Breaking news: Georgia Supreme Court strikes down Charter Schools Commission in 4-3 vote.
Pro charter school forces plan a rally tomorrow but the Supreme Court ruling will cast a pallor over the event. (AJC photo)
In a long-awaited ruling released this morning, the state Supreme Court struck down a state commission that could approve charter schools over the objection of local boards of education and direct local funding to the schools. The vote was 4-3.
“No other constitutional provision authorizes any other governmental entity to compete with or duplicate the efforts of local boards of education in establishing and maintaining general K-12 schools,” the opinion states. “By providing for local boards of education to have exclusive control over general K-12 schools, our constitutions, past and present, have limited governmental authority over the public education of Georgia’s children to that level of government closest and most responsive to the taxpayers and parents of the children being educated.”
The decision is a major victory for school systems and local control but a setback to the burgeoning charter school movement in Georgia. Unclear is the fate of the charter schools approved by the commission, some of which are operating and some of which planned to open this fall.
The ruling has no impact on the 160 charter schools that were approved by local systems, only those 16 approved by the state Georgia Charter Schools Commission:
They include the Georgia Cyber Academy, Georgia Connections Academy, Cherokee Charter Academy (the county’s first charter school), Provost Academy Georgia, Heritage Preparatory Academy, Chattahoochee Hills Charter School, Atlanta Heights Charter School, Fulton Leadership Academy, the Museum School of Avondale Estate , Peachtree Hope Charter School, Coweta Charter Academy at Senoia, Heron Bay Academy, Pataula Charter Academy, Ivy Preparatory Academy in Norcross and the Statesboro’s Charter Conservatory for Liberal Arts & Technology
Charter schools receive public funds to operate under a board-approved charter, or contract, that spells out a plan for improving student achievement and provides benchmarks for measuring this improvement on a five-year time line. If those benchmarks aren’t met, the school is supposed to close.
Up until two years ago, school boards in Georgia had primary power to veto or promote charter schools, but lawmakers felt that the school boards were hostile to charter schools and turned down strong applicants. So, the General Assembly created a commission that not only could approve charters, but redirect monies so that the schools receive their share of local dollars.
And that was the issue that is before the Supreme Court after seven systems — Atlanta, DeKalb, Candler, Coweta, Bulloch, Gwinnett and Griffin-Spalding — sued to have the state law that created the Charter Schools Commission declared unconstitutional. The systems lost their case in Fulton County Superior Court a year ago, but appealed to the Supreme Court in October. (Not all the systems were part of the appeal to the high court,)
The Supreme Court focused on two issues in its ruling: Does the state constitution give the state the right to create charter schools over the objection of local boards of education? The state argued for a broad definition of state-sponsored “special schools,” which have historically been limited to the state-run schools for the blind and deaf. The second point of contention was whether the seven-member Charter Schools Commission was a device for the state to divert local money to charter schools.
In its decision, the court sided with the systems, but now the question is what becomes of the charter schools already approved by the commission. Please note, the majority of charter schools in Georgia were approved by local boards of education and are not affected by this court ruling. This ruling is limited to the 16 approved by the now defunct commission.
However, in the larger picture, the decision ruling undermines the charter movement as it returns control to local boards and reduces the flow of dollars to charter schools approved at the state level.
The state Board of Education can still approve charter schools that were rejected by local boards, but those schools get only state money, no local funding. Consider that local systems provide on average about 45 percent of what it now costs to educate a child. So, it’s a dramatic drop if a charter school loses its local dollars. Without that local funding, it is unlikely that the commission charter schools can pay their bills.
So, will local boards of education step in and “adopt” those schools to maintain the stream of local funding?
The problem is that some of the charter schools approved by the now illegal commission are regional, and thus would require several school boards to “adopt” them. They are the most imperiled by this ruling.
According to the court’s statement this morning:
The Supreme Court of Georgia has struck down as unconstitutional a 2008 Act that authorized creation of a new kind of state charter school called “commission charter schools.”
With today’s 4-to-3 decision, the high court has reversed a Fulton County court decision and ruled in favor of local school boards, finding that the state-established schools authorized by the 2008 Georgia Charter Schools Commission Act do not fit the definition of “special schools” as envisioned in the state Constitution.Under the current Constitution, which voters approved in 1983, local school boards have exclusive authority to create and maintain K-12 public education, Chief Justice Carol Hunstein writes for the majority. The Constitution only allows the state government to create “special schools.” Yet in the 2008 Act, the State authorized the “Georgia Charter Schools Commission,” whose members are appointed by state officials, to approve petitions for a new type of general K-12 public school known as a “commission charter school.”“Because our constitution embodies the fundamental principle of exclusive local control of general primary and secondary (“K-12”) public education, and the Act clearly and palpably violates Art. VIII, Sec. V, Par. VII (a) by authorizing a State commission to establish competing State-created general K-12 schools under the guise of being ‘special schools,’ we reverse,” the 24-page majority opinion states.
Charter schools are a relatively recent phenomenon, according to briefs filed in the case. The first opened in 1992 in St. Paul, MN. Georgia’s first, Addison Elementary School, opened three years later in Cobb County. In general, charter schools receive public funds but are not subject to all the rules and regulations that apply to other public schools. Rather, they are held accountable for producing academic results, which are laid out in a performance-based contract, or “charter.” Georgia law in 1993 authorized existing locally-controlled public schools to convert to charter schools and permitted the creation of “start-up charter schools.” Both are now referred to as “local charter schools.” In 1998, the Georgia legislature amended the statute to authorize the creation of state charter schools that are approved by the Georgia Board of Education. In 2008, the legislature passed the Georgia Charter Schools Commission Act, creating the “Georgia Charter Schools Commission” and “commission charter schools.” (A footnote in today’s opinion states that “state chartered special schools” established by earlier legislation are not at issue in this appeal, and “we intimate no opinion as to their status under the 1983 Constitution.”)
In this high-profile case, seven local school districts – Gwinnett, Bulloch, Candler, DeKalb, Atlanta, Griffin-Spalding and Henry – sued former state Superintendent Kathy Cox, the Department of Education, the Charter Schools Commission and three charter schools approved by the Commission. The school districts challenged the 2008 Act claiming, among other things, that the Georgia Legislature lacks constitutional authority to create the “commission charter schools” because they are not “special schools.”
In May 2010, the trial court ruled in favor of the charter schools on the constitutional claims and dismissed other claims. The judge found that the Act is constitutional and that commission charter schools are “special schools.”
Today’s opinion reverses that decision. The Georgia Constitution states that, “[a]uthority is granted to county and area boards of education to establish and maintain public schools within their limits.” This language, the majority opinion states, “continues the line of constitutional authority, unbroken since it was originally memorialized in the 1877 Constitution of Georgia, granting local boards of education the exclusive right to establish and maintain, i.e., the exclusive control over, general K-12 public education.”
“No other constitutional provision authorizes any other governmental entity to compete with or duplicate the efforts of local boards of education in establishing and maintaining general K-12 schools,” the opinion states. “By providing for local boards of education to have exclusive control over general K-12 schools, our constitutions, past and present, have limited governmental authority over the public education of Georgia’s children to that level of government closest and most responsive to the taxpayers and parents of the children being educated.”
The current Constitution also states, however, that “[t]he General Assembly may provide by law for the creation of special schools in such areas as may require them…” At issue in this case is whether “commission charter schools” qualify as “special schools.” Today’s majority opinion says they do not.
“As the language in the Act and the record in this case reflect, the commission charter schools established by the Commission pursuant to the Act are created to deliver K-12 public education to any student within Georgia’s general K-12 public education system,” the majority opinion says. “Commission charter schools thus necessarily operate in competition with or duplicate the efforts of locally controlled general K-12 schools by enrolling the same types of K-12 students who attend locally controlled schools and by teaching them the same subjects that may be taught at locally controlled schools.”
Conditions existing at the time of the adoption of the 1983 Constitution “reflected that ‘special schools’ were those that enrolled only students with certain special needs, e.g., adults, deaf or blind children and those that taught only certain special subjects, e.g., vocational trade schools with jobs-oriented curricula.” The consensus among the drafters of that Constitution was that special schools “were indeed those schools that enrolled only students with certain special needs or taught only certain special subjects,” the majority opinion says. The late House Speaker Thomas B. Murphy, who was a member of the Select Committee on Constitutional Revision, said in reference to the special schools provision: “The reason for this paragraph in the Constitution is it allows the General Assembly to establish schools for the blind, deaf, or people of that nature.”
To interpret “special schools” under the Constitution “as including those schools that are indistinguishable in every constitutionally significant manner from general K-12 schools established and maintained by local boards of education would render the ‘special’ in ‘special schools’ meaningless,” the majority states.
Today’s opinion concludes that, “[t]he record establishes uncontrovertedly that the Georgia Charter Schools Commission Act and the schools established thereunder represent the efforts of well-intentioned people, motivated by their genuine concern over the current condition of this State’s general K-12 public education, to provide the children of this State with an alternative and, in some cases, a superior educational opportunity. In holding the Act unconstitutional under the unique provisions of this State’s Constitution, we do not in any manner denigrate the goals and aspirations that these efforts reflect. The goals are laudable. The method used to attain those goals, however, is clearly and palpably unconstitutional.” Joining the majority are Justices Robert Benham, Hugh Thompson and P. Harris Hines.
In a dissent, Justice David Nahmias writes that “[c]ontrary to the majority’s untenable opinion, the 1983 Georgia Constitution does not prohibit the creation of the Charter Schools Commission or commission charter schools.”
Calling the majority’s reasoning “illogical” and its conclusion “overbroad,” the dissent says that today’s ruling effectively abolishes not only commission charter schools as unconstitutional but also the “state chartered special schools” created by the Charter Schools Act of 1998 and “any other ‘special school’ the General Assembly might dare to create.”
“Today four judges have wiped away a small but important effort to improve public education in Georgia – an effort that reflects not only the education policy of this State’s elected representatives but also the national education policy of the Obama Administration,” says the 75-page dissent. “That result is unnecessary, and it is unfortunate for Georgia’s children, particularly those already enrolled and thriving in state charter schools. It is equally unfortunate for this Court’s reputation as an institution that fairly and accurately interprets the law and exercises the judiciary’s most awesome power – the power to nullify laws enacted through the democratic process – only when that result is clearly and palpably dictated by our Constitution.”
References to “special schools” first appeared in Georgia law nearly a century ago. “What is notable about all of these references – by the General Assembly, the Justices of this Court, and the Judges of the Court of Appeals – is that they all equate ‘special schools’ to schools or school systems established separate from the statewide, county-based common school systems,” the dissent says. “Not once is there a suggestion that a ‘special school’ is defined by its students or curriculum.”
“The ordinary meaning of the constitutional text, its context and history, prior usage, and basic language and logic all support the conclusion that ‘special schools,’ as that phrase is used in the 1983 Constitution, are simply individual public schools that are created by the General Assembly separate from the general county and area school systems,” the dissent says. “Special schools certainly may include schools for students with special needs, like the existing area schools for blind and deaf children, and schools that teach special subjects, like vocational trade schools. But the Legislature’s authority is not limited to creating those two types of special schools.”
The majority’s “assertion that ‘local boards of education’ were given exclusive authority over public schools under our constitutions beginning in 1877 is simply inaccurate,” the dissent says. The 1877 Constitution contains no mention of local school boards, which are not mentioned until the 1945 Constitution. Furthermore: “The General Assembly has created schools and school systems independent of the common county systems since the early years of this State, and the 1983 Constitution restored its power to create such special schools (but not school systems) without any local system approval or participation.” Local school boards have never had exclusive control over general K-12 public education, “because that control has always been shared with and regulated by the General Assembly and, since 1870, by the State Board of Education and State School Superintendent as well,” the dissent says. “The majority may be able to change our law, but it cannot change our history.”
The majority’s concern that commission charter schools duplicate the efforts of local school boards in creating general K-12 schools is also misplaced, the dissent says, given that less than 1 percent of the state’s nearly 2,300 public schools are commission charter schools, state charter schools established by the 1998 act, or area schools for the deaf and blind.
The dissent says “[t]he majority is cagey about exactly what it is holding.” The majority argues that commission charter schools cannot be considered “special schools” because they do not differ in their student bodies or curricula from general public schools. Yet, “there are very few public schools that enroll a student body consisting only of girls, like Ivy Prep,” one of the three charter commission schools being sued. “If such an obvious factor as gender does not differentiate a student body, then what factors do?” the dissent says. “The majority does not say.”
According to the majority, the baseline to which a “special school” must be compared “is not the average or ordinary local school in Georgia but any local school that exists or might ever be created in our State – that is, any school that ‘local boards of education are also authorized to create,’” the dissent says. “Indeed, in rejecting the suggestion that a state chartered school’s unique operating charter is relevant, the majority says that, like the children in Lake Wobegon, in Georgia no public school is average.” The majority’s conclusion that a special school “must enroll students categorically different from those at a locally controlled school or teach subjects wholly unlike those that may be taught in locally controlled schools,” renders the Constitution’s special school provision “a dead letter,” the dissent says.
In conclusion, the dissent says that “the policy position that the majority of this Court reads into our Constitution today contravenes the education policy established by both our State’s Republican Governor and Republican-majority General Assembly that passed the 2008 Act and our nation’s Democratic President and the Democratic-majority Congress that funded the ‘Race to the Top’ Program from which Georgia has received $400 million in funding, in part due to the State’s multiple charter school authorizers.”
Judges have no special competence in education policy, and “litigation is ill-suited to gather the sort of information and make the sort of nuanced and balanced assessments required for good social policy,” the dissent says. “Courts should strike down education-related legislation only where the Constitution ‘clearly and palpably’ prohibits the policy determination at issue. That is not the case here.”
“But the policy debate and the political process no longer matter,” says the dissent. “The majority of this Court has announced the new policy and removed the issue from the political process, unless the General Assembly and the people of our State bear the delay and enormous burden required to correct the Court’s error through a constitutional amendment.” Joining the dissent are Presiding Justice George Carley and Justice Harold Melton.
Justice Harold Melton writes a separate dissent “to emphasize the fundamental principles at play in this case.” He writes that “even under the majority’s faulty constructs and its incorrect definition of ‘special schools,’ these principles, which the majority fails to apply, require a finding that the Charter Schools Commission Act of 2008 is constitutional.”
“Two bedrock rules of statutory construction govern in this matter,” his dissent says. The first is that “we must presume that the statute is, and was intended to be, constitutional.” The second is that short of a claim that the statute improperly impinges upon a First Amendment right, such as free speech, “the statute cannot be struck down unless it is unconstitutional in all of its applications….”
As to the first principle, even a cursory review of the Act supports the presumption it is constitutional, this dissent says. For example, in provisions related to cosponsors, the Act suggests that cosponsors should be sought out to maximize “access to a wide variety of high-quality educational options for all students regardless of disability, race or socioeconomic status, including students who have struggled in a traditional public school setting.”
“Even if one applies the majority’s definition of ‘special schools’ as those that ‘enrolled only students with certain special needs or taught only certain special subjects,’ these provisions unequivocally support a conclusion that the Act was not “unconstitutional,” the dissent says.
As to the second principle, “it is untenable to argue that the Act is unconstitutional in all of its applications or lacks a plainly legitimate sweep.” The existence of Ivy Preparatory Academy, an all-girls charter school and one of three sued by the local boards, “proves that the Act meets the majority’s constitutional test, as it has been properly applied to create a special school.”
The Georgia Legislature “created a law to provide for special charter schools to enhance our educational system, and it included evidence on the face of the statute supporting such a constitutional intent,” the dissent says. “Nevertheless, the majority looks beyond this basic principle to reach a result that simply cannot be explained in the context of the applicable law and the undisputed facts.”
Attorneys for Appellants (school districts): Michael J. Bowers, T. Joshua Archer, Joshua Moore, Thomas Cox, Gerald Edenfield, Susan Cox, Charles Aaron, Timothy Shepherd, A.J. Welch, Jr.
Attorneys for Appellees (charter schools): Bruce Brown, Jeremy Berry, E. Claire Carothers, Thurbert Baker, former Attorney General, Dennis Dunn, Dep. A.G., Stefan Ritter
–From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog
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259 comments Add your comment
East Cobb Parent
May 16th, 2011
8:10 am
I understand the ruling and the justification, however, I don’t understand why school boards did not approve some of the charters in the first place. There is not a perfect answer, but if the money followed the child (at the local level) then I think local districts would strive more to meet the needs of all their students. I don’t want to make this about Cobb, but I can tell you they are not meeting the needs of the gifted kids in MS and HS. Some times local control is all about CONTROL and the needs of the children be damned.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
8:12 am
So Georgia remains in 1877…and bottom of the educational barrel. I bet our school superintendents are dancing out in the streets this morning… ” Got all the money and all the power…don’t mess with me, folks!”
Atlanta Media Guy
May 16th, 2011
8:20 am
Looks to me the public has lost all control of the PUBLIC schools. Those with the biggest bags of money win! I think a school district that has FAILED to make AYP the last 6 years, like DeKalb, the stakeholders and taxpayers of that district should have the choice of making schools in their neighborhoods Charter. 6 years, 1.2 Billion dollars and DeKalb County kids are still not learning. Charters gave the locals a little more control of what is taught and how their school should operate. Seems to me there is a problem at DCSS. But the Supreme’s have made their choice, I guess the Big Guy in the White House will have the final say when the Feds take over the school systems with their National Curriculum.
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
8:25 am
The public has TOTAL control over public schools. It is up to the public to elect qualified and responsible school board members.
If you vote for idiots, then idiots will be running your schools.
In Georgia, we also vote for the State DOE person. However, we continue to vote for an idiot and thus, Georgia continues to have an idiot lead the State.
Fedup
May 16th, 2011
8:27 am
Maureen, can you provide the names of the specific current charter schools impacted?
Larry Major
May 16th, 2011
8:28 am
I guess we know why this one took longer than expected.
An appointed commission with unquestionable control over public school funding is now eliminated and control returned to elected officials.
The authority has been given back to the people.
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
8:31 am
Charter schools do nothing to resolve the real problems in education. All that happens is another branch of educational paperwork and politics is created.
Instead of “white flight” how about staying and work to fix?
Instead of “charter schools” how about staying and work to fix?
When will we learn?
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
8:32 am
An appropriate decision, in my view.
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
8:33 am
Any idea of how much in local dollars money has been diverted to these quasi-private schools and can the local systems get that money back?
