No surprises in how many Georgia students lose HOPE

I’m not surprised or shocked that only three out of 10 student who start college with the HOPE Scholarship keep it the entire time they’re in school, as reported today by the AJC.

Nor is it unexpected that the University of Georgia boasts the highest rate of retention, with 60.9 percent of the students on the merit-based scholarship maintaining it throughout college. UGA has its pick of the state’s brightest students. I would bet that it also has the state’s most affluent students as academic performance tracks with socio-economics. Children of college graduates outperform children of high school graduates.

State Rep. Earl Ehrhart, R-Powder Springs, says it’s “shocking” that only 15.6 percent of the students at Clayton State University with the scholarship kept it through graduation in 2010, and 18.3 percent did so at Southern Polytechnic State University.

“If they can’t keep up the grades in college, what’s going on here?” he asks.

For starters, the students at Clayton and Southern Poly may be working more hours at jobs to finance their education. Students who work a lot of hours  — both in high school and college — tend to suffer lower grades as a result. They are more likely to dip below the required 3.0 GPA to earn and keep HOPE.

Research suggests that while working 10 hours a week enhances student performance, putting in 35 hours or more hurts performance.  Also, students with full-time jobs are more likely to drop out of school. Yet, in 2000, 830,000 full-time college students also worked full-time.

Just now, I received a release from the Civil Rights Project at UCLA on college affordability in California. The study found that, “Across the board students are found to be working too many hours to keep up with their studies and a huge proportion (30 percent) of those surveyed may abandon their studies and hopes of getting a college degree. The lowest income students are now getting a smaller share of the CSU’s State University Grant than they received in the past and middle-income students need increasingly more aid to keep up with rising costs. ”

There’s also the historic indifference of colleges to their graduation rates. With millions of public dollars wasted on kids who don’t finish college, many states are pushing their colleges to do a better job of helping students graduate. The AJC news story on lost HOPE Scholarships points out that the Regents are now pressuring colleges to boost completion rates.

According to the AJC:

Few students regain HOPE if they lose it. Of the 24,496 students who entered a University System college in fall 2004 with the scholarship, 10,439 lost it after their first year. Only 972 students regained it the following year.

Recent changes to HOPE eligibility requirements should result in more students holding on to it, because the new rules will give a truer picture of students’ grades, said David Lee, director of strategic research and analysis for the Student Finance Commission, which oversees the scholarship.

Students who graduated from high school before 2007 were allowed to use only their highest grades in English, math, science, social studies and foreign language to determine eligibility. Students may have failed these classes on their first try, but those grades weren’t considered, Lee said. As a result, some students who technically had a 2.0 GPA received the scholarship, he said.

Now all the grades students earned in core courses count when the commission determines eligibility, Lee said. The impact of these changes will be noticed in 2013.

As part of the HOPE overhaul approved this spring, high school students will be required to take specific rigorous courses to be eligible for the scholarship. The requirement, which begins with this fall’s ninth-graders, should make students better prepared for college, lawmakers said.

This fall, HOPE will pay full tuition only for the state’s most accomplished students, about 10 percent of recipients. Others will receive scholarship money to cover 90 percent of current tuition rates — not the new, increased rates for next fall.

– From Maureen Downey, for the AJC Get Schooled blog

53 comments Add your comment

A Conservative Voice

May 11th, 2011
4:17 pm

The AJC news story on lost HOPE Scholarships points out that the Regents are now pressuring colleges to boost completion rates.

They didn’t “Lose” anything……they just didn’t work hard enough to “Earn” it

Teacher Reader

May 11th, 2011
4:18 pm

I agree Conservative Voice. I also feel that the kids would have worked harder, if they knew that they would have only been given the money in the first place if they had really good grades. Right now there is no incentive for the kids to take school seriously. They receive it for the first year, goof off and there is no consequence. I am a firm believer that you only appreciate what you work for. When you’re given something 9 out of 10 times you don’t take as good care of it, as if you worked to earn it yourself.

Ole Guy

May 11th, 2011
4:21 pm

I graduated with honors…not Summa; not Magna, but GET DOWN ON MY KNEES, THANK THE LAUDE AND GET THE HELL OUTA THERE BEFORE THEY CHANGE THEIR MINDS!

