Teachers: No merit to merit pay arguments
When Centennial High School English teacher Jordan Kohanim suggested that I run a column on the Monday print education page against merit pay to balance the one in favor it last week, I asked if she would write a piece. She and Northview High colleague Ashley Ulrich quickly produced this piece, which runs in Monday’s AJC Opinion section. Enjoy.
By Jordan Kohanim and Ashley Ulrich
Furloughs. Pay cuts. Class size increases. With all these factors, the talk about merit pay and the proposal of Senate Bill 386 brings Georgia public education to a crossroads. By switching to merit pay at this critical time, not only is the legislation dropping the proverbial straw on the camel’s back, legislators are setting up a system that will harm students for much longer than their terms in office.
The bill, which is not clear on how exactly teachers will be compensated, does claim to rely on more than just test scores to gauge teacher quality. Sadly, the fact of the matter is there are not enough resources nor enough time to devote meaningful observations that would measure a teacher’s performance. Test scores would become a large enough factor in determining teacher quality and the devastating effects of relying on such data would become widespread. Test scores also make an easy sound bite for politicians—without getting into the messy business of actually measuring learning.
What is the problem with using testing data to determine teacher effectiveness? It hurts students. First, most educational research argues that testing does not measure student achievement, progress, or even potential. In fact, these numbers are so easily manipulated that they can be skewed for political agenda and end up demoralizing children that do not deserve such labels as “failed.” For decades, research has also argued that standardized tests disadvantage large populations of students. By measuring teacher effectiveness partly on this testing, schools that work with these student populations are already set behind, as well. The reverse is also true: schools (and students) at the top of the testing range have difficulty showing substantial gains. How do we quantify a gain when students are already earning “exceeds standards” marks on the CRCT or the EOCT?
Tests also do not measure skills that will be essential in an evolving global marketplace. If schools are to emphasize 21st century skills like innovation, creativity, technical skills, and critical thinking—standardized testing actually discourages them.
Another cause for concern is that curriculum, in response to increased accountability to testing, will pare itself down to test-prep. This has been proven by other states, like New York, who have seen this detrimental shift because of the emphasis on testing. How are students going to compete nationally, let alone globally, if they can only think inside the box (or in this case—inside the bubble)?
Beyond this testing issue, merit pay also presents other drawbacks. The role of educators is multi-faceted and it includes objectives that are immeasurable. For example, one colleague said, “If a student enters my ninth grade classroom at a fourth grade reading level, I may not be able to get him to gain substantially in test scores, but I’m definitely going to keep him from dropping out.” Isn’t that an important goal too?
Merit pay also attempts to reward or punish teachers for factors far out their control. Teachers cannot control student homelessness, transferring into the school late in the year, or the lack of academic culture in which a student is raised.
At the same time, merit pay will ignore those few factors that are within a teacher’s control: pursuit of upper-level degrees and continuing education. By leaving out raises based at least partly on degrees earned, it will create a void of teachers earning their Masters, Specialist, or Doctoral degree. If a teacher has to devote years and thousands of their own dollars to a degree program, on a teacher salary that gets cut with furloughs and losses of raises, too many teachers will not be able to take that financial and time burden on themselves with no payoff clearly in sight.
There are alternatives to merit pay that can be investigated. The system we have now is not perfect. However, it does reward teachers for the only factor we can control: our own learning and professional development, our commitment to education, and observations made by our superiors. Instead of abandoning this entirely, why not improve the system we have now? For starters, the state could honor National Board Certification, which is a nationally normed standard used to gauge teacher quality. Systems could also institute a comprehensive review: that is, having feedback from fellow teachers, community members, as well as students.
Rather than completely destroying how the community controls the quality of education in favor of a system that has been proven to fail in states like Texas, our legislators need to slow down and re-evaluate. Senate Bill 386 is a race for funding, and it lacks any actual plan for implementation in the bill itself. Ultimately, it will lead to demoralizing teachers, stunting innovation in the classroom, dumbing down curriculum, and denying students the first rate education we want for them.
Supporting and passing this bill, as it stands now, starts Georgia’s public education down a slippery slope that is doomed to fail. Once this is done, it will be hard to un-do. Imagine a tractor that slides down a muddy hill and gets stuck. This will be us: spinning wheels and fighting to get any traction at all in a year, or two, or three, when educators and students witness the failures of merit pay firsthand.
Why can’t we try to go about things in a better, fairer, more productive, responsible manner now?
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154 comments Add your comment
irisheyes
February 28th, 2010
7:50 pm
Maureen, is there any way that we can have an FAQ post where PAGE and GAE are specifically defined as PROFESSIONAL ORGANIZATIONS not unions. Then, people won’t look quite so ignorant when they talk about how the teacher’s union is standing in the way of merit pay. I’m really trying to look out for the little guy.