EducationCEO
May 16th, 2011
8:36 am
@AtlantaMediaGuy – Please do not leave out Gwinnett. I believe we are going on our 7th or 8th consecutive year of NOT making AYP. Don’t give DeKalb all the glory:-)
What's really going on
May 16th, 2011
8:36 am
@East Cobb Parent – I couldn’t agree with you more on your point about why some of the schools were not approved locally in the first place. It is clearly not about the kids. I sincerely hope that in cases where commission approved schools are excelling and meeting the terms of their charter that there is some provision made by local boards of education to continue to fund the schools. To not do so would speak volumes about what is the focus (yet again) and it surely isn’t the students. Rather its the preservation of a public ediucation system that works ok for some but not nearly well enough for most.
I also agree with your point about money following students at the local level. However, sadly such a notion might be viewed by many to be as toxic to public schools as vouchers are considered to be. Many would rather support a public school system where we have de facto private schools in the public school system. How fair is that? Public is public. I can go to a public park, a public pool, a public recreation center, or a public library anywhere in the county, but not a public school. Actually, I’m sorry.. wait.. there’s always HB251 isn’t there? Good luck with that one. While that does facilitate transfers, if you’re considering a spot at one of the “private” public schools… good luck with those odds. Go figure… what’s really going on?
I am the teacher
May 16th, 2011
8:36 am
This is a good ruling. Hopefully, all of the “magic” that charter schools are supposed to create for a select student body can now be applied to the public school instead, especially the money spent! Creating charter schools and allowing the public schools to further decline is not sensible. Our democracy needs strong public schools. Public school money should go to public schools and not special interest groups. If a public school is not being run properly, then those in charge should be dismissed. There are enough rules in place if only they were followed as they were intended. We are not returning to 1877. We are looking to the future through unclouded glasses. This gives Georgia education a chance to pull out of bottom place if they do it right this time. Let’s pray we get it right this time. There is too much at stake.
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
8:38 am
@EducationCEO, thank you for pointing that out about Gwinnett. In all of the praise that Wilbanks, et al, receive, no one ever points out that Gwinnett Schools also fail to make AYP on a yearly basis.
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
8:41 am
@fedup, All of the commission charters now operating and those opening in the fall: Here is the list from the Georgia Charter Schools Commission :
New schools approved for the fall: Georgia Connections Academy, Cherokee Charter Academy (the county’s first charter school), Heritage Preparatory Academy and Chattahoochee Hills Charter School.
Existing schools: Georgia Cyber Academy, Atlanta Heights Charter School, Fulton Leadership Academy, the Museum School of Avondale Estate , Peachtree Hope Charter School, Coweta Charter Academy at Senoia, Heron Bay Academy and Pataula Charter Academy, Ivy Preparatory Academy in Norcross and the Statesboro’s Charter Conservatory for Liberal Arts & Technology
FBT
May 16th, 2011
8:44 am
A true loss for the children.
John
May 16th, 2011
8:45 am
This is a ruling that is a win for local communities. It returns to local communities the power to determine their own educational goals. If the State really wants to allow charter schools then it should fund those schools from State funds. This was always a terrible law due to be struck down, although I am not sure I find the court’s reasoning to be the most persuasive.
Nevertheless, it’s a loss for the children attending these schools. I feel for them. When the parents play politicking it’s the children who lose in the end.
decaturparent
May 16th, 2011
8:46 am
This is really pathetic. At least in the case of DeKalb County, parents tried to work within the system for years and years in under-performing schools before they finally bailed to create state approved charter schools like the one in Avondale. Everyone complains that parents want to escape and don’t want to get in an do the hard work that is needed to turn a school around. In Avondale, there were plenty of parents who tried very hard to turn their local school around, but the loser admins would have none of it. The parents had no other choice.
Sad, sad day for public education today. I’m not personally affected by it but I know many who are.
Disappointed
May 16th, 2011
8:50 am
I am very disappointed with the ruling. It is sad that these 4 justices are letting the big dollars of the big schoool systems sway thier thinking.. This is all about the Money, Gwinnett is greedy and is in fact developing and will bring it’s own online school system online this fall, offering 9-12, to keep/get more money. It is all about them not giving any of thier funds to other worthwhile school options. To the HS teacher, charter schools is an option to overcrowded, under performing schools, where teachers don’t teach to educate, they teach to the test and the kids learn nothing, it is about systems with way to many administrators, a school does not need a principal and 7 Ap’s. Will the state now have to give back the federal money they recieved for ahving this ability to establish charter schools?? I hope the legislature will change the laws to make these legal…
ABC
May 16th, 2011
8:54 am
Quoting HS Public Teacher: “Instead of “charter schools” how about staying and work to fix?
Because my children only get ONE chance at education and I am not willing to gamble that any effort on the parents’ part has any significant effect on the quality of education. At least not for MANY years, and I can’t afford to wait many years for a school to improve. My children need a good education now.
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
8:55 am
@decaturparent – If the Avondale parents were all that concerned, why didn’t they elect to the school board a person that would represent their interest?
It seems that rather than voting, they chose to work around the system to create their own system.
Charter Parent
May 16th, 2011
8:55 am
Truly a sad day for education in the State of Georgia….
It is clear that education is not a priority for this State…
Local control?!? What about letting parents control their portion of property taxes that help to fund education in their county/city and have true “school choice”. Let’s see how quickly the schools “reform”.
Charter schools are all about local control and high parental involvement…not about maintaining the status quo. Georgia…wake up!!
justbrowsing
May 16th, 2011
8:57 am
I am glad- there are plenty of non performing schools- charters included. I am not a fan of Charters as I feel that too much parental influence can further undermine student accountability. As for the monetary effects- unless the Commission can provide the money needed that local districts will not have to provide- then they need not approve them- seems the charter schools experiment has failed in other places- just look at Florida. It also appears they lack stability with maintaining sufficient teaching staff.
Derrick
May 16th, 2011
8:58 am
Dunwoody Mom: If you in fact live in Dunwoody, I can see why you think this is an appropriate ruling. Dunwoody has good public schools. The people in South DeKalb are likely to disagree with you. And that is just the problem with our school system in Georgia, and throughout the country. Poorer areas are completely left out. At least charter schools give a few students in those areas a fighting chance. For instance, the Museum school of Avondale Estates serves (or, served) an area of DeKalb County where the public schools have “Great School” ratings of 1 and 3 out of 10. Can’t imagine why parents wanted a different option.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
8:58 am
“It returns to local communities the power to determine their own educational goals.” The power has been there for hundreds of years…and Georgia only continues to FAIL. So let’s go back to business as usual and continue to fail. “Public school money should go to public schools and not special interest groups.” Public schools are run by school boards who ARE special interest groups and who have used and abused their power and …what do you think will be different now??? Now they know they can’t be challenged…Good ol’ boys and business as usual…WOW!
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
8:59 am
@Charter Parent – I have no children. Are you suggesting that I have control over my property taxes and can get my money back? Get real.
What's really going on
May 16th, 2011
9:00 am
@HS Public Teacher, 8:31am – I agree with you that more people should try to “stay and make it work” however, I think that today’s parent, for better or worse is privy to much more information about education than they ever have been. As a result, we have created more informed consumers of education. Of course you can debate how truly “informed” they really are, but the reality is they (we) are more informed. So I tend to think (and i may be wrong, however it’s the case for me) that we might have more people staying to try to fix their local schools if they felt that there was a framework or model in place where their opinion is valued and seriously considered when it comes to impacting what happens at the neighborhood school. Rather, what we have is a scenario where the most decision-making power and influence that parents have is how many jumpies they can have at the fall festival. While that is not meant to diminish the benefits of a fall festival and the level of planning that it requires to pull them off, that level of input/involvement simply will not suffice for today’s informed consumer parent. And yes I do realize that for those of us with the wherewithall, we can “work the system” to the benefit of our children, however, that’s gets old and tired. They system, itself needs to just work. School Councils are a joke. I’d venture to say that in most schools they are luck to meet twice a year and they do little to nothing to impact what happens on a day-to-day basis. PTA– hmm.. not trying to criticize, but I havent seen a PTA do much of anything to effect real change in a school. so what does that leave for involvement.. not much. Personally, I could never figure out why there aren’t more conversion charters in school systems seeing as though it would afford more autonomy at the local level, AND it is (in theory) a model that could actually empower local parents (via Governing Board) to effect real change at the school. Even converting to charter wouldn’t be utopia in all districts, however, it may serve to make the local community feel a bit more invested and that the school truly is “their” school. Right now… what happens if you dont like the math curriculum and you tell the principal or superintendent… they say Sorry, the state made us do it. Or what if you do not like the amount of PE that your child receives, or the lunch program, or any number of other things .. You continuaously are told someone else makes us do these things, and at timees you may be able to read between the lines a bit that the principal doent like it either. My point in those examples is exactly what about that scenario makes one feel like this is “our” school. What a joke! So what happens is life happens, and parents realize they havent the time or inclination to fight what seems to be a losing battel so they do what they can to get the next best thing and oftentimes for those with the means, it means they move, or home school, or try private. Of course moving (to a “better” school zone) doesnt solve everything as it’s still the same system per se.. however for parents the rationalization is at least the school looks better on paper as far as test scores go, parental involvement seems better, they have 5 jumpies at fall festival as opposed to one, there are after school science clubs, etc… list goes on. Until we make education truly about the kids and stop paying it lip service, I just don’t see any of this changing anytime soon.
Ed
May 16th, 2011
9:01 am
Sure, in theory it is in the power of parents to change their local schools through greater involvement, through chartering via their local school board, or even through electing a better school board. In Avondale, greater involvement was rejected by the school system, chartering via the local board was rejected by the board, and the county school board . .. well, we’ve got a convicted felon, a corporate puppet who openly admits his decisions are colored by “seeing race” and others all supporting a Friends & Family system that is quite literally an [alleged] criminal enterprise.
Over time, it could be changed, maybe. Parents whose kids are school-aged TODAY don’t have that time–that’s the basic issue: corrupt and incompetent school systems that will take years to reform vs. kids in school NOW. Constiutionally, the decision may be sound. For kids, it’s a lost opportunity.
Ernest
May 16th, 2011
9:02 am
I wonder if SACs will threaten to put the Georgia Supreme Court on probation because of the 4-3 vote?
Derrick
May 16th, 2011
9:03 am
What we need is a legislator with some political courage to propose a constitutional amendment to abolish local school boards. They exist primarily to waste tax payer money. There is no reason why the state school board could not fund schools individually and approve charters when the local schools are failing. No money should be wasted on the incompetence that is being displayed in districts like Atlanta and DeKalb.
Disappointed
May 16th, 2011
9:04 am
The point about now the money can go back to local schools is really kinda bogus! The local system has had Decades to improve the system and use the money and have failed! Vouchers and charter schools that excel and actually allow for the students to be taught and not just passed along is a much better idea. If school systems had to actually teach, and evaluate teachers on how they are teaching and how well the students are learning, it might get better. Let the free market determine what is done, if a public schoolis not educating my child well enough, I’d love to have the option to put them in a charter school that will actually teach them and not use my personal money to do this. I pay enough in taxes, and if my child is going to a charter school or online school, my school tax money should go there. It is time to do something to help the kids, and Charter schools are a good option to do that.
justjanny
May 16th, 2011
9:05 am
Oh, Happy Day! Sonny and his thugs just got out-voted! Under his “leadership”, a small group ruled to the detriment of the masses. Leave the money with the local school districts and provide guidance to help meet the local community needs. Again, Oh, Happy Day. Next…Go Fishing!
That's goofy
May 16th, 2011
9:06 am
Thank you GOP for sitting on your hands and not being proactive to change the laws. It is far more important to make sure guns are allowed in church and pass immigration laws then actually do something for GA’s students.
EP Mom
May 16th, 2011
9:08 am
@ABC: Right on! We simply don’t have time to wait for the public schools in our community to sort out their troubles. We’ve lived on the South side for 6 years, and if we’d been forced (because we couldn’t afford to sell our house in this market and because we’ve got two other children for whom we pay tuition) to send our child to the school for which we’re zoned…it just wouldn’t have happened. The schools in our community are largely unsafe, under-performing, and seemingly miserable.
At some point, there is no more time to stay and fix and long broken situation, namely the public schools in our area. Parents may not have the right to good education or even free education, but we certainly have a right to choice.
We heart our charter school and are thankful everyday that our child attends a school focused on academics and staffed by a passionate and dedicated faculty!
just watching
May 16th, 2011
9:09 am
@Fedup, you can find a list of all charter schools in GA at http://bit.ly/lNpfcX
The Commission charter schools are noted. There are 14 of them, with 3 being virtual schools.
As for this decision, is it really any surprise? Seriously.
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
9:11 am
@Derrick, I don’t believe voters would ever approve a disbanding of school boards. In many areas, parents can at least see their school board members at the grocery store and talk to them. If the power were vested in the Legislature, I think parents would feel they had no sway.
In fact, I would bet that voters in most parts of Georgia would disband the General Assembly before their local boards of education.
Maureen
Disappointed
May 16th, 2011
9:11 am
The legislature had to wait until the case was resolved. You can’t blame the GOP for this… Nice try. This case has been going through the court system for over 2 yers now. Now hopefully they will introduce an amendment that will stand up and get passed by the people to remove some of this control and give it back to the population
just watching
May 16th, 2011
9:12 am
Oops…..forgot to count some of the newer ones, there are now more than 15 (including ones slated to open next fall).
Jennifer
May 16th, 2011
9:12 am
There is no saving Georgia from itself.
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
9:12 am
@What’s really going on….
I agree with much of what you say. PTAs have little power. They play a supportive role and that’s about it for most schools. I have seen some schools where the PTA does carry a bit more clout – they complain about lack of supplies to the classroom and the principal responds (for example).
However, the “power” does not rest with the PTA but rather with the School Board. The parents of Avondale or any school need to take their concerns to that body. They have an elected official there to represent them. If that elected person doesn’t do their job, then they need to elect someone else.
This is the way of our political system. We have elected representation.
Better yet, why didn’t one of the concerned Avondale parents run for the school board position? This is the type of INVOLVEMENT that is needed!
redweather
May 16th, 2011
9:13 am
Based on the length of the main dissent (75 pages!!!), I assume Nahmias was assigned this appeal but couldn’t get the three votes in addition to his to uphold the Commission’s constitutionality.
CharterStarter
May 16th, 2011
9:14 am
To use an oft-used and abused phrase: “Make no mistake…”
This issue is not over.
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
9:14 am
@charterstarter, What would the next step be? And wouldn’t any other legal movement take years and years?
What will happen to the schools in the meantime?
Maureen
Mac
May 16th, 2011
9:14 am
Charter schools are a way of making sure all children receive a quality education. We have urban school districts where the kids cannot take books home, students are given crossword puzzles as extra credit to bring their grade up to passing. Many of these school systems have set the bar so low, because their only concern is meeting AYP and job securit Meanwhile, the students in the urban districts are not afforded the same resources as those in the strong academic school systems. So many of our children are being set up for failure, and the elimination of something that was serving as a positive alternative for the education of our children, is a sheer disgrace. Once again our children are victims of the system which is driven by the greed of money. Charter schools work…..but the powers that be refuse to recognize it by pretending to be blind.
School systems in Georgia need to be investigated.
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
9:15 am
Let’s talk about fair….
The Avondale Museum School has an FTE of 135 students..WELL BELOW the 450 FTE for full state funding. However, this school provides art, music, PE and a foreign langugage.
The elementary school my children attended has about 500 students and next year will have 1 PE, 1 Music, 1/2 an Art teacher and no foreign language. But, yet my tax dollars are going to support a small, small school which offers more than my local.
Sorry, wrong, wrong, wrong.
Hmm.
May 16th, 2011
9:17 am
Maureen,
Shouldn’t Georgia Cyber Academy be on the list as well? It looks like they were also approved by the Georgia Charter Schools Commission.
http://gcsc.georgia.gov/vgn/images/portal/cit_1210/7/24/168135916Georgia%20Cyber%20Academy%20Recommendation.pdf
Rod Johnson
May 16th, 2011
9:17 am
The death of America continues, thanks to public education and teacher unions.
Educating our youth is NOT a top priority of America. No – our top (and ONLY) priority is starting more illegal, unnecessary wars to benefit corporate lobbyists.
Our kids will be too stupid for real work…but not too stupid to join the asinine military and be cannon fodder for the Military Industrial Complex. Which is exactly the plan.
RIP America.
Disheartened and Stunned
May 16th, 2011
9:19 am
In a dissent, Justice David Nahmias asserted the ruling was too broad and that “four judges have wiped away a small but important effort to improve public education in Georgia.” I so totally agree with Justice Nahmias! When are we going to realize that changes are needed to improve education in GA. Our state is an embarrassment with low graduation rates, cheating scandals, loss of accreditation and local school boards who would rather squabble about power than focus on the real issues!! Charter schools were just beginning to offer some hope of change for Georgia’s children! I hope our legislators will NOT let this effort end here.
State Supremes To Low Income Georgia Students: You’ll Go To School Where You’re Told And You’ll Like It. — Peach Pundit
May 16th, 2011
9:20 am
[...] Charter schools around the State leaving those students in limbo. As Maureen Downey writes in her “Get Schooled” column: The decision is a major victory for school systems and local control but a setback to the [...]
Decaturite
May 16th, 2011
9:23 am
They made the right decision because what you had with this charter law was taxation without representation and money siphoned off from the regular public schools without voter input. Public schools are hurting badly financially, so opening up more schools and “brain draining” the traditional public schools isn’t a solution to anything. Competition is great, so if the state wants to fund these schools then they should do it on their on dime and not “steal” from the local districts. I feel sorry for the kids affected – and so happy that my kids are in Decatur Schools!
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
9:23 am
@Hmm, Thanks. I added. Maureen
Ga. Supreme Court overturns charter schools law – The Augusta Chronicle | Law Advice
May 16th, 2011
9:25 am
[...] to local districts. …Georgia Supreme Court overturns state charter school lawDaily JournalBreaking news: Supreme Court strikes down Charter Schools Commission in 4-3 vote.Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog)all 55 news [...]
justbrowsing
May 16th, 2011
9:25 am
Charter schools experience many of the same issues as your regular schools- problem is they have to maintain certain student numbers to stay afloat- how much “real” learning can happen in a situation like that? Who would be asked to leave for being a distraction in the classroom on a regular basis? Nobody- maybe we should give public schools the same lattitude offered charters.
Roach
May 16th, 2011
9:26 am
If the state wants to create something, let the state pay for it. No more unfunded mandates.