JimBob

May 11th, 2011
4:37 pm

Working at a private university in Georgia, let me assure you that the greatest reason that students don’t makes grades is that they don’t deserve to. With massive high school grade inflation since HOPE began, but no real increases in the SAT or ACT, it is easy to see today’s students are no better prepared than those in pre-HOPE years. If anything, they are worse off since they may truly believe they “achieved” a 3.0 gpa. A few years back, we had a student apply who had a 3.0, and was 189th out of a class of 210. She did not keep HOPE past her first year. The greatest accomplishment of HOPE is that it has kept many of the truly brightest here rather than seeing them go up East or North Carolina. These kids are the 3.7 and 1200 kids, and because of it, will keep getting full tuition awards. But they also come from, by a huge margin, the most affuent families. Now I am all for wealth, but please know the bulk of students going to Georgia –or any state– are ill prepared for what awaits them. Scholarship and maturity would do them wonders.

BehindEnemyLines

May 11th, 2011
4:38 pm

Not surprising to me in the least, so we find ourselves in relatively rare agreement.

meh

May 11th, 2011
4:39 pm

I enrolled went to school in fall of ‘04 and graduated in December ‘10 while co-oping for five of those semesters. It isn’t about being from a higher income tax bracket or if your parents also had college degrees it is about working for it. Everyone I know was able to take out a student loan to cover expenses that HOPE scholarship didn’t provided (housing, meal plans, transportation, etc). What college kids need to learn is that you need to keep your partying on the weekends, which start on Thursdays, and get your work done so that you will be able to pay off that student loan when you graduate…Of course part of that is also choosing a degree that is marketable.

Jason

May 11th, 2011
4:42 pm

The article said, “UGA has its pick of the state’s brightest students.”, and drew the conclusion that “Nor is it unexpected that the University of Georgia boasts the highest rate of retention…”.

Maybe it should have just drawn the conclusion that UGA boasts many worthless degrees and cupcake classes! If you ride around in Athens long enough a degree is bound to fall into your car’s back window.

In all seriousness though, I would have been interested to know the retention rate at Georgia Tech. Tech also has it’s pick of the best and brightest, but I’d be willing to bet it has a fairly low HOPE retention rate. I’d imagine that rate is going to get even lower soon. It seems funny to me that the approach was just to change the GPA requirements. They should have changed it so that you can only receive hope if you are working toward degrees in career fields that are really needed like Engineering, Teaching, Medical, Law, Veternarian, Applied Sciences, Dentistry, etc… This would have been the best way to benefit the brightest students at both Tech and UGA along with all the other schools in Georgia.

So what the state is now esentially doing is encouraging kids to all rush into liberal arts and business majors that are easy to pass. I mean hey, why take calculus when it might mean you lose your scholarship? So now we’re going to end up producing a good number of students that all have degrees but no highly needed skill sets. While it is important that we have people with business degrees, those type of degrees are a dime a dozen. Whay we really need to do is help people acheive the degrees that are tougher to come by, require harder work, are avoided because of the cost associated with degree. We have a huge shortages in our society of doctors, engineers, and scientists, but this change to HOPE just made it less likely that people will pursue those degrees.

Troglodyke

May 11th, 2011
4:42 pm

Well said, Jim Bob. College is work, and too many high school grads haven’t ever had to do any.

Bring back quality vocational schools so that precious college slots are not being taken up by students who won’t or can’t do the schoolwork. Having training in a vocation is completely respectable, and if you choose the right one, you’ll never lack for work.

Jason

May 11th, 2011
4:45 pm

Another reason its not surprising that half of college students lose their hope scholarship in the first year is the simple fact that MANY college professors grade their classes on a curve. If they grade on a curve that means that only half of all total students will make better than a C. So, simply due to the nature of the grading scheme, half of the students are almost garunteed to lose HOPE.

Really?

May 11th, 2011
4:52 pm

“UGA has its pick of the state’s brightest students.”
You’re sure the brightest kids aren’t getting scholarship to private colleges, maybe even out of state? If the state’s smartest are the ones at the Athens Athletic Club it would explain a lot.

William Casey

May 11th, 2011
5:00 pm

@TEACHER READER: Absolutely correct. The single change most likely to improve HOPE retention would be to make it a reimbursement program, especially the first year. Now, perhaps the real agenda for HOPE is to get kids to “try” college life. If so, keep things as they are. Unfortunately, a certain percentage are going to decide that they like the social life but the classroom not so much.