ScienceTeacher671
February 28th, 2010
7:52 pm
Waldo, (1) there are no teacher’s unions in Georgia, and as noted above, the organizations we do have are less than effective. (2) The teacher no longer determines the pace of covering classroom material, state curriculum guides and local curriculum coordinators do. Teachers must proceed whether or not students have mastered the material. (3) AJC doesn’t pick who comments on the blog; commenters are self-selected. Apparently teachers and their relatives and friends are the main ones interested in education in Georgia.
Next comment?
Now we know
February 28th, 2010
7:53 pm
Now we finally know where Waldo is; stuck on stupid.
catlady
February 28th, 2010
8:06 pm
Lee, until we expect and demand MASTERY of basic skills at each grade level prior to being promoted, we will still have these same problems. It seems to me the gap has gotten wider between those on grade level and those who are not. I see teachers working much harder, dealing with many more problems, than we did 40 years ago, yet some students being more seriously impaired in their achievement. The difference I see is in the input. Too many children come from homes where they are not valued, not to mention the whole idea of “education” and “civil behavior”. We have too many kids whose parents are drug addicted (ask me how much I can smell when they come in the door. It sticks to their clothes, their backpacks. I guess their parents toke on the way to school or before breakfast), whose parents are so in search of self they subject their kids to multiple “daddies” before they are 5, who are being raised by grandparents or great-grands or aunts because mom and dad don’t want the responsibility, or are in jail, or have just disappeared.
While the kids start school with more “things”, they are far poorer than they were in 1973. I teach in a rural, Appalachian area that has changed in many ways, many of them bad, in the intervening years.
Children need PARENTS first and foremost. Without the security and discipline of parenting, they come to school carrying burdens that interfere with their formal education from the start. No teacher, no matter how good, can ameliorate years of the neglect suffered by a chained dog.
One tired American teacher
February 28th, 2010
8:13 pm
To those of you who say PAGE doesn’t support teachers, get off your cloud and read the data. When GA cut professional learning, PAGE stepped up to the plate and starting providing numerous opportunities for those while the state and the feds required more AYP standardization. There is more than liability to PAGE membership. I am sick of you people repeating old rumors.
The problem with all merit pay legislation is that politicians think they are all educational experts because they went to school once in their lifetimes. School today is what NOT what you experienced people. Let teachers do their job and get out of our way. We are doing a darn good job with less, but yet our numbers and our requirements grow daily. Teachers need to jointly vote these bozos out of office. Get people under the Gold Dome who care about our future and stop electing these pork barrel darlings who only want to perpetuate their gravy train.
MBW
February 28th, 2010
8:13 pm
I feel that the real answer lies somewhere between the two columns.
1) I think that basing pay solely on test scores is perhaps not comprehensive enough….but I don’t think tests lie either. An annual physical can’t give you a full picture of someone’s health, it CAN still give you some major indicators to look at.
2) BUT…I think student learning MUST be a significant part of a teacher’s evaluation, no matter how it’s measured.
3) We should reward teachers who pursue higher degrees and prof. development…..but there are far too many diploma mills springing up that will give a master’s degree to anybody who pays the tuition. We need a system of rigorous accreditation for teacher training programs.
HSMT
February 28th, 2010
8:18 pm
While I do agree with merit pay, it is not the only way to measure success in the classroom. Standardize test are right now the only way to measure student achievement so we need to keep them. We need to realize at some point that the education system is a billion dollar business that cant afford to fail. Why not start to treat it like a business. If the CEO or in this case the superintendent is not meeting expectations, we need the ability to fire them. Pay should be place on supply and demand. If math is the biggest problem in our schools then you pay the math teachers more money and hold them accountable for performance. Teachers have to work ten times as hard in low performance school to get students to meet standards, but receive the same pay as others in schools that are not low performing. I’m in the beginning of my professional education career and I’m already questioning how long I can stay in the field because it takes so much work to get low performing students to achieve. If you treat education like the business it is, you would see an improvement in results.
Mikey D
February 28th, 2010
8:38 pm
HSMT… Education is NOT a business. That’s an ignorant argument that folks constantly try to make, but it doesn’t hold water. In the business world, a manager has some say in who gets hired to work under him/her. Teachers take who they are given, and do their best with what they have. In the business world, if you have people who are not contributing or pulling their share of the weight, the manager has the option to fire them. The last time I checked, teachers weren’t allowed to fire their students and replace them with harder workers.