Most local school boards are a disaster for the kids and the communities, even when there is no headline-grabbing scandal. These board members serve themselves, their relatives on school payrolls, and their buddies–they don’t advance economic development and don’t foster intellectual growth and economic opportunity for the children. Show some courage and fix that.
Lenny
May 16th, 2011
9:26 am
This ruling is appropriate and correct. Groups who wish to start charter schools still have every right to do so, they just have to have all of the T’s crossed and I’s dotted during the application process. Many of the schools that were approved at the state level were denied at the local level because the groups applying simply did not meet all of the requirements to establish a school. If local groups feel charters are being denied without merit or reason they can replace school board members through the ballot box. And speaking of local control, the Charter Academy in Senoia was organized by Charter Schools USA, the Florida for profit group. I thought that was quite a disconnect to have public charter school in Georgia organized and administered by a for profit group from Florida. Where’s the local control in that?
Rod Johnson
May 16th, 2011
9:26 am
Public Schools suck due to one single reason: TEACHER UNIONS.
Throwing more money at these horrible, lazy, ignorant, awful people is NOT the solution.
Case in point: My 3rd grade children spent 1.5 hours on Friday WATCHING A DISNEY MOVIE.
IN CLASS.
“so the teacher could take a break and grade tests”.
And some of you say “Yeah – We need to THROW MORE MONEY at this system”.
Unreal. We’re a nation of braindead sheep and this ruling is a direct reflection of the Obama Administration’s love affair with archaic unions. Want to make a difference in America? Outlaw unions and start executing union bosses. That’d be a start, anyway.
Unions and union members suck.
Larry Major
May 16th, 2011
9:28 am
The dissent is remarkably long. The full Court decision is available at:
http://www.cpoga.org/supreme_court_ruling.pdf
Let's be real
May 16th, 2011
9:30 am
Bottom line, parents want to use public money to fund a “private” or “exclusive” education. I am all for wanting and trying to provide children with the best education possible, however, the educational landscape has now changed.
If parents really did their research they would find that money used to fund special education and the inclusion movement has really changed our educational system more than anything. I understand parents who have a child that needs accommodations to want those met, but the question is, “at what price to the greater society?” We now spend more money educating special needs children who will only be able to contribute so much to society and only a fraction of our resources to educate gifted students who can change our society. Is their any wonder we are falling behind other nations?
I am not against the local charter schools but I am against vouchers; if you want your child to have a private education, PAY FOR IT YOURSELF!
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
9:30 am
@Rod Johnson – there are no teachers unions in Georgia.
Tired of Poor Education
May 16th, 2011
9:30 am
I guess Cherokee County School Board is rejoicing, but I guarantee the over 2600 parents that registered their children for the Charter School is not. Does this not tell the board how unhappy that the parents of Cherokee County are? If they do not want parents to remove their children from their local school system then offer a better education. Strange the Charter Schools have to maintain a level of excellence or they get shut down, why do the local schools not have to do the same?
Since Charters are totally decided on by the local school system, parents who registered for a better education at the Charter School should unite at the board meeting and let them know this is what we want for our children. In the end, is that not what government is about…For The People, By The People!
To the HS Public Teacher: Many parents have fought the cause across GA and they should be applauded. After awhile though the years are passing and your child is still not getting the education they deserve; so they put their child first, instead of fighting an institution that REFUSES to change.
Derrick
May 16th, 2011
9:31 am
Maureen, I’m sure you are correct that voters would never approve of disbanding of local school boards. That says more about Georgia voters than it does about school boards. We’d rather vote for someone that we might meet at Piggly Wiggly than for someone who knows what the hell they are doing.
Private School Parent
May 16th, 2011
9:31 am
Hey Dunwoody Mom,
I like the way you think…..since I don’t have any kids in public school then I should not have to pay to baby sit those little criminals. I choose to associate with people who strive to achieve something in life and be a productive citizen rather than sitting around waiting on a handout.
Mr. T
May 16th, 2011
9:32 am
Well, there goes any chance for a decent public education in Georgia…..Teacher unions win……Children lose!
What's really going on
May 16th, 2011
9:32 am
@HS Public Teacher 9:12am – Realistically speaking however, can you blame the parents in Avondale for trying to go around the system to try to better insure their kids can access a quality education? The issue for me isn’t total hopelessness around whether the traditional public system can change; it can– anything is possible. Rather it’s the urgency around something needing to be different NOW…. for children who are currently in school. I support all choice options in varying degrees for right NOW. Six years from now, maybe we no longer need to have vouchers because the tradtional public now has it’s act together. Or maybe a tax supported scholarship is no longer needed. The point is that we need more options on the table, not less. If it only affords options to 10% of students, so be it. Who says choice reform efforts are the answer to all things wrong with education in America. They are not. However, for now they can serve as a stop-gap measure for some. In a military battle where one side is losing and their backs are against the provervial wall, does the commander keep running troops up the middle to get slaughtered… I think not. Rather at some point all options for survival have to be placed on the table and that may be done knowing that everyone will not be saved, however it is necessary to proceed nonetheless. If the tides later start to turn in the battle then of course the strategy can change. But at that moment when there is no end in sight to the slaughtering, one has to consider other options. That may not be the best analogy, but all i know is that it is totally unacceptable to expect parents to sit tight and wait.. things will get better… totally unacceptable. Even if the parents in Avondale ran for office and won as you suggest… it’s not a Board of one. There are other Board members to contend with who may not share their views, so their ability to affect change is diminshed again. What you are talking about could take a generation to change.
There’s nothing wrong with the concept of “public” education, however we are at a point where we need to decouple ourselves from the existing entrenched means of delivery of a public education where everyone simply sends their child to their local zoned school. Let the “public” dollars follow their child wherever their parents choose to send them, and that includes other public schools.
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
9:33 am
@Rod Johnson and Mr. T –
Please understand this. Please get this through your head. Please never ever get this wrong from this point forward…
In Georgia, THERE ARE NO TEACHER UNIONS!!!!!! It is illegal under State law for teachers to form a union.
Why is this so very difficult for you people to understand? There are professional organizations that teachers join, but they are very far from having any union powers at all.
Please get informed before you spout total crap.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
9:33 am
Thinking that parents can be actively involved in any public school is absolute foolishness.-yes, we can run a PTA, meaning fund raisers and nothing much else, we copy and staple papers, etc..but we can effect absolutely no input or change in a public school without a fight or a suit. Schools don’t want parents involved and they definitely do NOT want parental input about ANYTHING. Public school is about 3 things and in this order…Power, control, and complete control. Education is provided as the teachers and administrators see fit and is non-negotiable. When our kids’ teachers are strrong, dedicated, communicative teachers, we consider it a blessing… when they are not, we endure…it no longer even occurs to us to EXPECT cooperation, communication or the right to discuss issues with a teacher…the consequences are too great. I feel pretty sure that the expression “payback is hell” came about from a parent who tried to question a teacher.
Competition can only improve the situation.
gradstu
May 16th, 2011
9:34 am
This has implications for GA’s shelved school funding litigation as well. The court seems to set a precedent amenable to the state’s argument in all funding litigation, namely “we give all of this money to local boards and it is not our fault if they screw things up for kids.” Can a local board then be sued for misusing public funds in the education of kids? In most other states, the courts find that the state has ultimate responsibility and that the authority of local boards is granted only to the extent that they implement the state’s will. This seems to be a different kind of ruling.
GA Voter
May 16th, 2011
9:34 am
These school boards focus on the needs of adults, not children. Charter schools and school choice more generally focus on individual students. When can we vote the justices off the court??
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
9:34 am
@GA Voter – Why not vote for a good person on the SCHOOL BOARD????
Let's be real
May 16th, 2011
9:35 am
Public Schools suck due to one single reason: TEACHER UNIONS.
Throwing more money at these horrible, lazy, ignorant, awful people is NOT the solution.
Case in point: My 3rd grade children spent 1.5 hours on Friday WATCHING A DISNEY MOVIE.
IN CLASS.
“so the teacher could take a break and grade tests”.
And some of you say “Yeah – We need to THROW MORE MONEY at this system”.
Unreal. We’re a nation of braindead sheep and this ruling is a direct reflection of the Obama Administration’s love affair with archaic unions. Want to make a difference in America? Outlaw unions and start executing union bosses. That’d be a start, anyway.
Unions and union members suck
______
Note: there are no teachers unions in GA
Note: if the class could work on assignments and activities without putting their hands on each other, running to the teacher’s desk every 5 minutes to go to the bathroom, ask 20 times ,”what is it we have to do again?”, then this teacher could give them educational work while they grade their papers.
I don’t blame teachers anymore for not taking work home to grade outside of the school day since they have been furloughed as well as been made the scapegoat for all of the educational cuts.
Maybe the reason the teacher had to play a 1.5 movie so the class would be quiet is because that is how the majority of those kids were taught at home to be quiet, by being sat in front of a tv.
Once again you have to be certified to be a teacher but you do not have to be certified to be a parent. Anybody can not be a teacher but just about anybody can contribute to bringing a child into the world.
South Cobb parent
May 16th, 2011
9:35 am
@Private School Parent
It is completely offensive to call public school students “criminals” and a public education a “handout.”
Mr. T
May 16th, 2011
9:37 am
@ HS Public Teacher
In Georgia, after 3 years, public school teachers receive what’s commonly called “tenure,” a special employment protection that teachers unions defend. As the below federal statistics indicate, tenured teachers (as opposed to less-senior “probationary” teachers) are practically impossible to fire.
Fulton Observer
May 16th, 2011
9:38 am
Local School Boards will now attempt to get back the money already spent to educate students at a greater level than their home schools evidently could have ever accomplished. FTE money SHOULD follow the students when they are attending school in the same district! What is the fuss about affidavits for if not. I for one am sick and tired of the mess these sad school boards are putting out there, fighting to keep students from a good education. It’s a travesty!!! This should be appealed all the way up to the high courts. The education of GA students will always be a disgrace to the nation and the good old boys will always see to it that it stays there.
Let's be real
May 16th, 2011
9:40 am
Public schools WANT PARENTAL INVOLVEMENT! What public schools do not want are parents who think just because they volunteer that their child should receive straight A’s, be placed in the TAG program (especially if they do not belong), have the best teachers and students in their class every year, and all sorts of other demands they can get by going to a private school.
Derrick
May 16th, 2011
9:41 am
Dunwoody Mom: Do you think that if the Museum School closes your kids will get better PE and foreign languages? DeKalb’s problems were not caused by charter schools; charter schools are an imperfect solution to DeKalb’s problems, which are really state-wide problems. I live in the area served by Museum School. I wish I had the option of sending my daughter (who is not school aged yet) to a Dunwoody public school. Instead, I will probably end up sending her to private school, or moving into the City of Decatur. For most of my neighbors, however, neither are serious options. I find that to be sad. But, I don’t know, maybe I’m wrong … maybe Dunwoody residents will get a new gymnasium out of it. Somehow, though, I don’t think any money saved will end at Avondale Elementary.
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
9:43 am
@Mr. T –
Again, you are simply and totally wrong. Teacher tenure was outlawed in the State of Georgia many years ago. It is nothing like college professor tenure where they cannot be fired.
A few school systems in GA (not all) have their own version of tenure. This is where a teacher that has been employed by that school system for more than 3 years may request a formal explanation for their termination. That’s it. That’s all it means. Nothing more.
Many teachers with more than 3 years of experience do not get offered a contract for another year. All that they can do is request a formal explanation – and this may be in writing or verbally in front of the school board. I have never heard of the decision ever being reversed.
Again, Mr. T, please become informed before you spout total crap.
Rod Johnson
May 16th, 2011
9:44 am
To “Let’s Be Real”: Those who can, do. Those who can’t, Teach.
I don’t care whether GA Teachers are unionized. Unions are the root of our nation’s education problems. And the typical response of “Spend more $$$” guarantees nothing whatsoever…other than more $$ being spent on thoroughly-underqualified loser teachers who let their kids watch TV in class, rather than learn.
Don’t get me wrong – I’d much rather waste $$ on American teachers than Lost Afghanistan, idiot Iraq, and asinine Libya. But at the end of the day, it’s still wasted money while our children’s futures burn, burn, burn away.
But hey – there’s always the loser military to join for those who can do absolutely nothing else in life.
B. Killebrew
May 16th, 2011
9:45 am
Smart decision.
Mr. T
May 16th, 2011
9:45 am
@ HS Public Teacher : Maybe you are the one that needs to be educated..required reading for you…..http://coefaculty.valdosta.edu/lschmert/gera/vol3no1/Tenuress-grubbs.pdf
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
9:46 am
@Derrick – not the point. If my children cannot have access to the same academic offerings as those provided at a school, for which my tax dollars go to support, then why should the children at Avondale have those? If The Museum School is so great, and it cannot survive without local dollars, then I am sure that the parents of the children attending Museum School would be willing to open up their pocketbooks a pay a little tuition….Don’tyou think?
Ed
May 16th, 2011
9:47 am
@Lenny:
“Groups who wish to start charter schools still have every right to do so, they just have to have all of the T’s crossed and I’s dotted during the application process.”
Rainbows and puppies for everyone!
If you seriously believe there is no venality and politics involved, that all you have to do is double-space correctly and you’re home free, I’ve got a bridge in Brooklyn that may interest you.
RoberTee
May 16th, 2011
9:48 am
If you want a charter school make your current school a charter school. Show up and get involved the same amount of hours in your current school as the charters require. Give the teachers the same flexibility as the charter school teacher. Scores and learning would improve dramatically when you have a troublemaker’s parent sitting next to them, or a student that refuses to work explaining to their parent why they won’t work. How about the uncooperative parent who ignores their child, the teachers requests and their child’s education having to work among parents who care and explain why they won’t make Johnny do his homework. What an effect on the education and the makeup of a BOE that would have; a large number of informed parents that know the issues forcing change through a BOE.
School Ratings Thread - Start One & Keep On Top? - Page 39 - City-Data Forum
May 16th, 2011
9:49 am
[...] Breaking news: Georgia Supreme Court strikes down Charter Schools Commission in 4-3 vote. | Get Scho… [...]
Let's be real
May 16th, 2011
9:49 am
To “Let’s Be Real”: Those who can, do. Those who can’t, Teach.
I don’t care whether GA Teachers are unionized. Unions are the root of our nation’s education problems. And the typical response of “Spend more $$$” guarantees nothing whatsoever…other than more $$ being spent on thoroughly-underqualified loser teachers who let their kids watch TV in class, rather than learn.
Don’t get me wrong – I’d much rather waste $$ on American teachers than Lost Afghanistan, idiot Iraq, and asinine Libya. But at the end of the day, it’s still wasted money while our children’s futures burn, burn, burn away.
But hey – there’s always the loser military to join for those who can do absolutely nothing else in life.
____
It is this attitude that has lead to many VERY TALENTED teachers to leave the profession and then have people like you wonder, “where are all the good teachers?” The answer, like many doctors, they are now in “private practice” making more more tutoring, writing curriculum, and teaching home school students.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
9:50 am
For every problem you blame the parents. I agree that there are parents who are lazy and shiftless and times have changed. And maybe, some teachers don’t know how to manage a classroom…oh, no! that couldn’t be possible, silly me. Funny, though, I’ve had kids in public school for 25 years, I’ve helped in their classrooms and those classrooms are not out of control…usually only one or 2 mischief makers.. All the kids my children are friends with have extremely conscientious parents and the kids are well-behaved and good students…so PLEASE stop making it look like all students are hoodlums and monsters with crappy parents…just ain’t so!
Velian Hill
May 16th, 2011
9:50 am
This is an excellent ruling. Maybe now we can get to work on shutting down private schools and home-schoolers. Children should go to their local public school and quit complaining.
JM
May 16th, 2011
9:51 am
How can a local school board possible sponsor the Georgia Cyber Academy? It has students attending from districts in the entire state.
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
9:52 am
@Jm, The systems could agree– via a school board vote – to pay something per each of their children in the school.
The problem is that some of the brick and mortar regional charters do not have the blessing or the support of their area boards. I doubt they will see an voluntary sharing of funds.
Maureen
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
9:52 am
@Rod Johnson – LOL!!!! Do you even read your own posts?
Your logic: Teacher unions are the problem with GA education. GA does not have teacher unions. However, the teacher unions are still at fault.
You seem so torn up about that one teacher that showed a movie in class. Have you even thought to email the department chair, or the assistant principal, or the principal?
There are bum people in every profession. Even in the medical field, the news regularly reports of bad doctors. Do not fault an entire profession based on one event on one day from one person!
BTW – Even the military now requires at least a High School education.
Let's be real
May 16th, 2011
9:53 am
RoberTee
May 16th, 2011
9:48 am
If you want a charter school make your current school a charter school. Show up and get involved the same amount of hours in your current school as the charters require. Give the teachers the same flexibility as the charter school teacher. Scores and learning would improve dramatically when you have a troublemaker’s parent sitting next to them, or a student that refuses to work explaining to their parent why they won’t work. How about the uncooperative parent who ignores their child, the teachers requests and their child’s education having to work among parents who care and explain why they won’t make Johnny do his homework. What an effect on the education and the makeup of a BOE that would have; a large number of informed parents that know the issues forcing change through a BOE.
_____
That is what happpened at Riverwood High school which is a great school.
Tired of Poor Education
May 16th, 2011
9:53 am
HS Public Teacher: You have been in the system way too long or just beginning. Idealistic thinking does nothing to get anything done in the school system. Do you really believe that parents who want a better education through the Charter are just lazy and have not tried to change things? Private schools thrive because the public education is IMPOSSIBLE. Does our rating at the bottom not tell you teachers something? Maybe if you stood up and fought for the children in your school and class, maybe the school system might take notice.. Oh I forgot you might get fired and not get tenure. Because you may not have a union, but Tenure is everything, because you don’t have to teach then, and you can’t get fired!
I applaud all the parents in Georgia for all the hard work you have put forth to change public education, not only for your children but for all the children of Georgia. Unfortunately, the Board of Education does not hear us, because nothing has changed since I came to GA in 1983 and I fought the battle hard as well.
Private School Parent
May 16th, 2011
9:53 am
South Cobb,
Too bad the truth hurts…..city of Atlanta public schools is a fine example of criminals sitting around waiting on a handout. Let some of those deadbeats finance their own child’s education…..oh that’s right they can’t find their baby dady to help out with actually raising and being involved with their offspring.