Archie@Arkham Asylum

May 11th, 2011
5:29 pm

I have noticed that a passel of students who go off to college in Georgia have to take remedial courses. ( These courses were called “Bonehead English/Math” back in my undergraduate days.) You would think these courses, not being college level, would not be covered by HOPE but I do believe that they actually are! I think HOPE was intended for outstanding students or have I been reading the acronym wrong all this time? What is outstanding about having to take coursework to remediate what what should have been covered in high school? Go figure! On the lighter side, the Athens Athletic Club (a.k.a. University of Vince Dooley) has actually improved in the years following the Jan Kemp debacle. Before that debacle, a story was going around Georgia Southern about 1986 ( I was in grad school there at that time!) that UGA had admitted a football player whose combined SAT score was 350. (If I remember correctly, you got X number of points just for spelling your name right!) Things have certainly changed at UGA since then!

catlady

May 11th, 2011
5:29 pm

This info has been out there for more than a decade. Kids who need to work in college are more likely to struggle coming in with a high school 3.0 than kids who have no financial worries. Doing anything 30-40 hours a week rather than studying of course will have a negative effect.

Look at the SEs of kids with the 3.7/1200. It looks quite a bit different from the 3.0/<1200 crowd.

Katharine

May 11th, 2011
5:42 pm

@Jason: I’m guessing the retention of HOPE @ Georgia Tech is one of the worst! My son graduated 10th in his class and is one of those 1200+ SAT kids. He lost HOPE at the end of his 1st year at Tech (and btw, there is a reason Tech students refer to 1st, 2nd, etc. year instead of Freshman, Soph. etc.!!!) One of his friends at Tech actually kept HOPE, but paid for it dearly. He moved into a 1 bdrm. apt by himself and did nothing but go to class and study. He left Tech 1 semester prior to graduating because he was so burned out, and never went back! Meanwhile, my son will begin his 5th year at Tech(Engineering) in the Fall, still treading water. Keeping my fingers crossed and holding my breath he will make it. Does it really need to be this extreme?

Ray

May 11th, 2011
6:11 pm

Any word yet on how that Cobb School board is gonna scrape the egg off its face with these latest scores validating the calender used this year?

Call their response to this enlightenment a litmus test for whether they actually do care about our kids.

It's K-12 Stupid

May 11th, 2011
6:21 pm

Don’t blame the college’s for the grades they give. Be thankful they aren’t falling to the inflation pressure like k-12 schools. If you aren’t ready for college, you don’t have much hope literally.

tchr

May 11th, 2011
7:33 pm

@ Archie

HOPE doesn’t cover Regent’s (read “Bonehead”) classes as of this year.

We need to think long and hard about what the HOPE scholarship is for: is if for merit or is it for opportunity? There is some gray area where both overlap but we either want to subsidize the best and brightest Georgians OR we want to try to give a cheap collegiate education to as many Georgians as possible. You can’t cry about how many students get cut from HOPE and simultaneously decry the ease with which students can get a degree. I, for one, would prefer to see more students of a “lower quality” funded than a handful of the “highest quality” get a full ride.

redweather

May 11th, 2011
7:46 pm

Jason: I’ve never heard of the “curving down” supposedly being done at Georgia. Can you be a little more specific?

Echo

May 11th, 2011
8:03 pm

Many of those 3.0 students “earned” their grade by doing simple things like turning in completed work (mostly lame assignments that could be done by a elementary aged student) on time. Their test and quiz grades tell the real story…most of them can’t actually DEMONSTRATE their knowledge because they don’t have any! I’m so sick of students and parents using the “test anxiety” or “I don’t test well” excuse. The real cause is a lack of preparation, study skills and just plain common sense.

