Burst the bubble of shallow professor evaluations
I read this piece in the Emory Wheel and asked permission of the Emory University student newspaper editors and the author to reprint in the AJC as I thought it was well done and interesting. The author is Andrew Brown, a senior at Emory University. Enjoy. You can read the Emory Wheel online.
By Andrew Brown
As I write this op-ed, I am sitting in the penultimate lecture of one of my classes at Emory University. In a moment, the professor will begin to teach. But I will keep writing this piece rather than pay attention to her because this lecture (like every other one she has given this semester) will be boring and disjointed, and it will tell me nothing that I won’t learn from reading the textbook.
Unfortunately, I think many Emory students have had similar experiences in their courses. In this particular class, only about half of the students show up to each lecture — and those who do pass the time by noodling on their iPhones or doing work for other classes. (At the moment, the student to my left is reading “The Game” by Neil Strauss, and the one on my right is playing games on his calculator.)
But today is unusual in that not a single student is skipping this class. (That doesn’t mean they are paying attention though — they aren’t). This is because the professor is going to add 1 percent as extra credit to the final grade of the students who come to class today. This incentive was given because today we fill out course evaluations. Useless as her lectures may be, my professor is right to stress the importance of evaluations. (Whether she is right to give bonus points for filling them out is another question, but I’m not complaining.)
What she may not realize is that Emory’s system for evaluating professors is broken. Course evaluations are really important. In theory, they allow professors to improve on weak areas of their teaching while also allowing the dean of faculty to detect incompetent professors and take the appropriate measures in response. I say “in theory” because that isn’t what actually happens. What actually happens is that everyone tears through the college’s bubble sheet evaluation and maybe writes a sentence or two on the department’s course-specific evaluation form.
No one really says what they actually think about the class or professor because to distill their thoughts might actually require 15 or 20 minutes of contemplative writing. That would mean having to remain in class longer than absolutely necessary, and who would want to do that?
Certainly not me.
I am as guilty as the rest. I fly through evaluations simply so I can leave earlier, and I must confess that most of my professors have therefore been deprived of the criticism they have earned.
But today I will make an exception. I feel so strongly about this professor that I am actually going to take my time with the evaluations and speak my mind. Tuition is $19,000 a semester at Emory — for that significant of an investment, I demand a certain standard of education.
But it shouldn’t take a semester’s worth of bad lectures to inspire me actually to finish an evaluation. There should be a new system for evaluating professors. The bubble sheet alone is inadequate; any meaningful critique of the professor must come through words.
Even if students are given ample time to complete evaluations, they still probably won’t fill them out thoughtfully.
Therefore, the writing of evaluations must be incentivized in some way. Maybe every student should be required to write a short essay, say 200 to 300 words, about each class. This would force students to do some thinking.Never mind that no one wants to write that much. The benefits that come from such a system will far outweigh the student discomfort.(And of course, if such a change were implemented, I will have graduated by then, so writing four more essays at the end of the semester won’t be my problem.) Maybe the essay idea isn’t a feasible solution. The department heads may not be able to take the time to read thousands of short essays. (But do they even take the time to read the thousands of short answers produced by the current system?)
But Emory administrators must at least recognize the problems with the current process for course evaluations and take necessary steps toward improvement. Students come to Emory seeking a solid education — bad professors should not continually be allowed slip through the cracks simply for lack of an effective evaluation system.
– From Maureen Downey at the AJC Get Schooled blog
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96 comments Add your comment
Echo
December 30th, 2010
11:16 am
I guess that prof is not differentiating to this student’s learning style. Shame!
DeKalb Educated
December 30th, 2010
11:32 am
Hope Lindsey and the rest of the Georgia Legislative Body consider how effective the evaluation process works in a private university before they begin to grade our public school teachers.
What's best for kids?
December 30th, 2010
11:33 am
Sounds a bit whiny, wouldn’t you say? Why not simply give the professor the bubbles that she deserves? And why would someone give an extra percent as an incentive to complete it?
I love teaching. I hate what it is becoming.
December 30th, 2010
11:38 am
I understand this students frustration, but what we have here is so typical. There is an evaluation process in place. It can be used to express a “written” detailed account of the professor’s strengths and weaknesses, but because students don’t want to bother sitting in class longer than necessary for 15 to 20 minutes of contemplative writing, the evaluation system is seen as broken. Instead, the author proposes that students be “required” to write essays in each class.
Maybe the students should just put forth the effort to express themselves using the format which is more than adequate if they take a little personal responsibility.
ScienceTeacher671
December 30th, 2010
11:44 am
The student says: Tuition is $19,000 a semester at Emory — for that significant of an investment, I demand a certain standard of education.
And if all students felt that way about every class, the system in place would be more than adequate.
However, what I get from the student’s essay is that Emory is full of lazy students waiting to be spoon-fed, and willing to do the absolute minimum to “succeed”.
Sort of like a lot of high school students, actually.
Really?
December 30th, 2010
11:49 am
Always love the way self important kids know more than their elders. Perhaps if the little snot noses treated the professor in a respectful manner he or she might learn something. If you never pay attention how do you know what is being taught?
Really?
December 30th, 2010
11:54 am
Used to be obtaining an education was a privilege and something to be honored. Now kids like this little whiner see it as a God given right. Where we went wrong in education is simple. When we started this ‘the customer is always right’ crap and began coddling students and parents as customers we totally devalued education in this country.
cricket
December 30th, 2010
12:04 pm
I think this student’s views bring home the point that an in class lecture is an obsolete form of instruction. If the teacher is standing before the students simply spewing forth information without engaging the those in attendance, it would be more cost effective to just present the lecture over streaming video. The same video could be used for several semesters. Fewer instructors would need to be paid.
Anti NCLB Advocate
December 30th, 2010
12:05 pm
It’s rather nice to know that students at Emory aren’t much different from the ones at the MOR university where I do my best to instruct and guide students who are the products of NCLB. This writer whines about a boring and disjointed lecture, yet doesn’t consider that if he and the other students were paying attention, the lecture wouldn’t seem disjointed because they could follow what the professor is saying.
I don’t give a rat’s rear about evaluations. The students who complete them are usually bitter about their grades, especially when they realize my concern for their scholarship or team eligibility is nonexistent–things they should have been concerned about from the first day of class. Students who do well receive the grades they’ve earned and not the ones they expect because they show up for class.
I’ve had to lower my standards considerably, and I’m the only one who seems bothered by that. What motivates me now is knowing that next fall I’ll be enrolled full time in a PhD program.
Connie Jenkins
December 30th, 2010
12:06 pm
Most of today’s students are the product of a school system that allows the students to be in charge. So now, everyone is shocked to learn that American students are way behind other countries in knowledge. A huge number must take remedial courses just to pass the first year of university. We all know that so many children will take the easy way out if allowed to.
