Being pagan in Georgia: Do schools promote some religions while denigrating others?
UPDATE: Folks, I closed comments on this at 10 p.m. Friday. Have a great holiday weekend. Maureen
A common plaint on this blog is that religion has been banished from our public schools. The usual comment is that we have kicked God out of the schools.
But some argue that not all religions are met with hostility in the classroom, only those far outside the mainstream.
That complaint was made this month via an Internet campaign on behalf of a pagan family in Carroll County. Stephanie Turner said her 11-year-old son was singled out and punished after he took off the neopagan holiday of Samhain. Once the boy returned to class, his teacher allegedly questioned him and said, “Paganism is not a religion.” Then, the teacher assigned a class essay on “How Christmas started,” according to the complaint.
(You can read more details on the “Turner Family Support” Facebook page.)
I exchanged e-mails with Turner seeking information about her son’s experience, but then received a call from Selena Fox, founder and executive director of the Lady Liberty League, an organization that advocates for religious freedom for Wiccans, Neopagans and other nature religion practitioners.
A Wisconsin resident, Fox explained to me in our telephone conversation that she was calling on Turner’s behalf to let me know that they were attempting to meet with the school district. In the meantime, websites and pagan organizations that took up the Turner family cause urged people to send e-mails of protest to the Carroll school chief, principal and teacher. And apparently they did.
When I contacted Carroll County two weeks ago, spokeswoman Elena Schulenburg told me: We are currently working with the parent to review this matter. The e-mail was circulated over the weekend ahead of our opportunity to meet with the parent to discuss any concerns. As always, our focus is on the safety and welfare of all students.
Accompanied by four advocates including an attorney, Turner met with Carroll school officials on Dec. 12. She and her advocates issued a statement later on the outcome of that meeting: First, a sincere apology for recent events and misunderstandings has been given by school administration and accepted by the family. Second, the Bowdon Elementary School guidance counselor will educate staff and students about honoring and accepting the differences that make us individuals. Third, procedures have been put in place to ensure classroom activities don’t alienate students.
In a Dec. 13 radio interview on Pagan Warrior Radio hosted by Selena Fox, Turner thanked the national pagan community for its support, saying, “It has helped my son so much knowing that he is not alone.”
The New York Times has a good piece about the encroachment of religion in public schools. Several of the examples of proselytizing occurred in Southern schools.
The New York Times story notes:
At a school assembly here in South Carolina on Sept. 1, a preacher described how Christ saved him from drugs, telling his rapt audience that “a relationship with Jesus is what you need more than anything else.” A rapper shouted the Lord’s praise to a light show and most of the audience stepped forward to pledge themselves to Christ while a few remained, uncomfortable, in their seats.
Such overt evangelizing would not be unusual at a prayer rally, but this was a daytime celebration in a public school gymnasium, arranged by the principal for sixth, seventh and eighth graders. When the rapper posted a video on YouTube, announcing that “324 kids at this school have made a decision for Jesus Christ,” he drew unwelcome public and legal scrutiny to the event. It was the kind of religious advocacy that is increasingly coming to light, legal experts say, as school populations become more diverse and as the objection of non-Christians — or, in this case, the rejoicing of evangelists — is broadcast on the Internet.
In landmark decisions in 1962 and 1963, the Supreme Court barred official promotion of religion in schools. That principle has remained solid, if pilloried by conservatives who blame it for what they see as the nation’s moral and social decline. At the same time, the courts and Congress have also reinforced the rights of students to pray on their own and to form after-school religious clubs.
But battles over the place of religion in schools continue. This month, the American Civil Liberties Union filed a lawsuit demanding that the Chesterfield County, S.C., school district end what the suit describes as the continuing promotion of religion in several of its schools, including the middle school that held the prayer rally. The A.C.L.U. brought the suit on behalf of a seventh grader who said he was subjected to unwanted proselytizing and has been harassed for his avowals of atheism.
Christian legal advocates counter that such plain violations are far less common than the opposite problem: overzealous officials trying to cleanse the schools of religion, punishing students for protected speech like personal prayer or handing out devotional messages to their friends.
Watchdog groups like the A.C.L.U., Americans United for Separation of Church and State and the Freedom From Religion Foundation say that in the last few years, they have learned more often about what they call blatant violations like the South Carolina rally. It is unclear, they say, whether the number of such events is growing, or whether they are now more likely to come to light. But still, these advocates say, even when clear violations occur, concerned families are often reluctant to bring legal challenges because they fear social hostility.