Rod Johnson
May 16th, 2011
9:55 am
To “Let’s Be Real”:
Like I said, I FAVOR shoveling more money to good teachers and getting the hell out of the failed Middle East….but not to all teachers regardless of performance. But teachers do NOT want ‘performance metrics’. gee, I wonder why? Everyone else “in the real world” generally gets raises based on their own performance. Teachers DO NOT want the same standard for them – they just want $$$ shoveled at them.
I favor more $$ for teachers along with performance-based pay-scales.
I favor returning Disciplinary Actions to teachers as well…that includes the Right To Spank kids. This policy worked fine for every American over the age of 35. Right now though, teachers can’t even defend themselves from thug kids without getting sued.
The whole thing == Dead America. We’re creating a nation of totally ignorant children, we’re spending far more $$$ on asinine Social Security and Medicare (Entitlement crap), and even more $$ on more failed American wars overseas that benefit noone outside the military-industrial complex.
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
9:57 am
There is a difference between parental involvement, which all school officials promote, and parental interference. The two are totally different.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
9:58 am
@Let’s be real ..”Public schools WANT PARENTAL INVOLVEMENT! What public schools do not want are parents who think just because they volunteer that their child should receive straight A’s, be placed in the TAG program (especially if they do not belong), have the best teachers and students in their class every year, and all sorts of other demands they can get by going to a private school.”
Horse manure!!!!- that’s the same bogus argument used to punish a whole class of students for the actions of a few. Grow some courage, tell parents who step over the line that they can’t and move on. We are NOT all trying to get favors for our children…SOME of us are trying to make your life easier so you can teach our children..and that is a FACT!!
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
9:58 am
@Mr. T – LOL! In your own link, it clearly states that Georgia Teacher tenure was eliminated by Roy Barnes in 2000.
The Fair Dismissal Act of 1975 is still in place. And, that is what I referred to as having an explanation for not offerring a contract.
What is your point???? There is no teacher tenure for k-12 in Georgia!
CB
May 16th, 2011
9:58 am
Whatever your position on charter schools, this decision was the only possible outcome based on the way the law (in this case, the GA Constitution) is written.
Of course, some of the folks howling the loudest that the judges should have ignored the law are the ones that decry “judicial activism” when it’s a lib’rul cause…
Rod Johnson
May 16th, 2011
9:59 am
For the record, my wife & I are very active at our kids’ elementary school PTA. The only thing that gets us is time spent volunteering. We’ve zero input on the curriculum, how money is being spent, how teachers are rated, etc.
Which is by design, of course. These lazy work-6-hrs-day teachers simply want to find someone else to shovel their workload off on.
Tired of Poor Education
May 16th, 2011
10:02 am
HS Public Teacher: I think you need to go visit your local public elementary school. It is not just one class, one teacher or one event. There is a party at least 2 times a month, fun Friday every week, and oh the reviews the teacher has to go over and over so they pass the CRCT test which is such a waste. There is so much time on review that nothing is learned.
Oh and the best yet, 2nd grade is a review year for all the students to make sure that NO CHILD IS LEFT BEHIND and they catch those who do not know the material. What do you think happens to the rest of the class? I do not think that is the best use of our school system. Have special programs for those who are behind, they need an education just as much as those who are moving on faster, but QUIT holding back the majority for the few.
Elementary school has become a joke. My daughter is a HS teacher and a tutor; she tells me these High School kids she teaches are lost from one basic thing…the basics they should of learned in elementary school. And yes most parents have gone to the teacher, principle and board of education, but NOTHING is ever done…
My grandchildren watch more movies and cartoons at school than they do at home.
bbb
May 16th, 2011
10:02 am
If the real concern is “taxpayers and parents,” then the state approved charters would stand. The real concern, however, of the suing entities is the greedy and power-hungry local school districts. These systems are intimidated by the potential success of charter schools that don’t have to work in the administration-heavy school systems that NEVER consider the welfare of the child when doing the “business” of school. If parents were satisfied with the local school systems, they wouldn’t fight for their children to have other opportunities through these charter schools. It is the PARENTS AND TAXPAYERS who are fighting for these schools. SO, get the school systems OUT of the argument.
North Fulton Mom
May 16th, 2011
10:05 am
Honestly, I don’t understand why this ruling is even controversial. I don’t have a problem with charters but I don’t see how anybody can argue that it’s ok for the state to overrule an elected local school board and direct funding away from a system that taxpayers support. The State Commission is an appointed group so voters have no direct say in who gets to sit on the commission, which imo is an unjustifiable funding mechanism.
Public schools aren’t perfect by any means but in my experience, communities with strong public schools tend to have strong local support. In those communities, a state commission with the power to swoop in and siphon away funding will suffer.
Rod Johnson
May 16th, 2011
10:05 am
To “Tired”: Spot on post there. It all starts in elementary schools….which are complete, miserable failures that only teach to the Lowest Common Denominator.
We need to move past the error, er, era of ” Don’t Hurt The Child’s Self Esteem” liberalism and return to teaching the 3 Rs.
As every adult in this thread knows, “reality” does not give a crap about your self esteem. It’s time our kids learn that, same way we all did growing up.
Tired of Poor Education
May 16th, 2011
10:07 am
To Rod: I am right there with you…
SenoiaDawgs
May 16th, 2011
10:15 am
So for all of the arguments posted here today I have one real life example and the effect of Charter schools. My daughter who attended a public elementary school in Coweta hated Kindergarten solely because of her teachers. There is a long list of reasons and every single parent of this teachers class was reporting the same thing. This teacher was 2 years from retirement and had nothing left in her “tank” but riding out the days until retirement. All but 1 student in that class chose to have their child attend Coweta Charter Academy in Senoia. These students all first graders now, have excelled at CCA and show a genuine love for school now. It’s amazing how hiring qualified teachers can have such an impact.
To the poster that mentioned CCA and it being run by a Florida company that is for profit and making it sound like a bad thing, there are businesses all over the world that are in business to make a profit. CSUSA obviously has their act together or they would have already folded as a for profit company. I dread the thought of my daughter going back to our district school and pray there is some way that the expansion of CCA continues and the doors remain open.
Lenny
May 16th, 2011
10:16 am
Ed, of course I know politics are involved. There are few things left where politics are not involved, especially in institutions administered by elected officials. But, local communities can vote board members out of office who are anti-charter school. Just because a local school board denies a charter doesn’t always mean it is antagonistic to the charter school movement as a whole. Some charters are denied because the applicants have not done their due diligence to ensure all of the requirements for starting a school have been met. For example, Coweta County is listed as one of the systems involved in the law suit, yet they have one of the most successful, if not the most successful charter school in the state and nation, the Central Education Center. Just because a charter is denied doesn’t always mean there is a nafarious reason behind the decision. If there is, then the people in the affected community should vote new board members into office.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
10:16 am
@Rod Johnson: While I disagree that all the teachers are lazy , 6h -a-day … I do agree that PTA nothing but a tool for fundraising- there is absolutely no parent-teacher function there. The name should be the Parent Fund-raising Association. Boy, was I surprised when I became a parent and discovered that I had no avenue at all to discuss any issues that I had..and that this is absolutely intentional. No ear to hear when my son could read before kindergarten and I asked for books for him to read while she was teaching the alphbet ( I don’t have time for “extra stuff’). Absolutely no ear to hear when a teacher deemed my daughters’ skort too short without measuring and 75.00 worth of skorts needlessly to waste. No ear to hear when my daughter’s book bag was so heavy it threw her over backward- (’ a rolling book bag would get in the teacher’s way”) No ear to hear when bullying was a problem (”we have never witnessed those behaviors”). No ear to hear when the kids were not allowed to go to the bathroom (all day long) and I had to stop on the way home from school so she could go. And that doesn’t even touch the educational concerns, (kindergarten worksheets handed out for busy work in a 10th grade English class.). Watching the movie made of a book instead of reading the actual book… Is it any wonder parents who cannot afford private schools are trying to find alternatives??
Local School Board Supporter
May 16th, 2011
10:17 am
Bottom line is this: You cannot divert public funds for schools under the pretense of being chartered when it is really a private effort. The court ruling was correct, whether most of you want to hear it or not. If Georgia is such a rotten state when it comes to education, then make a decision! Your options: Move back to where you came from or move to another school district.
Archdawg
May 16th, 2011
10:19 am
Charter Schools have been a very positive factor in the re-population of much of DeKalb County and the City of Atlanta. They provide an alternative to expensive private schools or the failing local school systems. The overall property tax receipts have increased over the last decade due to a increase population in the Urban Metro core and increasing property values resulting from the growth and development. That has created more revenue to share with the entire Public School systems including Charter Schools (although the recession has hurt tremendously). Everyone has benefitted, the tax money that is being ‘diverted’ to Charter Schools likely would not have existed without this growth. This is not an isolated phenomenon either, it has happened in most Urban centers across the country. This is one reason why many leaders in political circles, both left and right, support the Charter School movement.
Opponents of the Charter School movement can’t get past the fact that they are giving up some of their control. If they effectively kill Charter Schools in Georgia you will see a reversal of the Urban Growth that has been so positive for the Core Metro area. Residents with school age children will begin to relocate back to the outer suburbs in search of better schools, leaving behind vacant houses left to be sold cheaply or rented lowering all property values (even more) and reducing the tax rolls.
As a parent of a soon to be school age child in East Atlanta/Grant Park I am currently facing the ‘School Dilema’ that everyone in our peer group is struggling with; Charter School, Private School, or Move. If the choice of Charter School is taken away then my options are either find an affordable Private School or move away from the City of Atlanta. Since my water bill is outrageous, my property taxes very high, and crime is still an issue the idea of paying for private school is not very palatable.
So go ahead and cut your nose off to spite your face, just don’t expect everyone to stick around and live with your decisions.
Educator for Life
May 16th, 2011
10:19 am
This is pathetic. Who cares how the schools get chartered? If they work, they work. If not, close them and move on. I just don’t understand Georgia. Why in the world would a charter school open under the local board anyway.? Isn’t that the reason for opening? If I want to do differently than Clayton, Cobb, DeKalb, Fulton, and Gwinnett, why would I want to be under their umbrella? Come on man!
Rod Johnson
May 16th, 2011
10:21 am
To “Philosopher” – PFA – Parent Fundraising Association…..hey, I like that – it’s 100% accurate.
Those in this thread who’re preaching “More Parental Involvement” clearly have no idea what they’re talking about. Wife & I have been trying this tactic since kindergarten and have gotten nowhere. Thus our rush to try to get our kids out of the failed school system they’re in and into a charter school. If public schools were as awesome as some of you are trying to make them out to be, why are thousands of parents seeking to leave???
Find the root of the problem
May 16th, 2011
10:21 am
Once again, if people did their research and understood that our educational system began this “downward spiral” when laws were passed to mandate funding (and a lot of of it) to special education. How many private school have special education programs? Even in cases where a family can get a public voucher for a private education when their child has unique special education needs (which I support), they have difficulty finding a private school who will accept their child.
The inclusion movement has really slowed the development of educating those students who are “in the middle” because they often are grouped with students who have accomodations. The teacher can only move the class so fast so if a child has “finished their assignment” but you have a few students on accomodations needing two extra days to complete their assignment, then the rest of the class has to “wait and suffer”. Then boredom ensure, etc. etc. Teachers/schools do not want to be sued for not meeting a child’s accomodations. Stand alone classrooms are no longer accepted so you will continue to see a great amount of $$ and teacher time being spent on a student that is less likely to go to college or trade school than being put on a student who has the ability to further their education. This is part of the reason parents have become frustrated with public education and I don’t blame them.
Antoher part has been the ESOL funding and the mandate to educate every child whether they are here illegally or not. I understand that it is better to have a child in school than not, but when my child’s teacher has to spend more individual time with a student who can not speak or read English instead of the rest of the class, who benefits the most; the child who can not speak English.
It is plenty of frustration and blame to pass around but no one wants to say, hey, let’s start grouping these kids by ability. Hey, let go back to self contained classrooms for special needs students. Hey, lets create a school or charter school where the majority of non-English speaking students attend during elementary school. Although they will not be popular at first, they would produce some positive results for all students if implemented correctly.
Teacher Reader
May 16th, 2011
10:23 am
Anger and sadness is how I feel right now. Our children are the losers in this. Many of our public school systems are failing our children. Too many of our children aren’t receiving an education. The reason that most charter schools are not approved by the county school system is fear of the charter school offering a better education than they can for a lot less money. You see most public school systems, or at least DCSS, has lost it’s focus on educating the children who live in the county and instead focus on the jobs that the district can create.
This is a sad day in Georgia, and one that has cemented my thoughts to homeschooling. Hopefully that won’t be taken away next.
Write Your Board Members
May 16th, 2011
10:23 am
Archdawg
Most charter schools in the city of Atlanta are not part of this ruling as they were approved by the local school board. This ruling does not impact NCS or other area charters.
As to the Avondale community, they tried for years to work to improve Avondale Elementary. This is a school that has horrible leadership and unbelievable teacher turnover. I do not blame them one bit for forming this school. On the other hand, Heron Bay was a joke.
Local School Board Supporter
May 16th, 2011
10:28 am
When you moved to Atlanta, did you not know about the school system? When you moved to Atlanta, did you not know about the high taxes, screwed up water system and HIGH crime? So when you decided to have children WHILE living in Atlanta, what did most of you think ….Atlanta was going to magically change over night? Young Gentrifites who moved into the city of Atlanta knew the risks and now want to whine and complain about a school system that doesn’t work for them all of a sudden.
Find the root of the problem
May 16th, 2011
10:30 am
Georgia, already the bottom of the barrell, took a huge step back today. Good job idiots! Enjoy your constitution, hope it’s worth more than the education of a few thousand kids!
____
Get the constitution changed.
Rick
May 16th, 2011
10:31 am
Dunwoody Mom,
Many of us don’t have the quality of schools that you no doubt have. My wife and I have lived in Grant Park for 14 years. Loving our neighborhood, after having 3 kids we decided to stay because a charter elementary (NCS) and middle school (ACMS) were established. Those two high-achieving schools have become the anchors of our community and have helped stave off white flight and suburban sprawl. Our kids are thriving in a TRULY diverse and educational environment, and we have a real community because of these schools.
Charter schools do not cost taxpayers any more than traditional schoold do. In fact, believe it or not, charters in the City of Atlanta are alloted less $ per student than are traditional schools, and thus are forced to do more with less.
Georgia, already the bottom of the barrell, took a huge step back today. Good job idiots! Enjoy your constitution, hope it’s worth more than the education of a few thousand kids!
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
10:35 am
@Rick – if you are referring to the “Neighborhood School”, this was a charter school that was approved by APS. The decision to allow this was done at the “local level” – which is the argument at the heart of this controversy.
bob leblah
May 16th, 2011
10:35 am
Can someone enlighten me to how students get in to charter schools. Is it is a lottery or is it based on merit? Other factors?
Archdawg
May 16th, 2011
10:36 am
Local School Board Supporter,
I moved to Atlanta because as an Architect I believe in the quality of life that an Urban City ‘CAN’ afford. I want Atlanta be be better than it is currently, and I’ve worked throughout my career to make it better. In my opinion Charter Schools are part of that solution.
Your comments underly your attitude perfectly though and I thank you for letting everyone see your thoughts. You really don’t care about the quality of the Educational System as long is it is under ‘your control’.
What I’m saying to you is that if you want to keep that control no matter the cost don’t complain when Atlanta once again returns to it’s Pre-Olympic days and you have even less money to spread througout the schools system, the police force, water system, etc…
Derrick
May 16th, 2011
10:37 am
Dunwoody Mom: I understand your point, and sympathize with your position. The answer to your question, though, is that your kids have access to a quality (or at least passable) public school whereas the kids in Avondale do not. Most of the population served by Avondale and Midway Elementary schools simply could not afford to pay tuition as you suggest. I called charter schools an imperfect option because ideally everyone would have access to quality public education. Reality is different, however. Under the circumstances, I have little sympathy for residents of areas served by above-average public schools who complain about divergence of tax dollars. If those of us in other areas are forced to send our kids to private schools, we are still forced to fund your child’s public education.
N GA Blues
May 16th, 2011
10:37 am
What I have not yet seen anyone mention is that in many of the RURAL counties, a school chartered by the local board simply isn’t feasible. I live in a county with fewer than 5,000 total public K-12 students— and there is ONE traditional private school. Without public virtual charter schools that only require Georgia residency (not residence in a specific county), my public options will effectively be reset to ZERO.
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
10:40 am
@Derrick, but you want me to pay to have other students have opportunties that my own children wouldn’t have? Um…no.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
10:41 am
@Local School Board Supporter: Most of us living here with children would love to be somewhere with a decent school system…we’re here because of jobs requred to feed our families …you know JOBS. So since we have to be here, we have every right to do whatever we can…which sadly, in this state is very little if you can’t afford private school- to improve the situation. Complaining loudly to shed light on a good ol’boy, broken system and trying to create find alternatives if we can is also our right. Besides, maybe in some years to come, the education system in this state might possibly get better because some of us didn’t shut up and sit down as others would have us do.
SenoiaDawgs
May 16th, 2011
10:41 am
To bobleblah: I can tell you that for Coweta Charter Academy you apply and are placed in a lottery if the there are more requested enrollments than classroom seats. The school here is a public school and anyone residing in Coweta County has the opportunity to attend.
LT from Atlanta
May 16th, 2011
10:43 am
Now that Georgia Supreme Court struck down Charter Schools Commission, a major cause for them to win $400 million “Race to the Top” federal funding, in 4-3 vote, should the state be ineligible for and/or lose such funding? What the court did was establish fundamental principles different from Race to the Top core principles of “implementing coherent, compelling, and comprehensive education reform.”
Educator for Life
May 16th, 2011
10:44 am
@ bob leblah, most charte schools will have a lottery if the number of applicatns exceed the number of spaces available. It is that simple.
Ed
May 16th, 2011
10:44 am
Deacturite noted:
“money siphoned off from the regular public schools without voter input. Public schools are hurting badly financially . . .if the state wants to fund these schools then they should do it on their on dime and not “steal” from the local districts.”
Slightly off topic, but that’s a good argument against the “equalization” process by which the state funnels money from a handful of “urban” school districts (most of which aren’t doing all that well, BTW) to “rural” districts, thus enabling the latter to keep property taxes lower. If state charters are an unconsitutional imposition of the state on local control, it seems “equalization” might be as well.
Educator for Life
May 16th, 2011
10:44 am
@ bob leblah, most charter schools will have a lottery if the number of applicants exceed the number of spaces available. It is that simple.