Echo

May 11th, 2011
8:04 pm

* an elementary aged student

East Cobb Parent

May 11th, 2011
8:46 pm

I think we will see even more grade inflation with the changes to HOPE, thus giving even more students a false since of accomplishment. Recently I watched “Race To Nowhere”, I noticed the students professing 3.+ GPA’s could not put together a single grammatically correct statement minus the words “like” and “uh”. The movie screamed grade inflation. If my child is accepted at both GA Tech and MIT where do you think I would send them, HOPE won’t even factor into the equation. I would send them to MIT even if I needed a second job. My main reason for this is for them to be farther from home and more on their own. For the record, I think Tech is an excellent school.
I’ve always told my children the following:
I will pay for college level courses – no remedial course
I will not pay for a course twice – you fail then you pay to retake the course
If you elect to not go to school that is fine, but you will be charged rent – there are no free rides after 18
Select a major you for which you have passion
Try to find a career that matches the passion and has availability in the job market

hssped

May 11th, 2011
8:55 pm

@tchr and Archie

HOPE did indeed cover remedial classes for the 2010-11 school year. But why does a HOPE recipient need remedial classes?

Atlanta mom

May 11th, 2011
9:29 pm

I read the original article in the AJC, and I believe it was about 40 or 43% of Tech students retain the HOPE for four years.

Dekalb Oldtimer

May 11th, 2011
9:30 pm

The HOPE problem can be dropped right at the doorstep of the inadequate preparation and inflated grades that begin right at the beginninng….public elementary, middle, and high schools. There is no way a student can make decent grades in college unless he/she has actually been educated and prepared in the public schools of Ga. From the looks of things today, that just is not going to happen…especially for those huge numbers of students who expect to be just ” passed along” without putting forth effort.

Economically deprived or economically affluent, born to highly educated professors or born to deaf parents with little education, students of all backgrounds have earned and kept HOPE scholarships.
We cannot continue to give little JOhnny and A because it’s hard for him, because he goes home at night to sleep in a hovel…..alone. WE cannot continue to cheat these students [and all students] out of an education.

Oh ..and being the child of college educated parents is actually a relatively recent occurrence. Back in the day it was quite rare to have parents who had been to college. Most of us did not let that get in our way. Today’s older captains of industry, college professors, doctors, engineers did not have college educated parent.

It’s up to all of us to stop this madness!!!

Tony

May 11th, 2011
10:26 pm

Here’s a good example of how kids are out of control and parents support their bad behavior:

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/27859592/detail.html

Not really directly related to this discussion about HOPE, but I believe there is a connection. You see many American kids don’t realize they have to WORK to earn an education. Whether at high school or college, students must do their part. They do not deserve a diploma automatically. They must work for it.

Our schools certainly do not need the kinds of kids highlighted in the WSB article who think it is okay to have a huge food fight and ignore the policemen warning them to stop.

chuck

May 11th, 2011
10:43 pm

Hi Maureen,

I didn’t get a chance to post on yesterday’s topic…Louisiana requiring board members to teach 3 days each year. I am quite surprised that you didn’t parallel that with Georgia’s own law that requires ADMINISTRATORS to teach 5 days each year. This law has been in place for a number of years, but I have yet to see an administrator actually fulfill that requirement. I would be very interested to hear from other teachers in regards to this law. I’m wondering why administrators always see to it that TEACHERS do things by the book, but don’t do so themselves.

It’s sort of like the law that allows teachers to remove disruptive students from their classrooms. Anybody ever see a teacher allowed to do that? Makes you wonder why why legislators spend so much time worrying about passing education laws when nobody seems to pay any attention.

Maureen Downey

May 11th, 2011
10:53 pm

@Chuck, I have not heard of anyone following that law. Has anyone?
Maureen

another comment

May 11th, 2011
11:03 pm

Right now I am so steamed that my 10th grade daughter’s Honor’s Lit. class writing assignment went from an essay on ” Who an I”, to the teacher allowing them to make any presentation on this. My daughter just shows me the You-tube video she did that is ten minutes long answering this. When she showed me this tonight, I was like what? I thought this was suppose to be an Essay. When she told me how difficult it was on Sunday, I told her the purpose was to get them to think and write an Essay for entrance to college. When I tried to talk her out of it, tonight, she told me that she told the teacher she was doing this and the teacher told her she would give her a 100 for this. I am shocked this is crazy. This is why these kids can’t keep the HOPE in college. They never learn to write an essay a book report, a thesis, they are lost when they get to school. The biggest thing of all with the advent of computers, they will type their own thesis, and not pay the department secretary to type theirs. So they won’t even get the professional proofreader like we had 30 years ago when we paid the department secretary to type our thesis.