–From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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563 comments Add your comment
Zeus is my Homeboy
December 28th, 2011
12:27 pm
Isn’t it ironic that Christian fundamentalists in this country are the ones who are the most concerned about the rising power of political Islam(Islamic Brotherhood, not Hezbollah and such)? The fact is religion and government are usually not compatible and quite often produce bad policy. History has been very unkind to leaders who thought a higher power was speaking directly to them. Of course, the fundamentalists will immediately bring up the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany as examples of what happens in godless societies, but that is an intellectually dishonest comparison. Those were totalitarian governments and those governments can’t be compared to modern secular democracies that allow for the free exercise of religion without promoting one religion over others.
Secular Americans and religious Americans who don’t require a pat on the back from the government to practice their faith believe strongly in the freedom of all Americans to worship as they choose. The idea atheists want to take away your right to worship on private property or American Muslims want to invoke Shariah Law are ridiculous. This idea that Christians are being persecuted in America is insulting to people around the world who are being persecuted for their religious beliefs. Not receiving preferential treatment from the government does not qualify as persecution!
When a local government or school does a sectarian Christian prayer they are clearly violating the Constitution, however, if a local government denies a religious group the right to purchase property that is properly zoned for a house of worship they are also violating the Constitution. Another thing that American Christian fundamentalist have difficulty with is accepting that: atheists, agnostics,pagans, Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses, and dare I say Muslims have the same rights they do. Moreover, this nation wasn’t founded on any religion and the Constitution doesn’t mention anything about Christianity. We are a representative democracy that allows for the free exercise of religion as long as it is not state supported.
Digger
December 28th, 2011
12:27 pm
Besides, Tebow is God.
God
December 28th, 2011
12:28 pm
@liberalefty – I find stepping on people more effective.
No Soup for You!
December 28th, 2011
12:30 pm
@Digger… Talking snakes? Try CNN or FOX.
John K
December 28th, 2011
12:31 pm
Good points, Zeus. Another thing, if it were indeed so important to the Founding Fathers wouldn’t you think they would have put that in The Constitution. In fact, the only mention of religion within the document is Article 6, “No religious test” for holding office.
BigCheezie
December 28th, 2011
12:31 pm
@Zeus is my Homeboy
Kuddos!! May Zeus bless you with adoring peasants. If there was a “Like” button, I would have hit it an odd number of times, to ensure it would be a like, cause if you hit it twice, it may take that first like away.
SouthGADawg
December 28th, 2011
12:36 pm
@John K
What can I say? You’re clearly a fringe lunatic who can’t stand Christians, nothing I say will change that. So the only way for you to determine if God really exists is to die. Its all perfectly logical.
I’m sorry if I offended you and your wittle sensibilities. In any event, this is why the AJC shouldn’t have stupid articles like this. It just brings out Christian-bashers like yourself and gives them a forum. Oh well. I’m off to go believe in things that “aren’t real” according to you and your buddies. But hey, that’s my right, correct? (just like its my right under the 1st Amendment to state that you’re an idiot)
Hcain
December 28th, 2011
12:37 pm
My good Xtian friends at New Birth are closing their school right at Xmas!
John K
December 28th, 2011
12:39 pm
LOL SouthGADawg, What you don’t know would fill the Georgia Dome six times over. But go ahead with your assumptions and victim mentality, it appears to fit you very, very well.
Dana D. Eilers
December 28th, 2011
12:39 pm
I am a modern Pagan woman, and I am an attorney. Additionally, I am the author of PAGANS AND THE LAW: UNDERSTAND YOUR RIGHTS. Modern Pagan religions such as Wicca, Druidry, Norse/Asatru have been recognized as religions meritorious of First Amendment protections by the EEOC, state supreme courts, federal courts, the United States Supreme Court, and by various state agencies, including the Missouri Tax Commission. However, they are hardly given equal air time by public schools; thus, the public schools are in violation of the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment. The only way to keep schools from violating the Establishment Clause is to keep religion out of the schools. Period. Prayer, preaching, sermons, conversions, handing out Bibles, etc. are in violation of the First Amendment and should be kept within the province of the home, one’s religious establishments, and/or private religious schools.–Dana D. Eilers, Attorney and Author
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
12:40 pm
Plaint– a new word for me!