Northside APS Parent
May 16th, 2011
10:44 am
Any evidence that charter schools as a whole improve outcomes seems to be isolated and anecdotal — there are high-performing and low-performing charter schools just like there are high-performing and low-performing traditional public schools, and high-performing and low-performing private schools. However, local charter schools, operating within local school systems, can be effective ways for parents to be more involved in their children’s education. As an active APS parent for the past 15 years, I haven’t needed a charter to effect tremendous positive change in our local schools, but I recognize that many parents have wanted and used the charter concept as a framework for making the same kinds of improvements.
State charter schools, however, were designed to do an end run around local elected school boards. There is nothing “special” about state charter schools other than their status. Not to diss Ivy Prep, but APS has two single-gender academies, one for boys and one for girls, as well as special-interest high schools in areas as diverse as Law and Social Justice, Health Sciences, and International Studies. Maureen correctly points out that the General Assembly implemented state charter schools because local school boards had turned down charter requests legislators thought should have been approved. Then, to add insult to injury, they redirected LOCAL taxpayers’ money designated for LOCAL schools towards their favored state charter schools. Big Brother strikes again!
My school board rep knows who I am and responds to my concerns when I call her or see her (weekly) at school events. My state representative sends me a canned email thanking me for my comments and to my knowledge has never set foot inside any of our schools. Which one do you think I would rather trust with my children’s education?
Schooled Stupid
May 16th, 2011
10:45 am
@I am a school teacher….I am sure glad my child will not attend a govt. school and specifically in your class. Charter schools are public schools, most are just created by individuals or entities not within the existing school system cartel. For example, the Gwinnett School of Math, Science, and Tech. or whatever, was created by the school board within the school system as a charter school. Explain to me what makes that school any different from Grayson or Brookwood other than the name and some higher level courses not offered at all other high schools. The school of education you attended did great job of transferring the pedagogy to you.
@ Derrick…please do not give Dunwoody schools any credit…Dunwoody may have good parents that are involved in the education of their children and therefore when they go to the school warehouse, they know how to act, and retain some information through rote memorization.
I will include more later education on the indoctrination of the schooled minds.
Find the root of the problem
May 16th, 2011
10:46 am
I agree that elementary school education is the key. What is the average classroom size of a charter school? I would guess it is smaller than a typical public school. How about transportation,are school systems required to provides buses also?
Education on the benefits of charter schools would be a big help.
sherry (a grandmother)
May 16th, 2011
10:47 am
What a terrible shame for the children! A chance for a better education for at least some of our children with hope that alot of children would follow. Georgia is at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to good public schools. Apparentedly, GA wants to stay there. I’ve lived here 25 years now and have yet to see an improvement in the public schools. I was so hoping at least my grandchildren by now would have alot better schools than my boys did.
bob leblah
May 16th, 2011
10:48 am
Someone earlier mentioned that there is no additional cost of charter schools on the state. I find that hard to believe. The upfront costs related to building/starting a school would is funded by who? Raised privately? Raised by tax payer dollars only by those in the school? Raised by general populous tax dollars?
What's Really Going On
May 16th, 2011
10:48 am
@Dunwoody Mom 10:40am – I think the real question you should be asking to your local school is why it is not able to provide art, music, PE and a foreign language given that you have over 3 times more students at your school. That seem to be the travesty in your case. Could it be that your school’s lack of real autonomy is why you are getting shortchanged?
a parent in a charter school
May 16th, 2011
10:53 am
How many of you know what it is like to live in an area where the schools are failing? There is no choice, you cant gamble on your children’s future. This is a huge loss to Ga and the parents who care to make a change. Its funny to me to see people living in expensive school districts thinking they are public when only the wealthy can afford to live there. We will fight for our children and to have a choice…
New teacher
May 16th, 2011
10:56 am
@Dunwoody Mom:
“…but you want me to pay to have other students have opportunties that my own children wouldn’t have? Um…no.”
Perhaps your children has access to the best DeKalb has to offer, but I am sure there are several other parents in DCCS that are paying for your children have access to opportunities that theirs don’t have. Are there some classes at your high school that are more readily available to students than at other high schools? Does your children’s school have extracurriculars that are not available in, say, south DeKalb?
I can certainly say this is true in Gwinnett, and I’m willing to put money on the same being true in several circumstances in DeKalb and other counties. The argument about you paying for someone else’s child as argument against charters doesn’t wash.
There isn’t much equity within a school system. Folks in areas with great school, cheers! You don’t need charters. This is a good thing. However, for those who happen to live in the “wrong part of the county” (or city, in the case of APS), there isn’t much recourse for the parents who truly care about what their kids’ education. Charters can help. By the way, anyone says that politics don’t go into which charters get approved really needs to take a step back and think. When was the last time politics were NOT involved in a decision on public matters?
D
May 16th, 2011
10:57 am
Can someone please tell me… is Cherokee Charter opening or not? Thanks.
Teacher Reader
May 16th, 2011
10:58 am
@ Local Board Supporter
If school boards were focused on providing the best education for our children, I would agree with you, but our schools are not educating our children. Our children are being used by those running our schools. Our schools are pitiful places. I was an education consultant who traveled and worked with schools all over the country, many in very poverty stricken places. I have worked with charter schools and public schools alike. The beauty of a charter school is that teachers see problems and can make immediate changes to support the learning of their students. Are all charter schools good schools-No, but parents deserve a choice.
With more and more of our schools not meeting AYP, our parents and children deserve a choice to where their child is educated. This ruling will make it difficult-even more difficult- for Georgia to attract quality companies.
I understood when I moved to Georgia nearly 4 years ago that the public education is the pits, but it has gotten that much worse today. If you want Georgia to be a viable place for educated people to come, stay and raise a family, improving schools are the only way to do this. I can tell you that my husband will be looking for another job and we’ll leave, even if we have to dump our house to get rid of it.
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
10:59 am
Folks – come on! All of this energy and spirit needs to be focused on your local school board. This is where decisions are made. It is not the PTA.
Get involved with school board meetings and elections. This will make a difference that you seek.
Write Your Board Members
May 16th, 2011
10:59 am
Charter schools often pay their teachers less than traditional public schools, thus allowing funds for extras. In addition, they often have smaller overhead in administration, not always having assistant principals or counselors.
d
May 16th, 2011
11:00 am
Just a note to any who think south DeKalb schools can’t perform – I just received my EOCT scores and a majority of my students passed their EOCT. Good things do happen in both north and south DeKalb.
New teacher
May 16th, 2011
11:02 am
…to have access…
…anyone who says that…
TimeOut
May 16th, 2011
11:02 am
The number one impediment that charter schools remove from the lives of students and their parents is the impact of non-performers and their ineffective parents. Some of these parents are ineffective solely because their children have learned so well to ‘play the system’ that they cannot implement meaningful behavioral management anymore than can their students’ teachers. Some of these parents have done all of the right things but their children have learned that NCLB/AYP means that the only people who have to do any real work are the adults. If we could remove without penalty to others, those disruptive and willfully non-performing students and send them to a ‘holding tank’ or better yet, let them get started on those license plates, while their parents are at work, we would not need charter schools. If we valued ‘learning’ more than AP scores, EOCT scores, etc. we would have meaningful teaching/learning occurring in all classes throughout the year. The current system does not allow for the removal of the willfully and chronically disruptive sociopaths nor does it protect the larger school community from the unethical ’squeaky wheels’ whose main purpose is to prevent the rest of us from holding them or their children accountable. I think it’s time to look for a grant to fund a bigger change than ‘charter schools.’ We don’t need the federal government’s input. They can’t run their own show.
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
11:04 am
@Lt from Atlanta, I am not sure that I agree our charter commission law was a major factor in our RTTT grant.(We already had a charter school law in place and 100 charters operating, more than other states that won grants.)
I think Georgia presented a strong overall package. I also think the state’s work in revising its performance standards was critical. Also, Gov. Perdue had a lead role in the Common Core State Standards. That was also a critical factor. The feds were looking for states already headed in the direction that they wanted. Georgia was on that same road.
And we are not in any danger of losing our grant by this decision.
Maureen
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
11:05 am
@bob, It is both a lottery and geography. You have to live in the area served and there has to be room for you.
Maureen
Dunwoody Mom
May 16th, 2011
11:06 am
My issue with this is that a school with 135 students, and which has so far received over $400,000 local dollars, to provide “opportunities” that many schools in DCSS do not have. That, in and of itself, is unfair.
Dr. John Trotter
May 16th, 2011
11:09 am
A L E R T: Earnet is right. Call Mark Elgart and SACS! There was no consensus on the Georgia Supreme Court on this issue!
JM
May 16th, 2011
11:10 am
Mareen, do you really think a local school board will vote to support 6 students in their district who attend the Georgia Cyber Academy? What if every school board put different requirements? The Georgia Cyber Academy’s attendance zone is defined as the entire state. How many school boards would be involved? 200+? Imagine trying to make that happen.
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
11:15 am
@JM. The systems do pay now to the state when their students take virtual high school courses that are not offered at their local schools. So.there is a mechanism in place.
Or
The state can take over full funding for this and the other 16 commission charter schools that are open or about to open. I don’t think that “full funding” would be as high as some of these charters are getting in those counties with high per-pupil funding, but the state could use the state average to determine its per-pupil allotment to each of these schools.
Maureen
Atlanta Media Guy
May 16th, 2011
11:20 am
Hey Decatur your system is one of the smallest in the state. I’ve been screaming for smaller systems, they work! A system the size of DCSS is full of corrupt, criminal individuals who care about the cars they drive, the church they attend, where their tithes are directly taken out of their paycheck, the sorority or fraternity they attended or the friends and family that remain on staff at a very high salary.
Hey DCSS, can we fire Audria Berry and her “army” of non-teaching seat warmers at the Palace and direct those funds to the schools where they should be to help the kids and not the friends and family plan? PLEASE!
That’s why we need people like Tyson, Moseley, Thompson, Mitchell-Mayfield, Turk, Ramsey, Beasley, Tucker, and the rest who were in Crawford Lewis’ leadership circle to resign and give the system back to real educators. Like the student who was on the DCSS BOE and who is graduating suggested in his speech the other night. DCSS needs a teacher to lead the system out of the abyss of constant failure and criminal activity!
PHLASH
May 16th, 2011
11:22 am
Two camps are affected by this. I’m sympathetic to one, unsympathetic to the other. I’m sympathetic to the groups of parents and communities who have organized to create a charter school well-suited to their students’ needs. I’m utterly unsympathetic to the folks who, under the banner of the charter movement, are using it to privatize schooling and education in the country, turning a public institution into a market-driven one. Is there a way to thwart the latter without backslapping the former?
Cindy Lutenbacher
May 16th, 2011
11:23 am
I’d like to respond to a number of different threads in this conversation.
First of all, in deciding whether or not we think our public schools are failures, we should not look at AYP, which is based on a set of standardized test scores. These test scores are flawed in the extreme and do not show learning or ability or knowledge. They have been created by corporations (and ETS is, by all measures, a corporation) whose sole interest is in selling their products. They have to sell the IDEA of these tests, AYP, etc. to us. Our first task is to reject this standardized absurdity that masks itself as “accountability.” As Kohn notes, “Standardized exams serve mostly to make dreadful forms of teaching appear successful.”
Secondly, even if one likes standardized testing, a recent study by Stanford University found that 17% of charter schools have higher test scores than their public school counterparts. 46% of charter schools perform the same as their counterparts, and 37% perform WORSE than the other public schools. So, to imagine that charter schools can fix Georgia’s test scores is to ignore the research.
Thirdly, charter schools actually consume fewer taxpayer dollars than regular public schools. Charters receive the same per-student allotment, but they receive no funds for buildings, utilities, and other facility oriented needs of a school.
I have mixed feelings about charters because I’ve seen the impact of two really magnificent charters: the International Community School and the Kindezi School. Both are doing a beautiful job of keeping children central in all decisions. I’ve also seen corporate “ventures” creating charters as a way of, yes, snagging taxpayer dollars without giving a rip about kids.
Find the root of the problem
May 16th, 2011
11:24 am
Its funny to me to see people living in expensive school districts thinking they are public when only the wealthy can afford to live there. We will fight for our children and to have a choice…
____
Great statement, time to wake up to the de facto seperate but equal educational system that has been re-created over the last 20-30 years. Just look at the recent battle over the Duluth redistricting which the GCPS says that “socio-economic factors have no bearing on how district lines are drawn”; yeah right!
Northside APS Parent
May 16th, 2011
11:25 am
I don’t know enough about the specifics of its charter, but Georgia Cyber Academy may be the only state charter school with a legitimate claim to “special” status under the law. If it can make a case that it offers services no one else provides, it could possibly retain its status even under the Supreme Court’s ruling.
Folks, the Supreme Court did not outlaw all charter schools! The opinion addresses the constitutionality of what amounts to a parallel state school system, operating in competition with local systems and using co-opted local dollars. It’s clear that many posters don’t know whether the charter school in their neighbohood is even at issue.
All charter schools are not evil, just like all public schools are not evil. The issue is whether the General Assembly should be able to trump local school boards.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
11:27 am
“Get involved with school board meetings and elections. This will make a difference that you seek. ” Are you kidding???!!! Well, I’m not laughing any more. Ineffective, politics-driven school boards who ignore the interests of the public it is supposed to serve are the REASON for the discontent and emergence of charter schools…What do you think has changed that would suddenly have faith in my school board?
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
11:29 am
correction- ’suddenly make me have faith in….”
Reaction to charter schools decision: State pledges flexibility but don’t schools really need money? | Get Schooled
May 16th, 2011
11:30 am
[...] When the Supreme Court ruling was issued this morning striking down the state Charter Schools Commission in favor of local control in creation of charter schools, I sent out e-mails seeking reaction from key players. (Read about the decision here.) [...]
N GA Blues
May 16th, 2011
11:33 am
“The state can take over full funding for this and the other 16 commission charter schools that are open or about to open. I don’t think that “full funding” would be as high as some of these charters are getting in those counties with high per-pupil funding, but the state could use the state average to determine its per-pupil allotment to each of these schools.
Maureen”
Maureen, I may have been reading the comments made by one of the plaintiffs’ lawyers wrong, but there was certainly an implication that as a result of the decision ONLY local boards could approve charter schools, period. Therefore, under this ruling does the state even have power to approve the funding or allow the schools to function?!?
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
11:35 am
@N GA, Yes, the state board has had the power to approve charters and, in fact, approved two of them before the creation of the Charter Schools Commission,
However, those state board charters cannot command local dollars, so those schools will get half what they would be getting had the Supreme Court not ruled against the commission.
The question is whether any of the 17 schools, both those already opened and those planning to open, can operate under such reduced funding.
Maureen
Ed Johnson
May 16th, 2011
11:38 am
“‘Today four judges have wiped away a small but important effort to improve public education in Georgia – an effort that reflects not only the education policy of this State’s elected representatives but also the national education policy of the Obama Administration,’ says the 75-page dissent.”
Appealing to the Obama Administration – actually, the Gates-Broad-Obama-Duncan Administration – is down right heinous.
And Eli Broad and his foundation may be none too pleased with especially Gwinnett after this.
j nes
May 16th, 2011
11:41 am
Someone please inform me if I am completely off-base, but..
This has opened my eyes to something big. The local boards oppose charter schools because funding for the students that attend the charters is diverted from the public school. The schools (Charter and public) get their money based on FTE numbers–basically money per student. So if the public school loses a student, they lose the money allocated for the student as well. So why does the school board care? If they don’t have to educate the student, they don’t need the money—right? This could only mean one thing: the money a school receives to educate a student is not going to educate the student!!–the school system profits from having more students. School boards with more money have more power (like to awarding county contracts to their family and friends). And that is what it is all about: more students=more money=more power for school boards=more corruption and nepotism=status quo for school systems. I have never realized what a crooked business public education is until now.
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
11:47 am
The Georgia School Board and Superintendent Associations are probably celebrating right now as their lobbying paid off BIG Time for them.
Today’s decision didn’t surprise me given the fact that the Georgia Constitution gives LBOEs the sanctioned power to do whatever they want with the schools and children in their jurisdiction. Now, why would they give all that centralized power up? This is not only a defeat for parents and children, but for law makers who are so naive to believe that LBOEs actually will give up power, control, and MONEY to do what is best for children and their parents. Give us VOUCHERS so we can have some leverage…as it is now LBOEs gerrymander, decide what kids get what classes, what schools offer what programs, what text books will not be replaced, what waivers the schools can get to avoid implementing laws…..We need to amend the Constitution to include parents at the local decision making table…and then let the public decide if parents should be involved….I hope everyone can finally SEE THE REAL POWER each Local Board Member has…over your child’s fate.
Statement On Today’s Supreme Court Ruling re: Charter Schools | Buzz Brockway
May 16th, 2011
11:48 am
[...] Charter schools around the State leaving those students in limbo. As Maureen Downey writes in her “Get Schooled” column: The decision is a major victory for school systems and local control but a setback to the [...]
Teacher Reader
May 16th, 2011
11:53 am
@ j nes You’ve got it. Most school boards are more interested in the jobs that they can make for friends and family members than the education the children are receiving.
Public education, is just another government entity that creates job and doesn’t have to have a good product. Sad, but true. We wonder why our children keep slipping down the rings of our global society, well this is one huge reason. Teacher’s Unions are another. Even states without unions are effected, because of their involvement in politics.
justbrowsing
May 16th, 2011
11:55 am
I hate this for those parents who are truly concerned with their child’s education. It is just so sad that they are not in the majority. I have come across manipulative parents only interested in grades for underperforming children. These are the types of parents I would worry about in the decision making process. The leverage given to THESE TYPES of parents could be ultimately abused.
Rod Johnson
May 16th, 2011
11:57 am
Teacher Reader: You’re exactly right. “Public Education” serves only to empower LBOEs whilst keeping our children ignorant so that they too can suck off the teat of gov’t when they get old enough to not find work in the private sector. Hell, at this rate, most kids won’t be qualified for private-sector work anyway, since the private sector isn’t interested in one’s “feelings” or “self esteem” but rather, what one can do.
This, of course, is anathema to gov’t education.
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
12:00 pm
I would blame the “failing education system” on the US DOE….the Federal government supplements the education process with BILLIONS of $$$ to go toward schools that produce ignorant and poor populations. The More POOR and uneducated, the MORE MONEY a school gets.
That is NOT right…so what is the incentive to educate when the Federal Government is there to give money to local systems and state systems?