FBT

May 11th, 2011
11:56 pm

My oldest is a senior at UGA and has kept HOPE. She studies very little and gets letter grade curves in her major classes just for showing up to class. She was shocked that she didn’t get an almost 10 point curve in an upper level anatomy course this semester. I really wonder why students are losing HOPE. You have to get a lot of C’s and D’s to lose HOPE.

God Bless the Teacher!

May 12th, 2011
6:16 am

@Maureen and Chuck

The law to which you’re referring was a requirement for a time for administrators to obtain recertification back in the early 2000’s. It hung around for a couple of years (at least in Clayotn County where I was an AP) but went away after too much outcry from administrators (primarily central offic folks) who didn’t have time in their schedules to plan for instruction with the current classroom teacher, much less spend a day in the classroom. Probably the point was made then what is being discussed now that administrators have “forgotten what it’s like to be in the classroom.” IMHO, even teaching for a few days each year isn’t a true picture of the day-to-day involvement of a regular classroom teacher. Most administrators (myself included) coordinated days with teachers where students would be reviewing for a test. Keep in mind you have administrators in high school whose classroom backgrounds may have been in ES or MS, and vice-versa, so “teaching” for five days may actually end up being wasted instructional time if the administrator doesn’t have the content background necessary to make the experience worthwhile. Being an administrator (both AP and P in the HS setting) for eight years prior to returning to the classroom a few years back gave me a greater respect for administrators (if they’re doing their jobs correctly) AND for teachers.

I teach in the middle

May 12th, 2011
6:44 am

It’s kind of ridiculous that all majors are held to the same standard. A student at tech studying biochemical engineering must have the same gpa to keep HOPE as a PE major at Podunk U? Just crazy. Equally crazy is changing the “rules” in the middle of the game. While my kiddo has held onto his 3.0 at UGA, he will no longer be in the “100%” tuition bracket. Fortunately, he only has one more semester! Yay!!

[...] No surprises in how many Georgia students lose HOPE | Get Schooled [...]

College Prof

May 12th, 2011
7:27 am

The HOPE issue is getting tiresome. The main reason students lose HOPE after their first year in college is that they were never really eligible in the first place. Grade inflation is a real problem in Georgia’s public high schools.

Since the inception of the HOPE scholarship in 1993 the percentage of HS graduates eligible for the scholarship has nearly doubled. This has occurred during a period of time when the preparation and commitment level of Georgia HS schools has declined greatly. Math skills among Georgia HS grads has declined preciptously.

UGA and Georgia Tech get a large percentage of the better students, with the remainder shared among the other institutions. Many of the students who are going to USG institutions simply are aren’t prepared or committed to do college-level work! Period

Weary and Worn Teacher

May 12th, 2011
7:56 am

The HOPE scholorship is a GIFT. The state does not owe you a college education. I get sick of people whinning about their kids losing it. If they would apply themselves they could probably keep it. Don’t look a gift horse in the mouth.

Yankee Prof

May 12th, 2011
8:22 am

This statistic is neither surprising nor a cause for conern, really. First off, it seems to give the lie to those who would claim HOPE-related grade inflation is rampant at GA colleges and universities. Secondly, maitaining a 3.0 or better for the whole of one’s college career is difficult and the accomplishment of only a minority of students. My own undergraduate experience is a case in point: I graduated 3.0+ but was below that threshhold a time or two along the way. And, as has been mentioned, this generation of college students has more external pressures, particularly economic, that compromise their ability to focus exclusively on their studies than generations previous. Further, the high drop-off rate of HOPE recipients also seems an effective answer to the problem of secondary-level grade inflation. This is all in keeping with the promise and responsibility of a scholarship: getting one is a privilege, keeping it a responsiblity, and neither is a guarantee.

Dr NO

May 12th, 2011
8:24 am

“Some gotta win
Some gott lose
Goodtime Charlie got the blues.”

dbow

May 12th, 2011
8:27 am

My group of 7th graders last year(now graduating 8th graders) was without a doubt the best class of students I have had in my long teaching career. While there were a few knuckleheads to be sure, the majority were hard working, serious students. They will be the BEST group of freshman my areas high schools will EVER see for a long, long time judging by the current group of students I have. I was hoping that my former students were part of an upward trend in students, but alas it is not to be. While my overall CRCT scores are still great, the percentage of my students that exceeded dropped by 15 percentage points. Am I to blame for this? Some would say yes, but I would point out that this group of kids is chock full of some of the whiniest, neediest, entitled, and most apathetic kids I have seen in a long while and I taught in some of the poorest schools in the country. I’ve heard that next years group is even worse. Sigh. To my my former students I say farewell and good luck. You will be missed and I know that you are the best group of students I will probably ever see. Some of you will go on to do great and wonderful things and I know that you will all be successfull in whatever you choose.