I am so glad that my 21 year old grandson quit college in disgust at the poor teaching after one year to join the Air Force. He will attend school for 3 years studying nuclear engineering where the instructors will be in charge. Students will not be allowed to have cell phones in class, nor will they be allowed to skip lectures.
I attended school in the ’40’s and ’50’s when the teachers were in charge and we were not allowed to be in charge. When my children were in school, I taught them that they went to school to learn and school was not intended to be a social club. Goofing off in school was not allowed.
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
12:17 pm
Ha ha ha! Wow, just…wow. There’s already an evaluation system in place – it’s not the problem. At the very least, bubble in the right score if the professor is terrible! That might take an additional 5 minutes of his precious time.
The overall issue doesn’t seem to be the system but the students in the class(es).
EnoughAlready
December 30th, 2010
12:29 pm
These are the same kind of teachers we have in elementary, middle, high school and college/universities across the country. I remember the exact same situation happening while I was in school. I hear the same stories from my daughter, except they are required to attend, because they will be counted as adbsent.
You are wrong, the problem is definitely the professor. The students at Emory are not the students most of you describe in poor schools around Georgia; these students are high performers and score high on SAT’s and other test. How can you say it’s the students?
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
12:31 pm
@cricket: Well how about the workplace? I’m bored every time we have a meeting – which is strictly lecture format with PowerPoint slides. Wouldn’t it be great if we could sit with our friends and/or classmates and pretend to work but really be talking about social stuff? Or what if we could all have laptops or iPads out so we could be “participating” using technology? The fact is these are fads, just like any other pedagogy you might respond with – they simply keep those who aren’t really interested in learning and knowledge (those without what some like to call “intellectual curiosity”) placated while those who really want to learn will no matter if it’s lecture based or otherwise.
It’s an unfortunate reality that we are expected to entertain rather than instruct at the K-12 level. The concept of personal responsibility is essentially dead in the water right now – and when does this stop? If not college, when?
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
12:35 pm
EnoughAlready: Maybe the professor is terrible. I had my fair share too. When it came time to bubble in the various choices, I was sometimes honest and sometimes not.
Anyway – my point was the problem isn’t the evaluation system. His point was that his classmates didn’t want to take the time to fill it out appropriately. That’s why I suggest it’s the students; not the evaluation tool. Whether or not the professor is terrible – who knows? 50/50 shot either way based on this article alone.
EnoughAlready
December 30th, 2010
12:49 pm
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
12:31 pm
Millions of people go to work every day and do absolutely nothing.
Prancer
December 30th, 2010
12:50 pm
Ineffectual college professors are nothing new. I had psych professor who stood in front of his class and read, word for word, from the textbook for the entire hour. No one ever complained because the lowest grade he ever gave was a B but the class was a huge waste of time and money. Back then there were no student evaluations so the guy, and others like him, was a permanent fixture at the school.
At least today’s students have the opportunity to give some feedback – provided they take the time to do it right and anyone in authority pays attention.
NWGA Teacher
December 30th, 2010
12:54 pm
Obviously, this professor has not designed engaging lessons in order to keep the students interested and entertained, nor does this student observe evidence of differentiation. Did the professor post and reference standards and objectives before beginning this lesson?
My child loved elementary and middle school, and while she enjoys high school, she remains disappointed by some teachers’ failure to “make the classes fun.” She now understands that she was conditioned to believe that LEARNING IS ALWAYS FUN and A TEACHER’S JOB IS ALWAYS TO HELP STUDENTS GET GOOD GRADES. In other words, she has learned that she has to study, she has to pay attention in class, she has to take notes, she has to turn in her homework, and she will not always get a second or third chance.
Give me a break. No wonder so many students are not ready for college. No wonder so many first-year college students flounder and fail. It’s bait-and-switch.
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
1:04 pm
EnoughAlready@12:49 – True, and millions of people are fired from those jobs everyday (even teachers!).
EnoughAlready
December 30th, 2010
1:07 pm
If you are going to lecture and read right out of the book, why should I pay $19,000 to contribute to a professors salary, medical and retirement benefits? I could easily purchase the book and get the same information I am getting out of attending your class.
A professor shouldn’t have to stand on their heads to keep me entertained, but they should ADD something to the course that can’t be found in the textbook.
A professor should have “added value” or a certain level of professional criteria that isn’t found in a book. Why get a Masters degree or higher if it doesn’t add value to your teaching ability?
HS Math Teacher
December 30th, 2010
1:09 pm
I didn’t go to Emory, but I did get two degrees, and a masters, spending a total of eight years in college. I went to 4 different universities and have had numerous professors. None of them were perfect, nor am I as a high school teacher. I did, however, RESPECT the adult in the front of the auditorium, or room.
I’ve had professors from China, India, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Scotland, and Russia. Some of the professors spoke poor English (I could understand the Scot, but his accent would throw me at times), and my eyebrows would furrow as I tried to put together what they were trying to say. When these professors would start writing on the board, I would give a sigh of relief, as math is a universal language. All of this had no bearing on my giving the professor respect for his or her accomplishments, and for the role they play in education.
There was no Hope scholarship, nor did I qualify for financial aid back in my school time; I paid dearly for an education (one out-of-state), working part-time jobs through school. This kid is going to have a diploma that will have EMORY UNIVERSITY emblazoned on it. He will get more than his (his parents’) money back.
Yes, we had those same evaluation forms in the 70’s and early 80’s. I did take the time to fill them out thoughtfully. I was kind at times when I could have been more truthful. If I had a really good professor (by my limited evaluation standards at the time), I would elaborate more on the open-ended items.
What's best for kids?
December 30th, 2010
1:10 pm
I wonder if this young scholar is paying his 19k a semester, or if his parents are paying it.
I also wonder why he thinks that it is okay, given his demands of excellent education, that using parenthesis is an acceptable means of expression. Parenthesis are frowned on in writing.
Not impressed with Mr. Brown. Methinks he is in for a large disappointment when he attends meetings at his job, assuming he has one, and the lectures are “disjointed and boring”.
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
1:14 pm
I was in college a total of 6 years including undergrad and grad at 3 different universities and with 3 different majors. I never, ever had a professor read from a textbook. More often than not, tests and the final exam came from class notes and that content was much more detailed and rigorous.
Larry Major
December 30th, 2010
1:15 pm
Mr. Brown is indeed a skilled writer. I particularly like the way he uses humor at just the right spots, allowing him to drive a point home without appearing confrontational. It’s a refreshing and interesting style.