Gman
December 28th, 2011
12:40 pm
When will people realize that harboring the thought “God will punish you for your actions” only leads to isolating yourself. You can’t truly love your neighbor if you think your neighbor is going to “hell” for not following in the same footsteps as you. I have yet to meet a Christian that truly accepts someone for who they are. And I truly feel it’s a show of being judgemental when they look at you and say, “I will pray for you”.
I have a great love and acceptance of the divine. But as a spiritualist, I don’t subscribe to all the dogma that most organized religions have about God. If I was this preacher at this school, I wouldn’t have asked kids to pledge themselves to the Lord. I would have asked them to recognize that God is with them each moment of their lives. And that’s nothing to fear or granting you more righteousness over another. Show God the same emotion that he always has for you…love.
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
12:45 pm
“Of course, the fundamentalists will immediately bring up the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany as examples of what happens in godless societies, but that is an intellectually dishonest comparison.”
Could you go into more detail with that allegation?
Arch
December 28th, 2011
12:48 pm
I know many “Christians” who will pray with their brother on Sunday and steal from their brother on Monday. I wonder if that evangelist at the school did the show for free?
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
12:48 pm
“When a local government or school does a sectarian Christian prayer they are clearly violating the Constitution, however, if a local government denies a religious group the right to purchase property that is properly zoned for a house of worship they are also violating the Constitution.”
That is a lie! You can not prohibit the practice of religion. I, as a tax payer own that property as much as you!
lugsafdl
December 28th, 2011
12:49 pm
ONLY SOUTHERN BAPTISTS CAN GET INTO HEAVEN AND EVEN THEY MUST PASS THRU DALLAS TO GET THERE.
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
12:51 pm
“We are a representative democracy that allows for the free exercise of religion as long as it is not state supported.”
We are the state! Where does the state begin? Your attempt at purism
eliminates the very existance of what our forefathers created.
Mahopinion
December 28th, 2011
12:52 pm
Sorry, but as a non-practicing Catholic, I see this kind of discrimination regularly on the schools. My own daughter was forced to sit and listen to her science teacher preach about how evolution is evil. Really? From her science teacher? Perhaps the teacher should ask to switch classes. Testimony and preaching belongs in the churches, synagogues and mosques. Not the public school classrooms.
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
12:52 pm
Arch
December 28th, 2011
12:48 pm
I know many non-christains who rape children and cut their bodies into many pieces.
Ole Farmer
December 28th, 2011
12:53 pm
You will never here me complain about no God in the public schools.
There is NO state religion in America. I believe that there should be a wall of separation between church and state. This is good for the churches (all churches whatever religion or no religion) and it’s good for the state.
Americans have time outside the public school system to pursue whatever religious or spiritual path they want, or no spiritual path at all. That’s what makes us free.
Ole Farmer
December 28th, 2011
12:53 pm
Uh…that’s “hear” not “here” lol.
John K
December 28th, 2011
12:55 pm
@williebkind, if you know many people who rape and cut up bodies, you probably should look for a better circle of friends.
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
12:55 pm
Dana D. Eilers
December 28th, 2011
12:39 pm
What is the reputation of lawyers?
SouthGADawg
December 28th, 2011
12:55 pm
Hey everybody! I’m a stupid moron with an ugly face and big butt and my butt smells and I like to kiss my own butt
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
12:56 pm
John K
December 28th, 2011
12:55 pm
I do! I do not hang out with non christains.
John K
December 28th, 2011
12:57 pm
Willie, so it’s the Christians who rape and cut up bodies?
donna P.
December 28th, 2011
1:02 pm
Oh Lord. These postings have gone downhill. All public schools in America recognize certain holidays in the calendar year. Spring Break is for Easter and Winter Break is for Christmas. The other recognized holidays are Federal holidays. If you don’t like it, then petition your local reps and try to add the holidays you want. If this boy is a Pagan and took a day off to celebrate one of their holidays, who cares. It’s his parents’ rights to allow him to do that. Punish the teacher if she said something negative about Pagans.
Being pagan in Georgia: Do schools promote some religions while denigrating … – Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog) | newzbuff.com
December 28th, 2011
1:05 pm
[...] Being pagan in Georgia: Do schools promote some religions while denigrating …Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog)A common plaint on this blog is that religion has been banished from our public schools. The usual comment is that we have kicked God out of the schools. But some argue that not all religions are met with hostility in the classroom, only those far …Battling Anew Over the Place of Religion in Public SchoolsNew York TimesThe Perspective of Religious MinoritiesPatheos (blog)Education and religion vs. learning and faithMilwaukee Journal SentinelMuncie Star Press -The Daily Advance -TCPalmall 40 news articles » [...]