Anonymous teacher

May 12th, 2011
9:27 am

The 6th grade teachers in my building were told Monday that they would not be allowed to retain ANY student regardless of ability or CRCT test scores this year. They were told this is “county policy” (which I don’t believe) and that students who were behind would be “caught” in the 8th grade. I don’t believe that will happen, either.

*sigh*

TimeOut

May 12th, 2011
9:44 am

Teachers are under too much pressure to water down the requirements for the courses they teach. The Hope should be based on an Exit exam that tests all subjects that students take, including their Foreign Languages. If parents and students knew that there was no way to get into a university except through demonstrated performance of proficiency on an instrument that covered all academic subjects, then ALL such classes would matter to administrators, counselors, parents, fellow teachers, and, most of all, the STUDENTS. The bac, or bachot, or the German’s arbitur is so much more rigorous. If there is no exception to the admission standard for universities, then we could achieve a much higher performance level as our students would arrive with more of their own motivation to LEARN.

UGADawg

May 12th, 2011
10:42 am

Dear Ecoh,

I really think you need to consider what you are talking about. Some students learn differently than others, and test & quiz grades DO NOT always show every students ability. There are ways to demonstrate learning in other ways BESIDES having to MEMORIZE material for a test or quiz. I will have you know that I have learning disabilities and I graduated UGA (undergrad and grad) both times with HONORS. Sometimes people have real issues that dont allow them to perform well on long exams, and display knowledge via other mediums. You will NEVER understand what it is like to be different! Go back to your old ways!

soccermom

May 12th, 2011
10:51 am

@Jason – what a supercilious a$$ you are!
As a UGA grad in the biological sciences field, I can promise you that no one threw a diploma in my car window. O Chem, Biochem, mycotoxicology, and etc. are not “gimme” grades!
Additionally, my son is an accounting major, finishing his second year at UGA. He is a smart young man who does know how to apply himself. From his account, not many, if any, of his classes are “gimme” grades.

j nes

May 12th, 2011
11:18 am

The pressure that NCLB put on public schools to increase graduation rates has had disastrous consequences. Schools now push through students that do not deserve it just to increase their own graduation rates. It is a self serving mission which devalues a high school diploma and creates uneducated high school “graduates” that will soon be standing in unemployment lines or dropping out of college because they are not prepared.

If this happens at the college level, economic recovery is a lost cause.

Anonymous Teacher

May 12th, 2011
11:28 am

@ j nes I have to agree with you. It is all about pass rates and graduation rates and NCLB. While I am in a middle school at the moment, it is a sad day when teachers are NOT allowed to retain students who are struggling simply because it “looks bad” to retain so many. I have several students who have NEVER passed the CRCT in math and reading. NEVER. Yet they have never been retained. NEVER. When they get to high school, they will be stuck in the 9th grade because they cannot do basic math or read. By then, the bar should be so low that it doesn’t even matter.

T Krugman

May 12th, 2011
1:25 pm

In Dekalb, we teachers are told to allow students multiple opportunities to make up or redo work; we are told to have flexible deadlines on assignments as well. This is not the case in the post secondary, or working world. Of course, this leads to rampant grade inflation, but it also makes the school and the respective school system look better- higher graduation rates,,lower failure rates etc.
I have seen administrators alter grades of failing students on the basis of a technicality or even due to parental pressure. The result, of course, is that these students are not prepared for the academic challenges of college,even if they ‘earned’ a “B” average in high school.

Not much Joy in Teaching

May 12th, 2011
2:25 pm

Let’s face it: due to NCLB and the PC-ness of this world where everyone must feel good about themselves (except teachers, policemen, or other public servants), school isn’t about kids actually learning anything these days.

What is school about?

* School is about making money for Gates and Pearson.

* School is about promoting the agenda of politicians.