Dr NO
December 30th, 2010
1:19 pm
FINALLY someone speaks out so that the insanity might end. As everyone knows the students always know better than the pupil.
Dr NO
December 30th, 2010
1:20 pm
I didnt go to Emory but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Tony
December 30th, 2010
1:22 pm
I am appalled that younwould print such a whiny piece based on a single student’s complaints about a professor. How sad.
It indicates to me that this student is quite disrespectful and very self-absorbed. With students like these, why would the professors waste any of their precious time improving their lectures.
Consumer of higher education
December 30th, 2010
1:33 pm
northatlantatetacher – your comment regarding the students is right on target! Mr. Brown declares the Emory system to be broken, then explains that the reason it is broken is that students do not participate in it. He completes his op-ed piece by tasking Emory to fix the problem. What does he expect the school to do – hold each student’s hand as they fill out the evaluation? Perhaps make the evaluation into a game that can be played on the student’s iPhone or iPad (with points redeemable at the iTunes store for completing each evaluation).
As a college student, I hold my professors accountable. I pay a lot of money (OK, I pay a bunch of money and my parents pay the rest) for my education. I expect professors to provide me with the informatino I need. I expect to be challenged. I am the customer. The professor is not doing me a favor by teaching – I am paying for the lecture.
However, as a consumer, I cannot expect the service to improve unless I take the effort to let the vendor know what the problems are. If I do not, I cannot complain.
another comment.
December 30th, 2010
1:34 pm
I believe the Emory student has hit the nail on the head, their are some real Frauds’s who teach at some of the Universities in Atlanta. One goes by R.O. and was bounced between the Architecture and Civil Engineering Department at Georgia Tech for years. This woman slept her way up through DOD. Secretary sleeping with Generals, then sent out for a Math degree. She was promoted and given an outstanding rating to another DOD agency. She never stayed more then 2 years in any one position. Along the way, she was sent off for training that led to a PHD. She also, inserted her name on a Patent for an Cost Estimating Software with four males. The males will tell that she did not a damn thing on this project, was just in the office. It is clear by her lack of knowledge that she was not an inventor of this system. However, once this was patented she took the Patent and the PHD and bamboozled GaTech. Then she sent her hyped up resume where she claims she is an expert in everything and did a two year or so term of distruction as an SES in Facilities at a Major Government Lab, in town where she claimed to be a Laboratory expert. This fool actually said in a meeting that a BSL-3 lab could have a window air conditionor, they can not. To make matters worse, all she needed to do was have read the CDC/NIH Guidelines on Biosafety Labs first and studied it and she would have known not a chance. She was asked to leave this position and went back to Tech, she had been on a Sabattical from Georgia Tech during this time. Once back at Georgia Tech she was calling various Architects and Engineers from around town to be guest lectures for her class. The Guest Lecturers receive no pay, she pocketed the pay. At least the students had a real Architect or Engineer on those days. I myself was once snookered into giving a LEED’s presentation to the A & E Community, I refused to give her credit. She knew she could not stand up to this crowd. It was my speech, my work, not hers, she was incompetant.
All of the above is true and was vetted by multiple sources, we checked this woman out. We background checked every place she worked at DOD, and could not beleive that Ga Tech would have someone like that as a professor. But then she could B.S. and add the B.S. on her C.V. and no one wanted her more than two years so everyone passed her along with glowing references.
I am a female who worked hard for my degrees so women like this make me sick. The guys did most of the background checking, with the guys in DOD, but everyway we checked came back the same. I was there when she made the moronic comment that you could use a building with a window air conditioner as a BSL-3 Lab. You absolutely can not, it is all about the air containment when you get to BSL-3 and 4 Labs. If you don’t know it you should keep your mouth shut.
So seeing the poor quality of Professors that Ga Tech hires, that other employers then think since they were or are a Ga/Tech Professor that they have been vetted and are the top of their field is not the case at all. The Emory students should be commended for exposing it exists their too.
A big problem with Universities in large cities are those Professors more interested in the Consulting income being on the University payroll then actually teaching. The one I spoke of above used to openly brag is I can bring in $200-400K a year consulting just by being a GaTech professor. Yeah never teaching.
Dr. Proud Black Man
December 30th, 2010
1:36 pm
This student is a prime example of “White Skin Privilege” that some of you here may mock.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_privilege
JM
December 30th, 2010
1:48 pm
@Dr. Pround Black Man
Where in the article does he disclose his race?
An American Patriot
December 30th, 2010
2:18 pm
DPBM, I, as well as you know that we have differences that may never be reconciled…..but sir, you are a racist, pure and simply. The author of the piece above was expressing an opinion, which is still admissable, I think…..and he should be afforded the opportunity to do so without the world calling him names……that is exactly what I’m doing, but my opinion is also a fact
Dr. Proud Black Man
December 30th, 2010
2:19 pm
@ JM
He doesn’t have to. His missive yells out loud, “I am White, cater to me!”
Dr. Proud Black Man
December 30th, 2010
2:23 pm
@ An American Liar
“The author of the piece above was expressing an opinion, which is still admissable, I think…..and he should be afforded the opportunity to do so without the world calling him names…”
Listen Jethro, I don’t need your validation. Can you dig it? As far as calling names… you might want to check yourself, sounds like you too have a touch of W.S.P.
Lori
December 30th, 2010
2:30 pm
PMB just assumes everyone who is educated must be white!
At least this guy can understand his prof, I went to GT where most of them barely spoke English.
Really?
December 30th, 2010
3:02 pm
Consumer of Education. Just be thankful you live in a country that allows anyone the chance to be educated. Now try not to take the privilege for granted. You are not paying for a service, you are investing in your future. There should be a large difference in your mind. With the right attitude one can learn something from the worst of teachers. If a student’s educational experience is lacking it is his or her own fault , not the professor’s or the system.
random thoughts
December 30th, 2010
3:17 pm
If the point of course evaluation is to provide professors useful information on improving their teaching, then universities should abolish questions that are to be answered on a scale (1-5, agree-disagree, whatever). Those numbers mean nothing when the professors try to do something to improve their teaching. What does it mean that they get a point of 3.8 out of 5 on an item like, “Professor answered students’ questions completely.” On the other hand, if they read that most of the students who come to the class are playing games or doing work for other classes, then they can start thinking about how to eliminate such behavior. If they think they are not learning what they can’t get out of the book, then that should tell them something. But, the administration wants simple data, a number, that can be compared with what other professors get. So, they just focus on those bubble-in questions.
How do students who, by definition, do not yet understand the discipline fully make a judgment on a professor’s lecture – other than whether or not it was “fun.” How does he know that he can actually learn from the book? Asking students to evaluate teachers (professors) is fundamentally problematic.