Let’s get rid of the USDOE Title I funds and let’s start making every community fully fund the education process…In 2009 Georgia Received almost 1/2 BILLION dollars in Title I funds…yet we are scraping the bottom of the SAT and ACT barrel. Title I schools are the most likely to fail to meet even minimum standards on a watered down curriculum…..yet the vicisous cycle continues…
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
12:04 pm
just browsing…what difference does it make if parents abuse the $$$ toward the education process, or if school districts use the system to affect more kids?
I’m not sure what abuse parents would try to pull, but you are right and there probably will be some…however, to deny us the opportunity just because a few will find a loop hole????? I’d like to get real imperical evidence that shows abuse with vouchers…..
Ed Advocate
May 16th, 2011
12:05 pm
@PHLASH
“using it to privatize schooling and education in the country, turning a public institution into a market-driven one.”
1. Charter schools are public schools. 2. They have widespread support across the political spectrum, including from smart education minds on the left side (e.g. Arne Duncan supports charter schools with initiatives like Race to the Top). 3. The “market-driven” concept is part of the point: Multiple choices may spawn competition, may spawn better results.
I say “may” because conservatives need to acknowledge that many charters (like most new businesses) also fail. But the experimentation and laboratory for innovation is the point. Try new things, see if they work, if they do (schools like KIPP, Ivy Prep) emulate them. If they don’t close them. But its much harder to try new things in traditional public schools.
HS Public Teacher
May 16th, 2011
12:06 pm
@Philosopher – I never said for you to “have faith” in your school board. I said to become INVOLVED with your school board because this is where education decisions are made.
If you think they are corrupt or are not doing what you think is best, attend the meetings and speak up! If you totally disagree with your representation on the school board, run for office yourself!
Rather than ‘fixing’ the school board, it is wrong to create a separate path of charter schools through the State – per the State Supreme Court. Simply work to change your school board!
It really can be that simple.
justbrowsing
May 16th, 2011
12:06 pm
@Kathy II- remember- we cannot continue to throw money at the problem. All parents are not as concerned as you are as a parent. This stifles student achievement as a whole. The system is made up of all these dysfunctional parts. As uncomfortable as it seems, I understand why parents would want an alternative. I just feel that at this point, we have got to hold parents- ALL parents including those in low SES places- accountable like parents of charter school students. If we did this- would we really be in need of alternatives such as charter schools anyway? If they want the latitude to operate in a fashion different from schools governed by LBOE’s, then they should pay for it separately. Lots of edu-preneurs out there.
Money Follow Kids
May 16th, 2011
12:12 pm
This is terrible news. We love the GA Cyber Academy and were happy to have the Georgia Connections Academy as an option too. We need more options for kids. Georgia will always be behind as long as politicians do not move education options foward. When I moved out of Georgia for college, I saw firsthand how behind our education was in comparison to other states. It is sad that charter schools are expected to get approval from local boards that don’t want to share their revenue. Who can blame the local boards? It is time to change the laws. Wake up GA Legislature and step up to the plate! Healthy competition would be good for education in GA because the current system is failing our kids.
Video News Blog » Breaking news: Supreme Court strikes down Charter Schools Commission in 4-3 vote. – Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog)
May 16th, 2011
12:13 pm
[...] Breaking news: Supreme Court strikes down Charter Schools Commission in 4-3 vote.Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog)In a long-awaited ruling released this morning, the state Supreme Court struck down a state commission that could approve charter schools over the objection of local boards of education and direct local funding to the schools. The vote was 4-3. …and more » [...]
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
12:13 pm
“The leverage given to THESE TYPES of parents could be ultimately abused.” Well, yeah..but right now, the leverage is in the hands of the politically motivated LBOEs whose interest has little to do with ANY child’s education…We can talk all we want to but the LBOEs and their puppeteers, the superintendents, have us all by the proverbial balls once again. Without competition and alternative schools to show the public that it can be done and done well in a different manner, there is no incentive to change the status quo…As I said, there is dancing in halls of the school board offices today!
Teacher Reader
May 16th, 2011
12:16 pm
@ HS Public Teacher
It is not as simple as speaking up. As a classroom teacher, I spoke up about the injustices to our children constantly, because the district I was working in was failing children left and right. I was labeled a trouble maker.
At our last school board meeting, we had 8 of the 10 spots allotted for public comment taken up by children and teachers saying how good their school was. School boards do not care what parents want. Local schools/principals who care about what is happening in their district, need to tow the line if they want to keep their job. Most school board members don’t want to hear what parents want to say or think, they want to do what is in their own best interest to continue getting high paying jobs for under qualified friends and family members.
I realize that many public school teachers don’t like charter schools or vouchers, but it is time for public school teachers to take a long hard look at what is really happening in their districts. Look at the wasteful spending. Look at the corruption. Look at the under qualified leaders in charge of our schools from the Assistant Principals on up. A teacher does not have enough experience to run a school or district or to make education decisions with a few years of teaching experience. Too many of our principals and administrators have less than 5 years of experience in the classroom.
Be real. What school boards do you know that have the interest of the children first? I can’t think of any in the Atlanta metro area.
Disappointed
May 16th, 2011
12:18 pm
@HS Teahcer, just because 4 misguided people made this decision does not mean it is right. read the dissenting opinion, they hit the points on the head.. The public school system has failed a lot of students, there are too many administrators in each school and school system.
You are right it is time to get involved… but at the legislature level, it is time to ammend the laws to allow the parents to have more of a say and allowing charter schools is one way..
The earlier post about the funds is correct, they don’t care about the children, it is about keeping those funds in the system for them to do with what they will, just Look at Gwinnett and it’s own charter schools and it new;y expanding online school, just another way to raise money and keep money in the district.. It is not about choice for the parents, it is about control for the LBOE’s..
And if you want to look at politics and economics, look at what Gwinnett did to North Gwinnett/Lanier when they split that… you have a middle school 8 miles from the high school when a newer one would have been 3, you have a subdivision 2 miles from the new high school but still goes to North, Thee are several subdivisons that still go to North and should have gone to Lanier, but ti was all about economics, and now Lanier has an extremely high amount of low income students, and North has very few… the Rich subdivisions complained and stayed in North, the others just got left behind..
Dr. Craig Spinks/ Augusta
May 16th, 2011
12:21 pm
The educ-rats are fighting over the cheese. But who’s fighting for the kids?
Teacher Reader
May 16th, 2011
12:23 pm
@ Dr Speaks Unfortunately our children have long been forgotten. Education has become big business and job maker-on many levels starting locally and going up to the DOE and Corporations.
I wish that the media would publish the amounts of money that the large education companies make the way they do the oil companies. This would open people’s eyes to the money that is involved in education.
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
12:36 pm
@ Dr. C. Spinks…I am one, and realize that advocating for an equitable education for ALL Georgian’s kids is NOT a one day, one week, one month, or even a one year commitment…IT is a LIFE of advocacy due to the evolving processes, along with the social, political, and economic changes in our communities….
Dr. Craig Spinks/ Augusta
May 16th, 2011
12:38 pm
Teacher Reader:
Good points!
By the way, do the GSBA, PAGE and GAE publish annual income and financial statements? Do local school board attorneys publish annual statements showing the fees they’ve collected from their respective local boards?
Does anybody think these organizations and attorneys are fighting for the kids- or for the teachers, for that matter?
Dr. Craig Spinks/ Augusta
May 16th, 2011
12:39 pm
Kathy II:
You are not alone. Our kids need more folks like you.
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
12:40 pm
AMEN To Teacher Reader….yes, there is HUGE BUSINESS in targeting the poor and ignorant populations…..huge price tag products that promise the “magic bullet”. Decision makers being able to implement Home made remedies and piecing togehter different scinentifcally proven programs together to FIT the budget….
Without a Constitution amendment to bring more stakeholders to the education table….we will not see reform….If any of you have the opportunity. CHeck out CNN this Saturday at 8 p.m. it is documentary from Soledad O Brian in which the former governor of Tennessee COMES CLEAN about misleading the public about the education outcomes..
Alan
May 16th, 2011
12:45 pm
Does anyone agree that we need to address the over paid teachers in the Georgia?
Teacher Reader
May 16th, 2011
12:55 pm
@ Alan, It’s not the teachers that are over paid, it’s the assistant principals, principals, secretaries, administrators, Coaches who are not on the teacher pay scale, etc. Teachers are really the low man on the totem pole in most school systems. In DCSS we have many secretaries that make nearly $100,000. That is just ridiculous. The person running the cable access channel, who is a friends/family member, has no experience doing her job makes $10-15,000 more than a public sector job of the same kind.
Teachers are always blamed, but if one looks closely, they will see the smoke and mirrors game that is played. Don’t get me wrong in some districts up North, I know of teachers that have 20+ years of teaching experience that bring home $85,00-95,000 plus full benefits, but that doesn’t happen here in Georgia.
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
12:55 pm
local attorneys are hand picked and paid by the BOE….The Georgia School Board Association is a LOBBYING group (that’s what associations are) and they do NOT lobby for students or parents or the community. In fact, the GSBA put out it’s “Vision for Education” for our children…and say that parents are NO different from joe blow down the street. To the GSBA parents are tertiary stakeholders…
Whereas, “The culture and climate of schools and school districts provide a sense of meaning for those internal members of the organizations as well as those external to the organization (Deal and Peterson, 1999). Groups that are considered internal members include school board members, district- and school-level administrators, faculty, staff, and students.”
Since when do students (all students mean 4 yrs -22) ever get to be “thought of as equals”? This is hogwash because most of us KNOW that NO contract is legally binding with anyone under the age of 18…so why did they NOT use language to include parents? I think we know the answer…
click around and check it out for yourselves…http://www.visionforpubliced.org/ProjectWork/CultureClimateandOrganizationalEfficacy/Documents.aspx
Charter Parent
May 16th, 2011
1:01 pm
Should’ve gotten out of this backward, good-old-boy state when I had the chance. All you local school board fans do realize the rest of the country (well…except Mississippi) laughs at the state of education in Georgia and basically thinks we’re a bunch of ignorants right off Hee Haw?
So…keep on chatting up Kathy Sue Boardmember at the local Publix….for all the goo it will do your child.
Remember folks….it’s all about the Power….not about the child.
Charter School Parent
May 16th, 2011
1:04 pm
I have been involved with a charter school for many years. Our school receives less money than any county school in the State of Georgia. The school receives less than half the money it costs a county school to educate one student, per student. If the school isn’t a county approved charter school, that is all the money they receive, unless they find a business partner to donate or any fundraising they do. To compensate for the smaller amount of money receive, the teachers work for less money, and at our school each teacher teaches two grade levels at once. They have two sets of standards to teach in the same amount of time a regular public school teacher has to teach one. They work at the school because they believe in the school’s mission. Our school has made AYP yearly and the schools CRCT scores are equal or above both the counties’ schools and the state scores. So it amazes me that some on here say give the county schools more money. The school systems can’t manage the money they have now to improve our student’s education. The whole education system needs to be revamped as a whole and the power given back to the states instead of the Federal Government. Since the Federal Government has taken over the DOE student’s grades haven’t improved, many states have decreased. It is time to revamp the system.
Elementary Teacher
May 16th, 2011
1:10 pm
I think this ruling is absolutely ridiculous. The problem with local school boards controlling the money is they can do things how they want to with no competition. The reason they are denying some of these charter schools is because they don’t want to give up any of their funding. Well, here’s a wake up call, there’s a reason the parents are looking to different avenues for their child’s education. The public schools are great for some students, and not for others. Each child is different and so are their needs. There are some students who do much better in a charter school, and some who do much better in a public school. It depends on the student. However, for us to say that students who are not doing well in a traditional public school just have to fail and flunk until they give up on themselves is cruel. By not allowing charters to exist without the approval of the local boards, there are going to be a lot more students who will get left behind, and there will be a lot more gifted students who are held back.
Public School Supporter
May 16th, 2011
1:18 pm
Our country will make it only if we have a strong public school. It behooves us to give all of our support to it. The voucher system and the charter schools program is an attempt to turn the clock back on desegregation. The politicians will continue to try to do this. It is sad. It is disappointing.
Teacher Reader
May 16th, 2011
1:33 pm
@ Public School Supporter
Our country will only make it if we hold our children to higher standards. Make them accountable for their actions. Worry less about how they feel, and more about what they do. Make sure that we give our children a strong foundation in basic education in the elementary school.
Right now education is being run by companies that make money off of the government mandates. Look at how much money the text book companies, testing companies, and packaged programs touted as the savior to our education system make. You will be shocked. Look at how much the NEA and AFL-CIO spend lobbying in Washington and state capitals around the country. Again, you will be shocked.
You do not understand that most making decisions about our public schools are people who have taught less than 5 years, who have on-line degrees from questionable “universities,” who worry more about the jobs that they can provide for people voting for them, than the children they are elected to educate.
Our public schools are failing our children. Parents should be able to look for alternatives for the failing education systems. Yes, there are some good schools, but not enough if we want our country to continue to make science innovations. Just look at the PhD students in our universities, very few are US citizens. Most come from China and India. Americans don’t have the test scores that these other nationalities do, or the drive to learn. Our children are all about money, however what we all fail to realize is that no amount of money can help you if the work force that you have to chose from is uneducated.
CherokeeCo
May 16th, 2011
1:37 pm
This decision undermines parental choice and sets Georgia back. In Cherokee 2600 families wanted a charter school and local school leadershp said, “There was no community support for charter schools.” They then voted no on the charter applicaton. It appears that the Cherokee County School System is happy to spend $600M a year be at the top of the bottom in school standing nation-wide. Concerned parents need to get active, speak up, and demand options for their children.
Philosopher
May 16th, 2011
1:41 pm
@Public School Supporter: throwing money at a ship with holes all through it while the captain and the mates are plugging the holes with bubble gum and covering over with paint is just plain stupid!! I do not believe in giving up on kids because they are challenged by their circumstances or because they are not white…It is not the purpose of charter schools to “turn back the clock on segragation”. Public schools, especially in the counties surrounding Atlanta are segregated… by wealth… and public schools do nothing to change that. It is not the idea of public schools that most of us object to but the reality of a broken, corrupt, entity not worthy of support in its present form.
News stories on the GA Supreme Court decision | G-PAN
May 16th, 2011
1:48 pm
[...] Victory for local districts. Setback for charter schools [...]
Edudawg
May 16th, 2011
1:55 pm
Folks, our decisions about public schools should be data-driven. As @Cindy Lutenbacher pointed out, public charter school results – in Georgia and nationwide – are mixed at best. We would expect charters, where the parents are more involved, to have higher student achievement but often they don’t.
Charter schools were conceived as incubators for innovation, not as escape routes from neighborhood schools. In my opinion, charters have failed in their mission to identify new best practices or innovative programs that can be adopted by all schools. What have Georgia’s charter schools taught us? They’ve shown that good schools – whether they are charter or traditional public schools – get the best results by emphasizing a commitment to academic achievement, appropriate discipline, and parental involvement.
Charters have also shown us that a high-quality education isn’t cheap. That’s why state policy makers created the commission that led to this lawsuit in the first place. The reduced funds going to charter schools weren’t enough to keep the doors open, much less provide a quality education. So the Commission was created as a way around locally elected school boards who were unwilling to fund incubator schools with scarce local resources.
I don’t see anything new here. Instead, I think that charter schools have validated what educators and average citizens have known about school for a long time. As a community, let’s use this knowledge to insist that every school board, every administrator, every principal, and every teacher in the state place the highest priority on academic achievement. Let’s also insist that every parent puts the education and welfare of his/her child as the first priority AND prepares the child to come to school every day ready to learn. Finally, let’s insist that our schools are adequately funded – not overfunded – but adequately funded.
Reactions to the decision | G-PAN
May 16th, 2011
2:02 pm
[...] When the Supreme Court ruling was issued this morning striking down the state Charter Schools Commission in favor of local control in creation of charter schools, I sent out e-mails seeking reaction from key players. (Read about the decision here.) [...]
Rallying charter supporters but to do what exactly? | Get Schooled
May 16th, 2011
2:27 pm
[...] is a passionate response from the Georgia Charter Schools Association to today’s state Supreme Court decision striking down the state Charter Schools Commission. It is from the head of the association, Tony [...]
B. Killebrew
May 16th, 2011
2:55 pm
http://blogs.edweek.org/teachers/living-in-dialogue/2010/11/you_say_charter_–_i_say_semi-.html
Disappointed
May 16th, 2011
3:08 pm
The link to the blog.. it is not surprsing that he takes that stance since he is a union activist. The Union is against anything that helps the kids and gets bad teachers out of the classroom… and since Ga has no teacher union, not really relevant here.
There are a lot of really good teachers, but there are also some that do not belong in the classroom. We need to stop teaching to the test and start teaching how to learn, get back to the basics and throwing more money at it is not the answer, all that will happen is that they will waste a whole lot more on administrators and less on students…
Teacher Reader
May 16th, 2011
3:12 pm
Well said Disappointed.
Back to Home
May 16th, 2011
3:34 pm
Guess I’ll get my homeschool catalogs out tonight and start looking over curriculum for next year.
Fayette Mom
May 16th, 2011
3:41 pm
To answer a question floating around…. the reason in some cases local school boards haven’t approved some of these charters is because many of these 17 charters cross over into several different BOE jurisdictions, making it very difficult. This is a sad ruling. These local, poorly run monopolies have no incentive to approve a charter school and invite competition. I can just see Wal-mart having a say in whether or not a new small variety store gets to open in town. Education should not be political and this is a clear cut case of just that…. politics.
Education headlines: Georgia court strikes state charter commission « School Board News
May 16th, 2011
4:07 pm
[...] Atlanta Journal-Constitution’s Get Schooled blog reported on the verdict as well. Joetta Sack-Min|May 16th, 2011|Categories: Advocacy & [...]
georgia cyber academy student
May 16th, 2011
4:08 pm
It isn’t just the parents that are mad, as a student of a charter school i am pissed, my right to a better education is being taken away. At first I started K12 when i was in 7th grade because i was sick and doctors didn’t know what was wrong and my school, Berkmar middle didn’t help at all, they actually wanted me to go to school with a plastic bag to throw up in. So my mom put me in k12, i am better now, but i staid in k12 not only because it was flexible but also because my grades went up for C’s to B’s and A’s. to take away charter school is taking away my education and my rights as a citizen of the united states of America. By doing this they are sending a message to kids saying “since this takes away power from the government we decided we are taking you education away.”
Sarah
May 16th, 2011
4:16 pm
I guess I will buy the K12 education package myself and homeschool my kids… they are NOT going to a BM school.
georgia cyber academy student
May 16th, 2011
4:24 pm
Good!!! Public schools suck. they make unnecessary rules because they feel big and powerful. And for the teachers there, they are good teachers, there is nothing wrong with them, its not their fault its the governments.