Merit pay is a way for the pathetic government of this state to reduce teacher pay, based solely on things that are beyond the control of any teacher. It’s despicable and it’s stupid. Kinda like our governor.
math 88
February 28th, 2010
8:44 pm
Lee- are you really that stupid? Seriously, if a kid comes to 9th grade reading on a 4th grade level, it may NOT be a teacher’s fault! Have you ever actually WORKED in a school? What if the kid has a horrible home life, is chronically absent and is just not that smart? huh? What if he is just plain lazy and the teachers recommended he be retained but mommy got all upset and the principal passed him anyway???? You really need a clue.
retired -yea!
February 28th, 2010
8:46 pm
I loved the article – I hate the legislatures ideas. All of the persons that say that it will be the luck of the draw are on the ball. Administrators have and are still stabbing teachers in the back. Also, their fellow teachers sometimes do it also. I went through all the years with graduation tests in all their forms and all the – your kids did great one year – to what did you not do other years? The factor here that is not addressed by the Governor’s ideas is the student. Some students simply do not come to school prepared to learn or wanting to learn. After you have had a few threaten to kill you – pull a switchblade on you ( first year!) or slam a door so hard the glass breaks – you will know too – Happy Teacher.
math 88
February 28th, 2010
8:49 pm
MBW- I got a degree at an online university which YOU would probably ignorantly refer to as a “diploma mill”. I have an undergraduate degree from Georgia Southern and a Master’s degree from UGA and I can assure you the education courses I took online were far superior. Guess who taught my school leadership class online? A SUPERINTENDENT! Guess who taught my class at UGA? A professor who had not been employed by a school system in 36 years. Gee. Hmmmmm…
at this point in the game
February 28th, 2010
9:05 pm
One Tired American Teacher – okay, so PAGE offered opportunities THEN . . what about NOW? check their website – they are “monitoring” the furlough situation. They are “talking” to responsible parties. WHERE IS THE ACTION?????
Suze Berry
February 28th, 2010
9:08 pm
I don’t think there’s a teacher worth their salt that’s against accountability of some sort – that is not the issue here. What is at issue, at least from where I sit, is the haste with which this is being pushed through in order to accommodate RTT (even though the research seems to support the fact that we could be part of RTT without merit pay), the overall generalization and lack of specification in how it’s going to be accomplished, and the certainty that there could be no measure of equality from one teacher to the next. How do you level the playing field in high school, for instance? The student base in 9th grade is totally different from that of 11th or 12th grade. Will those teachers be held to the same standards? I can assure you, the attitudes of high school students change as they mature and grow. A junior or senior understands the reality of getting all of the credits you can for graduation as opposed to the new 9th graders. I don’t think there’s a high school in Georgia, probably not in the United States, that doesn’t show a statistically altered student population from 9th to 12th grade. Pardon my disbelief, but I just don’t trust the people that we have making the rules to take this type of disparity into account. Is it fair to penalize the 9th grade teacher because a greater proportion of their students haven’t a clue? False assurances coming from a group of people that have tried their best to dismantle all of the gains that Georgia has made in k-12 education does nothing to convince me that this is a good thing.
Involved
February 28th, 2010
9:15 pm
As a parent/PTA member/sub in my local school district, I have to say that I find the opinions of most of the teachers on this blog embarrassing. Let me see if I’ve got all this straight:
1. Administrators/legislators are all good-for-nothing back-stabbers who have it out for teachers.
2. Parents are horribly negligent, if not downright drug addicts.
3. Students are lazy (at best), or violent criminals (at worst).
4. Standardized tests are irresponsible, no matter what.
5. Teachers are above sharing the pain in the current economic crisis.
Did I get it all? Why would you even do the job is what I ask.
I really hope my kids(who have mostly had wonderful teachers) do not run across the bloggers here. I am afraid they will be judged before walking in the door and never be held to the type of expectations that we have for them.
Please PAGE lackey please
February 28th, 2010
9:24 pm
Teachers in Georgia do not need more expert training to deal with issues such as disruptive students; they need more administrative support and backup. When Johnny throws a chair, teachers don’t need a workshop that PAGE will be happy to provide; Johnny needs to be removed, period.
But PAGE can’t talk about that, because some of the very administrators who aren’t removing the Johnnys of the world are PAGE members.
@at this point in the game; not only is PAGE “monitoring” the furloughs, as opposed to taking a real stand, like calling for cuts in administrative bloat, PAGE actually suggested to teachers that THEY need to be more professional because of the furloughs!
Will the PAGE lackey tell us why PAGE thought the appropriate response to teachers being furloughed was to lecture teachers on being more professional?
irisheyes
February 28th, 2010
9:25 pm
Involved asked, “Why would you even do the job is what I ask.” Let me try to answer it.