When all students show up just for one point on the final grade, you just start wondering about the intelligence of these students. I think the professor gives this extra credit because she knows that it only affects a few students, if any, in the end.
EdDawg
December 30th, 2010
3:21 pm
Thank you PMB for the link. Some can’t handle criticism of one’s own race. Having read some literature on race matters in education for my degrees, I can totally agree with your assumption of the writer’s race. He does sound like a privileged, whiney, White kid. Maybe he isn’t; maybe we’re wrong. Either way he needs to get over it and realize that most college educated people have had to self-teach themselves for a class or two. That’s the issue many students have with on-line learning is that it requires so much self-teaching of the material & responsibility. He needs to grow-up and realize that in life people don’t cater to your learning style; you were successful enough to get into Emory now it’s time to expand your learning style with some meta-cognation.
The Real Point
December 30th, 2010
3:25 pm
Oh its so easy to dismiss this student and his peers as being lazy for not wanting to take the time to fill out the form. But if you do that, you completely miss the obvious issue.
The evaluation system relies on the students to fill out the evaluation honestly and to provide useful feedback. The students don’t feel a need or a desire to provide this feedback or in the case of bubble form evaluations, do more then just blindly fill in random bubbles. This isn’t unique to Emory and was even a problem at my own university 20 years ago. Any system that has a well known and critical flaw like this is a broken system. That is not the fault of the students, for they usually have little to no incentive to participate. Rather the fault lies with the school and instructors who continue to utilize the same broken system without attempting to find another method that is more reliable.
For shame on the educators who comment here that the student is at fault. An analogy here would be if a school was using a textbook known to be factually incorrect and the school and instructors continued to use it year after year. That can not be the fault of the students.
This student questioned the status quo. He identifies the problem, and even provides an idea of an alternate methodology. While I personally doubt his idea would work any better then the existing system, he at least considered it and made a suggestion rather then just knocking the system.
God Bless the Teacher!
December 30th, 2010
3:28 pm
Perhaps the Emory professor has burnt out from facing a class full of students who’d rather play on their iPhones and play games on their calculators. There is nothing more disheartening and frustrating that to stand in front of a class of students who openly choose to NON-participate in the learning process. It’s reflective of the work ethic the USA society has accepted as the norm…get by with as little effort as possible.
God Bless the Teacher!
December 30th, 2010
3:32 pm
“frustrating THAN”, not “frustrating THAT.”
Dr. Proud Black Man
December 30th, 2010
3:49 pm
@EdDawg
Thanks. Apparently the plank in some bloggers eyes is too much for them to handle.
@ Lori
“PMB just assumes everyone who is educated must be white!”
ASSumptions are a symptom of White Skin Privilege. Thanks for proving my point.
@ Everyone
Heriza Kwanzaa!
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
3:59 pm
@The Real Point: For a student to openly admit rarely coming to class, and when he does, not paying attention and then go on degrade this professor with a snappy, witty style that attempted to use humor but only further makes him seem like an entitled twentysomething – I’m not sure how anyone is supposed to respond to this any other way.
She may be terrible, but his own admissions completely undermine his credibility.
THEN he complains about the metric Emory uses to grade the professors – when he also admits to not taking any time on it?? It’s a laughable argument at best.
What's best for kids?
December 30th, 2010
4:33 pm
@The Real Point,
Straw man falacy, comparing the bad book to the ineffectual grading of professors. Andrew even said that he would be glad that his new system would be graduated and not have to deal with the essay. Apparently writing a 200-300 word reflection on learning is just too much for these young people, yet they want, nay demand, good teaching. Input and output should be equal, don’t you think?
If the kids are too lazy to really answer the questions, then what makes anyone think that they will take the time to write a well thought essay on their experience?
Andrew, and I use your first name because you sound like a whiny, entitled teenager, you would have been better to leave out the part that you wouldn’t want to write the essay.
What's best for kids?
December 30th, 2010
4:36 pm
“That WITH his new system,he would be graduated and not have to deal with the essay.”
Maureen, what happened to the promised wordpress blog with the edit button? I sure could use it. ugh…
The Real Point
December 30th, 2010
4:38 pm
@NorthAtlantaTeacher
Respectfully, I totally disagree with your interpretation. First, nowhere in the article does the author openly admit or otherwise indicate that he himself rarely comes to class. On the contrary, his implication is that he does attend for he indicates that only about half the students attend the class which is an observation that can only be made from someone actually in the hall. (Yes, he could know this from someone else, but we would be making an assumption without evidence to claim that.)
The student most likely is a twenty something. He is attending the university after all. So dismissing him for sounding like one is a spurious argument. As to him being entitled? I argue that any student is entitled to the education they pay for. He did not write this article for the AJC, his audience was the students who attend the same school he does and pay the same tuition. His complaint about the tuition he spends versus the quality of education is valid and appropriate for that audience. Lastly, I also don’t see any attempt at humor in this piece. He isn’t joking, he is making observations.
As to his complaining about the metric when he admits to not taking any time on it as well. He along with the others have no incentive or reason to take time on it. Why should he? But what is the line between a complaint and a critique? In my opinion when a complaint includes a suggestion on how to correct the complaint *AND* acknowledges that the suggestion itself may have flaws, then it is obvious the complainant put some actual thought into the process instead of having a knee-jerk reaction. That to me raises this to a critique.
ScienceTeacher671
December 30th, 2010
4:43 pm
When I was in college, lo these many years ago, we had professors who took attendance and those who didn’t. We had professors who taught from the book, and those for whom the book was supplemental material you could (and had better!) read on your own time. If you had one of the latter professors, you didn’t dare miss class, because you would miss important information you couldn’t get otherwise.
For the professors who taught directly from the book, it was okay, because there was a great deal of material in the textbook that I needed to learn. The only one who really annoyed me was the social studies professor who lectured and tested directly from the book, and counted class attendance as part of the grade. I could have read it on my own faster than he talked, and used the time I spent in class to do something else, like study chemistry.
I survived and passed, however, and I still remember some social studies.
schlmarm
December 30th, 2010
4:56 pm
A common thread runs through each of these blogs/topics posted by Maureen–there is no longer respect for the teaching profession, and hasn’t been in quite awhile.
Critque inward first and then outward
December 30th, 2010
4:57 pm
Education is not the only aspect of a college education. Attending the lecture
should prepare the individual for basic business courtesy. If a student does not
like the presentation style of the professor,there are still lessons to be learned
that transfer into the business world. One may not always agree with a boss,
co-worker ,or a management team,but a certain level of professional etiquette,
courtesy, and personal integrity should be expected in the business setting
as well as academia. The professor also has a responsibility to meet the
educational and professional requirements to help prepare the college students,
but the primary responsiblity to learn and achieve professional goals rest with
the college student. The college student must invest more time in pursuing
his,or her goals than anyone else,and missing class misses a big part of
education -developing networks with students and professors that enhance
future professional opportunities and seeking different perspectives on material
learned.