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
5:02 pm
OK, let me ask all of you this: How many of you have visited or been actively involved in your public school’s School Council as per OCGA 20-2-85 through 86?
What did your school district do when lawmakers gave us HB 1187 that gave parents choice if a school was closer to there home than what the LBOE zoned their child for?
What did you school district do when HB 251 gave intra district choice if a school had room for your child?
Georgia lawmakers give us laws, but LBOEs interpret, implement, and enforce these laws without consequences. In Houston County, there is one body/person to review any out of zone request…and the rule of thumb….don’t give choice to anyone or if you do, keep it secret. When HB 251 came out,,,our district came up with a bogus 80% capacity standard….of course I had to get the “capacity” for the building from the state because EVEN that was a secret. If I didn’t know what the capacity of the facility was, I could not hold anyone accountable for a bogus 80% capacity standard pulled out of thin air.
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
5:23 pm
the only reason I asked these questions is because we can make a difference…HOWEVER, if parents are NOT informed about laws that are in place, (and school districts are NOT going to spoon feed parents we have to go digging) then when one or two parents in any given district want to exercise the laws…we are made to look as if we are the deviant ones or the ones who got it wrong…there is NO reason why a parent has to fight the school system to be involved.
Who has knowlege of HB 400 or OCGA 20-2-237? The BRIDGE Law? That is another area that actively involves parents and the letter of the law must be followed….Senator Fram Millar authored the bill and he has been very generous with any information as to the letter and spirit of the law. The BRIDGE law puts parents in the process, ….and at my son’s school they involved us too…However, out of 8 middle schools I think our school was the only one to have this parent meeting….
Educator at heart
May 16th, 2011
5:38 pm
It amazes me that the general public seems to have so little respect for the teaching profession as well as traditional public schools in our state. I am now going to speak as an educator as well as a parent of a child in our public school system.
Teachers at the school where I am employed as an elementary educator, most of the teachers work long hours and are committed to educating each and every child that crosses the classroom thresholds. I know my test scores speak for themselves. For some of my subjects, I have 100% of the students pass the CRCT. For the remaining subjects, it is also a high percentage. We spend hours and hours creating innovative lessons and activities, have rapport with our parents and offer our students to use their multi-talents to be successful in school as well as home and community. Yes….we are 99% Free and Reduced Lunch, high minority population and have a high mobility rate. We are continually in need of funding. We have to spend hundreds of dollars and sometimes thousands to supplant what we do not receive from the school system. Our facility is in need of repair and may be even considered unhealthy in many areas of the building. Yet, we come in each day with a determination to offer a positive future for the children we educate. No one can honestly say that we do not give our heart, soul, commitment and physical energy to make our educational setting one conducive for learning and growing.
All I hear is the complaints about traditional public education. Why do people not celebrate the success stories? Why do people not spend the same kind of time and resources in our traditional public schools that they spend for charter schools? Parents need to be proactive in their community schools. They need to speak out and become active in establishing parent councils. They need to take ownership of the public schools and DEMAND that their voices be heard. I like what I read in one post,” If the boards do not listen to the parents, vote them out!” We are the taxpayers and the local schools are our schools. They are not “owned” by the administrators or the boards. We need to stand up, be counted and advocate some serious change in our school systems. Or, is it that most of the parents seek to have an environment for educating their children that is “separate” from the masses of students. Or….is it that privatization has become so powerful that parents are blinded by their promises of “saving” children from the horrors of traditional public school? Some of the Commission Charter schools were a “legal” way of taking public dollars to give to private management companies. The millions of dollars that were going towards facilities, corporate curriculums, consultants, etc was amazing.
Our public schools need dollars.Teachers are being laid off due to lack of money from the state. Facilities are being closed because of lack of money from the state and local governments. Programs are being eliminated from the schools due to lack of funding. And we talk about funding small schools that have recently opened under that magic name of “charter school/” What exactly is happening in our state? Our public schools need adequate funding, safe and healthy facilities, parental support and strong advocacy. Our talented public school teachers need the same kind of support and praise that people seem so ready to give to charter schools. We as a community can create green learning centers, arts academies, science academies, schools that specialize in the innovations that are working around our nation….and we can do this in our traditional public schools. Let there be a move towards magnet schools and a choice of schools within districts. Let us work together as communities to create change within our local systems.
Let us rally for improving our local schools at the local level. I wonder how many people will show up??????????
justjanny
May 16th, 2011
5:42 pm
@Dunwoody Mom…you are so right! Now what abot Eddie Long’s charter school (s)?
Kathy II
May 16th, 2011
5:58 pm
Educator at heart: there is already intra school choice: HB 251, but LBOEs found that loop hole too. I agree that we should NOT target teachers, but maybe not for the same reasons. Over the past decade I have seen who is making the rules, who gets promoted, who gets laid off, and who is going to teach what and when, why and how. Central office staff have their hands in the “structure” of the process and then assign teachers their duties. Believe me…I TRUST my son’s teachers before I trust some pencil pusher up at the central office who may not even know my son. This issue should NEVER be about teachers, but about a system that is BROKEN and has been for many years. Georgia backloaded on AYP absolute bars and when it comes down to crunch time…we pull the tests (graduation tests) and implement another test for AYP purposes…TWO years BEFORE NCLB mandates expire…no coincidence.
School Board members are elected every four years…and the public is very quick to forget…and there is one more point: Most of the citizens in Houston County do NOT have kids in the school system…BUT they vote for BOE members and guess who addresses the chamber of commerce and business leaders? Yep, the superintendent and Board Chair touting their successes…
One last point…you teach at a Title I school…did you know that there are Federal (NCLB), state, and local laws that give your parents more opportunities and rights than a parent who pays full price for their child’s lunch? How backwards is that? Those who do not have the resources to be involved have all those opportunities and some are even paid to be involved in their child’s school (parent involvement coordinators) …., but those of us who pay for our child’s lunch(and rightfully so) we EVEN PAY to be involved! We pay all the time….
Rick
May 16th, 2011
6:02 pm
Dunwoody Mom,
You are correct, Neighborwhood Charter School and Atlanta Charter Middle Schools were approved by APS…..However, the group of parents in my neighborhood – including a state representative – that worked through the process and tendered the document are extremely savvy and were able to put ample pressure on APS to demand approval, which they were granted. Do you think that school boards will not be empowered by this decision, resulting in the refusal of charters designed to improve the education of our children, and as a result in many cases, to stablize our neighborhoods?
I am a product of Atlanta Public Schools myself. Some of the APS schools on the northside are great, and several seem to be getting better. But many of us need TRUE local control, as in hiring the Principal and teachers, and NOT just voting for the school board. Those of you who say that moving out of a school sytem is the answer are lost. Enjoy your traffic and strip malls. And those of you who tell me to send my kid to a crap school so it will get better – would you do that yourself if you value education and TRUE diversity? Finally, to those (like Dunwoody Mom) who seem more concerned with how others may be benefitting from her tax dollars, I don’t have much sympathy. My kids’ education doesn’t cost you any more than you’re already paying.
——–
@Rick – if you are referring to the “Neighborhood School”, this was a charter school that was approved by APS. The decision to allow this was done at the “local level” – which is the argument at the heart of this controversy.
georgia cyber academy student
May 16th, 2011
6:42 pm
Educator at heart your opinion is a good one. I don’t have any thing agents teachers. when i did go to public school i liked my teachers, what is wrong is that government is taking away the education of kids who are doing better in a charter school. this isn’t an argument of government or the teachers and parents it’s an argument on how kids can get the best possible education and if charter school works for a lot of kids, government should fund it as well as any public school.
Here’s What You Can Do Right Now To Help! « Virtual School Meanderings
May 16th, 2011
7:39 pm
[...] AJC: http://blogs.ajc.com/get-schooled-blog/2011/05/16/breaking-news-supreme-court-strikes-down-charter-s... [...]
AJBrown
May 16th, 2011
8:06 pm
Maureen, Provost Academy Georgia should also be included on the list–a statewide cyber high school for grades 9-12 that was approved by the Commission and was slated to open in August.
Maureen Downey
May 16th, 2011
8:20 pm
@AJBrown, It is on the list, toward the middle. And I included a comment from the principal in the blog entry I did today on reaction to the Supreme Court decision,
Maureen
relieved!
May 16th, 2011
8:52 pm
I am so thankful that this ruling came about. The charter school that is in my area was put together by a group of friends that didn’t want their children to be apart of the local school systems (which there is nothing academically wrong with!) They did not seek local system support from any of the 5 counties they are taking funds from. Rather decided to have a chosen board because they could pick who would make the decisions. However, because taxes were raised (in some counties tremendously), the tax payers should have a say in who makes the financial decisions for the school. Our country once felt strongly about the slogan “no taxation without representation”. And now…some people are trying to do just that. Personally I am comforted by the separation of powers and the statement “we the people” that were put into place so many years ago!
No Commission Needed
May 16th, 2011
10:20 pm
This ruling is great! A win for the tax payer; notice in the ruling a mention of local taxes going to these commission school. Here in SWGA they ran a full page ad telling us no local taxes were being used.
SW Dekalb Parent
May 16th, 2011
10:36 pm
I ain’t payin no taxes……can i still get my chilren in charter?
Sad in Coweta County
May 16th, 2011
11:35 pm
Where does GA rank in graduation rates, test scores, etc.? Where does MN rank in graduation rates, test scores, etc.? MN has open enrollment plus lots of charter schools and magnet schools… Don’t take away school choice, GA! GA schools could use a little competition.
Can't believe this ruling
May 16th, 2011
11:39 pm
This is unfortunate…yet again, another case of the haves and have nots. There is a large group of children in metro-Atlanta who are underrepresented ( and this is not a race issue, it’s an economic issue, but that’s for another day.) Charter schools fill a need for children who otherwise may not have the same opportunity to succeed in the traditional public school setting. Oh..and for those charter schools commissioned by APS…APS is HAPPILY taking HUGE sums of money for charter schools to lease the buildings they occupy. I can only hope our government gets a clue…and swiftly. When we complain about jobs being sent overseas due to limited skills in The US, we should think about this ruling. We have only ourselves to blame.
Tracy
May 16th, 2011
11:42 pm
You people who believe public charter schools that let parents work one on one with their children in a safe environment is a bad thing are complete idiots. White flight? Yes – even rats flee a sinking ship and I know many blacks who are fleeing the bathroom rapes, gang beatings, bully till death, drugged up student seducing teacher led public schools. There are some hell holes that you cannot stay and fix – you build anew. If you can’t see that then you haven’t had your child raped in a high school bathroom yet. We the parents who want to flee pay taxes too and we are sick of throwing our tax money at absolute failures led by teacher unions. Teachers who – by the way – dont care to teach so much as they care to play favorites and grope little girls and boys. This isnt a nightmare, its the truth, and until it happens to your child keep looking through those ‘clear’ rose colored glasses. Parents have the RIGHT to dictate the education of their children and so we have the RIGHT to take our children out of the prisons you call public schools whether you like it or not. You want to stay and fix it? Feel free. Those of us at least as smart as bilge rats are leaving in droves – as you can obviously see by the enrollments of thousands in the chartered schools.
B. Killebrew
May 16th, 2011
11:49 pm
Tracy…what movie did you watch?
Tracy
May 16th, 2011
11:52 pm
Real life. My autistic nephew was raped in a high school bathroom. He was also mistreated by teachers and no IEP or 501 saved him. He was constantly bullied, beaten and harassed and no teacher stood up for him. What world are you living in that you don’t see the truth on your own news?
Educator at Heart - Please Quit Whining !!!
May 17th, 2011
12:02 am
@EAH…for the last time…it is NOT about systems, it is about what is best for each child and the children and the parents (who fund education and pay your salary) being the customers !!!
It has been proven over and over again, there are always some % of children that are not best served in the traditional public school setting – for the horrible schools, studies show it can be a very high %, but even for the good schools, it is always still SOME % !!!
Do your homework !!! View the documentaries titled, “The Cartel” and “Waiting for Superman!”
And please do me a favor -stop the whining about being a public school teacher. Parents are the ones ultimately responsible for their children’s education and to best optimize that education, it has and always will be about PARTNERSHIP. Parents and Children should always be the ones to make the final decision as to what works best for them – not some power hungry Super, corrupt School Board members, or a teacher who thinks he/she is God’s gift to the profession when in reality, they’re not. Stop taking everything so personal and realize, it is not about you, the teacher, or public vs. charter vs. private, it’s about the children. Even the great public schools by most traditional standards, have children who are not best served by that school’s offerings.
I am a former military officer who has layed my life on the line countless times for the many freedoms this country offers. It is well known that sane people do not enter the military for fame and fortune. I have always said that as a former military officer now working in the private sector, I work half as hard as I did in the military but get paid twice as much. In the military I worked twice, sometimes three times as hard as I now do in the corporate world but received 50% of what I now make. However, the leadership training, camraderie, commitment, and most importantly, job satisfaction was unparalelled and I would do it again in a heartbeat. My reward was knowing I was doing the right thing, and was truly one of the many unsung heroes that made the world a better and more democratic place to live.
As a teacher, school board member, superintendent, no one has the right to enslave children to an educational offering that isn’t working for them. School Choice freedoms are long overdue, the money should follow the child public or private, and return to serving the child as the customer. The competitive and customer oriented school environment that wil result will be the change we need so that all of our children will thrive educationally.
Tracy
May 17th, 2011
12:22 am
The money used does not belong to the school board. Or the schools. It belongs to the people who PAY TAXES. And they have the right to choose how their child is educated. The local school districts want to keep control over money allocated for children even when those children do not attend their school. The per pupil funds should follow the child to whatever school their parent chooses for them to attend.
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
8:34 am
Georgia Constitution Article VIII Sectin V:
Paragraph II. Boards of education. Each school system shall be under the management and control of a board of education, the members of which shall be elected as provided by law.
The New York Times published: ” a 24-page ruling, Chief Justice Carol W. Hunstein said that only local boards of education were empowered by Georgia’s Constitution to open and finance public schools.”
Question: So, why don’t the legislators introduce legislation to create and establish additional “Boards of Education”? For example: Atlanta is a city school system, but located in what counties? Perhaps it’s time to establish corporate/city school systems with Boards of Education and NON incorporated school systems for the county? (BTW: the education committees in the Senate and House could get working on this right now…special sessions)
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
8:46 am
ALSO: It may be time for the pro Charter school power houses to look to federal legislators. What if the federal government made Title I monies conditional for State DOEs and Local BOEs? For instance, what if the federal government said, IF a state does not provide for adequate “choice” in the education process…then that state and local education system will NOT receive Title I funds.
The State and Local dollars might be the “bulk of financing” education, but the FEDERAL Title I dollars is enough to have some leverage…..
Jeff G
May 17th, 2011
8:48 am
@Rod Johnson..your repeated anti-teacher union screeds are off base here. Regardless of the merits or problems of teacher unions, they are irrelevant in Georgia. Do some research before flying off the handle, and think for yourself instead of letting Fox pundits do it for you. Teacher unions in Georgia have no collective bargaining power. The only thing they do is provide support for teachers who have legitimate grievances when school systems fail to honor the terms of the contract which the systems themselves created. As far as the effects of unions on educational outcomes, you’d have a hard time finding the correlation you’re claiming. Some states with unions may have poor outcomes, but that’s mostly due to the large number of urban schools that always struggle due to poverty and other socioeconomic factors. Wisconsin has consistently performed at the highest levels despite their supposedly detrimental teacher unions.
Patricia Bryan
May 17th, 2011
9:33 am
Any suggestions for someone who has applied to teach in some of these charter schools? What should their next step be?
Thisisridiculous!
May 17th, 2011
9:34 am
Is this a joke! In Georgia, our school systems are still operating on standards set forth in the 1870’s, 1940’s, and even the 1980’s!!!! This is a new age in education, and clearly we have no standards in place that are meeting the needs of our children! To all of you school systems out there that meet AYP and 123 and Your Excellency every year, guess what… you have still failed to meet the needs of some the children that attend your schools! The tax dollars never left the community! The money was merely shifted to allow deserving children of tax-paying citizens the right to be in environment that better fits their learning styles. IF the COMMISSION is unconstitutional, then let us come up with a more appropriate way to grant charters. These children should not have suffer because there are still a few adults around that still cannot fathom the idea of opportunity for all people and not just the one’s that look like them! These charter schools offer the basis for an alternative to our traditional school structure that just may help to transform Georgia into a premier place to have our children educated. The challenge here is to let go of that ol’ way of thinkin’… and move forward with creating environments in which all children can learn. This is about the children, right?
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
11:14 am
If the “Charter schools” that are affected by this ruling has “zoned” students enrolled….I am curious if anyone can tell me if their “public” school is a public Title I school that is in Needs Improvement status as Per NCLB and are ENTITLED to school Choice?
If a school has to offer choice as per NCLB, then the charter school SHOULD be an alternative for the FAILING Public School.
Maureen, do you know if these Charter schools are in areas where the public school is in NI status? If so, then what are the schools being offered up as choice? Also, if there are public schools that are NOT safe as per NCLB, the Unsafe School Choice Option should also be looked at…as argument FOR the Charter School.
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
11:32 am
here’s the link….for AYP from the GDOE…….. click on AYP report…if a school did not make AYP it will state what action that school must take…for instance, NI first year status…may have to offer school choice, or may offer Supplemental Education Services…..NI year two..may be either of these consequences too…
NI for three years, schools must offer both, choice and SES…..
Now, if these “Charter school students” are zoned for a school in NI status first, second, or third year then choice is an option for parents…that is how we tie Charter school choice to Title I federal funding…
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
11:34 am
THe Link for AYP from the GDOE: Sorry for any confusion
http://public.doe.k12.ga.us/ayp2010/search.asp
Commission is NOT accountable to Parents or Taxpayers
May 17th, 2011
12:48 pm
Page 17… On the one hand, local school boards are comprised of members who live in their schools’ districts and must be ELECTED to their positions by the parents and taxpayers residing in the areas from which the students are drawn and the local schools taxes are raised. See Art. VIII, Sec. V, Par. II; Art. VIII, Sec. VI, Par. I. The Commission, on the other hand, is comprised of seven political APPOINTEES who are selected by the governor, the president of the Senate (i.e., the lieutenant governor) and the speaker of the House, see OCGA § 20-2-2082 (b); hence, its members are NOT accountable in any manner either to the parents or to the taxpayers.