I teach because I want to be a positive role model for my students. I teach in a high poverty school, and you could not imagine some of the homes my kids come from. That being said, every child deserves the chance to learn. Where the trouble comes is when education is placed in the hands of legislators and “educrats”. The teachers you see posting here are in the trenches. They often get to school early, stay late, and give 110% to their children every day, all while being told “Here’s what you have to teach, here’s how you have to teach it, here’s the script you have to use, and every child will be average or above by 2014.” Not every child will be working on grade level by 2014. It’s not that the expectations aren’t there, it’s just a fact of life. We don’t live in Lake Wobegon where everyone’s above average. There ARE students and parents who don’t care. There are administrators who are power hungry. It’s another fact of life. I’m glad that doesn’t happen in your school, but there are places where it does happen. We’re not making these stories up so someone will feel sorry for us.
@Involved
February 28th, 2010
9:31 pm
No involved, what’s truly embarrassing is a legislature that idly stands by and does nothing while a school system sweeps over 40,000 discipline cases under the rug.
What’s truly embarrassing is a legislature dominated by the party that screeches about the rule of law and personal responsibility has done nothing to increase the support for discipline in the classroom, even with documented cases of teacher abuse up to and including teacher assault being swept under the rug.
What’s truly embarrassing is a legislature that will play Russian Roulette with teachers’ livelihoods with a merit pay proposal that even they can’t fully explain the details of, at least partly based in test scores, when we haven’t even begun to resolve what may be the single largest cheating scandal in our state’s educational history.
But we do a great job with fishin’
ScienceTeacher671
February 28th, 2010
9:44 pm
Involved, don’t go overboard.
There are SOME administrators who cannot be trusted to have the best interests of their teachers or students at heart. Not all, but some. You need look no further than the current cheating scandal to see proof of that.
SOME parents are negligent, SOME are abusive, SOME are drug addicts. It’s unfortunate, but it’s true. Those who teach gifted children, and those who teach in wealthy suburban areas perhaps see less of it than those who teach at-risk and lower SES students — which is not to say that it doesn’t also occur in higher SES areas or to brighter children, but children who are dealing with issues such as these often have a great deal of trouble focusing on schoolwork, and so they struggle academically.
SOME students are lazy, and SOME students are violent criminals. At last count, 3 of my former students were incarcerated for murder. Does that mean I haven’t also had some wonderful students who have grown up to be model citizens? Of course not, but do you think the criminals you read about in the paper were perfect children before they left school?
I see the need for some standardized testing, but I think one could make a good argument that the CRCT is irresponsible, and that it is used in an irresponsible manner.
Schools and teachers were “sharing the pain” even before the economic crisis. You’ve heard the old saw about doing more and more with less and less?
Why anyone would do the job is a good question, and I know many people who wouldn’t attempt to walk into a classroom full of children. There are probably good reasons why “the best and the brightest” often choose other careers, and there are probably good reasons why many new teachers leave the profession within the first five years. Can you think of some?
Political Mongrel
February 28th, 2010
10:02 pm
@Really: no, not really. You make the assumption that standardized tests cover the same material as what is taught in the classroom. Over the last few years, this has improved, but often in the past curriculum was not aligned with the tests. The ITBS, for example, was aligned with standards for a different state and not aligned with Georgia standards, but it has been given year after year as a local measuring tool. Was the solution to find a test that matched Georgia standards? No, it was to realign local curriculum more to Iowa’s. Since Georgia CRTs have been out, curriculum has been realigned to them, but there are still problems.
I can’t see why you are belaboring your point. If a teacher knows what’s been taught in his/her classroom and designs tests to match, why do you seem to feel that this is less reliable than some test made up by an anonymous figure, probably from another state, who has no idea what has gone on in that particular classroom.
For about a ten years, I made a hobby of looking through standardized tests for errors, poorly written or ambiguous questions, and poor design. In spite of tests being designed by professionals, I found errors and sloppy work that were shocking. Standardized testing does not deserve the respect that some people think it does.
Plus, where does this leave teachers in areas that are not tested?
concerned!!
February 28th, 2010
10:28 pm
The move to a “one size fits all” curriculum with the implementation of NCLB has not been realistic, but in fact harmful. Test scores have become the main focus versus the student becoming a successful and independent learner. My concern with merit pay is it will put more emphasis on tests by attempting to turn the teacher’s classroom into their sales territory. The student’s scores will become the sales product that will determine the teacher’s salary and/or bonus. Students are human beings not cold and inanimate products.