The Real Point
December 30th, 2010
5:04 pm
@What’s best for kids?
I did not compare the bad book to the ineffectual grading of the teachers. I compared the *system* of using a known incorrect book with the *system* of using a known flawed evaluation method. Blaming the student for the deficiencies of the system is non-productive. They didn’t create it, can’t change it, and rarely have input to which system to use.
Andrew acknowledges that the essay solution may not be any more successful then the current methodology. It is obvious that his intent is to critique the situation and by presenting an alternative (complete with its drawbacks) to hopefully start a dialogue by which a more permanent and constructive methodology could be created.
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
5:08 pm
The Real Point: I said an *entitled* twentysomething. That is a very different animal.
He outright admits to some blantantly disrespectful behavior, even admitting writing this article during her class, and then complains about how boring and ineffectual she is…all in the same op ed piece. You will have to forgive me, as I can’t take any of this from Mr. Brown too seriously. Perhaps she’s terrible, but we’ll never know from this article.
TopSchool
December 30th, 2010
5:12 pm
This is an adult who by choice… can read and write…with the necessary basic tools…the text to pass the test…if they choose not to listen to the teacher. The ignorance of anyone thinking this compares to a child in public schools….What a sad translation of the issues.
Children not given a proper foundation do not have a choice of the environment they are given.
Public Education must provide the basics to every child.
Speaking publicly is a talent…not every teacher has the talent to entertain an audience. And as adults we realize the stimulation for knowledge comes in many forms.
There are some basic skills in teaching that are apparent in every classroom.
Like I said previously…basically WHEN THE STUDENT IS READY THE TEACHER WILL APPEAR.
But, every school should have fair minded Administration that has the student’s best interests in mind. Simply…the public needs to demand less emphasis be placed on the standardized test…and more emphasis on the whole child along the path of 12 years of basic education. A foundation and a love for learning. The public school house has lost its vision of fostering a learning environment where students engage in lessons with meaning and learn instinctively. The school house has turned into a regurgitation of what is on the test. Teaching the test. And all creativity has gone out the door.
Basically…we are boring the hell out of our young minds…and just with this example …the bored child has no choice but to act out and refuse to conform to the “teach the test” mentality.
The CHILDREN and PARENTS will need to change the path of PUBLIC EDUCATION…
Right now…it is a boring workbook approach to education…memorize and regurgitate the information for a test score.
And Atlanta Public Schools produced exactly what the politician wanted. An increase in test scores…Nut… bolt…follow a recipe for learning Public Education.
http://www.TopPublicSchoolCorruptionAtlanta.com
And @ proud Black Man…you never answered my questions…Why are Black Folk so hard on their own kind? Why won’t Black Folk help their own race? Atlanta Public Schools is a fine example of Black Administration keeping their own race from prospering and selling out to the White Race?
Explain this to a White Man…I need some education on this topic…
@ Maureen …you have not addressed my questions on the media mentality. What is your opinion?
Dr. Proud Black Man
December 30th, 2010
5:24 pm
@ TopSchool
“And @ proud Black Man…you never answered my questions…Why are Black Folk so hard on their own kind? Why won’t Black Folk help their own race?”
Don’t remember you asking but here ya go. This lady speaks more eloquent than I would::
http://blacksmithenterprises.blogspot.com/2010/01/crabs-in-barrel.html
The Real Point
December 30th, 2010
5:40 pm
@northatlantateacher
entitled – to give (a person or thing) a title, right, or claim to something; furnish with grounds for laying claim
He is a student. He pays tuition for the education. By dictionary definition of the word he is entitled to an education commiserate with the scale of tuition that he pays. Your use of the word implies a definition that he is acting spoiled and privileged above his station. His article is written specifically to other students with the same tuition requirements as is obvious by its publication in the STUDENT newspaper. He is not attempting to artificially elevate himself above his readers. He did not submit it to the AJC, Maureen requested the right to reprint it.
Again you miss the point of the article. The article is not about this one teacher, you aren’t supposed to be learning how good or bad she is. The article is about the flawed evaluation process.
curious
December 30th, 2010
5:43 pm
Wouldn’t it be interesting to read the professor’s evaluations of the students: disengaged, bored, logged in-tuned out, attention deficit, etc, etc.
At $160k per degree, the students don’t need an education, they need investment advice.
As for the professor getting yanked, the students need to look up the definition of tenure.
Teacher for Life
December 30th, 2010
5:51 pm
My neice decided to get another degree in Fashion Design. She is an older student at SCAD. One evening,she went in and the poor professor was trying to do a demonstration in
her three dimensional drawing class. Several 18 and 19 year olds were sitting in the back clowning and one was fast asleep. She politely turned around, dropped a book on the floor to wake up the snoozer and gave those students the look of death that only a real teacher can give. The students were so alarmed that they shut up, sat up, and she learned what she needed to in that class.
They are used to well mannered and thirsty for knowledge students in college. What they are getting are the spoiled I’ll mannered, spoon fed denizens weaned on Gates electronic empire that wouldn’t know how to sit still and take notes unless there were … Why bother with this nonsense. Waste of thoughts.
catlady
December 30th, 2010
5:54 pm
Senior or sophomore(ic)? Many have dissected this piece far better than I. Kudos to them.
The disrespect shown to professors and teachers is rampant. Go to any classroom and see it in action. My daughter recently taught undergrads in introductory science courses for 2 years while getting a graduate degree. After the first couple of classes, she came to me with this revelation, “My students don’t appreciate my efforts.” She told of students talking during class, coming in late, texting, and some of the big ole boys coming up and trying to intimidate her. The emphasis on “customer service” has permeated even the university. The idea of personal effort seems to be passe. You get out what you put in–whatever happened to that? It has always worked for me as a student.
Wow
December 30th, 2010
5:55 pm
Connie Jenkins- I don’t think I have ever heard anyone say they are PROUD their child or grandchild quit college. If he had that bad of a professor it was probably a poor school. The secret is WHICH college or university you go to. A degree from Georgia State or Georgia Southern is not the same as one from UGA, Emory, or GT.
Teacher for Life
December 30th, 2010
5:55 pm
The computer does something to the word “ill” sometimes. At my Ivy League University, you dare not disrespect the professor. You got kicked out and a refund. Times have changed.
HS Public Teacher
December 30th, 2010
5:57 pm
This is an example of how our young kids today feel empowered to judge adults.
catlady
December 30th, 2010
5:58 pm
BTW, “evaluations” like this are expected by SACS as a measure of “effectiveness.” Apparently about as meaningful as some of the other stuff we propose to do.