Arch
December 28th, 2011
1:05 pm
You can’t prohibit a student from practicing his/her religion as long as it does not violate the rights of others or a school policy (see the “Tebowing” kids, who were not punished for their exhibition but for clogging the halls during class changes).
But a state-funded school cannot promote Christianity in so much as it can promote Islam, Judaism, or the flying spaghetti monster. Private school? knock yourself out. Unfortunately, this goes on in more ways in small rural schools. Christmas trees, parties, christmas movies, assemblies with Christmas themes, including music with Christian themes, are the norm. I would bet most schools in my county have a tree on display somewhere. People would argue that some children would not have a christmas if not for their school. My response? Not the purpose of the school to give them a christmas, there are charities and foundations everywhere for that. Just like the school, and my tax dollars, are not there to facilitate an assembly for a preacher, a rapper, or a rapping preacher.
ryan2white
December 28th, 2011
1:06 pm
The worst part about the South is the religious idiots. I can’t understand how any of you blindly believe that your religion is correct and all others are “abominations”. Open your eyes and your minds. All books, all stories, and all things are created by Man… nothing else. God/Jesus, whoever, is just an imaginary friend for grown-ups.
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
1:06 pm
Please, all of you educated bloggers, show me in plain English that America was not founded on Christainity. I read the letters of the forefathers and some discussed the unintended consequences of religion and no religion in government. I read in today’s media the consequences of having some religious freedom in government but never the good. During times our existance there were supreme court justices who imposed their personal agendas on the nation and we know activist judges have legislated from the bench. The only constant we have is our belief. The progressive liberals have done every thing to obscure that and indoctrinate our children against our morals and beliefs. I am sure one day I will read about Dana D. Eilers is appointed to the court. The fall of the greatest nation continues.
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
1:06 pm
John K
December 28th, 2011
12:57 pm
Are you a drive by progressive liberal?
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
1:07 pm
ryan2white
December 28th, 2011
1:06 pm
You can teach your kids that but not mine.
Mahopinion
December 28th, 2011
1:08 pm
If you are hearing a voice in your head, it’s time to increase your medication.
Once Again
December 28th, 2011
1:09 pm
Government schools promote the worship of the almighty state. Anyone who hasn’t figured that out yet, hasn’t bothered to poll the general population about their sentiments on the need for government to do virtually everything for them.
Christianity is just a cover. The real god in america is the state.
williebkind
December 28th, 2011
1:09 pm
Arch
December 28th, 2011
1:05 pm
Was the reason the action was executed. I am sure there were some teenagers standing in the hall talking about wiccas and no one could pass.
John K
December 28th, 2011
1:10 pm
Willie, The Constitution is the law of the land. Show me where in The Constitution does it establish this as a Christian nation.
Silly Bloggers
December 28th, 2011
1:10 pm
Relgious debates always fascinate me. I will say this though. I have gone back and forth on the issue for a very long time. With that being said, I will simply state some observations:
1. The tide is changing, at least at a snails pace. From Pew studies, Agnostics/Atheists now represent anywhere from 12% to 16% of the US population. In and of itself, not a very initmidating figure, but considering this figure was only 2% in 1995, that is some serious ground gained.
2. On global Standard of Living indexes, countries that are more secular have incredibly low percentages of teenage pregnancy, abortion, hate crimes, and violent crimes. In other words, the opposite of what is experienced here in the US. As crazy as it may be to some, educating your children as opposed to threatening them with the fires of Hades does have a positive impact.
3. I did read the Bible. You can start on Genesis and go no farther for the simple reason that none of the gospels even agree on the order the world was created. For a holy book, you would think this would be consistent, but it isn’t. The Bible scared the bejesus out of me as a child and I think that it was took me so long to actually be open to opposing views.
4. Lastly, I once supported churches and those who practiced religion in a private and responsible way; however, after seeing people like East Repeat and the other scipture-quoting blind faith activists over the years, I can no longer support churches for the sole reason that they serve as an umbrella to protect people like this. In the broader view, it is people like East Repeat that wants to push the button for a nuclear war in hopes that Armaggedon will come and bring the second coming of Christ.
Zeus is my Homeboy
December 28th, 2011
1:12 pm
Williebkind:
Do you think students who are not Christians should be forced to sit through sectarian Christian prayers are school?