Cobb Taxpayer
February 28th, 2010
10:38 pm
The current Georgia teacher pay schedule, based exclusivily on longevity and degrees, is inefficient, ineffective, broken and hijacked by educators and questionable degree institutions (notice some the advanced degrees of Georgia teachers and the mail order,internet, degree mill, tier 3 and below) and unaffordable. What’s so wrong with higher pay for greater responsibility and measured performance.
What's wrong
February 28th, 2010
10:47 pm
What’s wrong Cobb taxpayer is that not even the people writing the bill can quantify what measured performance is.
What if someone told you Cobb taxpayer, we are going to redo the way we compute your property taxes, but we really can’t explain it to you, because we don’t even know ourselves, what new formula we will use.
In the same way you would no doubt have a problem with that, that is the basic problem with this bill.
sped teacher
February 28th, 2010
10:52 pm
Just curious as to how Special Needs teachers will be evaluated. Obviously legislators have not witnessed the frustration many special needs students express even being required to participate in standardized testing. Comments like “I don’t know this” “I feel dumb” are quite common during testing as many of these kids haven’t even been exposed to all of the grade level material on the tests due to their cognitive ability and IEPs. Think of one taking the Bar Exam when he hasn’t been exposed to the material. What gains are measured? If I have a student that goes from throwing chairs out of frustration to being able and sit and “bubble” a test independently..that is HUGE progress. Is there a behavior component? I am amazed that they put so much weight on approximately 10 hours of testing to determine 180 days worth of learning. Ever seen a student whose family is divorcing or parent passed away prior to testing perform well? I forgot teachers are social workers as well. Oh and YES everyone teaches to the test. That comes from the higher ups!
ScienceTeacher671
February 28th, 2010
11:02 pm
@ Cobb Taxpayer, “What’s so wrong with higher pay for greater responsibility and measured performance”?
Not a thing. That was the purpose of the National Board Certified Teacher program that the General Assembly says we can no longer afford.
Now they want to spend taxpayer dollars developing a new program, but they don’t know yet exactly how they are going to do it. From other pieces of legislation proposed this session, it appears that they want to redo the CRCT tests so that results can be compared from year to year to assess student growth for purposes of judging schools and teachers, rather than using these tests for the original stated purpose of judging whether or not students had mastered the Georgia curriculum.
Your guess is as good as mine, though, since no one has actually said how the program would work.
amanda
February 28th, 2010
11:51 pm
Why do we overlook the hypocrisy that an administration seeking to limit social programs and touting individual responsibility in other aspects of life ignores active parenting and student work ethic and as major factors in student achievement? The bottom line is that there are MANY factors to academic success, and family dynamics and individual drive will always be a greater influence on student performance than the classroom teacher. Yeah, yeah- I’ve seen Freedom Writers and Stand and Deliver and Dangerous Minds too, but there is a reason why those teachers worked 2 side jobs and had failed marriages. I refuse to believe that I am not a meritorious teacher just because I can’t be everything and everywhere to support my 124 students each year.
Joe Wilson
February 28th, 2010
11:57 pm
I had to pay the performance-based certification when I began teaching in 1980. Part of the buy-in by the people administering the program was that teachers would get raised based on passing this difficult process. I have yet to see any of that promised money for passing it. I have also passed four different teacher certification tests in various fields, plus obtained a master’s and specialist degree to add to my journalism degree from the University of Georgia. Merit pay will not improve education, it will just make many leave the profession after a few years when the job market improves. Students will not have experienced teachers, but a steady stream of people in and out of the profession. Georgia will have to provide emergency certification for people, unqualified to teach and lacking the experience to really improve education in this state.
Teacher Parent Voter Taxpayer
March 1st, 2010
12:13 am
Most of these comments show a lack of understanding of how “the other half” lives. Teachers in rural, urban, and low SES areas don’t understand how parents in affluent areas who pay the most in taxes are worried that their Gifted children are going to stagnate in a classroom with a lazy, uncreative teacher who isn’t trying to progress or move forward. Well-educated, active parents with motivated children don’t understand exactly how low some kids’ ability levels are, how unhealthy some home lives are, how literally dangerous some Georgia schools have become, and how mainstreaming students with special needs in inclusion classrooms affects learning. Is there any chance that any of you will stop generalizing all Georgia schools based on your specific experience and embrace the reality of difference in our state? Education and learning are not one-size-fits-all, and that is why absolute rules and measures will never be quantitatively accurate for anyone.
Rick Cole
March 1st, 2010
5:31 am
You get more of whatever you measure. I don’t see any problem with developing good measures of teacher performance and reward those who do well. Teachers should be out in front helping legislatures create good plans. Instead, many of these comments reveal real fear in being tested. Teachers shouldn’t be afraid of competing and excelling. That is what they are preparing their students to do in the job market.