John L Davis
December 30th, 2010
6:00 pm
I have taught college and graduate level students for the last 17 years. I have found the student evaluations not to be effective, but for a different reason.
That reason is that students use them to punish professors who demand a standard of achievement from them and to reward professors who give them an easy A. Further, administrators at the schools I have taught seem unable to realize that students do this.
Until evalutions actually provide helpful feedback and not the opportunity to punish those whom one “doesn’t like,” they will not be effective.
Ole Guy
December 30th, 2010
6:06 pm
Mr Brown, I have counted more birthdays, since my first college graduation, than I sometimes care to think about, so please allow me the latitude of presumed wisdom. The greately misguided tenor of the NCLB dictates that the teacher should adapt a teaching style to fit the student’s “learning style”. The complete failure of this grand notion lies in many areas, not the least of which resides in the reality that it is the student which must adapt to the world about, NOT the opposite. This reality carries over into all of life’s endeavours: the college classroom, the work place…in general, our daily presence in society. Having seen many many college professors, both in undergrad programs, MBA studies, and beyond, I can truly understand the difficulties related to inderstanding those mentors which do not fit our immediate comfort zones. However, Mr Brown, you just might do yourself justice if you hold off criticisms until you have earned the title of college graduate and entered the real world,, for it is only them that you will learn the true value of adapting to the world. To expect otherwise is nothing short of the path to unhappiness and ultimate failure.
Good luck in you studies, Mr Brown.
redweather
December 30th, 2010
6:10 pm
I gave the students in my three first-year composition classes an opportunity to evaluate the class, i.e., the amount of required writing and reading, the quality of the textbook, and the quality of my teaching. There were twelve questions in all. Of the seventy students who made it to the end of semester, five completed the anonymous (and voluntary) evaluation. Of those, two provided an additional written response. One student who did not complete the evaluation suggested that giving extra credit for doing so might increase participation. I don’t plan on doing that.
I typically enjoy reading these voluntary evaluations. For instance, I like to know if students found the textbook helpful, and if I require them to do more or less work than they are required to do in their other classes. I also like to know if they are more confident (or not) as writers having taken the class. It would be nice if more participated. But you take what you can get.
Devildog
December 30th, 2010
6:20 pm
It could be worse. The student could write for a newspaper and the idiot is an editor. Talk about evaluations going into a black hole . . . .
Ripdog
December 30th, 2010
6:23 pm
Little boy, shut the f**K up and pay attention to your professors. It always kills me how these little snot nose college kids think they know everything. I have to deal with self important brats like that at my job, hence that’s why they remain contractors and never get hired.
TopSchool
December 30th, 2010
6:37 pm
@ Proud Black Man…this helps…
I think it is part of the slavery mentality that has remained though the acts of slavery are no longer part of our society.
I watched a Black teacher in the Northside APS school give every Black child she had in her class hell…
The way she talked to them was different from the White children. She expected more of the Black children than she did the White kids…
I asked her why…She said…”The White children will never struggle…therefore if the Black children wanted to compete in a mostly White school…they needed someone to be tough on them. Black children had to be twice as smart as a White child to compete in this world.”… So she made sure they struggled and made the curriculum more difficult for them. I would often times help these children in the after school program.
I honestly think the White race takes for granted their Whiteness. They do not understand. You can’t expect them to know what they are not able to experience first hand. They are too quick to respond to someone Black and call them a racist.
I think …especially in Atlanta Ga …it is all about RACE. And until we address this issue…we have failed to advance as a human RACE. There is a silent culture war dealing with RACE. The same issues are prevalent in dealing with sexual orientation and male vs female topics. I find it interesting to learn about this topic.
Another USG Professor
December 30th, 2010
6:39 pm
I can tell you that any student in any of my classes that chooses to distract me and the others in the classroom by noodling on an Iphone, laptop, etc. while WE are in the middle of class activities will be summarily shown the door by me personally and given a grade of zero for the day for first offense. Repeat offenses can lead to withdrawal from the course. It’s in my class syllabi and I do actively monitor these sorts of things, so I guess that means I’m not the prototypical college prof the Emory student is referencing above.
As for the evaluation issue, I agree with the other poster(s) that what we mostly use, and the information that we get from what we use, is next to useless. I’ve been a college professor for 16 years and I can count on one hand the number of useful, thoughtful evaluations I have received from students that I could actually, then, turn around and use to make changes/improvements in the classroom experience. Most of what I get – admittedly not a lot – is either character assassination (i.e. the professor sucks) or generic boilerplate feedback (i.e. the professor did a great job!). Neither one is helpful in terms of trying to identify ways to improve the educational experience.
unclefast
December 30th, 2010
6:55 pm
I tell my high school students: If you want to have fun, go to Six Flags!
abacus2
December 30th, 2010
7:08 pm
Does anyone else suspect that Dr. Proud Black Man is not really black? He tries much too hard to instigate. Just asking.
afadjato
December 30th, 2010
7:21 pm
Anybody who have been through a good University will admit that the most brilliant professors are also the boring ones. After all rigorous academics is not fun nor easy. This student forgets that she/he is in the University and that 95% of the work has to be done by him/her.
It is also in America that I professors teach from a prescribed textbook. A textbook is just the thoughts of one person,the author, and at the University I believe Professors should be free to use more than one book in their lectures. However, they cannot because people from the accreditation agencies have watered down standards with the so called QCI so much that the hands of Professors are tied to Administartion. and Accrediting agencies. One should teach to the syllabus and any deviation would result in poor review. Please we should all remeber that these Professors are also human being with families and they deserve a right to work and to living. In spite of their meager salaries they still teach. American Professors are one of the best outside this country because they find people eager to learn something new with some rigour and challenges.
If Standards have fallen in our educational sector, a closer look should be given also to the accreditation agencies. They do demand academic rigorosity. The adminstrators also demand what they call compliance. In many Institutions overseas College education is very very rigorous.
I bet my stars she is not a brilliant student or she is being made to take that course because she is required to. I f she wants her way she drop out and enroll in some of these fly under the radar colleges.
Ole Guy
December 30th, 2010
7:27 pm
Red, clearly, your observations do not speak well of future generations. The kid wanting extra credit for participation harkens to the “what’s in it for me” mindset, which seems to manifest itself in many areas of daily endeavour, be it the workplace (yep, this ole guy, bumping up on the mid-60s, continues to toil, albiet at National/global sites), on the streets, and in the home.
We can pontificate all day about the woeful state of education, parental disinterest in the home, and just about any-and-all influences in the world of youth. The bottem line, I truly believe, lies in challenge…the current generation of youth has NEVER been challenged to any appreciable degree. And whose fault is that?