* School is about some power-hungry administrator getting to push teachers around just because.

* School is about providing baby sitting services

* School is about helping kids feel good about themselves despite their not being able to read, write, or do math on grade level.

Lt Dan

May 12th, 2011
3:24 pm

Following a few wasted quarters of academic tomfoolery, I learned to fly helicopters, first in the (relatively) friendly skies of Alabama, then in the (extremely) unfriendly skies of SE Asia. After THAT experience, I knew, without a doubt, that education was no “I’ll do it in my own time” endeavor. After settling up a few bar tabs around town, and convincing my profs that I actually knew what I was doing, I received my degree (on the GI Bill) and went about the business of “making footprints”. All this happened within 10 years of my hs graduation. When, at 18-19 y/o, I realized I was not yet mature enough to take the collegiate life seriously, I was thrown (well, in reality, I voluntarily became) to the wolves.

Could this be the problem? Not too many young men are truly prepared for college. The “female scent”, somehow, seems to overpower the “call of the books”…A (repeat…A) beer, all-too-often, becomes a “big bash”. For me, and for many of my peers, it took a “kick in the pants”, a total immersion, of sorts, into the “poo poo pot” of mankind at his worse.

I am not suggesting, for one minute, that going to war is the only way to “find one’s self”; to find the goal-oriented motivation to achieve. But it sure as hell squared me away!

Dekalb Oldtimer

May 12th, 2011
11:06 pm

DARE FOR THe AJC and MAUREEN AND OTHER ED. ASSIGNED REPORTERS:::::::::

TAKE ON THE THE HOPE ISSUE FROM THE “get real” point of view THAT HAS BEEN MENTIONED HERE ON THIS BLOG TIME AND TIME AGAIN:

Example…..TKrugman post @1:25…..Anonymous Teacher @ 9:27&11:28, DekalbOldtimer@9:30p.m.,Troglodyke@4:42. It’s K-12 Stupid@6:21…
Combine these with others mentioning similar concerns….that have been mentioned on this blog from DAY 1 !!!! SOMEONE NEEDS TO DO THIS IT IS EVER TO BE REPAIRED.

Lee

May 13th, 2011
8:00 am

Once again, make HOPE a Reimbursement Program and many of these problems go away.

Several years ago, my oldest child who made straight A’s for 12 years, took every AP class available, and graduated 4th in her class, went to the University and struggled with a couple of classes during her first semester. Told me later that she “DIDN’T KNOW HOW TO STUDY”. Think about that one for a minute. If the most rigorous curriculum you have does not require you to learn good study habits, then something is wrong.

My youngest daughter, who we sent to private school, is now in college and thinks “it is easy”. BTW, when we took her out of public and enrolled her in the private school, she went from making high A’s to B’s and C’s that first year.

southernopinion

May 13th, 2011
9:20 am

I know for a fact that students lose the Hope Scholarship and don’t care. I taught at the regional 2 year college in Americus, Georgia and saw first hand when I started with about 15 students and ended with 5! Yes! FIVE! They did not care and did not come to class. Most came on the Hope Scholarship. WHAT A WASTE OF MONEY!

Really amazed

May 13th, 2011
9:57 am

@Lee, I know exactly what you mean. My son has always been a great student. Up until 9th grade, straight A student. Now in a very challenging private school he has a least 3 b’s some in honors and one in Ap world history. We are told that when these students graduate on go on to college the students from there school are the ones making through college not just to it. I hope this is true. I hear all the time how at the local public high school students are getting extra pt. for just showing up, turning homework in and get to re-take test. His school won’t budge on a grade if you are making an 88 or 89 it will be that 88 or 89. Then again entitlement at public schools and passing kids for AYP is a new way of life. I won’t stand for it with my children. They may go to private school but they are not the ones entitled and having things, stuff, ipods, ipads and grades just being handed to them. This is truly a misconception about all private school kids. I see more entitlement going on, in my neighborhood by the children going to public. They even tell my kids they don’t have any homework and every quarter they have an awards ceramony for A’s and or A’s and B’s very rarely is a C handed out to anyone. My youngest in elementary private doesn’t have an awards ceramony until end of 5th grade and she is in 3rd making the straight A’s. It is expected out of them at the elementary school level. They all had to take an SSAT just to be enrolled.