Jennifer
March 1st, 2010
6:08 am
@ Waldo — As “at this point in the game” pointed out, there are no unions in this state. Also, in our district (and I’m sure many others) we have course maps that give us a pacing guide that we are REQUIRED to keep up with. In addition, we have quarterly benchmark tests that assure we’ll stay up on that pace. We assess students on the content that is required to be taught each quarter. If we don’t stay on track, they don’t do well. So, of course we stay on track. These assessments are from elementary grades through high school! We don’t need merit pay to ensure we stay on track. There’s a system in place for that already. Please, Waldo, get informed before you offer an opinion.
Really?
March 1st, 2010
6:21 am
@Political Mongrel – “If a teacher knows what’s been taught in his/her classroom and designs tests to match, why do you seem to feel that this is less reliable than some test made up by an anonymous figure…” Those are big “ifs”. “If” a teacher actually teaches the curriculum and not what they personally find most interesting. “If” a teacher designs a test that actually measures what they want to measure. “If” a teacher bothers to actually look at the work they assign. True story – my 5th grader suspected that her teacher never read the book reports she assigned each month. My daughter wrote her report about Ben Franklin. The first paragraph was exactly as one would expect. The rest of the report described how Ben Franklin joined Buck Rogers in becoming the first humans on Mars. The teacher never noticed that nonsense, and actually hung the report in the hallway for three weeks as an example of excellent work. (Nice neat hand writing and plenty long – must have been an excellent report. Why waste time actually reading it?) Teacher designed assessments would be sufficient “if” all teachers were good teachers but they aren’t. Some students may be lucky enough to never lose a year of their education to a teacher who collects a paycheck but doesn’t teach. Mine haven’t been that lucky. I want an outside assessment.
dmac
March 1st, 2010
6:25 am
Bravo to the AJC for this posting. Also, this has to be one of the most intelligent string of blog entries (except for Waldo) that I’ve seen in a long time.
Teachers are the saints that live amongst us.
Happy Teacher
March 1st, 2010
7:08 am
I agree dmac…Wouldn’t it be great if the legislators would sit down with a group of the teachers from this blog as they consider the fine points of the legislation?
A guy can dream…
c
March 1st, 2010
7:31 am
Very well written! I think that basing a educator’s pay based on test scores is harmful to everyone. Our teachers work very hard with our students.(I have been a school volunteer for the last 7 years and have worked closley with all of my daughters teachers,and been in the classrooms at least 3 times a week)Some students are very smart, and bright and talented and gifted, they just do not take tests very well. Then you have a few whom don’t get good grades in class because they are better at learning on their own, and they score excellent on tests. I think we need to stop putting so much pressure on our students and our teachers. More parents need to get involved in their child’s education and what is going on. If your teacher schedules a conference with you, by all means do everything you can to attend and really listen to what they say.
Just A Grunt
March 1st, 2010
8:02 am
Imagine that! More union employees making the case for not judging them on what they accomplish, rather begging you to keep sending them your tax dollars for showing up for work 180 days out of the year.
Maybe if teachers concentrated more on teaching their students instead of worrying about their degrees the kids might learn something. The teachers unions have made it so hard for people who have actual real world expertise from joining their ranks, least the student learn some hard truths about how things work outside of the classroom, that they are producing a product which is unable to cope or succeed once they leave the classroom, and placing a tremendous burden on the the private sector employers.
Remember most of the teachers have never been outside of the classroom themselves, so they know nothing of what is needed to succeed in life, rather they moan and groan about a lack of resources or they blame the raw materials given them. Those excuses don’t fly in the private sector and they shouldn’t be allowed in the teaching of our kids either.
Reward the good ones, get rid of the bad ones and quit making excuses.
Lee
March 1st, 2010
8:13 am
Catlady, I’ve read your posts about mastery vs exposure many times and I am in total agreement. I think we try to push too much too quick and it usually catches up with students when they hit middle school and have to start applying what they learned.
Lee
March 1st, 2010
8:23 am
math 88
February 28th, 2010
8:44 pm
Lee- are you really that stupid? Seriously, if a kid comes to 9th grade reading on a 4th grade level, it may NOT be a teacher’s fault!
Bullcrap. Someone passed this student from grade to grade knowing that they were not on grade level. Who was it?
Your other examples do not make any sense. So what if a student has a bad home life, parents are drug addicts, etc, etc. If that student cannot do the work, they need to be retained.
Grade inflation and passing a student from grade to grade who cannot do the work is no better than the test fraud that was recently perpetrated on the CRCT.
EX-Evil Old English Teacher
March 1st, 2010
8:32 am
Just a Grunt
THERE ARE NO TEACHER UNIONS IN GEORGIA!