We can blame anyone and everyone in that arena…WE have allowed ourselves to become afraid of one another…to become so GD pc-oriented in everything we think, say, or do, that we don’t dare “upset the apple cart” as it were. Educators don’t want to piss off mom and dad, lest they complain to the whomever the educators have to please…and it goes on and on. WHERE IN HELL IS IT SUPPOSED TO STOP? WHEN ARE WE GOING TO STOP WEE WEEING AROUND, GET TOUGH, AND, IN THE PROCESS, GAIN THE RESPECT WE ONCE KNEW, BOTH WITHIN OURSELVES, OUR COMMUNITIES, AND AROUND THE GLOBE?
While elected leaders continue to address these problems on a piecemeal basis, we continue to avoid the discomfort of “out of the box” solutions. Kids who, through continued demonstration, do not belong in the publically-funded education system, need to/must be removed so that those who truly want an education may strive to do so.
The animal kingdom, to which we belong, has always operated on Darwin’s “survival of the fitest” doctrine. People who could not/would not apply themselves simply were swept aside on the race track of life. Now, it seems that everyone, come hell or highwater, WILL have a hs diploma…everyone, worthy or not, can own a home, etc, etc, etc…adnauseum. WE SEE WHERE THAT HAS GOTTEN US!
We all know, in our own little worlds of influence, what needs doing…LET”S JUST DO IT!
UGA prof
December 30th, 2010
7:45 pm
I’m a UGA professor. Students usually evaluate a professor on whether the course is easy rather than on whether the teaching is good. They often don’t know whether the teaching is good. (Hint: “Make it easy” and “make it fun” are not the recipe for effective teaching.) You don’t know whether you’ve been taught well until you get to a later course and find out whether you’re prepared.
Deans and department heads know that evaluation scores don’t mean much. Student evaluations are useful, even vital, for detecting really deviant behavior — teachers who don’t meet classes according to the schedule or who do offensive things in the classroom — but they’re no help to the professors or their superiors in improving day-to-day teaching. If things are roughly normal, the evaluations tell you nothing useful.
Lies and distortions on evaluations are common. I was once chided by a student for “spending lecture time talking about a Florida vacation” when I was actually telling them about the supercomputer conference at which IBM announced major developments (highly germane to the class). I have been told, in the same course, that I assigned too much homework and that I assigned no homework. They’re crazy.
Atlanta mom
December 30th, 2010
7:49 pm
Let me get this straight. Students at Emory know there will be an evaluation at the end of a course. The evaluation includes space for written comments. And they can’t be bothered, because it might take 15 minutes of their precious time?
They deserve every bad professor they have.
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
7:54 pm
The Real Point:
Sigh. No, I think you miss the point. How would Mr. Brown know that he’s talking about in this particular class? He isn’t paying attention and is using his energy writing this article rather than giving his education time and respect. It would be nice if the article were written simply to bemoan the problems with the entire system rather than using a professor that he clearly does not pay attention to in the first place.
The article does have a certian air about it, but that’s my opinion…no need to quote from dictionary.com to make yours.
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December 30th, 2010
8:12 pm
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ScienceTeacher671
December 30th, 2010
8:17 pm
@The Real Point: By dictionary definition of the word he is entitled to an education commiserate with the scale of tuition that he pays.
ScienceTeacher671
December 30th, 2010
8:18 pm
@Atlanta mom: I agree completely!
northatlantateacher
December 30th, 2010
8:27 pm
@ScienceTeacher671 – Ha! I missed that..too funny and SO true.
oldtimer
December 30th, 2010
8:27 pm
And college teacher rarely spend anywhere near 40 hours a week in the classroom….Maybe some money could be saved by asking them to teach an extra class.
Connie Jenkins
December 30th, 2010
8:58 pm
WOW! After reading all these hear comments I shore am glad I didn’t waste any time and money going to one of them high class schools. All you educated folks just wore me out reading all this complaining stuff.
P.S.* Wonder how many of you will take this comment seriously or take if for the satire it is.
abacus2
December 30th, 2010
10:02 pm
“commiserate” ! The dear child must have been playing on his iPad during language arts class.
teacher&mom
December 30th, 2010
10:08 pm
I often did not fully appreciate my teachers or professors until years after the courses were completed. Life experiences and maturity often gave me a different perspective that I did not have as an undergraduate. Hindsight is 20/20.
Of course, college is the ultimate “school choice” idea. If you are unhappy, then you have the right to go somewhere else along with your “voucher” aka HOPE scholarship.
Pete H Rodda
December 30th, 2010
10:17 pm
As a former college instructor, high school instructor and military instructor of more than 22 years, I have seen the type of professor the student describes. If you want to change something, then stand up and be counted. Fill in the bubbles truthfully, don’t hide behind the lame excuse of not having the time to write an essay or specific comments that supported the “bubble scoring.” More important, the entire class should have talked about the evaluation before the evaluation was due. Then all students’ comments would have focused on the professor’s lack of teaching skills. The student writing the article critiqued the professor and was not merely “whining”.
Karma
December 30th, 2010
10:38 pm
I want to know when APS is going to have administrator evaluations done by teachers. When I was in DeKalb we did that and it was just so nice to “tell” someone about a good or bad principal (they were usually the latter obviously). Of course, it’s very likely no one ever looked at them.
Karma
December 30th, 2010
10:39 pm
As for this Emrhoid… Typical.
NWGA Teacher
December 30th, 2010
11:44 pm
The most boring class of my life, taught by the most boring professor ever, was taught STRAIGHT from the text. We thought we would lose our minds — all we did was read, write, and endlessly regurgitate the textbook. The professor would just smile, and nod, and say, “I know. But you don’t know what it’s really like out there, and I do.” By the end of the semester, we knew the material backward, forward and inside out. Sometimes, you just have to suck it up and do the work.
New (formerly Future) Teacher
December 30th, 2010
11:53 pm
Wow! I’m surprised that the blog post has gotten so many comments, because student evaluations aren’t highly valued. Though the profs mentioned how important they were during the last week of class, the profs and students all knew the evaluations were all nonsense (I’m talking about Tech). I’m guessing evaluations were formalities of a sort, which is why some profs offer extra credit for a high response rate.
If students did fill them out, it was either for extra credit (”Dr. Blah did a great job!”) or out of anger (”Dr. Blah was awful! Fire her!”). Now, take this situation and apply it to high school students evaluating their teachers. Or teacher evaluating their admins. Or middle-managers evaluating their superiors. I could go on, but we see what the main problem is with these type of subjective evaluations of superiors, yes? There is SOME value in these evaluations (for example, if a large sample of students agree that a professor is unprepared for lecture, then the university should investigate), but there is a huge built-in problem with them, so grain of salt and cup of chamomile, please
No need to bite the kid’s head off over something as irrelevant as student evaluations.
