom is such a sweetheart.” Huh?
I am in the class regularly and I see the kid sneaking up to other kids with his fist balled up and talking in a low voice, making threats. I report what I see to the teacher and she will call him out and tell him to sit down. This is his second year in her kindergarten class. We have had it with this nonsense and the next time anything is said to my son that involves violence, I will just call that sweetheart of a mom myself. Don’t get me wrong – I don’t think this kid could hurt my kid – but that kind of behavior is just disturbing. And we are in a “top” northside elementary school and the parents live in a million dollar neighborhood. No thug upbringing here. Perhaps that is why the school doesn’t seem to be taking this seriously….
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
10:07 am
Do I think the child is a LEGITIMATE threat to murder the child in question? I would say the odds are OVERWHELMINGLY against it…for now any way.
Do I think the parents have a LEGITIMATE right to have their mind put at ease, given we have had actual MURDERS in school?
Yes. EMPHATICALLY yes. And knowing how school systems generally behave, it’s dumbfounding that so many posters AUTOMATICALLY assume the school did the right thing.
Three things I feel the parent could have done better:
1) Did you put these questions in an email, so that there is documentation?
2) Asking another child to be removed from your child’s class is asking a bit much. Absent REAL ABUSE it’s not a bad thing AT ALL for your child to learn how to interact/coexist with those they don’t agree with…after all, they might have to meet them on a blog one day LOL
3) Have you spent the day in your child’s classroom so you can watch the interaction for yourself? (And please don’t play “blame the teacher” it’s not the TEACHER’S fault administration didn’t address your concerns)
Ron Burgundy
December 29th, 2011
10:10 am
If the kid wears a black trenchcoat and listens to Goth and is emotionally removed sure. if the kid saw a western movie or something then no.
I mean kids today are pu$$es. When I grew up we played cowboys and indian and war. I remember seeing Raiders of Lost Ark as a small small child at the theater. It affected me nill.Parents wont let their kids watch part of Disney now. Then their kids grow up unable to handle the inevitable stress of life…How payment behind…walk away. Wife complaining….walk away. Kids are sheltered from hardships so they grow up to walk away from them.
Ron Burgundy
December 29th, 2011
10:11 am
I think the parents should be notified and thats baout it.
catlady
December 29th, 2011
10:11 am
Once class of 4th graders had a list on the wall before Christmas of what they wanted. I noticed one that seemed strange: Remington. I asked the boy why he wanted an electric razor–was it for his dad? It turns out his primary wish was for a gun! Why? So he could go out and kill things for fun!
Man up
December 29th, 2011
10:13 am
It sounds like the school took it seriously. These type of parents are never happy unless they are getting exactly what they want. They are the definition of entitlement mentality that is ruining our schools and country. Their control issues are disgusting and detrimental to their child and to if to everyone.
frank lopez
December 29th, 2011
10:14 am
I am glad I am too young to play guns anymore. I use to smile too while paying guns with my brother. I might be committed to the psych ward if I plyed with the former educators child. The real tragedy is this person actually taught other children and there are many more educators like him.
Man up
December 29th, 2011
10:15 am
Toxic to everyone
Beverly Fraud
December 29th, 2011
10:16 am
“The young boy who shot Kayla was a known trouble maker, had been suspended several times for using the f-word, his father is an ex-con, the gun used had been traded for with drugs.”
If the comparison is NOT valid, then why wouldn’t the office and the teacher simply say “There have been no threats of violence toward your child this year” (And yes you CAN say this without saying anything SPECIFIC about a particular child)
And where is the child’s TEACHER in all of this? No one finds it odd that the parent hasn’t mentioned what the teacher thinks? Is the teacher (who perhaps knows ALL TOO WELL the other child is a behavior problem) being silenced by administration?
Again go back to Greg Kaiser’s post. I ask myself, based on the QUESTIONS raised, what is MOST likely:
The school communicated OPENLY and HONESTLY?
The parents are out of control helicopter parents?
As much as I know FULL WELL the dangers of helicopter parents, I’m thinking the school has NOT been open and honest with the parents.