Elizabeth
March 1st, 2010
8:35 am
Really: “the classroom tests given by the 30 year veteran who is counting the days to retirement and should have been shown the door a decade ago?”
I am sick and tired and incensed that people think that just because a teacher is nearing 30 years of service, he or she is no longer effective and should be “shown the door”. Most teachers who have taught for that long are the BEST teachers; they are experienced, professional, dedicated to their students and to teaching. I could have retired 5 years ago but I love my job and love my kids and want to continue. Most of the people I know who have worked that long feel the same way I do. It is for us that NLCB has been most frustrating because we are no longer allowed to teach effectively. Now we have to mimic a process to teach the test that is NOT working. Why is experience not valued in education the way it is in other professions. This even happens with pay. After 21 years, a teacher receives NO MORE raises on the salary scale. Do we treat business people and other professionals that way? No, their experience is valued and they are paid more for their expertise.
I am not too old and tired to teach. Yet the perception is that I am “out of it” and should be gone because I am “marking time”. Nothing could be further from the truth. Stop the stereotyping and slamming of experienced teachers. When all of us are gone, those who come in and leave after a few years will demonstate that the quality of teachers will NEVER AGAIN be what is is now. It will be worse, far worse because those new in the profession will only know how to administer a process. They do not reallly know what teaching is. God help the kids.
irisheyes
March 1st, 2010
9:38 am
Just a Grunt, all of your arguements lose value when they are based on a premise that is blatently incorrect. Honestly, if you are not knowledgeable enough to know the basic fact that there are no teachers unions in Georgia, can you really give an informed opinion about anything else regarding education in Georgia?
BTW, before anyone gripes about me posting during the day, my students are having a lesson with a special teacher right now.
what's right for kids???
March 1st, 2010
12:19 pm
Really? If a child is at a 4th grade reading level in 9th grade, the child should have been retained, but that is not allowed in the elementary schools any longer; nor is it allowed in the middle schools. We have social promotion, and God love the teacher who suggests that a child be retained. The school does not tolerate “failure”. So the kid is promoted, gets good grades, and then comes to high school and the parents can’t figure out why they are doing so poorly. The system is broken, not the teachers.
Hey, It's Enrico Pallazzo!
March 1st, 2010
12:49 pm
@Lee,
Who passed the student to the next level? Nine times out of ten it was the parent who insisted that his/her child be promoted. Get rid of that exception then I will believe that a teacher was responsible for the promotion.
Political Mongrel
March 1st, 2010
12:52 pm
@Really–you’ve brought up a complaint that has absolutely nothing to do with outside assessment. Standardized tests would do nothing whatsoever to cure the problem you cited. This is the kind of thing that can be caught only by internal inspection and observation, which is the most effective method.
@just a grunt–There is actually one teacher’s union in Georgia–the American Federation of Teachers. They have almost no members and no influence.
In this state, teachers do not enter into collective bargaining. GAE, PAGE, and the AFT cannot negotiate with the state or local school boards. THERE ARE NO TEACHERS’ UNIONS IN GEORGIA THAT FUNCTION AS A UNION DOES, AND GAE AND PAGE ARE NOT UNIONS. They are free to lobby, and they provide legal services and benefits just like any other interest or support group, but they cannot directly influence school boards or the legislature. You’re welcome to your anti-union opinions, but you are not welcome to make up your own “facts”.
Lee
March 1st, 2010
1:12 pm
Oh good grief.
The last time I looked, my child’s report card did not have a line for the parent to sign stating “Promoted to the next grade.” That was entirely the purview of the teacher.
“The system is broken, not the teachers.” Yes, and who is the system? Teachers. Administrators. Any of this ring a bell?
Hello. Anybody home?
Corrupt Teachers
March 1st, 2010
1:13 pm
The vast majority of teachers/administrators don’t give a Rats ___ about their kids so long as they still have a job. The biggest problem with our schools is that they are run like a bureaucracy. There is more campaigning in the average high school than most political races. The entire system is broken and until you throw out the current officials, most administrators, most teachers, etc, it will remain that way. The funniest part about all this is the Democrats solution to throw money at the problem and the Republicans solution to look the other way. No one actually wants to try something the studies have shown works: vouchers.
clueless
March 1st, 2010
1:32 pm
Isn’t it the principals who have to sign off on the social promotions?
clueless
March 1st, 2010
1:34 pm
Please list the studies that show vouchers work.
from Sen. Doug Stoner
March 1st, 2010
4:02 pm
Teacher pay proposal another attack on public schools
By Sen. Doug Stoner
Senate Bill 386, under consideration in the Senate Education & Youth Committee, would impose a so-called “merit pay” system for Georgia’s public school teachers and administrators that would be largely tied to students’ scores on standardized tests, rather than each educator’s level of experience.