P.S. I’ll admit that Andrew is a bit of an donkey for being openly disrepectful to his professor. I’m pretty sure many students at Emory, especially those who know him and those in that class, can identify the professor. That was not cool, Andrew. If you go to lecture and not choose not to pay attention, why bother attending, even for extra credit? To me, sleep > 1% extra credit.
Lee
December 31st, 2010
10:39 am
I see Mr. Brown has entered into the fourth stage of college education which is disenchantment. Usually happens in your senior year when you realize a significant percentage of what passes for enlightenment is a bunch of crap.
What are the Stages of a College Education you ask?
1. Euphoria – student is away from Mom and Dad, realizes the professor doesn’t take attendence, and there is a keg party every weekend.
2. Panic – Dad didn’t take it too well when you failed those classes. Need to cut down on the partying, go to class, and crack open a book.
3. Satisfaction – usually your Junior year. Finally got into the course load pertaining to your major and things are interesting.
4. Disenchantment – you realize what the professor is telling you is a boatload of crap and that he probably couldn’t make it in the “real world”.
5. Disgust – the first payment on all those college loans is due and you’re waiting on tables because you couldn’t find a job in your chosen field. Meanwhile, you find out that your idiot cousin is making $60k pumping out septic tanks. You also realize you should have paid more attention in Finance class because with interest, that $100k student loan will cost you more than a quarter million by the time you pay it off.
6. Melancholy – after a few years, you realize your job sucks and you think back to those carefree days of college as “the best years of your life.”
7. Disgust pt 2 – you decided to go back for your Masters. Once again, you realize most of the professors don’t know what the hell they are talking about but now, your kids won’t let you study and you are at the library on Saturday’s instead of watching the ball game.
There, that should clear it up for you.
Paul Denton
December 31st, 2010
11:38 am
Lee, you totally have it down. Those are the exact stages that one goes through from college to post-grad. Thank god that I don’t have the children to impede the studying process.
no wonder
December 31st, 2010
12:51 pm
there are just too many people who think college education is the same as job training…
Connie
December 31st, 2010
3:21 pm
I meant I am proud of my grandson because he quit the college classes after one year because he realized he would not be receiving adequate instruction. He decided not to transfer to GA State or Univ. of GA because he has friends there and they have complained of the poor instructors. He feels like he will receive a much better education in the Air Force. He is not lazy and wants the best value for his time. He works full time and helps his mom with expenses. His father died 3 years ago in an accident on his own property so insurance did not cover him.
It irritates me that the HOPE funds are wasted on so many who just want to spend four years goofing off and playing in school. They are supposed to have graduated from high school with a B average so why do so many have to take remedial courses in the first year of college? That B they were ‘given’ should have been a D.
redweather
January 1st, 2011
9:55 am
Connie, your grandson sounds like young people I encounter in the college classroom all the time. They presume to know many things when in fact they don’t know all that much. Your grandson sounds like the type of student who wants to know how every lesson in every class will benefit him. Only he can answer that question: education is about one-tenth instruction and nine-tenths application. Attentive students can learn and apply their knowledge despite the worst instruction. Inattentive students, or those who presume to know more than they actually do, typically learn only what they decide to learn. And this is true whether those students are attending college or the Air Force academy.
Lee
January 1st, 2011
12:37 pm
I should add a couple more stages:
8. Melancholy pt 2 – you kids graduated from high school and you are helping them move into their dorm. You visit a couple of old hangouts and remember the good times there. You wonder where the time went and thank God for slacks with elastic in the waistband.
9. Disgust pt 3 – you find out that Junior is a chip off the old block. Grades are in for the first semester and it is apparent that there was too much partying and not enough studying. You hold the first [of many] Come-to-Jesus meetings.
And the cycle of life continues….
Extremes make me scream...
January 1st, 2011
3:21 pm
@Schlmarm: I think the lack of respect comes from the profession’s inability to recognize aspects of the profession that need improving. The comments in this blog are examples. The educators here have no idea if the student’s criticism of this professor is valid yet they blindly defend the professor. When you blindly defend what is wrong, you lose your credibility.
Teachers use the word “support” as a weapon. When administrators do not “support” teachers, they find themselves in a battle with morale. The fact is that there are many times that teachers should not be supported.
Everytime administrators, teachers, counselors and others “SUPPORT” what is obviously wrong, you lose credibility. When you lose credibility, you lose respect.
Angela
January 2nd, 2011
3:24 pm
First, not all college students are kids. Secondly, professors need to earn respect just as students do. Third, there ARE poor professors out there. Just because you didn’t encounter one does not mean they do not exist.
I had 2 professors that I learned NOTHING from, yet had to take the course they were offering. Every day I groaned at the waste of tuition money (that I paid out of my pocket) since I basically ended up teaching myself the course.
I whined about it, and they heard about it; weekly AND during the evaluation. I felt since I forked over the dough to learn something that, yes, I was ENTITLED to get my money’s worth.
College is not like it was 20 years ago. Professors have to cater to the poorly (publically) educated students that come through the doors. They simply must dumb down the curriculum for those who cannot read since “no child is left behind”. Then uneducated students are black, white, and latino HOPE recipients who feel their entitlement to the free education should also get them free grades.
So I suggest, before you guys flame the writer for whining, go ahead and TRY to see it from their point of view. The author may be whining, but who doesn’t whine anymore. It’s America.
Oh Please
January 3rd, 2011
12:55 am
Another whiney student boo hoo hoo. *Yawn* I taught university for 18 years, 15 at UGA. Students are pretty boring themselves, rarely read the material, try to get extra points for just showing up, don’t prepare for tests even when the questions are provided in advance to encourage them to study, then write evaluations such as “worst teacher I ever had” on evaluations in all their classes (note to students: “worst” is a superlative, we can’t all be your worst teacher ever). UGA students mostly want to just drink, attend football games, have s*x, and strut around saying “I’m an undergrad at UGA” like everyone is supposed to fall over in awe. The only awesome thing is that they ever graduate. In all those years, I got evaluations ranging from very good to excellent, but I hated the last three years teaching!
On actual evaluations over the years, I have had personal elements commented upon more often than I care to remember – clothes not expensive enough, clothes too baggy, clothes too tight, boobs too small (REALLY!), butt too big, butt too small, hair too short, too much makeup, not enough makeup, makes personal comments, doesn’t connect personally, too loud, too quiet, blah, blah blah. I finally quit after I just could not take the disrespect and lack of intellectual interest anymore.