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
3:20 pm
…@commission is not accountable to tax payers an parents: that is why Federal Title I funds for Title I schools should be looked at closely. The federal govt. can attach “conditions” to Title I funds just as it did years ago with the drinking age going to 21 and Highway funding…..
Laura Leckband
May 17th, 2011
3:48 pm
This is a sad day for Georgia. The truth is parents can, have and continue to work with schools in Georgia THAT ALLOW THEM TO DO SO. In Avondale parents did their utmost to improve the local school for more than 5 years, while being obstructed by the administration of that school at every turn. The real result of this ruling will be parents deciding once and for all to leave their neighborhoods, and likely Georgia as well. Charter schools are not perfect by a long shot, but they represent the only way parents have to truly impact the quality of the education their children receive. School Boards, particularly the DeKalb School Board. obstruct participation, limit comment, and work to maintain their members inviobility at the polls. They provide no responsiveness to parental concerns – that is just laughable.
I challenge you – How many jobs are created in a state with substandard schools? How many students stay in that state to work? How many corporations choose to relocate a company headquarters to or build a plant in a place where key employees will not move because they will not doom their children to a poor education?
Congratulations, Supreme Court – you are now leading Georgia’s “Race to the Bottom”.
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
4:15 pm
@Laura: I agree with you on many of your points….the real challenge I hope for the majority of parents is TO KNOW the current law…and GO TO THE BOE meetings and school councils and start demanding ACCOUNTABILITY.
OCGA 20-2-85-86 School councils
OCGA 20-3-237 Parent involvement in creation and updating Codes Of Condutct
CGA 20-2-237 regarding the BRIDGE Law. are just a few ….
Then there is Section 1118 of NCLB that pertains ONLY to Title I schools…
If the majority of parents do NOT exercise these laws to HOLD LBOEs or administrators accountable…THEN THEY GET Away with whatever they do.
Examine WHY charter schools were created….then TAKE those qualities and take them to the BOE…DO NOT allow a resource officer or principal to determine if your child was assaulted at school, CONTACT the local police department or call the 1-800-say-stop (GDOE Safety Hotline) to start a paper trail that the school system now avoids. If you have an issue, that is NOT resolved at the lowest level DO NOT be afraid to take it to the OPEN Meeting your BOE has…Make all complaints public knowledge and don’t be afraid to utilize the system’s grievance policy…ALSO, there Is SACS that you can contact too for issues that the LBOE might be deviating from their “written ” …We can’t give up for the SAKE of the parents who do not speak up for a plethora of reasons.
Shirley F.Rogers
May 17th, 2011
4:30 pm
The interpretation of this preposterous, bigoted, class oriented, ruling handed down by the Georgia Supreme Court is as follows:
It is “constitutional” for taxpayer monies to fund failing public schools controlled by the local school system. It is “unconstitutional” to use taxpayer monies to properly educate our children.
However, I do agree with the Supreme Court in its definition of “special”. I interpret that as this:
If someone or something does what it is supposed to do (provide a quality education) then it is not special, but it is operating as it should. It is no more extraordinary for one to refrain from committing adultery than it is to go to school and learn substantive, relative subject matter, taught by educators who actually teach as opposed to have schizophrenic, manic episodes when a student ask to use the restroom.
Finally, this should have been a matter for the ballot where the people of the State of Georgia have the opportunity to decide; not four Supreme Court Judges that had the privilege of educating their children where and how they choose.
Commission is NOT accountable to Parents or Taxpayers
May 17th, 2011
6:44 pm
I don’t consider a “commission” who is not elected and not accountable to parents or the taxpayers a good choice. I am also not okay with schools exempt from the rules and regs and are only bound by contracts between the petitioner and the governmen agency, without input from the parents and people a good choice. Personally, I want accountability for my tax dollars.
Southwest Georgia Mom
May 17th, 2011
7:48 pm
It’s all about money, no one seems concerned over the kids or the education they are recieving. Parents already have an advantage living in northern Georgia where their children can recieve a better education and have more oppurtunities to learn, etc. Whereas in south Georgia and more rural areas this is not possible, so a “charter” school is almost a neccessity for parents that want their children to strive for an education.
yes i am worried
May 17th, 2011
7:51 pm
For what seems like the 100th time, the parents in Avondale did try hard to work within the system. There are serious problems at the local elementary school and they are related to the administration, who are tied to Dr. Lewis. (think friends and family)
I watched, from afar, as dozens of parents worked their rears off trying to improve Avondale Elementary. They contributed a substantial amount of money and innumerable hours volunteering to a school where the principal routinely ran off half the staff a year.
Dr. Lewis was aware of this and kept the administration in place.
The community was left with no options.
Jennifer
May 17th, 2011
7:58 pm
These folks who think this ruling was such a good idea – go send your kid to Meadowcreek or Summerour. Then you can talk. Let’s see Louise Radloff send her great grandchildren there and then let’s have a discussion.
Hope
May 17th, 2011
8:07 pm
SHAME! SHAME! On those responsible for this selfish and thoughtless action taken against the best interest of Georgia’s children with highly questionable motives. We will be watching and hold you responsible for the harm this disruption in their education will surely bring! I just SHAME! SHAME! On those responsible for this selfish and thoughtless action taken against the best interest of Georgia’s children with highly questionable motives. We will be watching and hold you responsible for the harm this disruption in their education will surely bring! I just enrolled my children in k12 and am sick with concern about what the future holds.
Hope
May 17th, 2011
8:13 pm
oops! sorry for the messed up post. But I’m sure my concern is clear.
Hope
May 17th, 2011
8:17 pm
To not accountable. They are accountable if we as parents determine they aren’t preforming we will leave. One size does not fit all! Money should follow child. The only people that dont like that idea dont like the competition. I as a parent know what my childrens individual needs are and should have options. Are you a parent ?
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
11:30 pm
@yes I am worried: I looked up Avondale Elem. and in 2010 it shows a poverty rate of 91%. It is a title I school. NOW…let me ask you this…
Did you obeserve those parents writing the “student/teacher/parent Compacts”? Did you see the parents helping to decide where the $125,450 would be spent? Did you see that with this money went to pay for ONE teacher? Did you notice if there is a parent involvement coordinator and is that coordinator a parent of a child at that Title I school? Did those parents approach the parent business partners on the School Council? How ofter does the school council meet each year? Did the school council or Title I parent group ever ask to see the budget for the school?
You see, if a school has an overwhelming of free or reduced lunchrate….that normally means, VERY little expendable income to support a principal’s special interest projects……..HOWEVER, there is so much more the parents can lawfully be involved with….INCLUDING deciding where Title I monies from the federal govt. can and should be spent…..
Kathy II
May 17th, 2011
11:36 pm
http://www.doe.k12.ga.us/ReportingFW.aspx?PageReq=104&SchoolId=23061&T=1&FY=2010
link above should take you to the Avondale Title I report from GDOE.
Maureen, I’d like to “re-submit” a question: Maureen, do you know if these Charter schools are in areas where the public school is in NI status? If so, then what are the schools being offered up as choice? Also, if there are public schools that are NOT safe as per NCLB, the Unsafe School Choice Option should also be looked at…as argument FOR the Charter School
Kathy II
May 18th, 2011
1:32 am
BTW: the only reason Avondale, like MANY of our Georgia Schools, is NOT in Needs Improvement status… and it made AYP?
Georgia DOE backloaded. It was the fundamental belief that No Child Left Behind would not last, so Georgia and other states set the Annual Measurable Objective (AMO) or Absolute Bar very LOW at the beginning of the Law’s implementation, then as we get closer to 2014 (100% proficiency in L/A and Math) the absolute bar is raised incrementally, but more dramatic the closer we get to 2014 . The way it looks, one might predict that Avondale will likely make AYP up until 2012. In 2012, the AMO for math CRCT is set for 91%…even if the kids don’t pass, it takes two consecutive years to be NI status…so that puts us at the spring of 2014 before the school will be put on NI status, which would beget school choice or supplemental education services….However, 2014 is when NCLB is up and the AMO=100%. SO what happens after 2014?
Meanwhile it looks like Avondale should be establishing a foundation in Social Studies and Science for these kids…the percentage of students meeting or exceeding the standards on these tests are alarming…(2010 report as 2011 AYP report has not been published. Remember, the schools get to “re test” the kids and calculated in AYP) ..
A.M. Announcements | Circle Games: the Education Roundabout
May 18th, 2011
9:42 am
[...] straddles ed reform lines with his pick for schools leader. Protests in Georgia over this week’s state supreme court ruling invalidating the state’s charter-authorizing commission. Local We spend so much time and [...]
Ben
May 18th, 2011
10:15 am
This is no big deal. All it does is bring these schools under the authority of the local school boards, where it should have been to begin with. The boards and unions don’t really care about “educating” the children; they care about preserving their authority. Which is fine because education today is relative and if the children get an education, it’s incidental and not by design.
So now the choice is for a child to either get a public or private education(home schooling included); no in-between anymore. You parents are going to have to make a hard choice because the “system” has just won a big victory. No free rides anymore.
Commission is NOT accountable to Parents or Taxpayers
May 18th, 2011
11:06 am
@ Hope – I agree with you. I want “money” follows the child legislation. We dont need all these so called “special schools” – if money followed the child, even in public education it would encourage competition. The schools that serve the child and parents will have more people wanting to send their kids there and those that don’t will close. We need to bring back education grants.
Kathy II
May 18th, 2011
11:39 am
For those who keep putting out there: It’s about the money and/or follow the money…Well, what money and identify the “checks and balances” that is in place for most governing bodies, even if they seem to be sovereign like school boards of education.
I would like to share one more thing…at least this early and I believe it has some meat to it.
We all agree that this whole case is about funding, and NOT about our kids….therefore:
what funds are public school systems fighting for?
TAX DOLLARS…and local BOEs have the power to TAX by way of milage rate…NOW, what if we look to legislation to LIMIT or MINIMIZE the LBOE to tax the people? I know there are powerful lawmakers who are PRO charter schools and choice: Senate Majority Leader Chip ROgers for one. Alisha Morgan in the House…..
I also know that the Houston County BOE wrote a resolution in support of the suit filed against the Charter Schools, so I will NO longer support any additional taxation for our county by way of SPLOST and because we really do not get choice down here either. (Houston County has complete control over all of its schools….even the one charter school where “somebody” gets to choose who gets to enroll in the school. We received $3 Million tax payer dollars from a grant to convert a failing “alternative education” facility…it is now the Houston County Career Academy, and it is very impressive. It’s just too bad that everyone does not have the same opportunity to attend…due to limited space, which makes sense)
Hope this helps, and KEEP TRYING TO FIND more options and ways to MINIMIZE LBOEs power…..but always remember their real POWER is taxation
Teacher
May 18th, 2011
8:40 pm
@Let’s Be Real: I cannot believe your comment about special education. So those students with disabilities don’t contribute much? Wow. I guess ignorance is bliss. You should be ashamed of yourself.
Lovingmom
May 19th, 2011
1:03 pm
This is such a Sad Sad day. Georgia and school systems across the country use “attendance boundries” To ensure the richer families who have more education get to go to newer better schools and the kids that live in older neighborhoods and are more likly to be minorities or have uneducated parents get the older falling down failing schools. Basicly they are playing the odds and wharehousing the kids who are less likely to excell academicly to bring up test scores at other schools. IN DOING THIS THEY VIOLATE EQUAL ACCESS TO EDUCATION LAWS!
Charter schools FREE students from attendance boundries, and give ALL students a chance at a decent education. And every county I have seen will come up with any excuse to deny them. A Group of parents and I tried to open a charter school a couple years ago in Cobb county and every time we tried to submitt the paperwork suddenly they came up with another form(that they neglected to mention in the instructions) that would have had to be filed months ago. Our secound try they did the same thing and suddenly their was a NEW form(again not mentioned in the forms) Cobb has NO real(open to any student) high school Charters only “magnet programs” that require you to be GIFTED to enroll. So simply put if you are poor and smart but not gifted you go to a failure factory where they train you to work for Micky Ds or wally world.
If my children did not go to Georgia Cyber Acadamy they will be forced into failing violent schools(smith and osborne). THAT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. There is no way I am going to give my fed tax dollars back to a school district that wants to force my kids into a failure factory when their is a excellant school only a few blocks from my home, but they make me drive over 5 miles to a failure factory school because they made a huge LONG attendance boundry around all the older neighborhoods in the city.
These Judges who made this decision are Clearly good old boys who do not realize in the state of Georga any school that gives EQUAL ACCESS to education to all students is one heck of a SPECIAL SCHOOL The only way to improve education in the US is to OUTLAW ATTENDANCE BOUNDRIES.
When the same school district has both the BEST and WORST schools in the state, You know that the school district is simply shifting all the poorly performing students to one or two schools. Seen the news lately, you know what I mean.
COME ON LEGISlATURE, if you really want to improve education, do away with attendance boundries all together and let parents chose to send their student to any school in the district. That joke of a choice law did not work because the districts simply claim that the school is full long before school has even started and when they are still continuing to enroll local kids. You left it up to the same districts that WANT ATTENDANCE Boundries, on just how they offer choice, do you really think someone who does not want kids to be able to choose will effectively give students choice. Even the NCLB choice does not work because the school district only offers schools that are over an hour drive to discourage most parents from taking the choice.
SSGuy
May 19th, 2011
1:49 pm
All politics are local. What works in one county will not necessarily work – or even make sense – in a different locale. So a lot of these comments are based on where we each live and seem a little shortsighted because of this. What is at stake here is control, nothing more and nothing less: control over money, control over political power, control over the educational fate of our children. If you are decrying charter schools as taking control away from local voters, you have missed the point. First, charter schools are public schools and, as such, are created and run by local voters. The point made concerning high parental participation is no joke. My kids went to an elementary school that had a PTO. The principal wanted to allow them as little input into the school as possible – they were there to throw parties and raise funds for the school, nothing else. I or my wife went to all of the scheduled meetings. At most 5% of the children were represented. We put our youngest in a charter school. When the PTO meets, about 98% of the children are represented.
Here’s what it boils down to in our area (again, all politics are local). There are lots of folks who don’t care about my kids, or any of the other kids there. In fact, they would be a lot more happy to funnel any taxes now allocated for the education system elsewhere. Sure we can vote, and do, for candidates who are more responsive to what we want, but so very few folks in the area care enough to educate themselves on the issue because they just don’t care about the issue. The education of someone else’s child is not a priority. Couple that with those with a vested interest in the status quo, and there is little chance for those who want and need what is provided in this environment to get it.
Yes, politics in this country is about voting and going with the majority’s decision, but what about protection of the minority voice? There ought to be room for both systems to exist, not just for those with the loudest bellow. More important, we are not voting for ourselves, we are not voting for our children alone, but we are voting for all of the children in our state, inside and outside our own communities. We have to vote for them as they are not in a position to make any sort of decision for themselves. What I would like to see more of in this discussion is what sorts of things are going to give all of them the best education we as a society can afford. It is dubious that any single group in the community is going to be able to handle all of their needs. If the push by those who want charter schools tells us nothing else, it should scream that the needs of a sizable portion of our young people are not being met. To the extent that their parents are willing to go through all of the effort it takes to change things in the face of challenges, legal and otherwise, that most are not willing to attempt, who is right in denying them?
It is easy to cast things in terms of black and white, stark right and wrong, but try this on for size: I am not going to provide an education for your child and I am not willing to allow you to have the resources that you need to provide for your child that I am going to make available for your neighbor. What would that make me? I know that I am oversimplifying, but not to the extent the point is not valid.
My parents and sisters, my wife and I have all worked in a variety of educational institutions at different times. Some of us still do. I have three kids, one in elementary school, two in high school, the oldest and youngest are about to go on to another school. They have been in, variously, private and public schools (both charter and more traditionally structured). Some have been great while one was bad enough for us to pull our daughter out and home school. We are committed to their education and are willing to do whatever it takes to help them on their way. I have seen enough to realize one size does not fit all and resent being told I should have but one choice for my children, and that choice made by someone else.
This issue is about the children, yours and mine. We lose sight of this to their detriment.
Kathy II
May 19th, 2011
2:37 pm
@ssguy: you said, “First, charter schools are public schools and, as such, are created and run by local voters”
Not true….both de facto and de jure
Georgia Constitution: ARTICLE VIII.SECTION V. Paragraph II. Boards of education. Each school system shall be under the management and control of a board of education.
Georgia School Board and Superintendent Associations “External stakeholders include parents, community leaders, the business community, civic organizations, the faith-based community, local, state, and federal elected officials, government and social agencies, and retirees. ”
http://www.visionforpubliced.org/ProjectWork/CultureClimateandOrganizationalEfficacy/Documents.aspx
Kathy II
May 19th, 2011
2:43 pm
BTW: a PTO is what almost every school has because it is the fund raising arm for the principal’s special interests. What about your child’s school councill, not to be confused with the student council.
Parents who are actively involved with PTOs normally have time, money or both….and normally will have the ear of the principla. However, what abour parents who do not have th resources or disposable income to participate in the school’s PTO? What purpose do they serve? Did you ever wonder why your school didn’t have a PTA?
I do agree it is local politics, but it is a whole lot of local trust in the education decision makers, a whole lot of “cognitive intimidation” by decision makers when dealing with parents, and a WHOLE lot of centralized power that is so engrained in a culture it may never change…no matter what law.
makers try to do.
PS: Never, and I mean never underestimate the ability of the system’s spin doctor/PR person….these folks come up with a spin and deliver it to local media, and never gets challenged.
Let's Be HONEST
May 20th, 2011
5:20 pm
all charter schools are NOT public schools and this ruling is about the commission and mostly schools that are commissioned not public schools. People need to look into stuff before they speak about this issue. Confusing people and telling them that charters are public schools is a false statement.
Charters rip off millions from the public
May 20th, 2011
5:26 pm
I don’t see anyone looking into all the states who implemented charters 10 years ago and are now investigating charters because they have lost millions.
justbrowsing
May 22nd, 2011
10:15 am
Competition will set the Civil Rights Act back a few years- how would political leaders fix this? Next, what is the need for a charter school if they fall under public school jurisdiction? Would they then be another public school subject to the same bureaucratic demands as the general public school? There is no way that I can see a charter school accepting public monies but being allowed more latittude with how they enforce discipline and manage curriculum if public schools are not going tobe allowed to operate with the same permissions that they have. Maybe all schools need parental contracts? Maybe all schools need the right to hold parents accountable for their children (even those who do not want to)…. Then what?