The past eight years have been difficult enough for Georgia’s public schools. Now, in his final year in office, Gov. Sonny Perdue has come up with another plan that won’t help the education of our students. While student achievement is – and should be – the ultimate goal of our school system, connecting standardized test scores to teachers’ and administrators’ paychecks is not the way to reach that goal and could, in fact, have an adverse effect.
Standardized testing is only one means of measuring academic success and is not necessarily the most reliable. It is an even less reliable method of evaluating the performance of teachers, because there is nothing “standard” about the classroom resources, academic programs or socioeconomic conditions that exist from one school system to another.
The reliance by government on “common evaluation instruments” and standardized test scores has already led to charges of educators being encouraged to specifically “teach to the test” rather than providing a broader learning experience that our students will need for success in life. Even worse, dishonesty in the reporting of test scores has already been alleged in some school systems here in the metro Atlanta area. Bringing teacher pay into the equation would likely encourage even more cheating.
“Pay for performance” is promoted by its supporters as a vehicle for increased accountability in our public schools, and there is certainly nothing wrong with accountability. But when it comes to student achievement, there is plenty of accountability that goes beyond the efforts of our teachers in the classroom. In addition to holding our educators on the front lines accountable, we must also measure the performance of parents, school board members, state legislators and, yes, our governor.
Constitutionally, public education is the responsibility of state government. Yet over the last eight years, Gov. Perdue and the legislative majority have shirked most of that responsibility through budget cuts, higher class sizes, unfunded mandates, increased paperwork, teacher furloughs and shifting the tax burden to the local level. Why should our teachers be the only ones who are consistently told to do more with less?
Gov. Perdue proposed slashing another $299 million from K-12 education funding in his fiscal year 2010 supplemental budget proposal. The Legislature has reduced that number to $281 million, but it stills brings the total school cuts for this year to $692 million. Educators, like other state employees, must take three more unpaid furlough days between now and June 30.
At the beginning of the legislative session, state School Superintendent Kathy Cox told lawmakers that some 35 local school systems across the state are near the financial breaking point. Those school boards must decide whether to make payroll or keep up bond payments on school buildings. Superintendent Cox said more education cuts will have a devastating effect on many more school systems that are “teetering on the edge.” She warned that some systems are already in the red. This leaves local school boards with no choice but to expand class sizes up to 40 students or increase local property taxes, or both.
Reducing government spending is to be expected in theses unprecedented economic times. But when it comes to reducing the funding of public education, this governor proposed drastic Quality Basic Education (QBE) funding cuts in seven out of his eight years in office – whether economic times were good or bad. The only year he did not was 2006, when he was running for re-election.
This administration’s eight-year reduction in QBE funding totals around $2.3 billion, not only hurting our students but shifting the burden to the local level where property owners are forced to make up the difference. The majority of school districts across the state have had to raise property taxes because of the cuts in QBE funding from the state. The governor calls these “austerity cuts,” but what is austere or fiscally responsible about merely shifting the tax burden from one level of government to another?
The Perdue administration’s misguided education policies do not stop with QBE funding cuts. The governor has also attempted to eliminate state funding for school nurses and bonus pay for teachers earning national certification. Meanwhile, as public school funding is slashed to the bone, the governor and the legislative majority passed a $50 million tax break for private schools and repeatedly pushed for private school vouchers.
Now, on his way out of office, Gov. Perdue is proposing a teacher pay system tied to student test scores. It is the height of hypocrisy for the state government to demand higher test scores while pulling more state resources out of our schools year after year. SB 386 gets a failing grade.
Sen. Doug Stoner (D-Smyrna) represents the 6th District (south Cobb).
Kteacher
March 1st, 2010
4:35 pm
Way to go Sen. Stoner. Now if you could only get your fellow senators to see it the same way. I wish you represented Gwinnett.
Jennifer
March 1st, 2010
5:07 pm
@Lee — If a student is being considered for retention, a meeting is held. THAT is where the parent would sign saying that they did not want their child retained. There is also a LARGE body of research out there (simple internet searches will lead you to many studies) that shows that retention doesn’t accomplish the intended goal (mastery of curriculum.)
Jennifer
March 1st, 2010
5:11 pm
@ Just a Grunt — In the private sector, if they receive a shipment of raw materials that are no good, they ship that back and get better raw materials. We can’t do that in school! Here’s some reading for you, from a businessman who has since made schools his business after getting “schooled” on this point… http://www.jamievollmer.com/blue_story.html