You seem to believe that involuntary sectarian Christian prayer is Constitutional. Using that logic pagans and Muslims would have the right to do the same. Do you believe that sectarian Islamic or pagan rituals should be forced upon students at Georgia’s public schools?
BTW, I am a dedicated husband and father and I don’t rely on an ancient religious document or a culturally conservative political philosophy to live my life. Further, the more secular states in our country actually have lower rates of teen pregnancy and divorce than more conservative states. High church attendance, abstinence only sex education, and less access to birth control haven’t helped more socially conservative states on paper. Moreover, minorities who tend to vote Democratic have high levels of church attendance, but also high levels of teen pregnancy and out of wedlock births.
Secular Americans tend to be well educated and for the most part have very stable family lives. hhttp://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=126653602 The fact metro Atlanta is becoming more secular is why I have stayed in Georgia.
George Washington
December 28th, 2011
1:14 pm
@ williebkind
“I am persuaded, you will permit me to observe that the path of true piety is so plain as to require but little political direction. To this consideration we ought to ascribe the absence of any regulation, respecting religion, from the Magna-Charta of our country.”
“I had always hoped that this land might become a safe and agreeable Asylum to the virtuous and persecuted part of mankind, to whatever nation they might belong.”
“Government being, among other purposes, instituted to protect the consciences of men from oppression, it certainly is the duty of Rulers, not only to abstain from it themselves, but according to their stations, to prevent it in others.”
“If I could conceive that the general government might ever be so administered as to render the liberty of conscience insecure, I beg you will be persuaded, that no one would be more zealous than myself to establish effectual barriers against the horrors of spiritual tyranny, and every species of religious persecution.”
- George Washington
Silly Bloggers
December 28th, 2011
1:14 pm
Zeus, looks like you and I were typing the in the same vein at the same time. Couldn’t agree more.
Zeus is my Homeboy
December 28th, 2011
1:18 pm
Dear WillieBKind and Other Revisionists,
http://www.adl.org/NR/exeres/9ECD82DE-51A2-4779-A95D-D047EAAFA37D,DB7611A2-02CD-43AF-8147-649E26813571,frameless.htm
DLink
December 28th, 2011
1:19 pm
@Good Mother on Page 3. You’re a good mother in having saved me from having to put something sensible together in here, thank you.
Folk, she’s on page 3, and I roll with the Good Mother.
Katz P. Ajamas
December 28th, 2011
1:24 pm
All y’all are infidels in someone’s eye. Where is the tolerance of liberals when someone wants to enjoy a non-mainstream meat for dinner? It’s a way of communing with life and yet you scream “they shoudl be hung” for eating a bit of horse or dog…
John K
December 28th, 2011
1:29 pm
@Katz, since you’re the expert, please tell me what other things I say.
catlady
December 28th, 2011
1:33 pm
I love @Infinite talking about the “cannon” of the Bible and the Big Bang Theory!
Gene
December 28th, 2011
1:37 pm
Let us not forget that Christianity, Judaism and Islam are all Abrahamic faiths, rooted in the same historic covenant and holy principle: the willingness of a man to kill another man because god told him to.
Ole Farmer
December 28th, 2011
1:39 pm
By opening the door to ANY religious or spiritual practice in public school, you eventually open the door to everything.
This is a breeding ground for continual conflict.
There is simply no room for public prayers or other spiritual displays of ANY kind in public schools.
I suppose you might argue that a class in “Comparative Religion” could be taught in public schools since it is in theory an objective course and would not involve actual practice. In my opinion even a class like this should be kept out of public schools and is best saved for college.
America simply does not have a state sanctioned religion, period and for the sake of our sanity we need to go back to the wall of separation between church and state.
Edward
December 28th, 2011
1:45 pm
Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree.
God was never in schools in the South
December 28th, 2011
1:46 pm
People who keep saying God was taken out of schools are believing in a fiction. If God had ever been present in schools in the South, our violent, racist, hate filled history would be different. There would have been no lynchings or Jim Crow laws or segregated schools. The fact is that if everything the religious right says is true, most dead Southern so called Christians are burning in hell even if it was only because of their silence in the midst of so much evil. Referring to the South as the Bible Belt is one of the highest hoaxes ever perpetrated in this country. The vast majority practiced a perverted form of Christianity aimed at assuaging their guilt for their ungodly hatred. The actions of millions of self-proclaimed Christian white Southerners for hundreds of years do not hold up to the light of the Gospel of Christ. Better to be an honest pagan than a phony, lying self-proclaimed Christian!